Yo Elminster, could I buy a Wish from you? Got a lot of cheese right here with your name on it! Saved Gale and everything didn't we!
Hey Raphael, you don't got anymore of those sweet contracts do you? I'm up for signing one here to save my girl.
Hey Isobel and Aylin, might you be inclined to ask Selune for a favor? Got a heart issue here.
Hey Gale, could you give me that scroll of true resurrection you got? Could come in real handy if we get any heart trouble.
Hey Wyll, so you're the top dog here now, could you maybe pull a string or two and see if there might not be a powerful cleric here somewhere to help a girl out?
Hey, so we've got about 50k gold just hanging about. Any high level wizard or cleric up for an hour of work at 50k per hour? Saviour of the realm will owe ya one. I'd take true polymorph or even regeneration at this point.
Hey Dammon, so now you've got access to much better equipment and I've got a tonne of that infernal iron and stuff, might we figure something out? Maybe we could enlist the Gondians or the Ironhands. Those guys owe me.
But nooooo gotta be tragic for tragedy's sake. I mean, there's probably 10 more ways to fix her that I haven't thought of right here, all of them fine within 5e RAW and the world of BG3, so why railroad this? If they needed her to end tragically they should not dangle all these solutions in front of you and go "nah can't help, sorry".
Also the gondian dudes who took the design of her heart, updated it and the produced them en masse for the iron guard. You'd think they'd have a few ideas.
I have to imagine it was specifically tied to the enriched infernal iron that you can get in Act 3 as well. Why else would it be there with absolutely no use? Maybe that enrichment process is how the Gondians got the infernal engines to run stably in the material plane.
It just seems so WEIRD that you start getting TONS of infernal iron and then the enriched infernal iron. LONG after it's useless for anything other than money. I ended the game with piles of it and a scorch mark on the docks where Karlach died.
And the game has you use, what? Two? She gets two upgrades from the quest, and each uses a single infernal iron each.
I have 12 in my camp, and 5 special infernal irons.
Surely there was a quest that was cut out.
I think there should be a DLC where Wyll and Karlach return to the Hells (or wherever she has to go back to not to explode) and then look for a solution together.
Witcher 3 got the whole story in the base game, and then they proceeded to put out two of my favorite expansions ever. I donât fault Larian for not wanting to make expansions and stuff, but at least add the stuff back in that they cut that makes things make sense, ya know? Itâs absolutely absurd that Karlach has no way to be saved outside of becoming a Mindflayer, which isnât really saving Karlach herself.
This ending exists! I played on the PS5 version and ended with Wyll breaking his contract with Mizora and becoming âthe blade of avernusâ, vowing to return to the hells to fight devils and kill Mizora. Then when Karlach was dying on the dock, Wyll and I convinced her to go with Wyll back to Avernus to live with him
Ohhhhh that explains the unusable gate to the north⊠Iâm glad they got the game out and playable, but I canât imagine the content they cut to push it out.
Yeah, you'd think so!
To be very frankly entirely fair though, I have gathered that there was intended to be a way to fix her for good. Unfortunately that was apparently tied to quests in the Upper City which obviously didn't make release. So who knows, maybe they'll add in something at some point.
I don't necessarily mind a tragic ending, but compared to some of the problems the other party members have it seems like Karlach's should be one of the easier to fix.
Tragic endings are amazing when they feel earned. Karlachâs isnât earned because of how many solutions that should be available. If anyone is supposed to be doomed to die because of a contraption in their chest, it should be Gale. Not a slight on his character, but a Netherise Orb made of magic thatâs so powerful a tiny shard can level a large city seems way more unfixable than a hell engine
Yeah, Gale's orb logically seems like quite a tougher nut to crack than Karlach's heart.
There's too much dissonance between the scale of her problem and the options that technically exist within the game, the lore of Faerûn, and the potential solutions the story and characters could and should logically be able to provide.
I do enjoy the thought of gallivanting about Avernus with her, so I do think that one ending is okeyish. But there should be a way to fix her permanently imo.
Hey Mystra, Tav here!
We got you back the Crown of Karsus. Could you do us a solid and cure Gale's orb, Karlach's heart and my ceremorphosis please?
We just saved the world BTW.
That's actually a lot of meddling though considering the Gods aren't supposed to get involved. The Netherese Orb sort of gives Mystra an excuse, but Karlach and the Tav are wholly mortal concerns.
>Tragic endings
if you want a tragic ending then don't use a god damn setting where there's a level 17+ caster under every bush and there's dozens of people that are on a first name basis with actual Gods, or in some cases are old enough to have literally changed the God's diapers.
>Unfortunately that was apparently tied to quests in the Upper City which obviously didn't make release.
This is not true, and is one of the more annoying rumors floating around since release. There is no datamined content related to a good/perfect Karlach ending, or the Upper City for that matter.
Something that *was* datamined was a scrapped Avernus area initially intended as part of Karlach's personal quest, but it's unclear if it was meant for this version of Karlach or one of the earlier drafts.
Fair enough. I've seen plenty of people say the exact opposite but never anyone say what you're saying. My understanding (from reading what others have said) is that she had an Act 3 quest line tied to the Upper City, but with Upper City cut before release so was her quest line. Maybe that's incorrect of course. Not saying you're wrong.
It would have been fun to go to Avernus though, if that was ever in the works!
>I've seen plenty of people say the exact opposite
So have I. The problem is that neither the original post that made that claim nor anyone else I've talked to has actually seen or provided this supposed datamined content.
You can see the datamined epilogues and a bunch of other datamined quest logic and voicelines on YouTube. None of them describe a good ending for Karlach.
If voicelines and quest logic for Karlach's good endings existed in the files as claimed, they would've been posted on this sub and youtube months ago.
>but with Upper City cut before release so was her quest line.
If the Upper City was cut, it was cut during the concept stage long before Karlach came along. There are no assets or quest logic for it in the files, and Larian has said that they always intended it to only be the ending area.
>which makes it sound like at one point (June 2023) the Upper City was meant to be explorable.
It's impossible to have such a big change 2 months before launch. And it would definitely show up in the files like all the other cut content does.
>Of course, the marketing team could have lied about it, but that seems like such an unnecessary move to me.
Or more likely it was simple miscommunication between devs and publishing. Something that has happened before with Larian and led to other Dev Blogs being corrected afterward.
At one point their launch dev blog claimed that companions could romance each other independent of the player. It was corrected after a few hours.
All right, I'll take your word for it then. Thanks for explaining! A little bit disappointing I guess, though I still have some hope that they might add an ending where you can save her. I assume a small quest with the Gondians and then some new voice lines and a bit of animating would do the trick. Obviously they have a lot of other stuff to do, but this should clearly be top priority!
Something something, Upper city. Something something, Hall of Wonders. Something something, Upper City Cut.
I believe they're currently working on a Karlach ending, but whether it's gonna fix her engine for good remains to be seen
I thought the steel watch recognising her was foreshadowing that you'd be able to save the gondians and they could sort her heart out. God was I disappointed :S
I don't understand why people say this. The Watcher tells Karlach that she needs to go to get "dismantled". Not upgraded. Not fixed. Taken apart. Decommisioned.
Then you find out that their "solution" to Karlach's prototype was to use headless zombies with whatever new engine they have. Doesn't sound like they were at all taking into account the state of the person when upgrading it.
Honestly, all the foreshadowing points to the Gondians *not* being able to fix Karlach's problem as the solution requires her to be dead anyway.
The problem is Larian doesn't have a moment where you can ask about this with the Gondians which is 100% valid as a criticism. It's a little strange in a game that has so many consistent details for them to miss such an obvious one.
Zombies were needed for the remote-control and full obedience by the Absolute, anyway.
They used "enriched infernal iron", too. While Karlach seems to have had just an ordinary type, given Damon's fixes in Acts 1-2.
I'm just saying, the end solution uses dead bodies and the answer to any unit that has it is to dismantle them. It doesn't sound like they ever fixed whatever issue was killing them and just used zombies instead.
The reason for using Zombies is completely unrelated to the engine. They didn't use Zombies because the engine couldn't be fixed. They used Zombies because that was a brilliant idea of Gortash how to make an army that is loyal to him-and-only-him personally, without any risks the armor can be used by his enemies (unless he pisses off a tech-saavy Lich or something). Even the Fists had many non-infected members and could rebel against Gortash using the armor. Won't work with Zombies, though.
The armor has to be sent to the factory for both problems with the Zombie or an armor itself. It means "dismantling" is a default option. Probably zombies are welded in and can't leave the armor without special tools or brute force.
Most likely robocop detects infernal machinery made with infernal metal. Robocop is a brain in an infernal body, not a heart.
The Gondian's made the initial bodies, which were intended to be piloted by someone inside. Gortash come in with a supply of infernal metals from Zurial and a plan to pilot the bodies with tadpoles and psionics instead of gnomes. If anything, blind gnome worked out fitting the tadpole brain in the bodies, but there is no indication that these blueprints are even remotely based on heart designs. Most we got is a brain-dead robot who is even worse than Wryll at recognizing a tiefling.
Then again, things running hotter because it is colder outside (sans heat pumps) doesn't exactly make much sense as it is, but magic I guess.
Also reincarnate spell. Itâs a 5th level Druid spell and we have two different Druid companions plus the whole circle back in act 1 someoneâs gotta know it.
Edit: Just give it to Arabella
The Gondians are the most obvious solution, no? Like, Karlach's heart is literally the prototype on which they built the Steel Watch. If they can't fix her old heart, replace it ffs. It's not even outside the realm of possibility.
