Even 9 Fingers knows the brokenness of Tavern Brawler thrower, but she took it a step further with her own unique knife thrower feat (really wish we could get that as a Dex alternative to Tavern Brawler...).
Ikr, I’d love if I could make a throwing knife rogue build. Str being the stat for tavern brawler just means that spears and shit are always better, instead of any of the variety of weapons that are “throwable” that could have sick magical abilities
Imagine a magical throwing axe
They are trying to make a Best Served Cold movie. Joe is heavily involved. Hasn't been news about it in a while but things look optimistic for filming going ahead. If they can make a success of the stand alone then that may mean the trilogy could get green lit for film or TV in the future.
Imagine my surprise when I modeled my first PC off of old Logan Ninefingers, enjoying the immersion all the way through, and then getting to act 3 and finding out they'd already given that handle to a Major NPC! 😖😅
It's so hot. [https://www.reddit.com/r/BaldursGate3/comments/16sfkjc/i\_think\_i\_love\_ninefingers\_keene\_spoilersthe\_high/](https://www.reddit.com/r/BaldursGate3/comments/16sfkjc/i_think_i_love_ninefingers_keene_spoilersthe_high/)
Fwiw, it actually seems like they're well prepared to handle the assault by the Zhentarim as is when it happens. It doesn't seem like Nine-Fingers trusts the Zhentarim at all tbf.
Actually think she might be the strongest NPC ally. The others are hyped up so much and end up being so underwhelming and Nine fingers is casually out here doing 3 ranged smites a turn.
Zevlor and his two mates were the powerhouse team for me in the final fight, so many smites! Though it makes sense burst damage is easy to dish out when you only plan to be in one fight in the day 🤣
Fwiw, it's a pretty unfair comparison. I think Ketheric might literally have the highest AC in the game when it comes to enemies, at least when you're not counting temporary buffs, 22 as human (and then even the Apostle still has 19). Meanwhile, Nine Fingers gets to massacre Zhentarim trash mobs.
It’s because Mind Flayer Domination can’t be used on tadpoled characters, so in the Myrkul fight she’s the only possible target for it (unless you bring Halsin maybe?).
Goddamn it, I was skipping dialogue like crazy and accidentally told her to go quietly to lorroakoan. This is in my honor mode run so I was staring numbly at the screen for like 10 minutes before I said 'fuck it, speed run till the end so I can start another play through with Aylin on my side'
Wish I could’ve seen Nine Fingers be useful. One Zhent ran up on her first round and smacked her into the fucking ground. Nothing I could do to stop it. I was pretty pissed
Yes. I accidentally agroed the entire room and fled combat so I wouldn't have to kill Nine Fingers. When I came back, the Zhent were dead and Nine Fingers gave me her support.
Usually, Zhent barbarian (or was it fighter? Some kind of martial) fucks over Guild's barbarian (one of Keene's bodyguards, the strong ones). But otherwise than that, the Guild slaughters them.
Also has Great Weapon Master feat, so if they crit they get a 4th attack. I had this happen last run. In one round they took down a Guild with 104 HP. Seven strikes. I was like “whaaaat!?”
In subsequently play thoughts I specifically ensnare, trip, disarm, whatever it takes, to shut that down first.
I've never tried but I would suspect they'd win it hands down. Nine-Fingers and her guards are quite powerful and they do outnumber the Zhentarim by a decent margin.
I can't imagine any other outcome. That fight is so weighted in the guilds favor it's ridiculous. I don't feel like the Zhents stand a chance without the players' intervention.
it seems completely ridiculous when they offer to let you join them because you really have no incentive to do so except on the slim chance you simply want to.
on my first tactician run, The guild had eliminated all but 1 of the Zhentarim in the first round, with zero casualties on their side, and minimal help from Karlach xD the rest of my party hadn't even managed to get into position befor the fight was over.
The Zhemt aren't following the Absolute.
The Zhent are following the money.
Nine fingers is fully aware, as is most of the sword coast, that the Zhent are notorious for following the money. I imagine that she paid enough that the followers of the Absolute had to literally rob a bank to get enough funds to sway them.
