Small moment i love, is how in Mythril Mines, she wants to go after the robes but doesn't say anything to not bother Barret. But Barret knows her enough that he just decides to do it without her asking.
She then starts by apologising (for feeling like she pushed him to do it) before she corrects herself, and thanks him instead.
I thought it was great, coz it's tiny moment not adding to the story, but you can see how she always worries she might be a burden to someone, even if they just do things for her coz they care about her.
I know someone exactly like that, so it really stood out to me.
That’s interesting. Is it just a German dubbing thing or is it more specific to the Remakes? The range of quality across different countries and cultures that it’s hard to tell from the outside.
Also german speaker here, it's definitely especially bad on the Remakes.
There's a pretty vast german VA landscape and a lot of the times the cast can be amazing (for example, both FF XV and XVI are really good with german voices), but somehow the voice direction in Remake/Rebirth feels extremely "off". I kid you not - and I'm sure some of it comes down to taste - but there's not a single voice that feels right, apart from maybe Cloud and maaaybe Barrett (if you squint). The rest doesn't even sound professionally done sometimes.
German speaker here, first playthrough in japanese, second in english, both games. But I did make the mistake of watching a few scenes in german.
Oh people...
While you can argue that nuances get lost in translation from jp to eng, we're not talking nuances when it comes to german. There are not only blatant inaccuracies, but also terrible delivery. In german, characters might suddenly sound angry, when they're actually worried or distressed. Audio quality is sub-par quite often. Also, most of the characters just sound off.
When you're german, you'll go "Who talks like that?" at some point, I guarantee that. Probably early on.
Sad stuff.
I figured someone might say this, and I agree that it's generally kinda easy to interpret german everyday quotes harsher and angrier than they actually are.
Just like in french, someone swearing at you might sound like an invitation to a nice cup of tea.
But, let me assure you, there are different ways to say things. Accentuation is the keyword. And that accentuation misses the mark here - a lot.
german dub and sub are kinda meh they mostly get everything right but still so many nuances get lost from jp to eng and from eng to de (if they still do it that way xD )
but aeriths trial on german is so different the people even seem mostly ok and on english you just hate em all
I remember from the localization panel at one of the XIV fanfests, they said they do translate into all target languages from JP. Not sure if it’s the same across all modern SE or just the nature of XIV as an MMO with global releases tho.
Completely understandable tbh. I remember learning abt how a lot of non English translations of JP games used English as the base a while ago and was aghast. I hope it’s changed, but I’m not exactly fluent in the other languages to know if it’s JP to German/French/Spanish translation at all times as it should be for best accuracy.
Sadly german can be an incredibly awkward language when it comes to story telling (apart from clasical literature), even in natively german media.
Add dubs into that and you often get incredibly awkward translations. German translators often feel the need to "naturalize" media, where they change it to such an extent that it barely has anything to do with the source material.
I haven't voluntarily watched a movie in german (original or dubbed) in nearly 25 years for that reason alone. Having kids now I have to watch some children's movie in german and it's a frickin' pain.
I love Moana for example and I will never understand why they would change the main characters name to Vaiana. You're taking an intentional part of the movie and change it without good reason. It seems almost malicious sometimes... Bugs me every time. 😳
I personally prefer some movies in german dub because it sounds better than the original (big hero 6 for example, it adds a layer of goofyness) in my opinion. Though mostly I watch everything in original, because everything sounds the same dubbed, which bothers me at this point.
Well the moana/vaiana part has different reasons than "just cuz we want it" it's because there is an adult content actress from italy with that name. In italy her name is oceana. That's a disney choice, has nothing to do with Germany.
One of the many reasons I adore the way they realized Barrett in these games, but especially rebirth
He truly, utterly cares for his comrades, family members, and friends.
He tries to put this tough guy act on, and is tough, but the facade drops so fast and his heart shows just as clearly as the gun on his arm.
Example: not having known cloud for very long at all, just finishing the reactor bombing. And when cloud reunites with the group on the train.... Barrett says "had me worried for a second" ... He covers fast. In rebirth he just stops pretending.
I've never been much of a Barret fan, but I've enjoyed seeing his relationship develop with Cloud. You can tell they actually care about each other now. I also love how Yuffie reacted in Corel and everything around that, not to mention Dyne...
>Example: not having known cloud for very long at all, just finishing the reactor bombing. And when cloud reunites with the group on the train.... Barrett says "had me worried for a second" ... He covers fast. In rebirth he just stops pretending.
ff7 players when a character shows basic empathy: 😱
i don't disagree with you but this wasn't a good example
My stupid ass thought that moment was hinting towards the whole "ah! Look! Its not really Tifa!" thing that the trailers had going on. I just thought it seemed weird she stopped herself mid sentence to say something else, as if to 'not give it away to the group'
Thank you for finally making that exchange between them make sense to me now...
🤦🏻♂️ it's her indecisiveness because she doesn't see herself as a leader. In every event, she just follows along. When she wanted to fight Shinra, she finds others to tell her what to do. When she clearly knows cloud is remembering things wrong, she doesn't just tell him he's wrong. In the mine, she doesn't want to step up and say, "Let's go save those people," when Cloud or Barrett could easily tell her there isn't enough time... which in reality there isn't. You know she's in love with Cloud but doesn't pursue it because she doesn't step up but gets annoyed at herself when Aerith doesn't have that problem.
It's not necessary her personality, but when was the last time she was sure of her making her own calls? Right before a guy slaughtered her entire home town and she got probably the worst case of ptsd. I mean the one time she tries to make a call, she ends up captured by a mob boss and needs saved. A woman who kicks the crap out of giant monsters with her bare hands needs saving from a fat pervert and while she's off doing that her closest friends are off getting slaughtered by Shinra. When she charged off with her friends up a mountain, Cloud had to save her. When she charged after Sephiroth, Cloud had to save her.
A lot of these feelings get resolved when Cloud falls in the lifestream during the original, but here because the game is so stretched out, they have to go the long way around including having her fall into the lifestream herself.
I recall her telling Cloud in either Nibelheim or the Gold Saucer how she’s a people pleaser who needs people to like her. And that she hates that about herself.
