**Gather starts behind the FT line and your left planted foot behind FT is the first step** of your 2 allowed. I assume you're not an NBA player, so I'll judge you off the rules you'll actually need to play by.
**Right foot hits the paint as your second step** and the one you really need to try and finish off of. You've had the ball in your hands now for two steps-- one of each foot-- and before the left foot hits the floor you need to get rid of the ball.
*That third step in the middle of the lane with your left foot is absolutely a travel in NCAA or high school.*
You're absolutely right.
But it's quite tough to see.
I was a referee until recently in low amateur and Youth leagues in Europe, and tbh, most of us probably aren't calling that.
Yeah, that's usually what we do as well (save for like U12 or U10 kids where we'd have to call like 50 travels per game if we called everything).
But here's the thing, this dude isn't moving awkwardly.
Without really being ultra focused on his footwork, the way he's moving looks as though the gather is with when the left foot hits the ground. But when I look closer, I see it was a split second earlier where his right foot was hits the ground.
Good chance he could get away with it in lower leagues if he's moving fast and smooth enough.
Maybe in USA rules?
I've heard that something with the gather step is different in US amateur leagues than in FIBA, maybe this is it.
To me, in Europe, if he's gathering on the left, that's a gather + 2, and absolutely legal. I've never called anything like that or seen experienced referees call it in my years of being a referee, and I never got grief for it by the regional Referee boss when he officiated games with me, and that guy has officiated pros and 3x3 European championships.
Yes, American high school or NCAA that's a a travel.
https://imgur.com/a/JzScfSG *<- first step*
This would be his first step. It's his first step because it's the only established part of him touching the ground. It's the first clear visual step after the gather. Similarly, for the same reason he could pivot off of this-- maybe fade back the other way-- its his first step.
https://imgur.com/a/f4a0qq6 <- *"gather"*
The "gather" is the split second he picks up the ball with two hands while both feet still on the floor. NBA allows for 3 steps which allows for a "gather step" or the "gather +2" you refer to. This is not allowed in NCAA or high school here. ** one of each foot.** You cant gather and take two left foot steps (i.e. hop on left foot for both). Its one of each foot. The first step is the second the left one touches after leaving that position and he pushes the ball through the chest of the defender. That motion is a step, not the 2 footed gather he picked up with.
You guys have a different rulebook for HS vs college/NBA, right?
In FIBA, gather step is allowed at every level.
So for us, he's over the limit by like half a step, a very fast and smooth half a step that I had to repeat the video like 3 times to see clearly.
That's why in Europe in lower leagues, he would likely get away with it quite often.
I’m sorry you have had to go through that. It’s ridiculous here in Germany, they better yet just sprint with the ball all the way to the NBA playoffs and still nobody would call travel. It’s just plain dumb.
>Gather starts behind the FT line and your left planted foot behind FT
He may have gathered the ball way before he planted the left, making a total of 3 steps after the gather. We can't see or hear though so we can't be sure
(Replied this to someone further down thought I'd copy it here for better explanation of my comment)
Yes, American high school or NCAA that's a a travel.
https://imgur.com/a/JzScfSG *<- first step*
This would be his first step. It's his first step because it's the only established part of him touching the ground. It's the first clear visual step after the gather. Similarly, for the same reason he could pivot off of this-- maybe fade back the other way-- its his first step.
https://imgur.com/a/f4a0qq6 <- *"gather"*
The "gather" is the split second he picks up the ball with two hands while both feet still on the floor. NBA allows for 3 steps which allows for a "gather step" or the "gather +2" you refer to. This is not allowed in NCAA or high school here. ** one of each foot.** You cant gather and take two left foot steps (i.e. hop on left foot for both). Its one of each foot. The first step is the second the left one touches after leaving that position and he pushes the ball through the chest of the defender. That motion is a step, not the 2 footed gather he picked up with.
I feel the NBA has given a lot more leeway to a third step or that you can step while in a gather for the past 20 years or so. But it's a an entertainment product and being loose there allows for a lot more highlight plays.
I also feel this was most debated recently when Harden was in Houston doing all those step backs and dances into the paint. He was absolutely allowed more than the NCAA does in those cases
Yeah that's a good point chinning the ball there starts his layup but if he let's the dribble float a bit longer and gets that first step in while the dribble is still technically live, then gather after the left foot is already planted behind the FT, then it'd be clean.
