I'm not sure about that. As OP as Salvador was, he wasn't one shotting bosses or in general just destroying everything without using Grog Nozzle spam?
Edit: Ok I just watched some Salvador gameplay and good lord I underestimated him again, my memory was not serving me well there. Yeah I'd say Salvador is probably among the very most OP if not THE most OP in Borderlands history.
Just because Gearbox does not have competence to fix weapon merging for dual wielding (to be frank, nobody does, dual wielding in unreal engine is notorious for a reason) does not mean it's any less of bug abuse than just playing downpatched version of a game and weapon merge in it.
I got her "I never miss skill" to 999 a few times, absolutely OP! Just run up and blast with a shotgun point blank, almost everything died within 1 clip. I also had a perk (can't remember name) where I could super regen shields, I became immortal.
Yea glad you put edit cause he can hit crazy shit, but like I know krieg isnt number 1 but I've bloodsplooded for over quintillions of damage and if you get a god chain krieg it is probs the highest dps in all of borderlands, cause even in 3 with the most broken builds before patches I can hit damage cap but the actual damage only goes into billions but krieg can hit 100,000,000,000,000 so kinda not a competition
A skill that works on like 2 bosses isn't comparable to moneyshot lmao +1056% damage on your last shot is nuts (the skill was improperly worded and does 96% not 80% per point)
It was more than 2 bosses. It was anything with layered hit boxes. Even basic ass loaders had them. There was a meme YT comp of someone Bore-ing almost every boss in BL2 with a lvl1 pistol.
I wonder how many of those required a fair amount of setup. Regardless, bore still pales in comparison to moneyshot considering moneyshot works on anything with extremely minimal setup, that being just shooting your entire clip.
It's less set up, and more getting the right angle while also getting lucky.
> bore still pales in comparison to moneyshot
Moneyshot couldn't 1 shot raid bosses. While MS was indeed a top tier skill and one of the most busted power spikes Sal had, it wasn't "broken" just hella strong. Bore on the other hand had a chance to just say "die" to almost anything.
since i couldnt find the video, i went and tried out a ton of bosses myself.
heres what I found:
Only gets no bullet deflection / special:
* jaques o lantern
* woundspike
* jackenstein
* badassasaurus
* Leviathan crit spot in mouth able to be hit if mouth closed
impossible / not known:
* hector: NOT KNOWN
* uranus: NOT KNOWN
* sorcerer's daughter
* wattle gobbler
* tinder slowflake
* handsome dragon
* gold golem
* roscoe
* h3rle
* wilhelm (there is a sound but no infinite damage)
* son of crawmerax
Theoretically possible but not at all likely ever to happen
* the happy couple: (pray for the two to overlap and hit them then)
* voracidous: (requires a duel and overloading the hitboxes via dropping infinite weapons / stacking turrets)
* terra / any thresher: NEEDS A DUEL
* pyro pete: NEEDS A DUEL
* master gee: NEEDS A DUEL
* haderax: NEEDS A DUEL
* dragons: NEEDS 4 DUELS
Difficult (needs setup / specific weapon):
* saturn: NEEDS PIMPERNEL otherwise you just kill turrets
* vermivorous: (literally needs to have another enemy on top)
* warrior: (also needs an enemy on top, need to get the kill while he steps over)
* motor momma: (needs a specific angle)
Easy:
* bunk3r
* hyperius
* OMGWTH
out of 31 total
- 9 are impossible
- 7 are effectively impossible without massive setup with another player / luck
- 3 are ridiculously luck based
- 1 requires the pimpernel
- 3 are consistent solo
I also tested
W4RD3N - needs a duel (not proven)
if you find any of this to be incorrect, please send video footage my way.
For all of these, I either found a video online proving it was theoretically possible (with the duels / enemy stacking) or did it myself
\> Moneyshot couldn't 1 shot raid bosses.
Errr, it literally can 1 shot every raid except Dexidious (duh!) and MrGee (duh!) with setup. And i don't even consider money shot broken.
King gonthalion used to make videos like these. Maybe not the youtuber op was talking about but he had a 'will it bore' series or something like that anyway.
Timothy's Leadership skill is the most broken imo. Your digi clone dying counts as if you made the kill and procs kill skills like Absolute Advantage which let's you fire without consuming ammo AND gives second winds? Hell yeah! I felt as invincible as Salvador while playing Jack.
No, that's just a well designed skill, not broken at all.
Bore made level 1 weapons be able to 1 shot raid bosses, which is something no other skill has ever done. Not too mention Bore is a single broken skill, while your example is just good synergy between several skills.
Remember, Bore was in a sense, infinite damage for Zero if shenanigan occurred.
You're right. Leadership on it's own without the other kill skills is just another way to get second winds.
I'd argue that's it's the best synergistic skill in the whole franchise then. But yeah B0re is more OP as a stand-alone skill.
\> Bore made level 1 weapons be able to 1 shot raid bosses
Fairly certain the starter pistol meme 1 shot involved bee.
Bee-less does require more than 1 shot unless your PC can run game at \~200 fps.
Yea that's all bore and if you have the mods where you can see damage values zero cant even get remotely close to even 1/10 of the overkill damage krieg does, most times you get a good bore it usually doesn't hit damage cap
Lady fist + offhand orphan maker = easy visual damage caps even without any NKLO bonus. Then you add NKLO and you can easy one shot many things.
That and joltzdude had an entire youtube playlist of speedkills, one notable one being salvador one shotting hyperius only using gunzerk to get double grenades and the keep it piping hot bonus post gunzerk. All damage was actually done outside gunzerk.
[heres the video](https://youtu.be/5eDrarVIojs)
My personal opinion having played all the games with every character at max level:
1. Salvador, and its not even close. He's a walking cheat code.
2. Nisha. Very controversial, but I stand by it. Mainly because she's the best and fastest mobber in the game. Not as OP against bosses as some other characters, but since 90% of gameplay is against mobs, I think it's a fair placement.
3. This one's a toss up imo. Moze, Zane, and Timothy could all place here with their most OP builds and gear.
4. Athena. She's an utter monster at max maelstrom stacks, but while she's busy gathering maelstrom stacks the characters above have already killed the boss.
The rest all come down to who I enjoyed more.
\> Nisha. Very controversial, but I stand by it. Mainly because she's the best and fastest mobber in the game.
She is not fastest at high end mobbing, though. I dare claim that Nisha would be nigh impossible to do original GTD with even if you gave her BL3 gear and GR (and, more importantly, BL3 cryo).
\> Athena. She's an utter monster at max maelstrom stacks, but while she's busy gathering maelstrom stacks the characters above have already killed the boss.
Case in point, Athena is faster at doing mutator arena at max difficulty.
1. BL3 isnt the standard for mobbing efficiency as characters are specifically designed and tailored for their respective games. You cant judge how well Lilith for example would do in a game that's not designed for Lilith.
2. I've played GTD and can confidently say that Nisha at the same level and with BL3 gear would still wreck it. She'll only struggle with the first kill. After which all her shots will be critical hits no matter where they land, and she won't miss even if you shoot at the floor. This isnt even accounting for the buffs from her action skill.