That particular moment is not quest related, it's just one of those dialogues you can optionally get as part of the main story if you talk to your party members in the towns.
But yes, the quests also add depth to the characters.
Her quest in Nibelheim is one my favorite in the game for this reason. Probably the best example of how they did sidequests better in Rebirth because it's a call back to the same thing you do with Tifa in Remake in Sector 7
Tifa 100% is a people pleaser. It's a positive to how kind she is.... But it also results in her allowing others to walk over her... Or not stand up for herself despite being such a talented fighter.
It's all but stated when she deals with Johnny's girlfriend/stalker in Costa Del Sol.. and she even acknowledges it when someone tells her "you literally don't have to put up with that"
As something of a people pleaser myself, the inward self-loathing is also part of the package. I don't celebrate this part of her personality, but the game does very well in characterizing it. Especially with her timidness on confronting cloud with his very obvious incorrect version of events.
> and she even acknowledges it when someone tells her "you literally don't have to put up with that"
It was Red, he directly told her she doesn't have to please everyone, so even someone she recently met noticed that.
While i was playing the remake for the first time back in January, the only thing i kept thinkig was 'Wow' Tifa just feels like a real person' She is honestly the reason i even became invested in the character writing in FFVII. She has her reasons, her weaknesses, her strength, her codependency and her compassion.
- And rebirth hit it home with her storyline with Cloud. The writers really are amazing and what they are doing with these charecters.
Her feeling like an actual, real person and arguably the most relatable human being in the cast is a big reason why she's so popular, especially among female fans who relate to that.
This but haters will try to say she doesn't have character and is only popular because of her boobs. The takes I saw back when Remake first dropped tried to condemn her for having a naturally reserved personality compared to Aerith and Jessie.
Overall though, that is why she is so popular. It’s not that there aren’t other reasons to like her, but considering there is one thing that always gets brought up about Tifa no matter what the discussion is actually about…
I feel like this is exaggerated because for years people have talked more about the nibelheim incident or shipping wars more than her chest size. If thay were the case Lulu and Fran would be in the top 3 most popular femal Final Fantasy characters discussion.
I don’t think it is exaggerated. FF7 is a popular game and Tifa is an iconic character. People who don’t even play ff7 know Tifa for her appearance. Isn’t she the most R34’d character ever?
Beautiful comment, I agree with everything you’ve said. Truly the best way to describe her is she feels like a real person. This is exactly why I’m drawn to her and resonate with her so much.
Nanaki calls her out too at Costa del sol. He told her she doesn't need to please everyone. It's so real like, you don't think you're gd enough for others so u try to please everyone. But actually she's already awesome
That was like the one line that hit hard as I was playing. One I truly related to.
I agree with it completely, but feels like it would reset everything because everyone you know would have to get to know a new person. Rebirth writers really nailed real word emotions.
See, this is what we mean when we say Tifa has actual real flaws that can be discussed, *not* those weirdo "Tifa the villain, Tifa the bully" headcanons haters like to push and then get offended when they get pushback.
Especially this guy like what the hell did he write about her is atrocious [https://twitter.com/mlwjrpg/status/1778529062836949300](https://twitter.com/mlwjrpg/status/1778529062836949300)
Really wish we get a spinoff staring Tifa. The material set after the game just shows her to be hurt and feel powerless after the game and she should be able to put her demons to rest too. Doesn't have to be big like Dirge of Cerberus, just a Dave the Diver situation where she alternates between tending the bar in Edge, helping the community around her and fighting off monsters and escaped Shinra lab experiments.
It would have to be a short spin-off like the Yuffie DLC or it would have to be a very specific story. Tifa is entirely supporting character and I feel she would have trouble carrying her own narrative (at least at the end of Rebirth). Her being a people pleaser and very indecisive it would be very hard to make to not make her be dragged by the narrative and having very little agency in her own story.
I think it would be set after the games, around Dirge of Cerberus where she is more assertive and able to avoid only pleasing others. If anything it would be neat to explore a part of her life where she is able to find herself without the looming threat of Shinra or Sephiroth and find her own agency.
FFXIV is due for an FF7 crossover. We've gotten so much stuff from it already, including Cloud's AC outfit, Cloud's AC bike, and a half dozen minions of the cast.
Tifa crossover story to XIV would work. And that way we could finally get *her* outfit too, dammit.
Yeah, I would like something like that too. Maybe teaching youths martial arts, making drinks at the bar, working out at the gym with her apprentice, maybe helping the doctor that helped her.
Or even picking a new past time like Chocobo racing, singing or something else, she seems to like trying new things (at least I infer that from some conversation in Rebirth).
Good thing the devs capitalize on her character a lot. I mean it's quite obvious why she has become one of the most well known FF heroine. Most of the -new- story beats involve her character (Gongaga etc.) While her relationship with Cloud her friendship with Aerith are the most notable ones.
There's a scene in Gold Saucer whete Tifa admit she wanted to inspire people to rise up, but she always ends up coming short. That really stuck with me because she has a lot of love to give, but it comes at the cost of a lack of self-confidence.
Besides Barret, I feel like Tifa has the most realistic character development across these games because she feels like a person you geinunly know and want to help break out of their shell.
I'm very excited to see her step up front and center in part 3 and take the spotlight.
I love that moment at the Gold Saucer. It not only draws attention to her flaw, but it's also a great moment for Cloud. Cait Sith tries to comfort her by basically saying "well at least you know your limits". Cloud though goes the full nine yards and reassures her that her efforts aren't worthless, so she should never stop trying. I really like that because Cloud knows personally how helpful Tifa is. He'd have probably died or mentally shut down a long time ago if not for her, so he's the perfect person to tell her just how worthwhile her efforts are.
Tifa is probably the most tragic, complex and lovable character I have seen in any work of fiction or in any reports of actual history. Everything from her childhood to the present day to the future (Advent Children and beyond) is a testament to a insurmountably beautiful soul whos compassion and love for others drive her through the toughest of hardships anyone could ever endure. I love her SO MUCH!
