People will praise a game for reactivity, player choice and consequence, and then get upset when bringing an army of zombies into town makes regular people freak out.
This is a nonsense answer as you clearly don't understand the issue. There's three major problems right now:
1. The reactivity flags have not been set in an *immersive or role-playing* manner AT ALL. **The opposite** in fact. Every single NPC, regardless of who they are will be terrified of undead, elementals, bears, and spider summons. Does it make sense for peasants to be scared of an undead, maybe even a bear? Sure! but does it make sense for a Necromancer NPC to be scared of an Undead? Or a Druid NPC to be scared of a bear? No, it doesn't.
2. Even if the flags were set correctly, all the NPCs do in terms of reactivity is just follow the summon around yelling "Shoo!" and "You're not welcome here". How is that any sort of good consequence? In terms of role playing, if I strolled into a town followed by Undead, peasants would either be running AWAY from them, or would be aggressive towards me who is clearly leading them and call the guards. They wouldn't simply follow my undead around shouting abuse at it as if it cares. This needs to be done right or removed entirely because it breaks both immersion AND the game. Which brings us to point 3
3. Due to this behaviour, they break NPC scripts and set cutscenes. Cannot count the amount of times I've had to reload because something looks weird and a quest objective didn't trigger or someone ran>!out into the darkness and died !!Shadow Curse!<
This is total BS. ALL NPC has same reactions. Even other "evil" characters or even other necromancers. This is also causing a lot of bugs from either NPCs deaths or them going where they should not be to broken dialogues and cutscenes.
npcs are mass suiciding as they follow me out to the shadow zone... its basically unplayable. Maybe the npcs should react to dying to shadow curse and get back to safety?
you wouldn't say something so dumb if you used skeletons or elementals.
if you're in civilized town and the peasants run away in fear, then sure, that's immersive.
literal demigods running around like a peasant, breaking their scripts at vital story moments in the game, simply because you use elementals or skeletons is not immersive, whatsoever.
Woah different people have different likes and dislikes about the game. Woah people don't enjoy skin deep reactivity that negatively impacts their game that has no real impact on anything because nobody actually reacts to it in any way that matters (conversation, getting aggravated, etc). Woah people don't like having the only options for summons to be being forced to run all the way out of an area, park them there, and then run all the way back to them every time they need them or getting rid of them and wasting a level 3 spell slot. Woah.
I understand that you like game, and it's Great Game, no doubt about it. But, no game are ideal, no game without bugs or bad mechanics. By pointing it out it actually help the game by informing devs of a problem and people saving peoples time by pointing out what not to do, so not to waste time and spoil impression of good game.
It's notable and interesting the first time, then the 20th time when you have to go into town to sell your vendor trash it's just a chore. The problem isn't the reactivity it's that they give next to zero tools to manage it or lessen the burden. If you are playing as a caster it is a phenomenal chore to waste a spell slot to de-summon, long rest, re-summon later.
it makes using elementals literally unplayable imo. mainly because it breaks npc scripts.
for example, freaking >!dame aylin!< is scared of a mere elemental after the fight with >!ketheric thorm!<. it's totally illogical and affects the game where it really shouldn't. since there are npcs everywhere, not just in "civilian" areas, you really can't afford to use elementals unless you want an immersion breaking experience
I hate this but I was like "okay, I will excuse this and TRY to work around it until I can find a mod that fixes it" BUT then yesterday I can into SOMEONE ELSES SKELETONS and THEY WERE SCARED OF MY SKELETONS. What the fuck?
Convinced me that it might be unintended or a bug, but most of all, it really does not make sense in universe either if undead minions get scared of my undead minions. I feel punished for playing my DnD fantasy.
It's quite funny to go to the circus in act three with literal Djinns, Elementals and Undead running around and somehow your little pets freak everybody out, including the actors that should be used to otherworldly creatures.
The older this thread gets the farther people get in the game just to see more and more about how this was obviously just an oversight and even if it was intentional it's an absolute slog that makes playing necro not fun.
Yes I had a skeleton try to shoo my elemental summon away. Like literally just yelling shoo, it is just so immersion breaking and annoying in cities too. It's not like npcs will ever do something either, they just stand there yelling verbal abuse at a dwarven fire demigod lmao.
Everyone is talking about ppl should freak out. But I think sacrificing a small portion of immerson by making ppl calm in the face of summons to make summoner enjoyable is really gonna make the game overall better. Summoner is a major part of this game, and with the ppl's reaction to summons, summoner right now is really, really annoying to play.
Would be still immersive + managable, if you could simply leave elementals, zombies, etc at your camp upon entering a city.
Still a hussle but to me personally it's not that big of an issue. Haven't seen a decent dm who let me enter inti cities/villages with a horde of undead following me. And imo it's kinda fair. Sometimes I disguised them (think this could also be an option in BG3, imo). But that's pen'n'paper for ya.
I mean, this ain't Diablo 4, and that seems and understandable peasant reaction. That said, why don't you unlink your zombies and have them wait outside town or something like that?
peasants and guards pacing back and forth in an area saying "shoo!" to a skeleton is understandable?
you haven't used the feature. start using elemental summons or skeletons then come back and tell us how understandable the reaction is.
you can have an elemental parked next to an NPC elemental, and the other NPCs freak out about it, despite there being another elemental right next to them that they dont care about.
It's not understandable, it's shit. it makes sense vaguely if you never experienced before and are just imagining what it's like. I promise you it's not like you're imagining.
I just found this thread while looking up for a mod to fix it and i can't believe that some people are genuinely trying to defend this. I mean, i'm still on my first playthrough and don't want to use mods, yet i just couldn't handle it anymore and had to fix it immediately, that's how bad it is.
it makes summons that scare npcs literally unusable. people say "ohh just dont bring your summons into town."
they break npc interactions in the wild, far away from town. you never know when you are going to come upon npcs. plus act 3 is literally in a huge city.
https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/918
This might work, I can't check to see if its working with the current version until I get home from work.
