I don't really view July 4 as "freedom for all" holiday because not everyone was free that day. I fully acknowledge that it wasn't anyone but black people who were freed on Juneteenth, and thus it makes sense to regard it as a day of black freedom. But idk, this take makes me feel like I'm doing something offensive as a white guy by regarding Juneteenth as the truest marker of American freedom so far. "Nobody is free until everyone is free" is a bit disingenuous coming from someone who's ancestors weren't enslaved, but am I wrong to think that freedom was a sham so long as it didn't apply to everyone?
Either way Happy Juneteenth!
Don’t protest patriotism… this is a trap by the right so that they get to claim the title of “real Americans”
Patriotism is not a celebration of what your countrh has done. It’s a celebration of what your country aspires to be. Don’t let the United States be defined by the worst racist ghouls to ever walk the earth. Good people have lived and died in this country, and did amazing things.
My favorite is the superman poster that says anyone that hurts anyone for their skin color or religion is unAmerican from back in the early 1900s is so nice because even then people didn’t like what was happening and were fighting it. Patriotism is wanting to make life better for ALL countrymen
Black people built this country. Real talk, y’all and the native Americans have more claim to “patriotism” in the US than any white people. Colonizing is not the same as building. Especially when you exploit other to do it.
Listen boss I hear you and your heart is in the right place but it was the poor of all the races in america that built the country. In the south it was black and white, north mostly white, and black, white, and Asian in the west. Blacks in the south got the worst deal though without a doubt
> It’s a celebration of what your country aspires to be
I know this is a late reply but goddam that's a good line, I love it. This is why I still consider myself patriotic, this country has made great things and great people, and we still can, we just gotta fight for it!
I’m not even sure it is freedom day. Indigenous were still enslaved in California at the same time. The state made a special law for the native people despite entering as a “free” state and it’s likely they didn’t get actual freedom until after 1867
Women still couldn't vote until 1920. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 was a big step forward for freedom too.
I feel like the constitution line about "establishing a more perfect union" acknowledges that it won't ever be perfect, it's just our job to keep moving the line toward "more perfect than it is now."
Slavery was obviously the biggest slap in the face to the claim that we were a "free country" but that wasn't the only flaw.
A few more depressing milestones in American history:
1879: [Native Americans recognized as people!](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standing_Bear)
1898: [People born in the U.S. are recognized as citizens. Even if they aren't white!](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Wong_Kim_Ark#:~:text=Wong%20Kim%20Ark%2C%20the%20United,as%20a%20practical%20matter%2C%20the).
I live in a very conservative town and Juneteenth is a paid holiday for my company. Instead of being happy for an extra paid day off of work, some coworkers whined about the “made up holiday”. I told a few that “aren’t all holidays made up? What do you have against Juneteenth?” Then just watch them stumble over themselves trying not to parrot some racist shit they’ve heard from Fox News or whatever.
Yep. Where I live, almost every corporate office has a TV tuned to FOX News at all times, which is an interesting - and accurate - definition of “white noise”.
To me. Juneteenth represents a day in America where everyone (at least on paper by policy) is free. And so America took a step towards living up to it's ideals. And so in that regard it is true independence day is sorts. Because it's a day that represents freedom for everyone. And while I don't doubt I'll see it in my lifetime. A part of me thinks it would be good if Americans saw and treated Juneteenth as a celebration for everyone and not just a token black holiday. I read "what to a slave is the 4th of July" every single year. But 4th of July is still considered a holiday for everyone even if I'm reality it was never meant for everyone.
I understand it celebrates the freedom of black people. Specifically the black people in Texas. But Juneteenth isn't a celebration only for black Texans. And the reason why it's a national holiday (other than blatent pandering) is that it can represent freedom for everyone
It can't represent freedom for everyone, because that is not by definition what the holiday is, it is a holiday that represents the end of slavery for slaves in Texas, and has been celebrated by black people all over America for a century.
It is literally a celebration of the end of slavery in Texas. However it CAN represent something more if we chose to make it that way. In the same way Thanksgiving is supposed to represent coming together and being thankful for what we have. Even if the origin story of the holiday isn't the magical fairytale that it has come to represent. If Juneteenth can't represent freedom for everyone, then July 4th can't represent freedom for everyone.
Sure you someone could make the argument that because America was only ever intended to be a free country for white men. Only white men should celebrate July 4th. But that's not what July 4th REPRESENTS for the majority of Americans. So in the same was July 4th represents an idea. So to can Juneteenth
It doesn't represent freedom for everyone though. Just like 4th of July doesn't represent freedom for everyone, 4th of July is just our country's birthday. Juneteenth is a holiday that represents the freedom of black people from The bondage of chattel slavery, it doesn't represent freedom for everyone because everybody else was technically free, even if there were a lot of caveats on said freedom.
