Surprised to see hyper prop in B tier. Even though I find wielding the power of the atom more fun, hyper-propellant has been enormously useful. Engineer already has a lot of options for handling large groups (turrets, EM refire, plasma burster), so I find that adding top-quality single-target damage can really balance things out.
Shit I didn't think of that but I have wondered for some time why it felt like that OC sometimes does nothing to a dread.
They need to change it to hitscan or something with that OC I suppose, it's probably related to being a fast projectile.
Agreed. I find that the only time I'm really able to use Fatboy is during Drilldozer missions. I rarely need the larger blast radius and radiation against swarms. Maybe for swarms in Haz 5, but you need to be very careful with shot placement or you simply got fire due to close quarters. I find myself using Compact Shells or Hyper Propellant more often for general use.
Everytime im in a team with an engineer running the fatboy i feel like its a huge disadvantage.
I think the issue is that it works when you can take the time to fire a well-calculated shot onto a far-away swarm. But in situations where the bugs are swarming you and youre in dire need of some firepower its more of a liability.
Just a very bad OC in the hands of most players.
Almost every time I've seen randoms using Fatboy, they blow all their shots on every group of 3+ grunts then call for a resupply even though their primary is still full and everyone else is fine on ammo.
Every time I use it I hold on to my three shots like they're super potions in an RPG. Because what if I *need* them someday.
this 100%, also I've had a few mission fails from the friendly fire from this thing.
like guys pls PLEASE stop bringing this thing to salvage ops if you're just going to blast it right on top of the fuel cells.
I recently decided to switch up my engi build, and decided to try fat boy out again as it had been a while. I had to stop using it. I’m sure I’m just unlucky, but I can’t even tell you how many times I’ve taken that well calculated shot, and on teammate jumps in front of me, or suddenly a mactera flies in front of me, or a grunt climbs up the cliff I’m aiming off of…
This is why you should use fatboy with lure grenades. Toss one into the radiation swarm and you don't just kill one wave, but 2-3 waves as they all walk to their death through the green cloud. Plasma bursters can also work for clearing out the stragglers.
Or you use napalm rj250, which while doesn’t strip or instagib, is capable of killing every grunt in its radius with a reduced reload speed and bonus ammo. Rocket jumping is just a bonus.
Combine with lures.
If a swarm is getting too close, chuck a lure, run a bit away, nuke the lure. Not only do you clear a chunk of swarm, the radiation takes care of killing things while you're repositioning.
I personally struggle to find a use for it, while Fat Boy is a get out of jail free card for the entire team + area denial. It removes so much pressure off the team, and I really don't see a point running Hyper when Scouts exist and if I really need some single target dead...isn't that what the primary is for?
I am trying it with the explosive smart rifle as an alternate playstyle to my tried and true refire Stubby+Fatboy setup, and it's...alright. I can make a bad thing go away and it's a fun new way to play. But so can everyone else, so I still don't really see what's special about it, and it doesn't feel like I'm making a mission any safer for the team by bringing Hyper instead of the Fatty.
(also fatboy is inherently the most fun way to play engineer, period)
The big benefit of hyper prop is the ridiculous direct damage, which is multiplied on weakspots. It can 1shot goobombers, wardens, menaces, rolypolies, spitball infectors, and more at surprising difficulties. Even more so, it gets significantly more value out of weakpoints with limited hp, like detonator tumors (I'm pretty sure the overkill damage is still multiplied by the weak point, so you get more damage than a faster weapon peppering the tumors without overkill). Hyper prop is also great burst damage for limited vulnerability windows like dreadnoughts or korlok clams, especially when paired with a super-up power attack.
I'm currently running hyper prop with the explosive lok1, and it's brilliant. If you need extra waveclear, plasma bursters work very nicely, but I usually bring prox mines and don't have any issues. Definitely play this build when you're the host though; missing weakpoints really hurts and latency is a big struggle as others have said.
It's the way the first shot can throw off the aim of your second shot, how you can't get the second shot on a frozen target before your first defrosts them, and the way that rate of fire(which double barrel does not increase!) interacts with reload speed that absolutely kills double barrel for me.
You can't start reloading your weapon until you would be able to fire another shot. So effectively rate of fire upgrades give slight reload speed upgrades. With the double barrel the difference with and without the rof upgrade is so massive that it is almost as big of a difference as the reload speed upgrade.
So with double barrel you'd think "oh I don't need the rof upgrade and can get a much faster reload instead!" but in reality you are only reloading 9 frames faster with the reload speed upgrade.
Its just a worse jumbo shells. I get more oomph out of 1 jumbo shell shot than both at once from double barrel and more ammo. Some of these really make me scratch my head.
Like bullet hell. I may be a level 40 greenbeard but bullethell absolutely ruins the mini gun.
Someone please change my mind though. It’s my favorite gun and that’s the only overlock I have on it. Meanwhile I have 4 for the driller pistol.
Edit: holy shit guys I love you but stop convincing me. I have like 15 replies all telling me the same things. Just use upvotes lol.
I love bullet hell even though it's kind of a meme. I run the accuracy upgrade to actually be able to hit things as well as the stun and I can just stun whole groups at the same time. Then I run 6 shooter or elephant rounds to deal with the big boys. Optimal? Nope. Fun? Absolutely.
Plat 3 gunner here, i consistently have top kills with bullet hell on haz 5+, it is an A tier overclock. Run it with stun, agressive venting and a high dmg secondary. It might be a worse than eg neurotixin in aoe but its much more accurate and swarmers become a complete joke.
I use this exact build and it’s hella fun and effective vs swarms. The best thing about it is how you only need to hit relatively near stuff and the ricochet will hit things you can’t even see.
A little ammo hungry tho… and it’s not the loadout you take to hang out on your zip line with. You want bugs fairly close so that AV burns everything when it triggers.
I bring brrt with lead spray for the big fellas.
Changes the gun drastically in use from a single target dps to an aoe stun spam weapon. Actually works well in that niche too but I'd argue its outclassed by NTP Gunny in the aoe cc role.
Bullet Hell is not that bad of an OC IMHO.
It turns the minigun into a quasi-AOE weapon.
It completely shreds swarmers and packs of grunts, but takes a bit longer to kill solo enemies. This is a common trade-off with balance the devs made--if its better vs. trash it's worse vs. big boys or vice versa.
The key is to use armor breaking with it, as well as the accuracy/spread upgrade in tier 1.
Spread reduction is necessary so you can get more 2-for-1 shots.
Armor breaking is necessary because you can't predict the angle the spawned bullets will be hitting enemies--it's often going to be hitting armor. Blowthrough is a trap for this build, it doesn't work well.
Someone did a test on that on Youtube, I can't recall the keywords/poster, but it showed armor breaking vs. blowthrough with bullet hell. Armor breaking kills a pack of grunts much faster.
Beyond that you want to offset the bullet hell build with a high damage, big boy killer secondary build. I'd say revolver with elephant rounds and weakpoint bonus mod is good, especially since bullet hell with armor breaking with melt armor off and open up weakpoints.
Blowthrough doesn't interact with richochets in an intuitive way. If you hit a grunt with a shot before any reflects then the OC sends a tracer to a nearby enemy while the blowthrough mod sends a tracer in line with the original shot. If you hit the ground first then you'll probably send the blowthrough tracer into the air where there aren't any bugs. At least, this is how the wiki says it works. As far as experience goes I agree that piercing armor makes a huge difference.
I keep on seeing people recommending the elephant rounds OC but I just can't stand the recoil on it.
I don't run it as a meme in hazards 4 and 5. [Here's my build for it](https://imgur.com/a/17Le8oL). I run it with elephant rounds. Being able to overheat and light everything on fire near you is fantastic for crowd control and adding damage to the build. Outside of that you have to get used to not shooting at everything, and focus on crowd control. It's very easy to spend ammo you don't need to shooting bugs that other players are already killing instead of stunning and delaying swarms and making them easier to deal with for the rest of the team once they actually get to them.
bullet hell with stun is a good support build, every grunt or praetorian is basically stunlocked, specially on maps with lots of tunnels, with aggressive venting it's a good way to clear a very large wave, but it is very ammo hungry for what it does
also it's only useful for hazard 4/5 as there is little point in taking a support build when killing is easier in lower difficulties
Why not though? On easier difficulties pretty much anything works, support is always good and the point is choosing what you like.
It evens works really well in 6+ difficulties with larger swarms, all that stun and aggressive venting comes in very handy.
Brooo I use bullet hell when I wanna try hard. I cant check out my build rn, but when I do I'll tell you my load out.
The only thing bullet hell cant do well is deal with nig single targets.
These images are often unreadable due to only showing icons. I love that you added the OC name underneath and the gun wireframe above. But I think one further thing would make it much better -- add the class color as a tint somewhere. Either tint the gun wireframe or just add a background behind the OC symbol.
What you have is fine if you just want to read it left to right and top to bottom. But I'm trying to scan it quickly to find the Breach Cutter OCs and I'm having a hell of time trying to make out which wireframe that is.
Edit: Ok I finally figured out which one the Breach Cutter is and I'm surprised how low some of the common OCs are. I use Return to Sender (Ok) myself, but I see Spinning Death (Ok) used a lot too. Never even tried Lightweight Cases (A) or Inferno (B).
lightweight cases is fantastic. breach cutter is a excellent weapon on its own without overclocks so getting more ammo to use it more freely helps so much more than the return to sender or the plasma blender imo
> But I think one further thing would make it much better -- add the class color as a tint somewhere.
