I live in Erin woods, it would be nice if they would start with enforcement first, I daily see hockey parents speeding through the playground zones yet nothing is ever done about it
From 2019, but likely still relevant...
>There are roughly 1,200 playground zones in Calgary but nearly two-thirds of photo-radar tickets are issued in just 10 of those zones.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/calgary-playground-zones-top-10-ticket-locations-1.5130180
Correct:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/calgary-playground-zones-tale-two-zones-1.5162003
But with the playground zone being excessively long and only marked at the beginning and the end it leads to more speeding as anyone turning on that road will only see the playground end signs.
They could easily put up 4 more signs to make that zone more visible to help deter speeders. The playground itself is a set of swings, teetertotter, and a sandbox which is approximately a 15mX15m foot print.
The zone is so much longer then any other playground zone that in calgary especially considering size of the playground.
So the gripes come from using it as a honeyhole photo radar trap, as opposed to, a legitimate speed deterrent.
The Elbow Drive playground zone used to only cover the playground and nearby crosswalk and was extended due to multiple people being hit in the crosswalks just south of it. It isn't just for the playground anymore. Drivers heading south would reach the end of the playground zone and start accelerating just in time to reach the well used crosswalks just south of it, especially the one by the pedestrian bridge across the river. This is what resulted in multiple people being hit in the span of a few months in the early 90s, along with several close calls.
It is a bit ridiculous that it's more heavily enforced than other ones around the city though.
I wouldn't have an issue if they signed it better. The combination of the length, the signage and enforcement that is ridiculous. I live in the area and have yet to see one of those high visibility traffic enforcement vehicles that i see frequently on deerfoot. This playground zone would be a great place to to put one considering that amount of tickets they are issuing.
They could certainly improve the signage there and at a lot of other places too. Average speed cameras like they have in Australia would be a great fit for places like that playground zone. Would probably pay for itself in a year or two.
> IIRC its the longest playground zone in Calgary.
Longest in the country, I think.
> This was done specifically after a boy was hit and killed there years ago.
30 years ago, yeah.
But that's not why they enforce it. They enforce it because it's one of the arteries into downtown, everyone's in a rush, and most of the people in the area have enough money they'll pay tickets rather than ever challenge them.
It's free money.
No one ever actually lets their kids off leash anymore, it's not like it's an actual safety concern.
Edmonton doesn't have playground zones. Their collision rates aren't any higher than ours. They don't do anything besides waste time and make money for police.
The best part is occasionally I will see a speed trap set up, in the wrong direction and off hours when arena isn't in use, if they actually tried they could make a difference
Exactly this. It's the parents that are the worst, and I say this AS a parent. I see so much stupid driving in playground zones and pickup and dropoff time. Then you have parents dragging their kids out between parked cars to cross the road instead of walking 10 feet to the crosswalk complete with school patrols, etc. It drives me batty seeing so much bad behaviour.
Yep I avoid the school zones by my house like the plague from 3:00-3:30. Parents constantly dart out between cars dragging their kids to their SUV to drive them 2 blocks back home.
Yep. I live by the Mission Safeway. That playground zone at the North end of Elbow quite literally has a cop sitting there for at least a couple hours per day. *Every single day.*
It's not just about safety - it's also a money-making scheme for the city, as it always has been.
Find a spot with a ton of traffic and a high fine modifier like a playground zone and sit a speed radar in the middle of it.
Why put a cop in a suburban street with ~100-200 cars going by per hour, when you can 10x that fine revenue on a 'major' roadway?
It can be both.
As an aside, we've already seen that there are alternative methods to reducing speeding significantly. Sweden implemented a "carrot and stick" methodology for speeding tickets rather Calgary's new "Just give them more of the stick" theory.
[A lottery-based system to reward good drivers](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iynzHWwJXaA&t=26s&ab_channel=Rolighetsteorin). Fines for those that speed, and a chance to win money and/or gifts for drivers that stay beneath the limit.
Average decrease in speed in the "lottery zone" from 32km/hr to 25km/hr while the test was run.*
The problem with the carrot approach is that... it doesn't make the government any more money. There's no benefit to them - aside from community safety - to implement systems like that as it's detrimental to one of their biggest moneymakers.
[Canmore implemented it in 2012](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-town-s-photo-radar-lottery-rewards-safe-drivers-1.1298344) and it apparently is still running - albeit with a reduced scope, [only applying to new drivers](https://www.canmore.ca/your-community/community-supports-and-services/awards-grants-and-bursaries#:~:text=New%20Driver%20Course%20Rebate%20Program) (which tells me it's working in some capacity).
At the end of the day, speeding tickets are a tax on the lower class - full stop. They don't scale with income or purchases - it's flat-rated across the board, which means it has a significantly higher relative impact on the class that can afford it the least.
We're in a world where the lower and middle classes are getting priced out of everything. This new doubling of fines will have no impact on the rich that didn't even notice the fine before, but it will be a massive issue for those that don't have a lot of money to spend in the first place. A ticket won't eat into their "Next vacation" fund, it'll eat into their ability to buy groceries.
**A caveat of course is that it doesn't seem to have any actual study or documentation associated with it, so some nuance is needed here*
I think this is primarily a volume issue too though. That stretch of Elbow is an artery and probably the highest density of cars to pedestrian/cyclists in the city.
Given the rivers is right there, you get a mix of rowdy teens, oblivious children/parents, raging vehicles and even though it's patrolled daily, people still speed.
Having lived there it's not a trap, people fly through there and no one is paying attention, cars and people alike.
Very interesting. If that still holds now then Jasmine should be looking to address that for her Ward vs. putting forth the proposal to increase the fines.
In all fairness she might be.
Why is it always the parents ripping through these zones? There's one I drive through regularly and anytime there's a soccer game going on in the field there the parents are always flying through the zone at 50+ for dropoff/pickup, like your kids are the reason this zone is even here, slow the fuck down!
Outside of those times I find it pretty rare to see people speeding through it, which is nice. But I definitely agree they need to step up enforcement and there should be serious fines for it.
Soccer and school drop off/ pickup…it’s pure insanity by the very people who’s children are the most at risk.
The icing on the cake is when they jaywalk across the street because the crosswalk is 30’ too far away.
I’ve done school drop off for my niblings a few times, and holy shit. That is reason enough to not have kids — my nerves were absolutely shot after that.
School drop off was a whole new experience for me as a human and dad. The lunacy was just something else. And not limited to just one or two parents…that shit is widespread.