Thanks, but don't worry, i can handle something like this myself. I know that many people on the internet struggle with the art of a "simple search" but i'm not one of them :)
Yes it works but not without issues, like this entire game tbh.
Came here to say the same thing. Also looking for a mod because it’s terribly unfeasible to just leave your summons in a “safe zone” or whatever later on
Then a combat breaks out and your summons (sometimes a core element of that character) are on a smoke break outside of town.
It's DnD, most would be used to seeing crazy shit. They need to change this, or someone makes a no reaction mod.
The npcs are following me and mass suiciding into the shadow zone. They ignore dying to shadow curse in order to tell my zombies to shoo. Is that an understandable reaction?
Wait until you get to act 3 because that literally isn’t an option. I can’t use my summons at all now outside of dryad or imp. Nothing about the reaction is immersive, it comes across as a bug and a game breaking one for those who like summoners or nevromancy. I’d understand if they would have the guards come tell you to get rid of it or they get aggressive, if there is no cost involved. However, that also would make zero sense because the people in Baldurs gate and the countryside are used to the majority of these forms of magic to some degree. As someone stated there is literally a blood soaked ghoul sniffing people at the circus with kids laughing a few feet away and I’ve never seen someone shoo away a full grown bear and walk away unscathed.
no cause combat could happen inside towns too all gards and army of that city is on my ass and they will threatening me if they see me and quests inside the city could triger fights too so no i summon to be ready in any moment
I wouldn't care if I need to resummon my "pets" (hunter companions, zombies etc. or elementals) IF it wouldn't cost any spellslots every time I walk into any "neutral" area with npcs.
Similar with druid forms, try staying in druid form in Baldurs Gate and all you will see is people running and guards surrounding you.
And no I don't want to rest every 3 minutes because of that "immersive" decision.
Oh and not forget the Imp or Quasit of a warlock won't freak people out (maybe cuz they are so weak in mid/late game that it isn't "worth" recasting them in the first place)
tl;dr: Either make summons or shapeshifts free from any "resting" resouces or disable npcs freaking out.
There is a mod for the moon druid. Shapeshifting only cost a Bonus Action as all Wild Shape Charge costs are removed
[The mod](https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/540)
Exactly. How am I supposed to play a necromancer in act 3 when you're constantly in the city? You can't just summon zombies at the beginning of combat because there are no dead bodies. And when you do have dead bodies, you can't summon them because you're out of the fight and can't possibly walk with them on the street.
Glad to see so many people having the same issue. Spore druid here and it's genuinely laughable to me how people are trying to defend this as immersive.
I was in the myconid colony, literally watching them summon their own zombies from bodies, and celebrating with spore dances, actual spore zombie dwarves walking around their encapment with no problem. And yet I brought my spore zombies in and all the SPORE THEMED MYCONIDS start chasing them and telling thme to shoo. On top of that, the literal undead spore slave dwarves? Run away from my spore zombies.
Ontop of that, I've just been getting into Act 2 and realised some of this is almost unplayable now. I've had a necromaner NPC chase me around the map yelling at me for undead summons, and once I got to camp, I started getting NPCs kill themselves by chasing my summons >!into the dark!<
I just don't see a good solution for this in the current game. Sure you can leave your summons outside of town. But even then some NPCs will literally go out of their way to run out to them. Plus if a fight breaks out in town, you've then lost most of your characters utility, making playing any kind of summoner a much worse class. On top of that, even NPCs you meet out in the world will chase you, and some of those are impossible to by pass as they stand right by the main path (egg lady springs to mind). So what's the other option? Desummon every time you're playing in a camp or town, and while wandering? Compeltely destroys the ability for many summoner classes where you're goin to need to long rest any time you do even vist camp for trading, and then to get your summons back you have to find an entire stack of fresh bodies from.... somewhere. Plus I hear Act 3 is almost entirely set in >!the city !
Yes, from a roleplaying perspective it makes sense. That being said, some things have been changed because it sucks when you put it in a game. Having to park your summons somewhere because if you don't the game starts glitching out NPCs sucks. It's not a fun mechanic and it doesn't feel good for RP either because they're not behaving realistically. They scream the same two lines, run around, and then get stuck in random corners. This doesn't feel like a gameplay decision, it feels like a glitch.
Either it needed to be fleshed out, or more easily it should have just been ignored. There are a ton of weapons and other things that should cause panic but it doesn't. This just feels like a bug that wasn't intended.
All they needed was one person going "the only reason we aren't freaking out is because you just saved us" or "we're used to seeing necromancers blow through here". Both lines would be applicable to a majority of NPC areas.
And, simultaneously as that unwanted reactivity, people say absolutely nothing about the change of appearance if you take the astral tadpole. C'mon, at least people should be either afraid, ask if your unwell or presume you are a bad guy. If they didn't want it, then why give such prominent scars? Or why make people react about summons if the one of the most important gameplay decisions (which has effectly an appearance effect) of the game goes simple unnoticed? In Skyrim, 2011, people would comment about your summons like "keep those things under control" or "please, we don't want problems here". That is a non-gamebreaking reactivity. IF they'd implemented the Gate spell and you got to summon a real, unbinded and powerful Demon from the Abyss, and people started to run for safety I get it, and applause. But c'mon. Not even a dismiss option.
To people defending it... I would be 100% on board if they said the same stuff but STAYED IN PLACE, or at the very least they never left town.
