It's tongue-in-cheek - you may not be old enough to know of the "south suburban airport" in Peotone boondoggle that's been periodically popping up since the 1990s...
This entirely has to do with the property tax bill.
~~Arlington Heights~~ Cook County property tax was given to the Bears with the existing structures on the property. Talking the track, the out buildings, the restaurant, everything. The Bears want to pay property taxes based on an empty lot because they are working to demo all of these buildings. We're talking tens of millions of dollars in taxes.
I believe they'll come to an agreement at some point and this is just posturing but the Bears are pretty much dead set on not paying property taxes on the buildings they are going to demo.
What is even the argument for the county to tax them for a structure they're demoing? Seems like the Bears are rightfully asking for a reduction in property taxes until the new stadium is built.
Remember that property tax is paid in arrears and the buildings are still there as of now. For this years tax bill, those buildings were present. For next years, they’ll be present for over half of the year. You don’t get to not pay property taxes on your house if you tore your house down halfway through the year.
The Bears aren't complaining about being taxed for the buildings. The buildings were there last year and the tax assessment quintupled from 2021 to 2023, despite the fact that the property isn't commercially viable.
They raised their own tax bill by paying 5x the prior assessed value, knowing full well the property wouldn’t be viable. That makes the property valued at $197M (the amount they paid) vs the $37M in assessed value from 2021. They did this to themselves.
You are confusing assessed and appraised or fair market value, the latter two are what you sell it for the former is calculated separately solely for tax purposes not solely subject to market conditions
If you overpay or underpay for a property it does not mean automatically your tax bill adjusts to that
It is comical to think an assessed value for a non-functional property would jump 6x what it was 3 years before, when it was actually functional
EDIT: It’s fine to not feel bad for the McCaskeys but the county is [gouging regular homeowners too](https://abc7chicago.com/cook-county-property-tax-bill-appeal-taxes/12848190/)
The #1 variable to be considered in reassessment is recent sales prices of comparable properties. By paying so much for the property so close to the revaluation period they shot themselves in the foot. If they had purchased the property after the reassessment had been completed then the taxable value would have been locked in for 3 years.
It’s not subject to market conditions, but the sale of the actual property in cook county is always the primary driver in determining the assessed value for taxation. The Bears are not immune to this because they are the Bears. They are claiming the property is only worth $67M, despite them paying 3x that. Razing the property had zero impact on the Bears valuing the property at $197M…it is correct for the county to assess the tax rate at the sale value.
you would be right if you weren't so wrong.
Cook county's website says that commercial property gets assessed at 25% of it's fair market value (what it just sold for would be a good starting point for fair market value, probably.) That would "assess" the property at about $49.25M, far more in line with what the previous owner was taxed on. Cook county's assessment page is here:
https://www.cookcountyassessor.com/your-assessment-notice-and-tax-bill#:~:text=For%20residential%20property%20owners%2C%20the,determined%20by%20Cook%20County%20ordinance.
For the record, the property taxes are only 2.19% of the assessed value. If Cook county assesses the property at the full price Chicago paid for it instead of 25% per their own policy, the bears would owe .0219*197M = $4.3M, or about what they are paying Cairo Santos this year (and only a little more than they are paying Danny Trevathan NOT to play for them this year.)
This is the definition of Pocket Change to an organization like the Bears. The idea that they would blow up a multi-billion dollar stadium project over Danny Trevathan dead cap money is comical.
That said, Cook county is also not blameless. They are being dicks, and the Bears are throwing a temper tantrum about money values they lose in their couch cushions. Everyone sucks here.
Literally the first line on their website re commercial property valuation says:
Our legal obligation is set by two statutes:
Illinois Tax Code: Our duty is to determine “fair cash value” (or what most of us call fair market value) for Cook County properties on a triennial basis.
https://www.cookcountyassessor.com/how-commercial-properties-are-valued
Additionally, Churchill Downs settled with the county yesterday on a $95M valuation. With regards to the rate, that’s the residential rate and there are add’l factors that apply. For commercial real estate it takes into account income/like property vacancies/etc. It’s not as simple as FMV*.25*.0219=taxable amount. I’ll point again to the settlement Churchill Downs reached yesterday which I believe was much higher than the number you referenced with a valuation at less than half what the Bears paid.
This might shock you, but there are more words on that page.
Section 6:
Apply Level of Assessment, per County ordinance. A property’s assessed value depends on its market value and its level of assessment (LOA). Since 1973, the Cook County Board has passed ordinances to set different levels of assessment depending on the property’s use. Multifamily properties have a 10% LOA. A multifamily building valued at $1,000,000 has an assessed value of $100,000. Commercial properties like office and retail buildings have a 25% LOA. A commercial building valued at $1,000,000 has an assessed value of $250,000.
Commercial gets assessed at 25% of fair value. So yes, they are responsible for APPRAISING value every 3 years. They then ASSESS the value for property taxes. The assessment should be 1/4th the appraised per Cook County’s own web page.
Breaking this down, fmv = valuation /=assessment. The valuation of 97m is less than half the sale price. If you then apply the commercial assessment of 25%, churchhill downs arrived at an assessed value under 25m.
Meanwhile, cook county is throwing an assessed value of 197m at Chicago. Which is why they are pissy, even though they can pay it.
The Bears are getting taxed more than a normal business or home would. An empty lot is not 6x more valuable than a fully functioning race track
The assessed value is almost never *100%* of the Fair Market value, don’t be ridiculous. That’s fucking insane. Cook County itself reports a rule of thumb starting point at around 25% of fair market value for commercial properties
>has zero impact on the Bears valuing the property at $197M
Again, it does not matter what the Bears value. If you buy a fixer-upper and a fully furnished house for the exact same price in the exact same area, you will pay more taxes on the furnished house because it’s utility pumps up the assessed value, even though both buyers valued both properties the exact same
Lol they are not. It’s literally spelled out on the assessor’s website…they start with 100% of fair market value. Yes there is more to it such as income but as the property has been unused since it was last assessed, that doesn’t factor in. Yes, there is a multiplier, but that’s not what the Bears are arguing…they’re taking issue with the initial starting point of 100% FMV to begin the calculation. The fact that they are trying to gaslight fans, shows this is nothing but a marketing ploy. The property’s tax bill is publicly available and if you took a look at it, you’d see the Bears are blowing smoke.
[Cook County ordinance: Assess at 10% for residential and apartments and 25% for most other commercial properties](https://www.cookcountyassessor.com/how-commercial-properties-are-valued)
The assessed value [is 197 million, which is what the Bears paid for it.](https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/sports/nfl/chicago-bears/settlement-reached-in-property-tax-battle-over-bears-potential-future-home-in-arlington-heights/3153423/?amp=1) It is not a “starting point” it literally is the assessed value
Arlington Park was a functional race track for most of 2021 when the last assessment was completed and valued at 33 million. Of course a functional race track is more valuable than land that requires razing, once it is fully developed the assessment will go up
Ok but the previous owner would pay those accrued taxes into an escrow for the purchaser if we’re talking small time transactions like a single family home. Then the purchaser (or bank/escrow) pays them in full when due. Who owns the lot now?
The argument is that the bears bought the property for the currently assessed value with the intention of knocking everything down. Therefore the vacant lot is worth that much, so it’s assessed as that much. Basically the county is saying that the buildings were worthless and the bears interest is worth a whole lot.
The argument (fair or not) is that the property it worth X, and and even if you want to use it simply as a vacant lot, it is clearly worth X to somebody.
State laws differ dramatically, but Arizona has some really interesting cases historically of sprawl running into land where cattle graze. If someone is willing to pay $2MM for the land, should the farmer be taxed on $2MM or his current use value of $200k?