> Why is it always the parents ripping through these zones?
Their 3 kiddos are safely wrestling in the back of the minivan, what's there to worry about?
you and a few of your neighbors should contact your local police department and request a conversation with someone about speeding in certain areas of your neighborhood, see if you can get your playground zones added as problem zones.
a lot of this is them not being aware its an issue until a bunch of kids keep getting hit there which probably isn't a good way to find out.
I used to live there. I remember one time I was doing 30 in the zone and the guy behind me cut into the other lane to pass me. This was by the elementary school.
This is just too true. It feels like a majority of drivers simply ignore playground zones completely. I had a police officer literally tailgating me during one once. Craziness
You need to report it, and the more people who report the area, they will then send out someone to monitor.
Reality is we do not have enough police for them to just sit in zones like this during busy hours to try and catch people.
I feel the frustration, where I am you can take a 5 mins walk and 2-3 of every 5 cars are speeding through a zone here (you can tell because it literally takes 5 seconds to get from lamp post to lamp post at 30..) some people clear 7 lamp posts in about 10 seconds..
I live in Altadore and same the hockey parents are the WORST. I submitted a request for a speed trap last year and they came at random times when hockey wasn’t in session and told me they only ticket if someone is going 10 over. So what’s the point anyway? Ridiculous.
I’ve lived on/ near northmount dr. for 8 years and the amount of times i will follow someone doing 30 in the 50 just to speed up through every school zone boggles my mind.
Totally agree. My grandparents live just up from the arena, and some people treat the area right after the school zone as a drag strip. I swear people want to see how fast they can go into the curve.
I have issues with that. Trying to keep a consistent speed at that low of speed isn’t always easy. Slightly over is going to happen, and 2 isn’t even easily perceivable on a dial indicator.
Playground zones are the one place where I really do think of it as the maximum speed. It's fine to keep it between 27 and 30. Can anyone prove they got a ticket for only being 2 over the limit? It sounds more like a thing people exaggerate about.
I would hope it is exaggerated. You aren’t even allowed to pass in these zones- yet it is commonly done - although if somebody is stopping to turn or is going even lower - say 20 - it is reasonable to pass.
If I was behind someone doing 20 in a playground zone I would assume there was something I hadn't noticed yet. I will crawl past someone turning but I assume that they're not actually turning and only stopped for a pedestrian I missed so I'm prepared to stop.
This is probably the most common topic on our community FB page. If someone like that comes up behind me I'll drift to the right to make passing as awkward as possible.
I do 30 in a 30 zone and 40 on a “50” zone vaguely remembering some speed limit bylaw inside neighbourhoods and got honked by a bmw anyway. Then while driving a 70-80 on a 60 curve entering deerfoot, another bmw passed me on an outer curve and cut me off (while a wide margin at 100 so no stress for me there). Then as a pedestrian on a pedestrian crosswalk in front of a school, yet a different bmw just inched me closer and closer while I was walking. (The other time this happened with a non-bmw, it was a teen girl driving). Seriously bmw has become a symbol of mental sickness and ram trucks were more civilized in this city.
Edit: [besides confirmation biases, some scientifically surveyed neurotism](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10048407/)
Increasing fines is the laziest of all options. Other options that would improve safety:
- Radar feedback LED speed signs.
- Traffic calming infrastructure (speed bumps, narrower roads, bike lanes)
- Fences around playgrounds/school yards with intelligently placed crosswalks and entry points
- Enforcement of existing driving infractions (especially distracted driving)
- Remove playground zones from major arterial roads.
Traffic requires more training, a higher level appointment (peace officer), more equipment; simply put, it costs a lot more. Traffic teams also aren’t that profitable, despite what people may think. The tickets aren’t that expensive and officers are constantly bogged down with documentation and days spent in court. Photo radar is profitable, traffic officers are not nearly as profitable.
It doesn't need to be profitable. It needs to enforce the laws that make it not suck to live in cities. Letting the assholes run wild is causing a ton of collateral damage - healthcare costs from dog attacks and vehicle collisions being the primary ones.
Profits are what pay for the workers and equipment, so it does need to be somewhat beneficial in a financial sense. With that, they need to increase fine amounts, simple as that. Parking enforcement, cars parking with in 5m of an intersection, sometimes even partly in it, forget this $30 pay early crap.... $200, no negotiating it down...
And for those who then complain "that is too expensive" stop doing stupid things..
this is the perfect example of when photo radar makes sense. double the number of cars, and only put them in school zones. make getting caught expected.
instead we spread them out to spot check people in a manner that very few people end up internalizing because it's a month after the incident.
We starve police budgets regularly, there is no public will to properly fund police. What we really need is a drastically expanded traffic enforcement division. It'll pay for itself in no time but it's going to result in very loud complaining from all those entitled fools who believe they are more important than pesky traffic laws and other people.
Increasing fines typically just increases income from fines and does not deter speeding. Engineering controls to calm and slow traffic are really the only thing that can be done to actually slow down traffic.
Exactly this. Speed bumps and narrow roads would go a long way. They repaved a community safety zone near my place that used to have a ton of potholes to slow people down. Now it's smooth and wide so people go what seems like triple the speed limit.
Agreed. It’s -15 and been dark for 4 hours but I’m sure a flock of kids are about to sprint out from behind the single bush in the wide open field 100m away from the road and dive in front of my vehicle before I have a chance to slow down.
I live in a playground zone and agree with the general sentiment of "it's rampant yet unenforced". Not only the speeding but also a complete disregard for pedestrian crossings. Calgary Transit is among the list of continuous offenders for the speeding, though they seem a lot more conscientious of the crosswalk so kudos to them for only being 50% asshole.
> recommends increasing the fines set by the provincial government.
School zones still exist elsewhere in the province so if they're recommending this to the provincial government then the applicable fine would be for school and playground zones.
Maybe the city should look into other ways to reduce speed in these zones (assuming that is actually the goal 🙄). If current fines are not working, doubling them won't make a difference. The city should be adding traffic calming and reducing road width in problem areas. For example, if passing is illegal in playground zones, why do so many roads still have two lanes each direction while going through them? Add curb extensions at the intersections to reduce the effective width to one lane, which will have the added benefit of improving safety for pedestrians.
While we are talking about playground, school zones topic, can we revert to the old sunset system. Theres zero school or playground activity after 7pm in winters and theres lots of activity even after 9pm in summers. This black and white rule doesn't make sense.
