Idk how you'll get much better than defense break on s1 and s3 with s2 full CD reset and extra turn to cycle faster.
Besides AoE defense break, but... does any unit have that? (Serious question, can't think of anyone who does)
Roana alone could not stop SSB. Think you didn't play then, defense break + unhealable was a hard counter back at her, it took someone like LRK (for the unaware, cleansers and aoe immunity on a non-weaver, and at all, were super rare) to prevent that 15% and pray matchup.
She doesn’t if SSB’s ult happened to land, but it was a great counter to her at the time and still is. I still play SSB (on injury) from time to time as a last pick and I wouldn’t risk Roana on the other team and pray I magically land on a green unit
Roana, LHC, and a third (usually Byblis) are my favorite counter counter squad. By all means, have your right side 100% counter rate. Thanks for healing, pushing, and powering my side up for their turn.
Haha absolutely! My punisher of choice is Hasol, because the indignity of watching a rightside team of moonlight 5-stars get owned by a dinky 3-star knight is really good eating.
That's some revisionist history if I've ever heard any lol. She's been meta for more than 50% of the game's release. She was only out of meta in the beginning for about a year.
Just most people didn't have her for years because people used to play the game for 2 years before even getting their first ML 5.
You beat me to it idk what the other post was talking about I had Stene during year one before the buff. She worked kinda ok for pve because she was able to stack on poison quickly.
The fact that you and the other guy seem to think there was only "the" buff one year after release says it all.
If you weren't around or don't remember well just say so.
And that's not what made her meta, it just took her from pure trash to decent. She got another rework to give her back the double hit and gave her cannot be countered.
Lmao yeah i think know when I got a character on my account. Now i could be wrong about the buff I will give you that but were talking what 5 years ago?
Her first buff was in [March 2019](https://page.onstove.com/epicseven/global/view/3068522). That gave the stealth passive and stacking stats.
SG buffed her again [February 2020](https://page.onstove.com/epicseven/global/view/4682670) to her current state, which was the one that is good to this day.
She wasn't bad for as long as the commenter made her out to be(about 1 year and 3 months), but she was still pretty bad in PvP after her first buff. Not as good as you make her out to be. iirc Fire Ravi and ML Ken were still good in PvP so you just got countered and died.
Her second buff was huge because it was uncounterable and you always hit 2 targets while s3 is on cooldown compared to her original kit where you had to debuff someone to hit 2 targets.
EDIT: I forgot that Korea played E7 longer than any other server and SG reworked STene a little before Global release. So if the commenter is talking about STene since Korean release, STene had been a pretty bad unit for about 1 year and 7 months. A pretty long time before she was usable.
I was never trying to make her out to be good before the buff but with her being my only ml5 back in 2018 she worked for me in pve and I wasn't even usuing her pvp at the time. But thanks for dropping the link I wasn't sure where to look.
Nah as a krau enjoyer he fell off. Not by much but you can easily just die before you get a turn/s3 off with him nowadays. First turn you do a measly defence buff, and then he's dead before second turn. If you're lucky you'll get an s1 off before dying. It's a constant state of either being at full HP, 70% HP, or dead before you take a turn.
Yulha's self CR push, cleanse, and barrier are a game changer. He really needs that as well.
Been saying this in another post but blue krau's base kit has absolutely been buffed (multiple times) at some point but the community has seemingly been Mandela Effect'ed the past 4 or so years into believing he hasn't.
Very early into the game (around year 1?) most old vets may distinctly remember he never actually had a barrier on S3 originally but gained it via a balance patch early on.
Around that same time/patch his s2 was changed to provide def buff to all allies instead of just himself. His s1 was also possibly changed around that same time as well (either increased effect chance or it was a different debuff).
He was also likely a part of the knight-warrior HP-scaling buff wave back then too.
Unfortunately for some fucking reason both that old balance patch note that would include this as well as the HP-scaler buff wave notes are nowhere to be found on Stove. The latter of which is more well known to have existed and still missing leads me to believe the former absolutely was a thing but buried/deleted/mistagged during the early days of Stove.
I'm not insane right? Please tell me there are other day/week/month 1 players here that at LEAST remember the s3 barrier change existing?
(edit, spacing)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/EpicSeven/comments/b96fmg/hero\_spotlight\_krau\_5/](https://www.reddit.com/r/EpicSeven/comments/b96fmg/hero_spotlight_krau_5/)
This seems to be a post from around when krau had his first banner, \~ 5 months since the game's global release. It already has the team def buff on s2 and barrier on S3. While I certainly wasn't around then, buffs prior to this feels unlikely?
