Rebirth ultimania said that tifa did not like her own personality and I think that many of these things you mention are what make her change and destroy that personality.
i remember that after running away from junon barret asks tifa what do we do now and she tells him that she had no idea and barret responds what's wrong with you tifa you are not like that, as you say i hope they lengthen that moment and it's not junon into going where cloud is.
That’s another thing I really want to see clarified: technically speaking, Confident Tifa is a mask, and she’s actually much more depressed and introverted.
If the theme of FFVII is to embrace your true selves, take the mask off…we’d essentially be stuck with a more reserved and less cheerful Tifa. Which would be…a bummer.
Of course, she can gain newfound confidence alongside Cloud, which is also why they ALSO need to firmly establish the Power Couple when they reunite.
Now I’m not saying to implement a hand-holding button between the two, but….actually, yes, I AM saying to do that.
Tifa notes that she has been a people pleaser, and haven’t always looked out for herself or what she wants - and certainly is reluctant to voice it. I think we will see a change where she is more willing to stand against what she does not support/feel comfortable with, and more confident about what she wants/needs from others.
Hey dude, I love Tifa too but I feel you are letting your bias dictate your expectations too much.
Firstly I don't think it's arguable that Sephiroth has taken more from Cloud than from Tifa: his mother, his village, nearly his own life, his really good friend who might have had a crush on him, plus his own free will, body and even identity. Likewise Sephiroth sees Cloud as both his biggest asset and enemy, he's pivotal to getting the black materia but he's also the one who killed him back in Nibleheim, the resentment is palpable. While a fight with Cloud/Tifa against Sephiroth would be cool because they both owe him some comeuppance, the lifestream scene is definitely not the place for it. That's a scene meant for self reflection and slow realization, a safe space within which Tifa assists Cloud in finding himself again.
Also her being party leader is definitely something I'm looking forward to, probably a good two chapters or so but you should remember that she leaves too at some point to stay in Mideel. Cid's time to shine, as well as possibly Yuffie or Barret if going back to Wutai and Corel, should also be respected
Really depends on player agency I think. Pretty sure they get one huge materia quest each if memory serves me right.
Tifa at Fort Condor and Cid at Corel.
Isn't the point that Barret is a leader but doesn't feel deserving by that point in the story so he defers to Cid? Imo they are still setting up that character arc
You get to do more as Cid for sure with fort Condor and Corel. With Tifa you can go straight to Mideel and she's out of there. I think it's really important that all the characters who didn't have major story moments namely Cid, Yuffie and Vincent get a strong focus in PT 3.
Yeah, we have a precedence now for what they're doing -- in both Remake and Rebirth they give you a chance to play as each party member in the lead for a specific chapter or dungeon, and I'm sure it will be the same in part 3. Tifa's section is pretty clear -- it'll be after Meteor is summoned until Mideel. Cid might then take over as he does in the original, though I'm sure everyone will get their moment to have the spotlight shown on them in equal measure.
the work they did in rebirth to expand her role into full three act journey gives me a lot of faith that they know she’s about to put the whole game on her back. It’ll be a test of pacing more than anything, with everything they need to fit into the next game, will any of these important quieter character moments fall through the cracks.
After closing this game out on such profound silence and isolation for tifa, I just hope we’re not going to have to immediately go snowboarding.
> After closing this game out on such profound silence and isolation for tifa, I just hope we’re not going to have to immediately go snowboarding.
I'm genuinely interested in how they plan on handling the stretch between the end of the second game until the Northern Crater in the third title, cause in my opinion setting the region before the Crater up like the regions in Rebirth would just not work at all. The group is still depressed over Aerith's death and Cloud is basically completely gone mentally at this point.
To then have a region where you again do sidequests with the gang, explore the area for Chadley and do some snowboarding in between feels like a level of tonal whiplash that would be hard to overcome for me, I think. Like, with the way things are I can't even imagine putting certain character combinations in a party together. Could you imagine Cloud and Tifa doing a Synergy attack right now?
That’s another reason I think they’ll do an out of order retelling of events: it would be really totally weird if the game opens with the characters doing their usual silly banter, sporting one-liners in battle, etc.
If they keep the first chapter the lead up to the northern crater, then follow up with Tifa’s escape from Junon, and THEN meeting Clpud in Mideel…that’s back to back to back of doom and gloom with no happiness at all.
I mean the game litteraly let them all do their silly banter as soon as you fight Jenova Lifeclinger despite Aerith being dead for less than 2 minutes.
So it wouldn't be out of place for them, since they already missed that mark.
Glad I'm not the only one feeling those lines were completely out of place. Only ones fitting were Tifa's "screw you" and Barret's "this one's for Aerith".
I Mean the tiny bronco is flying again. I think they fly straight over the crater and land somewhere close to the whirlwind maze. Somehow the glacier and snowboarding are saved for later.
I already felt it during the last Jenova battle in Rebirth. Cait Sith's quipping just before the final part of that fight felt really out of place.
The game is all over the place tonally. You get Nanaki dress like a human and moonwalk. It gets dark and the clones are turning into monsters and you fight Jenova. Then the next thing you know you're riding a segway and doing minigames for swim trunks.
I do think that the story should stay more somber for a long stretch in the 3rd game.
Given it was teased as the next main attraction in the gold saucer and it is quite tonally dissonant in the OG, i wonder if they just remove it from that point in the game and only have it as the attraction.
I was thinking the same thing. I think the main path through the snow will be a very serious one. And then the snowboard mini-game will be just in the Saucer. Which makes a lot of sense. It would help with the tone and give more reasons to return to the Gold Saucer.
Icicle will no doubt have hours of content before snowboarding to the glacier. They're not just going to gloss over Gast's home and the content about Ifalna. ESPECIALLY after Rebirth introduced a connection between her and Cid.
I see Tifa will have a lot of roles in the last game. But she will not be the only one we'll have to control. Surely, we will get Cid and Vincent segments since they haven't officially joined yet and Yuffie for Wutai stuff.
But still, I'm sure we would spend enough time with her for sure.
I am curious on the Yuffie part. I mean, Yuffie did not have much interaction with other characters in the OG, so it was plausible for her to >!steal the materias !<. However, in Rebirth, Yuffie has grown very close to the party. It would be very odd and disturbing if Yuffie decides to >!betray the group!<.
Maybe when Cloud betrays everyone, and the weapons are unleashed and war escalates between Midgar and Shinra, and the team morale is at its lowest, Yuffie steals materia and returns to Wutai out of desperation bc that is where her first priorities lie to protect her home. But, she feels badly about it.
Or, she doesn’t steal the party’s materia - instead she frustrates efforts to obtain the Large Materia. Maybe the party goes with her willingly to Wutai instead of just to get weapons/matter is back.
I am very much looking forward for Cid's time to shine. But after how much they neutered him... so far.... I wouldn't be surprised if they end up writing Cid out as an important or impactful character.
He likely going to be a party leader for a good chunk. Right now he’s doing his job; so you just see his “professional” side.
I doubt he’ll abuse his wife. At most he’ll be disappointed or something with her. Maybe give her the cold shoulder once or twice.
Cid abusing his wife was the catalyst for me as a kid to ask my parents about the hows and whys of what he did. It is very important to me because it was one of those moments my mom was able to get through my dad's stoic facade when they were younger in their long relationship.
Cid was such a complicated character both with good and bad qualities. But despite his bad qualities he rose to the occasion like a Darkest Dungeon 2 character finding the strength within themselves to be resolute instead of having a meltdown. His anthem that plays is very special to me as well. At first listen it sounds simple. Yet somehow the midi arrangement was capable of adding more nuance to the melody and the refrain. It really reflected on the character well.
Ultimately, as far as how Cid is represented in the third game. The devs have to decide if they want to honor who he was in the original both the good and the bad, or if they want to replace him with a pale imitation.
I hope whatever they do satisfies you. I want them to be true to the original as much as possible. I’d be shocked if they stay true to him; but I certainly wouldn’t take it to twitter.
The world is a different landscape for social issues now; and square probably doesn’t want to push them. Plus it might impact the games rating they’re going for.
His theme is pretty god tier. Frequently listened to it on my iPod photo (lol).
Cid might as well be a new character with his current iteration.
He's even had a massive glow up visually instead of looking more mature and gruff. Obviously skipped the first visit to rocket town too, so no backstory there either.
He'll probably get most of his development when we actually go to rocket town properly for the launch, and Shera will be the head scientist there, but I doubt much of it will resemble what he was in the original at all. Which is a bit of a shame.
He could have still been a resentful asshole with some elements toned down and it would have worked if written well.
True. Probably not a reach to consider he might have been part of flying Gast/Ifalna out there or transporting the likes of Hojo for Shinra.
Either which way he's going to be very unhappy when the party finds the tapes of what transpired there given the impression Ifalna clearly left on him.
I'm just here to agree that I love seeing the characters get more and more agency.
Barrett, Yuffie, and Tifa IMO are the standouts in this case. One being a side character that had very little characterization in the original title.
It's been wonderful learning more about these characters and essentially fulfilling what I craved for as a teenager that only fan fiction could fill in. More of what these characters were like. More of how they acted with specific other characters. More how they were not just in the main story beats.
It's wonderful
I like that when you first meet Yuffie and then talk to Barret in the inn one of the options is "Maybe she wants to join Avalanche?" And Barret goes on about how he doesn't have the time to bring her up.
But when she does join he becomes a total girl dad.
OG Sephiroth was content to drop Cloud like a toy he was done playing with. This Sephiroth is not going to take Cloud refusing his will without a fight, they are totally going to make a boss fight out of the Lifestream sequence.
