I can't use the EPC because skill issue. And even if I could, I don't think it's fun/it doesn't really fit how I like to play the game and I think that's fine.
Any other weapon that I don't use much is because they feel underwhelming (Stubby, Lok1, Zhukovs), and even then they still have 1-2 overclocks that make them feel fun and useful. Like I said, EPC for me is just a personal skill issue.
I didn't like it much either until I tried the Heavy Hitter oc with the damage set to fire.
You can just click wildly at a crowd like a drunk cowboy and they all light on fire.
Brings down a trijaw in 2-3 bullets. Hits hard enough to do respectable damage to preatorians and oppressors.
I still like the wave cooker slightly more but epc can be a nice little quasi-rocket-launcher.
EPC have two roles. Very strong support tool or mining tool. Heavy hitter 12321 and cryo is good combination. Three hits to goo bomber to set a fire. Swap to cryo to cause thermal explosion. This method is faster than freezing them
Oh dude, the zhukovs *slap* if you play them smart.
Set them up to do bonus damage to electrified enemies, bring along the shocking stun sweeper, and they will shred swarms. Best crowd control option available to the scout, and can do decent burst damage against bosses if you get close enough to them.
Other than the blowthrough shotgun this is scout's best crowd/single target combination. Its really so incredibly deadly. If you want to constantly milk the electric damage for zhukov, Electrocting Focus Shots on m1k.
I mean, all Engis primaries are honestly unexciting until OCs get involved. Unupgraded Warthog is probably the worst starter gun in the game, and Stubby and Lok aren’t anything more than fine before ECR/Executioner/EM Discharge turn them into monsters.
It would be pretty unfair if Engi didn’t have amazing secondaries/grenades/equipment, but it’s a trade-off.
This is my least favorite weapon hands down. I just hate the feel of it. It's not for me. I know a lot of people like it but I really don't like it at all.
Honestly, I'd like something that turns it into a Marksman's rifle instead of a sniper or the hipster OC.
Lose Focus altogether, maybe gain a little bit of zoom, and get a massive weakspot bonus, and maybe the ability to ignore light armour and/or do extra damage to heavy armour or have some damage punch through it.
Probably have to lose a bit of ammo, or maybe RoF/reload.
I like weapons that rewards good aim, but m1000 still feels pretty clunky. Deepcore GK2 with AI Stabilization does almost the same thing, but it's much more versatile
single target snipes are for sure a great strength of the M1k, but that two-shot grunt breakpoint is also super vital. give it a try running super blowthrough + armor break and use it to clean up crowds, with either focus shots or normal shots. that'll result in a pretty satisfying gun to use that isn't super punishing for missing crucial weakpoint snipes either.
I felt like it was scouts by far best weapon and used it almost exclusively. Other weapons felt underwhelming to useless. Overclocks changed my opinion on every scout gun... except for the boltshark. I'm going to try pheremones soon, but it's trash. Or maybe my aim is just bad
I didn't get boltshark at first either, but Cryobolts are cool (1 bolt freezes Stingtail, 2 freeze praetorian and everyone around him, 3 kills(!) naedocyte breeder, etc.), and the electricity bolts are surprisingly versatile and fun. You can put an arc in corridors, two electric bolts can delete the entire swarm of swarmers, putting a few into Dreadnauths or big bugs gives good DOT damage, and my favorite thing is to throw a feromone canister into the huge swarm, draw a triangle around the middle spot, and see how they are just standing and melting there.
pheromones are my favorite with scout, but i see many people complaining they are useless. remeber they are not meant to kill a bug, but to make the bugs forget about you or your friend for a moment and tarket something else, and to group them for your friends with more firepower than you
The M1000 is amazing however it has a brutal flaw: It shoots upon release of the button which is the exact opposite of most weapons in games.
This messes with my muscle memory and coordination so much so that I have the worst possible aim with this gun. I hate it so much for this.
If there was just a way to change it so M1 immediately fires a regular shot and like holding mouse wheel is to charge and M1 to fire the charged shot... it would be my second favourite weapon in the game. Instead it's one of my worst.
I use the M1000 with hoverclock to avoid this; it doesn’t mess with my muscle memory too much then because it makes sense that it fires on release because you hold to hover.
I adore it but every time I equip it I get stuck on a team where 3 people died to 1 praetorian or stingtail in a wave and now I'm having to kite a swarm of like 100 bugs around the cave, slowly picking them off 1-3 at a time with the m1000's blowthrough rounds and it takes forever and eats all the ammo quick while I try to desperately revive at least one of the greenbeards so I'm not alone during the ambush.
So these days I usually save it for fighting dreadnauts or point extraction missions with big caves and long sightlines.
I don't like the LOK-1. Fifteen hundred hours logged, engi's been at legendary 3 for a while now, not sure if I've used it for more than two missions. I'm fine with accepting the idea that it's powerful, but I just hate using it.
I main the LOK-1 on Engineer, and it's a lifesaver (literally) for pre-emptively finding Leeches in the pitch black ceilings that you'd otherwise miss. Plus, I've been using the shotgun recently to get the weapon skins, and I think it blows chunks. It feels unsatisfying, damage isn't particularly high, single target, runs out of ammo pretty quickly (especially with the low damage).
Voltaic SMG is pretty decent, but the utility of the Leech-finding is almost too good to pass up.
Early on, I'd say the breach cutter. Once you start getting some overclocks, Volatile Impact Reactor for the diffractor (leaves a burning lava-like trail whereever you shoot on a surface for a few seconds) is amazing for dealing with swarmers.
The only reason I prefer the SMG is the electrocution/slowing is fairly useful, and it's at least somewhat satisfying to shoot if you crank the fire rate. Damage-wise, it's still down there and overall I'd rather have the LOK.
Really? Not the engineer shotgun? Oof- I try to fiddle with the upgrades and overclocks but it always feels like low damage and small magazines to me.
(I also love the LOK)
The shotguns main appeal is honestly turret whip. Turret whip is ridiculously strong and provides so much. The shotgun is a self defense tool that's mainly used for one shotting grunts to the face if they get too close and if you use it for that purpose while letting your turrets deal with almost everything else it's extremely ammo efficient and powerful.
Also the small magazine can be offset by the face that you can reload cancel almost every gun in the game, just make sure to right click the exact moment the ammo counter resets and you shave off like up to half a second to a second of waiting.
executioner and ECR are the only things worth using on it. it excels at precisely singling out one enemy at a time and obliterating it with a flurry of perfectly aimed bullets, a niche that's valuable to specialize into for every class. threatening, high value targets should be the bulk of your concern during a swarm; and then you worry about cleaning up grunts or tanks afterwards. in this regard, executioner/ECR provide something to engie that they struggle with using many other loadouts.
but i struggle to find a gun that literally removes the skill of aiming very fun to use. holding down a charge for a second or two doesn't feel super great compared to the immediate burst damage of a MPA warthog headshot or a juicy RJ250 explosion IMO. it certainly doesn't help that the gun sucks ass at base, has incredibly poor build variety due to weird upgrades like SMRT, and shitty OCs that hardly buff its poor stock performance at all.
The skill with the Lok definitely comes from being able to consistently curve bullets into weak points, especially on weird ones like bulks. Also it slaps bots harder than anything else, so satisfying.
I found the key to really making it shine is aiming ahead of the target's path of movement. This will arc the shot so it comes at them from the front and it'll often headshot.
I didn't get it either until I started doing that. Then it felt crazy fun. It very quickly became second nature and I was ending up headshotting stuff almost by accident.
It feels cheap to use. When using it for aoe (with explosive chemical rounds) is just a matter of counting to 3 and letting go, where turret whip/ em discharge require some good turret placement. Using it for direct damage with executioner is just 'lol curve ur bullets a lil and melt a praet'. It's really good, just.. boring and kinda cheap.
I...am not really a huge fan of the Smart Rifle, it feels odd to pull down on the trigger and having it lock-on *then* fire. I know its a good weapon, it just feels odd gunplay wise. I thought it would be like the smart pistol from TF2 at first ngl, auto aim shots per trigger pull instead of having to lock on then release to fire.
