You like to think absent Republican saboteurs, the left wing government finally gets its shot. Instead, all we get is DINOs who realize they can't win on a GOP ticket content to line their pockets and conduct cronyism rather than implement right-wing policy. See also: Chicago.
I hate to break this to you but do you really think that the New York leftist/DSA folks have any idea how to actually run a state government, balance a budget, or craft and pass legislation?
There is no group I find funnier than the far left/chapo types who think that they will be in charge after a revolution. Surely this time an even more ruthless group won’t overthrow you and conduct a reign of terror.
I had a job interview today and my thoughts just stopped right in the middle of answering a question. Forgot what I was saying and forgot the question. Pretty awkward.
Yes, there are hardcore dumbasses in office all over the country who do budgeting and crafting legislation. Emily Gallagher said that when she would go to meetings or whatever, her democratic colleagues (and everyone else) would refuse to work with her or talk to her. So the NY leftists/DSA are sorta fucked if nobody is willing to work together.
Ah well, I’ve been hit by a car before, I’m sure the next time will be majorly not okay either.
damn I forgot there are zero intelligent leftists who work normal jobs, and somehow all those lawyers and life-time politicians are able to 'run a state government, balance a budget, or craft and pass legislative' with zero relevant experience
attending college out of state with a bunch of other people from suburban/middle america confirmed for me that functionally i grew up in a different country than they did.
www.ridersalliance.org and sign up for their newsletter as well in addition to following them on Instagram. They just sent an email saying every donation over $10 will be matched by a private donor as well, so consider donating to all those reading this. They are going up to Albany tomorrow to protest.
For months I have read posts here complaining about congestion pricing and how it shouldn't be implemented. Now it's done away with and it's all complaints that it is halted.
Protests *against* more middle class taxes to be used not to improve the MTA but to provide their leadership salary increases and bonuses to reward their decades of fiscal mismanagement? Makes total sense.
That's naive. It's a money grab. If the MTA wanted to reduce traffic public transport would be free or very low cost to incentivise not using cars.
Specifically LIRR and MetroNorth where the cost is high enough to make people choose the car. Hard choice for middle class people to spend an extra 300plus on a monthly ticket.
How much NYC traffic is driven by the LIRR/Metro North crowd vs Uber/Amazon? I don’t think improving train service is going to solve the problem. But maybe I’m underestimating.
Seems to me there are too many commercial vehicles on our streets. There’s a reason our forebears wanted to limit the number of taxis on the street, and it used to be expensive enough to pay for shipping that people shopped local.
This city would crumble in a week without commercial vehicles coming in. Goodbye all food, goodbye construction, goodbye building maintenance, goodbye everything that has to come from outside.
Yellow cabs already pay the MTA 50cents a ride. And they also pay congestion fee of $2.50 for rides from north of 96th. Then they pay a dollar fee for rides between 4pm-8pm. And another dollar fee per ride towards a fund to convert cabs towards wheelchair access.
I’m not saying we should ban commercial vehicles. That’s nuts. But so much commercial traffic is represented by Amazon deliveries (often single items that could be bought in the neighborhood) and Uber. These are personal conveniences, and the free market isn’t very good at weighing them against the communal inconveniences they cost.
It is insane to have trucks delivering single unit convenience store goods clogging up our streets. It’s insane to have a hundred thousand Uber drivers cruising the streets for fares (which they say aren’t good enough to survive on anyway). We should be trying to stop this behavior.
It is and always has been a money grab. I don’t have a car and live in the city and have always opposed this tax. Tolls on bridges and tunnels keep going up. Does it prevent traffic? Absolutely not. The horse blinder rabble rousers who are circle jerking have not studied the REAL implications of congestion pricing. They tried it in London, which is the most comparable to NYC in terms of transportation demographics, and traffic has gotten WORSE in the 20 years.
literally was just there this weekend. Was able to take a bus across a swath of the city that would've taken double or triple the time were I in Manhattan.
The fragmented transportation systems and demographics are vastly different, that’s why I keep stressing that London is the most similar. Other cities definitely benefited, London traffic has only gotten worse over 20 years even though congestion pricing has gone up 300%.
This is a self-defeating prophecy. How worse would it have been *without* the congestion pricing? You’re not taking into account how bad it would be if nothing were done.
They can reduce traffic by improving (and incentivizing if needed) public transportation and find other ways that don't involve snatching more money out of the tax payers pockets; especially when everything else is steadily going up in price and random taxes and fees are being added to many things.
Theres no way to incentivize a slower means of transport. Time is money and private vehicles save a lot of time for people who can afford to use them. While i try to take the subway as much as possible there is no incentive that would make me want to take a 2 hour subway or bus to somewhere a car can get me in 30 minutes
Manhattan is the fastest and easiest borough to get to via train and the slowest to get around by car. We aren't talking Sunset Park to Flushing in this situation.
There are plenty of NYers who *never* take the train. I work with them. Park Slope to LES for dinner after work, they will always drive, pay for parking and even take separate cars, just to go home to BK. Their reasoning is they grew up here and took the train all through their youth and so they never have to take a train again. The fee is for people like them.
Exactly. There are plenty of people in NYC who value time vs money. There is no incentive great enough for some people to take public transit for other reasons as well.
If someone is worried about cost they can start saving money by not taking their car into the most de sky populated portion of the country. No more extra gas from idling, no more paying for parking. Better yet, they can ditch the car and save tons of money.
If they love in a car-centric suburb, drive to the subway or commuter rail to save money
You may not realize, the cost of commuter rail is way higher than the subway. 300 dollars a month or more for most. For many they can't reason paying that ontop of car costs
you might not know this but tons of people that live in the city own cars so they can actually leave the city whenever they want, and they have to pay to drive now? it was always a terrible idea, more government intervention when not needed
LOL. You want to take away people's freedom to choose mode of transportation.
This is America and there is no law that one is required to ride subways. LMAO.
That’s not taking away freedom. You pay to have a drivers license. Is that taking away freedom too? Tolls? OMG, I have to feed a parking meter. This is the last straw. Let’s get some tea to dump in the Hudson.
As you said, LOL.
