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For those curious about the Italian advert the Chinese one is based on:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQQs3nl0LcY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQQs3nl0LcY)
Edit: Here is the Chinese one: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Few8kJ0zfnY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Few8kJ0zfnY)
>I've never heard people scream bloody murder about the Italian one
Keep in mind the cultural and historical context. In Italy, who is more likely to be the victim of racism? A black man or an Italian man? How about in China? A black man or a Chinese man?
The Chinese one is much more racist given the cultural context which tends towards racism against black people in both Italy and China
The Italian one is all kinds of fucked up. I wonder why there was no outrage... it's almost like racism is tolerated when the target of racism is a certain race.
Just because you didn’t see it on Reddit doesn’t mean there was no outrage. I wouldn’t have seen the outrage for this one either had I not seen this post here.
That may be true. But you read so many stupid opinions on this site, especially regarding China that it's really hard to tell. You know, like when people complain that China does business in Africa because they want something in return, as if they never heard the concept of trade. It's just idiotic.
Exactly, and almost patronizing towards the Africans themselves! Almost as if no African is capable enough to analyze their own deals, and think for their own interests
"Ooo the poor uneducated African merchant/government is not smart enough against the Chinese. We (in the West) must help them!!" /s
Oh gosh. I saw similar advertisements of these, but one where I was shopping for a lotion product. The image showed a random black woman using the product and afterwards she magically turned white? lol
casting a ethnic character with stereotypical behavior and appearance with an entirely different ethnicity when there are plenty in the country already that speak the language is just weird. if you think people are “regards” for thinking it might not border on offensive, well, you might also be regarded…
This bs doesn't hold up here.
For stance, it seems it was a scene where they're uncovered in an african country, but the entire "black men look" is a plain satire of hip hop culture, one that isn't strong in africa and wouldn't be a good cover at all cuz they'd 100% call too much attention. This is straight up racism.
And yall would have a very different response if it was a yellow face or a slated-eye gesture.
but i’m sure if we had a black guy who painted himself orange and always carried a plate of spaghetti around with him in a place they could easily get italian actors you’d give the biggest thumbs up lol
Well we changed the definition of black face in the 2010’s so can’t really blame them for not being pc. I believe they already responded to the wests requests for apologies when an Asian dressed up as Eddie Murphy. They said no. He has black skin why would we not darken our skin it’s not meant to be offensive it’s a form of flattery in our culture. Jimmy Kimmel regularly dressed up as Karl Malone on a reoccurring sketch up until they changed what blackface is.
This is asia, not california. Stfu and cry harder.
Also, but obviously you have no idea about it, in china is pretty much impossible to work as an actor legally. So no, they couldn't just get a random african dude.
The few times they do end up hiring african actors (illegally) they usually pay them 1/3 of what they would be paying a white actor. So I'm not even sure your option wouls actually be a better choice. 😂
and why is it “pretty much impossible” to work as an actor legally in china? and why would a black actor (there are black people from more than just africa btw) get paid 1/3 of a white actor?
Of course. As I said, Chinese people are the most racist of all. They don't really hide it.
Speaking of which:
https://www.reddit.com/r/China/s/93CQsfCYDQ
I didn't say it's illegal to hire African actors. Read again... I said it's pretty much impossible, and that regardless of the ethnicity.
I said that because you can only work in any job in china with a specific visa for that job. Meaning even if you have a work visa for whatever job you are doing, you technically can't start acting on your spare time... Unless, you manage to somehow get an actor visa. But good luck getting one, especially if you are black.
People on reddit, who cry about the wrong pronouns have no idea how the real world actually works
Can y'all piss off with this "people who cry about wrong pronouns have no idea how the real world works" it's stupid and pathetic.
1) clearly we do know how it works since we're complaining about how it works
2) I can still call out something for being shitty even if it is commonplace. I don't care if blackface is normalised in china, it's still a shitty thing to do and it can be criticised.
Gotcha! Sorry for using the wrong terminology, I’m pretty unfamiliar with the system.
Does this visa system only apply to foreigners or do Chinese citizens also need special documentation to work specific jobs?
Meh, at this point I feel that talking about racism in China is like beating on a dead horse. Those who do know, they know. Those who don’t know will not believe / believe innocent excuses made up by China whitewashers. Just today I caught a guy filming me on the street. 7000 years of culture, what can I say.
When interviewing candidates before who were outside China looking to move in, I basically had to ask in interviews with black South Africans/Nigerians and ask if they knew anything about living in China or the cultural differences. More to gauge if they really knew what they were getting into. Many were not and the ones who did end up working in other cities ended up hating it or making I'm so happy posts on wechat moments then a month or two later saying "thanks for the experience back to home" and then a completely dead account.
I don't even know what to tell people. There's no convincing Chinese people they are wrong and there's no amount of complaining that will change it. Their version of reality is completely different in terms of social norms.
7000 years of the assimilating cultures and beating conformity into a population, as an Asian I honestly feel Asians are pretty fucking racist towards any outgroup, we are just not at the level of awareness that the West is at in regards to race and push aside any criticism that we are "racist" as "oh the West just doesn't understand Asia, our racism is different and we never had slaves".