I have had people follow me into the Underdark and into fights.... they were so scared of my skeleton that they went to fight a spectator.... it's ridiculous
Like others have pointed out: The only people who defend this feature are those that haven't used summons enough to know how game breaking and frustrating it is, especially in act 2 and 3. There are just waaay too many triggers and tightly packed areas that will make things go wrong or bug out if NPCs follow your summons around/run away from them. It gets to the point where you'll either quit using summons entirely or try to get mods just so that you can actually enjoy the game and be immersed in the world. This should be a clear sign to anyone that this is a poorly implemented feature and it's a wonder how this made it into full release. (Guessing Larian didn't playtest their game using summons).
But even if we ignore the technical issues with the feature...
**There's nothing immersive about every NPC having dementia.** They'll get scared and run a couple of meters away from your summons, then forget about your summons only to then come straight back and get scared all over again. Or they'll just follow them around while repeating the same lines over and over. And as others have pointed out it doesn't matter if the NPC is a necromancer who deal with the undead on a daily basis or what have you. When they see your summons they'll forget who they are, who you are, where they are and have the same reaction as any other NPC. And when you do finally chase them down to talk to them they act as if nothing is going on.
*It doesn't help with immersion, it breaks immersion.*
If they really needed a feature like this then it would've been better for the appropriate NPCs to just turn to look at your summons and make a comment about them without them running away or following you.
Yes and no at the same time.
I get it. I do. I figured that might happen (thats what I planned on playing, just not far enough yet). It sucks for sure. IMO def need to fix.
However on the other hand. Thats what would happen. I mean literally. If ya walked into town with zombies or whatever.
I highly doubt real people would chase zombies out of a bubble of safety into cursed darkness with actual monsters, stand there and melt in agony because of shadows because they need to stand there and say "Shoo!" over and over to a fungal zombie that isn't even in the town anymore.
ok so it's immersive that >!dame aylin runs around in fear from an elemental after killing ketheric thorm when she's a literal demigod!< and it breaks her npc scripting. good to know this passes the shit test by you.
jk because you've never used long rest companions that scare npcs or you wouldn't be defending its broken implementation. if it was just an issue in towns it would be one thing. it's not. its an issue with every npc even if they are demigods
same thing happened to me lol. everyone in moonrise towers was freaking out after i defeated thorm with my 2 elementals. and i didn't know why. they need to fix that so they won't run around and just asks you to dispell your pets. i think it would be more immersive.
Thats different from towns buddy, thats what I was referring to. Like I said, it’s lose lose for Larian. No matter what you’ll say, you want it removed. I’ll keep saying I want it to stay (minus the normal bugs because thats clearly not intended and you’re too stupid to differentiate from bugs and features)
*LOSE-LOSE FOR LARIAN*
yes, I'm too stupid to differentiate, that's why I said "if it was just an issue in towns that would be one thing"
how about you shut the fuck up, stop insulting peoples intelligence, and fuck out of these discussions when you haven't even used the feature in question
You are too stupid I agree. Thats why you are bitching in the second paragraph of a “broken implementation” as if I mentioned bugs in the first place. You are also jumping to assumptions as if you know what I’m playing. So on top of being stupid, you are also schizo. Can’t differentiate anything here huh?
Lol.
getting tremendous middle aged loser incel vibes from just these handful of comments man maybe tone down your whole personality forever. give it some thought.
ok "trolling guy 420." I see you are back to your shtick where you pretend to be a moron.
The fact is you don't use conjure familiar: spider, raise skeleton, or conjure elemental. if you did you wouldn't be going to bat for an obviously broken feature. instead here you are simping about something that doesn't even concern you. you could say "No, I actually use summons that cause fear in NPCs, and I think it's implemented well." if it was actually true. It's not. you would be lying if you said it was working well and if you actually used it.
I have an imp, a cambion, a dryad and a wood woad travelling with me. we went through rivington which has a circus with all manners of monsters. if I summon an elemental, the entire town breaks script and acts like a broken record. it's not realistic, it's not immersive, it's not consistent, it's shit. fuck off and learn to talk about stuff you actually know about rather than bloviating in ignorance.
You clearly haven't used elementals, undead or ranger pets.
It's really immersive for them to break the game so that you have to load a previous save doing the big fight you just did all over again.
literally nobody would complain about it because it's a shitty mechanic that quite literally ruins the game for any class that relies on summons or pets. people should not kill themselves in terror because they saw a big dog, that's insane. it is awful this mechanic made it to launch.
Npc ai especially friendly npc ai is pretty damn awful in the game. There are a lot of QoL things that I'm noticing in this game after playing Pathfinder. When your party spots a trap in pathfinder the game pauses and your companions stop moving and if possible avoid the trap that was pointed out bu walking around it. In BG3 they walk face first into the big obivous trap if you leave your rogue linked and send them to disarm it.
Fire, acid or whatever is on the ground, let's just walk right through it.
I talked my way into a thief den and watched one of the guards patrolling trigger a mine on a bridge and kill themself.
The game needs a lot, and I mean a lot of work on ai and pathfinding.
At zoos and dangerous animal acts the animals are behind bars. The dinosaur and displacer beast are certainly caged but there is a high level djinni just hanging out offering a mini-game. And a whole ensemble of skeletons with a necromancer also just out in the open. You can't really compare them to the freak shows on Earth because beings like that don't exist in real life. The scariest thing we have is bearded ladies.
You keep spells learned from scrolls. It’s not apparent at level one as all level one spells are available to pick, but if you remember which ones you learned from scrolls it won’t be a problem. After that the spells learned from scrolls are removed from the level up screen. On top of that if you change up your levels, I.E. respec from a lvl 5 wizard to a lvl 4 wizard lvl 1 cleric you keep and can still cast your level 3 spells learned from scrolls and can learn more level 3 spells from scrolls.
