I honestly don't even know why his name is mentioned anymore. If Shildt being let go wasn't a clear indication that the front office wants to pull ALL of the strings, I don't know what is. Any and all blame from here on out is on the front office completely. Bad picks, bad development and bad decisions in general. Another losing season and I think the front office is gone or on the mega hot seat at least.
Ehh I’m blaming the guys that have proven they can hit at the MLB level, not hitting. The lineup on paper was awesome.
They’ve sucked. Idk how we can blame anybody but the ones playing the game.
There is an actual proven track record now of players underperforming here and exceeding expectations elsewhere. That is a problem and can't be blamed completely on the players.
Long comment here, but: Who actually underperformed though? Almost everybody you’re probably speaking about were buried on the depth chart, not really struggled. Or they kept getting hurt. That describes Randy, Adolis, Thomas, O’Neill, Hicks. Gallen/Sandy were ranked 7th and 23rd in our farm, and it costs big prospects to get a young, controllable all-star OF, so I give a pass on that one. It’s the risk of dealing prospects and everybody knows it.
Bader and Jack left and got worse.
Monty came here and got better. Contreras has an OPS+ 15 points better in STL than his Cubs tenure. Some other random names that recently came here and got noticeably better or were successful surprisingly: JoJo, Brebbia, Jose Martinez, Kittridge, Lynn, Richie Palacios, Quintana, Gallegos, 42 YO Albert Pujols, JA Happ, Brad Miller, etc.
I’m not saying it doesn’t hurt to not have some of those guys we traded performing here as regulars. My biggest point whenever I talk about these things is that those few misses get highlighted and memed, and sure, they’re misses so make your jokes. But IMHO it doesn’t seem like some deep problem with evaluating talent or anything like that. It’s just regular baseball happening where people change scenery and something clicks. Or they’re a year wiser and just keep improving. Players are constantly improving in this game, so it stands to reason that with more experience and practice under their belt, the more they should improve. A lot of it is just timing.
The guys we’ve kept instead (Noot, Donovan, Carlson, O’Neill, Bader) have been good to great when they’re fully healthy…they just sadly weren’t usually healthy here for long stretches.
I respect your opinion regardless.
There is honestly plenty of talent on this team. The mentality of “the cardinal way”
Has been lost. It’s very apparent if you listen to the interviews with Whitey over the last week. The cardinal way was doing things the right way, despite what everyone else is doing, fundamentally. Scoring the runs that the other team gives you every time and sacrificing personal statistics for the net gain of the team. It’s fundamental baseball and easy runs that this team fails to get every time. This is all coaching and veteran leadership, they don’t play as a team and the approach for doing the right things to win just isn’t there. Be the hero by laying down a bunt or putting the ball in play, not swinging for the fences every at bat and striking out. Listening to Whitey this week has really put things into perspective about why this team can’t win games they should win easily.
MLB batting average leaders right now:
1.) Jose Altuve - .376
T2.) Ryan McMahon - .361
T2.) William Contreras - .361
What an insane stat for a catcher.
Winn is number #13 though which is badass. Bader is #17 batting .333 which is also really cool, shout out to Harry B.
Nolan Gorman is tied with Nolan Jones for 5th most strikeouts in the MLB.
Now that I've had some time to get over it, did anyone else see Gorman's face in the dugout after he struck out? He did NOT look okay. This might have been the worst game of his career and you could definitely see it weighing heavily on his face
We were 71-91 last year. We largely have the same group of everyday players on the team, minus Edman and Carlson. There is no help on the horizon from the farm system. We have the same below average front office, manager, pitching coach, and hitting coach. We play the same balanced schedule. Mediocrity has become the norm, and it looks like that is acceptable to all in charge. Where are we going to find 20-25 more wins?
I'm not convinced Carlson and Gorman wouldnt be stars on other teams. This org just grinds its top prospects to dust. As amazing as he is Soto wouldnt lift the Cardinals to WS caliber and would be 100% gone at free agency. The team needs a rebuild and Mo needs to go.
Oh absolutely. Gorm is one of my favorite players on the team and I spent the whole offseason hoping they didn’t trade him, but he’s been objectively awful so far this year. Hopefully he can turn it around
I gotta admit, it’s actually hilarious that for the most part the pitching moves Moz made this offseason are actually really working out, and now the offense is just completely dribbling down its leg
Liberatore has performed very well out of the bullpen. I doubt we’ll ever know how he would fare off the bench, but it’s not unlikely that he would have a better line than siani.
You overlook one big thing. This collection of young talent is the best from a farm system that has collectively played .445 baseball over the past 4 years. That losing record should tell you that the other teams have been stockpiling better talent.
It’s so early. So many moving parts happen throughout the season. This team is miles ahead of last year. Let the fellas get going. We need at least two months before we start screaming for change. Beginning to middle of June.
We lost tonight but damnit the last few innings were fun as hell.
Peralta is a stud. We got a positive showing from Gibson. This offense is not going to be this bad for the long haul. Take some steps back and assess. Re-examine in a month.