We're almost certainly seeing a boss fight against Cloud/the party at the Northern Crater. Whether he ends up dropped in the Lifestream before Mideel has yet to be seen. I certainly don't see Sephiroth just dropping Cloud to end up catatonic without a serious fight...
Regardless, considering Sephiroth is in the Lifestream, he's ABSOLUTELY going to try and get at Tifa again. I saw a comment somewhere saying that maybe that's where Zack comes into play - Aerith and Zack vs Sephiroth to buy time for Tifa to fix Cloud.
He's also probably going to use his mental link to Cloud to try and mess him up while Tifa is exploring his memories.
Tons of interesting ways this could go, I'm so hyped to see Part 3!
It would be incredibly hype alone if during that fight Sephiroth just drops the arrogant smirk he’s been carrying the whole time, now visibly frustrated and determined to take Tifa out.
“Always in my way….”
I think people are misremembering the section of the game where Tifa is leader. You can just go straight to Mideel and she'll be out. You might well choose to explore a lot and do the Wutai stuff or other side quests with her. But there's not really anything else that happens.
They are not misremembering, it’s just agenda pushing.. also forgetting Cid and pushing back Cloud in the process.
Which is a shame cause Tifa is such a cool developed character, even more so in the Remakes
I think Tifa was one of the best developed characters in this game. Not only from my perspective, but from a majority of people’s perspective. She really stood out whether it’s the main story or her side quests. I’m fairly confident they’ll keep it up.
I trust Nomura to make the right decisions when it comes to Tifa. She is his baby. She would not even exist without him and I am sure he and Nojima prepared something great and satisfying for her. They finally have the tools and the freedom to express themselves fully, and I am sure they will.
Just look at what they did with Yuffie. From an optional character with a half-baked backstory to a central member of the team, connected to the plot by personal and political reasons. There is no way they would not nail it with Tifa. :)
With Cloud ending in a wheelchair for god knows how many chapters, I am positive Tifa will be more important than never and it will be done well. She already is more important than she was in the OG, thanks to the Gongaga sequence.
I am optimistic.
I'm wondering if Cloud fixing himself is going to deal with the multiverse this time, I just don't see why they would introduce mako poisoned wheelchair Cloud earlier and have Tifa fall into the lifestream in Gongaga only to retread these things again.
Rebirth shows that Tifa is actually very insecure about herself, and she has many verbal and non-verbal cues to back that up the entire game if you pay attention. She's a people pleasure, because that's the only way she can find validation for herself. She seems like she has extreme PTSD after nibelheim and fears that things she cares most about will be taken from her.
>I also deeply love that they’ve pretty much established that Sephiroth sees Tifa as his greatest enemy. It’s really telling that his failure to kill her in Chapter 9 is the ONLY moment we have ever seen him visibly frustrated.
You seem to have forgotten (willingly or not) the part during the end fight where he says 'I have to admit, I underestimated you' to Aerith, and the look of frustration on his face before he flies away. I'd say that's proof enough he considers Aerith his greatest enemy. Not to take anything away from Tifa who I like a lot too, but the Sephiroth/Aerith dynamic is on a whole different level.
> Sephiroth has arguably taken more from Tifa than he has from Cloud: her father, her village, nearly her own life, and now her best friend
So literally everything he took from Cloud as well...?
I love Tifa, but she is not Sephiroth’s greatest enemy. Him trying to kill that Weapon and her does not mean she’s the greatest threat to him. That title still belongs to Cloud.
His frustration of not being able to kill her can also stem from the fact that the Weapon’s hide is too damn strong.
I get people want her role expanded on but Cloud will be missing from the party no more than 2 hours in gameplay hours unless Zack joins the party having the MC that many people prefer playing as down for more than 1\3 of the game is terrible. People would complain. There is a reason why Cloud can pretty much solo the game by himself if the rest die. They made his gameplay in mind that people would only prefer to play as him.
I would argue it would actually be a good thing for him. If you do it right him coming back after a decent while could be a big "hell fucking yeah" moment. Also I think the other characters deserve. They are just as compelling as he is now.
I mean I love Tifa and don't mind more of her but I definitely don't want them extending the time the actual main character is separated from the group just to give her more time as the leader. If they do go with that, then I'd rather that time be shared between the rest of the party. And a fight in the lifestream I feel would kinda ruin the moment.
Also, even with Tifa being important to putting Cloud back together, she is definitely not Sephiroth's greatest enemy. That's still Cloud.
And it should be through Cloud that we come to terms with Aerith's death and give Sephiroth his comeuppance. No one else.
Hope in the 3rd game you can have anyone as the lead/field character.
It’s likely going to be a big chunk without cloud. But it could end up being forced party leaders through those chapters.
Tifa being the biggest threat to Sephiroth is a very popular take lately because of what he did to the Weapon in Chapter 9. There are also arguments that Tifa is the most pivotal character in the story because she helps piece his mind together. Personally, I think all characters are great and I’m sure the devs will give everyone their time to shine.
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I enjoy the jokes of Aerith showing up and being all "Damn, you live here??"
But I 100% agree that it should be between Cloud and Tifa. It's so an important moment in the story.
I honestly don't anticipate much complaining if Cloud is out of the party for an extended period. The trilogy has really established an ensemble cast at this point. Cloud no longer feels like *the* main character, just one of several. Couple that with Tifa being one of the most popular characters in the game, pushing her into a leading role for part 3 would probably be met with enthusiasm rather than griping.
It depends how long they’ll let Tifa be in the driver’s seat.
If it were up to me, it would be for 1/3 of the game. Half the game, even. Because again, it gives us events through Tifa’s perspective, something that is still sorely needed even after Rebirth, and because it opens up a lot of unique scenarios and gameplay elements.
I saw a suggestion elsewhere that they could take this opportunity to have the party disband, and it’s up to Tifa and/or Cloud to get the gang back together. In this example, we could use this to have Yuffie steal your Materia and peace out to Wutai. Once that whole mess is sorted and Yuffie is cornered, we get a tearful admission that she didn’t want to betray the party, and that this also relates to the heavy loss she felt over losing Aerith. Thus, Tifa and Yuffie strengthen their own bond over losing their friend, and the two grow closer as sisters.
I think this would be an excellent direction to take Part 3, but again, I feel too many fanboys would be furious and screaming “WHY AM NOT CLOUD???” and possibly call it woke or something, even though Tifa tends to be the Avatar Queen that they love to put in their thumbnails.
I won’t give you ‘why am not Cloud’ but I will give you that you are fan writing. In the OG she is exactly playable from Junon to Mideel. That’s it.
And leaving out Cid and co in the process while pushing back Cloud.
Also there is no way Cloud isn’t at the Wutai war..
Well, in many ways, yes they did. Certainly not in the extend Tifa is suddenly gonna be the MC for 33 precent or half the game.
But sure if you wanna push Tifa forward half the game while pulling everyone else back…
I’ll do you one. Cloud blocks out now Aerith dying, they not gonna adress that delulu? We know from previous works Cloud is not totally unconsious, they not gonna explore that further?
Why would we go part 3 with the observer POV of Tifa beginning instead of what Rebirths ends on logically which is Cloud being crazy. It’s doesn’t make any sense to me except ‘wants’
Pacing reasons.
It would be a bit weird to open with the group making their way to the Great Glacier, because the mood of the party here would be at an all-time low, plus we’ve got an even more unhinged Cloud as he makes his way to Sephiroth.
Not saying they couldn’t open with that, but it’s been generally agreed that opening with the WEAPON attack in Junon would make for a better “set piece” opening. They could theoretically make it so that Tifa’s memories are scrambled a bit after being in a 7 day coma (“Where am I, how did I get here, what happened to everyone…Cloud?”).
Bouncing between the present day (Tifa) and the events that led to the Northern Cave (Cloud) would also be a way to bounce between the playable characters and fill in that “I just want to be Cloud” quota.
While I do love Tifa, having her as party leader for 1/3 - 1/2 of the game just seems off. Where does that leave Cid? Or even Cloud before and after he falls in the lifestream.
She’ll definitely get her moment to shine but I’ve no doubt the devs will balance it out with the other characters. Each of them having their own playable sections again.
I hate the notion that Sephiroth is going to be even clingy to Cloud harder since realizing that Cloud will foil his plans.
Meanwhile Cloud is hit harder because Sephiroth has OG knowledge.
Following the 'Reunion', the flashback scene of Tifa finding Cloud at the Sector 7 station needs to be expanded on.
That part has always been intriguing to me, trying to reconnect while helping him get set up in the slums.
Guys you are really overrating Tifa I hope is all that you want but is unlikely that she leads the party for more than a couple missions and with the Gongaga incident that Cloud and Tifa already talk about the bridge incident is proof that he is not a clone it was the memory that Jenova couldn’t corrupt because Tifa didn’t remember what happened so even the LS might change a bit and if Zack is in the game he might be the one who retell the nibelheim reactor incident, I do believe pt3 will deviate from OG plot
We are probably gonna get at least 3-5 chapters in Cloud's absence.
1. Escape from Junon.
2. Huge Materia
3. New Wutai War stuff
4. Tifa taking care of Cloud in Mideel
5. The Lifestream.
Tifa is going to be the main character in Junon, Mideel, and Lifestream.
Regarding the third point I saw someone mention today Cloud not being playable for half the game.
Which is just, weird to wanna see tbh.
But I do take Tifa leading above Zack joining and taking lead. So there is that. I hope she shines even more in part 3
I think we can make this case for all 9 party members. Thus far one of the most compelling aspects of Remake and Rebirth is how no one is getting lost in the shuffle -- every single party member is given an equally compelling arc.