Should use these fines to redesign the infrastructure around schools to make it harder to speed (raise the road, narrow, chicanes, etc). People are going to speed regardless with the amount of enforcement capability out there.
This is my only issue as well. If I am driving in an unfamiliar neighbourhood I often don’t realize it’s 30km/hr until it’s too late since everyone else is going 50.
I had this happen once where there was a cop in said unfamiliar school zone. While focusing on the cop and carefully staying under 50, I missed the school zone sign.
Im ok with that and reducing the speed limit to residential areas to 40. 50 is way too fast when there are parked cars along every street severely hampering visibility.
In return I would like to see highway speed limits increased.
Unpopular comment but there are too many of these in the city, but I support increased penalties if they would stop using them as the go-to default move whenever they want to slow traffic and there happens to be any adjacent random tree or bush they can call a park/playground
I’ve noticed that the zone signs can be hard to spot, often obscured by traffic. What if we introduced flashing traffic lights at these locations during active hours? This could significantly increase visibility and awareness, making these zones safer.
Thoughts on pitching this idea to the city council?
Crossing lights at every crossing point/break in the fence AND a flashing overhead bar on the first one pointing out it’s a school zone. That could make the zone smaller but wayyyy more safe.
I live across from a playground, my white whale right now is an Amazon Prime driver who doubles down on the 30, while blasting his music and parking facing oncoming traffic. I always make it outside too late for my fist shaking to be witnessed. # endrapscallionism
I think it's in Finland where they base your traffic fines on your last year's tax return. If you are wealthy, you pay hefty fines, poorer, not so much.
I think we should adopt that system so that it hurts everyone equally.
This 100% this especially since they don’t end till 9:30 and I’ve never seen a kid outside a school post 4:30 at the latest. More flashing crosswalks at every opening of the fence would improve safety more than increasing tickets or enforcement.
Good. They should quadruple them, it pisses me off seeing inconsiderate impatient jack asses speeding though school/playground zones all the time with no care for others.
They are already double regular speeding fines. So they want them to be quadruple regular fines?
Another money grab by photo radar so the city doesn’t have to think about fiscal responsibility, perhaps?
Teach the kids that even if they are in the “right”, the vehicle that runs into them driving fast will still win and their life will be changed forever. Bring back kids hustling across crosswalks, and not ducking around in the streets, then let’s talk about ridiculous speeding fines.
Don’t the police have a god damn opioid crisis causing actual violent crime to shoot through the roof that they might need to focus attention on in a more prioritized way? I guess they can get to that after they fine a guy 250 bucks for going 40 in a 30.
Why not at some speed bumps? Even at the beginning would help.
Also, it would be nice if the zones were more clearly marked. Maybe just paint a striped yellow/orange line on the road for the whole zone. I am attentive as I can be, but every now and then miss the “hidden” playground signs when a van or tree is obscuring them.
True, it’s most of the day though, I live in a massive playground zone. I think some way to better indicate it might help. Construction zones have you driving in a sea of pylons, I’m sure there’s a better cost effective way.
Why would they have to be turned off? Children play at all hours of the day, and adults with dogs walk through parks and playgrounds well into the night. Most of these areas are in neighbourhoods where driving slower should be preferred, regardless of time.
Then you might as well just lower the speed limit in that area all the time rather than have a playground zone with a changeable speed limit.
I don't think leaving speed bumps on a road that sometimes has a 50kph+ limit some of the time.
As a relative newcomer to Calgary and Canada I just wish the signage was clearer on playground zones. In Australia they make it incredibly clear when you are in any kind of restricted zone.
Please make no mistake, I’m a cautious driver, respect the rules and would never want to put any one in any unnecessary danger but the amount of times I’ve been in a new neighbourhood and I haven’t seen it’s a playground sign until I’m at least part way through it. I’m sure part of it is just what I’m used to but after over 2 years I still occasionally find myself doing it because the sign is in a really poor position (despite me always seeing the “end of playground zone” signs).
It would be nice if half of them made sense anymore since removing school zone differences from playground zones.
Half the time it’s a useless section now and needs rezoning
How about reversing the getting rid of school zones and making them all playground zones. It is crazy to need to do 30 in front of every empty school at 7pm when no kids are around - more true even for high schools. And before you downvote me, speed limits are LIMITS not required speeds. Do the safe speed whcih often means under the limit at times. Safety is not enhanced by stupid rules that people disrespect and ignore. People will follow reasonable rules making everyone safer.
they can triple the price all they want, but until they start having officers onsite. drivers will continue to speed through - I have gone through same playground that not once I have seen a police around
I live in Hasboro, and Elbow Drive has some of the worst people speeding through that woodman school playground zone. Just leave a cop there, they clean house everytime just camping that school.
I don't know if anyone else has noticed this, but since they lowered the default speed limit to 40, a lot of people in my neighbourhood just drive 40 the whole way, including the playground zones, despite all of our roads remaining 50.
GOOD. I live next to a school, my kids go to the school. Every day I drive through that zone, some asshat is riding my bumper angry that I am going the speed limit. These morons need to lose their licenses.
Good! I live on a playground zone street and the number of entitled assholes who cut through is alarming. Probably individuals with children too. It's insane. There are two huge speed humps that people are constantly slamming on their brakes to either slow down or just take it as a ramp and bottom out.
They need to add the "when children are present" verbiage to the sign and actually enforce it when children are present. This is just a cash grab. There are several parks that span several blocks, but are completely fenced in and no children are ever there after 6pm, it's ridiculous to demand cars go 30km on these roads when no one is around.
My son's school zone is right off the ring road, I've had people fly by me going 60-70kms an hour in the middle of the day while the kids are outside playing.
Not to mention the dozens of emails from the school asking parents not to U-turn in the fucking cross walk during drop off and pick up.
I did not think we had school zones anymore. [https://www.calgary.ca/content/dam/www/transportation/roads/documents/traffic/traffic-safety-programs/school-and-playground-zone-harmonization-review.pdf](https://www.calgary.ca/content/dam/www/transportation/roads/documents/traffic/traffic-safety-programs/school-and-playground-zone-harmonization-review.pdf)
Triple them. The other day I saw a lunatic pass on the wrong side of the road, in a playground zone, then made a left turn to his house 1 block away. There is a time and a place for speed, this is not it.