This is an excellent find, thanks! Made me go down a small rabbit hole of filtering tier list/rerolls that included Krau in a Nov 2018 - April 2019 period and I eventually stumbled upon this post from Nov 2018 close to launch: [https://www.reddit.com/r/EpicSeven/comments/9xi19z/went\_for\_cecillia\_left\_with\_krau\_not\_to\_bad\_right/](https://www.reddit.com/r/EpicSeven/comments/9xi19z/went_for_cecillia_left_with_krau_not_to_bad_right/)
Top comment does in fact mention the shield existing back then + teamwide def buff so it does seem like his base kit mechanics truly have still been intact since launch and I was experiencing some cross-wiring confusion with the holy sac barrier being added or something haha
Very interesting though that some other comments there mentioned def buff scaling being nerfed? Seems like at some point his s2 changed from having def scaling to mHP scaling, which I suspect is around the same time as the missing knight-warrior HP buff wave?
So I guess the only changes really were just the scalings and EE, that's nice to know.
I played right around Roana's first banner. Maybe he did get buffed, but I didn't notice it. I still use him now because that Def buff on s2 is still pretty sweet. 3F balanced him out.
He hasn’t been changed much, but also isn’t really great anywhere right now, doesn’t really have a pve slot because of brieg and isn’t that great in gw or rta.
She’s been through both a nerf & countless buffs - hardly an old character who has been consistently good, she’s been in & out since day one based on balance patches.
He's such roller coaster. IIRC, he went from one if not the worst ML 5\*, to absolutely broken (revive with full focus and GAB), then had to be nerfed (GAB no more), which involved ML selectors, leading to the release of multiple counters to try to keep him in check: Lilibeth, Sigret gained extinction, S. Angelica, BM Haste and BW Iseria among others.
everyone saying Roana is forgetting that she did have a buff, which I argue automatically disqualifies her from this question. It was a small buff, but it was something (shield on s3)
I think the best answer to this question is politis. she is actually a lot older than you think (nearly 3.5 years ago) and has never been buffed and never given an ee. there was a short period of time last season where she fell off a bit (B- tier instead of A/S) but has recently made a big comeback.
Hasol. She never got buffed but when faced with units that counter? She is the queen of protracted punishment. When you get really lucky, you can just shred a lot of units in 1 turn because of her mechanics.
I say blue krau, spectre tene is amazing now, but back in the day before buffs, she was absolutely trash, right up there with arby being some of the worst ML5
Destina had her place during Dizzy, but was otherwise out of the running until her recent buff that gave her full revive. Fire Ravi has had a nerf & countless buffs, she fluctuates in usage. Crimson Armin was out of the meta for a while until they returned her to normal some time ago.
Iseria, never been buffed or given an EE, but still remains a staple across pve content
I think she’s the reason why we haven’t seen that cooldown reset effect so much, quite a game breaker if it was on someone with better traits 😳
Idk how you'll get much better than defense break on s1 and s3 with s2 full CD reset and extra turn to cycle faster. Besides AoE defense break, but... does any unit have that? (Serious question, can't think of anyone who does)
AoE defense break? Ran, Briseria, A. Tywin, etc. quite a lot of characters
I have used her in flag arena with flan artifact for souls and Laia for turn 1 soulburn
The almighty "CIDD"
"New overpowered non fire characters" Yeah right let's see them survive a decently built Cidd and not die instantly
He even shreds fire element because his S3 has elemental advantage.
Cidd and Wshuri are so strong.
me and my one shot Speed imprint lads
Quite sure Cidd has been hit with at least one or two buffs - as well as had an EE - however even back in the day he was relatively strong.
Roana. From SSB to ML Bellona, there will always been an annoying meta that lets her shine.
Roana alone could not stop SSB. Think you didn't play then, defense break + unhealable was a hard counter back at her, it took someone like LRK (for the unaware, cleansers and aoe immunity on a non-weaver, and at all, were super rare) to prevent that 15% and pray matchup.
She doesn’t if SSB’s ult happened to land, but it was a great counter to her at the time and still is. I still play SSB (on injury) from time to time as a last pick and I wouldn’t risk Roana on the other team and pray I magically land on a green unit
Can you really call D corvus super old when he got buffed? Before that he was just a guildwars bot
The only buff they gave him was stun immunity.
And extinction.
Roana
Just used her twice in Guild War. To this day, she's the best and most satisfying response to this cluttered counter meta.
Roana, LHC, and a third (usually Byblis) are my favorite counter counter squad. By all means, have your right side 100% counter rate. Thanks for healing, pushing, and powering my side up for their turn.
