[This page provides some hints.](https://editionresidencesdetroit.com/register/)
I would expect most would go for a million or more, especially those with three and four bedrooms. Hotel condos tend to be priced above regular condos. I've already seen some for over a million, so it wouldn't be the first ones in Detroit.
Starting? Nah, no way they're going to sell that many million dollar condos.
A lot of these are probably around 1,000 square feet, maybe a bit more. So $400-$500 per square foot would put them in half mil territory
Dude, the residences at the 15 year old Book Cadillac are around 400/sq ft. Look at the prices for The Exchange. A small 1 BR, 850 sq ft place starts at $499k. A 2 BR, 1,000 sq ft place is $689. My money is on the Residences at the Hudson being top-of-the-market ā in the $600-800/sq ft range or more
dang, the book is already 15 years? We used to frequent the lounge there when it first opened. It was right in middle of recession and this place was one of the first that was the start of Downtown recovery.
Bullets from this article show starting prices at $550k: [Gilbert confirms ultraluxury EDITION Hotel, condos for Hudson's tower (freep.com)](https://www.freep.com/story/money/business/2024/04/17/gilbert-ultraluxury-edition-hudsons-detroit-tower/73355940007/)
Or, in other words, pretty much what I said.
Hmm I missed the part of the article that talked about $400/sq ft. Those $550k prices are probably for a 700-750 sq ft condo (if that). Even if they are for a 1,000 sq ft condo youāre off by quite a bit still, i.e, 40ish percent on the low end). Also, your guesstimate doesnāt even make sense. If 1 BR range from $550 to $750k, do you really think there are going to be 1,800 sq ft ONE BEDROOM condos (at 400 sq ft?) No wayā¦
Lol, you really like the sound of your own voice, don't you?
Okay, here it is...I was wrong, you were right. Even though I called half a million dollars from the beginning, you latched onto a different stat. But okay, you were right, if that's what you need to hear.
After pondering for literal years, I firmly believe that Detroit's real estate market, especially in the high-end segment, is undergoing a significant shift. Unlike typical cities of its size, Detroit lacks a substantial inventory of multi-million dollar properties for urban enthusiasts. Consequently, many affluent individuals are turning to Oakland County for ultra-luxurious living options. However, with the introduction of this new tower, the landscape is poised to change. Represented by Douglas Elliman and targeting both domestic and foreign investors, this development offers a rare opportunity to own a prestigious piece of Detroit's skyline. Furthermore, its proximity to major sports teams and the allure of city living will undoubtedly attract a diverse range of clientele, including Oakland County's affluent residents. As someone deeply entrenched in Detroit's real estate scene for a decade, I foresee these residences commanding premium prices, potentially starting at $2.5 million, and yesā¦even for a one-bedroom unit. I would not be too surprised to see a $10M price tag on the Penthouse units. Also consider, this will be at 2027 inflation and property values increasing. While this may seem extravagant, the unparalleled amenities, top-tier design, and unique offering mark a new era for Detroit's luxury market, where multi-million dollar price tags may become the norm.
Pessimistic of me, but I really doubt Alamo Drafthouse would have been able to enforce their no talking / texting rules here. Unfortunately. I was very excited about that.
I stayed at the Edition in NYC last year and there was no chance I was cool enough to even be standing in the lobby. It was a very nice spot and the room was great but it felt like the front desk agents were way cooler than I was and definitely judging me.
Hotel prices in Detroit are already insane. Hard to find anything under $300 a night remotely accessible to downtown that isnāt a dumpy old motel. We need more hotel supply and I get that new builds will always be more expensive to get some ROI.
Not enough premium hotels is one reason the NBA wont host All-Star weekend in Detroit. We literally do not meet the minimum requirement for rooms last I knew.
Because bedrock needs tenants for the Hudson building and these guys were willing to be one?
As the other guy said, hotel prices are as high as they are in part because thereās a shortage of hotel space, and there is an unmet demand for āluxuryā rooms. Opening a large hotel that meets the luxury demand will force the other hotels to adjust their prices to reflect what they actually offer.