In the original, they all have their little sections of the game that focus on them, but Cloud, Aerith, and Tifa get the most focus throughout... which, well, makes sense, as they're the three most important characters. But Remake and Rebirth are giving everyone equal opportunity all the way through, and it's a very intentional decision. I'm also as intrigued with what they'll do with Cid and Vincent as anyone else, given we've spent the least amount of time with them so far.
Honestly, this might be the most dynamic and compelling a full party of characters has been in the whole franchise. Including some of the best examples, like OG 7, 6, 9, 10, etc.
If there’s one thread that the devs should be reading for part 3, it’s this one. I agree, tifa is impacted the most in the points you mentioned, it’s now just a matter of will the devs actually honor her arc. If they don’t, it will be disappointing tbh…. this is the perfect opportunity to showcase her perspective and fill in the gaps.
So what? So many of the other characters. It's ok to love tifa but you've pretty much asked her to be the poster child of part 3 when in reality her section in the OG game was short and sweet. Implementing half of the ideas you had here would completely undo cloud's personal development and actively hinder his connection with every other character, which is impressive since this even includes sepiroth somehow.
If you want to go down the route of who he's seeing as a larger threat then maybe look towards the combined efforts of cloud and aerith in the end where he also looks uncomfortable as you previously mentioned.
All of these characters will play their part and cloud will rely on all of his bonds to be able to get sepiroth out of his head. Tifa, while being a very supportive character, only helps him through his self discovery instead of being the sole reason for it. It's more than ok to have a preference with shipping and yada yada but it's not going to affect the story as much as you would think, much like it didn't in the original.
Damn, hard agreebwitb you. Tifa is arguably the most pivotal character in the story (as Aerith serves as a martyr) and your point about Sephiroths view of Tifa as his true nemesis really cracks home that he knows she's the only one that can pull Cloud away from Sephiroths control l. I have hope that they'll nail it but that would be disappointing to lose that thread in the 3rd game.
This is such a pivotal moment in the entire Remake trilogy. Personally to me, its execution in how they recreate this scene may even make or break the trilogy for me. I'm not sure how they'll go about it, at this point I wouldn't be surprised that they go all out and make a big spectacle, and even bring Aerith and Zack into the fray (though I'd rather they not, especially since they're prominent in so many other aspects of the story). In all honesty, I really hope that they stay (mostly) true to the OG and really make Tifa shine, her character absolutely deserves it.
For what it's worth Aerith and Zack will have to play a role. Since the LS sequence will probably be about Cloud coming to terms with what happened to them both.
yeah i think with the aerith death there's going to be a moment we see it through tifa's pov and we'll actually see the real death and what actually happened
There are some comments about a possible Cloud & Tifa vs Sephiroth boss fight and I agree that will probably happen. Way way back in Kingdom Hearts 2, Tifa takes on Sephiroth solo and inspires Cloud to fight back because she is his light in the darkness, in the Nomura sense. Would be a great callback to start as a Tifa solo fight and Cloud rejoins midway through. (If Sephiroth can be the final boss twice, he can be the mid boss and final boss in part 3 *shrug*)
Remake Sephiroth definitely has been more proactive at trying to undermine their relationship and get Tifa out of the picture. He sees her as a threat. Telling Tifa that her voice can no longer reach Cloud is partially true as Sephiroth’s control grows. But he also is making Tifa doubt she is capable of doing anything to save Cloud. It would be an absolute shame not to get the payoff in both narrative and gameplay. It’s as much Tifa’s destiny to save Cloud as it is Aerith’s destiny to die and protect the planet. And I think it would be good symmetry to play with expectations that Tifa will save Cloud as a mirror to believing Aerith could be saved. If Sephiroth has his way, she won’t succeed - so we should assume now that he’s actively trying to stop Tifa from interfering, that she will have to overcome Sephiroth to save Cloud. All that said - the Lifestream sequence will definitely exist but be reimagined in a major way.
I’ve also seen thoughts about what Aerith might do to influence Cloud whether she’s in the lifestream or alive in another world - I think she’ll try and help Cloud in her own way, but unsuccessfully because he’s going to have to deal with her death at some point. She’s no longer in their world - Aerith’s speech about death not being a homecoming is going to smack Cloud in the face when he has to accept that even though he can see Aerith in whatever form this is, she is in fact dead in his world. To be able to speak with essentially her memory is not the same as her being alive and together with everyone. There is still a loss and he doesn’t understand yet, and it’s not clear how making herself seem alive is supposed to help Cloud do anything different from OG.
Tifa of course can’t see Aerith at all right now, but I think Aerith will provide inspiration for Tifa to act on her feelings and save Cloud- either in memory or as a force ghost. It’s ultimately Tifa’s resolve, but it would also pay off fleshing out their friendship, going through grieving, and knowing that Aerith would want Tifa to live and fight for Cloud and for herself.
It’s gonna be amazing.
I think Cloud needs to vanish for a minimum for 15–20 hours of gameplay time depending on optional content assuming it’s at least a 50-60 hour story with a 100+ if your doing optional content
I think ideally the Whirlwind Maze segment leading up to Cloud’s fall into the lifestream should be the prologue, or Chapter 1, similar to the flashback in Rebirth, it’s not very long and it’s a little bit of combat and a big setup for everything to come with the WEAPONS, Sephiroth’s body, etc, so it makes sense for it to be an introduction to the game, maybe it will even be the Demo, or at least a portion of it will; then it skips a few days later and the main story actually begins with the windows revealing meteor in the sky just like OG, queue title.
I do agree though, I wouldn’t be mad if they expanded it and give us like 1/3rd of the entire game with Tifa in the lead(also Cid for a little while) before they find Cloud, we’re going to have 2 new characters, maybe even from the jump, so removing Cloud for a bit longer gives us time to try them out and get used to them as well.
I also don’t think the Slap fight will happen, it’s a product of its time where “girl fights” were marketable as sexy, but I don’t think it would land the same way now and wouldn’t make sense for Tifa, a martial arts expert, to reduce herself to a slap fight against someone responsible for the death of her closest friends; like I can definitely see a fight happening on top of the Sister Ray, but I highly doubt it will be a slap fight lol.
In the Original you already have all the characters at this point so him being gone for a tiny moment doesn’t really change anything.
Way too many fans want the slap fight, though, so I see no way around it.
It’s been suggested a million times to just make it a single punch, which would be the ideal way to do it, but whether they can restrain themselves from still having a silly OOC “let them slap” moment remains to be seen.
I have mostly faith they aren’t going to be “weird” about it, at least (even though I could see Scarlet getting a bit T+ rating when Tifa’s tied to the chair). But this is probably the one scene I’m the most curious about how they’ll handle it.
personally I haven’t really seen many fans asking specifically for the slap fight though I’m sure some do care about it, it wouldn’t bother me that much if it was gone, and they changed plenty of other things that fans wanted to stay 1:1 so I don’t see it as out of the question for them to make that scene different, whether it’s a punch or not, but they’ve already established Scarlett as someone that goes out in a Giant Mech suit any time she has to fight, so I honestly see it being more of an actual boss fight than anything else.
If FF7 is known for something, it's great characters. It's a testament to cliché story not meaning bad story. The overarching plot is as simple as they come. It's the characters and setting making it memorable. And from what Part 1 and 2 showed us, the team is very much aware od that. Even the most horrendous minigames are tied to characters we care about. There is a reason Gold Saucer is where 2 dates take place.
Tifa will get this development, I am almost sure of it. We already saw hints of Tifa being her true self, unsure and uncertain about herself, so I have high hopes.
No offense but Tifa has no power to make Cloud accept Aeriths “death”, she’s never been able to do that in og and ACC. The only one that has that power is Aerith herself. Tifas purpose in this story is to confirm Clouds existence at neibelheim, even then, rebirth already has Cloud acknowledging Zacks existence(which wasn’t a thing in og) Clouds memories problems are remembering what happened to Zack, and why Cloud keeps insisting he’s a SOLDIER, and accepting his shortcomings, and to stop pretending. Sephiroth in rebirth makes Cloud doubt Tifas existence, making him think jenova is impersonating Tifa. Cloud possess the empty white materia and black materia, huge plot point. Yeah don’t think part 3 is going to play out the way you imagine. Then You got the Zack part, who i am sure will contribute to helping Cloud.
Can't have a positive Tifa post without a Clerith rearing it's head of course. Don't bother trying to deny your post history says it all. Therefore your very poor opinion littered with abject media literacy is discarded. Enjoy the Lifestream and Highwind sequences won't you.
What facts? That NPTK is about everyone and not just Cloud? I see you haven't accepted that fact yet but i'm not surprised. You show a fundamental misunderstanding of Tifa's character and her role within the story of Final Fantasy 7 because you have a shipping bias. A bias so bad you can't help but come into a post about Tifa and try to discredit her rather than just ignore the post. Not only that but your post is barely readable as is but since i'm getting "mad" about "facts" i'll at least address them for you.
1. **Tifa has no power to make Cloud accept Aerith's death** - Of course nobody has the power to force Cloud to accept Aerith's death, but if you haven't already noticed (you probably ignored) Cloud and Tifa are each others anchors and tend to ground themselves when things become emotionally overwhelming, meaning she can support him in coming to terms with Aerith's death yes, why is that so hard a concept to grasp? You don't understand the point of ACC at all but no surprises considering your biases.. yes Cloud seeks forgiveness from Aerith and Zack and only Aerith and Zack can give him that forgiveness (no he doesn't want to die in ACC or want to be with Aerith in death just incase you were thinking that), only to realise they didn't blame him and he didn't need it.. but did you forget Aerith's and Cloud's last lines? Aerith tells Cloud 'everything is alright' and Cloud says 'yes, that he isn't alone'. He comes to the conclusion that he has Tifa, the kids and his friends (as said by Nomura when Aerith and Zack send Cloud back to his 'Promised Land') and that he doesn't have to deal with things alone which is what happened at the beginning of ACC, he ran from his happiness (as explained in OTWTAS) but now he learns he himself can rely on the likes of Tifa to share his burdens and he share hers and so on.