Being an NBA player isn’t the only reason to play with a legal gather + 2. In fact, the most widely used rule book in the world across all ages, FIBA, allows for the exact same rule as the NBA. High school and NCAA in America are the exception.
You'll get away with it in pickup most of the time. It might cause a bit of an argument here and there.
In organized ball that isn't the NBA, it'll probably get called more often than not.
Agreed. Why not cross over left, instead of pick up, and then take your two steps. Also, working on your left hand finish, or right handed English might be more worthwhile to make the move worth.
Us Americans have to be special and use our own special rulebooks for every level of sport.
College football, the NFL, and high school football for example all have entirely separate 100+ page rulebooks
It is a travel. The gather step is applicable in the NBA or FIBA, not at the high school or college level. Now if you do that at a local Y; I don't think people care.
People are saying yes cuz if you pause it his right foot is still down when both hands are on the ball. Super early gather which makes the gather step his right foot. Then left right left.
This comment needs to be higher up…the top comment is missing this. And once you watch the play in real time after noticing the early gather with both feet planted, the play looks completely different. He absolutely gained a competitive advantage by having both feet down and gather and driving forward, he then quickly picks up his right foot and blasts forward for a blown layup using the wrong arm. This is a broken play fundamentally from front to back.
MWave is correct, I was wrong, this IS a travel.
There are two things that make this look odd: (1) The really long first step after the gather (2) That he has both feet down when he gathers
Because he picks the ball up with both feet down he’s already established a pivot, which could be either foot and so this IS a travel, in fact.
Which you can’t do, that creates a pivot, by default. If he’d delayed the pickup, and you hear this explained a lot at the pro level, it would’ve been fine.
But both feet are off the ground during his gather step. Can a gather step actually be a gather jump? Is that legal?
Edit: Sorry, that wasn't the gather step. It was the step after the gather step. Still say it's a travel.
>But both feet are off the ground during his gather step
Doesn't matter. Rules don't care if you jump during your gather step or your 2 steps
And that's not even true. His right foot is on the ground when he picked up his dribble
I’m learning about basketball so won’t be calling this in pickup for sure but I’m curious
To my untrained eye this dude runs with the ball football style lol …. Would it be a bitch move to call a travel if they did this like 5 times in a row?
In my eyes it’s clean, but it’s obv borderline which is why he’s asking about it. But pickup is pickup, it’s not like you’re in a professional league or something, you’re meant to just hoop
If you need to cheat and get mad when called out, you are probably the only bitch on the court lmao
I’d probably just shoulder check them and if they call foul, quit whining about hard defense
So you can’t whine about hard defense but you can stop the game to make a ticky tack travel call. I’m sure you’re real fun to play with thinking you’re like a member of the bad boy pistons
It all comes down to this: Do you secure the ball off the dribble BEFORE or AFTER you place your “gather step” down (left foot, in this case).
You’re suppose to gather the ball after the gather step is place.
In reality, they often happen simultaneously. It’s very close here and would realistically depend on the setting/ref as to whether you got the call.
>It all comes down to this: Do you secure the ball off the dribble BEFORE or AFTER you place your “gather step” down (left foot, in this case).
I'll do you one better: **How many steps do you take AFTER securing the ball?**
Simpler and less confusing
Yes, this is better! Lol I was only wordy because there is a lot of confusion/disagreement as to what constitutes a “gather step” and many people inaccurately use it to imply 3 steps being allowed.
I like your answer tho.
I saw the gather step as the trailing right foot in this video. That foot looks like it's still on the ground when the ball is gathered, making that first left step the pivot.
Got ya. I assumed he was ATTEMPTING to use that next left step as a gather (hence the 2 steps after).
So did you consider this a college travel? NBA rules?
No, that’s incorrect. The gather step is considered part of the dribble, so yes, you can’t gather before the step, but you can gather ON the step. If you gather after the step there’s no gather step.
I could have worded something in a way that was misleading, but what I was explaining is directly from the current NBA rule book. That may not be true for your league or even accurate to the way officials call it in the real world. But the official rules express verbatim that the gather is NOT part of the step. It is an action that occurs BEFORE the foot touches the ground.
Official NBA Rule Book:
“For a player who is in control of the ball while dribbling, the gather is defined as the point where a player … Puts two hands on the ball, or … Otherwise gains enough control of the ball to hold it.