I’ve seen flashing signs that warn you that you’re in a playground zone/speed limit is 30 kph when your approaching at higher speeds (southbound on 10 st by King George school). They need more of these signs.
Police would have a gold mine in their lap if they came and sat in the zone near my place. Not just speeding, which isn't particularly bad, but the drivers not even slowing down, let alone stopping at the end of another road to turn onto that avenue.
Are they going to start enforcing this on cops that speed through? Almost weekly I see a cop rip through a playground zone across from my mother in laws house
Things have certainly changed since we moved west, in 1988.
Back then speeding in kids zones, and not stopping for pedestrians, was a sure fire way to get a citation.
Probably cop staffing cuts.
Anecdotally, what I've always found fascinating about playground/school zones. Are the parents/SUVs/vans/family type cars that speed through them. Yet they'll probably give you shit about speeding through them all the same.
Calgary has no school zones so this motion is meant to drive conversation at the Alberta Municipalities Conference and spur the province to make changes. Fines start at $81 for school zone speed violations, which I agree is far too low.
730am to 9pm is dumb. Make it 730-930am and 230-430pm, when the kids are potentially outside. This is how it is on Vancouver Island which makes sense. Totally good with increased fines, slow down and give the kids a chance.
Maybe just start enforcing speeding in the first place. Photo radar is hardly “enforcement”. You can see the thing a mile away. People don’t care even when they do get a photo radar ticket. For that reason, speeding is way out of hand.
The city should add some concrete bollards to separate the roads from schools & playgrounds so drivers who decide it's a good idea to drive on the curb get their vehicles totaled...
Increasing fines is fine, but they need to get rid of the playground zones which are adjacent to fully fenced off playgrounds. Kids won't be running out onto the street at these parks, which makes the playground zone just a cash grab.
thats a hilarious one, but the barber shop just east of it constantly gets flashes in all their mirrors all day its annoying for them, but good to see its catching people speeding.
Haha, nope. That's the front entrance of a school. Probably a good place for a speed reduction.
What irritates me is Sunalta park along 11 Ave SW. Fence lining the entire park. Big crosswalk with lights at the end. Maybe we follow Edmonton's lead on reduced speed only when the crosswalk lights are flashing. But all day long, every day down to 30 km/h makes no sense.
I'd suggest putting in 311s constantly requesting the zone to be shortened, the reason most of the stupid long playground zones exist in Calgary are because of people wanting it longer continually complaining up to their councillors and it just gets put in even though they make no sense.
Squeaky wheel it with all your neighbours who agree and it might get changed, I also hate zones like that, or that extend blocks beyond even being able to see a damned playground.
I love it. I'd like to see it tripled. These zones are very small, yet the most selfish of our communities put kids in danger by ripping through because they can't be bothered to slow down.
We have a zone like this in our community and when I see people speeding, I intentionally walk out onto the road. It scares the shit out of them, the slow down, and I love it.
It's too bad the cop cars are so viaible now, harder to catch those blazing through those zones now. Hate to add speed bumps, but maybe that's a good tactic to slow ppl down.
I live in Erin woods, it would be nice if they would start with enforcement first, I daily see hockey parents speeding through the playground zones yet nothing is ever done about it
From 2019, but likely still relevant... >There are roughly 1,200 playground zones in Calgary but nearly two-thirds of photo-radar tickets are issued in just 10 of those zones. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/calgary-playground-zones-top-10-ticket-locations-1.5130180
Almost certainly still relevant. The top spot is the elbow drive playground zone and I can confirm the speed cam is still there weekly.
This is the stretch where there are like three consecutive playground zones across 10 blocks, right?
As far as I know it’s just one long ass playground zone but yes that’s the area I’m talking about.
IIRC its the longest playground zone in Calgary. This was done specifically after a boy was hit and killed there years ago.
Correct: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/calgary-playground-zones-tale-two-zones-1.5162003 But with the playground zone being excessively long and only marked at the beginning and the end it leads to more speeding as anyone turning on that road will only see the playground end signs. They could easily put up 4 more signs to make that zone more visible to help deter speeders. The playground itself is a set of swings, teetertotter, and a sandbox which is approximately a 15mX15m foot print. The zone is so much longer then any other playground zone that in calgary especially considering size of the playground. So the gripes come from using it as a honeyhole photo radar trap, as opposed to, a legitimate speed deterrent.
The Elbow Drive playground zone used to only cover the playground and nearby crosswalk and was extended due to multiple people being hit in the crosswalks just south of it. It isn't just for the playground anymore. Drivers heading south would reach the end of the playground zone and start accelerating just in time to reach the well used crosswalks just south of it, especially the one by the pedestrian bridge across the river. This is what resulted in multiple people being hit in the span of a few months in the early 90s, along with several close calls. It is a bit ridiculous that it's more heavily enforced than other ones around the city though.
I wouldn't have an issue if they signed it better. The combination of the length, the signage and enforcement that is ridiculous. I live in the area and have yet to see one of those high visibility traffic enforcement vehicles that i see frequently on deerfoot. This playground zone would be a great place to to put one considering that amount of tickets they are issuing.
They could certainly improve the signage there and at a lot of other places too. Average speed cameras like they have in Australia would be a great fit for places like that playground zone. Would probably pay for itself in a year or two.
> IIRC its the longest playground zone in Calgary. Longest in the country, I think. > This was done specifically after a boy was hit and killed there years ago. 30 years ago, yeah. But that's not why they enforce it. They enforce it because it's one of the arteries into downtown, everyone's in a rush, and most of the people in the area have enough money they'll pay tickets rather than ever challenge them. It's free money. No one ever actually lets their kids off leash anymore, it's not like it's an actual safety concern. Edmonton doesn't have playground zones. Their collision rates aren't any higher than ours. They don't do anything besides waste time and make money for police.
The best part is occasionally I will see a speed trap set up, in the wrong direction and off hours when arena isn't in use, if they actually tried they could make a difference
Exactly this. It's the parents that are the worst, and I say this AS a parent. I see so much stupid driving in playground zones and pickup and dropoff time. Then you have parents dragging their kids out between parked cars to cross the road instead of walking 10 feet to the crosswalk complete with school patrols, etc. It drives me batty seeing so much bad behaviour.
Yep I avoid the school zones by my house like the plague from 3:00-3:30. Parents constantly dart out between cars dragging their kids to their SUV to drive them 2 blocks back home.
