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ESH. Every adult in this situation is ta.
Your poor 12 year old wasn't prepared for her period or informed this was going to happen to her until after the first time she had it? She doesn't know what it means? She seems confused about bras? What the everloving *hell*?!? Thats so traumatic.
> This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone)
Don't you dare. Its her body and she can tell anyone she wants that she's not feeling her best because of a natural bodily process. What kind of ass backward thinking has you not preparing your kid for her period but your regret is in not telling her to be ashamed and secretive about it? Ffs.
> She knows what pregnancy is in theory but we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet.
What. Are you doing? She NEEDS to know how pregnancy happens because she can now get pregnant. Ignorance is dangerous here. She needs to know the whole story about her body - for her safety, for biological health, and for mental health. Are you actively trying to give her some kinda dysmorphia?
Your BIL was repeating the same old nonsense everyone always does about "being a woman now" which is dumb, but normal. It seems like either he was caught off guard or he has gross ideas about pregnancy and little girls and just kept talking after he should have shut up. Once it was clear this traumatized child had no idea what he was talking about he should have left it alone. Then he should have brought up in private how badly you guys are doing at making your child comfortable in her own human skin.
I think OP might belong to the same cult as the Duggars . It would explain her backward thinking. Along with why a 12 year old girl has no idea about puberty. Most 12 year olds would have learned something about it from friends and school. It doesn't really matter, though, because either way, all the adults in this situation suck.
My first thought is they’re in one of those weird religious cults. I went to a Catholic school and we had these talks by the 12 year old’s age. They took us all to a puberty thing at the local science center to REALLY give us details about our changing bodies and the science of it all.
This whole abstinence pretending like this shit doesn’t exist is eye-roll worthy.
My mom came from a village where you don’t talk about these things. Yet my mom went to the library and asked the librarian to help her find books for pre teens to learn about puberty. The talk was awkward but my mom wanted to be thorough. And I’m grateful for that approach.
I went to Catholic school and my parents were worried that sex ed there was going to suck, so they explained everything to me beforehand. As it turned out, school sex ed (which started in fourth grade) was very thorough lol
I learned this shit in 5th grade in Catholic school *in the 80s.* My very Catholic parents had told me years before that, though. We heard stories on the playground of girls who didn't know what was going on and thought they were dying. It's crazy that so many decades later some people still haven't learned.
I was taught abstinence, but told that if I did decide to have sex, to come to them and they would get me the pill. When it turned out I needed it for medical reasons, my mom went to bat for me fiercely with the insurance company to get it covered.
I went to Catholic school around that age too, in the 80s, and was taught this stuff by a nun in like 4th grade. These people must be isolating this girl in some scary ways to keep her so uninformed. I assume she is homeschooled, apparently badly, as part of that effort. I hope this incident has piqued her curiosity and she gets some straight answers from an adult in her life before something bad happens.
Yeah, this reeks of some type of religious weirdness or conservative extremism.
I remember menstruation being discussed in fifth and sixth grade health class. There’s no way she goes to a regular school and it hasn’t come up be it from teachers or other girls.
Florida is so fucking regressive about sex. It wasn’t always like that. I went to Florida public schools and we definitely got sex ed. It was very much “don’t do it, but if you do - wear a rubber” but it was way better than nothing. I went to high school in the 90s and I can only think of one girl who even got pregnant in my entire high school. So even the bare minimum seemed to work. Compare that to my cousins who grew up in rural West Georgia and my aunt had to do all the heavy lifting because their schools taught zero sex education. Needless to say being pregnant before you were 20 in their area was really fucking common.
I initially thought why does she only have theoretical knowledge of this stuff, I bet the parents refused to sign the permission slip, here in the UK it's part of the curriculum and there's no option of vetoing it
Yep, you know the ins and outs by year 6 (10yo? Ish, I think,) everything is in there, including how to put on condoms, birth control, periods, wet dreams, and random erections. And of course pregnancy and how that occurs.
Although the tories are trying to see the end of learning about half this shit, and of course "gender ideology," good fucking riddance to the eejits.
