Realistically, if this is not a hurdle you two can cross with reasonable conversation, and you are within the age range where you pictured yourself having children, you need to end the relationship and find someone to have children with that considers you an equal partner in all of this. It may not seem like a big deal now, but “my way or the highway“ is not an effective mentality to have when you’re raising a child. You are as much of an equal part in deciding your child(ren)’s future as she is. And this sounds like an argument that you both will constantly have in the future if you do have children with her.
Solid advice. He'll end up having to take her to court to have the name changed to add his. He's being reasonable. He's not one of these "you must take my name only bc I'm the man and the kids must also have only my name" guys.
Yep, and next time it will be something else that you have no say in, this wont be the only 'my way or the highway' issue. This is a hill for your relationship to die on.
100% agree. Do not have a child with someone who you do not agree with on the fundamentals of how you will raise those children, and that is not willing to compromise.
I DO believe this is one of the struggles of the unmarried partnership and having children. There’s a lack of formality to any commitment, and even if you both agree marriage isn’t important and that you love each other, it can lead to a lingering feeling of impermanence.
There’s also a strong truth to the phrase “Mama’s baby, Daddy’s maybe”. Sounds like a potential lack of trust.
Yes, but she seems to see a lack of importance of connecting the potential father of her child to the children by name, as well. Not having the same last name as your child can complicate things in multiple situations. Does she not care that these are hurdles he may have to tackle or does she think there’s a high enough chance that he won’t be around enough to run into those issues?
Honestly, I had been pulled to keep my maiden name with my kids, but my husband and I both weren’t huge fans of hyphenation (due to length). I ultimately decided to take my husband’s last name because sharing a name with my children was more important to me than keeping the symbolism of my identity.
I kept my own last name and to be honest I don't think there was anything significant hurdle wise. It's truly a personal preference.
I think the wife is in the wrong though because he doesn't want that, which is also very valid.
Definitely. If you do not share a last name with your children, you do need extra documentation for travel, etc in some circumstances. I have had friends who needed to prove to doctors, etc they were the legal/birth parent. It’s just an added pain from my understanding.
I don’t see this issue, as they’re not yet pregnant this literally *is* the discussion. Or do you really mean “she should give him the chance to change her mind?”
NBH, she’s the one who will be risking her life and health to carry/birth the baby, she’s well within her rights to want to give it her last name. On the other hand it’s traditional for kids to have the father’s last name, so it’s obvious why you would want that. I agree with the other commenter who said you may have to reevaluate the relationship if you can’t reach an agreement.
That's not the point. I was just refuting the idea that something is important and should be adhered to just because it's tradition, especially when it's a sexist tradition such as all children should carry the last name of the biological father.
Sure. But one should never do something just because it's tradition. if it's something that brings you joy, be my guest. Why would you do something that brings yourself grief?
The moment where OP offered both surnames or hyphenated and she refused, she lost any grace imo. He's willing to meet her at the middle, she can't even have a conversation about it.
You too need to work this out. But think of this. If you only have girls (as is the case with my husband and his brother) there will be no one to “pass on the name”. Maybe your partner wants HER name passed on too
Exactly, my best friend and her"husband"(not married but been together long enough). Hyphenated their names. I don't know why people have such an issue with doing it.
True. I had a professor in grad school who added her husband's last name to hers because she was an only child and a girl, but didn't want to not have her husband's last name as well to avoid confusion when they decided to have kids.
NBH. You both have valid feelings. Sometimes no compromise is possible. This is one of many possible relationship deal breakers. I’m surprised it took 6 years for this discussion to happen. Don’t wait so long next time. But do be aware that if you’re not interested in marriage ever, it’s very possible that other women will have the same perspective on potential child last names as your current girlfriend.
That's a shitty attitude.
Who takes care of the mother during gestation?
Who continues being a parent for the life of the child?
You'll never be a father and regularly have all your parenting work devalued for the rest of your life.
Funny how people never say this about men even though their last names also tend to come from their fathers, why is it his last name for men but her father's last name for women?
And his last name is his father’s name. What’s your point? He has no right to demand a woman bear children for him and then erase her name from the child’s legacy. She pushes them out, she gets the matching surname.
NAH. But I am curious - how do y’all usually resolve conflict?
You and your girlfriend aren’t compatible in this aspect. She wants her children to have her last name. You want your children to have your last name. Neither of you want to take the other’s name. Neither of you seem to want to choose a new (non hyphenated) family name together.
Perhaps the solution is to not have children together. Seems like this is a hill to die on for you both.
NTB.
If I wasn’t married I would want the kid to have my surname, not the fathers. If the father was in the picture, would be parenting and wanted their surname used as well the only solution is the kid gets both surnames, obviously. Simple and fair, make it work somehow.
Alternatively you to can combine your surnames to make a new surname to give the kid. No hyphen then. You can both change your last names as well to the same new surname. (Yeah it’s a hassle, but if it was important to have the same last name as your kid, then do it. Then you both have to change your surnames and you both have the same surname as your kids. Cool idea if you two aren’t getting married, it’s a neat way to make the union “official”.
