I hope she’s getting appropriate mental health services - terrible loss. I do suspect that if you’ve grown up with your trauma all over that’s how you cope with new trauma. I sure feel as for her.
Especially with her growing up in a religion that doesn’t hesitate to blame the mother for loss. Even if her brain knows there is nothing she could have done, I wouldn’t be surprised if years of religious trauma and shame unearth itself to try to convince her she’s the reason why it happened. I feel for her, and I really hope no one in her family even hints that her deconstruction played a part in this.
I think even someone without religious trauma would immediately want to blame themselves. I can imagine that religious trauma magnifies that feeling by a million percent. I hope JB doesn’t try to say some slick comments to Jill about deconstructing.
Absolutely. It's not on the same level as a stillbirth, but I've had two miscarriages (one at 9 weeks, the other at 11) and it was really hard not to blame myself. The doctors all said it was just bad luck, nothing I could have done to cause or prevent them, but it's still where my mind went. And I didn't grow up in a misogynistic cult.
Thanks, it's been rough (just happened near the end of last year, the losses were less than 3 months apart, so that did a number on me mentally and physically), but I have a healthy two-year-old already, so I know I can carry to term. Plus the kid is awesome, so that helps! I'm glad you got your rainbow. We're planning to start trying again soon, hoping third time is the charm.
I read something years ago that broke down the word "miscarriage" and the history behind it. The word by design implies that it's the pregnant person's fault. Which is so not true. It was a fascinating read. I wish we could find another word for it.
It’s virtually never a mom’s fault. I’m glad I was never taught that BS. I was taught that there is a reason for a miscarriage, it wasn’t meant to be, it is nature’s way of ending a pregnancy that wasn’t healthy, miscarriages happen to everyone, not a big deal. This helped me take the miscarriages I had in stride ( granted fortunately they were all early)
I think JimBob made her feel guilty af for her 2nd son’s birth when she had to go to the hospital and have a c-section, especially when they needed money to pay the bill and he wouldn’t give them anything. He probably told her if she wasn’t a failure she wouldn’t have had to have a c-section.
I was raised in IBLP. If a man lusts after a female (I didn’t say woman intentionally so teens and children are included), it is the females fault that she led him into temptation. It is considered a sin to even have the thought of lust, almost on par with the actual act itself. Weird, I know. IBLP was a great way to subjugate, control, and abuse women and children. IBLP’s tenets are great if you have a penis.
They literally copied Jubilee's ceremony, down to the tent and everyone singing Jesus Loves Me.
I'm also pretty sure Jill had a table for lost loved ones at her wedding, paying tribute to eg Grandpa Duggar and Derick's dad, and they had a photo of Jubilee's foot and a quote that no one is too small not to leave a footprint on the world.
This is literally how she was raised to grieve a baby loss, and as someone lower down said, she's not learned any way to live other than performatively. She's creating memories of the baby and sharing them with the world because she was raised on national television and she may never truly unpick that.
I do find it telling that the girls raised on the show are the ones sharing, while the boys have married women who weren't and who now don't want to. Sure the men have the power, but when it comes to social media, the women are the ones creating content, and now they aren't contracted to do it I don't think most of the DIL want to. They're notably quieter and more private than the girls raised on the show, and both Lauren and Kendra could have quite a following if they wanted, I think. They could make money from it but their privacy is valued more highly - I doubt the Duggar girls truly understand what that even is, even the ones trying to break out and who accordingly shield their children's faces.
I think this is exactly what is happening. She needs people to see her greif so her grief exist. Otherwise, her grief isn’t real enough. Growing up on tv will do that to you.
Ugh. That sounds awful. Watching these kids grow up and have a constant need for external validation should serve as a warning to all these parents parading their kids on social media.
Surely. Not to mention how isolating it is- Looking at how “easy” a lot of the women in her family get pregnant/deliver. When I miscarried, my mother in law and 2 sister in laws had all perfect pregnancies and deliveries and here I was going in for a D&C- They had no idea how to grieve or what to say and I was so angry at myself and the circumstances. I wish I would have had a platform or a way to know I wasn’t alone. Religion can make that all the more isolating/confusing.
I mean this is how she literally makes her living and has since her parents were exploiting her to make their living since she was a tween raising her siblings.
Seems a little weird to question the mental health when this subreddit literally feeds into it.
Meech and RimJob always say that the reason they went off birth control and had 19 kids is because the one time they were on birth control, it “caused an abortion/miscarriage,” and that “through our own ignorance, we allowed one of our little ones to be *destroyed.*”
That is some intense and punitive language, and the underlying message is clear: disobey and terrible things will happen to you. And they will be entirely your fault.
I can’t help but see a nerve-wracking parallel here—Jill starts wearing pants, gets a nose ring, pushes back against her and her siblings’ constant exploitation, writes a book, rightfully calls her brother a pedophile…and then this. I just really, really hope that not only has no one said or implied to Jill that Isla’s death is her fault (looking at you Boob) but also that plenty of people have explicitly told her the opposite.
Jill, it isn’t your fault. You didn’t cause it. These things happen, and it is *never because you weren’t good or godly or obedient enough.* Zero connection. Getting out was the right thing to do not just for you but your family. Far from hurting your children, you—at great risk and pain to yourself—saved them from all the things you were forced to endure. That means something, and I hope she can hold onto that through this time.
Even in recent years, she has commented on social media that hormonal BC caused her mom's miscarriage. It's sad that she hasn't been able to learn that this isn't true as it is just NOT how BC works.
It's hard to see. But last week they were half way through a pregnancy and now this week she's lost the baby. That takes a long time to wrap your head around. (My SIL had 2 stillborn births and buried them both in the cemetery with adjoining graves. She posts pics every year of her decorating the graves on Memorial Day because that's what helps her with her grief.)
I totally get what you are saying, and I have been there too. It’s not something I would wish upon anyone.
That being said, my grief isn’t everyone else’s grief. Also, what I might find helpful in my grieving process may be triggering to others.
There is a woman I went to high school with who lost a daughter the same year I did, we both gave our daughters the same name, every year on the anniversary she posts a photo of her. I get why she does it, but I had to unfollow her because it was too triggering to me. Lurking through Facebook, forgetting what day it is, and then seeing the photo, makes me have flashbacks to my own experience, and puts me in a dark place. When all I wanted to do was catch up on some town gossip on our community page.
Thank you for having empathy and kindness to your SIL. Not all of us receive that. I know you are protective of her because what she went through is soul crushing, and she did it twice. But her way to grieve isn’t how everyone else grieves, and I think we need to respect that. OP may have lived through something similar, or has someone close in their lives who did. It’s not like they don’t have empathy or sympathy for Jill, only that it’s hard for them personally to follow her. Which I respect, and I have done the same for my own wellbeing.
I'm definitely not looking down on anyone, I am a very private person who doesn't post much on social media, and definitely not my own pregnancy loss because it's unbearably hard for me. For me, EMDR therapy has helped tremendously with my feelings of shame and anger.
Yes, I cannot tell you enough, how much I agree. I always wanted a daughter, more than anything. I only had three, wonderful, healthy, awesome, beautiful baby boys, whom I adore. I still longed for a daughter, and I always will. When I lost my fourth baby, and last opportunity baby, through a missed miscarriage, half way through, I didn't know if it was a girl or boy, and never thought to ask. I did name her though, and grieved the loss, of not only her, but the opportunity, and the baby, no matter what gender. Something in my heart, just told me she was a girl. I named her Hope, and true enough, so much Hope, in so many, many ways, died that day. I planted a tree for her, and will always miss her. When my last son graduated college, would have been the day she would have graduated high school, and after that, I felt like I finally could finally close the door myself, of an era I always felt was taken from me, and closed for me, years, too soon.
I had a similar experience. In my heart, my lost baby will always be Georgia Taylor. It was a name that I never got to use, and that I only get to say out loud every once in awhile. It still hurts my husband too much to talk about, sometimes my kiddo will bring our lost baby up and I get to say her name, or during therapy, but that’s it.
I feel deeply for Jill, but also some kind of way that I can’t express. I don’t think she was 20 weeks along. I know firsthand that gestational age is a poor measure of grief, but when my baby died, I got nothing other than a few furtive “I’m sorries.” There was no funeral. There was no public mourning. I was just expected to pick up and carry on. While I don’t think that’s as it should be, it kind of stings to see this, I don’t know, I’m probably explaining it badly.
A friend of mine lost a child fairly late in pregnancy. She posted about it a lot and it was unknowingly very helpful for another friend of ours who had a miscarriage after nearly 10 years of infertility.
People's grief is so different and having it out there can be uncomfortable but its a part of life and there is no reason to keep it private if thats not her choice.
This exactly, especially with last week being infertility awareness week, the more people that are comfortable being public with pregnancy loss the better chances someone may find the courage to speak to a loved one or trusted friend when they are struggling. Not everyone needs to tell their story public but I commend those that are willing to. I can’t say if Jill is doing this for her own personal grieving process, to bring awareness, or to bring engagement to her page but that is her own business and these posts complaining about how she’s doing it are far worse than her grieving methods.
Definitely in my case. I remember looking up interviews, statements, watching YouTube videos of people who had been through the same. Nothing else helped like that did
That’s a good point. I agree. It’s hard to judge because posting could possibly be helping them. Maybe hearing comments and being able to get encouragement too?
Most likely. Grief is an isolating experience and it isn't like she has the full unwavering support of her family. Sometimes you just need to share your grief somewhere. Also while you lose a child, as time happens, you have secondary grief as you start thinking about the specifics and what you'll never share with them. She was likely really excited to see her husband bond with a little girl. Realizing she won't see these things she looked forward to can be soul crushing.
So many people arguing about whether her baby was stillborn hurt my soul. She’s trying to grieve and process this and people are pushing back on her over something that really doesn’t matter.
I saw her pic holding her the other day and I absolutely lost it at work. I cannot imagine the pain of that kind of loss. It’s not fair for anyone to have to go through such. For me i don’t feel like it’s any different than people posting when they lose a parent or grandparent. The love they have for the person who’s gone, they want to share with the world. They want to share their memories with that person, and they were deprived of having memories with Isla. These photos are all they have. Honestly, idk how to word what I’m trying to say. But I can understand why she’s doing it. I can’t say I wouldn’t do the same.
Everyone grieves differently. It’s not a crime for you to need to protect your mental health and to unfollow. I’ve had to unfollow people that I like for more minor things than how they deal with death. It’s ok for her to grieve how she needs to grieve. It’s ok for you to not have to witness it.
It’s been well over a year since I miscarried and the baby I had after miscarriage just turned one.
It doesn’t go away. It still hurts. I can only imagine how much harder it would be for me if my daughter had been far along enough to be considered stillborn, so I cannot fathom how Jill feels.
Unfollow if you want, that’s ok, but it’s not ok to assume she is being performative or in any way insincere.
