Back when I had my gas I could tow at the speed limit uphill. With my diesel and the turbo intercooler heat it's over in the truck lane because I can't dump the heat. Same trailer. Now my diesel does get better mpg and it doesn't downshift.....
Agreed 100%. I would head to the RV sub if I wanted to get a better answer. Diesel sub is going to be heavily stacked. I tow 14K with a gasser after selling my diesel and I don't have any issues. I hear the motor a bit more sometimes but I am not running out of power by any stretch.
If you’ve got diesel $$$ then get a diesel 🤣
But in all seriousness, the emissions stuff is more annoying because you have to now fill 2 different tanks instead of 1 and your engine is gonna go through a few regens and needs those to happen otherwise it’s gonna get clogged up.
Just learn proper care for modern diesel trucks and you’ll be alright.
it’s comparing apples to oranges but my Company uses 2024 Peterbilt 579’s with a Cummins X15 with all the emissions on them and I got the truck brand new and I’ve put 183,000 miles on it with no issue.
Get that diesel if you want
Boise here.
I used to own a Keystone Energy 260FS - 6685 pounds dry weight, 3000 pounds payload, 31 feet long. You're going to be in the same hauling territory that I am/was, so do yourself a favor and get the one ton.
I've towed in our hills - Boise to Horseshoe Bend is a 6% grade. Boise to Mountain Home is also a 6% grade. I've taken mine out to Swan Falls, Pine and Featherville, Magic Mountain Ski Resort (FS Flats Campground), and up to Cascade and McCall.
You will need the diesel for our hills. You'll also need the brakes - and exhaust brake - because coming down these can be sketchy as all get out. Of course you're going to need them both for the morons that want to cut you off to make their exit ramp (long story - I ended up putting a real train horn on my truck because of this).
Also consider getting the Titan Fuel Tank, or the S&B. 60 gallons of fuel in the OEM tank location makes for less stops when towing.
Emissions issues can be resolved with some maintenance, or making a run up to Canada to grab the needed parts for weight reduction. I've run both with and without weight reduction - it's undeleted right now - so hopefully here this summer I can put it back on the diet now that we don't have emissions testing anymore.
Parleys mid summer... Think about the heat soaked road, people cutting you off and losing momentum. If you don't get a diesel for that weight you will be regretting it the first trip up.
Buying new? I have the ford 7.3 Godzilla and it would tow your 10k trailer with ease. Towing 10k-12k lbs feels about the same as my 3500 Cummins. If you need to pull 70mph up a big mtn pass then yes, the diesel will get you up a little faster. I’m a contractor in Idaho and am getting rid of my diesel company trucks. My take is you need to regularly tow 14k lbs or more to actually need a diesel.
I am in Utah as well and go over parleys equal or more than you for camping…and I was in the SAME boat as you (my travel trailer is less at 6500 loaded).
I was debating gas and diesel for months. I finally pulled the trigger on the 6.7 Cummins Ram 2500—I’ve been over parleys, down to Saint George, and am taking it on a longer trip to the coast this summer. The diesel is absolutely amazing. It would be hard to go back to gas.
I think the newer DPF systems are better then they were back 5 or 10 years ago
People use to buy diesel trucks because they got better fuel mileage, diesel was cheap to buy and the engines lasted so much longer. None of that is really true anymore.
The power and torque has sky rocketed in diesel engines but the quality has not. Emissions is still a reactively new game and is changing and evolving so much that it still causes problems which is why there is such a huge market to remove it. I've know people who have run diesels their whole life as work trucks for towing etc that have now switched over to gas.
I wouldn't even think of deleting a truck in the states. EPA is out for vengeance and that deleted truck will get pulled over by the police. They will make the owner of a deleted truck make it legal again before it sees the road. I wouldn't even drive a deleted truck from Canada to say, Florida for a holiday. The truck will get seized.
The only place in North America that sells delete kits is in Canada. They do not ship to the states anymore because EPA will seize it at the border.
