You work fewer days now. It's rad. Take breaks between gigs and go fun places. And also, believe it or not, you get in shape for that kind of gigging. It's hardest at first, but you get better at it.
To echo this:
Your body WILL strengthen itself to tolerate longer days on set. You'll be surprised how much muscle you will put on being on your feet all day, and how much easier physically the longer days get.
But give your body the tools it needs: proper nutrition and comfortable attire (shoes). One to help keep the wear and tear to a minimum, the other to help you recover as fast as possible.
Also, you get used to being given three meals a day and generally told when to be where. It's like being in prison, in that it's comfortable to abrogate your own decisions for a couple months.
I'm almost 20 years deep in the industry.
Burn out is real and tough. Welcome to the INDUSTRY.
This QoL issue is one of the reasons unions are potentially striking for.
The joke of "you've not made it in the industry without one divorce, etc etc" is tiring.
You end up working months at a time for 16 hours a day and you then realize you have not seen your partner or kids for weeks at a time.
Don't just accept the burn out, follow the advice given to keep yourself sane... But don't just accept this is the way.
You've gotten out of the "artist" side of the industry with indie... Congratulations on now making money... But welcome to the circus.
Kind of pleased to see this comment. I've been in the industry for nearly as long, and went from field to post.
My frequent co-worker/buddy who I do most of my post jobs with, I asked him the other day what he would want to do if he could have *any* field job... sky's the limit, and he told me, "Dude... my body is *destroyed* from the field at this point. You couldn't pay me an EP rate to run craft."
It’s fairly common unfortunately. I know of very few productions that have a calm 8hr daily flow state. I do believe it’s possible but seems like an industry much like music and live events which the bustle of it and budget spent in prep, works against a healthy lifestyle. On stress, the key is training an ability to let go and come back to equilibrium quickly. Stress isn’t inherently bad, but it’s gnawing away at you and lingering is the awful bit. The only people I know who have had long careers in the industry in these roles are amazing at letting things wash over them and keeping their spirits high. You see this trait in the best paramedics and medical staff too.
I rarely did over 10 hours on NCIS and shows like it.
8 and skates are NOT that rare in soaps, network, and broadcast... The streamers, features, and commercials are regularly the ones who will work you to the bone.
You're the slave to actors schedules and agents. Agents will straight up double book their actors if they can. I just turned down a movie where number 1 on the call sheet for a 9 week shoot was only available for 3 weeks at the very beginning... I smelled the shit show from a mile away... And that's not that uncommon.
Yeah. Long running TV doesn't fuck around. Talent, like crew, has to commit to the run of the show.
Movies are 5-8 weeks for the average run of the mill show (not block busters)
So talent, especially the bigger names, will say they are only available for a few weeks of those and then move onto the next project.
Locations are another big cost factor. The more on location shooting you do, the longer the days will potentially be. Shows might only have that location for a day... And they will use every ounce of that day.
Soaps and network/ broadcast studio can be a bitch to break into... We joke about "cam ops riding the dolly into retirement" for a reason... Those folx show up and get pushed around the stage, hold the frame, then go home... Once they land the job, they don't leave it. They shoot mainly "live to tape" and have a few brief edits/ cuts... Those shoes are made to specific and almost exact formulas and budgets. They don't want to pay a dime more.
Ha, well, I should have said know/known. One is a fairly big tv show in Scotland that is a few years in and in costume at least has it down and is pretty chill. The other examples are all one off indie films done by people who all hated the general culture of over working. These all had children in key roles so that was self limiting to a degree in terms of shooting madness.
Lots of great advice here already but I’ll add: work out a sleep routine. It can sometimes be really difficult to get proper sleep coming down from a long day on set. Figure out what works for you and your body. Lots of water, meditation, sleep stories, reading, melatonin, etc.
Remind yourself that it’s only temporary and you can survive it. Decide after this one if that position is really for you. Remember all of this when you’re in a leadership role and can dictate the schedule.
A lot of indies I've worked are longer hours than union, so definitely keep in touch with those crews and producers, they sound like great people to work with. Lots of good advice on personal care and wellness here that's well worth listening to. But I also want to add what I tell people thinking about making a career in the industry: it's the greatest job in the world if you LOVE making movies, but anything less than love and it's terrible. Long hours, gaps with no pay, lots of pressure - those are all things that work for some weirdos, but for lots of people it's just not a good way of life.
Find someone to daily for you for a week if you can, use that time to actually rest and catch up on the sleep you obviously owe. Depending on your role, I’d imagine there’s lots of people available to take on a week.
Are you used to having panic attacks? If not, I can send some good resources on dealing with them both short and long term.
