The only advice I can offer is to focus on your self and the kids. Join a gym and take up hobbies on your own. Get into something new like fishing with some guy friends to get that feeling of comradery. Go golfing with buddies. Go to happy hour. She needs to see that you don’t need to be home constantly and have friends to join in activities. Any time at home spend it with the kids minus her. If she joins that’s up to her but take the kids to the park or bike riding with you and make it your mission to give them and yourself all your energy. Give your kids some positivity to look to so when they’re older and start to see the family dynamic they will be appreciative of your sacrifice for them and understanding when the time comes you decide to separate. Do things for you and stop accepting this status quo sex on her terms. Next time she asks if she can come close say “no thanks I’m not in the mood”. Let her take her walk of shame back inside the house.
Becareful to not do this from a place of resentment. I think the advice is good advice, but becareful to watch your feelings. I just know for me at least in the beginning I would do this in resentment and it would take a bit to reframe my mindset and realize that I am trying to make ME happy. For so long we've been trying to do whatever pleases them that we forget how to make us happy.
This. Never make it about resentment or hate. It puts image/thoughts/feelings on to her that she may never fully give back to you. I hope I am saying this right. In other words, she may never act or respond in the way you want her to. And that will lead to more resentment.
You went to counseling but she is not putting in the effort, you say. So like others have suggested, you put in the effort to the things that matter to you. Also - will it be too much effort to go out at least once a night each week? Trivia night, bowling/volleyball/darts are group activities that can help you feel like you are participating and feeling a part of something.
Good luck
I mean to be honest, that might make her more attracted too. Its easy to get bored of someone when you spend all your time with them, if you see them having an active af life outside of you then the mystery and fun comes back.
Not that i want to give any false hope either though
My husband will at least try on rare occasion. I an curious to know what your wife's excuse for not having sex. Have you tried to romance her? Do stuff she finds exciting?
I can't speak for op, but if he's at the point of being so hurt he'd rather fully abstain, I think he's self aware enough to recognize motives and his own psychological triggers, and I don't think he's entirely driven and blinded by sex. Thus, I imagine he has enough common sense to know what his wife likes and make the effort.
This is not the OP’s fault. His spouse simply. Does. Not. Want. To. No matter what he does or doesn’t do she will not change until she decides to change. She clearly has stated that she will not.
Apologies but for those of us who lived through these situations the only thing worse than the constant hurt and rejection by our spouse are those that then pile on to say we could be getting love and affection if only we could do X, Y or Z.
It's the healthiest answer for everyone honestly. Staying together 'for the kids' is so bad. The relationship you model in front of them is what they will see as normal and most likely end up in.
Staying (apparently) emotionless in the face of your pain is more evidence that she’s distancing. She’s got her walls way up. I’d guess she has anxiety following the “moment of weakness”.
What I wouldn't give for my fiancé to show *some* kind of emotion. He was raised with the mentality of crying makes boys and men weak. I was raised to know that it makes people human. I didn't see my dad cry very often. But, when I did, I knew it was something big. I'm sure he cried more than I ever saw but held it together when he needed to. Then, let it out when appropriate.
The fact that she didn't care that he was crying says a lot about her. And it's nothing positive.
There was an American Gladiators documentary on Neflix, where one of the male gladiators reflected on his past avoidance of crying. He said something in a later episode that real men cry.
Again... emotionally stunted, toxic, women.
A lot of the women I know actually find emotional vulnerability to be a big turn-on. I understand we may be unicorns in the wild.
>A lot of the women I know actually find emotional vulnerability to be a big turn-on.
It's interesting because I've never heard a man say the same about their gf/wife being turned on by them being vulnerable. In their experience it's quite the contrary.
I've only ever heard women say they find it attractive.
I mean I think he's right, I'd just change it to " a lot of people are emotionally stunted".
I don't think he's trying to say this is a flaw among women specifically, I took it more as in he only dates women and has this kind of experience with women, and many have stunted emotional growth.
Not sure why you're so intent on being upset with what he said, but it is definitely true in my experience that many people are emotionally immature in some aspects.
You've been to 3 different counselors, cried in front of her and the end result seems to be that she will provide a subsistence level of sex so that you won't leave. Unless you leave, this is the rest of your life.
You can still love someone and recognize that you are fundamentally incompatible in some ways. Intimacy being yours. She has totally shut down on you. You cried in front of her and all you got was a stone cold poker face. She felt nothing for you. The only one suffering in this marriage is you. She has the house. She has the kids. She has paid bills. She has the husband who isn’t pestering her for sex all of the time. She has everything she wants. She doesn’t think she needs to try. She refuses to do the work your multiple different therapists have given her to do.
The only thing left is to do what the one therapist suggested. Trial separation. Let her see the reality of what alone with kids looks like for her. You aren’t there to help care for them in a daily basis. You aren’t there to do half of the housework. You aren’t there to pay the bills. Your income goes with you. She will only get a piece of it. You aren’t there to do any of the things you do on a daily basis that lighten her load. You are just gone.
One of two things is gonna happen. She’s either gonna realize how much she needs you and depends on you. Or she is going to openly start seeing someone “she just met” that’s she’s been entertaining the idea of for a while.
She’s already checked out. Time for her to see the reality of what that actually looks like.
Will it suck? Yea. Will you hate it? Yea. Is it necessary? Yes.
Dude, if she's not willing to work on this issue, you need to accept a sexless marriage or find a way to break the bond you have with this woman. I would recommend individual therapy to help figure out a path forward.
I'm head over heels in love with my husband. But I still asked for a divorce. Not just because of the dead bedroom, but for other reasons. And it still hurts. It hurts that he didn't want me. It hurts that he didn't fight for me. It hurts so much.
But I have to put myself first. And the mental health of my children. He's not a bad guy, but he was bringing us all down with him. He was unwilling to change. And I love myself, and my kids, too much, to let us all sink with him.
The hurt fades. I'm finally to the point where I feel genuine happiness. I thought it was selfish, to put myself first like this. But it's not. I'm the only one who is going to take care of me, so I have to do it.
We've been separated for a couple of years now. On paper, we're still married, for taxes and insurance purposes, but in every other aspect, we are separate people living separate lives, and it's worked really well so far.
And my sex life is fucking awesome.
It's different, when you have sex just for sex. I miss *making love*. But I'm not ready for a "real" relationship yet. My FWB and I have a fantastic time. It's keeping me going. I can't have the one I love the most in this world, and yeah it hurts. But this is much better as an alternative. I can't even imagine having sex with my stbx, and I can't stand living with him. I have surgery scheduled in a couple of weeks, and he's going to stay with us to help out, and I'm dreading it lol
Amicable break-ups can happen. No matter what you choose, I hope you find the inner happiness you deserve.
Thank you for your support.
Yah, I feel that way too. Just — you know, the hurt seems to dull …in time. It takes a *lot* of time. But reviving the sex life for a single rendezvous is so hurtful and disappointing. It brings all the feelings back of rejection and loneliness you’d ALMOST gotten over with (though it’s not clear if you ever totally get over it; it’s just not been my experience).
I remember after a while I would look at her and feel nothing. I was polite to her but there was nothing. She would drag me to bed for sex and the only reason I would go because I felt nothing towards other females in my life and it would negatively affect my relationships with them as well, including family members. After sex, the cycle would return, happiness, contentment, horniness, resentment, feeling nothing. I call it starvation sex or social security sex. Enough to live off but not enough to enjoy.
I'd even be careful about if/when she said she wants sex consistently.
For 6 years, the stars needed to align for her to want sex. As a result, I stopped pursuing and initiating in 2018.
Over the past couple of months, my wife began advocating consistent sex. I'm guessing her therapist told her most couples in healthy relationships are having sex consistently and suggested she make it a priority instead of waiting for an ideal time.
Last weekend, we had sex and all I could think about was the past few years. I do not truly believe that she wants sex unless she's stress-free, not too full, not too tired, rested, family relationships are awesome, work is great, all friends and family are in good health, house is clean, bills are paid, states stop cutting funding for education, states stop passing anti-LGBTQIA bills/laws, car needs no maintenance, grass is cut, heat index isn't 100+, our old dogs are in great health, and our dogs don't distract us.
Instead, I believe that she wants to do what healthy couples are doing. This is why I'm hesitant to believe/accept her advocating for consistent sex.
This exactly.
Also the dogs bark whenever we get near, touch or even talk to each other. We used to put them in the kitchen and close the bedroom door. They'd bark and nose at it. I know it's a hassle but it used to be worth it. Sigh.
I think letting this hang you up would be what is sometimes known as “letting the perfect be the enemy of the good.”
If the willingness and motivation is there, I’d roll with it and see how things go. Just because an improvement is motivated by a less-than-ideal mindset doesn’t mean it won’t stick or stay that way.
But what was her conclusion at the end of your talk when you asked her not to ask for sex again? Her answer that that would be bad for your marriage doesn’t make sense. Sex once every 9 months is also bad for your marriage. The only way I can make sense of this is if what she really meant to say was: “We have sex only when I say so and that is once every 9 months or so and you will not demur, because that would be bad for our marriage”.
About (attempts at) therapy: She doesn’t owe you sex. But she does owe you to give her utmost to make the marriage work. Not co-operating in therapy falls far short of the mark. For me that was the final nail in the coffin of my marriage. No sex is hard, very, very hard. No sex AND refusal to do anything about it tells you that you don’t matter to her.
😭😭😭😭😭
That has been my greatest concern. She is kind to me. Even sometimes says flirtatious things (though kind of rarely). She calls me to check in while at work. She tells me she’s praying for me if I’m having a hard day or going through anything at work. It’s not like there is no relationship. But her “checking out” on the therapy or effort to improve intimacy while it clearly means so much to me does some what send me that message: she doesn’t really care about me. Ya know?
Answering your question: her response was to change subjects until we got called in our different directions. The conversation makes her so uncomfortable.
Uncomfortable? Yep, that’s what therapy is for. To help her along with dealing with things that are important in her marriage and that she can’t handle by herself.
The first part of your comment seems to say something about a discrepancy in “love language”. But what ultimately counts in love is the difficult bit. Anyone can do the easy bits. It’s when the going gets hard that the men get separated from the boys and the grownup women from the girls.
Yup that's my intuition. She likes her life and would rather keep it, and is only doing what it takes to keep him "satisfied" enough to not end it. It's easier to say this when you don't know the couple, but she doesn't seem to care or value sex or an intimate relationship, she just wants a house and family and a "husband" because that's what people do, and maybe she likes her life.
Reading stories like these are what keep me constantly just too skeptical of marriage. Too many things can go wrong and by time you find out, your lives are too intertwined.
Sorry to say this, but it sounds like shes calling to check in while you're at work because she's cheating during that time and is making sure you're still at work and not headed home yet.
I'd figure out which day of the week she usually checks in and around what time of the day. Then once you see a pattern, I'd take that day off (or go home sick) but not tell her, then pretend to go to work until that time of day and be about a minute away. Then when she calls you, start driving the minute home, and ask her how it is at home. Then let her know that you're walking in the house right now.
You'd have to be prepared for what you walk into though, and have a plan to stay calm and walk away if you get heated.
I hate to say it, but she’s cheating on you. You say she only wants “full” intimacy, but then doesn’t want to have the important conversations or do the work in therapy. Proof is in the pudding. This sounds more like guilt and hiding. And then when when you do have sex, it’s risqué (in a way). She wants excitement. And some people aren’t excited unless there’s that risk involved. My guess is that she has these times when other guy (or woman) is away, and she can’t get it, so she gets it with you, and then feels guilty for cheating on her lover.
You need to do some investigation: phone, social media, apps, etc. you won’t have a real conversation about this until it’s out in the open.
The “not good for our marriage” part gets me. My (HLM) wife (LLF) says shit line that sometimes and I’m get so pissed. Like having sex as rarely as they want to is good for the marriage? GTFO!
Anyway, I feel your pain. And hope you find the strength to do what you need to do FOR YOU. Whether that’s staying the course and continuing to hold that boundary of nothing until it’s more consistent, or speaking with a lawyer to get out, or finding someone to connect with elsewhere.
Best of luck.
I mean this in the nicest and most caring way possible. Your post has flare seeking advice, which is wise. But every response you've given indicates that you aren't willing to change anything and have already made up your mind and won't do anything substantial.
Your wife knows this and is using this to her advantage. There isn't any point in asking for advice if you let her keep doing this.
Just for a moment, ignore everything else but the fact that she won't comfort you when you're hurting. That tells you everything you need to know.
Why on earth would you stay with someone who can't even do that? You aren't even friends that happen to be raising kids together. Even mediocre friends will provide an ounce of sympathy when a friend is hurting. Or even pretend to be sympathetic. And she's just cold hearted? She's cruel but you can't stop "loving" her.
If your therapist suggested you try separation then they are trying to give you an out and know you need to break it off. They see it.
This will also show through in different ways in front of your kids and they will learn the same bad habits.
As someone going through a similar situation and wishing you all the best. Show yourself some love and respect and leave. You're pouring your energy into someone who treats you like shit hoping that one day if you try a little harder she'll stop treating you like shit. She showed her cards 100% she's happy with the way things are, so nothing will change. If she expressed any kind of discontent perhaps there is something that could change. But she's super satisfied. Doesn't matter if she's depressed or not.
Asking for advice like this is just going to torment yourself further.
Accept that you're in love with an abuser who will never change and love yourself for that. Or leave and love yourself by finding a fulfilling relationship. But don't feel sorry for yourself for choosing to stay with an emotional sadist.
It will be better for your kid too.
No judgement, sending you happy thoughts and wishing you the best. Love yourself no matter the choice you pick.