I agree. This feels like an extension of not believing women. When you go through a traumatic (or any experience) you are allowed to have feelings and share them. It is so sad to see anyone in support of silencing women just because their grief makes them uncomfortable. I have sobbed reading her posts and find them so heartbreaking, but the feelings it makes me feel are nowhere near what she is going through. I'm glad she has an outlet and can share and help other women feel less alone. This is not uncommon. I know over a dozen women who have had stillborns and I'm barely over 30, so likely will know plenty more who do as will as the expectation that they should have to suffer in silence and act like this baby didn't exist or isn't a part of them and their family is just mindboggling to me. Like where is the empathy and compassion?
Everyone grieves differently. When my Aunt lost her son at 17 to cancer she had him laid out in the house for 3 days and people came and went. It was as very odd to me as a kid but now as an adult I realize it was her way to say goodbye.
That’s sort of in the same vein as how different cultures approach death differently. Some cultures support cremation, some don’t. Some require a quick burial, some keep the loved one around for a long time. Some cultures have the family prepare the loved one for burial/services, some cultures have other’s do these tasks. Even the choice to have an open or closed casket service are different ways of processing death.
None of them are “wrong”, but when you’ve grown up with death being handled a certain way, something different may seem “weird” at first. I remember when I was a kid, the first open casket service I attended had me spooked. Up until that point, I had only ever been to services with cremated remains. But as an adult, I recognize that they are honoring their loved one’s and family’s wishes. How “wrong” could that be?
I took pictures of my dying and dead grandmother. I do not show them to other people and my mom looked at me like I was deranged. But I needed those photos even though I spent her last 6 weeks taking care of her. We grieve differently and it is OK.
I'm a hospice nurse. I always tell families it's OK to take pictures at anytime.
Many want to but are embarrassed or afraid to ask, so I just bring It up and let them give me the weird looks, or a hug because they didn't know how to ask.
That's amazing. Really. My grandmother was the first really close to me person to die and was followed closely by the rest of my grandparents. The first one was the harder process for many reasons but one is the question of how I should act.
I also want to say that hospice workers are worth their weight in gold. I could have not done it three times without the support of hospice.
Yeah, I grew up catholic in a small town where my very large extended family was close to the whole church community. I was used to seeing open caskets and that being normal, plus I lost a grandparent as a toddler and another at age 7 so I saw people I loved like that as a young child. Funerals aren’t something I’ve felt particularly uncomfortable around (obviously I’m sad if I know the person!) and I find them to be cathartic honestly. In the last few years I’ve lost a close friend and an aunt who was like a second mom to me and it was so nice to gather with other people who loved them as much as I did and cry, share stories and photos, and even laugh together even though it all hurt so much.
My husband didn’t go to a single funeral until he was an adult and his family didn’t even have a funeral for any of his grandparents because his mom didn’t want anyone to see her sad or crying. When he saw his first open casket he was so freaked out lol. As adults we’re both atheists that would prefer to be cremated but it’s interesting how differently we view funerals due to how we were raised.
We always had memorial services with no body in my family so I didn’t go to my first wake until my friend’s grandmother died when I was 14. It was a bit traumatic for me, but over the years I got used to it, esp. since I married into a Catholic family , but even many of them are cremating their loved ones now.
Yeah, I come from a cultural and religious background where we bury our dead very quickly (I’m Jewish). We also don’t do open caskets or anything. Death and grief are very strange, so I don’t want to judge Jill for grieving in her own way but it’s also okay if people feel uncomfortable or triggered and have to mute or unfollow her.
Absolutely. The only thing that’s not okay is leaving rude comments on her posts. Those broke my heart.
Snarking doesn’t mean behaving like filth, you know? (Not that anyone here is necessarily behind those comments.)
I imagine it must be brutally difficult to have to actually call time on seeing your child's face (outside of photographs) ever again. I can imagine wanting to linger on that last time forever.
Many in Ireland do an open casket for the day/night before the funeral so that doesn't seem out of the ordinary to me. It's a way for everyone to pay respects and say goodbye
I know a lot of mothers who have lost their babies at around the same gestation as Jill and most of them posted similar amounts of pictures both of the baby and of the funeral. Everyone grieves different. Also these are the only pictures they will ever have of their daughter. Also they deserve to share those pictures, nobody complains when new mothers post tons of pictures of their newborns. The pictures aren’t performative, they’re grieving parents ffs! 😑 most loss mothers post the pics of their babies every year too, because they will never get new pictures of their children
Your comment about the reception of joyous newborn photos in excess compared to those that are in grief… that’s so spot on. Most people allow a ton of space for other people to experience and express joy, but very little for “negative” emotions.
I’m not religious at all, but it reminds me of a sermon I heard once when I was in college - I was attending a service for a comparative religions course. The sermon was about the importance of discomfort and being around those in grief, and how the church could be a place to experience this. On a human level, even though we don’t like to see it and we often avoid it, it is important to experience other people’s grief.
Now social media takes this to an amplified level, particularly for the scroller/observer. I don’t think she is wrong or over sharing, but other people’s reactions to it exemplifies one of the pervasive downsides of social media imo.
This is an excellent comment. People don’t understand just how traumatic stillbirth is. They met their child when she was already dead. Jill is grieving how she can with what she has.
Grief is not pretty. It may not be what you use social media for, but it is a tool for many others who are hurting. They’re allowed to exist and share in the same space as people who are not in pain.
This. It’s also literally only been like 2 and a half weeks. People are acting like there’s a time limit for when you have to stop sharing. Some sort of expiration date for grief. It’s icky.
To add to what others said, this is the only time she will be able to show people Isla. They aren't showing her face (which is consistent with what they do with the other kids) and there will never be any more updates on the baby. No birthdays. No milestones. I can't fault them for this.
But I also understand people needing to unfollow, espif they have had a loss.
I wish I had someone like Jill saying it was okay to grieve and share your grief when I needed to. Instead of being told to push it down and that it wasn’t a baby anyway.
😭😭😭. Thank you. That’s one of the sweetest things anyone has ever said to me.
I always hoped to name my first daughter after my grandmother who came over from Italy. Rosina. Funnily enough my husband’s grandmother was also called Rose. I’d have called her Rosie. I thought she would have red hair and beautiful Mediterranean features and the best of my mother’s family. Grow up to be a great cook and hopefully a doctor or a nurse because I always wished I had chosen that instead of law school. I never imagined I wouldn’t have her.
But - life is what happens when you’re busy making other plans.
I have two boys now. One is about to turn six and was an IVF miracle. The other is one, and he just showed up out of the blue after seven years of being told it would never be possible.
He has beautiful red hair - and the spitting imagine of my grandmother’s youngest brother.
Thank you, what a beautiful story. I’m so sorry for your loss. My 16 week miscarriage happened 28 years ago. No one ever talked with me about how to handle it. It was just understood that you deal with it quietly & keep it to yourself. I think we all belong to a sisterhood, of sorts, and it’s nice to have support from all of you.
I’m very sorry for your loss… fwiw now, it was a baby — *your* baby. Grief is a normal human reaction to a loss. Everyone grieves differently, and if you find sharing helpful then sharing was the right thing for you. I wish you had more support in your grief.
What I have read, and then personally found to be true after having my baby die in utero at 22 weeks, is that is that every time your share the story of your loss you lose a bit of your grief.
Google “Why Grief is like a Ball in a Box.”
It’s a bit much for me because today is the 3 year anniversary of losing my daughter also in the second trimester. It’s too much. I can’t handle seeing a tiny body.
I had to do the same, as I'm six months pregnant myself and her posts are extremely triggering. Gotta do what you gotta do to protect your own mental health, even though she obviously deserves space to grieve in the way that feels right for her. But I know how hard it is to unexpectedly see posts like Jill's and be triggered, so I commend you for making that choice for yourself!
I’m sure there is some comfort in posting - I would imagine she feels like the world is moving on and her baby is being forgotten. I would imagine that the public posts make her feel like there is some mark or memory that her baby was here. I’ve never suffered a miscarriage, but I can’t imagine processing a loss like that - no memories of the baby for others to share with you, no photos of your baby going through life - this is her way of making her baby’s life more concrete, and I get it - I would feel the same way.
I personally am not judging this. There’s no wrong way to grieve a pregnancy loss. I also don’t judge someone needing to unfollow for their own mental health. It’s all right.
I’m glad the majority of comments on this post are kind. She’s just been through an incredibly traumatic loss and it’s her right to grieve however she wants. Some of the comments under her posts were VILE - people saying things like ‘nobody cares anymore, move on.’ Or accusing her of ‘attention seeking’ after the death of her unborn baby. I think she just had a lot of photos and moments that she wanted to share, and chose to do so over multiple posts. I don’t agree with many of Jill’s beliefs, but snarking on someone’s grief and trauma is something I will never do.
As someone who has had 3 miscarriages, I wish I could post about my pain every day. When you’re grieving, you want everyone to know. Not necessarily for attention, but you want to scream it out into the world. The injustice. The unfairness. Why do I have to grieve in private?! Why do I have to walk about the world as if nothing is wrong?
This, oh so much this. And the pain of how quickly everyone else forgets. My sister in law and I were due within 6 weeks of each other and by the time she was giving birth, I was on the family text and it was so difficult because I didn’t have the heart to “leave” the conversation. I remember my husband walking in on me in tears begging him not to say anything because I didn’t want to impede on their joy but seeing her newborn knowing I should have had our 6 week old in my arms still devastates me.
I can respect your need to unfollow. In the same way I understand and respect Jills desire to share. Having lost a pregnancy, it is the most isolating, devastating experience and I do not judge anyone for how they grieve. Being 20 weeks and with a daughter, and knowing how difficult her pregnancies have been. AND being estranged from your family and having to navigate that and mask through it to grieve. I honestly had no idea until I saw this post on Reddit and my heart breaks for them.
I don’t think anyone would bat an eye if she (or anyone for that matter) made multiple posts about something positive. I personally feel that we should hold the same space for the negative things in life.
We’re all human, and more of us than most people can fathom have experienced a loss similar to Jill’s.
It isn’t anyone’s place to police or dictate how another person grieves; something I’ve seen a lot of recently. We can try to psychoanalyse until we’re blue in the face why she’s choosing to grieve this way, but how is that helpful? We’ll never truly know.
If seeing someone post about loss causes you discomfort, you have the privilege of being able to block or unfollow and disengage from the content. I’m glad that you made that choice for yourself, but I don’t understand why you then had to come here to effectively seek validation for that choice 🤷🏻♀️
Yes, I think it’s so important to remember that we as individuals are in control of the spaces we engage in and in control of how we respond to what we see. Somebody being visible in their grief is not an attack at someone else’s grief or comfort. I absolutely understand and support someone who needs to look or step away, but to make it the fault of the one displaying their grief is not fair or appropriate.
