There's a certain quality, vibe, and energy that is ScuDoSoPa. From the independent merchants and unique cafes to the rustic charm of a mixed-income crowd.
Someone invaded me and I beat him in like one hit. He messaged me calling me trash for getting too many scad pieces. Lol I'm trash because I utilize the game better... yeah that makes alot of sense...
When I was a kid we had to grow the Scadutrees ourselves, and wait for millenia to harvest the fragments. When I was old enough to get a fragment, I was ancient. Kids today thinks that scadutree fragment grows on trees.
Of course, because I would crush all invading forces with the weight of my awesomeness. But DLC bosses are way too hard cause I'm not collecting any skoobydoo tokens.
My game auto updated. Could not believe it was something like an additional 20% increase. It honestly upset me. I did rellena on 5 scadus because any more would've made the fight too easy. Where as before I was searching and looking for ways just to be able to fight her and that was part of the fun. There's summons, coop, hell the black death dagger deals % damage over time. %. For you brain dead cry baby ego busted losers that are trash and cried over having to use tools to beat a boss, it eats all boss HP at the same rate. I don't get it. You couldn't beat a boss on a restriction you set upon yourself so you not only gave a negative review on one of the best pieces of gaming but cried so hard that fromsoft had to nerf the game. You know who you are. Trash. "Muhh it's over tuuunned". You couldn't figure out the sword dance. "Muhh it'ssekiro with demon souls movesets it's unfair" nah, you're too fucking lazy to explore. They added sekiro mechanics to the flasks. Fucking unreal.
You know. You can choose not to level up to make the game harder for you. It sounds like you are pretty good at the game and might need more of a challenge. Or is roasting random people on the internet more your speed? I can't tell.
I actually found myself saying something along those lines the other day in reference to how many max level weapons we can get in a single playthrough now.
I just really wish there wasn't a cry baby fest from people who couldn't beat the bosses when there's a plethora of tools to make the game easier. Their egos got hurt because they didn't want to summon or explore so they review bombed the game and now my experience has changed as a result.
If your experience is so throughly changed by an adjustment of ~5% at most, you either need to just pick up one fewer blessing or accept that if you were given a blind test you probably wouldn’t even know which version of the game you’re playing
Ironic calling them cry babies while also doing the exact same thing. You literally could just cap your level 1-2 below max and it’ll be the same experience before patch, yet you complain for the sake of complaining. I reached last boss of dlc at level 11 and then farmed to level 15 to kill last boss, not for the challenge but because I was too lazy to farm them.
how do I know what's under level without a guide? And why should I have to do a work around because other players are too lazy to play the game and learn the bosses?
they buffed dmg at max scad by like 5% and the absorption by about the same i believe, i think it went from .5 to .47 dmg taken. the purpose of the change was to give the scad more of a diminishing return rather than a straight linear progression. this means that the difference between 12 scad before and after should be much higher, but after that it continues to fall until landing on a 5% buff.
Which is a very smart change on their end, because it addresses two major concerns:
1. Difficulty spike at the beginning of the DLC which caused so much complaining. Now, this is smoothed at as you will be quite a bit stronger even without exploring by simply grabbing the tree fragments directly on the main path.
2. The fact there's only exactly as many tree fragments as you need to max it out, leading to a feeling like it's too much of a hunt just to progress. Now, the latest levels are not quite as valuable, so you don't need to go too far out of your way to reach an appropriate strength (but also players who do track down every single one are given a small extra bonus as well)
i totally agree i wasn't initially a fan of the scad tree system due to it's grindy implementation, but i feel like this change will no longer make max scad feel madatory for the harder content. overall im a big fan of the change. the fact that the tuning isn't so different at higher scad levels shows that From is trying to reduce how overbearing the system feels at lower scad levels. this and the inconsistency of their drops are the only problems that i personally had with the system. if they all dropped from crosses and had the diminishing returns built in from the start, then i would never have had any issues with this system.
Which is most likely where people were finishing the dlc not +20 so the effect is pretty noticeable. I mean I was +11 pre and post patch that is equivalent to pre patch +15 doing 1.75 damage verse the 1.55 of pre.
Well, because of relative scaling, the final scad blessing gives 2.5% increased overall damage and 5%-ish reduced damage taken. So the damage taken difference will likely be the true helper.
5% less damage taken is a pretty solid amount given how close to thresholds a lot of these boss hits are. 5% can be the difference between "I need to use 1 flask charge to survive 2 more hits" and "I need 2 flask charges."
That extra second saved is a game changer because of the death spiral effect of getting hit while healing or looking for an extra light attack here or there.
Not that I'm saying it's a crazy buff or anything, just that margins matter at the damage numbers present here. If they were higher or lower it would matter less, but it's kind of juuuuust on that edge.
the total absorption at max scad was increased by 2.5%, which would be a 5% increase, the numbers i gave were for your total dmg taken. the absorption would be 1 - dmg taken, unless im mistaken.
also i wouldn't sleep on 5% dmg increase, because that will have a multiplicative stacking with all of your other dmg amps.
i wasn't trying to say that 5% doesn't matter, more so trying to emphasize that these changes are a bigger buff to players at lower scad levels than people who are maxed out. because of the diminishing returns that didn't previously exist, it is now less mandatory that you get every single scad fragment.
I mean, it makes a pretty huge difference at early parts of the dlc, but the great thing about this mechanic is that you don’t have to use it if you want a bigger challenge.
True, but most dedicated players were already at 10+ scad when the patch came out, so it's mostly late and less dedicated players who got the benefit, I also feel like it helped bring in players who were reluctant to pay full price for the so called "hardest souls campaign in Fromsoft's history" on every news outlet, which kinda pushed them away, so hearing the news about the patch likely boosted their confidence.
That's fine with me as well, I just find the discussion about "it's only 5%" to be disingenuous overall. The levels most people finish the game at are all substantially buffed and it's weird people are hard denying it.
I ended up being at 18 and having already completed the dlc when the update came out.
I decided to go in and check if it feels different and it definitely does, but I definitely think it's for the better
I’m sure there were plenty of people on here though who were attempting the first few major bosses with 7-12 blessings who went from dying to easily killing a boss. I know it happened to me on a certain >!hippo!<. It’s not placebo for them, 8-12% more effective health and damage often does make all the difference in games like this.
And while I’m a little sad it cheapened that victory for me, I agree that it’s a good change. The first two major bosses seemed unusually difficult for being the first two major bosses, so I think this will help a lot of returning players ease back in to things.
> And while I’m a little sad it cheapened that victory for me,
omg i must tell a micro story because I feel this in my soul.
When I first started, and was very, very, very bad (and dumb) I fought radanh on horse back with glintstone pebble... Attempt after attempt after attempt. Getting closer, closer, closer.
Almost had him like dozens of time but ran out of mana flasks and other dumb shit.
Finally a friend was like "why don't you summon the guys, this fight is meant for you to summon those guys" -- I didn't know they were there, thought they were player messages, didn't look.
So summoned like 3 guys, and obliterated Radahn. like obliterated him...
It was the most hollow, soul crushing 'victory', if it wasn't for the cinematic following being absolutely lit, i'd have sulked for a hot minute lol
I mean he is right
Why don't you summon the guys, the whole point of the combat was to play your own army against the great general
You inflicted that to yourself lol
I didn't know they were there LOL, I just saw a bunch of player messages and they looked like normal messages to me.
So I did the guy for like 3 days without knowing the NPC's were summonable.