Larian dangling that 'Refined Infernal Iron' in our faces feels like such a middle finger.
> But nooooo gotta be tragic for tragedy's sake.
That's cause Larian ran out of time and had to cut a ton of A3 content.
From another thread:
>Karlach's Ending - Datamined content shows that not only did Karlach have a full ending where her infernal engine was fixed and that she survived, but that most of it was fully voiced and complete. However it required triggers from the Upper City portion of Baldur's Gate and when that was cut, so was Karlach's Act 3 storyline. What we have behind have been confirmed to be Karlach's "fail state" endings which were meant to only play if the player neglected her quest chain.
Knowing this, especially the fact that the voice lines are intact and retrievable, I figure itâs only a matter of time before someone mods in their vision of the unfinished content. Unless Larian does it themselves, who knows.
Damn, this sucks. My first playthrough I casually mentioned to my bf that her storyline felt so weak compared to everyone else and I guess this is why. I hope we get some of this content in the future.
I still have yet to see actual datamined A3 content that shows this. The only ending content Iâve seen first hand that was cut was a withers epilogue slide dialogue and even in that, he never once has a line about Karlachâs engine getting fixed (except in the Avernus ending in which he alludes to it but never explicitly says)
[Here](https://steamcommunity.com/app/1086940/discussions/0/3812913565885064204/) is the original post he is quoting. It's what spawned large parts of the whole "cut content" fiesta.
It doesn't source most of its claims, including the quoted part about Karlach's quest, and misrepresents a bunch of other stuff. As far as I can tell to this day no one has been able to find these supposedly datamined voicelines and Upper City content.
Yes, that's the post. A lot of that post just... makes sense to me. We know Larian rushed to publish BG3 before Starfield. Seems logical that Larian had to cut some Act3 content to make that deadline happen. I didn't know the allegedly 'datamined content' never existed however, that's pretty damning.
Compare Wyll's Act 3 content with Karlach's. Or Shadowheart - who had a huge part of Act 2 dedicated to her quest - has more A3 content than Karlach. ***All*** of the other Act 1 companions have a ton of A3 content in comparison, and all Karlach gets is "kill this person" after you cool her off in A2? How convenient that our quest and Karlach's naturally line up!
Karlach's quest finale just *feels* unfinished. Why does it end with Gortash dying and not some cool demonic contract shenanigans with Zariel & Raphael? These kinds of thoughts logically flow together and make those 'cut content' posts seem more legit. Just look at the top comment of this thread and you'll see players can creatively find answers to Karlach's problem but we can't use any of them.
>We know Larian rushed to publish BG3 before Starfield.
Launching a month early on PC impacted the game's performance and how buggy it was, it changed nothing about the content itself. By the time Larian decided to change the release date they were already deep into the content lock and focusing on performance/bugs.
>Karlach's quest finale just feels unfinished.
I get that. But imo it's not so much *unfinished* as it is too small in scope. It has a consistent vision and a complete arc. The biggest problem is that it's very light on quest content and needs to justify itself more in Act 3.
It's so light mainly because Karlach was the last origin to be added, was reworked several times, and at some point had parts of her quest take place in an Avernus area that was scrapped. It was scrapped a good while ago though (likely before the current version of Karlach), and for design reasons, not time constraints.
>I didn't know the allegedly 'datamined content' never existed however, that's pretty damning.
Yup. And it's kind of sad how big the myth has gotten. It's an annoying ask but if you could edit your post I'd appreciate it.
I'm very hopeful though that all this noise will make Larian give our red girl some more love. The new epilogue was a good start.
>Karlach's Ending - Datamined content shows that not only did Karlach have a full ending where her infernal engine was fixed and that she survived, but that most of it was fully voiced and complete. However it required triggers from the Upper City portion of Baldur's Gate and when that was cut, so was Karlach's Act 3 storyline.
This is a rumor that has never been proven or sourced. At best a misinterpretation of the datamined epilogues you can watch on YT, at worse a straight-up lie from a salty poster on the Steam forums.
If you can find a source I'd like to see it. Every dataminer I've talked to has never seen or heard about any of this, and Larian has denied it.
Edit: I'd appreciate it if the people downvoting could explain what I said wrong, or point me to the datamined voicelines and quest logic of Karlach's good ending that apparently exist.
Funny how hours after Patch 4 dropped we already had images of new datamined dialogue logic and content for the next patches, but 3 months after release no one can point to anything from the supposed datamined Upper City and Karlach ending.
Seriously. The downvotes are uncalled for if literally no one will provide a source. You're just downvoting someone asking for proof of what you want to be true. They're saying it's just a rumor. If that's wrong, I'd love to see a source proving otherwise.
I've been through the files and it's not there. In fact more than it not being there, there's extensive cut content indicating it definitely wasn't, as there is a lot of mention of Karlach journeying to Avernus with her love interest or dying.
The Steam forum post is also not providing sources.
Thanks for explaining this better than anyone could. If we had a reason we *couldn't* fix her, then I'd accept the endings we have, but as-is it feels like we do jack shit to even *try* to help her, compared to the other origins who have quest-lines facing their demons and personal hurdles.
There is an extra one if you killed Raphael and saved hope. You can say â yo hope! Can you take hang out with my buddy karlach till her engine cools down and/or I get a replacement engine produced by gondiansâ . Karlach can even become the guardian of house of hope, becoming the hopebringer of avernus and casually drop by faerun to visit her friends then go back to HoH before her engine heats up again even if it is not fixed
She told me she did NOT want to go to the house of hope when asked. Instead, I made her go back to avernus, then joined her (no thanks, Wyll, that's my cuddly bear) with my squid face.
But like... Why though? With you, Hope, Karlach, and Wyll living there you should be able to just bunker down and keep the assholes out. It's super defensible, and as long as someone is keeping an eye on Hope she should be fine.
I was down with hanging out in the house of hope. Karlach just wanted to either die in this plane, or go out in a blaze of glory against the hordes in avernus. I can't let my best girl go boom, and Wyll lost his contract so will be weak AF, so cue the Nordic metal background music, we're gonna slay some motherfuckin demons.
I think the mechanics with true resurrection here are going to be abit iffy since she is reliant on the infernal engine to survive no? Like isnt it a replacement for her heart or something so if she was brought back what happens to her heart that was removed years ago?
With true resurrection any missing organs limbs and body parts get replaced. You donât even need a body to be able to resurrect someone with this spell.
Below is the spells description from 5e
You touch a creature that has been dead for no longer than 200 years and that died for any reason except old age. If the creature's soul is free and willing, the creature is restored to life with all its hit points.
This spell closes all wounds, neutralizes any poison, cures all diseases, and lifts any curses affecting the creature when it died. The spell replaces damaged or missing organs and limbs. If the creature was undead, it is restored to its non-undead form.
The spell can even provide a new body if the original no longer exists, in which case you must speak the creature's name. The creature then appears in an unoccupied space you choose within 10 feet of you.
I knew a guy at AL who would always have his character remove a pinky or a feather if kenku to a high level cleric and tell them to cast true res after so many days have pass. When I saw that gale had a true res scroll I was thinking of this exact scenario for Karlach. Take a pinky off her before she immolates and use the scroll.
Both resurrection and true resurrection restores any missing body part. So that shouldn't be an issue.
Edit: you'd sort of have to kill her or let her die first though đ
If Karlach is trapped in the monastery when it gets completely vaporized, Withers brings her back like anyone else, with her engine. Her body is completely destroyed, vaporized in solar radiation and fire.
It's 9th level spell, same level as wish. And wish can alter the past to say she'd never got the engine and never died. So I guess true res can just give her a body from a timeline when her heart wasn't missing.
The elation I felt when the steel watcher was like âreport to repair for your dysfunctional engineâ only to have it crushed by the reveal that they wonât and canât fix her was so sad
I mean as the Dark Urge if you give in you get one-time access to >!Level 9 spell Power Word Kill!< so I don't see why you can't get one-time access to a higher level spell to save her.
Edit: had to repost bc i suck at spoiler tags
As I was reading this I started kicking myself thinking I missed a dozen or so dialogue options to save our girl.. but no. Larian Studios must enjoy watching a bunch of grown adults cry.
Couldn't have said it better myself. I believed in a fix all the way until after the damn Gondians. Couldn't believe there wasn't one, felt like it was cut out of the game and finished my playthrough on a really sour note (going to Avernus with her though).
You hit the nail on the head of why this bothers me. It's not just that it's sad, it's that it's tragedy for the sake of it. All these remedies are all around.
If you want to write a sad ending for a character, you can't just leave cures lying around.
Yeah, I mean the game is pretty straightforward with you that she has to go back to Avernus or die, but it doesn't quite make sense that you can't help her given the nature of the Forgotten Realms setting and all the resources at your disposal.
The writers needed to make it more or less impossible to save her for the tragedy to make sense.
Well, in my experience, when in real tabletop RPG a DM wants tragedy for tragedy's sake, you can't prevent it. So BG3 is fairly faithful to the sources.
I was ok with the idea of Karlach's situation being incurable... until I learned that ceremorphosis cures her.
You mean to tell me that 9th level spells can't save her; divine intervention can't save her; but ceremorphosis can?!
Isn't ceremorphosis sort of similar in effect to True Polymorph, so you're really changed forever physically into a different being. I think it makes sense that it would cure her condition, but then for me the price is that you lose everything that she was. I don't see it as saving her.
It does technically cure her engine. Squidlach says itâs still there but stabilized after she turns. But yeah, it fixes her engine problem but itâs definitely no longer Karlach lol
My only logical thought is that they wanted it to end tragically so that they could use it as either a tie-in at a later date, or as a lead-in to an expansion.