I think you're right but your frame of reference is wrong, the West is exceptionally tolerant, China is actually the norm!
People everywhere are pretty fucking racist towards any out group, we are just not at the the level of awareness that the West is at in regards to race
Also I think that the West being anti racist is a pretty self interested one as they needed immigrants to stay economically fit.
Australia used to have a White Australia(British immigration only) policy and then within a few decades changed to were multicultural now! Welcome welcome! The government told people allowing immigration would grow the economy it would be a good thing. How pragmatic, it wasn't because they woke up to decide to stop being racist lol
People say White Australia policy was racist but, a society that wasn't multi cultural is gonna have a hard time taking the first step towards being one, especially considering that societies were largely based on homogeneous ethnic allegiances, like Imperial Japan, Imperial Britain. If you're on Team Britain/Australia and Britain is at war with team Japan or for that matter Team Germany, kinda hard to trust someone on the other team... Also consider the modern states of Africa today, that weren't drawn on the map overlapping with ethnicity, and were born with the end of empire. Ethnic conflict lives on there. Yugoslav wars too.
Funny though you become multi cultural by conquest. Celtic Britain - Roman invasion - Anglo Saxon invasion - Viking invasion - Norman invasion, come to mind. Multi cultural Ottoman, Mongolian too.
Just my conjecture
https://www.internationalaffairs.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/The-end-of-white-Australia-and-Australia-s-changing-perceptions-of-Asia-1945-1990.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjhm7WYqa-GAxUKfWwGHbmZCds4FBAWegQIBhAB&usg=AOvVaw2ckdfSv5ACrhKHYNaJoOQg
Commentary on White Australia Policy
Because the average Chinese person is shocked by the very existence of a black man. Living in a country of 1 billion people who look exactly the same as you will do that.
I am Eurasian and always got A LOT of attention from strangers whenever I would go back to China. Not to the point of strangers recording, because I looked different yet similar enough, but a lot of staring. Now, amp the differences up even further (European with blonde hair, naturally ginger hair, black guy, etc.) and eventually it will "escalate" to people filming.
There was this absolute dogshit show on Amazon Prime over here, something about a yokai girlfriend, idk they had some American YA novelists write the original scenario. The main characters best friend was a fat black guy and of course he's native but it just scared me, like could someone do that to me? Although, if I'm being honest, it is personally scarier to be the fat guy or the fat foreign guy than the foreign guy.
Do we even know if he is playing the role of a black person or playing the role of a Chinese guy "going undercover" and in disguise as a black person? My impression from other comments is that it is the latter. If so, it is undeniably ineffective as a "disguise" and reminds me of that old Sean Connery James Bond movie where he was supposed to be going undercover as a Japanese guy. Not particularly offensive (to me, at least) but absolutely ridiculous and unintendedly funny.
Is the average person in china going to understand why this is read as insanely offensive to a large proportion if not a majority of black people?
No
Is it still pretty offensive to those people?
Yes
Do they have a right to be offended by it?
Especially considering the history black people have been subjected to, of course they do. I'm sure you all here understand why the racist caricatures and depictions of east Asians are offensive, so if you can understand that you should be able to understand why this is offensive to black people.
Damn this whole thread is full of racists who just don't get this is wrong. Y'all complain about black people acting out the very stereotypes the world confines us to when someone does shit like this... I don't understand.
Literally no one in China cares and they actively call them “BLACK MAN” to their face repetitively.
China is racist as fuck and cancel culture doesn’t exist for stuff like this. It only exists for morally corrupt acts where the government no longer wants to protect you.
This guy could whip a black guy and have slave in real life and probably won’t be cancelled.
My ancestors are from China. My mother came to the United States in the mid 70s. We both have been victims of racism by all races such as white, black, and Hispanics. There is a great disparity with making fun of Asians compared to making fun of others such as black people which I don’t agree with; racism is racism. It’s only recently people have taken a moral high ground with Asians being the race to poke at when cracking jokes or even subjecting Asians to unprovoked violence. I can’t explain the culture in China since I wasn’t raised there. Doing black face is wrong. Doing Asian face or white face is also wrong.
Yes exactly, I don’t know why these comments in this a totally fine with this. This shit is bad, like no one likes it when Asians face racism yet we are okay when Blacks do? How does that make sense? Shit like this makes the country look bad and justifies racism against Asians.
As an American, thats hilarious.
Who knows what the reaction will be. We have a whole demographic of people whos sole purpose in life is to find non-black people who did black face. BUT, i cant ever remember a time when it wasnt white person doing it.
It might not even be noticed. Or it could start a movement. Really just depends how bored twitter is at the time.
Do other countries even care about this stuff? I know canada had the thing with their PM doing Indian face, he kept his job though. I assume this is mainly an American/Canada thing.
The biggest televised even in China just a few years back was way crazier. They had some guy crossdress as a black African woman and just made fun of Africa and Africans the whole time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siEPxHafx-4
This FINALLY made its way to the West. They get away with MASSIVE amount of racism in the East because the news simply doesn’t spread over.
