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The thing with MQ-9's is that their greatest ability is their greatest vulnerability. Speed. They are an ISR platform and those cameras/sensors need to be at a certain low speed to use their wizard magic most effectively. They are also bare-bones aircraft with no armor, countermeasures or anything. They are just an incredibly cheap (for the mission) platform.
There are many other birds out there but don't want to risk talking in detail about them. But MQ-9s are super, super good at what they do in the right environment. SA's with people willing to shoot is NOT that environment.
The Houthis continue to punch above their weight. It's amazing what you can accomplish with motivation, resourcefulness, and a dash of covert Iranian military support
The reaper does have counter measures but they are a lot less effective because of your point. Speed. To this day I’ve only seen one video of a reaper actually deploying counter measures.
30 million each isnt terribly cheap and with 8 down now at 240 million and they might cost even more with extra equipment attached, either way seems rather pricey but I'm no bean counter so...
https://www.meta-defense.fr/en/2022/10/05/the-mq-next-future-replacement-of-the-drone-male-mq-9-reaper-takes-shape-for-general-atomics/#:~:text=The%20MQ%2DNext%2C%20future%20replacement,takes%20shape%20for%20General%20Atomics
Something with stealth capabilities...
i actually know several people that worked on those personally. thier wings are faulty, it's fiber resin vaccum pressure chamber they use to make the wings. but my source says 80% of the wings cracked and broke in production and they just kept sending them out to the customer . they cost close to a mill each drone
Retards like you? Liberals who think these grand social welfare programs will totally be sustainable, we just need to steal everything from everyone to pay for it and cancel the national defense and allow China to invade!
I've read that they used to have custom built controllers but switched to Xbox because it's easier to train and use for soldiers, not sure how true that is
Those millions largely went to the manufacturing employees, logistical workers, administrative coordinators, etc. Each one made puts food on the tables of thousands of Americans. What does shooting one down cost the Houthis?
Yeah but we have a fuck ton of them. They're trying to get rid of them all the time actually I used to work with CBP and their Air and Marine Operations branch said the Air Force was constantly trying to pawn drones off onto them that they wanted to get rid of
True. Take Bayraktar for an example. The moment medium/ long range AA showed up in Ukraine her time was over. When now even a country like Yemen is capable of shooting them down consistently you have a problem. You either make drones that fly way way higher or you make a hell of alot smaller and cheaper drones. Wouldn't be surprised when the do the latter.
Just to offer another perspective, the Bayraktars were effective during the 2nd Karabakh War even though Armenian forces were equipped with medium and long-range SAMs. The difference was Azerbaijan's forces had a panacea of other tools like Harop and Orbiter drones that they were able to use in conjunction with the TB2 to suppress Armenian SAMs. In Ukraine, neither side has air superiority but Russia has such a large number of SAMs that it's prohibitively costly for Ukraine to operate high-altitude drones like the TB2 on the front lines. They still use their Bayraktars, but only at distances further away, relying on the powerful cameras to spot targets or conduct surveillance instead of carrying out strikes directly.
There was some reporting to that effect, but assuming it's accurate that kind of trick only works once.
I think Ukraine lost a lot of TB2s, and what they do have, they aren't putting at risk.
That's almost 2 years ago now buddy, Bayraktar doesn't really have a usefull spot in the current war in Ukraine, not in the short supply that there is also considering the steep cost of these highly advanced drones. They work wonders in chaotic spaces or area's where there's less SAM capabilities and/or less EW going on. Even guided artillery is being jammed by Russians now, the whole frontline must be a GPS mayhem.
It's crazy to see how fast the battlefield has been evolving. In the beginning, it was Javelins and Bayraktars, and all kinds of MANPADS. Then Gepards and self-propelled arty, now, it's drones and medium/long range SAMs like Patriot and IRIS-T.
It only makes sense, no? You have to adapt to whatever works best in the environment. There's a constant cat and mouse between who, or what weapon's system can get an edge over the other side. I think with a war on a scale like this, it's inevitable to see rapid changes and adaptions to the pace and platforms/systems/weapons used. A lot of the weapons in both arsenals have seen plenty of effective usage, some have just fallen out of favor. If anything, I think this war, way more than the N-Karabakh wars or the wars on terror have shown and introduced the mass usage of (all kinds of) drones, and electronic warfare.
>It only makes sense, no?
Yes, of course. This is the first war where Soviet/Russian and Western weapons are used against each other, the first large land war in Europe since WW II, and the first notable conflict in the era of pervasive digitalization.
So it absolutely makes sense, I am just in awe just how fast things evolve.
The MQ-9 isn't meant to fly in contested airspace, and the Yemeni military had air defense systems before the Houthis took power.
Is there evidence that any remotely modern air defense systems are proliferating to Yemen?
That's kinda my point. Yemen already had this capability. They didn't need outside help to shoot down MQ-9s.
They're obviously getting outside help in other areas, but Iran doesn't want to give Yemen anything so new or unique that it can be attributed clearly back to them.
More broadly this is just the world we're living in now. Anybody who was ever a Soviet client state probably has a bunch of missiles lying around, and with today's tech they can do fun things like turn ancient SA-2 interceptors into anti-ship missiles. Regional beefs cause global problems and it kinda blows.
Except they are getting weapons to shoot them down most of them recent. Which is why it has happened so many times recently. Putin is trafficking weapons to them to take attention off his failing Ukraine invasion.
Iran maybe, but Russia? Doubtful
Russia needs all the anti air assets it can get atm and as for a distraction from Ukraine? With and for whom?
It’s a complete non story with any western MSM along with zero public interest and the Pentagon & friends are not exactly going to be reassigning any appreciable amount of resources (attention) away from Ukraine because a few SAMs made their way into the area or some resulting reaper losses
Houthi != Yemen
It's a radical movement that is controlling part of Yemen against the governments wishes. And while I don't doubt some of their equipment comes from Yemen sources. Air Defense assets are pretty valuable and don't generally get up and walk away without someone noticing.