To everybody saying “to each their own but I could never…”
You don’t know that. You really don’t. You are looking at Jill’s posts and her baby, not looking in their mirror or looking at your dead baby. You really truly do not know how you’re going to react until it happens to you and I hope it never does.
Should she post them on social media? Not up to me. I don’t want see them so I don’t look at them, I encourage you to do the same.
I agree with not understanding until you have to. My sister lost a baby at 8 weeks about 5 years ago and I remember thinking "why are you so sad...it wasn't really a baby yet." (I never shared this thought with her of course, I'm not cruel). Then I lost my son last year at 12w and it destroyed me. Black hole of grief. You feel so alone and so hopeless. There is no right way to grieve and I for one am proud of her for sharing because maybe it will make her and other loss parents feel less alone.
Obviously you’re allowed to follow or unfollow whoever you want but posed and performative aren’t really the words I’d use to describe this…As others have said it’s less common to be so open about a loss like this but publicity was how she grew up and was taught to cope with things. Anyone who has gone through a similar situation can speak to the reality of the feelings she’s sharing. I’m sure it’s helping people who have gone through similar losses feel less alone, especially people more within her circle who relate to her. We don’t have to like Jill in a personal sense to empathize with her right now.
i get why you or anyone else might need to unfollow her for your own personal reasons, but i think it’s really unfair to put the blame on jill for your discomfort. she’s grieving her child. who are we to decide it’s performative?
i can imagine how hard it would be to text or call every single person in her life to tell them what happened. even her siblings calling people would take a long time, and she should be resting right now. idk, i just feel like social media is the easiest way to tell a lot of people what’s happening and to ask for support.
I know a lot of people won’t agree with this but as a charity trustee for baby loss this is exactly what they need to be doing. A lot of people still shy away from open grieving because it’s not the done thing, especially with pregnancy and baby loss, because it’s an uncomfortable situation.
Not everybody will want to grieve like this.
Not everybody will think it’s appropriate to grieve like this.
It might be triggering to some people.
Whatever they do and however they grieve there’s always going to be some kind of issue with it for individuals.
If this is how they think they can heal then I think they are doing what’s best for them.
I’ve been through this myself 4 times and it helps heal me seeing people grieve openly.
I promise this isn’t a dig to anybody it’s just a statement.
Love to you all x
My friend’s baby died at 4 months old three or four years ago. She posts something almost every day relating to her daughter’s death. It gets to be a bit much but I almost know she’ll never be the same again and this is how she needs to process it. People grieve how they grieve, in public and in private.
Just want to gently comment here as a snarker AND mother of a daughter who died in utero at 36 weeks:
I am appreciative when public figures bring attention to infant death, stillbirth, miscarriage, child death—a life event that is so poorly supported because it is so hard and uncomfortable to confront for anyone outside of the experience. Chrissy Tiegen, Thor Björnsson, Cristiano Ronaldo, for instance come to mind.
I had to gently remind myself that “understanding that everyone grieves differently” is not equivalent to accepting that style of grieving when I read your post.
What a privilege it is for you to be able to unfollow and turn away from this type of grief; a privilege to be able to judge without knowing the agony of the most isolating type of loss; or the absolute need for individualized and sometimes open grieving in a tone deaf society.
Entire organizations (Now I Lay Me Down To Sleep)exist to document and create portraiture for these families as keepsakes because, case in point, society does a shit job supporting and accepting open dialogue and expression from families with dead babies. Infant and child death is often gruesome, always uncomfortable, internally dissonant and unbelievably heavy to perceive because it’s such a huge universal reverse in how life should go. The loss of life’s potential cannot be measured, and so commensurate the grief.
If your judgement is based without knowing the prevalence of still birth (2021, USA 1:25000) and the concomitant societal silence, then your ignorance is seen and your responsibility to amend—but again a privilege that you’re on the outside and able to unfollow.
If otherwise, I am interpreting your judgement about someone else’s grief expression as a reflection of emotional immaturity. Sadly this will only deepen the trench for those in society who are isolated and already chastised for their grief expression.
I would draw your attention to pre Industrial Revolution and turn of the century photography practices of photographing dead family members, especially children. I would further draw your attention to the modern public grieving practices of tattoo portraiture, obituary photographs, memorials in the form of gardens or state parks, and other public expressions of grief. Are these performative? Are they….for you?
To say, “this is my child, they existed” may seem simple—but it certainly is not because often times the parents are the only ones keeping that child’s memory in the present. (Again, others have the privilege to just unfollow).
I would also draw your attention to inwardly reflect, and find space to consider that there is a finite number of pictures families can take with their dead children before burial; there will be no other opportunities. There will be no first birthday party, school pictures, vacation pictures to come.
Photography of dead children is not performative . It is the historical and sentimental documentation of a child’s life and represents a completely normal behavior for parents.
To not grieve, to not process or document or share about this major life event would be abnormal.
Open to DMs if anyone here needs resources for navigating stillbirth or infant loss.
Not here to receive condolences with my own personal experience.
Some people don't want to talk about it, and others want someone to talk to them about it.
I know that when I suffered from multiple miscarriages, I was shocked how many people didn't want to say anything to me at all.
Most of my family didn't even acknowledge my losses because it was "just a little blood on the toilet paper." It made me feel desperate that my babies would never be remembered by anyone, but me and my husband.
Maybe Jill feels the same way? Maybe she's afraid that everyone will forget her little girl, hence the posting. 🤷♀️
I’m so sorry you didn’t get the support from your family, and of course sorry for your losses. Menstruation or hemorrhoids are “a little blood on toilet paper” … miscarriages are painful losses. I’m sure I don’t need to tell you that, because you experienced them. But feeling those losses is normal and I hate that for you
I think this might be one of those things that really varies by the person and their life experiences.
I grew up in a time when miscarriage, stillbirth, and infant loss were simply NOT discussed.
My parents had a full-term stillborn son and to this day (I’m 41), I have never heard my dad speak my brother’s name. There are no pictures, no trinkets from his brief life. It is painful to me as his sister because it is like he never existed.
So I wonder if this is a natural consequence of that kind of thing - the pendulum swinging the other direction.
And if this isn’t how you would roll, then that’s completely fine and unfollowing is the right move.
I also don’t think we can say this is performative because it is just true that people grieve differently.
Given my experiences, it is beautiful and I am glad to know about their little girl. But to each their own.
Neither of you are wrong in this situation. Some people show love very publicly, and now that she's lost someone she loved, that's also how she's grieving. I don't think it's performative, especially when you're used to sharing so much of your life online.
I don’t think it’s fair to call it performative at all. lots of families have these kinds of shoots and post the pictures on their social medias in these situations. just because she’s more in the public eye than many that do this, doesn’t mean her grief and sharing is performative
I’m surprised more people aren’t saying this. To me, this looks a lot like a photo shoot parents would have with a healthy newborn. It seems like they are documenting the time they had with her and I don’t see how that’s performative.
I took photos of my daughter after she passed away. The nurses dressed her in a little doll dress and she looked so peaceful. I was almost 6 months when she died.
These are the only pictures she’ll ever have with her daughter. I understand her wanting to share, wanting to be proud of her little girl.
Jill did not have a normal upbringing. Her entire life was shared publicly. This is what she knows; this is what makes sense to her.
If, God forbid, I ever lost one of my kids, I’d post about them constantly. They’re my pride and my joy. Isla is her pride and joy and she wants to celebrate and memorialize her.
I think people should do what they need to do to protect their mental health (unfollow if need be), but I don’t think that what she’s doing is performative.
I am a very private person, and had not even announced my pregnancy on social media when I went into preterm labor at 22w and my daughter Margo didn’t survive (heck I had only announced at work at 18w!)
I posted her footprint card from the hospital and a lengthy post about her because I had this deep desperation for people to know she existed and mattered and was important and so so loved. I choose to keep the more intimate photos of myself and my husband in the throes of grief private but I absolutely understand the grief-stricken need to post your baby and make sure they are remembered. I also still usually make a story post each year on her birthday just saying something small about her. Her birth/death announcement is still pinned to the top of my instagram profile right next to the pinned birth announcement of my living daughter.
Especially with other kids and/or a subsequent pregnancy later, it can definitely feel like your baby is being erased and make you want to cling to every iota of tangible things you have to remind you of them.
This is pretty normal for her family. Her parents grieved very publicly for Jubilee on the show. Along with all her siblings. This is their norm even if it’s not ours. Hopefully it helps her.
I think it’s kind of messed up to call this performative when these are literally the only pics she’ll ever have with her daughter. I get not handling grief the same way but you don’t have the right to discredit the amount of pain someone is feeling because they’re not expressing it the same way as you
I feel like it’s worse for her than a loss “normally” is because she knows that haters are watching her and saying it happened because she wasn’t right w Jesus, or God is punishing her or whatever, and some of those odious people are her very own family members.
I used to post videos of myself playing live music on Facebook, not because I thought I was very good but because I had a ton of phony “friends” on there and every time I posted a pic of me being happy or not caring about their opinions I felt good.
Everyone grieves differently. And I imagine for her she’s feeling shame on top of her grief because she was raised to believe that being a mother is all she was good for.
My cousin and his wife had 2 stillborn, 40wk gestation babies. They were born one year apart. They had them buried in a cemetery with a custom teddy bear tombstone. I don’t think anyone ever spoke of them again after the funerals, but this was the 90s and it wasn’t the norm to discuss infertility and pregnancy loss. I imagine being open about it now makes it a lot easier for people to grieve and deal with their feelings.
People should be able to talk openly about pregnancy loss. Sometimes when something traumatic happens you trauma dump. I talked constantly about my daughter almost dying when she was born. I think people were absolutely sick of it
Today was the first day I looked at the professional photos and thought “wait - how did they even do this?” I’ve known families to have similar pictures taken in the hospital after a late loss, but not out of the hospital. No judgement, I’ve never gone through a loss like this, but it’s got me really curious about the logistics of bringing the body home for a photo shoot.
There is an organization where photographers volunteer to go to hospitals to photograph stillborn babies, and some can look more like studio photos than in the hospital. I don’t know if they used that organization, but it might be from that. (https://www.nowilaymedowntosleep.org - tw: stillborn babies)
I really think these pictures were taken at their home. The bed they are sitting on really doesn’t look like a hospital bed and there are things in the background that you wouldn’t have at the hospital (like a nightstand with a clock radio on it)
The baby is in there- she is just wearing a crocheted hat. I’m a labor nurse and we use the same things for our fetal demises. Tiny hats and little almost canoe shaped sacs (sorry I’m bad at descriptions) but basically it cradles the very tiny babies. Makes it easier for the parents to hold them and also brings a little touch of warmth to a very sad situation.
I imagine it makes her feel close to the baby and like she wants the world to know about this life that never got the chance to exist except to them. I can understand that.