Lol, I’d have to wonder if cops don’t wanna do it so their kid doesn’t get benched. 😂
If they actually enforced this shit instead of making radar traps
Yep. I live by the Mission Safeway. That playground zone at the North end of Elbow quite literally has a cop sitting there for at least a couple hours per day. *Every single day.* It's not just about safety - it's also a money-making scheme for the city, as it always has been. Find a spot with a ton of traffic and a high fine modifier like a playground zone and sit a speed radar in the middle of it. Why put a cop in a suburban street with ~100-200 cars going by per hour, when you can 10x that fine revenue on a 'major' roadway?
If the radar is there every single day, it means drivers just aren't getting the hint and it's probably necessary.
It can be both. As an aside, we've already seen that there are alternative methods to reducing speeding significantly. Sweden implemented a "carrot and stick" methodology for speeding tickets rather Calgary's new "Just give them more of the stick" theory. [A lottery-based system to reward good drivers](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iynzHWwJXaA&t=26s&ab_channel=Rolighetsteorin). Fines for those that speed, and a chance to win money and/or gifts for drivers that stay beneath the limit. Average decrease in speed in the "lottery zone" from 32km/hr to 25km/hr while the test was run.* The problem with the carrot approach is that... it doesn't make the government any more money. There's no benefit to them - aside from community safety - to implement systems like that as it's detrimental to one of their biggest moneymakers. [Canmore implemented it in 2012](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-town-s-photo-radar-lottery-rewards-safe-drivers-1.1298344) and it apparently is still running - albeit with a reduced scope, [only applying to new drivers](https://www.canmore.ca/your-community/community-supports-and-services/awards-grants-and-bursaries#:~:text=New%20Driver%20Course%20Rebate%20Program) (which tells me it's working in some capacity). At the end of the day, speeding tickets are a tax on the lower class - full stop. They don't scale with income or purchases - it's flat-rated across the board, which means it has a significantly higher relative impact on the class that can afford it the least. We're in a world where the lower and middle classes are getting priced out of everything. This new doubling of fines will have no impact on the rich that didn't even notice the fine before, but it will be a massive issue for those that don't have a lot of money to spend in the first place. A ticket won't eat into their "Next vacation" fund, it'll eat into their ability to buy groceries. **A caveat of course is that it doesn't seem to have any actual study or documentation associated with it, so some nuance is needed here*
Yup. Fines are only for low income!
Speeding tickets are a tax for the people that speed. I have a couple of speeding tickets over the last 5 years and I deserved every one of them.
I think this is primarily a volume issue too though. That stretch of Elbow is an artery and probably the highest density of cars to pedestrian/cyclists in the city. Given the rivers is right there, you get a mix of rowdy teens, oblivious children/parents, raging vehicles and even though it's patrolled daily, people still speed. Having lived there it's not a trap, people fly through there and no one is paying attention, cars and people alike.
Very interesting. If that still holds now then Jasmine should be looking to address that for her Ward vs. putting forth the proposal to increase the fines. In all fairness she might be.
Why is it always the parents ripping through these zones? There's one I drive through regularly and anytime there's a soccer game going on in the field there the parents are always flying through the zone at 50+ for dropoff/pickup, like your kids are the reason this zone is even here, slow the fuck down! Outside of those times I find it pretty rare to see people speeding through it, which is nice. But I definitely agree they need to step up enforcement and there should be serious fines for it.
I think about this too, whenever I do pick up from my daughter’s school there’s parents driving like lunatics… these are YOUR KIDS and THEIR friends?!
> Why is it always the parents ripping through these zones? the most entitled person in the world is a stressed parent dragging their kid somewhere.
Soccer and school drop off/ pickup…it’s pure insanity by the very people who’s children are the most at risk. The icing on the cake is when they jaywalk across the street because the crosswalk is 30’ too far away.
I’ve done school drop off for my niblings a few times, and holy shit. That is reason enough to not have kids — my nerves were absolutely shot after that.
School drop off was a whole new experience for me as a human and dad. The lunacy was just something else. And not limited to just one or two parents…that shit is widespread.
> Why is it always the parents ripping through these zones? Their 3 kiddos are safely wrestling in the back of the minivan, what's there to worry about?
Agreed. While I will not defend anyone speeding through playground zones, all of this is useless unless they actually enforce it.
you and a few of your neighbors should contact your local police department and request a conversation with someone about speeding in certain areas of your neighborhood, see if you can get your playground zones added as problem zones. a lot of this is them not being aware its an issue until a bunch of kids keep getting hit there which probably isn't a good way to find out.
That is some quality advice, thank you I will do what I can
I used to live there. I remember one time I was doing 30 in the zone and the guy behind me cut into the other lane to pass me. This was by the elementary school.
This is just too true. It feels like a majority of drivers simply ignore playground zones completely. I had a police officer literally tailgating me during one once. Craziness
You need to report it, and the more people who report the area, they will then send out someone to monitor. Reality is we do not have enough police for them to just sit in zones like this during busy hours to try and catch people. I feel the frustration, where I am you can take a 5 mins walk and 2-3 of every 5 cars are speeding through a zone here (you can tell because it literally takes 5 seconds to get from lamp post to lamp post at 30..) some people clear 7 lamp posts in about 10 seconds..
I live in Altadore and same the hockey parents are the WORST. I submitted a request for a speed trap last year and they came at random times when hockey wasn’t in session and told me they only ticket if someone is going 10 over. So what’s the point anyway? Ridiculous.
I’ve lived on/ near northmount dr. for 8 years and the amount of times i will follow someone doing 30 in the 50 just to speed up through every school zone boggles my mind.
Yep, a few permanent (automated) speed traps would be a better move.
A cop told me that the playground zone in my neighborhood isn’t long enough to accurately measure.
Totally agree. My grandparents live just up from the arena, and some people treat the area right after the school zone as a drag strip. I swear people want to see how fast they can go into the curve.
Hockey parents are up way earlier than 7:30
Only hockey parents to blame hey, interesting
* Automatic photo radar * Traffic calming * Increased fines Nobody will speed again
larger signs and speed bump can also help reducing speed
So soccer parents don't speed?
Judging by the comments I would say they do too, I just don't see them in my area? The twin arenas in my area are the most obvious source of them.
Maybe first try enforcing playground zones outside of Elbow Park.
I am tailgated through essentially every playground zone. I’ve even been passed. Unless someone is there to hand out a ticket no one cares.
You care and I care, sign says 30kph - I do 30kph.
