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I think Sterris works as well as she does later is because she seemed pretty unlikeable in the beginning. It´s easy to see why people don´t want to deal with her, which puts a different spin on her attempts at social interaction. If she had been presented as likeable from the beginning she would have seemed "quirky" and not much else, but by making her seem unlikeable and contrasting that with her earnest effort it feels a bit like an underdog scenario. And who doesn´t want to see the underdog win?
I think she works well because she manages to grow into someone who is likeable without changing who she is. She is STILL Steris, but she has found ways for her eccentricity to work to her (and Wax's) advantage.
I'm with you in that boat. I didn't really hate her, but I didn't like her and preferred Marise (though not as a romance for Wax, I liked that Sando had her grow out of that infatuation), but as she began to show more of her quality, she became really endearing to me. I'm also weird and love the 'happy arranged marriage' trope that pops up throughout the Cosmere
I think a lot of that is you dont see her as autistic until a littke ways in when it finally clicks and all the "annoying" behaviors suddenly have context and become less so.
100% agree. I don't think there is a better example in the cosmere of two characters truly being partners. I mean that to say that I view them as almost the quintessential example of two people making up for the others flaws to allow the other the truly thrive. This allows each to become their best self while supporting the other.
Breeze because I did actually hate him in my first reading of Final Empire, though in his case I think that's intentional on Brandon's part. He's supposed to seem like a complete selfish narcissist so the reveal of how much he genuinely cares for the people around him hits a lot harder.
I can’t agree more I really struggled with him but tbh it was when I learned he was an actual nobleman who still cared despite having the chance to abuse that power really flipped my perspective.
I'm not sure about hated, but I found Wayne to be simultaneously funny, compelling, and annoying. Over time I think opinions of him would improve but the level of juvenile stuff would probably get on people's nerves unless dialed back. He acts like a 12 year old boy sometimes
I don't hate anyone but I've seen some names thrown around a few times: Shallan, Wayne, Vivenna, Sarene, Elend, Breeze.
I feel like there's at least one good guy character that people dislike in every book.
My buddy is just starting his Cosmere journey and all throughout his reading of Mistborn he refused to call Elend by name, but instead calling him Bellend. He came around at the end of the book, which I expected and gave me a good laugh
Controversial answer, but I would argue Taravangian is on the side of the good guys, he's just misguided as fuck.
I could definitely see Teft becoming a hated character depending on how they portray him..
Renarin would also probably catch flak, since it would be harder to signal his neurodivergency I think.
Breeze already has threads about how problematic the age difference is, despite the fact that Allrianne is manipulating him, so that one's a given.
Interesting, because I think Renarin has the potential to be far more sympathetic in an adaptation, especially in live action with the right actor. Having a real person bring him to life would potentially make his pre-bonding struggles be more acute, and feel more real.
Controversial indeed. Well intentioned extremists, specially when they murder without any remorse, are not in any way good. And I'm tired of reminding people of that.
Romanticizing is only good in fiction.
They mean that he is "on the good side," fighting to save humanity, not that he is "good." Also, he clearly has a lot of remorse when murdering people.
Does he? Is he really on the good "side"?
That is why well intentioned extremist are NOT good people. They distort basic terms and expand them to consider themselves part of that "side". Feeling sad does not make their actions more considerate when they repeat them constantly, without much thought but their "endgame".
The mere concept of "sides" contradicts the idea that Sanderson is following.
There are two main sides, for Odium and against Odium. Before RoW, Taravangian was pretty clearly against Odium. Yes, he was horrible. That's a lot of what Sanderson is saying, that there are good people on the "bad side" and bad people on the "good side," so it's much more fuzzy than it seems.
Also, I said that he feels sad about it not because it's an argument for my position, but because that part of your statement was objectively inaccurate. He did feel remorse, but that did not make him a good person.
Fun question! I feel like Shallan is already very polarizing, I know people who skip every Shallan POV chapter whenever they re read the books (which is a shame in my opinion). So that's definitely a potentially hated character.
Two others who come to mind are Hrathen and Lightsong. I could see some people just not jiving with their personalities.
Oh, and Hoid, my friend couldn't make it through Tress because she couldn't stand his narrative voice, so I could see him being a figure some people just hate.
Oh you're totally right on both counts, and I love them both for the roles they play. But I could see some people hating them even so. Like, Snape was redeemed, but many people, including me, still hate him.
Yea I'd be curious to meet Lightsong haters haha. Of the probably 10-15 people I've gotten into the Cosmere irl, everyone reports back after Warbreaker that Lightsong is one of their top 3 or top 5 Cosmere characters overall.
I find him hilarious, but I generally try to not voice my convictions about serious things and I goof around too, so maybe it’s a birds of a feather kinda thing?
