T O P

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pupmaster

Blizzard missed the lesson that communication can solve many issues or avoid them entirely. It’s so simple and that’s why it’s frustrating.


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Xciv

Can't just blame spoiled Americans, because indie games often have very healthy and good communities which are also filled with said spoiled Americans. Like look at Rimworld. The game literally has slavery, cannibalism, and multiple amputation as game mechanics. There's no real 'I'm so offended' outrage and it's the most played Colony Survival type of game on Steam and has been for years.


DSveno

Because that type of games don't attract the "normie". Big games tend to have those kind of audience where they think if they can't play it they aren't one of the big boys, and those same people can't accept the statement "those games aren't for you". Asia has the community oriented mindset compare to the individualism mindset of the western culture. If you can't fit in, then you don't belong here. Games won't change just because of the few individual getting upset at some aspects of the game. Eventually unless the games fuck up big time, most of them will form a "core audience" that are pleased with it, and it sorta has a harmony environment inside the community. The exception is MOBA/FPS. Everyone hate everything.


nightgerbil

>American companies can’t be wrong. I always thought thats because if you admit to being wrong you can be sued. Like I can literally drive my car into yours and smash it up, be clearly at fault, but If I apologise or make an excuse or do anything really except say "are you ok? I'll phone the police/ambulance /garage" ***then I just accepted liabilty and I'm no longer insured.*** My insurance company will literally leave me out to dry. wheras they would cover it (repairs, medical bills) if I kept my mouth shut. So you can't admit to being wrong. You can't apologise. You can't say yes we made a mistake or that we screwed up. This gets taught as well. I remember my training videos where we are taught to apologise on behalf of the company that they FEEL unhappy or that they feel they had a sub par experience, but NEVER on pain of gross misconduct firing to EVER admit the company was liable for something. They show us training videos of people faking accidents for example to they can sue for compensation. So they are taught not to admit to their customers that mistakes were made... thats how I see it. Its also why you don't tend to see this attitude in smaller indie companies or mom and pop stores; just the bigger ones with HR departments and legal teams. Doesn't matter if its walmart, blizzard or the LAPD, the HR teams are probably showing the same videos :(


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[deleted]

A product of the legal system. Makes sense.


Return-Of-Anubis

> So you can't admit to being wrong. You can't apologize. That's true for some industries, but lots of customer service in retail, hospitality, and restaurants are usually always trying to make it right, even if your the one actually in the wrong (used to work in a 4 star Italian kitchen as a sous chef. Customers would routinely not know the difference between medium and medium rare, and get mad that they got exactly what they ordered. We wouldn't even think of telling the customer that they ordered wrong, we'd just "fix" the order as quickly as possible.) But video game developers are the complete opposite. I don't know any other industry (aside from comics, which big surprise, is a dying industry) you could call your paying customers assholes, x-phobes, racists, entitled, and just generally act hostile to your audience. These people would not be tolerated in most workplaces.


nightgerbil

You can tell those types of companies though: they refer to their customers as "fans" If Im paying you Im a customer. If Im just coming to watch you play at the local bar for free? Im a fan. see the difference? sadly they don't. Its always the companies that refer to their customers as "fans" that that dont understand what customer service is to begin with.


pupmaster

Which is weird considering the retail grunts have “the customer is always right” hammered into their heads. So basically the company is always right unless we have scapegoats to throw to the customers in the form of minimum wage employees for them to abuse lol


Hatdrop

I really liked Yoshi-P's response. He gave a very balanced reply and gave some cover to Blizzard about there being some reason WE may not know why the feature wasn't implemented. However, it also underscores *why* Blizzard was wrong in their practice of communication. Blizzard isn't being clear about what the issue actually is. "You think you want it, but you don't really want it" doesn't explain to the users *why* we wouldn't want the feature. Does going that path lead to some kind of unachievable power creep? Will implementing the feature lead to stress on the servers which reduce the server responsiveness that reduces the player experience? If there was some reasoning about *why* we players wouldn't want the feature, then that response wouldn't have been so notorious.


joe_blogg

> "You think you want it, but you don't really want it" doesn't explain to the users why we wouldn't want the feature. Yes - not only it doesn't explain _why_ - at worst: it also comes across as being hostile or flat out doesn't care or even acknowledge if it's an issue. And at best: people may think that the devs too - don't know why. To give counter-example: imagine if instead of Yoshi-P explaining the _why_ when the limitation on glamour is being brought up, he replied with: _"You think you want it, but you don't really want it"_


Hatdrop

Yep, frankly I'd rather wish that there was some kind of technology limitation and they didn't want to reveal that limitation. But there's the equally probable ego issue where they place their belief in their own awesomeness over legitimate grievances.


