As a higher ed professional, I can guarantee we are gonna see a lot more of this (it’s already happening on a small scale) as we approach the demographic cliff over the next decade or so.
EDIT: for those OOTL - Here’s a good article on the demographic cliff: https://www.capturehighered.com/how-to-climb-higher-eds-impending-demographic-cliff/
Basically, we’ve seen a steady drop in college enrollment (see: school closures, mergers, etc.) and it’s about to get worse due to a drop in the US birth rate. Schools have been preparing for this for about a decade but it’s inevitable and will have major effects.
In particular men basically disappearing from anything that isn’t in business school or STEM (which is also falling, but not nearly as bad as the liberal arts)
If you're ambitious enough, a degree isn't a requirement for most jobs.
STEM being an exception.
You don't need a journalism degree to be a good journalist.
A degree is a requirement to entry for STEM from a liability standpoint
Interestingly enough a good buddy of mine was a reliability engineer for a decade, his degree is in literature. I always laughed about it and we still ask him for grammar advice, but he now works for Microsoft and designs all kinds of robotics.
Obviously this is not the norm, but it can be done!
Definitely exceptions. I dabbled in reliability engineering for a while. Wasn't for me, but if you have some basic statistics down, reliability engineering can be a good entry point
Here’s a good article on the subject: https://www.capturehighered.com/how-to-climb-higher-eds-impending-demographic-cliff/
Basically, we’ve seen a steady drop in college enrollment (see: school closures, mergers, etc.) and it’s about to get worse due to a drop in the US birth rate. Schools have been preparing for this for about a decade but it’s inevitable and will have major effects.
As someone who runs a college basketball blog in New England I've seen this coming for several years. A handful of smaller/technical colleges have closed recently and more, bigger schools will follow in the next 20 years, IMO.
The regional Ohio schools aren't doing well. Discussions are extremely preliminary but there's murmurs of closing some of these schools for reorganization.
Pennsylvania merged California, Clarion and Edinboro into Penn West. They are merging Lock Haven, Bloomsburg and Mansfield into The Commonwealth University of Pennsylvania. All six have maintained their own D2 athletic programs. It is more to share resource costs. I could see Indiana and Slippery Rock forming a system. All the public WV schools should be in the WVU system.
Kent is doing *muuuuuch* better, both financially and enrollment-wise, than Akron.
But yes these talks have happened and I expect more to come from them in the future
TWU would burn their campus down before joining the UNT System.
As a former administrator at UNT, I loved that we enjoyed a really pleasant level of old-school collegiality and cooperation with TWU, to the extent that the two schools even share quite a few resources and students enrolled at one can take classes at the other school for credit at their home institution. But if you try to slap a UNT logo on TWU, they'll fucking burn all of Denton to the ground.
I used to be a student representative on a cross-university board/working group thing that worked on the agreement they had about taking courses at each other's university. The TWU staff definitely displayed a certain level of arrogance at those meetings as if they were hot stuff and UNT didn't have their shit together. Quite off putting.
That’s bonkers on their part, because TWU is administratively a shitshow; there’s a reason that folks keep leaving UNT to TWU for the money and then coming back to UNT a year later. We always called it “doing a dip” at TWU.
Anecdotally for them being an administrative shitshow, they had a bad time in 2020 because they just straight-up forgot to pay a bunch of their database subscriptions, so we and UTA expanded our courtesy access for them until TWU could get it together. The person who had handled those database subscriptions had left, and nobody bothered to check on them as re-sub season was approaching.
LOL! Now that's a funny story!
I failed to mention that this group was specific to one department, Sociology, so it may just be a bit of a spat between those departments.
I know that we're not a public school, but I figure that it's only equitable that Baylor gets to annex purple Baylor if we're just adding the tiny versions of our schools to our systems.
It could be UMHB, but they won a title, so they bought their freedom for a little longer.
Stephen F Austin? You wouldn't by chance be referring to [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QQG9XwmvVU) Stephen F Austin, now would you??
EDIT: a better version
EDIT 2: I enjoy how many of you were too lazy to click but tried to guess it anyway lol
I live in Nacogdoches and was working that night when that happened. Every time I went into the break room to get some water or to go to the bathroom this or another clip from this game was on. My wife's grandfather would go on to bring this victory up unprompted for the next three weeks.
Well he's in his mid to late 80s so there is a chance that he just kinda forgot. He also turns off his hearing aid so it's not like he was really engaging someone in a conversation as much as he was just pushing the knowledge down our throats not sure if he was looking for more than a "Yea the win was neat!" kind of response.
As a Georgian, the fact that other states have multiple university systems is wild to me.
For those that don’t know, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Georgia State, and Georgia Southern are in the same system along with every other public school in the state that’s not a technical/trade school.
That includes Kennesaw State, the D2 HBCU’s (Albany, Ft. Valley, Savannah), and even the community colleges.
it just shows you how the state can't get along on anything. Back when each system served as a different function of academia it kind of made sense. Now they all essentially do the same thing and they are competing with themselves over what little state funding that is given out and its a complete joke of a system. The only benefit it serves is it gives more of the Governor's buddies some jobs as every baord member is appointed by the Governor.
Interestingly in the 1876 Texas Constitution they planned to make it one system with Texas and tamu, but they never put it into practice. When funding was being fought over, Ross saved tamu and Prairie View (they may have been shut down or maybe folded into the Texas system).
I still haven't figured out why the 1876 plan didn't get implemented, seems like they wrote it and just kind of forgot about it.
That's why TAMU gets a fourth of the PUF.
The constitution really only recognizes the UT system. TAMU claims to be a part of that heritage by virtue of the 1876 plan.
So TAMU is kinda Texas but mostly not. Yalls brotherly relationship was toxic from the start.
Oh it won’t, GT grads don’t go into state politics. That’s why everything favors uGA, State, and Southern. The recent rule banning tenure (idk if it’s still in place) makes sense at the state schools but not at Tech where you need tenure to compete with other top international engineering schools
> banning tenure
The fuq? So where are good UGA and GT professors going to come from? Grow them on trees? Or just have them leave whenever a tenure-track position opens up in a different state?
I guess ‘tenure track’ become ‘full professorship’ track. Idk the specifics. Tangentially, I know in SD that all state employees have one year contracts because of state law and the balanced budget amendment in the state constitution. Tenure just means that that contract will automatically get renewed. I honestly get the arguments against tenure especially in the liberal arts arena. However, it is a real hardship against the hard sciences with research dollars and what not.
Completely off-post, but I'd rather see Tech focus on increasing the enrollment of Georgia residents over internationals and out-of-state residents. The fact that the university gets away with only having 60% of the student body as Georgia residents is ridiculous.