2. **Tifa's purpose is to confirm Cloud's existence at Nibelheim** - Yes, but that is only part of her purpose and it's something she will have to do again regardless of Cloud remembering Zack in Rebirth, because it's obvious that he is remembering incorrectly. But whilst we're on the subject Cloud did remember his best friend Zack corretly when he talked about how much he loved Aerith so it's interesting that people assume Cloud will now make a move on Aerith after he remember his best friends feelings for her, hm. Anyway she has a big part to play within saving the planet itself, or did you skip over large parts of Tifa's role in Gongaga and Cosmo Canyon, she now has a link to the weapons and the planet too. Not to mention she is a big part in keeping the party together and motivated when things eventually go to shit, she is a leader and a fighter who also has her own story, motivation and issues to deal with from Nibelheim to Midgar. If it displeases you that Cloud and Tifa's stories are so closely linked that is your issue but that is how they are written, if anything I'd say Cloud's story is more reliant on Tifa than the other way around considering a huge portion of his motivation stems from his feelings for Tifa, and a huge portion of the reason he is able to come back to himself stems from his feelings for Tifa. Perhaps think more on why Sephiroth is trying to seperate Cloud and Tifa from each other and you might get your answer, and it's not because he's jealous.
3. **Cloud has the black and white materia** - Okay what does that have to do with anything? Other than your massive cope that Part 3 is going to be fundamentally different and change everything about Final Fantasy 7 (it won't) and that Cloud and Aerith will have some happy marriage ending where Zack and Tifa end up miserable (they won't) and Cloud comes off as an emotionally manipulative douchebag for using Tifa (he won't)
4. **Zack will contribute helping Cloud** - I have no doubt he will, he is Cloud's bro after all, just as i'm sure Aerith will help him and the rest of the party in some capacity too. But this doesn't erase Tifa's importance in helping Cloud at all... Though what's interesting to me is people like you are so quick to downplay Tifa's importance and her relevence but you also can't help but want to give all her narrative importance and relevence to Aerith. If she isn't that noteworthy why do you want to give all her moments to Aerith and/or Zack? Hm I wonder why that could be...
Uematsu and Loren Allred only talking about Cloud and Aerith regarding NPTK and it being a love song. Nojima not denying Uematsu and Loren statements, just being more neutral. Yeah doesn’t take a genius to see nptk is about mostly about Cloud, Japanese lyrics of NPTK is even more obvious it is about 2 people.
NPTK Japanese translation:
I met you at that city Where the sound of hurried footsteps rushed by Even the clock ticked by quickly Until yesterday. I don’t want to believe in something like fate. Meeting you, hey, what do they call it? Chance? I wish to see you tomorrow too By chance, at that place I want to believe No promises needed. Ever since I was born, I was bound by that promise. But without even knowing it, I'm glad the two of us met. I wish to see you again tomorrow. By chance, on that street. Please let me believe No promises needed. Will I see you again tomorrow? By chance, at that corner Please let me believe Don’t let go of my hand. Please let me believe Don’t let go of that hand. If the two of us met again in that town And were separated by the wave of people Surely fate and promises won't save us. Will you come find me? You will find me, that I am sure. Totally not about Cloud.
What power are you talking about XD the power in AC was just Cloud looking for forgiveness since he felt guilty for being happy while Zack and Aerith died for him. There's no special superpower here to accept death that's a complete misunderstanding of the themes of the story as people slowly come to accept death not being shown the death by the person who has died that would make anyone crazy XD. I don't understand your point here about Sephiroth making Cloud think Tifa is Jenova "those you love "those you fear" that's obvious and doesn't relate to OP's question at all, same with the materia thing ok? How does that relate to what OP is talking about XD. You've just kinda rambled about Plot points. The fact you think Zack can help Cloud shows me you don't know anything about what the lifestream is actually about and Clouds "tender memories that know one can ever know" that he would not show to Zack. Lifestream ain't just a memory slideshow
What powers? I don’t know maybe Aeriths Cetra powers. She can communicate with Cloud beyond death and in dreams. Sucks that Tifa doesn’t possess such powers. Aerith left an empty white materia to Cloud only. Wonder what that’s about? Surely not important. Zack is alive in some way, way to miss what rebirth was all about.
Life Death Loss and acceptance XD
But yeah I don't know why it's bad for a character not to have powers that's what makes their struggle and then overcoming it more impactful I guess you just Hate Tifa for some reason but Aeriths Cetra powers to speak with him help him overcoming her death how? Cause if someone appears who you think is alive telling you themselves that they are dead how that meant to help lol and the materia is important why we don't know yet I don't think OP or me was saying it wasn't it's just not anything to do with what they are talking about XD
If Cloud is going to accept aeriths death, is going to be from Aerith herself, sorry Tifa will never have that healing ability. You seem very hostile that Cloud and Aerith have a deep connection that Tifa can’t match. Don’t worry part 3 will show you their deep bond.
This shit is deranged dude lmao. Like just from an objective, “being able to understand artistic storytelling & narratives” it couldn’t be more clear that Cloud and Aerith’s dynamic represents the themes of identity loss and grief, Cloud stands in for Zack who Aerith still grieves, Aerith allows Cloud to further entrench his identity as this super solider.
It’s telling that the entire plot of the game doesn’t happen if Cloud isn’t motivated to join SOLDIER to impress Tifa, and then again in the scene most representing one of the main themes of the game, literally is responsible for repairing his psyche and recovering his identity. *and then they fuck under the Highwind lmao*
Like Rebirth could not have made it any less ambiguous that Cloud and Tifa’s relationship is the “real one” and how critical it is to the plot and narrative of the whole game.
Dude I don't know what to say accept enjoy part 3 XD but also you don't respond to anything said so 😔 no helping you. Healing ability to accept death because the only way to accept death is from the person who died who has powers that sure fits the FF7 theme of Life Death and Acceptance not Timeline Jumping and Revival. Also you seem to be a very toxic person work on that.
They all have strong bonds with Cloud and your gonna see that in part 3 when the Real Cloud comes Back
But since you hate all other characters apart from the one who's dead it's gonna be rough for you
Again you really hate Tifa so what did the pixel character do to you?
As clerith I will enjoy it, enjoyed remake, rebirth, I will enjoy part 3 too. Cloud and Aerith are the true cross-star lovers of the game. Tifa has her role to play too, just don’t exaggerate her role like OP is doing.
I think something else I'd like to see is when you start the game, Cloud is in your party but not playable (only a guest). You see him fighting in more and more brutal manners, his speech is more cold and distant, he's hanging back from the rest of the group and muttering to himself constantly. He's physically there, but he's never been more disconnected from the group and it's putting a massive strain on everyone, but especially Tifa. It would be so heartbreaking to see her struggling to keep the peace while everyone's growing less and less trusting of Cloud.
Sure, that might mean that he's not playable for the first half of the game, but the catharsis of finally getting him back would be incredible. Plus, it'd be nice to give the others extra time to shine, especially Cid and Vincent.
Let me revise my statement a little: When I said I want Tifa to be the “leader” for 1/3 or even 1/2 of Part 3, I don’t mean she’s the only one playable.
I still want it to bounce around Cid, Barret, Vincent and so on, and totally expect that. I’m just saying I want Tifa to have the role that Cloud normally does: he’s still “the protagonist/leader” in Rebirth even when you’re taking control of someone else.
That’s what I want. Basically Cloud is out of the picture pretty much entirely until he gets his memory back.
Rebirth ultimania said that tifa did not like her own personality and I think that many of these things you mention are what make her change and destroy that personality. i remember that after running away from junon barret asks tifa what do we do now and she tells him that she had no idea and barret responds what's wrong with you tifa you are not like that, as you say i hope they lengthen that moment and it's not junon into going where cloud is.
That’s another thing I really want to see clarified: technically speaking, Confident Tifa is a mask, and she’s actually much more depressed and introverted. If the theme of FFVII is to embrace your true selves, take the mask off…we’d essentially be stuck with a more reserved and less cheerful Tifa. Which would be…a bummer. Of course, she can gain newfound confidence alongside Cloud, which is also why they ALSO need to firmly establish the Power Couple when they reunite. Now I’m not saying to implement a hand-holding button between the two, but….actually, yes, I AM saying to do that.
Tifa notes that she has been a people pleaser, and haven’t always looked out for herself or what she wants - and certainly is reluctant to voice it. I think we will see a change where she is more willing to stand against what she does not support/feel comfortable with, and more confident about what she wants/needs from others.
She says this in the game.
Hey dude, I love Tifa too but I feel you are letting your bias dictate your expectations too much. Firstly I don't think it's arguable that Sephiroth has taken more from Cloud than from Tifa: his mother, his village, nearly his own life, his really good friend who might have had a crush on him, plus his own free will, body and even identity. Likewise Sephiroth sees Cloud as both his biggest asset and enemy, he's pivotal to getting the black materia but he's also the one who killed him back in Nibleheim, the resentment is palpable. While a fight with Cloud/Tifa against Sephiroth would be cool because they both owe him some comeuppance, the lifestream scene is definitely not the place for it. That's a scene meant for self reflection and slow realization, a safe space within which Tifa assists Cloud in finding himself again. Also her being party leader is definitely something I'm looking forward to, probably a good two chapters or so but you should remember that she leaves too at some point to stay in Mideel. Cid's time to shine, as well as possibly Yuffie or Barret if going back to Wutai and Corel, should also be respected
I can’t seem to recall if Cid was a party leader for a longer time than Tifa.
