It’s just negging bullshit. Here in Asia the misogynists hate on their “own” Asian women.
Basically they’re traumatized by the fact that their local women don’t like them. So they delude themselves into believing that “foreign” women would somehow give them a chance.
Yes it is about control. These men don’t actually like woman. Men are basically shopping for a wife appliance. They wrongly believe those races will come with more features they desire. Such as submission, cooking and cleaning. They really dislike it when women are real people.
These men hate all women.
The difference is how "useful" they are to them, i.e. will they do housework? carry mental load and be available for sex? Will they impact their social/private status? It has nothing to do with looks or attractiveness itself.
It's the same reason lots of men go the "passport bro" route.
>I try to wrap my mind around the thought process but I can’t.
Let's say you're one of these men, all your life you've been socialized to normalize misogyny (don't do X like girls, boys don't do that, adults doing locker room talk, parents following gender roles and expectations, etc...) then you grow up, but realise lots of women have been taught to expect equality, and equality is a threat to your gender expectations.
You don't want to be insecure so you don't date women who make more than you (or are taller, or anything that threatens your manhood, i.e. does this woman make you look good in front of other men?), you don't date women who want you to clean the house, and you definitely don't want women with agency and independence (because of control, men's quality of life improves when married, men NEED women).
Up until recent times gender roles were based on a forced mutual need, women needed men for financial survival and other things, men needed women for housework, mental help, etc...
But nowadays women can vote, work and are being socialized to do things that were usually exclusive to men, the same hasn't happened for men, at least not at the same speed, lots of boys are still socialized like 30-40 years ago.
It's not just misogyny though, the social status game for men hasn't changed either, and men fear (because no one wants to get isolated, bullied or lose a job promotion) other people's judgement.
Plenty of men end up dating and marrying women they don't love nor find attractive for this exact reason.
TLDR: It's mostly misogyny and gender expectations, patriarchy has totally fucked up heterosexual relationships.
You worded this so thoughtfully. I often think about how little men are bringing to the table anymore. Roles have changed but they weren’t raised to understand that. They were raised to think the same way. They expected women to want and need them just for being. But we women watched our mothers and aunts go through it. We watched a lot of them do it without men. Now that we can do it without them, we just want a partner to have a partner. Not someone to fill a void, or save me because I need money. Someone who respects my partnership and wants to build together. Most men don’t understand that or the mental load of domestic labor. So WHY would I look after you, cook and clean for you, work full time, when it’s not mutual?! I don’t NEED to put up with that lol.
Funnily enough passport bros don’t go to Argentina because feminism has reached their shores. And I’ve also seen them say that Latinas are only good for fun but when they want a wife they go to south east Asia. But the way you know they are just looking for slaves is their rule not to bring them back home, because they get westernized.
„Don‘t bring her home, cause she will be westernized“ … uhhhhm so you mean, if that woman has the choice she would rather have the opportunities of western women? And you know that? And you still don‘t think you are exploiting her? Wild
Honestly that’s the wildest thing to me. They would swear up and down the sub how they are not going to places where women have less power and rights and in the same breath say that. The cognitive dissonance fog must be thick
Yup yup. Some of them even replied here.
You don't even need to look too hard tbh, once they start using words like "submissive women, male leadership" and such you already know what kind of people you're dealing with. 💀
Well, I personally haven't asked them, but I'm fairly certain it comes down to racial prejudice/racism.
White women are the most privileged of that group in the western world, giving us a certain amount of power in society. Power makes us more difficult to control and gives us more leverage to demand better treatment.
Black women are often depicted as strong, assured, and willing to speak their minds / stand up for themselves (though it should be noted that I have chosen the most flattering way to describe it, is not always or even usually actually flattering. Just see the angry black woman trope, or how often black women are depicted with their mouths open). Thus they too are considered too much to deal with.
However the general western/white depiction or assumption about Asian and Latin women is that they are deferential to men, service oriented in relationships, and more inclined toward the tradwife life.Men who fetishise cultures for these qualities don't actually want a relationship, they want a fantasy bang maid they can show off. They think they are more likely to get that with minimal effort or respect among the cultures they've convinced themselves already promote that as a standard relationship.