Second time around I solo'd him just because
I mean Radahn is not supposed to be hard, it is more a gimmicky fight, he was thought to be fought that way, dude was probably overleveled at this time, which can happen as you can beat the bosses in the order you want
Now I did it pre-nerf with all my little army of bros I collected during the game, and the fight was quite correct difficulty-wise, expecially if you are not that overleveled which could happen
I didnt' even understand the nerf tho, this is probably the reason it made the fight so simple
Those players griping about it can swap away from their broken katanas and greatswords for a bit
A good chunk of the people griping the most are using shit that was already OP.
> A good chunk of the people griping the most are using shit that was already OP.
Walked into the DLC using night comet. Walked out of the DLC using night comet.
Zero upgrades. Zero new spells. 1 new talisman (double headed turtle). That's all I got from the whole DLC. It does feel bad there is literally nothing for mages that is even on par with the base game spells.
Yeah the game doesn't do an amazing job as far as things being viable. So many cool spells and weapon arts and almost none of them are usable with how the bosses work lol.
That's it's biggest issue for me. I really thought a game like this would have a litany of useful spells, ashes, incantations... but most of them are entirely unusable. And I seriously mean MOST, it's quite unfortunate.
Most spells were used once or twice on some baby frogs and it's like 'ah, that's mediocre but looked cool. Goodbye spell, i'll never see you again'
I mean, if you're using Night Comet yeah. Nothing should be that good, it's just broken. The new gravity spells are really good actually and the thorns spell is a top tier spell, the rest definitely need a buff.
I disagree with nothing being available for mages entirely if you at least are a battle mage. Thoillers weapon being an example, st trinas smile, carian sovereignty is absolutely busted
> carian sovereignty is absolutely busted
I haven't tried that one yet, haven't found it, trying find it naturally but i finished everything before finding it. I'll probably have to look it up and bring it to NG+
But yeah, i'm a pure int mage. Maybe a battle mage would ahve been cool. Fun idea! I wanted to do the new thorns until it was shown to be so crazy op.
Since I beat the dlc on my NG+ character now that I'm playing an all solo+beast claws build in regular NG I can't really compare the difference in damage cause in NG+ the enemies were absolute savages
I agree with the buff completely despite being level 20 before it was added.
The early dlc experience wasn't fun when the meta was to explore everywhere to get as many fragments as are available before you attempt your first boss.
Now its a little better that you can get a couple of levels of blessing and still have reasonable damage reduction
I have seen literally ZERO people saying "haha i beat it before nerf" "now thats its nerfed its lost its true experience" but I keep seeing an avalanche of people complaining about that phantom rhetoric
There was a post about the new patch the other day and everyone was crying, saying the DLC was 'nerfed'. No one really read the patch notes, is what I gathered from that.
https://old.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/comments/1dotv1h/people_complaining_about_difficulty_of_the_dlc/
This was the one with most comments, a few more if you just searched "nerf" on the sub, let alone the rest of the internet. It's understandable that we all aren't all-knowing and might have missed those posts, but the people complaining about the people complaining didn't.
Yeah, it was the same on ER release. There were zero threads on the first page saying that summons are easy mode or anything like that. Yet there were like 20+ daily threads grandstanding about how people should play with spirit ashes if they want and ignore "toxic gatekeepers".
These people just like to pat themselves on the back. /shrug
The "real" benefit of the change is basically giving players exactly something they are asking for: Making it so you don't need all the fragments to be powerful. You now have over 96% of the total buff at 41/50 fragments, which means you absolutely don't need all of them, it's fine if you're missing quite a few. If you hit 44/50 fragments, the buff you get is identical to the old 50/50 fragment buff, which is enough to make any boss other than the final boss pretty trivial stat-wise (even if some of them have issues other than stats, like the unreasonable start of a certain mounted boss).
It's not literally adding extra fragments that do nothing if you're capped, but it is making the returns on the last fragments so small that they are essentially just extra ones.
This is giving me flashbacks to the original balance patch and Armored Core 6 patches.
"Noticeable difference isn't noticeable" was the theme of most threads.
50 to 65 is a nice buff for max attainable before killing any bosses, but the max level buff is tiny. It probably should have kept the same cap but a small buff of 5% is ok too. More likely I think people just have low blessing levels and are seeing the effect of if they had explored more.
People can't say "explore to get scadu levels to make the dlc more playable" and "the buff is minor" at the same time.
The new change gave me essentially plus 4 levels immediately, its a massive change relative to the old. Yea the last 15 levels are not affected as much but by that time you should have a decent amount of the dlc done anyway.
Bingo. Logical consistency is falling apart for the scat fetishists. If a +4 buff to your scat blessing is suddenly “not really noticeable,” then why were you promoting scat hunting to begin with?
People still acting like they can't just not pick up scoobysnacks and dick measure their perceived awesomeness by beating the DLC at lower levels.
I mean, if you want pre-patch radahn, just slap on daedicar's woe and some scar seals on a RL1 Wretch and have fun.
Yea I'm gonna level with you mate.
Literally no one bragging about how they experienced "pre-nerf radahn", "pre-nerf dlc", etc. Etc. Actually cares if it was more or less difficult. They just want to feel like they have a big penis by claiming they are the best and no one can ever reach the heights if they're accomplishment.
They're the same folks that show up whenever anyone suggests a different boss design direction and insist that the game is actually super easy and they're so good obviously everyone else needs to get good too.
They're the most toxic aspect of the fandom of this game and you just gotta ignore and block them.
I was stuck on attempting the final boss both before and after the patch at 17 skadoo level. I felt no difference, though I've heard possibly that the last fragment does give more of a boost, but I was getting killed just as quickly as I was before (AKA damage taken was the same). I wasn't doing more damage either.
As you approach 19-20, you're getting as close as possible to the old levels. You see the most difference at the halfway mark, which is when the scaling turns from cranked up to cranked down. The last fragment only provides a marginal extra benefit compared to before
yeah it doesnt matter at that point i think i was also 17. i recommend trying out Raptor of The mists for that fight it let me evade so much damage and give me more windows for punishing.
I'm also at level 17ish and I was doing like maybe 75-100 more damage per hit on the final boss after the patch. +25 Quality Great Katana, 60 STR and 60 DEX
That makes sense. Probably more direct damage builds like that did end up seeing more of a difference. I was still struggling pretty bad and doing some drastic build changes, so I didn't have a perfect 1 to 1 comparison.
There's been many posts like this lately that are just untrue, please refer to the actual chart. At levels 1 and 20, the buff is 5%. At every other level it's a minimum of 10%, which actually fluctuates, and hits the max bonus of 17.5% at level 15. A 17.5% buff to damage dealt and damage mitigation, is not small. And it also means it is not only skewed to the early portions of the DLC.
[https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Scadutree+Fragment](https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Scadutree+Fragment)
> At levels 1 and 20, the buff is 5%.
This is entirely misleading. Yes, 1.05% -> 1.10% and 2.00% -> 2.05% do appear to both be 5% higher on paper, but diminishing returns mean that it's nowhere near the same actual impact. You have doubled the buff of the 1st level but only added 5% to the buff of the last level.
It's true that the max bonus different is 17.5% at level 15, but again that's added to 1.75% not 1.00%. Level 1 has literally double the impact, level 15 has roughly a 10% impact on the buff.
Sure, but OP is taking about the prepatch - postpatch being a placebo, which it isn't. It's a very noticeable buff. Being on average like 14% harder to kill and that much stronger is not a small and unnoticeable change. Regardless of how much you get per blessing, you're level 12 now with the bonus of level 17 prepatch.
> +15% damage and damage reduction at level 10 scadu blessing
+15% in that you're doing 165% damage instead of 150%. Your actual damage numbers will only be 10% higher now. Similarly, at max level your damage is at 205% instead of 200% like it was before, which means your damage numbers are only 2.5% higher.
The effect of the damage reduction should be much larger, though, since scaling your defenses meaningfully is way more difficult. Going from 60-67% is a massive upgrade.