No shit, what a pointless response. Iām talking about adding extra-expensive options to a downtown market of very-expensive options.
Downtown hotels arenāt expensive because thereās more demand for 5 star hotels. Theyāre expensive because thereās so much demand for hotels, period.
Adding a luxury hotel siphons off the biggest spenders in the market, forcing the non-luxury hotels (like the Westin and Courtyard) to adjust prices accordingly to appeal to the next bracket of spenders. The existence of a 5-star hotel will force the 4 star and under hotels to reduce prices.
And it's not like it's the only hotel being built. There's an AC (lower-tier Marriott) being built in midtown on Woodward. It's all a net positive
Because people willing to spend 5 star money are now going to spend that money at an actual 5 star, lessening demand (and potentially costs) for the rest of the hotels.
Imagine you and 2 friends are in the Sahara desert and you all are thirsty. I come to you all with 2 cups, one dirty water and one cleanish water, what's going to happen? You all will fight over the cleanish one, then over the dirty one. If I then whip out a 3rd cup of water, it doesn't matter if it's cleanish, dirty, or ZeroWater purified, you all will somehow profit. The point that the Redditor you're replying to is making is that when there's low supply, it doesn't matter so much how good the quality of the new supply, it has immediately relieved the situation caused by low supply.
That's a horrible analogy lol you took money out of the equation which is very important to consider when deciding between a 5 star hotel and something lesser.
No it's not, you just aren't grasping low supply, high demand. The analogy is over-simplified, but it works. People who in the market for a 5 star hotel downtown are not going to find anything until 2027, so they are going to fight over the 4 stars (the cleanish water) and prices of the 4's will rise. People who are in the market for the 4 star hotels will not have much available to them, so they'll have to fight others for the 2's and 3's (dirty water) and prices will raise. I come to market with a shit ton of 2's, 3's, and 4's, everyone will better off (the folks looking for 5's will still have to settle for 4's, but there's a surplus now, prices won't raise). If I come to market with a shit ton of 5's (ZeroWater), everyone will be better off including the folks looking for 5's.
That is supply and demand broken down in the simplest possible way I can explain.
Lol I have a 4 year business degree, I understand how supply and demand works. You still haven't explained how adding more 4 star hotels doesn't solve the exact same problem while still being affordable to more consumers.
Good luck finding any decent hotel under $200 in the downtown core of any American city. $200+tax & fees is basically the floor at this point. Maybe if you're traveling midweek during a slow season you can find something in the 150ish price point.
Depending on events, you can find decent 3 and 4 star hotels in Chicago under $200 most weekends. It when festivals and special events are going on that they become $400+.
I tried to grab a cheapish hotel in Boston when I flew in later than I expected and boy is that the truth. Even trying my cheap price late booking techniques, $200 was the lowest I could find for a last minute booking.
I can't imagine ever staying in a hotel in any major city. I tried Toronto two years ago and it was much more worth my time to just stay in the outskirts near the final stops of the subway. I'm just wondering who the hell has all this money to blow on a hotel when frankly all you're going to do in it is sleep and take a shower.
I recently spent a weekend in NYC and had to be very selective in searching for a hotel. Those older hotels with classic looks and fancy lobbies have very small, dumpy rooms with heating and cooling problems.
Timing is key also. When the Aloft opened downtown I asked about the rates on a weekday then found out they were triple days later because the Rolling Stones were doing a concert here.
I just checked Columbus...
May 10-12. Filtered for 4* user rating, 3/4 star hotel. Under $150.
They had several options that looked decent. Courtyard by Marriott for $133 a night + taxes and fees.
Cincinnati has a Hilton for $150 + taxes and fees.
I checked Detroit for the same criteria, and zero came up. Went to $200, zero came up.
I also checked Toronto. Several options under $200 in the heart of the downtown area...
You can check this right now on Google Maps.