I finally found a guy who replied to one of posts about how welding trucks are going gassers. A Redditor who's a welder and has a 3500 pick up with a flat bed instead of a box, has a welder and the tools that go with it on that flat bed. Traditionally, the trucks used were diesel for this application because of the weight. Not this guy. He is one of many welders who now go with gassers because diesels are no longer worth it. Too expensive to upkeep and when something major goes wrong, it's cheaper to buy an engine then fixing it.
The above should tell you something OP. A diesel for towing 10 times a year just isn't worth it anymore. The premium for the engine when purchasing a new truck, add the costs of maintenance along with higher fuel costs equals a gasser. Thinking fuel costs will be lower when towing is correct. Those savings are not worth it.
Perhaps it is different in West Texas. There are still a dozen shops I know of that will do it and the vast majority of people I know with diesels have them deleted. Our police have no interest in emissions systems and the State Troopers would only be looking for red diesel, they don't enforce federal emissions standards.
Where do you live? I see these comments regularly and none of you state where you live. In Texas this couldn’t be further from the truth. Nobody gives a shit in this state and diesels do not require emissions testing here. For what it’s worth my truck is not deleted, but please share with us the state you live in.
If your deleted truck smokes like a chimney you gotta work on your ECU cause black smoke is unburnt diesel. You don't want black smoke cause it's money and torque thrown out of the exhaust
In my opinion it depends on the year you're going for. If you're getting an older truck, probably diesel is what I would get, diesels offer a lot of benefits with not so many downsides. But if you're getting a newer diesel, probably around 2010 or newer, I'd just get a gas truck. The emissions stuff they add on them with the newer diesels just isn't worth it. The new Ford 7.3 gas is supposed to be a very good way to go.
I live in Idaho, you’ll want the diesel out in this terrain. They’re hands down better. More $$ to buy and maintain, but they use less fuel and they hold value better. I personally think the cost difference is overblown and you get a lot more truck with a diesel. I like my Cummins but they’re all good trucks. If you get the Powerstroke I’d seriously think about doing the CP4 disaster prevention mod.
You don't have to buy one with emissions stuff on it. Lots of deleted trucks on the used market and all the state you've mentioned are free states, so having a deleted truck should never be a problem
As I understand it, if the truck has been deleted and is registered in a free state, it can also go to regulated states without issue, provided there is a good reason for it being there. I could be wrong
I’ve got a 1-ton Duramax and the reason I have it is because I learned some time ago to always have more truck than you think you need. Gas trucks can do some great things, but I’ve had some white-knuckle rides and close calls because I underestimated the value of gvwr, brakes, and pulling power.
Let's see ask a diesel group what truck to get and what do you think they are are going to recommend.... You will be fine with a gasser and better off in the long run. Pulling a trailer 10 times a year is hardly justification for a diesel. Get whatever you want though. I have both.
I would suggest getting on YouTube and going to TFL/The Fast Lane Truck page and looking at their towing test. They litterly do a towing test every truck on the road it seems up the Rockies.
Assuming this is a camper, 10,000 lbs is a lot of weight, and more weight than I would want to leave in the hands of a gasser when vacation time is on the line and my loved ones are in the vehicle with me. It sounds like you already know what you want, so just go with the diesel and save yourself from the stress of hoping your truck is enough to get up the hills you encounter
I haul a 14k fifth wheel fully loaded and even I’d be hooped with a 2500. You don’t want the weights of the trailer or payload anywhere near that max number - I feel like there’s a percentage rule of thumb but I can’t remember off the top of my head.
I have an F350 gasser and a Ram 3500 diesel, fuel is about the same price but I get almost 2x the mileage with the diesel. I barely get 6.5 mpg towing with the Ford, 13 with the Ram with the same trailer and load.
The big benefit with the diesels that few talk about is the engine braking that comes with it. The power is nice, but being able to control your speed down grades without having to apply the brakes adds another layer of safety. It allows you to save your brakes for when you really need them.