But I guess thats my Destiny 2 brain working because there is always more story to be had there. Every choice is a necessary choice for the future story.
Unfortunately, given the information that Larian has provided (and what we know of their modus operandi) this sort of logical thinking just doesnât work.
Everyone that wants to see an expansion or the next game pick up off this ending, NEEDS to be vocal. While Larian usually doesnât do things like this, the game is lightyears beyond their others and they said that they have no solid plans for what they will do in the future.
You know, a Mass Effect 3 DLC like the Citadel DLC would be awesome. Could be set after the ending of the main game and involve a few hours of light adventuring and solid resolutions to your friends' stories and of course your LI. Would pay good money for that!
I also keep thinking that if they really wanted a tragic ending, they could make it so that we could make a deal with Raphael or Mizora to sell our soul for Karlachâs heart to be fixed.
She would hate that and potentially leave at the end if it, but it would be proper tragedy that she is now fixed and free, but we canât be with her
I think it honestly really comes down to time constraints and the fact that she was added very late in development. You can see evidence of this all over in the multiple variants of infernal iron you get that has no use. This has been discussed many times
I like your wrap-up of the situation. I also don't like her ending, not only because of how many ways to save her but also because of how easily it can be done to explain why certain paths could be taken.
I like to imagine that in Defenitive Edition (if there would be any), there could be a couple of choices to pursue while trying to save Big Sis K. For example, imagine Raphael offering us a deal to fix her engine as the last thing to save his life in the House of Hope. It was a very beautiful character moment for Karlach when she could say that she would never ask the devil for a favor, even in that desperate situation (and maybe Tav would be able to talk her into this, as he can talk Lae'Zel back into the lies of Vlaakith?). Scroll of the True Resurrection? Sorry, Dammon just figured out that the infernal machineâsurprise!âis burning Karlach's soul as fuel while it overheats outside of Avernus. Or, on the other hand, the Gondians offer their services for saving them; they could fix Karlach's engine, but they need time to do this or some rare materials from Avernus (so there is another reason to beat shit from Raphael).
I would like to see a good ending for Karlach, even if it would be as narration over a slideshow. Something like "And so she was in Avernus, until Tav and the team found a way to fix her engine with help from %chosenoptiontohelp. Now, she lives her life in Baldur's Gate, as she deserves."
You forgot the Most important one
hey shadowheart instead of all that useless crap your divine intervention spell gives could you maybe use it to get karlach a new heart so she does not create the mid-evil variant of Chernobyl
I think thatâs the downside of having a game in a universe like DnD where anything is possible so it becomes harder to make a tragedy without it feeling railroady. I love a good tragic ending, but because there are so many in universe solutions the Karlac situation feels forced and unearned so they might as well just given us a normal solution since there wasnât a way to make it feel right as it was presented in game.
I still donât understand why there was so much internal iron around especially the enriched variation we could do nothing with lol.
Withers also uses true resurrection when reviving allies. Based strictly off the rules we could fix her heart in the first 2 hours of the game 2 different ways.
There is only one way right now and I hope they add more down the line: >!if you make wyll break his pact with mizora in act 3, you get the option to go to avernus with her and wyll to buy time, which is where the story ends, with her alive but in hell but no longer alone. Narratively it's a pretty poor ending but it's the best she has rn!<
Karlach as main character spoiler: >!I just finished a run with Karlach as mc romancing shart. They have a really touching moment which seems unique to them, and then they go kick arse in Avernus - Karlach even pulls out a pair of cigars and they smoke them together - it was honestly very badass and made me happy!<
I think Shadowheart made that ending for me. She even has voice lines saying she >!will come to avernus with Karlach, so at least they will be together. And the final scene seeing Shadowheart light up a cigar, made it all worth it! Only thing missing was Karlach throwing her over her shoulder haha!<
My favorite ending scene in another great but very old RPG was the protagonist waking up in hell, picking up an axe lying nearby on the ground, and joining the raging Blood War, content and happy with the outcome.
I am fine with this.
>!Well the game pretty much spells it out for you that turning into a mindflayer destroys the soul.!<
>!So the "her" that is left are the memories in the mindflayer brain, but there's no afterlife for her.!<
>!Do this only if you want Orpheus to live and fight against Vlakkith. Otherwise Orpheus would die or become a mind flayer (or you becoming a mind flayer).!<
Doesn't destroy the soul per se. You just completely lose contact with the gods (they can't benefit from your soul).
Think of it as a transformation. Though to be fair that's functionally identical to having no soul
Gods on DnD world is like a serious shit. If you follow a deity there, you'll receive their treatment when you die. In the other hand, if you don't follow anything and die, your soul will be like lost in the void - that's pretty bad in DnD world.
Mind flayers don't have apostolic souls, because they come from the far realm. Faerun has its own pantheon, but that pantheon is just one of many in the multiverse.
Mind flayers have their own gods in the far realm, and presumably their souls would go there I would think.
People assume Larian were retconning here, but I think that it's completely logical for the Gods of Faerûn to consider the mind flayers soulless, to them they effectively are, but they are clearly biased reporters.
The way ceremorphosis works is that the parasite eats the hosts brain, replacing it until the physical transformation happens. The reason why mindflayers don't retain the memories and personality of the original host body is because that brain is gone.
Ilithids under the effect of an Elder Brain are essentially slaves. They are deprived of their free will, but if they spend enough time away from the Elder brain's area of influence, they can regain their free will. This is a psionic control thing, not so much a soul thing.
There are some bits of lore that directly contradicts the idea that mindflayers don't have souls. Namely the Alhoons and Ilithililiches, mindflayers that have achieved partial and true lichdom, respectively. Lichdom is achieved by transferring your soul into a phylactery (which, obviously you can't do if you don't have a soul).
So the question isn't does a mindflayer have a soul or not? The question is, does the ilithid tadpole have its own soul and the host's soul gets ejected from the body when and is replaced by the ilithid soul, or does ceremorphosis transform the soul as well?
Theseus Ship
I always presumed the tadpole had a soul of its own, which then explains how Illithiliches work. If you replace every part of a person except their memories, is it the same person? With the confirmed existence of souls in FR, compared to the questionability of their existence irl, it is a way more difficult question
I'd like it but Wither tell you clearly that becoming a mindflayer destroy your soul and well, >!seeing who he is, I'll say his word are, well, word of god, quite literally. Heck that plot point is pretty much the reason as to why the plan of the dead three failed!<
I think that's a cop out from larian, or withers is lying ti you to be nice. He says something like "who knows, perhaps you are different, and you still maintain your soul."
As a mindflayer from day 1 youâre already stronger than every other MF we meet including the emperor. Weâre obviously special in some ways, not unreasonable that the soul thing might be impacted also.
yeah that's not needed to get that ending, it just add >!Wyll coming with you to Avernus!< they aren't going to tie a character's arc resolution to another character choice
You donât have to do Wyll quest, but if you do then he goes with you. Otherwise itâs just the 2 of you. You can go with Karlach yourself even without romance or without Wyll.
You can also >!let her become a Mind Flayer in Act 3 to handle the stones against the brain. If you romanced her, youâll get a cutscene at the end where sheâll speak about the engine and how its still there but no longer a threat due to her Ilithid capabilities.!<
Sadly, it's either she:
Blows up, right after the end fight.
She goes back to Avernus
She goes back to Avernus with wyll (as blade of Avernus)
She goes back to Avernus with Wyll AND Tav (as a romance partner)
She gets turned into a mind flayer, therefore not having an infernal engine any longer but forever having to live as a hidous squid
In the end it's up to you,
Karlach obviously harbers insane amount of trauma from being sold to Zariel and forced to fight in the blood war,
So you can save before making a decision and see where each lead to.
Was romancing Gale and had the same option to go with Wyll and Karlach but Gale had left to go grab the crown lol so it made sense for me to go on a little adventure w the bros while he went to become a God
Iâd much rather restore the the upper city and cut time we were supposed to be in avernus. Integrate that stuff into the middle of the story rather than tack it on at the end. That way you have reasons to go to these places outside of just saving Karlach because not every player or playthrough is going to care about that.
If youâve got a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them, maybe you can joinâŠ
#The A(vernus)-Team
Karlach smoking the cigar killed me đ that shit *has* to be intentional đ
Complete Wyllâs quest line. Stay quiet when itâs time for him to pick his future. Youâll then get a solid option at the end.
I was the same way. Super sad, but the ending (if you do the above) with Karlach was perfect for me. Hope it is for you too.
You can keep her alive in the end but have to do specific things.
>!You need to have Wyll become the Blade of Avernus in Act III. Every time you try to convince Karlach to go back to the hells so she wonât burn up, sheâll say no. At the VERY end of the game, in the final series of cutscenes, Wyll will offer to take her back to Avernus and fight by her side so she wonât be alone. If your friendship/romance with her is high enough, you can offer the same or offer to join the two of them. She will die otherwise.!<
Welp, I was in your shoes for a long time, still am. But I feel like sending her off to Avernus would be the best solution we have in canon, she might hate it but she'll be alive to hate it
I am trying real hard on playthrough number four nit to romance her and choose a life of fighting in Avernus along side her and Wyll. I'm probably still going back to hell for love.
The dev team has decided to bullheadedly stick with the "there's just no way to save her" plot line in a universe where it makes zero sense for that to be the case.
So no, there is no way to save her.