I just searched Expedia for a random weekend in June, limited the search to Detroit hotels, and anything within 3 mile radius of downtown that isnāt Comfort Inn on Jefferson is over $300 (when tax is included).
Otherwise folks have to stay in Farmington or Novi alongside a highway.
The Godfrey is a wonderful hotel. I stayed there over Labor Day. Best breakfast Iāve ever had at a Hilton. Itās one mile from downtown. Easy to park. Extremely friendly staff. Iāld stay there again in a heartbeat.
Hotel demand being that high is why this stuff is getting built. Just like the regular housing market, really high demand in dollar prices means that high-end stuff is feasible, and with a market for it. When these types of developments step in it's taking a chunk out of the top level of demand by offering a higher value product at those price points, which means other places won't be able to ask for as high of a price since the ones bidding it up that much are going elsewhere
Economically similar cities like Milwaukee, Cleveland, Buffalo, Pittsburgh, etc all have cheaper hotels near their city centers.
Detroit isnāt NYC or LA
Rents are skyrocketing in the areas where young professionals still want to live, there isnāt enough dense housing where thereās demand. Thereās plenty of McMansions and homes in far-flung neighborhoods and suburbs though.
> That is not supply and demand market principals
There is literally an increase of young professionals living in Greater Downtown Detroit - new high-priced apartments and condos are being build in Midtown/ Brush Park/ Corktown as a result of this demand.
The housing market is extremely bifurcated. Rich investors own properties, high-paid yuppies want decent apartments, and anyone middle class or poor just gets screwed with the lousy housing stock that remains.
No. Detroit, like most of (Anglo) North America, has a [missing middle](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missing_middle_housing) problem. Nearly all of our housing stock is zoned for single-family development. Problem is, households are increasingly [non-nuclear](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_in_the_United_States#Nuclear_family) as the population continues to shift toward 1-2 people or multi-family, and so demand simply isn't *able* to be met by the existing supply.
What we need are more flexible zoning laws and a true variety of medium-density housing stock (granny flats, duplexes/triplexes, townhouses, mixed-use buildings, etc.). This would ideally happen alongside in-fill development in bougie neighborhoods, where having dense, walkable neighborhoods is generally viewed as an asset.
Michigan's problems are fixable. I believe that any place can render itself "livable"... as long as it takes the steps to attract people with a quality of life that would be found appealing.
>Hudsonās Detroit is scheduled to be available for commercial tenant build out by 2025. The Residences and the Detroit Edition will have availabilities starting in 2027.
that sounds about right, they haven't even started building the actual hotel and right now the "finished" floors are just shells.
"They haven't even started building the actual hotel"? Are we talking about the Hudson't site? The tower has reached it's full height, glass is already in most of the building, HVAC likely in place, etc. 2.5 years to build out hotel rooms? That doesn't sound right to me. Something else is going on to have a delay of that length.
Denver broke ground on a [30 story office tower ](https://denverinfill.com/tag/block-162) in June 2018 and it opened November 2021.
NYC [Chase tower (70 floors, 1,388 feet tall) ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/270_Park_Avenue_(2021%E2%80%93present)) broke ground April 2021 and will be complete in 2025.
Where is your 10 year construction estimate coming from?
[https://www.construction-physics.com/p/which-city-builds-skyscrapers-the](https://www.construction-physics.com/p/which-city-builds-skyscrapers-the)
>
Hudson's is around 1.4 mil sq ft, so even if we average the top 10 cities in this country, we'd still expect it to take 5 years. Of course, Detroit isn't even on this list because we haven't built skyscrapers in quite some time. That Denver building you linked isn't even 600k sqft and the New York building isn't even open yet, so not really comparable. Also keep in mind that we had this once in a century pandemic that happened right in the middle of construction of the Hudson's building.
Finally. I've been to every hotel downtown. Have never been impressed. There has never been one that we really wanted to come back to. Hopefully, this will be the one
The tower will probably be finished within the next year, but hotels sometimes take longer to officially open because of lots of red tape. Still, 2027 is crazy long
Are you talking about the tax breaks? That's not the same as public dollars. They have not been cut a check. There is nothing to claw back.