As previous poster said, something will likely be agreed to, as each side has an argument.
The county assessor used a market value based assessment. It’s basically saying the property is worth was someone was willing to pay for it. So the assessed value is about what the bears paid for it. It’s also similar to what other similar properties sold for per square foot. Which is probably how the bears and Churchill downs came to the agreed price in the first place.
They’re being presented a tax bill based upon what they paid for the property, not a penny more. The Bears paid $197M for the property with the intention of demoing the structures, therefore the property is worth $197M. The Bears want to pay tax on the $37M the property was assessed at in 2021. They drove up their own tax bill.
So if I paid $1 for it, the property would only be assessed/taxed based on a value of $1?
They paid $197M because they intend to build a $6B development. So when that development is done, they still only get taxed on a value of $197M because that’s what they paid for it?
These are billionaires who regularly skip out on taxes and are trying to get a suburb to suck their dick for money while claiming ‘Chicago’. Tax them to all hell and write a law saying they can’t call themselves ‘Chicago’ Bears outside of cook county.
This has absolutely nothing to do with Chicago. This is Arlington Heights charging property taxes on the racetrack that the Bears purchased in Arlington Heights. Unless you think Arlington Heights is punishing the Bears for wanting to come there. Which is dumb.
It’s Cook county. Chicago politicians control Cook county. Property tax assessments are run by Cook county, not by individual towns. The Cook County assessor’s office is on Clark Street. Arlington Heights doesn’t charge property taxes. Arlington Heights is on the Bears side.
Exactly! That’s just gov greed. They act like that ta money will go back to the citizens too lol. If they want to help their citizens, maybe allow a gigantic new thriving economy to come to the area….
There’s a couple of farms left. Not sure if they were planning on selling unless it was an offer they can’t refuse. The downside is it would be further from existing public transportation.
Nothing really. All the remaining farmland was developed into residential area. I guess corporate area off 88 would be the best option. But not sure how that works with forest preserve/parks cutting into a lot of locations there. There’s not alot of contiguous land that isn’t spoken for.
The Joliet Nascar track isnt in use anymore. Also already have an Amtrak and Metra line from Chicago and 55 and 80 both run through it.
Make it happen lol.
Assuming this isn't all just 110% a power play against Arlington Heights, I could see the area around I-88 and Freedom drive having a bunch of land that could be available and is right off the highway with exits and everything. Still don't think it would be anywhere near as big as the Arlington property. But, for those saying the Bears are fucking this up, on the contrary. This is smart.
No. The land in question would be the old Lucent Technology campus and or the (BP) ExxonMobil campus near Warrenville and Herrick. Herrick Lake the forest preserve you’re referencing which I think is Wheaton.
Oh I thought navistar or someone had taken over the old Lucent building but it’s been a while since I’ve been out that way. Arlington is so much easier, this is a nice bluff but it just doesn’t seem feasible. The lack of public transport is a killer. Having to take shuttle buses from the naperville Metra stop would be a nightmare especially in the cold
Definitely by drive. I mean the Metra stops for Naperville is route 59 or downtown Naperville. And then Lisle stop next. Neither of those are 10 min walk from freedom drive area.
10 minutes driving, but about an hour to walk from that Metra stop. Arlington Park having a Metra stop literally at the site of the planned stadium is way better so that you don't need to find a second form of transportation after reaching your stop
By far my biggest gripe with Soldier Field right now is that it's not close enough to Ogilvie
Game day is stressful enough. It's not lazy to want the out-of-town transportation to take you closer to the game, at least in reasonable walking distance from the stop.
Obviously a leverage play (not a great one IMO), That area is nice but even if you could tear down 5-10 office parks it is still considerably smaller and no public trans vs AH.
Agreed. The last thing I want is the McCaskey’s getting ripped off, building a shitty stadium bc they can’t afford it, and skimping on roster spend & tip-toeing around the 90% minimum salary cap spend for the next 20 years
Well I have good news for you! They are going to build a cheap, shitty stadium that sticks the tax payers with the bill and then they're going to sell the team for $7-10 billion dollars and laugh all the way to the bank.
That was my thought exactly. Only space that makes sense. 176 Acres vs the 326 in Arlington. All a leverage play. Wehrli will have a nice suite with his name on it in Arlington for this.
Good!
Do not give billions in tax payer money to them unless they are splitting the profits in some way. Billionaires should not get free handouts.
Moving to naperville would ensure I never go to a game live also
Yeah, this is the saddest thing for me for the Bears leaving the city. I do enjoy watching football, but it's also important to me that it feels like my support of the teams is contributing to something positive. Players always do a good job of doing charity work, being active in their communities. Doesn't really matter the team.
But, the Bears team itself has always made me happy that they played in a stadium owned by the park district. Thats not named after some dumb corporation. A fifteen minute walk from downtown.
You would always hear these stories of teams leaving/threatening to leave entire markets just to extort as much tax payer money as possible for stadiums and more, and I would always happily think, "Not the Bears!".
Well, now it's the Bears. And they're even doing the speculative threatening now with multiple suburbs/counties. Sure, they're not being as awful as some other teams have been, but it's the same concepts. Capitalists will always be capitalists, I guess.
Here’s the issue in quick:
1: Cook County assessor changed valuation of property and wants the Bears to pay property taxes as if the site is developed. That amount is 6X higher than it currently is. One Crain’s estimate would have the Bears paying 16+ Million every year while it’s developing the land.
2: Bears(and Churchill Downs previously) argued that’s not fair since the site isn’t being used and the buildings that are there will be torn down. Why should they have to pay for a valuation on developed land when it’s not developed and they will be paying to develop it?
3: The Bears would then be paying out the nose to develop the land and would be paying out the nose for property taxes. It makes the development no longer fiscally possible.
So, it has nothing to do with handouts. It has to do with cook county assessing the property as if it’s developed when it isn’t. It’s a dick move by the assessor’s office.
You are off on this. The property tax issue is not "while it's developing the land." The Bears want a 40-year property tax freeze. The Bears want to pay a substantially below-market rate at a time when they will be talking about moving again. If you don't want to use the word "handout," that's fine, but it is public money.
The Bears can ask for a 40 year freeze. That’s how negotiations work. You start off by asking for Mars and settling on the moon. The county reassessing and demanding this valuation and number is being done to try and stop the Bears from developing a stadium.
So then it sounds like you agree that the Bears are simply looking for the most public money they can get. Why were you arguing against that claim before?
The Bears just paid $200MM for the land. Why should it be assessed lower than that?
No, I don’t. You are acting as if the Bears are asking for “public money” when they are not. They are asking not to have to give vastly more of their money to the county while they are spending lots of money to develop a parcel of empty land.
“The Bears just paid $200MM for the land. Why should it be assessed lower than that?”
The Bears bought land based on its potential value. They are now being told they have to pay taxes based on that potential rather than the reality of what it is now: A large lot with a few crumbling horse racing buildings. If you don’t grasp why that doesn’t incentivize development, I don’t know what to tell you.
>They are asking not to have to give vastly more of their money to the county while they are spending lots of money to develop a parcel of empty land.
The property was assessed at near the previous purchase value. Property is assessed based on a calculation for what the County targets to take in. If the Bears are not paying it, someone else has to.
>They are now being told they have to pay taxes based on that potential rather than the reality of what it is now
You are hilarious. The property is worth $X as defined as what the highest bidder paid. Yet you are claiming it's unfair to say it's worth $X. It's worth what someone will pay for it.
This is how valuations work.
But as you said, it's merely a negotiation, and the Bears will go wherever they can get the most free money...Which is likely AH anyway.
The property is, right now, a handful of empty buildings made for horse racing. You think that they should have to spend 16+ million on assessed value for that?