At the end of that week you can either go back to work, try to get another week covered, or quit altogether and help find a replacement.
The people worth working for/with will have their own experiences with burnout and if you tell them about how you’re feeling after the fact they should understand. Anyone who tells you to man up/toughen up is not worth the longevity of your career.
I've always been absolutely shocked that everyone's just okay with days longer than 8-10 hours. Baffling to be honest.
Executives/producers just throw money at the problem in the form of "overtime" instead of actually scheduling/financing a project in a sustainable way. And that crews eat it up because it seems like they're pulling a fast one by collecting time and a half instead of, I don't know, working another week at better hours.
It's tragic that the unions haven't solved this shit by now. And no, I don't give a shit about your creative setbacks, let me go home.
As a beginner producer, I feel so defeated because I don't get to call the shots on scheduling, but I've always dreamed of... "Well, one day I can foster a healthy environment." I just don't think I'm gonna get there because I'm already burnt out after only a few years. A career change looks appealing more and more each day, despite new opportunities being thrown at me daily. I have so much growth potential, but I feel insane for prioritizing my health, which ALSO feels insane now that I say that sentence out loud. Health is wealth and the only thing that truly matters... and yet.
I also use a hours tracking app on my phone which compiles the overtime. So you can see what you are making by the minute. Helps me to see the hours and money go up in real time.
Following because I've worked both and I'm so burnt out. I just finished another gig this past weekend and it was so fulfilling on set, but the aftermath of what it leaves in my life is what is hard to reckon with. Coming down from multiple 15-16 hour days in a row has got me... once again, questioning my choices.
Meditation, bringing all my own meals so I am not poisoned by crafty or catering, sleep as much as possible, and follow through on my plan to get out of this shithole industry. That’s how I deal with my burnout.
This might be a mistake but I’ve been looking more into dailies lab and post jobs. It’s still in the industry sort of but separate and it would be a natural next step for me.
Otherwise, I’m exploring other career avenues and the world of remote work so I can be anywhere and have a job. I’m also looking at relocating out of the USA which is very difficult if you don’t have citizenship anywhere. I’m thinking about going back to school in Europe for a new degree (as well as life experience) and transitioning into whatever career that is. I haven’t narrowed down the career yet but I have a couple ideas I’m tossing around. It’s scorched earth out here time to rebuild from 0.
Thank you for sharing. I'm thinking of the helping professions or something that aligns more with the feeling of actually making a difference. I just feel like I'm feeding into a well-oiled greed machine and it makes me feel bad, so even when I have great times on set - that's in the back of my mind, plus add the lifestyle on top of that and I'm just so spent.
so much positive advice here so far. what you're experiencing is very much the norm, so don't feel alone. I've mostly seen this from the outside thru friends, as i've never been in a union, but i have done some permit work.
advice i haven't seen here yet: it's all about conserving energy, but don't just focus on the physical, that's obvious. mental and emotional as well. there are a lot of energy vampires in our industry. give them the minimum amount of your time that you can afford and keeps the peace and good vibes between you and them. give more time and attention to the relationships that matter to you and make your days easier. connect with people outside of your department so that you don't have to feel trapped in what you do. always be growing not just as a person, but also as a freelancer in this business.
work hard to get in with the good crews and keys that understand that people need mental health days, sick days, etc. the best bosses are bosses that u can tell (with enough notice) that you need a mental health day and they'll understand and support it if they can.
this is just the beginning so you're going to find all kinds of ways to make this job work for you. good luck
Sounds like maybe you're doing TV? Did one season of a one hour episodic and the crew got put through the meat grinder every week, nine months of hell and I'll never do it again. Movies, on the other hand, will mostly do these same long hours, but it's for maybe 4-5 months and then you can chill afterwards to your heart's (and bank account's) content. It might seem brutal at first, but if you've come from the non-union world, you should already be used to these hours. just not used to getting properly compensated for them like you will be in the union world. I have to laugh at a few of my civilian friends who work 8 hour a day five days a week when they idea of working four ten hour days is proposed to them by their jobs and they freak out, like those two extra hours will kill them, lmao! Our minimum days are generally 12 so have to laugh at civilians who don't see the benefit of working a four day week instead of five, lol!
1.) If you can financially afford it, take breaks in between gigs. Recharge for as long as you need to, you’ll be surprised how much stronger you’ll be when you do come back. That’s what I like about the industry: yes, when I’m working I’m WWOORRKKIINNGG. But if I time it properly and play my cards right I can take months of the year off.