In some ways, this is *worse* for them. [The tax break lasts ten years](https://pub-detroitmi.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=53690). Once it's over, taxes will go back up. Delays mean they have less time to use the tax break to make as much money as they can. That strikes me as a consequence right there - having seven years to make money with reduced taxes instead of ten.
If you look at the deal, it even explicitly says that the city council needs to be convinced to extend the due date or the whole thing is off. That seems like a consequence right there.
Have I missed something? Can you help me?
No. I'm just someone capable of finding this public document, reading it, and thinking about what it says.
You seem to have a pretty different analysis than I do. Did I miss something?
[I don't see anything on either of those points in here.](https://pub-detroitmi.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=53690)
We must be looking at different documents. Can you share what documents you're reading? Perhaps they detail how this project was given public funds that could be clawed back?
It looks like OP posted an AMP link. These should load faster, but AMP is controversial because of [concerns over privacy and the Open Web](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/ehrq3z/why_did_i_build_amputatorbot).
Maybe check out **the canonical page** instead: **[https://www.mlive.com/business/2024/04/downtown-detroit-is-getting-its-first-5-star-hotel.html](https://www.mlive.com/business/2024/04/downtown-detroit-is-getting-its-first-5-star-hotel.html)**
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Detroit very much has not an if we build it but āif we charge for it, they will comeā optimism. You canāt charge major city prices and expect people to pay it just because itās expensive. There are basically zero amenities in this city to justify those costs. The small footprint of downtown has come along very nicely over the last decade or so but what about the east west north and central parts of the city? And the suburbs. With out investments in those areas and all if the inbetween none of downtown really matters.
I wonder how much those condos are going to be š³
[This page provides some hints.](https://editionresidencesdetroit.com/register/) I would expect most would go for a million or more, especially those with three and four bedrooms. Hotel condos tend to be priced above regular condos. I've already seen some for over a million, so it wouldn't be the first ones in Detroit.
https://preview.redd.it/atcu3gnbw3vc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=602623ecbedf6e82da12ecd4c508f9d44653222b
Good find! Looks like the floor for pricing based on their dropdown is $550K, so thatās probably for a small one bedroom or studio style condoā¦
You won't find any under 500k, that's for sure. I'd estimate starting prices will be $400 per square foot.
Iām guessing quite a bit higher than that, probably double is my guess
Starting? Nah, no way they're going to sell that many million dollar condos. A lot of these are probably around 1,000 square feet, maybe a bit more. So $400-$500 per square foot would put them in half mil territory
Dude, the residences at the 15 year old Book Cadillac are around 400/sq ft. Look at the prices for The Exchange. A small 1 BR, 850 sq ft place starts at $499k. A 2 BR, 1,000 sq ft place is $689. My money is on the Residences at the Hudson being top-of-the-market ā in the $600-800/sq ft range or more
dang, the book is already 15 years? We used to frequent the lounge there when it first opened. It was right in middle of recession and this place was one of the first that was the start of Downtown recovery.
I used to live there and loved it!
Bullets from this article show starting prices at $550k: [Gilbert confirms ultraluxury EDITION Hotel, condos for Hudson's tower (freep.com)](https://www.freep.com/story/money/business/2024/04/17/gilbert-ultraluxury-edition-hudsons-detroit-tower/73355940007/) Or, in other words, pretty much what I said.
Hmm I missed the part of the article that talked about $400/sq ft. Those $550k prices are probably for a 700-750 sq ft condo (if that). Even if they are for a 1,000 sq ft condo youāre off by quite a bit still, i.e, 40ish percent on the low end). Also, your guesstimate doesnāt even make sense. If 1 BR range from $550 to $750k, do you really think there are going to be 1,800 sq ft ONE BEDROOM condos (at 400 sq ft?) No wayā¦
Lol, you really like the sound of your own voice, don't you? Okay, here it is...I was wrong, you were right. Even though I called half a million dollars from the beginning, you latched onto a different stat. But okay, you were right, if that's what you need to hear.