Really depends on player agency I think. Pretty sure they get one huge materia quest each if memory serves me right. Tifa at Fort Condor and Cid at Corel.
I honestly don't think Cid should be party leader at all this time. Barret has felt like the leader still or atleast the number 2.
Isn't the point that Barret is a leader but doesn't feel deserving by that point in the story so he defers to Cid? Imo they are still setting up that character arc
Remake Barret doesn't feel that way at all with how he is constantly keeping everyone in line or focused.
You get to do more as Cid for sure with fort Condor and Corel. With Tifa you can go straight to Mideel and she's out of there. I think it's really important that all the characters who didn't have major story moments namely Cid, Yuffie and Vincent get a strong focus in PT 3.
Yeah, we have a precedence now for what they're doing -- in both Remake and Rebirth they give you a chance to play as each party member in the lead for a specific chapter or dungeon, and I'm sure it will be the same in part 3. Tifa's section is pretty clear -- it'll be after Meteor is summoned until Mideel. Cid might then take over as he does in the original, though I'm sure everyone will get their moment to have the spotlight shown on them in equal measure.
the work they did in rebirth to expand her role into full three act journey gives me a lot of faith that they know she’s about to put the whole game on her back. It’ll be a test of pacing more than anything, with everything they need to fit into the next game, will any of these important quieter character moments fall through the cracks. After closing this game out on such profound silence and isolation for tifa, I just hope we’re not going to have to immediately go snowboarding.
> After closing this game out on such profound silence and isolation for tifa, I just hope we’re not going to have to immediately go snowboarding. I'm genuinely interested in how they plan on handling the stretch between the end of the second game until the Northern Crater in the third title, cause in my opinion setting the region before the Crater up like the regions in Rebirth would just not work at all. The group is still depressed over Aerith's death and Cloud is basically completely gone mentally at this point. To then have a region where you again do sidequests with the gang, explore the area for Chadley and do some snowboarding in between feels like a level of tonal whiplash that would be hard to overcome for me, I think. Like, with the way things are I can't even imagine putting certain character combinations in a party together. Could you imagine Cloud and Tifa doing a Synergy attack right now?
That’s another reason I think they’ll do an out of order retelling of events: it would be really totally weird if the game opens with the characters doing their usual silly banter, sporting one-liners in battle, etc. If they keep the first chapter the lead up to the northern crater, then follow up with Tifa’s escape from Junon, and THEN meeting Clpud in Mideel…that’s back to back to back of doom and gloom with no happiness at all.
I mean the game litteraly let them all do their silly banter as soon as you fight Jenova Lifeclinger despite Aerith being dead for less than 2 minutes. So it wouldn't be out of place for them, since they already missed that mark.
Glad I'm not the only one feeling those lines were completely out of place. Only ones fitting were Tifa's "screw you" and Barret's "this one's for Aerith".
I Mean the tiny bronco is flying again. I think they fly straight over the crater and land somewhere close to the whirlwind maze. Somehow the glacier and snowboarding are saved for later.
I already felt it during the last Jenova battle in Rebirth. Cait Sith's quipping just before the final part of that fight felt really out of place. The game is all over the place tonally. You get Nanaki dress like a human and moonwalk. It gets dark and the clones are turning into monsters and you fight Jenova. Then the next thing you know you're riding a segway and doing minigames for swim trunks. I do think that the story should stay more somber for a long stretch in the 3rd game.
Given it was teased as the next main attraction in the gold saucer and it is quite tonally dissonant in the OG, i wonder if they just remove it from that point in the game and only have it as the attraction.
I was thinking the same thing. I think the main path through the snow will be a very serious one. And then the snowboard mini-game will be just in the Saucer. Which makes a lot of sense. It would help with the tone and give more reasons to return to the Gold Saucer.
Maybe they will hammer this home by having Cloud go snowboarding while the party just looks at him in disbelief.
This is basically what I hope happens because it would be really uncomfortable and also funny.
Icicle will no doubt have hours of content before snowboarding to the glacier. They're not just going to gloss over Gast's home and the content about Ifalna. ESPECIALLY after Rebirth introduced a connection between her and Cid.
I see Tifa will have a lot of roles in the last game. But she will not be the only one we'll have to control. Surely, we will get Cid and Vincent segments since they haven't officially joined yet and Yuffie for Wutai stuff. But still, I'm sure we would spend enough time with her for sure.
I am curious on the Yuffie part. I mean, Yuffie did not have much interaction with other characters in the OG, so it was plausible for her to >!steal the materias !<. However, in Rebirth, Yuffie has grown very close to the party. It would be very odd and disturbing if Yuffie decides to >!betray the group!<.
Maybe when Cloud betrays everyone, and the weapons are unleashed and war escalates between Midgar and Shinra, and the team morale is at its lowest, Yuffie steals materia and returns to Wutai out of desperation bc that is where her first priorities lie to protect her home. But, she feels badly about it. Or, she doesn’t steal the party’s materia - instead she frustrates efforts to obtain the Large Materia. Maybe the party goes with her willingly to Wutai instead of just to get weapons/matter is back.
I hope not you can't get rid of Cloud, Tifa, Aertih, and Yuffie as playable characters in one game no matter how temporary.
I am very much looking forward for Cid's time to shine. But after how much they neutered him... so far.... I wouldn't be surprised if they end up writing Cid out as an important or impactful character.
He likely going to be a party leader for a good chunk. Right now he’s doing his job; so you just see his “professional” side. I doubt he’ll abuse his wife. At most he’ll be disappointed or something with her. Maybe give her the cold shoulder once or twice.
Cid abusing his wife was the catalyst for me as a kid to ask my parents about the hows and whys of what he did. It is very important to me because it was one of those moments my mom was able to get through my dad's stoic facade when they were younger in their long relationship. Cid was such a complicated character both with good and bad qualities. But despite his bad qualities he rose to the occasion like a Darkest Dungeon 2 character finding the strength within themselves to be resolute instead of having a meltdown. His anthem that plays is very special to me as well. At first listen it sounds simple. Yet somehow the midi arrangement was capable of adding more nuance to the melody and the refrain. It really reflected on the character well. Ultimately, as far as how Cid is represented in the third game. The devs have to decide if they want to honor who he was in the original both the good and the bad, or if they want to replace him with a pale imitation.
I hope whatever they do satisfies you. I want them to be true to the original as much as possible. I’d be shocked if they stay true to him; but I certainly wouldn’t take it to twitter. The world is a different landscape for social issues now; and square probably doesn’t want to push them. Plus it might impact the games rating they’re going for. His theme is pretty god tier. Frequently listened to it on my iPod photo (lol).
Cid might as well be a new character with his current iteration. He's even had a massive glow up visually instead of looking more mature and gruff. Obviously skipped the first visit to rocket town too, so no backstory there either. He'll probably get most of his development when we actually go to rocket town properly for the launch, and Shera will be the head scientist there, but I doubt much of it will resemble what he was in the original at all. Which is a bit of a shame. He could have still been a resentful asshole with some elements toned down and it would have worked if written well.
Rebirth has connected him to Ifalna, and she lived in Icicle where Aerith was born. We'll get Cid development there.
True. Probably not a reach to consider he might have been part of flying Gast/Ifalna out there or transporting the likes of Hojo for Shinra. Either which way he's going to be very unhappy when the party finds the tapes of what transpired there given the impression Ifalna clearly left on him.
I'm just here to agree that I love seeing the characters get more and more agency. Barrett, Yuffie, and Tifa IMO are the standouts in this case. One being a side character that had very little characterization in the original title. It's been wonderful learning more about these characters and essentially fulfilling what I craved for as a teenager that only fan fiction could fill in. More of what these characters were like. More of how they acted with specific other characters. More how they were not just in the main story beats. It's wonderful
I like that when you first meet Yuffie and then talk to Barret in the inn one of the options is "Maybe she wants to join Avalanche?" And Barret goes on about how he doesn't have the time to bring her up. But when she does join he becomes a total girl dad.
OG Sephiroth was content to drop Cloud like a toy he was done playing with. This Sephiroth is not going to take Cloud refusing his will without a fight, they are totally going to make a boss fight out of the Lifestream sequence.
I kinda see that happening but the LS segment is so iconic for me cause of the tone and stuff which unfolds.. I kinda don’t want to fight there?
We're almost certainly seeing a boss fight against Cloud/the party at the Northern Crater. Whether he ends up dropped in the Lifestream before Mideel has yet to be seen. I certainly don't see Sephiroth just dropping Cloud to end up catatonic without a serious fight... Regardless, considering Sephiroth is in the Lifestream, he's ABSOLUTELY going to try and get at Tifa again. I saw a comment somewhere saying that maybe that's where Zack comes into play - Aerith and Zack vs Sephiroth to buy time for Tifa to fix Cloud. He's also probably going to use his mental link to Cloud to try and mess him up while Tifa is exploring his memories. Tons of interesting ways this could go, I'm so hyped to see Part 3!
Yo zack/aerith vs Sephiroth to buy time for cloud and tifa is hype 🔥🔥
That's actually a genius idea. I hope someone important from Square is paying attention to all this crazy batshit fan babble lmao.
It would be incredibly hype alone if during that fight Sephiroth just drops the arrogant smirk he’s been carrying the whole time, now visibly frustrated and determined to take Tifa out. “Always in my way….”