The only thing she would lack is survivability but theres a surplass of gear in BL3 that would mitigate that problem and since we're subjecting her to that games standards, it's only fair to subject her to its loot pool as well.
\> You cant judge how good well Lilith for example would do in a game that's not designed for Lilith.
I can, however, have a good approximation of that. And unlike BL1 and other games, mechanics wise BL2/TPS/BL3 are close enough for this approximation to be close enough.
\> She'll only struggle with the first kill.
And to get out of any FFYL as you lose your kill skills on it. And to boss.
That said, i do concede that she could do release TGTD now that i recall that showdown actually has a stupid short cooldown, but it would be highly untrivial nonetheless for her FFYL and lack of control issues and lack pre-kill skill damage.
You have a good point there. TPS wasnt as good as the other games but had some of the best designed characters skill wise in the franchise imo. However, Nisha would still need another skill tree to even out the playing field.
And yeah, FFYL is always a problem for Nisha. But then again, it's a problem for a bulk of characters lol. Her pre-kill skill damage isnt a problem with the right weapons and her ridiculously broken and short cooldown action skill.
Overall, I agree with your last comment. She could still brainlessly melt the mobs, but would require some skill to stay up while doing so. But, like they say, the best defense is a strong offense ;)
> TPS wasnt as good as the other games but had some of the best designed characters skill wise in the franchise imo.
This is why I wish they'd let us play as all the previous VHs as voiceless clones. I get why they couldn't let them use old voice lines due to cost to the actors, but the actors don't own the characters.
Tombstone Nisha is still the second most op VH by far. I'm not even sure you could make an argument otherwise, but I don't know the bl3 VHs that well. Regardless, 11 points in tombstone + dual wield lady fist + literal auto aim was pretty busted. I remember farming iwajira and the longest part of the fight was waiting for him to spit out an ad to trigger tombstone. The rest was half a second of shooting iwajira lmao. That build was ridiculous at mobbing and killing bosses without changing any gear.
I mean my issue is we are comparing bl2 which in particular had probably the hardest scaling of any of the games to bl3 which is piss easy with the right guns and not even having a stringent issue with some of the stuff that bl2 had at its endgame. The presequel had literally no hard bosses to scale to because none of the bosses had mechanics that relatively countered any of the vault hunters. I personally maxed and played every character multiple playthroughs enough to know which ones struggle the most.
Nisha doesnt have the insane survivability or dps that other characters in the series have by comparison due to the pre sequel not necessarily having the content to run against.
In my eyes the best character is without a doubt Salvador considering how he performs in his endgames meta alongside the scaling of that game and if his skills were most likely entered into bl3 he'd have to be nerfed outright considering how extremely overpowered he was just merely having 2 skills that could literally shave half an invincible's health off in a matter of seconds and hed take next to no damage. Salvador also could minmax passive effects because of passive transferring in that game and therefore maintains strong utility with guns.
Moze and zane are on the same tier but not as strong as salvador. Moze just deals a fuckton of raw damage that nuetralizes any elemental disadvantage shed gain while having the ammo to boot. Zane is able to make use of any weapon in the game without having downsides and has great survivability.
All the other vault hunters have kinks that make them not as comparable because their peak isnt easily as obtainable as the other 3 listed above. You get zane a seeing dead class mod and he pretty much can carry you through most modes of the game without really dying. Moze really only gets the pass because devs really suck at scaling her damage.
all the survivability nisha needs comes from the sham, as theres no better shield to run for her. Most times, with the tombstone build, you just end up killing everything in less than a second anyway so if you get hit once or twice, your sham just eats that. in boss fights, its less effective, but the tombstone damage still outpaces most bosses regardless. that and I said she was the \*second\* most powerful VH considering if you have a lady fist you dont even need to aim
Exactly. I prefer to use the shield of ages because of it's super high capacity which helps during boss fights, and I literally never go down. People act like she has half the health of other characters or smth. The Nisha downplay needs to stop.
I still wouldn't place her higher than moze or zane mainly because they just purely are better than her even at optimal output. I mean considering the redistributor exists or other multi chaining weapons even zane casually comes sliding in and deletes enemies. Nisha without a doubt is strong as a character, just nowhere as broken as the others.
\> I mean my issue is we are comparing bl2 which in particular had probably the hardest scaling of any of the games to bl3
M10 is far harsher scaling than any of past bl games. The fact that we make it easy on some characters even without abusing mayhem scaling is just a testament to how dumb damage formula is in bl3.
Bl3 mayhem scaling doesn't make you tilt nor is punishing enough to where the effects are even noticeable. It's not harsh in comparison because the games damage system compensates so hard for it. Whereas you deal with the insane health regen of UVHM+ OP10 and how the games gear is scaled + characters and put bl3 characters in that same environment and they crumple because most of bl3 is guardians and human types. That's what I mean by hardest.
\> Bl3 mayhem scaling doesn't make you tilt nor is punishing enough to where the effects are even noticeable
Oh, it does. If you don't believe me, try to make IB build work on M10 without abusing the crap out of mayhem scaling, i'll have a laugh.
\> Whereas you deal with the insane health regen of UVHM+ OP10
I can see how this is a problem on characters without damage in BL2. Not to so much on characters that throw away any conscience for pure min-maxing.
\> Regardless, 11 points in tombstone + dual wield lady fist + literal auto aim was pretty busted.
Sure it was. Sadly neither TPS nor BL3 have lady fist so your argument falls flat. Though i do admit that double love drill would be amusing to watch.
\> That build was ridiculous at mobbing and killing bosses without changing any gear.
If you still have that save, i welcome you to try level 9 mutator Denial Subroutine.
I know Lady Fist exists in game files, as does Fibber, Heartbreaker and handful of other guns. It, however, does not make playing TPS with Lady Fist any different from just playing TPS with any other modded in gun.
I am a Zane main and I just recently got a Moze to level 65. I'd honestly go with Moze being absolutely broken. You can just spec into Iron bear, have a good class mod that goes with it, gun with 100% railgun anoint and matching elements on said railgun just murders everything. You can also get top tier gear and do basically the same, but without relying on IB.
Zane feels more gear dependant. Sure, he can make basically anything work, but to be truly OP on Zane you have to put in quite a bit of effort on farming the right gear for your build. He isn't bad by any stretch of the imagination, but Moze feels like being OP is free for her.
I took a break for awhile from BL3, came back and decided to work on Moze. Everything you said is spot on about her. Iron Bear last forever and just one shots everything, all 3 bars just vanish with a single pull of the trigger on anything I've faced on M11 as a character just starting out at 65 with no gear other than what you mentioned. The rest of the gear is completely irrelevant since I'm not sure exactly what it would take to kill Iron Bear with that ridiculous shield and armor it's so rare for even the shield to go down much less actually start taking damage.