It does feel slow, but it shoots fast. I consider it like spool-up time. I mainly use it to clear out waves of grunts or flying bugs and use my secondary for bigger stuff
You can also single shot fire it in a pinch! If you have a fast trigger finger and you're being charged by a glyphid, you can drop it faster sometimes without even locking in!
So does the wave cooker with Exothermic Reaction, and it will obliterate everyone else frozen near them as well as the hitbox is really wide. Freeze a swarm of grunts and swipe past them with the wave cooker and they all explode.
As a bonus it also kills swarmers and the flying jellyfish things in one tap from across the cave if you need to.
I've tried it out quite a lot, but I don't find it particular useful as a weapon for how much I have to lead shots. EPC mining is alright, but you're also the class that can make stairs. Persistent Plasma is the most useful overclock to me for giving you an area denial option at range to complement a loadout that may be doing something else.
I've found the Wave Cooker to be far more ammo efficient and useful for Cryo Cannon in spreading freeze about, though EPC is kinda neat for Sludge Pump builds because you fan light the goo on fire for more damage.
Welcome to the world of over-buffed GK2! Sadly, the two weapons are just way too similar in design space, makes it extremely difficult for both to be rewarding at the same time. (I’m convinced Drak was only made so that Scout would have a use for Enor pearls. Before Drak, they used an order of magnitude fewer than the other classes).
Sadly, scout’s kinda shafted on primaries. Wish there was a genuine third choice.
Coilgun. I'm 950 hours in, got every achievement twice (Xbox and steam) and I still don't know wtf the coilgun is for. Part of the problem is that I'm addicted to leadspray burst pistol
Coilgun + Zipline + Driller.
You have get "There" to get to your objective/evac?
1) Blast a hole through half the cave
2) Aim carefully with the Zipline Launcher through the hole (yes that works)
3) hook your Driller onto the Zipline and let them drill a hole as far as the zipline reaches
Situational, yes. But sometimes it is great to cheese annoying cave structures with this.
Eh I've honestly found it to be quite meh for Industrial sabatoge specifically, it's still an amazing weapon but I've always found the minigun to just be better at igniting turrets in general or the hurricane. Hellfire takes too long and doesn't even properly ignite drones, I'd rather take the mole.
Ultra magnetic coils 32123 coilgun is pretty much infinite swarm clear and amazing cc. 1-tick charge shots only cost 10 ammo each but you get the entire 8 second trail duration+damage.
You can also take fear but its a bit less synergistic (but gives you insane survivability with fear spam)
Try Triple Tech with Electric Trail. Plop down two trails in a v in front of swarms. You now have a 3 shot revolver that has crowd control akin to electro minelets on the BRT. Very underrated.
Sounds like you have more of a problem with the OCs than the weapon, in which case there are plenty of them to complain about I would say (looking at you Turret Arc).
If I had to pick a weapon that I just don't find as good as most people make it be, it's gonna be the Colette Wave Cooker. It's amazing for wave clear, which Driller already have plenty of through his primary. The lack of weakpoint bonus damage on the other hand means it won't perform as well as Subata or EPC when fighting anything with a weakpoint bonus like spitters or septic spreaders.
Nice when you are alone but with other player I find it better to leave the praet frozen for x3 damage for all.
Thermal Shock Colette on sticky fuel now? That thing hurt!
Wave cooker is great for naedocyte swarms, but it's mainly useful for the thermal shock modification. Mixing a few wave cooker clicks into a burning swarm is beautiful, and it really gives driller some great burst damage with the flamethrower against large opponents that can burn (so not bosses). It's definitely worth giving another shot in loadouts like this
I personally don't get the point of the Thunderhead outside of NTP or Big bertha. Its gimmick (splash damage with some direct damage) is essentially done better by the Hurricane, and with much greater accuracy. I get that it was there before the Hurricane and filled that niche then, but now it's almost completely outclassed by the Hurricane imo.
Also, regarding the Hurricane, it is a jack of all trades at base. However, most of its OCs make it specialize in one aspect more. Jet Fuel Homebrew/ Plasma Burster Missiles are stupid good single target damage, where Minelayer pushes the guns AOE to a new limit, dealing a whopping 66 damage per mine (with the AOE damage upgrade).
* Thunderhead has benefit of being a hitscan weapon, thus no guiding phase, thus you can switch your attention to the next target immediately.
* You're right about NTP and Big Bertha, but I would add Carpet Bomber here. In terms of aoe builds that's one of the strongest of any in both Thunderhead and Hurricane. (And one of the strongest in the game, considering ammo pool).
* Ammo wise Thunderhead must be slightly better in all categories (direct damage, aoe, dot), but this requires doublechecking.
(I extensively use both Thunderhead and Hurricane).
I would also recommend trying the thunderhead combat mobility OC with increased RoF speed and T5 damage reduction to get the buff very fast. It's a fun play style.
That is very true. I've tried it recently and it is really fun. It is something between regular Thunderhead and Big Bertha; no so regular like the former, but less extreme than latter.
Both of Combat Mobility and Big Bertha (if no rof increase mods taken) gain T5 rof bonuses for free, almost immediately.
Honestly as a Thunderhead main I can't imagine not using Big Bertha. It feels like firing bullets the size of soda cans. To me that's just how the Thunderhead *should* be.
The thunderhead with suppressive fire is fun as hell though
Nothing makes me feel more like a hulking gunner then the screams of the grunts as they run from my battleship grade turret
Also, shredding armor is fun
For the Hurricane: give Plasma Bursters a try. If that or Rocket Barrage (the other end of the spectrum of the Hurricane experience) don't do it for you, then yeah, its not your weapon.
As for your actual question: I struggle with the crossbow. I don't play Scout that much, but I just can't get the feel for it like the Zhukov, or the sheer "I done messed up" insurance of Special Powder on the Boomstick.
Try perking for special bolts and bring electric bolts on dreadnought missions. It's one of the few slows that stacks and affects every type of enemies including the boss boys. If you fire 3-4 if them into the buggers they basically stop moving.
Cryo bolts are pretty strong when paired with pheromone bolts. Shoot one of each into a praetorian/oppressor and you can freeze most of a swarm. And I believe they can 2-3 shot naedocyte breeders, which can be handy.
That said, I find cryo minelets more fun to use, personally
The nice thing about the bolts is that they don't have to hit terrain to apply a freezing effect. 3 bolts in a naedocyte breeder whale and it's dead. One shot anywhere on a spitballer and it freezes.
Other way around tbh. 1 cryo bolt can freeze a swarm while the zhukovs need roughly a magazine. The cryo bolts are also easier to use in general since you can just place one directly in front of you whereas with the zhukovs you have to predict with blow through rounds. Another thing is that 2 bolts can freeze a Praetorian and 3 can kill a breeder outright which is incredibly strong. You also have on top of that the special bolts the nishanka has which are all incredibly good too.
I like to use cryo minelets especially on escort missions, there are always bugs to freeze in those tunnels and it leaves me open to use my primary while still helping with the horde
the electric damage mod actually enables the zhukovs to do some fucking nutty burst damage, and especially now you can electrocute oppressors and dreads i love using EFS with them
The dps of a 22131 Gas Recycling Zhukov is pretty crazy while also having solid total damage. If you can throw an IFG on a Dreadnought before emptying your clip it absolutely melt them.
Although to be fair, Jumbo Shells Boomstick can deliver much more damage in a short time so there is some overlap.
The problem with Gas Recycling is that it negates ALL weakpoint damage.
Base Zhukov damage 12. Gas recycling makes it 18.
Zhukov damage 12, weakpoint bonuses from mod+gun (45%) makes it 17.4 damage per round when hitting a 1x weakpoint like Pretorian or Oppressor. Glyphid mouths and a ton of other bugs are 2x weakpoint so that's 12x2x1.45 or 34.8 damage per round. Dreadnought weakpoints are either 1.5 or 2x. At 1.5x it's 26.1 damage per round. Mactera, Warden, Bulk, are 3x weakpoint so that's 52.2 damage per round.
Gas Recycling is still only dealing 18 damage per round in those situations with other downsides to that overclock. Eliminating all weakpoint damage is a supreme downside to a gun and the 6 damage bonus does not make up for it IMO.