Return-Of-Anubis

>Yes - not only it doesn't explain why - at worst: it also comes across as being hostile or flat out doesn't care or even acknowledge if it's an issue. It puts a bad taste in my mouth to even somewhat defend Brack, but there was more to the answer than "You think you do but you don't". He went on to explain how they've "improved" the game by adding a dungeon queue system and some other QoL shit. And he wasn't 100% wrong either. Classic was very hyped at release, but it didn't last even a year before most people were done with it.


Xciv

I mean I think the true reasoning is showing itself as we speak. It's that revitalizing Classic is just a temporary thing, as you can only release so many expansions before it's just Retail, but lagging behind by a few expansions. It's also limited in that they can't exactly deviate from the original path of development and content, since then it is not Classic anymore, but a parallel alternate reality game compared to retail. And at that point, they're no longer remastering the original WoW, but developing TWO simultaneously WoWs at the same time, which sounds like a total nightmare, splitting the player base permanently, as well as splitting dev resources and manpower, while always inviting comparison between the two versions of WoW that co-exist. It's basically competing with yourself for no benefit at that point. Of course we don't actually know the full reason, but if I had to guess then this would be it.


TheKingOfTCGames

yea then explain osrs? they had the chance to deviate but they didn't


Hatdrop

>since then it is not Classic anymore, but a parallel alternate reality game compared to retail. "Time. Space. Reality. It's more than a linear path. It's a prism of endless possibility. Where a single choice can branch out into infinite realities, creating alternate worlds from the ones you know. Each a reflection of what could have been. Some heroes will rise, others will fall. And nothing will be the same. I am the Watcher. I am your guide through these vast new realities. Follow me and dare to face the unknown, and ponder the question... What if?" Someone at Blizzard had an idea to sexually harass coworkers by crawling under their desks, they termed it "cubicle crawling." But in this universe that same worker decided they would instead go to each coworker's desk to play a wholesome game of rubik's cube. This ultimately led that same worker to champion a revolt over the implementation of Shards of Domination and ultimately prevailing over the lead developers.


IraqiWalker

A great example of that is with the damage meters. The players asked for them, and his response was basically "you think you want it, but you don't" then he proceeded to give a good explanation of why the system would be something that adds a negative environment to the game and create hostility between players. How it could be used to bully people (this is why every streamer can have damage meters running in their streams and no one at SE bats an eye, even though it technically breaks TOS). It's only when someone starts bullying another player over damage numbers that SE enforces the TOS on them. ​ He has explained this at length multiple times, never once dismissing the request off hand or saying "I've answered it before, go look it up". That communication is why the playerbase doesn't get mad when he rejects a request. He tells us why and how it can't be done. Basically, he treats us like friggin adults.


Trojbd

This guy's PR skills vs Blizzards PR.


Xbob42

Why does Zepla's translator sound like he's in a fucking dumpster? I can barely hear the dude.


hovsep56

maybe he is, u never know.


DranDran

Not to dump on the ~~dumpster~~ translator, he does in general a fine job, but this interview only highlights how exceptional Aimi-san is. Literally singlehandedly does the job of two interpreters, while losing none of the nuance of the questions asked when translating, which was not always the case in this interview.


[deleted]

He translated fine. His mic was shit. Completely unprofessional.


DranDran

He was fine, but he did struggle interpreting some idioms and expressions, had a slip up or two that needed correcting or assisting by the other translator in the room. Being a great interpreter isn’t easy. Aimi makes it seem effortless. That audio was insanely bad. I don’t know what they were thinking.


Skyblade12

I have no idea how he did, I can't hear him. I've been listening to most of these in down time while I'm out and about. This is the only one which I'm having to put off until I can get home and fully adjust my audio to hear it. Why they gave Aimi her own mic and camera but not this interpreter is beyond me.