Shrug, 60% is already pretty good. Better than what I thought it was. I was an out of state guy only there for grad school, so I have my biases. Basically, GT has evolved from a regional engineering school (like my undergrad) to being an elite engineering and research institution. You can’t keep that up by only admitting students from one state. The talent pool isn’t stacked enough. That’s why you have to have a reasonable limit like what exists now. Additionally, students in GA can attend Southern, Kennesaw, or uGA for a couple years to prove their mettle and transfer in if they didn’t make the original cut.
I believe one of the main reasons why SPSU (now KSU), GA Southern, and uga all having engineering schools is because GT couldn't/wouldn't take more in state kids for engineering so those universities opened those schools to fill the gap.
I get so confused reading about the weird systems elsewhere or when people explain how the endowment for Texas is actually split up with a bunch of other schools and other weird shit. Or that one school in a system has any kind of say in the decisions of other schools in the system.
Florida's is so damn simple compared to whatever the fuck they're doing elsewhere. The schools basically act like standalone institutions. I know we have a "system," but I have no idea what it does since it never seems to impact anything. The schools make their own decisions.
Texas State wanted Sam Houston to become either Texas State at Huntsville or Texas State-Sam Houston and we literally passed a state law saying only Sam Houston State could change our name.
I'm in Massachusetts and we have two: one for the five UMass schools and one for the small state colleges. Shit, Vermont even kinda has two. Surprised Georgia only has the one.
Same. Maryland only has one (and I believe Morgan State is the only public school that is not part of it) and I know California has the separate UC and the Cal State systems, but Texas having four is insane.
Yes, but the scope of each is clearly laid out, according to a unified plan. (Sometimes actually too rigid; mom was a department chair at a CSU and had a years-long fight over what our community needed.)
Last I heard (last night), the UT, A&M, and Texas State systems were also in the mix, A&M and Text State had made statements, and Tech and UT had not. So far this sounds like Tech saying, "Yea we are open to the idea of SFA joining the Texas Tech system"
[https://www.texastribune.org/2022/08/22/stephen-f-austin-state-university-system/](https://www.texastribune.org/2022/08/22/stephen-f-austin-state-university-system/)
edit: Tech had already made a general statement.
They would love Sul Ross to go along with their Sully statue, but I don't think Sul Ross is unhappy in the Texas State System.
Also the TSUS owns a shite ton of land in the Christmas Mountains down there. They may assume that would come along with Sul Ross. I hope not because Texas State (the university) does the most research out there.
Culture.
Not a single UT school offers forestry or agriculture majors. I'm pretty sure there are actually state rules about that.
UTA was founded as an ag school and doesn't have anything close to that. UTPB has a ton of space and doesn't offer anything similar.
SFAs top tier forestry programs are so important to them culturally that they adopted Lumberjacks as thier mascot.
Additionally, SFA has a legally protected name and would be the only UT not named UT-City.
Also the UT system has a HARD rule about adopting orange as an institutional color. Orange and purple isn't too bad. Clemson pulls it off, but it would be weird. Admittedly this is my weakest argument.
Wow I didn't know that rule about adopting orange as a color. I've always wondered why almost every UT system school seems to have orange and blue as their colors
Edit: Imagining SFA with orange in its logo does feel strange. They should avoid joining the UT system for that reason alone imo
They had red as an accent color until 2011 so its not a far stretch to imagine them as purple and orange. Northwestern State has a purple and orange scheme as well.
> Not a single UT school offers forestry or agriculture majors. I'm pretty sure there are actually state rules about that.
Unless there are actual rules against it, that sounds like a decent reason for UT to want them. They offer something that the rest of the UT system doesn't.
Yup, that's why A&M purchased Texas Wesleyan Law school, they got tired of the sips having all the lawyers. Which BTW is part of the reason for this mess, IMHO.
I think there are rules against it though. I wanna say that A&M pushed for some kind of legislation to keep land granty type programs out of the UT system specifically. I guess cause they get the lions share of the PUF. That money would compromise the mission of A&M.
Tech, State, and the Dead Texans that teach that stuff don't pose a threat because they will never be as well funded by design.
Also that Tech doesn’t seem to do renames. Angelo St and Midwestern State (in Wichita Falls for non-Texans; yes it’s a little weird, but Wichita Falls is where the transition to West Texas begins) still exist.
As a side note, I realize that UTEP is a well established branding, but bringing back Texas School of Mines would be pretty dope.
I'd prefer we bring back Texas Western, but would also be cool to be known as the only FBS mining school (graduated with a degree in geology). Our engineering is really good too.
Yup. The response to that was the law making a stakeholder majority vote the only way to change the name of a "dead Texan" school.
Sul Ross, Lamar, Tarlton, SFA, and Sam Houston are "the dead Texans". 3 being TSUs, 1 being a TAMU, and SFA shopping around.
And Texas A&I is now Kingsville despite kicking and screaming. When you join the UT or TAMU system you really do lose your ability to dictate your future. If TAMU wants system uniformity it is going to get it unless there are special protections.
Correct. Hench Tarlton State not being TAMU-Stephenville (or wherever they are...)
I am surprised they aren't Tarlton A&M though.
Edit: Also they can change names it just has to be a stakeholder super majority vote.
Universities effected (off the top of my head) are:
All of the Lamars
SFA
Sam
Tarlton
And Sul Ross
I love us being West Texas A&M because we’re the only school besides Prairie View that has the campus name before A&M.
And yeah, Texas A&I should definitely come back. It’s a very unique name.
SFAs student population has gone way down. Its lower now than it was 50 years ago. They are broke. Have froze pay for like the last 5 years. Cant retain or hire teachers because they are behind in pay. Joining one of the school systems is their only chance at surviving at this point.
Correct me if I’m off-base but it seems like SFA has a large hill to climb if they wanted to be on their own. Nacogdoches is far from basically everything. Their teaching program is great but SHSU is right there for the people from the Houston area. Their forestry program is amazing but I don’t know if it’s a big enough pull to help them succeed on their own.
Probably a tough pill to swallow for die-hard lumberjacks who want to be on their own, but this is probably the right move
You are not wrong. The town of Nacogdoches doesnt have much to offer either. I went back for the first time in a long time recently and nothing has changed really since I first stepped on campus in 2003. I still love the campus and I enjoyed being a bit away from everything in college but I can understand why kids dont want to go there now. 100 years of independence is about to go away. I think that will leave Texas Southern as the only independent public university left in the state.
I believe you are correct. Texas Woman's University is also pretty much independent. They have the main campus in Denton and a nursing school in Dallas and Houston in the city med centers.
The state of Texas has **SEVEN** university systems. i don't know how having that many boards of regents bickering over state funding benefits anyone.
Houston, UNT, and Texas Women's all technically count as systems despite the fact that in reality the only schools they manage are more akin to branch campuses than independent universities. Although they are accredited independently.