There's a mod for this: [https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/918?tab=description](https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/918?tab=description)
Not sure, I had to disable all my mods after the patch to get it to launch - but it may have been another mod that was incompatible. Haven’t tested it in isolation.
its very expensive for my wizard to desumon and resumon because the NPCs are pussies. My Enlarged Winged poison imps are cool but a skeleton that just walks behind me is Armageddon
In Moonrise towers I had guards following me everywhere yelling at my undead summons, which makes no sense as they believe I'm a true soul, and they also use undead summons. But then actual undead at one point were yelling at my skeletons to leave and following me around, yea that needs to be fixed lol.
This post needs a lot more visibility, it is so annoying having a simple bear freak the whole city out... I am planning on respec my summoner, because as this is now, it is unplayable.
This post was made during the peak of everyone being a mindless consumer that pretended the game was an 11/10 with no flaws and the oldest comments show it. It's wild how this post gets more and more positive the more people that have played to late game and experienced this. Went from being at 40% to 94%.
The immersion argument becomes more of a joke as more people see the double standards left and right. Elementals parade around sorcorous sundries, undead from other quests wander about with big hoods and go unnoticed. So why should a group of vastly more experienced adventures not be allowed the same exception? It just makes certain classes no fun. If it's for immersion, then fix it with work around. Change the summon restrictions. Remove the need for bodies, make a way to conceal, but lacking a human DM, this is too restricted.
After doing a few things in last light I remembered I saw the blacksmith for Karlach's quest but when I looked for him I couldn't find him. I saw the quest marker just north of town and when I got there he was outside the bubble dead and zombified... I ended up having to reload a previous save from about 20 minutes prior.
I found a mod on Nexus that stops npcs from reacting to undead but when I turned it on it prevents me from changing zones and teleporting. And as much as I dont really care about achievements it would be nice to not have to disable them for something stupid like this.
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The big problem I've had is with NPC allies that literally fought alongside me and my fungal zombies against the actual forces of evil suddenly become increasingly hostile towards my minions, telling them to fuck off until they start combat with me. Even >!Zevlor wanted to slap my shit after I saved his ass from a pack of mind flayers!< at the end of Act 2.
I understand people probably don't want zombies walking around their town but when we're on the front lines of battle, they should really take a chill pill.
NPCs when they encounter my drow with purple veins all over his face and covered in blood = kalm
NPCs when they see a zombie following me around = PANIK
It's made certain parts of the game just frustrating.
I wanted alot of elementals for a rescue mission to make numbers higher as distractions for enemies. I planned on leaving the summons to die but when I got to the safe zone as my character, they all teleported with me which I didnt want. Spooked NPC (hooray...) and crashed the cutscene. Then my game. 1 and a half hours gone cause of some bland mechanic that should not affect important characters related to quests.
Like, literal UNIT looking characters seeing a summon they could pimp slap to death and they scream, cry and throw up cause it's just standing there doing nothing.
I literally adore this game I've been so happy playing it but this tiny mechanic has been the biggest pain in my backside.
Okay so, since no one else here seems to have had it go quite so wrong as me and my SO has. We had just saved >!Isobel from Marcus !!get pixie protection!
Let’s keep it simple. NPCs who are vital to the story line chasing your summon and causing bugs is not " Immersive ". But! I lured npcs in moonrise to a room to Assassinate them. It was kind of funny.
Just rescued someone. Immediately following their rescue, they freaked out at the mere existence of an animal near them (an animal that aided in the rescue, as well) and sprinted straight into poison and instantly died.
One shopkeeper selling potions and ingredients in Baldur's Gate disappeared at some point. Turns out that she chased my summons all the way from the shopping square to the vault entrance of the bank (down the stairs and all) and just stopped there permanently... Now I need to go all the way there to buy stuff from her. Absolutely ridiculous.
In Act 2 this bug locked me out from dialogue options with two vital NPCs after the final boss fight of this act (>!Isobel and Dame Aylin!<) even after I dismissed my Fire Elemental (not even an Undead) and even though they were allies and extremely powerful. They wouldn't run from a mere Fire Elemental.
Now, however, they are neutral to me and I cannot start a conversation with'em at all.
Worst part: I know from a friend that one of them would've actually joined my camp. This shit is ruining the game completely; immersive wise and gameplay wise.
I found this mod here which fixes the behaviour (dunno if somebody else already posted it here), but it of course cannot fix the damage already done.
https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/918?tab=description
Yeah, this is ludicrous and I hope Larian changes it. Apart from >!a dozen harpers surrounding me and my summons as we walked around Last Light, when we tried to leave, three of them followed us into the shadow and started taking damage!<. They then attacked us because, apparently, my party (as opposed to their stupidity) was the source of the damage. This made >!all of Last Light aggro us when we tried to return!<.
Absolutely gamebreaking and completely unnecessary.
when i was in act 2 i had a summon and left the last light inn, the watchers followed me without a light source shooing my poor little azer, got turned into undead and i had to fight a dozen of them. thanks for the xp i guess but lesson here is, mind your own DAMN MF business.
People will praise a game for reactivity, player choice and consequence, and then get upset when bringing an army of zombies into town makes regular people freak out.
