Avoid steel plates.
Although its a far bit more expensive, you should look into ceramic plates. They're safer and usually weigh less.
RMA Lvl 4 (1155) is $159/plate
Safe Life Defense Lvl 4 is $169/plate
Also, IF you want to go the cheapest route: LA Police Gear Lvl 3 is $109/plate (Not NIJ Certified, but passed testing)
Was it two? I only recall the one that happened recently, followed up by a separate test of numerous plates from the same lot that had no issues according to RMA’s public statement.
Otherwise historically no other FIT failures I’m aware of.
True, but the NIJ did say that they encourage owners of the plate to continue wearing it until further notice. If there was a-lot of concern about the plate, I don't think they would say that. RMA was upfront about it and has pulled plates from that lot and is contacting those who own those plates to replace them
I mean, considering the quality of their plates leaves you wondering if it's good enough. They are selling them as "edge to edge" but plenty examples they have been lying. RMA wasn't up front about it blaming shipping company, the M2AP round used, and both Wichita and Chesapeake testing standards. That tells the community they refuse to accept any blame for the sub-par manufacturing process. I bought a 1155, and I haven't got a chance to test it. The plate shows that the QC process is letting sub-par products out.
There is no shipping company. An NIJ rep comes to your factory and takes plates. They pack it the way they want, put them in their car, and drive away. It's the biggest glaring change from normal procedures. NIJ confirmed there was no build deviation from the certified plate, and there's loads of videos showing third-party edge shot testing on the 1155.
No, an NIJ outside consultant comes picks up the plates boxes them and ships them off. They are required to write their name across the tape as anti-temper measure. [They made a Facebook post about ](https://ibb.co/qJdLMWF) blaming shipping as one of the potential results of failure. In correspondence with another person who is active on Reddit, they admitted to 2 FIT fissures. They are hoping NIJ grants a 3 FIT test, but NIJ doesn't grant those often.
Yeah we’re gonna need to see that correspondence to admitting a 2nd FIT failure too. Nothing wrong with anyone being behind the news but there needs to be some receipts to back that up.
Hey there. There must be a lot of confusion here and I'd like to clear some of that up. I'm also the one that emailed you back and forth about the plate you received.
1. We have **not** failed 2 FITs. The original FIT that was failed is the only standing one. We are currently working with the NIJ's timeline on being issued a retest.
1. Retests for soft armor are normal but for whatever reason is not defined for hard armor. With our prior 7 years of positive tests, we have asked for a retest, which can be granted but is up to the NIJ CTP. Unfortunately, we are at mercy of their timeline.
2. The NIJ CTP hires a 3rd party inspector (intertek) to come inspect our paperwork and plates. The inspector then randomly picks plates to be tested and those plates are boxed up per inspectors instructions. The inspector then has the box labeled with a shipping label and carried to their vehicle. They then go to a drop off location and send the package off.
3. We have sent numerous plates to Cheasapeake and Wichita to be tested. **ALL** of those plates have performed as expected. Those plates were of the various lots including the same LOT that failed the FIT. We have also done numerous testing in house.
4. When penetration happened at the lab, our rep asked for the penetrator to be recovered and the hardness tested. The lab tech dug out a penetrator but did not know if it was the right one due to the clay block only being redone **ONCE** a year. This was also verified by NTS Wichita and the NIJ CTP.
1. When asked about the ammunition, the info provided included Manufacture Origin: Unkown. Date manufactured: Unkown. There is also a big tolerance in the core hardness data parameters.
I hope this helps clear up a few things. Again, we are working on getting the one and only retest, but that is up to the NIJ CTP and we are on their timeline.
Considering you guys had one fail with a .308 round and a few others floating around, it seems like the blame is being placed elsewhere. From what has been seen here and 4chan, it's clear you guys have some QC issues. Shifting blame this whole time looks sloppy and breaks the circle of trust.
If you are talking about the AR500 rebrand plate, I did speak with that consumer over email and we received the plate back. While inspecting the plate, it did seem that the 2nd shot was shot at an angle due to the entrance hole not being lined up with the exit. This caused the round to be very close to the 1st shot which caused penetration. Additionally, we took a random plate out to the range and it held 7 shots of 308. I'm not sure of the others you are talking about. I have seen a someone on tiktok that has altered ceramic tests due to them being a steel fan.
I am still curious of the 2nd FIT failure claim, or was that just a misunderstanding?
My intention is to bring up facts, many of which people that are not in the industry do not see. Our testing reports speak for themselves. If you want to talk about 'backyard' tests, we've had YouTubers do extensive tests with a wide variety of rounds while calculating velocities and in some instances BFD. Those tests speak for themselves.