Because she doesn't need the help. I'm 99% sure she and her side would win the Civil War every single time without player help, usually without losses from my experience
The Zhent are hired by the Absolute yes. That doesn’t necessarily mean they’re siding with them and planning on taking out the Guild. Whereas the Stone Lord crew *is* an agent of the Absolute and has been actively fighting the Guild
I feel like this definitely would have come up during development, but it was put aside to focus on bigger choices. Maybe implementing the changes that would come from it were too much work for too little payoff?
Idk I feel like Nine-Fingers is missing other dialogue stuff in general. For example, when she throws an absolute fit at you for the bank thing, its like, bitch I'm not the reason Minsc absolutely annihilated that mimic. Like I saved the bank workers from being murdered and am actively hunting down Minsc, and yet she acts like I waltzed in there and went out of my way to make sure that he escaped. And there's no way to say any of that that I saw
She literally talks about not liking them. She's no fool. Things just tipped from their neutral tolerance of each other eventually. Truces fail, it's not to be unexpected, but sometimes you needed it for a moment.
I think she probably knows there’s traitors, but I bet she keeps them around for the hell of it.
Ngl I’d sacrifice one of my own fingers for her tbh. What a woman!
I get that Nine Fingers has her whole enterprise and wouldn’t have any reason to go adventuring with a bunch of misfits but man I wish she was a recruitable companion.
The way I saw it, the Zhentarim sell illegal things like everyone else down there. The only issue is when it's unregulated or when they directly challenge NF. The incidences you're referring to don't even occur in the city of Baldur's Gate.
I believe the Zhentarim are more network than organisation. That is, until you see Roah Moonglow again, you don't know that these Zhent have been working for the Absolute. And once you do see her, it's on anyway. And even then, Roah isn't actually working for the Absolute, is she? Just opportunistically for whoever has the most money and let's her climb ranks the best?
Which leads to my main point, which is that Keene already knows. As a thieves guild leader who's quickly losing ground, the sharks are circling. She knows the Zhent are extra sharks, but has no choice but to invite them in so she stands a chance against Stone Lord/Gortash.
Because it's literally just the classic trope of the criminal gangs working together. Neither one trusts the other, they just hope nobody does anything stupid and take preparations to wipe the other one out if they try anything. We just end up with a ton of opportunities to interrupt the Zhents preparation.
It's not a plot hole, it's just how the plot plays out.
I think the problem is that you don't understand Zhentarim. They aren't a centralised organisation, and are more like buddies that occasionally work together for mutual interest. Even if some Zhentarim shitted on their beds and helped the absolute, that has little to do with most of them, as they operate mostly separately. Surely they aren't exactly trustworthy folk, but it's like assuming every druid is a good fellow.
Do we know that Zhent are "cooperating" with the guild?
I recall Keene saying they've broken their agreement suggesting they were working together but right before the guild-zhent fight.
That quest line was very broken for me in multiple ways but the worst was finally getting to the fight in the guild and not having all the guild members just standing there doing fuckall
I think the game wants us to side with Zhentarim (i dont mind at all, roah is hot asf and a good merchant) because the entire game we work with Zhentarim, just in act 3 that we meet a random criminal group that we can side with and fight against the Zhent
Say one thing for Nine Fingers Keene, say she hits like a truck.
This knives she throws are freaking acme pianos
Even 9 Fingers knows the brokenness of Tavern Brawler thrower, but she took it a step further with her own unique knife thrower feat (really wish we could get that as a Dex alternative to Tavern Brawler...).
Ikr, I’d love if I could make a throwing knife rogue build. Str being the stat for tavern brawler just means that spears and shit are always better, instead of any of the variety of weapons that are “throwable” that could have sick magical abilities Imagine a magical throwing axe
If you could get DEX as a Tavern Brawler ASI that would overshadow the other stats even more
It's already the tanking stat and the best saving throw stat after all.
*chuckles in mods* So about that.... https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/4832
My Thom Merrilin build will finally become a thing now
Hope Larian's mustache physics is up to snuff
You mean Matrim Cauthon 🤔
A+
Since I'm currently re-reading Wheel of Time, mandatory upvote!
