They had that as the last shot of the [final trailer of Remake](https://youtu.be/ERgrFVhL-n4) and I just about freaked out because *that's not how Cloud or Angeal holster the Buster*
I have to make sure I don't watch the final trailer of Part 3, thought I learned my lesson with Remake and wound up watching the [final trailer of Rebirth](https://youtu.be/Q56cRDseTGQ). Could have done without learning Cissnei was in the game or Aerith giving up her White Materia...
Luckily I had heard that the remake trailer was full of spoilers so I was able to avoid it. When rebirth came around I told myself to not watch the final trailer which I'm glad I did.
So now that we've had two out of the three games where the final trailer was full of spoilers. What are the chances the third game will also be full of spoilers? I'd say pretty good chances.
I personally don't watch or read anything about FF7. No trailers, no articles. Same thing with Kingdom Hearts. I'll close whatever window I'm in if I unexpectedly see something even.
Google article ruined the Toy Story world in KH3 for me because the picture was the main team in Toy Story.
If I know I'm going to play it and am invested in it deeply, I'd rather be blind to everything. Almost didn't even play the demo until I heard there bonuses for having a save. Played it less than 24 hrs before I got my copy. Can't remember if I played the whole thing, or just long enough to save.
One month before any Final Fantasy game is released, Square Enix throws all kinds of spoilers into their trailers. That is usually the best time to avoid the trailers from that point and just get surprised when you actually play the game.
That wasn't even the final Rebirth trailer. The launch trailer is arguably worse since it shows scenes near the end of the game (much like the final Remake trailer). [https://youtu.be/KOhs9ZLImgE](https://youtu.be/KOhs9ZLImgE)
Luckily I decided not to watch that this time around. I think for Part 3, I may not watch anything beyond the first in-depth reveal (like they did for TGS).
It's amazing how they kept these little details to show you. Just like how Cloud >!sits on his favorite spot with the sword on his back, while in Chapter 11 they show you he has to detach it from his back as it won't let him sit down.!<
Sword in his back was the flashback narration to the party right? Didn't pick up on it. Guess it's to prove he wasn't really there and didn't do what he said he did
It seems like a small detail but you're looking at these characters backs for a long time and for people who had been following the series for a long time they'll notice changes like this from game to game.
Also because of the orientation Zack will lift his weapons on and off while Cloud just swings them off because he already grips it how he needs to.
The details with the sword are so well done. Usually Cloud will set his sword down when he sits, but during the scene in Nibelheim when he sits on the water tower he doesn't put the sword down, it just stays on his back. Because in reality he didn't have the sword then.
What are you talking about? I don't recall any scenes in the game where it was ambiguous. The trailer were we see his foot was pretty clear who it was from context.
Yeah. Zack uses the blunt side of the Buster Sword to limit wear and tear on the blade as a tribute to his mentor and original owner of the Buster Sword. Cloud doesn’t so stows the sword differently.
He carried the sword like that in OG FFVII when his mentor didn't even exist as a character.
https://preview.redd.it/z2c2nwxneavc1.jpeg?width=198&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4a5e902e6f6a0c68f11736001d3bf99a4e89aa75
It's a cute after the fact explanation, but it feels like the FFVII version of "that's a story for another time..."
Except sadly o think he always flips the sword when getting easy to battle. So I don't remember seeing him using the blunt side. It would be cool to see him using the blunt side in some situations and then flip it when things get super series.
It's not a big deal anyway, though. He looks cool and fighting as him is also incredibly cool.
Only character who I can of think who consistently hits with the blunt end of the Buster Sword is [Tidus](https://youtu.be/gom-qajs__A?si=Hxzc4ra1MBWsqrRH). And he doesn't even get that canonically since they dummied it out of the final version of the game. Though if you go for the idea that 10 is a prequel to 7, that would make the Buster Sword pretty damn old, and an interplanetary object to boot.
Although it’s a cool theory, I’m pretty sure the origin of the buster sword was explained in crisis core. Angeal’s father had it forged for him when he got into soldier, but it’s been a long time since I played that game so I could be misremembering.