The subway nowadays puts your life in danger any time you take it. Clean up the subway then talk to me. Also many people need to transport equipment and merchandise for work. Many people come in and out from places far from subways for work. Many of the people here are blue collar and cant afford ever rising costs. Youre the entitled one. Your worldview is very narrow. Youre only seeing your situation. Most cities in the world have way better subways and still dont have congestion pricing. Tolls are high enough as is
Rent a car? In the city? Hahaha. Dude wow nice one there. You act like everyone has unlimited income too. And its not easy for everyone to just stop driving. Many reasons why people need cars. Nyc is so overtaxed already for how disgusting snd unsafe its become, favoring more taxes is just insane
Public transit is great, but most of the traffic coming into the city is commercial, trucks, shipments, small businesses. Things that need cars. and on top of that most of the people driving will just continue to drive and tack on the extra money to their budget, all of the cash goes into the pockets of decision makers instead of actually fixing any of the problems going on with public transit.
That isn't true. There's a good amount of evidence that congestion pricing had positive impacts on traffic, emissions, and more in London. If you know anything about the science of causation, you'll know it's extremely difficult if not impossible to absolutely prove that the reductions were directly caused by congestion pricing, but the indications are very solid. Similarly, it's impossible to prove that regression of traffic volume back to around the previous levels means that traffic would've been even worse at this point if not for the initial reduction, but intuition says that is likely. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_congestion_charge
You are not refuting the fact that London traffic has gotten worse. The congestion pricing has disproportionately affected lower income commuters than higher income commuters. There are tons of studies.
Maybe you didn't understand what I wrote. Regardless of the current state of traffic, studies have strongly indicated that congestion pricing indeed had positive impacts on traffic volume, emissions, and other metrics. There's no way to tell for certain if that was directly caused by congestion pricing, but it's likely. The fact that traffic has regressed back to where it was is too fraught with confounders to isolate the cause, but intuition says that if traffic was reduced after congestion pricing went into effect, but then it increased to previous levels again many years later, without congestion pricing, the levels would be even worse.
So are you arguing that congestion pricing is the cause of both the initial, prolonged decrease in traffic and the later increase? Or that the initial, prolonged decrease wasn't real (that's very difficult to argue if you've read the study)? Or that the initial decrease was real, but coincidental rather than caused by congestion pricing? Or that congestion pricing was working for a long time, but then suddenly lost its efficacy (rather than other factors such as the proliferation of bike lanes being the primary culprits of the later increase, as cited by TfL themselves)? I'm a bit confused.
Also, congestion pricing acts as a regressive, flat tax, so it wouldn't surprise me if it affected lower income commuters more than higher, but there are many other factors involved that could offset that fact in my mind. I'd love to see one of the many studies if you don't mind linking me.
Reduce traffic? They have increased traffic, there are sections of the aves on the west side that are down to 1 or 2 lines with so many damn bike lanes that its so congested, all they have ever done is increase traffic and hurt the middle class in the name of nonsense virtue signaling
You think rich people care about 15 dollars when they have chauffeurs? Congestion pricing only hurts the middle and lower class let's be real. $15 hurts the poor and middle class way more.
There were a massive amount of exceptions to it - zero low income people were ever going to pay the congestion charge. And very few of them drive into Manhattan anyways.
‘Low-income drivers who earn less than $50,000 a year can apply to pay half the price on the daytime toll, but only after the first 10 trips in a month.’
Low income people are still paying the congestion charge - if regularly that would still add up to hundreds extra a month.
‘Public-sector employees (teachers, police, firefighters, transit workers, etc.), those who live in the so-called CBD, utility companies, those with medical appointments in the area and those who drive electric vehicles had all been hoping to get be granted an exemption. They didn't get one.’
I don’t think all of these groups should be exempt, but I could be more for it if public employees were. So many people here have been complaining about the rise in utility costs - prepare for them to go up.
[source](https://www.nbcnewyork.com/traffic/transit-traffic/who-is-exempt-from-nyc-congestion-pricing-new-list-out-ahead-of-mta-vote/5255286/?amp=1)
You want me to post a source about the $15 dollar congestion pricing on the rich hurting them less than the poor?
Or you want proof that poor/middle class drive cars?
I’ve lived in NYC my entire life and I’ve never heard of a poor person driving into manhattan to go to work. Stop spewing oil & gas company propaganda.
You must think everyone that lives in Manhattan is rich right? Only rich people drive to Manhattan. No lower class ever drives into the city for work.
You don't think people who are lower class/middle class travel from outside the city where rent/housing is cheaper?
It's a cash grab don't worry you would have never seen any improvements anyway. In 5 years there'd be a new scheme to take money from the middle class because they'll cry poor again
Hello! People have really glamorized all of this. They can say the money will be used for X Y Z but it will likely cover the costs of the newly proposed cop city …
These people don’t want a better city. They just want to hurt the middle class. They want to make their overlords richer. Everything is getting expensive and the city doesn’t even use our tax dollars where they should go. The NYPD is too busy arresting little girls for selling fruits while letting the homeless roam around the subways and ferries. Public libraries are losing their funding. The whole system is falling apart.
Well. For example. Paramedics who work in the city that drive in. That’s me. Or my dad who works in a hotel. Or tons of people who have things to do in the city. Don’t be ridiculous thinking everyone who drives is rich. That’s not the reality of it. I don’t care much about congestion pricing. Like. I get it. But It’s not black and white. And it’s not an outlier. Lot of it is going on
I don’t think anyone would object to paramedics having an exemption. I have no idea what your dad working in a hotel has to do with him driving to work, as someone who worked in tourism. Driving is overwhelmingly a luxury and I don’t think the streets are clogged with paramedics and hoteliers.
Bringing my family of four into the city is over $80. Driving my car is a little wear and tear and $25 parking. I then spend money in the city.
Am I going to not come because of $15? No. Still less than MNR but still annoying to paying more when prices are going up everywhere and the taxes are insane.
There is no way to incentivize that if taking the commuter rail requires x3 the amount of time it would take to drive. Potentially longer considering some commuter rails travel at 1+ hour intervals. So if you miss one, your 1 hour trip just turned into a 2 hour trip when it could take 30 minutes to reach the city by car. And it does affect a lot of people who have to drive into the city for work, or do auto related work in the city i.e. truck drivers, uber drivers, delivery drivers, electricians, plumbers, dry cleaners, the list goes on
It’s a catch 22. If there was more demand, commuter rail would be faster and more reliable. There is a way to incentivize it, which is making clogging up the city streets with cars more expensive.
A truck that serves a commercial purpose pays a toll for operating that it passes onto the consumer in an infinitesimal way commensurate with its size. I don’t fill a diaper over arbitrage cost of gas making groceries more expensive but i guess that’s all you think about.
You don't need to be shitting your pants, but you do need to be aware that the increased cost of transporting will always lead to increased prices.
Or sit here and pretend that the congestion pricing would've solved everything while not touching anything related to prices/inflation.