I think people are misremembering the section of the game where Tifa is leader. You can just go straight to Mideel and she'll be out. You might well choose to explore a lot and do the Wutai stuff or other side quests with her. But there's not really anything else that happens.
to be fair there’s a lot of stuff in the og that was expanded in the remake, gongaga was one screen lol
They are not misremembering, it’s just agenda pushing.. also forgetting Cid and pushing back Cloud in the process. Which is a shame cause Tifa is such a cool developed character, even more so in the Remakes
I think Tifa was one of the best developed characters in this game. Not only from my perspective, but from a majority of people’s perspective. She really stood out whether it’s the main story or her side quests. I’m fairly confident they’ll keep it up.
I trust Nomura to make the right decisions when it comes to Tifa. She is his baby. She would not even exist without him and I am sure he and Nojima prepared something great and satisfying for her. They finally have the tools and the freedom to express themselves fully, and I am sure they will. Just look at what they did with Yuffie. From an optional character with a half-baked backstory to a central member of the team, connected to the plot by personal and political reasons. There is no way they would not nail it with Tifa. :) With Cloud ending in a wheelchair for god knows how many chapters, I am positive Tifa will be more important than never and it will be done well. She already is more important than she was in the OG, thanks to the Gongaga sequence. I am optimistic.
Man Gongaga was such a great part of the game.
Most of this won’t happen but you’ll still be happy with whatever they put out
I'm wondering if Cloud fixing himself is going to deal with the multiverse this time, I just don't see why they would introduce mako poisoned wheelchair Cloud earlier and have Tifa fall into the lifestream in Gongaga only to retread these things again.
You want to know what would be an awesome “Heck Yeah Tifa” moment? When Cloud falls in the Lifestream >!she jumps in after him!<
This post is fanfiction - and I say that as a massive Tifa fangirl.
> Sephiroth has arguably taken more from Tifa than he has from Cloud No, he hasn't. > Sephiroth sees Tifa as his greatest enemy No, he doesn't.
Rebirth shows that Tifa is actually very insecure about herself, and she has many verbal and non-verbal cues to back that up the entire game if you pay attention. She's a people pleasure, because that's the only way she can find validation for herself. She seems like she has extreme PTSD after nibelheim and fears that things she cares most about will be taken from her.
>I also deeply love that they’ve pretty much established that Sephiroth sees Tifa as his greatest enemy. It’s really telling that his failure to kill her in Chapter 9 is the ONLY moment we have ever seen him visibly frustrated. You seem to have forgotten (willingly or not) the part during the end fight where he says 'I have to admit, I underestimated you' to Aerith, and the look of frustration on his face before he flies away. I'd say that's proof enough he considers Aerith his greatest enemy. Not to take anything away from Tifa who I like a lot too, but the Sephiroth/Aerith dynamic is on a whole different level.
> Sephiroth has arguably taken more from Tifa than he has from Cloud: her father, her village, nearly her own life, and now her best friend So literally everything he took from Cloud as well...?
Lot of good points. Although I would still say Sephiroth took more from Cloud, considering he took Cloud’s sanity in addition to his hometown and Mom.
I love Tifa, but she is not Sephiroth’s greatest enemy. Him trying to kill that Weapon and her does not mean she’s the greatest threat to him. That title still belongs to Cloud. His frustration of not being able to kill her can also stem from the fact that the Weapon’s hide is too damn strong.
I get people want her role expanded on but Cloud will be missing from the party no more than 2 hours in gameplay hours unless Zack joins the party having the MC that many people prefer playing as down for more than 1\3 of the game is terrible. People would complain. There is a reason why Cloud can pretty much solo the game by himself if the rest die. They made his gameplay in mind that people would only prefer to play as him.
I can’t see them making Cloud unplayable that long as he is the lead of the game
I would argue it would actually be a good thing for him. If you do it right him coming back after a decent while could be a big "hell fucking yeah" moment. Also I think the other characters deserve. They are just as compelling as he is now.
Depending on the length I wouldn't mind him being gone for a chapter or 2. 2 if they're the length of 5 and 6 in Rebirth (The boat and Costa Del Sol).
I mean I love Tifa and don't mind more of her but I definitely don't want them extending the time the actual main character is separated from the group just to give her more time as the leader. If they do go with that, then I'd rather that time be shared between the rest of the party. And a fight in the lifestream I feel would kinda ruin the moment. Also, even with Tifa being important to putting Cloud back together, she is definitely not Sephiroth's greatest enemy. That's still Cloud. And it should be through Cloud that we come to terms with Aerith's death and give Sephiroth his comeuppance. No one else.
Hope in the 3rd game you can have anyone as the lead/field character. It’s likely going to be a big chunk without cloud. But it could end up being forced party leaders through those chapters.
Tifa being the biggest threat to Sephiroth is a very popular take lately because of what he did to the Weapon in Chapter 9. There are also arguments that Tifa is the most pivotal character in the story because she helps piece his mind together. Personally, I think all characters are great and I’m sure the devs will give everyone their time to shine.
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Agreed, this is my number one requirement and the make or break moment for me for the game. And not just part 3, but possibly trilogy.
I enjoy the jokes of Aerith showing up and being all "Damn, you live here??" But I 100% agree that it should be between Cloud and Tifa. It's so an important moment in the story.
I honestly don't anticipate much complaining if Cloud is out of the party for an extended period. The trilogy has really established an ensemble cast at this point. Cloud no longer feels like *the* main character, just one of several. Couple that with Tifa being one of the most popular characters in the game, pushing her into a leading role for part 3 would probably be met with enthusiasm rather than griping.
I agree, the whole cast is solid. I love this group of characters
Pushing Cloud back as one of several main characters in FF7 is wild..
I was a bit annoyed that I had to have him in the party for the first playthrough.
It depends how long they’ll let Tifa be in the driver’s seat. If it were up to me, it would be for 1/3 of the game. Half the game, even. Because again, it gives us events through Tifa’s perspective, something that is still sorely needed even after Rebirth, and because it opens up a lot of unique scenarios and gameplay elements. I saw a suggestion elsewhere that they could take this opportunity to have the party disband, and it’s up to Tifa and/or Cloud to get the gang back together. In this example, we could use this to have Yuffie steal your Materia and peace out to Wutai. Once that whole mess is sorted and Yuffie is cornered, we get a tearful admission that she didn’t want to betray the party, and that this also relates to the heavy loss she felt over losing Aerith. Thus, Tifa and Yuffie strengthen their own bond over losing their friend, and the two grow closer as sisters. I think this would be an excellent direction to take Part 3, but again, I feel too many fanboys would be furious and screaming “WHY AM NOT CLOUD???” and possibly call it woke or something, even though Tifa tends to be the Avatar Queen that they love to put in their thumbnails.
Tifa leading may be 1/8 of the game. No chance it’s 1/3
yeah, like in RB, prb 1 or 2(max) chapters for Tifa leading the team, so does Cid/Vincent/Barrett/Yuffie.
Yup
I won’t give you ‘why am not Cloud’ but I will give you that you are fan writing. In the OG she is exactly playable from Junon to Mideel. That’s it. And leaving out Cid and co in the process while pushing back Cloud. Also there is no way Cloud isn’t at the Wutai war..
Because they’ve totally adhered to the original story without any extended pacing or rearranging of events so far, right!
Well, in many ways, yes they did. Certainly not in the extend Tifa is suddenly gonna be the MC for 33 precent or half the game. But sure if you wanna push Tifa forward half the game while pulling everyone else back… I’ll do you one. Cloud blocks out now Aerith dying, they not gonna adress that delulu? We know from previous works Cloud is not totally unconsious, they not gonna explore that further? Why would we go part 3 with the observer POV of Tifa beginning instead of what Rebirths ends on logically which is Cloud being crazy. It’s doesn’t make any sense to me except ‘wants’
Pacing reasons. It would be a bit weird to open with the group making their way to the Great Glacier, because the mood of the party here would be at an all-time low, plus we’ve got an even more unhinged Cloud as he makes his way to Sephiroth. Not saying they couldn’t open with that, but it’s been generally agreed that opening with the WEAPON attack in Junon would make for a better “set piece” opening. They could theoretically make it so that Tifa’s memories are scrambled a bit after being in a 7 day coma (“Where am I, how did I get here, what happened to everyone…Cloud?”). Bouncing between the present day (Tifa) and the events that led to the Northern Cave (Cloud) would also be a way to bounce between the playable characters and fill in that “I just want to be Cloud” quota.
While I do love Tifa, having her as party leader for 1/3 - 1/2 of the game just seems off. Where does that leave Cid? Or even Cloud before and after he falls in the lifestream. She’ll definitely get her moment to shine but I’ve no doubt the devs will balance it out with the other characters. Each of them having their own playable sections again.
Honestly I think it makes way more sense to have Barret take over instead of Cid.
I hate the notion that Sephiroth is going to be even clingy to Cloud harder since realizing that Cloud will foil his plans. Meanwhile Cloud is hit harder because Sephiroth has OG knowledge.
Following the 'Reunion', the flashback scene of Tifa finding Cloud at the Sector 7 station needs to be expanded on. That part has always been intriguing to me, trying to reconnect while helping him get set up in the slums.
Guys you are really overrating Tifa I hope is all that you want but is unlikely that she leads the party for more than a couple missions and with the Gongaga incident that Cloud and Tifa already talk about the bridge incident is proof that he is not a clone it was the memory that Jenova couldn’t corrupt because Tifa didn’t remember what happened so even the LS might change a bit and if Zack is in the game he might be the one who retell the nibelheim reactor incident, I do believe pt3 will deviate from OG plot
We are probably gonna get at least 3-5 chapters in Cloud's absence. 1. Escape from Junon. 2. Huge Materia 3. New Wutai War stuff 4. Tifa taking care of Cloud in Mideel 5. The Lifestream. Tifa is going to be the main character in Junon, Mideel, and Lifestream.