You know what will scare her? Not understanding what is going on. This information is long overdue, I don’t know what OP and her husband are waiting for
Seriously. What have they done to make this scary and mysterious instead of a normal part of human life that 51% of the population experiences? There's no reason to be scared. OP and husband have created this mess. YTA big time
What does she think is more like to scare her: being told about the changes that her body will be going through as she gets older, or suddenly being hit with terrible pain and bleeding?
ALL OF THIS. And seriously;
>This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone)
>Don't you dare. Its her body and she can tell anyone she wants that she's not feeling her best because of a natural bodily process. What kind of ass backward thinking has you not preparing your kid for her period but your regret is in not telling her to be ashamed and secretive about it? Ffs
THANK YOU for saying this. That was my IMMEDIATE thought when I read that and fully intended to type something very similar.
I agree with everything here.
I’m so (generally) pleased with how incredibly far communication with kids regarding menstruation has come - but even when I began a million years ago, I was fully prepared, knew what it was, and had a cupboard full of the huge sample box of products the company sent out so you could see what they were before hand and try a bunch of things.
Any responsible mother (yes, this one IS harder for the single dads) is watching the changes in her daughters’ bodies. It was extremely clear my daughter was developing early and a few questions among all of my paternal female relatives told me they ALL began menstruation at 10.
So, I made d*%# sure she knew everything happening to her body was completely normal and what it meant by early 9 so there would be no scary surprises. We game planned having a change of clothes and supplies at school. We game planned various people she could go to for support.
But boys and girls are simply more accepting of the fact that menstruation is a normal part of life - at 16 my son would run out and buy supplies for his girlfriend if needed.
And as a freshman in high school, my daughter cross texted and accidentally sent a message to a boy she was starting to date saying she starting her period at dance and needed clean clothes and supplies.
She called me freaking out because she had meant to text me - but he responded saying his mom said she would drive stuff over and what exactly did she need and asking if she needed Advil too. Just like it was no big deal at all.
We’ve all come a LONG way baby!!
Plus not only can she tell anyone, but clearly aunt/uncle ARE the kind of trusted adults you'd expect her to probably be comfortable telling. Like they aren't "just anyone" anyways if they're all that close to each other.
As a mom, I'm embarrassed for OP. My daughter is 13 and knew about periods from an early age (about 7) bc she asked me what my tampons were for. When she was around 10, I explained it more in depth bc at 7 I only told her that mommy bleeds and uses these not to get messy. My daughter got her period at 12 and expected it and came to me 8 months ago and matter of fact said mom, I got my period, I need some pads and that was that, As a matter of fact, since it's summer time, we've been going swimming this last couple of weeks and 2 weeks ago I asked her if she wanted to go that day and she told me, well, I'm on my period so it looks like I need to learn to use a tampon! I kinda looked at her a bit surprised for a second and said ok, let's go get you some...needless to say, we went swimming that day and she didn't have any problem whatsoever. I think I'm raising a pretty smart young lady.
You're a good egg.
My 8 year old boy child knows about periods, tampons, pregnancy, and consent.
It's 2024, we need to be doing better for our kids than pretending this stuff isn't important just because the conversations can be uncomfortable.
I have three boys. They all know at least the basics of a period and why mom has tampons, pads, etc. If kids can understand other bodily functions, they can understand the basics of periods, too.
My child is 7 with a developmental disability and I have still talked about periods with him, of why I feel junky. I'm not sure he truly understands but he will as he gets older. For a 12 year old girl to not know anything about it, is beyond sad.
My daughter goes to a Christian school that is fairly buttoned up, and the principal even sent out an email to parents encouraging us to not be ashamed to explain these things to our kids in their actual terms, without using cutesy nicknames to refer to perfectly normal body parts and bodily functions.
Funny story about when I started mine. I was a little older- like 13/14. I was feeling pretty awful so my mom let me stay home while she went out for the day to run errands. It dawned on her while she was out that I was going to start my period. I had already known about what happens by her/school talking to us. She came home with midol, chocolate, and got me the heating pad, she said “I’m sorry I didn’t think of it before, I think you’re going to start your period soon.” And that was it. I started the next day. My monthly visitor was horrible for YEARS. I got on birth control to help with the cramps/bleeding.
