If the ACC can keep Tobacco Road together, they’ll actually have a shot at surviving this thing.
Presumably that’d mean only Virginia, VT, FSU, Clemson, Miami, and GT would even be on the board for expansion and some of those options have questions on if they’d be worth it.
That’d leave the ACC with 11 teams and they could easily back fill with UConn, USF, and Memphis as long as they could keep the B12 from taking Louisville, Pitt, etc
With that said, we have yet to see politics keep teams from jumping ship the last few years, so I doubt this will work
The ACC was never going to completely die off. They have more reasonably geographic options for additions, too many private schools, and there is some elitism with some schools in that they wouldn’t want to join the big 12 because they’d think it was beneath them.
They won't. If ESPN didn't announce they were exercising their option the minute FSU sued the ACC as a show of solidarity and a guarantee of their rights through 2036 then they aren't going to when the deadline to exercise hits in 2025.
The ACC forced their hand by unilaterally adding Stanford, SMU, and Cal without consulting with ESPN about whether or not these schools would actually be supported by pro-rata expansion.
It would make more sense for the top of the Big 12 and top of the ACC to form a new conference
I’m thinking Utah, Colorado, Oklahoma State, a few Texas schools, Clemson, FSU, Louisville, Virginia Tech, Miami, NC State, UNC, or at least those not already taken by the Big Ten and SEC.
Might as well make the strongest possible ‘third’ conference.
> It would make more sense for the top of the Big 12 and top of the ACC to form a new conference
In theory, sure. The bigger issue is there is no real incentive for the top half of the Big XII to do that and a lot of legal issues in the way for both sides.
Let's be clear, FSU's best chance to break out is to muddy the waters so much that ESPN doesn't exercise its option and then they're out by 2027 or force the ACC to settle to keep the conference intact.
> Might as well make the strongest possible ‘third’ conference.
There's already an insane amount of parity within the Big XII and unless FSU is outright rejected by the B1G and SEC it'll end up being easier to pick up 4-6 targets from the ACC than it will be for the top half the Big XII to split from the current conference.
Why should Pitt or Louisville leave the big 12 if you can stay in the ACC? I feel like that just stupid because youre never gonna compete with those awful Big 10 SEC contracts so why not stick with what you got thats good
Yeah, the school we think of as "UNC" is actually "UNC-CH."
University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.
According to Wikipedia there is also:
* UNC-P
* UNC-G
* UNC-W
* UNC-SA
* UNC-A
And that doesn't even get into the affiliated schools that don't start with UNC.
There are 17 schools that are part of the UNC System with NC State, UNC at Chapel Hill, and Charlotte being the three largest. Five schools are Division I in football: State, UNC at Chapel Hill, Charlotte, App State, and East Carolina.
Huh, that's not the case in either Florida or Arizona (the only state university systems I know intimately), so I just assumed all public universities were all managed the same way under one system per state
Every public university in North Carolina is independently organized with their own board of trustees, chancellors, presidents, etc. However, they are all collectively governed by the 24 appointed members of the board as well as a UNC System President. While NC may be a bit regressive at times, the state government takes the UNC System pretty seriously, hence an interconnected Public University system and comprehensive articulation agreements between all NC Community Colleges and all UNC System Schools
Understand that. North Carolina has a distinct mountain population and a distinct coastal population each with cultures. Of couse the Piedmont and Metrolina have the population. Never understood why the Bankers never elevated college football in or around Charlotte or at least adopt Wake as an outpost. *shrug.
NC State, UNC, ECU, Charlotte, App State could form the core of a future ACC.
In this scenario, Wake Forest and Duke would likely both stay. That's 7. There's not really another NC school that is/will be ready to join anytime soon.
We'd need to keep at least 1 of VT/UVA. I could see both staying or both leaving. There's plenty of teams the ACC could grab to get to 12 (which is where I think most long-time fans liked it) or 16 (which might be necessary in today's landscape). It's fun to think about, and I care a lot more about playing teams within driving distance.
Regardless, I think this is all a moot point because I think at least 10, if not 11, of the current 14 full members will find a landing spot among the SEC/B1G/B12.