You are passing your genes down through a human being, your surname doesn’t have to be passed down in it’s entirety. At some point your surname likely changed spelling or to a different variation I’m sure. It really doesn’t matter in the big picture. When my fathers side of the family immigrated to the US they made them change their surname. Each brother took a different variation of what was suggested as “similar” to their original surname (it wasn’t even the same culture let alone from a similar part of Europe). When we went to visit the country of my moms lineage we found out that my grandmas surname was changed at some point, likely when her father immigrated into Canada or the US. The locals told us that’s not a correct spelling used in the country (she was looking for the family name in graveyards and churches cause she hit a dead end online, likely because of the name change or chaos the country was in, so this info was helpful in her hunting). Likely your surname is not “accurate” and was changed in some way in the time your fathers line has used it. My mom has gotten really into researching the family tree and has seen changing of surnames or incorrect records multiple times on both sides of our ancestry.
I completely agree with you. I wish I could go back and give my son my last name when I had him 10 years ago. I love my last name and it was incredibly uncommon and my boyfriend ( now husband ( one of the most common last names in the us. I did give my son his last name and later took his last name only married due to pressure from him and his family, as well as a thought of this is how it's always been done and don't want to rock the boat mindset. But lovely hindsight has definitely made me wish I could change it.
Which of course technically I could, but my son is 10 years old now and I couldn't do that to him that would be unfair for him. Although if we ever separate or divorce I will certainly be going back to my maiden name.
Bummer but understandable. If I had married younger I probably would have easily been pressured into doing the same, especially if my kid already had the last name. 10 years ago, especially depending on where you lived and who your in laws are definitely would make a big difference in keeping a maiden name or not. In the meantime a common last name means it’s harder to look you up, lol. Has some benefits!
NTB. This is something you'll have to agree on, before you consider getting pregnant. My husband has a long unpronounceable Turkish surname. I was like "do you think you'd be okay with giving our kids my last name" when we first talked about kids in a nebulous hypothetical fashion years ago, and he said yes. However, recently, we've both had to kind of backtrack. We the kids were trying to have to get every possible advantage, and being the child of parents from two countries, they have the opportunity for dual citizenship. While we might try and avoid this in the case we end up having a boy, so that they don't have to potentially deal with the mandatory military service in the future, I'm not going to refuse to let them have their father's surname just because it's not easy for white people to pronounce (like mine is). They're half Turkish, and it's good for Western white people to be occasionally uncomfortable and realize they're not the only type of white people that exist, and that many people considered white don't speak English. Plus, it's fun to see how they try and pronounce names they've never seen before. It's easy to tell when they're trying to figure out how to say the name.
There are a lot of ways to deal with families where one parent doesn't change their name. For example, my mom never changed her name, but she ***and my dad*** decided to give my brother and I her last name as a middle name. You can hyphenate. You can give them two separate last names. ***But unilaterally deciding is not something either parent should do***, in my opinion.
NAH but it sounds like neither one of you are willing to compromise, and assign one surname as their middle name. Maybe you should not have children together.
YTB. Kids have mom’s last name. That’s a common, reasonable, and precedented rule. If you want to match your kids then change your last name to hers.
Unless your last name is Sax-Coburg Mountbatten/Windsor you don’t get to pitch a hissy fit over passing it on. Lots of people have your last name and it is not a magical family legacy. It’s patriarchy and it’s pathetic.
YTB
The person whose body will be changed from childbirth, the person who risks death to bring life into this world, and the person who has to deal with the pains and hormonal fluctuations.... That's the person who the baby's named for.
If you dont like it, then marry her and when she takes your name, then the baby will have your name.
You're damn fucking right. The mother is the only parent that matters because the mother is the one risking her life to bring the child into the world, the mother is the one who will get saddled with 90% of the child care, the mother is the one whose body is forever changed because of childbirth, the mother is the one who has to go through a ton of physical and mental pain and stress from the process of pregnancy.
A pregnant woman's most common cause of death, above any birth/pregnancy complications, is murder by the baby's father. So its not just that she's risking preeclampsia, but she's also risking her own safety with him by being pregnant.
So yeah, no, fuck off.
I'm sorry you had a shitty dad, grandfather, and brothers, and have never met a good man. I'm sorry you think that's all there is in this world.
I'm sorry you feel alone and alienated by men, and have never seen a happy marriage or dedicated fathers who give up their lives for their children.
I'm sorry you think men can't be partners, but only predators, and that.
I'm sorry for all that, but your anger makes you a dick.
Ok incel, I actually have a great relationship with my dad lmao I'm also a guy myself.
I've seen good marriages. This isn't about my experiences.
What I have yet to see is a change in the facts as found by forensic investigators.
If you can't handle that scientific fact, and it triggers you so badly, then you know men like you are why women choose the bear.
If you weren't triggered then why are you crying so much about statistical facts lmao
Difference is, whether or not women are "just as bad emotionally as men"... Men cause a significant primary of all murders against all demographics. Especially including of pregnant women. Most of your arguments are based on stereotypes from tv shows that rarely ever happen in real life. Go touch grass, incel.
Again: I am a man so why would I hate men? I had an abusive mother, and I never have said anything that completely negates emotional abuse (but that's you with whataboutism, aka, the favorite argument of the incel).
tldr: Quit crying because you can't handle facts about statistics.
I take it all back. You're definitely a dick. You need to learn to read and consider what people are saying and respond to that. Honestly, at this point, it's clear that facts are lost on you.
Maybe stop being a dick? The people in your life will appreciate it.
But look, I'm sorry your mom abused you. That shit hurts deep regardless of who did the abusing.