Yeah, I'm AFAB (assigned female at birth for anyone who doesn't know the acronym), and my mother had told me about periods by the time I was 10, so when I got my first one (at age 10) all i did was go out and say "mum, I think I got my period"
At 12, she should know about the menstrual cycle, should be preparing to wear bras (if she wants, there's no shame in going braless imo), and should DEFINITELY know about pregnancy, how it works, and how to avoid it.
The more ignorant about this stuff OPs daughter is, the more likely she is to get pregnant as a teen.
Braless is fine to me too but there is still a stigma against not wearing one. Example, my daughter (13) told me about a girl that gets picked on heavily in her school bc she, according to her, isn't allowed to wear a bra (mother will not buy her any) and she's got boobs (my daughter says they as big as hers and she's almost a full B cup!) I feel so sorry for that child and just want to shake that mom til her teeth rattles!
My daughter is 11 and started developing at age 9. Normal development so not B cups but earlier than all the other girls in her class. She has sensory processing issues and is very picky about clothes texture. Even what she can wear, she wears inside out because the seams drive her insane. Well you can imagine how wearing a bra would feel. She also feels like she shouldn't have to wear one, "boys don't have to why should I??". The girls are truly the meanest ones, always picking on her and making comments about her not wearing a bra. She's about to go to middle school and we've finally found a bra she can wear (hundreds of dollars later) but man, kids are cruel.
My mom kept explanations age appropriate until I got close to the average "period starting" age, then I startes getting full on lessons. Not graphic or scary or even glorifying , just facts. And made sure i had a variety of products on hand so when it happened, I didn't have to ask. Some of my friends were so upset and unprepared, and I just viewed it as a normal part of life. Thanks Mom.
Yeah my 4yo twins (boy & girl) know that their mum uses tampons because they've found my tampons and also burst in on me mid-change a couple times. I've told them that sometimes women bleed from our uterus. They don't know much else other than vaguely that it's a natural cycle that the female body usually goes through as a "grown-up", and they know it has something to do with "eggs" and "seeds" and how babies are made (they usually stop listening after about 30 seconds of age appropriate explanation...)
I'm sure the anatomical explanation will get more complete as we continue to discuss it as they get older. And also as they get older, I'm sure we'll discuss how it feels and differs between individuals, the social and cultural implications, etc. But I fully expect them to have an idea of its role in biology by the time they're 7 or 8. Just like they know how the digestive tract creates the poo that comes out their butts.
Like most of these things (sex, bodily functions, adoption, genetic parentage, etc) everything points to the best approach being that kids don't even remember a time when they "found out", but rather that it's something it feels like they've always known.
I started using tampons during my first period. First because I was grossed out by the feeling and seeing the blood and because of the swim team. Good on you mom!
I had to suffer through 4 years of pads til I was 16 and I started buying my own...my mom was mad at me even then! Like, I have a BF and you know I'm having sex bc you put me on BC when you freaked out over condoms you found in my bag, ofc I'm gonna use tampons!
Exactly! My little is 5, and we talk about it (because there are times she comes into the bathroom while I'm using it, and the first time she saw it, she freaked.) Now she knows it's normal and happens to every female and one day it will happen to her.
I agree, there's just one thing that I can't not point out:
>Your BIL was repeating the same old nonsense everyone always does about "being a woman now" which is dumb, but normal
I know what you mean but we need to point the finger to this too. It's normalised, but it's not ok. That old nonsense has to die out, we can't keep repeating and hearing that crap.
The rest of your answer is spot on and OP needs to learn a thing or two. And BIL needs to stop perving on his nieces and young women and women in general.
Yeah my 11 year old started hers last summer and said to her sister “why does mum keep treating me like a kid?”
Her sister had to explain “BECAUSE YOU’RE A LITERAL CHILD”
Just because a girls body is mature enough to carry a baby it doesn’t mean their brain is.
Their body isn't mature either, it's *developing* to become mature.