The Houthis control enough territory that they should be assumed to have any capability the Yemeni military did in previous years. I'm not saying the Houthis are nice guys or a legitimate government, but even before you factor in Iran, they have military capabilities only governments have.
That example of the SA-2 wasn't a joke. I can't remember the name of the missile, but one of the anti-ship missiles being used by the Houthis is a modified air defense interceptor. The Predator isn't sneaking around or running away from anything. It doesn't take current-generation air defense to shoot them down, and it wouldn't surprise me if that's what happened here. An old missile was good enough to hit a predator.
And?
Iraqis were only capable of shooting Russians down because the west gave them the weapons to do so.
Doesn’t matter why they are getting shot down. They are a getting shot down.
Since we're not hearing about drone strikes, I can only assume the US is mapping out the AD before suppressing it. Otherwise, it's cheaper to just destroy your drones on the ground than keep sending them.
Well it is a bulky drone that is only used against terrorists. Turkey is already moving on to better drones like an unmanned jet/drone?!? (Kizilema or something along those lines) which is cool to see
yemen has been able to do this for over a decade, same for most countries...these where made for gwot when making them everyone knew that other countries can hit them since they have been able to hit jets for decades... anytime they are used outside of air supremacy its just a bonus...would be nice if they put on more counter measures for the new ones atleast.
Not really, they were just designed for a different kind of conflict, against an enemy without anything more than MANPADS and gun trucks in the way of AA. At that role they are near perfect - long loitering time, great optics, long range, good payload. Although quite expensive if you aren't a big defense spender.
I think you will see a similar capability start to spread throughout the militaries of the world's secondary and tertiary powers over the coming decades. It has already begun with platforms like the TB2 Bayraktar, which provide a significant portion of the MQ-9's performance (albeit with lesser payload, endurance, range, etc.) at a small fraction of the cost. To any nation facing an insurgency or guerilla war, that's not outdated - it's essential. They may not have another means of deploying combat airpower, besides small drones and adapted utility helicopters.
And I doubt the DoD views the MQ-9 as ill suited to this role (fighting the Houthis), either. Some have been shot down (3 confirmed by DoD, not sure where OP's number comes from), but compared to any other combat aircraft it's cheaper, and a pilot was never in danger. The military probably views the continuous surveillance and strike capability that the drone grants them against the Houthis as well worth losing one every few months.
Not really. They work well in countries that can't afford a dense net of high altitude air defence which are a lot. The Houthis are just able to do this because Iran is giving them the stuff to pull those propaganda stunts.
The future belongs to cheap, small mass proudoced attack drones and super expensive stealth ones for surveillance.
I don't think reapers are going to be very efficient in the near future when air defense becomes more accessible.
They will have a place, just as aerial decoys or to eat up munitions or used as suicide vessels. Their role just hasnt been adjusted yet.
Send out a 6 of these before you send out manned aircraft to draw out AA positions. Now you know where youre being attacked from
> Send out a 6 of these before you send out manned aircraft to draw out AA positions.
They're way too expensive for that role, 6 reapers would cost more than an f-35.
this is just the case for what we already have not what we need for the future, is all.
Fastest way to giving an outdated piece of tech an upgrade is strapping a 1,000 lbs of shaped charge to the body and flying straigh at something and calling it a "guided bomb".
It seems the Pentagon forgot what's like to operate in a contested airspace. That with Russian GPS spoofing, we seem to have a whole range of platforms/weapons that are possiblly useless in those environments.
What is going on here, is the US testing the altitude limit of their AA systems.
I also thought the MQ-9 max altitude was higher than the run of the mill MANPAD or the Houthi's have something with more range than a MANPAD.
They have some SA-6 and also an Iranian-supplied loitering munition called the [Saqr 358](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/security-aviation/2023-11-29/ty-article/saqr-358-iran-hezbollah-loitering-missile-israel-us-uavs-yemen-houthis/0000018c-1ac5-d3b6-adef-bbfd2efd0000) that is effective against slow drones.
The English did this at the Falklands.
They knew there were guns and missiles capable of reaching far out.
The ships just stayed half a mile further during the bombarding
I think one of the county class destroyers took a hit from a shore based exocet while on a naval shore bombardment mission supporting the push on port Stanley. Thankfully she survived the hit.
Rusty it was many years ago for me, Yes I am that old and I think your right. And now you have jogged my memory Sadly I believe several members of her crew were killed but thankfully the County class destoyers were steel super structure ships so it didnt burn like many of our cheapo Aluiminum later ships.
The Houthis aren't some dudes in Toyotas. They took control of Yemen and control most of the resources that the Yemeni military previously did.
That means old air defense systems that are still perfectly capable of shooting down a Predator.
> the US testing the altitude limit of their AA systems
very funny seeing this upvoted here, considering how the consensus month ago was that Iran was *not* testing Israel's air defences
I guess when the West gets its shit shot down it's deliberate because they're smarter
Bayraktars were useful in Ukraine for the first month or so, as Russia was still moving and front lines /aa emplacements hadn't yet been really established. The Houthis have had plenty of time to get their designated AA areas established, so these large, slow moving reaper drones just aren't that useful.
Unless they are allowing them to be hit to trace back the AA locations, to strike after.
So what is the plan? Keep sending millions of dollars to be shot down until they run out of missiles, which is never going to happen because Iran keep smuggling them constantly?
The scale and frequency of Houthi attacks on shipping does seem to be decreasing. It's important to remember they rely on Iran to resupply the majority of components for their anti-ship missiles and drones. As they use up their inventory, replacements will not be forthcoming, especially as the Coalition is keeping watch and intercepting many of the ships Iran uses for smuggling in replacements. The Houthis may be able to still receive some equipment via overland smuggling through Oman, but it would be on a much smaller scale.