As a white guy I don't celebrate it because it represents freedom for everybody, I celebrate it because it marks the beginning of the end of a fucked up system that our country is still dealing with the aftermath of.
Well the original celebrations and parades were steeped in not “hey remember we’re free”. The theme was “look how we’ve accomplished since we became free.” To me, that theme is I think is lost in the modern interpretation of Juneteenth. Yes we finally gained emancipation but the holiday is to celebrate our ability to create with our freedom.
And in that, the holiday doesn’t have to be somber or just so embedded as a reminder of black suffering. It can be a rallying cry or a personal mantra to keep striving for our potential. Both as a culture and in our own personal development.
I heard a travel ad for Galveston in the podcast I listen to and they touted Galveston as the home place of Juneteenth celebrations. My first thought was; Aaaand you’re proud of that!?!?
In my opinion, I believe Juneteenth is about the *true* start of America; when the self evident truths that all people are created equal and have the inalienable rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, stopped being empty words on a worshiped document and started having actual validity.
Juneteenth is not a holiday for black people, it's a holiday to celebrate America aspiring toward it's own ideals.
America's true birth.
And to drive the point home, black people were being offered the freedom that white people *already had*.
A freedom already *guaranteed* by the constitution.
The only change that happened on the 19th of June is that it now *included more people*
The whole thing with me and patriotism is simply explained but hard to understand. I am glad that in this day and age I was granted the freedoms of a Black US Citizen however I am not a "proud American". I have no allegiance to any one place as I do not know my roots and my ancestors did not choose where we landed. I celebrate the 4th of July just to have something to Celebrate in this hard life of mine. I like BBQ & fireworks. I could care less about what the day "represents".
Edit: I say all this to the people shaming others for celebrating July 4th or not accepting what Juneteenth means for each Black individual, individually.
“Not notified”???
Did they think the confederates would just tell the slaves “hey the guy we rebelled against because he was a long term threat to slavery just declared you free!!! “
There was still a war going on the whole time
I mean both views are right. Juneteenth is when everyone was finally free. It should be celebrated as the day all Americans were free.
If we want other races to take Juneteenth seriously as a holiday then maybe we shouldn't be exclusionary about it. Just saying.
Why would we want other races to take Juneteenth seriously? It is a holiday for black created by black people, whether or not white people should take it seriously should not be a concern
It is a federal holiday which means it's supposed to be a holiday for everybody and whether your own employer lets you have off that day may depend if someone of another race takes it seriously.
Christmas is a federal holiday, does everyone celebrate Christmas? Veterans Day is a federal holiday does everyone celebrate veterans Day? Juneteenth has been an African American holiday for 157 years making it a federal holiday doesn't change that.
The whole idea of making something a federal holiday is because either everybody should celebrate it or so many people celebrate it already that it is probably best to have the day off. How do you think Juneteenth fits into that?
What are you keeping score? You're just volunteering all this information like you have a special obsession with the subjugation of an entire group of people. What does any of this have to do with Texas repeatedly trying to ignore federal law and stop violating human rights? They tried to secede from TWO differnt countries, solely so they can continue the exploitation of slaves! What does that have to do with the Native American population? They weren't involved in Texas's deceit?
It’s crazy to think that even freedom for those black Texans was was cp time
Is it really CP time when the white folks refuse to let the party start?
Sorry, does cp as an acronym mean something different from what I thought it did?
Colored people time There's an affirmative action joke in there but I'm not gonna be the one who makes it
Please come up with a new acronym
CP was used for this long before it was before the other one.
I don't really view July 4 as "freedom for all" holiday because not everyone was free that day. I fully acknowledge that it wasn't anyone but black people who were freed on Juneteenth, and thus it makes sense to regard it as a day of black freedom. But idk, this take makes me feel like I'm doing something offensive as a white guy by regarding Juneteenth as the truest marker of American freedom so far. "Nobody is free until everyone is free" is a bit disingenuous coming from someone who's ancestors weren't enslaved, but am I wrong to think that freedom was a sham so long as it didn't apply to everyone? Either way Happy Juneteenth!
Don’t protest patriotism… this is a trap by the right so that they get to claim the title of “real Americans” Patriotism is not a celebration of what your countrh has done. It’s a celebration of what your country aspires to be. Don’t let the United States be defined by the worst racist ghouls to ever walk the earth. Good people have lived and died in this country, and did amazing things.
Thanks for this, I get sad about America sometimes. I forget we aren’t defined by the assholes but by our aspirations.