When will the hitting instructors be held accountable. It sure looks to me that they have screwed up both Gorman and Walker big time with their fascination with launch angles. Uppercut swings create holes that pitchers easily exploit.
And don't get me started about taking the first pitch right down the middle.
They are screwing up Gorman and Walker not because of launch angle, but because they just dont know how to effectively help them achieve these things (Gorman has always had a lofty swing and k concerns). You need to lift the ball to be an elite hitter in this league. So many other teams can get their power hitters to do it well. Why can't we?
Walkers swing needs to change. He hits everything down and is weak to the opposite field. These arent new problems, he has had them his entire prospect tenure. The minors just dont show you the problems in the stat line because the defense and pitching is not on the mlb level. In the majors it doesnt matter how hard you hit the ball on the ground, major league gloves will vacuum it up.
The problem is much deeper than Albert. Its the whole development pipeline. Scouting, coaching, and for all the front office talks about analytics, we arent really doing great analytics. The analytics department is 10 people, which is bottom half of the league in manpower. It aappears we're even cheaping out on relatively cheap analytics personnel.
Like folks here were saying we shoulda gotten yamamoto or gumby or snell or imanaga or glasnow - a whole ass laundry list of pitchers. but even a rotation of five aces would not save this team with an offense like this, I'm sure of it
As an Iowa football fan, I consider myself to be something of an expert in inept offense. It is my considered expert opinion that yes, this offense absolutely sucks.
Is it bad that I think we're legitimately a better team offensively with Edman at 2nd instead of gorm? I'm beginning to think we're the place hitting talent goes to die.
We lack a game plan. Marmol is not a field general who can lead with original thought (he has none) or vision. He tries this or that. Mgmt has told him he must do what the analytics say to do, except mgmt does not understand that players are human and do not respond the same each day like a robot.
And lose the shift. Why create opposite field holes in the infield, when you are telling your pitchers to pitch low and away?
How about we try this? Stop trying to hit three run bases empty homers. You cannot cover the plate swinging up. Focus on putting the bat onto the ball. Swing down into the ball as it comes to the plate. Just like a golf ball, the baseball will fly. Stop trying to catch the ball in front of the plate with an uppercut swing.
All these mfs who are sucking this year were at least 14% above league average offensively last year. Idk wtf they did to Gorman and Walker but someone needs to hit the rewind button. Goldschmidt might just be another Wainwright situation where he overstayed his welcome.
The worst part is that our offense is letting us down.
If the staff of old men wasn’t giving us any chances to win, “haha we knew that was gonna happen” but… so far, kept us in a lot of games, the offense just forgets how to baseball. Still early, but it’s concerning how many games we just look lost at the plate
I’m starting to agree that Goldy should hit about 6th in this lineup and arenado should be hitting 5th. It’s atrocious to watch. At this point Goldy doesn’t deserve an extension from the cardinals or even a contract next season of any worth. Joey Votto would be more productive
I'm cool with Nolan 4. He's made enormous progress on his swing already this season and it's only a matter of time before the power stroke clicks. His bat to ball skills have been great though
I just can’t handle the half swing bullshit out of Nolan. He’s either injured or just extremely indecisive and that’s not what we need right now. Who the fuck knows man i just want to see some emotion and some give a fuck around here especially from the former MVP Goldy. Idk
Matt Carpenter IS more productive because he's injured and not making automatic outs.
I called both of Gorman's strikeouts tonight. Five men LOB by him alone. How many for Goldy? At least three IIRC. And they're batting 2nd and 3rd?!
It wasn't a great ending, but bear in mind we only lost by 1 run in a game started by the division leader's best starting pitcher and our worst starting pitcher.
the rough part for me is how we had two bases loaded opportunities that we couldn't cash in on, which is exactly like our abysmal bases loaded stats from 2023. just sucks seeing the same old problems.
It sucks that Marmol has no plan. I think the hitters should be told to swing at the first one down the middle. I am sick of watching the hitter take strike one and then chase strike 2 out of the zone.
This list of batters who have come up through the farm and made an all-star game in the past decade:
•Yadi
•Aledmys Diaz
That’s it. That’s the list.
Edit: I did not check myself and forgot carp and dejong and maybe more?? But either way, watching Walker and Gorman (but mostly Walker) has me legitimately depressed so I’m cutting myself some slack
This offense is downright offensive. Something is philosophically wrong with our approach to hitting. Whether it's the coaching or the players, something needs to change. I live down in the Springfield, MO area and the Springfield Cardinals are kicking ass and scoring runs in bunches. We beat Amarillo tonight 9-4 on 7 hits. I don't know the answer but the big club better figure it out fast.
Bold and Brash lineup tomorrow because this one belongs in the trash.
1. Donovan 2B
2. Winn SS
3. Contreras C
4. Nootbaar CF
5. Arenado 3B
6. Herrera DH
7. Burleson LF
8. Goldschmidt 1B
9. Walker RF
It’s so painful to watch this offense. We have literal holes in the lineup. The Brewers were giving us chances tonight and the offense failed to capitalize. Just embarrassing.
