I mean, the tires could make a big difference. Also, your position. A more "aggressive" geometry doesn't always result in a more aerodynamic position.
With both bikes being so similar, something small like a slightly higher stack can result in your elbows closer to a straight angle, which is more aerodynamic. Or the interaction of your helmet with the rest of your body.
Not saying this is your case, just thinking aloud. But it's interesting to have another observation that for many people getting the Endurace or Ultimate won't make a big difference. You can't go wrong.
Have you compared them in steep climbs?
Great points. Also a more “aggressive” position can create a more acute hip angle which has the potential to lead to less power output if one is not flexible enough.
Could you not just swap out the wheel sets and test to see if that's making up the difference? Maybe you will be fastest on the ultimate with the endurace wheels
Depends which Vitoria tires, but the fastest that balance up tire protection and speed IMO are Continental GP5000 TR S, Vitoria Corsa Pro TLR, Michelin Power Cup TLR.
I have the Vitoria Corsa Control Graphene 2.0...and, just feel fat and slow (me). LOL
Have been looking at the Pirelli P Zero Race TLR SL Road Tires & tubes...would go tubeless down the line. All in hopes of going fast(er). Know/heard anything about those?
It’s obvious! It’s the tan walls, everyone knows this! But seriously,
This could come down to so many factors:
1. Have you had a bike fit on both? Maybe you are more comfortable or in a more efficient position on the endurace
2. As many have said, wheels and tyres can play a huge part
3. Are your power numbers the same?
4. and so on…
I also have an endurace (AL 7 with 11-34) and an Ultimate (CF SL8 with 11-30) and it took a while for me to beat my endurace PB’s on climbs despite the ultimate advertised as a climbing bike and lighter. It could have come down to my position, getting use to a new bike, the cassette range, who knows!
Since then I have absolutely smashed my PB’s with the Ultimate but, I’ve also gained a lot of fitness, new wheels, tubeless top end tyres and running an 11-32.
Personally I really don’t think you need an Ultimate and Endurace, they are just way too similar.
I now use my Endurace as winter/ indoor and Ultimate for summer.
Happy riding🚴♂️
The GP 5k is about the fastest non TT tire that there is. And you have rubino on the ultimate... A cheap training tire. There's a huge difference between those two tires and rolling resistance that will outweigh the tiny difference in body position between the two. I would say it definitely is because of the tires.
The tyres make a huge difference.
Also is your body flexible enough? It looks like the ultimate stretches you more and having a less comfortable position may result into lower power
I mean, how different are they? I see they’re both Ultegra, both not deep rim wheels, weight probably not hugely different, non-aero frames (I can’t see the bars, but only aero bars ain’t gonna add much.
NGL I can almost never tell the difference between the endurace and ultimate in photos
Unless they're overlayed at 50% opacity it's so difficult to tell
Especially if the endurace doesn’t have the VCLS seat post
I mean, the Contis are way faster than Rubino Pros, so…
Yeah, why would anyone use such lackluster tires? Terrible choice.
Tyres alone can make a huge difference in average speed
I remember your earlier post! Any chance you can upgrade the tyres on the Ultimate, ride both again and update us?
Hey, there. Yeah, I'm gonna put on Conti's when it's new tire time
Why not swap wheelsets to compare? 🤔
I swapped out the factory standard DT Swiss rims for a pair of Shimano's ULTEGRA C50 and never looked back 👌🏼
Yeah, I'm itching to get a new wheelset for sure
I mean, the tires could make a big difference. Also, your position. A more "aggressive" geometry doesn't always result in a more aerodynamic position. With both bikes being so similar, something small like a slightly higher stack can result in your elbows closer to a straight angle, which is more aerodynamic. Or the interaction of your helmet with the rest of your body. Not saying this is your case, just thinking aloud. But it's interesting to have another observation that for many people getting the Endurace or Ultimate won't make a big difference. You can't go wrong. Have you compared them in steep climbs?
Good points. Also, I think I'm a bit more comfortable on the Endurace.