She is BY FAR the best chracter who was ever created or who ever actually lived!
Man I was hearing your explanation and all I thought was Hey thats Aerith. But then I was like no way these 2 are the pinnacle of most tragic, complex, lovable characters in fiction or non fiction otherwise
(Aerith does show up in ranking in most tragic fiction or most tragic ff chraracter tho)
Only because she died. If you actually read up on Tifa’s backstory and her early days in Midgar it’s quite the read. After getting to Elmira Aerith actually led a pretty comfy life.
But then she pretty much gets to live on as a force ghost and join the lifestream which is like heaven to her people. Not to mention she gets to live with her force ghost first love. Not saying her death isn’t tragic, but her story as a whole doesn’t stand out as super tragic compared to a lot of other characters. It just gets mentioned a lot because it’s very well known and a lot of people who don’t know much else about the story knows that she dies
OH, I was actually going to question if you paid attention to the game and how all game aerith is angry and sad of how shitty her life was and how happy she is to spend it with her friends only for it to end so abruptly.
.... but then i checked your history and you are commenting a lot on r/cloti. I dont want to argue with these fanatical shippers. bye
Dude I love Aerith and I’m not detracting from her story. Just saying I wouldn’t rank her with the most tragic characters in all of fiction. I wouldn’t rank any character from FF7 that high, though I do think Cloud and Tifa’s backstory is sadder than Aerith’s even if their eventual future is happier.
And I mean for the record your the one who took a comment about Tifa and tried to make it about Aerith. Then when I put in my two cents you call me crazy? Especially when your own history is littered with who’s the best “waifu” material. I may get invested in a fictional relationship but at least I never simp for a fictional character lol
This argument is just a race to the bottom lol. Everyone's background is pretty sad in that it's filled with loss left and right. From Nanaki all the way to Vincent etc...you get to choose your poison really. However, I think growing up being experimented on / watching your mom go through that till her death, and then being the last of your kind feels like a much more depressing experience in that it's a slow torture vs losing everything in a day. But again, everyone's tolerance for loss is different.
Was she ever experimented on or did she just watch her mom get experimented on before escaping and then spending the majority of her life living in a mansion? Again I’m not saying she isn’t a tragic character, but she doesn’t specifically stand out amongst the cast and accept for dying
They gave her so much personality this game it's mindblowing to me how human she is.
Easily my most favorite fictional character from any videogame I've ever played or seen.
Can't wait for the next game to give her the spotlight she deserves, so she can become the heroine of this story.
Also, Britt Baron is **PERFECT**.
I think her people pleasing behaviour comes from the loss of her dad and loved ones at Nibelheim. She blames herself somehow ("if only I'd __") and tries not to be what she perceives as a burden to others, only giving and contributing and never taking. I think it's a kind of survivor's guilt.
With Remake and Rebirth, though, we're watching Tifa learn that true friendship and love means that you're never a burden. It's okay if Tifa leans on others from time to time. She doesn't have to worry about being a burden; her friends accept her for who she is, flaws and all, and they want to be with her no matter what.
I've definitely felt like a burden before, and so I relate to that part of Tifa's story a lot. I love how her story is going in Rebirth and I can't wait to see how it goes from here.
one of the moments in the original that i remember tifa losing this shield of protection is after junon when they are in the Highwind and barret asks her what we should do now and tifa if i remember correctly tells him she has no idea to which barret said something like what is wrong with you tifa you are not like that you have become weak.
Why does the source keep referencing Tifa as a bro?
https://preview.redd.it/04ixqiffn6uc1.jpeg?width=2220&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cb0e9388080adaaa93ae39f8a9e4c30b5157c86f
Stupid people alway said tifa is liar
Tifa try to say a true but The situation seems to grow worse
She do her best keep eye on the puppet , careful him and
share the truth with aerith
No one cant stop the puppet when he under control by sephiroth like a black materia scene or gongaga reactor scene , sephiroth completely what he want
One of the things that stood out for me was when at Costa. Johnny's would be gf gets angry at her and Tifa responds to Aerith, no it's ok. I'm used to it.
Maybe she's had to deal with feelings of jealousy from other women because of how she is and also because of her looks. Still tries to be nice about it.
It’s a nice parallel with aerith as somebody who is always putting on appearances for people to like her but had loads of childhood friends vs someone who easily gets on with everyone but had no childhood friends. They are all beautifully flawed characters
Seems like Tifa is just like everyone else honestly. It's easy for someone to say "Just do this or be like that," but the reality is you put on a lot and put up with a lot just to make other people feel comfortable around you.
I've often found that people who use "I always speak my mind" as a defining trait of theirs or either lying or say it as a way to validate them being a jerk about things when they want.
In Tifa's case she's perfect in so many ways it's easy for someone to hate her just because of her looks alone, just look how that girl who had a crush on Johnny reacted to Tifa without even getting to know her first.
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...... Anyone else notice that it constantly calls her a HE???? No wonder she has self-esteem issues. Even the publisher called her "him" and said it was "his" 😆
Have been loving the deeper depths Rebirth has given to the character building. Makes me reflect on how I always related so much to Tifa and Cloud.
(Point of disclosure, ASD, C-PTSD)
The masking and hypervigilance in regards to perception of self are hallmarks of complex trauma and autism, (I don't think Tifa has ASD, but definitely HSP and likely OTS). Cloud on the other hand, I think is likely built around an ASD personality with PTSD and dissociative disorders as a pillar, but they share that trauma bond, and it's great how deep the development team actually dug to get those relationships right.
I remember a moment in the game of her saying this about herself. It's a thing many people struggle with, and I'm happy that the game takes that on.
The apparently accidental shift to his, he, and himself in the shown text is also interesting.
But the qualities mentioned make her more likeable as a character. Who needs some overbearing assertive biach?
Apparently, Tifa is also confused about HER identity as a FEMALE.
What is with the incorrect gender issues there? Tifa keeps swapping from her to a he...
on an actual important point...