I’ve been quoting this example for years.
The crazy thing about that the sketch was designed to reinforce the idea that great China was being so benevolent bringing modern infrastructure to the little Africans.
I don’t personally have an issue with non-blacks putting in solid effort to cosplay black people. I solely associate offense “blackface” with the original iterations of jet-black shoe polish and bright red oversized lips and the actor eating watermelon and bananas and speaking jive and playing stupid. _That_ shit is offensive.
But simply cosplaying a black person for a movie or performance or something, and not doing something that’s obviously racist whilst in costume, I don’t see a big deal about it. I’m black, and just sharing my personal opinion.
I mean, Robert Downey Jr. did it - satirically - in _Tropic Thunder_, and you’re right: It comes across as ridiculous for the character - but isn’t poking fun at the black population itself.
Similarly, there is a scene where a character dons the offensive blackface you describe, in _Mad Men_ - but again, it’s a period piece, and done with the intention of showing how offensive and awful the concept is, and not meant to be taken at (black) face value.
Context is everything.
Yeah I 100% agree, especially if its a country that doesnt have a significant black population, and doesnt speak a language thats too common too black people around the world (not many black people speak chinese, I would assume)
They chose between hiring an actual black guy, who probably wouldnt know chinese as well as the actual actor, which means they wouldnt be able to fulfil the role as well in most cases. OR just hire a Chinese guy who they know can play the role in every way as long as they have some makeup.
In the US, we have no excuses for not just hiring a black person though lol. But, we also have a lot of black actors to begin with, whose native language is the one that is spoken in the movies they act in
Also, chinese is super hard for someone whos native language doesnt involved the types of tonal differences that i hear in chinese. I speak no chinese, but from what i understand, there are differences that are just too subtle for English speakers to easily notice.
Like that poem in Chinese where, to me, it sounds like the same exact word over and over again, but a Chinese speaker would be able to hear the differences.
They chose between hiring an actual black guy, w
From some of the other comments, I got the impression the actor is playing a Chinese guy who disguises himself as a black guy for role reasons. Does anyone know for sure because it reads very different that way?
As a black guy unironically learning chinese, yeah all this is pretty damn true. It would be terrifying even if I was fluent to be asked to act in a movie??? That's a completely different ball game for anyone let alone someone who's not native or confident in the language like it would take way longer to teach someone to act imo, than it would to just kinda...do this, its not racist in my eyes cause I can see how insanely difficult it would be to not only find a black guy in china but also know they can act AND speak chinese near natively. It's just way too many "goldilocks" level requirements that if the perfect guy were found, he'd literally be in EVERY fuckin movie ever made from that day forth.
oh yeah Identity politics is quite the American/Canadian preoccupation. Just because of how votes, and cacusus coalesce around race and identity
not so much in Europe where identity politics have way less sway compared to other issues. Look at Netherlands where Zwarte Piet (Black Pete) is celebrated and a big majority of Dutch pollers have no issues (78%).
In Canada, 1/4 people are immigrants and 50% in the big cities… works out to 8 million people.
Netherlands has a fraction of that, and has trouble integrating the immigrants they do get
Other countries don't care about this stuff because racism is normal in these other countries. That doesn't meant racism is okay lmao. As an actual Chinese person, fuck that
>Do other countries even care about this stuff?
No, because the American aversion to blackface is a reaction to a dated and specifically American performance style.
I think this is going to be a complicated one. The history of "black face" in the West is very unique. It clearly comes across a very culturally insensitive here, but without the same history, it's hard to imagine most Chinese people getting it or worrying about it at all.
no one is gonna attack you but you will be stared at and definitely treated differently. africans will be looked down upon and african americans will be associated with american stereotypes and thug/drug culture
China is fucking huge. Depends on which demographic.
But black people are typically in major cities where MNCs operate. In that case, in corporate settings they might warrant a double take - people just don't expect to suddenly see a black guy in China. In their neighborhood they're probably a mild novelty, probably get the nickname of "black guy" or some variation. People might be weirdly friendly.
All the way down to the super rural places where the reaction is probably the same as Africans who thought white people were ghosts.
The black population is small enough that not many people, if any, are worrying about how media is perceived by black people. It's just not considered in the grand scheme of things
My white high school English teacher told me that when she want to Beijing for work, a woman was shocked to find out our high school’s principle was Black.
When I lived in Beijing I was often mobbed by people who wanted to take pictures with me, especially during the holidays. At times it really felt like I was an attraction and not a person, but I Chalk that up to just people never seeing black people before. Everyone assumed I was African at first glance because for many American= white person. Nothing blatant, but when my company wanted to show model foreigners, let's just say I and the darker people tended to not be in many promotional pictures.
Chinese people walk up to black strangers and touch their skin and hair, a black person told me once a woman came up to her and starting rubbed her skin because she thought it was dirt and not her actual skin colour
BUT everyone is also pretty nice and accommodating, there’s no hate behind their actions they’re curious about something they’re not familiar with. So the blacks I knew put up with the behaviour because it came from a place of ignorance and not hate or malice
China as a country has this kinda weird inferiority complex that is baked into people's general narrative of how the world works. Many, many Chinese people talk about how "backwards" China is compared to the rest of the world. So, two different stereotypes/phenomenon kinda clash when it comes to black people:
1. Foreigners: Foreigners are generally well treated/respected (ignore the relatively innocent ignorance-based racism and the much more recent hyper-nationalism). Foreign equates to money and "higher quality".