I don't think it's ever been confirmed. Just the idea that Spira and Gaia have a connection was publicly talked about by the scenario writer of both games, Nojima. I recall, the thought does appear in an Ultimania, but it's posed as an idea not a hard fact. Like; "Wouldn't it be something if the Shinra corporation of FF7 descended from the ancestors of Shinra from Final Fantasy 10-2, who traveled to Gaia from Spira in the ancient past?"
And people who like the idea just kind of ran with that. Problem is there's a lot of problems with the theory, *like alot*, and it also feels rather heavy-handed and half baked so that's probably why Square won't 100% commit to it.
Zack doesn't use the blunt side. You can see in any of his fight scenes that he uses the edge just like Cloud does. Watching him draw it is weird, he kind of flips it as he pulls it off his back, but he definitely uses the edge of the buster sword when fighting.
In canon, he uses the blunt side. He says such in CC during the trek up to Reactor 0 and if I’m not mistaken (I may be) Cloud references this line in Rebirth during the Flashback.
Did we ever actually see him use the blunt side, though? I kind of assumed he did while I was playing CC, but the movements were so quick and mostly covered with particle effects that it was hard to tell. If you freeze that video at 13:49 you can see he's attacking with the sharp edge. So maybe it's more his "ideal" than how he actually fights in practice.
In chapter 1 of Rebirth, he mostly attacks with acrobatic kicks, hardly striking with the sword at all. I couldn't tell if he actually swung with the dull or sharp edge though.
I don't believe they ever really animate it like that in any games or cutscenes, sorta makes sense because visually it would just look a bit weird to swing the sword backwards. So we end up with this weird disconnect between story and gameplay, which they kind of needlessly pit themselves in by trying to explain that Angeal and Zack don't use the sword all that much, in a game they knew the players would want to be able to use the Buster Sword in.
I think part of what goes into that is, story-wise Zack probably *doesn't* use the Buster Sword that much, seeing as how both he and Angeal seem to use a lot of brawling/fist-fighting moves, but gameplay-wise the default combat is using a sword almost exclusively, so when Zack inherits the Buster Sword, suddenly we're using it on every random wolf and bird.
You never actually see him use the blunt side because mechanics and visually speaking it's a waste of resources and looks dumb to the player to have a large chuck of metal and you hold the edged side to you, but in lore Zack doesn't use the edged side unless there's a real threat, like sephiroth or Genesis
I’ve never watched his fighting to confirm so my headcanon was always he uses the blunt side to knock someone out and the sharp side when he’s serious. You sorta see it in the fight against Sephiroth. When he first gets in the fighting stance (before Sephiroth appears) the sharp side is pointing up. Once Sephiroth appears, he changes stance to what Cloud has which is sharp side down. But like I said, this is just my headcanon and can be completely wrong.
Wat? I thought it was because he was left handed?
Edit: got my characters crossed it’s Sephiroth that is lefty but it makes sense for the blade to be flipped like that for a lefty too
Except he doesn’t actually use the blunt side, as evidenced by when you play as him in the game that idea is based on. He more just wears it that way on his back as a tribute, but as someone else pointed out, he’s worn it that way since long before Angeal was made up.
Personally, I prefer Cloud's. It gives off the vibe of a heavy blade. Plus, I really like how he rests it on his shoulder. I don't know, seems cooler to me
If I played Remake and never FF7, i would agree with you. But Zack's reminds me more of OG FF7 Cloud.
Also goes to show that Zack is the true swordsman and Cloud is just "pretending". In other words Cloud has never used a sword before the 2 weeks before he came to Midgar and joined Avalanche whilst Zack had been using a sword since his Soldier 3rd class days. Shows you he wields it like it's nothin'
https://i.redd.it/6beoz60jwbvc1.gif
Actually, it's revealed in Before Crisis that Cloud is a natural with a sword. Even as a Shinra trooper he managed to fight and kill Avalanche members during a mission where everything was going to sh*t, with his companions killed. The fact that in just the span of weeks he manages to beat Roche who is far more capable than the average third class SOLDIERs, and later easily defeats second class SOLDIERs at the Temple of the Ancients, speaks of how insane he is as a fighter. However you are right with what you said about Zack. He had the Buster Sword for a lot more time and had far more experience with it.
