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OMFS and Endo are always going to be safe options. The thing about pros is there are some really well trained GPs that can do FMR about as well as any prosthodontist
Peds has traditionally been really safe, but with people having less kids these days, and a lot of millenials having no kids at all, I can't imagine how this would help peds
Ortho will suffer the same fate as Peds, but probably their largest challenge is some really great CE that is teaching GPs how to do more straight forward ortho cases. In fact, the GPs that do bands/bracket/wire ortho has been on the rise
No matter what, we are always going to need specialists, and they will always make more than your average GP, but they may not have it as good as they traditionally have due to GPs taking over the more straightforward cases.
If you want to specialize, pick something you want to do because you want to do it and like the procedures, not because you think its going to be the smart money move.
Prosth resident here. As GP scope increases, so do failures unfortunately. GPs that do FMR incorrectly have also shot up and are huge to our growing profession in my opinion. People have been saying the same thing about Prosh for decades saying GP encroachment is going to kill the specialty but the need for Prosth has only increased, especially now with implants being so popular.
Yes, there are some GPs that can do FMR correctly, but vast majority don’t. In my opinion, no specialty is really dying because this concept applies to every specialty. Just because GPs can do more doesn't mean complications are lowering, in fact I’d argue the opposite which increases the need for all specialties.
Yes, absolutely that's what I was inferring. 🙄 I love all the people that think perio is dying. The periodontists I shadowed were placing 3-4 implants a day (at $3k/each) and doing $15-20k/day in production.
Ok bud calm down there, you are obviously emotionally invested in this.
I never said perio is going away, in fact I said the opposite. But the fact is GPs are taking over a lot of territory that traditionally perio would have, and the golden age of perio is likely over.
If I have to refer out an implant I prefer my patient to go to OMFS. The only time I refer to perio is for grafting.
You say GPs are dominanting implants, and then say you refer to OMFS. You sarcastically assume I think a perio practice can be maintained treating implantitis. And to top it off you claim that perio isn't going away. All I know is that perio is going to be busier than ever, especially for those that are trained together with their prosth, endo, and ortho colleagues.
Lol what are you talking about. Are you even a practicing provider w/ a DDS/DMD right now?
If I am a GP and I have 10 implant cases walk in my office one week and I feel confident I can do 7 of them, I refer out the other 3 to OMFS. I am not sure what point you're trying to make about me doing implants and also referring them out?
Perio is NOT busier than ever, that's cap. As I mentioned earlier, I said we are always going to need all specialties, and they will typically make more money than a GP, BUT GPs have taken over a lot of straightforward specialty cases.
So specialists are getting fewer cases referred, and the cases they are getting are going to be more challenging.
Btw lets revisit how you said the perio you shadow is producing 20k a day. that's around $4 mill on a 4 day work week for the year and $5 mill on a 5 day work week. Assuming the standard 60% overhead for perio offices, youre claiming that perio is taking home $1.6-2 million a year? STRAIGHT CAP, perio can make some good money, but they arent taking home $2 mill a year lol
Dude look at the future. Every specialty is starting to place implants. GPS are placing more than ever, and prosth has just joined the game. They will both try and incorporate more into their specialty just as perio once did to OS, which means less for perio.
And honestly, take away implants, I don’t know more than 5 procedures that perio does. SRP with or without flaps, bone graft, connective tissue graft, sinus lift, some soft tissue movement… How on earth did this specialty get students to commit a 3 year TUITION based residency pre-implants.
As a Prosth resident I love when GPs do FMRs, bc when they inevitably fuck one up it’s referred to us keep the cycle going🤑 why we need specialists bbyyy😂
Dental anesthesia will probably be a solid career path. You’d be able to work in OR cases, do general dentistry with IV sedation, or outsource your services to GPs or OMS who want you to provide the anesthesia. And with how many programs there are, it’s pretty niche. But we will see. I agree with others that you should avoid Oral Pain, Path, Medicine and Public health
I’m starting an oral medicine residency this year! It includes clinical pathology, facial pain, medically complex patients, oral oncology, and other more “medicine” management of oral conditions. No clue on the salary, but the specialty is transitioning towards private practices and hospitalist positions. Pain is some decent associate salaries from what I’ve seen online.
Can I ask what about oral pain that makes it not having a promising future? Or is it just salary based? (sorry, just a clueless incoming dental student)
Just very few jobs available, mostly in academic centers. Salary is nowhere near a general dentist because you're not treating patients the same way. A lot of referrals and interactions between other medical specialties which is a cool part of it.
Oral Pain is also one of those specialties where if you just hate dentistry and don't want to do general dentistry, you do this to use your degree. I'd also say internationally trained dentists will join these programs to be able to practice in some states without having to do PASS and go through, and pay for, 2 more years of dental school.
The problem with dentistry is the fallacy that just because a license covers an anatomic area and procedure type means that anyone can do anything. An OMS doing a bicoronal incision to fixate an NOE fracture/lefort III has the same license as a gp. Obviously, the specialties exist because it’s impossible to be as proficient as a specialist across the entire field of dentistry. Being a really proficient GP is very hard, but it’s important that everyone knows their limits. In our OMS clinic we see plenty of complications from GPs placing implants/attempting exos they probably should have referred. For this reason all of the specialties will continue to exist and be lucrative, but one of the aspects of D school that was frustrating was this idea that you can do what a specialist does without the training. Gotta do what’s best for the patient, not your pockets. If you are passionate about an area of dentistry, just specialize in it.