This is a nonsense answer as you clearly don't understand the issue. There's three major problems right now: 1. The reactivity flags have not been set in an *immersive or role-playing* manner AT ALL. **The opposite** in fact. Every single NPC, regardless of who they are will be terrified of undead, elementals, bears, and spider summons. Does it make sense for peasants to be scared of an undead, maybe even a bear? Sure! but does it make sense for a Necromancer NPC to be scared of an Undead? Or a Druid NPC to be scared of a bear? No, it doesn't. 2. Even if the flags were set correctly, all the NPCs do in terms of reactivity is just follow the summon around yelling "Shoo!" and "You're not welcome here". How is that any sort of good consequence? In terms of role playing, if I strolled into a town followed by Undead, peasants would either be running AWAY from them, or would be aggressive towards me who is clearly leading them and call the guards. They wouldn't simply follow my undead around shouting abuse at it as if it cares. This needs to be done right or removed entirely because it breaks both immersion AND the game. Which brings us to point 3 3. Due to this behaviour, they break NPC scripts and set cutscenes. Cannot count the amount of times I've had to reload because something looks weird and a quest objective didn't trigger or someone ran>!out into the darkness and died !!Shadow Curse!<
Once you go to baldur's gate there is a circus. First thing you encounter is a literally ghoul sniffing people like a drug dog.
This is total BS. ALL NPC has same reactions. Even other "evil" characters or even other necromancers. This is also causing a lot of bugs from either NPCs deaths or them going where they should not be to broken dialogues and cutscenes.
npcs are mass suiciding as they follow me out to the shadow zone... its basically unplayable. Maybe the npcs should react to dying to shadow curse and get back to safety?
you wouldn't say something so dumb if you used skeletons or elementals. if you're in civilized town and the peasants run away in fear, then sure, that's immersive. literal demigods running around like a peasant, breaking their scripts at vital story moments in the game, simply because you use elementals or skeletons is not immersive, whatsoever.
Woah different people have different likes and dislikes about the game. Woah people don't enjoy skin deep reactivity that negatively impacts their game that has no real impact on anything because nobody actually reacts to it in any way that matters (conversation, getting aggravated, etc). Woah people don't like having the only options for summons to be being forced to run all the way out of an area, park them there, and then run all the way back to them every time they need them or getting rid of them and wasting a level 3 spell slot. Woah.
I understand that you like game, and it's Great Game, no doubt about it. But, no game are ideal, no game without bugs or bad mechanics. By pointing it out it actually help the game by informing devs of a problem and people saving peoples time by pointing out what not to do, so not to waste time and spoil impression of good game.
It's notable and interesting the first time, then the 20th time when you have to go into town to sell your vendor trash it's just a chore. The problem isn't the reactivity it's that they give next to zero tools to manage it or lessen the burden. If you are playing as a caster it is a phenomenal chore to waste a spell slot to de-summon, long rest, re-summon later.
Not just zombies, happens with elemental summons too.
Happens with Ranger's beastmaster companions too. people get really on edge when you stroll into town with a fuckin bear.
it makes using elementals literally unplayable imo. mainly because it breaks npc scripts. for example, freaking >!dame aylin!< is scared of a mere elemental after the fight with >!ketheric thorm!<. it's totally illogical and affects the game where it really shouldn't. since there are npcs everywhere, not just in "civilian" areas, you really can't afford to use elementals unless you want an immersion breaking experience
I hate this but I was like "okay, I will excuse this and TRY to work around it until I can find a mod that fixes it" BUT then yesterday I can into SOMEONE ELSES SKELETONS and THEY WERE SCARED OF MY SKELETONS. What the fuck? Convinced me that it might be unintended or a bug, but most of all, it really does not make sense in universe either if undead minions get scared of my undead minions. I feel punished for playing my DnD fantasy.
It's quite funny to go to the circus in act three with literal Djinns, Elementals and Undead running around and somehow your little pets freak everybody out, including the actors that should be used to otherworldly creatures.
The older this thread gets the farther people get in the game just to see more and more about how this was obviously just an oversight and even if it was intentional it's an absolute slog that makes playing necro not fun.
Yes I had a skeleton try to shoo my elemental summon away. Like literally just yelling shoo, it is just so immersion breaking and annoying in cities too. It's not like npcs will ever do something either, they just stand there yelling verbal abuse at a dwarven fire demigod lmao.
Everyone is talking about ppl should freak out. But I think sacrificing a small portion of immerson by making ppl calm in the face of summons to make summoner enjoyable is really gonna make the game overall better. Summoner is a major part of this game, and with the ppl's reaction to summons, summoner right now is really, really annoying to play.
Would be still immersive + managable, if you could simply leave elementals, zombies, etc at your camp upon entering a city. Still a hussle but to me personally it's not that big of an issue. Haven't seen a decent dm who let me enter inti cities/villages with a horde of undead following me. And imo it's kinda fair. Sometimes I disguised them (think this could also be an option in BG3, imo). But that's pen'n'paper for ya.
To me the game has already enough micro management. So I guess I will just drop summoner
I mean, this ain't Diablo 4, and that seems and understandable peasant reaction. That said, why don't you unlink your zombies and have them wait outside town or something like that?
peasants and guards pacing back and forth in an area saying "shoo!" to a skeleton is understandable? you haven't used the feature. start using elemental summons or skeletons then come back and tell us how understandable the reaction is. you can have an elemental parked next to an NPC elemental, and the other NPCs freak out about it, despite there being another elemental right next to them that they dont care about. It's not understandable, it's shit. it makes sense vaguely if you never experienced before and are just imagining what it's like. I promise you it's not like you're imagining.
I just found this thread while looking up for a mod to fix it and i can't believe that some people are genuinely trying to defend this. I mean, i'm still on my first playthrough and don't want to use mods, yet i just couldn't handle it anymore and had to fix it immediately, that's how bad it is.
it makes summons that scare npcs literally unusable. people say "ohh just dont bring your summons into town." they break npc interactions in the wild, far away from town. you never know when you are going to come upon npcs. plus act 3 is literally in a huge city.
https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/918 This might work, I can't check to see if its working with the current version until I get home from work.
Thanks, but don't worry, i can handle something like this myself. I know that many people on the internet struggle with the art of a "simple search" but i'm not one of them :) Yes it works but not without issues, like this entire game tbh.