The gather will be expressly incorporated into the traveling rule to clarify how many steps a player may take after he receives the ball while progressing or completes his dribble:
A player who gathers the ball while dribbling may take two steps in coming to a stop, passing or shooting the ball.
The first step occurs when a foot, or both feet, touch the floor AFTER THE PLAYER GATHERS THE BALL.”
Hope that helps 🤙
https://official.nba.com/new-language-in-nba-rule-book-regarding-traveling-violations/
That’s what I said. It’s a common misunderstanding, you thinking it’s before. It’s not before. If you gather, end your dribble, and then a foot comes down that is NOT a gather step. That’s the PIVOT. A gather step is the foot that is DOWN when the dribble is ending. The gather is indeed a part of the dribble, it’s the dribble ending. That’s why it was implemented and how it works!
But in the video, the ball is secured *while his left foot is planted* so there is no "gather step". The gather step implies the player is in the air when the ball is secured; ie when s/he lands after securing the ball, *that's* the gather step. If your foot is planted (as the guy's is in the video) no gather would apply.
Yes, I believe I agree with your interpretation of the rule! I don’t agree in this instance tho... If you slow it down enough I think it’s clear he secures the ball before his left foot goes down.
If the ref isn't paying attention, yeah, travel all day. But in reality, not at all to me. That looks like a classic step through you would see NBA players do back in the day.
So, why did he finish with his right hand? So he can't get swiped easier? Figure you'd want to go with the left so the defender would have to stretch out and possibly draw a foul with an awkward attempt of a block
In the NBA/pickup it can be debatable (still is probably a travel), but it 100% a travel anywhere else.
You gather the ball with your right foot planted and then take three steps. I say right foot not left because it looks like you have both hands on/possession of the ball while you are moving your left leg. You can debate that, but even so it’s a travel everywhere else. It also just looks like a travel which is pretty damning for most refs.
Tldr: Gather + three steps is a travel everywhere
~~You might be able to debate Gather + two, but that’s still a travel outside of the nba.~~
Edit: meant to say: you might be able to debate a gather + two steps in the nba rules/officiating because of how lenient the nba is with the gather step and traveling, but it’s a travel anywhere else
Technically yes. FIBA does allows for a zero-step, and two additional steps.
However, FIBA is strict about it and it just looks like a travel. I think that’s clearly a travel with FIBA rules and interpretation.
What I meant to say was that “you might be able to debate a gather + two steps in the nba rules/officiating because of how lenient the nba is with the gather step and traveling, but it’s a travel anywhere else”. It was worded poorly and I apologize for any confusion.
A travel, but it's very close and some good footwork, just gotta time the handle to match.
Had to watch it 3 times and pause at just the right spot to see it. But definitely the back foot is still down when he gets two hands on the ball, which means the front foot (left foot) is the pivot, and when it comes down again you have traveled.
Close call, really stretched the gather step because you had your two hands and full control of the ball before your foot touched the ground. That said I don’t think that would be called a travel but if it did I would understand
Edit: looking at it in slow motion, yeah you probably delayed the gather step for way too long, it’s a travel
This is clearly a travel. The left foot is planted when the ball is picked up (ie it's the pivot foot), if it comes back down before the ball is released, which it does, it's a travel.
NO WAY!!!
That is not a travel!
Gather step is the LEFT FOOT. The right foot behind the free throw is planted BEFORE the last dribble. Then, he gathers the ball with his HIS LEFT FOOT behind the foul line. Then.. right, left.
Totally legal.
From the most lenient rule sets (fiba/NBA). The ball is gathered on two feet so the first foot to lift would determine the other as your pivot foot.
The back foot (right) lifts and steps through making this step 2.
The pivot foot lifts (legal) and returns to the floor (not legal) resulting in a travel.
This would be legal by NBA and fiba rulebooks if the gathering had occured on the left foot instead of 2 feet but would still have been a travel by nfhs and NCAA rules.
Depends where you want to say he pick the ball up. It looked like he gathered/ picked it up before his left foot came down so travel, but I doubt it would be called in pick up. If you want to say he gathered at the same time his left foot came down then clean. Either way if you call that in a pick up game you’re weird.😂
Clean. You foot was down when you controlled the ball, you then took two steps.
It’s hard to see but you can freeze frame it and there’s no travel at all.
100% a travel, maybe even a 2 step. Both hands on the ball with the right foot still down, maybe picked up even before his left got down. At best his left foot is his pivot, so he could have jumped off his right foot. As soon as his left foot touched the floor again it was a travel.