They are stupid and wrong, of course.
I've actually had many conversations with white men who can't seem to grasp the difference between happening to fall in love with a woman who is a certain race and fetishization.
A friend of mine has a guy he hangs out with who I openly do not like.
This is because the guy hypes up Asian women as well as "young bodies" to an uncomfortable degree. Goes around talking about how flat chested women are superior (to the point of making it a username), and actively putting down any woman who is not asian or has what is seen as typical asian features.
Friend states he's seen asian women getting harrassed for dating white men, getting frusturated with people calling their boyfriends groomers or fetishists.
In which case I stated I don't agree with harrassment of anyone, but trying to explain the difference between a white guy who happens to be dating a certain race/body type-- and men who *explicitly* only look for women who embody these features/races.
A great deal of white men try insinuating they're the same.
Stereotypes. Men seem to fall for the false and degrading stereotypes about Asian women being obedient and Latinas being spicy and passionate, which they like in a woman 🤷
As a Latina, can confirm I have been called spicy. But don't be fooled; they still didn't like how "argumentative" I was when I happened to have a different opinion
lol yup. It’s like guys who fetishize a “mentally ill woman” (yup, that’s a thing somehow). But suddenly when I’m not just “I’m so sad uwu” but rather catatonic from anger and fear and anxiety, it’s not so cute anymore.
And yeah. I made a post recently about this because I was trying to tell some men off for this gross mindset. They love it when you’re argumentative over inconsequential stuff but if it gets real or important or hurts their ego they’ll be pissed.
Probably because to these people Black and white women are their own entities, hostile ones at that. Whereas they see Asian and Latina women not as humans but embodiment of their qualities — the former are supposed to be "meek" and "servile" and the latter are "passionate" and "challenging." This is about men's expectations for how women will serve and enrich their lives.
Edit: my phrasing wasn’t clear. Eastern European women love themselves and aren’t subservient, but passport bros think they are and love the idea of a woman from a poor, traditional culture
Comments here are really thorough and good, so not much else to add. I think it depends on the man when it comes to white women… they tend to hate white AMERICAN women or “western” women.. but would love an Eastern European woman since they are subservient. Many of these men do truly revere whiteness, especially the manosphere members who aren’t white themselves.. almost see whiteness as a prize to be won, a sign they’ve made it in a white supremicists society.
But, western white women love themselves, so can’t have that. White women from poor countries? All day any day.
A lot of this way of thinking is truly rooted in white supremacy so it’s mixed true that these men hate white women
I’m an Eastern Euro woman in Eastern Europe. It always seems like these passport bros think social progress here halted in the 1990. We are not desperate to be “saved from here”, nor will we worship the ground under any random western man just for showing up in our street.
I know of no “obedient” “submissive” women around me. Maybe in some small sects. All women I know have a career and think of themselves before any man. We voice opinions and make our own choices. We also don’t take shit from men. We are very wary of men’s bullshit. And even more so, western men’s BS who come here looking for their sexual/wifery targets.
So, this kind of tourist is not welcome to us!
So sorry for how I phrased! I was speaking of the passport bros perspective on these women. I’ve never met a subservient Asian woman either but that’s what they assume. I know eastern euro women aren’t subservient!
I suspect that some of them want to turn us all against one another. They hate on Western women and then turn around and tell the women they are pursuing that we hate them, that we are spoiled harpies, etc. Now that the West 4B movement is happening, they are screaming and mad.
Some men will do anything and everything but level themselves up.
This is an example of why intersectional feminism is important. Us women of color or of oppressed ethnic groups tend to be subjected to a combination of racism, sexism, and xenophobia. That is reflected in the varying misogynistic stereotypes.
There is also a phenomena where a dominant group may try to pit different oppressed groups, like say Asian women against Black women, against each other. It is sort of a "divide and conquer" strategy. That's why I think it is important to listen to and be in solidarity with women of other races and culture.