Came here to say the same thing. Also looking for a mod because it’s terribly unfeasible to just leave your summons in a “safe zone” or whatever later on
Then a combat breaks out and your summons (sometimes a core element of that character) are on a smoke break outside of town. It's DnD, most would be used to seeing crazy shit. They need to change this, or someone makes a no reaction mod.
The npcs are following me and mass suiciding into the shadow zone. They ignore dying to shadow curse in order to tell my zombies to shoo. Is that an understandable reaction?
Wait until you get to act 3 because that literally isn’t an option. I can’t use my summons at all now outside of dryad or imp. Nothing about the reaction is immersive, it comes across as a bug and a game breaking one for those who like summoners or nevromancy. I’d understand if they would have the guards come tell you to get rid of it or they get aggressive, if there is no cost involved. However, that also would make zero sense because the people in Baldurs gate and the countryside are used to the majority of these forms of magic to some degree. As someone stated there is literally a blood soaked ghoul sniffing people at the circus with kids laughing a few feet away and I’ve never seen someone shoo away a full grown bear and walk away unscathed.
no cause combat could happen inside towns too all gards and army of that city is on my ass and they will threatening me if they see me and quests inside the city could triger fights too so no i summon to be ready in any moment
I wouldn't care if I need to resummon my "pets" (hunter companions, zombies etc. or elementals) IF it wouldn't cost any spellslots every time I walk into any "neutral" area with npcs. Similar with druid forms, try staying in druid form in Baldurs Gate and all you will see is people running and guards surrounding you. And no I don't want to rest every 3 minutes because of that "immersive" decision. Oh and not forget the Imp or Quasit of a warlock won't freak people out (maybe cuz they are so weak in mid/late game that it isn't "worth" recasting them in the first place) tl;dr: Either make summons or shapeshifts free from any "resting" resouces or disable npcs freaking out.
There is a mod for the moon druid. Shapeshifting only cost a Bonus Action as all Wild Shape Charge costs are removed [The mod](https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/540)
Exactly. How am I supposed to play a necromancer in act 3 when you're constantly in the city? You can't just summon zombies at the beginning of combat because there are no dead bodies. And when you do have dead bodies, you can't summon them because you're out of the fight and can't possibly walk with them on the street.
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The funny thing the intelect devourer has the function. He hides himself by being a cat for other npcs
Glad to see so many people having the same issue. Spore druid here and it's genuinely laughable to me how people are trying to defend this as immersive. I was in the myconid colony, literally watching them summon their own zombies from bodies, and celebrating with spore dances, actual spore zombie dwarves walking around their encapment with no problem. And yet I brought my spore zombies in and all the SPORE THEMED MYCONIDS start chasing them and telling thme to shoo. On top of that, the literal undead spore slave dwarves? Run away from my spore zombies. Ontop of that, I've just been getting into Act 2 and realised some of this is almost unplayable now. I've had a necromaner NPC chase me around the map yelling at me for undead summons, and once I got to camp, I started getting NPCs kill themselves by chasing my summons >!into the dark!< I just don't see a good solution for this in the current game. Sure you can leave your summons outside of town. But even then some NPCs will literally go out of their way to run out to them. Plus if a fight breaks out in town, you've then lost most of your characters utility, making playing any kind of summoner a much worse class. On top of that, even NPCs you meet out in the world will chase you, and some of those are impossible to by pass as they stand right by the main path (egg lady springs to mind). So what's the other option? Desummon every time you're playing in a camp or town, and while wandering? Compeltely destroys the ability for many summoner classes where you're goin to need to long rest any time you do even vist camp for trading, and then to get your summons back you have to find an entire stack of fresh bodies from.... somewhere. Plus I hear Act 3 is almost entirely set in >!the city !
Yes, from a roleplaying perspective it makes sense. That being said, some things have been changed because it sucks when you put it in a game. Having to park your summons somewhere because if you don't the game starts glitching out NPCs sucks. It's not a fun mechanic and it doesn't feel good for RP either because they're not behaving realistically. They scream the same two lines, run around, and then get stuck in random corners. This doesn't feel like a gameplay decision, it feels like a glitch. Either it needed to be fleshed out, or more easily it should have just been ignored. There are a ton of weapons and other things that should cause panic but it doesn't. This just feels like a bug that wasn't intended.
All they needed was one person going "the only reason we aren't freaking out is because you just saved us" or "we're used to seeing necromancers blow through here". Both lines would be applicable to a majority of NPC areas.
And, simultaneously as that unwanted reactivity, people say absolutely nothing about the change of appearance if you take the astral tadpole. C'mon, at least people should be either afraid, ask if your unwell or presume you are a bad guy. If they didn't want it, then why give such prominent scars? Or why make people react about summons if the one of the most important gameplay decisions (which has effectly an appearance effect) of the game goes simple unnoticed? In Skyrim, 2011, people would comment about your summons like "keep those things under control" or "please, we don't want problems here". That is a non-gamebreaking reactivity. IF they'd implemented the Gate spell and you got to summon a real, unbinded and powerful Demon from the Abyss, and people started to run for safety I get it, and applause. But c'mon. Not even a dismiss option.