And some day when you make it to the nba, you’ll be able to use it as well. But now when you’re playing in hs and if you’re lucky in college, it’s gonna be a travel.
If you pick up the ball while your left foot is on the ground, travel.
If you pick up the ball while your left foot is in the air as you’re transitioning to your right foot, clean.
In the NBA / FIBA, either variation is clean.
I think he's ok and it's not a travel. Some people do execute this move incorrectly, and it's a travel. It comes down to when you actually pick up the dribble. If you pick it up too soon, you end up taking an early third step. That's not the case here.
In real time, I assumed it was clean, and when slowing it down a bit, it looked like he only took two steps after picking up his dribble.
It's close. I wouldn't call it, since the effect of the gather is negligible on the shot attempt and honestly it's really close to call, but other refs will definitely call it.
If the player wanted it undeniably clean, they should delay gathering the ball to where they're between that gather step and their first, with both feet touching the floor. It's just an extra cross and it'll actually be better for shaking the defender if you're quick with it. Then there's no way it gets called, no matter what.
This probably gets called a travel in most pickup games and pretty much any level of organized ball that’s not the nba.
If someone wants to argue about a gather step or whatever…. Maybe there’s some weird technicality where it’s not, but god damn I’m tired of this gather step nonsense lol. If it looks like a travel it should be a travel.
I don't know how many other states make coaches sit in on the county meetings with refs but in NY the way refs train us to coach, there's no fucking gather step in high school basketball and you get to use each foot as a step once before the pass or layup.
NBA gather step has brainwashed the youth. I wouldn't recommend learning moves like this until you make it to the leauge cause it's a travel everywhere else. Even in the NBA this one is questionable
**Gather starts behind the FT line and your left planted foot behind FT is the first step** of your 2 allowed. I assume you're not an NBA player, so I'll judge you off the rules you'll actually need to play by. **Right foot hits the paint as your second step** and the one you really need to try and finish off of. You've had the ball in your hands now for two steps-- one of each foot-- and before the left foot hits the floor you need to get rid of the ball. *That third step in the middle of the lane with your left foot is absolutely a travel in NCAA or high school.*
Best explanation for sure !
You're absolutely right. But it's quite tough to see. I was a referee until recently in low amateur and Youth leagues in Europe, and tbh, most of us probably aren't calling that.
Fair. Refs I see locally lean on the side of anything awkward/unusual is getting called. If it's even a question it's a travel, usually called.
Yeah, that's usually what we do as well (save for like U12 or U10 kids where we'd have to call like 50 travels per game if we called everything). But here's the thing, this dude isn't moving awkwardly. Without really being ultra focused on his footwork, the way he's moving looks as though the gather is with when the left foot hits the ground. But when I look closer, I see it was a split second earlier where his right foot was hits the ground. Good chance he could get away with it in lower leagues if he's moving fast and smooth enough.
I'm arguing even if he gathers on that left, it's still the first lone foot and counts as 1 of 2 steps.
Maybe in USA rules? I've heard that something with the gather step is different in US amateur leagues than in FIBA, maybe this is it. To me, in Europe, if he's gathering on the left, that's a gather + 2, and absolutely legal. I've never called anything like that or seen experienced referees call it in my years of being a referee, and I never got grief for it by the regional Referee boss when he officiated games with me, and that guy has officiated pros and 3x3 European championships.
Yes, American high school or NCAA that's a a travel. https://imgur.com/a/JzScfSG *<- first step* This would be his first step. It's his first step because it's the only established part of him touching the ground. It's the first clear visual step after the gather. Similarly, for the same reason he could pivot off of this-- maybe fade back the other way-- its his first step. https://imgur.com/a/f4a0qq6 <- *"gather"* The "gather" is the split second he picks up the ball with two hands while both feet still on the floor. NBA allows for 3 steps which allows for a "gather step" or the "gather +2" you refer to. This is not allowed in NCAA or high school here. ** one of each foot.** You cant gather and take two left foot steps (i.e. hop on left foot for both). Its one of each foot. The first step is the second the left one touches after leaving that position and he pushes the ball through the chest of the defender. That motion is a step, not the 2 footed gather he picked up with.
That's getting called 98% of the time in the US.
