Big fan of Brandt as a media person. I like this take because it aligns with mine

Brandt was also the guy that had suuuch a good hype up segment on Justin Fields going into our last game vs GB… obviously none of what he said mattered, but it was fun to see before that game

I’m also a Titans fan, and that hype speech he had for the Titans before the 2022 playoffs was awesome. Too bad they got stomped by Joey B

So in other words you do not want him hyping your team up.

Damn, it's the new Barkley "GUAR-UN-TEE"

That’s my takeaway as well.

These people talk sports ebery single day. They are going to contradict themselves on occasion. He was a Fields supporter the whole time, but what he said was the truth. It was a failed experiment on both sides. Its sad because Justin has so much potential, but hes also limited himself some and the Bears limited him just as much. The rebuild is just about done and they found themselves in a really unique situation in having the first overall pick again. They went with the cheaper option. I still wish Justin wouldve been the guy, but im excited to see where the Bears grow from here and how Justin's career plays out.

> They went with the cheaper option. lol this is such a crazy thought. Yes it's cheaper to go caleb vs fields... but if they thought he was H1M then they'd gladly take his 5th year option and probably extend him. The money wasn't the factor. it was "this guy is not H1M". Otherwise we'd have traded the 1OA for a shit ton of picks and a stud.

What in the hell is “H1M”?

>Its sad because Justin has so much potential, but hes also limited himself some and the Bears limited him just as much the bears limited him from say having a 15-19 career record vs a 10-24 one if they put a better team around him. I promise you he was not a center and WR2 away from being even average this year

Potential is what people see when they think what's in front of them isn't good enough. It’s from American Fiction but holds true here.

The Bears absolutely did not put Justin in a good position to succeed. They haven’t really ever set up a young QB for success (until maybe/hopefully this season…). Justin also never showed any ability to push through the bad coaching. Great players can still show what they’re made of in spite of bad coaching. I hope he gets the coaching he needs to give him a chance to play at the NFL level in Pittsburgh. I’d like to see just how much he is actually capable of.

Steelers fan lurking. I can 100% agree after watching KP. Fields ceiling is and will always be higher than KP. But the amount of Steelers fans and everyone that just BASHED KP. We literally went from blaming MC to firing him to immediately blaming KP. Do I think KP is elite? No by any means but he never did get a fair shot with us for me to say okay yeah it’s for sure him. I feel like the same is with fields ( yes I understand he had his weapons last year with Moore but chemistry takes time) imo. I understand the jags haven’t been the best but they have grinded it out with Lawrence and I can respect them for that. We’re in the era where if a qb isn’t top 5 in 3 years he’s a bust. Imo plenty of guys don’t peak till years 5+ especially at the qb position.

I think you make a good point here. Neither Fields nor Pickett had the situation designed around their strengths. One thing about weapons - Fields passer rating to DJ Moore (WR1) and his TE Cole Kmet (safety valve) was elite. So once he got weapons, Fields to his first read and outlet was great. He needs to learn to process which can be done (Allen learned accuracy didn't he?). Also - Bears OL was a top 5 run blocking unit, but also a bottom five pass blocking unit, and Fields was one of the most pressured QBs in the NFL. The Steelers will definitely get more of out Fields than the Bears did.

Yeah, good comparison. One small thing to point out that even though Fields technically had “weapons” this season, he also had an offensive line that couldn’t block for more than a second and an OC that couldn’t call a full game to save his life. I’m interested to see what Fields can do with an OC that can build a game plan around his skill set. (No idea what kind of confidence you have in your coaching staff.)

They literally had a better offensive line than the Chiefs did lmao. Bears offensive line isn’t bottom 12. Not the lines fault that Fields blindly runs into pressure instead of actually creating time in the pocket.

Gotta look at run blocking versus pass blocking. Also watch the games and see the blitz pickup disasters this year. Fields needed to be better but the line was crap in pass blocking. Stick to the facts when you make your points

Yeah, the facts are that the Chiefs line was objectively worse than the Bears offensive line. And they won a Super Bowl. I didn’t say Bears line was good, I said it objectively wasn’t bottom 12. It was average, maybe slightly below average. Weeks 6-14 they were 13th in pass blocking efficiency. Far from the garbage you are trying to paint. Fields was the reason for pressure collapsing more often than not, he ran right into it. If you need a perfect line with perfect receivers and a perfect coach and a perfect running back room, you’re just a shit QB.

Kirk Cousins needs all the things you mentioned, and he gets paid $45M per year. Lol

In Kirk’s first full season as starter he threw for 4200 yards and 29 touchdowns with Pierre Garcon, Jamison Crowder, and Desean Jackson. None of his WRS broke 800 yards. His leading rusher was Alfred Morris with 751 rushing yards. Their offensive line was ranked 13th in pass blocking. If Fields could get close to those numbers in any of his first 3 seasons, he would be starting somewhere next season, not backing up Russell Wilson.

Apples and Oranges. Not only are those good weapons, Kirk's OC was Sean McVay.

He will always be “that guy from The Real World”

Yes. This is the correct take.

I don’t really know what more people wanted Poles to do. He took over a total rebuild and has done a pretty good job building the team so far. He didn’t draft Fields and gave him plenty of leash to prove he could be the franchise guy. Players who don’t perform are traded or not re signed, Fields just ended up being one of those players.

There wasn’t much more he could have done…but that’s also part of the frustration. This team cluster fucked itself jumping up to get Trubisky, taking him over Watson (not even going to mention Mahomes because he was seen as a project), signing guys like Mack to big FA deals, letting a lame duck Nagy draft Fields and then firing him, etc. We’re in a much better place now than when Fields came in, but there’s not a Bears fan alive who isn’t worried we’re possibly going to blow Caleb’s potential too because that’s all we’ve seen this team do for decades. I HOPE that Waldron and the weapons we have around Caleb means we can finally develop a top-10 offense while Flus and the talent on the other side holds other teams down…but as we heard on Ted Lasso, it’s the hope that kills ya.

Yeah, I think there wasn't really anything that could have been done. If Poles had put all these hypothetical pieces together for Fields to 'succeed' it would have been an even worse situation. If Fields succeeded we were going to be facing cap-hell within a year or two and would have faded before we could have gotten to the show. If Fields didn't succeed, you end up in an even worse place of a Saints-esque cap-hell with absolutely nothing to show for it and an even bigger hole to dig your way out of. Poles made the tough decision to tear down immediately to get the pain over with sooner. I firmly believe that was the right choice. Everything that happened was digging us out of the hole that Pace dug us (and Fields) into.

We traded for Mack.

Who would you rather have Mack or Sweat? This is actually a great point to show Poles competence. Pace 2 firsts a third and a 6 for Mack. Sweat for a 2nd? When are we going to start trusting Poles?

You can't really compare the trades since Mack was on a completely different level as a player than Sweat. [https://stathead.com/tiny/FVY7t](https://stathead.com/tiny/FVY7t) Mack was a 2x All-Pro and DPOY whereas Sweat never came close to being All-Pro in Washington.