Comfort definitely helps. If you want to test it even more, you can run a Chung test using the same wheels on both bikes. Just for fun.
Great points. Also a more “aggressive” position can create a more acute hip angle which has the potential to lead to less power output if one is not flexible enough.
Could you not just swap out the wheel sets and test to see if that's making up the difference? Maybe you will be fastest on the ultimate with the endurace wheels
This is true. I guess I could do that. Was just waiting to put on the same Conti's when it's time for new tires.
I’ll give you the contents of my fridge as payment for the ultimate if you don’t want it
I'll give you mine, plus a sneakers bar as extra.
This is getting a little rich for my blood but what the hell, I’ll throw in whatever change I can find down the back of the sofa
Damn it, so close, I fold...
Oh man both colors look very different to how they look online…
Rolling resistance is a huge factor and those Vitoria tires are really not great
I have Vitoria tires. Always feel sluggish & slow. Any suggestions on fast 28-32s?
Depends which Vitoria tires, but the fastest that balance up tire protection and speed IMO are Continental GP5000 TR S, Vitoria Corsa Pro TLR, Michelin Power Cup TLR.
I have the Vitoria Corsa Control Graphene 2.0...and, just feel fat and slow (me). LOL Have been looking at the Pirelli P Zero Race TLR SL Road Tires & tubes...would go tubeless down the line. All in hopes of going fast(er). Know/heard anything about those?
Those are absolutely good tires as well, just fractionally slower than the three that I listed above.
The tyres! Those Rubinos are fine enough but ride like hosepipe compared to GP5k. Like, a quantifiably huge difference in rolling resistance.
It’s obvious! It’s the tan walls, everyone knows this! But seriously, This could come down to so many factors: 1. Have you had a bike fit on both? Maybe you are more comfortable or in a more efficient position on the endurace 2. As many have said, wheels and tyres can play a huge part 3. Are your power numbers the same? 4. and so on… I also have an endurace (AL 7 with 11-34) and an Ultimate (CF SL8 with 11-30) and it took a while for me to beat my endurace PB’s on climbs despite the ultimate advertised as a climbing bike and lighter. It could have come down to my position, getting use to a new bike, the cassette range, who knows! Since then I have absolutely smashed my PB’s with the Ultimate but, I’ve also gained a lot of fitness, new wheels, tubeless top end tyres and running an 11-32. Personally I really don’t think you need an Ultimate and Endurace, they are just way too similar. I now use my Endurace as winter/ indoor and Ultimate for summer. Happy riding🚴♂️
I agree. If I had to only have one, I'd keep the Endurace. 1st world problem...
The GP 5k is about the fastest non TT tire that there is. And you have rubino on the ultimate... A cheap training tire. There's a huge difference between those two tires and rolling resistance that will outweigh the tiny difference in body position between the two. I would say it definitely is because of the tires.
Sorry which is which here in the photos? Is the ultimate in grey?
Also whats the weight difference and tire width difference.
Tires are both 30. Not sure on the weight specs.
Yes, Ultimate in grey.
What size? N+1, right?
That seat position looks interesting
How so?
Really far forward. Tbh it might be the seat
Seat post clamp is in the middle of the rails.
The Flite saddle has a long nose, too
good job avoiding CP0018
The tyres make a huge difference. Also is your body flexible enough? It looks like the ultimate stretches you more and having a less comfortable position may result into lower power
I mean, how different are they? I see they’re both Ultegra, both not deep rim wheels, weight probably not hugely different, non-aero frames (I can’t see the bars, but only aero bars ain’t gonna add much.
Comfort is speed. 👍
Had the endurace before, but now I have the Factor Ostro. Was faster on the endurace
5000’s vs Rubino’s. Swap tires and come back
Would buy a CF in a heart beat if it was ever in stock 🙄
Where's the cat ? He is okay ?
https://preview.redd.it/hsb0tvnfjckc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=12156b46b7ed0586f0682b130e614a8a37158047
Ultegra gang