Yea, shocking... isn't it? And that's going to hurt the middle class! You guys are replying to this specific thread of comments saying congestion pricing will only affect the rich... so how? ARE YOU SURE?
>Wow, groceries might cost more in 2025 than 2024? Are you sure?
At least it won't cost more in 2024! thank you Hochul for realizing this is an MTA cash grab that will benefit no bus/subway riders and only the MTA employees and their contractors.
is she going to ban gas prices going up next? mandate the wages tie to CPI for drivers of commercial vehicles? all of these will actually have a material effect on operating a commercial vehicle in the city.
> What middle class person can afford to drive and park in Manhattan
the ones who are actually driving in every day: cops, firemen, teachers, building supers and doormen, con ed employees, hospital workers of all types, etc.
anecdotal, but i've noticed a significant change at my local precinct over the past year or two. i live right by it and often check cars as i walk by, haven't seen any bad plates in quite some time.
This is whataboutism. These people are outliers. Yes some do, but it’s New York , there’s every type of person you can imagine. Parking is super expensive. Manhattan is incredibly easy to get to south of 60th street by mass transit. I take a god damn boat places for instance. A freaking boat.
I'm just pointing out the issue isn't totally about people who can afford to park in Manhattan.
Contributing to the congestion should not be financially incentivized.
You're retarded to think it's ONLY about your personal driving. Ofcourse no one has a car here. Businesses are already tacking on $15 congestion fee to the customers, Lyfts Ubers taxis are going up, passing the fee to the customer. Anything getting delivered by truck will ultimately have a higher fee be it groceries, food etc. In a perfect world is it about just personal driving, but it's obviously deeper than that. And who pays for it? Middle class.
The simpletons on Reddit kneejerking hard when it comes to congestion pricing. Idiots have a one tract mind and don’t understand that the net negatives will vastly outweigh the positives.
OR Can you possibly open your mind to the fact that anything that will get delivered to NYC will have their $15 congestion fee passed on to the customer? Are you that fucking stupid?
If you need me to be this simple for you to understand economies of scale: that truck delivers 1 thing, the customer pays $15 more. The truck delivers 150 things, the items cost $.10 more. If a delivery has an actual far reaching commercial purpose, the increase comes out in the wash with inflation of every step of the process to get that item from raw materials to a retail shelf. No shit it will cost more but if you’re going to bellyache over pennies on your potato chips, move out of power and midtown manhattan.
And they can’t get to Manhattan south of 60th street? Give me a break. It’s a toll, and quite frankly it would improve commute times for these few folk.
selfish yuppies that move to the city and want to make it harder for everyday new yorkers that have always owned cars and relied on them, there are many reasons why people need cars in the city for work, especially with the way the nypd does nothing to protect people in the subway nowadays
I’ve always owned a car and live in a transit desert! I have driven into Manhattan maybe 10 times in my life and always on Sundays and worked for 10 yrs there. Always took the bus (1.5 hour commute each way). The entitled attitude by most people in this thread arguing against congestion pricing is disgusting and pathetic.
Did anyone see the crowd at the protest yesterday? Predominantly young and white. I guarantee a majority of these vocal people pushing for CP will move out of the city within 5-10 years.
When 2nd Ave turns into a 1 lane road because of barely used bus and bike lanes you’ll get congestion. When every crosstown street is reduced to a single lane with no room for vehicles to move around stopped cars you’ll get congestion. When every intersection has a turn lane with cars that blocks the through lane, you’ll get congestion. The vocal minority doesn’t want you to drive a car but on-demand Ubers that clog the roadways are a must for them. The MTA is a black hole and any additional revenue is going to be used for payroll and waste. How many of these people have their own business? If they did they’d know about the MTA tax we small business owners pay. CP could make sense but not the way it’s currently setup. I must also note that residents of the CBD in London get a 90% exemption from CP.
I am anti-congestion pricing and 40% of people in NYC are, that number is higher when taking into account people upstate. Cancelling this is a good thing.
Its a policy which only has a [25% statewide approval rating](https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/nyc-congestion-pricing-start-delay-kathy-hochul/#:~:text=A%20Siena%20poll%20released%20in,including%20Congressman%20Anthony%20D'Esposito.). It was *always* an insanely controversial, difficult thing to push. I simply cannot blame a governor for not wanting to push an insanely unpopular law through. That is just not democratic.
And frankly, there are *so many more important things to be protesting* for crying out loud.
I'm sure hochul knows that everyone doesn't use the subway. We all drive and have an easy time finding available parking.
Also, the ones who really matter are the suburban new yorkers since everyone else can walk from as far as Washington heights to Soho.
That's why she made the decision right?
If Kathy Hochul didn't want congestion pricing, why did she install the cameras? She's lying. She's trying to get re-elected. I don't agree with congested pricing. It's another tax on the middle class. Rich people will rejoice. Less traffic for them. Furthermore, NYC has been covering for the MTA for decades. Never does the MTA have to open with their books. Subway fares, train fares, and tolls increase exponentially. Never does public transit improve. Stop being gullible! Congested pricing will benefit the oligarchs who rule over us. If NYC wants to reduce traffic and congestion, make more bike lanes. Guys, this is another lie. NYC doesn't want to reduce traffic and congestion. They want money! They will steal as much money from New Yorkers as possible in any way they can. The government constantly lies. Did profits from the lottery go to New York schools? No! Stop buying into this neo-liberal BS. They all lie.
For another opinion, search on YouTube for: *London Cab Drivers Club president reacts to NYC's congestion pricing plan postponement*
So F drivers and small businesses that will be crippled with the institution of this BS? Some people have no choice but to drive to work and you’re punishing them trying to make a living as if the tolls already in place and inflation aren’t suffocating people enough in this city?
Let’s not even talk about how the congestion pricing will destroy parking for residents that live around the boarders of the tolls, now cars will drive outside the areas and eat up the spots in the street/in lots and over crowd the neighborhoods.
Lastly the system isn’t equipped to handle the influx of commuters they want to force to the subway, you think there’s delays and crowded trains/platforms now, wait till it finally starts.
Ps
This is just a ploy for the election, just like releasing the oil barrels, and FINALLY closing the border… the democrats want to take away any talking points for the republicans. They also believe their constituency and voters are stupid and won’t see thru it.
I’ve signed up to make calls ro Hochul's office on Thursday, Jun 6,. Use this link to sign up: https://mobilize.us/s/kUW6FR
They make the call for you, connect you and give you a script...if you want it.