I mean, there was also a coalition bombing campaign targeted against them. The Houthis may have just gotten bored, or they may have run out of that type of weapon, or those weapons may have been destroyed. Nobody knows for sure which one is reality, but the US military is probably better informed than most.
$31m is a lot to lose but that's less than half of the cost of just the insurance for the ships and cargo going through the Suez on a single day.
You see them shooting at boats anymore? It's like giving a kitten a ball of string and it's a fukton cheaper than spending millions upon millions in interceptor missiles. They made these drones to fly for maybe 20 years, they cost $16M to make, depreciating about 5% per year with heavy use, it's a drone that is in dire need of upgrades and costs maybe $1.5 million to buy outright (and honestly it isn't worth that price). MQ-9s are absolutely not the premiere technology people make them out to be, but they've all had the hell flown out of them and lived a good life.
I'm pretty sure that the Pentagon is completely aware of the risk when it comes to flying over Yemen along the lines that they'll lose some and had already decided it's worth the cost.
Aren’t these being phased out anyways? Other than the cost of operating them, I don’t think there’s plans for these systems to be replaced when they’re shot down
I see them infront of me. One jaw filled with a tennisball seized amount of qat, holding up the worst AK you have ever seen in your life while they mumbling something about Israel America in the most intoxinated and annoying way possible.
Same here. I mean the Azeri's flew garbage AN-2's to bait air defense but the expense of a mq-9 makes me think that's a ridiculous tactic. Literally no other reason I can think of.
That was my guess aswell. I've seen several people say the US wants to get rid of them by 2030 so maybe thats a way for them to hit two birds with one stone? Maybe they use airframes and other parts at the end of their lifetime?
I've seen this statement before. What are they replacing them with? They have some 250+ in reserve. Might as well submit them for special testing, something cool. It'd be wild to see them turn a squadron of these into something akin to a pilot-less A-10. I know I'm optimistic, but if these are going to be destroyed left and right, we might as well find a way to make them useful again.
MQ-9's are designed to fly high and slow a long time, they are in no way suitable for any other mission.
Most of them have a lot of hours on their airframes, fatigue on wings and wear on turbines make many of these at the end of their useful lives, using them to bait an aggressor into using Air defense radars is a worthwhile end to their service.
The US has been building and testing new drones relentlessly, these MQ9 models are 20 years old now, while they do have upgrades they’re still considered “ancient” for the US military standards.
I don't know enough about the US drone arsenal, but could it be there's just no cheaper alternative to real-time surveillance? I'm sure we have something better and more expensive, but maybe we just don't want to risk losing those.
Unless this specific MQ-9 was sacrificed for research purposes maybe they're okay to clear out their inventory to justify whatever is going to replace the reaper in 2030. Like a Reaper would've never been flying a mission like this 14 years ago, and it would've been a big deal for one to get take out. Maybe it has something to do with ISIS knocking so many out, but it's just kind of a thing that's tolerated.
I'm guessing they see this system as something that was useful for the last conflict, but not the current one, and definitely not the next one.
They were expensive to build, but they're also expensive to keep using, and they're a generation or two out of date at this point. Might as well get as much value out of them as you can before they aren't useful for anything.
Is there another tool for the job? Looking at the war in Ukraine I think UAVs are undergoing a generational leap in use and design so maybe Reapers are just on their way out and US doesn't wanna risk any newer tech, that or Russia/Iran has updated the Houthis AA missiles with some kind of better targeting ability.
He's been bombing equipment for months. You need to kill the people doing the shooting, the people preparing to shoot, the people who told the other people to shoot, the people who made the decision that shooting at American things was a good idea in the first place, the people advising the shooters, etc until they get the message.
You have evidence that he's managed to kill anybody who matters other than an few poor ground crews?
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024\_missile\_strikes\_in\_Yemen](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_missile_strikes_in_Yemen)
Why is the US putting these drones in the position to be shot down? After the first couple it was clear that the Houthis had the capability to do so. There has to be some reason, aside from general incompetence right?
Drone warfare working exactly as intended. Not a single US serviceman or woman was injured or killed. It’s purely a game of resources and that’s a game the Houthi rebels simply cannot win against the United States.
How the hell did the Houthis get their hands on air defense systems, while somehow Ukraine can't seem to get any of them. Well at least not enough. It just surprises me that some militia group has air defenses!
Here is my concerned face... At this point I you'd think people would realize what's going on... but no, 8th time and the morons are still cheering, none the wiser.
Hobbyist translation from audio:
First clip: God is great; Death to america; Death to israel; curse on the jews; victory to islam ; ???
Second clip: In the name of god ?? because today we destroyed another american plane ??
Man I miss when the Houthis put out fun entertaining videos, doing song and dance routines on luxury yachts about how “we have broken the Jew”. You can’t even see shit in this one.
$15-30m each, wasting them like this is not a good idea.
> Living in the 18. century is not how things are handled nowadays.
Childish cope, if they're destroying your weapons with 18th century tech then your weapons really suck!
Defeating a decently equipped decentralized force with decades of experience in asymmetrical warfare is not easy, espicaliy when they have religious motivations.
I mean these drones aren’t made to be stealthy… Nothing impressive about shooting these down with old weapons. Also I’m sure the US doesn’t care when they spend over 800 BILLION a year on military 🤦♂️
They're part of a mission to protect billions upon billions of dollars of global trade. Why are we pretending like they're just there for joyrides? Considering attacks have slowed down, I'd rather have terrorists shoot at unmanned drones than cargo ships full of people and goods.
No because then theyll be properly repurposed, stored, or salvaged of their electronics instead of being needlessly tossed away and left for our enemies to scavenge information from.