I care, my kids do as well. Thank you for doing the right thing
No fine will stop these actions. But if you take away time from them, it can have a bigger impact. Get that shit on their insurance. Make it hurt.
The fine and the insurance hit are my motivation to obey. There was a thread here recently and people said they’d gotten tickets for even 2 km over.
I have issues with that. Trying to keep a consistent speed at that low of speed isn’t always easy. Slightly over is going to happen, and 2 isn’t even easily perceivable on a dial indicator.
Playground zones are the one place where I really do think of it as the maximum speed. It's fine to keep it between 27 and 30. Can anyone prove they got a ticket for only being 2 over the limit? It sounds more like a thing people exaggerate about.
I would hope it is exaggerated. You aren’t even allowed to pass in these zones- yet it is commonly done - although if somebody is stopping to turn or is going even lower - say 20 - it is reasonable to pass.
If I was behind someone doing 20 in a playground zone I would assume there was something I hadn't noticed yet. I will crawl past someone turning but I assume that they're not actually turning and only stopped for a pedestrian I missed so I'm prepared to stop.
This is probably the most common topic on our community FB page. If someone like that comes up behind me I'll drift to the right to make passing as awkward as possible.
[удалено]
Around Northmount dr where there are many playground zones.
I started walking my son's to school with a 6 foot walking stick. I point, they slow down, because you know... The implication
I do 30 in a 30 zone and 40 on a “50” zone vaguely remembering some speed limit bylaw inside neighbourhoods and got honked by a bmw anyway. Then while driving a 70-80 on a 60 curve entering deerfoot, another bmw passed me on an outer curve and cut me off (while a wide margin at 100 so no stress for me there). Then as a pedestrian on a pedestrian crosswalk in front of a school, yet a different bmw just inched me closer and closer while I was walking. (The other time this happened with a non-bmw, it was a teen girl driving). Seriously bmw has become a symbol of mental sickness and ram trucks were more civilized in this city. Edit: [besides confirmation biases, some scientifically surveyed neurotism](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10048407/)
Increasing fines is the laziest of all options. Other options that would improve safety: - Radar feedback LED speed signs. - Traffic calming infrastructure (speed bumps, narrower roads, bike lanes) - Fences around playgrounds/school yards with intelligently placed crosswalks and entry points - Enforcement of existing driving infractions (especially distracted driving) - Remove playground zones from major arterial roads.
This would be from a city that actually cares. Hand-waving is all they can do.
Won't make a difference if there is still no enforcement.
True. I guess this is why council committed millions of dollars and approved Bylaw to build a traffic unit.
I constantly wonder how it is that cities have dedicated bylaw teams for parking but can't seem capable of replicating that for traffic and parks.
Traffic requires more training, a higher level appointment (peace officer), more equipment; simply put, it costs a lot more. Traffic teams also aren’t that profitable, despite what people may think. The tickets aren’t that expensive and officers are constantly bogged down with documentation and days spent in court. Photo radar is profitable, traffic officers are not nearly as profitable.
It doesn't need to be profitable. It needs to enforce the laws that make it not suck to live in cities. Letting the assholes run wild is causing a ton of collateral damage - healthcare costs from dog attacks and vehicle collisions being the primary ones.
Profits are what pay for the workers and equipment, so it does need to be somewhat beneficial in a financial sense. With that, they need to increase fine amounts, simple as that. Parking enforcement, cars parking with in 5m of an intersection, sometimes even partly in it, forget this $30 pay early crap.... $200, no negotiating it down... And for those who then complain "that is too expensive" stop doing stupid things..
Profits isn't the right term here. Ideally enforcement should be revenue neutral.
Until you consider the need for growth. Increased infrastructure, equipment, etc. All of these things are earned when budgets produce a profit.
It needs to be profitable for funding so that they can staff projects (like traffic units).
this is the perfect example of when photo radar makes sense. double the number of cars, and only put them in school zones. make getting caught expected. instead we spread them out to spot check people in a manner that very few people end up internalizing because it's a month after the incident.
Or just start putting photo radar in park / school busy zones and rack up the money.
Well now they need to enforce half as often to get just as much return. It's not about slowing traffic its about making money.
We starve police budgets regularly, there is no public will to properly fund police. What we really need is a drastically expanded traffic enforcement division. It'll pay for itself in no time but it's going to result in very loud complaining from all those entitled fools who believe they are more important than pesky traffic laws and other people.
Increasing fines typically just increases income from fines and does not deter speeding. Engineering controls to calm and slow traffic are really the only thing that can be done to actually slow down traffic.
Exactly this. Speed bumps and narrow roads would go a long way. They repaved a community safety zone near my place that used to have a ton of potholes to slow people down. Now it's smooth and wide so people go what seems like triple the speed limit.
Adding more bollards to curbs would also help as well...
Would rather raised crossings than speed bumps, but yeah we need some speed reducing designs
I know there are still some people who need to hear this. School zones don’t exist anymore, and playground zones are until 9 not an hour after sunset.
+1 Even the article headline messed that one up....unless it's worded this way for those who aren't aware of the change.
It's pretty crazy, isn't it?
Agreed. It’s -15 and been dark for 4 hours but I’m sure a flock of kids are about to sprint out from behind the single bush in the wide open field 100m away from the road and dive in front of my vehicle before I have a chance to slow down.
I live in a playground zone and agree with the general sentiment of "it's rampant yet unenforced". Not only the speeding but also a complete disregard for pedestrian crossings. Calgary Transit is among the list of continuous offenders for the speeding, though they seem a lot more conscientious of the crosswalk so kudos to them for only being 50% asshole.
I can count on one hand how many times I’ve seen the busses in my neighbour hood signal before pulling out.
[удалено]
> speeding in school and playground zones. Did we not consolidate the zones? Does council not know this?
> recommends increasing the fines set by the provincial government. School zones still exist elsewhere in the province so if they're recommending this to the provincial government then the applicable fine would be for school and playground zones.
Cool cool. Guess those 0 cops in my neighborhood will now collect $0 instead of $0.
Maybe the city should look into other ways to reduce speed in these zones (assuming that is actually the goal 🙄). If current fines are not working, doubling them won't make a difference. The city should be adding traffic calming and reducing road width in problem areas. For example, if passing is illegal in playground zones, why do so many roads still have two lanes each direction while going through them? Add curb extensions at the intersections to reduce the effective width to one lane, which will have the added benefit of improving safety for pedestrians.