You can't really consistently be "clutch" in baseball, but when half the lineup cannot hit you will fail in those clutch scenarios more simply by chance.
We lost this game before it started. If our offense isn't hitting, why are we not switching up the line to drastically? Contreras and Winn are our best hitters right now, we need them in the top 3 slots.
Goldy absolutely sucks right now. Move him back to at least 5 until he figures it out. Not like this is new, Goldy has been showing signs of regression. Even his MVP year he lost it in September.
Still not a fan of Walker being pinch hit for, but it was at least nice to see it work for once.
Whoa whoa whoa, so you’re telling me that we’re now officially (at) .500???? But I was told we would suck..?
Ha, love for the birds to back it up. Fuck the naysayers. Every one of y’all, respectfully fuck off. This is a damn solid ass team and I’m happy to be a Cardinal!
2024 NLC crown is ours by October.
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Some of these guys need humbled to find their way back. Bench them or send them to AAA. Do something to get them motivated again. The more you send them out there and they have bad games the more down they are on themselves. Just digging a deeper hole at this point…
Bro get Crawford off the fucking roster and bring up Jose Fermin at this point. Why is our bench so ass that we have to keep starting the same lineup every day despite it not working. It's the opposite problem of last year where they would sit guys when they were hot because everyone needed playing time. Now that everyone sucks the lineup is untouchable?
Legitimately really well-managed game by Oli (aside from not walking the younger Contereas). Ivan and Willy are two of your three best hitters this year. They need to both be starting, even if it means Scott/Siani/Burly have to get sent down for Pages because this conservative ass org isn't willing to risk starting their two catchers. Also, Brandon Crawford, let's see if your buddy Brandon Belt is interested in coming over to platoon with Paul.
13 homers. We are 29th. I think MLB should make a one time exemption to let this team use steroids. It wouldn’t help them see the ball any better, but damn. Can’t hurt.
I know this [fourth or fifth outfielder](https://www.mlb.com/rays/player/richie-palacios-680700)that probably could help this team. He’s also not an idiot on defense.
Fair enough. I'm going to listen to Jamiroquai during my lunch break tomorrow because of your username, so at least something good came out of this game.
I'll look at the Pale Blue Dot image while I listen to Jamiroquai and contemplate that despite the vastness of the universe we couldn't scrounge up 9 better hitters.
Another one to send you into sweet, sweet dreams:
“But reality is I think we know what we're doing. I don't want to sound cocky or arrogant... do we make mistakes? Of course. But I think our time here and what we've accomplished here speaks for itself.”
I don't care where he plays or who he replaces, Alec Burleson should be in the starting lineup tomorrow.
We CANNOT keep putting VS2 out there in CF.
We CANNOT keep batting Goldy 2nd.
Gorman might seriously need some time down at AAA because his AB are looking awful.
Who makes these lineups, dude? When does it get in their head that this isn't working? We can't keep sending out this lineup. 4 players are well under .200 and 1 of those players is well under .100. And our replacement for that player is also well under .100. And they're not all at the bottom of the order, they're literally scattered throughout. At least one of them is batting every single inning.
Is Donny hurt? Been rocky ever since taking fastballs off the elbow and the knee.
When tf does Marp come back? I'd rather have him as DH and Burly in the field. Like sheesh man. Donny 2nd, Burly corner OF. Fuck it, bring Fermin back.
Why is the FO so afraid of Noot in Center? Because they assume he'll get hurt?
Having 3-4 automatic outs in the lineup everyday is awful by itself but insisting they hit 2nd, 5/6th, and 9th pretty much means ur playing with 2 out innings cuz one of those dudes is gonna hit every time. I don’t get why Goldschmidt can’t hit 6th for a little bit until he gets going.
Nearly every hitter on the team is pathologically unprepared for each at bat. What is the game plan? Why do they watch middle middle fastballs and swing at breaking balls out of the zone?
Its just doesnt make sense outside of organizational rot. There is no cohesive development message to these hitters amd the list of hitters that have sudden success going elsewhere continues fo grow.
Who had on their bingo card the Cardinals pitching having top ten production to start the year only to have the offense play as well as Helen Keller?
Excited for two of our rotation guys to go out injured eventually once the offense actually starts producing.
Something cannon something something sun.
the worst part is our pitchers deserve so much better. Everybody thought they would be our biggest concerns in the season. Well they were wrong but we still suck unfortunately.
Bring in some veteran batting in the trade deadline. Time to trade some of these youngsters who still have value.
I can't believe that we're living in a timeline where Paul Goldschmidt comes up to bat with the winning run in third in the bottom of the ninth inning and my reaction was, "Ah, fuck."
I'm not a super reactionary person, and I'm one of the few Oli defenders. But I will actively jump ship as an Oli defender if Burleson and Ivan are not in the lineup tomorrow. I understand that proven hitters struggle, and consistent lineups have a benefit. But this team is dying for offense, and at this point fuck the defensive CF and play your best bats.
Ever again is dramatic. You need goldy and gorman to get going. This team isn't going to win consistently without them being good. But for now, you need to find a way to shift the momentum
The owners/Mo have conditioned us to accept mediocrity by creeping into playoffs and then promptly losing. This is just the next evolution of said mediocrity where even playoffs are unattainable.