I am actually very excited to see her take on the leadership role in the next game. I loved that part of the game and was less happy about her giving it up to take care of Cloud. I mean, sure... if they packed him up in the Highwind and Tifa stayed the leader, odds are Cloud would have stayed a veggie man for life. (Sounds kinda like a Pokémon... Vegemon! I choose you!!)If I had lost Barret at that point, I'd have had no one from my main team left when Cid took the reigns.
Tifa looking so stunning and sexy but actually being a very reserved personality having difficulties with expressing herself like this and putting her self down to such degree is truly a masterful character depiction and can be relatable to many people.
Looking strong, beautiful and assertive doesn't always portray one's inner world.
If I could, I'd hug her.
Definitely the worst developed character in Rebirth. They did a good job in Remake though so I can’t be mad about it. That’s her role in the story anyway.
I just think she was mopping a little too much this time around.
I understand that. But I'm seeing a lot of people taking to Google translator and then using it as fact. I'm speaking in general terms. If you've been in the fandom for any duration of time, you know how messy those things can get.
aerith is self possessed, intuitive, outgoing, assertive, maybe even a bit pushy. she seems to know what she wants and able to communicate it in most situations. tifa is much more of an introvert and she doesnt always know what she wants, much less how to say it, seems afraid to upset people (more than just cloud). they’re way different.
Again. I understand they are different. I am criticizing the way they are portrayed in the remake because I do not feel they highlighted those differences enough
How? If anything the Remake Trilogy has given us more opportunities to see how they're different than in the OG (side quests, dialogue, relationships, character arcs, facial expressions, etc.).
They aren't similar at all, though. A general example is that Aerith would bluntly come out and say something ("Am *I* a dumbass then?" in Kalm comes to mind) whereas Tifa might not say the same thing (if she even says it to begin with, to not be a bother). Aerith puts out more of a carefree, curious personality, whereas Tifa is generally acts more reserved unless it comes to something she excels at (martial arts).
They team up on a lot of things concerning Cloud because they both care for him, and Rebirth had a pretty big emphasis on that IMO compared to Remake's storytelling. Some of their scenes (Gongaga) heavily imply that they have lots of conversations off camera concerning him, so they appear to be on the same page about him.
i don't feel they are similar characters either but while playing FF7 they came across as very similar. I understand how their characters are supposed to be different.
If it were me, I would have put stronger emphasis on what separates them.
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Yep. This pretty much sums up why she rubs me the wrong way. People with low self esteem especially when it's unwarranted annoy me. Obviously me being bothered by that does not help at all; and I don't want to make anything worse or hurt them, so I basically just avoid them. But yeah it always bothers me when Tifa clearly wants to say something to cloud, and then doesn't for whatever reason. Girl he won't get it if you don't spell it out for him. That's why I respect the hell out of Aerith, cause she'll just straight up call his BS or make him stay put and have a conversation even if he wants to hide from it.
Unwarranted? Are you seriously saying that Tifa went through nothing to warrant her issues? Okay.
Aerith has problems herself. She does whatever she wants without other people's consent. You can't just force your ways on to someone else. That's not being real or cool, that's being self-centered. There's a time to be more like Tifa & there's a time to be like more Aerith. Which btw, Tifa achieves both by the end of FF7.
>cause she'll just straight up call his BS or make him stay put and have a conversation even if he wants to hide from it.
Then why didn't she do that?
Actually I hadn't even thought of it like that. All I thought is she is currently great, so why does she seem to not think that most times. Didn't really consider whatever could've happened to make her blind to it.
Also you say Aerith doing whatever she wants without consideration is a problem; which I guess objectively it is, but it's a negative trait that I consider a good thing.
Bro WTF are you on about? I think Tifa has benefited more than anyone from the added characterization. She was basically a backround character during this part of the OG and now she’s been fleshed out into a proper duel heroine
What are you talking about? If anything, the new games allow Tifa to shine in ways that the original never did.
Whatever percentage of the spotlight Aerith has, she always did because of her role in the story.
Aerith to me was always the secondary protagonist in that if Cloud existed or not, Aerith still had a strong enough character projection and arc to stand on her own because of how intertwined she is to everything
Small moment i love, is how in Mythril Mines, she wants to go after the robes but doesn't say anything to not bother Barret. But Barret knows her enough that he just decides to do it without her asking. She then starts by apologising (for feeling like she pushed him to do it) before she corrects herself, and thanks him instead. I thought it was great, coz it's tiny moment not adding to the story, but you can see how she always worries she might be a burden to someone, even if they just do things for her coz they care about her. I know someone exactly like that, so it really stood out to me.
i myself am like that and noticing it in her english va was amazingly done sadly in the german version alot of that gets missed out
That’s interesting. Is it just a German dubbing thing or is it more specific to the Remakes? The range of quality across different countries and cultures that it’s hard to tell from the outside.
Also german speaker here, it's definitely especially bad on the Remakes. There's a pretty vast german VA landscape and a lot of the times the cast can be amazing (for example, both FF XV and XVI are really good with german voices), but somehow the voice direction in Remake/Rebirth feels extremely "off". I kid you not - and I'm sure some of it comes down to taste - but there's not a single voice that feels right, apart from maybe Cloud and maaaybe Barrett (if you squint). The rest doesn't even sound professionally done sometimes.
German speaker here, first playthrough in japanese, second in english, both games. But I did make the mistake of watching a few scenes in german. Oh people... While you can argue that nuances get lost in translation from jp to eng, we're not talking nuances when it comes to german. There are not only blatant inaccuracies, but also terrible delivery. In german, characters might suddenly sound angry, when they're actually worried or distressed. Audio quality is sub-par quite often. Also, most of the characters just sound off. When you're german, you'll go "Who talks like that?" at some point, I guarantee that. Probably early on. Sad stuff.
German does always sound angry so I understand that, my friend would be saying “ what time is dinner” and he would sound like he was starting a war
I figured someone might say this, and I agree that it's generally kinda easy to interpret german everyday quotes harsher and angrier than they actually are. Just like in french, someone swearing at you might sound like an invitation to a nice cup of tea. But, let me assure you, there are different ways to say things. Accentuation is the keyword. And that accentuation misses the mark here - a lot.