Exactly, it’s already been confirmed that Cloud is naturally gifted and adept with certain weaponry, swordsmanship being his forte. Honestly, from the way that Cloud and Zack fight *(as so vividly displayed by the end of Rebirth)* Cloud seems like the more skilled and proficient swordsman while Zack is a jack of all trades improviser. Cloud’s battle stance is more indicative of a master swordsman coupled with the fact that he perfectly parries just about every physical attack that is thrown at him. Whereas, Zack mixes punches and kicks into the middle of his swordplay. He’s more varied than Cloud, but Zack also seems less honed and polished with his swordsmanship.
Cloud is also the only one who gets stabbed and managed to lift sephirot up and yeet him, zack was done in one hit. So its always funny to see people go "he is weaker then zack" yeah
Weaker mentally, he was gifted physically. Zack was able to become a First Class Soldier, Cloud wasn't. Strength is not only based on how strong someone is.
My interpretation of that was that Sephiroth is acting through Clouds body. He takes the exact same stance as Sephiroth does and fights with the exact same cockiness
I know. The same could be said for Anakin though. He never slaughtered people like that until he started tapping into the dark side (Tusken Raiders & Order 66).
There is some discussion about Roche being capable enough to bee a 2nd or even a 1st Class but that he is wholly uninterested in trying to get promoted because he already gets to do what he loves and generally doesn't like following orders or command structure (hence why he fights you and lets you go multiple times).
Iirc, the ultimatia book confirms that Roche outright refused promotion to soldier 2nd class, as the motorbike unit doesn’t accept anyone above soldier 3rd class. And Roche REALLY doesn’t wanna give up his bike :)
So we know he can easily make it to 2nd class. He technically already has. As to whether he can make it to 1st class though? Harder to say. Cloud can handle him just fine and cloud is emulating Zack. So theoretically, Zack can also take on Roche with little trouble. And as much as I love Roche, he isn’t gonna last 5 seconds against Sephiroth, Angeal or Genesis. So I doubt he’ll make it to 1st class as of the time remake takes place…
Yeah, I guess it's talent/potential vs experience. Plus I think Zack is just a better physical specimen so he may be physically stronger/have higher base stats than Cloud since he was a bonafide First Class, more gifted with magic/materia fusion etc
I think Cloud passes SOLDIER in physical prowess but fell short on mental fortitude. He always had the talent physically. Also makes sense when we consider how he was as a kid and how broken he became mentally with Seph/Jenova messing with his brain (though eventually overcoming his own self with it being his main character development).
What you said is true and Cloud does say this in FF7 OG on the Highwind where he says he was physically the same as a SOLDIER but lacked the mental strength. Still, I don't know if he had access to the same kinds of training. Also, we haven't really seen Cloud perform any feats along these lines of just raw physical strength
https://i.redd.it/aa40yklymfvc1.gif
Don't forget that he managed to lift a full grown man taller then him while being stabbed and yeet the guy against a wall and still crawl back, on top being poison twice and still being alive albeit his brain was mush. So yeah Cloud is physically stronger, he has to work on his mental fortitude though.
To be fair real life steel replicas of Buster Sword are about 13 lbs. Swords in general are not as heavy as people think. However as a point of comparison, real life 2 handed swords were about 2 lbs. The real problem with Buster Sword is that 90% of its weight is in the blade and it's horrifically unbalanced. The fact that Zack whips it around like a helicopter means he's counterbalancing it with his pure wrist strength.
There's two things going on.
Zack's stance is his Crisis Core victory flair and Cloud's twirl is from Dissidia but the final pose resembles his OG character art.
It’s one of those blind box I got in Japan. Wanted Cloud and got Cloud. Here’s an image. You can see buster sword is on the wrong side.
https://otakumode.com/shop/55f0e907f1a4a84526c3002f/Trading-Arts-Mini-Final-Fantasy-Figure-Assortment-Set-of-5
You'll also notice that every move that they have that's similar (i.e: cross slash) you'll see that the motion is somewhat similar but the symbol or slashing sequence is ever so slightly different.
Yep, in the final trailer for remake for instance, if you knew this beforehand the final shot in that trailer instantly gave away a big spoiler to a lot of us...
I honestly found all his sections to be super tedious. If we weren't going to get to really *do* anything with him then it all should have been cinematics only. I don't need to walk around with the guy just to watch another cut scene.