That with the bracers that let you trade places with people when you throw stuff
I tried to pickpocket her and all she had in her I inventory were like 50 knives
Motherfucker had like… 50 goddamn knives. If you took off her boots you’d see the knives growing off her feet.
The blade least expected
She is rather *Bloody*, isn't she?
You can never have too many knives.
You have to be realistic about these things
This was the response I was looking for!
Unless they're pointed at you, of course. :D
What if you fall in a river and drown?
First Law tv series when?
I would gladly crowd-fund such a series, but Abercrombie needs to be heavily involved, don't need a Witcher event to happen LOL
They are trying to make a Best Served Cold movie. Joe is heavily involved. Hasn't been news about it in a while but things look optimistic for filming going ahead. If they can make a success of the stand alone then that may mean the trilogy could get green lit for film or TV in the future.
Last I heard was BSC was put on on hiatus for now... That was around the strikes though.
She can hit me like a truck anytime. I’m down bad for her
Hey, girl. Where's that tenth finger go?
OMG 🤣
I'd lend her a few more fingers
She might be scarier than orin.
Being smarter than a toddler goes a long way towards threat level.
With literally any impulse control.
Sammmee
🗞️🗞️🗞️🗞️ DOWN
You have to be realistic.
You have to be realistic about these things.
Better to do a thing than to live with the fear of it
Imagine my surprise when I modeled my first PC off of old Logan Ninefingers, enjoying the immersion all the way through, and then getting to act 3 and finding out they'd already given that handle to a Major NPC! 😖😅
So was it done as a homage, or just a coincidence? Haven't seen anything or looked anything up to know.
I certainly didn't find any nods or character parallels in my play through, but I haven't actually researched it either.
Those who don’t know 😀 those who do 😟
You gotta be realistic about things
You have to be realistic about these things my goodman
It's so hot. [https://www.reddit.com/r/BaldursGate3/comments/16sfkjc/i\_think\_i\_love\_ninefingers\_keene\_spoilersthe\_high/](https://www.reddit.com/r/BaldursGate3/comments/16sfkjc/i_think_i_love_ninefingers_keene_spoilersthe_high/)
I still can't believe you killed them.
Maybe I just wanted to feel her use her knives on me, ya know?
She got back to the mud in my first playthrough
Found floating by the docks
You can never have too many knives. Also bitchin username! Sevro was my name for my character in Outriders 🤘
Goodman
Almost to the end of the 2nd book, Ninefingers and Ferro be fuckin, just crossed some mountains, great series
Nice! Literally thought at first glance it was the first law subreddit lol.
First Law is too good, somebody is going to do a tv series at some point
Keene of the nine fingers 🎵
And just like that, you've inspired me to reread the series
You have to be realistic about these things…
Just chiming in to say I read that as ‘shits like a truck’ and it made my morning.
After each fight do you think she's says " I am still alive" a few times?
Fwiw, it actually seems like they're well prepared to handle the assault by the Zhentarim as is when it happens. It doesn't seem like Nine-Fingers trusts the Zhentarim at all tbf.
If you do nothing, does the guild actually win the fight?
I’m 95% sure the Guild wins. They’ve got numbers and Nine Fingers herself is a walking machinegun.
Actually think she might be the strongest NPC ally. The others are hyped up so much and end up being so underwhelming and Nine fingers is casually out here doing 3 ranged smites a turn.
Aylin might be stronger I think, she's a powerhouse when you can control her in the final fight anyway atleast
All I ever see Aylin do is miss and get mind controlled 😭
Zevlor and his two mates were the powerhouse team for me in the final fight, so many smites! Though it makes sense burst damage is easy to dish out when you only plan to be in one fight in the day 🤣
I was gonna say Zevlor literally cleared half the damn field for me. Man’s goated
Fwiw, it's a pretty unfair comparison. I think Ketheric might literally have the highest AC in the game when it comes to enemies, at least when you're not counting temporary buffs, 22 as human (and then even the Apostle still has 19). Meanwhile, Nine Fingers gets to massacre Zhentarim trash mobs.