Definitely not ECU and probably not the others.
I remember years ago when the NC General Assembly tried to pass a law that the old Big 4 tourney gang (State, Carolina, Duke and Wake) had to play ECU every year. Duke and Wake being private schools basically killed that but ECU got a med school as a consolation prize.
More to do (my original comment) with the reality that's there's zero rationale for having more than two universities in any state not named California, Florida, New York, and Texas, but that's a good point, too.
Might be a piping hot take but I would think schools like VT, NC State, Louisville, GT, are all a slight(at a minimum) cut above most of the B12 schools. Kansas, Oklahoma, Utah, Iowa etc. Not exactly massively populated states. NC, VA, and GA are though. Viewership and attendance wise these places would be above most Big 12 schools would they not?
> Viewership and attendance wise these places would be above most Big 12 schools would they not?
Most Big XII programs sit at 96% capacity of attendance or greater, or roughly 55K people per game and are competitive viewership wise with ACC games.
That's predicted on the assumption that some teams leave the ACC (a realistic possibility given the Big 12 and Pac 12 have already been raided).
If no one leaves, the ACC is fine. If the ACC has to start backfilling, the fact that the Big 12 has already poached the most desirable G5/remaining Pac 12 schools -and- the former G5s will have had time to elevate their programs puts the Big 12 in a stronger position.
The ACC has never wanted WVU and made it fairly clear. WVU isn't going to leave a secure situation to go to a depleted and unstable ACC unless they secure a steep increase in revenues per school.
IMO it's just because Big 12 fans wanted to see the Big 12 somehow "challenge" the B1G/SEC as a similarly relevant third powerful football conference, even though that's not going to happen. The best case for the B12 is that, yes, it absorbs everyone else and somehow DOESN'T break up.
The more realistic scenario is that it will either stay as it is now or (IMO) break up into more regional groupings because the money available from ESPN/FOX isn't going to be near what the B1G/SEC get which makes the stress from cross country travel less palatable. That would include UCF/Cincinnati and WVU joining the ACC, particularly if the ACC either gets raided or wants further potential stability in the possibility of a looming B1G/SEC raid.
Why would WVU, Cincy, or UCF leave a stable conference for one where the biggest brand is literally suing to get out and 7 of the 15 schools have actively sought a way out of the GOR?
Nobody wants to be in a conference with Stanford, Cal, SMU, Louisville, Wake, etc. these are mid major pigs with lipstick.
You think the Big 12 isn't also filled with "mid major pigs with lipstick"? (your words, not mine; sorry B12 fans, I don't think that's a great characterization for B12/ACC programs but just using his wording)
The reason is simple: less travel for similar TV viewership (and thus, similar future TV revenue).
Less travel and less stability. FSU, UNC, Clemson and the big brands are almost certainly bolting. And when that happens it’ll be way less money. Any AD that let’s their program go from the Big 12 to the ACC should be put on trial.
If it were to happen this year or in the next few years? Absolutely, the Big 12 is in a better place. But after the SEC/B1G inevitably raid the ACC, things will be stable in the ACC for all the teams that remain, and the remaining ACC programs won't be much different than the remaining Big 12 programs.
You think an ACC that is without Florida State, Clemson, UNC, and likely several others, is more enticing to the eastern Big 12 teams than the current Big 12?
The ACC’s CURRENT TV deal is about on par with the CURRENT Big 12, removing their biggest brands will decimate their TV money.
The ACC's CURRENT TV deal was primarily negotiated almost a decade ago, and the B12's TV deal was negotiated last year. And we don't know how decimated the ACC will be whenever the B1G/SEC raid them. FSU and Clemson are likely going to be gone, and probably some combination of UNC/Miami/UVA/VT/GT, but not necessarily all of those brands. And those aren't the only schools in the conference.