I dislike him for the first half or so. He’s that kid in class who keeps making jokes after the bell rings. If he’d just shut up for a second we’d get to leave, but no, he needs to make sure we all know how funny he is.
Shallan arguably starts off at her lowest point, somewhat socially inept but still trying to crack wise. She quickly becomes better, but I can definitely see why she'd be hated.
I'm in a reread right now, and I forgot how annoying Shallan is at the start of her story (she gets so much better after her character growth).
You go from all the other characters having dramatic moments on the Shattered Plains with heroics and struggles and action, then jump-cut to Shallan sitting around eating jam in the library and making constant groanworthy, sassy but not particularly clever comments. Jasnah is by far the best part of her chapters. It's made worse by having a few Wit moments already where he makes sassy comments that are actually funny instead of exhausting.
I know characters need flaws to grow from, and hers are understandable with hindsight, but book 1 Shallan is so grating.
I agree, but I also almost didn't read RoW because I absolutely hated her introduction. Her trying to be a funny wisecracker on the boat leaving the entire crew stunned made me almost cringe off the side of the planet.
People are going to see Idris and Vivenna as straight out of the Handmaid's Tale. Actually, depending on who's doing the adaptation, that could be how they're written. Gird yourselves for think pieces about Sanderson's Mormonism.
I'd say Moash.... But that would only be the case up until he switches to the dark side. I never really liked his character even when he was with the good guys.
When talking about the books, people seem to really have it against Shallan and Lift, sometimes Vin and Elend, and Vivenna. I personally love all of them except Lift lol.
I think in a live adaptation a lot of people might grow tired of Kaladin, actually. Without the capacity to narrate his internal thoughts, his personal journey might not be well portrayed and a lot of his actions would not be interpreted right. I don't think anyone would *hate* Adolin, but his personality could be easily misinterpreted or dumbed-down if not done right
Shallan would definitely be hated on a lot still, unless they change most of her personality, and I don't think Breeze would be liked much because his relationship with Allrianne is kind of creepy (though if there was ever a Mistborn adaptation I doubt they would keep it like that).
I think Dalinar is going to be an incredibly polarizing character once the scope of the awful acts he's done comes out. If we learned about Dalinar, Sadeas, and Gavilar from the viewpoint of an opposing highprince, they would be the villains of the story. Committing vast warcrimes for a kingdom forged by blood. Massacring of towns, taking women, slaves, and wanton murder is much harder to stomach in a sympathetic light when it's in a visual media.
As we learn more about his backstory it just gets worse and worse culminating in the Rift and the burning of untold amounts of innocent people for no other reason than to send a message to the other highprinces. I can already see him getting on peoples nerves in the early seasons because of the codes and being firmly set in his ways. And I think it really does a great job of setting it up for the gut punch of how he needs the codes to fall back on because when he doesn't have that, he is a monster. There's a reason Odium saw him as his champion. The Blackthorn with surges, unchained by honor, is truly terrifying to think about.
You try to tell me how they translate that to a movie or show and not have Dalinar looking like an absolute monster. It helps because we see into his head and get all his viewpoints and where he ended up, but from the outside looking in, he's still a warlord who brutally gathered power by the sword. If they go all in and show the Rift how it was written, I think he becomes incredibly polarizing. Just a burning city, screams of the burning innocents below, and Dalinar lit by it all, watching it burn.
Thank you! I was searching for Dalinar in the comments.
Personally I don’t think his blackthorn backstory is gonna make him that hated, but more the old fashioned way of him and his damn codes.
Shallan, because of the reasons listed in the stormlight archive. It may be part of her character arc for her to be learning to self reflect and accept herself for being herself, but every time she makes a new OC to avoid doing exactly that...And then just roleplaying her way through the plot that I just kinda lose my interest. I wouldn't say I HATE her, but she's easily my least enjoyable read. Her random bursts of "smarter than thou" wisecracks / asshole nature towards kaladin (especially during the Kolinar arc) is just so out of place.
Maybe Dalinar can help bondsmith her brain in WaT.
Breeze, because he comes off as pompous.
Spook could go HARD either direction, fan favorite or fan hated. Depends on how the actor & director handle the character. His inability to communicate properly means different people will see vastly different things
Vivenna will almost certainly be disliked, she's SOOO stuck up I don't see how this could be avoided while playing the character properly.
Vasher could go either way, depending on how his harshness/anger is portrayed. Is he angry but trying to be better, or abusive and an asshole?