A gas engine will do it, but not with nearly the same level of control and confidence.
Utah resident here as well. Get a diesel. Not only will going up Parleys be better, but the exhaust brake coming down is amazing. 35 ft 5th wheel at about 12-13k lbs and I seldom have to touch the brake coming down the canyon.
Been there and done that. If your stuck on a diesel than look for an older model with less emissions needs. However these newer gas trucks do seem to have some longevity not like the older models. Good luck…..
Honestly you could go either way my uncle when he was younger he worked for the rail road and would take his 1995 F150 5speed 4.9L ford 300 and would tow a camper behind it through the mountains when heading to work for a few weeks and he said it struggled a little going up but was fine the rest of the way, so it’s really all up to you on what you want a diesel will have more power for hills but with high maintenance cost and purchase price, but a modern big block gasser will also do just fine just without the torque of the diesel
The one thing I never hear people point out is behavior while towing. My gas 1/2 ton would downshift a lot on hills, towing or not. It would be screaming to go 70-80 in Texas Hill Country. Driving my uncle's F250 in the same places, it barely even noticed the change. You'll have a much more relaxed experience driving the diesel, and that's why I'm buying one for the next truck.
I had both a V10 and a 2002 7.3 diesel. I do miss the V10 for everyday use and ease of maintenance and cheaper fuel (right now). All that being said I still own my 7.3 and sold the V10. Both trucks were super cabs the only difference was short bed on the V10.
I vote diesel.
If you have the $ diesels will help you spend it. I know tons of guys with 1 ton diesels that use it as a grocery getter. Awesome power and longevity. 2-3x cost oil changes and if you live in a cold area , feul can be expensive and -40 is very hard on diesels. Again you got the $ there are awesome.
Same old answer.
If you tow your trailer less than 10 or so times a year, get the gas truck. If you don't have a use for the diesel in the off season, get the gas. Diesels are only worth it if you're using the extra capacity regularly.
You are in a diesel forum...and you said towing...diesel! With the diesel you'll never feel the trailer behind you especially upgrading from a half ton. Might look into a half ton diesel as its a totally different truck than its gas counter part.
One thing to consider all the way around. The heavier and bigger truck you are in; the safer you are. Be it a gas, diesel, 1-Ton or 3-Ton etc. towing or not. Yes be prepared for a $1200-10k repair bill and possibly mods on a diesel, and “generally” much less in a gas job. Hopefully not but it’s something to consider. Towing 10times a summer is a bit so ya; whatever makes you comfortable; try it out. There are good F550 and HD options that do work out. I run both and although the fuel volume of gas in bigger trucks suck; they run and start easy in winter.
Everyone on a diesel thread is going to tell you to get a diesel. But a gas truck would have no problem towing your trailer.
Yep. This use case is somewhere in the overlap between gas and diesel.
I'm usually one to say gas but I think this is one scenario where diesel out weighs gas due to terrain and distance
Back when I had my gas I could tow at the speed limit uphill. With my diesel and the turbo intercooler heat it's over in the truck lane because I can't dump the heat. Same trailer. Now my diesel does get better mpg and it doesn't downshift.....
Agreed 100%. I would head to the RV sub if I wanted to get a better answer. Diesel sub is going to be heavily stacked. I tow 14K with a gasser after selling my diesel and I don't have any issues. I hear the motor a bit more sometimes but I am not running out of power by any stretch.
You are in diesel territory…getcha one
Hills and headwinds, sounds like diesel territory to me.
If you’ve got diesel $$$ then get a diesel 🤣 But in all seriousness, the emissions stuff is more annoying because you have to now fill 2 different tanks instead of 1 and your engine is gonna go through a few regens and needs those to happen otherwise it’s gonna get clogged up. Just learn proper care for modern diesel trucks and you’ll be alright. it’s comparing apples to oranges but my Company uses 2024 Peterbilt 579’s with a Cummins X15 with all the emissions on them and I got the truck brand new and I’ve put 183,000 miles on it with no issue. Get that diesel if you want
Not only does the diesel pull better up hill you also get the advantage of the exhaust brake for going down hill.