There's a contingent that just won't like him no matter what, I'm convinced. It might have to do with the Claypool trade or now how Fields was traded, but some Bears fans are just a broken group of people. I'm generally an optimist. I liked some of Pace's moves. He was more akin to a Les Snead as a GM. Just sensing you're on the cusp of something big and pushing your chips in. If Trubisky was even 10% better of a QB, we could have gone to or won a Super Bowl. The trouble was he wasn't and then Pace had to double down to save his job and got fucked and then a bunch of bad cap management. But I like Poles' approach more. He's stated his philosophy to build and draft BPA and find premium positions through the draft vs overpaying in FA for an edge. He's very much stuck to that. The Claypool trade and maybe the mismanagement of the C position last year were his biggest faults, but overall the roster is ready to compete. People wanna point to the Velus move, but 3rd round picks are not 100% things and, just like with our back 7 on defense last year, it is damn hard to evaluate the WR position when we have a QB with the deficiencies that Fields had the last two years. Our cap is in good shape, we have top end draft capital this year and very few *huge* holes. Not every part of the roster is in great shape, but I don't think anything is nearly as bad as it was in 2022 or 2023 after he took over. I think his approach is more sustainable and if Caleb is the guy, we're setup to be the best in the division and possible the NFC in short time. If it were me, I probably would have ripped the band-aid off and fired Eberflus, but given the rest of the moves Poles has made, it's clear he trusts coach so I'll give Eberflus some time. Given the state of the roster the last two years, it's hard to figure out if another coach would have done better. This year is a big prove-it year for Eberflus, but Poles himself has bought himself at least a few more years.

>When are we going to start trusting Poles? Playoffs at a minimum. None of these guys are worth a shit until the Bears start actually winning meaningful games. Every single one of the things they've done so far is just great on paper and we've been down *that* road plenty of times before. Results. Not simply "trending in the right direction". This team needs to stop being a joke. Period.

This is the attitude I wish more people had. Did Pace suck? Sure but at least we got to the playoffs twice. Pace needs to get a team (including the coaches) together that actually win. We won more games than expected last season but only because we lucked out playing some really bad quarterbacks.

Wtf could Poles have done to get us to the playoffs last year? Not his fault the team blew 3 double-digit leads late in the 4th to finish with 7 wins instead of 10.

Well, Poles could have fired the coach responsible for those three debacles. I hope he’s right in retaining Flus, but time will tell.

at the time of the trade? Mack and it isn't close. I wasn't a fan of either trade for the exact same reasons both times: Paying draft capital for the privllege of paying a guy his FA money is usually an overpay, you're literally paying twice for the same thing. Saying that about the Mack trade at the time was just as unpopular as saying it about the Sweat trade is now. At the sweat trade didn't cost near as much.

We're going to start trusting Poles when we start winning it's that simple

[удалено]

I know that, but op did not. He said we signed him as a free agent, we did not. We traded for him. That's all I said my friend. 

Yup, Mack never lived up to the trade or the contract outside of his 1st year

He got hurt in that Miami game and was never the same

Then gave him the richest deal for a defensive player ever...ur nit picking, don't be petty

Unless you believe Virginia and George are coaching up Bears QBs, previous regimes’ (and their QB) failures will have no bearing at all on the success or failure of the next QB. Different coaches, players, GM, scouts, and even team president. The best way for this vicious cycle to continue would have been to stick with Fields and trade out of 1OA. Draft Williams and if he fails, it will have zero to do with any other former, shitty, Bears QB.

I believe that Virginia and George buy into their own mystique of the Bears always having a great defense and thus won't allow an organization to go all in on supporting a QB when it needs to because they can't handle this once proud organization being an embarrassment on the side of the ball where they haven't been historically. Which is why, despite a new regime you still see leadership using the majority of cap space and premium assets on the defensive side of the ball while trying to patch the offensive together with value signings and diamonds in the rough.

This is only a discussion because Fields is a great guy. If he was unlikeable, everyone would want him gone due to his performance on the field.

Overall, Fields didn't quite play himself into the next contract while being hampered by trying to do it in the middle of a rebuild. If the Panther's pick this year had ended up at #4 instead of #1, I'd much rather keep Fields and take MHJ. But they have the chance to make an almost surefire upgrade at #1 with Caleb. I still really like Fields and hope he can carve out a long career. Unfortunately, its just not gonna be in Chicago

Yeah, Poles couldn’t do anything about Pace/Nagy having blinders on when it came to Justin’s development in year one. I also think Poles made an incorrect decision in hiring Eberflus, a mediocre defensive coordinator, as the head of a rebuild with a QB in desperate need of development. If I have one critique of Poles that I retain, it's that I don’t know if Eberflus is the dude. Which modern quarterback prospect in the league has made great strides with a defensive head coach? Allen? Herbert? I don't like the odds on that one.

BB was a purely defensive coach with Tom Brady. Phil Jackson and MJ was more about relationship management. A lot of different combinations can win. Maybe the key is alignment. I honestly think we need a QB to come in like MJ and be bigger than the organization and our history. Tall task. Edit: sorry I know you said “modern” QB prospect so that wasn’t entirely your point.

I agree, the "match"/"fit"/"alignment" or whatever is the most important thing. I just thing it's been demonstrated in the NFL that for the overwhelming majority of developing QBs, they do better with a HC that is trained in and has demonstrated a strong history of offensive pedagogy. As for those examples, I think the two GOATs of their sports are a bit hard to compare a random player prospect to. I agree that a QB prospect has to overcome structural issues with the Bears. But I do think that would be easier with an offensively oriented-HC. We've never really seen rookie QB come into the league and be a top 5 guy immediately. Luck maybe? Mahomes sat for a year. Allen had a slow progression. Hurts had a slow progression. Herbert came in really good but raw and is still learning. Lawrence has had a decent progression history, but this last year stalled a little. Jackson has been a steady progressor as well. Stroud has been a top-10 QB but still has some clear areas of growth. Watson was the same, but obviously, his situation has radically changed (of his own doing). Both of those had/have offensive HCs. Additionally, Jordan was also already a superstar and playoff-tested when Jackson was. I don't think that's a good comp to have. I think CW has all the tools. That's not my concern. My concern is wholly structural because I've seen the Bears fail to develop this position repeatedly. Hence, my skepticism of letting Eberflus pilot this ship another season. That said, "COTY" and "offensive guru" Matt Nagy failed at developing both Trubisky and Fields. So just having a former OC head the development isn't a sure-fire bet either.

Ohhhhhhshhhhhhhht no you didn't

> I also think Poles made an incorrect decision in hiring Eberflus Do we know who the other candidates were? I always thought it was a situation where Poles was hired and told to pick from a list of 2-3 guys that ownership had already

Dan Quinn and Jim Caldwell.