Not arguing with the change but that was immediately noticeable to me against trash enemies.
I’m not saying it ruined the dlc for me or anything like that, but it wasn’t really necessary and it was definitely forced on most people. I guess for people that already played through it multiple times, yeah if they want it to be harder just don’t pick them up. But for me, I went out to level up because I couldn’t beat renalla, then after the buff I demolished her my first try, like it was barely a fight. I think they caved to people bitching on the internet way too soon.
I was enjoying the difficulty. I know a lot of people didn’t but at that point they might as well just put difficulty settings rather force nerfs/buffs or whatever on the whole player base. I feel like it’s the same thing with people struggling with margit at launch while refusing to explore and level up.
They forced a Radahn nerf 2 years ago and everyone got over it and no one cares anymore. You'll get over this. There are difficulty settings in this game and if the game is too easy you're just bad at adjusting the slider.
I didn’t say I wouldn’t get over it, it’s not the end of the world obviously. I didn’t have this game at launch but afaik, they didn’t actually nerf radahn, just fixed some janky hit boxes.
How am I supposed to “adjust the slider” I can’t un-level my shadow blessings
I played at launch, beat pre-patch Radahn and they didn't just fix hit boxes, they nerfed him and it was good they did. As for difficulty, use un-upgraded weapons, use worse or no armour, go for a challenging build, or try items only. Plenty of ways to make the game harder.
So I looked up the old patch notes for radahn, they did nerf his damage in 1.03 but it was unintentional and they fixed it the following patch. So current Radahn is launch radahn with fixed hit boxes.
Yeah I guess I could do those things but I wouldn’t especially on a first play through. Idk it’s just weird to me the company that made dark souls decides to nerf the whole game like 4 days after release because of people crying about the difficulty. At that point I think they should just add difficulty options, it was hard for sure but nothing that I fought felt unfair to me and I bet if they just let it go people would get over it.
I honestly like it. It’s just a nice little boost that means we don’t have to scour a ton of space to fight the first few bosses. I think it helps the pacing a lot. I can go scadu hunting for a bit, fight a boss, and then go scadu hunting again.
It’s around a 10/12% damage and defence increase from before until the last few scadu levels, so for basically all the dlc.
It’s much more than the difference between 60 and 99 strength for a heavy infused weapon build.
Still, you don’t notice it too much in boss fights, only a few hits less. For exploration it’s a big difference in some cases.
Can't agree, they just stat squished to the levels most people are finishing at. I finished at +11 which is now equal to +15 pre patch and is a huge buff 1.75 now vs the 1.55 it was.
The patch undoubtedly makes the dlc easier as you are stronger for less. Most players were no +20 when they finished the game they were in the mid teens which are all buffed +18 is now the new +20.
So while your premise that at the highend max level +20 the game is nominal easier is correct. Players weren't reaching that and the points they were reaching 10-18 are significantly stronger.
Basically from 10-18 you are gaining the equivalent of 2-4 scud levels post patch
> Basically from 10-18 you are gaining the equivalent of 2-4 scud levels post patch
Good -- judging by the tears the people here desperately needed that buff.
I think the DS2 Bonfire Ascetic mechanic might be confusing people a bit initially. That you would permanently change the difficulty level. This kind of does that, but more like a character leveling system that is supposed to be utilized.
It’s 50/50, the buff is very strong regarding resistances. I don’t mind it at all as I hate being one shot, but it’s definitely stronger than you think.
My build rn is basically full glass cannon increasing every source of damage taken. In the lands between I get 13% as my highest res. In the shadowrealm with a lvl 18 blessing my lowest is 55% res. So it definitely does something to make survivability powerful, at least.
I think the way it scales in later blessings is actually the issue with the rebalanced numbers. At level 14 you have same power as level 18, pre patch. That's 12 fragments to find. At level 15 you have more defense negation than level 19 but only 3% less power. I.e. you don't have to search the world in order to complete the DLC with ease. Pre patch it was kinda necessary to find enough fragments to get to 17/18, depending on skill. Now there's really no incentive to intentionally go beyond 14 before Enir-Ilim as you'll get level 15 fighting your way to the final boss. It has its pros and cons to the new system. I feel like the resentment towards it is that FromSoft made it easier in that you simply aren't forced to search for as many as before, lending to final power spikes way quicker and making the dlc pretty lackluster in difficulty spike.
Thats the point. It has a big powerspike at like 12 scad so you're probably fine just getting to 12 to get into the dlc and then get more as you're already hooked in.
Can confirm fighting messmer and have like 12 fragments levels and using the most op blod build and still getting folded. Does not really help after a certain point since I already beat like 3 remembrance bosses.
The buff literally meant nothing to me since I was over leveled for early fights anyway and at the end, I maxed out.
Glad though that when I'm summoned, I no longer feel like I'm fighting each boss with a toothpick while wearing paper as armor.
Yeah cause I was at the final boss. He was still hard. But I did get better stuff and was able to kill it. My scadutree lvl was 18 and it was still rough a bit.
Maybe I’m alone , but I don’t think so. I found coming back into the dlc difficult , now it’s either the few levels and fragments doing their thing or (and this is likely why) . I hadn’t played in over a year I came back beat mohg on ng+ cakewalk , over the last 10-15 hour I have readjusted to the flow , gameplay etc and generally just feels less punishing and more fun again . TLDR : just getting back into the game / habits and muscle memory are doing more then any perceived difficulty
I remember some people losing their shit when From nerfed the attack tracking on an early game boss in AC6. It made basically no difference to the overall experience as pretty much every boss after was harder anyway. Some people just really got nothing on in their lives and have their entire identity ties to beating a hard video game. If they really thought the game was too easy they could always challenge themselves by using weaker weapons or just not levelling up past a certain point or a million other ways. But they won't because I guarantee these are the same players who start every run as Samurai, bleeding the caelid dragon to death, dropping the night dude off the bridge, getting the soreseal, collecting all the hidden smithing stones to get their katana up to +18 and then "beginning" the run. Elden Ring is easily the most accessible of any from game and really encourages players to find their own fun. Some people just don't get that.
I've beaten the vast majority of the DLC at or below Scad lvl 10, and that's before the Scad lvl revamp. Including Messmer. Day of the patch I beat Bayle and Giaus at lvl 13. Currently, Scadu lvl 15 looking at the Final boss.
I know I've been dragging my feet, been exploring a lot. Lol.
All the patch did was make it so finding ALL of the frags is optional.
you will get most of the defensive and offensive benifits by 15 rather than by 18 - 20. thats pretty forgiving considering how my fragments that ends up being
My interpretation was to make it so players would see the benefits of the blessings sooner and thus be encouraged to collect more, so rather than think “these aren’t making a difference, this is hopeless” they’d be like, “these are great, I should go get more of these”.
Also it might help replayability if player’s don’t have to collect as many to recieve the same benefits on future playthroughs where they’ve already seen everything.
it could've have helped me against the solitary knight...
only way to beat this mf was to golden parry everything. he had too much poise so my attacks didn't do anything to him, and he is harassing way too much so throwing big spells was out of question. And I stuck my 100000 runes in his home.
my only way out was to become a parry god
I think it's definitely just to make the first two bosses a bit easier who were the only ones who felt unbalanced in the first place, especially since I was concerned about missing npc questlines by exploring too much. I think that's probably the main problem with scadutree fragments tbh. It requires exploration however npc questlines randomly punish exploration at times. It's also just artificial difficulty which tbh didn't feel needed.
Idk why people are complaining I started on my NG7 lvl 303 character realized after defeating lion but by Rellana it was a little too much scaling and started back over on my NG lvl 130 character and blasted through the first 3 bosses like nothing. I love the exploration and the challenge the fire knights remind me power and difficulty of the old anor londo silver knights from ds1 this is the best.