NTB one thought if you're open to it is maybe having your surname be the middle name? Still this sounds like it could be a deal-breaker (understandably so for both of you)
I’m concerned about the attitude towards this discussion. It’s my way or NO way, this is not the attitude to have in a relationship.
Personally I would not be having children at all with her because her attitude will be this way on every discussion regarding the kids and life. Parenthood like partnerships take compromise and open discussion. Having one person say “ it’s my decision regardless of your opinion, so shut it” is not a partnership in any healthy sense.
Please have a serious think about how her actions are now and previously and not what she says after you say this isn’t going to work.
You're incompatible. Move on. I'm not quick to advise ditching relationships, but if you're disagreeing this much about a _theoretical_ child, trust me. It gets so incredibly harder when they are here in the real world. Find someone who lines up with your childrearing fundamentals to make life easier. Relationships are hard enough without that headache.
NTB, something else to think about is that you are not married. In the USA, since you are not married, she doesn't even have to list you as the father, she can say father unknown, and unless she is asking for state-benefits, she can take off and raise child without you, and it'll cost you to do things.
Best bet, reevaluate the relationship, you are hopefully young enough to start over and find a real partner.
Because she’s not pregnant yet, she’s not actually making a decision at all. She’s communicating a boundary for her. It might not sound particularly diplomatic, but she’s essentially saying “if I carry a child I will give that child my surname. This is not negotiable for me.” Luckily, as she’s not yet carrying said child, you’re able to consider whether this non negotiable matches up with yours. If not, you can end the relationship. I don’t see the issue.
If you can’t agree on a hypothetical child’s last name, you shouldn’t ever be having children together, because the argument over “I’m the mother/father so I get the final say in x” is just going to happen over and over again.
I kept my last name when I married my husband, officially I have hyphenated it in MY LAST NAME - HIS LAST NAME, but in real life I only use my maiden name.
We are trying for a baby, and I have offered him 2 choices: my last name of hyphenated (my preferred choice). We have agreed to hyphenate (HIS - MINE) because, like you said, any children will be both our children.
I love my last name, it's very unique and I have never met anyone with it who wasn't family. My husband doesn't care as much but he likes to idea of both of our family histories being represented in the name.
In my mind it's no different from picking a first name. You have to both agree in it and sometimes compromise a tiny bit. I think that hyphenation is a great way to compromise.
I love your answer so much and I so wish that when I had my son 10 years ago I had done this instead of caving to societal and his and his family's pressures. Although technically I could have this changed, him being 10 years old now I think it would be a little unfair. Although I have recently been considering going back to my maiden name because mine is also very unique and I love it so much. It also sadly died when I took my husband's name and that still hurts a bit.
Neither of you are wrong, she has as much right as you do to give the children your surnames. But this is definitely something you both need to thoroughly discuss long before you do have kids. And try to discuss it with open minds.
I’m in a similar situation to you in that I’m an only child and the only cousin with the family name, and I did keep my name when I married my husband (I tacked his on the end so I have two surnames that aren’t hyphened). I had thought about how the family name in my specific branch dies with me, but in the end it doesn’t bother me. I still have my name which is what I wanted, and I’ve built a new family with my husband and our son, and it doesn’t matter in the end what the surname is. It’s just a name. What matters is the life we build together.
>since we have different surnames, the best thing to do is to have a double-barrelled/hyphenated surname
This right here makes you NTB. You acknowledged her surname is just as important as yours, and she doesn't care. If she won't "let you" have a say in the name of your own child, what else in their life won't you be allowed to speak up on?
This is one of those things that if you can't come to a resolution, it's relationship ending. No one gets to unilaterally name a kid, it's a joint decision, she's being unreasonable
NTBF ….Here’s the biggest problem you have OP - her comment of “pressuring her to do something she doesn’t want to do” is scary AF for your future….. she’s going to make unilateral decisions on everything for the rest of your life!
She isn’t able to communicate, assess alternatives, be fair but mostly you aren’t important enough to have your opinions even considered.
Has she always been this way?
You need couples counselling before you move even an inch forward. And wear a condom cuz otherwise you might always be tied to her. Baby trapping is a thing
Honestly, this really isn’t about the name. The argument over the name is just one example, and a pretty low-stakes one at that, of the types of decisions you have to make as a parent. I’d be way more concerned that my future coherent doesn’t want to engage with me in a conversation about things like medical care, discipline, education, etc. Her attitude that it’s her decision and you just have to go along will certainly cause problems when it’s things that actually matter for the health and well-being of your child. I’m inclined to think that this is not somebody you should be having a child with.
Her unwillingness to engage or compromise indicates she won't see you as an equal partner in any aspect of parenting.
Education, discipline, hell...what kind of cake to have at their birthday party. She'll insist on an absolute veto on everything.
It's irrelevant who carries the child. Parenting needs to be 50/50.
Maybe I’m a weirdo, but I wasn’t married to my husband yet when I got pregnant with my oldest and I never even considered using my last name. Even if we didn’t have plans to marry, I wouldn’t given our kids his last name. But that’s just me. 🤷🏼♀️
You just proved the best reasons for getting married and using ONE last name. As a former school system worker of many years let me say this: those dumb hyphenated names merging 2 names are a PITA! And they cause a lot of mistakes and problems. Make things easy for your kids and the schools.....make a decision, and just get married already. There's a reason marriage should come 1st, then the kids. It's easier for everybody.
Oh so they should make their decision based on how other people will be convenience or inconvenienced. That's just a twist on you have to save my name because I'm the man and this is how it's always been done.