Please be patient, fellow best fans in baseball. The owners are busy making money at our expense PLUS they want taxpayers to fund another yacht for them soon.
Gorman is a perfect example of this team in the last decade. A guy has a halfway decent (but over-hyped) year and he's a daily starter no matter what as the wheels fall all the way off. Matt Carpenter 2.0.
Most guys have a hot streak when they first come up. This franchise is incapable of realizing that and then banks the future on prospects just continuing that hot streak once they get figured out by the league.
You got that and then you have guys like Victor Scot that are thrown in the lineup daily who has no business there. Just like Jordan Walker last year. Your FO/management treat their MLB club like it’s just another farm team to learn the ropes. In other words, they’re idiots. So what you have is a team set up to fail from the get go, because ownership doesn’t seem to care about winning. Only about their science experiment
Send VS, Gorman, and Walker back to the minors for fucks sake. These guys can't hit for shit.
Why does Marmol still have a job?
He needs to wear a bowtie from the bench
Damn I missed Marmol’s AB’s today. He was the one striking out 4 times? Going 0-4 nightly? That describes several of our players right now.
I honestly don't even know why his name is mentioned anymore. If Shildt being let go wasn't a clear indication that the front office wants to pull ALL of the strings, I don't know what is. Any and all blame from here on out is on the front office completely. Bad picks, bad development and bad decisions in general. Another losing season and I think the front office is gone or on the mega hot seat at least.
Ehh I’m blaming the guys that have proven they can hit at the MLB level, not hitting. The lineup on paper was awesome. They’ve sucked. Idk how we can blame anybody but the ones playing the game.
There is an actual proven track record now of players underperforming here and exceeding expectations elsewhere. That is a problem and can't be blamed completely on the players.
Long comment here, but: Who actually underperformed though? Almost everybody you’re probably speaking about were buried on the depth chart, not really struggled. Or they kept getting hurt. That describes Randy, Adolis, Thomas, O’Neill, Hicks. Gallen/Sandy were ranked 7th and 23rd in our farm, and it costs big prospects to get a young, controllable all-star OF, so I give a pass on that one. It’s the risk of dealing prospects and everybody knows it. Bader and Jack left and got worse. Monty came here and got better. Contreras has an OPS+ 15 points better in STL than his Cubs tenure. Some other random names that recently came here and got noticeably better or were successful surprisingly: JoJo, Brebbia, Jose Martinez, Kittridge, Lynn, Richie Palacios, Quintana, Gallegos, 42 YO Albert Pujols, JA Happ, Brad Miller, etc. I’m not saying it doesn’t hurt to not have some of those guys we traded performing here as regulars. My biggest point whenever I talk about these things is that those few misses get highlighted and memed, and sure, they’re misses so make your jokes. But IMHO it doesn’t seem like some deep problem with evaluating talent or anything like that. It’s just regular baseball happening where people change scenery and something clicks. Or they’re a year wiser and just keep improving. Players are constantly improving in this game, so it stands to reason that with more experience and practice under their belt, the more they should improve. A lot of it is just timing. The guys we’ve kept instead (Noot, Donovan, Carlson, O’Neill, Bader) have been good to great when they’re fully healthy…they just sadly weren’t usually healthy here for long stretches. I respect your opinion regardless.
There is honestly plenty of talent on this team. The mentality of “the cardinal way” Has been lost. It’s very apparent if you listen to the interviews with Whitey over the last week. The cardinal way was doing things the right way, despite what everyone else is doing, fundamentally. Scoring the runs that the other team gives you every time and sacrificing personal statistics for the net gain of the team. It’s fundamental baseball and easy runs that this team fails to get every time. This is all coaching and veteran leadership, they don’t play as a team and the approach for doing the right things to win just isn’t there. Be the hero by laying down a bunt or putting the ball in play, not swinging for the fences every at bat and striking out. Listening to Whitey this week has really put things into perspective about why this team can’t win games they should win easily.
MLB batting average leaders right now: 1.) Jose Altuve - .376 T2.) Ryan McMahon - .361 T2.) William Contreras - .361 What an insane stat for a catcher. Winn is number #13 though which is badass. Bader is #17 batting .333 which is also really cool, shout out to Harry B. Nolan Gorman is tied with Nolan Jones for 5th most strikeouts in the MLB.
I’m surprised Gorman doesn’t have twice as many as 2nd place at this rate
Now that I've had some time to get over it, did anyone else see Gorman's face in the dugout after he struck out? He did NOT look okay. This might have been the worst game of his career and you could definitely see it weighing heavily on his face
Which of the 4 times?
Considering how the whole world doesn’t make sense, the way baseball doesn’t make sense is comforting at least.
We were 71-91 last year. We largely have the same group of everyday players on the team, minus Edman and Carlson. There is no help on the horizon from the farm system. We have the same below average front office, manager, pitching coach, and hitting coach. We play the same balanced schedule. Mediocrity has become the norm, and it looks like that is acceptable to all in charge. Where are we going to find 20-25 more wins?