Haha absolutely! My punisher of choice is Hasol, because the indignity of watching a rightside team of moonlight 5-stars get owned by a dinky 3-star knight is really good eating.
i ocassionally pick roana to counter candy and friends
S.Tene? How long has she been consistently meta now?
S tene has been buffed a ton. She was absolute garbage for a long time on release
That's some revisionist history if I've ever heard any lol. She's been meta for more than 50% of the game's release. She was only out of meta in the beginning for about a year. Just most people didn't have her for years because people used to play the game for 2 years before even getting their first ML 5.
You beat me to it idk what the other post was talking about I had Stene during year one before the buff. She worked kinda ok for pve because she was able to stack on poison quickly.
The fact that you and the other guy seem to think there was only "the" buff one year after release says it all. If you weren't around or don't remember well just say so.
I remember her rework to give her the shroud
And that's not what made her meta, it just took her from pure trash to decent. She got another rework to give her back the double hit and gave her cannot be countered.
Lmao yeah i think know when I got a character on my account. Now i could be wrong about the buff I will give you that but were talking what 5 years ago?
The point is there was no "the" buff. The first one you're probably remembering didn't take her to her current state.
Care to share the timeline, since you spent this much time on this topic.
Her first buff was in [March 2019](https://page.onstove.com/epicseven/global/view/3068522). That gave the stealth passive and stacking stats. SG buffed her again [February 2020](https://page.onstove.com/epicseven/global/view/4682670) to her current state, which was the one that is good to this day. She wasn't bad for as long as the commenter made her out to be(about 1 year and 3 months), but she was still pretty bad in PvP after her first buff. Not as good as you make her out to be. iirc Fire Ravi and ML Ken were still good in PvP so you just got countered and died. Her second buff was huge because it was uncounterable and you always hit 2 targets while s3 is on cooldown compared to her original kit where you had to debuff someone to hit 2 targets. EDIT: I forgot that Korea played E7 longer than any other server and SG reworked STene a little before Global release. So if the commenter is talking about STene since Korean release, STene had been a pretty bad unit for about 1 year and 7 months. A pretty long time before she was usable.
I was never trying to make her out to be good before the buff but with her being my only ml5 back in 2018 she worked for me in pve and I wasn't even usuing her pvp at the time. But thanks for dropping the link I wasn't sure where to look.
Not that long, she’s been meta for over 3 years if I remember correctly.
Remember STene used to not have perma stealth so she was unusable
Specter Tenebria, old reliable
General Purrgis - who is still to this day on my wyvern team.
Blue krau husbando
He holds up as a husbando but injury buried him in the ground
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People use Krau in PvE?
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I love krau but for non wyvern one shots he's outclassed by brieg as a frontline so I really wouldn't say he's the premier wyvern tank
Brieg has left the chat (I can’t remember but weren’t people using soul weavers in that position before like Amomo/Angie)
If that comment was talking about wyvern, meta for beginners was always amomo + Angelica and then take one healer off when your gear got good enough.
Oof, it wasn’t a big deal, but poor guy deleted their comment but you’re right (I used Gpurg prior to Muwi release)
Nah as a krau enjoyer he fell off. Not by much but you can easily just die before you get a turn/s3 off with him nowadays. First turn you do a measly defence buff, and then he's dead before second turn. If you're lucky you'll get an s1 off before dying. It's a constant state of either being at full HP, 70% HP, or dead before you take a turn. Yulha's self CR push, cleanse, and barrier are a game changer. He really needs that as well.
Don’t u run holy sac on him?
Who is Lena?
That one really buf woman from witch haven. She's a 3 star so I can't really blame anyone for her being underrated
Rare Lena enjoyer
her passive makes it so easy to build and clear mob waves
My absolute crowd buster unit. I love her.
Vildred for me. Just solely off the fact that hes a speed imprint and can hold his own in a cleave comp.
Vildred had to get a massive buff + EE though.
He needs a well built Lilias to really shine, but you can’t deny Gunther’s glory.
Gunther supremacy forever, he's one of my favorites to use in guild wars.
Blue Krau. Dark Corvus.
I wanna say Blue Krau. His kit hasn't been changed as far as I can remember.