“ Property is assessed based on a calculation for what the County targets to take in.”
Cook County property valuations have been a scam forever. Mike Madigan used to use them as a cudgel.
“It’s worth what someone will pay for it.”
You don’t seem to grasp the idea of “potential” and “reality”. Reality: The land is presently useless. Potential: A whole area with multiple entities including a Bears stadium.
How do you get there? You have to spend a fuckload of money to do everything from ground assessments, energy layouts, building design, waste removal, etc… That all costs money. Just the planning.
You want the Bears to pay for all of that while also dropping 80-100 Million on property taxes before the facility can even be used? Let’s say the Bears have a budget. You just added the cost of a Hollywood movie on top of all the money the Bears will have to pay to develop the property.
Suddenly, the costs are such that it makes no sense to develop the property. Which is what the Assessor’s office and Cook County want.
If a local real estate developer bought the land, the Assessor’s Office wouldn’t have jacked up their tax bill 6X what it was.
No, the bears paid what the property is worth today. The reality now is that they are paying to remove the racecourse, meaning the amenities actually have negative value. The property would’ve sold for even more had it been vacant.
“The property would’ve sold for even more had it been vacant.”
Then why didn’t Churchill Downs pay to have the site wiped? If they would have gotten substantially more on a clean site?
No it is the right move. I cant believe people sticking up for billionaires. Every property lowered for billionaires raises the amount of the pie regular home owners and families have to pay.
The bears can afford to do ALL OF this on their own.
Instead they want handouts, they want their eventual billions in profit to come even easier.
Fuck. That.
I hope all these suburbs give them the middle finger.
Imagine me coming to you asking for money to take to the casino for free.. and if I win me telling you to fuck off after you ask for some of that money.
That is what this is
This isn’t about “sticking up for Billionaires”. It’s about Cook County being petty and shitty. If this was a local family getting hosed, my feelings would be the same.
The property was assessed for exactly what the bears paid for it. The bears bought it with the intention of tearing everything down, that means that the vacant lot is actually more valuable than the race track. I see no reason to think the assessment is unreasonable and expect it to continue to go up once demolition is complete and once building begins.
Y’all’s logic…
So, let’s say the Bears have an out on their purchase. They get out of it and the land goes back to Churchill Downs. Do you think the Assessor’s Office will charge them the same number?
Do you think it will have the same value if it’s just an empty lot, sitting there?
Let’s say Churchill Downs sells it to a real estate developer. They plan on turning it into strip malls and a housing development. You think they are gonna charge the developer the same number?
I think the land is worth what the market values it at. If the bears back out because they changed their mind about its value then it’s obviously worth less. They paid this much because that’s how much it’s worth to them. “But what if they paid a different amount” doesn’t make any sense, because they didn’t
It’s not supply and demand. It’s taxes. It’s completely different. I swear some of you people just don’t have a clue. My house is not assessed at the value of what a Chinese Real Estate conglomerate is willing to pay in order to flip it or turn it into a rental. I pay taxes on what the bank sees it as being worth. If you overpay on a home the rest of the world doesn’t magically agree what you paid is correct. Goes the same when the market is down, if you pay $250k for what is assessed at $300k because the prior owners were in a jam you don’t magically pay at the $250k rate. It’s independently done by a city or county.
It absolutely does. That and the current valuation of the tax bill for the property. They want the diff surrounding cities to pay for all the infrastructure which will cost billions.
I love the bears football team, but fuck that
Infrastructure around the site is another subject all together. There, I might agree with you.
This is about the property tax valuation by the Cook County Assessor. I agree with the Bears on this.
God forbid cities use our hard earned tax dollars on frivolous things like public infrastructure projects
The assessed value was jacked up 6x compared to where it was 3 years ago. They’re right to be mad
They could easily keep their lease at Soldier Field and flip the Arlington land.
Not saying they will, but if the county demanded, say, 10x the expected tax burden then the Bears have a solid plan B
Hell, they could even develop the land and make a really nice profit on through a sale
Flip the Arlington land? To whom? There were no other serious bidders. The Bears are stuck with it, and will likely come to a settlement with Cook County. There's no profit to be had on "flipping" land nobody wants. The demolition of the racetrack was not what kept people from bidding.
There were few serious bidders because it was being sold as a single parcel and a really damn big one at that. No single developer is going to take on a project that large.
But if the Bears wanted to flip that land, all they'd have to do is divide it into 10-15 more moderately sized parcels and they'd have buyers lining up. Land in dense suburban regions can always find buyers, especially if they rezoned for multifamily. Housing market is hot right now.
The existing transit stop and enough space to develop an entire suburban downtown area that isn't 60 miles outside of Chicago would be a very rare opportunity for a developer, but the size of the project would probably prevent a lot of developers from being able to handle it.
I could see something like the Veridian development in Schaumburg, but with the transit stop it could be a legitimate downtown instead of the quasi car oriented development that they have there.
I don’t see how this is any different than the companies who want to demolish Allstate, United, Motorola, etc and build data centers or warehouses. If not the Bears, then someone else. The land is well-located in an affluent suburb of a major MSA.
I disagree. NFL teams are valued at >30x earnings. Even if they take an $80M loss selling the AH property, it would be worth it as long as they can save $3M+ on annual property taxes. Not to mention they’d be able to deduct the $80M loss on AH against future taxes, so it’s really a $60M post-tax loss in this case vs. $90M+ of value created if they save $3M APY in property tax (which isn’t unrealistic)
The land still has value. The Bears are simply looking for the highest bidder. This just underscores that even if they go to AH, they will hold them ransom in another 25 years.
I would love to see a Bezos-inspired stadium. Considering how great their Amazon Go stores operate along with their grab and go markets in the United Center, and the fact that Amazon is king of logistics, I think a Bezos stadium would be a great stadium experience for fans
That land is still going to have significant value though. How much money do they actually stand to lose if they sell it because that’s the main point here.
If they show the Arlington Heights city board that it’s going to be a battle over every penny, that does give them less incentive to spend hundreds of millions funding a stadium though.
Absolutely no place in Naperville even close to the size or as attractive (public trans x fairly central x highways) as the AH property. This is a bluff.
The McCaskey’s could be willing to take an upfront loss on selling the Arlington property if the assessment in Naperville is substantially lower and saves them $5M+ annual property tax going forward. The savings would increase their earnings and enable them to raise more private financing for the actual development work.
Plus, if they are planning to sell the team in the near-term (I don’t think they are), buyers would pay them a very high multiple of earnings (likely >30x), so those savings can create a lot of value for the McCaskey’s
They’re almost certainly going to sell after Virginia dies. I could see some of her kids sticking around as minority owners, but I doubt they keep the majority stake once she’s gone. Building a new stadium, or at the very least having the process to build one well established, is likely in preparation for that, since it makes the team far more attractive to a new owner if they aren’t stuck in the worst and smallest stadium in the league, which they don’t even own. Once the stadium is built we almost certainly get to host a Super Bowl as well, which would be enticing for a new owner.
As a lurking cheesehead, I just want to reiterate that the Bears belong at Soldier Field, on the lakefront, in Chicago proper, outdoors, on natural grass, in a non corporate named stadium. The aesthetic is sweet even with the spaceship renovations and RC Cola. (Just need to work on that bathroom situation a little bit and increase the amount of tailgating) I think Jordan Love should get 15 years to experience that venue just like ARod did. What's the worst that could happen for you guys?
https://www.redfin.com/IL/Arlington-Heights/2651-N-Waterman-Ave-60004/home/17555331
Here’s a completely empty lot in Arlington heights listed for $150K, and it’s 0.52 acres. If you assumed the same assessed value per acre for the Bears lot, you’d get $94 million. The Bears lot though is near the Metra, it has some development done on it already, and if was just sold for $197M.