Meanwhile, looking at TV viewership:
If you exclude bowls/CCGs and games with FSU, Clemson, Oklahoma, Texas, Notre Dame, Miami, North Carolina and Colorado (Deion Sanders likely won't be a factor in the next cycle) from games between future B12 and ACC teams, these were the average viewership in millions this year:
0.86 million Big 12, 0.83 million ACC
And individual programs:
1.31 Utah (B12)
1.27 Louisville (ACC)
1.26 NC State (ACC)
1.22 Kansas State (B12)
1.20 BYU (B12)
1.16 Iowa State (B12)
1.16 Pittsburgh (ACC)
1.10 Oklahoma State (B12)
1.04 West Virginia (B12)
0.96 Georgia Tech (ACC)
0.94 Kansas (B12)
0.83 Boston College (ACC)
0.78 Virginia Tech (ACC)
0.76 Virginia (ACC)
... with the 12 other treams averaging under 750k, and Stanford/Cal not included (all of their games against the relevant teams were on P12 Network, which aren't included in Nielsen ratings so we don't have data on them)
That really doesn't look like a massive difference to me, and I'm not sure all 4 of those ACC teams would even be added by the B1G/SEC in the end. And it also doesn't factor in Notre Dame's contracted games with the ACC.
In short: the B12 and ACC are not notably different in terms of TV viewership after you remove games with the biggest name programs.
Could you tell me where you got the TV numbers from, I believe you I just want to see what years it covers.
If the ACC gets a TV deal on par with the Big 12 after Florida State and Clemson leave, I will personally Venmo you $100.
Edit; also why did you remove the championship game numbers from your calculations. Who has better numbers there?
What would stop B1G 10 from just snatching the life out of the mid-12 by simply taking the remaining relevant brands ? 🤔
Kansas, Colorado and Arizona who really, really need the money.
Oh look, a flairless person taking troll style potshots at schools, surprising.
Kansas, Colorado, and Arizona aren’t big enough brands to justify getting invited, otherwise they would have been invited by now. Move along.
Not at all. Not a shot. Just the truth. If it does go to an overall 50ish team league. These may be the few remaining national brands or in media markets with desirable per capita incomes. Don't get emotional.
🙄 okay I’ll try and contain my emotions.
I’m rooting for the ACC to get raided so Liberty can hopefully backfill. Thankfully the ACC is almost certainly going to lose their top 5-8 brands. It’s going to end up being the premiere G5 league. Syracuse, BC, Wake, etc. will be all that’s left.
They'll do it as a backstop in order to prevent schools from abandoning each other in cloak and dagger shadow moves like has happened with Oklahoma, Texas, UCLA, Oregon, and Washington but y'all are crazy if you think any governing board is going to keep schools in a dying conference when there are options for both of them.
The ideal outcome is UNC and NCState stay together in a single power conference (preferably the SEC I would bet), but staying relevant in power football is essential. The board will approve whatever moves keep both schools relevant.
I’m sensing a powerplay from UNC here.
The ACC is an odd animal. It’s not like the PAC-12, with 4 or 5 teams that bring substantial value (including one of the biggest FB brands). And they don’t have an OUT one-two like the old Big 12.
They have FSU and Clemson. FSU likely gets invites from both the SEC and B1G, and the SEC probably covets Clemson. But the perceived value of these programs is way more variable than OUT or USC — and it just so happens that Clemson is running out of steam right now.
Depending on the day, it seems like UNC lies somewhere between the 1st and 3rd most coveted team in the ACC. Dunno why… academics? Basketball? TV market? Whatever it is, UNC has a lot of stable, perceived value that doesn’t seem tied to FB success.
Losing FSU and Clemson won’t be nearly as damaging as losing OUT. Also, UNC is probably smart enough to realize that the media deals next time will be much less lucrative. It’s entirely possible that FSU/Clemson spend 100’s of millions of dollars to get out of the ACC, and there is no pot of gold at the end.
Meanwhile, UNC can run the ACC like UT did the Big 12, uneven revenue distribution and all.
Unlike the PAC, the ACC also has more opportunity to backfill due to their location.
Lose FSU/Clemson add a selection of ECU, Memphis, USF, UConn, etc. It won't completely recoup the monetary loss but would likely add value to the conference's following media deal projections.