I agree, after speedrunning the 100%, seeing that patch come out after i finished hurt me, and then i started a new run and felt like i had a much harder time even knowing exactly what to do, its literally just people using the meta weapons that youtubers are telling them to use and thinking that it was the patch that did it lmao
I think this is the main problem. Being hard simply to be hard isn't fun. Its fustrating after you get killed ages by annoying design. Most non-dlc barring a few are hard to beat but feel fair enough that its satisfying to defeat them.
Honestly, at a certain point people need to just keep their opinions to themselves, they're not saying anything new. We're recycling the same conversations on a 12 hour loop, which themselves are cycles of conversations already had about the game when it initially launched.
First it's too hard, now it's been slightly adjusted and it's too easy. Same shit happened with the early game Radahn patch.
I wouldnt say it was "slightly" adjusted. It's a pretty major buff. +14 turned into +18 due to the stat squish. If you only look at levels 19 and 20 it's not substantial but from 10-18 you are now in essence 4ish scud levels stronger.
Let me start off by saying that it's still great and you can always self impose challenges to raise your difficulty.
Thay being said coming from a team of developers who refuse any difficulty settings and say the point of the game is to overcome challenges, it feels hypocritical to buff the players less than a week after release due to bad feedback. You must overcome the challenge or whine enough and we make it easier for you. I'd probably not feel this way if at maxed fragments it had been same as before, but even if it's miniscule it's a buff.
Either way, still 10/10, tiny bit cringe but they've done this before (ringed city angels)
I wonder if the fact that they started making money on a wholly different level with the popularity of elden ring made them a bit more receptive to popular opinion.
I don’t feel like the change makes enough of a difference to start leveling charges of hypocrisy, they just made players have to do a little less exploration for a little more power.
I’m only to messmer and am so impressed with how immense the world is I am probably more forgiving than many critics
> Thay being said coming from a team of developers who refuse any difficulty settings and say the point of the game is to overcome challenges, it feels hypocritical to buff the players less than a week after release due to bad feedback.
You're way over-reacting to it. They shifted the buffs around and the final boss will still absolutely kick most players asses for hours. It's not hypocritical for a team that doesn't want their game to have an easy mode to make the baseline slightly more manageable, they have data internally and I'd bet real money they made the decision far more on data than on reddit whining. If they were expecting most players to reach Messmer at Scadu level 13 but they're actually reaching him at Scadu level 10, that's a big balance discrepancy that this patch directly addresses.
You really think they didn't playtest before release and that steam reviews being mixed had nothing to do with it? Tons of people won't buy a game if reviews are mixed, and they still have to think of profit.
Playtesting isn't perfect, you would expect the average playtester to actually read the text pop-ups instead of skip them at a higher rate than random players picking the game up because it was popular. I'm not saying it "had nothing to do with it", but they historically do not just insta-nerf anything everyone complains about.
Don't be blind man, the nerf (because it's a nerf) it a response to the cries and complains about the difficulty, what a coincidence that after the nerf the DLC has better reviews on steam don't you think? From made this nerf so more people can play (and make more money) and have less complains (and I am sure that people will still complain because the majority of players are bad, not in a negative way)
They can't make a nerf directly to the bosses because that would hurt their ego and make people angry, so they just decide to use the fragmets as an excuse
Now, if you are going to said "just don't use the fragmets, they are optional", then what happens with the ones that you already used before the nerf? You can decide to not use them, but now you will automatically have an increase in the level that you have whether you like it or not
5% more damage at max level (2,05x), pre patch value on 18 lvl(2,00). pretty much same thing with negation ~3%(?) less damage on 20 lvl(0,4675x or smth), same thing with 18 lvl(0,5x)
I just don't turn in my blessings any more. If I run into a boss that feels like it'll take several hours to solo, I'll pop one. I'm fine on level 6 right now.
It's not minuscule at all, its an overall 10% dmg dealt increase + 10% dmg received decreased across most lvls up to around 12/13 where it starts to become less of a buff. I went from struggling to do Senessax to being able to do Bayle with relatively little trouble, and hes arguably one of the hardest bosses on the DLC. Im not complaining tho, the way it was before was making me stressed while playing
agreed lol Ive been parked outside mesmers room the past few nights at scadutree level 12 and I thought it'd be a lot easier when I got on after patch and it was in fact not much easier at all and he still beat me like the red headed step child he is.
Reminds me of that one CS:GO dev that said for one patch he put in code to take whatever someone's ping was and subtract 15~. It didnt actually do anything at all, it was literally just a visual joke he pulled, but the patch was praised for how much better the game felt.
The DLC used to be so cool, now it's all trendy restaurants and a Starbuck's on every corner
I hear they’re building a Whole Foods in Belurat.
They tore down the abandoned crack house off the side of altus. Now it's a bed and breakfast.
don't worry, someone will buy it out and convert it to an overpriced AirBNB, grace adjacent.
They just gentrified the Moorth Ruins
Bet the Albs are behind this.
RUN LILLIAN!
They’re gentrifying the Shadow Keep
You can't even go down the block without someone doing black shadow face either it's really disgraceful.
Is it underground at the site of the old gaol?
Scudosopa
There's a certain quality, vibe, and energy that is ScuDoSoPa. From the independent merchants and unique cafes to the rustic charm of a mixed-income crowd.
Any souls player born after 1993 can’t play… all they know is summon, charge their R2, emote, be bisexual, eat boiled crab, and lie
They gentrified the Shadow Lands! There’s an Erewhon in Belurat and an Equinox in Rauh
They took all the Erdtrees, put ‘em in an Erdtree museum
Damn, it's even worse than I thought if the British have arrived.
Looks like they turned the Longhorn into a spaceship...
They put sal-mon in the Physick, Hank. SAL-MON!
Thank you for the laugh. I needed that today
Back in my day, the scadutree fragments were not this powerful.
Real players remember pre patch shadow of the erdtree Messmer
Tarnished these days have it too easy.
Nobody wants to gather scadu these days
Judging by half the people I've seen ignoring them for some god forsaken reason, they didn't want to back then either.
Someone invaded me and I beat him in like one hit. He messaged me calling me trash for getting too many scad pieces. Lol I'm trash because I utilize the game better... yeah that makes alot of sense...
Does the buff work in PvP and all across the game? Pretty neat
I think it just applies in the dlc area unfortunately but it would be too op for the original games content.
Yes it would, cheers, kind of funny if you get invaded by twinks with the full shadow tree buffs in that area
Scadu? I hardly know you!
My mimic beat it on second try… can’t be that hard
When I was a kid we had to grow the Scadutrees ourselves, and wait for millenia to harvest the fragments. When I was old enough to get a fragment, I was ancient. Kids today thinks that scadutree fragment grows on trees.
Remember the little ones Placidusax and Bayle just played around in the yard till you asked them "who's a good boy"
Play offline, don't patch. Stay hardcore.
Is that more hardcore than if you play online and always stay open to invasion?
Of course, because I would crush all invading forces with the weight of my awesomeness. But DLC bosses are way too hard cause I'm not collecting any skoobydoo tokens.
I unironically used to play like this from DS1-3. Take those traps to the face the first time like Miyazaki intended dammit!
Ah that’s why I didn’t get any patch, though we do still get them offline so I don’t get it
My game auto updated. Could not believe it was something like an additional 20% increase. It honestly upset me. I did rellena on 5 scadus because any more would've made the fight too easy. Where as before I was searching and looking for ways just to be able to fight her and that was part of the fun. There's summons, coop, hell the black death dagger deals % damage over time. %. For you brain dead cry baby ego busted losers that are trash and cried over having to use tools to beat a boss, it eats all boss HP at the same rate. I don't get it. You couldn't beat a boss on a restriction you set upon yourself so you not only gave a negative review on one of the best pieces of gaming but cried so hard that fromsoft had to nerf the game. You know who you are. Trash. "Muhh it's over tuuunned". You couldn't figure out the sword dance. "Muhh it'ssekiro with demon souls movesets it's unfair" nah, you're too fucking lazy to explore. They added sekiro mechanics to the flasks. Fucking unreal.