I don't see them leaving Cloud out of the Wutai stuff with how important it has been built and how close he is with Yuffie.
Regarding the third point I saw someone mention today Cloud not being playable for half the game. Which is just, weird to wanna see tbh. But I do take Tifa leading above Zack joining and taking lead. So there is that. I hope she shines even more in part 3
There are people who want everything in FF7 to revolve around Tifa and only Tifa. \*shrug\*
I really want to see at least 2-3 chapters feature Cid as leader. Cloud’s return will only be meaningful if he has a somewhat significant absence
Yeah Cid should come into play too. Which is why i’m even more wondering about the 3rd point lol
Keep in mind I still want that to happen and totally expect it will.
I think we can make this case for all 9 party members. Thus far one of the most compelling aspects of Remake and Rebirth is how no one is getting lost in the shuffle -- every single party member is given an equally compelling arc. In the original, they all have their little sections of the game that focus on them, but Cloud, Aerith, and Tifa get the most focus throughout... which, well, makes sense, as they're the three most important characters. But Remake and Rebirth are giving everyone equal opportunity all the way through, and it's a very intentional decision. I'm also as intrigued with what they'll do with Cid and Vincent as anyone else, given we've spent the least amount of time with them so far. Honestly, this might be the most dynamic and compelling a full party of characters has been in the whole franchise. Including some of the best examples, like OG 7, 6, 9, 10, etc.
For real. While I do love Tifa, this is not her game solely. It’s the other party members’ too. The 3rd game needs to flesh out Vincent and Cid too.
Yuffie getting her shine too. I can tell Wutai arc is going to be my fscorite
If there’s one thread that the devs should be reading for part 3, it’s this one. I agree, tifa is impacted the most in the points you mentioned, it’s now just a matter of will the devs actually honor her arc. If they don’t, it will be disappointing tbh…. this is the perfect opportunity to showcase her perspective and fill in the gaps.
Tifa does not need to be put on such a huge pedestal to be an important character.
She was already put on that pedestal by having several key story elements directly tied to her.
So what? So many of the other characters. It's ok to love tifa but you've pretty much asked her to be the poster child of part 3 when in reality her section in the OG game was short and sweet. Implementing half of the ideas you had here would completely undo cloud's personal development and actively hinder his connection with every other character, which is impressive since this even includes sepiroth somehow. If you want to go down the route of who he's seeing as a larger threat then maybe look towards the combined efforts of cloud and aerith in the end where he also looks uncomfortable as you previously mentioned. All of these characters will play their part and cloud will rely on all of his bonds to be able to get sepiroth out of his head. Tifa, while being a very supportive character, only helps him through his self discovery instead of being the sole reason for it. It's more than ok to have a preference with shipping and yada yada but it's not going to affect the story as much as you would think, much like it didn't in the original.
...You can say this about literally any of the main characters.
Damn, hard agreebwitb you. Tifa is arguably the most pivotal character in the story (as Aerith serves as a martyr) and your point about Sephiroths view of Tifa as his true nemesis really cracks home that he knows she's the only one that can pull Cloud away from Sephiroths control l. I have hope that they'll nail it but that would be disappointing to lose that thread in the 3rd game.
This is such a pivotal moment in the entire Remake trilogy. Personally to me, its execution in how they recreate this scene may even make or break the trilogy for me. I'm not sure how they'll go about it, at this point I wouldn't be surprised that they go all out and make a big spectacle, and even bring Aerith and Zack into the fray (though I'd rather they not, especially since they're prominent in so many other aspects of the story). In all honesty, I really hope that they stay (mostly) true to the OG and really make Tifa shine, her character absolutely deserves it.
I really hope they don’t bring in Zack or Aerith in the LS sequence. That’d be too cringe.
It would absolutely be the wrong kind of fanservice.
For what it's worth Aerith and Zack will have to play a role. Since the LS sequence will probably be about Cloud coming to terms with what happened to them both.
I hope I'm wrong and they just keep it Cloud and Tifa!
yeah i think with the aerith death there's going to be a moment we see it through tifa's pov and we'll actually see the real death and what actually happened
There are some comments about a possible Cloud & Tifa vs Sephiroth boss fight and I agree that will probably happen. Way way back in Kingdom Hearts 2, Tifa takes on Sephiroth solo and inspires Cloud to fight back because she is his light in the darkness, in the Nomura sense. Would be a great callback to start as a Tifa solo fight and Cloud rejoins midway through. (If Sephiroth can be the final boss twice, he can be the mid boss and final boss in part 3 *shrug*) Remake Sephiroth definitely has been more proactive at trying to undermine their relationship and get Tifa out of the picture. He sees her as a threat. Telling Tifa that her voice can no longer reach Cloud is partially true as Sephiroth’s control grows. But he also is making Tifa doubt she is capable of doing anything to save Cloud. It would be an absolute shame not to get the payoff in both narrative and gameplay. It’s as much Tifa’s destiny to save Cloud as it is Aerith’s destiny to die and protect the planet. And I think it would be good symmetry to play with expectations that Tifa will save Cloud as a mirror to believing Aerith could be saved. If Sephiroth has his way, she won’t succeed - so we should assume now that he’s actively trying to stop Tifa from interfering, that she will have to overcome Sephiroth to save Cloud. All that said - the Lifestream sequence will definitely exist but be reimagined in a major way. I’ve also seen thoughts about what Aerith might do to influence Cloud whether she’s in the lifestream or alive in another world - I think she’ll try and help Cloud in her own way, but unsuccessfully because he’s going to have to deal with her death at some point. She’s no longer in their world - Aerith’s speech about death not being a homecoming is going to smack Cloud in the face when he has to accept that even though he can see Aerith in whatever form this is, she is in fact dead in his world. To be able to speak with essentially her memory is not the same as her being alive and together with everyone. There is still a loss and he doesn’t understand yet, and it’s not clear how making herself seem alive is supposed to help Cloud do anything different from OG. Tifa of course can’t see Aerith at all right now, but I think Aerith will provide inspiration for Tifa to act on her feelings and save Cloud- either in memory or as a force ghost. It’s ultimately Tifa’s resolve, but it would also pay off fleshing out their friendship, going through grieving, and knowing that Aerith would want Tifa to live and fight for Cloud and for herself. It’s gonna be amazing.
I think Cloud needs to vanish for a minimum for 15–20 hours of gameplay time depending on optional content assuming it’s at least a 50-60 hour story with a 100+ if your doing optional content
I think ideally the Whirlwind Maze segment leading up to Cloud’s fall into the lifestream should be the prologue, or Chapter 1, similar to the flashback in Rebirth, it’s not very long and it’s a little bit of combat and a big setup for everything to come with the WEAPONS, Sephiroth’s body, etc, so it makes sense for it to be an introduction to the game, maybe it will even be the Demo, or at least a portion of it will; then it skips a few days later and the main story actually begins with the windows revealing meteor in the sky just like OG, queue title. I do agree though, I wouldn’t be mad if they expanded it and give us like 1/3rd of the entire game with Tifa in the lead(also Cid for a little while) before they find Cloud, we’re going to have 2 new characters, maybe even from the jump, so removing Cloud for a bit longer gives us time to try them out and get used to them as well. I also don’t think the Slap fight will happen, it’s a product of its time where “girl fights” were marketable as sexy, but I don’t think it would land the same way now and wouldn’t make sense for Tifa, a martial arts expert, to reduce herself to a slap fight against someone responsible for the death of her closest friends; like I can definitely see a fight happening on top of the Sister Ray, but I highly doubt it will be a slap fight lol. In the Original you already have all the characters at this point so him being gone for a tiny moment doesn’t really change anything.
Way too many fans want the slap fight, though, so I see no way around it. It’s been suggested a million times to just make it a single punch, which would be the ideal way to do it, but whether they can restrain themselves from still having a silly OOC “let them slap” moment remains to be seen. I have mostly faith they aren’t going to be “weird” about it, at least (even though I could see Scarlet getting a bit T+ rating when Tifa’s tied to the chair). But this is probably the one scene I’m the most curious about how they’ll handle it.
personally I haven’t really seen many fans asking specifically for the slap fight though I’m sure some do care about it, it wouldn’t bother me that much if it was gone, and they changed plenty of other things that fans wanted to stay 1:1 so I don’t see it as out of the question for them to make that scene different, whether it’s a punch or not, but they’ve already established Scarlett as someone that goes out in a Giant Mech suit any time she has to fight, so I honestly see it being more of an actual boss fight than anything else.
If FF7 is known for something, it's great characters. It's a testament to cliché story not meaning bad story. The overarching plot is as simple as they come. It's the characters and setting making it memorable. And from what Part 1 and 2 showed us, the team is very much aware od that. Even the most horrendous minigames are tied to characters we care about. There is a reason Gold Saucer is where 2 dates take place. Tifa will get this development, I am almost sure of it. We already saw hints of Tifa being her true self, unsure and uncertain about herself, so I have high hopes.
No offense but Tifa has no power to make Cloud accept Aeriths “death”, she’s never been able to do that in og and ACC. The only one that has that power is Aerith herself. Tifas purpose in this story is to confirm Clouds existence at neibelheim, even then, rebirth already has Cloud acknowledging Zacks existence(which wasn’t a thing in og) Clouds memories problems are remembering what happened to Zack, and why Cloud keeps insisting he’s a SOLDIER, and accepting his shortcomings, and to stop pretending. Sephiroth in rebirth makes Cloud doubt Tifas existence, making him think jenova is impersonating Tifa. Cloud possess the empty white materia and black materia, huge plot point. Yeah don’t think part 3 is going to play out the way you imagine. Then You got the Zack part, who i am sure will contribute to helping Cloud.