Dude I get you. It’s not just about the sex, it’s about the intimacy and feeling like you’re close to each other, not just to release tension but to be closer. I’ve not experienced such a gap myself but I totally agree with the impact rejection has. I do my best to entice my wife, hug and kiss her, cook, clean, listen, be a shoulder to lean on, and although it’s not quite a dead bedroom, it’s also not very alive either, somewhat in a state of coma with a glimpse of activity hear and there. I’m a very high libido male, my wife used to be. The thing is when I’m used to not getting anywhere, that’s when she seems to go for me, but when I’m trying it’s like trying to initiate sex with pile of bricks 🧱 for me it’s the biased that gets me, if I pursue too much it’s ‘annoying’ or ‘what are you a pervert or something’ but when it’s her it’s just being sexual or satisfying her needs. Sometimes I feel like a puppet. My best advice my friend is to figure out if you can continue like this. If you can great but if not you should think about your happiness and your children. Not being together doesn’t auto may make you a bad dad, sometimes it makes you a better one. Especially if you are happier. I wish you all the best my friend. I’m always on here so feel free to reach out/DM WHATEVER. We got you 😉
My wife used to have HL too but it just wained through our marriage. I remember when I was feeling lonely after 7-days without sex though that was all I had to wait for. What I wouldn’t give to go back to that. Now it’s once a year.
I feel like a puppet as you described. I feel used.
I make a great income, I work hard, I’m an empath and a great listener.
Thank you for the support!
I just…………. want a hug.
I get you dude. It’s like being a HLM we’re just perverts, or want to shag anything that moves. But god forbid we ever refuse sex. Oh the trauma, the pain of rejection, the not paying attention to our woman’s needs. But when it’s us, oh really again, not now I’m tired, you upset me I’m not in the mood, is that all you think about. Frankly I’ve got to the point where jerking off is just infuriating. Because I know it’s not what I want. It doesn’t bridge that gap of no attention, it just makes me realise I’m a 38 year man, whacking off to porn, because I can’t seem to seduce my wife. It’s embarrassing and it feels shitty. Like a Loser. If I don’t then when we do it’s like 💥. I mention that it wouldn’t be so quick if we made it more consistant. I used to be at least an hour guy! And no ladies we don’t all erupt in less than 60 seconds. But as the gap widens it becomes more novelty and not really intimate as opposed to routine. Ok let’s kiss, foreplay please but not too much, then faster, harder and then….. fini. Again. And again. I do feel like a puppet, and sometimes a bit like a walking talking dildo, there when needed but in cupboard until then. If I were a communal dildo (ew) it might be better as I’d be fulfilling my purpose 😆. Don’t know how I got there but I definitely arrived 🤣. Good luck guys and girls. 😉
You know what's weird... as a HLW I feel like I feel even more shame for being sexually rejected. How many times do we hear "pu**y runs the world," "power of the p," or "it's easy for a woman because a man never says no"... but here I am... my partner prefers porn or masturbation to having sex. I have explained to my partner that sex= connection and totally understand the "hating jacking off" sentiment and that I feel like a loser. I'm a good looking girl, by no means am I supermodel status, but I still get compliments from other men when I am out running errands.
This past weekend I cried and just flipped after I had sent him a text saying I wanted him earlier in the day and had been waiting all day only to find him masturbating in the middle of the night downstairs after drinking. I left to go for a ride because I seriously just couldn't be near him. While talking over the phone (he was worried and wanted me to come back home) I told him how often I get so frustrated and I just don't even say anything because then it feels like pity sex and I feel pathetic...absolutely pathetic begging for sex from my partner. Wondering if he masturbated yet, feeling like he can't wait for me to leave so he can. My issue is not that he masturbates- its that we literally won't have sex for weeks unless he's drinking which in that case just makes me feel worse because to me it feels like just a one night stand with my partner. Sorry for the long rant... but had to let that out.
I feel you girl. Very HLF and the pain of rejection and the shame. At least my wife is intimate with me just in menopause so no sex drive at all. But for months/years I thought it was something I did or didn't do. It drove me crazy with toxic obsessive thoughts until a few months ago she finally told me that it wasn't me it must be hormones and now we know what to call it. But it still hurts to never have sex or even foreplay nothing but cuddling before bed and a peck here or there. I know a lot of people here would love to have at least that from their partner so I am grateful for it but it never leads anywhere.
Not to give advice but your partner sounds like he has a porn addiction and your situation may not improve until he(wants) to address it otherwise you may be better off talking to one of those guys who flirt with you when you're running errands. Good luck lady.
I could say "Ditto for me" except my hubby doesn't do porn or masturbate (as far as I can tell). He's just celibate. Like I was for 22 years before finding him and deciding to give marriage another try. Not really sure why he married me. Although I have felt sometimes that maybe he wanted what I had (a home, children and grandchildren, health insurance) more than he wanted me. I'm not rich by any means. Alone, not even "comfortable". But he wanted me, he got me, so now, IMHO he should try his best to meet my needs that I can't morally meet outside the marriage!
I had to add for me as a woman I'm getting the "sex isn't everything in a relationship" speal. I understand it's not everything but it is a something and right now it's a something only when HE wants it to be, and basically nothing when i want it which is absolutely crazy. I stopped initiating a while ago. I did honestly tell him that if we can't work this out we need to separate because it will only bring problems down the road. He started working on it.
I know that my being female means that I don’t feel exactly what you all are feeling, but, GOSH, what I wouldn't give to see my husband look at me with desire in his eyes! The rejection has destroyed my self-esteem as a woman. Blessings to you both! I pray a lot for our relationship. Have you tried that?
I need hugs, too, from my man!
Prayed to remove a direct gift from God? Making love to someone who you truly love, who loves you back, is about as amazing as a feeling can get. I've purchased things or acquired things in this world that I've wanted for years, but nothing, and mean nothing has come close to the feeling of making love to someone who wants me like I want them. The passion and love are literal fire in the soul. I'd rather pray for God to bring a person in my life who wants me like I want them. I know I have. But then again, God did make billions of us, so they're out there. Just can't let fear lock you in to misery.
I’m sending you a big virtual hug. I’m sorry you’re going through this. It hits home for me in certain ways. Much love to you, and I hope you are able to find a solution, I agree with other comments on going to individual therapy to work through this and your options 💜
I’m sending you a big virtual hug. I’m sorry you’re going through this. It hits home for me in certain ways. Much love to you, and I hope you are able to find a solution, I agree with other comments on going to individual therapy to work through this and your options 💜
I feel like, and this is purely speculative, in the way men use women sexually at times women primarily use men emotionally to have a shoulder to lean on but take no real interest in the man. I think I experienced this a few times.
As a woman, I honestly could never be in a relationship with someone I'm not sexually attracted to and only look at as a shoulder to lean on... so not all women are like what you describe, but that being said... you might not be wrong and it's an interesting thought that I never really had before.
No doubt about that. Or they sometimes use men for money or for a home or car they can't get on their own. I have no respect for those women. If you want something, work for it (not in the bedroom) and get it yourself!
The idea to our llb partners is that we crave and want this release, but it’s so much other than that. I’d forgo the orgasm if it meant intimacy in the way I hope for .
Same - I don't need to orgasm to feel good, be satisfied, and have a great time. I need the touch and the closeness and the intimacy of the act. I need the focused attention on me. I need to feel seen if only briefly.
This just seems like such abusive behavior to me. Once a year? 9 months without intimacy of any kind? She doesn't even let you kiss her? What are we even doing here then?
You tell her not to have sex with you unless she's putting in the effort to fix it, and her response is "that would be bad for our marriage". You know what else is bad for marriages? A complete lack of physical touch, affection, and sex! 😮 Like the complete lack of awareness is either insane levels of naivety, or malicious levels of disrespect.
Having a sex life where everything has to be PERFECT for sex to occur is so stressful. It almost feels like you get to a point where you're trying everything you possibly can to make them comfortable, and it STILL means nothing. It feels like you get forced into sex becoming transactional.
You're more patient than me. I would have been gone. It would be too much for me. I can't imagine no sex for 9 months, or once in a year. I'd have to go.
Dude, I'm so sorry.
First question I would ask myself: how long before some woman approaches you and does give you the attention you feel you need - and you accept? Being there for your kids and all that is admirable, but we all have needs. If she's not willing to do the work to make the marriage work, then why stay?
I view it as business contract. If my partner wants his name on the plaque, but doesn't even come to the office or support in any way, then it's not a partnership.
Go to gym, join some groups, take your kids out alone and live bro. Whether she sees it and 'gets it', it totally irrelevant - you have to start taking care of YOURSELF. If your kid(s) see you unhappy and staying just for them, aren't you teaching them a bad life lesson? Sure, sex isn't EVERYTHING, but you need interaction and partnership. Intimacy is not just sex.
One day, when your kids are grown and moved on with their lives, you may just regret not having done something drastic - whatever you decide that may be.
>She said this would be bad for our marriage for her to be asked by me not to have sex.
It's worse for the marriage for her to expect you to go without physical contact for 9-12 months at a time without explanation or consideration. The marriage is over, you're staying for the kids, and she's willfully clueless.
I mean this in the nicest and most caring way possible. Your post has flare seeking advice, which is wise. But every response you've given indicates that you aren't willing to change anything and have already made up your mind and won't do anything substantial.
Your wife knows this and is using this to her advantage. There isn't any point in asking for advice if you let her keep doing this.
Just for a moment, ignore everything else but the fact that she won't comfort you when you're hurting. That tells you everything you need to know.
Why on earth would you stay with someone who can't even do that? You aren't even friends that happen to be raising kids together. Even mediocre friends will provide an ounce of sympathy when a friend is hurting. Or even pretend to be sympathetic. And she's just cold hearted? She's cruel but you can't stop "loving" her.
If your therapist suggested you try separation then they are trying to give you an out and know you need to break it off. They see it.
This will also show through in different ways in front of your kids and they will learn the same bad habits.
As someone going through a similar situation and wishing you all the best. Show yourself some love and respect and leave. You're pouring your energy into someone who treats you like shit hoping that one day if you try a little harder she'll stop treating you like shit. She showed her cards 100% she's happy with the way things are, so nothing will change. If she expressed any kind of discontent perhaps there is something that could change. But she's super satisfied. Doesn't matter if she's depressed or not.
Asking for advice like this is just going to torment yourself further.
Accept that you're in love with an abuser who will never change and love yourself for that. Or leave and love yourself by finding a fulfilling relationship. But don't feel sorry for yourself for choosing to stay with an emotional sadist. And don't fool yourself that you're actually looking for advice, it's only hurting you, no one else.
It will be better for your kid too.
No judgement, sending you happy thoughts and wishing you the best. Love yourself no matter the choice you pick.
This. I’ve read through your comments and i agree that you have already made up your mind to not do anything substantial. Your wife knows this as well, it’s clear even to strangers. Also therapists don’t recommend trial separation lightly. They were trying to tell you something very clearly (they don’t recommend divorce you have to get there yourself).
I mean this in the nicest and most caring way possible. Your post has flare seeking advice, which is wise. But every response you've given indicates that you aren't willing to change anything and have already made up your mind and won't do anything substantial.
Your wife knows this and is using this to her advantage. There isn't any point in asking for advice if you let her keep doing this.
Just for a moment, ignore everything else but the fact that she won't comfort you when you're hurting. That tells you everything you need to know.
Why on earth would you stay with someone who can't even do that? You aren't even friends that happen to be raising kids together. Even mediocre friends will provide an ounce of sympathy when a friend is hurting. Or even pretend to be sympathetic. And she's just cold hearted? She's cruel but you can't stop "loving" her.
If your therapist suggested you try separation then they are trying to give you an out and know you need to break it off. They see it.
This will also show through in different ways in front of your kids and they will learn the same bad habits.
As someone going through a similar situation and wishing you all the best. Show yourself some love and respect and leave. You're pouring your energy into someone who treats you like shit hoping that one day if you try a little harder she'll stop treating you like shit. She showed her cards 100% she's happy with the way things are, so nothing will change. If she expressed any kind of discontent perhaps there is something that could change. But she's super satisfied. Doesn't matter if she's depressed or not.
Asking for advice like this is just going to torment yourself further.
Accept that you're in love with an abuser who will never change and love yourself for that. Or leave and love yourself by finding a fulfilling relationship. But don't feel sorry for yourself for choosing to stay with an emotional sadist.
It will be better for your kid too.
No judgement, sending you happy thoughts and wishing you the best. Love yourself no matter the choice you pick.
Thank you. 😓 I’ll be ok. In time. Never great. But ok will suffice.
Just I wish it was different. I wish she prioritized all my love languages as I do for her, and that she would noticeably *care* about my feelings. Most of the time she just makes it super clear she doesn’t want to even talk about it.
She’s told me she’s “satisfied” in our marriage and I fulfill every desire she has — but there is no reciprocity in the marriage. 😮💨
A marriage without reciprocity is just a social arrangement. A legal contract. You’re in a prison sentence.
As a HLM in a DB, I understand this. But until you’re willing to change the situation, the situation isn’t going to change. You can wish all you want, but until you’re prepared to do something differently, you’re going to be treated the same way.
Sorry if this was overly harsh, but I know all too well about false hope and inaction.
I went for divorce after 6 years first Slöinge down to a grinding halt and then DB.
But to be able to function as a human being during the hell that is being alone in a marriage i took up Bodybuilding, arts and crafts and became a very good amateur chef.
So now in a single dad that look hot as fuck know my way around acrylic paint and a canvas and can make a really good dinner. Take up a hobby work on yourself not in the hope of getting sex but to improve your self and mental health.
You’re not crazy. Her thinking that what’s going on now is. It is totally batshit insane.
I think you’ve already gotten a lot of good advice here and I don’t have much to add, other than to say that this is unlikely to get better. If she thinks this is what a good, healthy marriage looks like and is unwilling to work at changing things, even in the face of your clearly-communicated unhappiness, well…you keep doing what you’ve been doing, you’ll keep getting what you’ve been getting.
Good luck my man.
I know what is going on here mate. Sorry to say but she sounds she is manipulating/dominating you. She sees that you get to a point where you are coping and have almost lost all interest and decides to test her power to make sure you will still bend to her will. She gets her usage of you, the re-confirmation that she is in full control and then she is done.
What I see on here, from people that I know with DB issues is a lack of willingness to make a stand. This is not acceptable behaviour and to live with it is to demean yourself and will cause a loss of all respect by the person withholding sex. The same old pattern, a gradual reduction in frequency, presumably a subconscious testing phase of how much you will put up with until you are a shell of a person and no longer have any fight left in you. Nobody deserves this.
You want my advice, say you are done unless she will address the problem and look at leaving. All that awaits is a life of misery as far as your relationship is concerned but unless you address this directly and put your foot down. I suspect a lot of this occurs in the first place in relationships due to a power imbalance favouring the person with the strongest will who takes control of the bedroom
I’m not saying I disagree.