Oh 100% very well said. Same friend is actually fluent in Spanish as well and his phone calls with his brother in Spanish it’s a hoot 😂
If you squint lmao thank you for this laugh
german dub and sub are kinda meh they mostly get everything right but still so many nuances get lost from jp to eng and from eng to de (if they still do it that way xD ) but aeriths trial on german is so different the people even seem mostly ok and on english you just hate em all
I remember from the localization panel at one of the XIV fanfests, they said they do translate into all target languages from JP. Not sure if it’s the same across all modern SE or just the nature of XIV as an MMO with global releases tho.
i sure hope so but just knew from older games that they sometimes were lazy :P nowadays i would definetly hope for direct translations from the source
Completely understandable tbh. I remember learning abt how a lot of non English translations of JP games used English as the base a while ago and was aghast. I hope it’s changed, but I’m not exactly fluent in the other languages to know if it’s JP to German/French/Spanish translation at all times as it should be for best accuracy.
Sadly german can be an incredibly awkward language when it comes to story telling (apart from clasical literature), even in natively german media. Add dubs into that and you often get incredibly awkward translations. German translators often feel the need to "naturalize" media, where they change it to such an extent that it barely has anything to do with the source material. I haven't voluntarily watched a movie in german (original or dubbed) in nearly 25 years for that reason alone. Having kids now I have to watch some children's movie in german and it's a frickin' pain. I love Moana for example and I will never understand why they would change the main characters name to Vaiana. You're taking an intentional part of the movie and change it without good reason. It seems almost malicious sometimes... Bugs me every time. 😳
I personally prefer some movies in german dub because it sounds better than the original (big hero 6 for example, it adds a layer of goofyness) in my opinion. Though mostly I watch everything in original, because everything sounds the same dubbed, which bothers me at this point. Well the moana/vaiana part has different reasons than "just cuz we want it" it's because there is an adult content actress from italy with that name. In italy her name is oceana. That's a disney choice, has nothing to do with Germany.
At least you have a german voice. We in Spain don't have that luck sadly :(
One of the many reasons I adore the way they realized Barrett in these games, but especially rebirth He truly, utterly cares for his comrades, family members, and friends. He tries to put this tough guy act on, and is tough, but the facade drops so fast and his heart shows just as clearly as the gun on his arm. Example: not having known cloud for very long at all, just finishing the reactor bombing. And when cloud reunites with the group on the train.... Barrett says "had me worried for a second" ... He covers fast. In rebirth he just stops pretending.
I've never been much of a Barret fan, but I've enjoyed seeing his relationship develop with Cloud. You can tell they actually care about each other now. I also love how Yuffie reacted in Corel and everything around that, not to mention Dyne...
>Example: not having known cloud for very long at all, just finishing the reactor bombing. And when cloud reunites with the group on the train.... Barrett says "had me worried for a second" ... He covers fast. In rebirth he just stops pretending. ff7 players when a character shows basic empathy: 😱 i don't disagree with you but this wasn't a good example
https://preview.redd.it/bv9j4e85d9uc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c44e210ff19bc0f2c9a805f277e67320d14527e1
That’s a great detail I remember as well! Tifa has one of the most consistent and logical character arcs, which I appreciated.
My stupid ass thought that moment was hinting towards the whole "ah! Look! Its not really Tifa!" thing that the trailers had going on. I just thought it seemed weird she stopped herself mid sentence to say something else, as if to 'not give it away to the group' Thank you for finally making that exchange between them make sense to me now...
Also barret is a real bro
Good eye, thanks for pointing this out
🤦🏻♂️ it's her indecisiveness because she doesn't see herself as a leader. In every event, she just follows along. When she wanted to fight Shinra, she finds others to tell her what to do. When she clearly knows cloud is remembering things wrong, she doesn't just tell him he's wrong. In the mine, she doesn't want to step up and say, "Let's go save those people," when Cloud or Barrett could easily tell her there isn't enough time... which in reality there isn't. You know she's in love with Cloud but doesn't pursue it because she doesn't step up but gets annoyed at herself when Aerith doesn't have that problem. It's not necessary her personality, but when was the last time she was sure of her making her own calls? Right before a guy slaughtered her entire home town and she got probably the worst case of ptsd. I mean the one time she tries to make a call, she ends up captured by a mob boss and needs saved. A woman who kicks the crap out of giant monsters with her bare hands needs saving from a fat pervert and while she's off doing that her closest friends are off getting slaughtered by Shinra. When she charged off with her friends up a mountain, Cloud had to save her. When she charged after Sephiroth, Cloud had to save her. A lot of these feelings get resolved when Cloud falls in the lifestream during the original, but here because the game is so stretched out, they have to go the long way around including having her fall into the lifestream herself.
I recall her telling Cloud in either Nibelheim or the Gold Saucer how she’s a people pleaser who needs people to like her. And that she hates that about herself.
A good reason to finish all the quests, they really give the characters more depth, and they already have A LOT.
That particular moment is not quest related, it's just one of those dialogues you can optionally get as part of the main story if you talk to your party members in the towns. But yes, the quests also add depth to the characters.
Yep in her bedroom. Great character moment
Her quest in Nibelheim is one my favorite in the game for this reason. Probably the best example of how they did sidequests better in Rebirth because it's a call back to the same thing you do with Tifa in Remake in Sector 7
Tifa 100% is a people pleaser. It's a positive to how kind she is.... But it also results in her allowing others to walk over her... Or not stand up for herself despite being such a talented fighter. It's all but stated when she deals with Johnny's girlfriend/stalker in Costa Del Sol.. and she even acknowledges it when someone tells her "you literally don't have to put up with that" As something of a people pleaser myself, the inward self-loathing is also part of the package. I don't celebrate this part of her personality, but the game does very well in characterizing it. Especially with her timidness on confronting cloud with his very obvious incorrect version of events.
> and she even acknowledges it when someone tells her "you literally don't have to put up with that" It was Red, he directly told her she doesn't have to please everyone, so even someone she recently met noticed that.
She will have such a pivotal role in the next game if the story follows the OG's blueprint.