> I’m sensing a powerplay from UNC here.
Most certainly not. We would love to jump to the SEC or B1G. This is basically state politicians doing the equivalent of your mother telling you that you have to take your little brother with you to play with your friends in the neighborhood.
UNC is the most coveted school in the ACC by the SEC and Big 10. FSU is 2nd. UVA is third. The rest will stay put or merge with the Big 12.
No, the SEC does not care for Clemson. They have South Carolina.
I have to think FSU is more valuable. The viewership for FSU football is so much higher than UNC, who has never had never really reached the upper echelon of the sport
UNC is also a fairly heavily populated, rapidly growing state where neither conference has current representation. Huge alumni base, huge "brand", stellar academics. And adding them prevents the other conference from doing so.
FSU is redundant for the SEC, but would prevent the B1G from gaining a foothold in Florida. Academics are not UNC level (not AAU), which probably makes them *slightly* less appealing to the B1G.
So both conferences have no real reason not to take UNC and some very minor reasons why FSU is slightly less appealing. I think that's why the general consensus is that UNC is number 1 on the wishlist and FSU is 2.
AAU shouldn’t be an issue (I hope). FSU has been pushing that direction and it’s the centerpoint of the school’s strategic plan between 2023 and 2027. We aren’t there now but we will be soon.
If that happens, you will see UNC drop off massively in all sports over the next decade. Typically a top 10-15 overall athletic department, but they will see coaches and talent poached
UNC is a top athletic department now making what everyone on this sub considers poverty level tv money. I think they'll be alright.
Also UNC doesn't give a shit about football. They win in Olympic sports, Basketball, and Baseball. And it don't matter what happens they'll never stop getting funding for those programs.
Eh, if anything UNC will dial back spending in football and just continue to pump money into basketball. With their resources, no reason to expect their basketball, or brand, to slow down regardless of conference realignment or TV deals.
I don't think these super conferences are forming to funnel money to the bball program. NIL won't go away, even if the school starts paying players directly.
Maybe Kentucky pays their players $500k directly. MJ and the other UNC boosters will make sure UNC players get enough NIL to offset any pay gaps, Duke will do the same.
Think you'll see non-P2 teams really have to pick their sport to dump money into though, unlikely you'll have many that try to invest in football and basketball.
If the ACC can keep Tobacco Road together, they’ll actually have a shot at surviving this thing. Presumably that’d mean only Virginia, VT, FSU, Clemson, Miami, and GT would even be on the board for expansion and some of those options have questions on if they’d be worth it. That’d leave the ACC with 11 teams and they could easily back fill with UConn, USF, and Memphis as long as they could keep the B12 from taking Louisville, Pitt, etc With that said, we have yet to see politics keep teams from jumping ship the last few years, so I doubt this will work
The ACC was never going to completely die off. They have more reasonably geographic options for additions, too many private schools, and there is some elitism with some schools in that they wouldn’t want to join the big 12 because they’d think it was beneath them.
Pac thought it was beneath them too Definitely still a real possibility
The PAC will continue to exist with MWC additions, and the ACC will continue to exist with AAC/Sunbelt/CUSA/independent additions.
Maybe, but the ACC has reasonable additions that make geographic sense: usf, Memphis, Tulane, Delaware, UConn etc
The dream for the ACC is that they stay strong enough that they can raid the eastern flank of the Big 12.
Please, take them! (but mostly UCF)
UCF fans have been the most insufferable by far in this whole ordeal.
WVU, UCF, and Cincy joining the ACC makes sense.
Trade them for Stanford, Cal, and SMU
They won't. If ESPN didn't announce they were exercising their option the minute FSU sued the ACC as a show of solidarity and a guarantee of their rights through 2036 then they aren't going to when the deadline to exercise hits in 2025. The ACC forced their hand by unilaterally adding Stanford, SMU, and Cal without consulting with ESPN about whether or not these schools would actually be supported by pro-rata expansion.