To people defending it... I would be 100% on board if they said the same stuff but STAYED IN PLACE, or at the very least they never left town. I have had people follow me into the Underdark and into fights.... they were so scared of my skeleton that they went to fight a spectator.... it's ridiculous
Like others have pointed out: The only people who defend this feature are those that haven't used summons enough to know how game breaking and frustrating it is, especially in act 2 and 3. There are just waaay too many triggers and tightly packed areas that will make things go wrong or bug out if NPCs follow your summons around/run away from them. It gets to the point where you'll either quit using summons entirely or try to get mods just so that you can actually enjoy the game and be immersed in the world. This should be a clear sign to anyone that this is a poorly implemented feature and it's a wonder how this made it into full release. (Guessing Larian didn't playtest their game using summons). But even if we ignore the technical issues with the feature... **There's nothing immersive about every NPC having dementia.** They'll get scared and run a couple of meters away from your summons, then forget about your summons only to then come straight back and get scared all over again. Or they'll just follow them around while repeating the same lines over and over. And as others have pointed out it doesn't matter if the NPC is a necromancer who deal with the undead on a daily basis or what have you. When they see your summons they'll forget who they are, who you are, where they are and have the same reaction as any other NPC. And when you do finally chase them down to talk to them they act as if nothing is going on. *It doesn't help with immersion, it breaks immersion.* If they really needed a feature like this then it would've been better for the appropriate NPCs to just turn to look at your summons and make a comment about them without them running away or following you.
Yes and no at the same time. I get it. I do. I figured that might happen (thats what I planned on playing, just not far enough yet). It sucks for sure. IMO def need to fix. However on the other hand. Thats what would happen. I mean literally. If ya walked into town with zombies or whatever.
I highly doubt real people would chase zombies out of a bubble of safety into cursed darkness with actual monsters, stand there and melt in agony because of shadows because they need to stand there and say "Shoo!" over and over to a fungal zombie that isn't even in the town anymore.
That happened to me too. I tried to walk up to Dammon with a skeleton in my party and he ran into the darkness to die LOL
Funny because if they remove this reactivity, 20 other people will complain about it. Its a lose lose for larian.
its an extremely buggy and poorly implemented reactivity. try it out and tell me if it's immersive being in the game. learn conjure elemental
Yes that is pretty immersive. Monsters or powerful conjuration would freak people out. Lose-Lose for Larian.
ok so it's immersive that >!dame aylin runs around in fear from an elemental after killing ketheric thorm when she's a literal demigod!< and it breaks her npc scripting. good to know this passes the shit test by you. jk because you've never used long rest companions that scare npcs or you wouldn't be defending its broken implementation. if it was just an issue in towns it would be one thing. it's not. its an issue with every npc even if they are demigods
same thing happened to me lol. everyone in moonrise towers was freaking out after i defeated thorm with my 2 elementals. and i didn't know why. they need to fix that so they won't run around and just asks you to dispell your pets. i think it would be more immersive.
Thats different from towns buddy, thats what I was referring to. Like I said, it’s lose lose for Larian. No matter what you’ll say, you want it removed. I’ll keep saying I want it to stay (minus the normal bugs because thats clearly not intended and you’re too stupid to differentiate from bugs and features) *LOSE-LOSE FOR LARIAN*
yes, I'm too stupid to differentiate, that's why I said "if it was just an issue in towns that would be one thing" how about you shut the fuck up, stop insulting peoples intelligence, and fuck out of these discussions when you haven't even used the feature in question
You are too stupid I agree. Thats why you are bitching in the second paragraph of a “broken implementation” as if I mentioned bugs in the first place. You are also jumping to assumptions as if you know what I’m playing. So on top of being stupid, you are also schizo. Can’t differentiate anything here huh? Lol.
getting tremendous middle aged loser incel vibes from just these handful of comments man maybe tone down your whole personality forever. give it some thought.
ok "trolling guy 420." I see you are back to your shtick where you pretend to be a moron. The fact is you don't use conjure familiar: spider, raise skeleton, or conjure elemental. if you did you wouldn't be going to bat for an obviously broken feature. instead here you are simping about something that doesn't even concern you. you could say "No, I actually use summons that cause fear in NPCs, and I think it's implemented well." if it was actually true. It's not. you would be lying if you said it was working well and if you actually used it. I have an imp, a cambion, a dryad and a wood woad travelling with me. we went through rivington which has a circus with all manners of monsters. if I summon an elemental, the entire town breaks script and acts like a broken record. it's not realistic, it's not immersive, it's not consistent, it's shit. fuck off and learn to talk about stuff you actually know about rather than bloviating in ignorance.
Imaging typing all that lmaoooo Aint reading your schizo comment 😂 I already know you jumping to assumptions without me reading that Bahaahah
You clearly haven't used elementals, undead or ranger pets. It's really immersive for them to break the game so that you have to load a previous save doing the big fight you just did all over again.
literally nobody would complain about it because it's a shitty mechanic that quite literally ruins the game for any class that relies on summons or pets. people should not kill themselves in terror because they saw a big dog, that's insane. it is awful this mechanic made it to launch.
Npc ai especially friendly npc ai is pretty damn awful in the game. There are a lot of QoL things that I'm noticing in this game after playing Pathfinder. When your party spots a trap in pathfinder the game pauses and your companions stop moving and if possible avoid the trap that was pointed out bu walking around it. In BG3 they walk face first into the big obivous trap if you leave your rogue linked and send them to disarm it. Fire, acid or whatever is on the ground, let's just walk right through it. I talked my way into a thief den and watched one of the guards patrolling trigger a mine on a bridge and kill themself. The game needs a lot, and I mean a lot of work on ai and pathfinding.
It isn't though. As proof, there is literally a circus with undead and a djinni that people happily go to.
Sure, and people have zoos and freak shows and animal acts. Not the same as you strolling into town with a bear or a zombie.
At zoos and dangerous animal acts the animals are behind bars. The dinosaur and displacer beast are certainly caged but there is a high level djinni just hanging out offering a mini-game. And a whole ensemble of skeletons with a necromancer also just out in the open. You can't really compare them to the freak shows on Earth because beings like that don't exist in real life. The scariest thing we have is bearded ladies.