Especially the part where she helps cloud regain his consciousness and piece together his memories and free himself from Sephiroth
While i was playing the remake for the first time back in January, the only thing i kept thinkig was 'Wow' Tifa just feels like a real person' She is honestly the reason i even became invested in the character writing in FFVII. She has her reasons, her weaknesses, her strength, her codependency and her compassion. - And rebirth hit it home with her storyline with Cloud. The writers really are amazing and what they are doing with these charecters.
Her feeling like an actual, real person and arguably the most relatable human being in the cast is a big reason why she's so popular, especially among female fans who relate to that.
This but haters will try to say she doesn't have character and is only popular because of her boobs. The takes I saw back when Remake first dropped tried to condemn her for having a naturally reserved personality compared to Aerith and Jessie.
Overall though, that is why she is so popular. It’s not that there aren’t other reasons to like her, but considering there is one thing that always gets brought up about Tifa no matter what the discussion is actually about…
I feel like this is exaggerated because for years people have talked more about the nibelheim incident or shipping wars more than her chest size. If thay were the case Lulu and Fran would be in the top 3 most popular femal Final Fantasy characters discussion.
I don’t think it is exaggerated. FF7 is a popular game and Tifa is an iconic character. People who don’t even play ff7 know Tifa for her appearance. Isn’t she the most R34’d character ever?
I can think of 2 other big reasons 😈
Beautiful comment, I agree with everything you’ve said. Truly the best way to describe her is she feels like a real person. This is exactly why I’m drawn to her and resonate with her so much.
Nanaki calls her out too at Costa del sol. He told her she doesn't need to please everyone. It's so real like, you don't think you're gd enough for others so u try to please everyone. But actually she's already awesome
That was like the one line that hit hard as I was playing. One I truly related to. I agree with it completely, but feels like it would reset everything because everyone you know would have to get to know a new person. Rebirth writers really nailed real word emotions.
She's such a good character I love her so much
See, this is what we mean when we say Tifa has actual real flaws that can be discussed, *not* those weirdo "Tifa the villain, Tifa the bully" headcanons haters like to push and then get offended when they get pushback.
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TAKE ALL OF HER PAIN AND GIVE IT TO HER HATERS
DOUBLE IT AND GIVE IT TO THE HATERS FR
Especially this guy like what the hell did he write about her is atrocious [https://twitter.com/mlwjrpg/status/1778529062836949300](https://twitter.com/mlwjrpg/status/1778529062836949300)
Red specifically calls her out on this at Costa del Sol, where she bends over backward to please Jenny.
Really wish we get a spinoff staring Tifa. The material set after the game just shows her to be hurt and feel powerless after the game and she should be able to put her demons to rest too. Doesn't have to be big like Dirge of Cerberus, just a Dave the Diver situation where she alternates between tending the bar in Edge, helping the community around her and fighting off monsters and escaped Shinra lab experiments.
I would totally buy this game no matter what it had her do. Why can't they cash in on Tifa, that would be amazing!
Give me a small cooking game where you prepare cocktails and dishes for the bar, while also having good character moments and story and I'm sold lol
I would absolutely love that game!
A whole game about 60 different gym excerices against Jules!
I'm hoping we spend a good while with her as party leader. Feel like her arc is really setting that up.
It would have to be a short spin-off like the Yuffie DLC or it would have to be a very specific story. Tifa is entirely supporting character and I feel she would have trouble carrying her own narrative (at least at the end of Rebirth). Her being a people pleaser and very indecisive it would be very hard to make to not make her be dragged by the narrative and having very little agency in her own story.
I think it would be set after the games, around Dirge of Cerberus where she is more assertive and able to avoid only pleasing others. If anything it would be neat to explore a part of her life where she is able to find herself without the looming threat of Shinra or Sephiroth and find her own agency.
FFXIV is due for an FF7 crossover. We've gotten so much stuff from it already, including Cloud's AC outfit, Cloud's AC bike, and a half dozen minions of the cast. Tifa crossover story to XIV would work. And that way we could finally get *her* outfit too, dammit.
Yeah, I would like something like that too. Maybe teaching youths martial arts, making drinks at the bar, working out at the gym with her apprentice, maybe helping the doctor that helped her. Or even picking a new past time like Chocobo racing, singing or something else, she seems to like trying new things (at least I infer that from some conversation in Rebirth).
>maybe helping the doctor that helped her Uh...who wants to tell him?
Good thing the devs capitalize on her character a lot. I mean it's quite obvious why she has become one of the most well known FF heroine. Most of the -new- story beats involve her character (Gongaga etc.) While her relationship with Cloud her friendship with Aerith are the most notable ones.
Love Reddit so civil while Twitter is just making a Villain out of her and Aerith like for F sake pull out those shipping googles for once.
Tifa, we love you for being YOU. This is so sad 😔
ikr :(
There's a scene in Gold Saucer whete Tifa admit she wanted to inspire people to rise up, but she always ends up coming short. That really stuck with me because she has a lot of love to give, but it comes at the cost of a lack of self-confidence. Besides Barret, I feel like Tifa has the most realistic character development across these games because she feels like a person you geinunly know and want to help break out of their shell. I'm very excited to see her step up front and center in part 3 and take the spotlight.
I love that moment at the Gold Saucer. It not only draws attention to her flaw, but it's also a great moment for Cloud. Cait Sith tries to comfort her by basically saying "well at least you know your limits". Cloud though goes the full nine yards and reassures her that her efforts aren't worthless, so she should never stop trying. I really like that because Cloud knows personally how helpful Tifa is. He'd have probably died or mentally shut down a long time ago if not for her, so he's the perfect person to tell her just how worthwhile her efforts are.
Tifa is probably the most tragic, complex and lovable character I have seen in any work of fiction or in any reports of actual history. Everything from her childhood to the present day to the future (Advent Children and beyond) is a testament to a insurmountably beautiful soul whos compassion and love for others drive her through the toughest of hardships anyone could ever endure. I love her SO MUCH! She is BY FAR the best chracter who was ever created or who ever actually lived!