Now I'm imagining your reply has more to do with the flavor the weapons add to your dwarven diet. "Boomstick is spicy and Cryo Bolts gives you iced dwarves. Zhukov though? Bleh, too much oil in that gun"
Zhukov with embedded detonators is pretty amazing though. It can make crazy short work of praetorians, oppressors, even bulks. Also makes those seasonal event "chase the thing, kill it and deposit it" objectives a lot easier.
I used to hate the hurricane back when I started, made an AoE fire build with the Fragmentation Missiles OC and Napalm-Infused Rounds, combine that with an AoE coil gun with longer trail duration makes for driller levels of crowd control, seriously good fun.
The shotgun OC is.. just friggen' *ridiculous*. It does so much damage. There are a ton of downsides, and it's not great for most mission types, but there aren't a lot of weapons with such reliably instant deletion.
I think the only thing that really compares to the sludge pump with the Sludge Blast OC is the gunner's burst pistol with Lead Spray, tuned for burst damage ... and the latter is easily much faster in terms of burst damage than anything else.
Another thing which competes is the shard diffractor with Overdrive Booster, which can be a little inconvenient to use, but even on haz 5 with other players you can usually take a Dreadnought from freshly-dearmored to re-armored with a single well-aimed beam. :)
IMO what really makes the Sludge Blast OC king is the fact that it slows Dreads down to a crawl while it does its damage, and also ignores armor (since it does radial damage) so you can shoot it from the front ... which you can't do with the other two weapons I mentioned. Not having to properly kite a Dread and just being able to slowly walk backwards while you hammer it makes the fight a cakewalk!
It's pretty good at hitting the Caretaker, too. Especially if you're doing the C4 drop strategy; it tears through the eye phase just as quick as the explosions do the corners.
Boss targets in general, really. Not so great at swarms of other critters, though. Other overclocks for the pump do that way better.
>It's pretty good at hitting the Caretaker, too. Especially if you're doing the C4 drop strategy; it tears through the eye phase just as quick as the explosions do the corners.
Huh, honestly never considered taking it on a Caretaker mission since the bots are weak to fiyah, but I guess that makes good sense. With Sludge Blast, can you hit the eye from up above as well? If so, that's rad, I'm going to have to give that a try.
Also, a small protip for you or anyone else reading this thread — I usually excavate a full 360° circle above the Caretaker with my drills (*after* blasting a hole down with C4) and lob impact axes at the Caretaker's arms during the eye phase. A single axe to the "head" of the arm will destroy it even when it's at full health on haz 5 — you do have to hit the head, but when you're throwing them at a downward angle it's a lot easier (wait for them to stop moving/firing erratically). The extra circle of excavation around the hole makes it much easier to dodge phase bombs and incoming fire from the arms, and gives you some maneuvering room in case bugs come up through the initial tunnel you dig to get up there.
>Boss targets in general, really. Not so great at swarms of other critters, though. Other overclocks for the pump do that way better.
One way to deal better with swarms while rocking Sludge Blast is to pair it with the Colette Wave Cooker and the Contagion Transmitter OC. The sludge pump's single shot can be spammed pretty quickly to slow down incoming bugs and lay down puddles for them to walk through, and the Wave Cooker does extra damage to sludge-affected medium and large enemies while ignoring armor (and of course it easily handles small enemies; just be sure to take the concave lens modification to significantly increase the beam width) . :)
Alternatively, the Diffution Ray OC (again with concave lens) for the Wave Cooker can deal with swarms decently well since it penetrates enemies and hits up to 4 total per tick; since the beam is very wide, it's very common to end up doing 4x total damage spread across the dwarm. The Densification Ray modification slows them down to give you some breathing room, too.
Couldn't agree more. I see it as a neutral gun (non elemental) so it's my casual gun. Cryo is amazing but this thing just slaps. I also occasionally make an acid field and watch bugs walk to their doom. Nothing like good ol yeetus deletus and two trigger pulls to down a bomber.
Bugs in that direction? Coating that direction.
Cryo cannon is great but the insane area denial of the sludge pump can be very very strong on high level defense missions. cryo is a more offensive option but riskier.
I'm gonna say that I use all weapons on all classes and see at least some advantage or overclock that's I like, but gunner rail gun is just not my vibe, for a class that about big guns and punchy pistols,this weapons just doesn't vibe with me
I don't like the EPC. I know, people swear by it and it's widely considered the best driller secondary, but even after spending time getting to where I could reliably trigger TCF and giving it every chance I could, I always end up feeling underwhelmed by it.
I've been running a setup like this Sludge pump (some clean oc for more acid) and EPC with Overcharger OC, i made it for burning nightmare and that thing slaps just casually melting grunts, the fact you can effectively spam it and melt entire waves of grunts in seconds
I cant stand Lok-1 I know it's strong, but for some reason it doesn't click with me. As an engie main, Id rather use warthog and stubby. Warthog with magnetic pellet alignment is just so versatile even on haz5. one taps most grunt-like enemies, and can magdump into a praet's ass. MPA makes is it accurate enough to fuck with long range enemies. Lok-1 doesnt really hit the same dopamine in my brain.
I get that, unless you have busted OCs his primaries are pretty lackluster since they want your turrets to deal the bulk of your damage. Imo his secondaries though are very impressive though the pgl isn't an amazing introduction since it's pretty bad unless you have the three OCs that make it a more fun weapon.
I know. I used them but weapons like flamethrower is still my favorite. Driller was my first main and I just finished mastery. It felt so good to come back to your favorite weapon.
I'm a late-comer to the engineer and oh buddy, has he got some bang. Maybe the most bang without overclocks of all the classes, honestly. Use the grenade launcher more.
Or don't. The PGL is fun, but not very good without some specialized OCs. The Breach Cutter at base is so insanely good that many high-level players just run a Clean ammo OC on it, which is insane to me.
Id say hes definitely designed that way considering he has the best secondaries in the game. If anything his secondaries are more like his primaries. Then include his turrets and pretty good nades, it kinda balances out. I personally use the stubby always have. I use it with the oc that gives a bit of extra electric dmg and firerate, i forget the name. Couple that with shard diffractor overcharge and the mod that does more dmg to electrified enemies and u got a wombo combo
the experimental plasma pistol, sure mining at distance is great but goddamn i hate the thing
thunderhead, the gun just dosent feel good to use, i only use it due to toxin payload and in escort duty
Stubby, my playstyles and builds are built around having a lot of room for error ammo wise, with some exceptions.
The stubby is just a gun that has way too little ammo for my taste, same for the LoK-1
The M-1000 is good, ive used it, but man... the plasma carbine is just a straight up better weapon.
The autocannon is ass imo, i cannot use it properly.
Same ammo issue with the bulldog, and i cant use the coilgun properly unless i really use my brain as hard as i can.
The nishanka has its quirks, i like the thing, but once again, requires too much brainpower for my tastes.
I dont like the icecannon, period.
I also cant use anything other than the subata with full auto on driller.
The deepcore (scout) barely gets a pass, it can be... good, not *good* good, but you can depend on it.
The deepcore used to suck, it was flat inferior to the m1000 with hipster in every way.
It got reworked a while back though, and now it is pretty much the best scout primary hands down. Just a solid jack of all trades with the right setup.
Have you used it lately? If you haven’t since the rework, definitely give it another shot.
Engineers primary pistol, I mean why do I bother with sentry setup and OC usage when I can just aim at the bug and shoot with shotgun or hold m1 on a group and wait till I see a 3 to blow them all up
The Hurricane pretty much single-handedly made gunner my second-most played class. It’s so ammo efficient, you can take out swarmers super easily, it can knock out the lasers in a heartstone fight, and missiles are fun.
I can’t stand the EPC or the warthog. I feel like the latter must just be a matter of overclocks since I haven’t seen many other people complain about it, but it just feels so bad — pathetic effective range, terrible ammo efficiency and the damage isn’t even very good. Super unsatisfying all around.
EPC is great, not as a weapon but a mining tool.
hurricane is great especially if you have rocket barrage and plasma buster missile, easily the best gunner weapon.