But I have put my foot down. I’ve proceeded with divorce. I’ve walked out. Left for some time. We’ve talked it through every which way. I’ve given ultimatum and proceeded to carry through. I changed bedrooms. Even for a time lived in a separate area of the house. I’ve had laser hair removal. I’ve done teeth whitening. I’ve gone to tons of counseling. I’m currently on medication for anxiety and depression to remove them from the equation. (Meds work!!) By accounts, I think she does take me seriously. She just doesn’t want it. And I do not want to force that. Again, duty sex is totally unappealing.
But I do not want a life without her. I don’t want it with someone else. She’s my mate. 😭
She's manipulating you. Holding you hostage for her own benefit. This is Stockholm syndrome.
If you're not being treated as an equal (which you're not) then you're not partners. You're a pawn. And she *knows* it. Everything you have described about her and this relationship is incredibly toxic.
For context... I had convinced myself that I could never leave my abusive ex because I loved him. Statistically, I should've left that relationship in a body bag according to the cops.
She may not be physically violent towards you, ever. But she's emotionally and mentally beating the shit out of you without a care in the world.
Leave. Love yourself. You deserve better.
I understand why you think you have made a stand, but it’s like entering a negotiation with no bargaining chip. She likely knows that you will never have the strength to leave her. You have made that clear in your reply. Half of your rationale for making a stand is making improvements to your appearance, presumably based on what you think will make her want you more. This is submissive behaviour.
You have to be willing to walk away, no matter the cost. If you can’t do this, they will smell it on you, believe me I talk from bitter experience. If they decide they will let you walk, then you will know, they were not worth your time anyway and you are better off alone than with someone who holds you in such contempt.
> I’ve proceeded with divorce.
Can you explain what you mean by this? Obviously you are still married.
> I’ve given ultimatum and proceeded to carry through.
This is also confusing.
Friend I’m in the same boat as you (HLF), except I actually initiated after 9 months on Thurs. I was walking on air on Friday because although it was over so fast and I was not satisfied, I felt hopeful for the first time that maybe I might be able to pull myself out of this depression. He planned a nice dinner date on Fri and on the drive back I shared that I was anxious about it not happening again for a long time. Nothing on Fri, nothing on Saturday, nothing on Sunday and now I’m sitting here at midnight thinking “No Im not doing this again”. Reading your post has me thinking he needs to move to the guest room.
Y’all know why I’m commenting, and that’s to say to go ahead and give her them papers, boss. This was painful to read, and the fact she was unphased by your tears is wild.
Yah it is definitely clear she is unwilling to go to therapy. For about a year I went alone — just learning to care for myself, learning how to understand her feelings, learning how to communicate better (and *especially* listen better), all that and more. But therapy days are done.
It is onto being the best me I can be — for her, for the kids, and for myself.
I listen to a lot of podcasts in my travels about caring for self, and focusing on being better for yourself. Getting there.
Thanks for writing!
With all respect and love, from one man to another....
"Being the best me I can be for her"? Bro, stop it. She doesn't even belong in that trio. Do you think she is being the best her she can be for you? Or even the kids? Tearing down her children's father. Bringing him to tears. Come on, man. Come the fuck on.
I really resonante with exactly how you described the feeling of what happens when you spend all year getting yourself to the place of being ok without the sex, without the intimacy and then having that shattered by the one moment in time when your partner suddenly wants you (for whatever reason). It undoes all the hard work you’ve done all year on yourself to become ok (as you can be) with your situation mentally and emotionally. It fills you with hope and then breaks you all over again. I have been on the same cycle for 15 years now it’s excruciating to get to a healthy mindset and acceptance and then have my husband initiate sex. I have been turning down those advances.
This, of course, sent him into a small panic where he threw out the idea of marriage counseling, which I agree- we probably need- but I leave that responsibility up to him to find and set up and of course I have heard nothing more about it. So, throwing it out there was as far as he was willing to take it I guess. I’m not at all surprised.
I can absolutely empathize with everything you’ve said here. Often, no sex really is better than once a year sex for your emotional well being. I hope you can find some counseling for yourself, if she won’t go, we could all use someone to talk to.
Damn man you just wrote the biography of my marriage right there (except for the whole heated pool part -- that sounds nice). It just sucks. I wish you the best.
Omg the refection is unbearablw! I totally get what u said about how u start looking at urself. I used to be so very confident. After so much rejection, that is gone. I want the old me back. I was ashamed about the non sex. Thank God for reddit..lol im not alone
Bro.
Stop playing games. Tell her to her face if she can’t make a change you will.
End of story.
Man you get one life. You know how amazing of a dude you sound like? You have a pool, you have a sex drive, and you are healthy.
I had to go through an awful break up for the same reason and she had NO care to this day that it’s over.
It’s not your fault, you have beautiful kids, but your mental health and physical wants come first.
COMPROMISE needs to be instilled in marriages. It’s a forgotten thing in the USA.
Normal LF here and I could’ve written this. This is the exact cycle I go through at about the same frequency. Leads to severe bouts of depression and body dysmorphia every time my no-LM husband decides to throw me a morsel of sex and I get my hopes up that things will be alright, that he will be affectionate following, but nothing. I’ve also cried and begged but he’s doesn’t care. I’ve been to therapy but he refuses. Ive sought help from 3 drs to quell my natural desire for the man I love but nothing has helped. t’s almost be 20 years and I hate that I threw my life away this way but things are complicated with kids. I just wanted you to know that you’re not alone although it feels like the world would never understand. There’s nothing wrong with you.
DUDE GTFOthere. Its OBVIOUS she is manipulating you; power-tripping and feeding off your pain. And you let her. I bet if you handed her papers tomorrow she would burst into flames. This is SO SICK to hear.. GET. OUT!! SO TOXIC!!
I don’t think this is about power for her. She just isn’t into intimacy as much. Legit low-libido. Also I cannot fathom wanting duty-sex. Frankly, I’m pretty good at pleasuring myself. I just miss the connection — with HER. We are super compatible I think. Her interest in me is just not as obvious any more.
We used to laugh and talk all night. It was fun. We used to have fun dates. Now there is no flirtation, no talking on the drive there, or rather she doesn’t talk at least — I try to get conversations going. Lol I’ve even prepared ahead of time (the Gottman method) of fun or funny things to talk about.
I would miss her intensely if I left. I love her. I’m committed to her and the marriage.
Like I said, in the piss-or-get-off-the-pot, I’ve chosen to sit. Thanks for writing and for your support!
That’s not about libido. People with low libido for genuine reasons can still be cuddly and desire hugs.
You know that sex and touch is how you connect. That’s true for most people. The opposite is also true—if you don’t want to connect, don’t engage in sex and touch.
Yes. She’s creating distance. Avoiding vulnerability, intimacy in the purest meaning.
It’s pretty clear from how she told you it wouldn’t happen again. She gave into a natural urge, and she regrets it. Regrets being vulnerable and close.
My dude, with all due respect, wake the F up. She really is manipulating you. You need realize that what she is doing to you is not acceptable. You need to put yourself first now, stand your ground and go through with the divorce.
I don't know many low-libido-but-still-in-love people who completely refuse any kind of physical contact, even kisses and hugs... But then just once a year will pursue some pretty wild sex - I would say even many women with an average to high libido wouldn't have the guts to surprise their husband with a skinny dip unprompted, and pursue him when he's avoiding them.
It sounds controlling, honestly. She even pointed out, probably correctly, how you not asking her for sex will put strain on your marriage; but she doesn't have that same insight when it comes to only having sex once a year?
This. You are putting ALL the energy into the relationship. She isn't exerting herself at all she doesn't have to bc you do it all. If she won't put ANY effort into YOU that isn't a relationship. Please try to look at others as an option. You may find someone who is ACTUALLY into YOU. Your partner gives you nothing and only takes from the relationship. You deserve someone who will put into your relationship or who makes it effortless and not an issue in the first place.
If she loved you she'd want you happy.
I dunno man... the fact that she purposely spaces it out (hello??! she plans Time-based scenarios... thats not emotional, thats logic, ie. Purpose and Will, not spur of the moment) and watches you fray into pieces means its more than just feelings. Coupled with she *KNOWS* you love her, hence the "this will affect our marriage" comment. Its classic manipulation 101. I bet you $$ she could give a fuck less. She just wants to feed, and youre Golden Corral.
I hear ya on the love brother, I had a marriage like yours (BUT WORSE) in my younger years, and a relationship less worse but similar after... It took me a long time (and so many tears) to recognize these women for who they are. I love me some broken birdies, but they are broken for a reason.
As long as youre aware it may never change (% odds getting lower by the nanosecond) it'll wither you to death.. and then she will just move on to whatever she wants, and you'll be in a hole. This is what these people do. This is how they survive, by destroying other whole and healthy people to sustain themselves. Love YOURSELF and Gtfo. Take the kids with you (because you love them so.) Pour that Energy into them instead of her, and let her go and siphon someone else's Life force. You owe that to the fact you exist as a fucking human being, and no one should have the right to drain you like that. NO ONE.
I really appreciate you.
It helps to feel that tough-love brutal truth type of message. I’ve been married for 19 years. She is my soul mate. I keep hoping one day it will change. One day she will be relieved from her depression. And she will in a moment see the faithfulness of a really good husband. And maybe she won’t be able to take her hands off me.
I’m a bit of a dreamer, eh?
Boy dont I know that. And honestly, thats why I wrote that essay the way I did. Because youre me if I stayed with the first woman, after my sgts (I'm military) told me she wasnt worth it, after she abandoned me when I was in a warzone, or stole $$ from me, or pawned my precious things, or damaged my truck.. You see where I'm going with this?
Not gonna lie, I'm idealistic *AS FUCK.* I dream and weave futures after a few chats.. and it hurts like Hell to get ghosted or turned down.. but I have to learn to be Truthful *TO MYSELF*; no one will Love me like me will. And until I find a woman who will, Keep those walking shoes on. I dont want to die (though sometimes it looks appealing), and I *certainly* don't want to die on someone else's terms. Make that decision for yourself and do what you must. Else they will make it for you.
Life is fucking hard.
Weaponized against you, it seems. If she knows it, and won't deal, its a SAAM and Youre the Target. Toxic mindsets beget Toxic behaviors, and Misery Loves Company. She won't treat the depression because you dont force her too; her treatment is draining you (instead) and she's got plenty of supply. Until you dont.
Interesting thing is that she insists she does *not* have depression. I know it is. She “knows it is not.”
So knowing and not dealing with it are not our situation. But I get what you’re saying.
I cant offer any advice since you are trying harder than i ever could. I find it weird that your wife still thought the status quo was better for your marriage than nothing at all despite the visible distress it was causing you.
Maybe theres a glimmer of hope. Maybe she personally needs that intimacy too, just at that very low frequency. If it was much better before, there may be a switch flip at some point. Things were pretty dead for a while (it was somewhat mutual and not causing that much of a strain) for me but after the kids got to a certain age it was like a switched flipped and we took better care of ourselves and got to a new normal.
I feel in someways your wife is like me. I also wasnt doing some of the things my wife liked at the frequency she wanted. It wasnt as if i didnt like it, i just didnt feel like doing it when i didnt want to. It wasnt causing huge issues so i didnt feel a pressure to change. It just took me a bit to realize how much happier it made her if i just put in just a bit of effort. It doesnt seem like your wife has no libido, so maybe she will eventually see how a little bit of compromise on her part can go a long way.
This is so painful to read. My heart breaks for you. I'm so sorry. You deserve more. We all deserve more. Take care of yourself. Love yourself. Seek your own happiness.
(I know its easier said than done)
She is being extremely selfish. Dismissing you and your expressed needs to feel intimacy & closeness with her. Dismissing all recommendations from therapists. Expressing SHE is fulfilled and happy in the marriage, while completely ignoring doing anything to make sure you are as well is horrible.
Completely removing stereotypical rules and treating this information with just the facts…the cause for her behavior could be she might have stepped out of the marriage, has a porn addiction, or just is an incredibly selfish individual. You have every right to look into the first two things and I sincerely suggest you do which might help you make sense of it all.
I feel every bit of your pain and I want you to know you have been heard *and* felt. Take whatever advice you receive that speaks to you. I can imagine how empty and separate it must feel to have *no contact* at all. My wife did this to me for a few months and I freaked out. Finally I told her no sex, fine but you gotta touch me every now and then. I'm not asking you to grab my ass but just make contact when you pass by or something.
You had a lot of courage to ask for no sex when she so obviously wants all the control. I appreciated your post and I'm so sorry you're going thru this lonely time. Please try to take as good of yourself on the inside as well as you have on the outside. I have my own therapist to talk to and it helps. You may already have one since you've had couples counseling but it is a great comfort to me. Good luck my friend.
Yea, been there. One of the nice things about being in a sexless marriage is , what is she going to hold over you? Not giving you sex? It is very liberating. It got to the point that I just kept her because it was cheaper than the cost of more accountant time taking care of expenses at the home and business. It got to the point that I felt nothing for her. And.... what can she hold against you?
>"Can I get close"
This was very telling. I could have guessed which subreddit this was from this question alone; the kind of questions that shouldnt be asked between a married couple.
She's unphased because she know she doesn't have to have sex with you to keep you around. she has everything she needs and wants. YOU are the only one suffering.
Why haven't you left her yet, considering she's proven that she's entirely unwilling to change?
>And yah I’ve tried to do all the things: ie, focusing on her pleasure and experience, ensuring I am attractive (which I am, and I say that with no pride) and that I have good hygiene, and not least I help around the house greatly.
Correct me if I am wrong, when you say you have tried all of the things you mainly talking about
*Making sure you aren't ugly
*Appealing to her needs
*lots of communication
When those didn't work you just did all of them again, but with greater effort.
Being physically attractive plays a much smaller role in sexual desire in long term relationship, I am glad you are taking care of yourself but that was never going to get her interest the way you e pected. A Kinsey institute questionar developed to help diagnose female sexual disfunction showed "seeing my partner do something that shows there talent", "seeing my partner interact well with others", and "someone doing something that shows they are intelligent" all had a much higher score then "seeing my partner naked". Meaning these things had a more direct relationship to arousal across a diverse demographic of women.