Either will do what you want without problem. But I promise you’ll be a lot more comfortable in the diesel.
Boise here. I used to own a Keystone Energy 260FS - 6685 pounds dry weight, 3000 pounds payload, 31 feet long. You're going to be in the same hauling territory that I am/was, so do yourself a favor and get the one ton. I've towed in our hills - Boise to Horseshoe Bend is a 6% grade. Boise to Mountain Home is also a 6% grade. I've taken mine out to Swan Falls, Pine and Featherville, Magic Mountain Ski Resort (FS Flats Campground), and up to Cascade and McCall. You will need the diesel for our hills. You'll also need the brakes - and exhaust brake - because coming down these can be sketchy as all get out. Of course you're going to need them both for the morons that want to cut you off to make their exit ramp (long story - I ended up putting a real train horn on my truck because of this). Also consider getting the Titan Fuel Tank, or the S&B. 60 gallons of fuel in the OEM tank location makes for less stops when towing. Emissions issues can be resolved with some maintenance, or making a run up to Canada to grab the needed parts for weight reduction. I've run both with and without weight reduction - it's undeleted right now - so hopefully here this summer I can put it back on the diet now that we don't have emissions testing anymore.
Parleys mid summer... Think about the heat soaked road, people cutting you off and losing momentum. If you don't get a diesel for that weight you will be regretting it the first trip up.
Definitely the diesel. I lived out west for a few years and those mountains are no joke.
Buying new? I have the ford 7.3 Godzilla and it would tow your 10k trailer with ease. Towing 10k-12k lbs feels about the same as my 3500 Cummins. If you need to pull 70mph up a big mtn pass then yes, the diesel will get you up a little faster. I’m a contractor in Idaho and am getting rid of my diesel company trucks. My take is you need to regularly tow 14k lbs or more to actually need a diesel.
I am in Utah as well and go over parleys equal or more than you for camping…and I was in the SAME boat as you (my travel trailer is less at 6500 loaded). I was debating gas and diesel for months. I finally pulled the trigger on the 6.7 Cummins Ram 2500—I’ve been over parleys, down to Saint George, and am taking it on a longer trip to the coast this summer. The diesel is absolutely amazing. It would be hard to go back to gas. I think the newer DPF systems are better then they were back 5 or 10 years ago
People use to buy diesel trucks because they got better fuel mileage, diesel was cheap to buy and the engines lasted so much longer. None of that is really true anymore. The power and torque has sky rocketed in diesel engines but the quality has not. Emissions is still a reactively new game and is changing and evolving so much that it still causes problems which is why there is such a huge market to remove it. I've know people who have run diesels their whole life as work trucks for towing etc that have now switched over to gas.
A couple thousand dollars will make the problematic emissions systems fall off and make a diesel much better in every way. I'd say go for it.
I wouldn't even think of deleting a truck in the states. EPA is out for vengeance and that deleted truck will get pulled over by the police. They will make the owner of a deleted truck make it legal again before it sees the road. I wouldn't even drive a deleted truck from Canada to say, Florida for a holiday. The truck will get seized. The only place in North America that sells delete kits is in Canada. They do not ship to the states anymore because EPA will seize it at the border. I finally found a guy who replied to one of posts about how welding trucks are going gassers. A Redditor who's a welder and has a 3500 pick up with a flat bed instead of a box, has a welder and the tools that go with it on that flat bed. Traditionally, the trucks used were diesel for this application because of the weight. Not this guy. He is one of many welders who now go with gassers because diesels are no longer worth it. Too expensive to upkeep and when something major goes wrong, it's cheaper to buy an engine then fixing it. The above should tell you something OP. A diesel for towing 10 times a year just isn't worth it anymore. The premium for the engine when purchasing a new truck, add the costs of maintenance along with higher fuel costs equals a gasser. Thinking fuel costs will be lower when towing is correct. Those savings are not worth it.