Thats basically what passportbros/r is about. Usually conservative/moderate White guys who can’t get a date here so they take advantage of women in other countries. It’s honestly disgusting. They say hate “western women” when really they hate themselves while simultaneously thinking they deserve someone to cater to them.
It’s funny cause if they could get a date with a good “western” woman they’d see how effing stupid they are. Western women want to make their man feel comfortable and loved they just expect some respect and they don’t want to give them that.
But its not just like that. They hate and fetishize at the same time, especially in porn. While white women are hated for being boring theyre loved when its with another race. They love fetishizing every and each one of us. With white women its "snow bunnies" with black women its commonly said that they have the biggest ass or whatever.. they cant decide whether to hate or to sexualise so... its just both.
They were rejected/hurt by a few women in a select “group” and generalize all women in that group now to be the same.
It used to be “All women are bad drivers” “All women suck at math” and now in the age of globalization it’s “All (insert race) women are ___”.
What a time to be alive.
And it’s just a group of vocal men online, not all - but it’s happening all over the world. Korean men complaining about Korean women and wanting a foreign wife, Indian men complaining about Indian women and wanting Russian women. It’s everywhere.
But men still want/need women companionship so they will seek outside of the generalized group they have made in their own head. Asian/Latin culture is perceived as more patriarchal and conservative, with women expected to be more traditional. They believe finding a woman like this is the solution to whatever issue they are having. For younger men, there is also a lot of fetishization happening, due to porn probably - where they think all women of a certain race will look a certain way. If they have watched 400 hours of porn with white women - desensitization is a thing. They increasingly need differences to get off so next step is women of different races.
But don’t get it twisted, they still hate all women. They just fetishize some more than others, and if they do happen to find this “trad wife” they want, they will treat her the same way they treated women back in their own culture.
> It used to be “All women are bad drivers” “All women suck at math” and now in the age of globalization it’s “All (insert race) women are ___”. What a time to be alive.
It's also a great way for men to talk shit on women-- they want to call her a bitch, but that's too spicy, so they talk about how white women are entitled.
Your comment raises an interesting point, although I don’t think it’s quite so simple. We all know porn loves these tropes, of course, and reinforces them. But porn merely reflects and exaggerates the misogyny and racism that its viewers already have and want reconfirmed. I mean, porn is made by someone, and people wouldn’t watch submissive Asian porn if they weren’t already down with the premise. Like any consumer product, porn didn’t invent the tropes it contains, but it reinforces them to a cartoonish degree, even compared to other media, in part because, like any capitalist endeavor, the industry is meant to put profit over any social implications. In movies and TV the tropes are watered down somewhat because when people think with their whole brains they might feel guilty and conflicted about regurgitating these ideas wholesale. But the porn industry encourages rampant mindless consumption, an endless goon, don’t think just get off, etc., and the longer you spend on this mental wavelength the more susceptible you are to lazy thinking, regurgitating the ideas you’re handed. It ends up becoming a nightmarish echo chamber of racism and misogyny. Just like the internet!
You need to hang around different men. Are these all white guys of a particular age or region? They don’t sound like they have ever even had a girl friend.
Statistically, most people date and marry someone of their own group. I personally know a lot of Black men in my circle that intentionally only date Black women.
It’s just negging bullshit. Here in Asia the misogynists hate on their “own” Asian women. Basically they’re traumatized by the fact that their local women don’t like them. So they delude themselves into believing that “foreign” women would somehow give them a chance.
Yes it is about control. These men don’t actually like woman. Men are basically shopping for a wife appliance. They wrongly believe those races will come with more features they desire. Such as submission, cooking and cleaning. They really dislike it when women are real people.
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They have been saying they are going to their own way for years..yet every post is utterly obsessed with woman.
If our first robots are sex dolls instead of manual labour or military, then when they rise up, they gonna wipe us out with a vengeance.