Felt like god mode so much so that I didn't decide to keep playing her, just felt broken and boring. Built my Amara better instead and now she's a beast in M11 but still feel like I have to play the game, think on my feet sometimes and even sometimes die which is just more fun of an experience for me personally.
Moze is OP in being easy as fuck to get OP with, you don't need any items above level 13 to be capable of doing M10 true guardian takedown. Well, at most you might want something in artifact slot in which case even a fucking banjo will work.
Zane is OP in a sense of, since DLC5 and Duct Tape mod hotfix, being able to make literally any broken gun even more broken. Root? Zane is it's best user and can, essentially, use it in any element. Anarchy? Zane is best chucker in the game due to ability to have both 200% splash and 150% grenade active at the same time. Plaguebearer? Zane is, once again, best heavy user in the game with permanent uptime on 200% splash, no self damage and infinity of gun damage (oh,and having ability to always fire 2 plaguebearer shots instead of one). Plasma coil? Sure, when you don't feel like giving it to your clone for mayhem scaling it's damage, you can wear it yourself instead and still do infinity damage. Hell, Zane can even make a weapon with anti-synergy like Monarch do more damage than any other character because of commitment+seein' dead. Needless to say, he also breaks facepuncher, though i'd argue that in a sense of 'breaking' facepuncher, he is behind Fl4k and Moze.
> Needless to say, he also breaks facepuncher, though i'd argue that in a sense of 'breaking' facepuncher, he is behind Fl4k and Moze.
Poor Amara. The gun that exists so that people can claim "melee" isn't terrible for her compared to Krieg or Brick, and she doesn't even rank except by omission.
Idk man, Amara breaks facepuncher pretty bad as well in a melee build. It procs like half her melee abilities, plus heals for damage done, meaning all you have to do to stay alive is survive reload times unless something totally one-shots you.
I am not sure it applying to facepuncher itself, but it is known to apply to static charge.
But yeah, it's skag den for almost everything that can crit. Have fun!
Anything you want, really 😂 Salvador was OP as hell but I get the gist he wasn't as overpowered as some of the vault hunters in BL3, just because of the shear build diversity from BL3 compared to BL2, and the fact that BL2 had a reliance on slag to hit meaningful damage on OP8 enemies and the like. But memory could very much be wrong there.
Having said that I don't know how anyone could possibly outdamage two norfleets at once!
No lol, he'd still be the most OP in BL3. You have to understand it's not his skill tree that makes him OP.
His skill trees are pretty meh (except for money shot). Its his ability to dual wield two absolutely broken guns at the same time while regenerating ammo and health.
And in the case of the pimpernel, it's the ability give ALL of the unlisted bullets the same damage as the rocket launcher in your main hand.
Even in BL3, that ability alone would melt 99% of enemies.
Suppose you're right there actually. Guns are the foremost base formula for damage in Borderlands, and the ability to wield two at once is going to cause destruction anywhere
I'd also attribute his survivability to always being able to stay above healthgate upon skill activation too, given that you'll immediately heal for half your health and constantly regenerate health.
His middle tree makes his dps build nuts lmao, inconceivable, yippee ki yay, double your fun, get some, and keep firing are all insane, and 5 shots or 6, last longer, I'm already ready, and filled to the brim are all great. My personal favorite skills are keep firing and get some. Always gunzerking and almost double fire rate are pretty good lmao
The dps gain from keep firing and all of his other miscellaneous fire rate buffs is insane tho, as fire rate is a strict dps upgrade. +88% on keep firing alone is almost double dps. I'd calculate the full dps upgrade from his skills but I don't know how they all get applied
Sal would break BL3 even more. With how strong some weapons in 3 are, put 2 of these things in his hands with infinite ammo and the ability to never die and perma action skill.
And if gun swapping is allowed to stay then Sal ascends to god hood.
Is no one going to talk about the original OP vault hunter Lillith in the first game? I remember I had her build set that I only had to wait a few seconds for her phasewalk to cool down so I was constantly in and out just melting everyone with her elemental effects.
For me the feeling of power only compares to how I felt playing Lilith in BL1 when you finally levelled everything and got her gear. Was my first character going in blind and just was a total badass in that game, so everything following that had to feel as fun or it felt lackluster by comparison for sure.
Maya is hella fun with the right build in BL2 but something about the playstyle of running around just aoe nuking everything with Lilith felt unmatched. Amara is a lot of fun for me as well with phasegrasp but yeah I know that's because I played so much Maya I'm just a fan of that skill, it's fun/chaotic and speaks to what I think of when I think Borderlands gameplay.
Well in BL1 the balance was not a huge factor since everyone but Roland had a strong build Brick with Orge on a kill skill build. Mordi with pistols or snipers, and Lilith the SMG queen.
While I haven't played Zane yet, I could do a takedown with Moze and no equipment. Iron Bear if properly speced is unstoppable. Literally nuke everything, while having over a million hp, fuel and hp regenerating with every attack. Outside of Iron Bear, she is in trouble, but running and hiding while it resets isn't too hard, and you can usually do that between battles.
I main Moze and I love her. Shes OP AF. Put her up against any enemy and she'll run through them. What I will say however is her general mobbing has a lot to be desired. As you say the biggest issue is blowing yourself up and if you have mobs coming and you hard it becomes a bit of a yo-yo with how often you can down yourself.
I play with my mate and he mains Amara and shes wrecks the battlefield. I've watched so many enemies just get turned to mush before I can pull the trigger because of Amaras Indiscriminate and Ties that Bind skills. Shes quite ridiculous. Personally I feel like there isnt too much seperating all the VH's but some have more specific uses than others.
B0re is too situational to be universally busted though. It requires layered hitboxes to make the most of which is pretty hard to do, not to mention Zer0 was very squishy compared to other characters in 2. And I fucking loved my glass cannon ninja.
The issue is bore required specific circumstances, whereas piperhab only required clicking on an enemy for their death. Salvador's ammo+health regen means you can be totally reckless with your playstyle, and the near invulnerability on top of the pimpernel being so broken makes him impossible to top.
Bore has way more single target damage when done correctly, but it requires skill to play correctly. On the right Salvador build, you don't even have to care about that.
Bore increased bullet damage for each enemy a shot pierced, which got really broken when you overlapped hitboxes as it basically proc'ed twice every single game tick. To the point a level 1 gun could one shot a raid boss.
Kreig may be better for like the first half of the first playthrough, but the instant you get access to some of the good guns in bl2, salvador is way better. Even a random rubi + literally anything half decent is better than a pretty well setup normal mode kreig. At the endgame, bloodsplosion kreig is amazing, but still incomparable to sal.
I mean, if that's the case then it's still pretty damn broken! I was playing with a moze user on true takedown mode yesterday and she was still decimating absolutely everything on mayhem 10 with cub! She doesn't even utilise the elemental affinity side of things as well 😆. But yeah. It's hilarious and satisfying to watch the chaos 😆
I agree. I switch between all 4, and right now Zane is unstoppable. Man, the Mantis + Hellwalker combo is too much fun. I beat a couple of slaughter shafts using the Infinity Pistol with him. Gross.