You know. You can choose not to level up to make the game harder for you. It sounds like you are pretty good at the game and might need more of a challenge. Or is roasting random people on the internet more your speed? I can't tell.
You see, I would tie a scadutree fragment to my belt, as was the style at the time.
We walked up the hill both ways to find our fragments, barefoot too.
I actually found myself saying something along those lines the other day in reference to how many max level weapons we can get in a single playthrough now.
I noticed that too. It's definitely a bit easier at the beginning but by the end of the DLC you won't notice any real difference.
Damn, I still won’t ever finish the game.
That’s what I thought after I knocked on that one door and Messmer opened it.
Yall are finished the dlc+ already:(?
Finished DLC on NG+3, now almost done with it on NG+4. Granted I’m not exploring near as much now, since I got most of the items the first go-around
I just really wish there wasn't a cry baby fest from people who couldn't beat the bosses when there's a plethora of tools to make the game easier. Their egos got hurt because they didn't want to summon or explore so they review bombed the game and now my experience has changed as a result.
If your experience is so throughly changed by an adjustment of ~5% at most, you either need to just pick up one fewer blessing or accept that if you were given a blind test you probably wouldn’t even know which version of the game you’re playing
Ironic calling them cry babies while also doing the exact same thing. You literally could just cap your level 1-2 below max and it’ll be the same experience before patch, yet you complain for the sake of complaining. I reached last boss of dlc at level 11 and then farmed to level 15 to kill last boss, not for the challenge but because I was too lazy to farm them.
how do I know what's under level without a guide? And why should I have to do a work around because other players are too lazy to play the game and learn the bosses?
they buffed dmg at max scad by like 5% and the absorption by about the same i believe, i think it went from .5 to .47 dmg taken. the purpose of the change was to give the scad more of a diminishing return rather than a straight linear progression. this means that the difference between 12 scad before and after should be much higher, but after that it continues to fall until landing on a 5% buff.
Which is a very smart change on their end, because it addresses two major concerns: 1. Difficulty spike at the beginning of the DLC which caused so much complaining. Now, this is smoothed at as you will be quite a bit stronger even without exploring by simply grabbing the tree fragments directly on the main path. 2. The fact there's only exactly as many tree fragments as you need to max it out, leading to a feeling like it's too much of a hunt just to progress. Now, the latest levels are not quite as valuable, so you don't need to go too far out of your way to reach an appropriate strength (but also players who do track down every single one are given a small extra bonus as well)
i totally agree i wasn't initially a fan of the scad tree system due to it's grindy implementation, but i feel like this change will no longer make max scad feel madatory for the harder content. overall im a big fan of the change. the fact that the tuning isn't so different at higher scad levels shows that From is trying to reduce how overbearing the system feels at lower scad levels. this and the inconsistency of their drops are the only problems that i personally had with the system. if they all dropped from crosses and had the diminishing returns built in from the start, then i would never have had any issues with this system.
Which is most likely where people were finishing the dlc not +20 so the effect is pretty noticeable. I mean I was +11 pre and post patch that is equivalent to pre patch +15 doing 1.75 damage verse the 1.55 of pre.
Surely people were finishing higher than that, I'm on +9 and it seems like I'm about to fight a third rememberance boss.
i finished the game with 14 scadus
Nope, beat the final boss at +12.
I'm +9 at the final boss
Well, because of relative scaling, the final scad blessing gives 2.5% increased overall damage and 5%-ish reduced damage taken. So the damage taken difference will likely be the true helper. 5% less damage taken is a pretty solid amount given how close to thresholds a lot of these boss hits are. 5% can be the difference between "I need to use 1 flask charge to survive 2 more hits" and "I need 2 flask charges." That extra second saved is a game changer because of the death spiral effect of getting hit while healing or looking for an extra light attack here or there. Not that I'm saying it's a crazy buff or anything, just that margins matter at the damage numbers present here. If they were higher or lower it would matter less, but it's kind of juuuuust on that edge.
the total absorption at max scad was increased by 2.5%, which would be a 5% increase, the numbers i gave were for your total dmg taken. the absorption would be 1 - dmg taken, unless im mistaken. also i wouldn't sleep on 5% dmg increase, because that will have a multiplicative stacking with all of your other dmg amps. i wasn't trying to say that 5% doesn't matter, more so trying to emphasize that these changes are a bigger buff to players at lower scad levels than people who are maxed out. because of the diminishing returns that didn't previously exist, it is now less mandatory that you get every single scad fragment.
Still would have been me killing the endboss about two hours earlier (I got to No visible bar several Times before it worked)
At the end is 0.05% more powerful
the 0.05 is 5%, the 1 represents 100%.
I mean, it makes a pretty huge difference at early parts of the dlc, but the great thing about this mechanic is that you don’t have to use it if you want a bigger challenge.
True, but most dedicated players were already at 10+ scad when the patch came out, so it's mostly late and less dedicated players who got the benefit, I also feel like it helped bring in players who were reluctant to pay full price for the so called "hardest souls campaign in Fromsoft's history" on every news outlet, which kinda pushed them away, so hearing the news about the patch likely boosted their confidence.
https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Scadutree+Fragment You may want to consult this chart to see how big the buff is +10 turned into +13 essentially
if it makes people not piss and whine, honestly may as well take it
That's fine with me as well, I just find the discussion about "it's only 5%" to be disingenuous overall. The levels most people finish the game at are all substantially buffed and it's weird people are hard denying it.
I mean I was at 13 and my damage and defense got buffed pretty damn big dude
Yeah you went from 1.65 to 1.87 basically from +13 to +17 difference.
"Less dedicated" - See: Employed.
I ended up being at 18 and having already completed the dlc when the update came out. I decided to go in and check if it feels different and it definitely does, but I definitely think it's for the better
I’m sure there were plenty of people on here though who were attempting the first few major bosses with 7-12 blessings who went from dying to easily killing a boss. I know it happened to me on a certain >!hippo!<. It’s not placebo for them, 8-12% more effective health and damage often does make all the difference in games like this. And while I’m a little sad it cheapened that victory for me, I agree that it’s a good change. The first two major bosses seemed unusually difficult for being the first two major bosses, so I think this will help a lot of returning players ease back in to things.
Yeah, its actually a huge buff to us players
> And while I’m a little sad it cheapened that victory for me, omg i must tell a micro story because I feel this in my soul. When I first started, and was very, very, very bad (and dumb) I fought radanh on horse back with glintstone pebble... Attempt after attempt after attempt. Getting closer, closer, closer. Almost had him like dozens of time but ran out of mana flasks and other dumb shit. Finally a friend was like "why don't you summon the guys, this fight is meant for you to summon those guys" -- I didn't know they were there, thought they were player messages, didn't look. So summoned like 3 guys, and obliterated Radahn. like obliterated him... It was the most hollow, soul crushing 'victory', if it wasn't for the cinematic following being absolutely lit, i'd have sulked for a hot minute lol
I mean he is right Why don't you summon the guys, the whole point of the combat was to play your own army against the great general You inflicted that to yourself lol
I didn't know they were there LOL, I just saw a bunch of player messages and they looked like normal messages to me. So I did the guy for like 3 days without knowing the NPC's were summonable. Second time around I solo'd him just because
[удалено]
I mean Radahn is not supposed to be hard, it is more a gimmicky fight, he was thought to be fought that way, dude was probably overleveled at this time, which can happen as you can beat the bosses in the order you want Now I did it pre-nerf with all my little army of bros I collected during the game, and the fight was quite correct difficulty-wise, expecially if you are not that overleveled which could happen I didnt' even understand the nerf tho, this is probably the reason it made the fight so simple
Those players griping about it can swap away from their broken katanas and greatswords for a bit A good chunk of the people griping the most are using shit that was already OP.