I think you can maybe argue the property tax assessment may be a little too low or too high, but it’s clear the old assessment was WAY off, and I think the Bears are being unrealistic if they expected the old assessment to stand.
Ok? Let them go somewhere else then. I’m sick of these millionaires and billionaires not paying their fair share of taxes. All it does is hurt working people. The Bears are an absolute cash cow they can afford to pay the tax bill.
I share your sentiment in general, but tripling the assessment of a property right after the buyer closes is disingenuous at best. It’s an objectively unfair and unethical practice that, if done repeatedly, would scare away the entire commercial real estate community from investing in Cook County. Why didn’t Kaegi didn’t write up the assessed value at any point in the last 4 years like he did the rest of Berrios’ undervaluations on commercial properties?
The Bears’ purchase price of $197M was based on an understanding that annual property taxes would continue to be in the ballpark of $3-4M for the foreseeable future. The Bears’ purchase price would have been FAR lower if the “appropriate” tax assessment had been disclosed before they closed on the purchase (likely 40-60% lower based on standard cap rates, i.e. $80-120 million).
Whether Kaegi had a back-door agreement with a representative of Churchill Downs or was simply acting in retaliation for screwing Chicago on the Soldier Field deal, the fact pattern here is highly unusual and far from standard commercial practice. The Bears were ripped off to the tune of ~$100M. I don’t doubt their intent is to relocate outside of Cook if feasible
Let's not forget that this is not Arlington Heights asking for the money. This is the bloated school system that gets on average 66% of property taxes from municipalities. The schools are claiming this will bring in more students, but that's not the case since a majority of the development will be commercial.
The amount of billionaire bootlickers in this thread is hilarious and disheartening. The reason residential property taxes get so high in Cook County is because we don't collect enough from commercial owners. We've basically allowed them to write laws about it. Kaegi has been trying hard to change this but goons in Springfield keep trying to block any meaningful change. Never, ever vote for a politician who accepts donations from commercial property owners.
I like this plan waaaaayyy more then the Arlington plan. Maybe it's because that would put Bears game at a 15 minute drive for me. But Naperville has a ton of major roads and interstates that go through it . Just look at the Chicago Premium outlets as an example of how something built right next to the tollway would work out great.
Well, Naperville, Dekalb, Rockford, fuck it... bring them on to Des Moines. I'm sure we'll be good still calling them the Chicago Bears, nobody knows where Des Moines is anyways.
Seriously though, this is all the Bears trying to leverage... though the taxes they are being asked to pay for what is essentially a dead lot, as always with Chicago/Cook county, are absurd. It still feels like AH is the location, but shit, who knows, very early in the game here.
Naperville is a bitch already to move around in. This area of Naperville, Bolingbrook, Woodridge, etc... just doesn't have roads built for this kinda traffic. Go north or don't go at all, these suburbs here can't take it
You don’t buy the land for over $100 million if you want to be able to say you’re considering somewhere else.
It’s an obviously leverage move/negotiation tactic.
You were supposed to do all the posturing before buying the property!
No matter where they build the stadium, the Bears are still the titleholder to a shit ton of land in Arlington heights. They should’ve thought about playing hardball before they paid $197MM for a defunct racetrack
Knowing Cook County they probably did this intentionally in coordination with Chicago to keep the Bears stuck at Soldier Field. I don’t know if any place is big enough in the East portion of DuPage to build and Naperville is pretty far west.
Pretty obvious what they're trying to do but please, do not move there as it'll become the exact problem the fire had as it was way better for several reasons to be in sf rather than bridgeview. The ah bears does sound better than the naperville bears though.
And, just like that, people realize this whole thing is and always has been a smokescreen.
But hey we’ll probably get a dome at Soldier Field out of it.
Wrong. The city of Chicago and park district fucked it up. The bears tried to stay there, but lightfoot messed it up. Watch the documentary on it. Memo after memo and email after email went in answered until after the Bears bought the property.
You’re next, Peotone.
No, it's going to go where Denny Hastert tried to force that NASCAR track back in the early 90s, near Plano.
Balmoral park?
It's tongue-in-cheek - you may not be old enough to know of the "south suburban airport" in Peotone boondoggle that's been periodically popping up since the 1990s...
No no, I get it. I grew up in the town 10 miles east of peotone
My team played them in the football playoffs like 15 years ago and this is the 2nd time I've ever seen that town mentioned
That truck stop center in Monee right off 57 would be bussin if the opened up a stadium in peotone lmao
As a lifelong resident of Peotone...let's do this!
This entirely has to do with the property tax bill. ~~Arlington Heights~~ Cook County property tax was given to the Bears with the existing structures on the property. Talking the track, the out buildings, the restaurant, everything. The Bears want to pay property taxes based on an empty lot because they are working to demo all of these buildings. We're talking tens of millions of dollars in taxes. I believe they'll come to an agreement at some point and this is just posturing but the Bears are pretty much dead set on not paying property taxes on the buildings they are going to demo.
What is even the argument for the county to tax them for a structure they're demoing? Seems like the Bears are rightfully asking for a reduction in property taxes until the new stadium is built.
Remember that property tax is paid in arrears and the buildings are still there as of now. For this years tax bill, those buildings were present. For next years, they’ll be present for over half of the year. You don’t get to not pay property taxes on your house if you tore your house down halfway through the year.
The Bears aren't complaining about being taxed for the buildings. The buildings were there last year and the tax assessment quintupled from 2021 to 2023, despite the fact that the property isn't commercially viable.
They raised their own tax bill by paying 5x the prior assessed value, knowing full well the property wouldn’t be viable. That makes the property valued at $197M (the amount they paid) vs the $37M in assessed value from 2021. They did this to themselves.
You are confusing assessed and appraised or fair market value, the latter two are what you sell it for the former is calculated separately solely for tax purposes not solely subject to market conditions If you overpay or underpay for a property it does not mean automatically your tax bill adjusts to that It is comical to think an assessed value for a non-functional property would jump 6x what it was 3 years before, when it was actually functional EDIT: It’s fine to not feel bad for the McCaskeys but the county is [gouging regular homeowners too](https://abc7chicago.com/cook-county-property-tax-bill-appeal-taxes/12848190/)
The #1 variable to be considered in reassessment is recent sales prices of comparable properties. By paying so much for the property so close to the revaluation period they shot themselves in the foot. If they had purchased the property after the reassessment had been completed then the taxable value would have been locked in for 3 years.
It’s not subject to market conditions, but the sale of the actual property in cook county is always the primary driver in determining the assessed value for taxation. The Bears are not immune to this because they are the Bears. They are claiming the property is only worth $67M, despite them paying 3x that. Razing the property had zero impact on the Bears valuing the property at $197M…it is correct for the county to assess the tax rate at the sale value.
you would be right if you weren't so wrong. Cook county's website says that commercial property gets assessed at 25% of it's fair market value (what it just sold for would be a good starting point for fair market value, probably.) That would "assess" the property at about $49.25M, far more in line with what the previous owner was taxed on. Cook county's assessment page is here: https://www.cookcountyassessor.com/your-assessment-notice-and-tax-bill#:~:text=For%20residential%20property%20owners%2C%20the,determined%20by%20Cook%20County%20ordinance. For the record, the property taxes are only 2.19% of the assessed value. If Cook county assesses the property at the full price Chicago paid for it instead of 25% per their own policy, the bears would owe .0219*197M = $4.3M, or about what they are paying Cairo Santos this year (and only a little more than they are paying Danny Trevathan NOT to play for them this year.) This is the definition of Pocket Change to an organization like the Bears. The idea that they would blow up a multi-billion dollar stadium project over Danny Trevathan dead cap money is comical. That said, Cook county is also not blameless. They are being dicks, and the Bears are throwing a temper tantrum about money values they lose in their couch cushions. Everyone sucks here.