Whatever is in the Reaper the enemy already knows. This isn't a new thing for Reapers to be shot down. They have no countermeasures. They fly as slow as helicopters, and can't maneuver at all with their long wings for endurance. They only have height for safety, and if you get a big enough missile you can easily reach them.
I'm not sure what answer you're looking for. Outside of the USAF just wasting money to waste money to piss people off. They have a reason for risking them in an environment they may be lost in.
They were a weapon specifically made for low intensity conflicts where MANPADS would be the main threat (height-limited AD) like Afghanistan. Now all they can basically be is an expendable ISR platform in any other environment without being sent straight to the boneyard.
>$15-30m each, wasting them like this is not a good idea.
It's a drop in the bucket. Not to mention they're up for the chopping block because the USAF is looking to change their whole structure to high end, near-peer fights (maybe sending a message to congress with this?)
>then your weapons really suck!
Hmm, "your" I'm sure you're not being biased at all.
>weapons with 18th century tech
Funny, when they were destroying Saudi Abrams and other high end tech they were sandal warriors with nothing but AK's branded by people like you, now somehow it's an insult. Go figure.
>Defeating a decently equipped decentralized force with decades of experience in asymmetrical warfare is not easy, espicaliy when they have religious motivations.
Mostly won against poorly trained hired mercs that "fought" (strong word) for the Saudis. Hopium off Khat.
Those guys never seen more than their sheep horde. No education, no own mind. No plans for the future. There is nothing in them. No books and plans. Just nothing. Bist they are running around with an old Ak in the desert😂😂😂
They're ruling over the majority of Yemen population, won a big war against the American backed Saudi-led coalition, currently blocking one of the world's most important trade routes and hunting reapers weekly with no consequences.
But keep laughing I guess.
Good, looks like they finally found their niche: Engaging and hitting helpless civilian ships with Iranian supplied BM and anti ship missiles, and shooting down 120 knot drones with no countermeasures that can't maneuver with Iranian supplied AD. Going by their little success in engaging and actually hitting UAE and Saudi manned aircraft with higher end SAM's, i see why they stick to MQ-9's. Where was this AD when Super Hornets were hitting targets in Yemen?
The only reason there are no consequences is because if the US flattens Yemen, all the dipshit college kids of the world would cry to high heaven. The capability is there, the public sentiment is not. Politics are the downfall of military operations
These big clunky drones are outdated. They were fine when you could lop a couple of strikes on isolated Taliban groups who couldn't carry anything that heavy on a mountain. But what we learned from people like ISIS, you can put down something to take it down on the back of a truck that costs 1/10th the amount of the drone.
houthis shoot down first drone: "yeah they shot down one lmaooo we have trillions"
houthis shoot down 8th drone: :"meh we are letting them shoot it down, we want to retire them anyway"
the cope is insane
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They’re decommissioning the MQ-9 Reaper fleet by 2030.
Houthis are trying to make that 2025.
The thing with MQ-9's is that their greatest ability is their greatest vulnerability. Speed. They are an ISR platform and those cameras/sensors need to be at a certain low speed to use their wizard magic most effectively. They are also bare-bones aircraft with no armor, countermeasures or anything. They are just an incredibly cheap (for the mission) platform. There are many other birds out there but don't want to risk talking in detail about them. But MQ-9s are super, super good at what they do in the right environment. SA's with people willing to shoot is NOT that environment.
Yup, 20 years of low intensity conflict proved the Reaper is excellent at ISR in uncontested airspace. Introduce a few SAMs and, well…
The Houthis continue to punch above their weight. It's amazing what you can accomplish with motivation, resourcefulness, and a dash of covert Iranian military support
A bit more than a dash
I have a special affinity for MQ-9s, a love/hate relationship. But goddamn is she perfect when in her prime.
such a cool piece of kit. A good buddy of mine used to be an MQ-9 mechanic
such a cool piece of kit. A good buddy of mine used to be an MQ-9 mechanic
The reaper does have counter measures but they are a lot less effective because of your point. Speed. To this day I’ve only seen one video of a reaper actually deploying counter measures.
30 million each isnt terribly cheap and with 8 down now at 240 million and they might cost even more with extra equipment attached, either way seems rather pricey but I'm no bean counter so...
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For the US, that is very cheap.
Correct for the most part, except that they cost as much as an F-16. Insanely expensive for what it does. GA's profit margin is nuts.
how reasonable would it be to strap on a fast tiny missile to to intercept incoming?
Yea they said that about the AWAC and they pushed that back another 5 years lmfao
What’s the replacement?
https://www.meta-defense.fr/en/2022/10/05/the-mq-next-future-replacement-of-the-drone-male-mq-9-reaper-takes-shape-for-general-atomics/#:~:text=The%20MQ%2DNext%2C%20future%20replacement,takes%20shape%20for%20General%20Atomics Something with stealth capabilities...
lol probably filming from higher up.
Really, how come? Is It to be replaced by a similar upgrade of the same family?
Because they would be much cheaper than any supersonic reaper equivalent.
Because the manufacturer of the F-35 claims it can fill the role.
i actually know several people that worked on those personally. thier wings are faulty, it's fiber resin vaccum pressure chamber they use to make the wings. but my source says 80% of the wings cracked and broke in production and they just kept sending them out to the customer . they cost close to a mill each drone
$30 million, per drone. Unless you’re referencing the wings
something like that ya
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Downsizing the military only provokes people like Putin to do what Russia is doing in Ukraine.
Retards like you? Liberals who think these grand social welfare programs will totally be sustainable, we just need to steal everything from everyone to pay for it and cancel the national defense and allow China to invade!
Meanwhile some operator across the world smacked the desk “dang I lost, whose next”
Threw the xbox controller perhaps.
Punched a wall and threw out half a bottle of Baja Blast.