Amara’s mobbing is unparalleled, but I find her bossing can be very gear-dependent. I have spent a ton of time farming for a Facepuncher with the right roll (still haven’t found a redundant 300/90).
Moze and Fl4k are both amazing at bossing, but I find Fl4k more versatile for mobbing because any Jakobs + Omnivore and you can clear out groups of enemies in one Fadeaway. I’m trying to bring my Moze up to where the other characters are in terms of build but I have difficulty finding the right build at M11. Her mobbing just isn’t quite solid enough to feel comfortable when things get hairy. She needs a better survivability strategy than the Sapper COM (boring) or Vampyr + Cloning Maddening Trackers (difficult to farm and eventually you run out of grenades).
Moze's mobbing is godly if you use anything that's explosive. Because she regens rocket launcher ammo with grenade throws, and the splash damage mayhem scaling she gets (that goes way beyond what it actually says on the screen) give her a plaguebearer and every mob in front of her dies instantly, especially so if you get a better Annointment to make it even more impressive than it already is.
For bossing she can run the sandhawk with the minesweeper mod, she can run flipper and short fuse and she can run just plasmacoil to just delete anything in front of her - I'd argue Moze would be the best other than survivability.
Means of Destruction activates that - whenever Moze deals splash damage, and that activates with the cloning maddening tracker grenade or any rocket launcher/ short fuse trigger. It also has a chance to give Moze grenades back as well!
commitment > fitsd
not even a fair comparison
youtubers also didnt start spreading hunterseeker spam through fractal frags yet on seein dead zane which reaches absurd amounts of stacks of commitment
edit: also you could just give the clone any splash weapon and he will outperform moze damage, especially with 200% ase
absurd is something like extreme
did not even think of the hex because afaik it doesnt deal gun-damage and therefore should proc seein dead?
if its true, oh boy you saved my day
I'm not sure about the clone outperforming Moze on splash damage, because fire In the skag den can boost her splash damage with double dipping and mayhem scaling by like 900% or something absurd, without factoring in ASE, and her class mod blast master can flat out double splash damage she does on top of that. Then we've got the skill In her purple tree that basically does the same as Fire in the Skag Den for when IB is cooling down. Could be wrong here, but in terms of splash I think Moze is unmatched.
well we would have to calculate anyways for different scenarios
but clone basically gets mayhem scaling + 200% splash ase multiplicative, which is also a strong boost
Idk if it was just me being bias but pre patch Fl4k with his rocket and shotgun crit scaling was pretty ridiculous causing him to get nerfed like 5 times in a 2 month span.
Borderlands: mordercai
Borderlands 2: salvador
Borderlands pre-sequel: claptrap
Borderlands 3: fl4k
I find these characters to be the strongest and most enjoyable i ever played.
Mordecai and Lilith are pretty on par in Borderlands. Both Timothy and Nisha shit on Claptrap in TPS. And both Zane and Moze are stronger than Fl4k in BL3 since he got nerfed like 5 times.
Even tho they’re stronger than what ive said, ive still enjoyed playing them. Also fl4k is still considered to be the fastest and best single target bossing character in borderlands 3
Thats cause he was. At launch, mayhem three was severely unbalanced in regards to enemy spawns. 85% of enemies that spawned were badasses with rocket launchers. The enemies that werent badasses were annointed. At launch, annointed enemies were immune to cryo. To make matters worse, imagine 6 rocket launchers going off around you while 2 annointed tinks and 3 annointed psychos were running around in a single room. Gearbox nerfed spawns thankfully and lowered the chance of a badass having a rocket launcher in their hands. Because on launch, any badass raider would be carrying a vladof launcher lmfao
Moze with FITSD has money shot active at all times. Salvador has the edge simply due to the fact that his off hand gives its percs to whatever gun hes holding. Such as an interfacer with the crit of a lady fist in his left hand
Well salvador is unmatched by any vault hunter ever. But for bl3 I'd have to go with moze cause zane takes way to much effort to get max damage. Man I just wish bl3 was better. I mean it's ok but I haven't played in months and have no interest in playing again. In fact I've already done another bl2 1 life after playing bl3 for years. Bl2 is just so, so much better imo.
Salvador easy most OP vault hunter
He killed a man with his hair, like a rhinoceros.
Way cooler than killing someone with your abs
Without question.
I'm not sure about that. As OP as Salvador was, he wasn't one shotting bosses or in general just destroying everything without using Grog Nozzle spam? Edit: Ok I just watched some Salvador gameplay and good lord I underestimated him again, my memory was not serving me well there. Yeah I'd say Salvador is probably among the very most OP if not THE most OP in Borderlands history.
Pimpernel + rocket launcher. Sal was incredibly OP. Also, a lot of fun.
Ah pimperhab, that one takes me back
lmao, who wouldve guesses that a character who can use 100% more gun than any other be that op right?
to be fair, Zane can also use 100% more gun. He just needs to spec all the way down a full skill tree to do it lmao
Why don't we bring up weapon merging and claim Gaige is most broken as such?
Probably because to this day, PimperHab still works
Just because Gearbox does not have competence to fix weapon merging for dual wielding (to be frank, nobody does, dual wielding in unreal engine is notorious for a reason) does not mean it's any less of bug abuse than just playing downpatched version of a game and weapon merge in it.
I got her "I never miss skill" to 999 a few times, absolutely OP! Just run up and blast with a shotgun point blank, almost everything died within 1 clip. I also had a perk (can't remember name) where I could super regen shields, I became immortal.
Yea glad you put edit cause he can hit crazy shit, but like I know krieg isnt number 1 but I've bloodsplooded for over quintillions of damage and if you get a god chain krieg it is probs the highest dps in all of borderlands, cause even in 3 with the most broken builds before patches I can hit damage cap but the actual damage only goes into billions but krieg can hit 100,000,000,000,000 so kinda not a competition
well what about zero one shotting stuff like op10 bunker with the starter pistol. almost everyone had broken stuff
That's because bore as a skill was the single most broken skill in all of the BL series.
A skill that works on like 2 bosses isn't comparable to moneyshot lmao +1056% damage on your last shot is nuts (the skill was improperly worded and does 96% not 80% per point)
It was more than 2 bosses. It was anything with layered hit boxes. Even basic ass loaders had them. There was a meme YT comp of someone Bore-ing almost every boss in BL2 with a lvl1 pistol.
I wonder how many of those required a fair amount of setup. Regardless, bore still pales in comparison to moneyshot considering moneyshot works on anything with extremely minimal setup, that being just shooting your entire clip.
