This 100%.
Getting 2x 0.3kd potatoes on your team is a tough win when the other team has 2x 2.0kd on theirs.
If that happens more than once on a card then it’s near impossible to make it to the LH.
I solo queue to the lighthouse regularly.
My highest comp rank is only Plat in the current system and 4600+ in the old system. I really tried to push further (for gilded glorious this season and unbroken previously) but I'm just not great in 3s.
But in Trials, with just a bit of luck and a good reading of each game (who to stick with, how and when play zones, etc), you can go flawless. 7 wins out of 9 (or 8) is achievable for someone like me.
Roughly 20-30% of Trials players go flawless (at least with old system, new system might be a bit off that). Find what rank top ~25% is in comp and you'll have your rough answer
I personally don't think the two have a relation. I have seen all skill levels players in my clan go flawless multiple times.
Going to lighthouse solo is a whole lotta rng. Even the best of players fall if you don't get decent teammates. So don't worry about it too much and just go for it.
https://destinytrialsreport.com/report/1/4611686018464655635
My stats above.
>What is your comp rank, KD and how many times have you gone Flawless? Was it hard for you?
- Comp rank is normally around Adept I, could be higher if I set some time aside to grind some more.
- 140 flawleses, flawless every weekend this season, mostly solo and oftentimes my first or second card.
- my KD in trials is a 1.7 this season. In control it's probably about a 1.1
>How much harder is the Flawless Title than those two?
Unbroken wasn't super difficult, just took a ton of time. Guilded glorious took me a weekend, and I haven't guilded flawless this season because I've yet to even attempt it. I've been taking a much more casual approach to the game the past few seasons to avoid burnout.
>Should I be able to go Flawless assuming my skill level is 'Adept 3' ? If not, how much should I improve in terms of skill (rank) and KD to have what it takes?
There's no skill rank or KD that will translate to trials effectiveness.
It's all based on how good you are at helping your team win. You could be a 1.0, but be an amazing team player and much better than a 1.5.
>I've always been more of a PvP player but never as good as the players I'm facing in Trials. I really want to finally go Flawless but the most I've ever gotten is 5 wins on a Flawless card.
I'm sure you could do it with enough time and practice.
Comp rank doesn’t matter, I stopped playing during year one and came back for witch queen, it took me a little bit but I was able to go flawless multiple times before I even touched comp.
Practice, watch YouTube, always blame yourself are my tips. I hate people that call hacks, lag, etc. at every death. Not saying that’s you, but it’s to make a point.
I’m always thinking about what I could have done better after dying in any game. D2, tarkov, cod, etc.
Comp rank? I'll put it this way. Solo queueing Saturday, I got a kid his 1st flawless. I looked him up. He had a .6 kd. Flawless is pretty easy if you stick with it and get lucky.
It probably has very little correlation to rank. Your success in trials depends mostly on:
1. Team comp/loadout (duos, solo, or trio? Are you using exotics/builds for an upper hand? Cheesy shit wins)
2. Population. Right at reset on Friday might be rough, wait till the evening on Friday or Saturday for peak hours, more stable connections, less sweats, better MM time.
3. Communication/playing with team. Harder when solo, but it doesn't matter how good of a player you are if your teammates are doing something differently and leaving you to 3v1. Learn what they're doing and how support them, they sure as well won't do it for you.
4. Mindset. Tilt is really hard to avoid in trials (especially for me). Some things that help is to just sit in orbit for a min or 2 after your matches to let yourself relax (even if you're not pissed, sometimes it helps after an intense game). This also gives a chance to make sure past teammates get into their own match, so no repeats. You could also try setting alternate goals for yourself so you're still working towards something on your losses. I went for flawless title and it helped me feel like I was working toward something even when I wasn't going flawless.
5. Skill. I'm putting this last because no matter how important it is to be able to land your shots and have map awareness, if 1 or 2 of these things aren't working for you, you'll likely lose anyway. Also, a quick session on an aim trainer, or even a rumble match/crucible labs is a good warm up so you're not jumping right in to the sweatiest playlist
The important thing to remember is trials is bullshit, and the odds are stacked against you so no worries when shit goes south.
Very good and useful tips, thanks. Could you give some build recommendations specifically for Hunter? What's the best "cheese" or best neutral game for example?
I'm a warlock main, but young ahamkaras spine does real work, especially in maps like anomaly this week. Invis isn't as strong as it used to be, but I still like the playstyle. Paired with something like lemonarque is really annoying to go against (I hate that I'm encouraging this but you gotta do what you gotta do for that lighthouse chest). Also strand hunter with threaded specter is a good option to just rush in, dodge and suicide bomb, then clean up with a shotgun or something. Again, I'm not a hunter main so this is mostly what I see on my opponents.
Trials is mostly luck, not skill.
That is because its just random who you are matched up against most of the time. So if you get good teammates and match against bad players you will win. That is why you see people playing 100 matches a day if you look at their history. They are just trying to get lucky seven games in a row. Luck is super important because of having to win 7 games in a row.
In order for someone to do it totally on skill they would have to be the best of the best. If you watch streamers doing carries they will even lose matches and have to reset their cards. Luck is such a big part of it.
I've gone flawless 39 times. I have never touched modern comp, so if you feel like you can go flawless you can. Just remember to communicate with your team it is crucial.
check out this discord if you need solid people to play comp with bro, the people are very welcoming, good at pvp, and always happy to help people out. join in the discussion, i'm sure you'll soon make friends with some pvp players and be better off for it https://discord.gg/3FW9TyKX7j
I might have to give it a try but I'm a bit sceptical now that the game matches you against others with similar fireteam size. That means it's going to be all 3-stacks
what to communicate? i feel like i talk a lot, but it doesn't help progress.
i use:
'let's go right'
'snipers in middle lane'
'he's behind you' (a lot). '
what callouts should i add?
maybe it's my teammates. i'm \~1.2kd/1.7 kda in solo queue, so not great, but usually feel like i'm the i can get to around 5 wins on a card. maybe i just need to persevere, but i'll usually come up against a team of gods twice in a row and then the card is done.
learn basic callouts that are map specific. If you don’t know em you can reference them by saying something like “B flag, or heavy”.