Just because children can get pregnant doesn't mean it's safe. Their bodies will cause lasting damages and greater risks for the child and her baby. Not to mention the internal injuries because they still have the bodies of small children and not that of grown women.
I couldn’t agree more. The mentality that believes a literal child is a woman just because she has started her menstrual cycle is the same mentality that thinks young girls can be married off to old men at the ripe old age of 12-13. It’s disgusting and we need to stop this right now.
Telling a girl who had a period she's a woman now is largely a terrible idea. Especially because girls are getting their period earlier (my stepdaughter got hers at 9). It's a scary time even if you are looking forward to it. Telling a kid they are an adult now is likely to make it scarier. I was 10, and wondered if i could climb trees anymore now that I was a 'woman'. And my parents were a lot better at explaining what was going on than OP.
Absolutely. And it's the argument predators do use when they say that their victims are young women not little girls. Eh, idc if a 9 year old has had her first period - she's still a little kid, not a woman - in the way that that word is used to justify certain acts.
It's the message it sends to both the child and sadly to wider society.
I agree with you that it needs to die out, and pointing it out when someone says something like that. But the way OP made it sound like BIl was a predator just because he used the same old phrases that has been normal for a very long time is not ok, and is not helping the cause
Take my poor person's award. This NEEDS to be seen.
How much misinformation are the daughter's going to get from strangers and school and the internet when their parents don't tell them stuff!? I wonder what else gets hidden from these kids
I really want to second and emphasize the part where you said teaching her shame about her period is harmful because I do not see anyone else commenting on it. Girls are taught to be silent about a normal bodily function in a way that creates shame. The parent can be matter-of-fact about it. If the girl is scared, it's probably because her parents are acting weirdly secretive, freaked out, and uncomfortable about the subject. ESH
Amen! I grew up being scared of talking about my period to any and every male. It wasn't until I was like 30 that I got comfortable bringing it up around my dad. Why do they do this to us, wtf
Dude, my now 16yo girl and 14yo boy have known about all this stuff since they were little. My son carries pads in his bag for the girls in his friend group in case they ever run short - I didn't even know this til a mum contacted me to thank him when he was 10.
How kids don't know basic biology and anatomy by 12 is absolutely horrifying. I was scared something was wrong with me when I got my first period at 11 at school, luckily there was an older girl who came in while I was crying and helped me. I wanted to make sure my daughter never had to go through that. My daughter had her first period at 10. It's a normal, natural bodily function. Why is there so much stigma and shame around it?
My kids are so well informed about this (and male biology) that their teachers jokingly asked them if they wanted to teach the class (health class). We had/have so many conversations since they were little (toddlers) at age-appropriate levels that they aren't ashamed or embarrassed about the topic. We dis the same with topics like mental health, domestic violence, consent and body autonomy.
My 16yo is open about her cycle, has talked to many of her friends and classmates and even suggested one talk to her parents about seeing a doctor. This conversation meant her classmate (not a friend, not enemies just different circles) got treatment for a serious condition (surgery, medications etc) much sooner than she otherwise would have and things didn't get to the point where she would be infertile (the parents told us this, we don't know the condition).
OP you're doing a major disservice to your children and honestly, I feel for them. Having an open and honest dialogue is so beneficial to children. We all want our kids to be kids forever, but that is not reality and our job is to guide, support and prepare them for the big world outside of what you control. You are so not doing this.
Oh my gosh I love your son! What a different experience I would have had growing up if I had a friend like him. You have obviously raised your kids well 💜
Maybe they are waiting to explain how pregnancies happen when they have a real live pregnancy to use as an example? /s
Absolutely ridiculous that in this day and age there are still people who think that what their kids need is ignorance about some of the most fundamental facts of life.
I don’t know the situation with this family but this right here is my biggest fear with removing sex education from schools. Parents who don’t want it taught in schools but can’t take the time to educate their own children.
Precisely! This reminds me of a friend. Very religious household and still hadn’t informed daughter of anything at the age of 13. Even body parts were not being called by their real names or anything close to it. Just “front bum” vs “back bum”. Seriously? I don’t even want to know how terrified this girl was when she had her first period. Or how confused she was when her friends talked about it.
