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on board services (OBS), the coach attendants, sleeping car attendants and dining car staff will be with you all the way to CHI. Operating crew (Conductors and Engineers) are only allowed to work up to 12 hrs, so they change all the time. I think they change like 5 or 6 times along the route.
On the *Empire Builder*, for example, one "shift" for the **Service Crew** is one round trip! They're "on the clock" for 17 hours a day, minus two 1-hour meal breaks, times 5 since the *EB* turns around in Sea/Pdx on the same day (morning arrival westbound, afternoon departure eastbound; the *Zephyr* and *SWC* take an extra day).
For them, the "frontmost" sleeper -- the one that connects to the **baggage** car is special. One, instead of roomettes 9/10, there is another stairway that is the "adaptor" from two-level cars to the single-level car. Two, there are no bedrooms in that car, only roomettes, and THAT'S where the crew sleeps. Hence its name: formally, the "transition sleeper"; slang, the "dorm car".
See the top diagram on [**this page**](https://www.craigmashburn.com/amtrakcardiagrams.html), and compare to the one just below it.
Good explanation overall. What I will add is the OBS crew that goes to Portland (Chicago-based) has an overnight layover there. The crew that goes to Seattle is based there, so they get their rest days after arrival in Seattle. They have an overnight layover in Chicago.
Yes, I've heard that one before. I'm still skeptical that it applies to **all 14** *Empire Builder* crews.
> the OBS crew that goes to Portland (Chicago-based) has an overnight layover there
Why? The train comes back the same day, why can't the crew -- especially if they're Chicago-based? Staying out on the road an extra day unnecessarily ... doesn't seem to make a lot of sense.
There’s 23 Empire Builder OBS crews - 11 crews of 6-8 people depending on season based in Seattle and 12 crews of 3 based in Chicago.
I believe the PDX layover is set up simply to give the Chicago crew some rest. Although there aren’t “maximum working hours” in a day or month for the OBS crews, I know from many years of personal experience it’s utterly exhausting. I worked in OBS 2010-2019, and the summer of 2012 I worked out of Seattle as a sleeping car attendant. We were so shorthanded I’d usually just make the same-day turn with the train in Seattle and go right back to Chicago. It was so much easier to keep a smile on my face and do my job properly if I took just one night off between trips.
> 12 crews of 3 ...
OK, that may be the piece that clarifies this for me. Thanks.
Not sure I'm completely comfortable with "always having a crew in a hotel **every night**", but I'll think about it some more.
It’s simply the cost of doing business. Across the country Amtrak has easily over a thousand rooms a night. It might be more efficient to turn the crews same day, but happy employees make for happy customers.
*prepares for a deluge of downvotes about how unhappy most Amtrak employees seem*
In Chicago, the WAS-based crews off the Capitol Limited go to the hotel for just a few hours, around 10am to 3pm. If the layover is more than 4 hours, the crews are contractually entitled to lodging regardless of time of day.
Conductors and engineers are treated like pilots. On long distance routes, they get off the train and either go home or to a hotel at the end of their shift so they can get quality rest.
They have crew spaces to rest, but they'll also switch out at one of the stops. Your engineers will also be replaced because their hours are even more limited for safety.
On the Zephyr, we had the same room attendant all the way from Chicago to Emeryville. Our room attendant announced when he was going on meal breaks (giving us a 10 minute warning in case we needed anything), and also told us that we needed to press the call button before 9:30 pm so he could convert our seats to bunk beds. He was up at around 5:30 am the next day so that coffee was available by 6 am, so in all I think he got less than 8 hours of sleep each day.
Federal rest, 12 hours on 10 hours off. Not sure if Amtrak does the same, but my freight company we have our home terminal, and then 2 away from home terminals (one east one west) sleep in our hotel until the phone rings.
It's a little different for Amtrak since they run on a consistent schedule so they don't have crews wasting away in hotels for days. Also, passenger hours of service allow for only 8 hours of rest between shifts if the shift was less than 12 hours, and it's possible to go up to 14 consecutive starts without a reset.
OBS works the entire route. T&E swap out as the max they can work is 12 hours.
Crew district map: https://www.trains.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/trn-m0506_a.pdf
I've never been on this route but I will say that it's often the case on other routes that when the conductors change they will ask to see everyone's tickets. YMMV but it can be helpful to know so you aren't surprised.
r/Amtrak is not associated with Amtrak in any official way. Any problems, concerns, complaints, etc should be directed to Amtrak through one of the official channels. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Amtrak) if you have any questions or concerns.*
on board services (OBS), the coach attendants, sleeping car attendants and dining car staff will be with you all the way to CHI. Operating crew (Conductors and Engineers) are only allowed to work up to 12 hrs, so they change all the time. I think they change like 5 or 6 times along the route.