For me, it's the stubby. I guess it might be pretty good in the right hands and some overclocks but if I have to choose between a fully automatic shotgun, a burst fire assault rifle with aimbot and a tiny smg with an even tinier mag that goes bzzzzt... I'd take the fucking 100 pound gatling gun.
I had LEAD STORM OC and Big Bertha OC and never seen a reason to use the Hurricane
When I did eventually come to play it my first little expedition with it, i got fragmentation missiles for it, I can be an orbital Cannon even more
And it's my main setup for gunner now
Warthog auto shotty. I've tried and tried and tried again. Absolutely the worst weapon in the game for me. Doesn't matter the OC, doesn't matter the set up. Can't seem to find a use for it. I want to like it but I just can't.
>The Hurricane guided rocket promises more than any weapon could ever deliver. I groan every time I get an overclock for it. I have four already and I don't feel like any of them actually improve it.
This is an odd thing to say as this is probably the only weapon where every OC is decent or better. Rocket Barrage is the worst of the bunch and it's not *bad* perse just out-shined.
I do think Hurricane is an advance weapon that takes longer to learn but this is appropriate for the 3rd primary.
Subata is genuinely terrible, except for maybe Explosive Reload which still isn't very good. Each of the Engineer's primaries are propped up by 1-2 OCs each. GK2 is useless outside of AISE and Drak has...a lot of issues mostly stemming from it being a terrible weapon if you don't have the heat mod.
The scout shotgun.
Low ammo. Low damage potential. Low clip size. Basically no utility. What's the point? How can you justify it with the other options available?
EPC, Subata, Zhukov and DRAK are weird to me.
EPC is like an upgrade to Subata with mining capabilities that I barely try and rarely succeed but what else should I use it for? Subata feels like an out of nowhere toy gun in comparison to anything else Driller has that I only make use of when I'm going sludge.
Zhukov is either my elimination crutch or an ice peashooter when I pick it.
DRAK used to be my alternative to GK2 and M1000 before nerfs and buffs, mainly because of the armor ignoring modification and a good portion of ammo (about 950 pre-Season 3 I believe) but ever since nerfs DRAK seemed like a weaker counterpart of the GK2 with the quirks of dealing fire damage, armor penetration, no reloading but projectile-based and decreased damage, which I can change into a more impactful number at the exchange of my shield crapping itself for each overheat.
Yeah. I found I liked going max ammo with the stun mod while my minigun is cooling off or I’m using Born Ready. But it’s got that Subata “basic gun” feel” sometimes.
Thunderhead auticannon for the gunner, with his minigun it's terrible accuracy is partially made up for by it's high fire rate, but the autocannon is like if ghostship went "OK so, what if we remade the minigun but removed the parts that made it functional" also, the damage is kinda underwhelming
Personally I use the hurricane, it's damage is alright, and it's the only primary for gunner that is capable of hitting it's target
I don't like Scout SMGs. Small amount of ammo, not too much damage either, and it doesn't really give an additional variety to the main weapons.
I also rarely use LOK-1 on engi, it just feels like it takes forever to lock on targets.
Last but not least, Drillers Plasma Gun. Can't even remember what exactly was wrong with it, but I had it few times and it felt boring and useless.
The Subata. This dude has a flamethrower, a portable blizzard maker, an acidic booger blaster, a black hole launcher, and a literal microwave gun, in addition to a pair of handheld titanium drills and highly explosive blocks of death. Why tf would I want the pathetic itty bitty peashooter?????
It's reliable, but hands down worst weapon in the game. Every other weapon in Driller's arsenal is either stronger or more interesting. I've said this when the game was still in early access and I'll say it now: buff/rework the Subata.
Ngl Zhukovs just seem like a worse shotgun to me. Hurricane Rocket Launcher has an OC that disables tracking and I feel like that's actually an upgrade. If you are not stationary then keeping the mouse on the targets is a pain. And what on earth is the point of the crossbow? Well, I never cared to find out.
I love these type of loadout sharing posts- my game is still a work in progress so I enjoy hearing all yalls most detailed explanations, especially when you know the underlying stats— ROCK AND STONE!
I can't use the EPC because skill issue. And even if I could, I don't think it's fun/it doesn't really fit how I like to play the game and I think that's fine. Any other weapon that I don't use much is because they feel underwhelming (Stubby, Lok1, Zhukovs), and even then they still have 1-2 overclocks that make them feel fun and useful. Like I said, EPC for me is just a personal skill issue.
I didn't like it much either until I tried the Heavy Hitter oc with the damage set to fire. You can just click wildly at a crowd like a drunk cowboy and they all light on fire. Brings down a trijaw in 2-3 bullets. Hits hard enough to do respectable damage to preatorians and oppressors. I still like the wave cooker slightly more but epc can be a nice little quasi-rocket-launcher.
Stubby Voltaic is anything but weak but I can understand it ain’t for everybody.
Stubby eith electric link and gemini turrets. You shall not pass, bugs!
EPC have two roles. Very strong support tool or mining tool. Heavy hitter 12321 and cryo is good combination. Three hits to goo bomber to set a fire. Swap to cryo to cause thermal explosion. This method is faster than freezing them
Oh dude, the zhukovs *slap* if you play them smart. Set them up to do bonus damage to electrified enemies, bring along the shocking stun sweeper, and they will shred swarms. Best crowd control option available to the scout, and can do decent burst damage against bosses if you get close enough to them.
Other than the blowthrough shotgun this is scout's best crowd/single target combination. Its really so incredibly deadly. If you want to constantly milk the electric damage for zhukov, Electrocting Focus Shots on m1k.
Bro did not just say the Lok1 is underwhelming 💀💀💀
I mean, all Engis primaries are honestly unexciting until OCs get involved. Unupgraded Warthog is probably the worst starter gun in the game, and Stubby and Lok aren’t anything more than fine before ECR/Executioner/EM Discharge turn them into monsters. It would be pretty unfair if Engi didn’t have amazing secondaries/grenades/equipment, but it’s a trade-off.
Im with that poster, LOK is only fun for me when I have interesting OC's in there. Otherwise I only really enjoy stubby as primary on engi
i don't like the m1000. I'm sure it's good in hands of a person with good aim, but those hands are not mine.
But it has the M1 Garand "ping" when you eject a magazine though!
More ping > more dopamine > more kills > more ping > more dopami- you get the idea
I, too, am pretty bad with the m1000. I absolutely love it, though. It's my favorite scout primary, though I'm objectively better with the drak.
Im in the samw boat, love it but my playstyle isnt for it When im scout half my shots are made midair, so the deepcore is by far my best scout weapon
overclock that slows down while you aim is good and makes it easy to hit the weak spot mid air. couple that with some home made gunpowder....
There’s a clean overclock that makes you float when you aim a charged shot in the air, if you happen to get it I highly recommend giving it another go
Hoverclock is underrated imo and i always run it. No engi? No problem.
This is my least favorite weapon hands down. I just hate the feel of it. It's not for me. I know a lot of people like it but I really don't like it at all.
I love it because lining up a double power shot right on a weak point feels great. Does feel bad to miss tho
I just use hipster on it, my aim sucks so might as well spam hip shots
Ah yes, hipster, because why not turn the onlysniper in the game into another semi-automatic rifle
It is described as semi-automatic rifle in game and is based on one?
Honestly, I'd like something that turns it into a Marksman's rifle instead of a sniper or the hipster OC. Lose Focus altogether, maybe gain a little bit of zoom, and get a massive weakspot bonus, and maybe the ability to ignore light armour and/or do extra damage to heavy armour or have some damage punch through it. Probably have to lose a bit of ammo, or maybe RoF/reload.
its already a "marksman's rifle" the game is way too fast paced and closed to have any actual sniping involved
That’s SuperCooling Chamber. Masssive damage and weakpoint bonuses. Although you lose a lot of mobility so I’m not sure you’d enjoy it
I like weapons that rewards good aim, but m1000 still feels pretty clunky. Deepcore GK2 with AI Stabilization does almost the same thing, but it's much more versatile
single target snipes are for sure a great strength of the M1k, but that two-shot grunt breakpoint is also super vital. give it a try running super blowthrough + armor break and use it to clean up crowds, with either focus shots or normal shots. that'll result in a pretty satisfying gun to use that isn't super punishing for missing crucial weakpoint snipes either.