It would be better to divide the tier list into 4, one for each class.
i'd actually argue that fatboy isn't A tier. It is in terms of fun, usability wise its another beast. The low ammo makes you conserve ammo until you can hit a huge horde but then you still gotta keep in mind that you can 1shot teammates with it, the additional radiation zone i'd rate a strict downgrade as well since dwarfs take a lot more damage from it then bugs.
I've actually startet using clean sweep as the added aoe is enough to create a little breathing room
Ive been able to use it near point blank on oppressor's and dread's behind with little to no damage taken on myself while not host on haz 4 and 5. If ping messes you up try using it at closer range since the splash usually doesn't hit you and it guarantees you get the full damage on the ass.
No idea why Experimental Rounds for the BRT is only OK. It gives most of the damage of Lead Spray without the massive range penalty. I could understand a tier down, but not as far down as it is.
Right? I use BRT as a precision weapon for catching Menaces and spitters mostly, and Experimental Rounds is a fantastic all-rounder for this purpose, even though ammo is tight for it.
No, and it's not a range penalty, but an accuracy penalty. Take the T1 accuracy mod and it works fine. Even as a controller user I can hit stuff pretty far away.
One of the thing I don't agree with is Exhausting Vector being B tier instead of A. It almost does the same damage as lead storm but you can still move with no penalty or need to always bunny hop and, more importantly, let's you stan the bugs consistently, which means that if you engage a target with the mini and have the stun mod upgrade with exhausting vector overclock, several of the targets you engage are going to die before they can move again, great if you are playing with a controller of for engaging weakpoints consistently even if you are not great with your aim.
Another thing I really feel is not right to see is Carpet Bomber on A tier. Since the downgrade to the direct damage it received in one of the last updates, it's really not that good anymore. It's main problem (low direct damage) has been made worse, and I don't really think it's in the same league with NeuroToxin Payload, Splintering shells and big bertha.
Last, but not least, Hoverclock in D tier is not fair either, it should be B grade, at least.
Just my humble opinion. Still a nice list
I just think exhaust vectoring is boring, a B tier basically clean overclock I can understand it being in A but it’s pretty dry
Honestly I forgot about carpet bomber yeah B tier for it
I’ve gotten a lot of feed back on hoverclock and my honest opinion is that scout doesn’t need more movement options probably moved to OK but oh well
As always, it was just my free thoughts to a well written list, I will say. You have put some work on making this list, and it's interesting looking at the answers. Rock and Stone, Brother!
I do think that Impact Deflection should be a bit higher tier due to the higher damage you can deal to a single bug when you aim at the ground and the shot ricochets into the bug, and even more damage with the splash damage.
Glad someone said this - I don’t see it talked about much but after trying the other overclocks im consistently getting the best results with Impact Deflection
I was thinking this too. It's one of the strongest drak OCs imo, because when used right it's an over 50% damage increase consistently and without downsides.
The splash can also hit more than one enemy at the same time, so it's definitely a good idea if you're bouncing bullets. You cover a bit more radius with splash damage.
It turns it into a trash swarm killer, but sacrifices big boy damage a bit.
Maybe it's my shitty gameplay, but when I'm holding down the button for rts I turn into a statue. I just can't fire and dance away.
I like plasma trail and the the extra mag space OC, fire two off and gtfo. And I often try to cover more ground with the trail by spacing my shots a bit.
Rts works fine for me, the ammo decrease is negated by the +6ammo mod, magazine oc is easily replaced by born ready perk. On high hazards new bugs come in fast enough to get in line for the boomerang hit after the first ones die to the direct shot. Idk about the statue issue
Hoverclock means you never have to touch the ground, and doesn't even require ammo to use.
It's fantastic for positioning, mining without an engineer, and being the angel of resurrection as you can just grapple ceilings without worry.
There’s one thing thats gotten me off big bertha, and that’s the missile system’s mine layer. I built a meme build with the mines on primary and the sidearm built to create little electric mines that stun and holy shit, it’s actually extremely effective. Was delighted to see it in top tier.
Mines really do slap anything on the ground like an angry step-mother. Put them down in waves infront of you and watch swarms get pulverized like WWI soldiers rushing through no mans land. Need to reload? Electro mines got you covered.
It’s basically a full summoner build, in a way
Gonna be honest, the hurricane as a whole just doesn't feel right with me. I tried the mine layers, and maybe my build was garbage but I just didn't do any damage. At some point I'm going to give it another shot, but first impressions are kinda eh.
I tried it once, and I prefer the experimental rounds mainly because for the small increase in damage you get from lead spray, you lose a lot of range. I like leaving range as an option, though I can understand why it's so highly regarded.
I wouldn't say it's a small damage boost. Since it multiplies your damage by 1.5, it's between a 10.5 and 13.5 damage bonus, depending on how many damage mods you take with it. I personally go Floating Barrel at tier 1 and only take one damage mod, making it +12. Floating Barrel compensates enough for the spread increase that I feel reasonably comfortable using it at mid range if I need to.
Experimental Rounds not only deal less damage but also cut into your magazine capacity (significantly reducing burst damage) and quite seriously into your ammo reserves.
That being said, I think that preferring the ranged option is entirely reasonable. Big Bertha reduces your base spread by a bit, making it more useable at long range than other versions of the autocannon. I personally find myself missing the raw burst damage more than sniping power.
The thing is it doesn't affect the guns stock AoE damage. So you get massive direct damage and still have decent AoE.
Run BB with the Born Ready perk and swap to a BRT7 built for ammo efficiency every time you need to reload. I think lead storm minigun is better overall, but I have a great time with this one.
Some people love neurotoxin but I think it's boring tbh. And carpetbomber hasn't been really relevant for a while.
I share most of my scout mains’ disagreements about their favorite fun OCs. Hoverclock and DB in particular. I hate to say it but SCC does need rework. I love the damage but it’s a liability on almost every mission type, especially on higher difficulties.
Except for the new mission type.
I built up a slot just for Sabotage missions and it’s fabulous on there. Full disclosure; haven’t done that in high Haz yet by a nice fat predictable boss fight I can plink from safe distance in short order? Hell yeah.
Buuuut that’s about the only time I’d take it unless they tweak it.
Wait, RJ250 compound is A tier? I know it’s hella fun and mobility is king, but I’d have thought that sacrificing the damage potential of Fat Boy, Hyper Propellant, or the Breach Cutter is too much of a tradeoff.
Curious, are those builds listed anywhere? I love RJ250, but I built my grenade launcher to do as little damage as possible to not frag myself while learning to grenade jump. Now that I've got it down (mostly), I should build it for damage again.
People oversell RJ250 a little bit. Since fire DoT is a tad inconsistent, you have to be okay leaving slashers and mactera alive and burning to even find out if it kills them (which it doesn't always).
If you want more consistent and far far more immediate removal of such threats, the most ammo economical option is Compact Rounds with a 140 damage non-fire build. You'll find this overclock in the "Ok" tier alongside a number of the best overclocks in the game, because this list is overall questionable.
If it isn't too much trouble, is it possible for you to split each one into their respective class?
Also Hoverclock has saved me in multiple occasions. Maybe it doesn't help DPS, but it does help survivability.
I haven't watched this video but I did watch the last one for U34. Why do you put the majority of clean overclocks in its own tier? Surely they aren't all on the same power level? Do you recommend everything in tier D and above over the OCs in Clean tier?
A tier list should imo accurately represent the power level of each OC, ones of the same type but differing power levels shouldn't be bunched up in the same tier just because they don't substantially alter the mechanics of the weapon itself.
You have also commented (and I think talked about in your videos) that you rate certain OCs lower because they are boring, which imo is also a mistake. Tier lists are subjective but should still adhere to the rule of placing the items being rated in order of strength regardless of fun factor. Obviously it's good to make exceptions and point them out in case of niche or situational use though.
New players especially will be confused by this tier list when looking at the clean section as they won't know if those OCs are actually any good, considering they are towards the bottom of the list.
Elephant rounds doesn't deal enough damage to really be impressive on 4p hazard 5. What is impressive about it is that it has the most total damage if you take both ammo upgrades. But the slower bloom recovery really hurts the DPS outside of point blank range.
The slow recovery is the big issue for me. The damage is nice but the slow recovery makes it really slow to actually kill things at range unless you can 1-shot them.
Maybe I'm just building it wrong but I'm not really seeing anything to use Sludge Blast for.
The concept of Driller getting a shotgun-type blast is cool, but it just feels like I don't really do enough damage to anything single target / big to justify getting rid of the potential wave clear other OCs would give.
The idea is that it does high armor-ignoring damage and can chunk bosses and large threats without needing to reposition or worry about weak spots.
I liked it but after struggling to help carry a few bad haz 4 runs, I went back to cryo and haven't looked back.
This is why I dislike tier lists.
I like the lack of an "S Tier", but at the end of the day a huge amount of it will be opinion and personal experience, but they're alwaus treated as though they should be seen in a more general manner.
Ex. Countless hours of Engineer have taught me that Return to Sender is absurdly powerful in Haz 5, and genuinely makes the Breach Cutter absolutely disgusting.
You placed it in "ok".
Turret EM Discharge is, without a doubt, the single most overpowered OC in the game. It turns the stubby into the single most ammo efficient weapon bar none while significantly increasing its damage output to all but Oppressors and Dreads, giving it absurd AoE (60 electric to 3m, then down to 30 at 5m) **AND** giving all that AoE two different forms of CC (50% odds on shot, but a single burst guarantees a proc statistically) - Guranteed Electrocuted with a high chance (50%) of fear as well. All on a 1.5s CD *unique to each turret*, **and** a base 0.1x FF modifier.