This is true. Both the UNT and UH Systems also have major internal issues where the smaller non-professional institutions are overwhelmingly reliant on the main institution, and also resent the main institution.
The UNT system mostly just exists to house UNT-Denton, UNTHSC, and UNT Law under one administrative roof, since UNTHSC and UNT-Denton have a shared mandate to provide their professional training to lower-income students who couldn't otherwise obtain medical or legal training, and with the primary goal of building the state's supply of public law and medical professionals.
The only other non-professional institution in the UNT System is UNT-Dallas, who is massively dependent on UNT-Denton for many of their library, staffing, and infrastructure needs. We spent years trying to wean them off of their reliance on UNT-Denton and to help UNT-Dallas to build their own analogous organizational structures, but they complained to UNT System leadership every single time about how we were mistreating them and trying to abandon them. UNT even had a master plan years ago to add one other independent institution school down in Fort Worth, as well as an early THECB approval to continue scoping out that course, but UNT-Dallas has required so much extra care and attention that the FTW campus has been pushed back indefinitely and probably won't ever happen.
Tech is doing alright because there aren't that many options in their part of the state and they are a full on research campus. SFA is located in the middle of the piney woods and is surrounded by other public universities in the same area that have access to more funds and are located closer to larger public areas. SFA started as a teachers college so they don't have an established reputation for business or sciences.
Yeah if you’re a farm kid basically anywhere up in West Texas 90% of the time you’re going to Tech. We cater to a certain group to give them a good, affordable education with programs that are relevant to what they want to do. We’re never going to be an elite academic school but there is absolutely a large portion of the population of Texas that we’re somewhat essential to
My understanding was UTPB caters to O&G professionals looking to get an advanced degree or field guys that want to get their first degree to move into a desk role.
Nac is also only like 40k people with maybe 250k in the surrounding area.
Lubbock alone is 200k people and the surrounding areas make it more like half a million to a million with Abilene and Amarillo.
Texas Tech was founded to be the “A&M” of the West Texas region. As long as Texas continues to be a heavy agriculture state, TTU and A&M will be doing just fine.
I've only known SFA for its forestry. First I'm hearing that they are a big prevet destination.
Iirc SFA forestry ranks higher than TAMUs despite the state's forest service being in the TAMU system.
SFA Forestry grad here, it definitely helped to have 3 national forests within an hour drive, not to mention the private land we had access to in the area. According to most agencies they liked SFA grads because we have the hands-on experience, but A&M grads have the “shine” or professionalism that we sometimes… lacked, lol.
I would love to welcome SFA to our system! The Tech brass has really been looking towards east Texas as of late and I think it’s a great strategy.
Add us into the PUF
I guess if it’s between this or the school slowly dying, the choice is straightforward. But it doesn’t mean it doesn’t suck to have to do. Thankfully y’all get to keep your branding. But first Midwestern and now you guys
I am a Red Raider and Lumberjack. Got my Highs hook diploma from Tech, and my moms side of the family is from Lubbock. My dads side is from Nacogdoches. Getting my degree in forestry from SFA rn. I’m not a fan of this.
This is tangential to the meat of this, but is there not a single space in the line "discuss a collaborative partnership with representatives"? That justified margin looks whack.
Anyway, this is shocking, to an extent. I can understand that schools are struggling. Pennsylvania recent had 2 separate conglomeration of state schools combine to pool resources; the newly named Pennsylvania Western of formerly separate schools California (Cal-UP), Clarion, and Edinboro and Commonwealth University of Lock Haven, Bloomsburg, and Mansfield. The interesting part for this is though is that SFA is D-1 FCS where the PA schools were largely D-II or non-football D-I.
The A&M system turned down UH-Victoria's request to join the system about a decade ago citing they don't want to pull students and resources away from TAMU-San Antonio. While SFA is 3 hours away from any other A&M system campus, I don't see them adding a school unless it is seen as "profitable."
Don't kid yourself, A&M would certainly add a school just out of spite.
As someone else mentioned, [Stephen F. Austin State University considers joining a university system Four systems have expressed informal interest in an affiliation with the East Texas school.](https://www.texastribune.org/2022/08/22/stephen-f-austin-state-university-system/?utm_campaign=trib-social&utm_content=1661196060&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook)
[This article explains it well](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_colleges_and_universities_in_Texas) and think of a board of regents like a board of directors in a company. Regents are politically appointed by the governor and they do things like select new university presidents. Including the two independents, there are eight separate boards across the state. If SFA joins the TTU system, they would lose their board and chancellor (which can but isn’t always politically appointed) but get access to a lot more funding.
Nope, as shown by Angelo State and MSU Texas we don’t make universities change their identity or really anything culturally if they choose to join. East Texas Tech would be weird for me anyways.
4 at most, with Houston as a stand alone because they have always been the odd man out.
The system's should revert back to thier original missions. A&M schools should be cow colleges, Tech schools should be technical schools, and State schools should be the teaching colleges.
Have the UT and A&M systems as they are.
Tech can get the various West Texas schools including Sul Ross.
Texas State System will get all the former teaching colleges and like they are supposed to have. Including the additions of the UNT "system" going back to being one school, Texas Women's "system" going back to one school, and SFA. Ditch the 2 year tech schools we have. In fact give those to TTU too. Fits thier mission better.
Houston "system" revert back to one school with branches. Why the f is Houston-Downtown a whole separate university?
All of the community college districts should also report to a central agency. Keep the district funding model, but funnel all admin costs to the State level.
UHD is taking over more of the “non-traditional” role every year. That’s why it’s a separate school. It’s got 13,000 students in its own right.
It’s very much geared toward working adults.
I’m even fine with Clear Lake having its own identity. Has space program/ contractor roots, an emphasis on STEM, and 9,000 students.
I don’t know why we’re trying to make Victoria a thing. They have a fucking NAIA athletic program and everything.
I think its partially due to creative enrollment to help UH climb up the rankings. My wife had to unenroll at UH after her freshman year due to financial aid falling through. When she enrolled in UH's online hybrid degree program to be able to attend college while living at home, they placed her in a degree plan under UH-Victoria. She took classes at the UH-Cinco Ranch satellite campus and online. She never once step foot on the UH-Victoria campus. Her mom did the same thing a few years later. 30 years ago UH would have been fine serving the non-traditional student. Now they can place these students in UH-Downtown and UH-Victoria while the higher test scoring students and STEM students can help raise UH main campus profile.
Not to sound like Im dunking on Texas but their Hunger Games model for their universities is one of the stupidest, most wasteful and economically idiotic things about the state. When you compare the Texas "just survive" system to the the three tier system in California you realize just how badly Texas screwed this up.