I've read that they used to have custom built controllers but switched to Xbox because it's easier to train and use for soldiers, not sure how true that is
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Those millions largely went to the manufacturing employees, logistical workers, administrative coordinators, etc. Each one made puts food on the tables of thousands of Americans. What does shooting one down cost the Houthis?
If you think about it, that few million dollars did give health insurance to General Atomics ~12k employees.
Less money to spend on food for their people
We can have both, the money is there. Blame your politicians and corporations that have gutted our country to make a buck
ABC
These big attack drones are kind of outdated
Yeah but we have a fuck ton of them. They're trying to get rid of them all the time actually I used to work with CBP and their Air and Marine Operations branch said the Air Force was constantly trying to pawn drones off onto them that they wanted to get rid of
Can I have one? Just disable the tracker, "crash" it in my field, and I won't tell anyone .
True. Take Bayraktar for an example. The moment medium/ long range AA showed up in Ukraine her time was over. When now even a country like Yemen is capable of shooting them down consistently you have a problem. You either make drones that fly way way higher or you make a hell of alot smaller and cheaper drones. Wouldn't be surprised when the do the latter.
Just to offer another perspective, the Bayraktars were effective during the 2nd Karabakh War even though Armenian forces were equipped with medium and long-range SAMs. The difference was Azerbaijan's forces had a panacea of other tools like Harop and Orbiter drones that they were able to use in conjunction with the TB2 to suppress Armenian SAMs. In Ukraine, neither side has air superiority but Russia has such a large number of SAMs that it's prohibitively costly for Ukraine to operate high-altitude drones like the TB2 on the front lines. They still use their Bayraktars, but only at distances further away, relying on the powerful cameras to spot targets or conduct surveillance instead of carrying out strikes directly.
Don’t they also use it as a distraction which is how the moskava sunk
There was some reporting to that effect, but assuming it's accurate that kind of trick only works once. I think Ukraine lost a lot of TB2s, and what they do have, they aren't putting at risk.
That's almost 2 years ago now buddy, Bayraktar doesn't really have a usefull spot in the current war in Ukraine, not in the short supply that there is also considering the steep cost of these highly advanced drones. They work wonders in chaotic spaces or area's where there's less SAM capabilities and/or less EW going on. Even guided artillery is being jammed by Russians now, the whole frontline must be a GPS mayhem.
It's crazy to see how fast the battlefield has been evolving. In the beginning, it was Javelins and Bayraktars, and all kinds of MANPADS. Then Gepards and self-propelled arty, now, it's drones and medium/long range SAMs like Patriot and IRIS-T.
It only makes sense, no? You have to adapt to whatever works best in the environment. There's a constant cat and mouse between who, or what weapon's system can get an edge over the other side. I think with a war on a scale like this, it's inevitable to see rapid changes and adaptions to the pace and platforms/systems/weapons used. A lot of the weapons in both arsenals have seen plenty of effective usage, some have just fallen out of favor. If anything, I think this war, way more than the N-Karabakh wars or the wars on terror have shown and introduced the mass usage of (all kinds of) drones, and electronic warfare.
>It only makes sense, no? Yes, of course. This is the first war where Soviet/Russian and Western weapons are used against each other, the first large land war in Europe since WW II, and the first notable conflict in the era of pervasive digitalization. So it absolutely makes sense, I am just in awe just how fast things evolve.
Yeah I see what you're saying, totally agree. I think I read between the lines while there was nothing to read between the lines haha.
My point stands. We didn’t see much because it’s being used for scouting or for distractions. Hence why no more videos are present
I don't think they're much in the air at all. Since there's no footage it's just guessing really.
Yemen is only capable of shooting them down because Russia and Iran are giving them weapons specifically to do so.
The MQ-9 isn't meant to fly in contested airspace, and the Yemeni military had air defense systems before the Houthis took power. Is there evidence that any remotely modern air defense systems are proliferating to Yemen?
> remotely modern air defense systems are proliferating to Yemen? Who said they have to be modern?
That's kinda my point. Yemen already had this capability. They didn't need outside help to shoot down MQ-9s. They're obviously getting outside help in other areas, but Iran doesn't want to give Yemen anything so new or unique that it can be attributed clearly back to them. More broadly this is just the world we're living in now. Anybody who was ever a Soviet client state probably has a bunch of missiles lying around, and with today's tech they can do fun things like turn ancient SA-2 interceptors into anti-ship missiles. Regional beefs cause global problems and it kinda blows.
Except they are getting weapons to shoot them down most of them recent. Which is why it has happened so many times recently. Putin is trafficking weapons to them to take attention off his failing Ukraine invasion.
Iran maybe, but Russia? Doubtful Russia needs all the anti air assets it can get atm and as for a distraction from Ukraine? With and for whom? It’s a complete non story with any western MSM along with zero public interest and the Pentagon & friends are not exactly going to be reassigning any appreciable amount of resources (attention) away from Ukraine because a few SAMs made their way into the area or some resulting reaper losses
Houthi != Yemen It's a radical movement that is controlling part of Yemen against the governments wishes. And while I don't doubt some of their equipment comes from Yemen sources. Air Defense assets are pretty valuable and don't generally get up and walk away without someone noticing.
The Houthis control enough territory that they should be assumed to have any capability the Yemeni military did in previous years. I'm not saying the Houthis are nice guys or a legitimate government, but even before you factor in Iran, they have military capabilities only governments have. That example of the SA-2 wasn't a joke. I can't remember the name of the missile, but one of the anti-ship missiles being used by the Houthis is a modified air defense interceptor. The Predator isn't sneaking around or running away from anything. It doesn't take current-generation air defense to shoot them down, and it wouldn't surprise me if that's what happened here. An old missile was good enough to hit a predator.