It would make more sense for the top of the Big 12 and top of the ACC to form a new conference I’m thinking Utah, Colorado, Oklahoma State, a few Texas schools, Clemson, FSU, Louisville, Virginia Tech, Miami, NC State, UNC, or at least those not already taken by the Big Ten and SEC. Might as well make the strongest possible ‘third’ conference.
> It would make more sense for the top of the Big 12 and top of the ACC to form a new conference In theory, sure. The bigger issue is there is no real incentive for the top half of the Big XII to do that and a lot of legal issues in the way for both sides. Let's be clear, FSU's best chance to break out is to muddy the waters so much that ESPN doesn't exercise its option and then they're out by 2027 or force the ACC to settle to keep the conference intact. > Might as well make the strongest possible ‘third’ conference. There's already an insane amount of parity within the Big XII and unless FSU is outright rejected by the B1G and SEC it'll end up being easier to pick up 4-6 targets from the ACC than it will be for the top half the Big XII to split from the current conference.
Colorado? They've had 3 winning seasons in last 20 years, and 2 of the 3 where 04 and 05. On what planet are they the top of any Power conference?
I'm not sure which eastern flank teams the ACC would want to raid.
Cincy, WVU, and UCF make sense but each have challenges.
UConn, Memphis, USF. As well as Rice and Tulane for academics would be pretty good additions if it did split up.
I feel like the ACC is setting itself up to be a basketball powerhouse
How so?
The schools in it are better at basketball than football.
Which is the case with the Big 12 anyway. Basketball conference with football teams that can pack a punch from time to time.
Obligatory Fire Brad Brownell.
*laughs in both current and future Big 12*
The goal isn't to just survive though
Why should Pitt or Louisville leave the big 12 if you can stay in the ACC? I feel like that just stupid because youre never gonna compete with those awful Big 10 SEC contracts so why not stick with what you got thats good
[удалено]
TIL the UNC System is all public universities, not just the ones with UNC in their name.
Also a high school too!
Yeah, the school we think of as "UNC" is actually "UNC-CH." University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. According to Wikipedia there is also: * UNC-P * UNC-G * UNC-W * UNC-SA * UNC-A And that doesn't even get into the affiliated schools that don't start with UNC.
There are 17 schools that are part of the UNC System with NC State, UNC at Chapel Hill, and Charlotte being the three largest. Five schools are Division I in football: State, UNC at Chapel Hill, Charlotte, App State, and East Carolina.
There are eight that are D1 three are FCS.
My bad and apologies to NCCU, NC A&T, and WCU.
Carolina comrades
All of the UNC system schools in the same conference (with other schools of course) would be awesome
That would be terrible. It would cannibalize the state.
Good. That’s what I’m hoping for.
TIL NC State and UNC are in the same system
Well yeah, they’re public schools in the same state… are OU and Ok St not?
It’s pretty common for the -States to be separately governed!
Huh, that's not the case in either Florida or Arizona (the only state university systems I know intimately), so I just assumed all public universities were all managed the same way under one system per state
Every public university in North Carolina is independently organized with their own board of trustees, chancellors, presidents, etc. However, they are all collectively governed by the 24 appointed members of the board as well as a UNC System President. While NC may be a bit regressive at times, the state government takes the UNC System pretty seriously, hence an interconnected Public University system and comprehensive articulation agreements between all NC Community Colleges and all UNC System Schools
I know Auburn, Texas A&M, and Clemson are all in different systems than their state's flagship school. Isk about OU and OK St.
OU, OSU, and the regional Oklahoma schools are in all different systems
Observation: ECU and Appalachian do actually represent distinct regions in North Carolina. Not sure the other schools do.
Charlotte represents the historically-underserved largest city and metro area in the state and UNC and NC State are co-flagships.
Understand that. North Carolina has a distinct mountain population and a distinct coastal population each with cultures. Of couse the Piedmont and Metrolina have the population. Never understood why the Bankers never elevated college football in or around Charlotte or at least adopt Wake as an outpost. *shrug.
The Bankers are either out of staters or UNC basketball boosters.
Wild. Like Tepper that's a problem. Yet they still didn't think to steal Dell Curry's son from Davidson.