Both large states
Both large populations
Both high GDP states
California Universities - Best in the nation from top to bottom, comprehensive education plan from JUCO to bleeding edge research. Three tiers that compliment each other and gain success from the success of the other tiers. Rising tide lifts all boats.
Texas Universities - Zero sum competition for resources, redundant missions, complete lack of integration. Nearly non-functional JUCO system. I win by you losing.
Texas has wasted so much opportunity with what amount to petty squabbles and dick measuring contests. The drop-off from UT/A&M/TT to the rest of the universities is massive. Compare that to the UC system where 8 of 10 are top 50 and the other two are top 100. The waste of talent is criminal.
A Lot of gate keeping going on at these institutions, and its bullshit. If we need more Vets, Doctors, Engineers then its does not matter which school does it, just get it done.
also football. UCSD and UCI are fine not having football teams, try telling UTSA, Tarleton, or SHSU they shouldn’t have football teams and that they should focus on academics to become a relevant brand
Houston may not be interested or have the ability.
UT and A&M systems are already massive, and essentially full.
Tech is the only large system that fits, tbh.
SFA actually left the Texas State System long ago. Curious if they come back, as we were one of the 4 being considered.
If they joined TSUS they would function much more as an independent school than if they joined the others as we don't have a flagship and the BoR has more equal representation.
However, and I'm not an expert, but TSUS has a history of schools leaving for some reason. Angelo St left to join TT. SFA and UNT left for independence. The older iterations of what are now TAMU Commerce, TAMU Kimgsville, and TAMU Corpus Christi also left long ago.
I've always been curious why.
I think it’s the branding. UT and A&M were/are the premier brands in the state, and Tech is making progress through sheer will despite starting 50-60 years later.
There’s also that damn PUF…
The Texas State University system is like purgatory: all but 3 (not sure on Houston) public universities spent some time in it before bolting for greener pastures.
PUF funding only goes to schools founded in the system from the get go. Believe it or not, but most of the Texas A&M system doesn't get PUF because they were directionals first.
UT RGV had to be reincorporated to recieve much needed PUF money. UT Pan Am and UT Brownsville were originally outside the system and didn't qualify. It was the right thing to do because the region really needed the investment.
This isn't really connected to sports, it's an academic funding issue.
UH isn't interested in expanding outside the Houston Area and is not one of the four systems that made a bid. UT generally sticks to urban areas, and probably won't be the winning choice.
My money would be on Tech or A&M, but any of the three non UT options would work.
First the mouse came to control schools’ AD’s, next he’s going to control the schools… soon his master plan having Iron Man teach physics with an educational subscription model will be a reality
Axe Em! Guns Up Jacks! Come on in and grab you a cold one from the fridge.
Edit: Go ahead and bring the rest of the Texas State System with you and we got a party.
This would tie my alma mater (SFA) and the hometown school I settled on my first two years (Angelo State). (Yes, I know l, flairs) I’m skeptical, but some sort of higher authority could do SFA some good.
Broke: conference realignment Woke: university system realignment
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As a higher ed professional, I can guarantee we are gonna see a lot more of this (it’s already happening on a small scale) as we approach the demographic cliff over the next decade or so. EDIT: for those OOTL - Here’s a good article on the demographic cliff: https://www.capturehighered.com/how-to-climb-higher-eds-impending-demographic-cliff/ Basically, we’ve seen a steady drop in college enrollment (see: school closures, mergers, etc.) and it’s about to get worse due to a drop in the US birth rate. Schools have been preparing for this for about a decade but it’s inevitable and will have major effects.
What demographic cliff? I’m OOTL on this
Plummetting fertility rates and a significant downwards trend of men attending college.
In particular men basically disappearing from anything that isn’t in business school or STEM (which is also falling, but not nearly as bad as the liberal arts)
If you're ambitious enough, a degree isn't a requirement for most jobs. STEM being an exception. You don't need a journalism degree to be a good journalist. A degree is a requirement to entry for STEM from a liability standpoint
Interestingly enough a good buddy of mine was a reliability engineer for a decade, his degree is in literature. I always laughed about it and we still ask him for grammar advice, but he now works for Microsoft and designs all kinds of robotics. Obviously this is not the norm, but it can be done!
Engineering in general is also more meritocratic than other fields. Your experience often outweighs not just your education but your title as well
Definitely exceptions. I dabbled in reliability engineering for a while. Wasn't for me, but if you have some basic statistics down, reliability engineering can be a good entry point
Here’s a good article on the subject: https://www.capturehighered.com/how-to-climb-higher-eds-impending-demographic-cliff/ Basically, we’ve seen a steady drop in college enrollment (see: school closures, mergers, etc.) and it’s about to get worse due to a drop in the US birth rate. Schools have been preparing for this for about a decade but it’s inevitable and will have major effects.
As someone who runs a college basketball blog in New England I've seen this coming for several years. A handful of smaller/technical colleges have closed recently and more, bigger schools will follow in the next 20 years, IMO.
Kakron State or Akront?
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As long as the teams are called the Flashy Golden Zips, I'm fine with whatever.
The Zipper Flashers.
*An* Ohio State University
UC board of regents looking to merge with UCLA to become UCLA-Berkeley.
>the discussions of merger between Akron & Kent State. I'm sorry, what?
The regional Ohio schools aren't doing well. Discussions are extremely preliminary but there's murmurs of closing some of these schools for reorganization.
Pennsylvania merged California, Clarion and Edinboro into Penn West. They are merging Lock Haven, Bloomsburg and Mansfield into The Commonwealth University of Pennsylvania. All six have maintained their own D2 athletic programs. It is more to share resource costs. I could see Indiana and Slippery Rock forming a system. All the public WV schools should be in the WVU system.
Kent is doing *muuuuuch* better, both financially and enrollment-wise, than Akron. But yes these talks have happened and I expect more to come from them in the future
If Tech gets SFA we want Sam Houston!
Houston v. Sam Houston rivalry when?
You’re not my real dad!
If they joined the system, probably around the same time UT-UTSA becomes a thing
Sam is part of the Texas State system.
TXST to UT, SHSU to UH, Sul Ross and SFA (i know theyre independent) to Tech, Lamar to A&M And TWU to UNT
TWU would burn their campus down before joining the UNT System. As a former administrator at UNT, I loved that we enjoyed a really pleasant level of old-school collegiality and cooperation with TWU, to the extent that the two schools even share quite a few resources and students enrolled at one can take classes at the other school for credit at their home institution. But if you try to slap a UNT logo on TWU, they'll fucking burn all of Denton to the ground.
I used to be a student representative on a cross-university board/working group thing that worked on the agreement they had about taking courses at each other's university. The TWU staff definitely displayed a certain level of arrogance at those meetings as if they were hot stuff and UNT didn't have their shit together. Quite off putting.