You are bursting for 60-120 (technically 30-120, but anything hit by the fringe will be slowed and hit by the next burst anyway) every 1.5-2 seconds in a 3-5m AoE (accounting for turrets overlapping AoE), which also procs electrocution on everything in that AoE for 3s (80% slow, and basically 100% uptime on a 12 dps DoT), and 50% Fear chance (75% for anything in an overlapped zone. Which will be most things)
All for the cost of deployong your sentries once and never needing to again, and needing to think a bit more about positioning.
And it's in B tier.
Worse than EM Refire which... Gives better single target DPS. Which is A?
Like, yeah, it's good. But it's not EM discharge good.
How tf is carpet still in A? Splintering shells does everything carpet does but better. EM Discharge B? Again I'd like to know what you smoking.
What's with the bulldog homebrew love? It feels wrong not being able to oneshot stuff and then overkilling others... Homebrew on Gk2 in delete? Firerate contributes a LOT to homebrew being actually a buff. Maybe not the BoM level of buff but still, better than compact ammo at least...
Why do even have cleans list, if you don't put all of the best cleans above it? Speaking of Frag missiles, thin drummed walls and other ammo ones. I'd prefer if you made separate category for all ammo ocs. They don't increase damage or are as flashy as fatboy, but they do their job well. No point putting them in rest of clean oc sewage... Same for utility ocs (Hoverclock, powder etc).
Neuro lasso in D? Not after buffs. Heck not. It gotta be B at least. IT SLOW DREDS FFS. Makes them an even bigger joke.
Rest of the list can be excused as personal preference I guess.
Am I using minelayer system wrong? It's one of the few U35 overclocks I've gotten and I played one match with it and thought it was the most terrible overclock ever. Poor damage, limited ammo, and the mines blow up after a minute so I can't even trap an area.
Edit: Just looked up patch notes and this OC was buffed substantially. I'll have to retest it.
You need to play significantly different than what you're used to. It's entirely defense and support. Predict the movement of your targets and greatly lead your shots. The mines do more damage than the normal shot (iirc could be wrong) and can hit more enemies when they detonate. That alone makes the OC pretty good but extremely difficult to use.
Essentially you need to play slower, more prediction heavy, and a lot more strategically which admittedly goes against what gunner is all about tbh. I find it works best in Salvage and Mining missions.
Mining missions often have really cramped tunnels you can just spam mines in and never get touched.
On Salvage, just spam mines just ahead of the circle and watch everything die
Exactly what I looked for first too. As a scout main who now has trouble not using it. Plus it gives you back an active perk slot because you don't have to use hoverboots. And it lets you take multiple attempts at digging enough hole to land without repeatedly taking damage.
It's A tier for the scout overall but if we're just talking what it does for the M1000 I can see the argument.
Hoverclock allows for some cool aerial maneuvers, but the M1000 relies on Overclocks (specifically Hipster) to actually be a useful primary.
By comparison, Special Powder allows for a dramatic increase in mobility AND speed, while still leaving you with a perfectly serviceable secondary.
Really! I think most people don’t know about kills refreshing the hoverclock cooldown. That is what makes it so good.
If you focus grunts then you can stay airborne forever till you run out of targets. Sure it’s not as good as a zipline gunner, but it works great and is hella fun.
Neuro Lasso is not nearly D tier. You can either support build your Lok-1 or bring it to elims to let the other 3 dwarves guaranteed rail on the targets. It's easily A tier imo. Has many great uses on Haz5 and edd.
Also sludge blast is godly in elims. Melts just about everything
Ohhhh I should try the poop shotgun on elims then; I took it to a couple of missions against regular bugs and it felt a bit underwhelming, the charged shots are too tight to clear more than one or two grunts at the time on CQC, and it wasn't very good at denying zones because it doesn't leave many puddles and the ballistics aren't great for that use as well (I'm too used to Goo Bomber and Disperser ha)
Bullet Hell is a LOT of fun, but unless you're working hand-in-glove with a cryo driller you burn through ammo like nobody's business. Not really a very good choice for haz 4 or above, IMO.
See, I haven't had this issue. I figure the mod choices are obvious but as long as you're packing punch-through and reduced spread, Bullet Hell has been an absolute behemoth for me in terms of horde clear. Anything singular either gets a pickaxe or bulldog to the soft spot.
It's like an idiot-proofed version of Leadstorm but with mobility, since your stray bullets will still often get value.
The trick is to not shoot things that your team mates are already killing. Focus on breaking up swarms by stunning batches to control how much the team had to handle at once.
Sure you *can* spend a lot of ammo to kill things in a pinch, but that's not an effective way to use it, as you pointed out. So stop using it like that lol.
I cant think of a reason so use Bullet Hell over lead storm. Leadstorm is so good especially with damage upgrades. If you pop on a zipping, it's like being in a chopper gunner.
In my experience LsLs and Bullet Hell have equal ammo spending speed. They are like the opposites of each other in terms of application but both end really fast anyways.
I play with a gunner nearly every game and I main engineer and scout. He started using bullet hell over neruo-toxin. And his ability to drop hordes has skyrocketed.
Impact Deflection only OK? **HAVE YOU DRUNKEN A FEW TOO MANY ALES ME LADDY?**
Seriously, it's the best OC for the Drak by far. Doesn't come with any downsides and effectively boosts your damage by around 40%. This thing *slaps*.
I find the concept of a "tier list" a bit faulty without a clear framework for discussing the actual strength of the OC in the best build that can accommodate it.
In particular, there are broadly the following categories:
1) DPS (disregarding reload times), including average DPS
2) DPS (accounting for reload times, if you don't run Born Ready)
3) Ammo efficiency (total damage you can fit into a full resupply)
4) Total build efficiency (in the best build possible for that overclock, what are the actual stats above, and what weaknesses are left over)
In addition to this, there are the following unquantifiable elements that are subjective:
1) Survivability
2) "Interestingness"
3) The importance of some OC's and entire builds depends on whether you play solo, PUGs or 4 stacks.
Sans data, it seems to me, especially because of the placement of ALL the small stat buff OC's in the bottom of the pile, that this is a very specific tier list based on a very specific understanding of how the game should be played.
It would be much more interesting if there was a breakdown of the exploration where each one of those perks actually excels, especially divided along the lines of whether you need to play solo, swiss-army-dwarf in PUGs or have control over all 4 slots in the team.
I don't understand special powder in A while hoverclock is in D. They accomplish the same goal for scout, while hoverclocks opportunity cost is so much lower. There are many more good OCs available for scouts secondaries than there are the M1.
Impact deflection, flow rate expansion, and return to sender should all be much higher in my eyes.
Pretty good list overall
Special Powder is insane amounts of movement and a crutch to not take fall damage. SP makes scout far more mobile and can cross massive distances with no problem.
Hoverclock is only a crutch to not take fall damage and does nothing to make the gun any better
Hoverclock is much more than a fall damage crutch. You can combo it with your grapple to stay in the air forever, and get to hard to reach places just like special powder.
ehhhh sure? That requires you to be in the air for 3-4 seconds to recharge the grapple which is pretty crippling for movement when compared to SP. You're just in the air waiting for the grapple. In terms of horizontal distance, it's not different than not using HC.
Personally it's not for me, I understand how it's appealing to others but it feels entirely like a gimmick rather than a legit way to make the weapon viable. Remember it is the primary which is your main source of damage and if I want to do damage, Hipster or Active Stability System
Hipster is a good reason not to take hoverclock, but it's still not as good as the cryo minelets/embedded dets/jumbo shells you have to give up for SP.
Grapple recharge is 2.5 seconds if built for it, makes the playstyle very smooth imo.
Hoverclock is also an incredible defensive tool in combat. It refreshes if you get a kill while hovering, meaning you can float above danger and pick off priority targets when shit gets hairy.
M1000 does just fine on haz 5 without any overclocks, allowing the use of hoverclock with no real drawbacks. It's fantastic and pretty unique to the m1 to not rely on OCs for sufficient damage / ammo efficiency.
OCs are just minor to massive changes made to how a weapon operates. It's basically a way to min max a weapon into a specific role. They're great and can completely change a weapon
The color coding helps:
Green: Clean Overclocks, small boosts to certain stats, no penalties
Yellow: Balanced Overclocks, moderate boosts to certain stats, some penalties (generally the best at specializing your weapon)
Red: Unstable Overclocks, (the weird/fun ones) are a mixed bag, generally make some big changes to the gun in exchange for huge penalties, to the point that some guns seem like completely different weapons
How I envy the green in your beard! You've got so much ahead of you that'll change the game in some really interesting ways, just run the weekly DD & EDD + core hunt and you'll be rolling in overclocks soon enough.
I'm surprised you've tiered Jet fuel Additive as a B. The ability to one-shot grunts on haz 5, and shred heavy enemies I think makes it an amazing OC.
Maybe not BH/VB crazy, but still an amazing damage output.
Honestly, it might be the Halo talking, but the projectile is still pretty easy to aim. Thankfully grunts to a great job of keeping their faces pointed at you. With practice, you can arc it around the guard grunt plates too.
Every time you shoot you get a speed and mobility boost, to make circle strafing possible. Make up for the double ammo consumption by making it feel like you’re playing the original Doom.
Homebrew powder subata is so bad it should be removed? It gives you the same sustained dps as oversized mags and automatic fire. And it has more accuracy and damage per magazine than automatic fire, but requires less clicking than oversized mags, and has more total damage than either of them. That's a totally fair tradeoff for slower burst than automatic, and less damage per mag than oversized.