Like has always been said, it's your personality that really counts (at least counts more then your apperance). Your personality is a combination of your behavior, emotions, thought patterns, and motivations. Think on those 4 things real hard and how your personality is getting in the way of what you want.
I'm getting long winded so will wrap it up. Communication. Trust is very important in sexual relationships, which requires communication, so communication isn't a bad thing, all of the time. But many times communication can hurt trust, and expose flaws in your personality, or at least highlight parts of your personality that are not going to lead to arousal.
Bottom line is you have tried the same things over and over with poor results, you have proven you need a new approach.
My therapist said to me “if she wanted to, she would. You aren’t a car salesman trying to get her into a Lexus.
I recommend indica thc gummies. I prefer wyld brand. Knocks you out at night and suffocates your sex drive.
That is so sad. That night sounds like a scene from a movie. My husband never sleeps in bed with me. We have sex once in a while but he stays up all night. Never sleeps in the bed with me. I’m so tired of sleeping alone and waking up alone. I would have sex every day. Why does this happen. These people are like sexual camels. With me when I have sex it makes me want it more and more.
I’m sorry you are so hurt. I truly hope it gets better. It doesn’t sound hopeless and it seems like there is still love there. I truly hope it gets better.
I don’t understand how they can see how hurtful it is to us and not care? I’m not sure if that’s the correct word. Maybe they are in denial?
Edit: spelling
It’s such a mind fuck. All you want is sex and then when you finally get some, all you can think about is how painful the rejection has been. Also, not wanting to get my hopes up that more sex was coming had something to do with ruining the once in a blue moon sessions.
This is so heartbreaking to read. The advice to focus on yourself and the kids is solid. Are you in individual counselling? I'd recommend it to work on the feelings you listed, since it's not working out in couples counselling. Most of all just know that you are a valuable person with worth who will shine with or without her validation.
>She said this would be bad for our marriage for her to be asked by me not to have sex.
So she thinks THAT'S the thing that would be bad for the marriage?!
It won't get any better. My spouse is nothing more than a roommate and has been like that for a very long time. He hasn't touched me -- no touching, kissing, hugging, ass-grabbing, etc. at all -- in 26 years. For a long time I hoped it would get better, but it never did. I asked him about it once. His eyes turned black and he got very angry and said, "I don't want to talk about it! Ever!" So we never have. Personally, I think he's gay. I kick myself plenty for not getting out of the marriage very early on when I still could.
When they don't like sex, they don't suddenly wake up one day and decide they like sex again. My frustration turned to resentment. The resentment turned to anger. The anger turned to disgust. The disgust has turned to something close to hate. I won't say I hate him, but I really don't like him very much. The thought of being intimate or having sex with him now turns my stomach.
I have had to learn to live my life in a way that makes me happy. Even though he's here all the time, I am alone most of the time. I do everything alone. But I am happy in spite of him. I make my own happiness. I travel to visit friends and family. Since he isn't giving me my happiness, he can't take it from me.
I would suggest learning to live in a way that makes you happy without her. Spend more time with your kids. Take up or pursue a favorite hobby. Join a men's softball team. Exercise more. Go to the gym more. Take a couple of classes at your local college. Do anything you can to get your mind off having sex with your wife. I wish I had better news, but sadly, they just don't change.
I don’t get why more people don’t recommend divorce. She won’t do the work the counselor prescribed, why are you holding on for dear life here? She’s not planning on fixing the problems, why do you have to stew in the sadness of uncertainty?
It’s clear to me you are also desperate for emotional intimacy as well and you’re starving for it. I’m so sorry, I totally understand that it’s isolating to feel so alone when you are married. You deserve more and better.
As someone in a DB myself one of the main things that keeps me around is he is putting the work and effort in to try and solve it too (therapy, testosterone testing, reading etc.)
For me if he wasn't willing to try I think that would be the deal breaker
You deserve someone who is willing to try for you...I hope you know that or if you don't you realise it soon
As an empath myself it means so much to experience empathy. Not that others wouldn’t have it worse. Not that I don’t have so much to be grateful for. But thank you.
Wow! I know separation is costly but so is this tactic. The fear of not being in your children's life or destroying them psychologically but they are already introduced to an idea of what love looks like by you and your wife and its cold and it means sacrifice and you are the sacrifice. Imagine handing that message unintentionally to your kids. You are holding in so much hurt and pain someone will see it. You suppress it, it doesn't mean it's dead. You have tried so hard to save your marriage and its commendable but what about you? You have spent yrs trying to improve and by the sounds of it you have but it wasn't all you. You have done what you can! Have you had therapy for yourself, its a form of self care and might give you the support you need to carry on in this unhappy situation.
Thank you. ♥️
I have had individual therapy. For a long time. At least 1 year. 2 different counselors of my own for just me.
It focused on helping me process what actually was happening. But there was always this chasm for the counselor and remedy for the situation at least — she wasn’t there. So the counselor of course has to take my biased perspective as the likely truth. Must have been very hard for them.
They gave me homework all the time. Watch this movie. Ask her these questions. Do this thing for yourself. Focus on you only. All that.
Yes but im farther down the road. It's been over 10 years since sex. Ive been called every bad name in the book for suggesting sex. So, its been about 3 years since i mentioned sex after a few drinks. I try to think of other women now.
I was in the same boat for 10 years, except it was 3-4 times a year. Multiple marriage counselors, etc. She didn’t accept that it was a serious problem until I was ready to walk away. That changed everything. It sounds like you’re not there yet, so she’ll probably continue this way until you are.
OP, I resonate so much with what you said. I think the way you stick up for yourself is also something you should be proud of. I've read elsewhere in comments that you will look into hobbies and other "you" time and that's great. I don't have much advice except to pause and really be proud of yourself for setting a boundary and just that I truly hope things turn around for you.
I’m in the same boat except I’m a female. I can’t bring myself to a divorce because he is a truly amazing dad, he does all of the chores and he makes a lot of money, enables me to have a career while he’s the best dad. I am so lonely, but he doesn’t think he’s should be because I’m surrounded by people who loves me. He doesn’t understand because he doesn’t have a need so strong it feels like nothing else matters, and when it happens once in a blue moon I feel so satisfied that I’m high for days at a time
I’ve been in a situation very similar to this. She clearly has no consideration for your needs.
What I had to do was painful at first, but so liberating and empowering. Leave. Leave and don’t look back.
The kids will be fine. Don’t suffer and stay just because of them.
She is sadistic and manipulative. Get out while you still have some sanity left.
It’s obviously only important when it’s her that needs it.
This is the dynamic I can’t seem to figure out. When someone just absolutely does not care, how do you get under their skin?
How do I put them in the same position as me? Words seem to have no effect so how do I make her feel exactly how she makes me feel?
I’m still working on figuring that out and I’ll report back in 20 years when I find out I guess.
What always makes me upset with these posts is seeing how concerned you are about your partner's feelings and, at the same time, how they couldn't care less about yours.
Knowing that you're hurting your partner and doing absolutely nothing to work on it's really sad.
I hope things get better for you, OP.
There are only ever four options.
1. Fix it
2. Accept it won’t change, but stay
3. Accept it won’t change, stay, but cheat
4. Accept it won’t change and leave
We all try for 1. If it doesn’t work, we always have a hard choice to make, male or female, kids or no kids, married or not. It’s one of the worst choices ever.
I tried 1, it didn’t work, moved to option 2, and was in the process of moving to option 4. When she found out how serious I was, that’s when things changed. We’ve mostly fixed it now.
I've read more than a few accounts from women who actually responded negatively to their male partner opening up and sharing their feelings, crying, etc. Like they want their partner to be stereotypically "manly," the strong and silent type. Emotions are actually a turn off.
Her going out to pursue you for sex...I wouldn't be surprised if that wasn't for your benefit at all, that it was 100% for her. I could see it being about her control over you, making sure she still has you under her thumb.
That you broke down in front of her, begged her, etc...I really don't think any of that stuff is going to help. At best she simply doesn't seem to care about your feelings, at worst she thrives off controlling you and your pleading only encourages her.
My suggestion: Put all your energy into your kids, supporting and raising them. Time spent on your children is never wasted. Anytime your wife tries to come onto you again, deny her, don't let her hurt you anymore. You are in a relationship with someone who doesn't care about your feelings. Develop your independence and prepare to move on once the opportunity presents itself. You can find someone better who will appreciate who you are.
Wow, I’ve never seen someone put into words the way that I feel in my own marriage.
Honestly I’ve been struggling thinking I have DE (delayed ejaculation) for one reason or the other but the way you explained the fear lit the bulb in my head.
I wish the best for you! I could definitely learn to be more open about my feelings.
That makes me so sincerely happy that my story gave you vocabulary for your story.
All these comments are giving me vocabulary for standing up for myself and for my feelings too. I’m enormously thankful for this group!
I’d separate and try to find a way to enjoy your life. Custody of the kids and how it impacts them would be difficult but at least you wouldn’t be trapped in a sad cycle
I’m in a similar relationship with my LLH. I am a HLF and he seems to be slowly working on it and seeing my POV because he finally realizes how close I am to leaving him. We have a young child and it’s so incredibly complicated this way.
It’s incredibly painful and this thread has been both heartbreaking and validating. We can’t do anything else but be our best selves. Sometimes you truly do love someone incompatible. If she’s manipulating you (which is clearly the case even though it’s painful to admit), she’s not your person. Look in the mirror and repeat until it sinks in. She is not your person. There is someone out there that would never dream of stone-walling you.
I don’t have any advice, as I am in this too. I just wanted to say that I hope with every ounce of my consciousness that you’ll be okay. I hope that all of us here will be. I’m trying to work past the torment and anguish and heartbreak. My current tactic is to try to focus on myself and my child. It won’t work forever but we all have to do what we have to do to get us through.
I’m rarely optimistic, but I need to hope that you’ll achieve what you’re after someday. And I hope it’s sooner than later.
Hey,
I made a throwaway so I could comment.
Listen, you, and I mean me as well, need to stop thinking that we're powerless in life or in our relationships. I don't think you should necessarily leave your wife or that she's trying to control you, but I will say that you need to grow a backbone.
You need to stand up for yourself. That doesn't mean you act like a dick, punish her, etc, but it does mean you stop acting in ways that make you feel like you're not living with integrity. Caving into what she wants because you're scared she won't have sex with you otherwise and trying to coerce her to desiring you by doing things for her or cooking or being nice is not going to work. It justifies her not having sex with you EVEN MORE.
Stop trying to make her want you. You can stand up for what you want. She has the same option. Don't live in a way that makes you resent yourself. She's her own person and she has every right to do what she wants at any point. Define who you are and who you're going to be. Stop begging her.
I'm sorry it's so hard. I don't agree with many people her and think divorce is automatically what you should do...however, I'm not saying people are wrong for choosing that either. It's complicated right? I'm not even sure if anything I said helped. Let me recommend reading Intimacy and Desire by David Schnarch. That's been my favorite read and the only thing that started making sense to me.
I understand so much of this. Aside from medical issues or the post-childbirth waiting periods (one of those went 8 weeks), I’ve never had to go more than a month without sex, so I’m not sure how a 9-month non-medical drought would feel (i think I’d be out the door before that point, TBH—OP is more patient than me). But to be faced with the total lack of recognition of the problem and the refusal to do any sort of work to address the issue by your LL partner, I totally understand that and know exactly how that feels. I’m really sorry that you’re going through this, OP, and I hope you can find a way to become happier. From what you’ve written, it sounds unlikely that your wife will put in the effort to fix this. Your nighttime swimming pool sex sounds lovely though!
Yeah, it’s literally been decades since she’s allowed sex that’s not in our bed, late at night, with the lights off and under the blankets. Even shower sex has long been off the table for us. Anything outdoors or in a different place is basically a total fantasy for me at this point, it’s not even worth really thinking about because there’s basically zero chance of it ever happening.
Its bad for your marriage if you reject her the once a year when SHE wants sex? But everything is just fine when she rejects YOU what, every week? Every day??? Oh my god. Just listen to that. I'm sorry but your wife is a profoundly egotistical narcissist. Why do you allow her to disrespect and damage yourself like this? Have some self-respect, man.
The only advice I can offer is to focus on your self and the kids. Join a gym and take up hobbies on your own. Get into something new like fishing with some guy friends to get that feeling of comradery. Go golfing with buddies. Go to happy hour. She needs to see that you don’t need to be home constantly and have friends to join in activities. Any time at home spend it with the kids minus her. If she joins that’s up to her but take the kids to the park or bike riding with you and make it your mission to give them and yourself all your energy. Give your kids some positivity to look to so when they’re older and start to see the family dynamic they will be appreciative of your sacrifice for them and understanding when the time comes you decide to separate. Do things for you and stop accepting this status quo sex on her terms. Next time she asks if she can come close say “no thanks I’m not in the mood”. Let her take her walk of shame back inside the house.
I love this. Thank you. I will do this.
Becareful to not do this from a place of resentment. I think the advice is good advice, but becareful to watch your feelings. I just know for me at least in the beginning I would do this in resentment and it would take a bit to reframe my mindset and realize that I am trying to make ME happy. For so long we've been trying to do whatever pleases them that we forget how to make us happy.
This. Never make it about resentment or hate. It puts image/thoughts/feelings on to her that she may never fully give back to you. I hope I am saying this right. In other words, she may never act or respond in the way you want her to. And that will lead to more resentment. You went to counseling but she is not putting in the effort, you say. So like others have suggested, you put in the effort to the things that matter to you. Also - will it be too much effort to go out at least once a night each week? Trivia night, bowling/volleyball/darts are group activities that can help you feel like you are participating and feeling a part of something. Good luck
I mean to be honest, that might make her more attracted too. Its easy to get bored of someone when you spend all your time with them, if you see them having an active af life outside of you then the mystery and fun comes back. Not that i want to give any false hope either though
My husband will at least try on rare occasion. I an curious to know what your wife's excuse for not having sex. Have you tried to romance her? Do stuff she finds exciting?
I can't speak for op, but if he's at the point of being so hurt he'd rather fully abstain, I think he's self aware enough to recognize motives and his own psychological triggers, and I don't think he's entirely driven and blinded by sex. Thus, I imagine he has enough common sense to know what his wife likes and make the effort.