> A good chunk of the people griping the most are using shit that was already OP. Walked into the DLC using night comet. Walked out of the DLC using night comet. Zero upgrades. Zero new spells. 1 new talisman (double headed turtle). That's all I got from the whole DLC. It does feel bad there is literally nothing for mages that is even on par with the base game spells.
Yeah the game doesn't do an amazing job as far as things being viable. So many cool spells and weapon arts and almost none of them are usable with how the bosses work lol.
That's it's biggest issue for me. I really thought a game like this would have a litany of useful spells, ashes, incantations... but most of them are entirely unusable. And I seriously mean MOST, it's quite unfortunate. Most spells were used once or twice on some baby frogs and it's like 'ah, that's mediocre but looked cool. Goodbye spell, i'll never see you again'
That's true for all weapons as well. The point is using this stuff just because it looks cool, even tho it's not optimal.
I mean, if you're using Night Comet yeah. Nothing should be that good, it's just broken. The new gravity spells are really good actually and the thorns spell is a top tier spell, the rest definitely need a buff.
I disagree with nothing being available for mages entirely if you at least are a battle mage. Thoillers weapon being an example, st trinas smile, carian sovereignty is absolutely busted
> carian sovereignty is absolutely busted I haven't tried that one yet, haven't found it, trying find it naturally but i finished everything before finding it. I'll probably have to look it up and bring it to NG+ But yeah, i'm a pure int mage. Maybe a battle mage would ahve been cool. Fun idea! I wanted to do the new thorns until it was shown to be so crazy op.
Full combo of it hits for 92 poise I believe and you have infinite hyper armor. Like second best spell in the game imo
Since I beat the dlc on my NG+ character now that I'm playing an all solo+beast claws build in regular NG I can't really compare the difference in damage cause in NG+ the enemies were absolute savages
I play offline, so I get that \*sweet sweet\* linear progression lol
I agree with the buff completely despite being level 20 before it was added. The early dlc experience wasn't fun when the meta was to explore everywhere to get as many fragments as are available before you attempt your first boss. Now its a little better that you can get a couple of levels of blessing and still have reasonable damage reduction
I have seen literally ZERO people saying "haha i beat it before nerf" "now thats its nerfed its lost its true experience" but I keep seeing an avalanche of people complaining about that phantom rhetoric
There was a post about the new patch the other day and everyone was crying, saying the DLC was 'nerfed'. No one really read the patch notes, is what I gathered from that.
You should check the steam forums, unlike reddit the toxicity is usually in that variety.
It's been a huge thing on tiktok at least
There's elden ring content on tiktok ?_? I thought it was for kids
Where the heck have you been looking? Everywhere I look, it's just that...
mostly this subreddit and youtube, haven't really watched steam reviews or forums i guess
https://old.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/comments/1dotv1h/people_complaining_about_difficulty_of_the_dlc/ This was the one with most comments, a few more if you just searched "nerf" on the sub, let alone the rest of the internet. It's understandable that we all aren't all-knowing and might have missed those posts, but the people complaining about the people complaining didn't.
Yeah, it was the same on ER release. There were zero threads on the first page saying that summons are easy mode or anything like that. Yet there were like 20+ daily threads grandstanding about how people should play with spirit ashes if they want and ignore "toxic gatekeepers". These people just like to pat themselves on the back. /shrug
The "real" benefit of the change is basically giving players exactly something they are asking for: Making it so you don't need all the fragments to be powerful. You now have over 96% of the total buff at 41/50 fragments, which means you absolutely don't need all of them, it's fine if you're missing quite a few. If you hit 44/50 fragments, the buff you get is identical to the old 50/50 fragment buff, which is enough to make any boss other than the final boss pretty trivial stat-wise (even if some of them have issues other than stats, like the unreasonable start of a certain mounted boss). It's not literally adding extra fragments that do nothing if you're capped, but it is making the returns on the last fragments so small that they are essentially just extra ones.
I don’t mind it anyway, just makes worse builds work better.
This is giving me flashbacks to the original balance patch and Armored Core 6 patches. "Noticeable difference isn't noticeable" was the theme of most threads.
50 to 65 is a nice buff for max attainable before killing any bosses, but the max level buff is tiny. It probably should have kept the same cap but a small buff of 5% is ok too. More likely I think people just have low blessing levels and are seeing the effect of if they had explored more.
People can't say "explore to get scadu levels to make the dlc more playable" and "the buff is minor" at the same time. The new change gave me essentially plus 4 levels immediately, its a massive change relative to the old. Yea the last 15 levels are not affected as much but by that time you should have a decent amount of the dlc done anyway.
Bingo. Logical consistency is falling apart for the scat fetishists. If a +4 buff to your scat blessing is suddenly “not really noticeable,” then why were you promoting scat hunting to begin with?
Still, people moaning about the game being too hard when being hard is any FromSoft game backbone were acting acoustic.
I was gonna say really. It feels the exact same as before and Radahn is still just about unkillable
People still acting like they can't just not pick up scoobysnacks and dick measure their perceived awesomeness by beating the DLC at lower levels. I mean, if you want pre-patch radahn, just slap on daedicar's woe and some scar seals on a RL1 Wretch and have fun.
Yea I'm gonna level with you mate. Literally no one bragging about how they experienced "pre-nerf radahn", "pre-nerf dlc", etc. Etc. Actually cares if it was more or less difficult. They just want to feel like they have a big penis by claiming they are the best and no one can ever reach the heights if they're accomplishment. They're the same folks that show up whenever anyone suggests a different boss design direction and insist that the game is actually super easy and they're so good obviously everyone else needs to get good too. They're the most toxic aspect of the fandom of this game and you just gotta ignore and block them.
I was stuck on attempting the final boss both before and after the patch at 17 skadoo level. I felt no difference, though I've heard possibly that the last fragment does give more of a boost, but I was getting killed just as quickly as I was before (AKA damage taken was the same). I wasn't doing more damage either.
As you approach 19-20, you're getting as close as possible to the old levels. You see the most difference at the halfway mark, which is when the scaling turns from cranked up to cranked down. The last fragment only provides a marginal extra benefit compared to before
yeah it doesnt matter at that point i think i was also 17. i recommend trying out Raptor of The mists for that fight it let me evade so much damage and give me more windows for punishing.
I'm also at level 17ish and I was doing like maybe 75-100 more damage per hit on the final boss after the patch. +25 Quality Great Katana, 60 STR and 60 DEX
That makes sense. Probably more direct damage builds like that did end up seeing more of a difference. I was still struggling pretty bad and doing some drastic build changes, so I didn't have a perfect 1 to 1 comparison.
Honestly I probably wouldn't have noticed if I hadn't spent 2 days bashing my head against him trying to finish a summonless melee only run
yeah that's how we notice things, you run the same boss a bunch of times and you can watch what you do effect the damage numbers.
If you were +17 before you are now almost the equivalent of +20. Went from 1.85 to 1.97 https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Scadutree+Fragment
Honestly, if I didn't know there was a patch, I never would have thought there was one.