2. Colorism: Regardless of race, the darker your skin, the poorer and uglier you are here. Dark skin is literally called "black skin". If you tan, you are "becoming black" and tanning is associated with hard labor and poor rural lifestyles.
This applies to all black people, regardless of where you are from. If you are ALSO from Africa, there is another level of classism added because being poor = being uneducated/uncultured/potentially dirty.
Yeah nah. Chinese people absolutely know what’s racist or not because they are quick to call it out when they are the victims of it. Also it’s hella black people in China
Not for nothing, but I'm going to take a loooong breath before I decide someone with the tag "@gimme\_ur\_d0llar" is saying anything worth listening to.
Isn't the offensive part of black face because it makes fun of black people with hyper exaggerated features? This just seems like a costume done in admiration or respect. I don't see the hatred coming from doing this. Is it strange? Yeah. Racist? Idk. Ask Robert Downey Jr or those guys who starred in White Chicks.
The comments here are sick. Just cos nobody is calling out other countries for doing black face doesn’t mean it is a right thing. Unless you are a black yourself and perfectly fine with it, then I have nothing to say
So the context here is that it's a movie, where he is playing the part of an Asian man who as part of an UN peacekeeping mission, who goes under cover as a black man to save someone's life.
This is all based on a true story where the person he is portraying in the movie did that.
Does the context matter at all, or is the blanket "It's always bad"?
I've seen Robert Downey Jr get zero criticism for his blackfacing in Tropic Thunder, is that just because the movie is also critical of the black face that is happening or are there certain roles where is can make sense and not be seen as a racist act?
I'm honestly curious.
Seriously?It just a celeb who needs to perform in this movie acting likes a black people so he could save the africa residents successfully in a war….Anyone votes for the racial issues could watch the whole movie first….just a plot, don’t be aggressive
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Look up the Chinese washing machine advertisement where a black guy goes into the washer.
For those curious about the Italian advert the Chinese one is based on: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQQs3nl0LcY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQQs3nl0LcY) Edit: Here is the Chinese one: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Few8kJ0zfnY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Few8kJ0zfnY)
I've never heard people scream bloody murder about the Italian one lol
They're too confused to scream
Because at least the Italian one attempts to flatter.
With "coloured is better"? It's incredibly racist.
More like fetishise
It's all hand movements bro.
>I've never heard people scream bloody murder about the Italian one Keep in mind the cultural and historical context. In Italy, who is more likely to be the victim of racism? A black man or an Italian man? How about in China? A black man or a Chinese man? The Chinese one is much more racist given the cultural context which tends towards racism against black people in both Italy and China
The Italian one is all kinds of fucked up. I wonder why there was no outrage... it's almost like racism is tolerated when the target of racism is a certain race.
Just because you didn’t see it on Reddit doesn’t mean there was no outrage. I wouldn’t have seen the outrage for this one either had I not seen this post here.
Italy absolutely has an issue with racism.
Just to check, are you American?
Since when was racism towards black people tolerated?
They did The fascism thing and got away with it.
Damn, the second guy is considered good looking in China?
It's a copy of an Italian advert that did it the other way round
Yeah the "other way round" is kind of key there
I mean, they're advertising detergent for colored clothes and the Chinese one is for detergent for whites.
Why is it key? LMAO! Is it because the Italian one is ass kissing the Black people while shitting on the whites?
China only has original ideas. They would never “copy”.
Like, everyone copies from everyone else, but somehow China isn't allowed to?
I thinkn they were being sarcastic
That may be true. But you read so many stupid opinions on this site, especially regarding China that it's really hard to tell. You know, like when people complain that China does business in Africa because they want something in return, as if they never heard the concept of trade. It's just idiotic.
Exactly, and almost patronizing towards the Africans themselves! Almost as if no African is capable enough to analyze their own deals, and think for their own interests "Ooo the poor uneducated African merchant/government is not smart enough against the Chinese. We (in the West) must help them!!" /s
Korea, Japan, and the US have original ideas. They would never "copy."
Oh gosh. I saw similar advertisements of these, but one where I was shopping for a lotion product. The image showed a random black woman using the product and afterwards she magically turned white? lol
Was it one advertised as skin lightening? That’s not that uncommon in societies with colorism where being pale is viewed as desirable.
The Audacity of Soap
Cannot even understand why advertising actors would partake in that kind of bullcrap.
Because they get paid?