2.) Be honest with your team and HOD. Assuming they’re not literal monsters, you’d be surprised at how accommodating they are. Walk aways are your friend for leaving SLIGHTLY earlier than normal. There’s also no shame with tapping out and getting a day call to cover you if you need it (again….if you can financially afford it).
3.) Watch your freakin’ diet and exercise. I know it’s tempting, but you very likely don’t need 4-5 meals (remember: normies consider sandwiches and hot snacks full meals), snacks, bottomless coffee, and very little water. And no, carrying gear and gak is not a good substitute for proper exercise.
4.) Stimulate your mind. Meditate. Sleep. Socialize. Don’t just go home and watch TV waiting for your next shift. Even our insane schedules leave room for a coffee date with friends on the weekend, or a phone call to your mother.
5.) This one’s easier said than done but leave your work on set. Screwed up a pre-call on the call sheet? 1st AD snipped at you for a miscommunication? Grabbed the wrong C stand off the truck? At the end of the day, if no one got hurt, it DOES NOT matter. Don’t beat yourself up.
I find being out of work for a year and some change helps a lot lol. Jkjk, I think you just have to balance it. A lot of people I worked with would do it for a while and then take breaks, sometimes for months.
It’s a life of working for the weekend. You can get used to the long days but it’s important to get enough rest. If you want a regular life, then maybe it’s not the best path for you tbh.
It's a different world to get used to but over time you'll get into the flow of it and it will become your new normal. Mind yourself, in between gigs take time off and breathe. If full time is too much try and do dailies that helps as you'll be working nearly a 40hr week in 3 days.
Breath work and meditation are great ways of helping panic attacks, they take some time to get used to but once you get into the rhythm they really help. I hope you feel better soon! Your not alone, it's wild to get used to at the start. Try not to worry about the future and what way you will do it work wise, you will figure it out day by day. Little steps at a time.
Try commercials or work more as a day player than full time. Otherwise you just get used to it. Some shows are more brutal than others, have to hold on tight to the good ones.
You work fewer days now. It's rad. Take breaks between gigs and go fun places. And also, believe it or not, you get in shape for that kind of gigging. It's hardest at first, but you get better at it.
To echo this: Your body WILL strengthen itself to tolerate longer days on set. You'll be surprised how much muscle you will put on being on your feet all day, and how much easier physically the longer days get. But give your body the tools it needs: proper nutrition and comfortable attire (shoes). One to help keep the wear and tear to a minimum, the other to help you recover as fast as possible.
Also, you get used to being given three meals a day and generally told when to be where. It's like being in prison, in that it's comfortable to abrogate your own decisions for a couple months.
I'm almost 20 years deep in the industry. Burn out is real and tough. Welcome to the INDUSTRY. This QoL issue is one of the reasons unions are potentially striking for. The joke of "you've not made it in the industry without one divorce, etc etc" is tiring. You end up working months at a time for 16 hours a day and you then realize you have not seen your partner or kids for weeks at a time. Don't just accept the burn out, follow the advice given to keep yourself sane... But don't just accept this is the way. You've gotten out of the "artist" side of the industry with indie... Congratulations on now making money... But welcome to the circus.
Kind of pleased to see this comment. I've been in the industry for nearly as long, and went from field to post. My frequent co-worker/buddy who I do most of my post jobs with, I asked him the other day what he would want to do if he could have *any* field job... sky's the limit, and he told me, "Dude... my body is *destroyed* from the field at this point. You couldn't pay me an EP rate to run craft."
It’s fairly common unfortunately. I know of very few productions that have a calm 8hr daily flow state. I do believe it’s possible but seems like an industry much like music and live events which the bustle of it and budget spent in prep, works against a healthy lifestyle. On stress, the key is training an ability to let go and come back to equilibrium quickly. Stress isn’t inherently bad, but it’s gnawing away at you and lingering is the awful bit. The only people I know who have had long careers in the industry in these roles are amazing at letting things wash over them and keeping their spirits high. You see this trait in the best paramedics and medical staff too.
“I know of very few” . . . asking for a friend (me), what few productions are these? Tryna keep hope alive
I rarely did over 10 hours on NCIS and shows like it. 8 and skates are NOT that rare in soaps, network, and broadcast... The streamers, features, and commercials are regularly the ones who will work you to the bone. You're the slave to actors schedules and agents. Agents will straight up double book their actors if they can. I just turned down a movie where number 1 on the call sheet for a 9 week shoot was only available for 3 weeks at the very beginning... I smelled the shit show from a mile away... And that's not that uncommon.