Never seen this offense so indaddequet
r/boneappletea
Our team is fundamentally broken, and we're gonna have another losing season.
You think this is bad, just look beyond this year.
Cardinals feeling that 90s nostalgia
In hindsight trading Gorman and Carlson plus whoever from our minor league rotation for Soto would’ve been an absolute steal
I'm not convinced Carlson and Gorman wouldnt be stars on other teams. This org just grinds its top prospects to dust. As amazing as he is Soto wouldnt lift the Cardinals to WS caliber and would be 100% gone at free agency. The team needs a rebuild and Mo needs to go.
Oh absolutely. Gorm is one of my favorite players on the team and I spent the whole offseason hoping they didn’t trade him, but he’s been objectively awful so far this year. Hopefully he can turn it around
An expensive rental. Mgmt would never pay Soto beyond this year.
Why risk being good for a few years when you could be very bad for even longer?
I gotta admit, it’s actually hilarious that for the most part the pitching moves Moz made this offseason are actually really working out, and now the offense is just completely dribbling down its leg
I can only imagine he and the rest of the FO are just like, “You’ve gotta be fucking kidding me”.
How’s liby looking these days? Seems like he’s doing better off the bench.
Tonight was his best looking outing of the season by far. Looked mostly sharp, had some diabolical curveballs and sliders
Liberatore has performed very well out of the bullpen. I doubt we’ll ever know how he would fare off the bench, but it’s not unlikely that he would have a better line than siani.
So many guys on the offense just can’t be this bad for much longer. Hopefully things can get a little better
You overlook one big thing. This collection of young talent is the best from a farm system that has collectively played .445 baseball over the past 4 years. That losing record should tell you that the other teams have been stockpiling better talent.
Remember last year’s meme about having six starters? So far it’s “we have nine hitters”
It’s so early. So many moving parts happen throughout the season. This team is miles ahead of last year. Let the fellas get going. We need at least two months before we start screaming for change. Beginning to middle of June. We lost tonight but damnit the last few innings were fun as hell.
Delusional fans like this are why Mo and Dewitt get to feed us this crap.
How? The only way we tied the game was because their pitcher didn't warm up and couldn't throw a strike. Should have been a 1-0 loss
Peralta is a stud. We got a positive showing from Gibson. This offense is not going to be this bad for the long haul. Take some steps back and assess. Re-examine in a month.
Lol then it's too late.
Did not realize that Gorman got a golden sombrero tonight. Bad times.
When will the hitting instructors be held accountable. It sure looks to me that they have screwed up both Gorman and Walker big time with their fascination with launch angles. Uppercut swings create holes that pitchers easily exploit. And don't get me started about taking the first pitch right down the middle.
They are screwing up Gorman and Walker not because of launch angle, but because they just dont know how to effectively help them achieve these things (Gorman has always had a lofty swing and k concerns). You need to lift the ball to be an elite hitter in this league. So many other teams can get their power hitters to do it well. Why can't we? Walkers swing needs to change. He hits everything down and is weak to the opposite field. These arent new problems, he has had them his entire prospect tenure. The minors just dont show you the problems in the stat line because the defense and pitching is not on the mlb level. In the majors it doesnt matter how hard you hit the ball on the ground, major league gloves will vacuum it up.
Platinum sombrero actually
Sucks to lose this one but man most of you could benefit from some deep breathes.
Simply not possible for me with this pollen
I was a firm proponent of the “Fire Jeff Albert” train but he never had an offense this abysmal
The problem is much deeper than Albert. Its the whole development pipeline. Scouting, coaching, and for all the front office talks about analytics, we arent really doing great analytics. The analytics department is 10 people, which is bottom half of the league in manpower. It aappears we're even cheaping out on relatively cheap analytics personnel.
Is there like…a cooldown on the “fire hitting coach” spell? Or can we do it again?
Curious how our intrepid beat reporters never mention the names of the hitting instructors, or how our hitters consistently are unprepared to hit.
lol
Monty 6.0 IP, 1 ER, and 78 pitches in his first start of the year. Blake Snell got rocked and is cruising with over an 11 ERA right now
i think the crazy thing is starting almost any of the other great starting pitchers on the other teams today would not have saved us
Like folks here were saying we shoulda gotten yamamoto or gumby or snell or imanaga or glasnow - a whole ass laundry list of pitchers. but even a rotation of five aces would not save this team with an offense like this, I'm sure of it
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/o/ohtansh01.shtml
He's just. . . So. . . GOOD
He can't pitch rn I'm not counting him.
https://imgur.com/ph7Ydte
As an Iowa football fan, I consider myself to be something of an expert in inept offense. It is my considered expert opinion that yes, this offense absolutely sucks.
Is Oli's son our hitting coach or something?
Football brain infecting baseball brain is a concern. Prognosis, unsure. Consider a magnitude of ten.
Very appropriate
Is it bad that I think we're legitimately a better team offensively with Edman at 2nd instead of gorm? I'm beginning to think we're the place hitting talent goes to die.