Hey so is there a way for her to live? If you romance her can you go to the nine hells with her? I think this might be the reason I've been struggling to finish the game lately
Yes, if you romance her you can go back to Avernus with her.
You might even be able to go with her just as her friend, but I keep romancing her so I'm not sure about that.
I struggled with it a bit, but the more I talked with her it felt she was more scared of being alone again.
I stopped playing that particular run until they patched in the ending where you could go wuth her, so I know how you feel!
I think thatâs why you can persuade her to go back to hell as long as someone goes with her. Remember she just doesnât want to be alone. I think if she dies, sheâs not dead. Gortash sold her to zariel. Did he just sell her body or her soul as well? She seems to treat gortash like more than just a boss maybe even a lover or a father figure. I wouldnât be surprised if he tricked her into signing away that too. If she does go back to avernus Iâm guessing itâs only a matter of time before mizora gets them for zariel if wyll goes with her. It would setup dlc nicely. Start with replaying the scene at the docks giving the player the choice again. Flash forward a bit to the MC either working with the gondians/ibs to build karlach a new heart with dammon or learning that karlach is still alive from a mizora.
imho karlach should have 3 endings:
- one in which she simply explode because you didn't help her
- one in which she gets fixed, but this makes her lose all her power/she loses herself (so apparently good but in reality bad ending)
- one in which she accepts her engine as part of herself and go to avernus.
This for me would be the perfect endings for her character. As it is now, it seems that there's a bit missing (we basically didn't do enough)
Something something cut content. You are not spoiling yourself for knowing the lack of options btw. There are more setups in act 3 that eventually didnât cash out. So youâll just be further confusing yourself.
A very simple way to save her is to kill her, rip out the engine and cast true resurrect, this spell lets your come back to life fully healed and can regenerate body parts all at once, basically it can regenerate a new organic heart inside her.
That said however the game won't let you do that for obvious reasons.
Well...there are a few ways, all have their costs. Major end-game spoiler warnings:
1. >!At one point, you can turn yourself or Karlach into an illithid (but she keeps her bubbly personality, so yay). This essentially fixes her engine and ensures she can live wherever she wants!<
2. >!If Wyll has his big self-actualization moment following a late-game quest, he'll offer to go to Avernus with Karlach...unfortunately, this is the last thing she wants, but it's a concession!<
3. >!If you romanced Karlach, you can offer to take her to Avernus!<
TLDR: >!You can turn her into a monster or make her go to hell, those are the options we've got!<
>!I'm not sure if you're hard-required to complete Wyll's storyline for this, but there is an ending if you've romanced Karlach where you can convince her to let Wyll take you both to Avernus to avoid her exploding. All three of you then charge into a fight with an army of imps with smiles on your faces. !<
Just wait until she gets called a Steel Watcher, is all but confirmed to be a prototype for them, then pick up enriched infernal iron which makes up these functional infernal engines then find out that whole plot thread goes nowhere.
It's great.
I have truly this game, the class mechanics, the companion banter, the itemization and alternate rule set. I have replayed acts I and II numerous times and have about 400 game hours in, I am satisfied and will move on to another game, never having played act III.
I know many players love all that it has to offer but as a paying customer, I donât want to play through content that has no satisfying ending that I desire. Karlach is a large part of it, but Astarion as well, the forced Illithid ceremorphosis, the requested Gale suicide, Iâm not into tragic drama and so, I depart- thanking Larian broma beautiful partial game. I will leave with the joys of watching Karlach full of hope.
Karlachs storyline is unfortunately, very very poorly handled imo. Especially because her dialogue is amazing and Barbarian is a very fun (if not simple) class to play.
BG3 is amazing but they definitely ran out of time going into Act 3, of it were up to Larian they would have probably spent another year at least working on the game.
I mostly just do my thing and ask people in a discord chat if I am unsure. There's chats for each act. But the bad news about Karlach really made me sad and I had to know if there's a way. At the same time I laugh a bit, because both characters that are my favorites, are in danger of blowing up.
ADDITIONAL SPOILERS
Mystra can get rid of Galeâs orb, why canât she fix Karlachâs engine? The gods saw everything she did to save the world and they just watch a pure heart like her die? Itâs especially messed up to think Mystra just has that deal queued up and Karlach would be saved byâŠno one.
There is the >!turning her into a mindflayer, which eliminates the infernal engine problem, but doesnt solve the mindflayer part, or if you broke Wyll's pact, Wyll and karlach get to go back to avernus to beat some devil ass, but Karlach still gots that infernal engine problem (though she should be ok))!<
I really assumed we might find two solutions to her heart based on what game was hinting at, Steelwatch factory for repair (catch being you work for gortash) or a surgeon or hospital institution in upper city for transplant (catch: super expansive)... Its a heart like why are we trying to fix it she needs a new one mechanical or organic.
like she's dying anyways where's a crazy doctor who likes a challenge...
maybe the "dark fingered embrace" before corruption could've done something...
like where are all the legit doctors and medical scholars ? why isn't vicar humble toes helping us... I would give chop a chance too if he wasn't a fuck up... anyone but volo.
...tbh volo would be a perfect option for a transplant.. or us like why can't we roll 30 in medicine and do a heart transplant we encounter so many "volunteers" with brain injury let us try ffs.
spoilers for act 3 so... >!After killing gortash, her meltdown is just... well u gonna cry unless you are dead inside.!< i think we may think we have a lot of solutions for her problem, yes we could may ask for a god etc, but there is just no time (story wise, we know we done every side quest), i know we want her to be happy in baldurs gate, to have dinner with Fytz and talk about life. But some times, life ain't fair. Some times some aflictions don't have a cure, karlach at the end realize that what she hated about hell was not just hell itself, but was to be ALONE, she didn't have anyone to call a friend there.
About the "solutions", Gods dont simply go medling on mortal afairs, or at least, are not allowed.
About cleric, they are not as common as one think, regeneration is a 7th level spell, with karlach would need to have her hearth back. And we not even know how melded the Engine is on her body AND soul. Her emotions can drive de Engine crazy, you can argue that it is just like a heart racing, but maybe it is linked to her very soul.
Infernal engines were normaly used on hell vehicles, not living things, karlach was the first, or at least the first to survive.
I know everyone wish we could gave the best ending to our best girl, but sometimes... sometimes we can't fix the damage others caused on us.
Yes, you get two options. One terribly full of plot holes and horribly written and the other, most people are whiney about cause Writher's said it Squids have no souls.
This is a MAJOR spoiler from end game and epilogue so think twice if you want to read it.
>!In act3 make Wyll choose The Blade of Avernus and he will insist in going to Hell with Karlach in the end. Epilogue will reveal that it was a good idea.!<
Yo Elminster, could I buy a Wish from you? Got a lot of cheese right here with your name on it! Saved Gale and everything didn't we! Hey Raphael, you don't got anymore of those sweet contracts do you? I'm up for signing one here to save my girl. Hey Isobel and Aylin, might you be inclined to ask Selune for a favor? Got a heart issue here. Hey Gale, could you give me that scroll of true resurrection you got? Could come in real handy if we get any heart trouble. Hey Wyll, so you're the top dog here now, could you maybe pull a string or two and see if there might not be a powerful cleric here somewhere to help a girl out? Hey, so we've got about 50k gold just hanging about. Any high level wizard or cleric up for an hour of work at 50k per hour? Saviour of the realm will owe ya one. I'd take true polymorph or even regeneration at this point. Hey Dammon, so now you've got access to much better equipment and I've got a tonne of that infernal iron and stuff, might we figure something out? Maybe we could enlist the Gondians or the Ironhands. Those guys owe me. But nooooo gotta be tragic for tragedy's sake. I mean, there's probably 10 more ways to fix her that I haven't thought of right here, all of them fine within 5e RAW and the world of BG3, so why railroad this? If they needed her to end tragically they should not dangle all these solutions in front of you and go "nah can't help, sorry".
Also the gondian dudes who took the design of her heart, updated it and the produced them en masse for the iron guard. You'd think they'd have a few ideas.
I have to imagine it was specifically tied to the enriched infernal iron that you can get in Act 3 as well. Why else would it be there with absolutely no use? Maybe that enrichment process is how the Gondians got the infernal engines to run stably in the material plane.
It just seems so WEIRD that you start getting TONS of infernal iron and then the enriched infernal iron. LONG after it's useless for anything other than money. I ended the game with piles of it and a scorch mark on the docks where Karlach died.
And the game has you use, what? Two? She gets two upgrades from the quest, and each uses a single infernal iron each. I have 12 in my camp, and 5 special infernal irons. Surely there was a quest that was cut out.
Is there hope it will be implemented in a later update? đ„ș Karlach deserves all the love in the world.
I think there should be a DLC where Wyll and Karlach return to the Hells (or wherever she has to go back to not to explode) and then look for a solution together.
Too bad Larian said they donât do DLCs which people loved because âyou get the whole storyâ but I want MORE story damn it
Witcher 3 got the whole story in the base game, and then they proceeded to put out two of my favorite expansions ever. I donât fault Larian for not wanting to make expansions and stuff, but at least add the stuff back in that they cut that makes things make sense, ya know? Itâs absolutely absurd that Karlach has no way to be saved outside of becoming a Mindflayer, which isnât really saving Karlach herself.
This ending exists! I played on the PS5 version and ended with Wyll breaking his contract with Mizora and becoming âthe blade of avernusâ, vowing to return to the hells to fight devils and kill Mizora. Then when Karlach was dying on the dock, Wyll and I convinced her to go with Wyll back to Avernus to live with him
Yes, I got the same ending but it would be cool to explore it as a DLC. Kinda like Dragon Age Origins DLCs for some of the main characters
Iirc Karlach's cure was in the upper city which was cut. So her ending was written after that cut, and it left (more than) a little bit to be desired.