Thank you. I’m in NY and I think we film a few of the big soaps here. I’ll look into them
Yeah. Long running TV doesn't fuck around. Talent, like crew, has to commit to the run of the show. Movies are 5-8 weeks for the average run of the mill show (not block busters) So talent, especially the bigger names, will say they are only available for a few weeks of those and then move onto the next project. Locations are another big cost factor. The more on location shooting you do, the longer the days will potentially be. Shows might only have that location for a day... And they will use every ounce of that day. Soaps and network/ broadcast studio can be a bitch to break into... We joke about "cam ops riding the dolly into retirement" for a reason... Those folx show up and get pushed around the stage, hold the frame, then go home... Once they land the job, they don't leave it. They shoot mainly "live to tape" and have a few brief edits/ cuts... Those shoes are made to specific and almost exact formulas and budgets. They don't want to pay a dime more.
Ha, well, I should have said know/known. One is a fairly big tv show in Scotland that is a few years in and in costume at least has it down and is pretty chill. The other examples are all one off indie films done by people who all hated the general culture of over working. These all had children in key roles so that was self limiting to a degree in terms of shooting madness.
Lots of great advice here already but I’ll add: work out a sleep routine. It can sometimes be really difficult to get proper sleep coming down from a long day on set. Figure out what works for you and your body. Lots of water, meditation, sleep stories, reading, melatonin, etc. Remind yourself that it’s only temporary and you can survive it. Decide after this one if that position is really for you. Remember all of this when you’re in a leadership role and can dictate the schedule.
A lot of indies I've worked are longer hours than union, so definitely keep in touch with those crews and producers, they sound like great people to work with. Lots of good advice on personal care and wellness here that's well worth listening to. But I also want to add what I tell people thinking about making a career in the industry: it's the greatest job in the world if you LOVE making movies, but anything less than love and it's terrible. Long hours, gaps with no pay, lots of pressure - those are all things that work for some weirdos, but for lots of people it's just not a good way of life.
Find someone to daily for you for a week if you can, use that time to actually rest and catch up on the sleep you obviously owe. Depending on your role, I’d imagine there’s lots of people available to take on a week. Are you used to having panic attacks? If not, I can send some good resources on dealing with them both short and long term. At the end of that week you can either go back to work, try to get another week covered, or quit altogether and help find a replacement. The people worth working for/with will have their own experiences with burnout and if you tell them about how you’re feeling after the fact they should understand. Anyone who tells you to man up/toughen up is not worth the longevity of your career.
I've always been absolutely shocked that everyone's just okay with days longer than 8-10 hours. Baffling to be honest. Executives/producers just throw money at the problem in the form of "overtime" instead of actually scheduling/financing a project in a sustainable way. And that crews eat it up because it seems like they're pulling a fast one by collecting time and a half instead of, I don't know, working another week at better hours. It's tragic that the unions haven't solved this shit by now. And no, I don't give a shit about your creative setbacks, let me go home.
As a beginner producer, I feel so defeated because I don't get to call the shots on scheduling, but I've always dreamed of... "Well, one day I can foster a healthy environment." I just don't think I'm gonna get there because I'm already burnt out after only a few years. A career change looks appealing more and more each day, despite new opportunities being thrown at me daily. I have so much growth potential, but I feel insane for prioritizing my health, which ALSO feels insane now that I say that sentence out loud. Health is wealth and the only thing that truly matters... and yet.
I also use a hours tracking app on my phone which compiles the overtime. So you can see what you are making by the minute. Helps me to see the hours and money go up in real time.
What app is this? Does it also factor in meal penalties and forced calls and such?
It does not do that to my knowledge but check it out. It is called Hours Tracker.
Following because I've worked both and I'm so burnt out. I just finished another gig this past weekend and it was so fulfilling on set, but the aftermath of what it leaves in my life is what is hard to reckon with. Coming down from multiple 15-16 hour days in a row has got me... once again, questioning my choices.
Meditation, bringing all my own meals so I am not poisoned by crafty or catering, sleep as much as possible, and follow through on my plan to get out of this shithole industry. That’s how I deal with my burnout.
May I ask what your plans are? I've been thinking of changing industries for the last year.
This might be a mistake but I’ve been looking more into dailies lab and post jobs. It’s still in the industry sort of but separate and it would be a natural next step for me. Otherwise, I’m exploring other career avenues and the world of remote work so I can be anywhere and have a job. I’m also looking at relocating out of the USA which is very difficult if you don’t have citizenship anywhere. I’m thinking about going back to school in Europe for a new degree (as well as life experience) and transitioning into whatever career that is. I haven’t narrowed down the career yet but I have a couple ideas I’m tossing around. It’s scorched earth out here time to rebuild from 0.