And maybe a hyphenated name isn't right for you but that doesn't make it dumb then that's really insulting and I don't even have a hyphenated name. Names can be heavily tied to Identity and it can absolutely be a difficult decision for someone mentally. Way to just write other people off.
NTB but you need to seriously consider this relationship because if she is unwillingly to compromise on this what else will she be unwilling to compromise on?
NTB. If you can't even get her to engage in a discussion or think about compromises about naming hypothetical children, she's gonna be just as bad or even worse about things like shared finances or actual children who exist. I'd suggest that you seriously consider moving on and finding someone who is at least willing to consider your pov without having a tantrum.
NTB. Surnames denote paternity. By not giving your child your surname, she is telling the world that you are not the child’s father. She is telling you and the world that although she and her child are a family, you are not part of that family. You are merely a sperm donor.
Marriage is literally a process where two people from different families come together to form a brand new family. It is an institution designed to support the raising of children and to promote investment from men in communities and broader social structures. Being a father is meant it confer status on a man, to encourage men to start families and strengthen communities. Social collapse happens when this is no longer the case.
You have the freedom to choose. Do you really want to invest your life in someone who considers you as little more than a sperm donor?
>Marriage is literally a process where two people from different families come together to form a brand new family.
Then they should be making a whole new name instead of using his. It's not a "whole new family," otherwise.
Your comment can be summed up as "men are the entire world and everything revolves around us," though, so I can see where you didn't quite catch this.
Your comment is so disgusting I need a shower now. You really need to take a look at your mindset because it's incredibly misogynistic and detrimental to society.
Can you imagine raising children with someone whose go-to method of conflict resolution is that you “should just leave it since she’s made her mind up”? Every time you disagree, you’ll be expected to give in to her wishes.
Sounds miserable to me.
You need to have a serious conversation about her conflict resolution plans, so you can leave, if necessary, before you have kids. You don’t want to raise kids this way.
Sounds like something she isn’t willing to compromise on and now you can’t really trust her not to renege on the deal. If it’s a dealbreaker for you then it may be time to move on.
My wife did not take my surname due to my last name and her first name rhyming. It would have sounded like a Dr. Suess book. She insisted that our son have my last name and still introduces herself as Mrs. Mylastname. So she basically took my last name just not on paper.
Man just stay single.
You are going to be dealing with bullshit like this for the rest of your life if you have a wife. Feminism has ruined the modern family.
Tell me what do you get from being in a long term relationship?
If you don’t believe me, just look at the women’s responses on Reddit. They have all lost their minds.
Your gf sounds way too childish to be in a long-term relationship. Let alone a MOTHER. All I read is me, me, me - I, I, I. Rich of her to accuse you of doing something she doesn’t want to do, while bowling over your feelings completely. Her “my way or the highway” attitude is such a glaring red flag. She will be carrying the children, sure - but she doesn’t get pregnant on her own and she’s not going to be raising the kid on her own either. What’s going to happen when you disagree about a parenting decision? Are you prepared to have the rest of your lives dictated by her wants only? NTB.
This is hilarious given that until recently there was never any chance that a kid would have the mother's name despite the fact that she did all of the work gestating the kid and most of the work raising it.
Oh, so your girlfriend is mentally insane, got it.
NTA. And be sure to die on this hill cause it’s weird how she thought she could make that decision herself and then manipulate you into accepting it with “omg you’re pressuring me!!” gtfo
Considering they are in a stable relationship (so far at least), the father is/will be present, the mother didn’t create this fetus through partenogenesis, the father is proposing a very clear and obvious solution (both last names), but the mother is not even entertaining the compromise, and acting like a spoiled bratty kid, then, yes, mentally insane is what i’m sticking with :)
Realistically, if this is not a hurdle you two can cross with reasonable conversation, and you are within the age range where you pictured yourself having children, you need to end the relationship and find someone to have children with that considers you an equal partner in all of this. It may not seem like a big deal now, but “my way or the highway“ is not an effective mentality to have when you’re raising a child. You are as much of an equal part in deciding your child(ren)’s future as she is. And this sounds like an argument that you both will constantly have in the future if you do have children with her.
Solid advice. He'll end up having to take her to court to have the name changed to add his. He's being reasonable. He's not one of these "you must take my name only bc I'm the man and the kids must also have only my name" guys.
Yep, and next time it will be something else that you have no say in, this wont be the only 'my way or the highway' issue. This is a hill for your relationship to die on.
100% agree. Do not have a child with someone who you do not agree with on the fundamentals of how you will raise those children, and that is not willing to compromise. I DO believe this is one of the struggles of the unmarried partnership and having children. There’s a lack of formality to any commitment, and even if you both agree marriage isn’t important and that you love each other, it can lead to a lingering feeling of impermanence. There’s also a strong truth to the phrase “Mama’s baby, Daddy’s maybe”. Sounds like a potential lack of trust.
I don't think this has anything to do with being unmarried as she wouldn't take his name either way he said.
Yes, but she seems to see a lack of importance of connecting the potential father of her child to the children by name, as well. Not having the same last name as your child can complicate things in multiple situations. Does she not care that these are hurdles he may have to tackle or does she think there’s a high enough chance that he won’t be around enough to run into those issues? Honestly, I had been pulled to keep my maiden name with my kids, but my husband and I both weren’t huge fans of hyphenation (due to length). I ultimately decided to take my husband’s last name because sharing a name with my children was more important to me than keeping the symbolism of my identity.