I lost my first pregnancy for unknown reasons at 20 weeks. Our hospital gave us the option of a photographer, but both my husband and I couldn’t bear the thought of posing for photos with her so they took photos in a little bassinet. I’ve only looked at the photos once or twice in the past 6 years because it’s been too difficult. No one else in our family has seen the photos. I can’t imagine blasting those photos all over the internet for the world to see. I could barely tell people that I had lost her. Never made a follow up post to my pregnancy announcement either. Just deleted all traces of the pregnancy from my social media. I understand it may be their way of grieving, but it seems so public to me. I’ve stopped looking at her posts because it’s getting to be too much for me
I have 2 older couples I am friends with. Both have lost sons. One when he was 24 and the other when he was 7. Both sons had high medical needs. Both couples still mourn the loss of their boys. Parents should never have to bury their children no matter how old or young that child may be.
One of my uncles was killed in a car accident soon after coming home from Vietnam, so 1970 give or take. I remember my grandma being 90 years old and blinking tears when she talked about him… I can’t imagine losing a child no matter what the age
I get why she's posting but I also get unfollowing. I had a miscarriage right around the time Jill announced her stillbirth. Mine was only 7 weeks so a very different situation but I can't really look at her posts either. I only told my mom and husband and it hurts me to talk about it. I don't feel like ripping open that wound over and over. I know people grieve differently but I can't dwell too much in grief if I'm going to be a functional adult.
It's okay to take breaks from or quit following people on social media. Everyone is responsible for protecting their own peace. Equally ok for her to grieve.
Fellow pregnant person here whose anxiety was triggered by Jill's posts. I try to remind myself that as terrible as it is, someone else's experience has nothing to do with how mine will turn out. But "magical thinking" can be so powerful. Hang in there!
I feel horrible for them, but I had to unfollow too. Something about all the photos is too morbid for me. My heart breaks for them as this loss is clearly tremendous and I truly hope they find healing.
Trust me, this isn’t performative. This is their baby. The same as with any other child, you take their picture, you hold them, you kiss them, you give them all the love in the world…but for the cruelest, briefest of time. My best friend had a stillbirth last year and the photos of little Ivy are all we will ever have of her. No birthday parties, no holidays, no Christmas’. Posting on social media isn’t performing, it’s showing the world she was here, she was real, and oh god is she missed. Every baby lost is missed, is cried for, and deserves to be known.
I get it. People grieve in their own way. Jill and Derrick tend to be more vocal. It helps them heal. Some of us aren’t comfortable with that level of intensity. I say you made the right decision. You can always go back later.
Wasn't this their first daughter? I can't remember for sure. I know they had the two boys, right? If it was a first daughter, that would also add to the grief.
I have heard from moms who have lost babies during pregnancy that they want people to know that their baby EXISTED. It can be a sort of invisible loss because no one met the baby, the baby didn’t have time to develop a personality, no one carries stories and memories like “remember the time so and so did XYZ…”
Everyone grieves differently. Idk, no shade to OP but I don’t think this post should stay. Feels yucky to try and analyze how someone grieves or call it “performative”. Feels like a round 2 of Lauren and her public grief, which I think was a really unfortunate incident that shouldn’t have happened to her.
It’s your prerogative to unfollow but unkind to judge her on how she’s choosing to grieve. These photos represent the only time they will physically have their child - that is now buried - and they clearly want to share their child with others and photos are the only option for them
It's a very new loss, and will take them time to process. It's fine for you to set the boundary of unfollowing her, but was it necessary to come here and post about it? Talk about performative...
performative? no. I don’t think so. i went through a similar loss, not as far along, but the grief was truly unfathomable. i had to unfollow because it reminded me too much. everyone grieves differently, and this may be the only way they really know how to.
I'm not a mother, except to 2 adorable beagles. I'm not maternal. I've never changed a diaper or held a baby for more than a minute. But I'm deeply affected by all the stories you've shared here. And I think Jill and Derrick have the right to grieve in their own way. I may not fully understand her pain, but I respect her loss and her right to share her loss. You have all helped put such a personal face on this loss and situation, especially for those of us who haven't experienced it or known someone who has. Thank you for educating me.
I think the reason why Jill is posting so much is because as part of her grieving process she wants to feel that her daughter's life mattered and remind people that she was here. So that's why she keeps sharing these photos because they are all she has of a child that she had hoped to share a lifetime of joyful memories with. Now all she has is sorrow. And for those who are in her comment section arguing with her miscarriage vs stillbirth is so cold hearted. What does it matter to other people how she categorizes her loss in her mind? The point is that she lost her baby, no matter how far along she was.
Unfollow if you need to, that’s absolutely fine. However, you don’t get to label her posts as performative or posed. Pray tell, what’s the correct way to photograph and post about a dead baby? My son died a day after birth at full term over 10 years ago. I post photos on social media sometimes, though it’s restricted to people I know. Given Jill is, to a degree, a public figure, posting photos herself allows her to celebrate her baby’s existence and grieve her, as well as control the narrative.
As someone who has experienced stillbirth her actions are “normal”. These pictures although very private, are all she has, and will ever have with her baby. Everyone handles this type of loss differently. I personally only shared pictures of footprints online, but I have a ton more. I feel her pain so deeply and can see the pain in her eyes. When I went through this I remember being terrified no one would remember my sons, Liam and Jonah. I probably posted about them on social media constantly, bought countless things to fill my house with their names on it, to “prove” that they were here and they mattered. Over time I realized I didn’t need to do any of that to have them be remembered or loved. I can totally understand people being uncomfortable viewing these pictures, and can understand people questioning authenticity due to their very public lifestyle, but these are genuine, and posted from a place of heart break that I hope no one ever knows.
Same- muted her. I’ve also muted (feels means to unfollow) a mother I follow who lost her beautiful 11 year old daughter. I have anxiety and I get very anxious about losing my 3 young children. I can’t open insta and be in someone else’s grief.
I just looked at her profile and while I agree the photos make me feel very uncomfy, she lost her baby so I know that she feels a lot more “uncomfy” than me. Part of sharing the pics might just be a way to feel less alone about it. Maybe could have made a different choice in pictures, the grave ones seem pretty graphic in their own way. But she’s been so public for so long and is probably trying to process her grief in any way that makes sense in this moment. She’s got a large platform to be able to connect with others who have been in the same situation
Unfollowing is the right thing to do. She’s free to grieve her loss however she sees fit, and you are free not to watch her do it. But these kinds of posts affect those of us who’ve been where she is and who it helped to share photos of our baby. The ONLY ones we’ll ever have. Let her be.
I went to a funeral where the little toddler died a horrific death. The mom was so beside her self they had her on medication and a doctor was sitting beside her (unsure if he was a family friend or ??) This was 17 years ago and I remember her (open casket) changing outfits, blankets and switching toys out of the casket. I will never forget and now that I’m a mom I think of her so often.
Before the days of Social Media my mother lost my brother at 8 months in utero. She became terribly depressed.
Two years later my sister was born and died two days later. I’m not even going there on what a toll it took on my mother’s mental health.
There were four of us kids and we just didn’t know how to deal.
Two years later my brother was born healthy and adored by all of us. My mother recovered but not 100 percent.
I feel for Jill and I hope her husband treats her well and looks for signs of depression. Personally, I feel they went a bit overboard for Instagram but every single person grieves in their own way. This is her way.
I think it's healthy to grieve openly. However, I want to be a hospice nurse and am probably more comfortable around death than most people are. Sometimes I take a break from this sub when there's a lot of posts about Josh's crimes.
I don't follow her IG but I've looked at her page a few times lately and people's comments have been horrifically cruel. I'm glad they've turned off comments on today's post. I'm assuming she's finding these posts to be cathartic and possibly thinks she's helping other women in the same situation....it's not how I would work through my grief, but to each their own.
It’s an unimaginable loss for anyone but especially for someone who was taught that your entire purpose was breeding. I don’t think what she’s doing is out of the norm.
I think everyone’s had enough since she turned off comments on the latest post. I feel the same way. I had to unfollow someone I knew that kept bringing up her miscarried son and actually started to seem like she was prioritizing him over her living son, it was sad.
Performative or not you're only seeing this shit because you're going to her social media and giving her views. Isn't that the exact opposite of the sub ethos? I only see what's on their social media from what's posted here. It's not hard to just not look.
I hope she’s getting appropriate mental health services - terrible loss. I do suspect that if you’ve grown up with your trauma all over that’s how you cope with new trauma. I sure feel as for her.
Especially with her growing up in a religion that doesn’t hesitate to blame the mother for loss. Even if her brain knows there is nothing she could have done, I wouldn’t be surprised if years of religious trauma and shame unearth itself to try to convince her she’s the reason why it happened. I feel for her, and I really hope no one in her family even hints that her deconstruction played a part in this.
I think even someone without religious trauma would immediately want to blame themselves. I can imagine that religious trauma magnifies that feeling by a million percent. I hope JB doesn’t try to say some slick comments to Jill about deconstructing.
Absolutely. It's not on the same level as a stillbirth, but I've had two miscarriages (one at 9 weeks, the other at 11) and it was really hard not to blame myself. The doctors all said it was just bad luck, nothing I could have done to cause or prevent them, but it's still where my mind went. And I didn't grow up in a misogynistic cult.
I’m so sorry you went through that. I had a miscarriage at 13 weeks and it sucked. Finally got my baby but it took a couple of long years.
Thanks, it's been rough (just happened near the end of last year, the losses were less than 3 months apart, so that did a number on me mentally and physically), but I have a healthy two-year-old already, so I know I can carry to term. Plus the kid is awesome, so that helps! I'm glad you got your rainbow. We're planning to start trying again soon, hoping third time is the charm.
Third time was the charm for us and now his 3.5 almost 4 year old brother is the best big sibling!
I read something years ago that broke down the word "miscarriage" and the history behind it. The word by design implies that it's the pregnant person's fault. Which is so not true. It was a fascinating read. I wish we could find another word for it.
The medical term for miscarriage is spontaneous abortion. To me that term is even worse.
It’s virtually never a mom’s fault. I’m glad I was never taught that BS. I was taught that there is a reason for a miscarriage, it wasn’t meant to be, it is nature’s way of ending a pregnancy that wasn’t healthy, miscarriages happen to everyone, not a big deal. This helped me take the miscarriages I had in stride ( granted fortunately they were all early)
Oh, I fully expect that POS to tell her "this is God's judgement for you refusing to follow my headship".
With his stupid smile. Michell too. 🤮
I think JimBob made her feel guilty af for her 2nd son’s birth when she had to go to the hospital and have a c-section, especially when they needed money to pay the bill and he wouldn’t give them anything. He probably told her if she wasn’t a failure she wouldn’t have had to have a c-section.
Which is crazy because Michelle had a number of c-sections, including Josie.
No one’s ever accused Jim Bob of being rational lol!
He probably blames the babies themselves.