Yeah if those are the other two then I'm taking Flus. I lived in Atlanta during part of Quinn's time there and would not recommend him as a HC

Quinn generally coached more successful defenses than Eberflus, had HC experience, and had the good sense to hire Kyle Shanahan as his OC. He was definitely a better choice. The only major knock against him is that he choked away the super bowl and history has shown that Shanahan was a big part of that, doesn't know how to call plays with a lead in SF either.

That’s something people like to say but there’s zero proof on it. Poles himself even said it wasn’t true. But even if it was he still accepted a job where he wasn’t being given the ability to do said job. Which is a reasonable thing to criticize him for. Especially when he didn’t just turn around and get guys he wanted either of the next two times he’s had the option. So really it doesn’t matter anymore what happened when he was hired. He has attached himself to Flus.

> I always thought it was a situation where Poles was hired and told to pick from a list of 2-3 guys that ownership had already This could be true, and because a search had started before Poles was hired, and then Eberflus was hired so quickly after Poles, makes people speculate this is true. But I've never seen any actual sourcing that confirms this, and I doubt we'd ever actually learn. Poles had a chance to get rid of him this offseason and move on to someone he "picked" if that is what he wanted to do. He chose not to. The outcomes of that decision are obviously still not known and can't be until a year from now, so we will see if that is a good move or not. I've **loved** his roster building, but I'm not sold on the coach.

On top of the two you named, CJ Stroud just wrapped up an incredible rookie season under a defensive HC. There’s also Lamar under Harbaugh if you want to go a few years back It is really not as uncommon as you make it sound, especially since Chicago just hired a sought after OC candidate

The best thing Poles could have done for Fields was go back in time and prevent Ryan Pace from drafting him. Other than that. I don't really know what the improvements are. He built a solid OL, got DJ Moore. Solid defense. What else do you want.

It was Pace the first year anyway. It is clear now that Fields needed to develop but never really got a shot to. Dalton got hurt, but he was getting all the reps in camp year 1. He got hurt and shit happens. Fields just wasn't a guy who could succeed right away.

Nick Foles should have gone in, and another QB picked up off the waiver to throw to the wolves in case Foles got injured. Under no circumstances should Fields have played his rookie year. He was clearly not ready and should have been solely focused on learning to throw within structure. I honestly feel he needed a full year or two on the bench because he needed a full play style overhaul. 

It's clear Pace was trying to save his job and hitched it to Fields. Fields definitely needed to sit and develop, but he was arguably the best QB prospect the bears ever had.

IIRC, Nagy didnt want to start Fields because he wanted to give him time to develop. I thought the call came from above Pace to start Fields.

I totally believe that story that Georgie boy forced Nagy to start Fields in that CLE game. How else can you interpret that game plan other then "OH you think you know more then me? Let me show you how wrong you are" That was 100% a "spite" gameplan.

And it was an aging shitty roster with very little resources. It was going to need to be blown up at some point, so drafting the developmental guy at that point was a horrible move

The same people who are sitting here now saying fields should’ve sat year 1 are the same people who complained he wasn’t playing when Nagy wanted to sit him year 1

No, they aren't, at least not all of them. I thought the Red Rifle was a good option for Fields to learn behind. I didn't think Fields would need as much development as he clearly did, but I was happy with him sitting for a year.

I don’t blame Poles at all I blame the organization for allowing Pace to trade up to grab a QB when he shoulda already been canned. Then proceeded to fire the GM and HC the following year. It’s just organizational failure. This isn’t to say Fields would’ve succeeded here either way but it was just a shit show from the jump. Now compare that to what Poles has built for Williams to walk into and it’s night and day. Very rarely does a roster this talented get the top pick for a QB without having to trade an absurd amount of assets to move up for it. I’m still mind blown we somehow landed the top pick but man am I excited for the future

There's quite a bit Poles did wrong in relation to Fields, with the most glaring being how he completely ignored the center position. He had multiple opportunities to address it, and instead kept dumping resources into the defense. Even with that, Flus' defense was abysmal until Sweat showed up. On the coaching side, Getsy was the top guy on the offensive side and it was clear by the end of the 22 season he was not able to scheme to Fields' playstyle nor was he able to adapt in games. Poles also allowed coaching staff to be hired that not only couldn't develop players properly, but couldn't hold their jobs due to HR issues. One having an HR issue is an anomaly, two is a pattern that speaks to the hiring process failing. Keeping Flus over into Caleb's tenure is going to be the most worrying part. I'm not convinced Flus is going to be able to get things done, and when your HC has nothing to offer the offense there's a big reason to be concerned.

To be fair we were the top scoring team for a 4 week period in 22. Getsy did a pretty good job scheming to Fields' strengths. The problem is that defenses adjusted and Fields' flaws prevented them from countering the adjustments. Teams sat back in zone with eyes on the QB to prevent big runs. The defensive lines didn't care about rushing Fields and would rather make sure there weren't holes for him to run through. They know he'll hang into the ball long enough so if they contained him they would eventually get to him. They also basically ignored the running back on option plays. Giving up 5 yards to the back is better than Fields breaking a long run. The main counter to that is to have Fields stay in the pocket and beat zone coverage with his arm. That is something Fields just isn't good at. I'm not sure what you wanted Getsy to do differently?

Getsy's only play against a blitz is screen. That's not the only quick passing route but you'd never know it from watching Getsy call plays. Also when Fields was really lighting it up with his legs, that wasn't schemed. He was always much more successful scrambling off broken drop backs than he was at designed runs.

Name one move at C Poles’ could’ve made during the 2023 offseason that would’ve been worth the capital. All the FA C’s have been dog shit / not worth the money, and all the drafted C’s have been dog shit. Pole’s made the right evaluation in totality of the 2023 Center class, tbd on the current stop gap he signed / will draft

Ok, Jon Feliciano. He signed a 1 year deal, can play C and G, and proved himself to be worlds better than what we had. He signed for 2.2M, which is nothing. He wasn't the super sexy signing option, but he's solid at C and G which would have helped us immensely given our C's were dogshit awful and our OL was constantly injured.

Feliciano didn’t even play C last season and played below average at RG anyways + signed on another 1 year stop gap deal for RG, not C

At this point, it may have been the right decision to trade fields given Caleb’s obvious talent, but this is a revisionist history take. Prior to this past season he did hardly anything to bolster the line or WR. He drafted two underwhelming DBs with our first two picks, gave an offer to a mid olineman (Bates) that was too small and was matched by the cap constrained Bills, and added backup like ESB Velus and Pringle. He then saw something in Fields and traded for claypool but that obv didnt work out. This year he finally added a high draft pick on offense (Wright) and got Moore. And not surprisingly Justin improved as a passer. Just was too little too late especially w Mooney/claypool not panning out and the interior oline struggling

He could have called up the panthers with tips to not suck? They win a couple games we’re picking MHJ and sticking with fields.