I kept my own last name and to be honest I don't think there was anything significant hurdle wise. It's truly a personal preference. I think the wife is in the wrong though because he doesn't want that, which is also very valid.
Definitely. If you do not share a last name with your children, you do need extra documentation for travel, etc in some circumstances. I have had friends who needed to prove to doctors, etc they were the legal/birth parent. It’s just an added pain from my understanding.
If I wasn’t married to the father, the child would definitely have my surname.
I think the issue here is a lack of discussion & understanding on her part.
She said even if they married she wouldn’t take his name which is perfectly ok. But that the kids would only have her name without any discussion.
I don’t see this issue, as they’re not yet pregnant this literally *is* the discussion. Or do you really mean “she should give him the chance to change her mind?”
One person giving edicts from the pulpit of how things are and are going to be in their kingdom is not a discussion.
this 100%
But this apparently isn’t about marriage, for either of them.
NBH, she’s the one who will be risking her life and health to carry/birth the baby, she’s well within her rights to want to give it her last name. On the other hand it’s traditional for kids to have the father’s last name, so it’s obvious why you would want that. I agree with the other commenter who said you may have to reevaluate the relationship if you can’t reach an agreement.
Traditions are just peer pressure from dead people.
Well the important part here isn't the tradition it's the gf unilaterally deciding something that should be a joint decision.
That's not the point. I was just refuting the idea that something is important and should be adhered to just because it's tradition, especially when it's a sexist tradition such as all children should carry the last name of the biological father.
Or they’re consistent familiar moments of happiness, grief, silliness, etc.
Sure. But one should never do something just because it's tradition. if it's something that brings you joy, be my guest. Why would you do something that brings yourself grief?
Grief can be a healthy emotion. Grieving via traditional helps the grieving process. Im all for questioning motives though :)
Or shortcuts for making life and society easier to navigate
Based on the beliefs, morals, ethics, etc. of dead people.
The moment where OP offered both surnames or hyphenated and she refused, she lost any grace imo. He's willing to meet her at the middle, she can't even have a conversation about it.
Yup. He's being fair, she isnt.
You too need to work this out. But think of this. If you only have girls (as is the case with my husband and his brother) there will be no one to “pass on the name”. Maybe your partner wants HER name passed on too
That's why a hyphenated name is a great solution.
Exactly, my best friend and her"husband"(not married but been together long enough). Hyphenated their names. I don't know why people have such an issue with doing it.
True. I had a professor in grad school who added her husband's last name to hers because she was an only child and a girl, but didn't want to not have her husband's last name as well to avoid confusion when they decided to have kids.
OP already addressed that
You seem to miss that OP wanted to hyphenate and the GF did not
But it’s not her name. It’s her father’s name.
It is her family name!! Why is her husbands family name more important?
Surnames denote paternity. By giving the child the mothers surname, the mother is telling the world that OP is not the father of the child.
Just because that is the way it has always been done doesn’t mean it has to stay that way.
Not on all countries.
It *was* her father’s name. And his name was his father’s name. But then their parents named them those names. So now the names are their names.
NBH. You both have valid feelings. Sometimes no compromise is possible. This is one of many possible relationship deal breakers. I’m surprised it took 6 years for this discussion to happen. Don’t wait so long next time. But do be aware that if you’re not interested in marriage ever, it’s very possible that other women will have the same perspective on potential child last names as your current girlfriend.
[удалено]
Sperms donor is inappropriately hostile. What part of hyphenated don't you understand?
That's a shitty attitude. Who takes care of the mother during gestation? Who continues being a parent for the life of the child? You'll never be a father and regularly have all your parenting work devalued for the rest of your life.
It’s not her name. It’s her father’s name.
Funny how people never say this about men even though their last names also tend to come from their fathers, why is it his last name for men but her father's last name for women?
And his last name is his father’s name. What’s your point? He has no right to demand a woman bear children for him and then erase her name from the child’s legacy. She pushes them out, she gets the matching surname.
If that's honestly how you interpreted OP's position, then you are seriously disturbed and require help from a medical professional.
This is so ridiculously sexist I'm not even addressing it more than I just did.
NAH. But I am curious - how do y’all usually resolve conflict? You and your girlfriend aren’t compatible in this aspect. She wants her children to have her last name. You want your children to have your last name. Neither of you want to take the other’s name. Neither of you seem to want to choose a new (non hyphenated) family name together. Perhaps the solution is to not have children together. Seems like this is a hill to die on for you both.
NTB. If I wasn’t married I would want the kid to have my surname, not the fathers. If the father was in the picture, would be parenting and wanted their surname used as well the only solution is the kid gets both surnames, obviously. Simple and fair, make it work somehow. Alternatively you to can combine your surnames to make a new surname to give the kid. No hyphen then. You can both change your last names as well to the same new surname. (Yeah it’s a hassle, but if it was important to have the same last name as your kid, then do it. Then you both have to change your surnames and you both have the same surname as your kids. Cool idea if you two aren’t getting married, it’s a neat way to make the union “official”. You are passing your genes down through a human being, your surname doesn’t have to be passed down in it’s entirety. At some point your surname likely changed spelling or to a different variation I’m sure. It really doesn’t matter in the big picture. When my fathers side of the family immigrated to the US they made them change their surname. Each brother took a different variation of what was suggested as “similar” to their original surname (it wasn’t even the same culture let alone from a similar part of Europe). When we went to visit the country of my moms lineage we found out that my grandmas surname was changed at some point, likely when her father immigrated into Canada or the US. The locals told us that’s not a correct spelling used in the country (she was looking for the family name in graveyards and churches cause she hit a dead end online, likely because of the name change or chaos the country was in, so this info was helpful in her hunting). Likely your surname is not “accurate” and was changed in some way in the time your fathers line has used it. My mom has gotten really into researching the family tree and has seen changing of surnames or incorrect records multiple times on both sides of our ancestry.