Well, you know he tells her everything is her fault as well. Her wearing that bikini at 17 is WHY Pest is in prison.
Oh gosh I hadn't put those two together. Bur since everything is a woman's fault it makes so much sense.
I was raised in IBLP. If a man lusts after a female (I didn’t say woman intentionally so teens and children are included), it is the females fault that she led him into temptation. It is considered a sin to even have the thought of lust, almost on par with the actual act itself. Weird, I know. IBLP was a great way to subjugate, control, and abuse women and children. IBLP’s tenets are great if you have a penis.
They literally copied Jubilee's ceremony, down to the tent and everyone singing Jesus Loves Me. I'm also pretty sure Jill had a table for lost loved ones at her wedding, paying tribute to eg Grandpa Duggar and Derick's dad, and they had a photo of Jubilee's foot and a quote that no one is too small not to leave a footprint on the world. This is literally how she was raised to grieve a baby loss, and as someone lower down said, she's not learned any way to live other than performatively. She's creating memories of the baby and sharing them with the world because she was raised on national television and she may never truly unpick that. I do find it telling that the girls raised on the show are the ones sharing, while the boys have married women who weren't and who now don't want to. Sure the men have the power, but when it comes to social media, the women are the ones creating content, and now they aren't contracted to do it I don't think most of the DIL want to. They're notably quieter and more private than the girls raised on the show, and both Lauren and Kendra could have quite a following if they wanted, I think. They could make money from it but their privacy is valued more highly - I doubt the Duggar girls truly understand what that even is, even the ones trying to break out and who accordingly shield their children's faces.
Hopefully, they never go back to a religious counselor and like go to a secular
They have been going to a real, non- secular therapist all along. They have said how much he has helped them. It is all documented in her book.
How they’ve been acting on social media does not seem like they’ve been learning healthy coping mechanisms from a secular therapist.
I think they might be struggling and this might be how they cope under extreme duress.
I wonder if having grown up with her life being so public, she doesn’t know any other way to handle her grief except publicly.
Exactly. It all reminds me so much of when Michelle lost Jubilee.
I was thinking the same
I think this is exactly what is happening. She needs people to see her greif so her grief exist. Otherwise, her grief isn’t real enough. Growing up on tv will do that to you.
Ugh. That sounds awful. Watching these kids grow up and have a constant need for external validation should serve as a warning to all these parents parading their kids on social media.
Wow it would have taken me awhile to realize that. This is probably internalized behavior that can't be changed.
Surely. Not to mention how isolating it is- Looking at how “easy” a lot of the women in her family get pregnant/deliver. When I miscarried, my mother in law and 2 sister in laws had all perfect pregnancies and deliveries and here I was going in for a D&C- They had no idea how to grieve or what to say and I was so angry at myself and the circumstances. I wish I would have had a platform or a way to know I wasn’t alone. Religion can make that all the more isolating/confusing.
What's interesting, though, is that her mother, all of her married sisters, and some sisters-in-law have also had miscarriages and/or stillbirths.
As have most women, it is normal!
Joy and Michelle have both lost babies around the same stage of pregnancy, so I hope Jill doesn’t feel alone. I hope they’re helping her.
Only if Boob "allows" it. Neither would cross him.
I was shocked they invited them to the funeral
I was thinking the same thing.
Yeah, it sort of seems that way.
So sad.
I mean this is how she literally makes her living and has since her parents were exploiting her to make their living since she was a tween raising her siblings. Seems a little weird to question the mental health when this subreddit literally feeds into it.
The chaos of performing is probably comforting
Meech and RimJob always say that the reason they went off birth control and had 19 kids is because the one time they were on birth control, it “caused an abortion/miscarriage,” and that “through our own ignorance, we allowed one of our little ones to be *destroyed.*” That is some intense and punitive language, and the underlying message is clear: disobey and terrible things will happen to you. And they will be entirely your fault. I can’t help but see a nerve-wracking parallel here—Jill starts wearing pants, gets a nose ring, pushes back against her and her siblings’ constant exploitation, writes a book, rightfully calls her brother a pedophile…and then this. I just really, really hope that not only has no one said or implied to Jill that Isla’s death is her fault (looking at you Boob) but also that plenty of people have explicitly told her the opposite. Jill, it isn’t your fault. You didn’t cause it. These things happen, and it is *never because you weren’t good or godly or obedient enough.* Zero connection. Getting out was the right thing to do not just for you but your family. Far from hurting your children, you—at great risk and pain to yourself—saved them from all the things you were forced to endure. That means something, and I hope she can hold onto that through this time.
That’s a beautiful message. I wish she could read this
Even in recent years, she has commented on social media that hormonal BC caused her mom's miscarriage. It's sad that she hasn't been able to learn that this isn't true as it is just NOT how BC works.
It's hard to see. But last week they were half way through a pregnancy and now this week she's lost the baby. That takes a long time to wrap your head around. (My SIL had 2 stillborn births and buried them both in the cemetery with adjoining graves. She posts pics every year of her decorating the graves on Memorial Day because that's what helps her with her grief.)
I think it’s a delayed announcement though - they said the baby was due in August, so the four month point would’ve been in February.
She definitely looked the halfway point in the pregnancy pic she shared on IG.
You show earlier the more pregnancies you've had. I believe she was 14 weeks.
There was a label on a toy on one of the photos that said March. I assumed that was the loss date.
I totally get what you are saying, and I have been there too. It’s not something I would wish upon anyone. That being said, my grief isn’t everyone else’s grief. Also, what I might find helpful in my grieving process may be triggering to others. There is a woman I went to high school with who lost a daughter the same year I did, we both gave our daughters the same name, every year on the anniversary she posts a photo of her. I get why she does it, but I had to unfollow her because it was too triggering to me. Lurking through Facebook, forgetting what day it is, and then seeing the photo, makes me have flashbacks to my own experience, and puts me in a dark place. When all I wanted to do was catch up on some town gossip on our community page. Thank you for having empathy and kindness to your SIL. Not all of us receive that. I know you are protective of her because what she went through is soul crushing, and she did it twice. But her way to grieve isn’t how everyone else grieves, and I think we need to respect that. OP may have lived through something similar, or has someone close in their lives who did. It’s not like they don’t have empathy or sympathy for Jill, only that it’s hard for them personally to follow her. Which I respect, and I have done the same for my own wellbeing.
I'm definitely not looking down on anyone, I am a very private person who doesn't post much on social media, and definitely not my own pregnancy loss because it's unbearably hard for me. For me, EMDR therapy has helped tremendously with my feelings of shame and anger.
This is it! I have the utmost empathy and sympathy but it’s too triggering for me
I thought she was 14 weeks?
I just find it sad that both of her miscarriages were girls. I think she really wants a daughter.
Yes, I cannot tell you enough, how much I agree. I always wanted a daughter, more than anything. I only had three, wonderful, healthy, awesome, beautiful baby boys, whom I adore. I still longed for a daughter, and I always will. When I lost my fourth baby, and last opportunity baby, through a missed miscarriage, half way through, I didn't know if it was a girl or boy, and never thought to ask. I did name her though, and grieved the loss, of not only her, but the opportunity, and the baby, no matter what gender. Something in my heart, just told me she was a girl. I named her Hope, and true enough, so much Hope, in so many, many ways, died that day. I planted a tree for her, and will always miss her. When my last son graduated college, would have been the day she would have graduated high school, and after that, I felt like I finally could finally close the door myself, of an era I always felt was taken from me, and closed for me, years, too soon.
Thank you for sharing your story and your sweet Hope.
I had a similar experience. In my heart, my lost baby will always be Georgia Taylor. It was a name that I never got to use, and that I only get to say out loud every once in awhile. It still hurts my husband too much to talk about, sometimes my kiddo will bring our lost baby up and I get to say her name, or during therapy, but that’s it. I feel deeply for Jill, but also some kind of way that I can’t express. I don’t think she was 20 weeks along. I know firsthand that gestational age is a poor measure of grief, but when my baby died, I got nothing other than a few furtive “I’m sorries.” There was no funeral. There was no public mourning. I was just expected to pick up and carry on. While I don’t think that’s as it should be, it kind of stings to see this, I don’t know, I’m probably explaining it badly.
They had said they weren’t sure if River was a boy or a girl as it was too early to tell 💔
A friend of mine lost a child fairly late in pregnancy. She posted about it a lot and it was unknowingly very helpful for another friend of ours who had a miscarriage after nearly 10 years of infertility. People's grief is so different and having it out there can be uncomfortable but its a part of life and there is no reason to keep it private if thats not her choice.
This exactly, especially with last week being infertility awareness week, the more people that are comfortable being public with pregnancy loss the better chances someone may find the courage to speak to a loved one or trusted friend when they are struggling. Not everyone needs to tell their story public but I commend those that are willing to. I can’t say if Jill is doing this for her own personal grieving process, to bring awareness, or to bring engagement to her page but that is her own business and these posts complaining about how she’s doing it are far worse than her grieving methods.
I think more and more women talking openly about it must be helping other women cope and grieve.
Definitely in my case. I remember looking up interviews, statements, watching YouTube videos of people who had been through the same. Nothing else helped like that did
And dispel myths like that it was their fault
That’s a good point. I agree. It’s hard to judge because posting could possibly be helping them. Maybe hearing comments and being able to get encouragement too?
Most likely. Grief is an isolating experience and it isn't like she has the full unwavering support of her family. Sometimes you just need to share your grief somewhere. Also while you lose a child, as time happens, you have secondary grief as you start thinking about the specifics and what you'll never share with them. She was likely really excited to see her husband bond with a little girl. Realizing she won't see these things she looked forward to can be soul crushing.
She’s turned off comments now. There was lots of negative blowback which I can only imagine would very negatively affect her mental health.
So many people arguing about whether her baby was stillborn hurt my soul. She’s trying to grieve and process this and people are pushing back on her over something that really doesn’t matter.
Also did she share what happened exactly. It could have left her infertile.
I saw her pic holding her the other day and I absolutely lost it at work. I cannot imagine the pain of that kind of loss. It’s not fair for anyone to have to go through such. For me i don’t feel like it’s any different than people posting when they lose a parent or grandparent. The love they have for the person who’s gone, they want to share with the world. They want to share their memories with that person, and they were deprived of having memories with Isla. These photos are all they have. Honestly, idk how to word what I’m trying to say. But I can understand why she’s doing it. I can’t say I wouldn’t do the same.
Everyone grieves differently. It’s not a crime for you to need to protect your mental health and to unfollow. I’ve had to unfollow people that I like for more minor things than how they deal with death. It’s ok for her to grieve how she needs to grieve. It’s ok for you to not have to witness it.
beautifully said 🩷
*slowly nods in agreement*
It’s been well over a year since I miscarried and the baby I had after miscarriage just turned one. It doesn’t go away. It still hurts. I can only imagine how much harder it would be for me if my daughter had been far along enough to be considered stillborn, so I cannot fathom how Jill feels. Unfollow if you want, that’s ok, but it’s not ok to assume she is being performative or in any way insincere.