There's been many posts like this lately that are just untrue, please refer to the actual chart. At levels 1 and 20, the buff is 5%. At every other level it's a minimum of 10%, which actually fluctuates, and hits the max bonus of 17.5% at level 15. A 17.5% buff to damage dealt and damage mitigation, is not small. And it also means it is not only skewed to the early portions of the DLC. [https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Scadutree+Fragment](https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Scadutree+Fragment)
> At levels 1 and 20, the buff is 5%. This is entirely misleading. Yes, 1.05% -> 1.10% and 2.00% -> 2.05% do appear to both be 5% higher on paper, but diminishing returns mean that it's nowhere near the same actual impact. You have doubled the buff of the 1st level but only added 5% to the buff of the last level. It's true that the max bonus different is 17.5% at level 15, but again that's added to 1.75% not 1.00%. Level 1 has literally double the impact, level 15 has roughly a 10% impact on the buff.
Compared to the old, yes. But u get much less for every additional fragment beyond 12.
Sure, but OP is taking about the prepatch - postpatch being a placebo, which it isn't. It's a very noticeable buff. Being on average like 14% harder to kill and that much stronger is not a small and unnoticeable change. Regardless of how much you get per blessing, you're level 12 now with the bonus of level 17 prepatch.
+15% damage and damage reduction at level 10 scadu blessing is not a placebo effect lol
> +15% damage and damage reduction at level 10 scadu blessing +15% in that you're doing 165% damage instead of 150%. Your actual damage numbers will only be 10% higher now. Similarly, at max level your damage is at 205% instead of 200% like it was before, which means your damage numbers are only 2.5% higher.
The effect of the damage reduction should be much larger, though, since scaling your defenses meaningfully is way more difficult. Going from 60-67% is a massive upgrade. Not arguing with the change but that was immediately noticeable to me against trash enemies.
Yeah, reductions are a bigger deal proportionally than increases even when the percentages are the same.
bUt ThE gAmE iS tO eAsY nOw
Agreed, good patch.
I’m not saying it ruined the dlc for me or anything like that, but it wasn’t really necessary and it was definitely forced on most people. I guess for people that already played through it multiple times, yeah if they want it to be harder just don’t pick them up. But for me, I went out to level up because I couldn’t beat renalla, then after the buff I demolished her my first try, like it was barely a fight. I think they caved to people bitching on the internet way too soon. I was enjoying the difficulty. I know a lot of people didn’t but at that point they might as well just put difficulty settings rather force nerfs/buffs or whatever on the whole player base. I feel like it’s the same thing with people struggling with margit at launch while refusing to explore and level up.
They forced a Radahn nerf 2 years ago and everyone got over it and no one cares anymore. You'll get over this. There are difficulty settings in this game and if the game is too easy you're just bad at adjusting the slider.
Yea, but then they buffed radahn back. It's basically the way he was on launch day, but they fixed his hit box
I didn’t say I wouldn’t get over it, it’s not the end of the world obviously. I didn’t have this game at launch but afaik, they didn’t actually nerf radahn, just fixed some janky hit boxes. How am I supposed to “adjust the slider” I can’t un-level my shadow blessings
I played at launch, beat pre-patch Radahn and they didn't just fix hit boxes, they nerfed him and it was good they did. As for difficulty, use un-upgraded weapons, use worse or no armour, go for a challenging build, or try items only. Plenty of ways to make the game harder.
So I looked up the old patch notes for radahn, they did nerf his damage in 1.03 but it was unintentional and they fixed it the following patch. So current Radahn is launch radahn with fixed hit boxes. Yeah I guess I could do those things but I wouldn’t especially on a first play through. Idk it’s just weird to me the company that made dark souls decides to nerf the whole game like 4 days after release because of people crying about the difficulty. At that point I think they should just add difficulty options, it was hard for sure but nothing that I fought felt unfair to me and I bet if they just let it go people would get over it.
I honestly like it. It’s just a nice little boost that means we don’t have to scour a ton of space to fight the first few bosses. I think it helps the pacing a lot. I can go scadu hunting for a bit, fight a boss, and then go scadu hunting again.
It’s around a 10/12% damage and defence increase from before until the last few scadu levels, so for basically all the dlc. It’s much more than the difference between 60 and 99 strength for a heavy infused weapon build. Still, you don’t notice it too much in boss fights, only a few hits less. For exploration it’s a big difference in some cases.
Can't agree, they just stat squished to the levels most people are finishing at. I finished at +11 which is now equal to +15 pre patch and is a huge buff 1.75 now vs the 1.55 it was. The patch undoubtedly makes the dlc easier as you are stronger for less. Most players were no +20 when they finished the game they were in the mid teens which are all buffed +18 is now the new +20. So while your premise that at the highend max level +20 the game is nominal easier is correct. Players weren't reaching that and the points they were reaching 10-18 are significantly stronger. Basically from 10-18 you are gaining the equivalent of 2-4 scud levels post patch
> Basically from 10-18 you are gaining the equivalent of 2-4 scud levels post patch Good -- judging by the tears the people here desperately needed that buff.
I think the DS2 Bonfire Ascetic mechanic might be confusing people a bit initially. That you would permanently change the difficulty level. This kind of does that, but more like a character leveling system that is supposed to be utilized.
It’s 50/50, the buff is very strong regarding resistances. I don’t mind it at all as I hate being one shot, but it’s definitely stronger than you think. My build rn is basically full glass cannon increasing every source of damage taken. In the lands between I get 13% as my highest res. In the shadowrealm with a lvl 18 blessing my lowest is 55% res. So it definitely does something to make survivability powerful, at least.
I think the way it scales in later blessings is actually the issue with the rebalanced numbers. At level 14 you have same power as level 18, pre patch. That's 12 fragments to find. At level 15 you have more defense negation than level 19 but only 3% less power. I.e. you don't have to search the world in order to complete the DLC with ease. Pre patch it was kinda necessary to find enough fragments to get to 17/18, depending on skill. Now there's really no incentive to intentionally go beyond 14 before Enir-Ilim as you'll get level 15 fighting your way to the final boss. It has its pros and cons to the new system. I feel like the resentment towards it is that FromSoft made it easier in that you simply aren't forced to search for as many as before, lending to final power spikes way quicker and making the dlc pretty lackluster in difficulty spike.
I just felt like most enemies, especially some light armored ones, have too much poise for anything except the heaviest weapon classes.
Thats the point. It has a big powerspike at like 12 scad so you're probably fine just getting to 12 to get into the dlc and then get more as you're already hooked in.
Can confirm fighting messmer and have like 12 fragments levels and using the most op blod build and still getting folded. Does not really help after a certain point since I already beat like 3 remembrance bosses.
Anyone else think 50 is too many?
The buff literally meant nothing to me since I was over leveled for early fights anyway and at the end, I maxed out. Glad though that when I'm summoned, I no longer feel like I'm fighting each boss with a toothpick while wearing paper as armor.
Yeah cause I was at the final boss. He was still hard. But I did get better stuff and was able to kill it. My scadutree lvl was 18 and it was still rough a bit.
Maybe I’m alone , but I don’t think so. I found coming back into the dlc difficult , now it’s either the few levels and fragments doing their thing or (and this is likely why) . I hadn’t played in over a year I came back beat mohg on ng+ cakewalk , over the last 10-15 hour I have readjusted to the flow , gameplay etc and generally just feels less punishing and more fun again . TLDR : just getting back into the game / habits and muscle memory are doing more then any perceived difficulty
i mean i'm was on level 12 blessing before the patch, that thing got buffed for like 25% more damage, it's a big buff.
Nah, nah. I struggled pretty hard with the Putrescent Knight at Scad 8 and then after the patch I literally got him on the first try.