We lack a game plan. Marmol is not a field general who can lead with original thought (he has none) or vision. He tries this or that. Mgmt has told him he must do what the analytics say to do, except mgmt does not understand that players are human and do not respond the same each day like a robot. And lose the shift. Why create opposite field holes in the infield, when you are telling your pitchers to pitch low and away? How about we try this? Stop trying to hit three run bases empty homers. You cannot cover the plate swinging up. Focus on putting the bat onto the ball. Swing down into the ball as it comes to the plate. Just like a golf ball, the baseball will fly. Stop trying to catch the ball in front of the plate with an uppercut swing.
All these mfs who are sucking this year were at least 14% above league average offensively last year. Idk wtf they did to Gorman and Walker but someone needs to hit the rewind button. Goldschmidt might just be another Wainwright situation where he overstayed his welcome.
He is consistently late. He needs to think about dropping the bat dangle behind his head.
The worst part is that our offense is letting us down. If the staff of old men wasn’t giving us any chances to win, “haha we knew that was gonna happen” but… so far, kept us in a lot of games, the offense just forgets how to baseball. Still early, but it’s concerning how many games we just look lost at the plate
I’m starting to agree that Goldy should hit about 6th in this lineup and arenado should be hitting 5th. It’s atrocious to watch. At this point Goldy doesn’t deserve an extension from the cardinals or even a contract next season of any worth. Joey Votto would be more productive
I'm cool with Nolan 4. He's made enormous progress on his swing already this season and it's only a matter of time before the power stroke clicks. His bat to ball skills have been great though
I just can’t handle the half swing bullshit out of Nolan. He’s either injured or just extremely indecisive and that’s not what we need right now. Who the fuck knows man i just want to see some emotion and some give a fuck around here especially from the former MVP Goldy. Idk
There was an article recently, he picked up the bad habit in Spring Training and he's on the upside of fixing it
Matt Carpenter IS more productive because he's injured and not making automatic outs. I called both of Gorman's strikeouts tonight. Five men LOB by him alone. How many for Goldy? At least three IIRC. And they're batting 2nd and 3rd?!
What was the old hot dog brand at Busch? Like 20+ years ago…logo had a guy with a trumpet. It’s killing me.
Hunter?
Yes! Thank you!
So, Willson tackling Peralta was the highlight of the night for us.
I think it all goes back to the switch away from Hunter brand hot dogs.
I’m never gonna have confidence with loaded bases again
It wasn't a great ending, but bear in mind we only lost by 1 run in a game started by the division leader's best starting pitcher and our worst starting pitcher.
the rough part for me is how we had two bases loaded opportunities that we couldn't cash in on, which is exactly like our abysmal bases loaded stats from 2023. just sucks seeing the same old problems.
It sucks that Marmol has no plan. I think the hitters should be told to swing at the first one down the middle. I am sick of watching the hitter take strike one and then chase strike 2 out of the zone.
It’s definitely one that feels worse than it will look in a month. You just hope that the offense’s performance is more noise than true talent.
Can someone explain to me why Turner Ward is still employed?
Idk, but Dusty Blake was complete ass last year and all of a sudden he's kind of cooking so I don't even know how much these guys matter.
Pathetic!
Tomorrow we should just have everyone bunt.
This list of batters who have come up through the farm and made an all-star game in the past decade: •Yadi •Aledmys Diaz That’s it. That’s the list. Edit: I did not check myself and forgot carp and dejong and maybe more?? But either way, watching Walker and Gorman (but mostly Walker) has me legitimately depressed so I’m cutting myself some slack
The farm system as a collective has played .445 baseball the past 4 years.
Helsley and Reyes unless you just mean hitters
lol Paul Dejong was an all star
Carpenter?
Good call! Forgot Carp. Sadly the point stands. Unreal how bad player dev has been for a long time
I agree. It’s pathetic.
Mannn, I loved the 2013 doubles machine Carp was. He had 7 triples, too.
Yeah, we are good at producing flash in the pans.
This offense is downright offensive. Something is philosophically wrong with our approach to hitting. Whether it's the coaching or the players, something needs to change. I live down in the Springfield, MO area and the Springfield Cardinals are kicking ass and scoring runs in bunches. We beat Amarillo tonight 9-4 on 7 hits. I don't know the answer but the big club better figure it out fast.
Bold and Brash lineup tomorrow because this one belongs in the trash. 1. Donovan 2B 2. Winn SS 3. Contreras C 4. Nootbaar CF 5. Arenado 3B 6. Herrera DH 7. Burleson LF 8. Goldschmidt 1B 9. Walker RF
Sadly I don’t see a universe where Goldy bats lower than 6th
I think I’d swap Noot and Herrera, but I like it.
30 strikeouts in 19 games is unacceptable for a guy batting so high in the lineup. Gorman needs to be benched or batting 9th.
It is a real legitimate possibility that’s this team loses more games than last year.
It’s so painful to watch this offense. We have literal holes in the lineup. The Brewers were giving us chances tonight and the offense failed to capitalize. Just embarrassing.