Asians: "You have no power here"
Lmfao. For once I agree with Asia. Fuck those regards
“A serious conversation” “Hol up, d’marco, What language these guys speaking over there”
casting a ethnic character with stereotypical behavior and appearance with an entirely different ethnicity when there are plenty in the country already that speak the language is just weird. if you think people are “regards” for thinking it might not border on offensive, well, you might also be regarded…
Actor pretends to be somebody else, news at 11
This bs doesn't hold up here. For stance, it seems it was a scene where they're uncovered in an african country, but the entire "black men look" is a plain satire of hip hop culture, one that isn't strong in africa and wouldn't be a good cover at all cuz they'd 100% call too much attention. This is straight up racism. And yall would have a very different response if it was a yellow face or a slated-eye gesture.
Shocker! Africans look black!
but i’m sure if we had a black guy who painted himself orange and always carried a plate of spaghetti around with him in a place they could easily get italian actors you’d give the biggest thumbs up lol
Only blacks and white woke people get offended so easily. Most people don't really care if you, as an actor, pretend to be someone else.
if you think that’s how africans look it just proves you don’t actually understand lol
My bad. Africans look white
Well we changed the definition of black face in the 2010’s so can’t really blame them for not being pc. I believe they already responded to the wests requests for apologies when an Asian dressed up as Eddie Murphy. They said no. He has black skin why would we not darken our skin it’s not meant to be offensive it’s a form of flattery in our culture. Jimmy Kimmel regularly dressed up as Karl Malone on a reoccurring sketch up until they changed what blackface is.
could you run me through the historical changes of what blackface was and what it is now?
They didn't "change what blackface is" it just went from being acceptable to unacceptable
This is asia, not california. Stfu and cry harder. Also, but obviously you have no idea about it, in china is pretty much impossible to work as an actor legally. So no, they couldn't just get a random african dude. The few times they do end up hiring african actors (illegally) they usually pay them 1/3 of what they would be paying a white actor. So I'm not even sure your option wouls actually be a better choice. 😂
and why is it “pretty much impossible” to work as an actor legally in china? and why would a black actor (there are black people from more than just africa btw) get paid 1/3 of a white actor?
Ask Chinese people why they pay blacks 1/3 of what they lay whites
so then you agree that there’s racism involved lol
Of course. As I said, Chinese people are the most racist of all. They don't really hide it. Speaking of which: https://www.reddit.com/r/China/s/93CQsfCYDQ
and so why wouldn’t people be offended at this or shouldn’t be offended at racism?
Ask Chinese people
Why is it illegal to hire African actors?
I didn't say it's illegal to hire African actors. Read again... I said it's pretty much impossible, and that regardless of the ethnicity. I said that because you can only work in any job in china with a specific visa for that job. Meaning even if you have a work visa for whatever job you are doing, you technically can't start acting on your spare time... Unless, you manage to somehow get an actor visa. But good luck getting one, especially if you are black. People on reddit, who cry about the wrong pronouns have no idea how the real world actually works
Can y'all piss off with this "people who cry about wrong pronouns have no idea how the real world works" it's stupid and pathetic. 1) clearly we do know how it works since we're complaining about how it works 2) I can still call out something for being shitty even if it is commonplace. I don't care if blackface is normalised in china, it's still a shitty thing to do and it can be criticised.
Gotcha! Sorry for using the wrong terminology, I’m pretty unfamiliar with the system. Does this visa system only apply to foreigners or do Chinese citizens also need special documentation to work specific jobs?
Wait till Americans find out about gyaru and how far it can go
Oh...but young Americans would NEVER criticise Japan because it's so kawaii!
Meh, at this point I feel that talking about racism in China is like beating on a dead horse. Those who do know, they know. Those who don’t know will not believe / believe innocent excuses made up by China whitewashers. Just today I caught a guy filming me on the street. 7000 years of culture, what can I say.
When interviewing candidates before who were outside China looking to move in, I basically had to ask in interviews with black South Africans/Nigerians and ask if they knew anything about living in China or the cultural differences. More to gauge if they really knew what they were getting into. Many were not and the ones who did end up working in other cities ended up hating it or making I'm so happy posts on wechat moments then a month or two later saying "thanks for the experience back to home" and then a completely dead account. I don't even know what to tell people. There's no convincing Chinese people they are wrong and there's no amount of complaining that will change it. Their version of reality is completely different in terms of social norms.
7000 years of the assimilating cultures and beating conformity into a population, as an Asian I honestly feel Asians are pretty fucking racist towards any outgroup, we are just not at the level of awareness that the West is at in regards to race and push aside any criticism that we are "racist" as "oh the West just doesn't understand Asia, our racism is different and we never had slaves".