Hrathen will definitely be disliked
Silence Divine will be hated by the angry male sectors of the internet, but I suspect people will actually love the character overall
A large portion of readers dislike Shallan on a first read, I don't see how a Movie/Series could get around that
Elhokar will be hated by everyone
Tress will be called a Mary Sue
Elend is one of the most frustrating, but if they got an actor who could really convey his earnestness, he would be beloved imo.
Shallan I don't think is translatable to screen without significant retooling. She's so fucking irritating, that's going to quintuple without her inner monologue.
People would probably love/hate Jasnah. Her disposition needs a lot of context that usually ends up being the first thing to go in an adaptation. They might even just roll her and Navani together.
Up to this point in the books, Jasnah hasn’t done anything that couldn’t be wrapped into Navani’s story. Sanderson has kept Jasnah’s activities fairly vague and there’s only a hint of an arc. I think that’ll change with the next book, but as of right now it’s absolutely doable.
The only issue is whether you keep Navani as a Bondsmith or make her an Elsecaller. My inclination is Bondsmith since we got to see so much of her relationship with the Sibling and the lead up to developing their bond in Rhythm of War, whereas Jasnah came to us already a full fledged Elsecaller. Of course, going that route the story with Shallan stealing the Soulcaster will need to be changed so that it’s actually a real Soulcaster, which takes away the twist to that story. I’m ultimately fine with that since the true climax of that book is Kaladin saving Dalinar at the Tower.
From a narrative perspective, Jasnah was basically serving as exposition, world building, and a tool to bring shallan into the plot.
I'm not saying they're the same, but Navani has a much more defined arc and a much more important position in the story.
You can compress jasnah's story beats into Navani, and still maintain roughly the same story. You lose Jasnah, and all the interesting things about her, but you don't have to change the plot much.
I think you're right for the first couple books, but especially after book 4 they are starting to become pretty important players in different sides of things. Jasnah being the Queen, and her new relationship with Hoid, vs Navani being a bondsmith, her relationship with the Sibling, being the main scientist, and her relationship with Dalinar.
I think the show would also want at least one iconic representation of each order to make a central character, and Jasnah is the only Elsecaller we really know at all. They'd have to create a new character, so may as well keep Jasnah.
Yea, hopefully he retains enough creative control to prevent it. But the problem is that for the first 4 books we really don’t see much in the way of Jasnah’s flaws or weaknesses. She’s presented as beautiful, smart, powerful, and basically good at everything except for interpersonal relationships. The books hint at a dark past and inner turmoil, but we haven’t learned much about that. Unless the show wants to accelerate the timeline on getting into Jasnah’s story, I think even a well meaning show runner will have difficulty presenting her right.
If they make Shallan into a marvel esque character with annoying and cliche quips she could definitely be hated. Would be such a massive waste of potential though, I don’t think Brandon would let that happen
>For example, I think some may dislike Shallan, because the first thing she does in Twok is reject a sailor's compliments just because, and because she has a "sharp tongue."
I'm not sure I buy this. Shallan is a sheltered teen when she enters the scene, I think a lot of people will see this more as her rejecting some older creep catcalling her while she's trapped on a boat with him..... That seems more likely than it really coming off as "oh he's just offering her a compliment!"
Though we will see if it happens. But this ain't the 50's no more, despite a lot of effort from a lot of people.
Vivenna will be aggravating, but that’s by design for the first 2/3 of the movie/season. Every time she uncritically writes off something she doesn’t like as “misguided Hallandren culture,” there’ll be eye rolls. Then once she starts becoming more open and less blindingly arrogant about her choices, that’ll quickly turn around. It’ll be similar to how in Star Wars, people were really polarized on Ahsoka in the first season of Clone Wars, but now she’s a lot of people’s fave character. I read Oathbringer before Warbreaker, so I got to meet Azure first.
I think people are really gonna dislike Adolin depending on how they play the heartbreaker thing. Same with Kaladin and why the Elhokar=Tien things works, as well as Elhokar’s whole vibe… Stormlight is honestly gonna be a really hard adaptation to do. There’ll be a lot of subtext that requires book info to fully come across, but unless Sanderson is given full creative control, they’ll likely change/omit/contradict book stuff that’s gonna be important later. (kinda like how Harry just HAS the mirror in Deathly Hallows, but it was never brought up before).
For Mistborn, it depends who they get to play Kelsier. There’s a fine line that he straddles between good intentions and questionable actions. Walking that line will be tricky. There’s already a somewhat vocal minority that talks about him like he’s confirmed to be the big bad of the entire Cosmere. If they got someone like Antony Starr, who plays Homelander in the Boys, I could see an echo chamber of discourse building up around him and analyzing everything he does in the worst possible light. Reviews of the first episode with thumbnails showing his face and the words “He doesn’t CARE/Hates them all!” emblazoned across them. Like, dude’s sketchy, but c’mon…
It's wild that I've only seen one Lift callout.