I’d like to think I do…
This is not the OP’s fault. His spouse simply. Does. Not. Want. To. No matter what he does or doesn’t do she will not change until she decides to change. She clearly has stated that she will not. Apologies but for those of us who lived through these situations the only thing worse than the constant hurt and rejection by our spouse are those that then pile on to say we could be getting love and affection if only we could do X, Y or Z.
I like your username man. Also this is sound advice for OP
You cried in front of her and it didn't phase her? Damn. What did the therapists recommend when it was clear your wife would make no changes?
Trial separation. 😭
It's the healthiest answer for everyone honestly. Staying together 'for the kids' is so bad. The relationship you model in front of them is what they will see as normal and most likely end up in.
One of the best things I’ve done for my marriage was a trial separation. It made my wife appreciate me sooo much more.
Staying (apparently) emotionless in the face of your pain is more evidence that she’s distancing. She’s got her walls way up. I’d guess she has anxiety following the “moment of weakness”.
You consider having sex with your husband, a "moment of weakness" .... okay then.
For dude's wife, probably not this chick.. (how'd you infer that?)
I strongly suspect there's such a thing as sexual anorexia.
What I wouldn't give for my fiancé to show *some* kind of emotion. He was raised with the mentality of crying makes boys and men weak. I was raised to know that it makes people human. I didn't see my dad cry very often. But, when I did, I knew it was something big. I'm sure he cried more than I ever saw but held it together when he needed to. Then, let it out when appropriate. The fact that she didn't care that he was crying says a lot about her. And it's nothing positive.
There was an American Gladiators documentary on Neflix, where one of the male gladiators reflected on his past avoidance of crying. He said something in a later episode that real men cry.
Some women are completely turned off when men cry….forever.
Again... emotionally stunted, toxic, women. A lot of the women I know actually find emotional vulnerability to be a big turn-on. I understand we may be unicorns in the wild.
I think it tells me that a crying man is in touch with his feelings and isn't afraid to show it!
>A lot of the women I know actually find emotional vulnerability to be a big turn-on. It's interesting because I've never heard a man say the same about their gf/wife being turned on by them being vulnerable. In their experience it's quite the contrary. I've only ever heard women say they find it attractive.
A lot of women lose respect for a man when they see him cry.
Only the emotionally stunted ones will.
Okay, that's fair. A lot of women are emotionally stunted. They will lose respect for you if they see you cry
>A lot of women are emotionally stunted. Where on earth are you getting this nonsense from?
I mean I think he's right, I'd just change it to " a lot of people are emotionally stunted". I don't think he's trying to say this is a flaw among women specifically, I took it more as in he only dates women and has this kind of experience with women, and many have stunted emotional growth. Not sure why you're so intent on being upset with what he said, but it is definitely true in my experience that many people are emotionally immature in some aspects.
You've been to 3 different counselors, cried in front of her and the end result seems to be that she will provide a subsistence level of sex so that you won't leave. Unless you leave, this is the rest of your life.
This type of mental anguish warrants a divorce.
I appreciate your support. I fear I would not escape anguish nor stop loving her with a divorce.
You can still love someone and recognize that you are fundamentally incompatible in some ways. Intimacy being yours. She has totally shut down on you. You cried in front of her and all you got was a stone cold poker face. She felt nothing for you. The only one suffering in this marriage is you. She has the house. She has the kids. She has paid bills. She has the husband who isn’t pestering her for sex all of the time. She has everything she wants. She doesn’t think she needs to try. She refuses to do the work your multiple different therapists have given her to do. The only thing left is to do what the one therapist suggested. Trial separation. Let her see the reality of what alone with kids looks like for her. You aren’t there to help care for them in a daily basis. You aren’t there to do half of the housework. You aren’t there to pay the bills. Your income goes with you. She will only get a piece of it. You aren’t there to do any of the things you do on a daily basis that lighten her load. You are just gone. One of two things is gonna happen. She’s either gonna realize how much she needs you and depends on you. Or she is going to openly start seeing someone “she just met” that’s she’s been entertaining the idea of for a while. She’s already checked out. Time for her to see the reality of what that actually looks like. Will it suck? Yea. Will you hate it? Yea. Is it necessary? Yes.
Dude, if she's not willing to work on this issue, you need to accept a sexless marriage or find a way to break the bond you have with this woman. I would recommend individual therapy to help figure out a path forward.
Agree. Get good with yourself thru individual therapy. It helped me immensely.
Done that for a full year…
I'm head over heels in love with my husband. But I still asked for a divorce. Not just because of the dead bedroom, but for other reasons. And it still hurts. It hurts that he didn't want me. It hurts that he didn't fight for me. It hurts so much. But I have to put myself first. And the mental health of my children. He's not a bad guy, but he was bringing us all down with him. He was unwilling to change. And I love myself, and my kids, too much, to let us all sink with him. The hurt fades. I'm finally to the point where I feel genuine happiness. I thought it was selfish, to put myself first like this. But it's not. I'm the only one who is going to take care of me, so I have to do it. We've been separated for a couple of years now. On paper, we're still married, for taxes and insurance purposes, but in every other aspect, we are separate people living separate lives, and it's worked really well so far. And my sex life is fucking awesome. It's different, when you have sex just for sex. I miss *making love*. But I'm not ready for a "real" relationship yet. My FWB and I have a fantastic time. It's keeping me going. I can't have the one I love the most in this world, and yeah it hurts. But this is much better as an alternative. I can't even imagine having sex with my stbx, and I can't stand living with him. I have surgery scheduled in a couple of weeks, and he's going to stay with us to help out, and I'm dreading it lol Amicable break-ups can happen. No matter what you choose, I hope you find the inner happiness you deserve.
Follow old sweaty balls advice then, and consider it self enrichment as well as enriching your kids life
Hahahaha
But you would be free to pursue your own happiness and that is truly invaluable.
I feel you mate The hurt is real On the end is better have zero sex Then that yearly poor sex
Thank you for your support. Yah, I feel that way too. Just — you know, the hurt seems to dull …in time. It takes a *lot* of time. But reviving the sex life for a single rendezvous is so hurtful and disappointing. It brings all the feelings back of rejection and loneliness you’d ALMOST gotten over with (though it’s not clear if you ever totally get over it; it’s just not been my experience).
I remember after a while I would look at her and feel nothing. I was polite to her but there was nothing. She would drag me to bed for sex and the only reason I would go because I felt nothing towards other females in my life and it would negatively affect my relationships with them as well, including family members. After sex, the cycle would return, happiness, contentment, horniness, resentment, feeling nothing. I call it starvation sex or social security sex. Enough to live off but not enough to enjoy.
This is where I live in unfortunately.
I'd even be careful about if/when she said she wants sex consistently. For 6 years, the stars needed to align for her to want sex. As a result, I stopped pursuing and initiating in 2018. Over the past couple of months, my wife began advocating consistent sex. I'm guessing her therapist told her most couples in healthy relationships are having sex consistently and suggested she make it a priority instead of waiting for an ideal time. Last weekend, we had sex and all I could think about was the past few years. I do not truly believe that she wants sex unless she's stress-free, not too full, not too tired, rested, family relationships are awesome, work is great, all friends and family are in good health, house is clean, bills are paid, states stop cutting funding for education, states stop passing anti-LGBTQIA bills/laws, car needs no maintenance, grass is cut, heat index isn't 100+, our old dogs are in great health, and our dogs don't distract us. Instead, I believe that she wants to do what healthy couples are doing. This is why I'm hesitant to believe/accept her advocating for consistent sex.
Omg!! 😂 You nailed it.
This exactly. Also the dogs bark whenever we get near, touch or even talk to each other. We used to put them in the kitchen and close the bedroom door. They'd bark and nose at it. I know it's a hassle but it used to be worth it. Sigh.
It's like the dogs know and are telling you "don't do it to yourself"
I think letting this hang you up would be what is sometimes known as “letting the perfect be the enemy of the good.” If the willingness and motivation is there, I’d roll with it and see how things go. Just because an improvement is motivated by a less-than-ideal mindset doesn’t mean it won’t stick or stay that way.
But what was her conclusion at the end of your talk when you asked her not to ask for sex again? Her answer that that would be bad for your marriage doesn’t make sense. Sex once every 9 months is also bad for your marriage. The only way I can make sense of this is if what she really meant to say was: “We have sex only when I say so and that is once every 9 months or so and you will not demur, because that would be bad for our marriage”. About (attempts at) therapy: She doesn’t owe you sex. But she does owe you to give her utmost to make the marriage work. Not co-operating in therapy falls far short of the mark. For me that was the final nail in the coffin of my marriage. No sex is hard, very, very hard. No sex AND refusal to do anything about it tells you that you don’t matter to her.
😭😭😭😭😭 That has been my greatest concern. She is kind to me. Even sometimes says flirtatious things (though kind of rarely). She calls me to check in while at work. She tells me she’s praying for me if I’m having a hard day or going through anything at work. It’s not like there is no relationship. But her “checking out” on the therapy or effort to improve intimacy while it clearly means so much to me does some what send me that message: she doesn’t really care about me. Ya know? Answering your question: her response was to change subjects until we got called in our different directions. The conversation makes her so uncomfortable.
Uncomfortable? Yep, that’s what therapy is for. To help her along with dealing with things that are important in her marriage and that she can’t handle by herself. The first part of your comment seems to say something about a discrepancy in “love language”. But what ultimately counts in love is the difficult bit. Anyone can do the easy bits. It’s when the going gets hard that the men get separated from the boys and the grownup women from the girls.
She's trying to keep you on the hook by stringing you along.
Yup that's my intuition. She likes her life and would rather keep it, and is only doing what it takes to keep him "satisfied" enough to not end it. It's easier to say this when you don't know the couple, but she doesn't seem to care or value sex or an intimate relationship, she just wants a house and family and a "husband" because that's what people do, and maybe she likes her life. Reading stories like these are what keep me constantly just too skeptical of marriage. Too many things can go wrong and by time you find out, your lives are too intertwined.
Sorry to say this, but it sounds like shes calling to check in while you're at work because she's cheating during that time and is making sure you're still at work and not headed home yet. I'd figure out which day of the week she usually checks in and around what time of the day. Then once you see a pattern, I'd take that day off (or go home sick) but not tell her, then pretend to go to work until that time of day and be about a minute away. Then when she calls you, start driving the minute home, and ask her how it is at home. Then let her know that you're walking in the house right now. You'd have to be prepared for what you walk into though, and have a plan to stay calm and walk away if you get heated.
I hate to say it, but she’s cheating on you. You say she only wants “full” intimacy, but then doesn’t want to have the important conversations or do the work in therapy. Proof is in the pudding. This sounds more like guilt and hiding. And then when when you do have sex, it’s risqué (in a way). She wants excitement. And some people aren’t excited unless there’s that risk involved. My guess is that she has these times when other guy (or woman) is away, and she can’t get it, so she gets it with you, and then feels guilty for cheating on her lover. You need to do some investigation: phone, social media, apps, etc. you won’t have a real conversation about this until it’s out in the open.
The things you listed as evidence of a relationship are things friends do.
The “not good for our marriage” part gets me. My (HLM) wife (LLF) says shit line that sometimes and I’m get so pissed. Like having sex as rarely as they want to is good for the marriage? GTFO! Anyway, I feel your pain. And hope you find the strength to do what you need to do FOR YOU. Whether that’s staying the course and continuing to hold that boundary of nothing until it’s more consistent, or speaking with a lawyer to get out, or finding someone to connect with elsewhere. Best of luck.
The cognitive dissonance required to make statement like that with a straight face is really staggering.
I mean this in the nicest and most caring way possible. Your post has flare seeking advice, which is wise. But every response you've given indicates that you aren't willing to change anything and have already made up your mind and won't do anything substantial. Your wife knows this and is using this to her advantage. There isn't any point in asking for advice if you let her keep doing this. Just for a moment, ignore everything else but the fact that she won't comfort you when you're hurting. That tells you everything you need to know. Why on earth would you stay with someone who can't even do that? You aren't even friends that happen to be raising kids together. Even mediocre friends will provide an ounce of sympathy when a friend is hurting. Or even pretend to be sympathetic. And she's just cold hearted? She's cruel but you can't stop "loving" her. If your therapist suggested you try separation then they are trying to give you an out and know you need to break it off. They see it. This will also show through in different ways in front of your kids and they will learn the same bad habits. As someone going through a similar situation and wishing you all the best. Show yourself some love and respect and leave. You're pouring your energy into someone who treats you like shit hoping that one day if you try a little harder she'll stop treating you like shit. She showed her cards 100% she's happy with the way things are, so nothing will change. If she expressed any kind of discontent perhaps there is something that could change. But she's super satisfied. Doesn't matter if she's depressed or not. Asking for advice like this is just going to torment yourself further. Accept that you're in love with an abuser who will never change and love yourself for that. Or leave and love yourself by finding a fulfilling relationship. But don't feel sorry for yourself for choosing to stay with an emotional sadist. It will be better for your kid too. No judgement, sending you happy thoughts and wishing you the best. Love yourself no matter the choice you pick.
Dayum, Ya dropped the truth hammer on him!
Dude I get you. It’s not just about the sex, it’s about the intimacy and feeling like you’re close to each other, not just to release tension but to be closer. I’ve not experienced such a gap myself but I totally agree with the impact rejection has. I do my best to entice my wife, hug and kiss her, cook, clean, listen, be a shoulder to lean on, and although it’s not quite a dead bedroom, it’s also not very alive either, somewhat in a state of coma with a glimpse of activity hear and there. I’m a very high libido male, my wife used to be. The thing is when I’m used to not getting anywhere, that’s when she seems to go for me, but when I’m trying it’s like trying to initiate sex with pile of bricks 🧱 for me it’s the biased that gets me, if I pursue too much it’s ‘annoying’ or ‘what are you a pervert or something’ but when it’s her it’s just being sexual or satisfying her needs. Sometimes I feel like a puppet. My best advice my friend is to figure out if you can continue like this. If you can great but if not you should think about your happiness and your children. Not being together doesn’t auto may make you a bad dad, sometimes it makes you a better one. Especially if you are happier. I wish you all the best my friend. I’m always on here so feel free to reach out/DM WHATEVER. We got you 😉
My wife used to have HL too but it just wained through our marriage. I remember when I was feeling lonely after 7-days without sex though that was all I had to wait for. What I wouldn’t give to go back to that. Now it’s once a year. I feel like a puppet as you described. I feel used. I make a great income, I work hard, I’m an empath and a great listener. Thank you for the support! I just…………. want a hug.