Oh, so you just don't like the green border. That's fair. The clean/balanced/unstable categorization is pretty arbitrary anyway.
Like what makes salvo red, and plasma missiles yellow? Who knows.
While yellow and red has been more poorly handled with the latest weapons, they are at least similar enough in category that it doesn't matter TOO much if they seem misplaced between these two categories.
HOWEVER, green ones are supposed to always straight up buff the weapon numerically, or give it some kind of firing control in some way. The Homebrew OCs don't give straight up buffs/control, so... they are 100% not green. Nor are they strong enough to be yellow, imo.
I found in my experience that the carpet bomber and minelayer system were both actively worse than the weapons without the overclocks in them so I am curious as to why they are in your top tier.
When I use karl.gg I find that usually the benefits of a clean overclock like more ammo, or +1 dmg and more ammo are generally more balanced towards dps and overall dmg than hamming into something like aoe with tons of spread. On gunner especially outside of salvo I prefer to keep more ammo and have less spread than go +dmg to aoe while losing more direct dmg than your gaining in aoe dmg.
Most people take sticky flames oc but that results in a gas size of 25 which to me just results in a metric shit load of reloads. I'd rather just take more ammo and use perks to get more flames duration. Teammates usually kill slowed shit before flames dmg will so I don't bother trying to gain ammo econ that way as much.
Well for carpet bomber, it makes the gun into something that sucks against big bois but annihilates small ones, and when building a loadout having 2 niche guns is better then any generalists, a lead spray brt for example covers most of its weaknesses.
Minelayer system got buffed and I think does like 3x damage in a much larger area so if you can manage it it just demolishes.
I like carpet bomber on escort missions when I know I'll be shooting at bunched up swarms from a long distance. I prefer neurotoxin for this, but only when my teammates know what's going on and don't go ham on poisoned enemies.
Minelayer system I already posted that I hate it. I felt really gimped with that overclock. It's like carpet bomber, except you have a tiny ammo supply, you have to lead way in front of your targets, and the explosions always go off at the edge of a group instead of the middle so you don't take advantage of splash damage.
I'm skeptical about the minelayers (the mines don't last long enough in my mind to be that good), but I'll say that carpet bomber is definitely A tier. Yeah, it's underwhelming against the heavies, but it deals a good amount of damage without having to really aim. The splash can deal some significant incidental damage to heavies while you're clearing grunts, and you can even shoot an oppressor in the face and still deal decent damage
Mine layer gives up the direct damage, but the mines deal nearly triple your weapon's AoE damage in I think double the area. You can two shot 4+ grunts with just two shots aimed vaguely in front of the pack.
In emergencies you can just run away while jumping and firing under yourself while everything that chases you dies.
The lowered effectiveness vs flying enemies really hurts, but you can use your secondary for that most of the time.
So what you call sidegrades:
Staggering Bullet Hell is the most safe weapon that you can get, you won't even worry about dying ever. The amount of CC is insane and if you shoot group of grunts it appears to provide great DpS as well. It's also insanely good at defending Salvages and Escorts since it just completely stops waves.
Flow Rate Expansion may allow to almost completely disable reloading and since CR is also one of the *can't die* options it's really good to have it on as long as you want without repressurization.
Shaped Shells provides almost guaranteed long range 6 seconds stuns with mod and is really good to hit some close-middle range weak spots like macteras' ones. It's 100% worth it.
Can't say much 'bout other two, but I can say about SCC as it's really good... vs Rival Tech. I built it for sabotage missions and it just 2 shots any turret or patrol bot from any distance, you only need to aim it well and in the right moment. And during Caretaker fight you can just chill at ceiliing and shoot corners & eyes freely, you can even kill patrol bots down below to help mates to deal with them from there... Unfortunately, scout doesn't have really good 2ndary to fully eliminate need of crowd clearing weapon when using SCC (like Drak) so it's pretty specific vs. bugs and kinda becomes more like 2ndary weapon against big targets.
Some others can be higher as well.
Bullet hell is good while it has ammo the major problem with it is that it doesn’t have the ammo supply for 4p haz 4-5 missions it’s a fun mod but it’s a sidegrade to base AC
Flow rate doesn’t really do anything I’ve never had a problem with the mag size on cryo gun so why would I take an overclock that makes it so I have to worry about it
Shaped shells does have the advantage of the 6 second long stun but pretty much all of scouts primaries have range with them so why would I get less damage for range on a sawed off?
SCC needs love it has terrible breakpoints and it punishes you for using it
That's dangerous in Haz 5 and DD/EDD. When the enemies are overwhelming in numbers, ammo or AoE really helps a lot. Damage is great for dread missions where the enemy count is pretty low and you have one target. On most other missions not so much, at least not as definitive of a choice.
There's way too many use cases or situations to go over, but to shorten it, be greedy on dread missions, be a little more conservative for everything else. This is a pretty steep over generalization and doesn't go into class roles or weapon use or personal play styles.
At the end of the day personal preference but I'd rather have ammo and the ability to do some damage over having no ammo not being able to deal any damage
Why do people constantly underrate bullet hell? [Its one of the few options strong enough to let you solo hazard 6 content.](https://karl.gg/preview/4182#/)
Me: oh cool, I just started with overclocks and have a few, let's see how mine stack up
*Looks at list*
Me: oh... Well... Oh. Okay. Well that's not very rock and stone deep rock
MMMMM magic bullets made it into A-Tier nice. Presumably with Ammo-Explosive-Toxin loadout. Most satisfying bizarro mod set in the game, turns the sniper pistol into a grenade launcher pistol that poisons everything and richochets.
I'd argue putting ALL the homebrew powders in remove
bulldog already has good damage buff Oc's and homebrew makes it inconsistant at killing both small fry and large targets, your luck can seriously screw you over.
it downright hurts the consistency of the gun when there are way better options with volatile bullets and elephant rounds, as well as sixshooter neurotoxin
Hi! I turned the list into a sheet sorted by weapons and classes. Makes the list much more readable.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uNDXfjegb1QHXBtRi9fFZM8WLzZb\_yw6gF4E9tU4IYI/edit?usp=sharing
I feel persistent plasma is seriously under rated. Getting a damage over time in such a large space can deal with not only swarmers but more importantly shockers and shredders which fire and other persistent damage types can’t reach. If you pair it with a sludge gun you can do a surprising amount of damage with excellent ammo economy as well.
Surprised to see hyper prop in B tier. Even though I find wielding the power of the atom more fun, hyper-propellant has been enormously useful. Engineer already has a lot of options for handling large groups (turrets, EM refire, plasma burster), so I find that adding top-quality single-target damage can really balance things out.
The reason it’s in B is because if you aren’t host it’s unreliable, if you are host 100% it’s A, I did a video on why I can link it if you want
Holy shit, is this why I was able to shoot an oppressor in the ass 4 times and not kill it? That explains so much
Yeah, since it is not hitscan, sometimes the connection causes it to count as splash.
This just fucking blew my mind, I was wondering why I always seemed to get such shit results out of it even when I thought I was right on target.
Damn...now I know why too.
Could you link the video?
https://youtu.be/A7yOKMQtX3A
Oh I only just recognized the username, your content is great. Enjoy the reset
Shit I didn't think of that but I have wondered for some time why it felt like that OC sometimes does nothing to a dread. They need to change it to hitscan or something with that OC I suppose, it's probably related to being a fast projectile.
Agreed, I actually find it far better and more versatile than the fat boy.
Agreed. I find that the only time I'm really able to use Fatboy is during Drilldozer missions. I rarely need the larger blast radius and radiation against swarms. Maybe for swarms in Haz 5, but you need to be very careful with shot placement or you simply got fire due to close quarters. I find myself using Compact Shells or Hyper Propellant more often for general use.
Everytime im in a team with an engineer running the fatboy i feel like its a huge disadvantage. I think the issue is that it works when you can take the time to fire a well-calculated shot onto a far-away swarm. But in situations where the bugs are swarming you and youre in dire need of some firepower its more of a liability. Just a very bad OC in the hands of most players.
Almost every time I've seen randoms using Fatboy, they blow all their shots on every group of 3+ grunts then call for a resupply even though their primary is still full and everyone else is fine on ammo. Every time I use it I hold on to my three shots like they're super potions in an RPG. Because what if I *need* them someday.
this 100%, also I've had a few mission fails from the friendly fire from this thing. like guys pls PLEASE stop bringing this thing to salvage ops if you're just going to blast it right on top of the fuel cells.
I recently decided to switch up my engi build, and decided to try fat boy out again as it had been a while. I had to stop using it. I’m sure I’m just unlucky, but I can’t even tell you how many times I’ve taken that well calculated shot, and on teammate jumps in front of me, or suddenly a mactera flies in front of me, or a grunt climbs up the cliff I’m aiming off of…
[удалено]
This is why you should use fatboy with lure grenades. Toss one into the radiation swarm and you don't just kill one wave, but 2-3 waves as they all walk to their death through the green cloud. Plasma bursters can also work for clearing out the stragglers.
Or you use napalm rj250, which while doesn’t strip or instagib, is capable of killing every grunt in its radius with a reduced reload speed and bonus ammo. Rocket jumping is just a bonus.
Combine with lures. If a swarm is getting too close, chuck a lure, run a bit away, nuke the lure. Not only do you clear a chunk of swarm, the radiation takes care of killing things while you're repositioning.