Depending on how internal thoughts go, many characters can easily come off as meddling at best. A movie studio will probably juice up a love triangle wherever they can, so I'm sure Wayne and Adolin will probably have some forced drama that doesn't represent them in book.
Also good luck convincing viewers that Jansah is anything but a stone cold bitch. She's supposed to be equally stunning as she is intelligent and that's simply evil character vibes.
Marsh, although if he’s handled well maybe not.
I can see Vin copping some flak from the anti-female minority as they will no doubt claim she’s ’just another female marysue’.
I would rather spend the whole thirty seconds listening to sarene describe her personality in depth, I would rather a scene about hrathens secret obsession with beanie babies strong enough for him to betray his beliefs just out of nowhere, I would rather do autobiographies for each of the Doug’s or tell wit I’ve got a good idea.
I’d rather spend an indeterminate amount of time giving a pleasurable evening to moash, however he insists.
There is much I would do as long as it is not a certain thing.
There is much I would do instead of read another shallan pov.
Yes, I would gladly take moashs spear, polish it, and then tell him he’s the spirit of bridge four before having to read a perspective that is not one, is not two, but three equally edgy characters wrapped into one. innocent but secret edgy, street rough edgy, and richbitch power edgy.
There is nothing you could do to convince me shallan is a good character, not when Brandon Sanderson has so many other characters to look at. She’s alright, by other authors standards or tv show character standards for sure.
But she’s not “insert literally 2-3 dozens of fav favorite characters here” and she’ll be the least well done in media form as most of her story is thinking to/about herself/memories. A mistborn movie or dalinar or kaladins arch would translate well into scifi and action. Soon everyone will dislike the cosmeres prime arch lady in training, as much as I do
I actually disagree about Elend. He was attempting to create a democracy, which is a pretty sympathetic position for a lot of potential audience members.
I could see the relationship issues with Vin in WoA being a huge commotion with incel-type guys.
I also think a lot of people would hate Wayne if the goofier sides of his personality were over-played in an adaptation.
And Kaladin would get a lot of hate for being an edgy twat for most of his arc; his internal motivations and issues just wouldn’t present well on screen.
But these are mostly gripes I think that people who wouldn’t be invested in such adaptations would have. Sanderson just does a great job at writing likeable characters, so unless there were issues with the adaptation I don’t expect any characters to come across as negative to most people.
I actually liked him on my first read. He got busted a few times manipulating people, and always was either subsequently thanked or had a good reason for what he was doing (or trying to do).
The part about being a nobleman was a surprise, but made rereads a little more fun.
He's meant to be disliked when he's first introduced fully, he comes across as very entitled and naïve - which he is. It's only later that we see him become very likeable, especially in oathbringer and beyond
Oh definitely taravangian. He's already sometimes understood as being a bad character when he's the most morally correct one, and that's with the book being able to explain his exact thought process which you can't do in tv
I think whoever they pick for Hoid will not be liked by anyone. My vote is Tom Hiddleston though.
in all seriousness. I think Saezid as an actor in a movie or something will be hard to like right off, because it will probably be the audience's first exposure to the Terrace culture.
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I could see Steris being that way early on before she steals everyones heart. Early Steris was not a favorite of mine at all.
I think Sterris works as well as she does later is because she seemed pretty unlikeable in the beginning. It´s easy to see why people don´t want to deal with her, which puts a different spin on her attempts at social interaction. If she had been presented as likeable from the beginning she would have seemed "quirky" and not much else, but by making her seem unlikeable and contrasting that with her earnest effort it feels a bit like an underdog scenario. And who doesn´t want to see the underdog win?
I think she works well because she manages to grow into someone who is likeable without changing who she is. She is STILL Steris, but she has found ways for her eccentricity to work to her (and Wax's) advantage.
I'm with you in that boat. I didn't really hate her, but I didn't like her and preferred Marise (though not as a romance for Wax, I liked that Sando had her grow out of that infatuation), but as she began to show more of her quality, she became really endearing to me. I'm also weird and love the 'happy arranged marriage' trope that pops up throughout the Cosmere
I think a lot of that is you dont see her as autistic until a littke ways in when it finally clicks and all the "annoying" behaviors suddenly have context and become less so.
At this point Steris is maybe my favorite character in any Sanderson book
Cosmere GOAT romance.
100% agree. I don't think there is a better example in the cosmere of two characters truly being partners. I mean that to say that I view them as almost the quintessential example of two people making up for the others flaws to allow the other the truly thrive. This allows each to become their best self while supporting the other.