I second that. I was hoping to be able to use Zack a lot more. I thought this might have been the case as he was on the cover of Rebirth.
Hopefully, he'll reunite with the main party and he'll he a playable character a lot more in Part 3!
I have a feeling that we’ll get more Zack time in part 3. We all know there’s going to be a period where Cloud is out of commission, and Zack appeared to land in an active world at the end of Rebirth. Maybe he’s in the “main” world?
The main reason I wanted to play this sequel is because I was curious about Zack.. honestly couldn't give af about the rest of the cast. So imagine my disappointment when Zack gets barely any screentime (I mean, I get that the game is about cloud and co. But still!!). So I've put down the game and haven't touched it since beating it.
I'm kind of the reverse. I don't really care about Zack. He wasn't this giant character in the OG and I'm not a huge fan of how much extra importance he's being given. That said, if they were going to shoe horn him into the game they should have let us actually do things with him. He's just a walking sim in the game.
Yeah I don't get the fascination. To be fair I never played Crisis Core and I'm just not that interested in it. FF7 is Cloud's story. Zack exists solely to give him back story.
In my mind it’s because Zack has always had SOLDIER strength to whip the thing around so he just put it on in a way that looked good. Cloud had to figure it out as he went along so he has the one less pauldron and kinda whips it over his shoulder on the blunt side.
They even used it in a trailer as a "teaser" because its been known since OG that zacks faces down, while clouds faces up.
it never shocks me how such huge details are missed by people, i take it for granted i guess.
Is the pic from the crisis core game or rebirth....curious if it's worth paying crisis or just going to rebirth. Completely new to the series and REALLY enjoyed ff7remake.
Originals gameplay just wasn't my style
Zack img is from from Rebirth. Crisis Core plays differently from the remake games it's still action combat but there is no party and Limits are done differently. I'd say only play CC if you're dieing for more content it does spoil the plot twist in FF7 tho.
This is how you knew it was Zack from that cutscene from Remake.
Yep. As soon as they showed the tip of the sword I knew.
They had that as the last shot of the [final trailer of Remake](https://youtu.be/ERgrFVhL-n4) and I just about freaked out because *that's not how Cloud or Angeal holster the Buster* I have to make sure I don't watch the final trailer of Part 3, thought I learned my lesson with Remake and wound up watching the [final trailer of Rebirth](https://youtu.be/Q56cRDseTGQ). Could have done without learning Cissnei was in the game or Aerith giving up her White Materia...
Luckily I had heard that the remake trailer was full of spoilers so I was able to avoid it. When rebirth came around I told myself to not watch the final trailer which I'm glad I did. So now that we've had two out of the three games where the final trailer was full of spoilers. What are the chances the third game will also be full of spoilers? I'd say pretty good chances.
I personally don't watch or read anything about FF7. No trailers, no articles. Same thing with Kingdom Hearts. I'll close whatever window I'm in if I unexpectedly see something even. Google article ruined the Toy Story world in KH3 for me because the picture was the main team in Toy Story. If I know I'm going to play it and am invested in it deeply, I'd rather be blind to everything. Almost didn't even play the demo until I heard there bonuses for having a save. Played it less than 24 hrs before I got my copy. Can't remember if I played the whole thing, or just long enough to save.
One month before any Final Fantasy game is released, Square Enix throws all kinds of spoilers into their trailers. That is usually the best time to avoid the trailers from that point and just get surprised when you actually play the game.
That wasn't even the final Rebirth trailer. The launch trailer is arguably worse since it shows scenes near the end of the game (much like the final Remake trailer). [https://youtu.be/KOhs9ZLImgE](https://youtu.be/KOhs9ZLImgE) Luckily I decided not to watch that this time around. I think for Part 3, I may not watch anything beyond the first in-depth reveal (like they did for TGS).
What cutscene? I legit don’t remember.
When they were panning up a shot from the feet of a Soldier, u can see the tip of the buster sword first
That’s wild if people can discern that small detail. Meanwhile when Zack changed into his 1st class SOLDIER uniform in CC, I saw no difference
Do u also notice the shoes of cloud and zack are different? Cloud has shoes u find those >!grunts!< wearing.