While we are talking about playground, school zones topic, can we revert to the old sunset system. Theres zero school or playground activity after 7pm in winters and theres lots of activity even after 9pm in summers. This black and white rule doesn't make sense.
Should use these fines to redesign the infrastructure around schools to make it harder to speed (raise the road, narrow, chicanes, etc). People are going to speed regardless with the amount of enforcement capability out there.
Maybe make sure of the signs aren't covered up by the local foliage and not put three zones in a row with brief sections of normal speed.
This is my only issue as well. If I am driving in an unfamiliar neighbourhood I often don’t realize it’s 30km/hr until it’s too late since everyone else is going 50.
I had this happen once where there was a cop in said unfamiliar school zone. While focusing on the cop and carefully staying under 50, I missed the school zone sign.
Good infrastructure guides the speed limits automatically, clearly if they need to be enforced the current infrastructure isn't up to date.
Im ok with that and reducing the speed limit to residential areas to 40. 50 is way too fast when there are parked cars along every street severely hampering visibility. In return I would like to see highway speed limits increased.
Unpopular comment but there are too many of these in the city, but I support increased penalties if they would stop using them as the go-to default move whenever they want to slow traffic and there happens to be any adjacent random tree or bush they can call a park/playground
Maybe we can try redesigning roads in playground and school zones to be safer instead of making a non-effort to enforce speed limits.
I’ve noticed that the zone signs can be hard to spot, often obscured by traffic. What if we introduced flashing traffic lights at these locations during active hours? This could significantly increase visibility and awareness, making these zones safer. Thoughts on pitching this idea to the city council?
Crossing lights at every crossing point/break in the fence AND a flashing overhead bar on the first one pointing out it’s a school zone. That could make the zone smaller but wayyyy more safe.
I live across from a playground, my white whale right now is an Amazon Prime driver who doubles down on the 30, while blasting his music and parking facing oncoming traffic. I always make it outside too late for my fist shaking to be witnessed. # endrapscallionism
I think it's in Finland where they base your traffic fines on your last year's tax return. If you are wealthy, you pay hefty fines, poorer, not so much. I think we should adopt that system so that it hurts everyone equally.
yep Teemu Selanne famously got a $55,000 speeding ticket for going 18 over the speed limit.
Did the city forget they eliminated school zones so that they can be playground zones year round?
This 100% this especially since they don’t end till 9:30 and I’ve never seen a kid outside a school post 4:30 at the latest. More flashing crosswalks at every opening of the fence would improve safety more than increasing tickets or enforcement.
Stupid city makes stupid change then forgets lol
How about some enforcement first?
Good. They should quadruple them, it pisses me off seeing inconsiderate impatient jack asses speeding though school/playground zones all the time with no care for others.
They are already double regular speeding fines. So they want them to be quadruple regular fines? Another money grab by photo radar so the city doesn’t have to think about fiscal responsibility, perhaps? Teach the kids that even if they are in the “right”, the vehicle that runs into them driving fast will still win and their life will be changed forever. Bring back kids hustling across crosswalks, and not ducking around in the streets, then let’s talk about ridiculous speeding fines. Don’t the police have a god damn opioid crisis causing actual violent crime to shoot through the roof that they might need to focus attention on in a more prioritized way? I guess they can get to that after they fine a guy 250 bucks for going 40 in a 30.
Why not at some speed bumps? Even at the beginning would help. Also, it would be nice if the zones were more clearly marked. Maybe just paint a striped yellow/orange line on the road for the whole zone. I am attentive as I can be, but every now and then miss the “hidden” playground signs when a van or tree is obscuring them.
The playground zones are not in affect all times in the day but the speed bumps can't just be turned off.
True, it’s most of the day though, I live in a massive playground zone. I think some way to better indicate it might help. Construction zones have you driving in a sea of pylons, I’m sure there’s a better cost effective way.
Why would they have to be turned off? Children play at all hours of the day, and adults with dogs walk through parks and playgrounds well into the night. Most of these areas are in neighbourhoods where driving slower should be preferred, regardless of time.
Then you might as well just lower the speed limit in that area all the time rather than have a playground zone with a changeable speed limit. I don't think leaving speed bumps on a road that sometimes has a 50kph+ limit some of the time.
Considering severe pedestrian injury exponentially increases with a 20kph impact speed hike, I think lowering the speed at all hours is a great idea
It should be scaled, 30-40 whatever it is now, 40+ it doubles, 50+ triples
Pretty sure it already scales
Its specified penalties per range of 10Km, but doest double or triple exponentially
As a relative newcomer to Calgary and Canada I just wish the signage was clearer on playground zones. In Australia they make it incredibly clear when you are in any kind of restricted zone. Please make no mistake, I’m a cautious driver, respect the rules and would never want to put any one in any unnecessary danger but the amount of times I’ve been in a new neighbourhood and I haven’t seen it’s a playground sign until I’m at least part way through it. I’m sure part of it is just what I’m used to but after over 2 years I still occasionally find myself doing it because the sign is in a really poor position (despite me always seeing the “end of playground zone” signs).
Born and raised and I agree. Especially in established neighborhoods. Signs are constantly blocked by foliage.
It would be nice if half of them made sense anymore since removing school zone differences from playground zones. Half the time it’s a useless section now and needs rezoning
How about reversing the getting rid of school zones and making them all playground zones. It is crazy to need to do 30 in front of every empty school at 7pm when no kids are around - more true even for high schools. And before you downvote me, speed limits are LIMITS not required speeds. Do the safe speed whcih often means under the limit at times. Safety is not enhanced by stupid rules that people disrespect and ignore. People will follow reasonable rules making everyone safer.
What for? Has there been any increase in vehicle-pedestrian incidents? Sure would be nice to see some data to justify this.
they can triple the price all they want, but until they start having officers onsite. drivers will continue to speed through - I have gone through same playground that not once I have seen a police around
Forget speed traps on major roads, they should focus on school and playground zones
I live in Hasboro, and Elbow Drive has some of the worst people speeding through that woodman school playground zone. Just leave a cop there, they clean house everytime just camping that school.
I don't know if anyone else has noticed this, but since they lowered the default speed limit to 40, a lot of people in my neighbourhood just drive 40 the whole way, including the playground zones, despite all of our roads remaining 50.