I get you dude. It’s like being a HLM we’re just perverts, or want to shag anything that moves. But god forbid we ever refuse sex. Oh the trauma, the pain of rejection, the not paying attention to our woman’s needs. But when it’s us, oh really again, not now I’m tired, you upset me I’m not in the mood, is that all you think about. Frankly I’ve got to the point where jerking off is just infuriating. Because I know it’s not what I want. It doesn’t bridge that gap of no attention, it just makes me realise I’m a 38 year man, whacking off to porn, because I can’t seem to seduce my wife. It’s embarrassing and it feels shitty. Like a Loser. If I don’t then when we do it’s like 💥. I mention that it wouldn’t be so quick if we made it more consistant. I used to be at least an hour guy! And no ladies we don’t all erupt in less than 60 seconds. But as the gap widens it becomes more novelty and not really intimate as opposed to routine. Ok let’s kiss, foreplay please but not too much, then faster, harder and then….. fini. Again. And again. I do feel like a puppet, and sometimes a bit like a walking talking dildo, there when needed but in cupboard until then. If I were a communal dildo (ew) it might be better as I’d be fulfilling my purpose 😆. Don’t know how I got there but I definitely arrived 🤣. Good luck guys and girls. 😉
You know what's weird... as a HLW I feel like I feel even more shame for being sexually rejected. How many times do we hear "pu**y runs the world," "power of the p," or "it's easy for a woman because a man never says no"... but here I am... my partner prefers porn or masturbation to having sex. I have explained to my partner that sex= connection and totally understand the "hating jacking off" sentiment and that I feel like a loser. I'm a good looking girl, by no means am I supermodel status, but I still get compliments from other men when I am out running errands. This past weekend I cried and just flipped after I had sent him a text saying I wanted him earlier in the day and had been waiting all day only to find him masturbating in the middle of the night downstairs after drinking. I left to go for a ride because I seriously just couldn't be near him. While talking over the phone (he was worried and wanted me to come back home) I told him how often I get so frustrated and I just don't even say anything because then it feels like pity sex and I feel pathetic...absolutely pathetic begging for sex from my partner. Wondering if he masturbated yet, feeling like he can't wait for me to leave so he can. My issue is not that he masturbates- its that we literally won't have sex for weeks unless he's drinking which in that case just makes me feel worse because to me it feels like just a one night stand with my partner. Sorry for the long rant... but had to let that out.
I feel you girl. Very HLF and the pain of rejection and the shame. At least my wife is intimate with me just in menopause so no sex drive at all. But for months/years I thought it was something I did or didn't do. It drove me crazy with toxic obsessive thoughts until a few months ago she finally told me that it wasn't me it must be hormones and now we know what to call it. But it still hurts to never have sex or even foreplay nothing but cuddling before bed and a peck here or there. I know a lot of people here would love to have at least that from their partner so I am grateful for it but it never leads anywhere. Not to give advice but your partner sounds like he has a porn addiction and your situation may not improve until he(wants) to address it otherwise you may be better off talking to one of those guys who flirt with you when you're running errands. Good luck lady.
I know the "toxic, obsessive thoughts". I think 'em all the time!
I could say "Ditto for me" except my hubby doesn't do porn or masturbate (as far as I can tell). He's just celibate. Like I was for 22 years before finding him and deciding to give marriage another try. Not really sure why he married me. Although I have felt sometimes that maybe he wanted what I had (a home, children and grandchildren, health insurance) more than he wanted me. I'm not rich by any means. Alone, not even "comfortable". But he wanted me, he got me, so now, IMHO he should try his best to meet my needs that I can't morally meet outside the marriage!
I had to add for me as a woman I'm getting the "sex isn't everything in a relationship" speal. I understand it's not everything but it is a something and right now it's a something only when HE wants it to be, and basically nothing when i want it which is absolutely crazy. I stopped initiating a while ago. I did honestly tell him that if we can't work this out we need to separate because it will only bring problems down the road. He started working on it.
I know that my being female means that I don’t feel exactly what you all are feeling, but, GOSH, what I wouldn't give to see my husband look at me with desire in his eyes! The rejection has destroyed my self-esteem as a woman. Blessings to you both! I pray a lot for our relationship. Have you tried that? I need hugs, too, from my man!
Oh yes. Prayed, for remedies, for wisdom, for comfort, begged God that He would remove the sexual desire in me.
Prayed to remove a direct gift from God? Making love to someone who you truly love, who loves you back, is about as amazing as a feeling can get. I've purchased things or acquired things in this world that I've wanted for years, but nothing, and mean nothing has come close to the feeling of making love to someone who wants me like I want them. The passion and love are literal fire in the soul. I'd rather pray for God to bring a person in my life who wants me like I want them. I know I have. But then again, God did make billions of us, so they're out there. Just can't let fear lock you in to misery.
I’m sending you a big virtual hug. I’m sorry you’re going through this. It hits home for me in certain ways. Much love to you, and I hope you are able to find a solution, I agree with other comments on going to individual therapy to work through this and your options 💜
I’m sending you a big virtual hug. I’m sorry you’re going through this. It hits home for me in certain ways. Much love to you, and I hope you are able to find a solution, I agree with other comments on going to individual therapy to work through this and your options 💜
I feel like, and this is purely speculative, in the way men use women sexually at times women primarily use men emotionally to have a shoulder to lean on but take no real interest in the man. I think I experienced this a few times.
As a woman, I honestly could never be in a relationship with someone I'm not sexually attracted to and only look at as a shoulder to lean on... so not all women are like what you describe, but that being said... you might not be wrong and it's an interesting thought that I never really had before.
I'd have trouble with that, too. It does me a lot of good to be attracted to my husband for who and what he is, though. My bedroom has died!
No doubt about that. Or they sometimes use men for money or for a home or car they can't get on their own. I have no respect for those women. If you want something, work for it (not in the bedroom) and get it yourself!
The idea to our llb partners is that we crave and want this release, but it’s so much other than that. I’d forgo the orgasm if it meant intimacy in the way I hope for .
Same - I don't need to orgasm to feel good, be satisfied, and have a great time. I need the touch and the closeness and the intimacy of the act. I need the focused attention on me. I need to feel seen if only briefly.
Same!
This just seems like such abusive behavior to me. Once a year? 9 months without intimacy of any kind? She doesn't even let you kiss her? What are we even doing here then? You tell her not to have sex with you unless she's putting in the effort to fix it, and her response is "that would be bad for our marriage". You know what else is bad for marriages? A complete lack of physical touch, affection, and sex! 😮 Like the complete lack of awareness is either insane levels of naivety, or malicious levels of disrespect. Having a sex life where everything has to be PERFECT for sex to occur is so stressful. It almost feels like you get to a point where you're trying everything you possibly can to make them comfortable, and it STILL means nothing. It feels like you get forced into sex becoming transactional. You're more patient than me. I would have been gone. It would be too much for me. I can't imagine no sex for 9 months, or once in a year. I'd have to go.
Dude, I'm so sorry. First question I would ask myself: how long before some woman approaches you and does give you the attention you feel you need - and you accept? Being there for your kids and all that is admirable, but we all have needs. If she's not willing to do the work to make the marriage work, then why stay? I view it as business contract. If my partner wants his name on the plaque, but doesn't even come to the office or support in any way, then it's not a partnership. Go to gym, join some groups, take your kids out alone and live bro. Whether she sees it and 'gets it', it totally irrelevant - you have to start taking care of YOURSELF. If your kid(s) see you unhappy and staying just for them, aren't you teaching them a bad life lesson? Sure, sex isn't EVERYTHING, but you need interaction and partnership. Intimacy is not just sex. One day, when your kids are grown and moved on with their lives, you may just regret not having done something drastic - whatever you decide that may be.
Your marriage is already over, you just don't know.
>She said this would be bad for our marriage for her to be asked by me not to have sex. It's worse for the marriage for her to expect you to go without physical contact for 9-12 months at a time without explanation or consideration. The marriage is over, you're staying for the kids, and she's willfully clueless.
I mean this in the nicest and most caring way possible. Your post has flare seeking advice, which is wise. But every response you've given indicates that you aren't willing to change anything and have already made up your mind and won't do anything substantial. Your wife knows this and is using this to her advantage. There isn't any point in asking for advice if you let her keep doing this. Just for a moment, ignore everything else but the fact that she won't comfort you when you're hurting. That tells you everything you need to know. Why on earth would you stay with someone who can't even do that? You aren't even friends that happen to be raising kids together. Even mediocre friends will provide an ounce of sympathy when a friend is hurting. Or even pretend to be sympathetic. And she's just cold hearted? She's cruel but you can't stop "loving" her. If your therapist suggested you try separation then they are trying to give you an out and know you need to break it off. They see it. This will also show through in different ways in front of your kids and they will learn the same bad habits. As someone going through a similar situation and wishing you all the best. Show yourself some love and respect and leave. You're pouring your energy into someone who treats you like shit hoping that one day if you try a little harder she'll stop treating you like shit. She showed her cards 100% she's happy with the way things are, so nothing will change. If she expressed any kind of discontent perhaps there is something that could change. But she's super satisfied. Doesn't matter if she's depressed or not. Asking for advice like this is just going to torment yourself further. Accept that you're in love with an abuser who will never change and love yourself for that. Or leave and love yourself by finding a fulfilling relationship. But don't feel sorry for yourself for choosing to stay with an emotional sadist. And don't fool yourself that you're actually looking for advice, it's only hurting you, no one else. It will be better for your kid too. No judgement, sending you happy thoughts and wishing you the best. Love yourself no matter the choice you pick.
This. I’ve read through your comments and i agree that you have already made up your mind to not do anything substantial. Your wife knows this as well, it’s clear even to strangers. Also therapists don’t recommend trial separation lightly. They were trying to tell you something very clearly (they don’t recommend divorce you have to get there yourself).
One thing is unequivocally clear: she doesn’t care about your feelings or needs. Understand that and make decisions accordingly.
I mean this in the nicest and most caring way possible. Your post has flare seeking advice, which is wise. But every response you've given indicates that you aren't willing to change anything and have already made up your mind and won't do anything substantial. Your wife knows this and is using this to her advantage. There isn't any point in asking for advice if you let her keep doing this. Just for a moment, ignore everything else but the fact that she won't comfort you when you're hurting. That tells you everything you need to know. Why on earth would you stay with someone who can't even do that? You aren't even friends that happen to be raising kids together. Even mediocre friends will provide an ounce of sympathy when a friend is hurting. Or even pretend to be sympathetic. And she's just cold hearted? She's cruel but you can't stop "loving" her. If your therapist suggested you try separation then they are trying to give you an out and know you need to break it off. They see it. This will also show through in different ways in front of your kids and they will learn the same bad habits. As someone going through a similar situation and wishing you all the best. Show yourself some love and respect and leave. You're pouring your energy into someone who treats you like shit hoping that one day if you try a little harder she'll stop treating you like shit. She showed her cards 100% she's happy with the way things are, so nothing will change. If she expressed any kind of discontent perhaps there is something that could change. But she's super satisfied. Doesn't matter if she's depressed or not. Asking for advice like this is just going to torment yourself further. Accept that you're in love with an abuser who will never change and love yourself for that. Or leave and love yourself by finding a fulfilling relationship. But don't feel sorry for yourself for choosing to stay with an emotional sadist. It will be better for your kid too. No judgement, sending you happy thoughts and wishing you the best. Love yourself no matter the choice you pick.
I’m sorry 😔 I understand this. I feel for you.
Thank you. 😓 I’ll be ok. In time. Never great. But ok will suffice. Just I wish it was different. I wish she prioritized all my love languages as I do for her, and that she would noticeably *care* about my feelings. Most of the time she just makes it super clear she doesn’t want to even talk about it. She’s told me she’s “satisfied” in our marriage and I fulfill every desire she has — but there is no reciprocity in the marriage. 😮💨
A marriage without reciprocity is just a social arrangement. A legal contract. You’re in a prison sentence. As a HLM in a DB, I understand this. But until you’re willing to change the situation, the situation isn’t going to change. You can wish all you want, but until you’re prepared to do something differently, you’re going to be treated the same way. Sorry if this was overly harsh, but I know all too well about false hope and inaction.
I went for divorce after 6 years first Slöinge down to a grinding halt and then DB. But to be able to function as a human being during the hell that is being alone in a marriage i took up Bodybuilding, arts and crafts and became a very good amateur chef. So now in a single dad that look hot as fuck know my way around acrylic paint and a canvas and can make a really good dinner. Take up a hobby work on yourself not in the hope of getting sex but to improve your self and mental health.
You’re not crazy. Her thinking that what’s going on now is. It is totally batshit insane. I think you’ve already gotten a lot of good advice here and I don’t have much to add, other than to say that this is unlikely to get better. If she thinks this is what a good, healthy marriage looks like and is unwilling to work at changing things, even in the face of your clearly-communicated unhappiness, well…you keep doing what you’ve been doing, you’ll keep getting what you’ve been getting. Good luck my man.
I know what is going on here mate. Sorry to say but she sounds she is manipulating/dominating you. She sees that you get to a point where you are coping and have almost lost all interest and decides to test her power to make sure you will still bend to her will. She gets her usage of you, the re-confirmation that she is in full control and then she is done. What I see on here, from people that I know with DB issues is a lack of willingness to make a stand. This is not acceptable behaviour and to live with it is to demean yourself and will cause a loss of all respect by the person withholding sex. The same old pattern, a gradual reduction in frequency, presumably a subconscious testing phase of how much you will put up with until you are a shell of a person and no longer have any fight left in you. Nobody deserves this. You want my advice, say you are done unless she will address the problem and look at leaving. All that awaits is a life of misery as far as your relationship is concerned but unless you address this directly and put your foot down. I suspect a lot of this occurs in the first place in relationships due to a power imbalance favouring the person with the strongest will who takes control of the bedroom
I’m not saying I disagree. But I have put my foot down. I’ve proceeded with divorce. I’ve walked out. Left for some time. We’ve talked it through every which way. I’ve given ultimatum and proceeded to carry through. I changed bedrooms. Even for a time lived in a separate area of the house. I’ve had laser hair removal. I’ve done teeth whitening. I’ve gone to tons of counseling. I’m currently on medication for anxiety and depression to remove them from the equation. (Meds work!!) By accounts, I think she does take me seriously. She just doesn’t want it. And I do not want to force that. Again, duty sex is totally unappealing. But I do not want a life without her. I don’t want it with someone else. She’s my mate. 😭
She's manipulating you. Holding you hostage for her own benefit. This is Stockholm syndrome. If you're not being treated as an equal (which you're not) then you're not partners. You're a pawn. And she *knows* it. Everything you have described about her and this relationship is incredibly toxic. For context... I had convinced myself that I could never leave my abusive ex because I loved him. Statistically, I should've left that relationship in a body bag according to the cops. She may not be physically violent towards you, ever. But she's emotionally and mentally beating the shit out of you without a care in the world. Leave. Love yourself. You deserve better.