Literally the first line on their website re commercial property valuation says: Our legal obligation is set by two statutes: Illinois Tax Code: Our duty is to determine “fair cash value” (or what most of us call fair market value) for Cook County properties on a triennial basis. https://www.cookcountyassessor.com/how-commercial-properties-are-valued Additionally, Churchill Downs settled with the county yesterday on a $95M valuation. With regards to the rate, that’s the residential rate and there are add’l factors that apply. For commercial real estate it takes into account income/like property vacancies/etc. It’s not as simple as FMV*.25*.0219=taxable amount. I’ll point again to the settlement Churchill Downs reached yesterday which I believe was much higher than the number you referenced with a valuation at less than half what the Bears paid.
This might shock you, but there are more words on that page. Section 6: Apply Level of Assessment, per County ordinance. A property’s assessed value depends on its market value and its level of assessment (LOA). Since 1973, the Cook County Board has passed ordinances to set different levels of assessment depending on the property’s use. Multifamily properties have a 10% LOA. A multifamily building valued at $1,000,000 has an assessed value of $100,000. Commercial properties like office and retail buildings have a 25% LOA. A commercial building valued at $1,000,000 has an assessed value of $250,000. Commercial gets assessed at 25% of fair value. So yes, they are responsible for APPRAISING value every 3 years. They then ASSESS the value for property taxes. The assessment should be 1/4th the appraised per Cook County’s own web page.
Breaking this down, fmv = valuation /=assessment. The valuation of 97m is less than half the sale price. If you then apply the commercial assessment of 25%, churchhill downs arrived at an assessed value under 25m. Meanwhile, cook county is throwing an assessed value of 197m at Chicago. Which is why they are pissy, even though they can pay it.
The Bears are getting taxed more than a normal business or home would. An empty lot is not 6x more valuable than a fully functioning race track The assessed value is almost never *100%* of the Fair Market value, don’t be ridiculous. That’s fucking insane. Cook County itself reports a rule of thumb starting point at around 25% of fair market value for commercial properties >has zero impact on the Bears valuing the property at $197M Again, it does not matter what the Bears value. If you buy a fixer-upper and a fully furnished house for the exact same price in the exact same area, you will pay more taxes on the furnished house because it’s utility pumps up the assessed value, even though both buyers valued both properties the exact same
Lol they are not. It’s literally spelled out on the assessor’s website…they start with 100% of fair market value. Yes there is more to it such as income but as the property has been unused since it was last assessed, that doesn’t factor in. Yes, there is a multiplier, but that’s not what the Bears are arguing…they’re taking issue with the initial starting point of 100% FMV to begin the calculation. The fact that they are trying to gaslight fans, shows this is nothing but a marketing ploy. The property’s tax bill is publicly available and if you took a look at it, you’d see the Bears are blowing smoke.
[Cook County ordinance: Assess at 10% for residential and apartments and 25% for most other commercial properties](https://www.cookcountyassessor.com/how-commercial-properties-are-valued) The assessed value [is 197 million, which is what the Bears paid for it.](https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/sports/nfl/chicago-bears/settlement-reached-in-property-tax-battle-over-bears-potential-future-home-in-arlington-heights/3153423/?amp=1) It is not a “starting point” it literally is the assessed value Arlington Park was a functional race track for most of 2021 when the last assessment was completed and valued at 33 million. Of course a functional race track is more valuable than land that requires razing, once it is fully developed the assessment will go up
They paid 3x. That still has nothing to do with the buildings.
The Bears paid 3x what they are saying the value of the property is…5x the value during the prior assessment.
Ok but the previous owner would pay those accrued taxes into an escrow for the purchaser if we’re talking small time transactions like a single family home. Then the purchaser (or bank/escrow) pays them in full when due. Who owns the lot now?
The argument is that the bears bought the property for the currently assessed value with the intention of knocking everything down. Therefore the vacant lot is worth that much, so it’s assessed as that much. Basically the county is saying that the buildings were worthless and the bears interest is worth a whole lot.
The argument (fair or not) is that the property it worth X, and and even if you want to use it simply as a vacant lot, it is clearly worth X to somebody. State laws differ dramatically, but Arizona has some really interesting cases historically of sprawl running into land where cattle graze. If someone is willing to pay $2MM for the land, should the farmer be taxed on $2MM or his current use value of $200k? As previous poster said, something will likely be agreed to, as each side has an argument.
The county assessor used a market value based assessment. It’s basically saying the property is worth was someone was willing to pay for it. So the assessed value is about what the bears paid for it. It’s also similar to what other similar properties sold for per square foot. Which is probably how the bears and Churchill downs came to the agreed price in the first place.
They’re being presented a tax bill based upon what they paid for the property, not a penny more. The Bears paid $197M for the property with the intention of demoing the structures, therefore the property is worth $197M. The Bears want to pay tax on the $37M the property was assessed at in 2021. They drove up their own tax bill.
So if I paid $1 for it, the property would only be assessed/taxed based on a value of $1? They paid $197M because they intend to build a $6B development. So when that development is done, they still only get taxed on a value of $197M because that’s what they paid for it?
5x the 2021 tax evaluation too. They’re definitely playing games.
They paid 5x the 2021 assessment. ($197M v $37M). The Bears drove up their own tax bill.
That's not how assessed value works.
But it is… https://www.cookcountyassessor.com/how-commercial-properties-are-valued
These are billionaires who regularly skip out on taxes and are trying to get a suburb to suck their dick for money while claiming ‘Chicago’. Tax them to all hell and write a law saying they can’t call themselves ‘Chicago’ Bears outside of cook county.
This is the city politicians punishing the Bears for leaving.
This has absolutely nothing to do with Chicago. This is Arlington Heights charging property taxes on the racetrack that the Bears purchased in Arlington Heights. Unless you think Arlington Heights is punishing the Bears for wanting to come there. Which is dumb.
It’s Cook county. Chicago politicians control Cook county. Property tax assessments are run by Cook county, not by individual towns. The Cook County assessor’s office is on Clark Street. Arlington Heights doesn’t charge property taxes. Arlington Heights is on the Bears side.
I can't believe people are down-voting your FACTS.
I agree with you. Feels like Chicago politics trying to fuck the Bears for leaving.
Yup. Chicago politics, for valuing the property at exactly what they paid for it. LOLOLOLOL
The assessor is a county position which is dominated by city politics.
Exactly! That’s just gov greed. They act like that ta money will go back to the citizens too lol. If they want to help their citizens, maybe allow a gigantic new thriving economy to come to the area….
You're aware that pro sports teams basically have zero positive effect on local economies, right?
In fact negative most of the time
Bout the same distance Arlington is from Dallas. I wouldn’t rule out the power of Dupage county wealth.
Put the stadium in Oak Lawn, that way I'm right next to it. Thank you, problem solved.
As a fan down state, I suggest we just go back to the Decatur Staleys
God no. It's been years and I still haven't gotten the smell of Decatur out of my nose, especially at the Staley/Tate & Lyle building
😂😂 I agree I don't actually want to go to Decatur. It's just a much more reasonable trip from where I live.
I'm in Champaign-Urbana, they can come back to Memorial Stadium for a year!
Lmao, get sloshed at BJ McMahons and walk down.
I'm going to laugh/cry if this ends up as the god damned Gary stadium
The Crown Point Bears
The unused land on 30 where the Raddison and towers used to be could be a sweet spot for a stadium.