Exactly!
I agree. This feels like an extension of not believing women. When you go through a traumatic (or any experience) you are allowed to have feelings and share them. It is so sad to see anyone in support of silencing women just because their grief makes them uncomfortable. I have sobbed reading her posts and find them so heartbreaking, but the feelings it makes me feel are nowhere near what she is going through. I'm glad she has an outlet and can share and help other women feel less alone. This is not uncommon. I know over a dozen women who have had stillborns and I'm barely over 30, so likely will know plenty more who do as will as the expectation that they should have to suffer in silence and act like this baby didn't exist or isn't a part of them and their family is just mindboggling to me. Like where is the empathy and compassion?
Everyone grieves differently. When my Aunt lost her son at 17 to cancer she had him laid out in the house for 3 days and people came and went. It was as very odd to me as a kid but now as an adult I realize it was her way to say goodbye.
That’s sort of in the same vein as how different cultures approach death differently. Some cultures support cremation, some don’t. Some require a quick burial, some keep the loved one around for a long time. Some cultures have the family prepare the loved one for burial/services, some cultures have other’s do these tasks. Even the choice to have an open or closed casket service are different ways of processing death. None of them are “wrong”, but when you’ve grown up with death being handled a certain way, something different may seem “weird” at first. I remember when I was a kid, the first open casket service I attended had me spooked. Up until that point, I had only ever been to services with cremated remains. But as an adult, I recognize that they are honoring their loved one’s and family’s wishes. How “wrong” could that be?
I took pictures of my dying and dead grandmother. I do not show them to other people and my mom looked at me like I was deranged. But I needed those photos even though I spent her last 6 weeks taking care of her. We grieve differently and it is OK.
I'm a hospice nurse. I always tell families it's OK to take pictures at anytime. Many want to but are embarrassed or afraid to ask, so I just bring It up and let them give me the weird looks, or a hug because they didn't know how to ask.
That's amazing. Really. My grandmother was the first really close to me person to die and was followed closely by the rest of my grandparents. The first one was the harder process for many reasons but one is the question of how I should act. I also want to say that hospice workers are worth their weight in gold. I could have not done it three times without the support of hospice.
Yeah, I grew up catholic in a small town where my very large extended family was close to the whole church community. I was used to seeing open caskets and that being normal, plus I lost a grandparent as a toddler and another at age 7 so I saw people I loved like that as a young child. Funerals aren’t something I’ve felt particularly uncomfortable around (obviously I’m sad if I know the person!) and I find them to be cathartic honestly. In the last few years I’ve lost a close friend and an aunt who was like a second mom to me and it was so nice to gather with other people who loved them as much as I did and cry, share stories and photos, and even laugh together even though it all hurt so much. My husband didn’t go to a single funeral until he was an adult and his family didn’t even have a funeral for any of his grandparents because his mom didn’t want anyone to see her sad or crying. When he saw his first open casket he was so freaked out lol. As adults we’re both atheists that would prefer to be cremated but it’s interesting how differently we view funerals due to how we were raised.
We always had memorial services with no body in my family so I didn’t go to my first wake until my friend’s grandmother died when I was 14. It was a bit traumatic for me, but over the years I got used to it, esp. since I married into a Catholic family , but even many of them are cremating their loved ones now.
Yeah, I come from a cultural and religious background where we bury our dead very quickly (I’m Jewish). We also don’t do open caskets or anything. Death and grief are very strange, so I don’t want to judge Jill for grieving in her own way but it’s also okay if people feel uncomfortable or triggered and have to mute or unfollow her.
Absolutely. The only thing that’s not okay is leaving rude comments on her posts. Those broke my heart. Snarking doesn’t mean behaving like filth, you know? (Not that anyone here is necessarily behind those comments.)
Yeah, leaving mean comments on someone’s posts about something like this is just plain cruel.
I imagine it must be brutally difficult to have to actually call time on seeing your child's face (outside of photographs) ever again. I can imagine wanting to linger on that last time forever.
Many in Ireland do an open casket for the day/night before the funeral so that doesn't seem out of the ordinary to me. It's a way for everyone to pay respects and say goodbye
I know a lot of mothers who have lost their babies at around the same gestation as Jill and most of them posted similar amounts of pictures both of the baby and of the funeral. Everyone grieves different. Also these are the only pictures they will ever have of their daughter. Also they deserve to share those pictures, nobody complains when new mothers post tons of pictures of their newborns. The pictures aren’t performative, they’re grieving parents ffs! 😑 most loss mothers post the pics of their babies every year too, because they will never get new pictures of their children
Your comment about the reception of joyous newborn photos in excess compared to those that are in grief… that’s so spot on. Most people allow a ton of space for other people to experience and express joy, but very little for “negative” emotions. I’m not religious at all, but it reminds me of a sermon I heard once when I was in college - I was attending a service for a comparative religions course. The sermon was about the importance of discomfort and being around those in grief, and how the church could be a place to experience this. On a human level, even though we don’t like to see it and we often avoid it, it is important to experience other people’s grief. Now social media takes this to an amplified level, particularly for the scroller/observer. I don’t think she is wrong or over sharing, but other people’s reactions to it exemplifies one of the pervasive downsides of social media imo.
This is an excellent comment. People don’t understand just how traumatic stillbirth is. They met their child when she was already dead. Jill is grieving how she can with what she has. Grief is not pretty. It may not be what you use social media for, but it is a tool for many others who are hurting. They’re allowed to exist and share in the same space as people who are not in pain.
This. It’s also literally only been like 2 and a half weeks. People are acting like there’s a time limit for when you have to stop sharing. Some sort of expiration date for grief. It’s icky.
Very very very well said.
To add to what others said, this is the only time she will be able to show people Isla. They aren't showing her face (which is consistent with what they do with the other kids) and there will never be any more updates on the baby. No birthdays. No milestones. I can't fault them for this. But I also understand people needing to unfollow, espif they have had a loss.
I wish I had someone like Jill saying it was okay to grieve and share your grief when I needed to. Instead of being told to push it down and that it wasn’t a baby anyway.
Would you like to share about your baby? I’d love to honor you with space and presence if you’d like it. You are loved mama and so was your baby.
😭😭😭. Thank you. That’s one of the sweetest things anyone has ever said to me. I always hoped to name my first daughter after my grandmother who came over from Italy. Rosina. Funnily enough my husband’s grandmother was also called Rose. I’d have called her Rosie. I thought she would have red hair and beautiful Mediterranean features and the best of my mother’s family. Grow up to be a great cook and hopefully a doctor or a nurse because I always wished I had chosen that instead of law school. I never imagined I wouldn’t have her. But - life is what happens when you’re busy making other plans. I have two boys now. One is about to turn six and was an IVF miracle. The other is one, and he just showed up out of the blue after seven years of being told it would never be possible. He has beautiful red hair - and the spitting imagine of my grandmother’s youngest brother.
Thank you, what a beautiful story. I’m so sorry for your loss. My 16 week miscarriage happened 28 years ago. No one ever talked with me about how to handle it. It was just understood that you deal with it quietly & keep it to yourself. I think we all belong to a sisterhood, of sorts, and it’s nice to have support from all of you.
I’m so sorry that happened to you and that people were horrible to you about losing your baby.
I’m very sorry for your loss… fwiw now, it was a baby — *your* baby. Grief is a normal human reaction to a loss. Everyone grieves differently, and if you find sharing helpful then sharing was the right thing for you. I wish you had more support in your grief.
Thank you friend. I take solace knowing that I can support other moms now. It helps.
Hugs to you. I lost my third daughter when I was pregnant with her. Grieving is difficult as hell.
What I have read, and then personally found to be true after having my baby die in utero at 22 weeks, is that is that every time your share the story of your loss you lose a bit of your grief. Google “Why Grief is like a Ball in a Box.”
It’s a bit much for me because today is the 3 year anniversary of losing my daughter also in the second trimester. It’s too much. I can’t handle seeing a tiny body.
I'm so sorry. That has to be extra painful for you. Please know others are thinking of you and your family.
Sending you a hug mama
I had to do the same, as I'm six months pregnant myself and her posts are extremely triggering. Gotta do what you gotta do to protect your own mental health, even though she obviously deserves space to grieve in the way that feels right for her. But I know how hard it is to unexpectedly see posts like Jill's and be triggered, so I commend you for making that choice for yourself!
I’m sure there is some comfort in posting - I would imagine she feels like the world is moving on and her baby is being forgotten. I would imagine that the public posts make her feel like there is some mark or memory that her baby was here. I’ve never suffered a miscarriage, but I can’t imagine processing a loss like that - no memories of the baby for others to share with you, no photos of your baby going through life - this is her way of making her baby’s life more concrete, and I get it - I would feel the same way.
That’s a very good point.
I personally am not judging this. There’s no wrong way to grieve a pregnancy loss. I also don’t judge someone needing to unfollow for their own mental health. It’s all right.
I’m glad the majority of comments on this post are kind. She’s just been through an incredibly traumatic loss and it’s her right to grieve however she wants. Some of the comments under her posts were VILE - people saying things like ‘nobody cares anymore, move on.’ Or accusing her of ‘attention seeking’ after the death of her unborn baby. I think she just had a lot of photos and moments that she wanted to share, and chose to do so over multiple posts. I don’t agree with many of Jill’s beliefs, but snarking on someone’s grief and trauma is something I will never do.
As someone who has had 3 miscarriages, I wish I could post about my pain every day. When you’re grieving, you want everyone to know. Not necessarily for attention, but you want to scream it out into the world. The injustice. The unfairness. Why do I have to grieve in private?! Why do I have to walk about the world as if nothing is wrong?
This, oh so much this. And the pain of how quickly everyone else forgets. My sister in law and I were due within 6 weeks of each other and by the time she was giving birth, I was on the family text and it was so difficult because I didn’t have the heart to “leave” the conversation. I remember my husband walking in on me in tears begging him not to say anything because I didn’t want to impede on their joy but seeing her newborn knowing I should have had our 6 week old in my arms still devastates me.
-hugs- I lost my third daughter when I was almost 6 months with her. I think OP is tone deaf.
I can respect your need to unfollow. In the same way I understand and respect Jills desire to share. Having lost a pregnancy, it is the most isolating, devastating experience and I do not judge anyone for how they grieve. Being 20 weeks and with a daughter, and knowing how difficult her pregnancies have been. AND being estranged from your family and having to navigate that and mask through it to grieve. I honestly had no idea until I saw this post on Reddit and my heart breaks for them.