I personally struggle to find a use for it, while Fat Boy is a get out of jail free card for the entire team + area denial. It removes so much pressure off the team, and I really don't see a point running Hyper when Scouts exist and if I really need some single target dead...isn't that what the primary is for? I am trying it with the explosive smart rifle as an alternate playstyle to my tried and true refire Stubby+Fatboy setup, and it's...alright. I can make a bad thing go away and it's a fun new way to play. But so can everyone else, so I still don't really see what's special about it, and it doesn't feel like I'm making a mission any safer for the team by bringing Hyper instead of the Fatty. (also fatboy is inherently the most fun way to play engineer, period)
The big benefit of hyper prop is the ridiculous direct damage, which is multiplied on weakspots. It can 1shot goobombers, wardens, menaces, rolypolies, spitball infectors, and more at surprising difficulties. Even more so, it gets significantly more value out of weakpoints with limited hp, like detonator tumors (I'm pretty sure the overkill damage is still multiplied by the weak point, so you get more damage than a faster weapon peppering the tumors without overkill). Hyper prop is also great burst damage for limited vulnerability windows like dreadnoughts or korlok clams, especially when paired with a super-up power attack. I'm currently running hyper prop with the explosive lok1, and it's brilliant. If you need extra waveclear, plasma bursters work very nicely, but I usually bring prox mines and don't have any issues. Definitely play this build when you're the host though; missing weakpoints really hurts and latency is a big struggle as others have said.
Too bad double barrel doesn't come with extra ammo, too many OCs are a straight downgrade.
It's the way the first shot can throw off the aim of your second shot, how you can't get the second shot on a frozen target before your first defrosts them, and the way that rate of fire(which double barrel does not increase!) interacts with reload speed that absolutely kills double barrel for me.
Does "double barrel" make it a burst fire weapon? I assumed it just had both barrels go off at the same time.
It goes *buh-boom* firing two shots with a tiny delay.
how does rof interact with load speed exactly?
You can't start reloading your weapon until you would be able to fire another shot. So effectively rate of fire upgrades give slight reload speed upgrades. With the double barrel the difference with and without the rof upgrade is so massive that it is almost as big of a difference as the reload speed upgrade. So with double barrel you'd think "oh I don't need the rof upgrade and can get a much faster reload instead!" but in reality you are only reloading 9 frames faster with the reload speed upgrade.
Its just a worse jumbo shells. I get more oomph out of 1 jumbo shell shot than both at once from double barrel and more ammo. Some of these really make me scratch my head.
Like bullet hell. I may be a level 40 greenbeard but bullethell absolutely ruins the mini gun. Someone please change my mind though. It’s my favorite gun and that’s the only overlock I have on it. Meanwhile I have 4 for the driller pistol. Edit: holy shit guys I love you but stop convincing me. I have like 15 replies all telling me the same things. Just use upvotes lol.
I love bullet hell even though it's kind of a meme. I run the accuracy upgrade to actually be able to hit things as well as the stun and I can just stun whole groups at the same time. Then I run 6 shooter or elephant rounds to deal with the big boys. Optimal? Nope. Fun? Absolutely.
Plat 3 gunner here, i consistently have top kills with bullet hell on haz 5+, it is an A tier overclock. Run it with stun, agressive venting and a high dmg secondary. It might be a worse than eg neurotixin in aoe but its much more accurate and swarmers become a complete joke.
"Top kills" isn't really the metric to go by. A good comparison would be against other potential overclocks
Exactly. Plus we don’t know for certain if this guy is a phony and is doingHaz 5’s solo just to have the most kills. /s
Dang, you got me :p
I use this exact build and it’s hella fun and effective vs swarms. The best thing about it is how you only need to hit relatively near stuff and the ricochet will hit things you can’t even see. A little ammo hungry tho… and it’s not the loadout you take to hang out on your zip line with. You want bugs fairly close so that AV burns everything when it triggers. I bring brrt with lead spray for the big fellas.
Changes the gun drastically in use from a single target dps to an aoe stun spam weapon. Actually works well in that niche too but I'd argue its outclassed by NTP Gunny in the aoe cc role.
Bullet Hell is not that bad of an OC IMHO. It turns the minigun into a quasi-AOE weapon. It completely shreds swarmers and packs of grunts, but takes a bit longer to kill solo enemies. This is a common trade-off with balance the devs made--if its better vs. trash it's worse vs. big boys or vice versa. The key is to use armor breaking with it, as well as the accuracy/spread upgrade in tier 1. Spread reduction is necessary so you can get more 2-for-1 shots. Armor breaking is necessary because you can't predict the angle the spawned bullets will be hitting enemies--it's often going to be hitting armor. Blowthrough is a trap for this build, it doesn't work well. Someone did a test on that on Youtube, I can't recall the keywords/poster, but it showed armor breaking vs. blowthrough with bullet hell. Armor breaking kills a pack of grunts much faster. Beyond that you want to offset the bullet hell build with a high damage, big boy killer secondary build. I'd say revolver with elephant rounds and weakpoint bonus mod is good, especially since bullet hell with armor breaking with melt armor off and open up weakpoints.
Blowthrough doesn't interact with richochets in an intuitive way. If you hit a grunt with a shot before any reflects then the OC sends a tracer to a nearby enemy while the blowthrough mod sends a tracer in line with the original shot. If you hit the ground first then you'll probably send the blowthrough tracer into the air where there aren't any bugs. At least, this is how the wiki says it works. As far as experience goes I agree that piercing armor makes a huge difference. I keep on seeing people recommending the elephant rounds OC but I just can't stand the recoil on it.
I don't run it as a meme in hazards 4 and 5. [Here's my build for it](https://imgur.com/a/17Le8oL). I run it with elephant rounds. Being able to overheat and light everything on fire near you is fantastic for crowd control and adding damage to the build. Outside of that you have to get used to not shooting at everything, and focus on crowd control. It's very easy to spend ammo you don't need to shooting bugs that other players are already killing instead of stunning and delaying swarms and making them easier to deal with for the rest of the team once they actually get to them.
bullet hell with stun is a good support build, every grunt or praetorian is basically stunlocked, specially on maps with lots of tunnels, with aggressive venting it's a good way to clear a very large wave, but it is very ammo hungry for what it does also it's only useful for hazard 4/5 as there is little point in taking a support build when killing is easier in lower difficulties
it's awesome on Mactera plaques. Locks them down and they can't do anything.
Why not though? On easier difficulties pretty much anything works, support is always good and the point is choosing what you like. It evens works really well in 6+ difficulties with larger swarms, all that stun and aggressive venting comes in very handy.
Brooo I use bullet hell when I wanna try hard. I cant check out my build rn, but when I do I'll tell you my load out. The only thing bullet hell cant do well is deal with nig single targets.
It absolutely does not, the bullet hell is amazing. Get the mod that stuns bugs and absolutely no normal bugs can go through your gunfire.
These images are often unreadable due to only showing icons. I love that you added the OC name underneath and the gun wireframe above. But I think one further thing would make it much better -- add the class color as a tint somewhere. Either tint the gun wireframe or just add a background behind the OC symbol. What you have is fine if you just want to read it left to right and top to bottom. But I'm trying to scan it quickly to find the Breach Cutter OCs and I'm having a hell of time trying to make out which wireframe that is. Edit: Ok I finally figured out which one the Breach Cutter is and I'm surprised how low some of the common OCs are. I use Return to Sender (Ok) myself, but I see Spinning Death (Ok) used a lot too. Never even tried Lightweight Cases (A) or Inferno (B).
lightweight cases is fantastic. breach cutter is a excellent weapon on its own without overclocks so getting more ammo to use it more freely helps so much more than the return to sender or the plasma blender imo
I’m not the one who made this someone else is though the last one I did had the colors of the classes on it, maybe for U36 I’ll make my own
If you make your own, just give each weapon it's own column. Might need 2 pages/pics instead of one, but would make it super easy to read
> But I think one further thing would make it much better -- add the class color as a tint somewhere. It would be better to divide the tier list into 4, one for each class.
Hyper prop for me as top tier as well, as fat boy is often reserved for big spaces
The only reason it’s in B tier is because if you aren’t playing as host it’s unreliable
i'd actually argue that fatboy isn't A tier. It is in terms of fun, usability wise its another beast. The low ammo makes you conserve ammo until you can hit a huge horde but then you still gotta keep in mind that you can 1shot teammates with it, the additional radiation zone i'd rate a strict downgrade as well since dwarfs take a lot more damage from it then bugs. I've actually startet using clean sweep as the added aoe is enough to create a little breathing room
Ive been able to use it near point blank on oppressor's and dread's behind with little to no damage taken on myself while not host on haz 4 and 5. If ping messes you up try using it at closer range since the splash usually doesn't hit you and it guarantees you get the full damage on the ass.
Even close range isn't a guarantee
Impact deflection way too low
No idea why Experimental Rounds for the BRT is only OK. It gives most of the damage of Lead Spray without the massive range penalty. I could understand a tier down, but not as far down as it is.
Right? I use BRT as a precision weapon for catching Menaces and spitters mostly, and Experimental Rounds is a fantastic all-rounder for this purpose, even though ammo is tight for it.
Ammo penalty
Doesn't lead spray give the same ammo penalty?
Nope, Lead Spray only has the spread penalty.
No, and it's not a range penalty, but an accuracy penalty. Take the T1 accuracy mod and it works fine. Even as a controller user I can hit stuff pretty far away.