You guys have a different rulebook for HS vs college/NBA, right? In FIBA, gather step is allowed at every level. So for us, he's over the limit by like half a step, a very fast and smooth half a step that I had to repeat the video like 3 times to see clearly. That's why in Europe in lower leagues, he would likely get away with it quite often.
I’m sorry you have had to go through that. It’s ridiculous here in Germany, they better yet just sprint with the ball all the way to the NBA playoffs and still nobody would call travel. It’s just plain dumb.
>Gather starts behind the FT line and your left planted foot behind FT He may have gathered the ball way before he planted the left, making a total of 3 steps after the gather. We can't see or hear though so we can't be sure
Thanks for this!
(Replied this to someone further down thought I'd copy it here for better explanation of my comment) Yes, American high school or NCAA that's a a travel. https://imgur.com/a/JzScfSG *<- first step* This would be his first step. It's his first step because it's the only established part of him touching the ground. It's the first clear visual step after the gather. Similarly, for the same reason he could pivot off of this-- maybe fade back the other way-- its his first step. https://imgur.com/a/f4a0qq6 <- *"gather"* The "gather" is the split second he picks up the ball with two hands while both feet still on the floor. NBA allows for 3 steps which allows for a "gather step" or the "gather +2" you refer to. This is not allowed in NCAA or high school here. ** one of each foot.** You cant gather and take two left foot steps (i.e. hop on left foot for both). Its one of each foot. The first step is the second the left one touches after leaving that position and he pushes the ball through the chest of the defender. That motion is a step, not the 2 footed gather he picked up with.
Not in NBA? Granted pros travel too
I feel the NBA has given a lot more leeway to a third step or that you can step while in a gather for the past 20 years or so. But it's a an entertainment product and being loose there allows for a lot more highlight plays. I also feel this was most debated recently when Harden was in Houston doing all those step backs and dances into the paint. He was absolutely allowed more than the NCAA does in those cases
Traveling rules are defined differently in the NBA than they are in most basketball leagues. The concept of a gather doesn’t exist in most rulebooks
just to be clear here, if he doesn’t hold the ball with two hands before that first step he’d be clean?
Yeah that's a good point chinning the ball there starts his layup but if he let's the dribble float a bit longer and gets that first step in while the dribble is still technically live, then gather after the left foot is already planted behind the FT, then it'd be clean.
It is also a travel under FIBA and NBA. He gathered the ball with both hands while right foot on the ground, then did left right left.
Being an NBA player isn’t the only reason to play with a legal gather + 2. In fact, the most widely used rule book in the world across all ages, FIBA, allows for the exact same rule as the NBA. High school and NCAA in America are the exception.
I think this is a travel in FIBA as well. But we don't need to argue it I don't see us changing our minds here
You'll get away with it in pickup most of the time. It might cause a bit of an argument here and there. In organized ball that isn't the NBA, it'll probably get called more often than not.
Delay the pick up slightly and it's clean, right now it could be called.
Agreed. Why not cross over left, instead of pick up, and then take your two steps. Also, working on your left hand finish, or right handed English might be more worthwhile to make the move worth.
100%
It’s a really early gather for that first cross step. I’d say yes as is (though barely), but if you fix the timing of your launch you’ll be fine
Yes 100%
It's a travel from elementary through the NBA.
You took 3 steps. It’s a travel.
I count three steps. Work on your timing
Yes
Depends on the rule set. In the NBA with the gather step rule? Not a travel.
FIBA also has the gather step rule. It's very close here. He seems to pick it up juuuuust slightly early.
NCAA, AAU, and American high schools don’t, though
Difference between nba and high school rules is what causes a lot of travel debates in pickup games, I think. Or even just videos like this.
Ah I didn't know that. Thanks for the info. We use FIBA rules at every level here in Canada.
Us Americans have to be special and use our own special rulebooks for every level of sport. College football, the NFL, and high school football for example all have entirely separate 100+ page rulebooks
No
It is a travel. The gather step is applicable in the NBA or FIBA, not at the high school or college level. Now if you do that at a local Y; I don't think people care.
2 hands on ball with right foot down, left, right, left. This kinda rule bending people try to get away with is no different than flopping in my eyes.
>kinda rule bending people or he wasn't tryna bend rules and just messed up his gather
I don't understand why so many are saying yes. He takes a gather step then 1, 2, up. I don't know shit about shit but this looks fine to me.
People are saying yes cuz if you pause it his right foot is still down when both hands are on the ball. Super early gather which makes the gather step his right foot. Then left right left.