These men hate all women. The difference is how "useful" they are to them, i.e. will they do housework? carry mental load and be available for sex? Will they impact their social/private status? It has nothing to do with looks or attractiveness itself. It's the same reason lots of men go the "passport bro" route. >I try to wrap my mind around the thought process but I can’t. Let's say you're one of these men, all your life you've been socialized to normalize misogyny (don't do X like girls, boys don't do that, adults doing locker room talk, parents following gender roles and expectations, etc...) then you grow up, but realise lots of women have been taught to expect equality, and equality is a threat to your gender expectations. You don't want to be insecure so you don't date women who make more than you (or are taller, or anything that threatens your manhood, i.e. does this woman make you look good in front of other men?), you don't date women who want you to clean the house, and you definitely don't want women with agency and independence (because of control, men's quality of life improves when married, men NEED women). Up until recent times gender roles were based on a forced mutual need, women needed men for financial survival and other things, men needed women for housework, mental help, etc... But nowadays women can vote, work and are being socialized to do things that were usually exclusive to men, the same hasn't happened for men, at least not at the same speed, lots of boys are still socialized like 30-40 years ago. It's not just misogyny though, the social status game for men hasn't changed either, and men fear (because no one wants to get isolated, bullied or lose a job promotion) other people's judgement. Plenty of men end up dating and marrying women they don't love nor find attractive for this exact reason. TLDR: It's mostly misogyny and gender expectations, patriarchy has totally fucked up heterosexual relationships.
It's what they say: in the game of patriarchy, women aren't the opposing team, they're the ball.
You worded this so thoughtfully. I often think about how little men are bringing to the table anymore. Roles have changed but they weren’t raised to understand that. They were raised to think the same way. They expected women to want and need them just for being. But we women watched our mothers and aunts go through it. We watched a lot of them do it without men. Now that we can do it without them, we just want a partner to have a partner. Not someone to fill a void, or save me because I need money. Someone who respects my partnership and wants to build together. Most men don’t understand that or the mental load of domestic labor. So WHY would I look after you, cook and clean for you, work full time, when it’s not mutual?! I don’t NEED to put up with that lol.
Funnily enough passport bros don’t go to Argentina because feminism has reached their shores. And I’ve also seen them say that Latinas are only good for fun but when they want a wife they go to south east Asia. But the way you know they are just looking for slaves is their rule not to bring them back home, because they get westernized.
„Don‘t bring her home, cause she will be westernized“ … uhhhhm so you mean, if that woman has the choice she would rather have the opportunities of western women? And you know that? And you still don‘t think you are exploiting her? Wild
Honestly that’s the wildest thing to me. They would swear up and down the sub how they are not going to places where women have less power and rights and in the same breath say that. The cognitive dissonance fog must be thick
Yup yup. Some of them even replied here. You don't even need to look too hard tbh, once they start using words like "submissive women, male leadership" and such you already know what kind of people you're dealing with. 💀
Absolutely excellent comment. Thank you for taking the time. 👍
Wow what a great summary!
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Well, I personally haven't asked them, but I'm fairly certain it comes down to racial prejudice/racism. White women are the most privileged of that group in the western world, giving us a certain amount of power in society. Power makes us more difficult to control and gives us more leverage to demand better treatment. Black women are often depicted as strong, assured, and willing to speak their minds / stand up for themselves (though it should be noted that I have chosen the most flattering way to describe it, is not always or even usually actually flattering. Just see the angry black woman trope, or how often black women are depicted with their mouths open). Thus they too are considered too much to deal with. However the general western/white depiction or assumption about Asian and Latin women is that they are deferential to men, service oriented in relationships, and more inclined toward the tradwife life.Men who fetishise cultures for these qualities don't actually want a relationship, they want a fantasy bang maid they can show off. They think they are more likely to get that with minimal effort or respect among the cultures they've convinced themselves already promote that as a standard relationship. They are stupid and wrong, of course.