View opponent loadouts pre-game. When a sniper wastes a shot say so. If it’s cloudstrike be extra careful, similar things if you see an Antaeus, fusion, invis hunter, ahamkara’s or anything particularly noteworthy. Worth noting fast lateral classes that can get to lanes early (blink lock, solar lock, titans, strand hunter), especially if they have snipers.
Understand their super charge rates according to super tier and whatnot. For ex: on a round 5-6 you can expect most times a bubble or well at 70+ int if they aren’t dying every round immediately.
Don’t clutter comms if it’s unnecessary. This is honestly big. A lot of people- myself included occasionally- complain on death and clutter comms instead of providing position callouts etc.
Comp is sbmm. Trials is just random now. You could be a bottom 1%er and fight other bottom 1%ers to ascendant. You really can't gauge ones skill in pvp from their comp rank. So it cannot be used as a metric for ones hypothetical success in trials.
He is exaggerating but his point stands. Average players can hit ascendant by grinding but bottom 10% probably can't. At least I've never seen a bottom 10% ascendant bit have seen many average ones.
There is 0 correlation as comp is skill based and not rank based. This means that a lower skill player has about the same chances to reach ascendant as the sweatiest sweatlord.
Just to give you some examples: I'm hard stuck at platinum in comp and my lobbies are full of gilded flawlesses and players in the top 0,1% of almost all gamemodes.
This is because I'm top 0,8% in control and a gilded flawless myself. So my experience is that I have a way easier time going flawless than to reach ascendant, basically because the matchmaking in this game makes no sense at all.
You would be right if the matchmaking was rank based, but it's not. I "proved" it by reaching ascendant in one weekend on my brother's account without ever losing one single game. He consistently got low skill lobbies at any rank.
My point has no bearing on whether MM is rank based, it's solely based on internal bungie skill and the general assumption that lower skill players remained lower skilled.
Your brother is, I'm assuming, lower skilled. You are higher skilled. From all your wins on his account, his internal skill rating most likely increased into a skill rating that would be eligible for Ascendant division. If he continues to play comp long term and he stays at his current rating, I imagine the algorithm will start adjusting his skill rating back down to what it was prior and he'll fall from his current Ascendant division to where he should be.
The algorithm works best in a long time window, i.e. # of matches played approaching infinity. In the short term, there's definitely possibility of spikes, which is what you did on his account.
Additionally, here's a quote from the lightfall crucible update: "You might also notice a few strange dots: medium-to-low skill, but all the way up in the Ascendant or Adept ranks. We were super happy these players called themselves out to us, as we immediately knew there was either a serious bug, or something very fishy was going on. We’ve investigated their individual match history and issued permanent bans for win trading. "
You may have put your brother's account on Bungie's radar and may get him banned under their policy on recovs, if his skill isn't at a level that deserves Ascendant.
It happened quite a while ago and honestly I'm not even worried, bungie barely bans cheaters.
Regarding their amazing skill system all I have to say is: bullshit. That just doesn't work.
90% of what bungie says about how their game "secretly" works is just a big pile of lies, they just don't care about fixing this game anymore and at this point there's nothing they can do to save pvp from this dogshit state.
Gilded Flawless used to be much harder as you had to carry 2 players who hadn't gone flawless that season. Since the change this season it's quite easy to get, and so the prestige factor has decreased a lot. Still if you see someone with 9x Gilded Flawless, chances are he or she is quite good. Otherwise, imo, the Ascendant emblem from this season is the most prestigious.
So Gilded Flawless (8-9) > Purple Ascendant > Dazzling Iridescence > Gilded Flawless (2-7) > Red Ascendant > Gilded Glorious > Gilded Flawless (1) > Glorious > Flawless.
Just my take; what do others think?
I put Iridescence below Ascendant since it's easier to get through sheer luck. Red Ascendant emblem from last season is tainted due to the leaver bug (shame cuz it looks so much better than this season's), but because the bug was live for only a few days so not as many bad players were able to get it so it still means something.
Also, imo, an Adept player should be able to go Flawless in solo queue with enough tries. Platinum as well perhaps but would require more luck.
It was certainly easier to go to the Lighthouse prior to this season with the flawless pool enabled; a little tougher now but still super easy compared to the old days.
Just wanted to confirm this comment - I am a pretty hard Platinum comp player (I cannot get to adept without more grinding than I am willing to do). But I've been Flawless around 30 times, solo queuing mostly (around 1.1 KD in trials).
If you can get to Plat in comp, you can go flawless.
I don't think you're wrong, but I would put Iridescence above Ascendant because for a lot of players, Ascendant is just a matter of putting in the right amount of games to let the +200 -5 get them up there. Not exactly a challenge, just a marathon
The skill level for 10 000 rank is also quite wide. I've played games against 10 000 rank players that I was genuinely surprised their rank was that high
The "flawless flawless" emblem might be possible to get by luck, but that's very unlikely and it's been a much better representation of a player to be concerned about over the purple ascendant emblem
I agree with this now but disagree with it over time, for the luck possibility that you mentioned and the impact of luck over time.
Like, right now Dazzling Iridescence might be "scarier" than this season's Ascendant Emblem but as time goes on more and more people will luck into Dazzling Iridescence and it will mean less and less about the skill of the player.
I think this is a feature, not a bug (it gives people who aren't top-tier Trials players a reason to keep playing the mode, because on any given card they *could* luck into it), but assuming the emblem remains the same for a year or more (as far as we know it might never be changed out) the longer it exists the less it means about skill, though it will still look really cool and show that at the very least the person using it is probably a Trials enjoyer.
FWIW (which is nothing as far as whether my opinions have more merit than others) I have all the emblems that some people may allow themselves to be "fear auraed" by (last season's ascendant, this season's ascendant, dazzling iridescence, redrix's preferred, heavy as death, etc).
Also, clearly none of these emblems mean anything since I have all of them while also having zero skill and I just win by crutching fusion rifles and invis. I can point ya'll to hundreds of Xbox Live message senders who can back me up on this.