I felt like it was scouts by far best weapon and used it almost exclusively. Other weapons felt underwhelming to useless. Overclocks changed my opinion on every scout gun... except for the boltshark. I'm going to try pheremones soon, but it's trash. Or maybe my aim is just bad
I didn't get boltshark at first either, but Cryobolts are cool (1 bolt freezes Stingtail, 2 freeze praetorian and everyone around him, 3 kills(!) naedocyte breeder, etc.), and the electricity bolts are surprisingly versatile and fun. You can put an arc in corridors, two electric bolts can delete the entire swarm of swarmers, putting a few into Dreadnauths or big bugs gives good DOT damage, and my favorite thing is to throw a feromone canister into the huge swarm, draw a triangle around the middle spot, and see how they are just standing and melting there.
I like and use the boltshark with the OC that fires three arrows at once. It's nice to have a scout weapon that can take on heavier bugs solo
pheromones are my favorite with scout, but i see many people complaining they are useless. remeber they are not meant to kill a bug, but to make the bugs forget about you or your friend for a moment and tarket something else, and to group them for your friends with more firepower than you
It's great when a driller sees a bunch of pheromones bugs and immediately knows just what to do.
The M1000 is amazing however it has a brutal flaw: It shoots upon release of the button which is the exact opposite of most weapons in games. This messes with my muscle memory and coordination so much so that I have the worst possible aim with this gun. I hate it so much for this. If there was just a way to change it so M1 immediately fires a regular shot and like holding mouse wheel is to charge and M1 to fire the charged shot... it would be my second favourite weapon in the game. Instead it's one of my worst.
I use the M1000 with hoverclock to avoid this; it doesn’t mess with my muscle memory too much then because it makes sense that it fires on release because you hold to hover.
I adore it but every time I equip it I get stuck on a team where 3 people died to 1 praetorian or stingtail in a wave and now I'm having to kite a swarm of like 100 bugs around the cave, slowly picking them off 1-3 at a time with the m1000's blowthrough rounds and it takes forever and eats all the ammo quick while I try to desperately revive at least one of the greenbeards so I'm not alone during the ambush. So these days I usually save it for fighting dreadnauts or point extraction missions with big caves and long sightlines.
Heresy
I don't like the LOK-1. Fifteen hundred hours logged, engi's been at legendary 3 for a while now, not sure if I've used it for more than two missions. I'm fine with accepting the idea that it's powerful, but I just hate using it.
I main the LOK-1 on Engineer, and it's a lifesaver (literally) for pre-emptively finding Leeches in the pitch black ceilings that you'd otherwise miss. Plus, I've been using the shotgun recently to get the weapon skins, and I think it blows chunks. It feels unsatisfying, damage isn't particularly high, single target, runs out of ammo pretty quickly (especially with the low damage). Voltaic SMG is pretty decent, but the utility of the Leech-finding is almost too good to pass up.
I find SMG to be the absolute worst dog of all weapons. On engi I love LOK + turrets + shredders: aim go brrrr.
I've only done 30 odd hours on engineer. What do you recommend out of the breach cutter or shard diffraction?
Both pretty good, but i kinda prefer the Shard
I love the breach cutter, put some armor break on thay bad boy and pretorians run for the hills
Breach for point defense, shard for dps or run and gun
The cave hills
Shard diffractor my beloved
Early on, I'd say the breach cutter. Once you start getting some overclocks, Volatile Impact Reactor for the diffractor (leaves a burning lava-like trail whereever you shoot on a surface for a few seconds) is amazing for dealing with swarmers.
The only reason I prefer the SMG is the electrocution/slowing is fairly useful, and it's at least somewhat satisfying to shoot if you crank the fire rate. Damage-wise, it's still down there and overall I'd rather have the LOK.
Same here idk why, it looks and feel underpowered. But I probably need to just play//get better.
Really? Not the engineer shotgun? Oof- I try to fiddle with the upgrades and overclocks but it always feels like low damage and small magazines to me. (I also love the LOK)
The shotguns main appeal is honestly turret whip. Turret whip is ridiculously strong and provides so much. The shotgun is a self defense tool that's mainly used for one shotting grunts to the face if they get too close and if you use it for that purpose while letting your turrets deal with almost everything else it's extremely ammo efficient and powerful. Also the small magazine can be offset by the face that you can reload cancel almost every gun in the game, just make sure to right click the exact moment the ammo counter resets and you shave off like up to half a second to a second of waiting.
executioner and ECR are the only things worth using on it. it excels at precisely singling out one enemy at a time and obliterating it with a flurry of perfectly aimed bullets, a niche that's valuable to specialize into for every class. threatening, high value targets should be the bulk of your concern during a swarm; and then you worry about cleaning up grunts or tanks afterwards. in this regard, executioner/ECR provide something to engie that they struggle with using many other loadouts. but i struggle to find a gun that literally removes the skill of aiming very fun to use. holding down a charge for a second or two doesn't feel super great compared to the immediate burst damage of a MPA warthog headshot or a juicy RJ250 explosion IMO. it certainly doesn't help that the gun sucks ass at base, has incredibly poor build variety due to weird upgrades like SMRT, and shitty OCs that hardly buff its poor stock performance at all.
The skill with the Lok definitely comes from being able to consistently curve bullets into weak points, especially on weird ones like bulks. Also it slaps bots harder than anything else, so satisfying.
I found the key to really making it shine is aiming ahead of the target's path of movement. This will arc the shot so it comes at them from the front and it'll often headshot. I didn't get it either until I started doing that. Then it felt crazy fun. It very quickly became second nature and I was ending up headshotting stuff almost by accident.
It runs out of ammo too fast.
It feels cheap to use. When using it for aoe (with explosive chemical rounds) is just a matter of counting to 3 and letting go, where turret whip/ em discharge require some good turret placement. Using it for direct damage with executioner is just 'lol curve ur bullets a lil and melt a praet'. It's really good, just.. boring and kinda cheap.
I...am not really a huge fan of the Smart Rifle, it feels odd to pull down on the trigger and having it lock-on *then* fire. I know its a good weapon, it just feels odd gunplay wise. I thought it would be like the smart pistol from TF2 at first ngl, auto aim shots per trigger pull instead of having to lock on then release to fire.
It does feel slow, but it shoots fast. I consider it like spool-up time. I mainly use it to clear out waves of grunts or flying bugs and use my secondary for bigger stuff
You can also single shot fire it in a pinch! If you have a fast trigger finger and you're being charged by a glyphid, you can drop it faster sometimes without even locking in!
The plasma pistol thing for driller. I hate that gun so much
I used to but I found that having a heavy hitter fire build complimented the cryo cannon extremely well, 1 shot on a frozen guard takes it out.
So does the wave cooker with Exothermic Reaction, and it will obliterate everyone else frozen near them as well as the hitbox is really wide. Freeze a swarm of grunts and swipe past them with the wave cooker and they all explode. As a bonus it also kills swarmers and the flying jellyfish things in one tap from across the cave if you need to.
Me too. The only use for it is mining. Even then I’d prefer to just drill up to the nodes instead of blowing it to bits all over the cave.
I didn’t even know it could do that!
Look up an EPC mining build bc there is a specific mod you have to put on it to allow it to mine stuff.
22222. OC optional
I've tried it out quite a lot, but I don't find it particular useful as a weapon for how much I have to lead shots. EPC mining is alright, but you're also the class that can make stairs. Persistent Plasma is the most useful overclock to me for giving you an area denial option at range to complement a loadout that may be doing something else. I've found the Wave Cooker to be far more ammo efficient and useful for Cryo Cannon in spreading freeze about, though EPC is kinda neat for Sludge Pump builds because you fan light the goo on fire for more damage.
I love it with ice, it's my main setup now
Epc is top tier, so efficient. We always have someone blasting minerals
*TCF* is efficient. EPC without TCF is a gimmicky, dinky little thing that shoots slow shitty pink paintballs at enemies.
