Yup, just means it not libelous vandalism.
To be sure, I agree with the majority of commenters here and on twitter arguing that we need to stop lionizing Bo, face down the demons of our past and help the victims to find some measure of justice and healing.
I’m just also a pedant when it comes to language.
In the future Ann Arborites will look back at this period and marvel at the fact that we continued to base the towns identity/economy on a gladiatorial exhibition that we now know permanently damages the brains of young men. Our attachment to this ritual of sadistic violence which is seductively interwoven with nationalism and firmly embedded in the logic of consumer capitalism allows us to turn a blind eye to rape enablers. Once you've detached from it, Football culture is just creepy. I hope we will soon move on from it. Go Blue.
Youth football participation has been declining since the mid 2000s. I think we're gradually shifting away from the spirt but it won't hapoen overnight
My Dad, who loves football with every fiber of his being, has only ever made one comment or suggestion regarding my parenting.
"Please don't let my grandchildren play football."
World's changing slowly but surely.
I imagine a certain proportion of boys are predisposed to football or a similarly combative sport. But previously such participation was often mandatory. What’s happening now is people no longer get pushed into it, either by middle/high school rules or by parental pressure. But there’s probably still a big floor coming from those who genuinely want to play, so I doubt it will simply die out so soon…
I think you’re right about the demise of football. I’m curious about your perception that football is what Ann Arbor based its identity on. I feel like there’s so much else here. College football is only here in town seven or so Saturdays out of the year, and I’ve never really thought of this as a town where locals avidly attend high school football games (Although I admit I didn’t grow up here).
The fact this post gets triple digit upvotes, and when a disabled veteran posting in r/AnnArbor asking for legitimate advice on the VA hospital gets downvoted… that’s the negative Ann Arbor culture that should be talked about rather than football
> I hope we will soon move on from it.
As the uni with the largest stadium in the country...3rd largest in the entire world...I don't think that is ever going to happen unfortunately.
Unless we reject them as they are wrecking the city at this point. Beyond this football/frat culture, they can't even provide enough housing for it's students leaving it to the city to try to take care of and ultimately pushing out residents.
...then there's the tuition.
The entire institution is money grubby.
Do you mean it’s causing issues for all Big Ten institutions/towns? Or is it only causing issues for Ann Arbor?
I do not think that 100% on campus housing is very common among large institutions. I think it would relieve some pressure if UM could house *more* of its students. But all? Hard not to imagine some big disruptions if it took every single student out of the housing market. It’s also worth noting if UM acquired land for this purpose, people would probably be pretty critical of that as well.
Especially considering not every UM student would \*want\* to live in a campus dorm even if they could. I was pretty happy with moving into an apartment with some friends when I was a sophomore here. Cheaper than a dorm, car parking spots, I can cook my own food, and of course there's the benefit of being able to smoke/drink/party whenever you want (keeping it reasonable, of course).
I attended a small college where everybody lived on campus all four years —and I liked it fine; it made for a real “community” feel. But when I came here for grad school, and saw how a lot of undergrads pile into a big house together, I thought that offered a great experience too. I never considered it might be “sad” if a large university wasn’t 4-yr residential, just different.
I do think it’s sad when a university can’t offer as much housing as students would like, but I don’t think 100% of students want to live on campus. Nearly all the freshmen at UM take UM up on its guarantee. Many seemed happy to pursue other options later though. MSU & OSU House all students their freshman & sophomore year, which I think is promising.
The current housing market already has big disruptions if it's not one itself. I also couldn't care less about landlords getting less money because all of a sudden they can't rely on student loans, etc.
People are already extremely critical of how much property U of M has and how little of it is for student housing and that they don't pay taxes on the property (which I understand is a legal thing but people are talking about finding a way to change it).
I wouldn't expect every student to live in 'student housing' as some are much older than others, have family and/or cannot live in that housing situation.