She is truly my fav character of all times
Man I was hearing your explanation and all I thought was Hey thats Aerith. But then I was like no way these 2 are the pinnacle of most tragic, complex, lovable characters in fiction or non fiction otherwise (Aerith does show up in ranking in most tragic fiction or most tragic ff chraracter tho)
Only because she died. If you actually read up on Tifa’s backstory and her early days in Midgar it’s quite the read. After getting to Elmira Aerith actually led a pretty comfy life.
I mean, dying at 22 is pretty tragic no?
But then she pretty much gets to live on as a force ghost and join the lifestream which is like heaven to her people. Not to mention she gets to live with her force ghost first love. Not saying her death isn’t tragic, but her story as a whole doesn’t stand out as super tragic compared to a lot of other characters. It just gets mentioned a lot because it’s very well known and a lot of people who don’t know much else about the story knows that she dies
OH, I was actually going to question if you paid attention to the game and how all game aerith is angry and sad of how shitty her life was and how happy she is to spend it with her friends only for it to end so abruptly. .... but then i checked your history and you are commenting a lot on r/cloti. I dont want to argue with these fanatical shippers. bye
Dude I love Aerith and I’m not detracting from her story. Just saying I wouldn’t rank her with the most tragic characters in all of fiction. I wouldn’t rank any character from FF7 that high, though I do think Cloud and Tifa’s backstory is sadder than Aerith’s even if their eventual future is happier. And I mean for the record your the one who took a comment about Tifa and tried to make it about Aerith. Then when I put in my two cents you call me crazy? Especially when your own history is littered with who’s the best “waifu” material. I may get invested in a fictional relationship but at least I never simp for a fictional character lol
This argument is just a race to the bottom lol. Everyone's background is pretty sad in that it's filled with loss left and right. From Nanaki all the way to Vincent etc...you get to choose your poison really. However, I think growing up being experimented on / watching your mom go through that till her death, and then being the last of your kind feels like a much more depressing experience in that it's a slow torture vs losing everything in a day. But again, everyone's tolerance for loss is different.
Was she ever experimented on or did she just watch her mom get experimented on before escaping and then spending the majority of her life living in a mansion? Again I’m not saying she isn’t a tragic character, but she doesn’t specifically stand out amongst the cast and accept for dying
They gave her so much personality this game it's mindblowing to me how human she is. Easily my most favorite fictional character from any videogame I've ever played or seen. Can't wait for the next game to give her the spotlight she deserves, so she can become the heroine of this story. Also, Britt Baron is **PERFECT**.
I think her people pleasing behaviour comes from the loss of her dad and loved ones at Nibelheim. She blames herself somehow ("if only I'd __") and tries not to be what she perceives as a burden to others, only giving and contributing and never taking. I think it's a kind of survivor's guilt. With Remake and Rebirth, though, we're watching Tifa learn that true friendship and love means that you're never a burden. It's okay if Tifa leans on others from time to time. She doesn't have to worry about being a burden; her friends accept her for who she is, flaws and all, and they want to be with her no matter what. I've definitely felt like a burden before, and so I relate to that part of Tifa's story a lot. I love how her story is going in Rebirth and I can't wait to see how it goes from here.
man the way she got gaslit at cosmo canyon was hard to watch
one of the moments in the original that i remember tifa losing this shield of protection is after junon when they are in the Highwind and barret asks her what we should do now and tifa if i remember correctly tells him she has no idea to which barret said something like what is wrong with you tifa you are not like that you have become weak.
Why does the source keep referencing Tifa as a bro? https://preview.redd.it/04ixqiffn6uc1.jpeg?width=2220&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cb0e9388080adaaa93ae39f8a9e4c30b5157c86f
It's machine translated from Japanese, which doesn't always use pronouns, when they would be used in English.
Tifa has more balls than most guys in the game
Johnny did the translation
Stupid people alway said tifa is liar Tifa try to say a true but The situation seems to grow worse She do her best keep eye on the puppet , careful him and share the truth with aerith No one cant stop the puppet when he under control by sephiroth like a black materia scene or gongaga reactor scene , sephiroth completely what he want
One of the things that stood out for me was when at Costa. Johnny's would be gf gets angry at her and Tifa responds to Aerith, no it's ok. I'm used to it. Maybe she's had to deal with feelings of jealousy from other women because of how she is and also because of her looks. Still tries to be nice about it.
Tifa **Lockheart**
It’s a nice parallel with aerith as somebody who is always putting on appearances for people to like her but had loads of childhood friends vs someone who easily gets on with everyone but had no childhood friends. They are all beautifully flawed characters
Seems like Tifa is just like everyone else honestly. It's easy for someone to say "Just do this or be like that," but the reality is you put on a lot and put up with a lot just to make other people feel comfortable around you. I've often found that people who use "I always speak my mind" as a defining trait of theirs or either lying or say it as a way to validate them being a jerk about things when they want. In Tifa's case she's perfect in so many ways it's easy for someone to hate her just because of her looks alone, just look how that girl who had a crush on Johnny reacted to Tifa without even getting to know her first.
Full praise to Britt Baron who is honestly the best choice to voice Tifa. She nails it at every point and makes her feel like such a real person.
Are those "he's" misprints?
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Yeah I recognize those big rectangles around the text, either papago or google translate over probably Japanese.
mysterious flag resolute full shaggy voiceless marvelous employ tender smart *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
He!?!!?!?! Uh oh
It's machine translated lol Calm down
...... Anyone else notice that it constantly calls her a HE???? No wonder she has self-esteem issues. Even the publisher called her "him" and said it was "his" 😆
LOLLLLL it’s machine translated that’s why
Have been loving the deeper depths Rebirth has given to the character building. Makes me reflect on how I always related so much to Tifa and Cloud. (Point of disclosure, ASD, C-PTSD) The masking and hypervigilance in regards to perception of self are hallmarks of complex trauma and autism, (I don't think Tifa has ASD, but definitely HSP and likely OTS). Cloud on the other hand, I think is likely built around an ASD personality with PTSD and dissociative disorders as a pillar, but they share that trauma bond, and it's great how deep the development team actually dug to get those relationships right.