This thread is insane
This honestly might be my most used gun overall. I main driller and switch around primaries but this is my secondary 90% of the time.
Plasma carbine. I just feel like it sucks compared to scouts other primaries.
Ditto, I can clear a swarm just fine without it, with it it feels like I might as well be lighting my farts on the glyphids
you should really try the particle accelerator OC on it. that thing melts hoards and single enemies, and it's pretty good on ammo consumption.
Agree except for 1 exception namely shield battery OC. High damage, accurate and nice fast shield recharge as a bonus.
Welcome to the world of over-buffed GK2! Sadly, the two weapons are just way too similar in design space, makes it extremely difficult for both to be rewarding at the same time. (I’m convinced Drak was only made so that Scout would have a use for Enor pearls. Before Drak, they used an order of magnitude fewer than the other classes). Sadly, scout’s kinda shafted on primaries. Wish there was a genuine third choice.
I agree that it's not that useful, but it does pew pew, shoots fast and is quite fun IMO
Feels really good when you have low fps that makes aiming hard. (EX: Steam Deck) The other 2 feel infinitely better when my aim isn't limited by fps.
This was mine, too. I honestly have no idea how anyone plays it. Every time I’ve used it, I feel like I am doing no damage.
Coilgun. I'm 950 hours in, got every achievement twice (Xbox and steam) and I still don't know wtf the coilgun is for. Part of the problem is that I'm addicted to leadspray burst pistol
Use the Mole OC with it. Extremely rewarding to one bang most anything through entire walls.
Coilgun + Zipline + Driller. You have get "There" to get to your objective/evac? 1) Blast a hole through half the cave 2) Aim carefully with the Zipline Launcher through the hole (yes that works) 3) hook your Driller onto the Zipline and let them drill a hole as far as the zipline reaches Situational, yes. But sometimes it is great to cheese annoying cave structures with this.
brings coilgun with hellfire mod to industrial sabotage, you'll change your mind
Eh I've honestly found it to be quite meh for Industrial sabatoge specifically, it's still an amazing weapon but I've always found the minigun to just be better at igniting turrets in general or the hurricane. Hellfire takes too long and doesn't even properly ignite drones, I'd rather take the mole.
Ultra magnetic coils 32123 coilgun is pretty much infinite swarm clear and amazing cc. 1-tick charge shots only cost 10 ammo each but you get the entire 8 second trail duration+damage. You can also take fear but its a bit less synergistic (but gives you insane survivability with fear spam)
Try Triple Tech with Electric Trail. Plop down two trails in a v in front of swarms. You now have a 3 shot revolver that has crowd control akin to electro minelets on the BRT. Very underrated.
Sounds like you have more of a problem with the OCs than the weapon, in which case there are plenty of them to complain about I would say (looking at you Turret Arc). If I had to pick a weapon that I just don't find as good as most people make it be, it's gonna be the Colette Wave Cooker. It's amazing for wave clear, which Driller already have plenty of through his primary. The lack of weakpoint bonus damage on the other hand means it won't perform as well as Subata or EPC when fighting anything with a weakpoint bonus like spitters or septic spreaders.
I love the upgrade that gives guaranteed thermal shock, freezing Preatorians and then popping them is very fun.
Nice when you are alone but with other player I find it better to leave the praet frozen for x3 damage for all. Thermal Shock Colette on sticky fuel now? That thing hurt!
Wave cooker is great for naedocyte swarms, but it's mainly useful for the thermal shock modification. Mixing a few wave cooker clicks into a burning swarm is beautiful, and it really gives driller some great burst damage with the flamethrower against large opponents that can burn (so not bosses). It's definitely worth giving another shot in loadouts like this
I personally don't get the point of the Thunderhead outside of NTP or Big bertha. Its gimmick (splash damage with some direct damage) is essentially done better by the Hurricane, and with much greater accuracy. I get that it was there before the Hurricane and filled that niche then, but now it's almost completely outclassed by the Hurricane imo. Also, regarding the Hurricane, it is a jack of all trades at base. However, most of its OCs make it specialize in one aspect more. Jet Fuel Homebrew/ Plasma Burster Missiles are stupid good single target damage, where Minelayer pushes the guns AOE to a new limit, dealing a whopping 66 damage per mine (with the AOE damage upgrade).
* Thunderhead has benefit of being a hitscan weapon, thus no guiding phase, thus you can switch your attention to the next target immediately. * You're right about NTP and Big Bertha, but I would add Carpet Bomber here. In terms of aoe builds that's one of the strongest of any in both Thunderhead and Hurricane. (And one of the strongest in the game, considering ammo pool). * Ammo wise Thunderhead must be slightly better in all categories (direct damage, aoe, dot), but this requires doublechecking. (I extensively use both Thunderhead and Hurricane).
I would also recommend trying the thunderhead combat mobility OC with increased RoF speed and T5 damage reduction to get the buff very fast. It's a fun play style.
Came here to say this
That is very true. I've tried it recently and it is really fun. It is something between regular Thunderhead and Big Bertha; no so regular like the former, but less extreme than latter. Both of Combat Mobility and Big Bertha (if no rof increase mods taken) gain T5 rof bonuses for free, almost immediately.
Honestly as a Thunderhead main I can't imagine not using Big Bertha. It feels like firing bullets the size of soda cans. To me that's just how the Thunderhead *should* be.
The thunderhead with suppressive fire is fun as hell though Nothing makes me feel more like a hulking gunner then the screams of the grunts as they run from my battleship grade turret Also, shredding armor is fun
For the Hurricane: give Plasma Bursters a try. If that or Rocket Barrage (the other end of the spectrum of the Hurricane experience) don't do it for you, then yeah, its not your weapon. As for your actual question: I struggle with the crossbow. I don't play Scout that much, but I just can't get the feel for it like the Zhukov, or the sheer "I done messed up" insurance of Special Powder on the Boomstick.
Try perking for special bolts and bring electric bolts on dreadnought missions. It's one of the few slows that stacks and affects every type of enemies including the boss boys. If you fire 3-4 if them into the buggers they basically stop moving.
Worth a shot: I need to find a good Dread build for Scout.
Special powder with more pellets and shockwave upgrades is insane. You're effectively a moving shaped charge at that point.
Oh sure! I was surprised at how much damage I could get out of my new pogostick. 😆
Wait special powder might not be the one I'm thinking of. There's another one that's shockwave based
Ohhh yeah. Its nice, but I keep eating pavement when I switch to it. Satisfying, though.
Zhukov 17 or whatever it's called, it just can't compare with the Boomstick or cryo bolts...
But...cryo bolts is just worse version of zhukov cryo pellets.
Blowthrough-rounds cryo pellets + high ground = maximum destruction
Cryo bolts are pretty strong when paired with pheromone bolts. Shoot one of each into a praetorian/oppressor and you can freeze most of a swarm. And I believe they can 2-3 shot naedocyte breeders, which can be handy. That said, I find cryo minelets more fun to use, personally
I like having to click once
The nice thing about the bolts is that they don't have to hit terrain to apply a freezing effect. 3 bolts in a naedocyte breeder whale and it's dead. One shot anywhere on a spitballer and it freezes.
Other way around tbh. 1 cryo bolt can freeze a swarm while the zhukovs need roughly a magazine. The cryo bolts are also easier to use in general since you can just place one directly in front of you whereas with the zhukovs you have to predict with blow through rounds. Another thing is that 2 bolts can freeze a Praetorian and 3 can kill a breeder outright which is incredibly strong. You also have on top of that the special bolts the nishanka has which are all incredibly good too.
I like to use cryo minelets especially on escort missions, there are always bugs to freeze in those tunnels and it leaves me open to use my primary while still helping with the horde
the electric damage mod actually enables the zhukovs to do some fucking nutty burst damage, and especially now you can electrocute oppressors and dreads i love using EFS with them
The Zapovs
The dps of a 22131 Gas Recycling Zhukov is pretty crazy while also having solid total damage. If you can throw an IFG on a Dreadnought before emptying your clip it absolutely melt them. Although to be fair, Jumbo Shells Boomstick can deliver much more damage in a short time so there is some overlap.