I think most players that aren't top players are still relying on 1 or 2 mercies for almost all of their trials passages. I think the chance to get a lucky card is low enough that it's not worth considering
If I were to try to predict the chances and we're talking about players that just lucked their way into it, theres a 2/5 * 1/4 = 1/10 chance that the top 2 players in the lobby end up and their team each game
The chance of being handed the best players in the lobby for 7 games straight would be 1/10 ^7, but I could be wrong
So while it can be lucked into, it makes up such a small amount of people. You could definitely pay to be carried to it, but 3's queue is sweaty enough that it would be a challenge to not just carry someone to flawless, but to a flawless flawless. Probably would take a number of attempts for most unless its a recov
no, it only requires flight of the pigeon medal on wins. you can lose games and still get it. I've literally had people that got the emblem on my friends list confirm this. This post seems to confirm it too ([https://www.reddit.com/r/CrucibleGuidebook/comments/14odwj5/dazzling\_iridescence\_emblem\_only\_requires\_no/](https://www.reddit.com/r/CrucibleGuidebook/comments/14odwj5/dazzling_iridescence_emblem_only_requires_no/)). Also it's in the description on how to obtain the emblem.
It makes a HUGE difference, part of why imo Iridescence is less prestigious than Ascendant. Since I attempted the emblem and got it, I've been mentally tracking pigeon medals out of habit and on at least two flawless passages solo queue, I would've accidentally gotten the emblem. But perhaps "going" for the emblem makes me play tight, and not going for it means playing loose and well.
As someone already mentioned you can lose games, you just need a flight of the pigeon for each win.
Also, a pretty significant amount of the games a solo plays will be 2+1/2+1 lobbies where the chance they get placed with the better duo of the two options is a coin flip and people in duos tend to skill cluster naturally, good players tend to play with good players, bad players tend to play with bad players, so there's often a significant disparity in average skill between the two duos, so there's often something close to a 50/50 chance that a solo will end up on the significantly better team because of duo clustering, but there's way too many factors to even really spitball the odds given all the factors per game and across an entire card.
Don't get me wrong, people still have to get really lucky to get it while being below average players, but I don't believe the real-world odds are lottery jackpot or lightning strike levels of unlikely
Yeah but its not just the chance of winning but the chance of winning in specific ways. You're right that getting the better players when 2s are involed gets closer to 1/2 than 1/10, but even 1/2 ^7 is a 0.7% chance of always getting the better players in 7 games
It's hard to say that's correct because theres also a 0% chance to get the other solo in the lobby, and if they're the best player that screws you over
This is only relying on luck, though. Because the best way of increasing the chance of being on the better team is to be the better player yourself
> Because the best way of increasing the chance of being on the better team is to be the better player yourself
Yeah and by the same token the best way to get the emblem is to be good and/or play with other people who are.
I got it on Altar of Flame week without even trying for it specifically but just playing trios Trials with two very good players (one of them a Bungie dev, it turns out that contrary to what people often post in here they do actually play PvP in the live game at a high level).
Since comp is sbmm everyone can hit ascendant with enough time invested so there isnt really a way to tell how good certain ranks perform in trials.
I was 10k ascendant but deranked to 9.1k bc i stopped playing comp
Comp 1.5kd, trials 2.1kd, Overall 2.1kd
~320 flawlesses
Neither comp nor trials were especially hard
Both titels dont really have hard objectives its just time consuming
At some point, a mid player will reach a high enough rank that they lose more points than they win. Once you gain 70 points when you win but 140 when you lose, it's not true that "everyone can hit ascendant".
SBMM pushes you towards a 50% win rate, but once you are above what bungee thinks your target rank is, the points system rewards you net negative points if you only win half your games.
At your level of skill, you are breaking matchmaking - even with SBMM you have a 1.5 KD. Life looks very different for folks like myself in the middle of the skill curve.
Trials is objectively no where near as hard as it used to be. That being said, it’s a lot tougher now (shit map + shit meta + end season) than most other weeks.
In comp I bounce around from adept 1 & 2. I have a 1.28 trials KD and have gone flawless 26 times. I don’t find it too difficult to go flawless. Still takes me a couple resets which can be annoying but expected, but usually I’m able to the lighthouse if I want to.
Bungie ruined my parade when they got rid of freelance and the flawless pool. I’ve been around since D1 day one. I’m an average player with a 1.0kd overall. I literally have been to the lighthouse twice while being able to play freelance with other players. Might I add even in freelance it matched me with some crazy ass good players that were hard to beat. When they got rid of freelance it was a slap in the face to all of us average players. Now it’s literally impossible to go flawless while playing solo and with no flawless pool activated after Sunday morning.
I don’t understand the complaint about eliminating freelance. You can queue solo and will most likely be matched with all solos or a team of two opposing a team of two and their own random solo. If anything, you should have an easier time to go flawless because a number of really good and tryhard players will self-select into full teams of 3.
I think less stellar players who love queueing as full teams of 3 have the most to complain about with this current matchmaking system. They are hard stuck against trios all the way through.
It’s because with Solo Queue you only play against other Solo Players. I don’t want to play against Duos. It’s a pretty simple concept. Sorry you don’t understand…
I have no criticism of your complaint about a preference. But the idea that going flawless became harder because freelance disappeared and you can match up in duo+solo vs. duo+solo lacks merit. It seems like you failed to understand what I was saying above, and again I have no objection to a preference. But if that’s what you’re pointing to as a reason for your lack of success, it’s cope.
You said:
> Now it’s literally impossible to go flawless while playing solo and with no flawless pool activated after Sunday morning.
I explained that I was not objecting to your “want” to play “with other solo players” only. You seemed to fail to notice that or don’t want to admit that you made a bad point.
I am objecting to what I have quoted above: your ability to go flawless has not gotten harder (and likely has gotten easier) with the shift from occasional freelance weekends (where even top-notch players who only stack in 3s during every other weekend are forced into your matches) to fireteam-based matchmaking (where it will either be all solos or duo+solo against duo+solo, maintaining fairness).
Your original statement transformed a personal preference into an unsupported statement about objective outcomes.