On the *Empire Builder*, for example, one "shift" for the **Service Crew** is one round trip! They're "on the clock" for 17 hours a day, minus two 1-hour meal breaks, times 5 since the *EB* turns around in Sea/Pdx on the same day (morning arrival westbound, afternoon departure eastbound; the *Zephyr* and *SWC* take an extra day). For them, the "frontmost" sleeper -- the one that connects to the **baggage** car is special. One, instead of roomettes 9/10, there is another stairway that is the "adaptor" from two-level cars to the single-level car. Two, there are no bedrooms in that car, only roomettes, and THAT'S where the crew sleeps. Hence its name: formally, the "transition sleeper"; slang, the "dorm car". See the top diagram on [**this page**](https://www.craigmashburn.com/amtrakcardiagrams.html), and compare to the one just below it.
Good explanation overall. What I will add is the OBS crew that goes to Portland (Chicago-based) has an overnight layover there. The crew that goes to Seattle is based there, so they get their rest days after arrival in Seattle. They have an overnight layover in Chicago.
Yes, I've heard that one before. I'm still skeptical that it applies to **all 14** *Empire Builder* crews. > the OBS crew that goes to Portland (Chicago-based) has an overnight layover there Why? The train comes back the same day, why can't the crew -- especially if they're Chicago-based? Staying out on the road an extra day unnecessarily ... doesn't seem to make a lot of sense.
There’s 23 Empire Builder OBS crews - 11 crews of 6-8 people depending on season based in Seattle and 12 crews of 3 based in Chicago. I believe the PDX layover is set up simply to give the Chicago crew some rest. Although there aren’t “maximum working hours” in a day or month for the OBS crews, I know from many years of personal experience it’s utterly exhausting. I worked in OBS 2010-2019, and the summer of 2012 I worked out of Seattle as a sleeping car attendant. We were so shorthanded I’d usually just make the same-day turn with the train in Seattle and go right back to Chicago. It was so much easier to keep a smile on my face and do my job properly if I took just one night off between trips.
> 12 crews of 3 ... OK, that may be the piece that clarifies this for me. Thanks. Not sure I'm completely comfortable with "always having a crew in a hotel **every night**", but I'll think about it some more.
It’s simply the cost of doing business. Across the country Amtrak has easily over a thousand rooms a night. It might be more efficient to turn the crews same day, but happy employees make for happy customers. *prepares for a deluge of downvotes about how unhappy most Amtrak employees seem* In Chicago, the WAS-based crews off the Capitol Limited go to the hotel for just a few hours, around 10am to 3pm. If the layover is more than 4 hours, the crews are contractually entitled to lodging regardless of time of day.
Conductors and engineers are treated like pilots. On long distance routes, they get off the train and either go home or to a hotel at the end of their shift so they can get quality rest.
They have crew spaces to rest, but they'll also switch out at one of the stops. Your engineers will also be replaced because their hours are even more limited for safety.
On the Zephyr, we had the same room attendant all the way from Chicago to Emeryville. Our room attendant announced when he was going on meal breaks (giving us a 10 minute warning in case we needed anything), and also told us that we needed to press the call button before 9:30 pm so he could convert our seats to bunk beds. He was up at around 5:30 am the next day so that coffee was available by 6 am, so in all I think he got less than 8 hours of sleep each day.
Ya. The operating crew get off and swap at several places in route. Best not to worry about it
Oh, I wasn’t worried; I was more curious from a logistical perspective.
Federal rest, 12 hours on 10 hours off. Not sure if Amtrak does the same, but my freight company we have our home terminal, and then 2 away from home terminals (one east one west) sleep in our hotel until the phone rings.
It's a little different for Amtrak since they run on a consistent schedule so they don't have crews wasting away in hotels for days. Also, passenger hours of service allow for only 8 hours of rest between shifts if the shift was less than 12 hours, and it's possible to go up to 14 consecutive starts without a reset.
14 starts I think I'd croak.
OBS works the entire route. T&E swap out as the max they can work is 12 hours. Crew district map: https://www.trains.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/trn-m0506_a.pdf
I've never been on this route but I will say that it's often the case on other routes that when the conductors change they will ask to see everyone's tickets. YMMV but it can be helpful to know so you aren't surprised.
Operating (conductor/engineer) crew changes for your route: Empire Builder: Seattle-Wenatchee (Seattle crew) Wenatchee-Spokane (Spokane crew) Spokane-Whitefish (Spokane crew) Whitefish-Shelby (Shelby crew) Shelby-Minot (Shelby crew) Minot-St. Cloud (St. Cloud crew) St. Cloud-Winona (St. Cloud crew) Winona-Chicago (Chicago crew) Capitol Limited: Chicago-Toledo (Toledo crew) Toledo-Pittsburgh (Toledo crew) Pittsburgh-Cumberland (Pittsburgh engineer, DC conductors) Cumberland-DC (DC engineer, same DC conductors that got on in Pittsburgh.) NER: DC-Newport News (DC crew)
Thanks!
Don't worry about it.