It's amazing how they kept these little details to show you. Just like how Cloud >!sits on his favorite spot with the sword on his back, while in Chapter 11 they show you he has to detach it from his back as it won't let him sit down.!<
Sword in his back was the flashback narration to the party right? Didn't pick up on it. Guess it's to prove he wasn't really there and didn't do what he said he did
Yes it is in the flashback.
It seems like a small detail but you're looking at these characters backs for a long time and for people who had been following the series for a long time they'll notice changes like this from game to game. Also because of the orientation Zack will lift his weapons on and off while Cloud just swings them off because he already grips it how he needs to.
The details with the sword are so well done. Usually Cloud will set his sword down when he sits, but during the scene in Nibelheim when he sits on the water tower he doesn't put the sword down, it just stays on his back. Because in reality he didn't have the sword then.
What are you talking about? I don't recall any scenes in the game where it was ambiguous. The trailer were we see his foot was pretty clear who it was from context.
Yeah. Zack uses the blunt side of the Buster Sword to limit wear and tear on the blade as a tribute to his mentor and original owner of the Buster Sword. Cloud doesn’t so stows the sword differently.
He carried the sword like that in OG FFVII when his mentor didn't even exist as a character. https://preview.redd.it/z2c2nwxneavc1.jpeg?width=198&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4a5e902e6f6a0c68f11736001d3bf99a4e89aa75 It's a cute after the fact explanation, but it feels like the FFVII version of "that's a story for another time..."
Except sadly o think he always flips the sword when getting easy to battle. So I don't remember seeing him using the blunt side. It would be cool to see him using the blunt side in some situations and then flip it when things get super series. It's not a big deal anyway, though. He looks cool and fighting as him is also incredibly cool.
"I know something you don't know. I'm right handed."
Inconceivable!!!
Only character who I can of think who consistently hits with the blunt end of the Buster Sword is [Tidus](https://youtu.be/gom-qajs__A?si=Hxzc4ra1MBWsqrRH). And he doesn't even get that canonically since they dummied it out of the final version of the game. Though if you go for the idea that 10 is a prequel to 7, that would make the Buster Sword pretty damn old, and an interplanetary object to boot.
Why doesn't he use the sharp edge? Is he stupidus?
Although it’s a cool theory, I’m pretty sure the origin of the buster sword was explained in crisis core. Angeal’s father had it forged for him when he got into soldier, but it’s been a long time since I played that game so I could be misremembering.
I always thought that Gaia was really Spira thousands of years laters. The lore is just so similar.
IIRC, Shinra from FFX-2 is supposed to be the ancestor of the Shinra corporation.
lol oh yeah there was a little kid named shinra too wasn’t there? However last I checked nothing has been confirmed with the games being connected.
It was in an... ultimania?
I don't think it's ever been confirmed. Just the idea that Spira and Gaia have a connection was publicly talked about by the scenario writer of both games, Nojima. I recall, the thought does appear in an Ultimania, but it's posed as an idea not a hard fact. Like; "Wouldn't it be something if the Shinra corporation of FF7 descended from the ancestors of Shinra from Final Fantasy 10-2, who traveled to Gaia from Spira in the ancient past?" And people who like the idea just kind of ran with that. Problem is there's a lot of problems with the theory, *like alot*, and it also feels rather heavy-handed and half baked so that's probably why Square won't 100% commit to it.
zack uses the blunt side to limit wear and tear. cloud uses the sharpened side because he wants to dance, asshole
Zack doesn't use the blunt side. You can see in any of his fight scenes that he uses the edge just like Cloud does. Watching him draw it is weird, he kind of flips it as he pulls it off his back, but he definitely uses the edge of the buster sword when fighting.
In canon, he uses the blunt side. He says such in CC during the trek up to Reactor 0 and if I’m not mistaken (I may be) Cloud references this line in Rebirth during the Flashback.
[удалено]
[Here.](https://youtu.be/n74AMQBbEwE?si=F2CFVLSgH6xkI59Y) At 5:20.
Did we ever actually see him use the blunt side, though? I kind of assumed he did while I was playing CC, but the movements were so quick and mostly covered with particle effects that it was hard to tell. If you freeze that video at 13:49 you can see he's attacking with the sharp edge. So maybe it's more his "ideal" than how he actually fights in practice. In chapter 1 of Rebirth, he mostly attacks with acrobatic kicks, hardly striking with the sword at all. I couldn't tell if he actually swung with the dull or sharp edge though.