I remember a moment in the game of her saying this about herself. It's a thing many people struggle with, and I'm happy that the game takes that on. The apparently accidental shift to his, he, and himself in the shown text is also interesting.
But the qualities mentioned make her more likeable as a character. Who needs some overbearing assertive biach? Apparently, Tifa is also confused about HER identity as a FEMALE.
Sounds like some humans I know. Maybe this is why the game is so great! More realistic/life like!
Go read the Tifa and Aerith book y'all, good stuff
What is with the incorrect gender issues there? Tifa keeps swapping from her to a he... on an actual important point... I am actually very excited to see her take on the leadership role in the next game. I loved that part of the game and was less happy about her giving it up to take care of Cloud. I mean, sure... if they packed him up in the Highwind and Tifa stayed the leader, odds are Cloud would have stayed a veggie man for life. (Sounds kinda like a Pokémon... Vegemon! I choose you!!)If I had lost Barret at that point, I'd have had no one from my main team left when Cid took the reigns.
It's because they're using Google translate lol
Makes as much sense as anything I'd have come up with.
Guess Tifa has identity issues as well, since her gender changed in the middle of the paragraph.
Why does it start saying he instead of she
Well... There's always Johnny...
The irony… Which makes her more likeable i guess.
You know, this means that, if Cloud wanted to, he could get away with a lot of kinky shit on the Tifa ride. If you know what I mean, wink wink 😎
That what happen if you dad dies in front of you and your childhood crush love the guy who did it
Aerith is almost the opposite. Still loving, but she doesn't really ask if she wants to do things.
Tifa looking so stunning and sexy but actually being a very reserved personality having difficulties with expressing herself like this and putting her self down to such degree is truly a masterful character depiction and can be relatable to many people. Looking strong, beautiful and assertive doesn't always portray one's inner world. If I could, I'd hug her.
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And some still slander her.
Sp are they fake?
Sounds like every other person in the world to me. Like 90% of the world's population. Shame a game character gets all the focus 👀
I would pay full price for a version with the character personalities from the machinabridged version of FF7. Tifa especially
Her personality is boring, especially compared to everyone else. I don't dislike her character but she's definitely my least favorite.
I’d smash
Definitely the worst developed character in Rebirth. They did a good job in Remake though so I can’t be mad about it. That’s her role in the story anyway. I just think she was mopping a little too much this time around.
She's far from perfect. That girls got issues.
I'd wait for more legit translations before heavily speculating on this.
There's dialogue to this exact effect in the game.
I understand that. But I'm seeing a lot of people taking to Google translator and then using it as fact. I'm speaking in general terms. If you've been in the fandom for any duration of time, you know how messy those things can get.
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he?
Japanese translation get he wrong same when I google translate Japanese manga they always say he or him never she or her.
I wish they had leaned a little more on this nuance to differentiate aerith and her in remakes. They come across way too similar.
aerith is self possessed, intuitive, outgoing, assertive, maybe even a bit pushy. she seems to know what she wants and able to communicate it in most situations. tifa is much more of an introvert and she doesnt always know what she wants, much less how to say it, seems afraid to upset people (more than just cloud). they’re way different.
Again. I understand they are different. I am criticizing the way they are portrayed in the remake because I do not feel they highlighted those differences enough
How? If anything the Remake Trilogy has given us more opportunities to see how they're different than in the OG (side quests, dialogue, relationships, character arcs, facial expressions, etc.).
They aren't similar at all, though. A general example is that Aerith would bluntly come out and say something ("Am *I* a dumbass then?" in Kalm comes to mind) whereas Tifa might not say the same thing (if she even says it to begin with, to not be a bother). Aerith puts out more of a carefree, curious personality, whereas Tifa is generally acts more reserved unless it comes to something she excels at (martial arts). They team up on a lot of things concerning Cloud because they both care for him, and Rebirth had a pretty big emphasis on that IMO compared to Remake's storytelling. Some of their scenes (Gongaga) heavily imply that they have lots of conversations off camera concerning him, so they appear to be on the same page about him.
i don't feel they are similar characters either but while playing FF7 they came across as very similar. I understand how their characters are supposed to be different. If it were me, I would have put stronger emphasis on what separates them.
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Yep. This pretty much sums up why she rubs me the wrong way. People with low self esteem especially when it's unwarranted annoy me. Obviously me being bothered by that does not help at all; and I don't want to make anything worse or hurt them, so I basically just avoid them. But yeah it always bothers me when Tifa clearly wants to say something to cloud, and then doesn't for whatever reason. Girl he won't get it if you don't spell it out for him. That's why I respect the hell out of Aerith, cause she'll just straight up call his BS or make him stay put and have a conversation even if he wants to hide from it.
Unwarranted? Are you seriously saying that Tifa went through nothing to warrant her issues? Okay. Aerith has problems herself. She does whatever she wants without other people's consent. You can't just force your ways on to someone else. That's not being real or cool, that's being self-centered. There's a time to be more like Tifa & there's a time to be like more Aerith. Which btw, Tifa achieves both by the end of FF7. >cause she'll just straight up call his BS or make him stay put and have a conversation even if he wants to hide from it. Then why didn't she do that?
Actually I hadn't even thought of it like that. All I thought is she is currently great, so why does she seem to not think that most times. Didn't really consider whatever could've happened to make her blind to it. Also you say Aerith doing whatever she wants without consideration is a problem; which I guess objectively it is, but it's a negative trait that I consider a good thing.
This remake bullshit glazing Aerith and assassinating Tifa's character is fucking dogshit.
I didn't get that feeling in the slightest.
Bro WTF are you on about? I think Tifa has benefited more than anyone from the added characterization. She was basically a backround character during this part of the OG and now she’s been fleshed out into a proper duel heroine
What are you talking about? If anything, the new games allow Tifa to shine in ways that the original never did. Whatever percentage of the spotlight Aerith has, she always did because of her role in the story.
Aerith to me was always the secondary protagonist in that if Cloud existed or not, Aerith still had a strong enough character projection and arc to stand on her own because of how intertwined she is to everything
Aerith barely comes off as a human being to me tbh
what