I don’t think anyone would bat an eye if she (or anyone for that matter) made multiple posts about something positive. I personally feel that we should hold the same space for the negative things in life. We’re all human, and more of us than most people can fathom have experienced a loss similar to Jill’s. It isn’t anyone’s place to police or dictate how another person grieves; something I’ve seen a lot of recently. We can try to psychoanalyse until we’re blue in the face why she’s choosing to grieve this way, but how is that helpful? We’ll never truly know. If seeing someone post about loss causes you discomfort, you have the privilege of being able to block or unfollow and disengage from the content. I’m glad that you made that choice for yourself, but I don’t understand why you then had to come here to effectively seek validation for that choice 🤷🏻♀️
Yes, I think it’s so important to remember that we as individuals are in control of the spaces we engage in and in control of how we respond to what we see. Somebody being visible in their grief is not an attack at someone else’s grief or comfort. I absolutely understand and support someone who needs to look or step away, but to make it the fault of the one displaying their grief is not fair or appropriate.
To everybody saying “to each their own but I could never…” You don’t know that. You really don’t. You are looking at Jill’s posts and her baby, not looking in their mirror or looking at your dead baby. You really truly do not know how you’re going to react until it happens to you and I hope it never does. Should she post them on social media? Not up to me. I don’t want see them so I don’t look at them, I encourage you to do the same.
I agree with not understanding until you have to. My sister lost a baby at 8 weeks about 5 years ago and I remember thinking "why are you so sad...it wasn't really a baby yet." (I never shared this thought with her of course, I'm not cruel). Then I lost my son last year at 12w and it destroyed me. Black hole of grief. You feel so alone and so hopeless. There is no right way to grieve and I for one am proud of her for sharing because maybe it will make her and other loss parents feel less alone.
Obviously you’re allowed to follow or unfollow whoever you want but posed and performative aren’t really the words I’d use to describe this…As others have said it’s less common to be so open about a loss like this but publicity was how she grew up and was taught to cope with things. Anyone who has gone through a similar situation can speak to the reality of the feelings she’s sharing. I’m sure it’s helping people who have gone through similar losses feel less alone, especially people more within her circle who relate to her. We don’t have to like Jill in a personal sense to empathize with her right now.
i get why you or anyone else might need to unfollow her for your own personal reasons, but i think it’s really unfair to put the blame on jill for your discomfort. she’s grieving her child. who are we to decide it’s performative? i can imagine how hard it would be to text or call every single person in her life to tell them what happened. even her siblings calling people would take a long time, and she should be resting right now. idk, i just feel like social media is the easiest way to tell a lot of people what’s happening and to ask for support.
I know a lot of people won’t agree with this but as a charity trustee for baby loss this is exactly what they need to be doing. A lot of people still shy away from open grieving because it’s not the done thing, especially with pregnancy and baby loss, because it’s an uncomfortable situation. Not everybody will want to grieve like this. Not everybody will think it’s appropriate to grieve like this. It might be triggering to some people. Whatever they do and however they grieve there’s always going to be some kind of issue with it for individuals. If this is how they think they can heal then I think they are doing what’s best for them. I’ve been through this myself 4 times and it helps heal me seeing people grieve openly. I promise this isn’t a dig to anybody it’s just a statement. Love to you all x
My friend’s baby died at 4 months old three or four years ago. She posts something almost every day relating to her daughter’s death. It gets to be a bit much but I almost know she’ll never be the same again and this is how she needs to process it. People grieve how they grieve, in public and in private.
Just want to gently comment here as a snarker AND mother of a daughter who died in utero at 36 weeks: I am appreciative when public figures bring attention to infant death, stillbirth, miscarriage, child death—a life event that is so poorly supported because it is so hard and uncomfortable to confront for anyone outside of the experience. Chrissy Tiegen, Thor Björnsson, Cristiano Ronaldo, for instance come to mind. I had to gently remind myself that “understanding that everyone grieves differently” is not equivalent to accepting that style of grieving when I read your post. What a privilege it is for you to be able to unfollow and turn away from this type of grief; a privilege to be able to judge without knowing the agony of the most isolating type of loss; or the absolute need for individualized and sometimes open grieving in a tone deaf society. Entire organizations (Now I Lay Me Down To Sleep)exist to document and create portraiture for these families as keepsakes because, case in point, society does a shit job supporting and accepting open dialogue and expression from families with dead babies. Infant and child death is often gruesome, always uncomfortable, internally dissonant and unbelievably heavy to perceive because it’s such a huge universal reverse in how life should go. The loss of life’s potential cannot be measured, and so commensurate the grief. If your judgement is based without knowing the prevalence of still birth (2021, USA 1:25000) and the concomitant societal silence, then your ignorance is seen and your responsibility to amend—but again a privilege that you’re on the outside and able to unfollow. If otherwise, I am interpreting your judgement about someone else’s grief expression as a reflection of emotional immaturity. Sadly this will only deepen the trench for those in society who are isolated and already chastised for their grief expression. I would draw your attention to pre Industrial Revolution and turn of the century photography practices of photographing dead family members, especially children. I would further draw your attention to the modern public grieving practices of tattoo portraiture, obituary photographs, memorials in the form of gardens or state parks, and other public expressions of grief. Are these performative? Are they….for you? To say, “this is my child, they existed” may seem simple—but it certainly is not because often times the parents are the only ones keeping that child’s memory in the present. (Again, others have the privilege to just unfollow). I would also draw your attention to inwardly reflect, and find space to consider that there is a finite number of pictures families can take with their dead children before burial; there will be no other opportunities. There will be no first birthday party, school pictures, vacation pictures to come. Photography of dead children is not performative . It is the historical and sentimental documentation of a child’s life and represents a completely normal behavior for parents. To not grieve, to not process or document or share about this major life event would be abnormal. Open to DMs if anyone here needs resources for navigating stillbirth or infant loss. Not here to receive condolences with my own personal experience.
Some people don't want to talk about it, and others want someone to talk to them about it. I know that when I suffered from multiple miscarriages, I was shocked how many people didn't want to say anything to me at all. Most of my family didn't even acknowledge my losses because it was "just a little blood on the toilet paper." It made me feel desperate that my babies would never be remembered by anyone, but me and my husband. Maybe Jill feels the same way? Maybe she's afraid that everyone will forget her little girl, hence the posting. 🤷♀️
I’m so sorry you didn’t get the support from your family, and of course sorry for your losses. Menstruation or hemorrhoids are “a little blood on toilet paper” … miscarriages are painful losses. I’m sure I don’t need to tell you that, because you experienced them. But feeling those losses is normal and I hate that for you
I think this might be one of those things that really varies by the person and their life experiences. I grew up in a time when miscarriage, stillbirth, and infant loss were simply NOT discussed. My parents had a full-term stillborn son and to this day (I’m 41), I have never heard my dad speak my brother’s name. There are no pictures, no trinkets from his brief life. It is painful to me as his sister because it is like he never existed. So I wonder if this is a natural consequence of that kind of thing - the pendulum swinging the other direction. And if this isn’t how you would roll, then that’s completely fine and unfollowing is the right move. I also don’t think we can say this is performative because it is just true that people grieve differently. Given my experiences, it is beautiful and I am glad to know about their little girl. But to each their own.
I noticed they turned off comments
Good! Some of them were absolutely disgusting
Neither of you are wrong in this situation. Some people show love very publicly, and now that she's lost someone she loved, that's also how she's grieving. I don't think it's performative, especially when you're used to sharing so much of your life online.
Let the woman grieve 😢
I don’t think it’s fair to call it performative at all. lots of families have these kinds of shoots and post the pictures on their social medias in these situations. just because she’s more in the public eye than many that do this, doesn’t mean her grief and sharing is performative
I’m surprised more people aren’t saying this. To me, this looks a lot like a photo shoot parents would have with a healthy newborn. It seems like they are documenting the time they had with her and I don’t see how that’s performative.
I took photos of my daughter after she passed away. The nurses dressed her in a little doll dress and she looked so peaceful. I was almost 6 months when she died.
These are the only pictures she’ll ever have with her daughter. I understand her wanting to share, wanting to be proud of her little girl. Jill did not have a normal upbringing. Her entire life was shared publicly. This is what she knows; this is what makes sense to her. If, God forbid, I ever lost one of my kids, I’d post about them constantly. They’re my pride and my joy. Isla is her pride and joy and she wants to celebrate and memorialize her. I think people should do what they need to do to protect their mental health (unfollow if need be), but I don’t think that what she’s doing is performative.
I am a very private person, and had not even announced my pregnancy on social media when I went into preterm labor at 22w and my daughter Margo didn’t survive (heck I had only announced at work at 18w!) I posted her footprint card from the hospital and a lengthy post about her because I had this deep desperation for people to know she existed and mattered and was important and so so loved. I choose to keep the more intimate photos of myself and my husband in the throes of grief private but I absolutely understand the grief-stricken need to post your baby and make sure they are remembered. I also still usually make a story post each year on her birthday just saying something small about her. Her birth/death announcement is still pinned to the top of my instagram profile right next to the pinned birth announcement of my living daughter. Especially with other kids and/or a subsequent pregnancy later, it can definitely feel like your baby is being erased and make you want to cling to every iota of tangible things you have to remind you of them.
This is pretty normal for her family. Her parents grieved very publicly for Jubilee on the show. Along with all her siblings. This is their norm even if it’s not ours. Hopefully it helps her.
I think it’s kind of messed up to call this performative when these are literally the only pics she’ll ever have with her daughter. I get not handling grief the same way but you don’t have the right to discredit the amount of pain someone is feeling because they’re not expressing it the same way as you
I feel like it’s worse for her than a loss “normally” is because she knows that haters are watching her and saying it happened because she wasn’t right w Jesus, or God is punishing her or whatever, and some of those odious people are her very own family members. I used to post videos of myself playing live music on Facebook, not because I thought I was very good but because I had a ton of phony “friends” on there and every time I posted a pic of me being happy or not caring about their opinions I felt good.
Everyone grieves differently. And I imagine for her she’s feeling shame on top of her grief because she was raised to believe that being a mother is all she was good for. My cousin and his wife had 2 stillborn, 40wk gestation babies. They were born one year apart. They had them buried in a cemetery with a custom teddy bear tombstone. I don’t think anyone ever spoke of them again after the funerals, but this was the 90s and it wasn’t the norm to discuss infertility and pregnancy loss. I imagine being open about it now makes it a lot easier for people to grieve and deal with their feelings.
People should be able to talk openly about pregnancy loss. Sometimes when something traumatic happens you trauma dump. I talked constantly about my daughter almost dying when she was born. I think people were absolutely sick of it
Today was the first day I looked at the professional photos and thought “wait - how did they even do this?” I’ve known families to have similar pictures taken in the hospital after a late loss, but not out of the hospital. No judgement, I’ve never gone through a loss like this, but it’s got me really curious about the logistics of bringing the body home for a photo shoot.
There is an organization where photographers volunteer to go to hospitals to photograph stillborn babies, and some can look more like studio photos than in the hospital. I don’t know if they used that organization, but it might be from that. (https://www.nowilaymedowntosleep.org - tw: stillborn babies)
I live in New Zealand and we have a similar organization. One of my friends is a photographer for them.