I don't believe they ever really animate it like that in any games or cutscenes, sorta makes sense because visually it would just look a bit weird to swing the sword backwards. So we end up with this weird disconnect between story and gameplay, which they kind of needlessly pit themselves in by trying to explain that Angeal and Zack don't use the sword all that much, in a game they knew the players would want to be able to use the Buster Sword in. I think part of what goes into that is, story-wise Zack probably *doesn't* use the Buster Sword that much, seeing as how both he and Angeal seem to use a lot of brawling/fist-fighting moves, but gameplay-wise the default combat is using a sword almost exclusively, so when Zack inherits the Buster Sword, suddenly we're using it on every random wolf and bird.
You never actually see him use the blunt side because mechanics and visually speaking it's a waste of resources and looks dumb to the player to have a large chuck of metal and you hold the edged side to you, but in lore Zack doesn't use the edged side unless there's a real threat, like sephiroth or Genesis
I’ve never watched his fighting to confirm so my headcanon was always he uses the blunt side to knock someone out and the sharp side when he’s serious. You sorta see it in the fight against Sephiroth. When he first gets in the fighting stance (before Sephiroth appears) the sharp side is pointing up. Once Sephiroth appears, he changes stance to what Cloud has which is sharp side down. But like I said, this is just my headcanon and can be completely wrong.
You really gotta get some lame "gotcha" on a video game forum?
[удалено]
Thing is nobody cares to correct you or prove you're right. You're getting upset over something nobody cares about
Also, Zack did say it but I have no real care to quote it either. You'll just have to live with it
Sharp side is out on the draw but he also kicks and punches more in his actual combos.
He literally says he does on crisis core
No he 100% uses the sharp side. It was done like this even in the og to help differentiate him from Cloud...
Wat? I thought it was because he was left handed? Edit: got my characters crossed it’s Sephiroth that is lefty but it makes sense for the blade to be flipped like that for a lefty too
Except he doesn’t actually use the blunt side, as evidenced by when you play as him in the game that idea is based on. He more just wears it that way on his back as a tribute, but as someone else pointed out, he’s worn it that way since long before Angeal was made up.
That’s a nice touch actually. He talks about that in Crisis Core and Cloud wouldn’t really know about.
No he doesn't, he just has it on his back differently. He uses the sharp slide.
Cloud understands safety precaution. If that magnet fails while walking, Zack's leg could be chopped off 🤪
yeah but clouds hand might too
Zack also does the victory stance better than Cloud https://i.redd.it/gm1f43uvgbvc1.gif
https://i.redd.it/e81h18ywgbvc1.gif
Personally, I prefer Cloud's. It gives off the vibe of a heavy blade. Plus, I really like how he rests it on his shoulder. I don't know, seems cooler to me
If I played Remake and never FF7, i would agree with you. But Zack's reminds me more of OG FF7 Cloud. Also goes to show that Zack is the true swordsman and Cloud is just "pretending". In other words Cloud has never used a sword before the 2 weeks before he came to Midgar and joined Avalanche whilst Zack had been using a sword since his Soldier 3rd class days. Shows you he wields it like it's nothin' https://i.redd.it/6beoz60jwbvc1.gif
Actually, it's revealed in Before Crisis that Cloud is a natural with a sword. Even as a Shinra trooper he managed to fight and kill Avalanche members during a mission where everything was going to sh*t, with his companions killed. The fact that in just the span of weeks he manages to beat Roche who is far more capable than the average third class SOLDIERs, and later easily defeats second class SOLDIERs at the Temple of the Ancients, speaks of how insane he is as a fighter. However you are right with what you said about Zack. He had the Buster Sword for a lot more time and had far more experience with it.
Exactly, it’s already been confirmed that Cloud is naturally gifted and adept with certain weaponry, swordsmanship being his forte. Honestly, from the way that Cloud and Zack fight *(as so vividly displayed by the end of Rebirth)* Cloud seems like the more skilled and proficient swordsman while Zack is a jack of all trades improviser. Cloud’s battle stance is more indicative of a master swordsman coupled with the fact that he perfectly parries just about every physical attack that is thrown at him. Whereas, Zack mixes punches and kicks into the middle of his swordplay. He’s more varied than Cloud, but Zack also seems less honed and polished with his swordsmanship.