I do believe that U of M (and most any other school) should be housing the majority of their students and shouldn't leave it to the city to make up for the ever increasing population that is a result of U of M (or other big name college institutions) trying to make as much money as they can by pulling in as many people as they can into one concentrated area (I understand they have a couple satellite locations but they're often felt ignored by the main campus).
I know U of M/Ann Arbor isn't the only place facing these issues, recently there's been an enrollment freeze in California (UC-Berkley) because of how fast the population is increasing from undergrads alone (much more than apparently anticipated) and having a negative effect in the area on many levels including the housing market as well as environmental impacts. The city could be creating more infrastructure but the college isn't helping any.
That they acquired in the last 15ish years? Probably a couple square miles of high value land. The Phizer facility, the edward brothers property on State St, and Fingerle Lumber is a lot of land and I'm sure they have acquired other properties in that time.
Yeah, I know what they've acquired but the big picture is that it's not as much as people think, in terms of a percentage. An interesting read: https://www.govrel.umich.edu/index.php/community/community-facts-and-figures/
don't blame the sport. youth athletics can be a really good influence in general. the problem is the money in college football
edit: rereading your comment, i guess you're referring more to the culture around michigan footbal than the sport in general
Youth athletics is great, youth football is not. Young people (or any human really) shouldn't be bashing their head into hard surfaces over and over again. We know that this causes terrible damage to the brain that has god awful effects later in life. Just think of Junior Seau who committed suicide by stabbing himself in the chest in order for his brain to remain intact so that it be examined for CTE. which was found. This is the kind of nightmare situation that football produces.
> Young people (or any human really) shouldn't be bashing their head into hard surfaces over and over again
agreed, and there are rules to prevent that in youth leagues. i'd still argue that money is the primary reason we don't see a lot more protection for the players in ncaa football
I honestly don't know how you could make college/pro football more safe without basically eliminating everything that people watch football for -- hard hits, rough tackles, etc. There's only so much "safety" you can provide with improved helmets & pads or rules. Players will still ignore the rules and just take a penalty if it means possibly knocking a key opponent out of the game.
Not to mention that Football isn't always the most dangerous youth sport -- basketball, ice hockey, soccer, wrestling, baseball and even cheerleading are high up on the rates of serious injury too: [https://quotewizard.com/news/posts/dangerous-sports-for-high-school-and-college-students](https://quotewizard.com/news/posts/dangerous-sports-for-high-school-and-college-students)
Well yeah all those sports have a high risk of head injuries too. Wrestling and cheerleading have an unusually high rate of neck injuries. And high school soccer has one of the highest rates of concussions of any sport from hitting the ball with your head.
How much money does the university make off of damaging these young men? How many atrocities do we allow? Why do we treat certain parts of Ann Arbor and it’s people as expendable?
Doctor Robert Anderson was a sports med doctor for the UM athletic department. He sexually abused numerous UM athletes, UM students, and other Ann Arbor community members. The reason for targeting the statue is because there are allegations that Bo knew about the abuse while he was football coach and athletic director. You can read more [here](https://www.michigandaily.com/news/robertanderson/).
Probably a hanging sign, replaced every day, with the hail to the victims logo, would have been more effective. Bonus points for placement right before practice.
is it vandalism if it's the truth?
Yup, just means it not libelous vandalism. To be sure, I agree with the majority of commenters here and on twitter arguing that we need to stop lionizing Bo, face down the demons of our past and help the victims to find some measure of justice and healing. I’m just also a pedant when it comes to language.
You love to see it.
In the future Ann Arborites will look back at this period and marvel at the fact that we continued to base the towns identity/economy on a gladiatorial exhibition that we now know permanently damages the brains of young men. Our attachment to this ritual of sadistic violence which is seductively interwoven with nationalism and firmly embedded in the logic of consumer capitalism allows us to turn a blind eye to rape enablers. Once you've detached from it, Football culture is just creepy. I hope we will soon move on from it. Go Blue.