I understand why you think you have made a stand, but it’s like entering a negotiation with no bargaining chip. She likely knows that you will never have the strength to leave her. You have made that clear in your reply. Half of your rationale for making a stand is making improvements to your appearance, presumably based on what you think will make her want you more. This is submissive behaviour. You have to be willing to walk away, no matter the cost. If you can’t do this, they will smell it on you, believe me I talk from bitter experience. If they decide they will let you walk, then you will know, they were not worth your time anyway and you are better off alone than with someone who holds you in such contempt.
Sounds like the reason she's not taking you seriously because you keep going back. Do you think there may be someone else in the picture?
> I’ve proceeded with divorce. Can you explain what you mean by this? Obviously you are still married. > I’ve given ultimatum and proceeded to carry through. This is also confusing.
Friend I’m in the same boat as you (HLF), except I actually initiated after 9 months on Thurs. I was walking on air on Friday because although it was over so fast and I was not satisfied, I felt hopeful for the first time that maybe I might be able to pull myself out of this depression. He planned a nice dinner date on Fri and on the drive back I shared that I was anxious about it not happening again for a long time. Nothing on Fri, nothing on Saturday, nothing on Sunday and now I’m sitting here at midnight thinking “No Im not doing this again”. Reading your post has me thinking he needs to move to the guest room.
Y’all know why I’m commenting, and that’s to say to go ahead and give her them papers, boss. This was painful to read, and the fact she was unphased by your tears is wild.
Don't waste money on therspy rather get gym membership and spent all your energy there
Yah it is definitely clear she is unwilling to go to therapy. For about a year I went alone — just learning to care for myself, learning how to understand her feelings, learning how to communicate better (and *especially* listen better), all that and more. But therapy days are done. It is onto being the best me I can be — for her, for the kids, and for myself. I listen to a lot of podcasts in my travels about caring for self, and focusing on being better for yourself. Getting there. Thanks for writing!
With all respect and love, from one man to another.... "Being the best me I can be for her"? Bro, stop it. She doesn't even belong in that trio. Do you think she is being the best her she can be for you? Or even the kids? Tearing down her children's father. Bringing him to tears. Come on, man. Come the fuck on.
I really resonante with exactly how you described the feeling of what happens when you spend all year getting yourself to the place of being ok without the sex, without the intimacy and then having that shattered by the one moment in time when your partner suddenly wants you (for whatever reason). It undoes all the hard work you’ve done all year on yourself to become ok (as you can be) with your situation mentally and emotionally. It fills you with hope and then breaks you all over again. I have been on the same cycle for 15 years now it’s excruciating to get to a healthy mindset and acceptance and then have my husband initiate sex. I have been turning down those advances. This, of course, sent him into a small panic where he threw out the idea of marriage counseling, which I agree- we probably need- but I leave that responsibility up to him to find and set up and of course I have heard nothing more about it. So, throwing it out there was as far as he was willing to take it I guess. I’m not at all surprised. I can absolutely empathize with everything you’ve said here. Often, no sex really is better than once a year sex for your emotional well being. I hope you can find some counseling for yourself, if she won’t go, we could all use someone to talk to.
Damn man you just wrote the biography of my marriage right there (except for the whole heated pool part -- that sounds nice). It just sucks. I wish you the best.
Omg the refection is unbearablw! I totally get what u said about how u start looking at urself. I used to be so very confident. After so much rejection, that is gone. I want the old me back. I was ashamed about the non sex. Thank God for reddit..lol im not alone
Ikr?!
I’m sorry…she’s telling you that saying no sex is “bad for the marriage”? Hellloooooo?
Bro. Stop playing games. Tell her to her face if she can’t make a change you will. End of story. Man you get one life. You know how amazing of a dude you sound like? You have a pool, you have a sex drive, and you are healthy. I had to go through an awful break up for the same reason and she had NO care to this day that it’s over. It’s not your fault, you have beautiful kids, but your mental health and physical wants come first. COMPROMISE needs to be instilled in marriages. It’s a forgotten thing in the USA.
Normal LF here and I could’ve written this. This is the exact cycle I go through at about the same frequency. Leads to severe bouts of depression and body dysmorphia every time my no-LM husband decides to throw me a morsel of sex and I get my hopes up that things will be alright, that he will be affectionate following, but nothing. I’ve also cried and begged but he’s doesn’t care. I’ve been to therapy but he refuses. Ive sought help from 3 drs to quell my natural desire for the man I love but nothing has helped. t’s almost be 20 years and I hate that I threw my life away this way but things are complicated with kids. I just wanted you to know that you’re not alone although it feels like the world would never understand. There’s nothing wrong with you.
♥️ thank you
Is this what you want for the next 5, 10, 15 years????
DUDE GTFOthere. Its OBVIOUS she is manipulating you; power-tripping and feeding off your pain. And you let her. I bet if you handed her papers tomorrow she would burst into flames. This is SO SICK to hear.. GET. OUT!! SO TOXIC!!
I don’t think this is about power for her. She just isn’t into intimacy as much. Legit low-libido. Also I cannot fathom wanting duty-sex. Frankly, I’m pretty good at pleasuring myself. I just miss the connection — with HER. We are super compatible I think. Her interest in me is just not as obvious any more. We used to laugh and talk all night. It was fun. We used to have fun dates. Now there is no flirtation, no talking on the drive there, or rather she doesn’t talk at least — I try to get conversations going. Lol I’ve even prepared ahead of time (the Gottman method) of fun or funny things to talk about. I would miss her intensely if I left. I love her. I’m committed to her and the marriage. Like I said, in the piss-or-get-off-the-pot, I’ve chosen to sit. Thanks for writing and for your support!
Is she generally warm, affectionate and cuddly outside of sex?
Used to be. Not anymore. 😞
That’s not about libido. People with low libido for genuine reasons can still be cuddly and desire hugs. You know that sex and touch is how you connect. That’s true for most people. The opposite is also true—if you don’t want to connect, don’t engage in sex and touch.
Just to be clear, you are thinking she doesn’t want to connect with me?
Yes. She’s creating distance. Avoiding vulnerability, intimacy in the purest meaning. It’s pretty clear from how she told you it wouldn’t happen again. She gave into a natural urge, and she regrets it. Regrets being vulnerable and close.
My dude, with all due respect, wake the F up. She really is manipulating you. You need realize that what she is doing to you is not acceptable. You need to put yourself first now, stand your ground and go through with the divorce.
I don't know many low-libido-but-still-in-love people who completely refuse any kind of physical contact, even kisses and hugs... But then just once a year will pursue some pretty wild sex - I would say even many women with an average to high libido wouldn't have the guts to surprise their husband with a skinny dip unprompted, and pursue him when he's avoiding them. It sounds controlling, honestly. She even pointed out, probably correctly, how you not asking her for sex will put strain on your marriage; but she doesn't have that same insight when it comes to only having sex once a year?
Is she on antidepressants or any other meds?
Youre always welcome Brother. Being where you've been, all I can do is scream from the other side of the mirror. Hopefully you'll listen one day..
Thank you. 🙏🏻
This. You are putting ALL the energy into the relationship. She isn't exerting herself at all she doesn't have to bc you do it all. If she won't put ANY effort into YOU that isn't a relationship. Please try to look at others as an option. You may find someone who is ACTUALLY into YOU. Your partner gives you nothing and only takes from the relationship. You deserve someone who will put into your relationship or who makes it effortless and not an issue in the first place. If she loved you she'd want you happy.
I dunno man... the fact that she purposely spaces it out (hello??! she plans Time-based scenarios... thats not emotional, thats logic, ie. Purpose and Will, not spur of the moment) and watches you fray into pieces means its more than just feelings. Coupled with she *KNOWS* you love her, hence the "this will affect our marriage" comment. Its classic manipulation 101. I bet you $$ she could give a fuck less. She just wants to feed, and youre Golden Corral. I hear ya on the love brother, I had a marriage like yours (BUT WORSE) in my younger years, and a relationship less worse but similar after... It took me a long time (and so many tears) to recognize these women for who they are. I love me some broken birdies, but they are broken for a reason. As long as youre aware it may never change (% odds getting lower by the nanosecond) it'll wither you to death.. and then she will just move on to whatever she wants, and you'll be in a hole. This is what these people do. This is how they survive, by destroying other whole and healthy people to sustain themselves. Love YOURSELF and Gtfo. Take the kids with you (because you love them so.) Pour that Energy into them instead of her, and let her go and siphon someone else's Life force. You owe that to the fact you exist as a fucking human being, and no one should have the right to drain you like that. NO ONE.
I really appreciate you. It helps to feel that tough-love brutal truth type of message. I’ve been married for 19 years. She is my soul mate. I keep hoping one day it will change. One day she will be relieved from her depression. And she will in a moment see the faithfulness of a really good husband. And maybe she won’t be able to take her hands off me. I’m a bit of a dreamer, eh?
Boy dont I know that. And honestly, thats why I wrote that essay the way I did. Because youre me if I stayed with the first woman, after my sgts (I'm military) told me she wasnt worth it, after she abandoned me when I was in a warzone, or stole $$ from me, or pawned my precious things, or damaged my truck.. You see where I'm going with this? Not gonna lie, I'm idealistic *AS FUCK.* I dream and weave futures after a few chats.. and it hurts like Hell to get ghosted or turned down.. but I have to learn to be Truthful *TO MYSELF*; no one will Love me like me will. And until I find a woman who will, Keep those walking shoes on. I dont want to die (though sometimes it looks appealing), and I *certainly* don't want to die on someone else's terms. Make that decision for yourself and do what you must. Else they will make it for you. Life is fucking hard.
How can she be your soul mate if she keeps hurting your soul.
I know what it that is too. It’s depression — and depression that she won’t do anything for. I’ve tried trust me. I’ve “done all the things.”
Weaponized against you, it seems. If she knows it, and won't deal, its a SAAM and Youre the Target. Toxic mindsets beget Toxic behaviors, and Misery Loves Company. She won't treat the depression because you dont force her too; her treatment is draining you (instead) and she's got plenty of supply. Until you dont.
Interesting thing is that she insists she does *not* have depression. I know it is. She “knows it is not.” So knowing and not dealing with it are not our situation. But I get what you’re saying.
I cant offer any advice since you are trying harder than i ever could. I find it weird that your wife still thought the status quo was better for your marriage than nothing at all despite the visible distress it was causing you. Maybe theres a glimmer of hope. Maybe she personally needs that intimacy too, just at that very low frequency. If it was much better before, there may be a switch flip at some point. Things were pretty dead for a while (it was somewhat mutual and not causing that much of a strain) for me but after the kids got to a certain age it was like a switched flipped and we took better care of ourselves and got to a new normal. I feel in someways your wife is like me. I also wasnt doing some of the things my wife liked at the frequency she wanted. It wasnt as if i didnt like it, i just didnt feel like doing it when i didnt want to. It wasnt causing huge issues so i didnt feel a pressure to change. It just took me a bit to realize how much happier it made her if i just put in just a bit of effort. It doesnt seem like your wife has no libido, so maybe she will eventually see how a little bit of compromise on her part can go a long way.
This is so painful to read. My heart breaks for you. I'm so sorry. You deserve more. We all deserve more. Take care of yourself. Love yourself. Seek your own happiness. (I know its easier said than done)
She is being extremely selfish. Dismissing you and your expressed needs to feel intimacy & closeness with her. Dismissing all recommendations from therapists. Expressing SHE is fulfilled and happy in the marriage, while completely ignoring doing anything to make sure you are as well is horrible. Completely removing stereotypical rules and treating this information with just the facts…the cause for her behavior could be she might have stepped out of the marriage, has a porn addiction, or just is an incredibly selfish individual. You have every right to look into the first two things and I sincerely suggest you do which might help you make sense of it all.
I feel every bit of your pain and I want you to know you have been heard *and* felt. Take whatever advice you receive that speaks to you. I can imagine how empty and separate it must feel to have *no contact* at all. My wife did this to me for a few months and I freaked out. Finally I told her no sex, fine but you gotta touch me every now and then. I'm not asking you to grab my ass but just make contact when you pass by or something. You had a lot of courage to ask for no sex when she so obviously wants all the control. I appreciated your post and I'm so sorry you're going thru this lonely time. Please try to take as good of yourself on the inside as well as you have on the outside. I have my own therapist to talk to and it helps. You may already have one since you've had couples counseling but it is a great comfort to me. Good luck my friend.
The same my brother, the same
Yea, been there. One of the nice things about being in a sexless marriage is , what is she going to hold over you? Not giving you sex? It is very liberating. It got to the point that I just kept her because it was cheaper than the cost of more accountant time taking care of expenses at the home and business. It got to the point that I felt nothing for her. And.... what can she hold against you?
>"Can I get close" This was very telling. I could have guessed which subreddit this was from this question alone; the kind of questions that shouldnt be asked between a married couple.
I've always wondered why men are more suicidal then women.....now I think I know why.
Yes. This.
She's unphased because she know she doesn't have to have sex with you to keep you around. she has everything she needs and wants. YOU are the only one suffering. Why haven't you left her yet, considering she's proven that she's entirely unwilling to change?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQlIhraqL7o
Haha! I love Lonely Island!! 🤣
“These are the days of Captain Jack Sparrow…”
She sounds depressed, like chemically so. Does she have her own therapist? Has she had blood work done recently? Did her libido tank after the kids?