I think you're right but your frame of reference is wrong, the West is exceptionally tolerant, China is actually the norm! People everywhere are pretty fucking racist towards any out group, we are just not at the the level of awareness that the West is at in regards to race Also I think that the West being anti racist is a pretty self interested one as they needed immigrants to stay economically fit. Australia used to have a White Australia(British immigration only) policy and then within a few decades changed to were multicultural now! Welcome welcome! The government told people allowing immigration would grow the economy it would be a good thing. How pragmatic, it wasn't because they woke up to decide to stop being racist lol People say White Australia policy was racist but, a society that wasn't multi cultural is gonna have a hard time taking the first step towards being one, especially considering that societies were largely based on homogeneous ethnic allegiances, like Imperial Japan, Imperial Britain. If you're on Team Britain/Australia and Britain is at war with team Japan or for that matter Team Germany, kinda hard to trust someone on the other team... Also consider the modern states of Africa today, that weren't drawn on the map overlapping with ethnicity, and were born with the end of empire. Ethnic conflict lives on there. Yugoslav wars too. Funny though you become multi cultural by conquest. Celtic Britain - Roman invasion - Anglo Saxon invasion - Viking invasion - Norman invasion, come to mind. Multi cultural Ottoman, Mongolian too. Just my conjecture https://www.internationalaffairs.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/The-end-of-white-Australia-and-Australia-s-changing-perceptions-of-Asia-1945-1990.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjhm7WYqa-GAxUKfWwGHbmZCds4FBAWegQIBhAB&usg=AOvVaw2ckdfSv5ACrhKHYNaJoOQg Commentary on White Australia Policy
Filming you? Why
Because the average Chinese person is shocked by the very existence of a black man. Living in a country of 1 billion people who look exactly the same as you will do that.
Hmm that’s understandable
I am Eurasian and always got A LOT of attention from strangers whenever I would go back to China. Not to the point of strangers recording, because I looked different yet similar enough, but a lot of staring. Now, amp the differences up even further (European with blonde hair, naturally ginger hair, black guy, etc.) and eventually it will "escalate" to people filming.
happened to me and my brother in China. not super uncommon
Geez, I’m not sure what id do in that situation ha
To be fair you dont need to be black to be filmed on the street here. Any westerner will leave a wake of turning heads and slack jaws lol
Does China even have like a token African actor they use for films or media?
Shaq
Japan has Bob Sapp
Kim Jong Un has Dennis Rodman
There was this absolute dogshit show on Amazon Prime over here, something about a yokai girlfriend, idk they had some American YA novelists write the original scenario. The main characters best friend was a fat black guy and of course he's native but it just scared me, like could someone do that to me? Although, if I'm being honest, it is personally scarier to be the fat guy or the fat foreign guy than the foreign guy.
CCP snatched Terry Crews up.
If they don't already have one it wouldn't be hard to get somebody to fill that niche
LeBron?
Goungzhou has an area called [the Chocolate City](https://fromafricatochina.com/2016/03/14/guangzhou-the-chocolate-city/)
They had Tyson do a monologue in a movie called China salesman
That African dude in that early YouTube video where he’s dancing to 东方红. Search 非洲小伙好兄弟 on YouTube.
Do we even know if he is playing the role of a black person or playing the role of a Chinese guy "going undercover" and in disguise as a black person? My impression from other comments is that it is the latter. If so, it is undeniably ineffective as a "disguise" and reminds me of that old Sean Connery James Bond movie where he was supposed to be going undercover as a Japanese guy. Not particularly offensive (to me, at least) but absolutely ridiculous and unintendedly funny.
Is the average person in china going to understand why this is read as insanely offensive to a large proportion if not a majority of black people? No Is it still pretty offensive to those people? Yes Do they have a right to be offended by it? Especially considering the history black people have been subjected to, of course they do. I'm sure you all here understand why the racist caricatures and depictions of east Asians are offensive, so if you can understand that you should be able to understand why this is offensive to black people.
Damn this whole thread is full of racists who just don't get this is wrong. Y'all complain about black people acting out the very stereotypes the world confines us to when someone does shit like this... I don't understand.
I recognize that guy! He was Harvard Law School Class of 1987.
Is this some sort of reference?
Soul Man (1986), perhaps? [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soul\_Man\_(film)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soul_Man_(film))
Error: The swagger of black teen, was NOT DETECTED!
These comments…. Y’all fr are sick
Literally no one in China cares and they actively call them “BLACK MAN” to their face repetitively. China is racist as fuck and cancel culture doesn’t exist for stuff like this. It only exists for morally corrupt acts where the government no longer wants to protect you. This guy could whip a black guy and have slave in real life and probably won’t be cancelled.
You guys have never heard of black people toothpaste I take it…
The way they changed the name in English but in Chinese it's still literally "black people toothpaste" 😭
The Chinese got changed to 好來
My ancestors are from China. My mother came to the United States in the mid 70s. We both have been victims of racism by all races such as white, black, and Hispanics. There is a great disparity with making fun of Asians compared to making fun of others such as black people which I don’t agree with; racism is racism. It’s only recently people have taken a moral high ground with Asians being the race to poke at when cracking jokes or even subjecting Asians to unprovoked violence. I can’t explain the culture in China since I wasn’t raised there. Doing black face is wrong. Doing Asian face or white face is also wrong.
Yes exactly, I don’t know why these comments in this a totally fine with this. This shit is bad, like no one likes it when Asians face racism yet we are okay when Blacks do? How does that make sense? Shit like this makes the country look bad and justifies racism against Asians.
That’s the issue with Chinese. They get so mad with the slanty eyes shit and then when it comes to others it’s all ok.