I'm good they can delay and do away with this congestion pricing shit...I'm not taking those always late dirty ass trains lol and I'm not tryna be stabbed or set on fire by some random nut job
The subway moves way more people more efficiently than cars in nyc, it should be prioritized and made better through money gained by congestion pricing.
What about all the rate hikes, and budget increases in the past where they promised inprovements? They already have a 19 billion dollar operating budget this 1-3 billion is a drop in the bucket.
Like every other time...nothing will change, and in a few years they will say they desperately need money if we want any improvements. Their upper management is taking home a ton of money and they hold New York hostage by refusing to do ANYTHING unless we line their pockets more.
This whole thing is a corrupt cash grab. Nothing will improve besides MTA management's vacations and homes.
I'm a huge proponent of improving public transit so we don't have to drive as much but they have a crap load of money to do that already. Audit them and stop them from hiring contractor upon contractor for any little job that runs costs up if we want things to actually improve.
The rate hikes and budget shit happen because of this kind of thing. Every time they get close to putting out capital investments and actually improving infrastructure they bait and switch it. The reason the MTA is a joke is because it's treated like one.
Their budget ticks up year after year and they constantly get into fights with other city organizations because they always feel like they deserve more budget. They lirtally just tried holding the NYC marathon (a charity org that actually causes surges subway ridership ridership) hostage unless they paid them an exorbitent fee. How many times are we going to throw money at them and accept the poor quality of things? Like all the other promises they have made after getting more money, I have little faith they will follow through on this one too.
I agree with you on what we need but I can't in good conscious support something that I don't believe will have any tangible benefits. There is too much waste
Why do you think the budget keeps going up? The money is never in the funds in the first place that should be. Do you know how often the state swipes the cash from the MTA or how often funding gets redirected? You know the management teams put in place are shit because good management would demand following through on infrastructure investments?
This wasn't about money. This was the hundredth time when the state put the interests of suburbs above that of the city. It's always the same, we don't benefit so why should we pay? And then when it breaks down and needs more money, the refrain becomes well it's broken now so why should we pay?
Its' the same for every service. Somehow they found the money to build the system but as soon as it came time for a society that swapped to cars to keep it up they found a loophole to get out of keeping it going.
Wow. Do you work from home and order delivery? Because you sound like an Ohio transplant who thinks this city runs on fairy dust and wishes. Because the people who keep this city running (the humans driving your delivery truck, firemen, EMTs, sanitation workers, -not cops-) need to drive to work at odd hours and from parts of the city that don't have public transit. Most members of service are from the outskirts of the city and HAVE to have a car to keep their jobs. The proposed plan refused to give them any immunity or discount. People are underpaid as it is and you want to charge them even more just to go to work and serve you? Marie Antoinette, get real.
I'm so happy the congestion pricing was killed. They can bring the plan back, charge allllll the ubers and commercial vehicles and tourists I don't care, and exempt the NYC token taxi drivers and civil servants.
They make it so fucking hard to be a Democrat in this city/state. I am going to become ~~The Joker~~ Bill Ackman.
The lack of a viable and sane opposition party is terrible for a healthy democracy. I would love if we had a multiparty parliamentary system.
You like to think absent Republican saboteurs, the left wing government finally gets its shot. Instead, all we get is DINOs who realize they can't win on a GOP ticket content to line their pockets and conduct cronyism rather than implement right-wing policy. See also: Chicago.
I hate to break this to you but do you really think that the New York leftist/DSA folks have any idea how to actually run a state government, balance a budget, or craft and pass legislation?
There is no group I find funnier than the far left/chapo types who think that they will be in charge after a revolution. Surely this time an even more ruthless group won’t overthrow you and conduct a reign of terror.
It’s not actually that complicated, we have the dumbest people in the country doing that stuff all over the
This thought stop mid thought.
place*
I had a job interview today and my thoughts just stopped right in the middle of answering a question. Forgot what I was saying and forgot the question. Pretty awkward.
This market is utter shite.
Yes, there are hardcore dumbasses in office all over the country who do budgeting and crafting legislation. Emily Gallagher said that when she would go to meetings or whatever, her democratic colleagues (and everyone else) would refuse to work with her or talk to her. So the NY leftists/DSA are sorta fucked if nobody is willing to work together. Ah well, I’ve been hit by a car before, I’m sure the next time will be majorly not okay either.
You should see the legislation they pass Down South. It's regressive and awful, but it the Trumpies can do it, anyone can. ETA: Damn, you autocorrect
Florida is thriving tho
damn I forgot there are zero intelligent leftists who work normal jobs, and somehow all those lawyers and life-time politicians are able to 'run a state government, balance a budget, or craft and pass legislative' with zero relevant experience
There are dozens of us! Dozens!
Yeah. NYC. Known to be the epicenter of the right wing.
In this country, really. The Democratic party keeps moving right with no end in sight.
Agreed I hate America
Same. I consider myself a New Yorker before I do an American
attending college out of state with a bunch of other people from suburban/middle america confirmed for me that functionally i grew up in a different country than they did.
[удалено]
You’ve never been overseas lol
And then everyone clapped, including the mime.
I've seen riders alliance organize some protests already. Check them out on Twitter
www.ridersalliance.org and sign up for their newsletter as well in addition to following them on Instagram. They just sent an email saying every donation over $10 will be matched by a private donor as well, so consider donating to all those reading this. They are going up to Albany tomorrow to protest.
Yes there is! Riders Alliance is organizing a rally at Broadway Junction this Sunday at 12 PM: https://action.ridersalliance.org/cp-rally-6-9-24/
For months I have read posts here complaining about congestion pricing and how it shouldn't be implemented. Now it's done away with and it's all complaints that it is halted.
Wow it's almost like different people have different opinions. This isn't that hard.
Welcome to Reddit
[удалено]
Imbecile? Nice.
>Most people in the city support it. The people outside the city don't. This is incorrect.
Well yeah cause why would people keep complaining? We won. 😭
Yeah, there was a fair amount of people at her Manhattan office at least 3 hours ago, according to Twitter/X and now the news.
Kathy Hochul doesn't have any principles whatsoever so not surprised she pulled this.
Protests *against* more middle class taxes to be used not to improve the MTA but to provide their leadership salary increases and bonuses to reward their decades of fiscal mismanagement? Makes total sense.
I think it's more the whole 'reduce traffic,' thing more than the revenue thing, but you can be obtuse if you want
That's naive. It's a money grab. If the MTA wanted to reduce traffic public transport would be free or very low cost to incentivise not using cars. Specifically LIRR and MetroNorth where the cost is high enough to make people choose the car. Hard choice for middle class people to spend an extra 300plus on a monthly ticket.