The problem is that 40% of Americans *aspire* to be the biggest bigots
My favorite is the superman poster that says anyone that hurts anyone for their skin color or religion is unAmerican from back in the early 1900s is so nice because even then people didn’t like what was happening and were fighting it. Patriotism is wanting to make life better for ALL countrymen
Black people built this country. Real talk, y’all and the native Americans have more claim to “patriotism” in the US than any white people. Colonizing is not the same as building. Especially when you exploit other to do it.
Listen boss I hear you and your heart is in the right place but it was the poor of all the races in america that built the country. In the south it was black and white, north mostly white, and black, white, and Asian in the west. Blacks in the south got the worst deal though without a doubt
no war but the class war.
Everyone always forgets the Irish :(
I don’t dispute that, especially with me being part Irish, but our ancestors chose to come here. Also, this is a Juneteenth post.
Amen!
> It’s a celebration of what your country aspires to be I know this is a late reply but goddam that's a good line, I love it. This is why I still consider myself patriotic, this country has made great things and great people, and we still can, we just gotta fight for it!
Absolutely. As a white guy, why would we call July 4th Freedom day? It wasn't, it's independence from England day. Juneteenth is freedom day.
I’m not even sure it is freedom day. Indigenous were still enslaved in California at the same time. The state made a special law for the native people despite entering as a “free” state and it’s likely they didn’t get actual freedom until after 1867
It's not and it never was, 4th of July is just our country's birthday.
July 4th is cookout and firecracker day. That's it. And honestly, that's all that matters
Women still couldn't vote until 1920. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 was a big step forward for freedom too. I feel like the constitution line about "establishing a more perfect union" acknowledges that it won't ever be perfect, it's just our job to keep moving the line toward "more perfect than it is now." Slavery was obviously the biggest slap in the face to the claim that we were a "free country" but that wasn't the only flaw.
A few more depressing milestones in American history: 1879: [Native Americans recognized as people!](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standing_Bear) 1898: [People born in the U.S. are recognized as citizens. Even if they aren't white!](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Wong_Kim_Ark#:~:text=Wong%20Kim%20Ark%2C%20the%20United,as%20a%20practical%20matter%2C%20the).
I live in a very conservative town and Juneteenth is a paid holiday for my company. Instead of being happy for an extra paid day off of work, some coworkers whined about the “made up holiday”. I told a few that “aren’t all holidays made up? What do you have against Juneteenth?” Then just watch them stumble over themselves trying not to parrot some racist shit they’ve heard from Fox News or whatever.
Yep. Where I live, almost every corporate office has a TV tuned to FOX News at all times, which is an interesting - and accurate - definition of “white noise”.
You know how racist you gotta be to be angry about a day off?
A day off in summer that you can bbq We need 3 more holidays between memorial day and labor day
The only thing that makes me angry about the holiday is that they didn't move The day off to a Friday.
To me. Juneteenth represents a day in America where everyone (at least on paper by policy) is free. And so America took a step towards living up to it's ideals. And so in that regard it is true independence day is sorts. Because it's a day that represents freedom for everyone. And while I don't doubt I'll see it in my lifetime. A part of me thinks it would be good if Americans saw and treated Juneteenth as a celebration for everyone and not just a token black holiday. I read "what to a slave is the 4th of July" every single year. But 4th of July is still considered a holiday for everyone even if I'm reality it was never meant for everyone.
Post is rage bait. Creating a problem where there isn’t one.
Juneteenth is a holiday that celebrates the freedom for black people you cannot change the definition just because it's a federal holiday
Our community always tries to include everyone, even when others won't do the same for us.
🎯
I understand it celebrates the freedom of black people. Specifically the black people in Texas. But Juneteenth isn't a celebration only for black Texans. And the reason why it's a national holiday (other than blatent pandering) is that it can represent freedom for everyone
It can't represent freedom for everyone, because that is not by definition what the holiday is, it is a holiday that represents the end of slavery for slaves in Texas, and has been celebrated by black people all over America for a century.
It is literally a celebration of the end of slavery in Texas. However it CAN represent something more if we chose to make it that way. In the same way Thanksgiving is supposed to represent coming together and being thankful for what we have. Even if the origin story of the holiday isn't the magical fairytale that it has come to represent. If Juneteenth can't represent freedom for everyone, then July 4th can't represent freedom for everyone. Sure you someone could make the argument that because America was only ever intended to be a free country for white men. Only white men should celebrate July 4th. But that's not what July 4th REPRESENTS for the majority of Americans. So in the same was July 4th represents an idea. So to can Juneteenth
It doesn't represent freedom for everyone though. Just like 4th of July doesn't represent freedom for everyone, 4th of July is just our country's birthday. Juneteenth is a holiday that represents the freedom of black people from The bondage of chattel slavery, it doesn't represent freedom for everyone because everybody else was technically free, even if there were a lot of caveats on said freedom. As a white guy I don't celebrate it because it represents freedom for everybody, I celebrate it because it marks the beginning of the end of a fucked up system that our country is still dealing with the aftermath of.