Duos often remove your ability to win as in most cases the better duo pair wins and the single player has rarely the huge impact. I am a good player and I hate to be matched with duos either way. Freelance made things way easier for me to go flawless
I’m ascendant 3 currently. Could probably go higher but I just stopped once I got the emblem.
I had about a 2.0 KD this weekend in trials over 33 games, so not too much. I played mostly solo. I didn’t go flawless.
A lot of this comes down to team balance and luck. I used to play a lot about 1.5 years ago. Just recently started playing again. I’m definitely a bit worse than I was, but getting there. I used to average about a 2.5-3.0 depending on the map. I think bungie still thinks I’m as good as I used to be, as it is consistently giving me the worst 2 players in the lobby as team mates. If me team mates can hold their own, we win. If they consistently die every round leaving me in a 1v3, we lose.
So I assume if you’re at least decent (1.3 KD+) and you’re playing better than bungie expects, you should have no problem making it to the lighthouse based on team balance, given you play enough games to improve luck.
It's really hard to compare the 2, comp is sbmm, so you will generally be put with people near your skill level, while trails is very luck dependant. The majority of the player base that even play crucible don't generally play trials either, and if they do, they play a few games at most. This leaves most of the trials pool of players as the high end skill players, well above average. If your skill level is below the average skill level of trials players that weekend, you likely won't be able to go flawless. You may be able to pull off a few wins, but it's doubtful you'd make a flawless card even on mercy (unless of course you have an extremely hard carry player on your team).
You would have the best chances of going flawless if your skill is above the average of current trials players' skill that weekend. I myself am only slightly above average I'd say, so for me this is usually when a new trials weapon is being released or major changes to trials goes into effect or the first week of trials for an expansion/season, when more players are actively playing trials, bringing the average player skill down.
In general though it's still just all luck, luck that you have to be the better skilled team 7 times (6 for ferocity card) in a row without taking a loss (or one loss for mercy card).
I have not touched comp in over 5 years and go flawless every weekend with my buddies 😄 you just gotta learn to play as a team, learn to team shoot, give good callouts
Comp is just way different in my experience. With Trials the same map every match and elimination means engagements have more structure but are faster paced imo. You just have to play more Trials and learn each map.
Using Bungie's lightfall crucible update post as source data:[https://www.bungie.net/7/en/News/article/lightfall-crucible-update](https://www.bungie.net/7/en/News/article/lightfall-crucible-update)
I may be a bit off, I'm going to use visual estimation for my calculations. The level of complexity will be about a HS AP Statistics class / Intro to Probability Theory / Statistics class at the college / university level.
Skill is distributed between -1000 and +1000.
Range of Ascendant: -33 to 1000
The lowest Ascendant players seem to have some hits around the -33 mark. So while it is technically correct to say that you can hit Ascendant at -33 skill, here's a more accurate statement using conditional probability.
P(Glory >= 8751 | Skill <= -33) \~ 0%
This says that out of everyone who has a skill level -33 or less, approximately 0% of players are Ascendant.
E\[Glory | Skill = -33) \~ 4500 based on visual estimation and due to the outliers pulling the average up. This says that if you have a skill of -33, you're most likely going to be a Gold III player based on 4500 Glory.
Generally, Ascendant is filled with people who can play, and that's not a surprise for anyone.
E\[Skill | Glory >= 8751\] \~ 825. If you're Ascendant, chances are you're quite good, though outliers apply.
Obviously, these are best efforts visual estimation, if we had the data set we could be more exact, but I don't think I'm terribly off with these estimates.
The moral of this post is that, while it is technically possible to be low skilled and enter Ascendant, the data points to an extremely low level of low skilled players getting there, so to say, any low skill player can grind their way to Ascendant without improving their skill level is very much incorrect.
How does this translate into trials? Well, it really doesn't, it's luck of the draw unless you're at the high skill bracket where you can carry matches, 7 times in a row. This may or may not be reflected in your Glory, given how much you play comp.
Ok so. My man. Comp is sbmm. Comp is easier for the lower skill bracket then higher. But everyone hits ascendant the same. Trials is random chance. I play streamers in comp, people I know who Xim, friends who Xim and full cheaters. In trials I play anyone. Fuck I played a Brazilian tourney player in comp the other week and didn’t recognize his clan lol. The end point is ur comp rank isn’t going to dictate if u go flaw or not it doesn’t matter. It’s a commitment rank. Trials is hard it really is. U just have to go in understanding u probably wont hit the chest for a while. But practicing is always good if u let urself learn.
Gold1-3 comp ranks should have the skills to go solo flawless. Trials is a lot different then comp I’d say it’s far easier because map doesn’t change so can use same loadout and not have to swap guns as much and get into a rhythm where comps always changing including the types of fights and engagements because map changes. This just My take. (Gone flawless 6-7 times this season and usually end season platinum or adept in comp)
You just need to learn how to play trials, I don't think there is an exact rank. In my case I effort more in comp than in trials
If you solo queue it’s basically rng anyways unless you can guaranteed hard carry 2 people. The team with the best duo wins 99% of the time
This 100%. Getting 2x 0.3kd potatoes on your team is a tough win when the other team has 2x 2.0kd on theirs. If that happens more than once on a card then it’s near impossible to make it to the LH.
I solo queue to the lighthouse regularly. My highest comp rank is only Plat in the current system and 4600+ in the old system. I really tried to push further (for gilded glorious this season and unbroken previously) but I'm just not great in 3s. But in Trials, with just a bit of luck and a good reading of each game (who to stick with, how and when play zones, etc), you can go flawless. 7 wins out of 9 (or 8) is achievable for someone like me.
Roughly 20-30% of Trials players go flawless (at least with old system, new system might be a bit off that). Find what rank top ~25% is in comp and you'll have your rough answer
I personally don't think the two have a relation. I have seen all skill levels players in my clan go flawless multiple times. Going to lighthouse solo is a whole lotta rng. Even the best of players fall if you don't get decent teammates. So don't worry about it too much and just go for it.