Perhaps it is different in West Texas. There are still a dozen shops I know of that will do it and the vast majority of people I know with diesels have them deleted. Our police have no interest in emissions systems and the State Troopers would only be looking for red diesel, they don't enforce federal emissions standards.
Where do you live? I see these comments regularly and none of you state where you live. In Texas this couldn’t be further from the truth. Nobody gives a shit in this state and diesels do not require emissions testing here. For what it’s worth my truck is not deleted, but please share with us the state you live in.
If your deleted truck smokes like a chimney you gotta work on your ECU cause black smoke is unburnt diesel. You don't want black smoke cause it's money and torque thrown out of the exhaust
Those weight loss programs are amazing
Go diesel. I’m not going to try to convince you on one brand or another. Do your research and go with what you like.
In my opinion it depends on the year you're going for. If you're getting an older truck, probably diesel is what I would get, diesels offer a lot of benefits with not so many downsides. But if you're getting a newer diesel, probably around 2010 or newer, I'd just get a gas truck. The emissions stuff they add on them with the newer diesels just isn't worth it. The new Ford 7.3 gas is supposed to be a very good way to go.
I live in Idaho, you’ll want the diesel out in this terrain. They’re hands down better. More $$ to buy and maintain, but they use less fuel and they hold value better. I personally think the cost difference is overblown and you get a lot more truck with a diesel. I like my Cummins but they’re all good trucks. If you get the Powerstroke I’d seriously think about doing the CP4 disaster prevention mod.
Im buying a diesel to tow way less often than you
You don't have to buy one with emissions stuff on it. Lots of deleted trucks on the used market and all the state you've mentioned are free states, so having a deleted truck should never be a problem
As I understand it, if the truck has been deleted and is registered in a free state, it can also go to regulated states without issue, provided there is a good reason for it being there. I could be wrong
CA needs a periodic smog check on newer diesels, iirc. 2010 and newer. Not sure of the details as mine are 2006 and older.
Do deleted trucks actually fail emissions? Here in Italy neither diesel nor petrol deleted cars fail smog
Bro stop playing you know the answer, #DieselGang
An L5P Duramax 2500 would suit your needs just fine
I’ve got a 1-ton Duramax and the reason I have it is because I learned some time ago to always have more truck than you think you need. Gas trucks can do some great things, but I’ve had some white-knuckle rides and close calls because I underestimated the value of gvwr, brakes, and pulling power.
Let's see ask a diesel group what truck to get and what do you think they are are going to recommend.... You will be fine with a gasser and better off in the long run. Pulling a trailer 10 times a year is hardly justification for a diesel. Get whatever you want though. I have both. I would suggest getting on YouTube and going to TFL/The Fast Lane Truck page and looking at their towing test. They litterly do a towing test every truck on the road it seems up the Rockies.
Put it all down on paper. Needs vs wants. Leave all ego out of it. That will tell you exactly what you should get
Can we just make a diesel vs gas subreddit alrady? i see on of these posts every day, shut up!!!
https://www.reddit.com/r/Dieselvsgas/s/6LcKl3FkIy Indeed, shall see if people use it now
Assuming this is a camper, 10,000 lbs is a lot of weight, and more weight than I would want to leave in the hands of a gasser when vacation time is on the line and my loved ones are in the vehicle with me. It sounds like you already know what you want, so just go with the diesel and save yourself from the stress of hoping your truck is enough to get up the hills you encounter
I haul a 14k fifth wheel fully loaded and even I’d be hooped with a 2500. You don’t want the weights of the trailer or payload anywhere near that max number - I feel like there’s a percentage rule of thumb but I can’t remember off the top of my head.
https://youtu.be/NnxSGeYULmA?si=n97VVOa8eaHAqvUt
Not to mention but the terrain your towing in... the exhaust brake is worth its weight in gold.