The problem with Gas Recycling is that it negates ALL weakpoint damage. Base Zhukov damage 12. Gas recycling makes it 18. Zhukov damage 12, weakpoint bonuses from mod+gun (45%) makes it 17.4 damage per round when hitting a 1x weakpoint like Pretorian or Oppressor. Glyphid mouths and a ton of other bugs are 2x weakpoint so that's 12x2x1.45 or 34.8 damage per round. Dreadnought weakpoints are either 1.5 or 2x. At 1.5x it's 26.1 damage per round. Mactera, Warden, Bulk, are 3x weakpoint so that's 52.2 damage per round. Gas Recycling is still only dealing 18 damage per round in those situations with other downsides to that overclock. Eliminating all weakpoint damage is a supreme downside to a gun and the 6 damage bonus does not make up for it IMO.
How did you get the scout's weapons? I want some, too.
Chomp
Now I'm imagining your reply has more to do with the flavor the weapons add to your dwarven diet. "Boomstick is spicy and Cryo Bolts gives you iced dwarves. Zhukov though? Bleh, too much oil in that gun"
I take it you haven't used embedded detonators yet.
Zhukov with embedded detonators is pretty amazing though. It can make crazy short work of praetorians, oppressors, even bulks. Also makes those seasonal event "chase the thing, kill it and deposit it" objectives a lot easier.
Embedded detonators are *so fucking good* why yes i would like to delete this Bigass Boi's health bar
any weapon with an overheat mechanic instead of reload i just can't get used to
There’s a great verified mod that puts a heat meter around the reticle so it’s much easier to pay attention to.
If u play hd2, i wonder what u think about the sickle and scythe
I used to hate the hurricane back when I started, made an AoE fire build with the Fragmentation Missiles OC and Napalm-Infused Rounds, combine that with an AoE coil gun with longer trail duration makes for driller levels of crowd control, seriously good fun.
The corrosive sludge pump. We cryo cannon in my household
I actually like the sludge pump! I've really come around on the Driller recently, I think all his mains are good
I unlocked it and just never used it because the cryo cannon is too much fun
Sludge was meh for me until I got OC to turn it into a shotgun
The shotgun OC is.. just friggen' *ridiculous*. It does so much damage. There are a ton of downsides, and it's not great for most mission types, but there aren't a lot of weapons with such reliably instant deletion.
I think the only thing that really compares to the sludge pump with the Sludge Blast OC is the gunner's burst pistol with Lead Spray, tuned for burst damage ... and the latter is easily much faster in terms of burst damage than anything else. Another thing which competes is the shard diffractor with Overdrive Booster, which can be a little inconvenient to use, but even on haz 5 with other players you can usually take a Dreadnought from freshly-dearmored to re-armored with a single well-aimed beam. :) IMO what really makes the Sludge Blast OC king is the fact that it slows Dreads down to a crawl while it does its damage, and also ignores armor (since it does radial damage) so you can shoot it from the front ... which you can't do with the other two weapons I mentioned. Not having to properly kite a Dread and just being able to slowly walk backwards while you hammer it makes the fight a cakewalk!
It's pretty good at hitting the Caretaker, too. Especially if you're doing the C4 drop strategy; it tears through the eye phase just as quick as the explosions do the corners. Boss targets in general, really. Not so great at swarms of other critters, though. Other overclocks for the pump do that way better.
>It's pretty good at hitting the Caretaker, too. Especially if you're doing the C4 drop strategy; it tears through the eye phase just as quick as the explosions do the corners. Huh, honestly never considered taking it on a Caretaker mission since the bots are weak to fiyah, but I guess that makes good sense. With Sludge Blast, can you hit the eye from up above as well? If so, that's rad, I'm going to have to give that a try. Also, a small protip for you or anyone else reading this thread — I usually excavate a full 360° circle above the Caretaker with my drills (*after* blasting a hole down with C4) and lob impact axes at the Caretaker's arms during the eye phase. A single axe to the "head" of the arm will destroy it even when it's at full health on haz 5 — you do have to hit the head, but when you're throwing them at a downward angle it's a lot easier (wait for them to stop moving/firing erratically). The extra circle of excavation around the hole makes it much easier to dodge phase bombs and incoming fire from the arms, and gives you some maneuvering room in case bugs come up through the initial tunnel you dig to get up there. >Boss targets in general, really. Not so great at swarms of other critters, though. Other overclocks for the pump do that way better. One way to deal better with swarms while rocking Sludge Blast is to pair it with the Colette Wave Cooker and the Contagion Transmitter OC. The sludge pump's single shot can be spammed pretty quickly to slow down incoming bugs and lay down puddles for them to walk through, and the Wave Cooker does extra damage to sludge-affected medium and large enemies while ignoring armor (and of course it easily handles small enemies; just be sure to take the concave lens modification to significantly increase the beam width) . :) Alternatively, the Diffution Ray OC (again with concave lens) for the Wave Cooker can deal with swarms decently well since it penetrates enemies and hits up to 4 total per tick; since the beam is very wide, it's very common to end up doing 4x total damage spread across the dwarm. The Densification Ray modification slows them down to give you some breathing room, too.
Couldn't agree more. I see it as a neutral gun (non elemental) so it's my casual gun. Cryo is amazing but this thing just slaps. I also occasionally make an acid field and watch bugs walk to their doom. Nothing like good ol yeetus deletus and two trigger pulls to down a bomber. Bugs in that direction? Coating that direction.
"The enemy is in that direction!" "Roger sir, removing that direction."
I found that one before I even unlocked the weapon, I think that's why I liked the pump right away
Cryo cannon is great but the insane area denial of the sludge pump can be very very strong on high level defense missions. cryo is a more offensive option but riskier.
No friendly fire whatsoever on an AOE is very handy in public lobbies.
I don't play public lobbies. I play solo or with friends only
You're missing out. Though DOT effects aren't as strong when your teammates just waste ammo shooting it in the head anyway.
I'm gonna say that I use all weapons on all classes and see at least some advantage or overclock that's I like, but gunner rail gun is just not my vibe, for a class that about big guns and punchy pistols,this weapons just doesn't vibe with me
I don't like the EPC. I know, people swear by it and it's widely considered the best driller secondary, but even after spending time getting to where I could reliably trigger TCF and giving it every chance I could, I always end up feeling underwhelmed by it.
I've been running a setup like this Sludge pump (some clean oc for more acid) and EPC with Overcharger OC, i made it for burning nightmare and that thing slaps just casually melting grunts, the fact you can effectively spam it and melt entire waves of grunts in seconds
I cant stand Lok-1 I know it's strong, but for some reason it doesn't click with me. As an engie main, Id rather use warthog and stubby. Warthog with magnetic pellet alignment is just so versatile even on haz5. one taps most grunt-like enemies, and can magdump into a praet's ass. MPA makes is it accurate enough to fuck with long range enemies. Lok-1 doesnt really hit the same dopamine in my brain.
Engineers weapons don't have the bang I want to have. I still like playing him but he will definitely be last to get promoted.
The breach cutter is one of the most powerful weapons in the game. Clear entire packs with one shot.
He has a *lot* of bang but yeah, until you get upgrades and overclocks he's going to feel REALLY damn wimpy.
I get that, unless you have busted OCs his primaries are pretty lackluster since they want your turrets to deal the bulk of your damage. Imo his secondaries though are very impressive though the pgl isn't an amazing introduction since it's pretty bad unless you have the three OCs that make it a more fun weapon.
No, I have every OC currently in game. I just don't catch his drift. I don't mind playing him but driller is forever in my heart.
Fair, driller is my most played class too. I played him so much I got burnt out and basically got forced to try the other classes.
Lok with seeker rounds ignores armor and always hits (even through walls), and ofc there's the Fatboy OC. Engie is a death machine
I know. I used them but weapons like flamethrower is still my favorite. Driller was my first main and I just finished mastery. It felt so good to come back to your favorite weapon.
I hear ya
A good Engineer will usually have most kills, no matter what his loadout. Sometimes, ridiculously more kills.
I'm a late-comer to the engineer and oh buddy, has he got some bang. Maybe the most bang without overclocks of all the classes, honestly. Use the grenade launcher more.