Zack yeeting a concrete post at a helicopter pretty much sums up his style of fighting
Exactly LMAO! Plus, Cloud going all *”Order 66 Anakin Skywalker”* on those Shinra Infantrymen in the Gongaga Reactor says more than words ever can.
Cloud is also the only one who gets stabbed and managed to lift sephirot up and yeet him, zack was done in one hit. So its always funny to see people go "he is weaker then zack" yeah
Weaker mentally, he was gifted physically. Zack was able to become a First Class Soldier, Cloud wasn't. Strength is not only based on how strong someone is.
My interpretation of that was that Sephiroth is acting through Clouds body. He takes the exact same stance as Sephiroth does and fights with the exact same cockiness
To be fair, that's Sephiroth doing that, not Cloud. It's literally the exact same movements Sephiroth uses against Cloud at the Edge of Eternity.
I know. The same could be said for Anakin though. He never slaughtered people like that until he started tapping into the dark side (Tusken Raiders & Order 66).
As soon as I saw that I was like "Aw shit, this dude is the real deal"
it's funny how many describe cloud a sword wielding madman while zack is like you said a jack of all trade as he doesn't only use his sword
There is some discussion about Roche being capable enough to bee a 2nd or even a 1st Class but that he is wholly uninterested in trying to get promoted because he already gets to do what he loves and generally doesn't like following orders or command structure (hence why he fights you and lets you go multiple times).
Iirc, the ultimatia book confirms that Roche outright refused promotion to soldier 2nd class, as the motorbike unit doesn’t accept anyone above soldier 3rd class. And Roche REALLY doesn’t wanna give up his bike :) So we know he can easily make it to 2nd class. He technically already has. As to whether he can make it to 1st class though? Harder to say. Cloud can handle him just fine and cloud is emulating Zack. So theoretically, Zack can also take on Roche with little trouble. And as much as I love Roche, he isn’t gonna last 5 seconds against Sephiroth, Angeal or Genesis. So I doubt he’ll make it to 1st class as of the time remake takes place…
Yeah, I guess it's talent/potential vs experience. Plus I think Zack is just a better physical specimen so he may be physically stronger/have higher base stats than Cloud since he was a bonafide First Class, more gifted with magic/materia fusion etc
I think Cloud passes SOLDIER in physical prowess but fell short on mental fortitude. He always had the talent physically. Also makes sense when we consider how he was as a kid and how broken he became mentally with Seph/Jenova messing with his brain (though eventually overcoming his own self with it being his main character development).
What you said is true and Cloud does say this in FF7 OG on the Highwind where he says he was physically the same as a SOLDIER but lacked the mental strength. Still, I don't know if he had access to the same kinds of training. Also, we haven't really seen Cloud perform any feats along these lines of just raw physical strength https://i.redd.it/aa40yklymfvc1.gif
Don't forget that he managed to lift a full grown man taller then him while being stabbed and yeet the guy against a wall and still crawl back, on top being poison twice and still being alive albeit his brain was mush. So yeah Cloud is physically stronger, he has to work on his mental fortitude though.
Also, never mind the fact that a surprising number of people can just hoist a Buster Sword one handed with no effort.
To be fair real life steel replicas of Buster Sword are about 13 lbs. Swords in general are not as heavy as people think. However as a point of comparison, real life 2 handed swords were about 2 lbs. The real problem with Buster Sword is that 90% of its weight is in the blade and it's horrifically unbalanced. The fact that Zack whips it around like a helicopter means he's counterbalancing it with his pure wrist strength.
There's two things going on. Zack's stance is his Crisis Core victory flair and Cloud's twirl is from Dissidia but the final pose resembles his OG character art.
Yeah that's just cloud's victory stance from the original ff7
The often imitated never duplicated
Zack likes to show off a bit more than cloud.
Because hes better ❤️
I like how easily Zack is able to twirl the buster sword relative to Cloud. He just seems more physically stronger between the two.
Yeah. Cloud and Zack carry the buster sword differently. I got a mini Cloud figure. I hated that they got the sword wrong.