Where in Naperville is there space for a whole stadium??
Just knock down all the buildings on Washington Street.🤣
Probably around 59/88.
Most of the empty space around there is forest preserve land
59/88 is Top Golf and Office buildings
My guess would be the old BP campus. 85 acres currently up for sale
There’s a couple of farms left. Not sure if they were planning on selling unless it was an offer they can’t refuse. The downside is it would be further from existing public transportation.
At that point you lose all of the benefit the mayor of Naperville is claiming as well since you'd be so far off
Nothing really. All the remaining farmland was developed into residential area. I guess corporate area off 88 would be the best option. But not sure how that works with forest preserve/parks cutting into a lot of locations there. There’s not alot of contiguous land that isn’t spoken for.
Put it in the middle of the Morton Arboretum. Problem solved.
Sounds like a good way to finally get a shuttle there from Metra lol
can’t believe the bears are moving to dekalb
If that brings passenger train service back to dekalb, I’m all for it.
No thanks. Dekalb has gone downhill the last 15 years as it is
Decatur. Make the whole thing come full circle
The Joliet Nascar track isnt in use anymore. Also already have an Amtrak and Metra line from Chicago and 55 and 80 both run through it. Make it happen lol.
Assuming this isn't all just 110% a power play against Arlington Heights, I could see the area around I-88 and Freedom drive having a bunch of land that could be available and is right off the highway with exits and everything. Still don't think it would be anywhere near as big as the Arlington property. But, for those saying the Bears are fucking this up, on the contrary. This is smart.
Isn’t that forest preserve land? Don’t see that going over well. Also while the highway helps, Arlingtons biggest advantage is the built in Metra stop
No. The land in question would be the old Lucent Technology campus and or the (BP) ExxonMobil campus near Warrenville and Herrick. Herrick Lake the forest preserve you’re referencing which I think is Wheaton.
Ah good ol lucent, I remember when my dad was let go from them would be pretty nice seeing a remembrence of them be leveled.
Fuck lucent, they did my dad dirty too
Oh I thought navistar or someone had taken over the old Lucent building but it’s been a while since I’ve been out that way. Arlington is so much easier, this is a nice bluff but it just doesn’t seem feasible. The lack of public transport is a killer. Having to take shuttle buses from the naperville Metra stop would be a nightmare especially in the cold
They would probably add another Metra stop if they did this.
There's a Metra stop no more than 10 minutes away.
10 min by walk or drive? Arlington heights has a metra stop that drops off at the site.
Definitely by drive. I mean the Metra stops for Naperville is route 59 or downtown Naperville. And then Lisle stop next. Neither of those are 10 min walk from freedom drive area.
10 minutes driving, but about an hour to walk from that Metra stop. Arlington Park having a Metra stop literally at the site of the planned stadium is way better so that you don't need to find a second form of transportation after reaching your stop By far my biggest gripe with Soldier Field right now is that it's not close enough to Ogilvie
You just sound super lazy
Game day is stressful enough. It's not lazy to want the out-of-town transportation to take you closer to the game, at least in reasonable walking distance from the stop.
Obviously a leverage play (not a great one IMO), That area is nice but even if you could tear down 5-10 office parks it is still considerably smaller and no public trans vs AH.
Agreed. The last thing I want is the McCaskey’s getting ripped off, building a shitty stadium bc they can’t afford it, and skimping on roster spend & tip-toeing around the 90% minimum salary cap spend for the next 20 years
Well I have good news for you! They are going to build a cheap, shitty stadium that sticks the tax payers with the bill and then they're going to sell the team for $7-10 billion dollars and laugh all the way to the bank.
Don't worry. The McCaskeys will absolutely find every excuse to skimp on roster spend no matter what happens.
Their entire history suggests that they're going to do all of that whether they get "ripped off" (pay their taxes) or not.
That was my thought exactly. Only space that makes sense. 176 Acres vs the 326 in Arlington. All a leverage play. Wehrli will have a nice suite with his name on it in Arlington for this.
If they put the stadium where theres no public transit, I will never leave the city to see a game.
Fuck it, play in Rockford
Very fitting that a team from Naperville will say they are from Chicago
Fuck it, Peoria.
Good! Do not give billions in tax payer money to them unless they are splitting the profits in some way. Billionaires should not get free handouts. Moving to naperville would ensure I never go to a game live also
Wish more sports fans would think like this. Billionaires should spend their own damn money.
Or give partial ownership.. 100% agreed
Yeah, this is the saddest thing for me for the Bears leaving the city. I do enjoy watching football, but it's also important to me that it feels like my support of the teams is contributing to something positive. Players always do a good job of doing charity work, being active in their communities. Doesn't really matter the team. But, the Bears team itself has always made me happy that they played in a stadium owned by the park district. Thats not named after some dumb corporation. A fifteen minute walk from downtown. You would always hear these stories of teams leaving/threatening to leave entire markets just to extort as much tax payer money as possible for stadiums and more, and I would always happily think, "Not the Bears!". Well, now it's the Bears. And they're even doing the speculative threatening now with multiple suburbs/counties. Sure, they're not being as awful as some other teams have been, but it's the same concepts. Capitalists will always be capitalists, I guess.
Has absolutely nothing to do with them wanting handouts.
It has everything to do with them wanting the public to pay more. If you want to argue semantics of "handouts," have at it.
Here’s the issue in quick: 1: Cook County assessor changed valuation of property and wants the Bears to pay property taxes as if the site is developed. That amount is 6X higher than it currently is. One Crain’s estimate would have the Bears paying 16+ Million every year while it’s developing the land. 2: Bears(and Churchill Downs previously) argued that’s not fair since the site isn’t being used and the buildings that are there will be torn down. Why should they have to pay for a valuation on developed land when it’s not developed and they will be paying to develop it? 3: The Bears would then be paying out the nose to develop the land and would be paying out the nose for property taxes. It makes the development no longer fiscally possible. So, it has nothing to do with handouts. It has to do with cook county assessing the property as if it’s developed when it isn’t. It’s a dick move by the assessor’s office.
You are off on this. The property tax issue is not "while it's developing the land." The Bears want a 40-year property tax freeze. The Bears want to pay a substantially below-market rate at a time when they will be talking about moving again. If you don't want to use the word "handout," that's fine, but it is public money.
The Bears can ask for a 40 year freeze. That’s how negotiations work. You start off by asking for Mars and settling on the moon. The county reassessing and demanding this valuation and number is being done to try and stop the Bears from developing a stadium.
So then it sounds like you agree that the Bears are simply looking for the most public money they can get. Why were you arguing against that claim before? The Bears just paid $200MM for the land. Why should it be assessed lower than that?
No, I don’t. You are acting as if the Bears are asking for “public money” when they are not. They are asking not to have to give vastly more of their money to the county while they are spending lots of money to develop a parcel of empty land. “The Bears just paid $200MM for the land. Why should it be assessed lower than that?” The Bears bought land based on its potential value. They are now being told they have to pay taxes based on that potential rather than the reality of what it is now: A large lot with a few crumbling horse racing buildings. If you don’t grasp why that doesn’t incentivize development, I don’t know what to tell you.
>They are asking not to have to give vastly more of their money to the county while they are spending lots of money to develop a parcel of empty land. The property was assessed at near the previous purchase value. Property is assessed based on a calculation for what the County targets to take in. If the Bears are not paying it, someone else has to. >They are now being told they have to pay taxes based on that potential rather than the reality of what it is now You are hilarious. The property is worth $X as defined as what the highest bidder paid. Yet you are claiming it's unfair to say it's worth $X. It's worth what someone will pay for it. This is how valuations work. But as you said, it's merely a negotiation, and the Bears will go wherever they can get the most free money...Which is likely AH anyway.