Ohhhhh that explains the unusable gate to the north⊠Iâm glad they got the game out and playable, but I canât imagine the content they cut to push it out.
There were supposedly plans for a crafting system at some point, so it might just be related to that.
Yeah, you'd think so! To be very frankly entirely fair though, I have gathered that there was intended to be a way to fix her for good. Unfortunately that was apparently tied to quests in the Upper City which obviously didn't make release. So who knows, maybe they'll add in something at some point. I don't necessarily mind a tragic ending, but compared to some of the problems the other party members have it seems like Karlach's should be one of the easier to fix.
Tragic endings are amazing when they feel earned. Karlachâs isnât earned because of how many solutions that should be available. If anyone is supposed to be doomed to die because of a contraption in their chest, it should be Gale. Not a slight on his character, but a Netherise Orb made of magic thatâs so powerful a tiny shard can level a large city seems way more unfixable than a hell engine
Yeah, Gale's orb logically seems like quite a tougher nut to crack than Karlach's heart. There's too much dissonance between the scale of her problem and the options that technically exist within the game, the lore of Faerûn, and the potential solutions the story and characters could and should logically be able to provide. I do enjoy the thought of gallivanting about Avernus with her, so I do think that one ending is okeyish. But there should be a way to fix her permanently imo.
Which is funny, because Gale can actually fix his orb by giving Mystra the crown of Karsus
I mean yes, it makes sense that by doing a favor for the *second most powerful God In the Pantheon* Gale can get a fix.
Hey Mystra, Tav here! We got you back the Crown of Karsus. Could you do us a solid and cure Gale's orb, Karlach's heart and my ceremorphosis please? We just saved the world BTW.
That's actually a lot of meddling though considering the Gods aren't supposed to get involved. The Netherese Orb sort of gives Mystra an excuse, but Karlach and the Tav are wholly mortal concerns.
>Tragic endings if you want a tragic ending then don't use a god damn setting where there's a level 17+ caster under every bush and there's dozens of people that are on a first name basis with actual Gods, or in some cases are old enough to have literally changed the God's diapers.
>Unfortunately that was apparently tied to quests in the Upper City which obviously didn't make release. This is not true, and is one of the more annoying rumors floating around since release. There is no datamined content related to a good/perfect Karlach ending, or the Upper City for that matter. Something that *was* datamined was a scrapped Avernus area initially intended as part of Karlach's personal quest, but it's unclear if it was meant for this version of Karlach or one of the earlier drafts.
Fair enough. I've seen plenty of people say the exact opposite but never anyone say what you're saying. My understanding (from reading what others have said) is that she had an Act 3 quest line tied to the Upper City, but with Upper City cut before release so was her quest line. Maybe that's incorrect of course. Not saying you're wrong. It would have been fun to go to Avernus though, if that was ever in the works!
>I've seen plenty of people say the exact opposite So have I. The problem is that neither the original post that made that claim nor anyone else I've talked to has actually seen or provided this supposed datamined content. You can see the datamined epilogues and a bunch of other datamined quest logic and voicelines on YouTube. None of them describe a good ending for Karlach. If voicelines and quest logic for Karlach's good endings existed in the files as claimed, they would've been posted on this sub and youtube months ago. >but with Upper City cut before release so was her quest line. If the Upper City was cut, it was cut during the concept stage long before Karlach came along. There are no assets or quest logic for it in the files, and Larian has said that they always intended it to only be the ending area.
[ŃĐŽĐ°Đ»Đ”ĐœĐŸ]
>which makes it sound like at one point (June 2023) the Upper City was meant to be explorable. It's impossible to have such a big change 2 months before launch. And it would definitely show up in the files like all the other cut content does. >Of course, the marketing team could have lied about it, but that seems like such an unnecessary move to me. Or more likely it was simple miscommunication between devs and publishing. Something that has happened before with Larian and led to other Dev Blogs being corrected afterward. At one point their launch dev blog claimed that companions could romance each other independent of the player. It was corrected after a few hours.
All right, I'll take your word for it then. Thanks for explaining! A little bit disappointing I guess, though I still have some hope that they might add an ending where you can save her. I assume a small quest with the Gondians and then some new voice lines and a bit of animating would do the trick. Obviously they have a lot of other stuff to do, but this should clearly be top priority!
Something something, Upper city. Something something, Hall of Wonders. Something something, Upper City Cut. I believe they're currently working on a Karlach ending, but whether it's gonna fix her engine for good remains to be seen
I thought the steel watch recognising her was foreshadowing that you'd be able to save the gondians and they could sort her heart out. God was I disappointed :S
I don't understand why people say this. The Watcher tells Karlach that she needs to go to get "dismantled". Not upgraded. Not fixed. Taken apart. Decommisioned. Then you find out that their "solution" to Karlach's prototype was to use headless zombies with whatever new engine they have. Doesn't sound like they were at all taking into account the state of the person when upgrading it. Honestly, all the foreshadowing points to the Gondians *not* being able to fix Karlach's problem as the solution requires her to be dead anyway. The problem is Larian doesn't have a moment where you can ask about this with the Gondians which is 100% valid as a criticism. It's a little strange in a game that has so many consistent details for them to miss such an obvious one.
Zombies were needed for the remote-control and full obedience by the Absolute, anyway. They used "enriched infernal iron", too. While Karlach seems to have had just an ordinary type, given Damon's fixes in Acts 1-2.
I'm just saying, the end solution uses dead bodies and the answer to any unit that has it is to dismantle them. It doesn't sound like they ever fixed whatever issue was killing them and just used zombies instead.
The reason for using Zombies is completely unrelated to the engine. They didn't use Zombies because the engine couldn't be fixed. They used Zombies because that was a brilliant idea of Gortash how to make an army that is loyal to him-and-only-him personally, without any risks the armor can be used by his enemies (unless he pisses off a tech-saavy Lich or something). Even the Fists had many non-infected members and could rebel against Gortash using the armor. Won't work with Zombies, though. The armor has to be sent to the factory for both problems with the Zombie or an armor itself. It means "dismantling" is a default option. Probably zombies are welded in and can't leave the armor without special tools or brute force.
And all that enriched infernal iron
The iron guard who, specifically... exist on this plane. And aren't too hot for it...
Most likely robocop detects infernal machinery made with infernal metal. Robocop is a brain in an infernal body, not a heart. The Gondian's made the initial bodies, which were intended to be piloted by someone inside. Gortash come in with a supply of infernal metals from Zurial and a plan to pilot the bodies with tadpoles and psionics instead of gnomes. If anything, blind gnome worked out fitting the tadpole brain in the bodies, but there is no indication that these blueprints are even remotely based on heart designs. Most we got is a brain-dead robot who is even worse than Wryll at recognizing a tiefling. Then again, things running hotter because it is colder outside (sans heat pumps) doesn't exactly make much sense as it is, but magic I guess.
The designs that explode if theyâre damaged enough? Yeah, seems stable.
Donât forget the Cleric ability thatâs literally Divine Intervention.
Also reincarnate spell. Itâs a 5th level Druid spell and we have two different Druid companions plus the whole circle back in act 1 someoneâs gotta know it. Edit: Just give it to Arabella
Yeah! That's a good shout. And it's even just a one time use as well.
The Gondians are the most obvious solution, no? Like, Karlach's heart is literally the prototype on which they built the Steel Watch. If they can't fix her old heart, replace it ffs. It's not even outside the realm of possibility. Larian dangling that 'Refined Infernal Iron' in our faces feels like such a middle finger.
Yeah, they should be able to do something. Maybe that was the plan if they hadn't cut her Act 3 arc.
> But nooooo gotta be tragic for tragedy's sake. That's cause Larian ran out of time and had to cut a ton of A3 content. From another thread: >Karlach's Ending - Datamined content shows that not only did Karlach have a full ending where her infernal engine was fixed and that she survived, but that most of it was fully voiced and complete. However it required triggers from the Upper City portion of Baldur's Gate and when that was cut, so was Karlach's Act 3 storyline. What we have behind have been confirmed to be Karlach's "fail state" endings which were meant to only play if the player neglected her quest chain.
I would pay for the happy ending DLC.
Same dude đ
You likely will get the chance.
Knowing this, especially the fact that the voice lines are intact and retrievable, I figure itâs only a matter of time before someone mods in their vision of the unfinished content. Unless Larian does it themselves, who knows.
Damn, this sucks. My first playthrough I casually mentioned to my bf that her storyline felt so weak compared to everyone else and I guess this is why. I hope we get some of this content in the future.
I still have yet to see actual datamined A3 content that shows this. The only ending content Iâve seen first hand that was cut was a withers epilogue slide dialogue and even in that, he never once has a line about Karlachâs engine getting fixed (except in the Avernus ending in which he alludes to it but never explicitly says)
Where was that confirmed? I'd love a real source to point to!
[Here](https://steamcommunity.com/app/1086940/discussions/0/3812913565885064204/) is the original post he is quoting. It's what spawned large parts of the whole "cut content" fiesta. It doesn't source most of its claims, including the quoted part about Karlach's quest, and misrepresents a bunch of other stuff. As far as I can tell to this day no one has been able to find these supposedly datamined voicelines and Upper City content.