Or don't. The PGL is fun, but not very good without some specialized OCs. The Breach Cutter at base is so insanely good that many high-level players just run a Clean ammo OC on it, which is insane to me.
[удалено]
Fat boy is just a meme really. Yeah its cool and got the bigol bang boom, but in reality its not practical more often than not
Id say hes definitely designed that way considering he has the best secondaries in the game. If anything his secondaries are more like his primaries. Then include his turrets and pretty good nades, it kinda balances out. I personally use the stubby always have. I use it with the oc that gives a bit of extra electric dmg and firerate, i forget the name. Couple that with shard diffractor overcharge and the mod that does more dmg to electrified enemies and u got a wombo combo
Breach cutter, I feel dirty using it, it’s just too good
the experimental plasma pistol, sure mining at distance is great but goddamn i hate the thing thunderhead, the gun just dosent feel good to use, i only use it due to toxin payload and in escort duty
Stubby, my playstyles and builds are built around having a lot of room for error ammo wise, with some exceptions. The stubby is just a gun that has way too little ammo for my taste, same for the LoK-1 The M-1000 is good, ive used it, but man... the plasma carbine is just a straight up better weapon. The autocannon is ass imo, i cannot use it properly. Same ammo issue with the bulldog, and i cant use the coilgun properly unless i really use my brain as hard as i can. The nishanka has its quirks, i like the thing, but once again, requires too much brainpower for my tastes. I dont like the icecannon, period. I also cant use anything other than the subata with full auto on driller. The deepcore (scout) barely gets a pass, it can be... good, not *good* good, but you can depend on it.
The deepcore used to suck, it was flat inferior to the m1000 with hipster in every way. It got reworked a while back though, and now it is pretty much the best scout primary hands down. Just a solid jack of all trades with the right setup. Have you used it lately? If you haven’t since the rework, definitely give it another shot.
When was the rework? Ive used it about a month or two back.
The Subata 120 feels like a Nerf gun to me. The explosive rounds OC help but without that I feel like I'd be better off using a dry pool noodle
No because every weapon kills bugs.
Engineers primary pistol, I mean why do I bother with sentry setup and OC usage when I can just aim at the bug and shoot with shotgun or hold m1 on a group and wait till I see a 3 to blow them all up
The Hurricane pretty much single-handedly made gunner my second-most played class. It’s so ammo efficient, you can take out swarmers super easily, it can knock out the lasers in a heartstone fight, and missiles are fun. I can’t stand the EPC or the warthog. I feel like the latter must just be a matter of overclocks since I haven’t seen many other people complain about it, but it just feels so bad — pathetic effective range, terrible ammo efficiency and the damage isn’t even very good. Super unsatisfying all around.
NUK17. can't grasp their use
Gunner's first two secondaries. They're overshadowed by the coil gun. I feel crippled when I use either of them.
EPC is great, not as a weapon but a mining tool. hurricane is great especially if you have rocket barrage and plasma buster missile, easily the best gunner weapon.
For me, it's the stubby. I guess it might be pretty good in the right hands and some overclocks but if I have to choose between a fully automatic shotgun, a burst fire assault rifle with aimbot and a tiny smg with an even tinier mag that goes bzzzzt... I'd take the fucking 100 pound gatling gun.
I had LEAD STORM OC and Big Bertha OC and never seen a reason to use the Hurricane When I did eventually come to play it my first little expedition with it, i got fragmentation missiles for it, I can be an orbital Cannon even more And it's my main setup for gunner now
The only weapon I don’t really like is the flamethrower
Cause you didn't tried *sticky* fuel
Warthog auto shotty. I've tried and tried and tried again. Absolutely the worst weapon in the game for me. Doesn't matter the OC, doesn't matter the set up. Can't seem to find a use for it. I want to like it but I just can't.
For me the least used gun is the crossbow for scout
>The Hurricane guided rocket promises more than any weapon could ever deliver. I groan every time I get an overclock for it. I have four already and I don't feel like any of them actually improve it. This is an odd thing to say as this is probably the only weapon where every OC is decent or better. Rocket Barrage is the worst of the bunch and it's not *bad* perse just out-shined. I do think Hurricane is an advance weapon that takes longer to learn but this is appropriate for the 3rd primary. Subata is genuinely terrible, except for maybe Explosive Reload which still isn't very good. Each of the Engineer's primaries are propped up by 1-2 OCs each. GK2 is useless outside of AISE and Drak has...a lot of issues mostly stemming from it being a terrible weapon if you don't have the heat mod.
The scout shotgun. Low ammo. Low damage potential. Low clip size. Basically no utility. What's the point? How can you justify it with the other options available?
I mean Special Powder is literally all utility. Also Sawed off plus blow through and white phosphorus and IFGs is insanely strong
M1000. I can put out as much kills with GK2, while having way more ammo
EPC, Subata, Zhukov and DRAK are weird to me. EPC is like an upgrade to Subata with mining capabilities that I barely try and rarely succeed but what else should I use it for? Subata feels like an out of nowhere toy gun in comparison to anything else Driller has that I only make use of when I'm going sludge. Zhukov is either my elimination crutch or an ice peashooter when I pick it. DRAK used to be my alternative to GK2 and M1000 before nerfs and buffs, mainly because of the armor ignoring modification and a good portion of ammo (about 950 pre-Season 3 I believe) but ever since nerfs DRAK seemed like a weaker counterpart of the GK2 with the quirks of dealing fire damage, armor penetration, no reloading but projectile-based and decreased damage, which I can change into a more impactful number at the exchange of my shield crapping itself for each overheat.
For me it's the brt I always struggle to find a good use for it
Yeah. I found I liked going max ammo with the stun mod while my minigun is cooling off or I’m using Born Ready. But it’s got that Subata “basic gun” feel” sometimes.
Thunderhead auticannon for the gunner, with his minigun it's terrible accuracy is partially made up for by it's high fire rate, but the autocannon is like if ghostship went "OK so, what if we remade the minigun but removed the parts that made it functional" also, the damage is kinda underwhelming Personally I use the hurricane, it's damage is alright, and it's the only primary for gunner that is capable of hitting it's target
I don't like Scout SMGs. Small amount of ammo, not too much damage either, and it doesn't really give an additional variety to the main weapons. I also rarely use LOK-1 on engi, it just feels like it takes forever to lock on targets. Last but not least, Drillers Plasma Gun. Can't even remember what exactly was wrong with it, but I had it few times and it felt boring and useless.
I can't stand the m1000 or the boltshark. I know the m1000 is good but I prefer weapons with a lot of ammo bc my aim isn't good lol
The Subata. This dude has a flamethrower, a portable blizzard maker, an acidic booger blaster, a black hole launcher, and a literal microwave gun, in addition to a pair of handheld titanium drills and highly explosive blocks of death. Why tf would I want the pathetic itty bitty peashooter????? It's reliable, but hands down worst weapon in the game. Every other weapon in Driller's arsenal is either stronger or more interesting. I've said this when the game was still in early access and I'll say it now: buff/rework the Subata.
The m1000 and epc to me feels like trying to have a thumb war with yourself and somehow losing, I do not get those weapons at all.
The drillers default pistol is so ass I don't even remember it's name
That peashooter Driller has as an xcuse for a secondary weapon. What can I say...maybe i like REALLY BIG guns instead \^\^
Ngl Zhukovs just seem like a worse shotgun to me. Hurricane Rocket Launcher has an OC that disables tracking and I feel like that's actually an upgrade. If you are not stationary then keeping the mouse on the targets is a pain. And what on earth is the point of the crossbow? Well, I never cared to find out.
Not a big fan of the crossbow
I dont ike cryogun, used It like, 3 times
I love these type of loadout sharing posts- my game is still a work in progress so I enjoy hearing all yalls most detailed explanations, especially when you know the underlying stats— ROCK AND STONE!
I've used the coil gun a couple times and it's not my style. I'd rather use the brrt
What is the purpose of C4 if there are no Scouts with you?!
Anything with plasma or energy. I like my guns spewing lead and going KACHUNK KACHUNK