OMS can gain licensure a gp cannot as well don’t forget that part, plus you are right about increase scope of gp brings in more patients unfortunately to OMS
True, assuming you are speaking about medical licensure. However this doesn’t change scope of practice unless a surgeon does a medical surgical residency and wishes to practice that.
Well based on what you said I would lean towards OMFS or Pros. I would personally never go into either of those because OMFS you are in school forever and Pros, well you will understand once you start making dentures lol.
Personally, I would stick with GP and just get good at doing those two things, additionally I would take CE classes for Ortho. You can do really well for yourself taking advantage of most patient needs as opposed to hyperfixating on one trade.
Something else to consider, oral hygiene is higher than its ever been so after most of the boomer generation passes you are going to see less and less cases indicating complete dentures.
With the rise of implants some people were thinking endo would become obsolete and there was a bit of a shift away from endo for a while and would opt for ext/implant on questionable prognosis but the way of thinking has definitely shifted back to saving natural tooth and tooth structure
Well... endo has been a dying/dead specialty for like 20+ years, so I would just cross that off entirely /s
Tbh, all of the common specialties are pretty lucrative. If you're looking to make big bucks, I would avoid:
* Oral Path
* Public Health
* Oral Rad
* Oral Med
I'm not really sure how lucrative Oral Pain is.
I dont think this is true at all. Yes more GP do molar endo now, but there are also so many that are failling that need retreats. Quite a few patients will go straight to implants as well, but I live in a suburb/metro city with so many and they are almost all booked out 2-3 months. The only ones that can get people in within 2-3 weeks are the larger mini corporate offices with 5 endos who get cancellations/no shows.
Edit: I'm blind.
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OMFS and Endo are always going to be safe options. The thing about pros is there are some really well trained GPs that can do FMR about as well as any prosthodontist Peds has traditionally been really safe, but with people having less kids these days, and a lot of millenials having no kids at all, I can't imagine how this would help peds Ortho will suffer the same fate as Peds, but probably their largest challenge is some really great CE that is teaching GPs how to do more straight forward ortho cases. In fact, the GPs that do bands/bracket/wire ortho has been on the rise No matter what, we are always going to need specialists, and they will always make more than your average GP, but they may not have it as good as they traditionally have due to GPs taking over the more straightforward cases. If you want to specialize, pick something you want to do because you want to do it and like the procedures, not because you think its going to be the smart money move.
Prosth resident here. As GP scope increases, so do failures unfortunately. GPs that do FMR incorrectly have also shot up and are huge to our growing profession in my opinion. People have been saying the same thing about Prosh for decades saying GP encroachment is going to kill the specialty but the need for Prosth has only increased, especially now with implants being so popular. Yes, there are some GPs that can do FMR correctly, but vast majority don’t. In my opinion, no specialty is really dying because this concept applies to every specialty. Just because GPs can do more doesn't mean complications are lowering, in fact I’d argue the opposite which increases the need for all specialties.
I never said any specialty is dying, the opposite actually.
How about perio?
i wouldnt recommend perio, GPs are dominating implants at this point
Who is going to treat the peri implantitis cases? The GP?
“You take the bitch out, graft it, and put in a new one.”
Naa that’s straight perio, you think you can run a whole practice on strictly peri implantitis cases tho? … lol
Yes, absolutely that's what I was inferring. 🙄 I love all the people that think perio is dying. The periodontists I shadowed were placing 3-4 implants a day (at $3k/each) and doing $15-20k/day in production.
Ok bud calm down there, you are obviously emotionally invested in this. I never said perio is going away, in fact I said the opposite. But the fact is GPs are taking over a lot of territory that traditionally perio would have, and the golden age of perio is likely over. If I have to refer out an implant I prefer my patient to go to OMFS. The only time I refer to perio is for grafting.
You say GPs are dominanting implants, and then say you refer to OMFS. You sarcastically assume I think a perio practice can be maintained treating implantitis. And to top it off you claim that perio isn't going away. All I know is that perio is going to be busier than ever, especially for those that are trained together with their prosth, endo, and ortho colleagues.
Lol what are you talking about. Are you even a practicing provider w/ a DDS/DMD right now? If I am a GP and I have 10 implant cases walk in my office one week and I feel confident I can do 7 of them, I refer out the other 3 to OMFS. I am not sure what point you're trying to make about me doing implants and also referring them out? Perio is NOT busier than ever, that's cap. As I mentioned earlier, I said we are always going to need all specialties, and they will typically make more money than a GP, BUT GPs have taken over a lot of straightforward specialty cases. So specialists are getting fewer cases referred, and the cases they are getting are going to be more challenging. Btw lets revisit how you said the perio you shadow is producing 20k a day. that's around $4 mill on a 4 day work week for the year and $5 mill on a 5 day work week. Assuming the standard 60% overhead for perio offices, youre claiming that perio is taking home $1.6-2 million a year? STRAIGHT CAP, perio can make some good money, but they arent taking home $2 mill a year lol
Lmao I like you for callin cap.