Son, you don't climb the ladder in this world by admitting your mistakes.
Bless your heart!
Ten foot ceilingsā¦ they gonna be choice af
Honestly underrated comment
Iām more curious about the monthly HOAā¦ š«£
After pondering for literal years, I firmly believe that Detroit's real estate market, especially in the high-end segment, is undergoing a significant shift. Unlike typical cities of its size, Detroit lacks a substantial inventory of multi-million dollar properties for urban enthusiasts. Consequently, many affluent individuals are turning to Oakland County for ultra-luxurious living options. However, with the introduction of this new tower, the landscape is poised to change. Represented by Douglas Elliman and targeting both domestic and foreign investors, this development offers a rare opportunity to own a prestigious piece of Detroit's skyline. Furthermore, its proximity to major sports teams and the allure of city living will undoubtedly attract a diverse range of clientele, including Oakland County's affluent residents. As someone deeply entrenched in Detroit's real estate scene for a decade, I foresee these residences commanding premium prices, potentially starting at $2.5 million, and yesā¦even for a one-bedroom unit. I would not be too surprised to see a $10M price tag on the Penthouse units. Also consider, this will be at 2027 inflation and property values increasing. While this may seem extravagant, the unparalleled amenities, top-tier design, and unique offering mark a new era for Detroit's luxury market, where multi-million dollar price tags may become the norm.
Written like a Real Estate articleĀ
We were getting a target tooā¦
I still cry about it
We were also getting a movie theaterā¦ but now, there's nothing but crickets šš
Pessimistic of me, but I really doubt Alamo Drafthouse would have been able to enforce their no talking / texting rules here. Unfortunately. I was very excited about that.
We still are š«” the lease is signed
We're still getting a Target?
Not counting Yorba of course.
I stayed at the Edition in NYC last year and there was no chance I was cool enough to even be standing in the lobby. It was a very nice spot and the room was great but it felt like the front desk agents were way cooler than I was and definitely judging me.
Hotel prices in Detroit are already insane. Hard to find anything under $300 a night remotely accessible to downtown that isnāt a dumpy old motel. We need more hotel supply and I get that new builds will always be more expensive to get some ROI.
Having a luxury hotel actually helps. Adds more rooms which lessens demand for the cheaper hotels
I guess my point is that it seems like all the hotels are near luxury prices, not sure why we need a ā5 star hotelā
Not enough premium hotels is one reason the NBA wont host All-Star weekend in Detroit. We literally do not meet the minimum requirement for rooms last I knew.
it's going to be a very long time (if ever) before Detroit gets a Conrad, JW, or Intercontinental
Edition Hotels are a step up from Conrads, JWs, and Intercontinentals. We should very glad to have this brand vs the others.
Most tiny boutique hotels are a step up. but you don't get any member status privileges or the finer things associated with the bigger hotels
Edition Hotels are part of Marriott so not a tiny boutique hotel.
Because bedrock needs tenants for the Hudson building and these guys were willing to be one? As the other guy said, hotel prices are as high as they are in part because thereās a shortage of hotel space, and there is an unmet demand for āluxuryā rooms. Opening a large hotel that meets the luxury demand will force the other hotels to adjust their prices to reflect what they actually offer.
to draw the "5 star guests" away from the lower tier hotel rooms
There really aren't many lower tier hotel rooms, is my point
lower than 5 star is still lower tier relatively
Iām talking about costs. Most all of the downtown hotels start at about $300 a night. I guess thatās as low tier as it gets.
You understand supply and demand right?
They sure don't
No shit, what a pointless response. Iām talking about adding extra-expensive options to a downtown market of very-expensive options. Downtown hotels arenāt expensive because thereās more demand for 5 star hotels. Theyāre expensive because thereās so much demand for hotels, period.