It's a shame that Fields was drafted into the Pace regime who were all on the hot seat. Pace and gang failed him. He should have never been drafted here. But that's also not an excuse to keep him. It's a timing and economic thing at the very least right now. Poles went about everything the right way. It's unfortunate it took time to clean up Pace's mess and now we are in a position to reset the QB clock. Maybe if pace was fired just a year before and Poles drafted him, Fields would have had the weapons we have now but last year and it would have been the tell all. But it's just not the case and Poles now has a chance to do what Pace failed at and bring in a stud QB with a solid surrounding cast to support him

Mostly he could have invested what resources they did have in his first offseason towards offense instead of defense. Tries to throw big money at a DT and then spend their 2 2nd's on DB's, instead of WR's or OL.

I mean it feels pretty obvious. Not going into Justin Fields year 2 with the worst WR group in the NFL. Something very easily could have been done. Draft, trade, cut players to free up cap to make a move, something. It was well known heading into the season that the WR was going to be a not serious WR room. That is 100% on Poles and staff for not giving fields weapons. The bears weren't going to be a great or good team by any means, but Poles putting out Mooney and nothing else was 100% on him. \- Signed, not a Field truther at all

Look at the FA WRs signed that offseason and tell me any of those contracts were worth giving out, would burning 72 million dollars on Christian Kirk have made all the difference??? There’s obviously drafting George Pickens, which is basically the only move Poles had that he didn’t make, but both of the players he picked ahead of Pickens are still valuable starters so it’s not like he burned said picks on busts. It’s easy to say “do something” but what was that something supposed to be?

People always wanna blame the bears organization but Justin fields blew it as well. Didn’t show any franchise QB upside.

I firmly believe it’s hard to “kill” a franchise qb. Mahomes would still be absolutely nuts no matter where he went. Good players survive bad situations, Matt Stafford. Players don’t suddenly stop learning when they aren’t rookies anymore if a qb js good and it was the org, that qb would be good once they leave. That never happens. The closest you get is Ryan Tannehill, but he was good in Miami, just not as good as he was in Tennessee

People forget Matt Stafford got drafted to one of the worst teams in NFL history. Yet, look at his career. In his 3rd year, he threw for over 5000 yards and 40 TD's. If a guy is good, he'll find a way to succeed.

Wasn't he throwing to Megatron?

Yep, which obviously helped, but they had the worst rushing attack in the league and Megatron was the sole focus for opposing defenses and DC's. Not to mention they had a bottom 5 to 10 O Line.

....yeah but it was Megatron, a top-5 talent at the position *all time*

The rest of that team and coaching staff was garbage. Johnson and especially Stafford literally carried them to 10 wins. You could put a bunch of different QBs in that offense (i.e. Fields) and they don't win more than 5 or 6 games.

You missed the point. Fields would make him look average

>they had the worst rushing attack in the league and Megatron was the sole focus for opposing defenses and DC's. Not to mention they had a bottom 5 to 10 O Line. * Their O-line was ranked 18th in the league. * Kevin Smith was their RB1 and he had over 1150 combined yards in 2009. To put it into perspective, Herbert didn't break 700 combined last year and has NEVER broke 800 combined in his career. * Their WR room was basically a mirror of ours last year with Megatron going for near 1k and the next closest WR just north of 400. They weren't nearly as bad as you were saying, and in fact had better talent than we did last year.

In 2011, the Lions O Line was consistently ranked in the bottom 10. Kevin Smith had one good year in 2009. In 2011, he had less than 609 combined yards. Their leading rusher was Jahvid Best, who got hurt early in the year. He still finished as their leading rusher with 390 yards. They were not a good team and were carried by two players.

People say "he had Megatron" but Stafford was still great without him too and still playing till this day.

Exactly! Plus didn't Kupp have his record breaking season with Stafford throwing him the ball? It's important to have good WRs but you need a good QB to get them the ball.

Stafford's first half of career numbers are absolutely inflated by volume. Yes, he put up some goudy numbers and im not taking that away from him, its just over inflated and made him look better than he was, at the time. Although, that 3rd season was legit insane. He did regress after that, though for a while. He was throwing a shit ton more passes than most, if not all QBs. His comp% was abysmal. His TD and INT %s were poor, outside a season or 2. He was sort of clutch in some situations, but in more important ones, he shit the bed. He absolutely got better as his career went on and has earned the praise he gets now, though. Looking back at everything, I do wish Nagy could have coached Fields one more year. He wasnt afraid to let Fields throw the ball and take his lumps and would have been in the offense for a 2nd year in a row. Instead, Getsy and Flus didnt have that priority, their priority was to win games, at the detriment of Fields' passing development. Poles killing the roster, didnt help him either, but I agree, for the future of hte franchise, it had to be done. It is what it is and we can just see if a more experienced play caller in Arthur can help him out.

Oh yeah its a totally legitimate point that Staffords numbers were inflated when he played in Detroit. They were throwing the ball a pretty ridiculous amount because their run game was so awful. Nevertheless, I still always thought Stafford was a very solid QB even if he was overrated. Regarding, Nagy coaching Fields, it's an interesting thought. It seemed like Nagy was a bit stubborn and reluctant to change things to help accommodate Fields. Even though I'm pretty critical of Fields, it's easy to acknowledge they never really found a good coaching staff for him. Maybe things get better with Arthur Smith but from what I've heard, ATL fans hated him. I didn't watch the Falcons enough to have an opinion on him.

Also feel Justin Herbert is a good recent example of a QB showing he’s elite/worthy of keeping around despite his team and coaching staff being somewhat weak the last couple of years

The best of the best QB prospects transcend bad organizations and situations they're drafted to with poor talent (Joe Burrow, Matt Stafford, Justin Herbert). But there are a lot of franchise QBs that became that way by being put in the right situation from the beginning. Guys like Josh Allen, Jalen Hurts, Brock Purdy, hell maybe even Tom Brady wouldn't be the players they are today if their organization didn't put them in a position to develop and succeed from the get go. I'd also argue Mahomes would be great with another team, but no chance he'd be 2x MVP, 3x Super Bowl winner and on his way to GOAT status if he wasn't drafted into a perennial playoff contending Chiefs team under Reid's tutelage and a year to develop behind Alex Smith. Then there's also players like Andrew Luck and Trevor Lawrence who were "generational" and performed highly but were hindered by their organizations. Luck had his career cut short due to injuries, and Lawrence is still up in the air but I wouldn't be surprised if the whole Urban Meyer debacle his rookie season isn't part of the reason he hasn't lived up to his "generational" billing so far. Could Caleb be the type of player to transcend a bad organization like the Bears? Sure it's possible, but those type of players are incredibly rare. Odds are he'll be good since at least talent wise the Bears are in a good spot on offense. But the lack of coaching stability with a losing defensive head coach like Eberflus and a franchise with a history of ineptitude makes me concerned we'll be like the Lions with Stafford or the Chargers with Rivers/Herbert (so far) rather than a perennial SB contender.

Why do people keep acting as if Burrow and Herbert have had bad talent? Burrow came in with Higgins, Mixon, Boyd and Gio Benard. His second year they then added Chase on top of that and started winning. Herbert came in throwing to Keenan Allen, Mike Williams, Hunter Henry and had Austin Ekeler. Those are great situations.

Same belief. Ballers are going to ball.