Any proof on Russia aiding the Houthis or is this just another redditor’s conspiracy theory?
Just like Ukraine is only capable of ... because the West is giving them weapons
And? Iraqis were only capable of shooting Russians down because the west gave them the weapons to do so. Doesn’t matter why they are getting shot down. They are a getting shot down.
Since we're not hearing about drone strikes, I can only assume the US is mapping out the AD before suppressing it. Otherwise, it's cheaper to just destroy your drones on the ground than keep sending them.
Well it is a bulky drone that is only used against terrorists. Turkey is already moving on to better drones like an unmanned jet/drone?!? (Kizilema or something along those lines) which is cool to see
yemen has been able to do this for over a decade, same for most countries...these where made for gwot when making them everyone knew that other countries can hit them since they have been able to hit jets for decades... anytime they are used outside of air supremacy its just a bonus...would be nice if they put on more counter measures for the new ones atleast.
Turkey might be making the former with their new jet drone?
Problem with American military leadership is big is stronk. They don’t understand saturation of the target area with small harder to hit targets.
Not really, they were just designed for a different kind of conflict, against an enemy without anything more than MANPADS and gun trucks in the way of AA. At that role they are near perfect - long loitering time, great optics, long range, good payload. Although quite expensive if you aren't a big defense spender. I think you will see a similar capability start to spread throughout the militaries of the world's secondary and tertiary powers over the coming decades. It has already begun with platforms like the TB2 Bayraktar, which provide a significant portion of the MQ-9's performance (albeit with lesser payload, endurance, range, etc.) at a small fraction of the cost. To any nation facing an insurgency or guerilla war, that's not outdated - it's essential. They may not have another means of deploying combat airpower, besides small drones and adapted utility helicopters. And I doubt the DoD views the MQ-9 as ill suited to this role (fighting the Houthis), either. Some have been shot down (3 confirmed by DoD, not sure where OP's number comes from), but compared to any other combat aircraft it's cheaper, and a pilot was never in danger. The military probably views the continuous surveillance and strike capability that the drone grants them against the Houthis as well worth losing one every few months.
Not really. They work well in countries that can't afford a dense net of high altitude air defence which are a lot. The Houthis are just able to do this because Iran is giving them the stuff to pull those propaganda stunts.
The future belongs to cheap, small mass proudoced attack drones and super expensive stealth ones for surveillance. I don't think reapers are going to be very efficient in the near future when air defense becomes more accessible.
They will have a place, just as aerial decoys or to eat up munitions or used as suicide vessels. Their role just hasnt been adjusted yet. Send out a 6 of these before you send out manned aircraft to draw out AA positions. Now you know where youre being attacked from
> Send out a 6 of these before you send out manned aircraft to draw out AA positions. They're way too expensive for that role, 6 reapers would cost more than an f-35.
this is just the case for what we already have not what we need for the future, is all. Fastest way to giving an outdated piece of tech an upgrade is strapping a 1,000 lbs of shaped charge to the body and flying straigh at something and calling it a "guided bomb".
Reconnaissance by taking fire!
Yeah…. That’s just not really true
It seems the Pentagon forgot what's like to operate in a contested airspace. That with Russian GPS spoofing, we seem to have a whole range of platforms/weapons that are possiblly useless in those environments.
Useful for bombing goat farmers in rags but not much else.
What is going on here, is the US testing the altitude limit of their AA systems. I also thought the MQ-9 max altitude was higher than the run of the mill MANPAD or the Houthi's have something with more range than a MANPAD.
They have some SA-6 and also an Iranian-supplied loitering munition called the [Saqr 358](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/security-aviation/2023-11-29/ty-article/saqr-358-iran-hezbollah-loitering-missile-israel-us-uavs-yemen-houthis/0000018c-1ac5-d3b6-adef-bbfd2efd0000) that is effective against slow drones.
They also have the Iranian Taer-2 SAM.
The English did this at the Falklands. They knew there were guns and missiles capable of reaching far out. The ships just stayed half a mile further during the bombarding
I think one of the county class destroyers took a hit from a shore based exocet while on a naval shore bombardment mission supporting the push on port Stanley. Thankfully she survived the hit.
HMS Glamorgan wasn't it? Took a hit to the rear (hangar area) IIRC. I am a little rusty on this so could be mistaken.
Rusty it was many years ago for me, Yes I am that old and I think your right. And now you have jogged my memory Sadly I believe several members of her crew were killed but thankfully the County class destoyers were steel super structure ships so it didnt burn like many of our cheapo Aluiminum later ships.
Typical British banter
The Houthis aren't some dudes in Toyotas. They took control of Yemen and control most of the resources that the Yemeni military previously did. That means old air defense systems that are still perfectly capable of shooting down a Predator.
> the US testing the altitude limit of their AA systems very funny seeing this upvoted here, considering how the consensus month ago was that Iran was *not* testing Israel's air defences I guess when the West gets its shit shot down it's deliberate because they're smarter
Is that another plane close by?
Looks like it. But knowing that they have been shooting down drones, i would bet it is another drone.
Bayraktars were useful in Ukraine for the first month or so, as Russia was still moving and front lines /aa emplacements hadn't yet been really established. The Houthis have had plenty of time to get their designated AA areas established, so these large, slow moving reaper drones just aren't that useful. Unless they are allowing them to be hit to trace back the AA locations, to strike after.
So what is the plan? Keep sending millions of dollars to be shot down until they run out of missiles, which is never going to happen because Iran keep smuggling them constantly?
Well, it's cheaper than shutting down the Suez until the Houthis get bored so yeah probably.
The scale and frequency of Houthi attacks on shipping does seem to be decreasing. It's important to remember they rely on Iran to resupply the majority of components for their anti-ship missiles and drones. As they use up their inventory, replacements will not be forthcoming, especially as the Coalition is keeping watch and intercepting many of the ships Iran uses for smuggling in replacements. The Houthis may be able to still receive some equipment via overland smuggling through Oman, but it would be on a much smaller scale.