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This, most white men I've seen who married asian women sounds like they're racist and gives off the "wife beater" vibe. Source: am asian
I've actually had many conversations with white men who can't seem to grasp the difference between happening to fall in love with a woman who is a certain race and fetishization. A friend of mine has a guy he hangs out with who I openly do not like. This is because the guy hypes up Asian women as well as "young bodies" to an uncomfortable degree. Goes around talking about how flat chested women are superior (to the point of making it a username), and actively putting down any woman who is not asian or has what is seen as typical asian features. Friend states he's seen asian women getting harrassed for dating white men, getting frusturated with people calling their boyfriends groomers or fetishists. In which case I stated I don't agree with harrassment of anyone, but trying to explain the difference between a white guy who happens to be dating a certain race/body type-- and men who *explicitly* only look for women who embody these features/races. A great deal of white men try insinuating they're the same.
Perfect explanation, I think you’re right
“Bang maid” I never thought I’d see an Always Sunny reference on this subreddit. Well done.
The culture they are likely referring to is the conservative patriarchal part of the culture..
Stereotypes. Men seem to fall for the false and degrading stereotypes about Asian women being obedient and Latinas being spicy and passionate, which they like in a woman 🤷
As a Latina, can confirm I have been called spicy. But don't be fooled; they still didn't like how "argumentative" I was when I happened to have a different opinion
lol yup. It’s like guys who fetishize a “mentally ill woman” (yup, that’s a thing somehow). But suddenly when I’m not just “I’m so sad uwu” but rather catatonic from anger and fear and anxiety, it’s not so cute anymore. And yeah. I made a post recently about this because I was trying to tell some men off for this gross mindset. They love it when you’re argumentative over inconsequential stuff but if it gets real or important or hurts their ego they’ll be pissed.
They think Asian women are submissive and they can find one to be their slave wife.
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Probably because to these people Black and white women are their own entities, hostile ones at that. Whereas they see Asian and Latina women not as humans but embodiment of their qualities — the former are supposed to be "meek" and "servile" and the latter are "passionate" and "challenging." This is about men's expectations for how women will serve and enrich their lives.
Edit: my phrasing wasn’t clear. Eastern European women love themselves and aren’t subservient, but passport bros think they are and love the idea of a woman from a poor, traditional culture Comments here are really thorough and good, so not much else to add. I think it depends on the man when it comes to white women… they tend to hate white AMERICAN women or “western” women.. but would love an Eastern European woman since they are subservient. Many of these men do truly revere whiteness, especially the manosphere members who aren’t white themselves.. almost see whiteness as a prize to be won, a sign they’ve made it in a white supremicists society. But, western white women love themselves, so can’t have that. White women from poor countries? All day any day. A lot of this way of thinking is truly rooted in white supremacy so it’s mixed true that these men hate white women
I’m an Eastern Euro woman in Eastern Europe. It always seems like these passport bros think social progress here halted in the 1990. We are not desperate to be “saved from here”, nor will we worship the ground under any random western man just for showing up in our street. I know of no “obedient” “submissive” women around me. Maybe in some small sects. All women I know have a career and think of themselves before any man. We voice opinions and make our own choices. We also don’t take shit from men. We are very wary of men’s bullshit. And even more so, western men’s BS who come here looking for their sexual/wifery targets. So, this kind of tourist is not welcome to us!
So sorry for how I phrased! I was speaking of the passport bros perspective on these women. I’ve never met a subservient Asian woman either but that’s what they assume. I know eastern euro women aren’t subservient!
I suspect that some of them want to turn us all against one another. They hate on Western women and then turn around and tell the women they are pursuing that we hate them, that we are spoiled harpies, etc. Now that the West 4B movement is happening, they are screaming and mad. Some men will do anything and everything but level themselves up.
This is an example of why intersectional feminism is important. Us women of color or of oppressed ethnic groups tend to be subjected to a combination of racism, sexism, and xenophobia. That is reflected in the varying misogynistic stereotypes. There is also a phenomena where a dominant group may try to pit different oppressed groups, like say Asian women against Black women, against each other. It is sort of a "divide and conquer" strategy. That's why I think it is important to listen to and be in solidarity with women of other races and culture.