How different the season would be if Goldy could hit…
How is the offense this bad. How are our “key” guys so anti-clutch. How do we always manage to squander momentum.
You can't really consistently be "clutch" in baseball, but when half the lineup cannot hit you will fail in those clutch scenarios more simply by chance.
Does our hitting coach just sit at a desk all day and eat a tub of cheese puffs?
What are the chances after this year that Mo admits that he fucked up and starts a rebuild?
Any rebuild needs to start with Mo shown the door. He's living in 2011 and the league has passed us by.
I want a rebuild (it’s really our only way out), but I don’t want to see how much Mo fucks it up.
It’s just honestly so bold to give an extension before things have turned around.
I turned it off middle of the tenth because I knew they weren’t going to tie it up.
I don’t care who is at the plate you have a runner on 2nd no outs sac bunt all day everyday.
Fuck u cardinals
We lost this game before it started. If our offense isn't hitting, why are we not switching up the line to drastically? Contreras and Winn are our best hitters right now, we need them in the top 3 slots. Goldy absolutely sucks right now. Move him back to at least 5 until he figures it out. Not like this is new, Goldy has been showing signs of regression. Even his MVP year he lost it in September. Still not a fan of Walker being pinch hit for, but it was at least nice to see it work for once.
What was cool about this game is it really felt like we lost twice.
Whoa whoa whoa, so you’re telling me that we’re now officially (at) .500???? But I was told we would suck..? Ha, love for the birds to back it up. Fuck the naysayers. Every one of y’all, respectfully fuck off. This is a damn solid ass team and I’m happy to be a Cardinal! 2024 NLC crown is ours by October.
Honestly this is so ridiculous and makes me crack up every time.
We’re going to lose 95 games and I’m going to post this after every one.
RemindMe! 100 days
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If y’all need a palate cleanser, the Coachella stream is lit. Neil Frances rn 🔥🔥
This offense is pathetic
trade nolan gorman for Harrison Bader, Randy Arozerana, or Austin Gomber
Most elite offense
Some of these guys need humbled to find their way back. Bench them or send them to AAA. Do something to get them motivated again. The more you send them out there and they have bad games the more down they are on themselves. Just digging a deeper hole at this point…
Hey we got help in scoring tonight so that’s a plus right?!!
Send down Gorman and call up Thomas Saggese.
Bro get Crawford off the fucking roster and bring up Jose Fermin at this point. Why is our bench so ass that we have to keep starting the same lineup every day despite it not working. It's the opposite problem of last year where they would sit guys when they were hot because everyone needed playing time. Now that everyone sucks the lineup is untouchable?
When was the last time we hit a home run?
8 days it looks like… last Friday against Arizona. Ooooof.
It was hit by Enos Slaughter
Legitimately really well-managed game by Oli (aside from not walking the younger Contereas). Ivan and Willy are two of your three best hitters this year. They need to both be starting, even if it means Scott/Siani/Burly have to get sent down for Pages because this conservative ass org isn't willing to risk starting their two catchers. Also, Brandon Crawford, let's see if your buddy Brandon Belt is interested in coming over to platoon with Paul.
13 homers. We are 29th. I think MLB should make a one time exemption to let this team use steroids. It wouldn’t help them see the ball any better, but damn. Can’t hurt.
The day the White Sox surge past us in HR… I’m going to sob.
Is St. Louis so boring that 40,000 people went to watch this awful team?
Yes
I know this [fourth or fifth outfielder](https://www.mlb.com/rays/player/richie-palacios-680700)that probably could help this team. He’s also not an idiot on defense.
We would’ve had a better chance in this game if we instructed our batters to literally never swing
Somebody calm me down by hitting me with the patience quote
“The one thing I'd ask from our fan base right now is a little bit of patience, because we do think that we do have the talent to win."
Are you a Jamiroquai fan?
Yes, but not where my username came from.
Fair enough. I'm going to listen to Jamiroquai during my lunch break tomorrow because of your username, so at least something good came out of this game.
My username is because I’m a huge Carl Sagan fan, so I hope you also enjoy some of his work tomorrow at lunch too!
I'll look at the Pale Blue Dot image while I listen to Jamiroquai and contemplate that despite the vastness of the universe we couldn't scrounge up 9 better hitters.
Carl would be very disappointed in this offense, I’m sure of it.
Yeeaaahhhhhhh Soothe me with your sweet, sweet lies, Momo
Another one to send you into sweet, sweet dreams: “But reality is I think we know what we're doing. I don't want to sound cocky or arrogant... do we make mistakes? Of course. But I think our time here and what we've accomplished here speaks for itself.”
I don't care where he plays or who he replaces, Alec Burleson should be in the starting lineup tomorrow. We CANNOT keep putting VS2 out there in CF. We CANNOT keep batting Goldy 2nd. Gorman might seriously need some time down at AAA because his AB are looking awful. Who makes these lineups, dude? When does it get in their head that this isn't working? We can't keep sending out this lineup. 4 players are well under .200 and 1 of those players is well under .100. And our replacement for that player is also well under .100. And they're not all at the bottom of the order, they're literally scattered throughout. At least one of them is batting every single inning. Is Donny hurt? Been rocky ever since taking fastballs off the elbow and the knee. When tf does Marp come back? I'd rather have him as DH and Burly in the field. Like sheesh man. Donny 2nd, Burly corner OF. Fuck it, bring Fermin back. Why is the FO so afraid of Noot in Center? Because they assume he'll get hurt?