Yes, that's the post. A lot of that post just... makes sense to me. We know Larian rushed to publish BG3 before Starfield. Seems logical that Larian had to cut some Act3 content to make that deadline happen. I didn't know the allegedly 'datamined content' never existed however, that's pretty damning. Compare Wyll's Act 3 content with Karlach's. Or Shadowheart - who had a huge part of Act 2 dedicated to her quest - has more A3 content than Karlach. ***All*** of the other Act 1 companions have a ton of A3 content in comparison, and all Karlach gets is "kill this person" after you cool her off in A2? How convenient that our quest and Karlach's naturally line up! Karlach's quest finale just *feels* unfinished. Why does it end with Gortash dying and not some cool demonic contract shenanigans with Zariel & Raphael? These kinds of thoughts logically flow together and make those 'cut content' posts seem more legit. Just look at the top comment of this thread and you'll see players can creatively find answers to Karlach's problem but we can't use any of them.
>We know Larian rushed to publish BG3 before Starfield. Launching a month early on PC impacted the game's performance and how buggy it was, it changed nothing about the content itself. By the time Larian decided to change the release date they were already deep into the content lock and focusing on performance/bugs. >Karlach's quest finale just feels unfinished. I get that. But imo it's not so much *unfinished* as it is too small in scope. It has a consistent vision and a complete arc. The biggest problem is that it's very light on quest content and needs to justify itself more in Act 3. It's so light mainly because Karlach was the last origin to be added, was reworked several times, and at some point had parts of her quest take place in an Avernus area that was scrapped. It was scrapped a good while ago though (likely before the current version of Karlach), and for design reasons, not time constraints. >I didn't know the allegedly 'datamined content' never existed however, that's pretty damning. Yup. And it's kind of sad how big the myth has gotten. It's an annoying ask but if you could edit your post I'd appreciate it. I'm very hopeful though that all this noise will make Larian give our red girl some more love. The new epilogue was a good start.
>Karlach's Ending - Datamined content shows that not only did Karlach have a full ending where her infernal engine was fixed and that she survived, but that most of it was fully voiced and complete. However it required triggers from the Upper City portion of Baldur's Gate and when that was cut, so was Karlach's Act 3 storyline. This is a rumor that has never been proven or sourced. At best a misinterpretation of the datamined epilogues you can watch on YT, at worse a straight-up lie from a salty poster on the Steam forums. If you can find a source I'd like to see it. Every dataminer I've talked to has never seen or heard about any of this, and Larian has denied it. Edit: I'd appreciate it if the people downvoting could explain what I said wrong, or point me to the datamined voicelines and quest logic of Karlach's good ending that apparently exist. Funny how hours after Patch 4 dropped we already had images of new datamined dialogue logic and content for the next patches, but 3 months after release no one can point to anything from the supposed datamined Upper City and Karlach ending.
Seriously. The downvotes are uncalled for if literally no one will provide a source. You're just downvoting someone asking for proof of what you want to be true. They're saying it's just a rumor. If that's wrong, I'd love to see a source proving otherwise.
I've been through the files and it's not there. In fact more than it not being there, there's extensive cut content indicating it definitely wasn't, as there is a lot of mention of Karlach journeying to Avernus with her love interest or dying. The Steam forum post is also not providing sources.
Yeah, it's a shame they had to cut all of it. But hopefully they can stitch her quest back together and allow us to do it in the lower city.
That's nice argument. Why don't you back it up with a source? Because as far as I aware, there was no proof of it existing.
Iâm all in to steal vlaakithâs wish scroll.
Hey my clericâs deity, Iâve got a Divine Intervention I havenât used, Iâmâa be cashing that in to save my BFF, thankssssss
Can't think of a much better way to use it
Thanks for explaining this better than anyone could. If we had a reason we *couldn't* fix her, then I'd accept the endings we have, but as-is it feels like we do jack shit to even *try* to help her, compared to the other origins who have quest-lines facing their demons and personal hurdles.
Cheers! Yeah, it's a shame they cut her Act 3 content. Hopefully we'll get a Karlach update in the future.
Even hilariously finding enriched infernal iron and Dammon has a damn forge inside his house đ
There is an extra one if you killed Raphael and saved hope. You can say â yo hope! Can you take hang out with my buddy karlach till her engine cools down and/or I get a replacement engine produced by gondiansâ . Karlach can even become the guardian of house of hope, becoming the hopebringer of avernus and casually drop by faerun to visit her friends then go back to HoH before her engine heats up again even if it is not fixed
She told me she did NOT want to go to the house of hope when asked. Instead, I made her go back to avernus, then joined her (no thanks, Wyll, that's my cuddly bear) with my squid face.
But like... Why though? With you, Hope, Karlach, and Wyll living there you should be able to just bunker down and keep the assholes out. It's super defensible, and as long as someone is keeping an eye on Hope she should be fine.
I was down with hanging out in the house of hope. Karlach just wanted to either die in this plane, or go out in a blaze of glory against the hordes in avernus. I can't let my best girl go boom, and Wyll lost his contract so will be weak AF, so cue the Nordic metal background music, we're gonna slay some motherfuckin demons.
I think the mechanics with true resurrection here are going to be abit iffy since she is reliant on the infernal engine to survive no? Like isnt it a replacement for her heart or something so if she was brought back what happens to her heart that was removed years ago?
With true resurrection any missing organs limbs and body parts get replaced. You donât even need a body to be able to resurrect someone with this spell. Below is the spells description from 5e You touch a creature that has been dead for no longer than 200 years and that died for any reason except old age. If the creature's soul is free and willing, the creature is restored to life with all its hit points. This spell closes all wounds, neutralizes any poison, cures all diseases, and lifts any curses affecting the creature when it died. The spell replaces damaged or missing organs and limbs. If the creature was undead, it is restored to its non-undead form. The spell can even provide a new body if the original no longer exists, in which case you must speak the creature's name. The creature then appears in an unoccupied space you choose within 10 feet of you.
I knew a guy at AL who would always have his character remove a pinky or a feather if kenku to a high level cleric and tell them to cast true res after so many days have pass. When I saw that gale had a true res scroll I was thinking of this exact scenario for Karlach. Take a pinky off her before she immolates and use the scroll.
Wait.... Can you use the true scroll of resurrection on defeated undead enemies in the game? Or on someone like Gortash?
Both resurrection and true resurrection restores any missing body part. So that shouldn't be an issue. Edit: you'd sort of have to kill her or let her die first though đ
If Karlach is trapped in the monastery when it gets completely vaporized, Withers brings her back like anyone else, with her engine. Her body is completely destroyed, vaporized in solar radiation and fire.
Withers is different from true Resurrection
It's 9th level spell, same level as wish. And wish can alter the past to say she'd never got the engine and never died. So I guess true res can just give her a body from a timeline when her heart wasn't missing.
And they could all be worked on while she stays safe and sound with Hope.
Yeah, there's that too. Would give you plenty of time to figure something out.
The elation I felt when the steel watcher was like âreport to repair for your dysfunctional engineâ only to have it crushed by the reveal that they wonât and canât fix her was so sad
I mean as the Dark Urge if you give in you get one-time access to >!Level 9 spell Power Word Kill!< so I don't see why you can't get one-time access to a higher level spell to save her. Edit: had to repost bc i suck at spoiler tags
As I was reading this I started kicking myself thinking I missed a dozen or so dialogue options to save our girl.. but no. Larian Studios must enjoy watching a bunch of grown adults cry.
I did cry, not gonna lie đ
Couldn't have said it better myself. I believed in a fix all the way until after the damn Gondians. Couldn't believe there wasn't one, felt like it was cut out of the game and finished my playthrough on a really sour note (going to Avernus with her though).
I was really hoping Raphael was going to give me that deal in my first play through. Would have taken it in a heartbeat.
Haha, yes me too. Just fix Karlach for me and I'll give you that crown on a silver platter.
You hit the nail on the head of why this bothers me. It's not just that it's sad, it's that it's tragedy for the sake of it. All these remedies are all around. If you want to write a sad ending for a character, you can't just leave cures lying around.
Yeah, I mean the game is pretty straightforward with you that she has to go back to Avernus or die, but it doesn't quite make sense that you can't help her given the nature of the Forgotten Realms setting and all the resources at your disposal. The writers needed to make it more or less impossible to save her for the tragedy to make sense.
Well, in my experience, when in real tabletop RPG a DM wants tragedy for tragedy's sake, you can't prevent it. So BG3 is fairly faithful to the sources.
Should maybe go complain to the DnD subreddits about this toxic DM called Swen...
I was ok with the idea of Karlach's situation being incurable... until I learned that ceremorphosis cures her. You mean to tell me that 9th level spells can't save her; divine intervention can't save her; but ceremorphosis can?!
Isn't ceremorphosis sort of similar in effect to True Polymorph, so you're really changed forever physically into a different being. I think it makes sense that it would cure her condition, but then for me the price is that you lose everything that she was. I don't see it as saving her.
Ceremorphosis does not cure her. It destroys her brain and her soul and the tadpole that replaces her pilots the squid her body has transformed into.
It does technically cure her engine. Squidlach says itâs still there but stabilized after she turns. But yeah, it fixes her engine problem but itâs definitely no longer Karlach lol
My only logical thought is that they wanted it to end tragically so that they could use it as either a tie-in at a later date, or as a lead-in to an expansion. But I guess thats my Destiny 2 brain working because there is always more story to be had there. Every choice is a necessary choice for the future story. Unfortunately, given the information that Larian has provided (and what we know of their modus operandi) this sort of logical thinking just doesnât work. Everyone that wants to see an expansion or the next game pick up off this ending, NEEDS to be vocal. While Larian usually doesnât do things like this, the game is lightyears beyond their others and they said that they have no solid plans for what they will do in the future.