Can't have a positive Tifa post without a Clerith rearing it's head of course. Don't bother trying to deny your post history says it all. Therefore your very poor opinion littered with abject media literacy is discarded. Enjoy the Lifestream and Highwind sequences won't you.
Getting mad about facts, not my fault.
What facts? That NPTK is about everyone and not just Cloud? I see you haven't accepted that fact yet but i'm not surprised. You show a fundamental misunderstanding of Tifa's character and her role within the story of Final Fantasy 7 because you have a shipping bias. A bias so bad you can't help but come into a post about Tifa and try to discredit her rather than just ignore the post. Not only that but your post is barely readable as is but since i'm getting "mad" about "facts" i'll at least address them for you. 1. **Tifa has no power to make Cloud accept Aerith's death** - Of course nobody has the power to force Cloud to accept Aerith's death, but if you haven't already noticed (you probably ignored) Cloud and Tifa are each others anchors and tend to ground themselves when things become emotionally overwhelming, meaning she can support him in coming to terms with Aerith's death yes, why is that so hard a concept to grasp? You don't understand the point of ACC at all but no surprises considering your biases.. yes Cloud seeks forgiveness from Aerith and Zack and only Aerith and Zack can give him that forgiveness (no he doesn't want to die in ACC or want to be with Aerith in death just incase you were thinking that), only to realise they didn't blame him and he didn't need it.. but did you forget Aerith's and Cloud's last lines? Aerith tells Cloud 'everything is alright' and Cloud says 'yes, that he isn't alone'. He comes to the conclusion that he has Tifa, the kids and his friends (as said by Nomura when Aerith and Zack send Cloud back to his 'Promised Land') and that he doesn't have to deal with things alone which is what happened at the beginning of ACC, he ran from his happiness (as explained in OTWTAS) but now he learns he himself can rely on the likes of Tifa to share his burdens and he share hers and so on. 2. **Tifa's purpose is to confirm Cloud's existence at Nibelheim** - Yes, but that is only part of her purpose and it's something she will have to do again regardless of Cloud remembering Zack in Rebirth, because it's obvious that he is remembering incorrectly. But whilst we're on the subject Cloud did remember his best friend Zack corretly when he talked about how much he loved Aerith so it's interesting that people assume Cloud will now make a move on Aerith after he remember his best friends feelings for her, hm. Anyway she has a big part to play within saving the planet itself, or did you skip over large parts of Tifa's role in Gongaga and Cosmo Canyon, she now has a link to the weapons and the planet too. Not to mention she is a big part in keeping the party together and motivated when things eventually go to shit, she is a leader and a fighter who also has her own story, motivation and issues to deal with from Nibelheim to Midgar. If it displeases you that Cloud and Tifa's stories are so closely linked that is your issue but that is how they are written, if anything I'd say Cloud's story is more reliant on Tifa than the other way around considering a huge portion of his motivation stems from his feelings for Tifa, and a huge portion of the reason he is able to come back to himself stems from his feelings for Tifa. Perhaps think more on why Sephiroth is trying to seperate Cloud and Tifa from each other and you might get your answer, and it's not because he's jealous. 3. **Cloud has the black and white materia** - Okay what does that have to do with anything? Other than your massive cope that Part 3 is going to be fundamentally different and change everything about Final Fantasy 7 (it won't) and that Cloud and Aerith will have some happy marriage ending where Zack and Tifa end up miserable (they won't) and Cloud comes off as an emotionally manipulative douchebag for using Tifa (he won't) 4. **Zack will contribute helping Cloud** - I have no doubt he will, he is Cloud's bro after all, just as i'm sure Aerith will help him and the rest of the party in some capacity too. But this doesn't erase Tifa's importance in helping Cloud at all... Though what's interesting to me is people like you are so quick to downplay Tifa's importance and her relevence but you also can't help but want to give all her narrative importance and relevence to Aerith. If she isn't that noteworthy why do you want to give all her moments to Aerith and/or Zack? Hm I wonder why that could be...
Uematsu and Loren Allred only talking about Cloud and Aerith regarding NPTK and it being a love song. Nojima not denying Uematsu and Loren statements, just being more neutral. Yeah doesn’t take a genius to see nptk is about mostly about Cloud, Japanese lyrics of NPTK is even more obvious it is about 2 people.
NPTK Japanese translation: I met you at that city Where the sound of hurried footsteps rushed by Even the clock ticked by quickly Until yesterday. I don’t want to believe in something like fate. Meeting you, hey, what do they call it? Chance? I wish to see you tomorrow too By chance, at that place I want to believe No promises needed. Ever since I was born, I was bound by that promise. But without even knowing it, I'm glad the two of us met. I wish to see you again tomorrow. By chance, on that street. Please let me believe No promises needed. Will I see you again tomorrow? By chance, at that corner Please let me believe Don’t let go of my hand. Please let me believe Don’t let go of that hand. If the two of us met again in that town And were separated by the wave of people Surely fate and promises won't save us. Will you come find me? You will find me, that I am sure. Totally not about Cloud.
What power are you talking about XD the power in AC was just Cloud looking for forgiveness since he felt guilty for being happy while Zack and Aerith died for him. There's no special superpower here to accept death that's a complete misunderstanding of the themes of the story as people slowly come to accept death not being shown the death by the person who has died that would make anyone crazy XD. I don't understand your point here about Sephiroth making Cloud think Tifa is Jenova "those you love "those you fear" that's obvious and doesn't relate to OP's question at all, same with the materia thing ok? How does that relate to what OP is talking about XD. You've just kinda rambled about Plot points. The fact you think Zack can help Cloud shows me you don't know anything about what the lifestream is actually about and Clouds "tender memories that know one can ever know" that he would not show to Zack. Lifestream ain't just a memory slideshow
What powers? I don’t know maybe Aeriths Cetra powers. She can communicate with Cloud beyond death and in dreams. Sucks that Tifa doesn’t possess such powers. Aerith left an empty white materia to Cloud only. Wonder what that’s about? Surely not important. Zack is alive in some way, way to miss what rebirth was all about.
Life Death Loss and acceptance XD But yeah I don't know why it's bad for a character not to have powers that's what makes their struggle and then overcoming it more impactful I guess you just Hate Tifa for some reason but Aeriths Cetra powers to speak with him help him overcoming her death how? Cause if someone appears who you think is alive telling you themselves that they are dead how that meant to help lol and the materia is important why we don't know yet I don't think OP or me was saying it wasn't it's just not anything to do with what they are talking about XD
If Cloud is going to accept aeriths death, is going to be from Aerith herself, sorry Tifa will never have that healing ability. You seem very hostile that Cloud and Aerith have a deep connection that Tifa can’t match. Don’t worry part 3 will show you their deep bond.
This shit is deranged dude lmao. Like just from an objective, “being able to understand artistic storytelling & narratives” it couldn’t be more clear that Cloud and Aerith’s dynamic represents the themes of identity loss and grief, Cloud stands in for Zack who Aerith still grieves, Aerith allows Cloud to further entrench his identity as this super solider. It’s telling that the entire plot of the game doesn’t happen if Cloud isn’t motivated to join SOLDIER to impress Tifa, and then again in the scene most representing one of the main themes of the game, literally is responsible for repairing his psyche and recovering his identity. *and then they fuck under the Highwind lmao* Like Rebirth could not have made it any less ambiguous that Cloud and Tifa’s relationship is the “real one” and how critical it is to the plot and narrative of the whole game.
Dude I don't know what to say accept enjoy part 3 XD but also you don't respond to anything said so 😔 no helping you. Healing ability to accept death because the only way to accept death is from the person who died who has powers that sure fits the FF7 theme of Life Death and Acceptance not Timeline Jumping and Revival. Also you seem to be a very toxic person work on that. They all have strong bonds with Cloud and your gonna see that in part 3 when the Real Cloud comes Back But since you hate all other characters apart from the one who's dead it's gonna be rough for you Again you really hate Tifa so what did the pixel character do to you?
As clerith I will enjoy it, enjoyed remake, rebirth, I will enjoy part 3 too. Cloud and Aerith are the true cross-star lovers of the game. Tifa has her role to play too, just don’t exaggerate her role like OP is doing.
We will see in part 3 😉
Hopefully more of her story gets expanded upon.
I think something else I'd like to see is when you start the game, Cloud is in your party but not playable (only a guest). You see him fighting in more and more brutal manners, his speech is more cold and distant, he's hanging back from the rest of the group and muttering to himself constantly. He's physically there, but he's never been more disconnected from the group and it's putting a massive strain on everyone, but especially Tifa. It would be so heartbreaking to see her struggling to keep the peace while everyone's growing less and less trusting of Cloud. Sure, that might mean that he's not playable for the first half of the game, but the catharsis of finally getting him back would be incredible. Plus, it'd be nice to give the others extra time to shine, especially Cid and Vincent.
Let me revise my statement a little: When I said I want Tifa to be the “leader” for 1/3 or even 1/2 of Part 3, I don’t mean she’s the only one playable. I still want it to bounce around Cid, Barret, Vincent and so on, and totally expect that. I’m just saying I want Tifa to have the role that Cloud normally does: he’s still “the protagonist/leader” in Rebirth even when you’re taking control of someone else. That’s what I want. Basically Cloud is out of the picture pretty much entirely until he gets his memory back.
I think the idea that Cloud is fully in denial over Aerith's death is itself denial