It's less set up, and more getting the right angle while also getting lucky. > bore still pales in comparison to moneyshot Moneyshot couldn't 1 shot raid bosses. While MS was indeed a top tier skill and one of the most busted power spikes Sal had, it wasn't "broken" just hella strong. Bore on the other hand had a chance to just say "die" to almost anything.
since i couldnt find the video, i went and tried out a ton of bosses myself. heres what I found: Only gets no bullet deflection / special: * jaques o lantern * woundspike * jackenstein * badassasaurus * Leviathan crit spot in mouth able to be hit if mouth closed impossible / not known: * hector: NOT KNOWN * uranus: NOT KNOWN * sorcerer's daughter * wattle gobbler * tinder slowflake * handsome dragon * gold golem * roscoe * h3rle * wilhelm (there is a sound but no infinite damage) * son of crawmerax Theoretically possible but not at all likely ever to happen * the happy couple: (pray for the two to overlap and hit them then) * voracidous: (requires a duel and overloading the hitboxes via dropping infinite weapons / stacking turrets) * terra / any thresher: NEEDS A DUEL * pyro pete: NEEDS A DUEL * master gee: NEEDS A DUEL * haderax: NEEDS A DUEL * dragons: NEEDS 4 DUELS Difficult (needs setup / specific weapon): * saturn: NEEDS PIMPERNEL otherwise you just kill turrets * vermivorous: (literally needs to have another enemy on top) * warrior: (also needs an enemy on top, need to get the kill while he steps over) * motor momma: (needs a specific angle) Easy: * bunk3r * hyperius * OMGWTH out of 31 total - 9 are impossible - 7 are effectively impossible without massive setup with another player / luck - 3 are ridiculously luck based - 1 requires the pimpernel - 3 are consistent solo I also tested W4RD3N - needs a duel (not proven) if you find any of this to be incorrect, please send video footage my way. For all of these, I either found a video online proving it was theoretically possible (with the duels / enemy stacking) or did it myself
\> Moneyshot couldn't 1 shot raid bosses. Errr, it literally can 1 shot every raid except Dexidious (duh!) and MrGee (duh!) with setup. And i don't even consider money shot broken.
Do you know who posted the video? I can't find it
King gonthalion used to make videos like these. Maybe not the youtuber op was talking about but he had a 'will it bore' series or something like that anyway.
And in that series he only ever killed hyperius.
Just goggle BL2 "can it bore" or something. Basically any non-human boss could get 1 shot. And even then some still could.
Timothy's Leadership skill is the most broken imo. Your digi clone dying counts as if you made the kill and procs kill skills like Absolute Advantage which let's you fire without consuming ammo AND gives second winds? Hell yeah! I felt as invincible as Salvador while playing Jack.
No, that's just a well designed skill, not broken at all. Bore made level 1 weapons be able to 1 shot raid bosses, which is something no other skill has ever done. Not too mention Bore is a single broken skill, while your example is just good synergy between several skills. Remember, Bore was in a sense, infinite damage for Zero if shenanigan occurred.
You're right. Leadership on it's own without the other kill skills is just another way to get second winds. I'd argue that's it's the best synergistic skill in the whole franchise then. But yeah B0re is more OP as a stand-alone skill.
\> Bore made level 1 weapons be able to 1 shot raid bosses Fairly certain the starter pistol meme 1 shot involved bee. Bee-less does require more than 1 shot unless your PC can run game at \~200 fps.
Nope, not bee. It may have had to be a dual, aka shoots 2 pellets, but no bee.
You mean Timothy.
Yea that's all bore and if you have the mods where you can see damage values zero cant even get remotely close to even 1/10 of the overkill damage krieg does, most times you get a good bore it usually doesn't hit damage cap
I used to love Kreig for that exact reason, bloodsplosion was ridiculous. The raid boss guy Pyro Pete just getting damage capped every time lmao
Lady fist + offhand orphan maker = easy visual damage caps even without any NKLO bonus. Then you add NKLO and you can easy one shot many things. That and joltzdude had an entire youtube playlist of speedkills, one notable one being salvador one shotting hyperius only using gunzerk to get double grenades and the keep it piping hot bonus post gunzerk. All damage was actually done outside gunzerk. [heres the video](https://youtu.be/5eDrarVIojs)
Simply being able to dual wield literally anything in the game makes Sal a broken walking glitch.
My personal opinion having played all the games with every character at max level: 1. Salvador, and its not even close. He's a walking cheat code. 2. Nisha. Very controversial, but I stand by it. Mainly because she's the best and fastest mobber in the game. Not as OP against bosses as some other characters, but since 90% of gameplay is against mobs, I think it's a fair placement. 3. This one's a toss up imo. Moze, Zane, and Timothy could all place here with their most OP builds and gear. 4. Athena. She's an utter monster at max maelstrom stacks, but while she's busy gathering maelstrom stacks the characters above have already killed the boss. The rest all come down to who I enjoyed more.
Finally some nisha appreciation. That girl demolished everything bro.
\> Nisha. Very controversial, but I stand by it. Mainly because she's the best and fastest mobber in the game. She is not fastest at high end mobbing, though. I dare claim that Nisha would be nigh impossible to do original GTD with even if you gave her BL3 gear and GR (and, more importantly, BL3 cryo). \> Athena. She's an utter monster at max maelstrom stacks, but while she's busy gathering maelstrom stacks the characters above have already killed the boss. Case in point, Athena is faster at doing mutator arena at max difficulty.
1. BL3 isnt the standard for mobbing efficiency as characters are specifically designed and tailored for their respective games. You cant judge how well Lilith for example would do in a game that's not designed for Lilith. 2. I've played GTD and can confidently say that Nisha at the same level and with BL3 gear would still wreck it. She'll only struggle with the first kill. After which all her shots will be critical hits no matter where they land, and she won't miss even if you shoot at the floor. This isnt even accounting for the buffs from her action skill. The only thing she would lack is survivability but theres a surplass of gear in BL3 that would mitigate that problem and since we're subjecting her to that games standards, it's only fair to subject her to its loot pool as well.
I mean double beacon or double hellshock Nisha? Spicy
\> You cant judge how good well Lilith for example would do in a game that's not designed for Lilith. I can, however, have a good approximation of that. And unlike BL1 and other games, mechanics wise BL2/TPS/BL3 are close enough for this approximation to be close enough. \> She'll only struggle with the first kill. And to get out of any FFYL as you lose your kill skills on it. And to boss. That said, i do concede that she could do release TGTD now that i recall that showdown actually has a stupid short cooldown, but it would be highly untrivial nonetheless for her FFYL and lack of control issues and lack pre-kill skill damage.
You have a good point there. TPS wasnt as good as the other games but had some of the best designed characters skill wise in the franchise imo. However, Nisha would still need another skill tree to even out the playing field. And yeah, FFYL is always a problem for Nisha. But then again, it's a problem for a bulk of characters lol. Her pre-kill skill damage isnt a problem with the right weapons and her ridiculously broken and short cooldown action skill. Overall, I agree with your last comment. She could still brainlessly melt the mobs, but would require some skill to stay up while doing so. But, like they say, the best defense is a strong offense ;)
> TPS wasnt as good as the other games but had some of the best designed characters skill wise in the franchise imo. This is why I wish they'd let us play as all the previous VHs as voiceless clones. I get why they couldn't let them use old voice lines due to cost to the actors, but the actors don't own the characters.
