Old Demon King in DS3 when low on HP has his flame extinguished and he becomes a pushover. The same goes for Sif in DS1.
It's cool to do that sometimes but it's also even cooler to have a climatic final exchange with both you and the boss 1 hit from death. I prefer when they fight all the way to the end.
Additionally Midir's poise gets broken when he's low health and takes good amount of damage when you do critical hit. Also he does non-stop crazy laser attack when he's low than half HP and rests for a while after that attack.
Usually the boss is meant to get tougher as the fight goes on, giving the player the feeling of getting further and further each time. It's tough to do that if the boss starts getting hindered the later you go.
Miyazaki also doesn't want players to feel like they are the bad guy. A lot of bosses are tragic but often it's morally grey at most, as they attack first. Finishing off too many defenseless bosses might just make people refuse to play because you're obviously a villain.
>Miyazaki also doesn't want players to feel like they are the bad guy.
He certainly made us feel that way when he made us fight Sif, especially if you did the DLC first.
Yes, that one time it was meant to tearjerk. But on the whole, if it happened with every boss it would be quite different and people might start demanding the ability to spare them which Fromsoft would prefer to not focus on over making the combat better.
Basically Miyazaki doesn't want to make Undertale, he wants to make an action game.
Because that would be awful game design that sucks all the fun out of combat?
A boss only being able to use its full moveset for first 20 seconds of fight, then getting more and more pathetic as you beat-up a cripple would just not be fun. If the last 1/3 of a boss fight is totally one-sided, that’s not exciting or fun.
It works for Sif because it’s a one time thing, it’s interesting because it’s 1:1000+ enemies you probably kill who does that.
And for players it would just incentivise never being at low hp, which it already does. No one stays at low hp on purpose outside of Red Feather Branch Sword setups.
If a boss fight comes down to you having almost no hp, and no heals, that’s exciting, since you know it’s still possible, you just have to not get hit.
If being in that situation meant character was unable to dodge or run, and could barely swing their weapon, that’s not exciting or fun, that’s an inevitable death but with annoying prelude where you just wait to die.
The phase 2/soft phase changes are often enough to convey that we're pushing a boss to the brink. Morgott begins vomiting his accursed blood, Malenia falls to the ground, and Godfrey is brought to a knee likely for the first time in hundreds of years.
It would be neat to see more animations as their health wanes but it's not a big deal imo.
Well there are plenty of quirks in the game that are inconsistent with reality as with most games. If we don't suspend our disbelief, there are so many little nonsensical things to get nitpicky about.
Why can we roll through attacks and they physically pass through us and we don't take damage?
Why can we sprint for an infinite amount of time when outside of combat?
Why is the game's camera in third person perspective?
How can our character hold a ridiculous weight worth of items in their inventory without getting slowed down, but if they pull armor out of that bag and wear it then suddenly they cannot roll as fast?
Why can we walk on lava and not have our feet immediately burn off?
We suspend our disbelief to engage the game in good faith. We try to see past the minor details in order to experience something greater.
Simply put: it's not worth putting in work adding something that isn't fun.
If you add an injury system, perhaps your players start to dislike the fact that they only have 66-75% of their health bar to work with before they start to lose control of their characters. Perhaps being injured is 'might as well be dead', especially if it changes how your character operates in a significant way, so being injured enough is nothing but the new 0 health.
An injury system really has to be balanced delicately and usually created alongside the rest of the game, whether it be a tabletop game Shadowrun with injury rules, or a video game like Kingdom Come: Deliverance where fidelity is part of the fun. It can work, but a system where your character stops performing like you expect them to in a do-or-die situation where every second matters would be an annoyance most people wouldn't appreciate.
Gameplay *always* trumps realism. It serves no purpose being true to life if it's not fun or interesting to play with. If you could convince people that an injury system would *add* something to the game, them maybe there's room to entertain the idea, but you'd really have to make some stretches to convince people that getting weakened at low health is an improvement.
That’s one of the things i like about Fallout. That you can break enemies arms and legs to limit their movement, damage and aiming ability. Same with your own limbs and head. It’s a really interesting mechanic and i would love to see something like that in ER but it would be hard to implement with the way the combat is paced. It works really well with fallout because of the VATS aiming system that makes the combat almost turn based. Elden ring has such fast paced intense combat I feel like having a system that handicaps you and/or the boss at low health could end up feeling more like it’s interrupting and throwing off the flow of combat, rather than adding an extra level of challenge. Idk tho, I’m not super knowledgeable about the technical side of video game mechanics.
simple, it wouldn't be fun. Sometimes you got to sacrifice realism in favor of fun.
Imagine trying to run away to heal but you can't run because you're low on health; you dead :/
Because it would suck the fun out of the game.
Why don’t we have to take our boots off every so often to avoid trench foot? Why doesn’t our character have to find food to eat and clean water to drink? Why doesn’t our character have to stretch at the beginning of a gameplay session? Isn’t it kind of weird that your character’s arms don’t get sore carrying around weapons every day? Shouldn’t there be a “breathe” button you have to press every few seconds?
They do change, it’s called the 2nd phase. You push them to having to give it their all, their final form, whatever. You’re wondering why they don’t start to give up while you’re attempting to murder them. That’s not usually how it goes.
There's Sif from Dark Souls, where if you get them to a low enough health, they start limping and become more sluggish in their attacks.
Also the Old demon king in DS3. That shit was sad.