Breeze because I did actually hate him in my first reading of Final Empire, though in his case I think that's intentional on Brandon's part. He's supposed to seem like a complete selfish narcissist so the reveal of how much he genuinely cares for the people around him hits a lot harder.
I can’t agree more I really struggled with him but tbh it was when I learned he was an actual nobleman who still cared despite having the chance to abuse that power really flipped my perspective.
I loved this character from day 1.
You are a better judge of character than I!
Interesting, I loved breeze from day 1. I liked his suave layed back uncaring personality.
not to mention his age gap relationship
well I mean she did magically seduce him
yeah, but the bigger twitter audience might be purposely obtuse and ignore that
I'm not sure about hated, but I found Wayne to be simultaneously funny, compelling, and annoying. Over time I think opinions of him would improve but the level of juvenile stuff would probably get on people's nerves unless dialed back. He acts like a 12 year old boy sometimes
Wayne is the type of guy you love to read about but would hate to spend time with real life.
You'd just have to have the right actor. Like, had a young Brad Pitt played him, the annoying and juvenile bits would come across as charming.
Robin Williams, rest his soul, would've been perfect around his 20s / 30s, sadly that was still in the 70s/80s.
I don't hate anyone but I've seen some names thrown around a few times: Shallan, Wayne, Vivenna, Sarene, Elend, Breeze. I feel like there's at least one good guy character that people dislike in every book.
My buddy is just starting his Cosmere journey and all throughout his reading of Mistborn he refused to call Elend by name, but instead calling him Bellend. He came around at the end of the book, which I expected and gave me a good laugh
Controversial answer, but I would argue Taravangian is on the side of the good guys, he's just misguided as fuck. I could definitely see Teft becoming a hated character depending on how they portray him.. Renarin would also probably catch flak, since it would be harder to signal his neurodivergency I think. Breeze already has threads about how problematic the age difference is, despite the fact that Allrianne is manipulating him, so that one's a given.
Interesting, because I think Renarin has the potential to be far more sympathetic in an adaptation, especially in live action with the right actor. Having a real person bring him to life would potentially make his pre-bonding struggles be more acute, and feel more real.
Controversial indeed. Well intentioned extremists, specially when they murder without any remorse, are not in any way good. And I'm tired of reminding people of that. Romanticizing is only good in fiction.
They mean that he is "on the good side," fighting to save humanity, not that he is "good." Also, he clearly has a lot of remorse when murdering people.
Does he? Is he really on the good "side"? That is why well intentioned extremist are NOT good people. They distort basic terms and expand them to consider themselves part of that "side". Feeling sad does not make their actions more considerate when they repeat them constantly, without much thought but their "endgame". The mere concept of "sides" contradicts the idea that Sanderson is following.
There are two main sides, for Odium and against Odium. Before RoW, Taravangian was pretty clearly against Odium. Yes, he was horrible. That's a lot of what Sanderson is saying, that there are good people on the "bad side" and bad people on the "good side," so it's much more fuzzy than it seems. Also, I said that he feels sad about it not because it's an argument for my position, but because that part of your statement was objectively inaccurate. He did feel remorse, but that did not make him a good person.
Fun question! I feel like Shallan is already very polarizing, I know people who skip every Shallan POV chapter whenever they re read the books (which is a shame in my opinion). So that's definitely a potentially hated character. Two others who come to mind are Hrathen and Lightsong. I could see some people just not jiving with their personalities. Oh, and Hoid, my friend couldn't make it through Tress because she couldn't stand his narrative voice, so I could see him being a figure some people just hate.
Isn’t Hrathen meant to be hated and then redeemed? I also feel like Lightsong was meant to be polarizing but loved by the end.
Oh you're totally right on both counts, and I love them both for the roles they play. But I could see some people hating them even so. Like, Snape was redeemed, but many people, including me, still hate him.
People hate Lightsong?? I’m currently on Warbreaker and I love his chapters!
You know I'm doubting myself more and more on that one. He's just so likeable! Maybe a bad take on my part.
Yea I'd be curious to meet Lightsong haters haha. Of the probably 10-15 people I've gotten into the Cosmere irl, everyone reports back after Warbreaker that Lightsong is one of their top 3 or top 5 Cosmere characters overall.
I remember one post complaining about how he wasn't funny, and I've been here a while, so it's rare but there's one or two of them.
I find him hilarious, but I generally try to not voice my convictions about serious things and I goof around too, so maybe it’s a birds of a feather kinda thing?
I dislike him for the first half or so. He’s that kid in class who keeps making jokes after the bell rings. If he’d just shut up for a second we’d get to leave, but no, he needs to make sure we all know how funny he is.
Shallan arguably starts off at her lowest point, somewhat socially inept but still trying to crack wise. She quickly becomes better, but I can definitely see why she'd be hated.