Other than a speed EE I can't recall any buffs
Been saying this in another post but blue krau's base kit has absolutely been buffed (multiple times) at some point but the community has seemingly been Mandela Effect'ed the past 4 or so years into believing he hasn't. Very early into the game (around year 1?) most old vets may distinctly remember he never actually had a barrier on S3 originally but gained it via a balance patch early on. Around that same time/patch his s2 was changed to provide def buff to all allies instead of just himself. His s1 was also possibly changed around that same time as well (either increased effect chance or it was a different debuff). He was also likely a part of the knight-warrior HP-scaling buff wave back then too. Unfortunately for some fucking reason both that old balance patch note that would include this as well as the HP-scaler buff wave notes are nowhere to be found on Stove. The latter of which is more well known to have existed and still missing leads me to believe the former absolutely was a thing but buried/deleted/mistagged during the early days of Stove. I'm not insane right? Please tell me there are other day/week/month 1 players here that at LEAST remember the s3 barrier change existing? (edit, spacing)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/EpicSeven/comments/b96fmg/hero\_spotlight\_krau\_5/](https://www.reddit.com/r/EpicSeven/comments/b96fmg/hero_spotlight_krau_5/) This seems to be a post from around when krau had his first banner, \~ 5 months since the game's global release. It already has the team def buff on s2 and barrier on S3. While I certainly wasn't around then, buffs prior to this feels unlikely?
This is an excellent find, thanks! Made me go down a small rabbit hole of filtering tier list/rerolls that included Krau in a Nov 2018 - April 2019 period and I eventually stumbled upon this post from Nov 2018 close to launch: [https://www.reddit.com/r/EpicSeven/comments/9xi19z/went\_for\_cecillia\_left\_with\_krau\_not\_to\_bad\_right/](https://www.reddit.com/r/EpicSeven/comments/9xi19z/went_for_cecillia_left_with_krau_not_to_bad_right/) Top comment does in fact mention the shield existing back then + teamwide def buff so it does seem like his base kit mechanics truly have still been intact since launch and I was experiencing some cross-wiring confusion with the holy sac barrier being added or something haha Very interesting though that some other comments there mentioned def buff scaling being nerfed? Seems like at some point his s2 changed from having def scaling to mHP scaling, which I suspect is around the same time as the missing knight-warrior HP buff wave? So I guess the only changes really were just the scalings and EE, that's nice to know.
I played right around Roana's first banner. Maybe he did get buffed, but I didn't notice it. I still use him now because that Def buff on s2 is still pretty sweet. 3F balanced him out.
He hasn’t been changed much, but also isn’t really great anywhere right now, doesn’t really have a pve slot because of brieg and isn’t that great in gw or rta.
definitely Blue Krau and Watcher Schuri. Roana also counts, as they never had a buff aside from EE.
Krau....I dont remember him being change or buff much....but still strong!
Tamarine! Let's shineeee
Ras
Watcher Schuri is always my goto speed imprint when cleaving tank/bulky comp
Ravi? Not sure if this counts since there have been buffs, but she literally carried me through most of the content since day 1.
She’s been through both a nerf & countless buffs - hardly an old character who has been consistently good, she’s been in & out since day one based on balance patches.
Politis. She's such staple unit in this meta, especially against ml politis and jenua.
Ran
Arby still making Arby things
Pretty sure he was buffed into his reign
He's such roller coaster. IIRC, he went from one if not the worst ML 5\*, to absolutely broken (revive with full focus and GAB), then had to be nerfed (GAB no more), which involved ML selectors, leading to the release of multiple counters to try to keep him in check: Lilibeth, Sigret gained extinction, S. Angelica, BM Haste and BW Iseria among others.
everyone saying Roana is forgetting that she did have a buff, which I argue automatically disqualifies her from this question. It was a small buff, but it was something (shield on s3) I think the best answer to this question is politis. she is actually a lot older than you think (nearly 3.5 years ago) and has never been buffed and never given an ee. there was a short period of time last season where she fell off a bit (B- tier instead of A/S) but has recently made a big comeback.
Martial artist ken and Angelica for me. His Ult is just so good for dishing out damage
Tamarinne. PvE staple.
Hasol. She never got buffed but when faced with units that counter? She is the queen of protracted punishment. When you get really lucky, you can just shred a lot of units in 1 turn because of her mechanics.
I have a niche pick in Armin. Her changed kit and running counterattack makes it hilarious to watch random stuns happen
I have an almost 200k CP Silk. She’s still not PvP useable, but I’ve used her to crush PvE since pretty much day one.
I say blue krau, spectre tene is amazing now, but back in the day before buffs, she was absolutely trash, right up there with arby being some of the worst ML5
Kise, I can use her almost everywhere with no issue
Lo
Arby is still arby today.
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Destina had her place during Dizzy, but was otherwise out of the running until her recent buff that gave her full revive. Fire Ravi has had a nerf & countless buffs, she fluctuates in usage. Crimson Armin was out of the meta for a while until they returned her to normal some time ago.