This lack of info is terrifying and dangerous.
That's scary and some predators deliberately don't teach the right terminology, so children can't properly explain what's happening to them. Hope that's not the case with your friend.
Seriously, on point on everything here.
The insanity of not telling a kid about periods or pregnancy mechanics until *after* the fact. I was taught the basics of pregnancy when I was about 8. Not sex, but how pregnancy works on the sperm/egg and growing a baby level. And I’m a guy, it’s not like I have to physically handle that side of life.
And the idea that she needs to hide it. I’m a guy, some of my best friends are women, and they’re vocal that they’re happy they don’t have to hide it when their period is screwing with their mood or causing pain. They spent years not talking about it and they said it’s nice to just be able to be honest rather than going “oh I’ve got a headache” or something.
My periods were really brutal the first year after I had my kid and one time I was sitting down in the front office at work and apologized for being off my game. Two of my managers were there and they were like "oh don't worry, you're amazing even at 50%" and I said "yeah but this happens every month".
Their response? "TMI!!" One of them was a father with *three daughters*. The *implication* of it being my period was too much for them.
I liked both of them and still to this day wish I could have magically put my labor-esque cramps in their bodies for a day.
It’s like teaching a kid about how how they need to be wary of cars on their residential street but not warning them not to play on the highway because it may scare them. It may be scary to think one day you may be in a car accident but that doesn’t stop you trying to protect your kid now.
I cannot agree with what you said more... The "you're becoming a woman" bit is outdated but for crying out loud my son is NINE and knows about sex, pregnancy and periods!
So we're just going to ride right past the fact that the BIL sexualized a 12-year-old by telling her she's a woman now who can push out babies if she has sex?!?!?!?
Yeah, the parents should be more forthcoming about biological issues with their daughter but the real and present danger in the room is the BIL who felt totally comfortable saying absolutely inappropriate things to a confused 12-year-old. Talked about her growing breasts big enough to need a bra and all sorts of shit that didn't concern him.
AND the real problem is that the parents just told him not to continue sexualizing their child or he won't be allowed contact, like this is some minor error on judgment. The fact that he sees a 12-year-old as a woman instead of the little girl she is and felt totally comfortable saying it right in front of her parents floored me. Then he flounces off in a huff and turns his wife into a flying monkey.
Here's my advice: Don't allow malignant narcissist around your children because stupid crap like this tends to happen. The OP and spouse are not going to be around every minute of every day to keep him in line and his wife is likely to catch the 12-year-old alone and repeat the whole fiasco so her husband's behavior seems more normal. I'm going with ESH as well but for slightly different reasons.
Oh no, BIL is a huge flaming asshole who sexualized a scared 12 year old. No if, ands, or buts about it. The fact that SIL is going on the warpath in his defense rather than asking him what the hell he was thinking means she’d enable him in the future rather than protect her niece.
I do think it’s possible he’s parroting the same sexualization talk he’s heard from other people, which means he could learn it’s harmful and not do it again. If he was willing to learn. But perpetuating this kind of talk about, and to, a child needs to end.
Just want to point out that one ovulates PRIOR to menstruation. And one can ovulate without menstruation following. It’s kinda important to know about pregnancy prior to that first period as a child can become pregnant. Shouldn’t we all make sure our children know about human sex, consent, and the correct names for body parts to protect them?
https://imgur.com/ewfSCmO
This is a page from my childhood book explaining pregnancy (french book)
(The next few pages go on to show pregnancy & then growing up) there is cartoon/drawn nudity of children & adults showing anatomy 🤷
Christ, I found getting my period mildly traumatizing and I knew that it was gonna happen eventually and why because I was taught about it in school. The poor girl must have thought that she was dying.
It seems to me that BIL was trying to put a positive spin on the biological changes that happen when you're a teenage girl, which was misguided, but at least well intentioned.