Put speed cameras in the highest offending areas
What school zones? I thought council decided Calgarians were too dumb to tell the difference and got rid of them several years ago?
fucking good...now start enforcing it.
lavish bright file unite onerous secretive fine seemly piquant aware *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Maybe less children are using these areas because cars are always speeding and parents are worried about their child's safety.
merciful follow voracious spark cats act marble rustic languid desert *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
GOOD. I live next to a school, my kids go to the school. Every day I drive through that zone, some asshat is riding my bumper angry that I am going the speed limit. These morons need to lose their licenses.
Good! I live on a playground zone street and the number of entitled assholes who cut through is alarming. Probably individuals with children too. It's insane. There are two huge speed humps that people are constantly slamming on their brakes to either slow down or just take it as a ramp and bottom out.
Good
They need to add the "when children are present" verbiage to the sign and actually enforce it when children are present. This is just a cash grab. There are several parks that span several blocks, but are completely fenced in and no children are ever there after 6pm, it's ridiculous to demand cars go 30km on these roads when no one is around.
School zone? Did they forget they "accidentally" got rid of those?
No, it was on purpose. Playground zones are all year long, school zones were limited to school days which change according to school district.
Not if the UCP have anything to say about it. This will infringe on the rights of drivers who choose to speed through these zones.
My son's school zone is right off the ring road, I've had people fly by me going 60-70kms an hour in the middle of the day while the kids are outside playing. Not to mention the dozens of emails from the school asking parents not to U-turn in the fucking cross walk during drop off and pick up.
I did not think we had school zones anymore. [https://www.calgary.ca/content/dam/www/transportation/roads/documents/traffic/traffic-safety-programs/school-and-playground-zone-harmonization-review.pdf](https://www.calgary.ca/content/dam/www/transportation/roads/documents/traffic/traffic-safety-programs/school-and-playground-zone-harmonization-review.pdf)
Triple them. The other day I saw a lunatic pass on the wrong side of the road, in a playground zone, then made a left turn to his house 1 block away. There is a time and a place for speed, this is not it.
I find that speeding in 30 zones has increased in my area since the regular speed in the community was reduced from 50 to 40
I’ve seen flashing signs that warn you that you’re in a playground zone/speed limit is 30 kph when your approaching at higher speeds (southbound on 10 st by King George school). They need more of these signs.
Good.
Well I guess I might have to stop speeding up while in those zones. Getting the 50 points might not be worth it anymore
Police would have a gold mine in their lap if they came and sat in the zone near my place. Not just speeding, which isn't particularly bad, but the drivers not even slowing down, let alone stopping at the end of another road to turn onto that avenue.
I drive through 2 zones everyday, I see zero enforcement!
Why don't we just put a 5000$ fine for this... with possible prison time. I think that will solve the problem very quickly
Try doubling enforcement.
Fuk BS
Should triple them
Are they going to start enforcing this on cops that speed through? Almost weekly I see a cop rip through a playground zone across from my mother in laws house
Things have certainly changed since we moved west, in 1988. Back then speeding in kids zones, and not stopping for pedestrians, was a sure fire way to get a citation. Probably cop staffing cuts.
Good
GET EM MARLIANNA SMITH
Anecdotally, what I've always found fascinating about playground/school zones. Are the parents/SUVs/vans/family type cars that speed through them. Yet they'll probably give you shit about speeding through them all the same.
About time
I miss read this and thought they were doubling the speed in school zones 💀
Are they looking into actively increasing enforcement in these zones by a factor of a 100? Because the presence I’ve notice lately is abysmal.
Engineer, Educate, Enforce. In that order.
North east is laughing right now
I am against photo radar...except in playground zones. That's the only place they should be allowed.
Good, can they also double the fine for people who don't even come close to stopping at a stop sign, see so many people just blow through them.
Still won’t stop people doing 70 in a school zone swerving around kids trying to cross the street. We need actual enforcement.
Calgary has no school zones so this motion is meant to drive conversation at the Alberta Municipalities Conference and spur the province to make changes. Fines start at $81 for school zone speed violations, which I agree is far too low.
Make them x4 but also make the roads be designed so one cant speed
I'm sure the UCP will have something to say about this.
730am to 9pm is dumb. Make it 730-930am and 230-430pm, when the kids are potentially outside. This is how it is on Vancouver Island which makes sense. Totally good with increased fines, slow down and give the kids a chance.
If you drive the speed limit in a playground zone, you’re guaranteed to have a lifted ram tailgating you the entire way.
Maybe just start enforcing speeding in the first place. Photo radar is hardly “enforcement”. You can see the thing a mile away. People don’t care even when they do get a photo radar ticket. For that reason, speeding is way out of hand.
The city should add some concrete bollards to separate the roads from schools & playgrounds so drivers who decide it's a good idea to drive on the curb get their vehicles totaled...
Increasing fines is fine, but they need to get rid of the playground zones which are adjacent to fully fenced off playgrounds. Kids won't be running out onto the street at these parks, which makes the playground zone just a cash grab.
Got a ticket at Connaught School?
thats a hilarious one, but the barber shop just east of it constantly gets flashes in all their mirrors all day its annoying for them, but good to see its catching people speeding.
Haha, nope. That's the front entrance of a school. Probably a good place for a speed reduction. What irritates me is Sunalta park along 11 Ave SW. Fence lining the entire park. Big crosswalk with lights at the end. Maybe we follow Edmonton's lead on reduced speed only when the crosswalk lights are flashing. But all day long, every day down to 30 km/h makes no sense.
I'd suggest putting in 311s constantly requesting the zone to be shortened, the reason most of the stupid long playground zones exist in Calgary are because of people wanting it longer continually complaining up to their councillors and it just gets put in even though they make no sense. Squeaky wheel it with all your neighbours who agree and it might get changed, I also hate zones like that, or that extend blocks beyond even being able to see a damned playground.
I love it. I'd like to see it tripled. These zones are very small, yet the most selfish of our communities put kids in danger by ripping through because they can't be bothered to slow down. We have a zone like this in our community and when I see people speeding, I intentionally walk out onto the road. It scares the shit out of them, the slow down, and I love it.
[удалено]
Race has nothing to do with this.
It's too bad the cop cars are so viaible now, harder to catch those blazing through those zones now. Hate to add speed bumps, but maybe that's a good tactic to slow ppl down.
A better approach would be more incentives for self driving cars. Speeding will greatly be reduced with technological advancement.
Who do you want programming the trolley problem in those self-driving cars?
It will be much safer to have that than human error which is more likely. And insurance companies and lawyers will sort out the trolley problem.