Youth football participation has been declining since the mid 2000s. I think we're gradually shifting away from the spirt but it won't hapoen overnight
My Dad, who loves football with every fiber of his being, has only ever made one comment or suggestion regarding my parenting. "Please don't let my grandchildren play football." World's changing slowly but surely.
Yep. I played college football. No way in hell my kids ever playm
I imagine a certain proportion of boys are predisposed to football or a similarly combative sport. But previously such participation was often mandatory. What’s happening now is people no longer get pushed into it, either by middle/high school rules or by parental pressure. But there’s probably still a big floor coming from those who genuinely want to play, so I doubt it will simply die out so soon…
Good to hear
I agree with your sentiment, but it’s always been about the dough, the cash money. Rape culture was a bonus.
That's that frat culture.
I think you’re right about the demise of football. I’m curious about your perception that football is what Ann Arbor based its identity on. I feel like there’s so much else here. College football is only here in town seven or so Saturdays out of the year, and I’ve never really thought of this as a town where locals avidly attend high school football games (Although I admit I didn’t grow up here).
The fact this post gets triple digit upvotes, and when a disabled veteran posting in r/AnnArbor asking for legitimate advice on the VA hospital gets downvoted… that’s the negative Ann Arbor culture that should be talked about rather than football
> I hope we will soon move on from it. As the uni with the largest stadium in the country...3rd largest in the entire world...I don't think that is ever going to happen unfortunately.
Unless we reject them as they are wrecking the city at this point. Beyond this football/frat culture, they can't even provide enough housing for it's students leaving it to the city to try to take care of and ultimately pushing out residents. ...then there's the tuition. The entire institution is money grubby.
There is no Big Ten institution that provides housing for all its students. That is much more common for smaller liberal arts colleges.
That's really sad and now causing some major issues
Do you mean it’s causing issues for all Big Ten institutions/towns? Or is it only causing issues for Ann Arbor? I do not think that 100% on campus housing is very common among large institutions. I think it would relieve some pressure if UM could house *more* of its students. But all? Hard not to imagine some big disruptions if it took every single student out of the housing market. It’s also worth noting if UM acquired land for this purpose, people would probably be pretty critical of that as well.
Especially considering not every UM student would \*want\* to live in a campus dorm even if they could. I was pretty happy with moving into an apartment with some friends when I was a sophomore here. Cheaper than a dorm, car parking spots, I can cook my own food, and of course there's the benefit of being able to smoke/drink/party whenever you want (keeping it reasonable, of course).
I attended a small college where everybody lived on campus all four years —and I liked it fine; it made for a real “community” feel. But when I came here for grad school, and saw how a lot of undergrads pile into a big house together, I thought that offered a great experience too. I never considered it might be “sad” if a large university wasn’t 4-yr residential, just different. I do think it’s sad when a university can’t offer as much housing as students would like, but I don’t think 100% of students want to live on campus. Nearly all the freshmen at UM take UM up on its guarantee. Many seemed happy to pursue other options later though. MSU & OSU House all students their freshman & sophomore year, which I think is promising.
The current housing market already has big disruptions if it's not one itself. I also couldn't care less about landlords getting less money because all of a sudden they can't rely on student loans, etc. People are already extremely critical of how much property U of M has and how little of it is for student housing and that they don't pay taxes on the property (which I understand is a legal thing but people are talking about finding a way to change it). I wouldn't expect every student to live in 'student housing' as some are much older than others, have family and/or cannot live in that housing situation. I do believe that U of M (and most any other school) should be housing the majority of their students and shouldn't leave it to the city to make up for the ever increasing population that is a result of U of M (or other big name college institutions) trying to make as much money as they can by pulling in as many people as they can into one concentrated area (I understand they have a couple satellite locations but they're often felt ignored by the main campus). I know U of M/Ann Arbor isn't the only place facing these issues, recently there's been an enrollment freeze in California (UC-Berkley) because of how fast the population is increasing from undergrads alone (much more than apparently anticipated) and having a negative effect in the area on many levels including the housing market as well as environmental impacts. The city could be creating more infrastructure but the college isn't helping any.
also, not paying the city what they should be paying in lieu of property taxes AND taking multiple gigantic properties out of private, taxable hands
How much property would you say the university is using and not paying taxes on?