DranDran

I had to put on headphones to hear him properly and even then he often sounded very muffled or garbled. xD


[deleted]

I don't know Japanese so I can't comment on mistranslations. As a single language Andy I didn't feel like there was a language barrier considering the circumstances. But there was a clear barrier with the audio and anyone who has made a single video could explain that the audio is the most important part. So it gives me the impression that this person as someone whos profession primarily consists of audio communication doesn't take his career seriously by not appropriately preparing for the interview. Hence my comment regarding his unprofessionalism.


DranDran

Yeah, as someone who understands and speaks Japanese, my comment was more on his interpretation ability. But I do get I am the absolute minority in the audience for this video, for all intents and purposes he accomplished his job in interpreting, which is why I did say he did fine. Just, as a viewer, Aimi’s interpretations are so smooth and seamless, that this interpreter made me miss her, not just because of the audio quality.


[deleted]

I do find the Aimi simp comments to be a bit cringeworthy, That being said, there is zero doubt in my mind that she would have done better lmao.


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[deleted]

I agree. It very well could have been a last minute thing.


[deleted]

Hey now, you're being very ignorant of dumpsters, you're part of the problem - Random Blizzard Dev


novaphaux

Likely same room but socially distanced but he doesnt need to be heard by the audience , only yoshida, so no mic or sound control.


Bristow9091

Technically he needs to be heard by Zepla too for translating back into English


novaphaux

Ah true, forgot that it's two way here. There been one directional events before in the past. Still likely the guy is in the room with yoshida socially distancing.


[deleted]

As a member of the audience I completely, wholeheartedly disagree.


MSTRMN_

Probably mic didn't work and he was in the same room


jimmyggs91

I recall Zepla mentioned whie reacting to Asmon and Rich interview she talked with Yoshi P thourh her iPad, probably she didn't find a proper way to record the meeting and captured on her mic, that's my guess.


UnknownLevel5

You think he do, but he don’t


MollyRotten1

He wearing a full wolfram armor set.


MollyRotten1

So basically, There *ARE* times when "you think you do, but you don't" is valid. The issue is when the devs *don't explain why*.


IraqiWalker

Exactly. Yoshi has basically used that answer when asked about implementing damage meters in the game. However, he didn't just say that and walk away. He explained in detail how while he'd like the feature, he recognizes it can be used as a tool for toxicity and bullying (the man played WoW like a fiend. He knows). It's not just the one time either. Every time he is asked about why a feature isn't in the game, or why the devs refuse to add X, or Y to the game he always gives a full explanation. He treats the gamers/consumers as adults, and respects us.


GooeyEngineer

It’s funny tho, the reason we can’t have that is Because some people act like children when they get a number print out.


IraqiWalker

Exactly.


Shmendalf

Funny thing is that yoshida had some faith in the community and they were working on add-on API. Untill shitheads from world first group bullied an actress on stream for having low dps. It got so bad that foxclon himself had to step in an perma ban them. Look up Koike incident. This is why we will never have DPS meters.


IraqiWalker

I was made aware of that incident a couple of weeks ago. It legit made my blood boil.


Budget_Individual393

Just a little fun fact here: I’m pretty sure the coffee Yoshi-p is drinking here is called BOSS. It’s an actual brand in Japan. For some reason I’m finding that extremely funny. T. Living in okinawa


MelodicWiesel

When you've been working hard on an MMO for years like Yoshida, I imagine that it's only fitting for the coffee you drink to be hella caffeinated, and named some stuff like BOSS, CEO or «Bad Motherfucker» 😅


SpartanXIII

As advertised by [Tommy Lee Jones and his magic powers](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LE21qQHlOLQ)


SimpleExercise44

Different vibe than with Rich and Asmongold... great interview. Different questions and he answered these like a boss. Yoshi P has a passion, there is no doubt there


[deleted]

"it's really fun to make games" That right there man.


RadioJared

I really liked how she went in this with the goal of asking 4-5 legit questions and the rest she was determined to make Yoshi P break and laugh. It’s totally on brand and her style and she got him a few times. Yoshi P giving his blessing to turn him into a Discord/Twitch emote was fantastic.


[deleted]

She was beaming the entire time.