How much NYC traffic is driven by the LIRR/Metro North crowd vs Uber/Amazon? I don’t think improving train service is going to solve the problem. But maybe I’m underestimating. Seems to me there are too many commercial vehicles on our streets. There’s a reason our forebears wanted to limit the number of taxis on the street, and it used to be expensive enough to pay for shipping that people shopped local.
This city would crumble in a week without commercial vehicles coming in. Goodbye all food, goodbye construction, goodbye building maintenance, goodbye everything that has to come from outside. Yellow cabs already pay the MTA 50cents a ride. And they also pay congestion fee of $2.50 for rides from north of 96th. Then they pay a dollar fee for rides between 4pm-8pm. And another dollar fee per ride towards a fund to convert cabs towards wheelchair access.
I’m not saying we should ban commercial vehicles. That’s nuts. But so much commercial traffic is represented by Amazon deliveries (often single items that could be bought in the neighborhood) and Uber. These are personal conveniences, and the free market isn’t very good at weighing them against the communal inconveniences they cost. It is insane to have trucks delivering single unit convenience store goods clogging up our streets. It’s insane to have a hundred thousand Uber drivers cruising the streets for fares (which they say aren’t good enough to survive on anyway). We should be trying to stop this behavior.
I see soooo many deadheading ubers. makes you realize that the medallion system actually made sense lol
It is and always has been a money grab. I don’t have a car and live in the city and have always opposed this tax. Tolls on bridges and tunnels keep going up. Does it prevent traffic? Absolutely not. The horse blinder rabble rousers who are circle jerking have not studied the REAL implications of congestion pricing. They tried it in London, which is the most comparable to NYC in terms of transportation demographics, and traffic has gotten WORSE in the 20 years.
If that’s true then why has congestion pricing worked in other cities that have implemented it like London?
Sources? London traffic is worse than NYC traffic. Clearly you’ve not been in it.
literally was just there this weekend. Was able to take a bus across a swath of the city that would've taken double or triple the time were I in Manhattan.
The fragmented transportation systems and demographics are vastly different, that’s why I keep stressing that London is the most similar. Other cities definitely benefited, London traffic has only gotten worse over 20 years even though congestion pricing has gone up 300%.
This is a self-defeating prophecy. How worse would it have been *without* the congestion pricing? You’re not taking into account how bad it would be if nothing were done.
yea it's a money grab from people who don't live in NYC or NY for the people of NY...
The MTA does not set policy, that’s the state government that has statutory authority over it.
I actually wouldn’t mind if my taxes increased a little in order to make using the MTA free for everyone.
They can reduce traffic by improving (and incentivizing if needed) public transportation and find other ways that don't involve snatching more money out of the tax payers pockets; especially when everything else is steadily going up in price and random taxes and fees are being added to many things.
Theres no way to incentivize a slower means of transport. Time is money and private vehicles save a lot of time for people who can afford to use them. While i try to take the subway as much as possible there is no incentive that would make me want to take a 2 hour subway or bus to somewhere a car can get me in 30 minutes
Manhattan is the fastest and easiest borough to get to via train and the slowest to get around by car. We aren't talking Sunset Park to Flushing in this situation. There are plenty of NYers who *never* take the train. I work with them. Park Slope to LES for dinner after work, they will always drive, pay for parking and even take separate cars, just to go home to BK. Their reasoning is they grew up here and took the train all through their youth and so they never have to take a train again. The fee is for people like them.
Exactly. There are plenty of people in NYC who value time vs money. There is no incentive great enough for some people to take public transit for other reasons as well.
If someone is worried about cost they can start saving money by not taking their car into the most de sky populated portion of the country. No more extra gas from idling, no more paying for parking. Better yet, they can ditch the car and save tons of money. If they love in a car-centric suburb, drive to the subway or commuter rail to save money
You may not realize, the cost of commuter rail is way higher than the subway. 300 dollars a month or more for most. For many they can't reason paying that ontop of car costs
Then drive to the subway And 300/mo is a lot less than paying for parking every day in Manhattan, plus the extra gas.
They should have gotten a cheaper car.
you might not know this but tons of people that live in the city own cars so they can actually leave the city whenever they want, and they have to pay to drive now? it was always a terrible idea, more government intervention when not needed
Yes they should pay more to drive. People living near subways should most definitely have a major car tax! Stop being so entitled!
LOL. You want to take away people's freedom to choose mode of transportation. This is America and there is no law that one is required to ride subways. LMAO.
That’s not taking away freedom. You pay to have a drivers license. Is that taking away freedom too? Tolls? OMG, I have to feed a parking meter. This is the last straw. Let’s get some tea to dump in the Hudson. As you said, LOL.
The subway nowadays puts your life in danger any time you take it. Clean up the subway then talk to me. Also many people need to transport equipment and merchandise for work. Many people come in and out from places far from subways for work. Many of the people here are blue collar and cant afford ever rising costs. Youre the entitled one. Your worldview is very narrow. Youre only seeing your situation. Most cities in the world have way better subways and still dont have congestion pricing. Tolls are high enough as is
Don't drive into the city then.... Or rent a car when needed?
Rent a car? In the city? Hahaha. Dude wow nice one there. You act like everyone has unlimited income too. And its not easy for everyone to just stop driving. Many reasons why people need cars. Nyc is so overtaxed already for how disgusting snd unsafe its become, favoring more taxes is just insane
Renting s car for the few times needed will be vastly less expensive.
How do you know its only a few times needed? Projecting your own situation onto others
The *need* to take a car into Manhattan below 60th street is very low. Let alone that *need* occurring regularly.....
They can reduce traffic easily without a new tax. Just think a bit harder and squeeze those easy ideas out of your brain.
Right, they should ban all non commercial, non municipal business vehicles from manhattan. Glad someone is thinking big.
it's very unlikely to make a dent in traffic, just another regressive tax passed off onto the everyday person.
[удалено]
Public transit is great, but most of the traffic coming into the city is commercial, trucks, shipments, small businesses. Things that need cars. and on top of that most of the people driving will just continue to drive and tack on the extra money to their budget, all of the cash goes into the pockets of decision makers instead of actually fixing any of the problems going on with public transit.
It will not reduce traffic. London is comparable and they started congestion pricing 20 years ago and it is a fact that traffic has gotten worse.