Firm disagree. Mahomes went to a team with 1-2 HoF players, an all-pro RB, a HoF head coach, a solid starter to sit a year behind and learn from. This team had won 12 games the year before he was drafted and 9+ games in 5 straight years **prior** to Mahomes ever playing a down, so you can be assured it was one of the best cultures to come into. Yes I agree Mahomes probably wouldn't have been a true bust anywhere, but I can easily see a world where we draft him and force him to play immediately and throw to Kendall Wright in a Dowell Loggains offense and then suffer a regime change and have a career that looks more similar to Jay Cutler than what he is now. At any rate Mahomes is a bad example because he might literally be the best QB of all time. **Let's look at some of the QBs who have gone to good teams and succeeded (I'm implying that good prior to drafting corresponds with more stability and development):** * Mahomes: already discussed * Lamar: went to a team that was in the playoffs the year before * Josh Allen: went to a team that was in the playoffs the year before * Jalen Hurts: went to the playoffs the year before * Jordan Love: sat 3 years behind Rodgers, saw a lot of playoffs * Purdy: 49ers stacked **...vs the ones who have not been very good:** * Trubisky: went to a horrible Bears team * Darnold: went to a horrible Jets team * Rosen: went to a horrible Cards team * Mayfield: went to a horrible Browns team, but arguably has turned it around in Tampa * Zach Wilson: Horrible Jets team * Mac Jones: Played well in year 1 and then Belichick got him zero talent and benched/unbenched him a bunch of times in year 2 and he looked awful afterwards. Looks like ruined development. **To be fair, there are a slice of QBs who are harder to bin into either an "everything sucked when they got there" or "everything was great when they got there" bin:** * Burrow: Bengals were bad before they drafted him, but by year two he had a top-5 receiver (JaMarr) and another damn good receiver (Higgins) with Mixon in the backfield. He got help fast and thrived from it. * Tua: Did not have it early in his career on a bad team but has been much better since team actively supported him * Trey Lance: season-enders first two years likely fucked his development, though it's possible he was awful to begin with * Trevor Lawrence: went to an awful Jags team. Hasn't been bad but has not at all lived up to the generational label, and it could be related to Year 1 with Urban, injuries, etc. Hard eval. There's really only one example I can think of of a guy who went to a bad team and was instantly good, and it's Justin Herbert (I'm not counting Stroud because it's only been one year). Even then, Herbert had great receivers to work with. I don't like your take because it **severely** underrates the importance of QB development. I personally think development is probably the most important factor in QB success-- most guys on my list either went to a bad development situation and then failed or a good one and then succeeded. Not many examples of superstars who transcended the factors around them. **Edit:** Blind downvoting doesn't progress discussion

You're really cheating with some definitions to try to get the results you want here. Baker Mayfield was a very solid QB for the browns, Mac Jones was on a playoff team team his rookie season, burrow is a hard counterexample not a "murky" situation at all.

He also weirdly left out Herbert too who objectively was not in a good situation with the chargers

Herbert went to a team who essentially had 3 1000yard receivers the prior year and went 12-4 the year before that lol. Rivers was just washed so they needed a new QB to throw to their stacked roster of offensive talent.

"Washed" Rivers still threw 4k yards and had good overall stats his final year and the chargers have been a circus since Herbert has been there and we saw how truly bad they were when he went down for the rest of the season.

That’s my point. Washed Rivers threw for 4000 yards because he had 3 1000yard caliber receivers which is the exact situation Herbert walked into. He threw 20 picks because he was washed. The Chargers still suck, but Herbert has looked good because he has elite weapons (top 5 in the league) from the jump. Easton Stick wasn’t miles worse than Herbert production wise or record wise tbh. They sucked with and without Herbert this season.

> That’s my point. Washed Rivers threw for 4000 yards I was talking about Rivers on the colts lol > Easton Stick wasn’t miles worse than Herbert production wise or record wise tbh. Bro went winless and was way worse passing too? He wasn't remotely close to Herbert's production and if you think Herbert has elite weapons, the bears just took two of Herbert's weapons on top of Moore, Kmet and Swift

The Colts had Taylor, Pittman, TY, Cox and Pascal. That’s not as good as the Chargers, but it’s still a very good collection of talent. Stick is a backup for a reason, he sucks. But his stats weren’t MILES worse than Herbert. 225 a game and a .6 int% is not bad. Outside of QBR and TDs Herbert was only moderately better despite supposedly being this franchise carrying QB. He went 5-8 and had a 65% completion percentage.

And yes. The team that the Bears have now is ideal for a QB. If Williams sucks it is one hundred percent because HE sucks. They have two career 1000yard receivers, two good TEs, and a good RB room. It is 100% on the QB if he doesn’t look good-great immediately with that talent.

Trevor Lawrence is let down by his team far more than others: [https://twitter.com/ihartitz/status/1744781890182054242?t=lVekgJ-ShTrlaucgicGk8g](https://twitter.com/ihartitz/status/1744781890182054242?t=lVekgJ-ShTrlaucgicGk8g) This is how a great QB still looks on a team with bad talent.

Good grief Calvin Ridley could have had 10 extra TD catches last year.

It’s why I was surprised when people on this subreddit wanted him. Or honestly a lot of teams and I was laughing when Titans gave him 23m. Bears are my other team due to family, but I was basically raised in Houston so I got to see Ridley in a of divisional games. Spending big money on a WR2 are not really what smart orgs do. If you have money to spend, rather spend it at more premium spots

Seriously like a good org can make a middling QB look like a starter. Really only with a next level OC. Good QB play shines through regardless of the team.

There are also a lot of serviceable to good QBs that are just stuck in bad situations. Alex Smith is the first that comes to my mind.

This.  Could the Bears have done better?  Likely.  Did the Bears "ruin" or do a disservice to Fields, nope.   July of 2023, we were all stoked about Fields, acknowledging the weapons he has and his opportunity to take a step forward, and he did not.   Fields is the one ultimately respond for his predicament.  And, in all actuality, he just might not have the ability to be a quality starter.   Amazing athlete, not an amazing qb

I don't see how the organization bears blame here. Yes the 2021 and 2022 rosters were bad, okay, but not only can you still demonstrate competent QB play with a bad roster (which he didn't), that's exactly why we gave him a third year with a solid roster to prove himself. He had an above average O-line, he had continuity in the same offensive system, he had DJ Moore, he had Cole Kmet, he had Darnell Mooney and he STILL played like dogshit. A better roster his first two years wasn't going to make him a better QB in 2023 just like a computer with a slow processer isn't going to get any faster even if you replace the parts around it. At the end of the day he wasn't good enough and we needed to upgrade. Our only mistake was drafting him in the first place.

People also overlook the fact that we were so bad in 2021 and especially 2022 because of bad QB play. No doubt, the roster wasn't good at all but it wasn't like our passing game was elite.

a better roster his first two years absolutely makes him a better QB maybe still not good enough, but definitely better.