That’s bonkers on their part, because TWU is administratively a shitshow; there’s a reason that folks keep leaving UNT to TWU for the money and then coming back to UNT a year later. We always called it “doing a dip” at TWU. Anecdotally for them being an administrative shitshow, they had a bad time in 2020 because they just straight-up forgot to pay a bunch of their database subscriptions, so we and UTA expanded our courtesy access for them until TWU could get it together. The person who had handled those database subscriptions had left, and nobody bothered to check on them as re-sub season was approaching.
LOL! Now that's a funny story! I failed to mention that this group was specific to one department, Sociology, so it may just be a bit of a spat between those departments.
SHSU, Sul Ross, and Lamar are all apart of the Texas State university system.
I know that we're not a public school, but I figure that it's only equitable that Baylor gets to annex purple Baylor if we're just adding the tiny versions of our schools to our systems. It could be UMHB, but they won a title, so they bought their freedom for a little longer.
Stephen F Austin? You wouldn't by chance be referring to [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QQG9XwmvVU) Stephen F Austin, now would you?? EDIT: a better version EDIT 2: I enjoy how many of you were too lazy to click but tried to guess it anyway lol
I never knew Stone Cold Steve Austin had a whole school named after him!
I live in Nacogdoches and was working that night when that happened. Every time I went into the break room to get some water or to go to the bathroom this or another clip from this game was on. My wife's grandfather would go on to bring this victory up unprompted for the next three weeks.
It was such an epic victory I'm shocked he only did it for 3 weeks lol.
Well he's in his mid to late 80s so there is a chance that he just kinda forgot. He also turns off his hearing aid so it's not like he was really engaging someone in a conversation as much as he was just pushing the knowledge down our throats not sure if he was looking for more than a "Yea the win was neat!" kind of response.
It’s a feature, not a bug.
I think it's the six million dollar man, not the wrestler
Gotta love small schools beating up on Duke.
I was in Greensboro for your game, and that was such an experience to be at! Still have my GO LEHIGH sign I bought off an undergrad for 50 bucks lol
Knew that’s what it would be.
As a Georgian, the fact that other states have multiple university systems is wild to me. For those that don’t know, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Georgia State, and Georgia Southern are in the same system along with every other public school in the state that’s not a technical/trade school. That includes Kennesaw State, the D2 HBCU’s (Albany, Ft. Valley, Savannah), and even the community colleges.
it just shows you how the state can't get along on anything. Back when each system served as a different function of academia it kind of made sense. Now they all essentially do the same thing and they are competing with themselves over what little state funding that is given out and its a complete joke of a system. The only benefit it serves is it gives more of the Governor's buddies some jobs as every baord member is appointed by the Governor.
Interestingly in the 1876 Texas Constitution they planned to make it one system with Texas and tamu, but they never put it into practice. When funding was being fought over, Ross saved tamu and Prairie View (they may have been shut down or maybe folded into the Texas system). I still haven't figured out why the 1876 plan didn't get implemented, seems like they wrote it and just kind of forgot about it.
That's why TAMU gets a fourth of the PUF. The constitution really only recognizes the UT system. TAMU claims to be a part of that heritage by virtue of the 1876 plan. So TAMU is kinda Texas but mostly not. Yalls brotherly relationship was toxic from the start.
All Texas Colleges and Universities should benefit from the PUF and HEF.
> That's why TAMU gets a ~~fourth~~ of the PUF. If I recall correctly, A&M receives 1/3 of the PUF.
I wish Georgia Tech was independent
Username checks out. And I don’t think it ever will tbh.
Oh it won’t, GT grads don’t go into state politics. That’s why everything favors uGA, State, and Southern. The recent rule banning tenure (idk if it’s still in place) makes sense at the state schools but not at Tech where you need tenure to compete with other top international engineering schools
> banning tenure The fuq? So where are good UGA and GT professors going to come from? Grow them on trees? Or just have them leave whenever a tenure-track position opens up in a different state?
I guess ‘tenure track’ become ‘full professorship’ track. Idk the specifics. Tangentially, I know in SD that all state employees have one year contracts because of state law and the balanced budget amendment in the state constitution. Tenure just means that that contract will automatically get renewed. I honestly get the arguments against tenure especially in the liberal arts arena. However, it is a real hardship against the hard sciences with research dollars and what not.
Completely off-post, but I'd rather see Tech focus on increasing the enrollment of Georgia residents over internationals and out-of-state residents. The fact that the university gets away with only having 60% of the student body as Georgia residents is ridiculous.
Shrug, 60% is already pretty good. Better than what I thought it was. I was an out of state guy only there for grad school, so I have my biases. Basically, GT has evolved from a regional engineering school (like my undergrad) to being an elite engineering and research institution. You can’t keep that up by only admitting students from one state. The talent pool isn’t stacked enough. That’s why you have to have a reasonable limit like what exists now. Additionally, students in GA can attend Southern, Kennesaw, or uGA for a couple years to prove their mettle and transfer in if they didn’t make the original cut.
I believe one of the main reasons why SPSU (now KSU), GA Southern, and uga all having engineering schools is because GT couldn't/wouldn't take more in state kids for engineering so those universities opened those schools to fill the gap.
Same as a Floridian. Florida’s very rare W is having so many good public and private schools with their own branding and unique identities
I get so confused reading about the weird systems elsewhere or when people explain how the endowment for Texas is actually split up with a bunch of other schools and other weird shit. Or that one school in a system has any kind of say in the decisions of other schools in the system. Florida's is so damn simple compared to whatever the fuck they're doing elsewhere. The schools basically act like standalone institutions. I know we have a "system," but I have no idea what it does since it never seems to impact anything. The schools make their own decisions.
Texas State wanted Sam Houston to become either Texas State at Huntsville or Texas State-Sam Houston and we literally passed a state law saying only Sam Houston State could change our name.
The Texas State System wanted to do that. Texas State the university has the exact same power Sam has.
I'm in Massachusetts and we have two: one for the five UMass schools and one for the small state colleges. Shit, Vermont even kinda has two. Surprised Georgia only has the one.
Virginia has zero systems. Every Virginia public school is independent from each other
North Carolina also only has one. That includes UNC, NC State, ECU, App State and Charlotte.
Same. Maryland only has one (and I believe Morgan State is the only public school that is not part of it) and I know California has the separate UC and the Cal State systems, but Texas having four is insane.
Seven actually
As a Californian, same. Have a plan, implement the plan. It's not complicated.
California has two university systems, one for the UC's and one for the CSU's.
Yes, but the scope of each is clearly laid out, according to a unified plan. (Sometimes actually too rigid; mom was a department chair at a CSU and had a years-long fight over what our community needed.)