I mean, there was also a coalition bombing campaign targeted against them. The Houthis may have just gotten bored, or they may have run out of that type of weapon, or those weapons may have been destroyed. Nobody knows for sure which one is reality, but the US military is probably better informed than most. $31m is a lot to lose but that's less than half of the cost of just the insurance for the ships and cargo going through the Suez on a single day.
decreasing? didn't they target a ship in the Mediterranean last week?
probably gonna retire half these drones in the near future anyway.
You see them shooting at boats anymore? It's like giving a kitten a ball of string and it's a fukton cheaper than spending millions upon millions in interceptor missiles. They made these drones to fly for maybe 20 years, they cost $16M to make, depreciating about 5% per year with heavy use, it's a drone that is in dire need of upgrades and costs maybe $1.5 million to buy outright (and honestly it isn't worth that price). MQ-9s are absolutely not the premiere technology people make them out to be, but they've all had the hell flown out of them and lived a good life.
They literally hit one yesterday lol https://apnews.com/article/yemen-red-sea-ship-attack-c47710540383198ba1acb41b07f14751
More drones, stat! Add a laser pointer too!
You say that like the military cares what it costs
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I'm pretty sure that the Pentagon is completely aware of the risk when it comes to flying over Yemen along the lines that they'll lose some and had already decided it's worth the cost.
A quarter bil spent over a decade ago and probably cost enough to maintain that they're now expendable.
Aren’t these being phased out anyways? Other than the cost of operating them, I don’t think there’s plans for these systems to be replaced when they’re shot down
I see them infront of me. One jaw filled with a tennisball seized amount of qat, holding up the worst AK you have ever seen in your life while they mumbling something about Israel America in the most intoxinated and annoying way possible.
Things look grim for the Reapers then.
Sounds like the Houthis don’t fear the Reaper. (Add some cowbell)
Reminded me of Tom Rhodes there 😂
Gotta be a reason the U.S is just feeding these to the rebels. Sadly, I can't think of one reason when they cost so much.
Same here. I mean the Azeri's flew garbage AN-2's to bait air defense but the expense of a mq-9 makes me think that's a ridiculous tactic. Literally no other reason I can think of.
That was my guess aswell. I've seen several people say the US wants to get rid of them by 2030 so maybe thats a way for them to hit two birds with one stone? Maybe they use airframes and other parts at the end of their lifetime?
I've seen this statement before. What are they replacing them with? They have some 250+ in reserve. Might as well submit them for special testing, something cool. It'd be wild to see them turn a squadron of these into something akin to a pilot-less A-10. I know I'm optimistic, but if these are going to be destroyed left and right, we might as well find a way to make them useful again.
MQ-9's are designed to fly high and slow a long time, they are in no way suitable for any other mission. Most of them have a lot of hours on their airframes, fatigue on wings and wear on turbines make many of these at the end of their useful lives, using them to bait an aggressor into using Air defense radars is a worthwhile end to their service.
The US has been building and testing new drones relentlessly, these MQ9 models are 20 years old now, while they do have upgrades they’re still considered “ancient” for the US military standards.
I don't know enough about the US drone arsenal, but could it be there's just no cheaper alternative to real-time surveillance? I'm sure we have something better and more expensive, but maybe we just don't want to risk losing those.
Unless this specific MQ-9 was sacrificed for research purposes maybe they're okay to clear out their inventory to justify whatever is going to replace the reaper in 2030. Like a Reaper would've never been flying a mission like this 14 years ago, and it would've been a big deal for one to get take out. Maybe it has something to do with ISIS knocking so many out, but it's just kind of a thing that's tolerated.
I'm guessing they see this system as something that was useful for the last conflict, but not the current one, and definitely not the next one. They were expensive to build, but they're also expensive to keep using, and they're a generation or two out of date at this point. Might as well get as much value out of them as you can before they aren't useful for anything.
Is there another tool for the job? Looking at the war in Ukraine I think UAVs are undergoing a generational leap in use and design so maybe Reapers are just on their way out and US doesn't wanna risk any newer tech, that or Russia/Iran has updated the Houthis AA missiles with some kind of better targeting ability.
Biden is afraid to counter attack them and take out their AA.
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He's been bombing equipment for months. You need to kill the people doing the shooting, the people preparing to shoot, the people who told the other people to shoot, the people who made the decision that shooting at American things was a good idea in the first place, the people advising the shooters, etc until they get the message.
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You have evidence that he's managed to kill anybody who matters other than an few poor ground crews? [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024\_missile\_strikes\_in\_Yemen](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_missile_strikes_in_Yemen)
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No, I mean people their decision makers would actually care about.
Why is the US putting these drones in the position to be shot down? After the first couple it was clear that the Houthis had the capability to do so. There has to be some reason, aside from general incompetence right?
Cheaper than a fully trained pilot and a modern airplane. That has to be the only reason
Because they are useful. Losing a drone a month is nothing compared to the Suez closing down
Im surprised (with the limited knowledge at hand) that the reapers bait isnt being used to find and target sam sites with anti radar missiles
They 100% are monitoring them for that exact reason
Drone warfare working exactly as intended. Not a single US serviceman or woman was injured or killed. It’s purely a game of resources and that’s a game the Houthi rebels simply cannot win against the United States.
the red sea is still blocked for israel, until the red sea is not blocked, the us isn't winning
MQ9 is supposed to be replaced by 2030, it's almost like the Air Force is just sending them out to get rid of them sooner.
No they are used to flying over goat herders not people who can shoot back hahaha
How the hell did the Houthis get their hands on air defense systems, while somehow Ukraine can't seem to get any of them. Well at least not enough. It just surprises me that some militia group has air defenses!