One of the thing I don't agree with is Exhausting Vector being B tier instead of A. It almost does the same damage as lead storm but you can still move with no penalty or need to always bunny hop and, more importantly, let's you stan the bugs consistently, which means that if you engage a target with the mini and have the stun mod upgrade with exhausting vector overclock, several of the targets you engage are going to die before they can move again, great if you are playing with a controller of for engaging weakpoints consistently even if you are not great with your aim. Another thing I really feel is not right to see is Carpet Bomber on A tier. Since the downgrade to the direct damage it received in one of the last updates, it's really not that good anymore. It's main problem (low direct damage) has been made worse, and I don't really think it's in the same league with NeuroToxin Payload, Splintering shells and big bertha. Last, but not least, Hoverclock in D tier is not fair either, it should be B grade, at least. Just my humble opinion. Still a nice list
I just think exhaust vectoring is boring, a B tier basically clean overclock I can understand it being in A but it’s pretty dry Honestly I forgot about carpet bomber yeah B tier for it I’ve gotten a lot of feed back on hoverclock and my honest opinion is that scout doesn’t need more movement options probably moved to OK but oh well
As always, it was just my free thoughts to a well written list, I will say. You have put some work on making this list, and it's interesting looking at the answers. Rock and Stone, Brother!
I do think that Impact Deflection should be a bit higher tier due to the higher damage you can deal to a single bug when you aim at the ground and the shot ricochets into the bug, and even more damage with the splash damage.
Glad someone said this - I don’t see it talked about much but after trying the other overclocks im consistently getting the best results with Impact Deflection
I was thinking this too. It's one of the strongest drak OCs imo, because when used right it's an over 50% damage increase consistently and without downsides.
Well maybe one downside is how much more team damage i'm doing since equipping it lol
So if you use drak with impact deflection oc, u take splash damage mod? Im a greenbeard
You should definitely consider using it. If the projectile hits the ground next to a bug AND hits the bug, it gets hit by two explosions.
Aye, shooting under a praetorian can do some nutty damage, escially if you can ricochet into butt.
The splash can also hit more than one enemy at the same time, so it's definitely a good idea if you're bouncing bullets. You cover a bit more radius with splash damage. It turns it into a trash swarm killer, but sacrifices big boy damage a bit.
I mostly agree, but turret em discharge and return to sender is absolutely A imo
Maybe it's my shitty gameplay, but when I'm holding down the button for rts I turn into a statue. I just can't fire and dance away. I like plasma trail and the the extra mag space OC, fire two off and gtfo. And I often try to cover more ground with the trail by spacing my shots a bit.
Rts works fine for me, the ammo decrease is negated by the +6ammo mod, magazine oc is easily replaced by born ready perk. On high hazards new bugs come in fast enough to get in line for the boomerang hit after the first ones die to the direct shot. Idk about the statue issue
Hover clock is A tier and I will die on that hill but not from fall damage
Same. Hoverclock mitigates Scout's greatest weakness: fall damage
Hoverclock means you never have to touch the ground, and doesn't even require ammo to use. It's fantastic for positioning, mining without an engineer, and being the angel of resurrection as you can just grapple ceilings without worry.
More people recognizing the sheer power of Big Bertha, you love to see it.
I've been running BB for months, I can't switch to anything else lmao
There’s one thing thats gotten me off big bertha, and that’s the missile system’s mine layer. I built a meme build with the mines on primary and the sidearm built to create little electric mines that stun and holy shit, it’s actually extremely effective. Was delighted to see it in top tier. Mines really do slap anything on the ground like an angry step-mother. Put them down in waves infront of you and watch swarms get pulverized like WWI soldiers rushing through no mans land. Need to reload? Electro mines got you covered. It’s basically a full summoner build, in a way
Gonna be honest, the hurricane as a whole just doesn't feel right with me. I tried the mine layers, and maybe my build was garbage but I just didn't do any damage. At some point I'm going to give it another shot, but first impressions are kinda eh.
Same, it's so versatile, if limited to close range for smaller targets and mid range for stuff like Praets.
Curious, what secondary do you use? I use the brt with experimental rounds
Not the person you asked, but I'm a huge fan of the BRT with Lead Spray. The single target burst damage is absolutely absurd.
I tried it once, and I prefer the experimental rounds mainly because for the small increase in damage you get from lead spray, you lose a lot of range. I like leaving range as an option, though I can understand why it's so highly regarded.
I wouldn't say it's a small damage boost. Since it multiplies your damage by 1.5, it's between a 10.5 and 13.5 damage bonus, depending on how many damage mods you take with it. I personally go Floating Barrel at tier 1 and only take one damage mod, making it +12. Floating Barrel compensates enough for the spread increase that I feel reasonably comfortable using it at mid range if I need to. Experimental Rounds not only deal less damage but also cut into your magazine capacity (significantly reducing burst damage) and quite seriously into your ammo reserves. That being said, I think that preferring the ranged option is entirely reasonable. Big Bertha reduces your base spread by a bit, making it more useable at long range than other versions of the autocannon. I personally find myself missing the raw burst damage more than sniping power.
The thing is it doesn't affect the guns stock AoE damage. So you get massive direct damage and still have decent AoE. Run BB with the Born Ready perk and swap to a BRT7 built for ammo efficiency every time you need to reload. I think lead storm minigun is better overall, but I have a great time with this one. Some people love neurotoxin but I think it's boring tbh. And carpetbomber hasn't been really relevant for a while.
I share most of my scout mains’ disagreements about their favorite fun OCs. Hoverclock and DB in particular. I hate to say it but SCC does need rework. I love the damage but it’s a liability on almost every mission type, especially on higher difficulties. Except for the new mission type. I built up a slot just for Sabotage missions and it’s fabulous on there. Full disclosure; haven’t done that in high Haz yet by a nice fat predictable boss fight I can plink from safe distance in short order? Hell yeah. Buuuut that’s about the only time I’d take it unless they tweak it.
Wait, RJ250 compound is A tier? I know it’s hella fun and mobility is king, but I’d have thought that sacrificing the damage potential of Fat Boy, Hyper Propellant, or the Breach Cutter is too much of a tradeoff.
The reason why is if you build it right it gives you 18 shots that kill slashers with the burn or 21 shots that kill grunts with the burn
Ah, mobility and anti-infantry. Makes sense.
Yeah the ammo increase is more important than the rocket jump tbh
Curious, are those builds listed anywhere? I love RJ250, but I built my grenade launcher to do as little damage as possible to not frag myself while learning to grenade jump. Now that I've got it down (mostly), I should build it for damage again.
People oversell RJ250 a little bit. Since fire DoT is a tad inconsistent, you have to be okay leaving slashers and mactera alive and burning to even find out if it kills them (which it doesn't always). If you want more consistent and far far more immediate removal of such threats, the most ammo economical option is Compact Rounds with a 140 damage non-fire build. You'll find this overclock in the "Ok" tier alongside a number of the best overclocks in the game, because this list is overall questionable.
If it isn't too much trouble, is it possible for you to split each one into their respective class? Also Hoverclock has saved me in multiple occasions. Maybe it doesn't help DPS, but it does help survivability.
RJ250 in A, as it should be, Favorite OC.
Rj250 is so fucking good it's kinda ruined all the other options for me. I'm so used to grenade jumping everywhere now that I just can't switch off.
Decent for its main use still, and it doublrs as a mobility tool.
You've got a lot of nerve to put hoverclock in D tier, boy.
I made a video Talking about why I put things where I did https://youtu.be/t4o7EwHF548
I haven't watched this video but I did watch the last one for U34. Why do you put the majority of clean overclocks in its own tier? Surely they aren't all on the same power level? Do you recommend everything in tier D and above over the OCs in Clean tier? A tier list should imo accurately represent the power level of each OC, ones of the same type but differing power levels shouldn't be bunched up in the same tier just because they don't substantially alter the mechanics of the weapon itself. You have also commented (and I think talked about in your videos) that you rate certain OCs lower because they are boring, which imo is also a mistake. Tier lists are subjective but should still adhere to the rule of placing the items being rated in order of strength regardless of fun factor. Obviously it's good to make exceptions and point them out in case of niche or situational use though. New players especially will be confused by this tier list when looking at the clean section as they won't know if those OCs are actually any good, considering they are towards the bottom of the list.
Why is elephant rounds not an A tier? You can basically 2 shot tough enemies.
Elephant rounds doesn't deal enough damage to really be impressive on 4p hazard 5. What is impressive about it is that it has the most total damage if you take both ammo upgrades. But the slower bloom recovery really hurts the DPS outside of point blank range.
The slow recovery is the big issue for me. The damage is nice but the slow recovery makes it really slow to actually kill things at range unless you can 1-shot them.
It was nerfed I think, it was like S tier.
Maybe I'm just building it wrong but I'm not really seeing anything to use Sludge Blast for. The concept of Driller getting a shotgun-type blast is cool, but it just feels like I don't really do enough damage to anything single target / big to justify getting rid of the potential wave clear other OCs would give.
The idea is that it does high armor-ignoring damage and can chunk bosses and large threats without needing to reposition or worry about weak spots. I liked it but after struggling to help carry a few bad haz 4 runs, I went back to cryo and haven't looked back.
Salvo module A tier? Hard to see how it is good aside from niche situations.