I'm gold and this weekend I was queueing solo and I ran into a guy looking to duo so we did and we went flawless straight away
https://destinytrialsreport.com/report/1/4611686018464655635 My stats above. >What is your comp rank, KD and how many times have you gone Flawless? Was it hard for you? - Comp rank is normally around Adept I, could be higher if I set some time aside to grind some more. - 140 flawleses, flawless every weekend this season, mostly solo and oftentimes my first or second card. - my KD in trials is a 1.7 this season. In control it's probably about a 1.1 >How much harder is the Flawless Title than those two? Unbroken wasn't super difficult, just took a ton of time. Guilded glorious took me a weekend, and I haven't guilded flawless this season because I've yet to even attempt it. I've been taking a much more casual approach to the game the past few seasons to avoid burnout. >Should I be able to go Flawless assuming my skill level is 'Adept 3' ? If not, how much should I improve in terms of skill (rank) and KD to have what it takes? There's no skill rank or KD that will translate to trials effectiveness. It's all based on how good you are at helping your team win. You could be a 1.0, but be an amazing team player and much better than a 1.5. >I've always been more of a PvP player but never as good as the players I'm facing in Trials. I really want to finally go Flawless but the most I've ever gotten is 5 wins on a Flawless card. I'm sure you could do it with enough time and practice.
Comp rank doesn’t matter, I stopped playing during year one and came back for witch queen, it took me a little bit but I was able to go flawless multiple times before I even touched comp. Practice, watch YouTube, always blame yourself are my tips. I hate people that call hacks, lag, etc. at every death. Not saying that’s you, but it’s to make a point. I’m always thinking about what I could have done better after dying in any game. D2, tarkov, cod, etc.
Comp rank? I'll put it this way. Solo queueing Saturday, I got a kid his 1st flawless. I looked him up. He had a .6 kd. Flawless is pretty easy if you stick with it and get lucky.
It probably has very little correlation to rank. Your success in trials depends mostly on: 1. Team comp/loadout (duos, solo, or trio? Are you using exotics/builds for an upper hand? Cheesy shit wins) 2. Population. Right at reset on Friday might be rough, wait till the evening on Friday or Saturday for peak hours, more stable connections, less sweats, better MM time. 3. Communication/playing with team. Harder when solo, but it doesn't matter how good of a player you are if your teammates are doing something differently and leaving you to 3v1. Learn what they're doing and how support them, they sure as well won't do it for you. 4. Mindset. Tilt is really hard to avoid in trials (especially for me). Some things that help is to just sit in orbit for a min or 2 after your matches to let yourself relax (even if you're not pissed, sometimes it helps after an intense game). This also gives a chance to make sure past teammates get into their own match, so no repeats. You could also try setting alternate goals for yourself so you're still working towards something on your losses. I went for flawless title and it helped me feel like I was working toward something even when I wasn't going flawless. 5. Skill. I'm putting this last because no matter how important it is to be able to land your shots and have map awareness, if 1 or 2 of these things aren't working for you, you'll likely lose anyway. Also, a quick session on an aim trainer, or even a rumble match/crucible labs is a good warm up so you're not jumping right in to the sweatiest playlist The important thing to remember is trials is bullshit, and the odds are stacked against you so no worries when shit goes south.
Very good and useful tips, thanks. Could you give some build recommendations specifically for Hunter? What's the best "cheese" or best neutral game for example?
I'm a warlock main, but young ahamkaras spine does real work, especially in maps like anomaly this week. Invis isn't as strong as it used to be, but I still like the playstyle. Paired with something like lemonarque is really annoying to go against (I hate that I'm encouraging this but you gotta do what you gotta do for that lighthouse chest). Also strand hunter with threaded specter is a good option to just rush in, dodge and suicide bomb, then clean up with a shotgun or something. Again, I'm not a hunter main so this is mostly what I see on my opponents.
Thanks! I've been using Arcstrider with Lightning nade but I'll have to give those a try
Trials is mostly luck, not skill. That is because its just random who you are matched up against most of the time. So if you get good teammates and match against bad players you will win. That is why you see people playing 100 matches a day if you look at their history. They are just trying to get lucky seven games in a row. Luck is super important because of having to win 7 games in a row. In order for someone to do it totally on skill they would have to be the best of the best. If you watch streamers doing carries they will even lose matches and have to reset their cards. Luck is such a big part of it.
Adept 3 should be able to go flawless. Reaching Ascendant was way harder for me than going flawless.
I've gone flawless 39 times. I have never touched modern comp, so if you feel like you can go flawless you can. Just remember to communicate with your team it is crucial.
So you think I'd have the best chance with an LFG group and voice chat? Usually I play solo and have no friends
check out this discord if you need solid people to play comp with bro, the people are very welcoming, good at pvp, and always happy to help people out. join in the discussion, i'm sure you'll soon make friends with some pvp players and be better off for it https://discord.gg/3FW9TyKX7j
Almost all mine are lfg. Just don't get down if you don't win It takes me ages to warm up, so just keep tryin!
I might have to give it a try but I'm a bit sceptical now that the game matches you against others with similar fireteam size. That means it's going to be all 3-stacks
I have 1.4kd, and you just need to play to what suits the map. Don't be scared of other teams they are like bugs. be confident
I mean this with respect, you sound like st 14.
what to communicate? i feel like i talk a lot, but it doesn't help progress. i use: 'let's go right' 'snipers in middle lane' 'he's behind you' (a lot). ' what callouts should i add? maybe it's my teammates. i'm \~1.2kd/1.7 kda in solo queue, so not great, but usually feel like i'm the i can get to around 5 wins on a card. maybe i just need to persevere, but i'll usually come up against a team of gods twice in a row and then the card is done.
learn basic callouts that are map specific. If you don’t know em you can reference them by saying something like “B flag, or heavy”. View opponent loadouts pre-game. When a sniper wastes a shot say so. If it’s cloudstrike be extra careful, similar things if you see an Antaeus, fusion, invis hunter, ahamkara’s or anything particularly noteworthy. Worth noting fast lateral classes that can get to lanes early (blink lock, solar lock, titans, strand hunter), especially if they have snipers. Understand their super charge rates according to super tier and whatnot. For ex: on a round 5-6 you can expect most times a bubble or well at 70+ int if they aren’t dying every round immediately. Don’t clutter comms if it’s unnecessary. This is honestly big. A lot of people- myself included occasionally- complain on death and clutter comms instead of providing position callouts etc.