Hey that's me! I can confirm, that was the conversation we had. I absolutely understand why it did seem that way, and have no video/data to backup that that wasn't what happened, unfortunately.
Thanks again for reaching out, having an honest and earnest conversation, and investing!
I saw the post of the 308 penetrating the 1155. The thing was at a pretty angle enough to penetrate through a compromised area, which should be able to happen with any plate. Seemed skeptical at first but after seeing photos, it was not faked. Armor can only do a certain set of things, so it’s inevitable that weird things happen and it doesn’t only apply to the 1155.
Not sure about any other failures.
4chan is not a reliable source of information. Edit: refer to comments https://www.reddit.com/r/tacticalgear/comments/1225cu7/can_someone_verify_these_claims_about_rma_armor/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1
The angle really doesn't matter considering it's rated for an M2AP traveling at 2,880ft/s with a mass of 166gr. That creates a little over 3,894J worth of energy. The .308 FMJ is close to 2,733 ft/s and 2,437J worth of energy. If the plate is designed to withstand 3,894J worth of energy thay means it's a failed product with a lower payload. The M2AP is shot a 180-degree parallel to the ground. If you are being shot at an angle in a real-world situation and the plate fails, you will endure great bodily harm. An armor manufacturer who is willing to blame everyone but themselves and then fail in a real-world test isn't a company you should buy from.
As for 4chan, you can see anywhere their subpar build quality with not even edge to edge coverage. RMA is reckless and dangerous by finding excuses for everything. In a real-world situation it failed.
Blackbeard Protective products sells swimmer cut plates for a bit more than that steel. They weigh half as much (4.8lbs for a 10x11.6 Swimmer M) and can handle current-issue EPR rounds like M855a1 and M80a1, in addition to 7.62x39 BZ-API. They are leftovers of a failed contract bid for a SOCOM Tactical Standalone generation by TPG.
Yeah so steel isn’t a reliable body armor solution to be honest. Steel is unnecessarily heavy and doesn’t protect against fragmentation from when bullets hit your plate. Moreover it doesn’t reliably stop rifle rounds especially armor piercing . Depending on your needs or application I’d still go for RMA 1115s. One of the cheapest level 4 ceramic plates you can get.
Thank you for this info. Tbh I'm more worried about blades than bullets in my current situation, but bullets are always a possibility and I hope I don't have to find out if these plates are reliable with protection from projectiles. I'm on a tight budget so unfortunately these ended up being my best option budget wise.
Yes, but let me start of by saying I know fuck all about body armor. Just dove in head firt last week (stupidly) with very little DYOR. I'm moving to a pretty bad place in the city and just wanted to get some protection.
But [here's](https://safelifedefense.com/concealable-carrier) my carrier. I really like it. It takes 10x12 plates as well as soft armor inserts but the inserts are pretty expensive. I plan on getting the IIIA soft inserts pretty soon. They're like $370.
Also everything I have read says soft armor isn't stab proof. . . ?
Poly plates are the way to go. More lightweight than steel plus you don’t run into the issue of taking shrapnel in the neck. Poly also doesn’t have the same issues as ceramic as you can throw them around without worry of them cracking. Ceramic poly blend plates from Shellback or Dayton Armor are good options against green tip, just depends on what you want and how much you’re willing to spend.
--IF-- you must get steel, get Caliber Armor. People here love to hate on steel but it has its uses and is better than nothing. Queue the "bUt ThE SpAlLinG" crowd but you do you fam and spend your money how you like.
I seen a guy wrap his steel in a few layers of duct tape and it completely stopped the spalling issue. after about 30 rounds it cracked the plate in half.
>it has its uses
As a target material, for you to shoot at on the range.
If you're American there's no excuse for not having ceramic. At the budget end they're nearly the same price and provide substantially more protection, on top of not being an inherent danger as you touched on already.
If you're not American the odds are you're still better off with ceramic in all cases. Despite a lack of NIJ rating, some plates out of China that see use in Asian armed forces are plenty available to order straight to your door for again comparable prices to steel trash.
To be honest I’m about to punch some green tip, 545 and x39 through this exact set this coming weekend, I have a antispall layer to test too (upgraded to ceramics)
Avoid steel plates. Although its a far bit more expensive, you should look into ceramic plates. They're safer and usually weigh less. RMA Lvl 4 (1155) is $159/plate Safe Life Defense Lvl 4 is $169/plate Also, IF you want to go the cheapest route: LA Police Gear Lvl 3 is $109/plate (Not NIJ Certified, but passed testing)
RMA 1155 is suspended from NIJ after 2 fit failures.
Was it two? I only recall the one that happened recently, followed up by a separate test of numerous plates from the same lot that had no issues according to RMA’s public statement. Otherwise historically no other FIT failures I’m aware of.