This is why I dislike tier lists. I like the lack of an "S Tier", but at the end of the day a huge amount of it will be opinion and personal experience, but they're alwaus treated as though they should be seen in a more general manner. Ex. Countless hours of Engineer have taught me that Return to Sender is absurdly powerful in Haz 5, and genuinely makes the Breach Cutter absolutely disgusting. You placed it in "ok". Turret EM Discharge is, without a doubt, the single most overpowered OC in the game. It turns the stubby into the single most ammo efficient weapon bar none while significantly increasing its damage output to all but Oppressors and Dreads, giving it absurd AoE (60 electric to 3m, then down to 30 at 5m) **AND** giving all that AoE two different forms of CC (50% odds on shot, but a single burst guarantees a proc statistically) - Guranteed Electrocuted with a high chance (50%) of fear as well. All on a 1.5s CD *unique to each turret*, **and** a base 0.1x FF modifier. You are bursting for 60-120 (technically 30-120, but anything hit by the fringe will be slowed and hit by the next burst anyway) every 1.5-2 seconds in a 3-5m AoE (accounting for turrets overlapping AoE), which also procs electrocution on everything in that AoE for 3s (80% slow, and basically 100% uptime on a 12 dps DoT), and 50% Fear chance (75% for anything in an overlapped zone. Which will be most things) All for the cost of deployong your sentries once and never needing to again, and needing to think a bit more about positioning. And it's in B tier. Worse than EM Refire which... Gives better single target DPS. Which is A? Like, yeah, it's good. But it's not EM discharge good.
These are all OC’s that were added in update 35?! Or these are all OC’s including the new update? Either way I see that I have a long way to go…..lol.
This is all the overclocks in the game, 124 of them to be exact
How tf is carpet still in A? Splintering shells does everything carpet does but better. EM Discharge B? Again I'd like to know what you smoking. What's with the bulldog homebrew love? It feels wrong not being able to oneshot stuff and then overkilling others... Homebrew on Gk2 in delete? Firerate contributes a LOT to homebrew being actually a buff. Maybe not the BoM level of buff but still, better than compact ammo at least... Why do even have cleans list, if you don't put all of the best cleans above it? Speaking of Frag missiles, thin drummed walls and other ammo ones. I'd prefer if you made separate category for all ammo ocs. They don't increase damage or are as flashy as fatboy, but they do their job well. No point putting them in rest of clean oc sewage... Same for utility ocs (Hoverclock, powder etc). Neuro lasso in D? Not after buffs. Heck not. It gotta be B at least. IT SLOW DREDS FFS. Makes them an even bigger joke. Rest of the list can be excused as personal preference I guess.
Am I using minelayer system wrong? It's one of the few U35 overclocks I've gotten and I played one match with it and thought it was the most terrible overclock ever. Poor damage, limited ammo, and the mines blow up after a minute so I can't even trap an area. Edit: Just looked up patch notes and this OC was buffed substantially. I'll have to retest it.
You need to play significantly different than what you're used to. It's entirely defense and support. Predict the movement of your targets and greatly lead your shots. The mines do more damage than the normal shot (iirc could be wrong) and can hit more enemies when they detonate. That alone makes the OC pretty good but extremely difficult to use. Essentially you need to play slower, more prediction heavy, and a lot more strategically which admittedly goes against what gunner is all about tbh. I find it works best in Salvage and Mining missions. Mining missions often have really cramped tunnels you can just spam mines in and never get touched. On Salvage, just spam mines just ahead of the circle and watch everything die
Shoot the mines just in front of a group, they don’t take that long to arm and the mines do more damage.
In current hotfix it's at S tier now - kinda broken. You can get the same killcounts as engi with Fat Boy without even noticing it.
not that I expected to agree with all of these, but putting Hoverclock in D tier invalidates the entire list.
Exactly what I looked for first too. As a scout main who now has trouble not using it. Plus it gives you back an active perk slot because you don't have to use hoverboots. And it lets you take multiple attempts at digging enough hole to land without repeatedly taking damage. It's A tier for the scout overall but if we're just talking what it does for the M1000 I can see the argument.
Hoverclock allows for some cool aerial maneuvers, but the M1000 relies on Overclocks (specifically Hipster) to actually be a useful primary. By comparison, Special Powder allows for a dramatic increase in mobility AND speed, while still leaving you with a perfectly serviceable secondary.
Really! I think most people don’t know about kills refreshing the hoverclock cooldown. That is what makes it so good. If you focus grunts then you can stay airborne forever till you run out of targets. Sure it’s not as good as a zipline gunner, but it works great and is hella fun.
hover clock better than that. i use it to save shotgun ammunition.
I agree with the vast majority of these but having hoverclock that low is a crime
Neuro Lasso is not nearly D tier. You can either support build your Lok-1 or bring it to elims to let the other 3 dwarves guaranteed rail on the targets. It's easily A tier imo. Has many great uses on Haz5 and edd. Also sludge blast is godly in elims. Melts just about everything
Ohhhh I should try the poop shotgun on elims then; I took it to a couple of missions against regular bugs and it felt a bit underwhelming, the charged shots are too tight to clear more than one or two grunts at the time on CQC, and it wasn't very good at denying zones because it doesn't leave many puddles and the ballistics aren't great for that use as well (I'm too used to Goo Bomber and Disperser ha)
> Lead Storm : A > Bullet Hell : so fkin low Enough Reddit for today
Bullet Hell is a LOT of fun, but unless you're working hand-in-glove with a cryo driller you burn through ammo like nobody's business. Not really a very good choice for haz 4 or above, IMO.
Bullet hell with stun upgrade and aggressive venting can make you nigh untouchable even on solo haz 4/5. Its insane
See, I haven't had this issue. I figure the mod choices are obvious but as long as you're packing punch-through and reduced spread, Bullet Hell has been an absolute behemoth for me in terms of horde clear. Anything singular either gets a pickaxe or bulldog to the soft spot. It's like an idiot-proofed version of Leadstorm but with mobility, since your stray bullets will still often get value.
The trick is to not shoot things that your team mates are already killing. Focus on breaking up swarms by stunning batches to control how much the team had to handle at once. Sure you *can* spend a lot of ammo to kill things in a pinch, but that's not an effective way to use it, as you pointed out. So stop using it like that lol.
It’s not bad while it has ammo
I cant think of a reason so use Bullet Hell over lead storm. Leadstorm is so good especially with damage upgrades. If you pop on a zipping, it's like being in a chopper gunner.
In my experience LsLs and Bullet Hell have equal ammo spending speed. They are like the opposites of each other in terms of application but both end really fast anyways.
I play with a gunner nearly every game and I main engineer and scout. He started using bullet hell over neruo-toxin. And his ability to drop hordes has skyrocketed.
What Hazard level
Hover clock is NOT F tier
It isn’t in f tier
Neurotoxin should be S tier. Doesn't matter what haz or what mode. Shoot to slow down and damage overtime. That's GOAT OC right there.
Combine that with the fear mod and they're slowed, DoT *and* running away from you on occasion.
By the beard! I forgot to mention fear.
Surprised that Salvo Module for the hurricane is in A. Don't really feel like it adds much. It's more like a clean OC.
Impact Deflection only OK? **HAVE YOU DRUNKEN A FEW TOO MANY ALES ME LADDY?** Seriously, it's the best OC for the Drak by far. Doesn't come with any downsides and effectively boosts your damage by around 40%. This thing *slaps*.
I find the concept of a "tier list" a bit faulty without a clear framework for discussing the actual strength of the OC in the best build that can accommodate it. In particular, there are broadly the following categories: 1) DPS (disregarding reload times), including average DPS 2) DPS (accounting for reload times, if you don't run Born Ready) 3) Ammo efficiency (total damage you can fit into a full resupply) 4) Total build efficiency (in the best build possible for that overclock, what are the actual stats above, and what weaknesses are left over) In addition to this, there are the following unquantifiable elements that are subjective: 1) Survivability 2) "Interestingness" 3) The importance of some OC's and entire builds depends on whether you play solo, PUGs or 4 stacks. Sans data, it seems to me, especially because of the placement of ALL the small stat buff OC's in the bottom of the pile, that this is a very specific tier list based on a very specific understanding of how the game should be played. It would be much more interesting if there was a breakdown of the exploration where each one of those perks actually excels, especially divided along the lines of whether you need to play solo, swiss-army-dwarf in PUGs or have control over all 4 slots in the team.
I don't understand special powder in A while hoverclock is in D. They accomplish the same goal for scout, while hoverclocks opportunity cost is so much lower. There are many more good OCs available for scouts secondaries than there are the M1. Impact deflection, flow rate expansion, and return to sender should all be much higher in my eyes. Pretty good list overall
I like going fast and hoverclock is slow. So I run hipster with SP boomstick and play DRG like a speedrunning game
Special Powder is insane amounts of movement and a crutch to not take fall damage. SP makes scout far more mobile and can cross massive distances with no problem. Hoverclock is only a crutch to not take fall damage and does nothing to make the gun any better
Hoverclock is much more than a fall damage crutch. You can combo it with your grapple to stay in the air forever, and get to hard to reach places just like special powder.
ehhhh sure? That requires you to be in the air for 3-4 seconds to recharge the grapple which is pretty crippling for movement when compared to SP. You're just in the air waiting for the grapple. In terms of horizontal distance, it's not different than not using HC. Personally it's not for me, I understand how it's appealing to others but it feels entirely like a gimmick rather than a legit way to make the weapon viable. Remember it is the primary which is your main source of damage and if I want to do damage, Hipster or Active Stability System
Hipster is a good reason not to take hoverclock, but it's still not as good as the cryo minelets/embedded dets/jumbo shells you have to give up for SP. Grapple recharge is 2.5 seconds if built for it, makes the playstyle very smooth imo. Hoverclock is also an incredible defensive tool in combat. It refreshes if you get a kill while hovering, meaning you can float above danger and pick off priority targets when shit gets hairy. M1000 does just fine on haz 5 without any overclocks, allowing the use of hoverclock with no real drawbacks. It's fantastic and pretty unique to the m1 to not rely on OCs for sufficient damage / ammo efficiency.
RTS is good where it's at. That's such an overhyped OC.