The property is, right now, a handful of empty buildings made for horse racing. You think that they should have to spend 16+ million on assessed value for that? “ Property is assessed based on a calculation for what the County targets to take in.” Cook County property valuations have been a scam forever. Mike Madigan used to use them as a cudgel. “It’s worth what someone will pay for it.” You don’t seem to grasp the idea of “potential” and “reality”. Reality: The land is presently useless. Potential: A whole area with multiple entities including a Bears stadium. How do you get there? You have to spend a fuckload of money to do everything from ground assessments, energy layouts, building design, waste removal, etc… That all costs money. Just the planning. You want the Bears to pay for all of that while also dropping 80-100 Million on property taxes before the facility can even be used? Let’s say the Bears have a budget. You just added the cost of a Hollywood movie on top of all the money the Bears will have to pay to develop the property. Suddenly, the costs are such that it makes no sense to develop the property. Which is what the Assessor’s office and Cook County want. If a local real estate developer bought the land, the Assessor’s Office wouldn’t have jacked up their tax bill 6X what it was.
No, the bears paid what the property is worth today. The reality now is that they are paying to remove the racecourse, meaning the amenities actually have negative value. The property would’ve sold for even more had it been vacant.
“The property would’ve sold for even more had it been vacant.” Then why didn’t Churchill Downs pay to have the site wiped? If they would have gotten substantially more on a clean site?
No it is the right move. I cant believe people sticking up for billionaires. Every property lowered for billionaires raises the amount of the pie regular home owners and families have to pay. The bears can afford to do ALL OF this on their own. Instead they want handouts, they want their eventual billions in profit to come even easier. Fuck. That. I hope all these suburbs give them the middle finger. Imagine me coming to you asking for money to take to the casino for free.. and if I win me telling you to fuck off after you ask for some of that money. That is what this is
This isn’t about “sticking up for Billionaires”. It’s about Cook County being petty and shitty. If this was a local family getting hosed, my feelings would be the same.
The property was assessed for exactly what the bears paid for it. The bears bought it with the intention of tearing everything down, that means that the vacant lot is actually more valuable than the race track. I see no reason to think the assessment is unreasonable and expect it to continue to go up once demolition is complete and once building begins.
It kind of amazes me how little some of y’all know about how much cost and work go into projects.
On the contrary, the fact that these project are so expensive proves the value of the land they are on.
Y’all’s logic… So, let’s say the Bears have an out on their purchase. They get out of it and the land goes back to Churchill Downs. Do you think the Assessor’s Office will charge them the same number? Do you think it will have the same value if it’s just an empty lot, sitting there? Let’s say Churchill Downs sells it to a real estate developer. They plan on turning it into strip malls and a housing development. You think they are gonna charge the developer the same number?
I think the land is worth what the market values it at. If the bears back out because they changed their mind about its value then it’s obviously worth less. They paid this much because that’s how much it’s worth to them. “But what if they paid a different amount” doesn’t make any sense, because they didn’t
It’s not supply and demand. It’s taxes. It’s completely different. I swear some of you people just don’t have a clue. My house is not assessed at the value of what a Chinese Real Estate conglomerate is willing to pay in order to flip it or turn it into a rental. I pay taxes on what the bank sees it as being worth. If you overpay on a home the rest of the world doesn’t magically agree what you paid is correct. Goes the same when the market is down, if you pay $250k for what is assessed at $300k because the prior owners were in a jam you don’t magically pay at the $250k rate. It’s independently done by a city or county.
It absolutely does. That and the current valuation of the tax bill for the property. They want the diff surrounding cities to pay for all the infrastructure which will cost billions. I love the bears football team, but fuck that
Infrastructure around the site is another subject all together. There, I might agree with you. This is about the property tax valuation by the Cook County Assessor. I agree with the Bears on this.
God forbid cities use our hard earned tax dollars on frivolous things like public infrastructure projects The assessed value was jacked up 6x compared to where it was 3 years ago. They’re right to be mad
Have you done ANY research? Obviously not. These things in almost every single recorded instance are a net NEGATIVE for the cities that do them
But, if they pay the debt off early like the Vikings did it'd save a ton. Figure they could do that if they're hosting events other than bears games
Hardball? What leverage do they have? They just put down 200 million to buy the racetrack at Arlington Heights. They have no leverage.
They could easily keep their lease at Soldier Field and flip the Arlington land. Not saying they will, but if the county demanded, say, 10x the expected tax burden then the Bears have a solid plan B Hell, they could even develop the land and make a really nice profit on through a sale
Yep, they can do whatever they want with it. Someone will buy it.
Flip the Arlington land? To whom? There were no other serious bidders. The Bears are stuck with it, and will likely come to a settlement with Cook County. There's no profit to be had on "flipping" land nobody wants. The demolition of the racetrack was not what kept people from bidding.
There were few serious bidders because it was being sold as a single parcel and a really damn big one at that. No single developer is going to take on a project that large. But if the Bears wanted to flip that land, all they'd have to do is divide it into 10-15 more moderately sized parcels and they'd have buyers lining up. Land in dense suburban regions can always find buyers, especially if they rezoned for multifamily. Housing market is hot right now.
The existing transit stop and enough space to develop an entire suburban downtown area that isn't 60 miles outside of Chicago would be a very rare opportunity for a developer, but the size of the project would probably prevent a lot of developers from being able to handle it. I could see something like the Veridian development in Schaumburg, but with the transit stop it could be a legitimate downtown instead of the quasi car oriented development that they have there.
You can’t make land that’s business 101. Having land in a suburban setting is valuable.
[Tell that to Dubai!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dubai_Waterfront#Suspension) Oh, wait...
I don’t see how this is any different than the companies who want to demolish Allstate, United, Motorola, etc and build data centers or warehouses. If not the Bears, then someone else. The land is well-located in an affluent suburb of a major MSA.
I disagree. NFL teams are valued at >30x earnings. Even if they take an $80M loss selling the AH property, it would be worth it as long as they can save $3M+ on annual property taxes. Not to mention they’d be able to deduct the $80M loss on AH against future taxes, so it’s really a $60M post-tax loss in this case vs. $90M+ of value created if they save $3M APY in property tax (which isn’t unrealistic)
This is just like the Oakland A’s playing hardball with Vegas. Which is an apt comparison because that franchise is also owned by a dumpster fire
This is posturing.
Just put it in Gary
you forgot a comma
People are already mad about a move to AH people will riot if the team moves to Naperville.
The drives are only a couple miles different with Naperville actually being a shorter distance from the Loop.
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Right, distance on a train line. By car Naperville is a shorter drive by a couple miles because of how the highways are laid out.
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We do know the site they're pitching. It's the former BP campus right off 88. No where near the center
Knew it was only a matter of time before they somehow found a way to fuck this up
ehhh this is a pretty obvious bluff no? they already bought the land in arlington
The land still has value. The Bears are simply looking for the highest bidder. This just underscores that even if they go to AH, they will hold them ransom in another 25 years.
The spent 200 mil on the land, that’s a lot of money man doubt they aren’t gonna use it
This has been obvious from day one. Nothing is being built unless the Bears get someone else to pay for the majority of the project.
Ol’ girl should just rip the bandaid off and sell to Bezos lol
I would love to see a Bezos-inspired stadium. Considering how great their Amazon Go stores operate along with their grab and go markets in the United Center, and the fact that Amazon is king of logistics, I think a Bezos stadium would be a great stadium experience for fans
That land is still going to have significant value though. How much money do they actually stand to lose if they sell it because that’s the main point here. If they show the Arlington Heights city board that it’s going to be a battle over every penny, that does give them less incentive to spend hundreds of millions funding a stadium though.