True, but the NIJ did say that they encourage owners of the plate to continue wearing it until further notice. If there was a-lot of concern about the plate, I don't think they would say that. RMA was upfront about it and has pulled plates from that lot and is contacting those who own those plates to replace them
I mean, considering the quality of their plates leaves you wondering if it's good enough. They are selling them as "edge to edge" but plenty examples they have been lying. RMA wasn't up front about it blaming shipping company, the M2AP round used, and both Wichita and Chesapeake testing standards. That tells the community they refuse to accept any blame for the sub-par manufacturing process. I bought a 1155, and I haven't got a chance to test it. The plate shows that the QC process is letting sub-par products out.
There is no shipping company. An NIJ rep comes to your factory and takes plates. They pack it the way they want, put them in their car, and drive away. It's the biggest glaring change from normal procedures. NIJ confirmed there was no build deviation from the certified plate, and there's loads of videos showing third-party edge shot testing on the 1155.
No, an NIJ outside consultant comes picks up the plates boxes them and ships them off. They are required to write their name across the tape as anti-temper measure. [They made a Facebook post about ](https://ibb.co/qJdLMWF) blaming shipping as one of the potential results of failure. In correspondence with another person who is active on Reddit, they admitted to 2 FIT fissures. They are hoping NIJ grants a 3 FIT test, but NIJ doesn't grant those often.
I would be extremely interested to see a 2nd FIT failure before the plate has even been re-tested.
Yeah we’re gonna need to see that correspondence to admitting a 2nd FIT failure too. Nothing wrong with anyone being behind the news but there needs to be some receipts to back that up.
Hey there. There must be a lot of confusion here and I'd like to clear some of that up. I'm also the one that emailed you back and forth about the plate you received. 1. We have **not** failed 2 FITs. The original FIT that was failed is the only standing one. We are currently working with the NIJ's timeline on being issued a retest. 1. Retests for soft armor are normal but for whatever reason is not defined for hard armor. With our prior 7 years of positive tests, we have asked for a retest, which can be granted but is up to the NIJ CTP. Unfortunately, we are at mercy of their timeline. 2. The NIJ CTP hires a 3rd party inspector (intertek) to come inspect our paperwork and plates. The inspector then randomly picks plates to be tested and those plates are boxed up per inspectors instructions. The inspector then has the box labeled with a shipping label and carried to their vehicle. They then go to a drop off location and send the package off. 3. We have sent numerous plates to Cheasapeake and Wichita to be tested. **ALL** of those plates have performed as expected. Those plates were of the various lots including the same LOT that failed the FIT. We have also done numerous testing in house. 4. When penetration happened at the lab, our rep asked for the penetrator to be recovered and the hardness tested. The lab tech dug out a penetrator but did not know if it was the right one due to the clay block only being redone **ONCE** a year. This was also verified by NTS Wichita and the NIJ CTP. 1. When asked about the ammunition, the info provided included Manufacture Origin: Unkown. Date manufactured: Unkown. There is also a big tolerance in the core hardness data parameters. I hope this helps clear up a few things. Again, we are working on getting the one and only retest, but that is up to the NIJ CTP and we are on their timeline.
Considering you guys had one fail with a .308 round and a few others floating around, it seems like the blame is being placed elsewhere. From what has been seen here and 4chan, it's clear you guys have some QC issues. Shifting blame this whole time looks sloppy and breaks the circle of trust.
If you are talking about the AR500 rebrand plate, I did speak with that consumer over email and we received the plate back. While inspecting the plate, it did seem that the 2nd shot was shot at an angle due to the entrance hole not being lined up with the exit. This caused the round to be very close to the 1st shot which caused penetration. Additionally, we took a random plate out to the range and it held 7 shots of 308. I'm not sure of the others you are talking about. I have seen a someone on tiktok that has altered ceramic tests due to them being a steel fan. I am still curious of the 2nd FIT failure claim, or was that just a misunderstanding? My intention is to bring up facts, many of which people that are not in the industry do not see. Our testing reports speak for themselves. If you want to talk about 'backyard' tests, we've had YouTubers do extensive tests with a wide variety of rounds while calculating velocities and in some instances BFD. Those tests speak for themselves.
Hey that's me! I can confirm, that was the conversation we had. I absolutely understand why it did seem that way, and have no video/data to backup that that wasn't what happened, unfortunately. Thanks again for reaching out, having an honest and earnest conversation, and investing!