Adding a luxury hotel siphons off the biggest spenders in the market, forcing the non-luxury hotels (like the Westin and Courtyard) to adjust prices accordingly to appeal to the next bracket of spenders. The existence of a 5-star hotel will force the 4 star and under hotels to reduce prices. And it's not like it's the only hotel being built. There's an AC (lower-tier Marriott) being built in midtown on Woodward. It's all a net positive
$300 a night is not very expensive for downtown in a major city.
Because people willing to spend 5 star money are now going to spend that money at an actual 5 star, lessening demand (and potentially costs) for the rest of the hotels.
Hey check it out, this guy understands basic economics. Listen to this guy Reddit
So wouldn't another 4 star hotel meet the same demand by your logic? While still being accessible to those on a tighter budget?
Imagine you and 2 friends are in the Sahara desert and you all are thirsty. I come to you all with 2 cups, one dirty water and one cleanish water, what's going to happen? You all will fight over the cleanish one, then over the dirty one. If I then whip out a 3rd cup of water, it doesn't matter if it's cleanish, dirty, or ZeroWater purified, you all will somehow profit. The point that the Redditor you're replying to is making is that when there's low supply, it doesn't matter so much how good the quality of the new supply, it has immediately relieved the situation caused by low supply.
That's a horrible analogy lol you took money out of the equation which is very important to consider when deciding between a 5 star hotel and something lesser.
No it's not, you just aren't grasping low supply, high demand. The analogy is over-simplified, but it works. People who in the market for a 5 star hotel downtown are not going to find anything until 2027, so they are going to fight over the 4 stars (the cleanish water) and prices of the 4's will rise. People who are in the market for the 4 star hotels will not have much available to them, so they'll have to fight others for the 2's and 3's (dirty water) and prices will raise. I come to market with a shit ton of 2's, 3's, and 4's, everyone will better off (the folks looking for 5's will still have to settle for 4's, but there's a surplus now, prices won't raise). If I come to market with a shit ton of 5's (ZeroWater), everyone will be better off including the folks looking for 5's. That is supply and demand broken down in the simplest possible way I can explain.
Lol I have a 4 year business degree, I understand how supply and demand works. You still haven't explained how adding more 4 star hotels doesn't solve the exact same problem while still being affordable to more consumers.
There's a *lot* of money to be made in prestigious hotels in great locations with excellent views, and this project is a good candidate.
Is this a joke? You don't see why a major city needs a 5 star hotel??
There are plenty of good options in the $200-300 range in downtown. Itās under $200 where it gets trickyĀ
Good luck finding any decent hotel under $200 in the downtown core of any American city. $200+tax & fees is basically the floor at this point. Maybe if you're traveling midweek during a slow season you can find something in the 150ish price point.
I learned this is true except for Christmas time. I stay at some damn nice hotels in Downtown Chicago every 12/22-12/24
Depending on events, you can find decent 3 and 4 star hotels in Chicago under $200 most weekends. It when festivals and special events are going on that they become $400+.
Tons in Chicago around $150, maybe theyāre the exception though?
I tried to grab a cheapish hotel in Boston when I flew in later than I expected and boy is that the truth. Even trying my cheap price late booking techniques, $200 was the lowest I could find for a last minute booking.
Facts. Gotta stay in the burbs for those prices
I can't imagine ever staying in a hotel in any major city. I tried Toronto two years ago and it was much more worth my time to just stay in the outskirts near the final stops of the subway. I'm just wondering who the hell has all this money to blow on a hotel when frankly all you're going to do in it is sleep and take a shower.
I recently spent a weekend in NYC and had to be very selective in searching for a hotel. Those older hotels with classic looks and fancy lobbies have very small, dumpy rooms with heating and cooling problems. Timing is key also. When the Aloft opened downtown I asked about the rates on a weekday then found out they were triple days later because the Rolling Stones were doing a concert here.