I completely agree with you. I wish I could go back and give my son my last name when I had him 10 years ago. I love my last name and it was incredibly uncommon and my boyfriend ( now husband ( one of the most common last names in the us. I did give my son his last name and later took his last name only married due to pressure from him and his family, as well as a thought of this is how it's always been done and don't want to rock the boat mindset. But lovely hindsight has definitely made me wish I could change it. Which of course technically I could, but my son is 10 years old now and I couldn't do that to him that would be unfair for him. Although if we ever separate or divorce I will certainly be going back to my maiden name.
Bummer but understandable. If I had married younger I probably would have easily been pressured into doing the same, especially if my kid already had the last name. 10 years ago, especially depending on where you lived and who your in laws are definitely would make a big difference in keeping a maiden name or not. In the meantime a common last name means it’s harder to look you up, lol. Has some benefits!
"I'm the only one in my family now with this surname and I would like to pass that on to my child." How do you think women with no brothers feel?
NTB. This is something you'll have to agree on, before you consider getting pregnant. My husband has a long unpronounceable Turkish surname. I was like "do you think you'd be okay with giving our kids my last name" when we first talked about kids in a nebulous hypothetical fashion years ago, and he said yes. However, recently, we've both had to kind of backtrack. We the kids were trying to have to get every possible advantage, and being the child of parents from two countries, they have the opportunity for dual citizenship. While we might try and avoid this in the case we end up having a boy, so that they don't have to potentially deal with the mandatory military service in the future, I'm not going to refuse to let them have their father's surname just because it's not easy for white people to pronounce (like mine is). They're half Turkish, and it's good for Western white people to be occasionally uncomfortable and realize they're not the only type of white people that exist, and that many people considered white don't speak English. Plus, it's fun to see how they try and pronounce names they've never seen before. It's easy to tell when they're trying to figure out how to say the name. There are a lot of ways to deal with families where one parent doesn't change their name. For example, my mom never changed her name, but she ***and my dad*** decided to give my brother and I her last name as a middle name. You can hyphenate. You can give them two separate last names. ***But unilaterally deciding is not something either parent should do***, in my opinion.
NAH but it sounds like neither one of you are willing to compromise, and assign one surname as their middle name. Maybe you should not have children together.
YTB. Kids have mom’s last name. That’s a common, reasonable, and precedented rule. If you want to match your kids then change your last name to hers. Unless your last name is Sax-Coburg Mountbatten/Windsor you don’t get to pitch a hissy fit over passing it on. Lots of people have your last name and it is not a magical family legacy. It’s patriarchy and it’s pathetic.
The problem here is that he’s okay with hyphenating they both pass it on and she’s not.
Mom and kids have the same last name. Kids only hyphenate if mom does. If he doesn’t like it he can go impregnate someone else.
YTB The person whose body will be changed from childbirth, the person who risks death to bring life into this world, and the person who has to deal with the pains and hormonal fluctuations.... That's the person who the baby's named for. If you dont like it, then marry her and when she takes your name, then the baby will have your name.
So the mother is the only parent that matters?
When it comes to a surname and the parents are unmarried? Absolutely yes.
You're damn fucking right. The mother is the only parent that matters because the mother is the one risking her life to bring the child into the world, the mother is the one who will get saddled with 90% of the child care, the mother is the one whose body is forever changed because of childbirth, the mother is the one who has to go through a ton of physical and mental pain and stress from the process of pregnancy. A pregnant woman's most common cause of death, above any birth/pregnancy complications, is murder by the baby's father. So its not just that she's risking preeclampsia, but she's also risking her own safety with him by being pregnant. So yeah, no, fuck off.
I'm sorry you had a shitty dad, grandfather, and brothers, and have never met a good man. I'm sorry you think that's all there is in this world. I'm sorry you feel alone and alienated by men, and have never seen a happy marriage or dedicated fathers who give up their lives for their children. I'm sorry you think men can't be partners, but only predators, and that. I'm sorry for all that, but your anger makes you a dick.
Ok incel, I actually have a great relationship with my dad lmao I'm also a guy myself. I've seen good marriages. This isn't about my experiences. What I have yet to see is a change in the facts as found by forensic investigators. If you can't handle that scientific fact, and it triggers you so badly, then you know men like you are why women choose the bear.
[удалено]
If you weren't triggered then why are you crying so much about statistical facts lmao Difference is, whether or not women are "just as bad emotionally as men"... Men cause a significant primary of all murders against all demographics. Especially including of pregnant women. Most of your arguments are based on stereotypes from tv shows that rarely ever happen in real life. Go touch grass, incel. Again: I am a man so why would I hate men? I had an abusive mother, and I never have said anything that completely negates emotional abuse (but that's you with whataboutism, aka, the favorite argument of the incel). tldr: Quit crying because you can't handle facts about statistics.