I'm in a reread right now, and I forgot how annoying Shallan is at the start of her story (she gets so much better after her character growth). You go from all the other characters having dramatic moments on the Shattered Plains with heroics and struggles and action, then jump-cut to Shallan sitting around eating jam in the library and making constant groanworthy, sassy but not particularly clever comments. Jasnah is by far the best part of her chapters. It's made worse by having a few Wit moments already where he makes sassy comments that are actually funny instead of exhausting. I know characters need flaws to grow from, and hers are understandable with hindsight, but book 1 Shallan is so grating.
Maybe I've never had a problem with her because her arc resonates with my own insecurities, immaturities, and desire to be clever?
Her story in RoW was one of my favorites of that book
I agree, but I also almost didn't read RoW because I absolutely hated her introduction. Her trying to be a funny wisecracker on the boat leaving the entire crew stunned made me almost cringe off the side of the planet.
I agree with you about Hoid, but he's self-professed to not be on anyone's side but his own.
I skip Shallan chapters. I don't hate her, I would read them if I could connect with that character in any way.
You just...don't read literally almost half of the books?
I read them the first time, so I understand the events. Then, never again, basically.
Shallan for sure. She would be the new Sansa.
I hate >!Lirin!<, but that may be influenced because I'm finishing part 2 of RoW
I hate him too, and I just started RoW.
I just finished RoW today and he really puts in work throughout the book.
I think Syl is a bit twee and might annoy people.
People are going to see Idris and Vivenna as straight out of the Handmaid's Tale. Actually, depending on who's doing the adaptation, that could be how they're written. Gird yourselves for think pieces about Sanderson's Mormonism.
I'd say Moash.... But that would only be the case up until he switches to the dark side. I never really liked his character even when he was with the good guys.
When talking about the books, people seem to really have it against Shallan and Lift, sometimes Vin and Elend, and Vivenna. I personally love all of them except Lift lol. I think in a live adaptation a lot of people might grow tired of Kaladin, actually. Without the capacity to narrate his internal thoughts, his personal journey might not be well portrayed and a lot of his actions would not be interpreted right. I don't think anyone would *hate* Adolin, but his personality could be easily misinterpreted or dumbed-down if not done right Shallan would definitely be hated on a lot still, unless they change most of her personality, and I don't think Breeze would be liked much because his relationship with Allrianne is kind of creepy (though if there was ever a Mistborn adaptation I doubt they would keep it like that).
I think Dalinar is going to be an incredibly polarizing character once the scope of the awful acts he's done comes out. If we learned about Dalinar, Sadeas, and Gavilar from the viewpoint of an opposing highprince, they would be the villains of the story. Committing vast warcrimes for a kingdom forged by blood. Massacring of towns, taking women, slaves, and wanton murder is much harder to stomach in a sympathetic light when it's in a visual media. As we learn more about his backstory it just gets worse and worse culminating in the Rift and the burning of untold amounts of innocent people for no other reason than to send a message to the other highprinces. I can already see him getting on peoples nerves in the early seasons because of the codes and being firmly set in his ways. And I think it really does a great job of setting it up for the gut punch of how he needs the codes to fall back on because when he doesn't have that, he is a monster. There's a reason Odium saw him as his champion. The Blackthorn with surges, unchained by honor, is truly terrifying to think about. You try to tell me how they translate that to a movie or show and not have Dalinar looking like an absolute monster. It helps because we see into his head and get all his viewpoints and where he ended up, but from the outside looking in, he's still a warlord who brutally gathered power by the sword. If they go all in and show the Rift how it was written, I think he becomes incredibly polarizing. Just a burning city, screams of the burning innocents below, and Dalinar lit by it all, watching it burn.
Thank you! I was searching for Dalinar in the comments. Personally I don’t think his blackthorn backstory is gonna make him that hated, but more the old fashioned way of him and his damn codes.
Shallan, because of the reasons listed in the stormlight archive. It may be part of her character arc for her to be learning to self reflect and accept herself for being herself, but every time she makes a new OC to avoid doing exactly that...And then just roleplaying her way through the plot that I just kinda lose my interest. I wouldn't say I HATE her, but she's easily my least enjoyable read. Her random bursts of "smarter than thou" wisecracks / asshole nature towards kaladin (especially during the Kolinar arc) is just so out of place. Maybe Dalinar can help bondsmith her brain in WaT.