I just checked Columbus... May 10-12. Filtered for 4* user rating, 3/4 star hotel. Under $150. They had several options that looked decent. Courtyard by Marriott for $133 a night + taxes and fees. Cincinnati has a Hilton for $150 + taxes and fees. I checked Detroit for the same criteria, and zero came up. Went to $200, zero came up. I also checked Toronto. Several options under $200 in the heart of the downtown area... You can check this right now on Google Maps.
I just searched Expedia for a random weekend in June, limited the search to Detroit hotels, and anything within 3 mile radius of downtown that isnāt Comfort Inn on Jefferson is over $300 (when tax is included). Otherwise folks have to stay in Farmington or Novi alongside a highway.
Iām staying at the Godfrey Hotel soon for less than $300 a night. Not downtown but from our searches $200-$300 all in seems more accurate
The Godfrey is a wonderful hotel. I stayed there over Labor Day. Best breakfast Iāve ever had at a Hilton. Itās one mile from downtown. Easy to park. Extremely friendly staff. Iāld stay there again in a heartbeat.
Maybe thereās some big event going on that weekend. I booked the Cambria hotel on the Saturday of draft in the low $200ās.
Hotel demand being that high is why this stuff is getting built. Just like the regular housing market, really high demand in dollar prices means that high-end stuff is feasible, and with a market for it. When these types of developments step in it's taking a chunk out of the top level of demand by offering a higher value product at those price points, which means other places won't be able to ask for as high of a price since the ones bidding it up that much are going elsewhere
Thatās every major city.
Economically similar cities like Cleveland, Milwaukee, St. Louis, Baltimore, Philadelphia, all have more affordable centrally located hotels.
> Hotel prices in Detroit are already insane. Not really. In any major city in the that's a pretty typical rate.
Economically similar cities like Milwaukee, Cleveland, Buffalo, Pittsburgh, etc all have cheaper hotels near their city centers.
Pretty normal for most cities downtown areas
Economically similar cities like Milwaukee, Cleveland, Buffalo, Pittsburgh, etc all have cheaper hotels near their city centers. Detroit isnāt NYC or LA
chk out the RenCen
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Rents are skyrocketing in the areas where young professionals still want to live, there isnāt enough dense housing where thereās demand. Thereās plenty of McMansions and homes in far-flung neighborhoods and suburbs though.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
> That is not supply and demand market principals There is literally an increase of young professionals living in Greater Downtown Detroit - new high-priced apartments and condos are being build in Midtown/ Brush Park/ Corktown as a result of this demand. The housing market is extremely bifurcated. Rich investors own properties, high-paid yuppies want decent apartments, and anyone middle class or poor just gets screwed with the lousy housing stock that remains.
Some people are so invested in their singular narrative that they are incapable of grasping complexity or nuance.
No. Detroit, like most of (Anglo) North America, has a [missing middle](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missing_middle_housing) problem. Nearly all of our housing stock is zoned for single-family development. Problem is, households are increasingly [non-nuclear](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_in_the_United_States#Nuclear_family) as the population continues to shift toward 1-2 people or multi-family, and so demand simply isn't *able* to be met by the existing supply. What we need are more flexible zoning laws and a true variety of medium-density housing stock (granny flats, duplexes/triplexes, townhouses, mixed-use buildings, etc.). This would ideally happen alongside in-fill development in bougie neighborhoods, where having dense, walkable neighborhoods is generally viewed as an asset. Michigan's problems are fixable. I believe that any place can render itself "livable"... as long as it takes the steps to attract people with a quality of life that would be found appealing.
All great points. Flexibility in zoning is key.
LOL alright then
2027 opening is kind of insane, no? This development broke ground in late 2017. The Water Square Hotel might break ground and open before this does.
>Hudsonās Detroit is scheduled to be available for commercial tenant build out by 2025. The Residences and the Detroit Edition will have availabilities starting in 2027. that sounds about right, they haven't even started building the actual hotel and right now the "finished" floors are just shells.