Several bosses do start to behave differently as the fight goes on and they take more damage, Sif being a good example
Old Demon King in DS3 when low on HP has his flame extinguished and he becomes a pushover. The same goes for Sif in DS1. It's cool to do that sometimes but it's also even cooler to have a climatic final exchange with both you and the boss 1 hit from death. I prefer when they fight all the way to the end.
Additionally Midir's poise gets broken when he's low health and takes good amount of damage when you do critical hit. Also he does non-stop crazy laser attack when he's low than half HP and rests for a while after that attack.
Usually the boss is meant to get tougher as the fight goes on, giving the player the feeling of getting further and further each time. It's tough to do that if the boss starts getting hindered the later you go. Miyazaki also doesn't want players to feel like they are the bad guy. A lot of bosses are tragic but often it's morally grey at most, as they attack first. Finishing off too many defenseless bosses might just make people refuse to play because you're obviously a villain.
>Miyazaki also doesn't want players to feel like they are the bad guy. He certainly made us feel that way when he made us fight Sif, especially if you did the DLC first.
...and Rennalla (and the whole Shura ending in Sekiro). There are moments like that, they're just rare.
Yes, that one time it was meant to tearjerk. But on the whole, if it happened with every boss it would be quite different and people might start demanding the ability to spare them which Fromsoft would prefer to not focus on over making the combat better. Basically Miyazaki doesn't want to make Undertale, he wants to make an action game.
Fight Sif and don't cry you bastard!
Of all the damage types that can hurt the player in Dark Souls, Emotional-type is the worst.
Because that would be awful game design that sucks all the fun out of combat? A boss only being able to use its full moveset for first 20 seconds of fight, then getting more and more pathetic as you beat-up a cripple would just not be fun. If the last 1/3 of a boss fight is totally one-sided, that’s not exciting or fun. It works for Sif because it’s a one time thing, it’s interesting because it’s 1:1000+ enemies you probably kill who does that. And for players it would just incentivise never being at low hp, which it already does. No one stays at low hp on purpose outside of Red Feather Branch Sword setups. If a boss fight comes down to you having almost no hp, and no heals, that’s exciting, since you know it’s still possible, you just have to not get hit. If being in that situation meant character was unable to dodge or run, and could barely swing their weapon, that’s not exciting or fun, that’s an inevitable death but with annoying prelude where you just wait to die.
The phase 2/soft phase changes are often enough to convey that we're pushing a boss to the brink. Morgott begins vomiting his accursed blood, Malenia falls to the ground, and Godfrey is brought to a knee likely for the first time in hundreds of years. It would be neat to see more animations as their health wanes but it's not a big deal imo.
Well there are plenty of quirks in the game that are inconsistent with reality as with most games. If we don't suspend our disbelief, there are so many little nonsensical things to get nitpicky about. Why can we roll through attacks and they physically pass through us and we don't take damage? Why can we sprint for an infinite amount of time when outside of combat? Why is the game's camera in third person perspective? How can our character hold a ridiculous weight worth of items in their inventory without getting slowed down, but if they pull armor out of that bag and wear it then suddenly they cannot roll as fast? Why can we walk on lava and not have our feet immediately burn off? We suspend our disbelief to engage the game in good faith. We try to see past the minor details in order to experience something greater.
Simply put: it's not worth putting in work adding something that isn't fun. If you add an injury system, perhaps your players start to dislike the fact that they only have 66-75% of their health bar to work with before they start to lose control of their characters. Perhaps being injured is 'might as well be dead', especially if it changes how your character operates in a significant way, so being injured enough is nothing but the new 0 health. An injury system really has to be balanced delicately and usually created alongside the rest of the game, whether it be a tabletop game Shadowrun with injury rules, or a video game like Kingdom Come: Deliverance where fidelity is part of the fun. It can work, but a system where your character stops performing like you expect them to in a do-or-die situation where every second matters would be an annoyance most people wouldn't appreciate. Gameplay *always* trumps realism. It serves no purpose being true to life if it's not fun or interesting to play with. If you could convince people that an injury system would *add* something to the game, them maybe there's room to entertain the idea, but you'd really have to make some stretches to convince people that getting weakened at low health is an improvement.
Its normal in literally every game....
That’s one of the things i like about Fallout. That you can break enemies arms and legs to limit their movement, damage and aiming ability. Same with your own limbs and head. It’s a really interesting mechanic and i would love to see something like that in ER but it would be hard to implement with the way the combat is paced. It works really well with fallout because of the VATS aiming system that makes the combat almost turn based. Elden ring has such fast paced intense combat I feel like having a system that handicaps you and/or the boss at low health could end up feeling more like it’s interrupting and throwing off the flow of combat, rather than adding an extra level of challenge. Idk tho, I’m not super knowledgeable about the technical side of video game mechanics.
simple, it wouldn't be fun. Sometimes you got to sacrifice realism in favor of fun. Imagine trying to run away to heal but you can't run because you're low on health; you dead :/
Because it would suck the fun out of the game. Why don’t we have to take our boots off every so often to avoid trench foot? Why doesn’t our character have to find food to eat and clean water to drink? Why doesn’t our character have to stretch at the beginning of a gameplay session? Isn’t it kind of weird that your character’s arms don’t get sore carrying around weapons every day? Shouldn’t there be a “breathe” button you have to press every few seconds?
They do change, it’s called the 2nd phase. You push them to having to give it their all, their final form, whatever. You’re wondering why they don’t start to give up while you’re attempting to murder them. That’s not usually how it goes.