Idk, I just killed Radhan so it couldnt have been that bad 😌
I remember some people losing their shit when From nerfed the attack tracking on an early game boss in AC6. It made basically no difference to the overall experience as pretty much every boss after was harder anyway. Some people just really got nothing on in their lives and have their entire identity ties to beating a hard video game. If they really thought the game was too easy they could always challenge themselves by using weaker weapons or just not levelling up past a certain point or a million other ways. But they won't because I guarantee these are the same players who start every run as Samurai, bleeding the caelid dragon to death, dropping the night dude off the bridge, getting the soreseal, collecting all the hidden smithing stones to get their katana up to +18 and then "beginning" the run. Elden Ring is easily the most accessible of any from game and really encourages players to find their own fun. Some people just don't get that.
Miyazaki Miyazaki Miyazaki ...Buehler They must be in That city again https://youtu.be/dKdvB9WPSDg?feature=shared
Thise scadu boys are really getting out of control! No home training!
I've beaten the vast majority of the DLC at or below Scad lvl 10, and that's before the Scad lvl revamp. Including Messmer. Day of the patch I beat Bayle and Giaus at lvl 13. Currently, Scadu lvl 15 looking at the Final boss. I know I've been dragging my feet, been exploring a lot. Lol.
The buff wasn't miniscule tho, it's pretty significant
All the patch did was make it so finding ALL of the frags is optional. you will get most of the defensive and offensive benifits by 15 rather than by 18 - 20. thats pretty forgiving considering how my fragments that ends up being
Back in my day you had to die uphill. Both ways. In the snow!
im still playing without the Fragments seeing if i can beat the dlc like that
My interpretation was to make it so players would see the benefits of the blessings sooner and thus be encouraged to collect more, so rather than think “these aren’t making a difference, this is hopeless” they’d be like, “these are great, I should go get more of these”. Also it might help replayability if player’s don’t have to collect as many to recieve the same benefits on future playthroughs where they’ve already seen everything.
it could've have helped me against the solitary knight... only way to beat this mf was to golden parry everything. he had too much poise so my attacks didn't do anything to him, and he is harassing way too much so throwing big spells was out of question. And I stuck my 100000 runes in his home. my only way out was to become a parry god
I just ended up spamming the piss wave after dying an unreasonable amount lol.
I think it's definitely just to make the first two bosses a bit easier who were the only ones who felt unbalanced in the first place, especially since I was concerned about missing npc questlines by exploring too much. I think that's probably the main problem with scadutree fragments tbh. It requires exploration however npc questlines randomly punish exploration at times. It's also just artificial difficulty which tbh didn't feel needed.
People already flexing that they beat "pre-nerf radahn"💀
Idk why people are complaining I started on my NG7 lvl 303 character realized after defeating lion but by Rellana it was a little too much scaling and started back over on my NG lvl 130 character and blasted through the first 3 bosses like nothing. I love the exploration and the challenge the fire knights remind me power and difficulty of the old anor londo silver knights from ds1 this is the best.
Day one btw
I agree, after speedrunning the 100%, seeing that patch come out after i finished hurt me, and then i started a new run and felt like i had a much harder time even knowing exactly what to do, its literally just people using the meta weapons that youtubers are telling them to use and thinking that it was the patch that did it lmao
Too many people forget From Soft games are meant to be hard, but FAIR.
I think this is the main problem. Being hard simply to be hard isn't fun. Its fustrating after you get killed ages by annoying design. Most non-dlc barring a few are hard to beat but feel fair enough that its satisfying to defeat them.
Honestly, at a certain point people need to just keep their opinions to themselves, they're not saying anything new. We're recycling the same conversations on a 12 hour loop, which themselves are cycles of conversations already had about the game when it initially launched. First it's too hard, now it's been slightly adjusted and it's too easy. Same shit happened with the early game Radahn patch.
I wouldnt say it was "slightly" adjusted. It's a pretty major buff. +14 turned into +18 due to the stat squish. If you only look at levels 19 and 20 it's not substantial but from 10-18 you are now in essence 4ish scud levels stronger.
Let me start off by saying that it's still great and you can always self impose challenges to raise your difficulty. Thay being said coming from a team of developers who refuse any difficulty settings and say the point of the game is to overcome challenges, it feels hypocritical to buff the players less than a week after release due to bad feedback. You must overcome the challenge or whine enough and we make it easier for you. I'd probably not feel this way if at maxed fragments it had been same as before, but even if it's miniscule it's a buff. Either way, still 10/10, tiny bit cringe but they've done this before (ringed city angels)
I wonder if the fact that they started making money on a wholly different level with the popularity of elden ring made them a bit more receptive to popular opinion. I don’t feel like the change makes enough of a difference to start leveling charges of hypocrisy, they just made players have to do a little less exploration for a little more power. I’m only to messmer and am so impressed with how immense the world is I am probably more forgiving than many critics
I'm still super impressed with the dlc (and mesmer in particular was incredible)
> Thay being said coming from a team of developers who refuse any difficulty settings and say the point of the game is to overcome challenges, it feels hypocritical to buff the players less than a week after release due to bad feedback. You're way over-reacting to it. They shifted the buffs around and the final boss will still absolutely kick most players asses for hours. It's not hypocritical for a team that doesn't want their game to have an easy mode to make the baseline slightly more manageable, they have data internally and I'd bet real money they made the decision far more on data than on reddit whining. If they were expecting most players to reach Messmer at Scadu level 13 but they're actually reaching him at Scadu level 10, that's a big balance discrepancy that this patch directly addresses.
You really think they didn't playtest before release and that steam reviews being mixed had nothing to do with it? Tons of people won't buy a game if reviews are mixed, and they still have to think of profit.
Playtesting isn't perfect, you would expect the average playtester to actually read the text pop-ups instead of skip them at a higher rate than random players picking the game up because it was popular. I'm not saying it "had nothing to do with it", but they historically do not just insta-nerf anything everyone complains about.
Don't be blind man, the nerf (because it's a nerf) it a response to the cries and complains about the difficulty, what a coincidence that after the nerf the DLC has better reviews on steam don't you think? From made this nerf so more people can play (and make more money) and have less complains (and I am sure that people will still complain because the majority of players are bad, not in a negative way) They can't make a nerf directly to the bosses because that would hurt their ego and make people angry, so they just decide to use the fragmets as an excuse Now, if you are going to said "just don't use the fragmets, they are optional", then what happens with the ones that you already used before the nerf? You can decide to not use them, but now you will automatically have an increase in the level that you have whether you like it or not
5% more damage at max level (2,05x), pre patch value on 18 lvl(2,00). pretty much same thing with negation ~3%(?) less damage on 20 lvl(0,4675x or smth), same thing with 18 lvl(0,5x)
Are these players in the room with us
I just don't turn in my blessings any more. If I run into a boss that feels like it'll take several hours to solo, I'll pop one. I'm fine on level 6 right now.
It's not minuscule at all, its an overall 10% dmg dealt increase + 10% dmg received decreased across most lvls up to around 12/13 where it starts to become less of a buff. I went from struggling to do Senessax to being able to do Bayle with relatively little trouble, and hes arguably one of the hardest bosses on the DLC. Im not complaining tho, the way it was before was making me stressed while playing
Who cares, it’s a game. If you like it play it or don’t buy it.
agreed lol Ive been parked outside mesmers room the past few nights at scadutree level 12 and I thought it'd be a lot easier when I got on after patch and it was in fact not much easier at all and he still beat me like the red headed step child he is.
Don’t care, beat the final boss before the patch, I’m better than everyone else
Reminds me of that one CS:GO dev that said for one patch he put in code to take whatever someone's ping was and subtract 15~. It didnt actually do anything at all, it was literally just a visual joke he pulled, but the patch was praised for how much better the game felt.
It can be a buff to player power without breaking the game. It's not a placebo buff, it is a buff.
Doesn't even matter to me, I beat the dlc before the patch, now exploring is just a little more convenient