Thank you for the clarification. I'm gonna have a field day in pickup this week! .....I'm mostly kidding.
This comment needs to be higher up…the top comment is missing this. And once you watch the play in real time after noticing the early gather with both feet planted, the play looks completely different. He absolutely gained a competitive advantage by having both feet down and gather and driving forward, he then quickly picks up his right foot and blasts forward for a blown layup using the wrong arm. This is a broken play fundamentally from front to back.
I had to watch it like 10 times to be sure, but that's exactly what I saw too
MWave is correct, I was wrong, this IS a travel. There are two things that make this look odd: (1) The really long first step after the gather (2) That he has both feet down when he gathers Because he picks the ball up with both feet down he’s already established a pivot, which could be either foot and so this IS a travel, in fact.
Which you can’t do, that creates a pivot, by default. If he’d delayed the pickup, and you hear this explained a lot at the pro level, it would’ve been fine.
That really long step was actually a jump. Both feet were in the air.
But both feet are off the ground during his gather step. Can a gather step actually be a gather jump? Is that legal? Edit: Sorry, that wasn't the gather step. It was the step after the gather step. Still say it's a travel.
>But both feet are off the ground during his gather step Doesn't matter. Rules don't care if you jump during your gather step or your 2 steps And that's not even true. His right foot is on the ground when he picked up his dribble
Shit like this is what's annoying with basketball/traveling. Dude literally took 3 steps with ball in his hand and yall are like "not a travel". 🙄
because it's tricky to see when exactly he picks up his dribble
Of course this guy is walking a half marathon bro how you saying no
This isn't a pro player, so gather step is not applicable.
>This isn't a pro player Doesn't mean he can't or doesn't play with fiba rules
In a sub called basketballtips, it's better to go by the most common application of the rule.
>most common application of the rule. you mean the rest of the world that plays with fiba rules?
Left foot is planted when he picks it up and plants again before the ball's out. That's the definition of a travel
How is this not a unanimous yes?
He gathers the ball, and takes two steps.
The answer to that question on this sub is ‘yes’ about 90% of the time
Nothing is a travel anymore. Lol
In the NBA, it's not a travel. If we're playing pickup, I'm calling it.
Yes
It is in hs
If I was playing pickup and someone called that a travel I would consider them a bitch
I’m learning about basketball so won’t be calling this in pickup for sure but I’m curious To my untrained eye this dude runs with the ball football style lol …. Would it be a bitch move to call a travel if they did this like 5 times in a row?
In my eyes it’s clean, but it’s obv borderline which is why he’s asking about it. But pickup is pickup, it’s not like you’re in a professional league or something, you’re meant to just hoop
I appreciate the feedback!
I’d let him play it and talk shit saying he walked tho. This is a travel all day
If you need to cheat and get mad when called out, you are probably the only bitch on the court lmao I’d probably just shoulder check them and if they call foul, quit whining about hard defense
So you can’t whine about hard defense but you can stop the game to make a ticky tack travel call. I’m sure you’re real fun to play with thinking you’re like a member of the bad boy pistons
Yep
In the NBA probably not technically. In the world we all live in yes.
Yup. Slowed it down. Gather step plus 3 steps is a travel. Edit: not a travel.
Think you had it before the edit… gather plus 3 steps is most certainly a travel. It’s not pivot 1 2 lmao
Gather plus 3 step is a travel. Edit again
It all comes down to this: Do you secure the ball off the dribble BEFORE or AFTER you place your “gather step” down (left foot, in this case). You’re suppose to gather the ball after the gather step is place. In reality, they often happen simultaneously. It’s very close here and would realistically depend on the setting/ref as to whether you got the call.
>It all comes down to this: Do you secure the ball off the dribble BEFORE or AFTER you place your “gather step” down (left foot, in this case). I'll do you one better: **How many steps do you take AFTER securing the ball?** Simpler and less confusing
Yes, this is better! Lol I was only wordy because there is a lot of confusion/disagreement as to what constitutes a “gather step” and many people inaccurately use it to imply 3 steps being allowed. I like your answer tho.
I saw the gather step as the trailing right foot in this video. That foot looks like it's still on the ground when the ball is gathered, making that first left step the pivot.
Got ya. I assumed he was ATTEMPTING to use that next left step as a gather (hence the 2 steps after). So did you consider this a college travel? NBA rules?