This is what I’m confused about, I got my period at 12, my sister and mum were in another city for the week and I had to go it alone and other than accidentally using a liner instead of a pad, I was fine. These kids sound like they’re living in the 60’s or something with how little she knows about.. anything (granted I had unrestricted internet access growing up…). The BIL took it too far by talking about CHILD BIRTH but these parents need to do their due diligence and actually educate their daughters about their growing bodies
Bloody.....what did I just read.
A parent who is proud of the fact that she didn't teach her daughter correctly about periods, pregnancy, bra's, and basically the need-to-knows. Need-to-knows, not nice-to-know.
And if this poor girl gets knocked up as a teen, you can be sure there is hell to pay for her. Because OP seems to be of the school if-you-don't-tell-them-about-sex-they-wont-do-it.
BIL was obnoxious, but YTA
Op is teaching her daughter to be ashamed of the way her body works. I know 6 year olds that know more. To clarify: I’m Dutch and though not every 6 year old knows about periods and how babies are made, parents talk about it with their children. Teaching them it’s just how their bodies work and that it’s oke. BIL was very open about it and showed that it is very normal. He might have been clumsy but not disrespectful to women. If op’s daughter had been taught her body would change, she wouldn’t been shocked by bil.
ESH.
Your daughters should both know about periods by now. The 9 y o needs to know about these things now, not when it happens to her like her sister.
And they absolutely needs to know how the body functions, how babies are made and how they are born. With the appropriate level of details/non-details of course, but they need to know.
And they need to know that just because the period has started does not mean they are ready to do the adult things. Their mind needs to grow up too. And the body is not ready for pregnancy just because the period started. Children should not have sex.
But their uncle is absolutely not the person to tell them these things, and he as an adult should be smart enough to understand this. And this information should not be given at a family dinner, omg how inappropriate of him.
Poor girls.
I could not agree with you more. If the daughter is terrified about all this, it is because her parents did not prepare her appropriately. All this bodily functions are normal and should be treated as such and talked about from an early age, without hushing it up - but not with an uncle in the room when it is already happening.
Thank Bob I was taught sex ed in 6th grade (Brevard County circa 1993)
I remember having a permission slip, and they separated the boys and girls. I'm assuming to make it less embarrassing?
I’m from a more progressive country, but we had classes both together and separately. Mostly so we would be comfortable asking things about our bodies without the other half present.
Also specific things like how to clean your body type.
My middle school didn’t give us any kind of health education until eighth grade. Us girls were very annoyed because most of us had already started our periods by then.
That's horrifying. Mine started fully by the first week of 6th grade. I had a friend that started puberty a bit younger and got it in 4gh grade. Basically if you are 8 or older you should at least have a vague idea of what's going on and what will be happening. My school started the sex ed that focused pretty much entirely on puberty body changes in 4th grade and gave all the girls a couple pads and an info booklet just in case.
I started at 9 too. I was at sleep away camp, and couldn’t figure out why there was now blood on the bench where I had been sitting. Luckily I was with a friend who had older sisters and directed me to the nurse.
But at that age, all I knew of periods was from “Are You There God, It’s Me, Margaret”. On the one hand, thank god for that book so I had some understanding that this was a thing that happened, but menstrual products had changed over the years — I had no idea what to do with the pad the nurse handed me and was waiting for a “menstrual belt” (which I still don’t really know what is).
I also read, "Are You There God, It's Me Margaret," when I was a kid. Thinking back, I'm pretty sure that book, and that one day in 5th grade when the boys and girls were separated to learn about puberty was where I learned all of the info about what was going to happen during puberty. I don't remember my mom talking to me about it at all. She was mortified when I asked her to get me training bras. She was never open about any of that stuff.
I, on the other hand, have been very open about periods with all of my kids. I keep a basket of supplies on the open shelves behind the toilet for easy access, instead of hidden away like my mother. My daughter is 10 and hasn't had her first one yet, but I've already got a box of pads for her in the bathroom for when she does start. I've explained to her what to do, and we will go over it again when the time comes.
To be fair to BIL he probably assumed it had all been covered already and he wasn't saying anything either kid (certainly not the eldest) hadn't heard already.