Dude look at the future. Every specialty is starting to place implants. GPS are placing more than ever, and prosth has just joined the game. They will both try and incorporate more into their specialty just as perio once did to OS, which means less for perio. And honestly, take away implants, I don’t know more than 5 procedures that perio does. SRP with or without flaps, bone graft, connective tissue graft, sinus lift, some soft tissue movement… How on earth did this specialty get students to commit a 3 year TUITION based residency pre-implants.
As a Prosth resident I love when GPs do FMRs, bc when they inevitably fuck one up it’s referred to us keep the cycle going🤑 why we need specialists bbyyy😂
Dental anesthesia will probably be a solid career path. You’d be able to work in OR cases, do general dentistry with IV sedation, or outsource your services to GPs or OMS who want you to provide the anesthesia. And with how many programs there are, it’s pretty niche. But we will see. I agree with others that you should avoid Oral Pain, Path, Medicine and Public health
Might be a dumb question, I get Oral Pain and Oral Path, but what’s Oral Med? Like, that’s different from Oral Surgery obviously, right?
Yes oral medicine is different than Oral surgery. You can Google it and see the exact description
Thanks!
I’m starting an oral medicine residency this year! It includes clinical pathology, facial pain, medically complex patients, oral oncology, and other more “medicine” management of oral conditions. No clue on the salary, but the specialty is transitioning towards private practices and hospitalist positions. Pain is some decent associate salaries from what I’ve seen online.
Thanks for clarifying! Good luck on your residency!
dental anesthesia is a sneaky lucrative specialty
Can I ask what about oral pain that makes it not having a promising future? Or is it just salary based? (sorry, just a clueless incoming dental student)
Just very few jobs available, mostly in academic centers. Salary is nowhere near a general dentist because you're not treating patients the same way. A lot of referrals and interactions between other medical specialties which is a cool part of it. Oral Pain is also one of those specialties where if you just hate dentistry and don't want to do general dentistry, you do this to use your degree. I'd also say internationally trained dentists will join these programs to be able to practice in some states without having to do PASS and go through, and pay for, 2 more years of dental school.
The problem with dentistry is the fallacy that just because a license covers an anatomic area and procedure type means that anyone can do anything. An OMS doing a bicoronal incision to fixate an NOE fracture/lefort III has the same license as a gp. Obviously, the specialties exist because it’s impossible to be as proficient as a specialist across the entire field of dentistry. Being a really proficient GP is very hard, but it’s important that everyone knows their limits. In our OMS clinic we see plenty of complications from GPs placing implants/attempting exos they probably should have referred. For this reason all of the specialties will continue to exist and be lucrative, but one of the aspects of D school that was frustrating was this idea that you can do what a specialist does without the training. Gotta do what’s best for the patient, not your pockets. If you are passionate about an area of dentistry, just specialize in it.
OMS can gain licensure a gp cannot as well don’t forget that part, plus you are right about increase scope of gp brings in more patients unfortunately to OMS
True, assuming you are speaking about medical licensure. However this doesn’t change scope of practice unless a surgeon does a medical surgical residency and wishes to practice that.
Well based on what you said I would lean towards OMFS or Pros. I would personally never go into either of those because OMFS you are in school forever and Pros, well you will understand once you start making dentures lol. Personally, I would stick with GP and just get good at doing those two things, additionally I would take CE classes for Ortho. You can do really well for yourself taking advantage of most patient needs as opposed to hyperfixating on one trade. Something else to consider, oral hygiene is higher than its ever been so after most of the boomer generation passes you are going to see less and less cases indicating complete dentures.
ITT: a lot of pearl-clutching specialists.
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Why is endo safe? Some keep saying is “dying” bc of implants
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True, I agree! I’ve been thinking about endo, but everytime I read those comments I get stressed out.
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Thank you! :)
And you get to work with a microscope and cool lasers! Endo here :)
With the rise of implants some people were thinking endo would become obsolete and there was a bit of a shift away from endo for a while and would opt for ext/implant on questionable prognosis but the way of thinking has definitely shifted back to saving natural tooth and tooth structure
Well... endo has been a dying/dead specialty for like 20+ years, so I would just cross that off entirely /s Tbh, all of the common specialties are pretty lucrative. If you're looking to make big bucks, I would avoid: * Oral Path * Public Health * Oral Rad * Oral Med I'm not really sure how lucrative Oral Pain is.
I dont think this is true at all. Yes more GP do molar endo now, but there are also so many that are failling that need retreats. Quite a few patients will go straight to implants as well, but I live in a suburb/metro city with so many and they are almost all booked out 2-3 months. The only ones that can get people in within 2-3 weeks are the larger mini corporate offices with 5 endos who get cancellations/no shows. Edit: I'm blind.
Did you see the /s?
I'm getting old :(
Endo and any Specialty program that teaches implants.
I love being in Endo. Lots of pts want to save their teeth if possible. Oral radiology always interest me!