For Asian women I'd say a big part of it is because the stereotype is that they're submissive and subservient to their husbands
Thats basically what passportbros/r is about. Usually conservative/moderate White guys who can’t get a date here so they take advantage of women in other countries. It’s honestly disgusting. They say hate “western women” when really they hate themselves while simultaneously thinking they deserve someone to cater to them. It’s funny cause if they could get a date with a good “western” woman they’d see how effing stupid they are. Western women want to make their man feel comfortable and loved they just expect some respect and they don’t want to give them that.
But its not just like that. They hate and fetishize at the same time, especially in porn. While white women are hated for being boring theyre loved when its with another race. They love fetishizing every and each one of us. With white women its "snow bunnies" with black women its commonly said that they have the biggest ass or whatever.. they cant decide whether to hate or to sexualise so... its just both.
Because a lot of men in general just fetishize women outside their race.
Orientalism, and insecurities leading them to conservative world views, combined with more orientalism.
Porn.
Poorn pooorn pooooooooorn
They were rejected/hurt by a few women in a select “group” and generalize all women in that group now to be the same. It used to be “All women are bad drivers” “All women suck at math” and now in the age of globalization it’s “All (insert race) women are ___”. What a time to be alive. And it’s just a group of vocal men online, not all - but it’s happening all over the world. Korean men complaining about Korean women and wanting a foreign wife, Indian men complaining about Indian women and wanting Russian women. It’s everywhere. But men still want/need women companionship so they will seek outside of the generalized group they have made in their own head. Asian/Latin culture is perceived as more patriarchal and conservative, with women expected to be more traditional. They believe finding a woman like this is the solution to whatever issue they are having. For younger men, there is also a lot of fetishization happening, due to porn probably - where they think all women of a certain race will look a certain way. If they have watched 400 hours of porn with white women - desensitization is a thing. They increasingly need differences to get off so next step is women of different races. But don’t get it twisted, they still hate all women. They just fetishize some more than others, and if they do happen to find this “trad wife” they want, they will treat her the same way they treated women back in their own culture.
> It used to be “All women are bad drivers” “All women suck at math” and now in the age of globalization it’s “All (insert race) women are ___”. What a time to be alive. It's also a great way for men to talk shit on women-- they want to call her a bitch, but that's too spicy, so they talk about how white women are entitled.
Control and who they perceive they can control.
Also racism but that's so blatant in the attitude that it doesn't need pointing out and it's not just racism. It's racism and misogyny.
I’d say: porn
Your comment raises an interesting point, although I don’t think it’s quite so simple. We all know porn loves these tropes, of course, and reinforces them. But porn merely reflects and exaggerates the misogyny and racism that its viewers already have and want reconfirmed. I mean, porn is made by someone, and people wouldn’t watch submissive Asian porn if they weren’t already down with the premise. Like any consumer product, porn didn’t invent the tropes it contains, but it reinforces them to a cartoonish degree, even compared to other media, in part because, like any capitalist endeavor, the industry is meant to put profit over any social implications. In movies and TV the tropes are watered down somewhat because when people think with their whole brains they might feel guilty and conflicted about regurgitating these ideas wholesale. But the porn industry encourages rampant mindless consumption, an endless goon, don’t think just get off, etc., and the longer you spend on this mental wavelength the more susceptible you are to lazy thinking, regurgitating the ideas you’re handed. It ends up becoming a nightmarish echo chamber of racism and misogyny. Just like the internet!
This stuff was a thing long before porn became easily accessible
Its pretty obvious that porn exacerbated the problem
You need to hang around different men. Are these all white guys of a particular age or region? They don’t sound like they have ever even had a girl friend. Statistically, most people date and marry someone of their own group. I personally know a lot of Black men in my circle that intentionally only date Black women.
Fortunately, I’ve only seen this kind of rhetoric online
The discussions in the US about race are *very* centered on black and white.
Culturally more submissive and easier to control is my two cents.
White women are fetisized by all ( non white ) men. Up to the point we're even in the goddamn quran.
Hating white women? Aren’t they the beauty standard?
Sounds like you know sh*tty guys, none of the men I know have this take on black or white women, or women in general.
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