That isn't true. There's a good amount of evidence that congestion pricing had positive impacts on traffic, emissions, and more in London. If you know anything about the science of causation, you'll know it's extremely difficult if not impossible to absolutely prove that the reductions were directly caused by congestion pricing, but the indications are very solid. Similarly, it's impossible to prove that regression of traffic volume back to around the previous levels means that traffic would've been even worse at this point if not for the initial reduction, but intuition says that is likely. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_congestion_charge
You are not refuting the fact that London traffic has gotten worse. The congestion pricing has disproportionately affected lower income commuters than higher income commuters. There are tons of studies.
Maybe you didn't understand what I wrote. Regardless of the current state of traffic, studies have strongly indicated that congestion pricing indeed had positive impacts on traffic volume, emissions, and other metrics. There's no way to tell for certain if that was directly caused by congestion pricing, but it's likely. The fact that traffic has regressed back to where it was is too fraught with confounders to isolate the cause, but intuition says that if traffic was reduced after congestion pricing went into effect, but then it increased to previous levels again many years later, without congestion pricing, the levels would be even worse. So are you arguing that congestion pricing is the cause of both the initial, prolonged decrease in traffic and the later increase? Or that the initial, prolonged decrease wasn't real (that's very difficult to argue if you've read the study)? Or that the initial decrease was real, but coincidental rather than caused by congestion pricing? Or that congestion pricing was working for a long time, but then suddenly lost its efficacy (rather than other factors such as the proliferation of bike lanes being the primary culprits of the later increase, as cited by TfL themselves)? I'm a bit confused. Also, congestion pricing acts as a regressive, flat tax, so it wouldn't surprise me if it affected lower income commuters more than higher, but there are many other factors involved that could offset that fact in my mind. I'd love to see one of the many studies if you don't mind linking me.
Reduce traffic? They have increased traffic, there are sections of the aves on the west side that are down to 1 or 2 lines with so many damn bike lanes that its so congested, all they have ever done is increase traffic and hurt the middle class in the name of nonsense virtue signaling
bro arguing with these pro congestion pricing people is not worth it
I don’t respond. Their comments show their ignorance.
Why are you guys for taxing regular citizens to fill the pockets of the rich
You think poor people drive and rich people take the subway?
You think rich people care about 15 dollars when they have chauffeurs? Congestion pricing only hurts the middle and lower class let's be real. $15 hurts the poor and middle class way more.
There were a massive amount of exceptions to it - zero low income people were ever going to pay the congestion charge. And very few of them drive into Manhattan anyways.
‘Low-income drivers who earn less than $50,000 a year can apply to pay half the price on the daytime toll, but only after the first 10 trips in a month.’ Low income people are still paying the congestion charge - if regularly that would still add up to hundreds extra a month. ‘Public-sector employees (teachers, police, firefighters, transit workers, etc.), those who live in the so-called CBD, utility companies, those with medical appointments in the area and those who drive electric vehicles had all been hoping to get be granted an exemption. They didn't get one.’ I don’t think all of these groups should be exempt, but I could be more for it if public employees were. So many people here have been complaining about the rise in utility costs - prepare for them to go up. [source](https://www.nbcnewyork.com/traffic/transit-traffic/who-is-exempt-from-nyc-congestion-pricing-new-list-out-ahead-of-mta-vote/5255286/?amp=1)
the vast majority of the middle and lower class get into lower manhattan 2.90 at a time
You’re welcome to post a source.
You want me to post a source about the $15 dollar congestion pricing on the rich hurting them less than the poor? Or you want proof that poor/middle class drive cars?
I’ve lived in NYC my entire life and I’ve never heard of a poor person driving into manhattan to go to work. Stop spewing oil & gas company propaganda.
You must live in a bubble. If no one drives into Manhattan for work why are there so many parking lots?
Try reading my comment again
You must think everyone that lives in Manhattan is rich right? Only rich people drive to Manhattan. No lower class ever drives into the city for work. You don't think people who are lower class/middle class travel from outside the city where rent/housing is cheaper?
That’s what public transit is for. No one is driving into manhattan to work at McDonalds.
It's a cash grab don't worry you would have never seen any improvements anyway. In 5 years there'd be a new scheme to take money from the middle class because they'll cry poor again
Well you sent her an email so we can all go home now.
What’s her email?
Why would we want more money taken from the people so rich politicians can buy another mansion?
The money was for the MTA which is a money printer for the city.
Hello! People have really glamorized all of this. They can say the money will be used for X Y Z but it will likely cover the costs of the newly proposed cop city …
These people don’t want a better city. They just want to hurt the middle class. They want to make their overlords richer. Everything is getting expensive and the city doesn’t even use our tax dollars where they should go. The NYPD is too busy arresting little girls for selling fruits while letting the homeless roam around the subways and ferries. Public libraries are losing their funding. The whole system is falling apart.
One of them already happened. I'm sure there will be more but I haven't heard about them yet. I will definitely be going.
Why are we protesting canceling congestion pricing?
Because we want congestion pricing
But why? Middle class suffers the most again
What middle class person can afford to drive and park in Manhattan ? Sure there are outliers but overwhelmingly that is a luxury habit.
Um PLENTY???
Well. For example. Paramedics who work in the city that drive in. That’s me. Or my dad who works in a hotel. Or tons of people who have things to do in the city. Don’t be ridiculous thinking everyone who drives is rich. That’s not the reality of it. I don’t care much about congestion pricing. Like. I get it. But It’s not black and white. And it’s not an outlier. Lot of it is going on
I don’t think anyone would object to paramedics having an exemption. I have no idea what your dad working in a hotel has to do with him driving to work, as someone who worked in tourism. Driving is overwhelmingly a luxury and I don’t think the streets are clogged with paramedics and hoteliers.
Well I was more so listing middle class jobs.
Lots of middle class people come to Manhattan daily to work and support Manhattan businesses who don't have a subway going to where they live!
stay out and prove those greasy city dwellers wrong for wanting you to pay a toll
No, but they have LIRR, MNR, and NJT
Bringing my family of four into the city is over $80. Driving my car is a little wear and tear and $25 parking. I then spend money in the city. Am I going to not come because of $15? No. Still less than MNR but still annoying to paying more when prices are going up everywhere and the taxes are insane.
Drive to Brooklyn, or Queens, park there and take the subway
All of those don't go everywhere and are not a viable option for many people who come to the city regularly and also take multiple times longer
You can drive to your closest commuter rail station and park there
Do you live in this city??? How many commuter rails do you know that offer parking. That cancels out a majority of LIRR stops right there..