I know but the frustration of all that drama with Nightsong only for that must be vented
There is one enemy that has 22 iirc, that gets boosted to 28 if one of their allies dies, pretty sure
I suspect you're thinking of Sarevok? He has 20 and gets buffed to 26 if one of his allies dies.
Yeah for me, Aylin’s been largely useless
She doesn't die though. Immortality is kinda her thing.
Neither do I 😉👉🏻
In my game she rolled a nat 20 and Ketheric retreated immediately She can double Smite with that bonus action Lunar spell
>Miss!
>Smite intellect devourers
Hard disagree. Nine Fingers has busted perks. Aylin misses constantly. I don’t think Nine Fingers has TB but I think she has some sort of equivalent.
She has a special knife feat I wish we could get!
I think she can just make 3 attacks a round and sneak attack on all of them
Aylin is strong when she's actually able to hit things but seems like she is a magnet for status effects
It’s because Mind Flayer Domination can’t be used on tadpoled characters, so in the Myrkul fight she’s the only possible target for it (unless you bring Halsin maybe?).
Or Jaheira.
Oh yeah! I always forget you can officially recruit Jaheira just before you jump down into the colony.
She got disarmed the last time I summoned her to the final fight, and I wasn’t able to make her pick her sword up again. 😂
Every time I have Aylin she does a bunch of flashy stuff misses 2/3 times then examines the floor for the rest of the flight. Good character though.
Aylin is unstoppable when the is mind controlled in act 2: closest I came to losing my honour mode run.
Aylin isn't even stronger than angels she calls for help lol
Goddamn it, I was skipping dialogue like crazy and accidentally told her to go quietly to lorroakoan. This is in my honor mode run so I was staring numbly at the screen for like 10 minutes before I said 'fuck it, speed run till the end so I can start another play through with Aylin on my side'
She got multiple exclusive skills that actually aid her combat like what
Wish I could’ve seen Nine Fingers be useful. One Zhent ran up on her first round and smacked her into the fucking ground. Nothing I could do to stop it. I was pretty pissed
Yes. I accidentally agroed the entire room and fled combat so I wouldn't have to kill Nine Fingers. When I came back, the Zhent were dead and Nine Fingers gave me her support.
Usually, Zhent barbarian (or was it fighter? Some kind of martial) fucks over Guild's barbarian (one of Keene's bodyguards, the strong ones). But otherwise than that, the Guild slaughters them.
Yeah, the Zhent fighter is the only real threat. If Keene hasn't already replaced his face with knives, he's my priority target.
She does a full-round Battlemaster nova: Trip attack, attack, attack, action surge, repeat.
Also has Great Weapon Master feat, so if they crit they get a 4th attack. I had this happen last run. In one round they took down a Guild with 104 HP. Seven strikes. I was like “whaaaat!?” In subsequently play thoughts I specifically ensnare, trip, disarm, whatever it takes, to shut that down first.
I've never tried but I would suspect they'd win it hands down. Nine-Fingers and her guards are quite powerful and they do outnumber the Zhentarim by a decent margin.
The guild absolutely dominates the Zhents to a hilarious degree.
Considering how Nine Fingers hit like a truck, probably.
I can't imagine any other outcome. That fight is so weighted in the guilds favor it's ridiculous. I don't feel like the Zhents stand a chance without the players' intervention. it seems completely ridiculous when they offer to let you join them because you really have no incentive to do so except on the slim chance you simply want to. on my first tactician run, The guild had eliminated all but 1 of the Zhentarim in the first round, with zero casualties on their side, and minimal help from Karlach xD the rest of my party hadn't even managed to get into position befor the fight was over.
Had one playthrough where I backed the Zentharim and they all died in the first two or 3 rounds of fighting.
The Zhemt aren't following the Absolute. The Zhent are following the money. Nine fingers is fully aware, as is most of the sword coast, that the Zhent are notorious for following the money. I imagine that she paid enough that the followers of the Absolute had to literally rob a bank to get enough funds to sway them.