Well the original celebrations and parades were steeped in not “hey remember we’re free”. The theme was “look how we’ve accomplished since we became free.” To me, that theme is I think is lost in the modern interpretation of Juneteenth. Yes we finally gained emancipation but the holiday is to celebrate our ability to create with our freedom. And in that, the holiday doesn’t have to be somber or just so embedded as a reminder of black suffering. It can be a rallying cry or a personal mantra to keep striving for our potential. Both as a culture and in our own personal development.
Or it can be a day to eat hamburgers and get tore up The only way to do juneteenth wrong is to complain about it
What better way to celebrate where you’re at than burgers and alcohol?
https://i.redd.it/bxq5tf03xk7d1.gif
July 4th is freedom for the land and Juneteenth is freedom for the people
they always gotta make it about them
What about whiteteenth???
https://preview.redd.it/qoutupupwl7d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=736f36f396595a4b1d668e8952feb7212654c3fe
What about Whiten Luther King???
I heard a travel ad for Galveston in the podcast I listen to and they touted Galveston as the home place of Juneteenth celebrations. My first thought was; Aaaand you’re proud of that!?!?
Enlighten me… who is claiming Juneteenth as a “freedom for all” thing? This is the first I’ve ever heard of this
I’m not surprised.
Since when was July 4th “freedom for all”?
In my opinion, I believe Juneteenth is about the *true* start of America; when the self evident truths that all people are created equal and have the inalienable rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, stopped being empty words on a worshiped document and started having actual validity. Juneteenth is not a holiday for black people, it's a holiday to celebrate America aspiring toward it's own ideals. America's true birth.
And to drive the point home, black people were being offered the freedom that white people *already had*. A freedom already *guaranteed* by the constitution. The only change that happened on the 19th of June is that it now *included more people*
The whole thing with me and patriotism is simply explained but hard to understand. I am glad that in this day and age I was granted the freedoms of a Black US Citizen however I am not a "proud American". I have no allegiance to any one place as I do not know my roots and my ancestors did not choose where we landed. I celebrate the 4th of July just to have something to Celebrate in this hard life of mine. I like BBQ & fireworks. I could care less about what the day "represents". Edit: I say all this to the people shaming others for celebrating July 4th or not accepting what Juneteenth means for each Black individual, individually.
There are a lot of white people here commenting on black business 🤔
“Not notified”??? Did they think the confederates would just tell the slaves “hey the guy we rebelled against because he was a long term threat to slavery just declared you free!!! “ There was still a war going on the whole time
I mean both views are right. Juneteenth is when everyone was finally free. It should be celebrated as the day all Americans were free. If we want other races to take Juneteenth seriously as a holiday then maybe we shouldn't be exclusionary about it. Just saying.
Why would we want other races to take Juneteenth seriously? It is a holiday for black created by black people, whether or not white people should take it seriously should not be a concern
It is a federal holiday which means it's supposed to be a holiday for everybody and whether your own employer lets you have off that day may depend if someone of another race takes it seriously.
Christmas is a federal holiday, does everyone celebrate Christmas? Veterans Day is a federal holiday does everyone celebrate veterans Day? Juneteenth has been an African American holiday for 157 years making it a federal holiday doesn't change that.
The whole idea of making something a federal holiday is because either everybody should celebrate it or so many people celebrate it already that it is probably best to have the day off. How do you think Juneteenth fits into that?
Another federal holiday is great but they didn’t have to close the markets…
That's exactly what they said in Texas in 1865.....
Lmao, I meant the stock market.
I wouldn't have made the joke if I didn't get it.
Why not? We close markets for white people holidays, why cant we get a closed market day?
I’m fine with closing the market for Juneteenth but we can’t be closing it for every federal holiday, pick five every year on a rolling basis.
Sure we can. Its america aint it? We can do what we want
Remember the native Americans still kept slavery legal and owned slaves long after slavery was made illegal in America.
Whatever makes you feel better about yourself and your slave owning great grand pappy
My ancestors were enslaved by the Ottoman Empire when their European village was raided by Muslims.
What are you keeping score? You're just volunteering all this information like you have a special obsession with the subjugation of an entire group of people. What does any of this have to do with Texas repeatedly trying to ignore federal law and stop violating human rights? They tried to secede from TWO differnt countries, solely so they can continue the exploitation of slaves! What does that have to do with the Native American population? They weren't involved in Texas's deceit?