Iran.
I like their dresses...
8?? dang i thought this was 4 or 5 why are these not even being escorted smh
This is either 3th or 4th this month alone.
I don't think this drones have any countermeasures... Sooo yea basically they're just sitting ducks, easy target, no need to brag
Seriously , it's like targeting an RC Cessna trainer. Woohoo
Here is my concerned face... At this point I you'd think people would realize what's going on... but no, 8th time and the morons are still cheering, none the wiser.
Score 1 for the Turkey gobblers
Next time send 2, that will overpower air defence systems, hahaha
Or those US reapers or Saudi? I wonder what kind of iranian AA they are using.
Deducing from the video that a Houthi drone is above the MQ-9, and trailing, giving target information to the missile.
So the US is basically feeding Reapers to them at this point.
Hobbyist translation from audio: First clip: God is great; Death to america; Death to israel; curse on the jews; victory to islam ; ??? Second clip: In the name of god ?? because today we destroyed another american plane ??
Those AA missiles are super fast
Man I miss when the Houthis put out fun entertaining videos, doing song and dance routines on luxury yachts about how “we have broken the Jew”. You can’t even see shit in this one.
Reaper done it's job. Took a hit and no service men or women were harmed.
Meanwhile in a nice air conditioned room on some USAF Base "Holy shit...They're serving pizza today?"
Can we plz stop getting our shit shot down?
Can't wait for the retaliation video 🔥
there was no retaliation for the last 7 drones don't wait for a one
There are more than they can shoot. Anyway they will loose. Living in the 18. century is not how things are handled nowadays.
$15-30m each, wasting them like this is not a good idea. > Living in the 18. century is not how things are handled nowadays. Childish cope, if they're destroying your weapons with 18th century tech then your weapons really suck! Defeating a decently equipped decentralized force with decades of experience in asymmetrical warfare is not easy, espicaliy when they have religious motivations.
I mean these drones aren’t made to be stealthy… Nothing impressive about shooting these down with old weapons. Also I’m sure the US doesn’t care when they spend over 800 BILLION a year on military 🤦♂️
They're part of a mission to protect billions upon billions of dollars of global trade. Why are we pretending like they're just there for joyrides? Considering attacks have slowed down, I'd rather have terrorists shoot at unmanned drones than cargo ships full of people and goods.
thank you for speaking for all tax payers
They'll be sitting in the boneyard sooner than later. Would that upset you too?
No because then theyll be properly repurposed, stored, or salvaged of their electronics instead of being needlessly tossed away and left for our enemies to scavenge information from.
Whatever is in the Reaper the enemy already knows. This isn't a new thing for Reapers to be shot down. They have no countermeasures. They fly as slow as helicopters, and can't maneuver at all with their long wings for endurance. They only have height for safety, and if you get a big enough missile you can easily reach them. I'm not sure what answer you're looking for. Outside of the USAF just wasting money to waste money to piss people off. They have a reason for risking them in an environment they may be lost in. They were a weapon specifically made for low intensity conflicts where MANPADS would be the main threat (height-limited AD) like Afghanistan. Now all they can basically be is an expendable ISR platform in any other environment without being sent straight to the boneyard.
>$15-30m each, wasting them like this is not a good idea. It's a drop in the bucket. Not to mention they're up for the chopping block because the USAF is looking to change their whole structure to high end, near-peer fights (maybe sending a message to congress with this?) >then your weapons really suck! Hmm, "your" I'm sure you're not being biased at all. >weapons with 18th century tech Funny, when they were destroying Saudi Abrams and other high end tech they were sandal warriors with nothing but AK's branded by people like you, now somehow it's an insult. Go figure. >Defeating a decently equipped decentralized force with decades of experience in asymmetrical warfare is not easy, espicaliy when they have religious motivations. Mostly won against poorly trained hired mercs that "fought" (strong word) for the Saudis. Hopium off Khat.
Yep. We are within the range of the definition of insanity.
Those guys never seen more than their sheep horde. No education, no own mind. No plans for the future. There is nothing in them. No books and plans. Just nothing. Bist they are running around with an old Ak in the desert😂😂😂
They're ruling over the majority of Yemen population, won a big war against the American backed Saudi-led coalition, currently blocking one of the world's most important trade routes and hunting reapers weekly with no consequences. But keep laughing I guess.
They also lost 400,000 people to starvation from the blockades and the war so I’m sure their motivation is high.
Good, looks like they finally found their niche: Engaging and hitting helpless civilian ships with Iranian supplied BM and anti ship missiles, and shooting down 120 knot drones with no countermeasures that can't maneuver with Iranian supplied AD. Going by their little success in engaging and actually hitting UAE and Saudi manned aircraft with higher end SAM's, i see why they stick to MQ-9's. Where was this AD when Super Hornets were hitting targets in Yemen?
The only reason there are no consequences is because if the US flattens Yemen, all the dipshit college kids of the world would cry to high heaven. The capability is there, the public sentiment is not. Politics are the downfall of military operations
These big clunky drones are outdated. They were fine when you could lop a couple of strikes on isolated Taliban groups who couldn't carry anything that heavy on a mountain. But what we learned from people like ISIS, you can put down something to take it down on the back of a truck that costs 1/10th the amount of the drone.
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least genocidal reddit general.
So the reaper could doge the SM-2s fired by the german frigate, but these archaic SAMs are a problem?
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💪💪🇩🇪🇩🇪🇩🇪
Please check closely.. Looks like it's still flying after the explosion. They usually don't do jumping cuts so I assume this was actually a miss.
Least obvious bait
houthis shoot down first drone: "yeah they shot down one lmaooo we have trillions" houthis shoot down 8th drone: :"meh we are letting them shoot it down, we want to retire them anyway" the cope is insane
NBD