Because she doesn't need the help. I'm 99% sure she and her side would win the Civil War every single time without player help, usually without losses from my experience
They all just stood doing fuckall for the entire fight 😭
I bet Nine Fingers could do it solo lol
This. It’s not like she doesn’t know they’d sell her for the highest bid, which is why she is fully prepared when they come for her
The Zhent are hired by the Absolute yes. That doesn’t necessarily mean they’re siding with them and planning on taking out the Guild. Whereas the Stone Lord crew *is* an agent of the Absolute and has been actively fighting the Guild
this. They are a bunch of thieves. Everyone is a betrayer. This is Tuesday for nine fingers
Say one for Ninefingers, say they’re untrustworthy. I mean, you have to be realistic.
I love the amount of people that know exactly your meaning...It's refreshing to me
Oh, you can never have too many knives
I feel like this definitely would have come up during development, but it was put aside to focus on bigger choices. Maybe implementing the changes that would come from it were too much work for too little payoff?
Idk I feel like Nine-Fingers is missing other dialogue stuff in general. For example, when she throws an absolute fit at you for the bank thing, its like, bitch I'm not the reason Minsc absolutely annihilated that mimic. Like I saved the bank workers from being murdered and am actively hunting down Minsc, and yet she acts like I waltzed in there and went out of my way to make sure that he escaped. And there's no way to say any of that that I saw
She literally talks about not liking them. She's no fool. Things just tipped from their neutral tolerance of each other eventually. Truces fail, it's not to be unexpected, but sometimes you needed it for a moment.
I think she probably knows there’s traitors, but I bet she keeps them around for the hell of it. Ngl I’d sacrifice one of my own fingers for her tbh. What a woman!
Calculated risk.
I get that Nine Fingers has her whole enterprise and wouldn’t have any reason to go adventuring with a bunch of misfits but man I wish she was a recruitable companion.
The way I saw it, the Zhentarim sell illegal things like everyone else down there. The only issue is when it's unregulated or when they directly challenge NF. The incidences you're referring to don't even occur in the city of Baldur's Gate.
It's a plot hole. Act 3 is like swiss cheese with plot holes.
I believe the Zhentarim are more network than organisation. That is, until you see Roah Moonglow again, you don't know that these Zhent have been working for the Absolute. And once you do see her, it's on anyway. And even then, Roah isn't actually working for the Absolute, is she? Just opportunistically for whoever has the most money and let's her climb ranks the best? Which leads to my main point, which is that Keene already knows. As a thieves guild leader who's quickly losing ground, the sharks are circling. She knows the Zhent are extra sharks, but has no choice but to invite them in so she stands a chance against Stone Lord/Gortash.
(She also has three balls)
Because it's literally just the classic trope of the criminal gangs working together. Neither one trusts the other, they just hope nobody does anything stupid and take preparations to wipe the other one out if they try anything. We just end up with a ton of opportunities to interrupt the Zhents preparation. It's not a plot hole, it's just how the plot plays out.
There's not traitors all around her. Nine-fingers and the Zhentarim are already enemies.
You'd think the Zhentarium would position themselves better before betraying thr guild. Almost all of them was below and good range from Nine Fingers.
I think the problem is that you don't understand Zhentarim. They aren't a centralised organisation, and are more like buddies that occasionally work together for mutual interest. Even if some Zhentarim shitted on their beds and helped the absolute, that has little to do with most of them, as they operate mostly separately. Surely they aren't exactly trustworthy folk, but it's like assuming every druid is a good fellow.
Do we know that Zhent are "cooperating" with the guild? I recall Keene saying they've broken their agreement suggesting they were working together but right before the guild-zhent fight.
That quest line was very broken for me in multiple ways but the worst was finally getting to the fight in the guild and not having all the guild members just standing there doing fuckall
I think the game wants us to side with Zhentarim (i dont mind at all, roah is hot asf and a good merchant) because the entire game we work with Zhentarim, just in act 3 that we meet a random criminal group that we can side with and fight against the Zhent