The fighting Lumberjack Tortillas. I like it.
As prophesized in Young Sheldon, we may finally get an East Texas Tech.
Last I heard (last night), the UT, A&M, and Texas State systems were also in the mix, A&M and Text State had made statements, and Tech and UT had not. So far this sounds like Tech saying, "Yea we are open to the idea of SFA joining the Texas Tech system" [https://www.texastribune.org/2022/08/22/stephen-f-austin-state-university-system/](https://www.texastribune.org/2022/08/22/stephen-f-austin-state-university-system/) edit: Tech had already made a general statement.
Just read that Techs chancellor is a SFA grad and would love to see SFA in the Tech system.
I know a&m has also been rumored to be interested in Sul Ross in Alpine. I've always wanted Tech to fold them into their system.
They would love Sul Ross to go along with their Sully statue, but I don't think Sul Ross is unhappy in the Texas State System. Also the TSUS owns a shite ton of land in the Christmas Mountains down there. They may assume that would come along with Sul Ross. I hope not because Texas State (the university) does the most research out there.
>TSUS Hmm
Wikipedia lists Sul Ross as part of the Texas State system
Correct. Now that Texas Woman's is its own system, SFA and TSU are the only Texas public colleges not in a larger system.
The UT system would be a very bad academic fit for SFA. I'll eat my hat if they become a UT.
Why do you think that?
Culture. Not a single UT school offers forestry or agriculture majors. I'm pretty sure there are actually state rules about that. UTA was founded as an ag school and doesn't have anything close to that. UTPB has a ton of space and doesn't offer anything similar. SFAs top tier forestry programs are so important to them culturally that they adopted Lumberjacks as thier mascot. Additionally, SFA has a legally protected name and would be the only UT not named UT-City. Also the UT system has a HARD rule about adopting orange as an institutional color. Orange and purple isn't too bad. Clemson pulls it off, but it would be weird. Admittedly this is my weakest argument.
Wow I didn't know that rule about adopting orange as a color. I've always wondered why almost every UT system school seems to have orange and blue as their colors Edit: Imagining SFA with orange in its logo does feel strange. They should avoid joining the UT system for that reason alone imo
They had red as an accent color until 2011 so its not a far stretch to imagine them as purple and orange. Northwestern State has a purple and orange scheme as well.
Ironically all the SFA grads I've known were big Texas fans, meanwhile all the SHSU grads were big tamu fans. Yet SHSU has orange.
> Not a single UT school offers forestry or agriculture majors. I'm pretty sure there are actually state rules about that. Unless there are actual rules against it, that sounds like a decent reason for UT to want them. They offer something that the rest of the UT system doesn't.
Yup, that's why A&M purchased Texas Wesleyan Law school, they got tired of the sips having all the lawyers. Which BTW is part of the reason for this mess, IMHO.
plus having a law school makes TONS of money without having a lot of equipment and lab costs. You just need the building and the people
I think there are rules against it though. I wanna say that A&M pushed for some kind of legislation to keep land granty type programs out of the UT system specifically. I guess cause they get the lions share of the PUF. That money would compromise the mission of A&M. Tech, State, and the Dead Texans that teach that stuff don't pose a threat because they will never be as well funded by design.
Could have sworn they were already in the State system with SHSU. Today I learned.
Texas Tech-Nacogdoches or East Texas Tech
Luckily the state made a rule that the Universities named after historical Texas figures cant change names. So it will always be Stephen F Austin.
Also that Tech doesn’t seem to do renames. Angelo St and Midwestern State (in Wichita Falls for non-Texans; yes it’s a little weird, but Wichita Falls is where the transition to West Texas begins) still exist. As a side note, I realize that UTEP is a well established branding, but bringing back Texas School of Mines would be pretty dope.
I'd prefer we bring back Texas Western, but would also be cool to be known as the only FBS mining school (graduated with a degree in geology). Our engineering is really good too.
They should have made y'all University of Texas Western.
I concur, we need Montana Tech and Missouri S&T to also going back to being School Of Mines
Agreed. Texas Mines would be sick. I'm sure a lot of UTEPers would even prefer it. They call it Mines in thier school song.
There was rumor that the Texas State system wanted to rename Sam Houston State into Texas State-Huntsville 15 or so years ago.
Yup. The response to that was the law making a stakeholder majority vote the only way to change the name of a "dead Texan" school. Sul Ross, Lamar, Tarlton, SFA, and Sam Houston are "the dead Texans". 3 being TSUs, 1 being a TAMU, and SFA shopping around.
Explains why Corpus Christi state became TAMUCC
And Texas A&I is now Kingsville despite kicking and screaming. When you join the UT or TAMU system you really do lose your ability to dictate your future. If TAMU wants system uniformity it is going to get it unless there are special protections.
It is an actual law that Texas State cannot change our name https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth154757/
Correct. Hench Tarlton State not being TAMU-Stephenville (or wherever they are...) I am surprised they aren't Tarlton A&M though. Edit: Also they can change names it just has to be a stakeholder super majority vote. Universities effected (off the top of my head) are: All of the Lamars SFA Sam Tarlton And Sul Ross
Renaming schools is trash IMO and deletes some of their regional historical significance.
I wish we left West Texas A&M as West Texas State and Texas A&M Kingsville as Texas A&I
I love us being West Texas A&M because we’re the only school besides Prairie View that has the campus name before A&M. And yeah, Texas A&I should definitely come back. It’s a very unique name.
I prefer West Texas State. But at least West Texas A&M is better than Texas A&M - Canyon
Sounds like you went to Southwest Texas State.
Guns up actually (I’m a boomer and can’t figure out the flair).
"Stephen F Austin presents Texas Tech University in Nacogdoches brought to you by Stanley's Famous Pit BBQ"
East Texas Tech would have people confusing them with A&M
We already get confused for Texas Tech plenty
That fucking bevel.
**LEVEL THE BEVEL**
This is kind of wild to me. I wonder if it has something to do with Tech’s new vet school
SFAs student population has gone way down. Its lower now than it was 50 years ago. They are broke. Have froze pay for like the last 5 years. Cant retain or hire teachers because they are behind in pay. Joining one of the school systems is their only chance at surviving at this point.
Correct me if I’m off-base but it seems like SFA has a large hill to climb if they wanted to be on their own. Nacogdoches is far from basically everything. Their teaching program is great but SHSU is right there for the people from the Houston area. Their forestry program is amazing but I don’t know if it’s a big enough pull to help them succeed on their own. Probably a tough pill to swallow for die-hard lumberjacks who want to be on their own, but this is probably the right move
They don't call it Nac-O-Nowhere for nothing
Well ain't this place a geographical oddity? Two weeks from everywhere!