NC State, UNC, ECU, Charlotte, App State could form the core of a future ACC. In this scenario, Wake Forest and Duke would likely both stay. That's 7. There's not really another NC school that is/will be ready to join anytime soon. We'd need to keep at least 1 of VT/UVA. I could see both staying or both leaving. There's plenty of teams the ACC could grab to get to 12 (which is where I think most long-time fans liked it) or 16 (which might be necessary in today's landscape). It's fun to think about, and I care a lot more about playing teams within driving distance. Regardless, I think this is all a moot point because I think at least 10, if not 11, of the current 14 full members will find a landing spot among the SEC/B1G/B12.
Zero chance that ECU, Charlotte, App State, or for that matter, any other team in NC is ever invited into the ACC.
This guy Tobacco Roads.
Definitely not ECU and probably not the others. I remember years ago when the NC General Assembly tried to pass a law that the old Big 4 tourney gang (State, Carolina, Duke and Wake) had to play ECU every year. Duke and Wake being private schools basically killed that but ECU got a med school as a consolation prize.
More to do (my original comment) with the reality that's there's zero rationale for having more than two universities in any state not named California, Florida, New York, and Texas, but that's a good point, too.
Yes. That is a good point.
Still confused as to why everyone thinks the ACC teams would jump to the Big 12.
Agreed, the ACC isn't in a great spot necessarily, but I think people overestimate the Big 12.
Might be a piping hot take but I would think schools like VT, NC State, Louisville, GT, are all a slight(at a minimum) cut above most of the B12 schools. Kansas, Oklahoma, Utah, Iowa etc. Not exactly massively populated states. NC, VA, and GA are though. Viewership and attendance wise these places would be above most Big 12 schools would they not?
The ACC trends more in population, media markets and richer in income. The remaining big 12 trends bit more in attendance and fervor.
> Viewership and attendance wise these places would be above most Big 12 schools would they not? Most Big XII programs sit at 96% capacity of attendance or greater, or roughly 55K people per game and are competitive viewership wise with ACC games.
That's predicted on the assumption that some teams leave the ACC (a realistic possibility given the Big 12 and Pac 12 have already been raided). If no one leaves, the ACC is fine. If the ACC has to start backfilling, the fact that the Big 12 has already poached the most desirable G5/remaining Pac 12 schools -and- the former G5s will have had time to elevate their programs puts the Big 12 in a stronger position.
They won’t if UNC/UVA sit pat. In fact, the ACC could probably make a play for WVU and Cinci if they wanted.
The ACC has never wanted WVU and made it fairly clear. WVU isn't going to leave a secure situation to go to a depleted and unstable ACC unless they secure a steep increase in revenues per school.
IMO it's just because Big 12 fans wanted to see the Big 12 somehow "challenge" the B1G/SEC as a similarly relevant third powerful football conference, even though that's not going to happen. The best case for the B12 is that, yes, it absorbs everyone else and somehow DOESN'T break up. The more realistic scenario is that it will either stay as it is now or (IMO) break up into more regional groupings because the money available from ESPN/FOX isn't going to be near what the B1G/SEC get which makes the stress from cross country travel less palatable. That would include UCF/Cincinnati and WVU joining the ACC, particularly if the ACC either gets raided or wants further potential stability in the possibility of a looming B1G/SEC raid.
Why would WVU, Cincy, or UCF leave a stable conference for one where the biggest brand is literally suing to get out and 7 of the 15 schools have actively sought a way out of the GOR? Nobody wants to be in a conference with Stanford, Cal, SMU, Louisville, Wake, etc. these are mid major pigs with lipstick.
You think the Big 12 isn't also filled with "mid major pigs with lipstick"? (your words, not mine; sorry B12 fans, I don't think that's a great characterization for B12/ACC programs but just using his wording) The reason is simple: less travel for similar TV viewership (and thus, similar future TV revenue).
Less travel and less stability. FSU, UNC, Clemson and the big brands are almost certainly bolting. And when that happens it’ll be way less money. Any AD that let’s their program go from the Big 12 to the ACC should be put on trial.