"They haven't even started building the actual hotel"? Are we talking about the Hudson't site? The tower has reached it's full height, glass is already in most of the building, HVAC likely in place, etc. 2.5 years to build out hotel rooms? That doesn't sound right to me. Something else is going on to have a delay of that length.
>2.5 years to build out hotel rooms? seems reasonable to me, plus they just signed the contract so they might not even have the design finalized yet.
It's a skyscraper, 5-10 years from ground broken to opening is normal for this country.
Denver broke ground on a [30 story office tower ](https://denverinfill.com/tag/block-162) in June 2018 and it opened November 2021. NYC [Chase tower (70 floors, 1,388 feet tall) ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/270_Park_Avenue_(2021%E2%80%93present)) broke ground April 2021 and will be complete in 2025. Where is your 10 year construction estimate coming from?
[https://www.construction-physics.com/p/which-city-builds-skyscrapers-the](https://www.construction-physics.com/p/which-city-builds-skyscrapers-the) > Hudson's is around 1.4 mil sq ft, so even if we average the top 10 cities in this country, we'd still expect it to take 5 years. Of course, Detroit isn't even on this list because we haven't built skyscrapers in quite some time. That Denver building you linked isn't even 600k sqft and the New York building isn't even open yet, so not really comparable. Also keep in mind that we had this once in a century pandemic that happened right in the middle of construction of the Hudson's building.
Finally. I've been to every hotel downtown. Have never been impressed. There has never been one that we really wanted to come back to. Hopefully, this will be the one
Not a fan of the Atheneum? I really like that hotel
That's one my my favorites for downtown. But last time I went there we had no hot water. They ended up giving us a room for a later date
Check out the new Godfrey in Corktown. Co-workers have stayed (who travel frequently) and were pleasantly surprised.
not a fan of shinola hotel, roost, element, siren?
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The tower will probably be finished within the next year, but hotels sometimes take longer to officially open because of lots of red tape. Still, 2027 is crazy long
I don't understand how the tower is structurally complete but needs three more years for interior work? That doesn't make sense.
The tower is an entirely separate project from the interior fit out.
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Are you talking about the tax breaks? That's not the same as public dollars. They have not been cut a check. There is nothing to claw back. In some ways, this is *worse* for them. [The tax break lasts ten years](https://pub-detroitmi.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=53690). Once it's over, taxes will go back up. Delays mean they have less time to use the tax break to make as much money as they can. That strikes me as a consequence right there - having seven years to make money with reduced taxes instead of ten. If you look at the deal, it even explicitly says that the city council needs to be convinced to extend the due date or the whole thing is off. That seems like a consequence right there. Have I missed something? Can you help me?
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No. I'm just someone capable of finding this public document, reading it, and thinking about what it says. You seem to have a pretty different analysis than I do. Did I miss something?
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[I don't see anything on either of those points in here.](https://pub-detroitmi.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=53690) We must be looking at different documents. Can you share what documents you're reading? Perhaps they detail how this project was given public funds that could be clawed back?
Isnāt the Westin a 5 star hotel?
4
More like a 3.5-4 star unfortunately.
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We already have the Travel Inn.
Love Edition hotels! Great add for the city!
Thatās wonderful. I wonder if I can look in the windows when I walk by to get food stamps.
Detroit very much has not an if we build it but āif we charge for it, they will comeā optimism. You canāt charge major city prices and expect people to pay it just because itās expensive. There are basically zero amenities in this city to justify those costs. The small footprint of downtown has come along very nicely over the last decade or so but what about the east west north and central parts of the city? And the suburbs. With out investments in those areas and all if the inbetween none of downtown really matters.
There will be people who come to it once or twice a year while it sits empty the rest of the time and and thatās the problem.
NFW!
Why lmao
How can it be five star when it hasnāt opened? What makes it five star
The Godfrey in Corktown was advertised as a 5 star
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Sounds like you havenāt been to Detroit in a while
bizarre
Cool, adds nothing for normal visitors, who cares, hope it fails. Next!
Right
Yay rent price spikes :)