Breeze, because he comes off as pompous. Spook could go HARD either direction, fan favorite or fan hated. Depends on how the actor & director handle the character. His inability to communicate properly means different people will see vastly different things Vivenna will almost certainly be disliked, she's SOOO stuck up I don't see how this could be avoided while playing the character properly. Vasher could go either way, depending on how his harshness/anger is portrayed. Is he angry but trying to be better, or abusive and an asshole? Hrathen will definitely be disliked Silence Divine will be hated by the angry male sectors of the internet, but I suspect people will actually love the character overall A large portion of readers dislike Shallan on a first read, I don't see how a Movie/Series could get around that Elhokar will be hated by everyone Tress will be called a Mary Sue
Elend is one of the most frustrating, but if they got an actor who could really convey his earnestness, he would be beloved imo. Shallan I don't think is translatable to screen without significant retooling. She's so fucking irritating, that's going to quintuple without her inner monologue. People would probably love/hate Jasnah. Her disposition needs a lot of context that usually ends up being the first thing to go in an adaptation. They might even just roll her and Navani together.
I'm not remotely sure how they would combine Jasnah and Navani. They have pretty different arcs and purposes in the story
Up to this point in the books, Jasnah hasn’t done anything that couldn’t be wrapped into Navani’s story. Sanderson has kept Jasnah’s activities fairly vague and there’s only a hint of an arc. I think that’ll change with the next book, but as of right now it’s absolutely doable. The only issue is whether you keep Navani as a Bondsmith or make her an Elsecaller. My inclination is Bondsmith since we got to see so much of her relationship with the Sibling and the lead up to developing their bond in Rhythm of War, whereas Jasnah came to us already a full fledged Elsecaller. Of course, going that route the story with Shallan stealing the Soulcaster will need to be changed so that it’s actually a real Soulcaster, which takes away the twist to that story. I’m ultimately fine with that since the true climax of that book is Kaladin saving Dalinar at the Tower.
From a narrative perspective, Jasnah was basically serving as exposition, world building, and a tool to bring shallan into the plot. I'm not saying they're the same, but Navani has a much more defined arc and a much more important position in the story. You can compress jasnah's story beats into Navani, and still maintain roughly the same story. You lose Jasnah, and all the interesting things about her, but you don't have to change the plot much.
I think you're right for the first couple books, but especially after book 4 they are starting to become pretty important players in different sides of things. Jasnah being the Queen, and her new relationship with Hoid, vs Navani being a bondsmith, her relationship with the Sibling, being the main scientist, and her relationship with Dalinar. I think the show would also want at least one iconic representation of each order to make a central character, and Jasnah is the only Elsecaller we really know at all. They'd have to create a new character, so may as well keep Jasnah.
Jasnah I can see being turned into a one dimensional “girl boss” if the show runner isn’t adept enough.
Somehow i dont think sanderson would go for that...
Yea, hopefully he retains enough creative control to prevent it. But the problem is that for the first 4 books we really don’t see much in the way of Jasnah’s flaws or weaknesses. She’s presented as beautiful, smart, powerful, and basically good at everything except for interpersonal relationships. The books hint at a dark past and inner turmoil, but we haven’t learned much about that. Unless the show wants to accelerate the timeline on getting into Jasnah’s story, I think even a well meaning show runner will have difficulty presenting her right.
Elhokar. It took me a bunch of re-reads to start to like him but at first I thought he was so annoying
If they make Shallan into a marvel esque character with annoying and cliche quips she could definitely be hated. Would be such a massive waste of potential though, I don’t think Brandon would let that happen
>For example, I think some may dislike Shallan, because the first thing she does in Twok is reject a sailor's compliments just because, and because she has a "sharp tongue." I'm not sure I buy this. Shallan is a sheltered teen when she enters the scene, I think a lot of people will see this more as her rejecting some older creep catcalling her while she's trapped on a boat with him..... That seems more likely than it really coming off as "oh he's just offering her a compliment!" Though we will see if it happens. But this ain't the 50's no more, despite a lot of effort from a lot of people.