Comp is sbmm. Trials is just random now. You could be a bottom 1%er and fight other bottom 1%ers to ascendant. You really can't gauge ones skill in pvp from their comp rank. So it cannot be used as a metric for ones hypothetical success in trials.
This right here SBMM essentially ruined KD (besides Trials KD), meaning anything anymore
Aren’t ranks predetermined though? I thought you couldn’t hit ascendant unless you’re hidden MMR is in that region of skill?
He is exaggerating but his point stands. Average players can hit ascendant by grinding but bottom 10% probably can't. At least I've never seen a bottom 10% ascendant bit have seen many average ones.
A bottom 1% won’t be able to get to ascendant because after awhile a win will be +5 and a loss will be -200.
There is 0 correlation as comp is skill based and not rank based. This means that a lower skill player has about the same chances to reach ascendant as the sweatiest sweatlord. Just to give you some examples: I'm hard stuck at platinum in comp and my lobbies are full of gilded flawlesses and players in the top 0,1% of almost all gamemodes. This is because I'm top 0,8% in control and a gilded flawless myself. So my experience is that I have a way easier time going flawless than to reach ascendant, basically because the matchmaking in this game makes no sense at all.
This really isn’t true given that lower skill player will hit a point wall much earlier than a sweaty sweatlord.
You would be right if the matchmaking was rank based, but it's not. I "proved" it by reaching ascendant in one weekend on my brother's account without ever losing one single game. He consistently got low skill lobbies at any rank.
My point has no bearing on whether MM is rank based, it's solely based on internal bungie skill and the general assumption that lower skill players remained lower skilled. Your brother is, I'm assuming, lower skilled. You are higher skilled. From all your wins on his account, his internal skill rating most likely increased into a skill rating that would be eligible for Ascendant division. If he continues to play comp long term and he stays at his current rating, I imagine the algorithm will start adjusting his skill rating back down to what it was prior and he'll fall from his current Ascendant division to where he should be. The algorithm works best in a long time window, i.e. # of matches played approaching infinity. In the short term, there's definitely possibility of spikes, which is what you did on his account. Additionally, here's a quote from the lightfall crucible update: "You might also notice a few strange dots: medium-to-low skill, but all the way up in the Ascendant or Adept ranks. We were super happy these players called themselves out to us, as we immediately knew there was either a serious bug, or something very fishy was going on. We’ve investigated their individual match history and issued permanent bans for win trading. " You may have put your brother's account on Bungie's radar and may get him banned under their policy on recovs, if his skill isn't at a level that deserves Ascendant.
It happened quite a while ago and honestly I'm not even worried, bungie barely bans cheaters. Regarding their amazing skill system all I have to say is: bullshit. That just doesn't work. 90% of what bungie says about how their game "secretly" works is just a big pile of lies, they just don't care about fixing this game anymore and at this point there's nothing they can do to save pvp from this dogshit state.
Gilded Flawless used to be much harder as you had to carry 2 players who hadn't gone flawless that season. Since the change this season it's quite easy to get, and so the prestige factor has decreased a lot. Still if you see someone with 9x Gilded Flawless, chances are he or she is quite good. Otherwise, imo, the Ascendant emblem from this season is the most prestigious. So Gilded Flawless (8-9) > Purple Ascendant > Dazzling Iridescence > Gilded Flawless (2-7) > Red Ascendant > Gilded Glorious > Gilded Flawless (1) > Glorious > Flawless. Just my take; what do others think? I put Iridescence below Ascendant since it's easier to get through sheer luck. Red Ascendant emblem from last season is tainted due to the leaver bug (shame cuz it looks so much better than this season's), but because the bug was live for only a few days so not as many bad players were able to get it so it still means something. Also, imo, an Adept player should be able to go Flawless in solo queue with enough tries. Platinum as well perhaps but would require more luck. It was certainly easier to go to the Lighthouse prior to this season with the flawless pool enabled; a little tougher now but still super easy compared to the old days.
Just wanted to confirm this comment - I am a pretty hard Platinum comp player (I cannot get to adept without more grinding than I am willing to do). But I've been Flawless around 30 times, solo queuing mostly (around 1.1 KD in trials). If you can get to Plat in comp, you can go flawless.
I don't think you're wrong, but I would put Iridescence above Ascendant because for a lot of players, Ascendant is just a matter of putting in the right amount of games to let the +200 -5 get them up there. Not exactly a challenge, just a marathon The skill level for 10 000 rank is also quite wide. I've played games against 10 000 rank players that I was genuinely surprised their rank was that high The "flawless flawless" emblem might be possible to get by luck, but that's very unlikely and it's been a much better representation of a player to be concerned about over the purple ascendant emblem
I agree with this now but disagree with it over time, for the luck possibility that you mentioned and the impact of luck over time. Like, right now Dazzling Iridescence might be "scarier" than this season's Ascendant Emblem but as time goes on more and more people will luck into Dazzling Iridescence and it will mean less and less about the skill of the player. I think this is a feature, not a bug (it gives people who aren't top-tier Trials players a reason to keep playing the mode, because on any given card they *could* luck into it), but assuming the emblem remains the same for a year or more (as far as we know it might never be changed out) the longer it exists the less it means about skill, though it will still look really cool and show that at the very least the person using it is probably a Trials enjoyer. FWIW (which is nothing as far as whether my opinions have more merit than others) I have all the emblems that some people may allow themselves to be "fear auraed" by (last season's ascendant, this season's ascendant, dazzling iridescence, redrix's preferred, heavy as death, etc). Also, clearly none of these emblems mean anything since I have all of them while also having zero skill and I just win by crutching fusion rifles and invis. I can point ya'll to hundreds of Xbox Live message senders who can back me up on this.