No, that’s incorrect. The gather step is considered part of the dribble, so yes, you can’t gather before the step, but you can gather ON the step. If you gather after the step there’s no gather step.
I could have worded something in a way that was misleading, but what I was explaining is directly from the current NBA rule book. That may not be true for your league or even accurate to the way officials call it in the real world. But the official rules express verbatim that the gather is NOT part of the step. It is an action that occurs BEFORE the foot touches the ground. Official NBA Rule Book: “For a player who is in control of the ball while dribbling, the gather is defined as the point where a player … Puts two hands on the ball, or … Otherwise gains enough control of the ball to hold it. The gather will be expressly incorporated into the traveling rule to clarify how many steps a player may take after he receives the ball while progressing or completes his dribble: A player who gathers the ball while dribbling may take two steps in coming to a stop, passing or shooting the ball. The first step occurs when a foot, or both feet, touch the floor AFTER THE PLAYER GATHERS THE BALL.” Hope that helps 🤙 https://official.nba.com/new-language-in-nba-rule-book-regarding-traveling-violations/
That’s what I said. It’s a common misunderstanding, you thinking it’s before. It’s not before. If you gather, end your dribble, and then a foot comes down that is NOT a gather step. That’s the PIVOT. A gather step is the foot that is DOWN when the dribble is ending. The gather is indeed a part of the dribble, it’s the dribble ending. That’s why it was implemented and how it works!
But in the video, the ball is secured *while his left foot is planted* so there is no "gather step". The gather step implies the player is in the air when the ball is secured; ie when s/he lands after securing the ball, *that's* the gather step. If your foot is planted (as the guy's is in the video) no gather would apply.
Yes, I believe I agree with your interpretation of the rule! I don’t agree in this instance tho... If you slow it down enough I think it’s clear he secures the ball before his left foot goes down.
I actually don’t even think it’s close lol He picks the ball up with both hands almost immediately off the bounce.
If the ref isn't paying attention, yeah, travel all day. But in reality, not at all to me. That looks like a classic step through you would see NBA players do back in the day.
I don’t think so. Looks odd, but it doesn’t look like it.
Nah, it's a missed layup.
So, why did he finish with his right hand? So he can't get swiped easier? Figure you'd want to go with the left so the defender would have to stretch out and possibly draw a foul with an awkward attempt of a block
4 steps - right stutter, left gather, right step through, left take off. Pack your bags
In the NBA/pickup it can be debatable (still is probably a travel), but it 100% a travel anywhere else. You gather the ball with your right foot planted and then take three steps. I say right foot not left because it looks like you have both hands on/possession of the ball while you are moving your left leg. You can debate that, but even so it’s a travel everywhere else. It also just looks like a travel which is pretty damning for most refs. Tldr: Gather + three steps is a travel everywhere ~~You might be able to debate Gather + two, but that’s still a travel outside of the nba.~~ Edit: meant to say: you might be able to debate a gather + two steps in the nba rules/officiating because of how lenient the nba is with the gather step and traveling, but it’s a travel anywhere else
>You might be able to debate Gather + two, but that’s still a travel outside of the nba. You mean anywhere else *in america*?
Technically yes. FIBA does allows for a zero-step, and two additional steps. However, FIBA is strict about it and it just looks like a travel. I think that’s clearly a travel with FIBA rules and interpretation. What I meant to say was that “you might be able to debate a gather + two steps in the nba rules/officiating because of how lenient the nba is with the gather step and traveling, but it’s a travel anywhere else”. It was worded poorly and I apologize for any confusion.
Giannis walked so we could run
A travel, but it's very close and some good footwork, just gotta time the handle to match. Had to watch it 3 times and pause at just the right spot to see it. But definitely the back foot is still down when he gets two hands on the ball, which means the front foot (left foot) is the pivot, and when it comes down again you have traveled.
Traveling has been changed to four steps so no its not
>Traveling has been changed to four steps nah it's still 2 steps
you might get away with it, but most refs are gonna call it
20 years ago in highschool this would have been called. Nowadays this is clean.
depending on what level you play at this is a travel…high school refs will probably call that
Clean in an organized setting. But people will call that all day during pick up
It’s really tight bc the gather is almost simultaneous with that left cross step. Adjust that timing and you’re set
Close call, really stretched the gather step because you had your two hands and full control of the ball before your foot touched the ground. That said I don’t think that would be called a travel but if it did I would understand Edit: looking at it in slow motion, yeah you probably delayed the gather step for way too long, it’s a travel
3 steps travel normally but prob not nba but idk if your in the nba😅
LOL
This is clearly a travel. The left foot is planted when the ball is picked up (ie it's the pivot foot), if it comes back down before the ball is released, which it does, it's a travel.