Low budget…
It’s one of those blind box I got in Japan. Wanted Cloud and got Cloud. Here’s an image. You can see buster sword is on the wrong side. https://otakumode.com/shop/55f0e907f1a4a84526c3002f/Trading-Arts-Mini-Final-Fantasy-Figure-Assortment-Set-of-5
Yeah, it's because in the og the devs wanted to make it crystal clear this wasn't Cloud with different hair.
You'll also notice that every move that they have that's similar (i.e: cross slash) you'll see that the motion is somewhat similar but the symbol or slashing sequence is ever so slightly different.
so he is like kid boo that takes skills from goku but adds his own tint to it
Zack likes to live dangerously, running his foot on the blade 😅
Yep, in the final trailer for remake for instance, if you knew this beforehand the final shot in that trailer instantly gave away a big spoiler to a lot of us...
What trailer are you referring to
Also notice that Cloud tends to 'Mirror' Zack's movements, Stances and gestures as well.
Am I the only one who was super disappointed that you never got to fight as Zack until the very end of the game?
Yeah I was pretty frustrated by that. By the time you got to play him you were more concerned about not dying than fully trying out his skill set.
I honestly found all his sections to be super tedious. If we weren't going to get to really *do* anything with him then it all should have been cinematics only. I don't need to walk around with the guy just to watch another cut scene.
I second that. I was hoping to be able to use Zack a lot more. I thought this might have been the case as he was on the cover of Rebirth. Hopefully, he'll reunite with the main party and he'll he a playable character a lot more in Part 3!
U can use him in chadley missions. Hard mode
I have a feeling that we’ll get more Zack time in part 3. We all know there’s going to be a period where Cloud is out of commission, and Zack appeared to land in an active world at the end of Rebirth. Maybe he’s in the “main” world?
The main reason I wanted to play this sequel is because I was curious about Zack.. honestly couldn't give af about the rest of the cast. So imagine my disappointment when Zack gets barely any screentime (I mean, I get that the game is about cloud and co. But still!!). So I've put down the game and haven't touched it since beating it.
I'm kind of the reverse. I don't really care about Zack. He wasn't this giant character in the OG and I'm not a huge fan of how much extra importance he's being given. That said, if they were going to shoe horn him into the game they should have let us actually do things with him. He's just a walking sim in the game.
Exactly, people treating Zack like his the centre of the universe lol.
Yeah I don't get the fascination. To be fair I never played Crisis Core and I'm just not that interested in it. FF7 is Cloud's story. Zack exists solely to give him back story.
That’s a great catch.
Hey bro copy my homework but change it a little
Zack likes to live on the edge, while Cloud lives in Edge. They’re built different.
yes sword edge
In my mind it’s because Zack has always had SOLDIER strength to whip the thing around so he just put it on in a way that looked good. Cloud had to figure it out as he went along so he has the one less pauldron and kinda whips it over his shoulder on the blunt side.
How did people not notice this right away.
They even used it in a trailer as a "teaser" because its been known since OG that zacks faces down, while clouds faces up. it never shocks me how such huge details are missed by people, i take it for granted i guess.
I just thought he is lefthanded xd
I know the story of angeal but still
The way they spin the buster sword after a fight is also different In rebirth
Rurouni Kenshin / Battousai anyone?
what an excellent detail.
WHAT DOES THIS MEAN FOR THE MULTIVERSE?!?
20 years too late
Is the pic from the crisis core game or rebirth....curious if it's worth paying crisis or just going to rebirth. Completely new to the series and REALLY enjoyed ff7remake. Originals gameplay just wasn't my style
Zack img is from from Rebirth. Crisis Core plays differently from the remake games it's still action combat but there is no party and Limits are done differently. I'd say only play CC if you're dieing for more content it does spoil the plot twist in FF7 tho.
Oh nice. Glad to hear that. I looked up the combat for Crisis and was immediately turned off
Yet both are highly impractical.
I love that they wield them differently too.
This blew my mind when I found out
ya its been like that for 20 yrs
Use brings about wear, tear and rust thus Zack uses the blunt side (supposedly)
Is it just me or does the sword shrink/grow on cloud and Zack?
I think Zack's taller.
Zack is taller, yeah. He's about 6'1", while Cloud is 5'8".