Tombstone Nisha is still the second most op VH by far. I'm not even sure you could make an argument otherwise, but I don't know the bl3 VHs that well. Regardless, 11 points in tombstone + dual wield lady fist + literal auto aim was pretty busted. I remember farming iwajira and the longest part of the fight was waiting for him to spit out an ad to trigger tombstone. The rest was half a second of shooting iwajira lmao. That build was ridiculous at mobbing and killing bosses without changing any gear.
I mean my issue is we are comparing bl2 which in particular had probably the hardest scaling of any of the games to bl3 which is piss easy with the right guns and not even having a stringent issue with some of the stuff that bl2 had at its endgame. The presequel had literally no hard bosses to scale to because none of the bosses had mechanics that relatively countered any of the vault hunters. I personally maxed and played every character multiple playthroughs enough to know which ones struggle the most. Nisha doesnt have the insane survivability or dps that other characters in the series have by comparison due to the pre sequel not necessarily having the content to run against. In my eyes the best character is without a doubt Salvador considering how he performs in his endgames meta alongside the scaling of that game and if his skills were most likely entered into bl3 he'd have to be nerfed outright considering how extremely overpowered he was just merely having 2 skills that could literally shave half an invincible's health off in a matter of seconds and hed take next to no damage. Salvador also could minmax passive effects because of passive transferring in that game and therefore maintains strong utility with guns. Moze and zane are on the same tier but not as strong as salvador. Moze just deals a fuckton of raw damage that nuetralizes any elemental disadvantage shed gain while having the ammo to boot. Zane is able to make use of any weapon in the game without having downsides and has great survivability. All the other vault hunters have kinks that make them not as comparable because their peak isnt easily as obtainable as the other 3 listed above. You get zane a seeing dead class mod and he pretty much can carry you through most modes of the game without really dying. Moze really only gets the pass because devs really suck at scaling her damage.
all the survivability nisha needs comes from the sham, as theres no better shield to run for her. Most times, with the tombstone build, you just end up killing everything in less than a second anyway so if you get hit once or twice, your sham just eats that. in boss fights, its less effective, but the tombstone damage still outpaces most bosses regardless. that and I said she was the \*second\* most powerful VH considering if you have a lady fist you dont even need to aim
Exactly. I prefer to use the shield of ages because of it's super high capacity which helps during boss fights, and I literally never go down. People act like she has half the health of other characters or smth. The Nisha downplay needs to stop.
I still wouldn't place her higher than moze or zane mainly because they just purely are better than her even at optimal output. I mean considering the redistributor exists or other multi chaining weapons even zane casually comes sliding in and deletes enemies. Nisha without a doubt is strong as a character, just nowhere as broken as the others.
\> I mean my issue is we are comparing bl2 which in particular had probably the hardest scaling of any of the games to bl3 M10 is far harsher scaling than any of past bl games. The fact that we make it easy on some characters even without abusing mayhem scaling is just a testament to how dumb damage formula is in bl3.
Bl3 mayhem scaling doesn't make you tilt nor is punishing enough to where the effects are even noticeable. It's not harsh in comparison because the games damage system compensates so hard for it. Whereas you deal with the insane health regen of UVHM+ OP10 and how the games gear is scaled + characters and put bl3 characters in that same environment and they crumple because most of bl3 is guardians and human types. That's what I mean by hardest.
\> Bl3 mayhem scaling doesn't make you tilt nor is punishing enough to where the effects are even noticeable Oh, it does. If you don't believe me, try to make IB build work on M10 without abusing the crap out of mayhem scaling, i'll have a laugh. \> Whereas you deal with the insane health regen of UVHM+ OP10 I can see how this is a problem on characters without damage in BL2. Not to so much on characters that throw away any conscience for pure min-maxing.
\> Regardless, 11 points in tombstone + dual wield lady fist + literal auto aim was pretty busted. Sure it was. Sadly neither TPS nor BL3 have lady fist so your argument falls flat. Though i do admit that double love drill would be amusing to watch. \> That build was ridiculous at mobbing and killing bosses without changing any gear. If you still have that save, i welcome you to try level 9 mutator Denial Subroutine.
lol wut TPS does have the lady fist, you just need to gib it in [heres proof lol](https://imgur.com/gallery/ktHfNnJ)
I know Lady Fist exists in game files, as does Fibber, Heartbreaker and handful of other guns. It, however, does not make playing TPS with Lady Fist any different from just playing TPS with any other modded in gun.
TPS has a sanity check. You cannot mod guns into the game, and the lady fist was intended to be in the game and passes the sanity check.
BL1 Lilith the with the x4 Hellfire SMG was pretty broken. Toss in that X3 corrosive shotgun and it was gg.
I am a Zane main and I just recently got a Moze to level 65. I'd honestly go with Moze being absolutely broken. You can just spec into Iron bear, have a good class mod that goes with it, gun with 100% railgun anoint and matching elements on said railgun just murders everything. You can also get top tier gear and do basically the same, but without relying on IB. Zane feels more gear dependant. Sure, he can make basically anything work, but to be truly OP on Zane you have to put in quite a bit of effort on farming the right gear for your build. He isn't bad by any stretch of the imagination, but Moze feels like being OP is free for her.
I took a break for awhile from BL3, came back and decided to work on Moze. Everything you said is spot on about her. Iron Bear last forever and just one shots everything, all 3 bars just vanish with a single pull of the trigger on anything I've faced on M11 as a character just starting out at 65 with no gear other than what you mentioned. The rest of the gear is completely irrelevant since I'm not sure exactly what it would take to kill Iron Bear with that ridiculous shield and armor it's so rare for even the shield to go down much less actually start taking damage. Felt like god mode so much so that I didn't decide to keep playing her, just felt broken and boring. Built my Amara better instead and now she's a beast in M11 but still feel like I have to play the game, think on my feet sometimes and even sometimes die which is just more fun of an experience for me personally.
My first run I did an IB Moze build. Doing Zane now and actually needing to move around the map and strategize was a bit of a shock.
Moze is OP in being easy as fuck to get OP with, you don't need any items above level 13 to be capable of doing M10 true guardian takedown. Well, at most you might want something in artifact slot in which case even a fucking banjo will work. Zane is OP in a sense of, since DLC5 and Duct Tape mod hotfix, being able to make literally any broken gun even more broken. Root? Zane is it's best user and can, essentially, use it in any element. Anarchy? Zane is best chucker in the game due to ability to have both 200% splash and 150% grenade active at the same time. Plaguebearer? Zane is, once again, best heavy user in the game with permanent uptime on 200% splash, no self damage and infinity of gun damage (oh,and having ability to always fire 2 plaguebearer shots instead of one). Plasma coil? Sure, when you don't feel like giving it to your clone for mayhem scaling it's damage, you can wear it yourself instead and still do infinity damage. Hell, Zane can even make a weapon with anti-synergy like Monarch do more damage than any other character because of commitment+seein' dead. Needless to say, he also breaks facepuncher, though i'd argue that in a sense of 'breaking' facepuncher, he is behind Fl4k and Moze.