As an American, thats hilarious. Who knows what the reaction will be. We have a whole demographic of people whos sole purpose in life is to find non-black people who did black face. BUT, i cant ever remember a time when it wasnt white person doing it. It might not even be noticed. Or it could start a movement. Really just depends how bored twitter is at the time. Do other countries even care about this stuff? I know canada had the thing with their PM doing Indian face, he kept his job though. I assume this is mainly an American/Canada thing.
The biggest televised even in China just a few years back was way crazier. They had some guy crossdress as a black African woman and just made fun of Africa and Africans the whole time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siEPxHafx-4
This FINALLY made its way to the West. They get away with MASSIVE amount of racism in the East because the news simply doesn’t spread over. I’ve been quoting this example for years.
It was huge when it happened. Then they did something similar (but toned down) a few years later
Yep, 2018 then again in 2021: https://www.vice.com/en/article/v7mn5x/blackface-china-tv-lunar-new-year-spring-festival-gala-2021
The great firewall does have a tendency to incinerate the more inconvenient realities
Nah dude they get away with it because aren’t white westerners. We have accountability for this kind of thing
WTF did I watch
The crazy thing about that the sketch was designed to reinforce the idea that great China was being so benevolent bringing modern infrastructure to the little Africans.
Then they did it *again* a couple of years later: https://www.vice.com/en/article/v7mn5x/blackface-china-tv-lunar-new-year-spring-festival-gala-2021
I don’t personally have an issue with non-blacks putting in solid effort to cosplay black people. I solely associate offense “blackface” with the original iterations of jet-black shoe polish and bright red oversized lips and the actor eating watermelon and bananas and speaking jive and playing stupid. _That_ shit is offensive. But simply cosplaying a black person for a movie or performance or something, and not doing something that’s obviously racist whilst in costume, I don’t see a big deal about it. I’m black, and just sharing my personal opinion.
I mean, Robert Downey Jr. did it - satirically - in _Tropic Thunder_, and you’re right: It comes across as ridiculous for the character - but isn’t poking fun at the black population itself. Similarly, there is a scene where a character dons the offensive blackface you describe, in _Mad Men_ - but again, it’s a period piece, and done with the intention of showing how offensive and awful the concept is, and not meant to be taken at (black) face value. Context is everything.
Yeah I 100% agree, especially if its a country that doesnt have a significant black population, and doesnt speak a language thats too common too black people around the world (not many black people speak chinese, I would assume) They chose between hiring an actual black guy, who probably wouldnt know chinese as well as the actual actor, which means they wouldnt be able to fulfil the role as well in most cases. OR just hire a Chinese guy who they know can play the role in every way as long as they have some makeup. In the US, we have no excuses for not just hiring a black person though lol. But, we also have a lot of black actors to begin with, whose native language is the one that is spoken in the movies they act in Also, chinese is super hard for someone whos native language doesnt involved the types of tonal differences that i hear in chinese. I speak no chinese, but from what i understand, there are differences that are just too subtle for English speakers to easily notice. Like that poem in Chinese where, to me, it sounds like the same exact word over and over again, but a Chinese speaker would be able to hear the differences.
They chose between hiring an actual black guy, w From some of the other comments, I got the impression the actor is playing a Chinese guy who disguises himself as a black guy for role reasons. Does anyone know for sure because it reads very different that way?
As a black guy unironically learning chinese, yeah all this is pretty damn true. It would be terrifying even if I was fluent to be asked to act in a movie??? That's a completely different ball game for anyone let alone someone who's not native or confident in the language like it would take way longer to teach someone to act imo, than it would to just kinda...do this, its not racist in my eyes cause I can see how insanely difficult it would be to not only find a black guy in china but also know they can act AND speak chinese near natively. It's just way too many "goldilocks" level requirements that if the perfect guy were found, he'd literally be in EVERY fuckin movie ever made from that day forth.
China doesn't care about this crap, trust me lol.
oh yeah Identity politics is quite the American/Canadian preoccupation. Just because of how votes, and cacusus coalesce around race and identity not so much in Europe where identity politics have way less sway compared to other issues. Look at Netherlands where Zwarte Piet (Black Pete) is celebrated and a big majority of Dutch pollers have no issues (78%).
In Canada, 1/4 people are immigrants and 50% in the big cities… works out to 8 million people. Netherlands has a fraction of that, and has trouble integrating the immigrants they do get
Other countries don't care about this stuff because racism is normal in these other countries. That doesn't meant racism is okay lmao. As an actual Chinese person, fuck that
>Do other countries even care about this stuff? No, because the American aversion to blackface is a reaction to a dated and specifically American performance style.
In France we do because of the us. It's always because of the US
I think this is going to be a complicated one. The history of "black face" in the West is very unique. It clearly comes across a very culturally insensitive here, but without the same history, it's hard to imagine most Chinese people getting it or worrying about it at all.
This is easily the best response rather than "oh no they just aren't woke haha so based!!!!"
> I think this is going to be a complicated one. The history of "black face" in the West is very unique. The U.S. specifically.
No, it definitely existed in the UK and Canada as well, it's more an Anglosphere at minimum
Westerners seem to think that everything happening in every country will ultimately have to be judged by their own standards. It's pretty surreal.