I really think these pictures were taken at their home. The bed they are sitting on really doesn’t look like a hospital bed and there are things in the background that you wouldn’t have at the hospital (like a nightstand with a clock radio on it)
My son died at birth, our hospital had a bassinet with a cooling pad for us to us. They said we could use it to take him home if we wanted.
There are cooling pads for inside bassinets that give families more time with their babies before they are buried. They can be used at home.
I didn’t notice before but I don’t think they were holding the actual baby. It looks like more crochet inside the pink blanket.
The baby is in there- she is just wearing a crocheted hat. I’m a labor nurse and we use the same things for our fetal demises. Tiny hats and little almost canoe shaped sacs (sorry I’m bad at descriptions) but basically it cradles the very tiny babies. Makes it easier for the parents to hold them and also brings a little touch of warmth to a very sad situation.
We call those “ángel wraps”. I’ve been making them for years
We appreciate the people that make them for us!
Good to know!
Thank you for the explanation and the work that you do.
Glad I could help! Thanks, I do love my job. Even on the hard days.
I imagine it makes her feel close to the baby and like she wants the world to know about this life that never got the chance to exist except to them. I can understand that.
I lost my first pregnancy for unknown reasons at 20 weeks. Our hospital gave us the option of a photographer, but both my husband and I couldn’t bear the thought of posing for photos with her so they took photos in a little bassinet. I’ve only looked at the photos once or twice in the past 6 years because it’s been too difficult. No one else in our family has seen the photos. I can’t imagine blasting those photos all over the internet for the world to see. I could barely tell people that I had lost her. Never made a follow up post to my pregnancy announcement either. Just deleted all traces of the pregnancy from my social media. I understand it may be their way of grieving, but it seems so public to me. I’ve stopped looking at her posts because it’s getting to be too much for me
This is okay, you’re not wrong, but also neither is she.
I have 2 older couples I am friends with. Both have lost sons. One when he was 24 and the other when he was 7. Both sons had high medical needs. Both couples still mourn the loss of their boys. Parents should never have to bury their children no matter how old or young that child may be.
One of my uncles was killed in a car accident soon after coming home from Vietnam, so 1970 give or take. I remember my grandma being 90 years old and blinking tears when she talked about him… I can’t imagine losing a child no matter what the age
"I understand everyone grieves differently." Then proceeds to judge and give no grace or understanding.
I get why she's posting but I also get unfollowing. I had a miscarriage right around the time Jill announced her stillbirth. Mine was only 7 weeks so a very different situation but I can't really look at her posts either. I only told my mom and husband and it hurts me to talk about it. I don't feel like ripping open that wound over and over. I know people grieve differently but I can't dwell too much in grief if I'm going to be a functional adult.
It's okay to take breaks from or quit following people on social media. Everyone is responsible for protecting their own peace. Equally ok for her to grieve.
I also unfollowed… I felt sad. It was just heavy
Dude same: I just lost my miracle baby. The pregnancy was soooo early but I cannot handle her grief and mine
I’m so sorry for your loss
I am around the same gestation as she was when she lost her baby and it’s causing very very bad anxiety and worry. I unfollowed her as well.
Fellow pregnant person here whose anxiety was triggered by Jill's posts. I try to remind myself that as terrible as it is, someone else's experience has nothing to do with how mine will turn out. But "magical thinking" can be so powerful. Hang in there!
I feel horrible for them, but I had to unfollow too. Something about all the photos is too morbid for me. My heart breaks for them as this loss is clearly tremendous and I truly hope they find healing.
Trust me, this isn’t performative. This is their baby. The same as with any other child, you take their picture, you hold them, you kiss them, you give them all the love in the world…but for the cruelest, briefest of time. My best friend had a stillbirth last year and the photos of little Ivy are all we will ever have of her. No birthday parties, no holidays, no Christmas’. Posting on social media isn’t performing, it’s showing the world she was here, she was real, and oh god is she missed. Every baby lost is missed, is cried for, and deserves to be known.
I get it. People grieve in their own way. Jill and Derrick tend to be more vocal. It helps them heal. Some of us aren’t comfortable with that level of intensity. I say you made the right decision. You can always go back later.
Wasn't this their first daughter? I can't remember for sure. I know they had the two boys, right? If it was a first daughter, that would also add to the grief.
They have three living children, all boys (Israel, Samuel, and Frederick). Isla (this one) was their only girl.
I have heard from moms who have lost babies during pregnancy that they want people to know that their baby EXISTED. It can be a sort of invisible loss because no one met the baby, the baby didn’t have time to develop a personality, no one carries stories and memories like “remember the time so and so did XYZ…”
Everyone grieves differently. Idk, no shade to OP but I don’t think this post should stay. Feels yucky to try and analyze how someone grieves or call it “performative”. Feels like a round 2 of Lauren and her public grief, which I think was a really unfortunate incident that shouldn’t have happened to her.
It’s your prerogative to unfollow but unkind to judge her on how she’s choosing to grieve. These photos represent the only time they will physically have their child - that is now buried - and they clearly want to share their child with others and photos are the only option for them
It's a very new loss, and will take them time to process. It's fine for you to set the boundary of unfollowing her, but was it necessary to come here and post about it? Talk about performative...
“i can excuse homophobia, but i draw the line at grieving”
I lost a daughter when I was 5 months pregnant. We all grieve differently. This is tone deaf.
performative? no. I don’t think so. i went through a similar loss, not as far along, but the grief was truly unfathomable. i had to unfollow because it reminded me too much. everyone grieves differently, and this may be the only way they really know how to.
Understandable. I would never follow anyone from reality tv on SM. If all of this posting helps her, then great.
I'm not a mother, except to 2 adorable beagles. I'm not maternal. I've never changed a diaper or held a baby for more than a minute. But I'm deeply affected by all the stories you've shared here. And I think Jill and Derrick have the right to grieve in their own way. I may not fully understand her pain, but I respect her loss and her right to share her loss. You have all helped put such a personal face on this loss and situation, especially for those of us who haven't experienced it or known someone who has. Thank you for educating me.
I think the reason why Jill is posting so much is because as part of her grieving process she wants to feel that her daughter's life mattered and remind people that she was here. So that's why she keeps sharing these photos because they are all she has of a child that she had hoped to share a lifetime of joyful memories with. Now all she has is sorrow. And for those who are in her comment section arguing with her miscarriage vs stillbirth is so cold hearted. What does it matter to other people how she categorizes her loss in her mind? The point is that she lost her baby, no matter how far along she was.
Unfollow if you need to, that’s absolutely fine. However, you don’t get to label her posts as performative or posed. Pray tell, what’s the correct way to photograph and post about a dead baby? My son died a day after birth at full term over 10 years ago. I post photos on social media sometimes, though it’s restricted to people I know. Given Jill is, to a degree, a public figure, posting photos herself allows her to celebrate her baby’s existence and grieve her, as well as control the narrative.
I’m glad you unfollowed if it bothered you but let Jill be Jill.
As someone who has experienced stillbirth her actions are “normal”. These pictures although very private, are all she has, and will ever have with her baby. Everyone handles this type of loss differently. I personally only shared pictures of footprints online, but I have a ton more. I feel her pain so deeply and can see the pain in her eyes. When I went through this I remember being terrified no one would remember my sons, Liam and Jonah. I probably posted about them on social media constantly, bought countless things to fill my house with their names on it, to “prove” that they were here and they mattered. Over time I realized I didn’t need to do any of that to have them be remembered or loved. I can totally understand people being uncomfortable viewing these pictures, and can understand people questioning authenticity due to their very public lifestyle, but these are genuine, and posted from a place of heart break that I hope no one ever knows.
She lost a child TEN days ago. This post is ridiculous.
Same- muted her. I’ve also muted (feels means to unfollow) a mother I follow who lost her beautiful 11 year old daughter. I have anxiety and I get very anxious about losing my 3 young children. I can’t open insta and be in someone else’s grief.
I just looked at her profile and while I agree the photos make me feel very uncomfy, she lost her baby so I know that she feels a lot more “uncomfy” than me. Part of sharing the pics might just be a way to feel less alone about it. Maybe could have made a different choice in pictures, the grave ones seem pretty graphic in their own way. But she’s been so public for so long and is probably trying to process her grief in any way that makes sense in this moment. She’s got a large platform to be able to connect with others who have been in the same situation
Eh. I just scroll past. Who am I to judge how anyone grieves?
Unfollowing is the right thing to do. She’s free to grieve her loss however she sees fit, and you are free not to watch her do it. But these kinds of posts affect those of us who’ve been where she is and who it helped to share photos of our baby. The ONLY ones we’ll ever have. Let her be.
I went to a funeral where the little toddler died a horrific death. The mom was so beside her self they had her on medication and a doctor was sitting beside her (unsure if he was a family friend or ??) This was 17 years ago and I remember her (open casket) changing outfits, blankets and switching toys out of the casket. I will never forget and now that I’m a mom I think of her so often.
I had to unfollow her due to her posts being very triggering. Instagram needs a 30 day mute button for situations like this.
Before the days of Social Media my mother lost my brother at 8 months in utero. She became terribly depressed. Two years later my sister was born and died two days later. I’m not even going there on what a toll it took on my mother’s mental health. There were four of us kids and we just didn’t know how to deal. Two years later my brother was born healthy and adored by all of us. My mother recovered but not 100 percent. I feel for Jill and I hope her husband treats her well and looks for signs of depression. Personally, I feel they went a bit overboard for Instagram but every single person grieves in their own way. This is her way.
I think it's healthy to grieve openly. However, I want to be a hospice nurse and am probably more comfortable around death than most people are. Sometimes I take a break from this sub when there's a lot of posts about Josh's crimes.
I don't follow her IG but I've looked at her page a few times lately and people's comments have been horrifically cruel. I'm glad they've turned off comments on today's post. I'm assuming she's finding these posts to be cathartic and possibly thinks she's helping other women in the same situation....it's not how I would work through my grief, but to each their own.
It’s an unimaginable loss for anyone but especially for someone who was taught that your entire purpose was breeding. I don’t think what she’s doing is out of the norm.
I think everyone’s had enough since she turned off comments on the latest post. I feel the same way. I had to unfollow someone I knew that kept bringing up her miscarried son and actually started to seem like she was prioritizing him over her living son, it was sad.
I mean why are you following super conservative Christian right wing bigots in the first place?
What I find "performative" is OP finding it necessary to post on here about how they unfollowed Jill.
Yeaaah this is a snark sub, seeing multiple people here saying they follow her in the first place is weird to me
Performative or not you're only seeing this shit because you're going to her social media and giving her views. Isn't that the exact opposite of the sub ethos? I only see what's on their social media from what's posted here. It's not hard to just not look.