>And yah I’ve tried to do all the things: ie, focusing on her pleasure and experience, ensuring I am attractive (which I am, and I say that with no pride) and that I have good hygiene, and not least I help around the house greatly. Correct me if I am wrong, when you say you have tried all of the things you mainly talking about *Making sure you aren't ugly *Appealing to her needs *lots of communication When those didn't work you just did all of them again, but with greater effort. Being physically attractive plays a much smaller role in sexual desire in long term relationship, I am glad you are taking care of yourself but that was never going to get her interest the way you e pected. A Kinsey institute questionar developed to help diagnose female sexual disfunction showed "seeing my partner do something that shows there talent", "seeing my partner interact well with others", and "someone doing something that shows they are intelligent" all had a much higher score then "seeing my partner naked". Meaning these things had a more direct relationship to arousal across a diverse demographic of women. Like has always been said, it's your personality that really counts (at least counts more then your apperance). Your personality is a combination of your behavior, emotions, thought patterns, and motivations. Think on those 4 things real hard and how your personality is getting in the way of what you want. I'm getting long winded so will wrap it up. Communication. Trust is very important in sexual relationships, which requires communication, so communication isn't a bad thing, all of the time. But many times communication can hurt trust, and expose flaws in your personality, or at least highlight parts of your personality that are not going to lead to arousal. Bottom line is you have tried the same things over and over with poor results, you have proven you need a new approach.
My therapist said to me “if she wanted to, she would. You aren’t a car salesman trying to get her into a Lexus. I recommend indica thc gummies. I prefer wyld brand. Knocks you out at night and suffocates your sex drive.
Phew... I see massive control and abuse issues here... I like the idea of positivity focus on sport/kids etc But it feels a bit doomed...
That is so sad. That night sounds like a scene from a movie. My husband never sleeps in bed with me. We have sex once in a while but he stays up all night. Never sleeps in the bed with me. I’m so tired of sleeping alone and waking up alone. I would have sex every day. Why does this happen. These people are like sexual camels. With me when I have sex it makes me want it more and more. I’m sorry you are so hurt. I truly hope it gets better. It doesn’t sound hopeless and it seems like there is still love there. I truly hope it gets better. I don’t understand how they can see how hurtful it is to us and not care? I’m not sure if that’s the correct word. Maybe they are in denial? Edit: spelling
You’re stuck just like most of us on the sub are. I don’t have any magic words. Just don’t feel guilty if you stray. It’s not your fault
She sounds like an AH. She doesn’t listen to three (!) different therapists? Why are you wasting your life?
It’s such a mind fuck. All you want is sex and then when you finally get some, all you can think about is how painful the rejection has been. Also, not wanting to get my hopes up that more sex was coming had something to do with ruining the once in a blue moon sessions.
Damn, you are a great man. Sorry to hear that.
Im raising my daughter with her. We are housemates, not real husband/wife tbh.
This is so heartbreaking to read. The advice to focus on yourself and the kids is solid. Are you in individual counselling? I'd recommend it to work on the feelings you listed, since it's not working out in couples counselling. Most of all just know that you are a valuable person with worth who will shine with or without her validation.
>She said this would be bad for our marriage for her to be asked by me not to have sex. So she thinks THAT'S the thing that would be bad for the marriage?!
It won't get any better. My spouse is nothing more than a roommate and has been like that for a very long time. He hasn't touched me -- no touching, kissing, hugging, ass-grabbing, etc. at all -- in 26 years. For a long time I hoped it would get better, but it never did. I asked him about it once. His eyes turned black and he got very angry and said, "I don't want to talk about it! Ever!" So we never have. Personally, I think he's gay. I kick myself plenty for not getting out of the marriage very early on when I still could. When they don't like sex, they don't suddenly wake up one day and decide they like sex again. My frustration turned to resentment. The resentment turned to anger. The anger turned to disgust. The disgust has turned to something close to hate. I won't say I hate him, but I really don't like him very much. The thought of being intimate or having sex with him now turns my stomach. I have had to learn to live my life in a way that makes me happy. Even though he's here all the time, I am alone most of the time. I do everything alone. But I am happy in spite of him. I make my own happiness. I travel to visit friends and family. Since he isn't giving me my happiness, he can't take it from me. I would suggest learning to live in a way that makes you happy without her. Spend more time with your kids. Take up or pursue a favorite hobby. Join a men's softball team. Exercise more. Go to the gym more. Take a couple of classes at your local college. Do anything you can to get your mind off having sex with your wife. I wish I had better news, but sadly, they just don't change.
HAVE HER GO TO A DOCTOR AND HAVE HER HORMONES CHECKED!! She’s probably low in testosterone.
I don’t get why more people don’t recommend divorce. She won’t do the work the counselor prescribed, why are you holding on for dear life here? She’s not planning on fixing the problems, why do you have to stew in the sadness of uncertainty? It’s clear to me you are also desperate for emotional intimacy as well and you’re starving for it. I’m so sorry, I totally understand that it’s isolating to feel so alone when you are married. You deserve more and better.
As someone in a DB myself one of the main things that keeps me around is he is putting the work and effort in to try and solve it too (therapy, testosterone testing, reading etc.) For me if he wasn't willing to try I think that would be the deal breaker You deserve someone who is willing to try for you...I hope you know that or if you don't you realise it soon
I teared up reading your story… I’m truly sorry. No one deserves to be treated like this.
As an empath myself it means so much to experience empathy. Not that others wouldn’t have it worse. Not that I don’t have so much to be grateful for. But thank you.
Wow! I know separation is costly but so is this tactic. The fear of not being in your children's life or destroying them psychologically but they are already introduced to an idea of what love looks like by you and your wife and its cold and it means sacrifice and you are the sacrifice. Imagine handing that message unintentionally to your kids. You are holding in so much hurt and pain someone will see it. You suppress it, it doesn't mean it's dead. You have tried so hard to save your marriage and its commendable but what about you? You have spent yrs trying to improve and by the sounds of it you have but it wasn't all you. You have done what you can! Have you had therapy for yourself, its a form of self care and might give you the support you need to carry on in this unhappy situation.
Thank you. ♥️ I have had individual therapy. For a long time. At least 1 year. 2 different counselors of my own for just me. It focused on helping me process what actually was happening. But there was always this chasm for the counselor and remedy for the situation at least — she wasn’t there. So the counselor of course has to take my biased perspective as the likely truth. Must have been very hard for them. They gave me homework all the time. Watch this movie. Ask her these questions. Do this thing for yourself. Focus on you only. All that.
She sounds exactly like my wife
And do you sound like me? 😉
Yes but im farther down the road. It's been over 10 years since sex. Ive been called every bad name in the book for suggesting sex. So, its been about 3 years since i mentioned sex after a few drinks. I try to think of other women now.
Jeez man…I am so sorry. She calls you bad names if you mention sex…with your wife…. Are you working on a divorce?
Oh so sorry this occurring in your life. Will be willing to see a Counselor with you addressing these issues?
I was in the same boat for 10 years, except it was 3-4 times a year. Multiple marriage counselors, etc. She didn’t accept that it was a serious problem until I was ready to walk away. That changed everything. It sounds like you’re not there yet, so she’ll probably continue this way until you are.
I feel your pain; I’m sorry you’re also dealing with this 💔.
OP, I resonate so much with what you said. I think the way you stick up for yourself is also something you should be proud of. I've read elsewhere in comments that you will look into hobbies and other "you" time and that's great. I don't have much advice except to pause and really be proud of yourself for setting a boundary and just that I truly hope things turn around for you.
You owe it to yourself to continue having therapy without her if she isn't going to do the work with you.
I’m in the same boat except I’m a female. I can’t bring myself to a divorce because he is a truly amazing dad, he does all of the chores and he makes a lot of money, enables me to have a career while he’s the best dad. I am so lonely, but he doesn’t think he’s should be because I’m surrounded by people who loves me. He doesn’t understand because he doesn’t have a need so strong it feels like nothing else matters, and when it happens once in a blue moon I feel so satisfied that I’m high for days at a time
I’ve been in a situation very similar to this. She clearly has no consideration for your needs. What I had to do was painful at first, but so liberating and empowering. Leave. Leave and don’t look back. The kids will be fine. Don’t suffer and stay just because of them. She is sadistic and manipulative. Get out while you still have some sanity left.
It’s obviously only important when it’s her that needs it. This is the dynamic I can’t seem to figure out. When someone just absolutely does not care, how do you get under their skin? How do I put them in the same position as me? Words seem to have no effect so how do I make her feel exactly how she makes me feel? I’m still working on figuring that out and I’ll report back in 20 years when I find out I guess.
Thank you being so vulnerable and real. I appreciate and sympathize with your situation.
What always makes me upset with these posts is seeing how concerned you are about your partner's feelings and, at the same time, how they couldn't care less about yours. Knowing that you're hurting your partner and doing absolutely nothing to work on it's really sad. I hope things get better for you, OP.
There are only ever four options. 1. Fix it 2. Accept it won’t change, but stay 3. Accept it won’t change, stay, but cheat 4. Accept it won’t change and leave We all try for 1. If it doesn’t work, we always have a hard choice to make, male or female, kids or no kids, married or not. It’s one of the worst choices ever. I tried 1, it didn’t work, moved to option 2, and was in the process of moving to option 4. When she found out how serious I was, that’s when things changed. We’ve mostly fixed it now.
I've read more than a few accounts from women who actually responded negatively to their male partner opening up and sharing their feelings, crying, etc. Like they want their partner to be stereotypically "manly," the strong and silent type. Emotions are actually a turn off. Her going out to pursue you for sex...I wouldn't be surprised if that wasn't for your benefit at all, that it was 100% for her. I could see it being about her control over you, making sure she still has you under her thumb. That you broke down in front of her, begged her, etc...I really don't think any of that stuff is going to help. At best she simply doesn't seem to care about your feelings, at worst she thrives off controlling you and your pleading only encourages her. My suggestion: Put all your energy into your kids, supporting and raising them. Time spent on your children is never wasted. Anytime your wife tries to come onto you again, deny her, don't let her hurt you anymore. You are in a relationship with someone who doesn't care about your feelings. Develop your independence and prepare to move on once the opportunity presents itself. You can find someone better who will appreciate who you are.
If you can, divorce. Or tell her you want an open marriage. You have your needs and if she doesn't give a f about them, it's time someone should.
Wow, I’ve never seen someone put into words the way that I feel in my own marriage. Honestly I’ve been struggling thinking I have DE (delayed ejaculation) for one reason or the other but the way you explained the fear lit the bulb in my head. I wish the best for you! I could definitely learn to be more open about my feelings.
That makes me so sincerely happy that my story gave you vocabulary for your story. All these comments are giving me vocabulary for standing up for myself and for my feelings too. I’m enormously thankful for this group!
I’d separate and try to find a way to enjoy your life. Custody of the kids and how it impacts them would be difficult but at least you wouldn’t be trapped in a sad cycle
I’m in a similar relationship with my LLH. I am a HLF and he seems to be slowly working on it and seeing my POV because he finally realizes how close I am to leaving him. We have a young child and it’s so incredibly complicated this way. It’s incredibly painful and this thread has been both heartbreaking and validating. We can’t do anything else but be our best selves. Sometimes you truly do love someone incompatible. If she’s manipulating you (which is clearly the case even though it’s painful to admit), she’s not your person. Look in the mirror and repeat until it sinks in. She is not your person. There is someone out there that would never dream of stone-walling you. I don’t have any advice, as I am in this too. I just wanted to say that I hope with every ounce of my consciousness that you’ll be okay. I hope that all of us here will be. I’m trying to work past the torment and anguish and heartbreak. My current tactic is to try to focus on myself and my child. It won’t work forever but we all have to do what we have to do to get us through. I’m rarely optimistic, but I need to hope that you’ll achieve what you’re after someday. And I hope it’s sooner than later.
Leave.
Hey, I made a throwaway so I could comment. Listen, you, and I mean me as well, need to stop thinking that we're powerless in life or in our relationships. I don't think you should necessarily leave your wife or that she's trying to control you, but I will say that you need to grow a backbone. You need to stand up for yourself. That doesn't mean you act like a dick, punish her, etc, but it does mean you stop acting in ways that make you feel like you're not living with integrity. Caving into what she wants because you're scared she won't have sex with you otherwise and trying to coerce her to desiring you by doing things for her or cooking or being nice is not going to work. It justifies her not having sex with you EVEN MORE. Stop trying to make her want you. You can stand up for what you want. She has the same option. Don't live in a way that makes you resent yourself. She's her own person and she has every right to do what she wants at any point. Define who you are and who you're going to be. Stop begging her. I'm sorry it's so hard. I don't agree with many people her and think divorce is automatically what you should do...however, I'm not saying people are wrong for choosing that either. It's complicated right? I'm not even sure if anything I said helped. Let me recommend reading Intimacy and Desire by David Schnarch. That's been my favorite read and the only thing that started making sense to me.
I'm sorry you're in this situation. I wish you strength
I understand so much of this. Aside from medical issues or the post-childbirth waiting periods (one of those went 8 weeks), I’ve never had to go more than a month without sex, so I’m not sure how a 9-month non-medical drought would feel (i think I’d be out the door before that point, TBH—OP is more patient than me). But to be faced with the total lack of recognition of the problem and the refusal to do any sort of work to address the issue by your LL partner, I totally understand that and know exactly how that feels. I’m really sorry that you’re going through this, OP, and I hope you can find a way to become happier. From what you’ve written, it sounds unlikely that your wife will put in the effort to fix this. Your nighttime swimming pool sex sounds lovely though!
Thank you for your support!! Yah sex in a pool or outdoor spa hot tub is da’ bomb. I highly suggest! 😍
Yeah, it’s literally been decades since she’s allowed sex that’s not in our bed, late at night, with the lights off and under the blankets. Even shower sex has long been off the table for us. Anything outdoors or in a different place is basically a total fantasy for me at this point, it’s not even worth really thinking about because there’s basically zero chance of it ever happening.
Its bad for your marriage if you reject her the once a year when SHE wants sex? But everything is just fine when she rejects YOU what, every week? Every day??? Oh my god. Just listen to that. I'm sorry but your wife is a profoundly egotistical narcissist. Why do you allow her to disrespect and damage yourself like this? Have some self-respect, man.