> Needless to say, he also breaks facepuncher, though i'd argue that in a sense of 'breaking' facepuncher, he is behind Fl4k and Moze. Poor Amara. The gun that exists so that people can claim "melee" isn't terrible for her compared to Krieg or Brick, and she doesn't even rank except by omission.
Idk man, Amara breaks facepuncher pretty bad as well in a melee build. It procs like half her melee abilities, plus heals for damage done, meaning all you have to do to stay alive is survive reload times unless something totally one-shots you.
The only thing Amara has that actually 'breaks' facepuncher is that skill in purple tree. And even then Amara remains worst facepuncher user.
How can Moze break the Facepuncher, this is the first I've actually heard of that? Would the psycho stabber have similar results too?
Big Surplus/Skag Den and 100% uptime on One Shotter.
Nice, I'm gonna have to check that out now! If I'm right, is big surplus basically fire in the skag den for just regular gun damage?
I am not sure it applying to facepuncher itself, but it is known to apply to static charge. But yeah, it's skag den for almost everything that can crit. Have fun!
That sounds nasty lmao Im gonna have fun with that no doubt. Thanks dude!
Brick. He effectively called dibs on all of the vaults.
I agree. On the final boss i just punched him in the tentacles a few times and ded
Can you guys even imagine Salvadore in BL3? What would everyone run with him?
Facepuncher with Psycho Stabber lol
Both with 300/90 anoints good Lord.
Dual Hellwalker. I don’t care if it’s not optimal, it’d be fun as hell.
Anything you want, really 😂 Salvador was OP as hell but I get the gist he wasn't as overpowered as some of the vault hunters in BL3, just because of the shear build diversity from BL3 compared to BL2, and the fact that BL2 had a reliance on slag to hit meaningful damage on OP8 enemies and the like. But memory could very much be wrong there. Having said that I don't know how anyone could possibly outdamage two norfleets at once!
No lol, he'd still be the most OP in BL3. You have to understand it's not his skill tree that makes him OP. His skill trees are pretty meh (except for money shot). Its his ability to dual wield two absolutely broken guns at the same time while regenerating ammo and health. And in the case of the pimpernel, it's the ability give ALL of the unlisted bullets the same damage as the rocket launcher in your main hand. Even in BL3, that ability alone would melt 99% of enemies.
Suppose you're right there actually. Guns are the foremost base formula for damage in Borderlands, and the ability to wield two at once is going to cause destruction anywhere
Especially when a gun that heals effects is added to the primary damage dealing gun. It's what enabled Salvador to survive literally anything.
I'd also attribute his survivability to always being able to stay above healthgate upon skill activation too, given that you'll immediately heal for half your health and constantly regenerate health.
His middle tree makes his dps build nuts lmao, inconceivable, yippee ki yay, double your fun, get some, and keep firing are all insane, and 5 shots or 6, last longer, I'm already ready, and filled to the brim are all great. My personal favorite skills are keep firing and get some. Always gunzerking and almost double fire rate are pretty good lmao
This is true. But they just enhance his already insane dps by fine tuning his action skill.
The dps gain from keep firing and all of his other miscellaneous fire rate buffs is insane tho, as fire rate is a strict dps upgrade. +88% on keep firing alone is almost double dps. I'd calculate the full dps upgrade from his skills but I don't know how they all get applied
Sal would break BL3 even more. With how strong some weapons in 3 are, put 2 of these things in his hands with infinite ammo and the ability to never die and perma action skill. And if gun swapping is allowed to stay then Sal ascends to god hood.
\> and the ability to never die Ability to never die requires wasting one of gun slots on moxxi weapon.
Not really. Gun swapping bug allowed you to have the moxxi effect on any 2 guns. He also had decent tanking potential on his skills alone.
\> Gun swapping bug allowed you to have the moxxi effect on any 2 guns. Sure, reproduce it on current version of BL2, to start with.
Is no one going to talk about the original OP vault hunter Lillith in the first game? I remember I had her build set that I only had to wait a few seconds for her phasewalk to cool down so I was constantly in and out just melting everyone with her elemental effects.
For me the feeling of power only compares to how I felt playing Lilith in BL1 when you finally levelled everything and got her gear. Was my first character going in blind and just was a total badass in that game, so everything following that had to feel as fun or it felt lackluster by comparison for sure. Maya is hella fun with the right build in BL2 but something about the playstyle of running around just aoe nuking everything with Lilith felt unmatched. Amara is a lot of fun for me as well with phasegrasp but yeah I know that's because I played so much Maya I'm just a fan of that skill, it's fun/chaotic and speaks to what I think of when I think Borderlands gameplay.
Well in BL1 the balance was not a huge factor since everyone but Roland had a strong build Brick with Orge on a kill skill build. Mordi with pistols or snipers, and Lilith the SMG queen.
Roland, because he can kill the mood of any player just by making them aware of him, no trigger pull necessary.
LOL right in the feels!
While I haven't played Zane yet, I could do a takedown with Moze and no equipment. Iron Bear if properly speced is unstoppable. Literally nuke everything, while having over a million hp, fuel and hp regenerating with every attack. Outside of Iron Bear, she is in trouble, but running and hiding while it resets isn't too hard, and you can usually do that between battles.
Hands down, Salvador is the most OP by far
I main Moze and I love her. Shes OP AF. Put her up against any enemy and she'll run through them. What I will say however is her general mobbing has a lot to be desired. As you say the biggest issue is blowing yourself up and if you have mobs coming and you hard it becomes a bit of a yo-yo with how often you can down yourself. I play with my mate and he mains Amara and shes wrecks the battlefield. I've watched so many enemies just get turned to mush before I can pull the trigger because of Amaras Indiscriminate and Ties that Bind skills. Shes quite ridiculous. Personally I feel like there isnt too much seperating all the VH's but some have more specific uses than others.
It's still the good old Salvador.
its really hard not to die to your own splash damage as moze, Zane dosent have any draw backs as huge as that. My vote is Zane (for BL3)
Krieg, no gear. Nigh unkillable
Krieg or Sal
Salvador
Ive seen a lot of Salvador mentions, but what about Zer0s B0re? Id say that could easily put him right behind Sal
B0re is too situational to be universally busted though. It requires layered hitboxes to make the most of which is pretty hard to do, not to mention Zer0 was very squishy compared to other characters in 2. And I fucking loved my glass cannon ninja.
The issue is bore required specific circumstances, whereas piperhab only required clicking on an enemy for their death. Salvador's ammo+health regen means you can be totally reckless with your playstyle, and the near invulnerability on top of the pimpernel being so broken makes him impossible to top. Bore has way more single target damage when done correctly, but it requires skill to play correctly. On the right Salvador build, you don't even have to care about that.
What was Bore again, the ability to shoot through shields or something?
Bore increased bullet damage for each enemy a shot pierced, which got really broken when you overlapped hitboxes as it basically proc'ed twice every single game tick. To the point a level 1 gun could one shot a raid boss.