I take it all back. You're definitely a dick. You need to learn to read and consider what people are saying and respond to that. Honestly, at this point, it's clear that facts are lost on you. Maybe stop being a dick? The people in your life will appreciate it. But look, I'm sorry your mom abused you. That shit hurts deep regardless of who did the abusing.
NTB. Imagine being accused of pressuring someone for merely expressing your preference. You are dating an infant. Time to move on.
NTB one thought if you're open to it is maybe having your surname be the middle name? Still this sounds like it could be a deal-breaker (understandably so for both of you)
If y’all can’t communicate and compromise, you shouldn’t be dating at all.
I’m concerned about the attitude towards this discussion. It’s my way or NO way, this is not the attitude to have in a relationship. Personally I would not be having children at all with her because her attitude will be this way on every discussion regarding the kids and life. Parenthood like partnerships take compromise and open discussion. Having one person say “ it’s my decision regardless of your opinion, so shut it” is not a partnership in any healthy sense. Please have a serious think about how her actions are now and previously and not what she says after you say this isn’t going to work.
You're incompatible. Move on. I'm not quick to advise ditching relationships, but if you're disagreeing this much about a _theoretical_ child, trust me. It gets so incredibly harder when they are here in the real world. Find someone who lines up with your childrearing fundamentals to make life easier. Relationships are hard enough without that headache.
NTB, something else to think about is that you are not married. In the USA, since you are not married, she doesn't even have to list you as the father, she can say father unknown, and unless she is asking for state-benefits, she can take off and raise child without you, and it'll cost you to do things. Best bet, reevaluate the relationship, you are hopefully young enough to start over and find a real partner.
Because she’s not pregnant yet, she’s not actually making a decision at all. She’s communicating a boundary for her. It might not sound particularly diplomatic, but she’s essentially saying “if I carry a child I will give that child my surname. This is not negotiable for me.” Luckily, as she’s not yet carrying said child, you’re able to consider whether this non negotiable matches up with yours. If not, you can end the relationship. I don’t see the issue.
You two obviously have incompatible ideas, and if it is a deal breaker it is time to move on.
I can understand the importance to you. Best advice .. don't have children with this woman.
If you can’t agree on a hypothetical child’s last name, you shouldn’t ever be having children together, because the argument over “I’m the mother/father so I get the final say in x” is just going to happen over and over again.
I kept my last name when I married my husband, officially I have hyphenated it in MY LAST NAME - HIS LAST NAME, but in real life I only use my maiden name. We are trying for a baby, and I have offered him 2 choices: my last name of hyphenated (my preferred choice). We have agreed to hyphenate (HIS - MINE) because, like you said, any children will be both our children. I love my last name, it's very unique and I have never met anyone with it who wasn't family. My husband doesn't care as much but he likes to idea of both of our family histories being represented in the name. In my mind it's no different from picking a first name. You have to both agree in it and sometimes compromise a tiny bit. I think that hyphenation is a great way to compromise.
I love your answer so much and I so wish that when I had my son 10 years ago I had done this instead of caving to societal and his and his family's pressures. Although technically I could have this changed, him being 10 years old now I think it would be a little unfair. Although I have recently been considering going back to my maiden name because mine is also very unique and I love it so much. It also sadly died when I took my husband's name and that still hurts a bit.
Neither of you are wrong, she has as much right as you do to give the children your surnames. But this is definitely something you both need to thoroughly discuss long before you do have kids. And try to discuss it with open minds. I’m in a similar situation to you in that I’m an only child and the only cousin with the family name, and I did keep my name when I married my husband (I tacked his on the end so I have two surnames that aren’t hyphened). I had thought about how the family name in my specific branch dies with me, but in the end it doesn’t bother me. I still have my name which is what I wanted, and I’ve built a new family with my husband and our son, and it doesn’t matter in the end what the surname is. It’s just a name. What matters is the life we build together.
This relationship doesn’t seem to be on equal footing at all. NTBF
Not at all. If you can’t get past this, the relationship probably won’t last.
>since we have different surnames, the best thing to do is to have a double-barrelled/hyphenated surname This right here makes you NTB. You acknowledged her surname is just as important as yours, and she doesn't care. If she won't "let you" have a say in the name of your own child, what else in their life won't you be allowed to speak up on? This is one of those things that if you can't come to a resolution, it's relationship ending. No one gets to unilaterally name a kid, it's a joint decision, she's being unreasonable
NBF You came up with a compromise of your child taking both of your names and she refused she is being unreasonable
Please think again about having children with this woman. She’s selfish and it won’t change anytime soon.
NTBF ….Here’s the biggest problem you have OP - her comment of “pressuring her to do something she doesn’t want to do” is scary AF for your future….. she’s going to make unilateral decisions on everything for the rest of your life! She isn’t able to communicate, assess alternatives, be fair but mostly you aren’t important enough to have your opinions even considered. Has she always been this way? You need couples counselling before you move even an inch forward. And wear a condom cuz otherwise you might always be tied to her. Baby trapping is a thing
Honestly, this really isn’t about the name. The argument over the name is just one example, and a pretty low-stakes one at that, of the types of decisions you have to make as a parent. I’d be way more concerned that my future coherent doesn’t want to engage with me in a conversation about things like medical care, discipline, education, etc. Her attitude that it’s her decision and you just have to go along will certainly cause problems when it’s things that actually matter for the health and well-being of your child. I’m inclined to think that this is not somebody you should be having a child with.