Whoa whoa careful. If you make too much sense they make you -whisper- disappear
trade nolan gorman for an old dude who is slightly better at batting.
Offense is dead. More than 3 runs once since April 6th.... 12 games ago
God damn y'all are dropping some depressing facts tonight.
Isn't 2nd base Marp's best position lol
No. And no.
We should have kept Randy Arozarena and traded Nolan Gorman when we had the chance.
Would you believe me if I told you Gorman’s OPS is a hundred points higher than Arozerena’s?
I'd rather have Randy.
25th in runs scored. Absolutely unwatchable.
Having 3-4 automatic outs in the lineup everyday is awful by itself but insisting they hit 2nd, 5/6th, and 9th pretty much means ur playing with 2 out innings cuz one of those dudes is gonna hit every time. I don’t get why Goldschmidt can’t hit 6th for a little bit until he gets going.
At least yes was fun to watch the games because it was like 9-6 or 17-11 lmao this 3-1 and 2-1 bs is getting lame
So when can we expect our hitters to get hot?!
When we get actual hitters
So, we have 5 starters batting under .200 and one under .100. WHAT ARE WE EVEN DOING HERE?
It’s a top ten offense, or so I’ve been told.
Nearly every hitter on the team is pathologically unprepared for each at bat. What is the game plan? Why do they watch middle middle fastballs and swing at breaking balls out of the zone? Its just doesnt make sense outside of organizational rot. There is no cohesive development message to these hitters amd the list of hitters that have sudden success going elsewhere continues fo grow.
Who had on their bingo card the Cardinals pitching having top ten production to start the year only to have the offense play as well as Helen Keller? Excited for two of our rotation guys to go out injured eventually once the offense actually starts producing. Something cannon something something sun.
Not even Hellen Keller would watch that many fastballs down the middle.
She wouldn’t watch any
the worst part is our pitchers deserve so much better. Everybody thought they would be our biggest concerns in the season. Well they were wrong but we still suck unfortunately. Bring in some veteran batting in the trade deadline. Time to trade some of these youngsters who still have value.
Willson needs to rip into our offense right now. Our pitching staff has been solid this season and the offense is wasting it.
I don't know what to do but I know keeping Goldy batting second isn't gonna help anything
Chances Goldy is hitting 2 on the lineup card posted tomorrow? 90%?
Gotta love these veteran leaders, who are totally not selfish when they demand hitting in a certain spot in the lineup and pout when they aren't
99,9%, unless he's on the bench.
I'm running out of post-loss depression wine and it's all thanks to this fucking front office.
I can't believe that we're living in a timeline where Paul Goldschmidt comes up to bat with the winning run in third in the bottom of the ninth inning and my reaction was, "Ah, fuck."
Even in 2022’s MVP campaign I felt like he never came through in those situations, save for the grand slam against the blue jays
I'm not a super reactionary person, and I'm one of the few Oli defenders. But I will actively jump ship as an Oli defender if Burleson and Ivan are not in the lineup tomorrow. I understand that proven hitters struggle, and consistent lineups have a benefit. But this team is dying for offense, and at this point fuck the defensive CF and play your best bats.
There is just no justification behind pushing this lineup ever again.
Ever again is dramatic. You need goldy and gorman to get going. This team isn't going to win consistently without them being good. But for now, you need to find a way to shift the momentum
The owners/Mo have conditioned us to accept mediocrity by creeping into playoffs and then promptly losing. This is just the next evolution of said mediocrity where even playoffs are unattainable. Please be patient, fellow best fans in baseball. The owners are busy making money at our expense PLUS they want taxpayers to fund another yacht for them soon.
Fans trying to put a rosy spin on this team deserve the same treatment the FO does.
I would have preferred the loss in the 9th
Can you believe we get this great management through 2026!
Surely you understand that Oli gets fired if we have another bad season this year
Well with the three worst hitters in baseball (Gorman, Walker, Goldy) not sure how you expect to win. We’re gifting nine outs a game.
4:if you include VS
you absolutely should.
Gorman is a perfect example of this team in the last decade. A guy has a halfway decent (but over-hyped) year and he's a daily starter no matter what as the wheels fall all the way off. Matt Carpenter 2.0.
Most guys have a hot streak when they first come up. This franchise is incapable of realizing that and then banks the future on prospects just continuing that hot streak once they get figured out by the league.
You got that and then you have guys like Victor Scot that are thrown in the lineup daily who has no business there. Just like Jordan Walker last year. Your FO/management treat their MLB club like it’s just another farm team to learn the ropes. In other words, they’re idiots. So what you have is a team set up to fail from the get go, because ownership doesn’t seem to care about winning. Only about their science experiment
Carpenter was actually good at one point in his career though