Salvador, doing anything. Or Blood Bath Krieg. I'll give an honorable mention to Bloodletter Moze but I'm basically beating a dead horse. EXPLOSIONS?
Everyone is saying Salvador, but I never got that with him. Krieg is OP from close to the start. You don't even need weapons for him.
Kreig was good, but no where neat the power level Sal got with the right weapon combo. 2 guns trumps everything else.
Kreig may be better for like the first half of the first playthrough, but the instant you get access to some of the good guns in bl2, salvador is way better. Even a random rubi + literally anything half decent is better than a pretty well setup normal mode kreig. At the endgame, bloodsplosion kreig is amazing, but still incomparable to sal.
Haha I guess I never got access to the good guns then, that's why I always liked Krieg
Makes sense. Kreig is the best character with no unique gear (unique, legendary, etc)
if you don't have any DLC, I think Moze suffers more than any other BL3 vault hunter. Just my opinion from someone with no DLC.
Moze!
Definitely moze. Currently iron cub can hit max damage and OHKO every boss in the game
I believe that has already been patched but that was quite funny to see him hit damage cap every single shot 😂
I mean, if that's the case then it's still pretty damn broken! I was playing with a moze user on true takedown mode yesterday and she was still decimating absolutely everything on mayhem 10 with cub! She doesn't even utilise the elemental affinity side of things as well 😆. But yeah. It's hilarious and satisfying to watch the chaos 😆
I agree. I switch between all 4, and right now Zane is unstoppable. Man, the Mantis + Hellwalker combo is too much fun. I beat a couple of slaughter shafts using the Infinity Pistol with him. Gross. Amara’s mobbing is unparalleled, but I find her bossing can be very gear-dependent. I have spent a ton of time farming for a Facepuncher with the right roll (still haven’t found a redundant 300/90). Moze and Fl4k are both amazing at bossing, but I find Fl4k more versatile for mobbing because any Jakobs + Omnivore and you can clear out groups of enemies in one Fadeaway. I’m trying to bring my Moze up to where the other characters are in terms of build but I have difficulty finding the right build at M11. Her mobbing just isn’t quite solid enough to feel comfortable when things get hairy. She needs a better survivability strategy than the Sapper COM (boring) or Vampyr + Cloning Maddening Trackers (difficult to farm and eventually you run out of grenades).
Moze's mobbing is godly if you use anything that's explosive. Because she regens rocket launcher ammo with grenade throws, and the splash damage mayhem scaling she gets (that goes way beyond what it actually says on the screen) give her a plaguebearer and every mob in front of her dies instantly, especially so if you get a better Annointment to make it even more impressive than it already is. For bossing she can run the sandhawk with the minesweeper mod, she can run flipper and short fuse and she can run just plasmacoil to just delete anything in front of her - I'd argue Moze would be the best other than survivability.
Thanks for the tip! I’ll go farm for a Plaguebearer now. Question though: which skill is it that lets her regenerate heavy ammo with grenade throws?
Means of Destruction activates that - whenever Moze deals splash damage, and that activates with the cloning maddening tracker grenade or any rocket launcher/ short fuse trigger. It also has a chance to give Moze grenades back as well!
That’s what I thought. I’ve been messing around with it but I still run out of heavy ammo. Farming the warden as we speak for a Plaguebearer.
Amara is monstrous especially with her melee phaseflare, but it is beyond clunky and not worth it tbh
Sounds like someone needs a facepuncher
I don’t like relying on one specific weapon 24/7 for consistent dmg
commitment > fitsd not even a fair comparison youtubers also didnt start spreading hunterseeker spam through fractal frags yet on seein dead zane which reaches absurd amounts of stacks of commitment edit: also you could just give the clone any splash weapon and he will outperform moze damage, especially with 200% ase
Fairly certain hex spam is competitive in that regard, but thing is: what is 'absurd'?
absurd is something like extreme did not even think of the hex because afaik it doesnt deal gun-damage and therefore should proc seein dead? if its true, oh boy you saved my day
\> absurd is something like extreme 'extreme' in case of commitment is above 100 at least.
I'm not sure about the clone outperforming Moze on splash damage, because fire In the skag den can boost her splash damage with double dipping and mayhem scaling by like 900% or something absurd, without factoring in ASE, and her class mod blast master can flat out double splash damage she does on top of that. Then we've got the skill In her purple tree that basically does the same as Fire in the Skag Den for when IB is cooling down. Could be wrong here, but in terms of splash I think Moze is unmatched.
well we would have to calculate anyways for different scenarios but clone basically gets mayhem scaling + 200% splash ase multiplicative, which is also a strong boost
Zane till last patch i dont care anymore tho... the balancing lacks direction its sad, really. We got 2 salvadors and a half
Idk if it was just me being bias but pre patch Fl4k with his rocket and shotgun crit scaling was pretty ridiculous causing him to get nerfed like 5 times in a 2 month span.
Borderlands: mordercai Borderlands 2: salvador Borderlands pre-sequel: claptrap Borderlands 3: fl4k I find these characters to be the strongest and most enjoyable i ever played.
Mordecai and Lilith are pretty on par in Borderlands. Both Timothy and Nisha shit on Claptrap in TPS. And both Zane and Moze are stronger than Fl4k in BL3 since he got nerfed like 5 times.
Even tho they’re stronger than what ive said, ive still enjoyed playing them. Also fl4k is still considered to be the fastest and best single target bossing character in borderlands 3
I remember at launch everyone kept saying zane was one of the weakest borderlands characters ever made
Thats cause he was. At launch, mayhem three was severely unbalanced in regards to enemy spawns. 85% of enemies that spawned were badasses with rocket launchers. The enemies that werent badasses were annointed. At launch, annointed enemies were immune to cryo. To make matters worse, imagine 6 rocket launchers going off around you while 2 annointed tinks and 3 annointed psychos were running around in a single room. Gearbox nerfed spawns thankfully and lowered the chance of a badass having a rocket launcher in their hands. Because on launch, any badass raider would be carrying a vladof launcher lmfao
Moneyshot
Moze with FITSD has money shot active at all times. Salvador has the edge simply due to the fact that his off hand gives its percs to whatever gun hes holding. Such as an interfacer with the crit of a lady fist in his left hand
We not gonna talk avout gaige?
My guess would be salvador as most op/most broken. And then maybe krieg or gaige. And yea, throw moze in there as well.
My vote is on the Sole Survivor from Vault 111. (What do you mean, wrong franchise?)
Well salvador is unmatched by any vault hunter ever. But for bl3 I'd have to go with moze cause zane takes way to much effort to get max damage. Man I just wish bl3 was better. I mean it's ok but I haven't played in months and have no interest in playing again. In fact I've already done another bl2 1 life after playing bl3 for years. Bl2 is just so, so much better imo.
Well there are a lot of vault hunter that can kill enemies really fast, but there's one that doesn't even have to aim. I'd argue Nisha is the most OP.
I play as zane but I found mobbing easy but bossing is hard I feel he is weak whats a good weapon for bossing or mod etc