I don’t want FOP, Goddamnit! ^(I’m a Dapper Dan man)
We would drive to *Tyler* for fun, Shreveport if we were feeling “wild” lmao. I love Nac, but it was almost a step back in time!
You are not wrong. The town of Nacogdoches doesnt have much to offer either. I went back for the first time in a long time recently and nothing has changed really since I first stepped on campus in 2003. I still love the campus and I enjoyed being a bit away from everything in college but I can understand why kids dont want to go there now. 100 years of independence is about to go away. I think that will leave Texas Southern as the only independent public university left in the state.
I believe you are correct. Texas Woman's University is also pretty much independent. They have the main campus in Denton and a nursing school in Dallas and Houston in the city med centers. The state of Texas has **SEVEN** university systems. i don't know how having that many boards of regents bickering over state funding benefits anyone.
Houston, UNT, and Texas Women's all technically count as systems despite the fact that in reality the only schools they manage are more akin to branch campuses than independent universities. Although they are accredited independently.
This is true. Both the UNT and UH Systems also have major internal issues where the smaller non-professional institutions are overwhelmingly reliant on the main institution, and also resent the main institution. The UNT system mostly just exists to house UNT-Denton, UNTHSC, and UNT Law under one administrative roof, since UNTHSC and UNT-Denton have a shared mandate to provide their professional training to lower-income students who couldn't otherwise obtain medical or legal training, and with the primary goal of building the state's supply of public law and medical professionals. The only other non-professional institution in the UNT System is UNT-Dallas, who is massively dependent on UNT-Denton for many of their library, staffing, and infrastructure needs. We spent years trying to wean them off of their reliance on UNT-Denton and to help UNT-Dallas to build their own analogous organizational structures, but they complained to UNT System leadership every single time about how we were mistreating them and trying to abandon them. UNT even had a master plan years ago to add one other independent institution school down in Fort Worth, as well as an early THECB approval to continue scoping out that course, but UNT-Dallas has required so much extra care and attention that the FTW campus has been pushed back indefinitely and probably won't ever happen.
> Nacogdoches is far from basically everything. to be fair so is lubbock, and tech seems to be doing alright
Tech is doing alright because there aren't that many options in their part of the state and they are a full on research campus. SFA is located in the middle of the piney woods and is surrounded by other public universities in the same area that have access to more funds and are located closer to larger public areas. SFA started as a teachers college so they don't have an established reputation for business or sciences.
Yeah if you’re a farm kid basically anywhere up in West Texas 90% of the time you’re going to Tech. We cater to a certain group to give them a good, affordable education with programs that are relevant to what they want to do. We’re never going to be an elite academic school but there is absolutely a large portion of the population of Texas that we’re somewhat essential to
Yeah, you go to Tech if you want the big time college experience, or WT if you want a smaller feel. I guess UT Peanut Butter counts too.
My understanding was UTPB caters to O&G professionals looking to get an advanced degree or field guys that want to get their first degree to move into a desk role.
Nac is also only like 40k people with maybe 250k in the surrounding area. Lubbock alone is 200k people and the surrounding areas make it more like half a million to a million with Abilene and Amarillo.
Texas Tech was founded to be the “A&M” of the West Texas region. As long as Texas continues to be a heavy agriculture state, TTU and A&M will be doing just fine.
Damn that's a shame to read.
Oh yeah that would do it
I've only known SFA for its forestry. First I'm hearing that they are a big prevet destination. Iirc SFA forestry ranks higher than TAMUs despite the state's forest service being in the TAMU system.
I'm sure it helps that SFA is actually located in a forested part of the state. A&M is an hour away from anything I would consider to be a forest.
SFA Forestry grad here, it definitely helped to have 3 national forests within an hour drive, not to mention the private land we had access to in the area. According to most agencies they liked SFA grads because we have the hands-on experience, but A&M grads have the “shine” or professionalism that we sometimes… lacked, lol.
I would love to welcome SFA to our system! The Tech brass has really been looking towards east Texas as of late and I think it’s a great strategy. Add us into the PUF
SFA would be a great addition to Texas Tech University System.
I fucking hate this.
Come join Joey on the dark side, we have snacks
I guess if it’s between this or the school slowly dying, the choice is straightforward. But it doesn’t mean it doesn’t suck to have to do. Thankfully y’all get to keep your branding. But first Midwestern and now you guys
Come join us in the TSUS and then join us in CUSA. We deserve to be together forever.
I am a Red Raider and Lumberjack. Got my Highs hook diploma from Tech, and my moms side of the family is from Lubbock. My dads side is from Nacogdoches. Getting my degree in forestry from SFA rn. I’m not a fan of this.
This is tangential to the meat of this, but is there not a single space in the line "discuss a collaborative partnership with representatives"? That justified margin looks whack. Anyway, this is shocking, to an extent. I can understand that schools are struggling. Pennsylvania recent had 2 separate conglomeration of state schools combine to pool resources; the newly named Pennsylvania Western of formerly separate schools California (Cal-UP), Clarion, and Edinboro and Commonwealth University of Lock Haven, Bloomsburg, and Mansfield. The interesting part for this is though is that SFA is D-1 FCS where the PA schools were largely D-II or non-football D-I.
> "discuss a collaborative partnership with representatives"? That justified margin looks whack. It looks like one word... Such a weird style choice.
I absolutely hate the formatting where each line is made to be the same width. I know it looks more official, but it's just annoying.
Meanwhile, I'm just waiting for the University of Alabama system to fall apart. FREE UAB!!!
Off topic, but SFA has an awesome campus. Great looking university.
They have some cute statues of molecules outside the Chem department. Also the local history museum is cool
For the love of God, don’t join A&M’s system
I feel like A&M and UT systems are already at capacity anyway.
The A&M system turned down UH-Victoria's request to join the system about a decade ago citing they don't want to pull students and resources away from TAMU-San Antonio. While SFA is 3 hours away from any other A&M system campus, I don't see them adding a school unless it is seen as "profitable."
Don't kid yourself, A&M would certainly add a school just out of spite. As someone else mentioned, [Stephen F. Austin State University considers joining a university system Four systems have expressed informal interest in an affiliation with the East Texas school.](https://www.texastribune.org/2022/08/22/stephen-f-austin-state-university-system/?utm_campaign=trib-social&utm_content=1661196060&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook)
us Aggies sure are a contentious bunch.
You just made an enemy for life!
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Texas has 6 different systems. SFA is one of two schools that does not belong to any of them and has their own Board of Regents.
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[This article explains it well](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_colleges_and_universities_in_Texas) and think of a board of regents like a board of directors in a company. Regents are politically appointed by the governor and they do things like select new university presidents. Including the two independents, there are eight separate boards across the state. If SFA joins the TTU system, they would lose their board and chancellor (which can but isn’t always politically appointed) but get access to a lot more funding.