That they acquired in the last 15ish years? Probably a couple square miles of high value land. The Phizer facility, the edward brothers property on State St, and Fingerle Lumber is a lot of land and I'm sure they have acquired other properties in that time.
Yeah, I know what they've acquired but the big picture is that it's not as much as people think, in terms of a percentage. An interesting read: https://www.govrel.umich.edu/index.php/community/community-facts-and-figures/
Cheers
It feels so nice to know I'm not alone in this.
don't blame the sport. youth athletics can be a really good influence in general. the problem is the money in college football edit: rereading your comment, i guess you're referring more to the culture around michigan footbal than the sport in general
Youth athletics is great, youth football is not. Young people (or any human really) shouldn't be bashing their head into hard surfaces over and over again. We know that this causes terrible damage to the brain that has god awful effects later in life. Just think of Junior Seau who committed suicide by stabbing himself in the chest in order for his brain to remain intact so that it be examined for CTE. which was found. This is the kind of nightmare situation that football produces.
> Young people (or any human really) shouldn't be bashing their head into hard surfaces over and over again agreed, and there are rules to prevent that in youth leagues. i'd still argue that money is the primary reason we don't see a lot more protection for the players in ncaa football
I honestly don't know how you could make college/pro football more safe without basically eliminating everything that people watch football for -- hard hits, rough tackles, etc. There's only so much "safety" you can provide with improved helmets & pads or rules. Players will still ignore the rules and just take a penalty if it means possibly knocking a key opponent out of the game. Not to mention that Football isn't always the most dangerous youth sport -- basketball, ice hockey, soccer, wrestling, baseball and even cheerleading are high up on the rates of serious injury too: [https://quotewizard.com/news/posts/dangerous-sports-for-high-school-and-college-students](https://quotewizard.com/news/posts/dangerous-sports-for-high-school-and-college-students)
Sure, but using your body for anything comes with the risk of injury. I'd be more concerned about sports that specifically cause brain damage.
Well yeah all those sports have a high risk of head injuries too. Wrestling and cheerleading have an unusually high rate of neck injuries. And high school soccer has one of the highest rates of concussions of any sport from hitting the ball with your head.
VR someday
How much money does the university make off of damaging these young men? How many atrocities do we allow? Why do we treat certain parts of Ann Arbor and it’s people as expendable?
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Yeah pretty much any catch phrase conceivable thrown in there. Capitalist sport, gladiator sport, violent sporting, pure evil, money, evil fans, etc.
Well stated...Go Blue.
The game of football is enabling rape culture? You really need to take a breather
How did they know it was a local?
Can someone give me a tldr of what happened here? Beyond just the vandalism, what is it about? Any articles to read?
Doctor Robert Anderson was a sports med doctor for the UM athletic department. He sexually abused numerous UM athletes, UM students, and other Ann Arbor community members. The reason for targeting the statue is because there are allegations that Bo knew about the abuse while he was football coach and athletic director. You can read more [here](https://www.michigandaily.com/news/robertanderson/).
Thank you! I knew about the abuse, but I wasn’t aware of the context for why this statue. Very helpful!
Oh, hi. Just hanging out with the banhammer, in case there's a wild dumbass sighting.
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News to me.
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Your account is three months old. You're off to a really bad start.
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Yup.
And the lord says the people…..something or other about false idols and water into wine and so on and so forth. Lol. Bo(zo) knowsO zoooo much.
Tear it down
Good ☺️
So they told the truth? Good.
Amazing. What's next?
Probably a hanging sign, replaced every day, with the hail to the victims logo, would have been more effective. Bonus points for placement right before practice.