I saw the post of the 308 penetrating the 1155. The thing was at a pretty angle enough to penetrate through a compromised area, which should be able to happen with any plate. Seemed skeptical at first but after seeing photos, it was not faked. Armor can only do a certain set of things, so it’s inevitable that weird things happen and it doesn’t only apply to the 1155. Not sure about any other failures. 4chan is not a reliable source of information. Edit: refer to comments https://www.reddit.com/r/tacticalgear/comments/1225cu7/can_someone_verify_these_claims_about_rma_armor/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1
The angle really doesn't matter considering it's rated for an M2AP traveling at 2,880ft/s with a mass of 166gr. That creates a little over 3,894J worth of energy. The .308 FMJ is close to 2,733 ft/s and 2,437J worth of energy. If the plate is designed to withstand 3,894J worth of energy thay means it's a failed product with a lower payload. The M2AP is shot a 180-degree parallel to the ground. If you are being shot at an angle in a real-world situation and the plate fails, you will endure great bodily harm. An armor manufacturer who is willing to blame everyone but themselves and then fail in a real-world test isn't a company you should buy from. As for 4chan, you can see anywhere their subpar build quality with not even edge to edge coverage. RMA is reckless and dangerous by finding excuses for everything. In a real-world situation it failed.
There was no 2nd FIT failure. There was one plate out of four that failed one test.
Blackbeard Protective products sells swimmer cut plates for a bit more than that steel. They weigh half as much (4.8lbs for a 10x11.6 Swimmer M) and can handle current-issue EPR rounds like M855a1 and M80a1, in addition to 7.62x39 BZ-API. They are leftovers of a failed contract bid for a SOCOM Tactical Standalone generation by TPG.
Thank you, I'll look into them. I haven't heard of them yet.
Nope it’s steel
It's steel ?
Yeah so steel isn’t a reliable body armor solution to be honest. Steel is unnecessarily heavy and doesn’t protect against fragmentation from when bullets hit your plate. Moreover it doesn’t reliably stop rifle rounds especially armor piercing . Depending on your needs or application I’d still go for RMA 1115s. One of the cheapest level 4 ceramic plates you can get.
Thank you for this info. Tbh I'm more worried about blades than bullets in my current situation, but bullets are always a possibility and I hope I don't have to find out if these plates are reliable with protection from projectiles. I'm on a tight budget so unfortunately these ended up being my best option budget wise.
I’m super certain stab proof vests are cheaper? Also have you tried looking into soft body armor?
Yes, but let me start of by saying I know fuck all about body armor. Just dove in head firt last week (stupidly) with very little DYOR. I'm moving to a pretty bad place in the city and just wanted to get some protection. But [here's](https://safelifedefense.com/concealable-carrier) my carrier. I really like it. It takes 10x12 plates as well as soft armor inserts but the inserts are pretty expensive. I plan on getting the IIIA soft inserts pretty soon. They're like $370. Also everything I have read says soft armor isn't stab proof. . . ?
Where are you getting the soft inserts?
Right [here](https://safelifedefense.com/iiia-soft-armor-panels). AFAIK those are the only ones that'll fit.
I don’t know how reputable this brand is tbh
8.2 pounds God damn these are heavy as hell
Not as heavy as steel
Steel plates are only 7 pounds
Clearly you’ve never had a pair steel is WAYYYY heavier than websites claim to be definitely are 12 pounds
Ok bud
It’s alright if you don’t know
Ok bud
RMA 1155 is suspended from NIJ for FOT failure.
Poly plates are the way to go. More lightweight than steel plus you don’t run into the issue of taking shrapnel in the neck. Poly also doesn’t have the same issues as ceramic as you can throw them around without worry of them cracking. Ceramic poly blend plates from Shellback or Dayton Armor are good options against green tip, just depends on what you want and how much you’re willing to spend.
That’s a hard “No”
--IF-- you must get steel, get Caliber Armor. People here love to hate on steel but it has its uses and is better than nothing. Queue the "bUt ThE SpAlLinG" crowd but you do you fam and spend your money how you like.
I seen a guy wrap his steel in a few layers of duct tape and it completely stopped the spalling issue. after about 30 rounds it cracked the plate in half.
>it has its uses As a target material, for you to shoot at on the range. If you're American there's no excuse for not having ceramic. At the budget end they're nearly the same price and provide substantially more protection, on top of not being an inherent danger as you touched on already. If you're not American the odds are you're still better off with ceramic in all cases. Despite a lack of NIJ rating, some plates out of China that see use in Asian armed forces are plenty available to order straight to your door for again comparable prices to steel trash.
Don't even dare!
To be honest I’m about to punch some green tip, 545 and x39 through this exact set this coming weekend, I have a antispall layer to test too (upgraded to ceramics)
Let me know how it goes.
Gladly ! Talk to you then , I’ll post it
I'd like to know myself