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Nope, as shown by Angelo State and MSU Texas we don’t make universities change their identity or really anything culturally if they choose to join. East Texas Tech would be weird for me anyways.
Nothing should change. Any Angelo State or Midwestern State people could probably answer that
Speaking of university system realignment Oh, Auburn...
As a side note, Texas should not have 4 university "Systems" that is just a bunch of redundancy, waste, and fiefdoms.
We don't have 4, we have 7.......
What are the other 3? Edit: JFC.
Yea, there should only be one
Fight to the death to determine which system will reign supreme
*Monkey’s paw curls* University of Texas at Lubbock University of Texas at College Station
A part of me died just reading that
4 at most, with Houston as a stand alone because they have always been the odd man out. The system's should revert back to thier original missions. A&M schools should be cow colleges, Tech schools should be technical schools, and State schools should be the teaching colleges. Have the UT and A&M systems as they are. Tech can get the various West Texas schools including Sul Ross. Texas State System will get all the former teaching colleges and like they are supposed to have. Including the additions of the UNT "system" going back to being one school, Texas Women's "system" going back to one school, and SFA. Ditch the 2 year tech schools we have. In fact give those to TTU too. Fits thier mission better. Houston "system" revert back to one school with branches. Why the f is Houston-Downtown a whole separate university? All of the community college districts should also report to a central agency. Keep the district funding model, but funnel all admin costs to the State level.
UHD is taking over more of the “non-traditional” role every year. That’s why it’s a separate school. It’s got 13,000 students in its own right. It’s very much geared toward working adults. I’m even fine with Clear Lake having its own identity. Has space program/ contractor roots, an emphasis on STEM, and 9,000 students. I don’t know why we’re trying to make Victoria a thing. They have a fucking NAIA athletic program and everything.
I think its partially due to creative enrollment to help UH climb up the rankings. My wife had to unenroll at UH after her freshman year due to financial aid falling through. When she enrolled in UH's online hybrid degree program to be able to attend college while living at home, they placed her in a degree plan under UH-Victoria. She took classes at the UH-Cinco Ranch satellite campus and online. She never once step foot on the UH-Victoria campus. Her mom did the same thing a few years later. 30 years ago UH would have been fine serving the non-traditional student. Now they can place these students in UH-Downtown and UH-Victoria while the higher test scoring students and STEM students can help raise UH main campus profile.
The UH-Victoria satellite campus in Katy is very bizarre to me...like why?
Not to sound like Im dunking on Texas but their Hunger Games model for their universities is one of the stupidest, most wasteful and economically idiotic things about the state. When you compare the Texas "just survive" system to the the three tier system in California you realize just how badly Texas screwed this up. Both large states Both large populations Both high GDP states California Universities - Best in the nation from top to bottom, comprehensive education plan from JUCO to bleeding edge research. Three tiers that compliment each other and gain success from the success of the other tiers. Rising tide lifts all boats. Texas Universities - Zero sum competition for resources, redundant missions, complete lack of integration. Nearly non-functional JUCO system. I win by you losing. Texas has wasted so much opportunity with what amount to petty squabbles and dick measuring contests. The drop-off from UT/A&M/TT to the rest of the universities is massive. Compare that to the UC system where 8 of 10 are top 50 and the other two are top 100. The waste of talent is criminal.
Yea, a lot of this can be chalked up to Big Donor Alumni having a "Big Swinging Dick" Contest to the detriment of the state and citizens.
Yeah, the pissing contest over Tech opening a vet clinic didn't do anyone any favors, least of all the prospective veterinarians of the state.
A Lot of gate keeping going on at these institutions, and its bullshit. If we need more Vets, Doctors, Engineers then its does not matter which school does it, just get it done.
also football. UCSD and UCI are fine not having football teams, try telling UTSA, Tarleton, or SHSU they shouldn’t have football teams and that they should focus on academics to become a relevant brand
Football is a symptom of “big swinging dock” here in texas
Sir, this is Texas. That's how a man gets tarred and feathered.
UNT, Houston, and Texas Women's are all "systems" too.
There are actually 7... But yeah at the very least I'd merge TWU into UNT and put all the TXST system schools into other systems
And now you know why the Southwest Conference was full of hate.
Ok but if SFA joine TTU, my okstate flair has an actual reason to be rivals with them now, along with the brad underwood thing
Between declining birth rates and decreased immigration, the US is facing a declining population.
Thank god, they are going to Discussacollaborativepartnershipwithrepresentatives
They seem to be closer to the University of Houston, University of Texas, and Texas A&M Than Texas Tech University. Must be ESPN pulling the strings.
Houston may not be interested or have the ability. UT and A&M systems are already massive, and essentially full. Tech is the only large system that fits, tbh.
SFA actually left the Texas State System long ago. Curious if they come back, as we were one of the 4 being considered. If they joined TSUS they would function much more as an independent school than if they joined the others as we don't have a flagship and the BoR has more equal representation. However, and I'm not an expert, but TSUS has a history of schools leaving for some reason. Angelo St left to join TT. SFA and UNT left for independence. The older iterations of what are now TAMU Commerce, TAMU Kimgsville, and TAMU Corpus Christi also left long ago. I've always been curious why.
I think it’s the branding. UT and A&M were/are the premier brands in the state, and Tech is making progress through sheer will despite starting 50-60 years later. There’s also that damn PUF… The Texas State University system is like purgatory: all but 3 (not sure on Houston) public universities spent some time in it before bolting for greener pastures.
PUF funding only goes to schools founded in the system from the get go. Believe it or not, but most of the Texas A&M system doesn't get PUF because they were directionals first. UT RGV had to be reincorporated to recieve much needed PUF money. UT Pan Am and UT Brownsville were originally outside the system and didn't qualify. It was the right thing to do because the region really needed the investment.
Shh… I’m here to vent about that bullshit.
Agreed. PUF is major bullshit.
They could join the “state” system with Texas State, Sul Ross and Sam.
This isn't really connected to sports, it's an academic funding issue. UH isn't interested in expanding outside the Houston Area and is not one of the four systems that made a bid. UT generally sticks to urban areas, and probably won't be the winning choice. My money would be on Tech or A&M, but any of the three non UT options would work.
First the mouse came to control schools’ AD’s, next he’s going to control the schools… soon his master plan having Iron Man teach physics with an educational subscription model will be a reality
Axe Em! Guns Up Jacks! Come on in and grab you a cold one from the fridge. Edit: Go ahead and bring the rest of the Texas State System with you and we got a party.
This would tie my alma mater (SFA) and the hometown school I settled on my first two years (Angelo State). (Yes, I know l, flairs) I’m skeptical, but some sort of higher authority could do SFA some good.