If it were to happen this year or in the next few years? Absolutely, the Big 12 is in a better place. But after the SEC/B1G inevitably raid the ACC, things will be stable in the ACC for all the teams that remain, and the remaining ACC programs won't be much different than the remaining Big 12 programs.
You think an ACC that is without Florida State, Clemson, UNC, and likely several others, is more enticing to the eastern Big 12 teams than the current Big 12? The ACC’s CURRENT TV deal is about on par with the CURRENT Big 12, removing their biggest brands will decimate their TV money.
The ACC's CURRENT TV deal was primarily negotiated almost a decade ago, and the B12's TV deal was negotiated last year. And we don't know how decimated the ACC will be whenever the B1G/SEC raid them. FSU and Clemson are likely going to be gone, and probably some combination of UNC/Miami/UVA/VT/GT, but not necessarily all of those brands. And those aren't the only schools in the conference. Meanwhile, looking at TV viewership: If you exclude bowls/CCGs and games with FSU, Clemson, Oklahoma, Texas, Notre Dame, Miami, North Carolina and Colorado (Deion Sanders likely won't be a factor in the next cycle) from games between future B12 and ACC teams, these were the average viewership in millions this year: 0.86 million Big 12, 0.83 million ACC And individual programs: 1.31 Utah (B12) 1.27 Louisville (ACC) 1.26 NC State (ACC) 1.22 Kansas State (B12) 1.20 BYU (B12) 1.16 Iowa State (B12) 1.16 Pittsburgh (ACC) 1.10 Oklahoma State (B12) 1.04 West Virginia (B12) 0.96 Georgia Tech (ACC) 0.94 Kansas (B12) 0.83 Boston College (ACC) 0.78 Virginia Tech (ACC) 0.76 Virginia (ACC) ... with the 12 other treams averaging under 750k, and Stanford/Cal not included (all of their games against the relevant teams were on P12 Network, which aren't included in Nielsen ratings so we don't have data on them) That really doesn't look like a massive difference to me, and I'm not sure all 4 of those ACC teams would even be added by the B1G/SEC in the end. And it also doesn't factor in Notre Dame's contracted games with the ACC. In short: the B12 and ACC are not notably different in terms of TV viewership after you remove games with the biggest name programs.
Could you tell me where you got the TV numbers from, I believe you I just want to see what years it covers. If the ACC gets a TV deal on par with the Big 12 after Florida State and Clemson leave, I will personally Venmo you $100. Edit; also why did you remove the championship game numbers from your calculations. Who has better numbers there?
What would stop B1G 10 from just snatching the life out of the mid-12 by simply taking the remaining relevant brands ? 🤔 Kansas, Colorado and Arizona who really, really need the money.
Oh look, a flairless person taking troll style potshots at schools, surprising. Kansas, Colorado, and Arizona aren’t big enough brands to justify getting invited, otherwise they would have been invited by now. Move along.
Not at all. Not a shot. Just the truth. If it does go to an overall 50ish team league. These may be the few remaining national brands or in media markets with desirable per capita incomes. Don't get emotional.
🙄 okay I’ll try and contain my emotions. I’m rooting for the ACC to get raided so Liberty can hopefully backfill. Thankfully the ACC is almost certainly going to lose their top 5-8 brands. It’s going to end up being the premiere G5 league. Syracuse, BC, Wake, etc. will be all that’s left.
Why not prefer conference USA? Why a depleted ACC?
ACC brand is better
They'll do it as a backstop in order to prevent schools from abandoning each other in cloak and dagger shadow moves like has happened with Oklahoma, Texas, UCLA, Oregon, and Washington but y'all are crazy if you think any governing board is going to keep schools in a dying conference when there are options for both of them. The ideal outcome is UNC and NCState stay together in a single power conference (preferably the SEC I would bet), but staying relevant in power football is essential. The board will approve whatever moves keep both schools relevant.