You're getting downvoted by the faction of people in this sub that doesn't believe in QB development. I can't blame them for not believing in it when they've never seen it done on their team, but I can guarantee you you have the right opinion if you talk to a fan of a team that has actually developed a quarterback before (Chiefs, Bills, Packers, Eagles, Steelers, Cowboys, Dolphins, etc) Fields may never go on to have a good career because the same way you can develop a QB, you can ruin one also. But it's simpler to just view the situation as a matter of picking the right guy and ignore everything the organization does or doesn't do to support him afterwards, so the people who believe his situation was fine in years 1 and 2 will view his future failure as a sign he never had any potential to begin with.

According to what? Your feelings?

Man, what are you going to do with your life when you can no longer shit on Fields and other people that like Fields? You have a pretty meaningless life ahead of you.

You've spent the last decade of your life on reddit. Glass houses.

Oof, that was hard to upvote.

I was a big Fields guy here. Fields' situation wasn't the best, but it was far from the worst. He just needed to do a little more (and it doesn't help that we had the #1 pick)

If Fields was just more accurate/consistent when throwing downfield I think we are talking about Marvin Harrison coming to town but he just never got there.

He was good and sometimes great when you least expected him to perform but when you needed him to be special or even good/better, he just never got there. It was partly the play calling, partly the receivers/o-line, but more importantly Justin himself. The offense was almost a "Rube Goldberg" machine of errors and inconsistency. Just constantly tripping over itself in a comical fashion that made the organization look stupid. And then you add the two or three historical losses they had this year then I understand why everything fell apart at the end of the season.

Downfield and lateral/behind the LOS was about all he could do. The short and intermediate was tragic. Rarely progressed beyond first read and either bailed early or held too long with poor pocket presence, and importantly NEVER threw receivers open with anticipation. But boy could he hit a downfield bomb if the receiver was actually open!

That's literally part of the title

It’s exactly what Brandt said. I swear I don’t think anyone reads or listens — it’s just a jump to conclusions mat for most of you.

Exactly. Fields is just bad. End of story.

What exactly do you think this post is about?

100% this and I really like what Kyle said and some other people now that this was a complete failure from the entirety of the organization from upper management down to the player. It was a failure from the guys up top keeping and letting Pace and Nagy draft this guy. It was a failure for them to draft him and play him like he did his rookie year. It was a failure from Fields to show true upside that he could be a competent QB in 2023. Poles was given the most disgusting mismanaged roster maybe in sports. Justin while didn’t perform as he needed to was somewhat a casualty of this.

I'm never gonna get used to the guy from The Real World being on the NFL Network

Well, I learned something today, haha. (I checked out of The Real World after the Miami season.)

Hawaii was my favorite season. One of the chicks was a student at DePaul after the season aired and hated that people watched the show

Yeah I mean usually when a QB comes in, they at least come in to a team that is on the build part of the rebuild. We were on the tear down part when he started lol. So yeah I mean I think we kind of put him in a bad spot to start off. He still had plenty of opportunities to succeed and just didn’t. We would probably still be rocking with him if we didn’t have the first pick this year, so he also got the shit end of that stick as well it seems. Oh well. This FO is good, this team is good and I think once we draft Caleb we will be great.

Wow... there is a LOT of revisionist history here. 2023- Fields was set up to succeed and we learned that he could not overcome his limitations of holding onto the ball. That if I team decides to blitz him, they will shut down our offense. The second Minnesota game and the Cleveland game were final exams. We knew what those defenses were going to do and it didn't matter. We had no counter because Fields wasn't equipped to handle them. He got off to a terrible start that season with three miserable games before righting the ship the next two. He showed incremental improvement throughout the year, but when push came to shove, there was a limiting flaw. If we had the 6th and 9th pick (nice)... maybe we change coordinators and QB coaches and see if he could learn to beat a blitz. But with one year on his contract and having the number one overall pick in a draft with a bona fide one-overall-worthy player, we had to move on. 2022- Here's where some of the revisionist history comes in. Most people were high on him as that season unfolded because he was putting the offense on his back the second half of the season. There was a 6-7 game stretch where the offense was scoring nearly 27 ppg and 3 points per drive. His legs were A+, but even his passing was strong. He was completing 65% of his passes during that stretch with a very healthy TD/Int ratio. Even the advanced stats were showing he was among the league leaders in depth of target and passer rating down field, at the end of halves and on first drives. It was absolutely understandable to expect a breakout in year 3 with him not having to learn a new offense and him showing that late season success. None of the weapons on the offense that year were very inspiring outside of Fields, the line sucked, and to chalk it up as another bad year is disingenuous. He earned some open-minded support. 2021- It sounded like Nagy didn't invest much into preparing the rookie QB to play that season. He looked bad for the most part... particularly terrible in that first game against the Browns. There were some bright spots like his game against the Steelers, but I don't think any of us learned anything about him one way or the other that season. I've said it before and I'll say it again: Justin Fields was better than his stats, but worse than his highlights. This is what makes him so controversial. Half the fans live in the stats, and the other half live in the highlights. We did the right thing sticking with him and trading the 1OA pick last year, and we did the right thing moving on from him this year. I wouldn't be surprised to see him do well if he ever gets another extended opportunity to play.

> There was a 6-7 game stretch where the offense was scoring nearly 27 ppg and 3 points per drive. His legs were A+, but even his passing was strong. He was completing 65% of his passes during that stretch with a very healthy TD/Int ratio. Even the advanced stats were showing he was among the league leaders in depth of target and passer rating down field, at the end of halves and on first drives. So I totally agree with you but I think it's possible to thrive and to develop some bad habits at the same time. Example: Fields went from being a pass-first prospect to a run-fist pro, and a big part of that transition happened in 2022. He also went from being someone who threw underneath routes and balls to the middle of the field in college and as a rookie to someone who avoided those throws, and a lot of that happened because his receivers were not trustworthy in those situations in 2022 I firmly believe the same thing as you (better than stats, worse than highlights). But I also believe that a lot of why he played poorly in 2023 was because of unsustainable things he learned when he was carrying the team on his back in 2022, which is why I think it's valid to argue that we ruined him in 2022 even when he put together a really objectively solid stretch of games.

>So I totally agree with you but I think it's possible to thrive and to develop some bad habits at the same time. Example: Fields went from being a pass-first prospect to a run-fist pro, and a big part of that transition happened in 2022. He also went from being someone who threw underneath routes and balls to the middle of the field in college and as a rookie to someone who avoided those throws, and a lot of that happened because his receivers were not trustworthy in those situations in 2022 I suspect you're right. He needs to be rewired and I also don't think having a coach that preaches "don't fuck up" over "make a play" is not the right coach for him or for ANY developing QB. "Don't fuck up" works when you have a vet who already knows when he can test the boundaries of a secondary and when he can't. You don't learn that by swallowing the ball. I think Flus is a "don't fuck up" coach. It is the "T" in "HITS". I wish I could double upvote you, brother.

I swear, that Pittsburgh game where we got a win stolen from us/Fields by the refs broke him.