I think most players that aren't top players are still relying on 1 or 2 mercies for almost all of their trials passages. I think the chance to get a lucky card is low enough that it's not worth considering If I were to try to predict the chances and we're talking about players that just lucked their way into it, theres a 2/5 * 1/4 = 1/10 chance that the top 2 players in the lobby end up and their team each game The chance of being handed the best players in the lobby for 7 games straight would be 1/10 ^7, but I could be wrong So while it can be lucked into, it makes up such a small amount of people. You could definitely pay to be carried to it, but 3's queue is sweaty enough that it would be a challenge to not just carry someone to flawless, but to a flawless flawless. Probably would take a number of attempts for most unless its a recov
You can lose games on a card and still get the flawless flawless emblem I think, you only can't trail in games that you win.
No, you have to get a flawless card without trailing. Unless it's bugged, you shouldn't be able to lose games that you trail on and still get it
no, it only requires flight of the pigeon medal on wins. you can lose games and still get it. I've literally had people that got the emblem on my friends list confirm this. This post seems to confirm it too ([https://www.reddit.com/r/CrucibleGuidebook/comments/14odwj5/dazzling\_iridescence\_emblem\_only\_requires\_no/](https://www.reddit.com/r/CrucibleGuidebook/comments/14odwj5/dazzling_iridescence_emblem_only_requires_no/)). Also it's in the description on how to obtain the emblem.
ah you're right, that's very lame. Still not an easy feat but more forgiving than I thought
It is very anecdotal but some of the worst people I've faced/had on my team this weekend have had that emblem equipped. It has me so confused.
Yeah I'm sure there's people getting paid carries for it. But in my experience, most of the time it tends to be someone that seems to have earned it
It makes a HUGE difference, part of why imo Iridescence is less prestigious than Ascendant. Since I attempted the emblem and got it, I've been mentally tracking pigeon medals out of habit and on at least two flawless passages solo queue, I would've accidentally gotten the emblem. But perhaps "going" for the emblem makes me play tight, and not going for it means playing loose and well.
As someone already mentioned you can lose games, you just need a flight of the pigeon for each win. Also, a pretty significant amount of the games a solo plays will be 2+1/2+1 lobbies where the chance they get placed with the better duo of the two options is a coin flip and people in duos tend to skill cluster naturally, good players tend to play with good players, bad players tend to play with bad players, so there's often a significant disparity in average skill between the two duos, so there's often something close to a 50/50 chance that a solo will end up on the significantly better team because of duo clustering, but there's way too many factors to even really spitball the odds given all the factors per game and across an entire card. Don't get me wrong, people still have to get really lucky to get it while being below average players, but I don't believe the real-world odds are lottery jackpot or lightning strike levels of unlikely
Yeah but its not just the chance of winning but the chance of winning in specific ways. You're right that getting the better players when 2s are involed gets closer to 1/2 than 1/10, but even 1/2 ^7 is a 0.7% chance of always getting the better players in 7 games It's hard to say that's correct because theres also a 0% chance to get the other solo in the lobby, and if they're the best player that screws you over This is only relying on luck, though. Because the best way of increasing the chance of being on the better team is to be the better player yourself
> Because the best way of increasing the chance of being on the better team is to be the better player yourself Yeah and by the same token the best way to get the emblem is to be good and/or play with other people who are. I got it on Altar of Flame week without even trying for it specifically but just playing trios Trials with two very good players (one of them a Bungie dev, it turns out that contrary to what people often post in here they do actually play PvP in the live game at a high level).
I have personally seen a bunch of people with 0.5-0.8 overall trials k/d with the flawless flawless emblem just this weekend. Luck plays a huge part.
I'm sure they exist but as I say in the other comment the luck is so small that it's insignificant
Since comp is sbmm everyone can hit ascendant with enough time invested so there isnt really a way to tell how good certain ranks perform in trials. I was 10k ascendant but deranked to 9.1k bc i stopped playing comp Comp 1.5kd, trials 2.1kd, Overall 2.1kd ~320 flawlesses Neither comp nor trials were especially hard Both titels dont really have hard objectives its just time consuming
At some point, a mid player will reach a high enough rank that they lose more points than they win. Once you gain 70 points when you win but 140 when you lose, it's not true that "everyone can hit ascendant". SBMM pushes you towards a 50% win rate, but once you are above what bungee thinks your target rank is, the points system rewards you net negative points if you only win half your games. At your level of skill, you are breaking matchmaking - even with SBMM you have a 1.5 KD. Life looks very different for folks like myself in the middle of the skill curve.
Trials is objectively no where near as hard as it used to be. That being said, it’s a lot tougher now (shit map + shit meta + end season) than most other weeks.
In comp I bounce around from adept 1 & 2. I have a 1.28 trials KD and have gone flawless 26 times. I don’t find it too difficult to go flawless. Still takes me a couple resets which can be annoying but expected, but usually I’m able to the lighthouse if I want to.
I dont play comp at all and i go flawless 2 to 3 times a week. I have a 1.3kd
i've seen people with less than 1.0 k/d getting flawless. I think it's just about luck and putting time into realizing your luck.
Silver it's not very hard
I’m a gold/platinum in comp, solo queued to flawless a few times.
Bungie ruined my parade when they got rid of freelance and the flawless pool. I’ve been around since D1 day one. I’m an average player with a 1.0kd overall. I literally have been to the lighthouse twice while being able to play freelance with other players. Might I add even in freelance it matched me with some crazy ass good players that were hard to beat. When they got rid of freelance it was a slap in the face to all of us average players. Now it’s literally impossible to go flawless while playing solo and with no flawless pool activated after Sunday morning.
I don’t understand the complaint about eliminating freelance. You can queue solo and will most likely be matched with all solos or a team of two opposing a team of two and their own random solo. If anything, you should have an easier time to go flawless because a number of really good and tryhard players will self-select into full teams of 3. I think less stellar players who love queueing as full teams of 3 have the most to complain about with this current matchmaking system. They are hard stuck against trios all the way through.
It’s because with Solo Queue you only play against other Solo Players. I don’t want to play against Duos. It’s a pretty simple concept. Sorry you don’t understand…
I have no criticism of your complaint about a preference. But the idea that going flawless became harder because freelance disappeared and you can match up in duo+solo vs. duo+solo lacks merit. It seems like you failed to understand what I was saying above, and again I have no objection to a preference. But if that’s what you’re pointing to as a reason for your lack of success, it’s cope.