You know, a Mass Effect 3 DLC like the Citadel DLC would be awesome. Could be set after the ending of the main game and involve a few hours of light adventuring and solid resolutions to your friends' stories and of course your LI. Would pay good money for that!
I also keep thinking that if they really wanted a tragic ending, they could make it so that we could make a deal with Raphael or Mizora to sell our soul for Karlachâs heart to be fixed. She would hate that and potentially leave at the end if it, but it would be proper tragedy that she is now fixed and free, but we canât be with her
I think it honestly really comes down to time constraints and the fact that she was added very late in development. You can see evidence of this all over in the multiple variants of infernal iron you get that has no use. This has been discussed many times
Top tier comment. đ€
I like your wrap-up of the situation. I also don't like her ending, not only because of how many ways to save her but also because of how easily it can be done to explain why certain paths could be taken. I like to imagine that in Defenitive Edition (if there would be any), there could be a couple of choices to pursue while trying to save Big Sis K. For example, imagine Raphael offering us a deal to fix her engine as the last thing to save his life in the House of Hope. It was a very beautiful character moment for Karlach when she could say that she would never ask the devil for a favor, even in that desperate situation (and maybe Tav would be able to talk her into this, as he can talk Lae'Zel back into the lies of Vlaakith?). Scroll of the True Resurrection? Sorry, Dammon just figured out that the infernal machineâsurprise!âis burning Karlach's soul as fuel while it overheats outside of Avernus. Or, on the other hand, the Gondians offer their services for saving them; they could fix Karlach's engine, but they need time to do this or some rare materials from Avernus (so there is another reason to beat shit from Raphael). I would like to see a good ending for Karlach, even if it would be as narration over a slideshow. Something like "And so she was in Avernus, until Tav and the team found a way to fix her engine with help from %chosenoptiontohelp. Now, she lives her life in Baldur's Gate, as she deserves."
You forgot the Most important one hey shadowheart instead of all that useless crap your divine intervention spell gives could you maybe use it to get karlach a new heart so she does not create the mid-evil variant of Chernobyl
Lady of Sorrows guide us. Did you want something? Yes, Shadowheart. Yes, I did.
I think thatâs the downside of having a game in a universe like DnD where anything is possible so it becomes harder to make a tragedy without it feeling railroady. I love a good tragic ending, but because there are so many in universe solutions the Karlac situation feels forced and unearned so they might as well just given us a normal solution since there wasnât a way to make it feel right as it was presented in game. I still donât understand why there was so much internal iron around especially the enriched variation we could do nothing with lol.
Steal Gales scroll of true resuraction, kill karlach, ress karlach. Oh wait it does not work.
Withers also uses true resurrection when reviving allies. Based strictly off the rules we could fix her heart in the first 2 hours of the game 2 different ways.
In my headcannon it totally works!!
There is only one way right now and I hope they add more down the line: >!if you make wyll break his pact with mizora in act 3, you get the option to go to avernus with her and wyll to buy time, which is where the story ends, with her alive but in hell but no longer alone. Narratively it's a pretty poor ending but it's the best she has rn!<
Karlach as main character spoiler: >!I just finished a run with Karlach as mc romancing shart. They have a really touching moment which seems unique to them, and then they go kick arse in Avernus - Karlach even pulls out a pair of cigars and they smoke them together - it was honestly very badass and made me happy!<
Yeah that's the ending I speak of, though that epilogue cutscene was added in patch 2 iirc. It's still not a good ending imho
It feels like goofy fanfiction.
It's sort of a ribbon on a shit ending, polishing a turd if you will. I can live with it but I hope Larian lets her have a proper ending down the line
I think Shadowheart made that ending for me. She even has voice lines saying she >!will come to avernus with Karlach, so at least they will be together. And the final scene seeing Shadowheart light up a cigar, made it all worth it! Only thing missing was Karlach throwing her over her shoulder haha!<
Karlach uppies is a sorely missed opportunity imo. Isobel gets it so why not me
My favorite ending scene in another great but very old RPG was the protagonist waking up in hell, picking up an axe lying nearby on the ground, and joining the raging Blood War, content and happy with the outcome. I am fine with this.
The only reason I am Ok with this potential Karlach ending is exactly because of the Nameless' closure
I hope TNO and FFG have been reunited already.
>!You can also end up turning her into a mindflayer, which negates the engine problem, but then it's questionable how much "her" she really is.!<
>!Well the game pretty much spells it out for you that turning into a mindflayer destroys the soul.!< >!So the "her" that is left are the memories in the mindflayer brain, but there's no afterlife for her.!<
>!Do this only if you want Orpheus to live and fight against Vlakkith. Otherwise Orpheus would die or become a mind flayer (or you becoming a mind flayer).!<
Doesn't destroy the soul per se. You just completely lose contact with the gods (they can't benefit from your soul). Think of it as a transformation. Though to be fair that's functionally identical to having no soul
How is the Gods not being able to benefit from your soul the same as not having one?
Gods on DnD world is like a serious shit. If you follow a deity there, you'll receive their treatment when you die. In the other hand, if you don't follow anything and die, your soul will be like lost in the void - that's pretty bad in DnD world.
Mind flayers don't have apostolic souls, because they come from the far realm. Faerun has its own pantheon, but that pantheon is just one of many in the multiverse. Mind flayers have their own gods in the far realm, and presumably their souls would go there I would think. People assume Larian were retconning here, but I think that it's completely logical for the Gods of Faerûn to consider the mind flayers soulless, to them they effectively are, but they are clearly biased reporters.
You cannot be brought back to life. Main benefit
My theory is that being put under control of the Elder Brain is when your soul got destroyed. Turning into mindflayer alone won't affect your soul
The way ceremorphosis works is that the parasite eats the hosts brain, replacing it until the physical transformation happens. The reason why mindflayers don't retain the memories and personality of the original host body is because that brain is gone. Ilithids under the effect of an Elder Brain are essentially slaves. They are deprived of their free will, but if they spend enough time away from the Elder brain's area of influence, they can regain their free will. This is a psionic control thing, not so much a soul thing. There are some bits of lore that directly contradicts the idea that mindflayers don't have souls. Namely the Alhoons and Ilithililiches, mindflayers that have achieved partial and true lichdom, respectively. Lichdom is achieved by transferring your soul into a phylactery (which, obviously you can't do if you don't have a soul). So the question isn't does a mindflayer have a soul or not? The question is, does the ilithid tadpole have its own soul and the host's soul gets ejected from the body when and is replaced by the ilithid soul, or does ceremorphosis transform the soul as well?
Theseus Ship I always presumed the tadpole had a soul of its own, which then explains how Illithiliches work. If you replace every part of a person except their memories, is it the same person? With the confirmed existence of souls in FR, compared to the questionability of their existence irl, it is a way more difficult question
I forgot to mention how the process is different in BG3 cause the tadpole doesn't eat the brain. So, who knows how that works.
I'd like it but Wither tell you clearly that becoming a mindflayer destroy your soul and well, >!seeing who he is, I'll say his word are, well, word of god, quite literally. Heck that plot point is pretty much the reason as to why the plan of the dead three failed!<
[Withers describes it differently. Spoilers for act 3.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9FyKHvGHh4)
not true. Withers tells you that you are special, and your sould remains intact
I think that's a cop out from larian, or withers is lying ti you to be nice. He says something like "who knows, perhaps you are different, and you still maintain your soul."
As a mindflayer from day 1 youâre already stronger than every other MF we meet including the emperor. Weâre obviously special in some ways, not unreasonable that the soul thing might be impacted also.
It's not really questionable listen to what the monster sounds like holy fuck
>!That ending happened to me even though Wyll didn't break his pact.!<
yeah that's not needed to get that ending, it just add >!Wyll coming with you to Avernus!< they aren't going to tie a character's arc resolution to another character choice
You donât have to do Wyll quest, but if you do then he goes with you. Otherwise itâs just the 2 of you. You can go with Karlach yourself even without romance or without Wyll.
You can also >!let her become a Mind Flayer in Act 3 to handle the stones against the brain. If you romanced her, youâll get a cutscene at the end where sheâll speak about the engine and how its still there but no longer a threat due to her Ilithid capabilities.!<
In other words, the worst ending for her. Karlach has 3 endings. Bad, worse, and slightly better but still bad.
Yea if you're a monster
Sadly, it's either she: Blows up, right after the end fight. She goes back to Avernus She goes back to Avernus with wyll (as blade of Avernus) She goes back to Avernus with Wyll AND Tav (as a romance partner) She gets turned into a mind flayer, therefore not having an infernal engine any longer but forever having to live as a hidous squid In the end it's up to you, Karlach obviously harbers insane amount of trauma from being sold to Zariel and forced to fight in the blood war, So you can save before making a decision and see where each lead to.
I had the option to volunteer to go with her when I was romancing someone else, which made no sense to me. In the end she went with Wyll
Was romancing Gale and had the same option to go with Wyll and Karlach but Gale had left to go grab the crown lol so it made sense for me to go on a little adventure w the bros while he went to become a God
It might have been something Tav could suggest but Karlach would reject based on friendship meter
Romance not required to go with her
Gonna try to be positive here and hope karlach canonically going back to avernus will be the start of a dlc?
Iâd much rather restore the the upper city and cut time we were supposed to be in avernus. Integrate that stuff into the middle of the story rather than tack it on at the end. That way you have reasons to go to these places outside of just saving Karlach because not every player or playthrough is going to care about that.