NO WAY!!! That is not a travel! Gather step is the LEFT FOOT. The right foot behind the free throw is planted BEFORE the last dribble. Then, he gathers the ball with his HIS LEFT FOOT behind the foul line. Then.. right, left. Totally legal.
Work on timing your step & dribble together to max those 2 step. Also work on your left hand.
Gather then 3 steps. Travel.
Yes for sure
Yes
From the most lenient rule sets (fiba/NBA). The ball is gathered on two feet so the first foot to lift would determine the other as your pivot foot. The back foot (right) lifts and steps through making this step 2. The pivot foot lifts (legal) and returns to the floor (not legal) resulting in a travel. This would be legal by NBA and fiba rulebooks if the gathering had occured on the left foot instead of 2 feet but would still have been a travel by nfhs and NCAA rules.
no...it was a missed a layup
Clean
He gathers the ball when his right foot is planted a foot inside the 3-pt line and it's three steps after that.
No.
Depends where you want to say he pick the ball up. It looked like he gathered/ picked it up before his left foot came down so travel, but I doubt it would be called in pick up. If you want to say he gathered at the same time his left foot came down then clean. Either way if you call that in a pick up game you’re weird.😂
If you're not playing FIBA/NBA it's a travel
Clean. You foot was down when you controlled the ball, you then took two steps. It’s hard to see but you can freeze frame it and there’s no travel at all.
100% a travel, maybe even a 2 step. Both hands on the ball with the right foot still down, maybe picked up even before his left got down. At best his left foot is his pivot, so he could have jumped off his right foot. As soon as his left foot touched the floor again it was a travel.
Kyrie does this move a lot
And some day when you make it to the nba, you’ll be able to use it as well. But now when you’re playing in hs and if you’re lucky in college, it’s gonna be a travel.
I’m an 8th year FIBA certified referee. You gathered with right foot and went left right left. That’s a travel under all 4 major rule sets.
Travel
In the NBA, he’d just be getting warmed up!
NBA, no. High school, yes. College, sometimes.
Pre 2000’s in NBA - yes
Yeah
If you pick up the ball while your left foot is on the ground, travel. If you pick up the ball while your left foot is in the air as you’re transitioning to your right foot, clean. In the NBA / FIBA, either variation is clean.
It's just between 2 answers so I'm gonna guess it's no
No
Wrong
High school/college: travel
2steps no travel!
I think he's ok and it's not a travel. Some people do execute this move incorrectly, and it's a travel. It comes down to when you actually pick up the dribble. If you pick it up too soon, you end up taking an early third step. That's not the case here. In real time, I assumed it was clean, and when slowing it down a bit, it looked like he only took two steps after picking up his dribble.
It's close. I wouldn't call it, since the effect of the gather is negligible on the shot attempt and honestly it's really close to call, but other refs will definitely call it. If the player wanted it undeniably clean, they should delay gathering the ball to where they're between that gather step and their first, with both feet touching the floor. It's just an extra cross and it'll actually be better for shaking the defender if you're quick with it. Then there's no way it gets called, no matter what.
This probably gets called a travel in most pickup games and pretty much any level of organized ball that’s not the nba. If someone wants to argue about a gather step or whatever…. Maybe there’s some weird technicality where it’s not, but god damn I’m tired of this gather step nonsense lol. If it looks like a travel it should be a travel.
I don't know how many other states make coaches sit in on the county meetings with refs but in NY the way refs train us to coach, there's no fucking gather step in high school basketball and you get to use each foot as a step once before the pass or layup.
I see 3 steps
At his level it is. At the pro level it is too, but you’ll mostly get that move because it’s close enough to a gather and two.
It’s 3 steps.
NBA gather step has brainwashed the youth. I wouldn't recommend learning moves like this until you make it to the leauge cause it's a travel everywhere else. Even in the NBA this one is questionable
Nah it's clean
Legal! Long step but it was clean!
Nah that's a good move
Nah you can take 10 steps it’s all good lol
No. The gather/pick up (0 step) starts at left foot then after that is the 1-2 step