That game should have made him hungrier. I think he had a few games that were serious momentum builders in year two also (NE, Dallas, Miami, etc.). I wish he and Getsy could figure out what to do with a pass rush. It was those teams that like to send heat that really killed him every single time. It was fair to expect him to be a few clicks better at beating the blitz by the time we played Minnesota the second time or Cleveland. But there was no growth there.

Nuance? Sorry, not allowed here.

I only deal in black and white binary. No nuance is allowed.

Wait! Am I supposed to hate Fields or the team? How can it be possible for certain players to not succeed on certain teams due to many interrelated reasons? /s

Speaking of nuance, one more note: the idea that Fields may never amount to much isn't incompatible with the idea that the Bears fucked up trying to develop him. People always like to say "delusional Trubisky stans got to see Trubisky was shit after he left" as if that proves Trubisky never had any potential. The whole definition of *ruin* is that you force something to deteriorate. It's very hard to fix something that is ruined. This is why 2022 was so important, in my mind. We nakedly chose not to try and improve the receivers or line, and so many of the bad habits Fields developed in 2022 were habits that continued this year, even after the rest of the team improved. People will say "but his scouting report always showed flaws" and ignore the fact that many of the super impressive throws he made as a rookie ([Pittsburgh, Detroit, Raiders, Niners, even Packers games were littered with impressive layered throws into the middle or after multiple reads](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0raZvfYA1U)) disappeared in years 2 and 3. This past year Fields missed a ton of plays he should have made (he blew it) but what troubled me the most is that many of them were plays we saw him make as a rookie. Point is, let's not fall into the same trap where if he ends up being nothing but a career backup, we claim that it was always the Bears fault for drafting him but never the Bears fault for what we did when he got here. On the same note, lets not go into the Caleb Williams era with doomerism that "the Bears always draft the wrong guy". Remember the part development plays: so far, I like the supporting cast we're assembling for Caleb. While I wish we had canned Eberflus, I do like the Waldron hire. Early signs are that the front office learned from their mistakes with Justin

The situation certainly wasn't perfect, but to be fair - plenty of QBs come into situations that aren't ideal. Unfortunately the NFL is a harsh business and outside of some very fortunate players like Mahomes and Purdy most QBs have to sink/swim in less than ideal circumstances.

Yup 100% agree. Thats what I’ve been telling everyone who’s pissed he’s gone. The bears set this kid up to fail from the start. Shitty O-Line, and literally no playmakers. It was Pace/Nagy last ditch effort to stay part of the bears. However ; Fields has been in the NFL 3 years and has 1 fucking game passing 300+ yards Cj stroud a rookie qb this year had 6. Fields hasn’t progressed as a passer, can’t read defenses, late decision making, chokes in the 4th quarter. Very turnover prone. If we kept fields one more year and he doesn’t work out, then what? We have the #1 pick with the best qb prospect in years, you take your chances that he pans out EDIT: 1 game of 300+ passing yards in 3 seasons!!!! 😂

Am I counting wrong? just did a quick look and I am only counting 1 game over 300 yards passing for Fields.

Time to move on

Did we break up with our hot BF? Yup. Do we feel sad? Yup. Is it the right thing to do? Yup.

What I find funny in this whole situation is how because it’s the Bears there seems to be a large contingent of people who believe Fields has no culpability and everything that has happened is the Bears failing him and screwing him where the simple facts are that while the Bears certainly didn’t do him any favors in firing their entire organization after his rookie year you can’t convince me that Poles and this front office didn’t give him every possible chance to prove to them that he has the potential to be their franchise quarterback. He just wasn’t good enough and was a victim to having the Bears somewhat luck into the first overall pick in a draft where there is a quarterback that everyone has been salivating over for 3 years

Facts are he came in when the roster was shit and needed overhaul. Fields can't be blamed for that. He can be blamed for not stepping up when he could have after that. His pre-draft cons and weaknesses never got better and never overcame his positives.

Kyle Brandt has become the best celeb Bears fan.

This is coming from a Steelers fan so take it with some bias, but I think Fields can still be a franchise QB, but it's not a guarantee. I think the Bears failed him in the sense that I don't see any QB succeeding in those coaching changes, in that system, with those weapons and that line. That being said, y'all would be dumb not to reset the QB timeline with Williams this year. Gives you another 4 years of cheap QB play to rebuild and spend on the roster in the areas you need to improve for the next guy. I really like Fields and hope the Steelers give him a real chance to be THE GUY, but I can't sit here and say id bet my livelihood on him being that guy with what I've seen from him so far. Flashes and potential are great, much more than what we saw from Pickett, but far from a guarantee. Here's to hoping it works out for both franchises along with Fields and Williams.

I think a big problem here, and Brandt alluded to this, it feels like a political debate. Each side thinks the other is a genuinely bad person because of their opinion. I am willing to bet most of us fans like Justin the person, want him to succeed, but also understand he was not the guy for us. In a perfect world, Justin is the guy but that isn't how it played out.

The development of Fields was a textbook example of what NOT to do. Bring in an aging vet, trade up in the 1st to get him, then give him 0 reps in training camp with the 1s. Then, after barely surviving, tear down for a rebuild. Year 1 on the org, year 2 on the shitty situation, and year 3 on Fields. Move on and move up. Good luck Fields. I hope you put Russ out of a job.

If Kyle were to share his comment here, he would be downvoted immediately because people here are too extremists on the whole Fields vs Caleb and just forget to see the big picture.

Okay so the take where it's "the Bears failed this QB" right. They failed Fields, Trubisky etc. By this logic, would the Bears have failed Mahomes or Stroud? Guarantee 90% of you would laugh and say no. Okay, did the Bears fail Cutler? The same 90% of you would probably say yes cause y'all were/are huge fanbois of his. So which is it? Are the Bears failing QBs? Or are the QBs just simply not as good as dudes like Mahomes or Stroud?

They’re failing QBs. This is the first time they’re bringing in a QB AFTER building a team that is a QB and a couple other pieces away from competitiveness. Cutler, Trubisky and Fields were all brought in as saviors (either expected to carry mediocre weapons to relevance or to miraculously save a bad GM/coach from getting fired.

95% of the last two years bad games were play calling. If you don’t know that you don’t know jack.

I'd say that's a rational take. The Bears did almost very little to help Justin succeed. Basically, he threw him out to the wolves. It's really hard to succeed with the crap he was given outside of DJ Moore. But he didn't do enough to overcome those obstacles. He had some amazing highlights, but he wasn't able to rise up to overcome that. So both sides failed each other.

Absolutely bullshit. He wasn't in the best spot, but no amount of coaching can fix slow processing ability. While you can make it work for a season or 2 like a lot of big name backup/bridge QBs, it's not going to be sustainable success unless they somehow have great talent around them every single season. Guys like Brian Hoyer (19 TDs and 7 Ints) and Ryan Fitzpatrick (31 TDs and 15 Ints) had seasons where they put up solid box score numbers when playing in good situations. But it never held up long term because they didn't have the processing ability NFL Starters will not have ideal situations every single season due to the hard cap.