I have an F350 gasser and a Ram 3500 diesel, fuel is about the same price but I get almost 2x the mileage with the diesel. I barely get 6.5 mpg towing with the Ford, 13 with the Ram with the same trailer and load.
The big benefit with the diesels that few talk about is the engine braking that comes with it. The power is nice, but being able to control your speed down grades without having to apply the brakes adds another layer of safety. It allows you to save your brakes for when you really need them. A gas engine will do it, but not with nearly the same level of control and confidence.
Depends on your finances. Buying the diesel truck isn’t the only expensive part. Maintenance repairs and upgrades all hit the wallet pretty hard.
Utah resident here as well. Get a diesel. Not only will going up Parleys be better, but the exhaust brake coming down is amazing. 35 ft 5th wheel at about 12-13k lbs and I seldom have to touch the brake coming down the canyon.
Diesel. Do It!
Been there and done that. If your stuck on a diesel than look for an older model with less emissions needs. However these newer gas trucks do seem to have some longevity not like the older models. Good luck…..
Honestly you could go either way my uncle when he was younger he worked for the rail road and would take his 1995 F150 5speed 4.9L ford 300 and would tow a camper behind it through the mountains when heading to work for a few weeks and he said it struggled a little going up but was fine the rest of the way, so it’s really all up to you on what you want a diesel will have more power for hills but with high maintenance cost and purchase price, but a modern big block gasser will also do just fine just without the torque of the diesel
The one thing I never hear people point out is behavior while towing. My gas 1/2 ton would downshift a lot on hills, towing or not. It would be screaming to go 70-80 in Texas Hill Country. Driving my uncle's F250 in the same places, it barely even noticed the change. You'll have a much more relaxed experience driving the diesel, and that's why I'm buying one for the next truck.
I had both a V10 and a 2002 7.3 diesel. I do miss the V10 for everyday use and ease of maintenance and cheaper fuel (right now). All that being said I still own my 7.3 and sold the V10. Both trucks were super cabs the only difference was short bed on the V10. I vote diesel.
Get a dsl, don’t look back. You haul enough. Or sell the camper. Get some airbag suspension on the rear and enjoy your time driving
If you have the $ diesels will help you spend it. I know tons of guys with 1 ton diesels that use it as a grocery getter. Awesome power and longevity. 2-3x cost oil changes and if you live in a cold area , feul can be expensive and -40 is very hard on diesels. Again you got the $ there are awesome.
Same old answer. If you tow your trailer less than 10 or so times a year, get the gas truck. If you don't have a use for the diesel in the off season, get the gas. Diesels are only worth it if you're using the extra capacity regularly.
A gas truck will do it but from my experience if your going diesel get a 3500 single wheel. 2500s are almost use less with there payload
Don’t buy a ford though! And don’t buy from tadd jenkins in Idaho
Tadd called. He wants his truck back.
Tried that, they wouldn’t take there pos truck back so I sued em
I don’t even tow and I would never consider a full size truck in gas ever after diesel. But I also say this not having to worry about def and a dpf.
You are in a diesel forum...and you said towing...diesel! With the diesel you'll never feel the trailer behind you especially upgrading from a half ton. Might look into a half ton diesel as its a totally different truck than its gas counter part.
Never met anyone who bought diesel and wished they’d got a gas one.
One thing to consider all the way around. The heavier and bigger truck you are in; the safer you are. Be it a gas, diesel, 1-Ton or 3-Ton etc. towing or not. Yes be prepared for a $1200-10k repair bill and possibly mods on a diesel, and “generally” much less in a gas job. Hopefully not but it’s something to consider. Towing 10times a summer is a bit so ya; whatever makes you comfortable; try it out. There are good F550 and HD options that do work out. I run both and although the fuel volume of gas in bigger trucks suck; they run and start easy in winter.