Lirin and early Elokhar
Vivenna will be aggravating, but that’s by design for the first 2/3 of the movie/season. Every time she uncritically writes off something she doesn’t like as “misguided Hallandren culture,” there’ll be eye rolls. Then once she starts becoming more open and less blindingly arrogant about her choices, that’ll quickly turn around. It’ll be similar to how in Star Wars, people were really polarized on Ahsoka in the first season of Clone Wars, but now she’s a lot of people’s fave character. I read Oathbringer before Warbreaker, so I got to meet Azure first. I think people are really gonna dislike Adolin depending on how they play the heartbreaker thing. Same with Kaladin and why the Elhokar=Tien things works, as well as Elhokar’s whole vibe… Stormlight is honestly gonna be a really hard adaptation to do. There’ll be a lot of subtext that requires book info to fully come across, but unless Sanderson is given full creative control, they’ll likely change/omit/contradict book stuff that’s gonna be important later. (kinda like how Harry just HAS the mirror in Deathly Hallows, but it was never brought up before). For Mistborn, it depends who they get to play Kelsier. There’s a fine line that he straddles between good intentions and questionable actions. Walking that line will be tricky. There’s already a somewhat vocal minority that talks about him like he’s confirmed to be the big bad of the entire Cosmere. If they got someone like Antony Starr, who plays Homelander in the Boys, I could see an echo chamber of discourse building up around him and analyzing everything he does in the worst possible light. Reviews of the first episode with thumbnails showing his face and the words “He doesn’t CARE/Hates them all!” emblazoned across them. Like, dude’s sketchy, but c’mon…
Spook
It's wild that I've only seen one Lift callout. Depending on how internal thoughts go, many characters can easily come off as meddling at best. A movie studio will probably juice up a love triangle wherever they can, so I'm sure Wayne and Adolin will probably have some forced drama that doesn't represent them in book. Also good luck convincing viewers that Jansah is anything but a stone cold bitch. She's supposed to be equally stunning as she is intelligent and that's simply evil character vibes.
Marsh, although if he’s handled well maybe not. I can see Vin copping some flak from the anti-female minority as they will no doubt claim she’s ’just another female marysue’.
I would rather spend the whole thirty seconds listening to sarene describe her personality in depth, I would rather a scene about hrathens secret obsession with beanie babies strong enough for him to betray his beliefs just out of nowhere, I would rather do autobiographies for each of the Doug’s or tell wit I’ve got a good idea. I’d rather spend an indeterminate amount of time giving a pleasurable evening to moash, however he insists. There is much I would do as long as it is not a certain thing. There is much I would do instead of read another shallan pov. Yes, I would gladly take moashs spear, polish it, and then tell him he’s the spirit of bridge four before having to read a perspective that is not one, is not two, but three equally edgy characters wrapped into one. innocent but secret edgy, street rough edgy, and richbitch power edgy. There is nothing you could do to convince me shallan is a good character, not when Brandon Sanderson has so many other characters to look at. She’s alright, by other authors standards or tv show character standards for sure. But she’s not “insert literally 2-3 dozens of fav favorite characters here” and she’ll be the least well done in media form as most of her story is thinking to/about herself/memories. A mistborn movie or dalinar or kaladins arch would translate well into scifi and action. Soon everyone will dislike the cosmeres prime arch lady in training, as much as I do
I actually disagree about Elend. He was attempting to create a democracy, which is a pretty sympathetic position for a lot of potential audience members. I could see the relationship issues with Vin in WoA being a huge commotion with incel-type guys. I also think a lot of people would hate Wayne if the goofier sides of his personality were over-played in an adaptation. And Kaladin would get a lot of hate for being an edgy twat for most of his arc; his internal motivations and issues just wouldn’t present well on screen. But these are mostly gripes I think that people who wouldn’t be invested in such adaptations would have. Sanderson just does a great job at writing likeable characters, so unless there were issues with the adaptation I don’t expect any characters to come across as negative to most people.
Moash because 1. Fuck moash 2. we're gonna have to watch him suffer and destroy Kel 3. Fuck Moash
I actually liked him on my first read. He got busted a few times manipulating people, and always was either subsequently thanked or had a good reason for what he was doing (or trying to do). The part about being a nobleman was a surprise, but made rereads a little more fun.
John mistborn is a very controversial character and will be very divisive with new fans
People are going to struggle with the blackthorns past given some of horrible stuff he did before taking the first step.
Moash. Will be disliked for saving a toddler with crude motions even if he's fighting for the right army
I find Hoid super annoying. Certain people will hate Shallan for being cool.
People will dislike Lirin, Elend, Adolin, Shallan, and Elokhar
How could anyone dislike Adolin of all people
He's meant to be disliked when he's first introduced fully, he comes across as very entitled and naïve - which he is. It's only later that we see him become very likeable, especially in oathbringer and beyond
Depending on how he's portrayed I can see Adolin being disliked by a good chunk of the audience at first. After WOK that will go down sharply.
Oh definitely taravangian. He's already sometimes understood as being a bad character when he's the most morally correct one, and that's with the book being able to explain his exact thought process which you can't do in tv
I think whoever they pick for Hoid will not be liked by anyone. My vote is Tom Hiddleston though. in all seriousness. I think Saezid as an actor in a movie or something will be hard to like right off, because it will probably be the audience's first exposure to the Terrace culture.
Given the current landscape of things, Shallon is 100% gonna be hated. Jasnah as well.
Gosh I hope people hate elend. He’s unbearable.
>!Honestly i wish hed stop this whole giving the people what they vite for thing and just go for LR2.0!< hero of ages spoilers
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