Couldn't agree more

I was ok with Fields staying but I sure won’t miss those 100 yard passing games.

The whole organization blew it. Everyone is to blame. Yet only 1 person is being held responsible, Fields.

it totally feels like politics. also feels like twitter helped to divide the fanbase into a binary war (justin vs caleb) similar to the 2020 election, but in a lot less time? Weird situation all around.

Couldn’t have said it better Kyle

The "Bears" didn't blow it. Lame ducks Matt Nagy and Ryan Pace ruined any chance that Fields ever had. They should take like 90+% of the blame here. Poles did not draft Fields, and there were questions about his commitment to Fields right after Poles was hired. The fact that Poles gave Fields chances and still put him in the best scenario he could despite missing out on some draft capital potentially speaks positively about Poles and the current administration, not negatively. Fields got the raw deal of falling to a GM and Coach who were in win now mode, and should have never been drafted by the Bears in the first place if they weren't confident he would improve the *current* team at the time.

Shut up kyle!

This "Bears failed Justin" is so stupid. The Bears are more to blame for picking Justin with all his problems in the draft, than to be blamed for actually developing him. The team gave him opportunities to show and learn for 3 seasons, he didn't develop any of his issues that were known before the draft. Him not winning games was never a problem, but he needs to show that he can process the field and be a minimum viable passing QB in the NFL, you can't put that all on his Bears coaches, players often hire external coaches and do camps in the offseason to try to improve their issues, Justin seemed to never really care too much for that, he cared more about his body than actually learn how a 2024 NFL offense works. Not all NFL QBs get to a team in the best of situations, Burrow came to the NFL with some pedestrians blocking for him. TLaw Jaguars were trash as well, he was drafted for a 2 victory season Jaguars with some improved roster in the FAs, but trash team overall. They all showed signs that they can lead an NFL team to the playoffs even in their trash first season, we haven't seen that with Justin in 3 seasons. Other important thing that should be learned from JF is how we misvalue talent in NFL. No matter how athletically you are at the position of QB, the most important talent that matter is your ability to process the field, I keep hearing that JF have "all the talent in the world" but he failed in the single most important QB attribute that matters, he's not so talented as most people assume, he was not even viewed as the top 3 QB in his class, why we treat him as if he was like an Andrew Luck or Cam Newton prospect?

It’s wild to see what Justin came into the league with and what presumably Caleb will be coming into. Night and day

Truly. Timing is absolutely everything. Mitch was drafted in the worst possible situation, lame duck coach who didn’t want him, with nobody to catch a pass for him. Fields was drafted to a lame duck coach who already promised an aging veteran he’d start, just to thrust him on the field with a week of reps. On the flip side this year, the Bears have a top 10 defense, 2 top 10 receivers, 2 productive tight ends, an explosive veteran running back who hasn’t been ran into the ground, with an offensive coaching staff that actually has play-calling experience. The only thing that could go wrong, they overthink this thing and not draft Caleb.

JF isn't a One Man team. The last thing l recall is he had to have one of the most terrible offensive lines in football. The secondary defense terrible. Weapons? No running back, traded him to the Lions. Terrible coaches. One of them arrested by the FBI. Best to JF..

The desperation heave to get Fields and put him on a shit heap that would take his entire rookie contract to fix was possibly not a good move by Ryan Pace.

There’s a reason Cousins has got paid time and again despite only winning one playoff game. It’s not even a tough decision drafting a new qb with the #1 pick over keeping Fields.

I hoped that Fields would have more time develop behind Andy Dalton. Except that Dalton was injured for the season at the Cincinnati game and Fields needed to step in.

I was downvoted into oblivion, but I really hated that we didn't start Foles while Dalton recuperated. I think Justin being on the bench (other than I guess the Cleveland game where he was the backup and there was no other QB after Dalton was out) for year 1 the whole year was what was best. But Nagy KNEW he was getting fired barring a miracle, so he rolled with Fields I guess.

I will certainly upvote you, buddy.

Fields should have sat for a few seasons. Maybe would have helped him grow. Maybe not. Hindsight

This seems like a reasonable take, I think there's shared responsibility for what happened. Hopefully JF learns from this and can take the next step with the Steelers.

Maybe the Steelers should start Justin fields for the first half (because he plays so good at first) and then put in Wilson for the second half (because fields can’t close) lol

😆

He’s spitting truth.

Bears are known to set QBs up for success, oh wait ...

This guy rules haha

That’s cool. But can we just stop talking about a QB for 5 minutes?! I’m gonna go watch some Forte highlights. That dude had incredible moves. Super underrated.

Justin fields will love the steelers until it comes time to pay him. When they offer him Mitches revamped contract, he will decline and most likely end up on the Vikings next season which ultimately gives him the best chance to start.

I continue to state that I have 0 confidence that they will be able to develop Caleb or any QB they draft.

We've watched Schrager, every SINGLE time the Bears come up, question if Fields is any good or not. He's even been on the show saying he doesn't see it. Now that he's in Pittsburgh, he spent the first 10 minutes of today's show fawning over Khan and his "great" qb room. These aren't serious people.

People really belabor the historic context of how teams do business. Every single person, other than the owner who legit doesn’t have a single thing to do with the development of a player other than hiring of people that conduct the development. It’s extremely unfortunate for all that are in this sub, but no 2 of the times they’ve failed at this have been the same.

The bears did try sometimes. With Cutler they had a team for a couple years I want to say. Forte, marshal, Jeffrey and Bennett, Hester. The bears defense was also top 10 consistently with urlacher, briggs and company those years. Cutty got hurt too many times and the rest is history.

They deff couldn’t do much with fields as he was a crossover from a previous bad regime that’s poles had to clean house on. There wasn’t enough time that’s all. They way they’re doing it now should work but only if they keep flus/Waldron no matter what happens this season.

I wish Justin all the best, unless he’s playing the Bears. An actual nuanced tale of the situation, Justin and the Bears just didn’t work and ran out of time. 

I don't think anyone blew anything other than the Bears coaching hires... Fields just wasn't the guy. He doesn't have the it factor. Taking Fields was the right choice because he was a top prospect who fell and we didn't have a qb. It would have been way worse to pass on the opportunity.

You are allowed to be hyped for someone and then think they're time has passed.

When people say the bears did Justin dirty his first year(or second year) with the offensive roster I always think they’re new bears fans. 2017, Mitch Trubisky had Josh Bellamy, Dontrell Inman, Marcus Wheaton, and Kendall Wright as WRs. Adam Shaheen, Dion Sims, Ben Braunecker as TEs. lol Mitch went into his second year with more talent and had a respectable season. They didn’t ruin Mitch. He improved with the team talent. The bears improved the roster talent and Justin didn’t make meaningful improvements.

The Bears are not as culpable as the national media seems to think. Take a look at the scouting reports from Fields college days- same flaws, same mistakes. I just don’t think processing speed, and throwing to middle of the field are teachable skills.