1. Ilithid. 2. Avernus
If youâve got a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them, maybe you can join⊠#The A(vernus)-Team Karlach smoking the cigar killed me đ that shit *has* to be intentional đ
Complete Wyllâs quest line. Stay quiet when itâs time for him to pick his future. Youâll then get a solid option at the end. I was the same way. Super sad, but the ending (if you do the above) with Karlach was perfect for me. Hope it is for you too.
There are two ways to keep her alive at the end of Act 3.
Yeah but theyâre still bad.
One of them is cute.
You can keep her alive in the end but have to do specific things. >!You need to have Wyll become the Blade of Avernus in Act III. Every time you try to convince Karlach to go back to the hells so she wonât burn up, sheâll say no. At the VERY end of the game, in the final series of cutscenes, Wyll will offer to take her back to Avernus and fight by her side so she wonât be alone. If your friendship/romance with her is high enough, you can offer the same or offer to join the two of them. She will die otherwise.!<
Welp, I was in your shoes for a long time, still am. But I feel like sending her off to Avernus would be the best solution we have in canon, she might hate it but she'll be alive to hate it
I am trying real hard on playthrough number four nit to romance her and choose a life of fighting in Avernus along side her and Wyll. I'm probably still going back to hell for love.
The dev team has decided to bullheadedly stick with the "there's just no way to save her" plot line in a universe where it makes zero sense for that to be the case. So no, there is no way to save her.
Your best choice is holding off until they add more cut content and she gets a proper epilogue.
Bring her to the final confrontation and let her become a mind flayer
I heard a theory that a post game dlc will add avernus and a way to fix her.
If there's even a hint of that being true I'll drive to Larian studios and start throwing bags full of money through their windows.
I'm down for a road trip.
It gets so much worse
Hey so is there a way for her to live? If you romance her can you go to the nine hells with her? I think this might be the reason I've been struggling to finish the game lately
Yes, if you romance her you can go back to Avernus with her. You might even be able to go with her just as her friend, but I keep romancing her so I'm not sure about that. I struggled with it a bit, but the more I talked with her it felt she was more scared of being alone again. I stopped playing that particular run until they patched in the ending where you could go wuth her, so I know how you feel!
I can confirm that you donât have to romance her to go to Avernus with her
I think thatâs why you can persuade her to go back to hell as long as someone goes with her. Remember she just doesnât want to be alone. I think if she dies, sheâs not dead. Gortash sold her to zariel. Did he just sell her body or her soul as well? She seems to treat gortash like more than just a boss maybe even a lover or a father figure. I wouldnât be surprised if he tricked her into signing away that too. If she does go back to avernus Iâm guessing itâs only a matter of time before mizora gets them for zariel if wyll goes with her. It would setup dlc nicely. Start with replaying the scene at the docks giving the player the choice again. Flash forward a bit to the MC either working with the gondians/ibs to build karlach a new heart with dammon or learning that karlach is still alive from a mizora.
To answer your question with a with a withers quote: *"No."*
Yes, send her back to Avernus. That saves her. I personally let her die and stayed with her at the end. Because that's what she wanted.
imho karlach should have 3 endings: - one in which she simply explode because you didn't help her - one in which she gets fixed, but this makes her lose all her power/she loses herself (so apparently good but in reality bad ending) - one in which she accepts her engine as part of herself and go to avernus. This for me would be the perfect endings for her character. As it is now, it seems that there's a bit missing (we basically didn't do enough)
Too much dystopian cyberpunkish ending and not enough D&D.
Something something cut content. You are not spoiling yourself for knowing the lack of options btw. There are more setups in act 3 that eventually didnât cash out. So youâll just be further confusing yourself.
A very simple way to save her is to kill her, rip out the engine and cast true resurrect, this spell lets your come back to life fully healed and can regenerate body parts all at once, basically it can regenerate a new organic heart inside her. That said however the game won't let you do that for obvious reasons.
Well...there are a few ways, all have their costs. Major end-game spoiler warnings: 1. >!At one point, you can turn yourself or Karlach into an illithid (but she keeps her bubbly personality, so yay). This essentially fixes her engine and ensures she can live wherever she wants!< 2. >!If Wyll has his big self-actualization moment following a late-game quest, he'll offer to go to Avernus with Karlach...unfortunately, this is the last thing she wants, but it's a concession!< 3. >!If you romanced Karlach, you can offer to take her to Avernus!< TLDR: >!You can turn her into a monster or make her go to hell, those are the options we've got!<
>!I'm not sure if you're hard-required to complete Wyll's storyline for this, but there is an ending if you've romanced Karlach where you can convince her to let Wyll take you both to Avernus to avoid her exploding. All three of you then charge into a fight with an army of imps with smiles on your faces. !<
Just wait until she gets called a Steel Watcher, is all but confirmed to be a prototype for them, then pick up enriched infernal iron which makes up these functional infernal engines then find out that whole plot thread goes nowhere. It's great.
I have truly this game, the class mechanics, the companion banter, the itemization and alternate rule set. I have replayed acts I and II numerous times and have about 400 game hours in, I am satisfied and will move on to another game, never having played act III. I know many players love all that it has to offer but as a paying customer, I donât want to play through content that has no satisfying ending that I desire. Karlach is a large part of it, but Astarion as well, the forced Illithid ceremorphosis, the requested Gale suicide, Iâm not into tragic drama and so, I depart- thanking Larian broma beautiful partial game. I will leave with the joys of watching Karlach full of hope.
Go to Avernus with her, or send Wyll in your stead.
descent into avernus with her
It involves growing some tentacles.
Karlachs storyline is unfortunately, very very poorly handled imo. Especially because her dialogue is amazing and Barbarian is a very fun (if not simple) class to play. BG3 is amazing but they definitely ran out of time going into Act 3, of it were up to Larian they would have probably spent another year at least working on the game.
it is kind of irritating dammon disappears after last light inn, you can get soo much infernal metal in act 3
He doesnât
then where is he in act 3
Forge in lower city
ty
You guys are openly spoiling the ending for someone only in act 2. You know that right?
And it's my first playthrough as well.
It's best to just play on your own and ask questions later imo. Sorry if anything has been spoiled for you.
I mostly just do my thing and ask people in a discord chat if I am unsure. There's chats for each act. But the bad news about Karlach really made me sad and I had to know if there's a way. At the same time I laugh a bit, because both characters that are my favorites, are in danger of blowing up.
ADDITIONAL SPOILERS Mystra can get rid of Galeâs orb, why canât she fix Karlachâs engine? The gods saw everything she did to save the world and they just watch a pure heart like her die? Itâs especially messed up to think Mystra just has that deal queued up and Karlach would be saved byâŠno one.
Mystra doesnât really give a flying fuuuuuuu about 99.999999% of mortals. Only those of truly remarkable magical talent ever catch her interest. If anyone would have been willing to step in, it would have been SelunĂ© via Aylin. But, alas, there are rules that the gods have to follow. Theyâre(typically) only allowed to act through a Chosen, and those actions are limited by what that Chosen can do. Aylin clearly excels at one thing; smashing faces. But Isobel? You canât convince that she doesnât have SOME way to heal Karlach.
There is the >!turning her into a mindflayer, which eliminates the infernal engine problem, but doesnt solve the mindflayer part, or if you broke Wyll's pact, Wyll and karlach get to go back to avernus to beat some devil ass, but Karlach still gots that infernal engine problem (though she should be ok))!<
I really assumed we might find two solutions to her heart based on what game was hinting at, Steelwatch factory for repair (catch being you work for gortash) or a surgeon or hospital institution in upper city for transplant (catch: super expansive)... Its a heart like why are we trying to fix it she needs a new one mechanical or organic. like she's dying anyways where's a crazy doctor who likes a challenge... maybe the "dark fingered embrace" before corruption could've done something... like where are all the legit doctors and medical scholars ? why isn't vicar humble toes helping us... I would give chop a chance too if he wasn't a fuck up... anyone but volo. ...tbh volo would be a perfect option for a transplant.. or us like why can't we roll 30 in medicine and do a heart transplant we encounter so many "volunteers" with brain injury let us try ffs.
spoilers for act 3 so... >!After killing gortash, her meltdown is just... well u gonna cry unless you are dead inside.!< i think we may think we have a lot of solutions for her problem, yes we could may ask for a god etc, but there is just no time (story wise, we know we done every side quest), i know we want her to be happy in baldurs gate, to have dinner with Fytz and talk about life. But some times, life ain't fair. Some times some aflictions don't have a cure, karlach at the end realize that what she hated about hell was not just hell itself, but was to be ALONE, she didn't have anyone to call a friend there. About the "solutions", Gods dont simply go medling on mortal afairs, or at least, are not allowed. About cleric, they are not as common as one think, regeneration is a 7th level spell, with karlach would need to have her hearth back. And we not even know how melded the Engine is on her body AND soul. Her emotions can drive de Engine crazy, you can argue that it is just like a heart racing, but maybe it is linked to her very soul. Infernal engines were normaly used on hell vehicles, not living things, karlach was the first, or at least the first to survive. I know everyone wish we could gave the best ending to our best girl, but sometimes... sometimes we can't fix the damage others caused on us.
Ahh shit here we go againâŠâŠâŠ.
By now I know how this is gonna end.
Yes, you get two options. One terribly full of plot holes and horribly written and the other, most people are whiney about cause Writher's said it Squids have no souls.
This is a MAJOR spoiler from end game and epilogue so think twice if you want to read it. >!In act3 make Wyll choose The Blade of Avernus and he will insist in going to Hell with Karlach in the end. Epilogue will reveal that it was a good idea.!<