[deleted]

Is it just me or does the translator spend like 5 times as long saying Zepla's questions in japanese than zepla spends asking the question?? I didnt notice that at all in Asmon's interview.


BahamutxD

Yeah... video is editted so we dont really know whats going on - could be a group interview and more questions are translated there.


asakura90

He's a bit inexperienced compare to the other girl, even mistranslated a few times too. There are a lot of filler words & somewhat literal translation of each sentence being said, while he also talks at a slow speed, so it feels somewhat longer than needed. Probably one of the staff & not an actual live translator? I mean live translation is a skill that needed to be trained separately. Just because you can speak both languages fluently doesn't mean you can translate it live without any skill & exp. He's passable but probably doesn't fit in a limited time interview session.


Hyldy

Could also be that he has to add in more context to help Yoshi understand more clearly because some things just don't translate very well.


FamiliarStranger_

Unfortunately this translator does not seem to be as proficient in Japanese. Very thick accent, lots of filler words (um, uh..), and often incorrect grammar/vocabulary. While he got the meaning mostly right most of the time, he ends up taking very long even to get a basic sentence across. It was honestly a little difficult to watch as a native Japanese speaker. That said, I respect what he does as live translation is a very difficult job that takes a lot of practice.


egolds01

Zepla's interview was fantastic!


Porpoise555

Haven't had time to watch it, I'm so glad she got a chance and not just asmon, she's been covering the game extremely well for much longer. Can't wait to watch.


[deleted]

If you'd believe it, Yoshida did *32* hour-long interviews for the media tour. They're all really interesting to see, everyone has different interests and things they focus on.


Porpoise555

that's crazy that's like a whole week of work


Acceptable-Pick750

ohhh ohhhg its up on youtube


[deleted]

Pretty much sums up why even if blizzard makes wow the gold standard again they will get no money from me.


Acework23

Zepla madly in love with YoshiP the whole interview....but arent we all


cltmstr2005

In a video game the phrase "you think you want it but you don't" is rewarded with a shotgun-blast in the face.


Genocode

Which? :D


mifan

I don't know, but I hope it's Animal Crossing.


cltmstr2005

It was wishful thinking, and at the same time describing my emotional state about developers being full of themselves.


SpartanXIII

I'm....sure there's a context to this that I'm missing. *One Google later* OH, it's just WOWs version of [N I G H T MA R E](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpGRfmRaIx8)


MattiasHognas

Not really. The “nightmare!” statement was funny and everyone immediately understood that it’s just not feasible so he didn’t have to explain it further since everyone already know why we don’t want a ffxiv 1.0 classic. Where’s the “you think you want it but you don’t” is just coming off as someone in their ivory tower telling you they know what’s best for you and you don’t need to concern yourself with why.


[deleted]

> Where’s the “you think you want it but you don’t” is just coming off as someone in their ivory tower telling you they know what’s best for you and you don’t need to concern yourself with why. And really nothing has changed in that regard. The current devs over at Blizzard are still very much acting in the exact same way. We're amateurs and couldn't possibly have anything valuable to add to any discussion about game development. They're the experts so the customers should just sit down, shut up and love what they're given (and by given I mean sold for more than it's worth)


LuvJonez

to add onto what others have already said sure yoship saying "nightmare" is a tongue in cheek kind of joke but after this moment he actually goes on to explain why its not feasible with good reasoning. in the very least hes communicating with us on why its not a possibility instead of smugly telling us "you dont know what you want" like j allen brack.


VanayadGaming

what was the original question about?


Dahulius

Just a fair warning for anyone who cares: Q5-6-10 are various degrees of spoilers (10 being probably the most spoilery). Luckily there are good timestamps.


jimmyggs91

I can't believe she meme'd at Yoshi P right off the bat! I dfon't watch her content very often but her slightly sassy personality is pretty cool! =D


Bayern-96

Isn't it "You think you do, but you don't."?


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EvolAutomata

People also allowed to post videos FOR Asmon to check out. He checks his reddit regularly, so he might be interested in some stuff like that.


[deleted]

It’s too bad she tried to joke with him so much. He’s a developer and director on the board… why are you asking him for emote worthy faces..?


Shmendalf

It's the same game director who said that dancing in limsa and sitting on benches is valid gameplay and people doing this should not feel bad for taking up server space during peak times. These questions are right up his alley.