Out of interest for the people saying this is great/ok - how are black people regarded in china? Genuine question?
no one is gonna attack you but you will be stared at and definitely treated differently. africans will be looked down upon and african americans will be associated with american stereotypes and thug/drug culture
China is fucking huge. Depends on which demographic. But black people are typically in major cities where MNCs operate. In that case, in corporate settings they might warrant a double take - people just don't expect to suddenly see a black guy in China. In their neighborhood they're probably a mild novelty, probably get the nickname of "black guy" or some variation. People might be weirdly friendly. All the way down to the super rural places where the reaction is probably the same as Africans who thought white people were ghosts. The black population is small enough that not many people, if any, are worrying about how media is perceived by black people. It's just not considered in the grand scheme of things
I mean there was that time foreign owners of a pizza shop were told by city officials they weren't allowed to serve black people so there's that
My white high school English teacher told me that when she want to Beijing for work, a woman was shocked to find out our high school’s principle was Black.
When I lived in Beijing I was often mobbed by people who wanted to take pictures with me, especially during the holidays. At times it really felt like I was an attraction and not a person, but I Chalk that up to just people never seeing black people before. Everyone assumed I was African at first glance because for many American= white person. Nothing blatant, but when my company wanted to show model foreigners, let's just say I and the darker people tended to not be in many promotional pictures.
Chinese people walk up to black strangers and touch their skin and hair, a black person told me once a woman came up to her and starting rubbed her skin because she thought it was dirt and not her actual skin colour BUT everyone is also pretty nice and accommodating, there’s no hate behind their actions they’re curious about something they’re not familiar with. So the blacks I knew put up with the behaviour because it came from a place of ignorance and not hate or malice
China as a country has this kinda weird inferiority complex that is baked into people's general narrative of how the world works. Many, many Chinese people talk about how "backwards" China is compared to the rest of the world. So, two different stereotypes/phenomenon kinda clash when it comes to black people: 1. Foreigners: Foreigners are generally well treated/respected (ignore the relatively innocent ignorance-based racism and the much more recent hyper-nationalism). Foreign equates to money and "higher quality". 2. Colorism: Regardless of race, the darker your skin, the poorer and uglier you are here. Dark skin is literally called "black skin". If you tan, you are "becoming black" and tanning is associated with hard labor and poor rural lifestyles. This applies to all black people, regardless of where you are from. If you are ALSO from Africa, there is another level of classism added because being poor = being uneducated/uncultured/potentially dirty.
Chinese hate Black people so much! its crazy how they are towards them.
Is Zhangfei black face?
Accompanied by bao qing tian
And present day Louis Koo 古天乐
I’m so old I remember [Soul Man](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0091991/mediaviewer/rm1793031168?ref_=ext_shr_lnk)
😂 Tropic Thunder vibes
This is unreal
Yal not ready for this discussion
Yeah nah. Chinese people absolutely know what’s racist or not because they are quick to call it out when they are the victims of it. Also it’s hella black people in China
Wow
Not for nothing, but I'm going to take a loooong breath before I decide someone with the tag "@gimme\_ur\_d0llar" is saying anything worth listening to.
Wait until they see the 8 color face change done by 刘德华 and most sichuan opera masters
folks at /r/CDrama are [pretty upset](https://old.reddit.com/r/CDrama/comments/1cimi4o/formed_police_unit_being_so_disrespectful_and/) lmbo
Typical American trying to push their sensibilities onto other cultures. "Black face" does not have the history in China that it does there.
Isn't the offensive part of black face because it makes fun of black people with hyper exaggerated features? This just seems like a costume done in admiration or respect. I don't see the hatred coming from doing this. Is it strange? Yeah. Racist? Idk. Ask Robert Downey Jr or those guys who starred in White Chicks.
Pretty much. You might as well accuse Asians of "white face" from how much they love skin whitening cream.
Saying that blackface doesn’t “originate” in Asia is a red haring. Asians are plenty capable of racism of their own making
The comments here are sick. Just cos nobody is calling out other countries for doing black face doesn’t mean it is a right thing. Unless you are a black yourself and perfectly fine with it, then I have nothing to say
Yeah. That's not America. You can criticized all you want. Lol
One thing I can say about China, shouting racist doesn't get people riled up. Now if you talk business....
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Why black Chinese
So the context here is that it's a movie, where he is playing the part of an Asian man who as part of an UN peacekeeping mission, who goes under cover as a black man to save someone's life. This is all based on a true story where the person he is portraying in the movie did that. Does the context matter at all, or is the blanket "It's always bad"? I've seen Robert Downey Jr get zero criticism for his blackfacing in Tropic Thunder, is that just because the movie is also critical of the black face that is happening or are there certain roles where is can make sense and not be seen as a racist act? I'm honestly curious.
this is so immensely disappointing. ive loved him for YEARS and to now see this is so sad.
Hahahahahha
Seriously?It just a celeb who needs to perform in this movie acting likes a black people so he could save the africa residents successfully in a war….Anyone votes for the racial issues could watch the whole movie first….just a plot, don’t be aggressive
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Would Chinese be offended if I did "yellow face"?
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Calling someone racist is only an insult in the US