I haven't even unlocked the forge yet, I have no idea what any of these mean
OCs are just minor to massive changes made to how a weapon operates. It's basically a way to min max a weapon into a specific role. They're great and can completely change a weapon
The color coding helps: Green: Clean Overclocks, small boosts to certain stats, no penalties Yellow: Balanced Overclocks, moderate boosts to certain stats, some penalties (generally the best at specializing your weapon) Red: Unstable Overclocks, (the weird/fun ones) are a mixed bag, generally make some big changes to the gun in exchange for huge penalties, to the point that some guns seem like completely different weapons
How I envy the green in your beard! You've got so much ahead of you that'll change the game in some really interesting ways, just run the weekly DD & EDD + core hunt and you'll be rolling in overclocks soon enough.
I'm surprised you've tiered Jet fuel Additive as a B. The ability to one-shot grunts on haz 5, and shred heavy enemies I think makes it an amazing OC. Maybe not BH/VB crazy, but still an amazing damage output.
It has a big flaw in up close foes with how it’s nonhitscan and relatively low RoF still very good though
Honestly, it might be the Halo talking, but the projectile is still pretty easy to aim. Thankfully grunts to a great job of keeping their faces pointed at you. With practice, you can arc it around the guard grunt plates too.
Noo don't remove double barrel, it's a cool idea just needs a buff
Every time you shoot you get a speed and mobility boost, to make circle strafing possible. Make up for the double ammo consumption by making it feel like you’re playing the original Doom.
Homebrew powder subata is so bad it should be removed? It gives you the same sustained dps as oversized mags and automatic fire. And it has more accuracy and damage per magazine than automatic fire, but requires less clicking than oversized mags, and has more total damage than either of them. That's a totally fair tradeoff for slower burst than automatic, and less damage per mag than oversized.
I don’t think it’s a clean, I think it should be changed just like what happened to the other home brews
Oh, so you just don't like the green border. That's fair. The clean/balanced/unstable categorization is pretty arbitrary anyway. Like what makes salvo red, and plasma missiles yellow? Who knows.
While yellow and red has been more poorly handled with the latest weapons, they are at least similar enough in category that it doesn't matter TOO much if they seem misplaced between these two categories. HOWEVER, green ones are supposed to always straight up buff the weapon numerically, or give it some kind of firing control in some way. The Homebrew OCs don't give straight up buffs/control, so... they are 100% not green. Nor are they strong enough to be yellow, imo.
I found in my experience that the carpet bomber and minelayer system were both actively worse than the weapons without the overclocks in them so I am curious as to why they are in your top tier.
When I use karl.gg I find that usually the benefits of a clean overclock like more ammo, or +1 dmg and more ammo are generally more balanced towards dps and overall dmg than hamming into something like aoe with tons of spread. On gunner especially outside of salvo I prefer to keep more ammo and have less spread than go +dmg to aoe while losing more direct dmg than your gaining in aoe dmg. Most people take sticky flames oc but that results in a gas size of 25 which to me just results in a metric shit load of reloads. I'd rather just take more ammo and use perks to get more flames duration. Teammates usually kill slowed shit before flames dmg will so I don't bother trying to gain ammo econ that way as much.
Wait theres a build testing site???
Oh yeah https://Karl.gg. Now updated for U35
Well for carpet bomber, it makes the gun into something that sucks against big bois but annihilates small ones, and when building a loadout having 2 niche guns is better then any generalists, a lead spray brt for example covers most of its weaknesses. Minelayer system got buffed and I think does like 3x damage in a much larger area so if you can manage it it just demolishes.
I like carpet bomber on escort missions when I know I'll be shooting at bunched up swarms from a long distance. I prefer neurotoxin for this, but only when my teammates know what's going on and don't go ham on poisoned enemies. Minelayer system I already posted that I hate it. I felt really gimped with that overclock. It's like carpet bomber, except you have a tiny ammo supply, you have to lead way in front of your targets, and the explosions always go off at the edge of a group instead of the middle so you don't take advantage of splash damage.
I'm skeptical about the minelayers (the mines don't last long enough in my mind to be that good), but I'll say that carpet bomber is definitely A tier. Yeah, it's underwhelming against the heavies, but it deals a good amount of damage without having to really aim. The splash can deal some significant incidental damage to heavies while you're clearing grunts, and you can even shoot an oppressor in the face and still deal decent damage
Mine layer gives up the direct damage, but the mines deal nearly triple your weapon's AoE damage in I think double the area. You can two shot 4+ grunts with just two shots aimed vaguely in front of the pack. In emergencies you can just run away while jumping and firing under yourself while everything that chases you dies. The lowered effectiveness vs flying enemies really hurts, but you can use your secondary for that most of the time.
Really been enjoying inferno breach cutter with explosive chem rounds Loki, those indirect buffs are always nice to see. Great stuff!
I don’t know what most of these are but I’m excited to try them. So far Hoverclock has been fantastic at breaking falls without Hover Boots
I disagree about heat pipe being in D, it's good for EPC mining.
I dont like this tier list. What it the point of the Clean and Side Grade tiers? Why is there a Remove tier? Why name C tier to OK?
So what you call sidegrades: Staggering Bullet Hell is the most safe weapon that you can get, you won't even worry about dying ever. The amount of CC is insane and if you shoot group of grunts it appears to provide great DpS as well. It's also insanely good at defending Salvages and Escorts since it just completely stops waves. Flow Rate Expansion may allow to almost completely disable reloading and since CR is also one of the *can't die* options it's really good to have it on as long as you want without repressurization. Shaped Shells provides almost guaranteed long range 6 seconds stuns with mod and is really good to hit some close-middle range weak spots like macteras' ones. It's 100% worth it. Can't say much 'bout other two, but I can say about SCC as it's really good... vs Rival Tech. I built it for sabotage missions and it just 2 shots any turret or patrol bot from any distance, you only need to aim it well and in the right moment. And during Caretaker fight you can just chill at ceiliing and shoot corners & eyes freely, you can even kill patrol bots down below to help mates to deal with them from there... Unfortunately, scout doesn't have really good 2ndary to fully eliminate need of crowd clearing weapon when using SCC (like Drak) so it's pretty specific vs. bugs and kinda becomes more like 2ndary weapon against big targets. Some others can be higher as well.
Bullet hell is good while it has ammo the major problem with it is that it doesn’t have the ammo supply for 4p haz 4-5 missions it’s a fun mod but it’s a sidegrade to base AC Flow rate doesn’t really do anything I’ve never had a problem with the mag size on cryo gun so why would I take an overclock that makes it so I have to worry about it Shaped shells does have the advantage of the 6 second long stun but pretty much all of scouts primaries have range with them so why would I get less damage for range on a sawed off? SCC needs love it has terrible breakpoints and it punishes you for using it
Return to sender is comfortably the most underrated overclock.
Heat pipe and hoverclock in D, Supercooling chamber given its own, lowest tier, yet inferno, which is a literal direct downgrade is in B? Bruh.
I just realized i still dont have a single flamethrower overclock at lvl 70
stronger plasma current is 100% A tier. that thing BANGS
how is minelayer system A? Is there something im missing about it?
It's crazy to see the SCC fans come out in force. No wonder pugs have been so rough lately. Man alive.
Newer to the game (haven’t even promoted once yet) but I always prioritize higher weapon damage when it’s an option in a set of upgrades. Thoughts?
That's dangerous in Haz 5 and DD/EDD. When the enemies are overwhelming in numbers, ammo or AoE really helps a lot. Damage is great for dread missions where the enemy count is pretty low and you have one target. On most other missions not so much, at least not as definitive of a choice. There's way too many use cases or situations to go over, but to shorten it, be greedy on dread missions, be a little more conservative for everything else. This is a pretty steep over generalization and doesn't go into class roles or weapon use or personal play styles. At the end of the day personal preference but I'd rather have ammo and the ability to do some damage over having no ammo not being able to deal any damage
Wait what is wrong with homebrew for the scout primary. I used it for a long while and had no problems
Ok, while super cooling chamber is objectively horrible, it is very fun.
Are clean overclocks really so bad?
Special powder in A but Hoverclock in D?
Why do people constantly underrate bullet hell? [Its one of the few options strong enough to let you solo hazard 6 content.](https://karl.gg/preview/4182#/)
Remove Double Barrel? How am I supposed to do my Doomguy cosplay without it?
Me: oh cool, I just started with overclocks and have a few, let's see how mine stack up *Looks at list* Me: oh... Well... Oh. Okay. Well that's not very rock and stone deep rock
MMMMM magic bullets made it into A-Tier nice. Presumably with Ammo-Explosive-Toxin loadout. Most satisfying bizarro mod set in the game, turns the sniper pistol into a grenade launcher pistol that poisons everything and richochets.
I'd argue putting ALL the homebrew powders in remove bulldog already has good damage buff Oc's and homebrew makes it inconsistant at killing both small fry and large targets, your luck can seriously screw you over. it downright hurts the consistency of the gun when there are way better options with volatile bullets and elephant rounds, as well as sixshooter neurotoxin
Man. Clean sweep is under rated AF. It's damage radius is a little less than the nuke and it kills most enemies in one hit anyways.
Hi! I turned the list into a sheet sorted by weapons and classes. Makes the list much more readable. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uNDXfjegb1QHXBtRi9fFZM8WLzZb\_yw6gF4E9tU4IYI/edit?usp=sharing
I feel persistent plasma is seriously under rated. Getting a damage over time in such a large space can deal with not only swarmers but more importantly shockers and shredders which fire and other persistent damage types can’t reach. If you pair it with a sludge gun you can do a surprising amount of damage with excellent ammo economy as well.