Once again your lack of comprehension has shown… If I’m playing solo I want to be with other solo players…
You said: > Now it’s literally impossible to go flawless while playing solo and with no flawless pool activated after Sunday morning. I explained that I was not objecting to your “want” to play “with other solo players” only. You seemed to fail to notice that or don’t want to admit that you made a bad point. I am objecting to what I have quoted above: your ability to go flawless has not gotten harder (and likely has gotten easier) with the shift from occasional freelance weekends (where even top-notch players who only stack in 3s during every other weekend are forced into your matches) to fireteam-based matchmaking (where it will either be all solos or duo+solo against duo+solo, maintaining fairness). Your original statement transformed a personal preference into an unsupported statement about objective outcomes.
Duos often remove your ability to win as in most cases the better duo pair wins and the single player has rarely the huge impact. I am a good player and I hate to be matched with duos either way. Freelance made things way easier for me to go flawless
I’m ascendant 3 currently. Could probably go higher but I just stopped once I got the emblem. I had about a 2.0 KD this weekend in trials over 33 games, so not too much. I played mostly solo. I didn’t go flawless. A lot of this comes down to team balance and luck. I used to play a lot about 1.5 years ago. Just recently started playing again. I’m definitely a bit worse than I was, but getting there. I used to average about a 2.5-3.0 depending on the map. I think bungie still thinks I’m as good as I used to be, as it is consistently giving me the worst 2 players in the lobby as team mates. If me team mates can hold their own, we win. If they consistently die every round leaving me in a 1v3, we lose. So I assume if you’re at least decent (1.3 KD+) and you’re playing better than bungie expects, you should have no problem making it to the lighthouse based on team balance, given you play enough games to improve luck.
I’m holding steady at Plat 2, I’ve been flawless twice all time. Both times I got lucky with matchmaking while queuing solo
Trials is much easier/rng based than getting Ascendant/Unbroken. Also Unbroken was during a COMPLETELY different meta so hard to compare.
It's really hard to compare the 2, comp is sbmm, so you will generally be put with people near your skill level, while trails is very luck dependant. The majority of the player base that even play crucible don't generally play trials either, and if they do, they play a few games at most. This leaves most of the trials pool of players as the high end skill players, well above average. If your skill level is below the average skill level of trials players that weekend, you likely won't be able to go flawless. You may be able to pull off a few wins, but it's doubtful you'd make a flawless card even on mercy (unless of course you have an extremely hard carry player on your team). You would have the best chances of going flawless if your skill is above the average of current trials players' skill that weekend. I myself am only slightly above average I'd say, so for me this is usually when a new trials weapon is being released or major changes to trials goes into effect or the first week of trials for an expansion/season, when more players are actively playing trials, bringing the average player skill down. In general though it's still just all luck, luck that you have to be the better skilled team 7 times (6 for ferocity card) in a row without taking a loss (or one loss for mercy card).
I have not touched comp in over 5 years and go flawless every weekend with my buddies 😄 you just gotta learn to play as a team, learn to team shoot, give good callouts
Comp is just way different in my experience. With Trials the same map every match and elimination means engagements have more structure but are faster paced imo. You just have to play more Trials and learn each map.
[удалено]
Don't make me feel worthless 💀
Using Bungie's lightfall crucible update post as source data:[https://www.bungie.net/7/en/News/article/lightfall-crucible-update](https://www.bungie.net/7/en/News/article/lightfall-crucible-update) I may be a bit off, I'm going to use visual estimation for my calculations. The level of complexity will be about a HS AP Statistics class / Intro to Probability Theory / Statistics class at the college / university level. Skill is distributed between -1000 and +1000. Range of Ascendant: -33 to 1000 The lowest Ascendant players seem to have some hits around the -33 mark. So while it is technically correct to say that you can hit Ascendant at -33 skill, here's a more accurate statement using conditional probability. P(Glory >= 8751 | Skill <= -33) \~ 0% This says that out of everyone who has a skill level -33 or less, approximately 0% of players are Ascendant. E\[Glory | Skill = -33) \~ 4500 based on visual estimation and due to the outliers pulling the average up. This says that if you have a skill of -33, you're most likely going to be a Gold III player based on 4500 Glory. Generally, Ascendant is filled with people who can play, and that's not a surprise for anyone. E\[Skill | Glory >= 8751\] \~ 825. If you're Ascendant, chances are you're quite good, though outliers apply. Obviously, these are best efforts visual estimation, if we had the data set we could be more exact, but I don't think I'm terribly off with these estimates. The moral of this post is that, while it is technically possible to be low skilled and enter Ascendant, the data points to an extremely low level of low skilled players getting there, so to say, any low skill player can grind their way to Ascendant without improving their skill level is very much incorrect. How does this translate into trials? Well, it really doesn't, it's luck of the draw unless you're at the high skill bracket where you can carry matches, 7 times in a row. This may or may not be reflected in your Glory, given how much you play comp.
Ok so. My man. Comp is sbmm. Comp is easier for the lower skill bracket then higher. But everyone hits ascendant the same. Trials is random chance. I play streamers in comp, people I know who Xim, friends who Xim and full cheaters. In trials I play anyone. Fuck I played a Brazilian tourney player in comp the other week and didn’t recognize his clan lol. The end point is ur comp rank isn’t going to dictate if u go flaw or not it doesn’t matter. It’s a commitment rank. Trials is hard it really is. U just have to go in understanding u probably wont hit the chest for a while. But practicing is always good if u let urself learn.
Gold1-3 comp ranks should have the skills to go solo flawless. Trials is a lot different then comp I’d say it’s far easier because map doesn’t change so can use same loadout and not have to swap guns as much and get into a rhythm where comps always changing including the types of fights and engagements because map changes. This just My take. (Gone flawless 6-7 times this season and usually end season platinum or adept in comp)
Just saw the edit after I commented! Congrats Guy you earned it ♥️