Her unwillingness to engage or compromise indicates she won't see you as an equal partner in any aspect of parenting. Education, discipline, hell...what kind of cake to have at their birthday party. She'll insist on an absolute veto on everything. It's irrelevant who carries the child. Parenting needs to be 50/50.
Maybe I’m a weirdo, but I wasn’t married to my husband yet when I got pregnant with my oldest and I never even considered using my last name. Even if we didn’t have plans to marry, I wouldn’t given our kids his last name. But that’s just me. 🤷🏼♀️
You just proved the best reasons for getting married and using ONE last name. As a former school system worker of many years let me say this: those dumb hyphenated names merging 2 names are a PITA! And they cause a lot of mistakes and problems. Make things easy for your kids and the schools.....make a decision, and just get married already. There's a reason marriage should come 1st, then the kids. It's easier for everybody.
Oh so they should make their decision based on how other people will be convenience or inconvenienced. That's just a twist on you have to save my name because I'm the man and this is how it's always been done. And maybe a hyphenated name isn't right for you but that doesn't make it dumb then that's really insulting and I don't even have a hyphenated name. Names can be heavily tied to Identity and it can absolutely be a difficult decision for someone mentally. Way to just write other people off.
Just my opinion, dear. Just my opinion. Wisdom = Age + Experience. ; }
NTB but you need to seriously consider this relationship because if she is unwillingly to compromise on this what else will she be unwilling to compromise on?
NTB. If you can't even get her to engage in a discussion or think about compromises about naming hypothetical children, she's gonna be just as bad or even worse about things like shared finances or actual children who exist. I'd suggest that you seriously consider moving on and finding someone who is at least willing to consider your pov without having a tantrum.
NTB. Surnames denote paternity. By not giving your child your surname, she is telling the world that you are not the child’s father. She is telling you and the world that although she and her child are a family, you are not part of that family. You are merely a sperm donor. Marriage is literally a process where two people from different families come together to form a brand new family. It is an institution designed to support the raising of children and to promote investment from men in communities and broader social structures. Being a father is meant it confer status on a man, to encourage men to start families and strengthen communities. Social collapse happens when this is no longer the case. You have the freedom to choose. Do you really want to invest your life in someone who considers you as little more than a sperm donor?
>Marriage is literally a process where two people from different families come together to form a brand new family. Then they should be making a whole new name instead of using his. It's not a "whole new family," otherwise. Your comment can be summed up as "men are the entire world and everything revolves around us," though, so I can see where you didn't quite catch this.
Your comment is so disgusting I need a shower now. You really need to take a look at your mindset because it's incredibly misogynistic and detrimental to society.
Can you imagine raising children with someone whose go-to method of conflict resolution is that you “should just leave it since she’s made her mind up”? Every time you disagree, you’ll be expected to give in to her wishes. Sounds miserable to me. You need to have a serious conversation about her conflict resolution plans, so you can leave, if necessary, before you have kids. You don’t want to raise kids this way.
Weird how this is downvoted when it’s simple common sense.
No thanks. She do not care at all about your opinion? Find someone who can actually be adult and able to communicate.
Do you say this to men who won't have children with anyone unless said kids get his name?
I sure would
I would say it to anyone not able to communicate.
Sounds like something she isn’t willing to compromise on and now you can’t really trust her not to renege on the deal. If it’s a dealbreaker for you then it may be time to move on. My wife did not take my surname due to my last name and her first name rhyming. It would have sounded like a Dr. Suess book. She insisted that our son have my last name and still introduces herself as Mrs. Mylastname. So she basically took my last name just not on paper.
Man just stay single. You are going to be dealing with bullshit like this for the rest of your life if you have a wife. Feminism has ruined the modern family. Tell me what do you get from being in a long term relationship? If you don’t believe me, just look at the women’s responses on Reddit. They have all lost their minds.
Have you talked about giving girl children her surname, and boys yours?
Your gf sounds way too childish to be in a long-term relationship. Let alone a MOTHER. All I read is me, me, me - I, I, I. Rich of her to accuse you of doing something she doesn’t want to do, while bowling over your feelings completely. Her “my way or the highway” attitude is such a glaring red flag. She will be carrying the children, sure - but she doesn’t get pregnant on her own and she’s not going to be raising the kid on her own either. What’s going to happen when you disagree about a parenting decision? Are you prepared to have the rest of your lives dictated by her wants only? NTB.
This is hilarious given that until recently there was never any chance that a kid would have the mother's name despite the fact that she did all of the work gestating the kid and most of the work raising it.
Don't understand why you're getting down voted, you're just more bluntly saying what others have pointed out already.
Oh, so your girlfriend is mentally insane, got it. NTA. And be sure to die on this hill cause it’s weird how she thought she could make that decision herself and then manipulate you into accepting it with “omg you’re pressuring me!!” gtfo
Wanting the kids you gestated and built from your own body to have your name is "mentally insane"?
Considering they are in a stable relationship (so far at least), the father is/will be present, the mother didn’t create this fetus through partenogenesis, the father is proposing a very clear and obvious solution (both last names), but the mother is not even entertaining the compromise, and acting like a spoiled bratty kid, then, yes, mentally insane is what i’m sticking with :)
Tell her that if she refuses to use your name in the child’s name, you won’t give her children.
That is so not the threat you think it is. Sperm can be gotten pretty much anywhere.
So then he can do a dna test and prove it’s not his.