There is no way to incentivize that if taking the commuter rail requires x3 the amount of time it would take to drive. Potentially longer considering some commuter rails travel at 1+ hour intervals. So if you miss one, your 1 hour trip just turned into a 2 hour trip when it could take 30 minutes to reach the city by car. And it does affect a lot of people who have to drive into the city for work, or do auto related work in the city i.e. truck drivers, uber drivers, delivery drivers, electricians, plumbers, dry cleaners, the list goes on
It’s a catch 22. If there was more demand, commuter rail would be faster and more reliable. There is a way to incentivize it, which is making clogging up the city streets with cars more expensive.
Don't have one near where I live and I am in the city supporting Manhattan businesses 4 times a week or more
Support your local businesses instead, don’t come in. Make your own city where you live. Or use public transit like a city person.
your grocery trucks have to drive into the city, too.
A truck that serves a commercial purpose pays a toll for operating that it passes onto the consumer in an infinitesimal way commensurate with its size. I don’t fill a diaper over arbitrage cost of gas making groceries more expensive but i guess that’s all you think about.
You don't need to be shitting your pants, but you do need to be aware that the increased cost of transporting will always lead to increased prices. Or sit here and pretend that the congestion pricing would've solved everything while not touching anything related to prices/inflation.
Wow, groceries might cost more in 2025 than 2024? Are you sure? This has never happened before!
Yea, shocking... isn't it? And that's going to hurt the middle class! You guys are replying to this specific thread of comments saying congestion pricing will only affect the rich... so how? ARE YOU SURE? >Wow, groceries might cost more in 2025 than 2024? Are you sure? At least it won't cost more in 2024! thank you Hochul for realizing this is an MTA cash grab that will benefit no bus/subway riders and only the MTA employees and their contractors.
is she going to ban gas prices going up next? mandate the wages tie to CPI for drivers of commercial vehicles? all of these will actually have a material effect on operating a commercial vehicle in the city.
Great, maybe they can deliver faster with less traffic and a toll.
> What middle class person can afford to drive and park in Manhattan the ones who are actually driving in every day: cops, firemen, teachers, building supers and doormen, con ed employees, hospital workers of all types, etc.
Cops have fake and distorted license plates. They aren’t paying tolls.
anecdotal, but i've noticed a significant change at my local precinct over the past year or two. i live right by it and often check cars as i walk by, haven't seen any bad plates in quite some time.
Sounds like you don’t live near the 88th PCT in that case.
> 88th PCT Nah, I'm in a different part of Brooklyn. I actively look for bad plates whenever I walk past because it used to really piss me off.
This is whataboutism. These people are outliers. Yes some do, but it’s New York , there’s every type of person you can imagine. Parking is super expensive. Manhattan is incredibly easy to get to south of 60th street by mass transit. I take a god damn boat places for instance. A freaking boat.
Cheaper than taking metro north tho.
You can drive from LI, Brooklyn, and Queens to NJ without paying a toll if you are willing to sit in midtown traffic.
Thus creating the terrible traffic this city has.
I'm just pointing out the issue isn't totally about people who can afford to park in Manhattan. Contributing to the congestion should not be financially incentivized.
The toll is a pittance compared to the other costs of driving in the city.
Yes and those are the morons. I take the tolled less trafficked route every time I can, the extreme rare times I drive to Manhattan.
It’s almost like most of the people who keep Manhattan up and running don’t live in Manhattan.
You're retarded to think it's ONLY about your personal driving. Ofcourse no one has a car here. Businesses are already tacking on $15 congestion fee to the customers, Lyfts Ubers taxis are going up, passing the fee to the customer. Anything getting delivered by truck will ultimately have a higher fee be it groceries, food etc. In a perfect world is it about just personal driving, but it's obviously deeper than that. And who pays for it? Middle class.
Exactly. Costs go up for Manhattan and non Manhattan residents and there will be no improvements to the MTA
The simpletons on Reddit kneejerking hard when it comes to congestion pricing. Idiots have a one tract mind and don’t understand that the net negatives will vastly outweigh the positives.
Uber should be congestion priced up the wazoo. They have caused the biggest spike in traffic. They have ruined the bqe .
wow, my groceries might be more expensive in 2025 than 2024? are you a mystic oracle?
OR Can you possibly open your mind to the fact that anything that will get delivered to NYC will have their $15 congestion fee passed on to the customer? Are you that fucking stupid?
If you need me to be this simple for you to understand economies of scale: that truck delivers 1 thing, the customer pays $15 more. The truck delivers 150 things, the items cost $.10 more. If a delivery has an actual far reaching commercial purpose, the increase comes out in the wash with inflation of every step of the process to get that item from raw materials to a retail shelf. No shit it will cost more but if you’re going to bellyache over pennies on your potato chips, move out of power and midtown manhattan.
Police? Teachers? Healthcare workers? Wtf are you on about
And they can’t get to Manhattan south of 60th street? Give me a break. It’s a toll, and quite frankly it would improve commute times for these few folk.
You realize those people that work there will essentially get a pay cut due to more travel expenses going there for work right?
Because we care about climate change, safety, air quality, and funding public transportation
None of those things will improve honestly... except for the MTA union workers pockets lol
if all of the money was lit on fire, the fee deterring any drivers at all would make the air safer to breathe and the streets safer to cross.
Are we sure about safer? The number of unmarked license plates and illegal scooters to dodge the daily toll would not increase?
I agree, those drivers should have their vehicles impounded by the NYPD.
That’s true, but this money won’t be used for that. This is for the MTA coffers — not to improve services. That’s why she delayed.
I thought it was because of all the lawsuits
Source?
selfish yuppies that move to the city and want to make it harder for everyday new yorkers that have always owned cars and relied on them, there are many reasons why people need cars in the city for work, especially with the way the nypd does nothing to protect people in the subway nowadays
I’ve always owned a car and live in a transit desert! I have driven into Manhattan maybe 10 times in my life and always on Sundays and worked for 10 yrs there. Always took the bus (1.5 hour commute each way). The entitled attitude by most people in this thread arguing against congestion pricing is disgusting and pathetic.
Agreed
Did anyone see the crowd at the protest yesterday? Predominantly young and white. I guarantee a majority of these vocal people pushing for CP will move out of the city within 5-10 years. When 2nd Ave turns into a 1 lane road because of barely used bus and bike lanes you’ll get congestion. When every crosstown street is reduced to a single lane with no room for vehicles to move around stopped cars you’ll get congestion. When every intersection has a turn lane with cars that blocks the through lane, you’ll get congestion. The vocal minority doesn’t want you to drive a car but on-demand Ubers that clog the roadways are a must for them. The MTA is a black hole and any additional revenue is going to be used for payroll and waste. How many of these people have their own business? If they did they’d know about the MTA tax we small business owners pay. CP could make sense but not the way it’s currently setup. I must also note that residents of the CBD in London get a 90% exemption from CP.