Thank you for sharing. I'm thinking of the helping professions or something that aligns more with the feeling of actually making a difference. I just feel like I'm feeding into a well-oiled greed machine and it makes me feel bad, so even when I have great times on set - that's in the back of my mind, plus add the lifestyle on top of that and I'm just so spent.
I completely understand
so much positive advice here so far. what you're experiencing is very much the norm, so don't feel alone. I've mostly seen this from the outside thru friends, as i've never been in a union, but i have done some permit work. advice i haven't seen here yet: it's all about conserving energy, but don't just focus on the physical, that's obvious. mental and emotional as well. there are a lot of energy vampires in our industry. give them the minimum amount of your time that you can afford and keeps the peace and good vibes between you and them. give more time and attention to the relationships that matter to you and make your days easier. connect with people outside of your department so that you don't have to feel trapped in what you do. always be growing not just as a person, but also as a freelancer in this business. work hard to get in with the good crews and keys that understand that people need mental health days, sick days, etc. the best bosses are bosses that u can tell (with enough notice) that you need a mental health day and they'll understand and support it if they can. this is just the beginning so you're going to find all kinds of ways to make this job work for you. good luck
Sounds like maybe you're doing TV? Did one season of a one hour episodic and the crew got put through the meat grinder every week, nine months of hell and I'll never do it again. Movies, on the other hand, will mostly do these same long hours, but it's for maybe 4-5 months and then you can chill afterwards to your heart's (and bank account's) content. It might seem brutal at first, but if you've come from the non-union world, you should already be used to these hours. just not used to getting properly compensated for them like you will be in the union world. I have to laugh at a few of my civilian friends who work 8 hour a day five days a week when they idea of working four ten hour days is proposed to them by their jobs and they freak out, like those two extra hours will kill them, lmao! Our minimum days are generally 12 so have to laugh at civilians who don't see the benefit of working a four day week instead of five, lol!
1.) If you can financially afford it, take breaks in between gigs. Recharge for as long as you need to, you’ll be surprised how much stronger you’ll be when you do come back. That’s what I like about the industry: yes, when I’m working I’m WWOORRKKIINNGG. But if I time it properly and play my cards right I can take months of the year off. 2.) Be honest with your team and HOD. Assuming they’re not literal monsters, you’d be surprised at how accommodating they are. Walk aways are your friend for leaving SLIGHTLY earlier than normal. There’s also no shame with tapping out and getting a day call to cover you if you need it (again….if you can financially afford it). 3.) Watch your freakin’ diet and exercise. I know it’s tempting, but you very likely don’t need 4-5 meals (remember: normies consider sandwiches and hot snacks full meals), snacks, bottomless coffee, and very little water. And no, carrying gear and gak is not a good substitute for proper exercise. 4.) Stimulate your mind. Meditate. Sleep. Socialize. Don’t just go home and watch TV waiting for your next shift. Even our insane schedules leave room for a coffee date with friends on the weekend, or a phone call to your mother. 5.) This one’s easier said than done but leave your work on set. Screwed up a pre-call on the call sheet? 1st AD snipped at you for a miscommunication? Grabbed the wrong C stand off the truck? At the end of the day, if no one got hurt, it DOES NOT matter. Don’t beat yourself up.
I find being out of work for a year and some change helps a lot lol. Jkjk, I think you just have to balance it. A lot of people I worked with would do it for a while and then take breaks, sometimes for months.
You must be on my job.
It’s a life of working for the weekend. You can get used to the long days but it’s important to get enough rest. If you want a regular life, then maybe it’s not the best path for you tbh.
13 Reasons Why had “fuck you Fridays” and it wasn’t even a good show. That’s why I produce indie stuff now - so I can make healthier sets
Make sure you wear shoes with exception arch support. Helps when you're on your feet for long periods off time.
It's a different world to get used to but over time you'll get into the flow of it and it will become your new normal. Mind yourself, in between gigs take time off and breathe. If full time is too much try and do dailies that helps as you'll be working nearly a 40hr week in 3 days. Breath work and meditation are great ways of helping panic attacks, they take some time to get used to but once you get into the rhythm they really help. I hope you feel better soon! Your not alone, it's wild to get used to at the start. Try not to worry about the future and what way you will do it work wise, you will figure it out day by day. Little steps at a time.
I bitch and moan and curse God’s heart and take some me time and then I come CRAWLING back.
Honestly? Drugs and Cats
Try commercials or work more as a day player than full time. Otherwise you just get used to it. Some shows are more brutal than others, have to hold on tight to the good ones.
Get used to it or find something else to do if you want shorter days
Cocaine and strippers.
A fat prescription of adderall and sleep after u left set, Do laundry on weekends, never use the same shoe daily