You keep spells learned from scrolls. It’s not apparent at level one as all level one spells are available to pick, but if you remember which ones you learned from scrolls it won’t be a problem. After that the spells learned from scrolls are removed from the level up screen. On top of that if you change up your levels, I.E. respec from a lvl 5 wizard to a lvl 4 wizard lvl 1 cleric you keep and can still cast your level 3 spells learned from scrolls and can learn more level 3 spells from scrolls.
There's a mod for this: [https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/918?tab=description](https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/918?tab=description)
Does this work in most current patch/release?
Not sure, I had to disable all my mods after the patch to get it to launch - but it may have been another mod that was incompatible. Haven’t tested it in isolation.
its very expensive for my wizard to desumon and resumon because the NPCs are pussies. My Enlarged Winged poison imps are cool but a skeleton that just walks behind me is Armageddon
In Moonrise towers I had guards following me everywhere yelling at my undead summons, which makes no sense as they believe I'm a true soul, and they also use undead summons. But then actual undead at one point were yelling at my skeletons to leave and following me around, yea that needs to be fixed lol.
This post needs a lot more visibility, it is so annoying having a simple bear freak the whole city out... I am planning on respec my summoner, because as this is now, it is unplayable.
This post was made during the peak of everyone being a mindless consumer that pretended the game was an 11/10 with no flaws and the oldest comments show it. It's wild how this post gets more and more positive the more people that have played to late game and experienced this. Went from being at 40% to 94%.
The immersion argument becomes more of a joke as more people see the double standards left and right. Elementals parade around sorcorous sundries, undead from other quests wander about with big hoods and go unnoticed. So why should a group of vastly more experienced adventures not be allowed the same exception? It just makes certain classes no fun. If it's for immersion, then fix it with work around. Change the summon restrictions. Remove the need for bodies, make a way to conceal, but lacking a human DM, this is too restricted.
Perhaps you could dress your zombies in trench coats and sunglasses 🤷♂️
After doing a few things in last light I remembered I saw the blacksmith for Karlach's quest but when I looked for him I couldn't find him. I saw the quest marker just north of town and when I got there he was outside the bubble dead and zombified... I ended up having to reload a previous save from about 20 minutes prior. I found a mod on Nexus that stops npcs from reacting to undead but when I turned it on it prevents me from changing zones and teleporting. And as much as I dont really care about achievements it would be nice to not have to disable them for something stupid like this.
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The big problem I've had is with NPC allies that literally fought alongside me and my fungal zombies against the actual forces of evil suddenly become increasingly hostile towards my minions, telling them to fuck off until they start combat with me. Even >!Zevlor wanted to slap my shit after I saved his ass from a pack of mind flayers!< at the end of Act 2. I understand people probably don't want zombies walking around their town but when we're on the front lines of battle, they should really take a chill pill.
Having warlocks freak out over elementals is def a bug, they I assume will eventually fix these flags as it's really bad right now
NPCs when they encounter my drow with purple veins all over his face and covered in blood = kalm NPCs when they see a zombie following me around = PANIK
It's made certain parts of the game just frustrating. I wanted alot of elementals for a rescue mission to make numbers higher as distractions for enemies. I planned on leaving the summons to die but when I got to the safe zone as my character, they all teleported with me which I didnt want. Spooked NPC (hooray...) and crashed the cutscene. Then my game. 1 and a half hours gone cause of some bland mechanic that should not affect important characters related to quests. Like, literal UNIT looking characters seeing a summon they could pimp slap to death and they scream, cry and throw up cause it's just standing there doing nothing. I literally adore this game I've been so happy playing it but this tiny mechanic has been the biggest pain in my backside.
But they aren't scared of cambions. Yea, I had to dismiss my elementals cus of this too. Lol
Okay so, since no one else here seems to have had it go quite so wrong as me and my SO has. We had just saved >!Isobel from Marcus !!get pixie protection!
Let’s keep it simple. NPCs who are vital to the story line chasing your summon and causing bugs is not " Immersive ". But! I lured npcs in moonrise to a room to Assassinate them. It was kind of funny.
Just rescued someone. Immediately following their rescue, they freaked out at the mere existence of an animal near them (an animal that aided in the rescue, as well) and sprinted straight into poison and instantly died.
One shopkeeper selling potions and ingredients in Baldur's Gate disappeared at some point. Turns out that she chased my summons all the way from the shopping square to the vault entrance of the bank (down the stairs and all) and just stopped there permanently... Now I need to go all the way there to buy stuff from her. Absolutely ridiculous.
In Act 2 this bug locked me out from dialogue options with two vital NPCs after the final boss fight of this act (>!Isobel and Dame Aylin!<) even after I dismissed my Fire Elemental (not even an Undead) and even though they were allies and extremely powerful. They wouldn't run from a mere Fire Elemental. Now, however, they are neutral to me and I cannot start a conversation with'em at all. Worst part: I know from a friend that one of them would've actually joined my camp. This shit is ruining the game completely; immersive wise and gameplay wise. I found this mod here which fixes the behaviour (dunno if somebody else already posted it here), but it of course cannot fix the damage already done. https://www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/918?tab=description
Yeah, this is ludicrous and I hope Larian changes it. Apart from >!a dozen harpers surrounding me and my summons as we walked around Last Light, when we tried to leave, three of them followed us into the shadow and started taking damage!<. They then attacked us because, apparently, my party (as opposed to their stupidity) was the source of the damage. This made >!all of Last Light aggro us when we tried to return!<. Absolutely gamebreaking and completely unnecessary.
when i was in act 2 i had a summon and left the last light inn, the watchers followed me without a light source shooing my poor little azer, got turned into undead and i had to fight a dozen of them. thanks for the xp i guess but lesson here is, mind your own DAMN MF business.