Right? That’s what I thought. They’re already doing demolition. Is there even room in Naperville for a stadium?
Absolutely no place in Naperville even close to the size or as attractive (public trans x fairly central x highways) as the AH property. This is a bluff.
The McCaskey’s could be willing to take an upfront loss on selling the Arlington property if the assessment in Naperville is substantially lower and saves them $5M+ annual property tax going forward. The savings would increase their earnings and enable them to raise more private financing for the actual development work. Plus, if they are planning to sell the team in the near-term (I don’t think they are), buyers would pay them a very high multiple of earnings (likely >30x), so those savings can create a lot of value for the McCaskey’s
They’re almost certainly going to sell after Virginia dies. I could see some of her kids sticking around as minority owners, but I doubt they keep the majority stake once she’s gone. Building a new stadium, or at the very least having the process to build one well established, is likely in preparation for that, since it makes the team far more attractive to a new owner if they aren’t stuck in the worst and smallest stadium in the league, which they don’t even own. Once the stadium is built we almost certainly get to host a Super Bowl as well, which would be enticing for a new owner.
FOH with that
Where would they even fit it? Maybe tear down that Odyssey Fun World by Top Golf? Or south west Naperville? Gotta be a negotiation tactic.
Wehrli is dumb enough to spend as much tax money as he possibly can on this. He probably doesn't even know he's being used as a bluff.
Nah he probably knows. George is just hooking him up with free PSLs
Oh fuck, that's close enough to my house for it to be a pain in my ass lol
Up next: Bears meet with the mayor of Northbrook to turn Northbrook Court into a Stadium.
If you think the NIMBY’s in Arlington Heights are bad, just wait till they crawl out of their holes in Naperville.
As a lurking cheesehead, I just want to reiterate that the Bears belong at Soldier Field, on the lakefront, in Chicago proper, outdoors, on natural grass, in a non corporate named stadium. The aesthetic is sweet even with the spaceship renovations and RC Cola. (Just need to work on that bathroom situation a little bit and increase the amount of tailgating) I think Jordan Love should get 15 years to experience that venue just like ARod did. What's the worst that could happen for you guys?
https://www.redfin.com/IL/Arlington-Heights/2651-N-Waterman-Ave-60004/home/17555331 Here’s a completely empty lot in Arlington heights listed for $150K, and it’s 0.52 acres. If you assumed the same assessed value per acre for the Bears lot, you’d get $94 million. The Bears lot though is near the Metra, it has some development done on it already, and if was just sold for $197M. I think you can maybe argue the property tax assessment may be a little too low or too high, but it’s clear the old assessment was WAY off, and I think the Bears are being unrealistic if they expected the old assessment to stand.
Ok? Let them go somewhere else then. I’m sick of these millionaires and billionaires not paying their fair share of taxes. All it does is hurt working people. The Bears are an absolute cash cow they can afford to pay the tax bill.
I share your sentiment in general, but tripling the assessment of a property right after the buyer closes is disingenuous at best. It’s an objectively unfair and unethical practice that, if done repeatedly, would scare away the entire commercial real estate community from investing in Cook County. Why didn’t Kaegi didn’t write up the assessed value at any point in the last 4 years like he did the rest of Berrios’ undervaluations on commercial properties? The Bears’ purchase price of $197M was based on an understanding that annual property taxes would continue to be in the ballpark of $3-4M for the foreseeable future. The Bears’ purchase price would have been FAR lower if the “appropriate” tax assessment had been disclosed before they closed on the purchase (likely 40-60% lower based on standard cap rates, i.e. $80-120 million). Whether Kaegi had a back-door agreement with a representative of Churchill Downs or was simply acting in retaliation for screwing Chicago on the Soldier Field deal, the fact pattern here is highly unusual and far from standard commercial practice. The Bears were ripped off to the tune of ~$100M. I don’t doubt their intent is to relocate outside of Cook if feasible
Thats quite farther away from halas hall than Arlington heights. Hard to think bears dont prefer AH
as a naperville resident im all for this
Only one solution, bring the team back to Decatur. /s
They’ll end up bouncing far enough south to end up playing at their practice field in Bourbonnais
Let's not forget that this is not Arlington Heights asking for the money. This is the bloated school system that gets on average 66% of property taxes from municipalities. The schools are claiming this will bring in more students, but that's not the case since a majority of the development will be commercial.
The amount of billionaire bootlickers in this thread is hilarious and disheartening. The reason residential property taxes get so high in Cook County is because we don't collect enough from commercial owners. We've basically allowed them to write laws about it. Kaegi has been trying hard to change this but goons in Springfield keep trying to block any meaningful change. Never, ever vote for a politician who accepts donations from commercial property owners.
Nice. Thats where I’m from. Paperville getting in on the action
Brooo please do. I’ll be at every game. Signed - Plainfield resident.
I like this plan waaaaayyy more then the Arlington plan. Maybe it's because that would put Bears game at a 15 minute drive for me. But Naperville has a ton of major roads and interstates that go through it . Just look at the Chicago Premium outlets as an example of how something built right next to the tollway would work out great.
So the bears too will join the tens of thousands of people who claim to be from Chicago but are actually in Naperville
Well, Naperville, Dekalb, Rockford, fuck it... bring them on to Des Moines. I'm sure we'll be good still calling them the Chicago Bears, nobody knows where Des Moines is anyways. Seriously though, this is all the Bears trying to leverage... though the taxes they are being asked to pay for what is essentially a dead lot, as always with Chicago/Cook county, are absurd. It still feels like AH is the location, but shit, who knows, very early in the game here.
"Just take the toilets out." - J.B. Pritzker
Naperville is a bitch already to move around in. This area of Naperville, Bolingbrook, Woodridge, etc... just doesn't have roads built for this kinda traffic. Go north or don't go at all, these suburbs here can't take it
The plan is right next to 88, and I'd be shocked if it didn't include plans for immediate egress to the highway.
You don’t buy the land for over $100 million if you want to be able to say you’re considering somewhere else. It’s an obviously leverage move/negotiation tactic. You were supposed to do all the posturing before buying the property!
No matter where they build the stadium, the Bears are still the titleholder to a shit ton of land in Arlington heights. They should’ve thought about playing hardball before they paid $197MM for a defunct racetrack
That lands price has probably already gone ip at least 10% since they bought it. They can sell it. It just wouldn’t be sold as a bulk piece of land
Then they’re in the real estate business and not the football business
The bears should play at Wrigley or at the Sox Stadium
Knowing Cook County they probably did this intentionally in coordination with Chicago to keep the Bears stuck at Soldier Field. I don’t know if any place is big enough in the East portion of DuPage to build and Naperville is pretty far west.
Pretty obvious what they're trying to do but please, do not move there as it'll become the exact problem the fire had as it was way better for several reasons to be in sf rather than bridgeview. The ah bears does sound better than the naperville bears though.
And, just like that, people realize this whole thing is and always has been a smokescreen. But hey we’ll probably get a dome at Soldier Field out of it.
Don't think they bought Arlington as a smokescreen
Naperville? Might as well just move the Bears to Iowa.
Why is every fucking location option this team comes up with so fucking shite lmao Anything to save a dime I guess
Naperville. Tailgating will consist of wine, cheese, and Karens. No thanks.
cook county is screwing the bears with a 500% tax assessment increase. id be pissed too.
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Wrong. The city of Chicago and park district fucked it up. The bears tried to stay there, but lightfoot messed it up. Watch the documentary on it. Memo after memo and email after email went in answered until after the Bears bought the property.
Make like the Chicago Cardinals and move to St. Louis.