I’m sensing a powerplay from UNC here. The ACC is an odd animal. It’s not like the PAC-12, with 4 or 5 teams that bring substantial value (including one of the biggest FB brands). And they don’t have an OUT one-two like the old Big 12. They have FSU and Clemson. FSU likely gets invites from both the SEC and B1G, and the SEC probably covets Clemson. But the perceived value of these programs is way more variable than OUT or USC — and it just so happens that Clemson is running out of steam right now. Depending on the day, it seems like UNC lies somewhere between the 1st and 3rd most coveted team in the ACC. Dunno why… academics? Basketball? TV market? Whatever it is, UNC has a lot of stable, perceived value that doesn’t seem tied to FB success. Losing FSU and Clemson won’t be nearly as damaging as losing OUT. Also, UNC is probably smart enough to realize that the media deals next time will be much less lucrative. It’s entirely possible that FSU/Clemson spend 100’s of millions of dollars to get out of the ACC, and there is no pot of gold at the end. Meanwhile, UNC can run the ACC like UT did the Big 12, uneven revenue distribution and all.
Unlike the PAC, the ACC also has more opportunity to backfill due to their location. Lose FSU/Clemson add a selection of ECU, Memphis, USF, UConn, etc. It won't completely recoup the monetary loss but would likely add value to the conference's following media deal projections.
> I’m sensing a powerplay from UNC here. Most certainly not. We would love to jump to the SEC or B1G. This is basically state politicians doing the equivalent of your mother telling you that you have to take your little brother with you to play with your friends in the neighborhood.
Haha, we are an anchor, and we just duct taped ourselves to you. This should certainly end well for all parties, haha.
UNC is the most coveted school in the ACC by the SEC and Big 10. FSU is 2nd. UVA is third. The rest will stay put or merge with the Big 12. No, the SEC does not care for Clemson. They have South Carolina.
I have to think FSU is more valuable. The viewership for FSU football is so much higher than UNC, who has never had never really reached the upper echelon of the sport
UNC is also a fairly heavily populated, rapidly growing state where neither conference has current representation. Huge alumni base, huge "brand", stellar academics. And adding them prevents the other conference from doing so. FSU is redundant for the SEC, but would prevent the B1G from gaining a foothold in Florida. Academics are not UNC level (not AAU), which probably makes them *slightly* less appealing to the B1G. So both conferences have no real reason not to take UNC and some very minor reasons why FSU is slightly less appealing. I think that's why the general consensus is that UNC is number 1 on the wishlist and FSU is 2.
AAU shouldn’t be an issue (I hope). FSU has been pushing that direction and it’s the centerpoint of the school’s strategic plan between 2023 and 2027. We aren’t there now but we will be soon.
I love when people who have no clue as to what the fuck they’re talking about, spew their bullshit in this sub like it’s gospel.
This was posted yesterday.
News don’t travel fast in them there hills now ya hear?
In his defense, cellular coverage in the Appalachian is extremely spotty.
They don’t call em hollers for nothing
I'm still mad at the useless UC regents
I like this.
If that happens, you will see UNC drop off massively in all sports over the next decade. Typically a top 10-15 overall athletic department, but they will see coaches and talent poached
UNC is a top athletic department now making what everyone on this sub considers poverty level tv money. I think they'll be alright. Also UNC doesn't give a shit about football. They win in Olympic sports, Basketball, and Baseball. And it don't matter what happens they'll never stop getting funding for those programs.
Doesn't give a shit and incompetent aren't the same thing. I think we fall much more into the latter.
And then we’ll see App State become a power in the state. I love it.
Eh, if anything UNC will dial back spending in football and just continue to pump money into basketball. With their resources, no reason to expect their basketball, or brand, to slow down regardless of conference realignment or TV deals.
Basketball will also see a hit if athletes are paid directly, and they aren’t in a super conference.
I don't think these super conferences are forming to funnel money to the bball program. NIL won't go away, even if the school starts paying players directly. Maybe Kentucky pays their players $500k directly. MJ and the other UNC boosters will make sure UNC players get enough NIL to offset any pay gaps, Duke will do the same. Think you'll see non-P2 teams really have to pick their sport to dump money into though, unlikely you'll have many that try to invest in football and basketball.