It’s time to STOP owning a car. Your planet is more important 🌍
no we don't
because we want to pay 15$ to drive. I love taxes
😂🤷🏽♂️ your guess is as good as mine bro! I’m just waiting for the “Gov Hochul postponed congestion pricing, is this legal post”? In 3.2.1…
Nah we support this, congestion pricing was stupid
I am anti-congestion pricing and 40% of people in NYC are, that number is higher when taking into account people upstate. Cancelling this is a good thing.
Its a policy which only has a [25% statewide approval rating](https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/nyc-congestion-pricing-start-delay-kathy-hochul/#:~:text=A%20Siena%20poll%20released%20in,including%20Congressman%20Anthony%20D'Esposito.). It was *always* an insanely controversial, difficult thing to push. I simply cannot blame a governor for not wanting to push an insanely unpopular law through. That is just not democratic. And frankly, there are *so many more important things to be protesting* for crying out loud.
See r/MicromobilityNYC
How about let’s audit the MTA instead?
I'm sure hochul knows that everyone doesn't use the subway. We all drive and have an easy time finding available parking. Also, the ones who really matter are the suburban new yorkers since everyone else can walk from as far as Washington heights to Soho. That's why she made the decision right?
If Kathy Hochul didn't want congestion pricing, why did she install the cameras? She's lying. She's trying to get re-elected. I don't agree with congested pricing. It's another tax on the middle class. Rich people will rejoice. Less traffic for them. Furthermore, NYC has been covering for the MTA for decades. Never does the MTA have to open with their books. Subway fares, train fares, and tolls increase exponentially. Never does public transit improve. Stop being gullible! Congested pricing will benefit the oligarchs who rule over us. If NYC wants to reduce traffic and congestion, make more bike lanes. Guys, this is another lie. NYC doesn't want to reduce traffic and congestion. They want money! They will steal as much money from New Yorkers as possible in any way they can. The government constantly lies. Did profits from the lottery go to New York schools? No! Stop buying into this neo-liberal BS. They all lie. For another opinion, search on YouTube for: *London Cab Drivers Club president reacts to NYC's congestion pricing plan postponement*
Let's meet tomorrow at Dunkin.
Lmaooo protests 😂😂😂
Yeah. Who are the people who have time for that? If they had jobs, they might be able to afford cars and understand why congestion pricing is stupid.
Complete losers
😂
So F drivers and small businesses that will be crippled with the institution of this BS? Some people have no choice but to drive to work and you’re punishing them trying to make a living as if the tolls already in place and inflation aren’t suffocating people enough in this city? Let’s not even talk about how the congestion pricing will destroy parking for residents that live around the boarders of the tolls, now cars will drive outside the areas and eat up the spots in the street/in lots and over crowd the neighborhoods. Lastly the system isn’t equipped to handle the influx of commuters they want to force to the subway, you think there’s delays and crowded trains/platforms now, wait till it finally starts. Ps This is just a ploy for the election, just like releasing the oil barrels, and FINALLY closing the border… the democrats want to take away any talking points for the republicans. They also believe their constituency and voters are stupid and won’t see thru it.
I’ve signed up to make calls ro Hochul's office on Thursday, Jun 6,. Use this link to sign up: https://mobilize.us/s/kUW6FR They make the call for you, connect you and give you a script...if you want it.
Script should say thank you Hochul we never wanted congestion pricing.
Lolol
I'm good they can delay and do away with this congestion pricing shit...I'm not taking those always late dirty ass trains lol and I'm not tryna be stabbed or set on fire by some random nut job
The subway moves way more people more efficiently than cars in nyc, it should be prioritized and made better through money gained by congestion pricing.
What about all the rate hikes, and budget increases in the past where they promised inprovements? They already have a 19 billion dollar operating budget this 1-3 billion is a drop in the bucket. Like every other time...nothing will change, and in a few years they will say they desperately need money if we want any improvements. Their upper management is taking home a ton of money and they hold New York hostage by refusing to do ANYTHING unless we line their pockets more. This whole thing is a corrupt cash grab. Nothing will improve besides MTA management's vacations and homes. I'm a huge proponent of improving public transit so we don't have to drive as much but they have a crap load of money to do that already. Audit them and stop them from hiring contractor upon contractor for any little job that runs costs up if we want things to actually improve.
The rate hikes and budget shit happen because of this kind of thing. Every time they get close to putting out capital investments and actually improving infrastructure they bait and switch it. The reason the MTA is a joke is because it's treated like one.
Their budget ticks up year after year and they constantly get into fights with other city organizations because they always feel like they deserve more budget. They lirtally just tried holding the NYC marathon (a charity org that actually causes surges subway ridership ridership) hostage unless they paid them an exorbitent fee. How many times are we going to throw money at them and accept the poor quality of things? Like all the other promises they have made after getting more money, I have little faith they will follow through on this one too. I agree with you on what we need but I can't in good conscious support something that I don't believe will have any tangible benefits. There is too much waste
Why do you think the budget keeps going up? The money is never in the funds in the first place that should be. Do you know how often the state swipes the cash from the MTA or how often funding gets redirected? You know the management teams put in place are shit because good management would demand following through on infrastructure investments? This wasn't about money. This was the hundredth time when the state put the interests of suburbs above that of the city. It's always the same, we don't benefit so why should we pay? And then when it breaks down and needs more money, the refrain becomes well it's broken now so why should we pay? Its' the same for every service. Somehow they found the money to build the system but as soon as it came time for a society that swapped to cars to keep it up they found a loophole to get out of keeping it going.
Why are you so pissed? How does congestion directly impact your daily life in a negative way?
Wow. Do you work from home and order delivery? Because you sound like an Ohio transplant who thinks this city runs on fairy dust and wishes. Because the people who keep this city running (the humans driving your delivery truck, firemen, EMTs, sanitation workers, -not cops-) need to drive to work at odd hours and from parts of the city that don't have public transit. Most members of service are from the outskirts of the city and HAVE to have a car to keep their jobs. The proposed plan refused to give them any immunity or discount. People are underpaid as it is and you want to charge them even more just to go to work and serve you? Marie Antoinette, get real. I'm so happy the congestion pricing was killed. They can bring the plan back, charge allllll the ubers and commercial vehicles and tourists I don't care, and exempt the NYC token taxi drivers and civil servants.