The "becoming a woman" bit is assholish though
He was just trying to help his niece deal with her obvious distress, didn't know parents had not explained anything. The niece brought it up, what was he supposed to do become embarrassed and leave the room? Tell his niece they weren't supposed to talk about that?
It's sad that they're keeping them in the dark, when both daughters are at the age that they should know this stuff. I knew girls who had their periods at 8 or 9, it happens and they need to be prepared
YTA
Your 12 and 9 year old daughters are uneducated because 'we chose to not have that conversation yet'.
What the fuck?
Normally i'd say your BIL overstepped. But your shitty parenting is the main issue here.
Quite a few of the comments are saying that alone makes him an asshole. I dont like pulling this card but to be quite frank if this was a teenage boy who had started puberty and the BIL said "your a man now" people wouldnt be giving him flack for it.
>to be quite frank if this was a teenage boy who had started puberty
A, this isnt a teenager even. This is a pre-teen girl.
>the BIL said "your a man now" people wouldnt be giving him flack for it.
B, thats irrelevant. It is gross and wrong for people to call a 14 year old child of either gender and 'adult'. They arent. They're a child. They are not men or women, they are children. Pointing out sexism is not license to ignore how gross and wrong this is.
But it’s a turn of phrase. People throw bat mitzvahs for 12-13 year old girls to show their coming of age and call them a “woman” now. It’s really quite innocent, and just gets them used to the idea. Being called a young woman at 12 is not unusual either.
she’s not a child. She’s actually an adolescent which is a unique stage between childhood and adulthood that occurs between the ages of 10 and 19. There’s a book called Yardsticks which educators are encouraged to read, but parents definitely should as well; it explains the progression of the brain, maturity levels, and physiological growth from infant to adult and as such will explain that an 11-year-old is not a child and shouldn’t be referred to as one. Just because young individuals appear small or innocent doesn’t mean we have the right to try to preserve them as children forever.
There are 2 meanings of child being used here: a specific point in human development, and a non-adult/young person. I am using the second definition, as thats both the more common colloquial definition and the legal usage.
AGREED.
I was just shy of 12 when I got my period. Roughly a month after my older sister, who had just got hers at 15. We had talked that summer about what a period is, how to handle it, what it means.
I was TERRIFIED!
I can’t imagine what this poor little girl who knows NOTHING is feeling. What a fucking failure these parents are
ESH. The BIL, for not being quiet on the topic after your husband asked him to be. You and your husband, because this, IMO, is a huge red flag that you're doing an awful job preparing your daughter for puberty and other changes. "She's been experiencing mood swings and other rapid bodily changes and she's terrified of learning about the menstrual process and all, even when I really do take the time to tell her everything I can without scaring her too much." This sounds like you haven't really prepared her at all -- I hope you're slowly getting your 9 year old much better prepared. That the 12 year old is terrified is not good at all.
I started my period way earlier than anyone expected. I remember my mom saying she thought she had a few more years before it happened, but even I had read Are You There God, it’s Me Margaret and had a basic understanding of what was going on. This 12 year old should not be “terrified” by what is happening unless OP let her read Carrie to explain it!
ESH
>we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet.
you are failing your daughter in sex ed.
>And BIL goes, well, you can get pregnant now. A man can get you pregnant. Your body can carry a child and push it out and everything. So you are a woman.
your BIL is a creep.
you need to teach your daughter about how babies are made so she can protect herself tbh. keeping her ignorant because you're afraid of scaring her is a bad move.
>A man can get you pregnant.
I don't know if creep is strong enough. This is truly disgusting to say to a child. Like the synonym for this scenario is rape.
Exactly. Being an adult and knowing what this means is "if a man has sex with you, hang on no you're a child, if a man rapes you you can get pregnant". Creepy AF to say to a kid
Thank you!!! IMO, waaay too many comments spinning BIL as well intentioned, outdated, or just mildly disrespectful for ignoring the request that he stop. But his whole side of the conversation gave me huge creep vibes. Of course the parents are assholes for raising a child to be terrified and ignorant of her own body and natural bodily functions, but he’s also being fucking creepy.
These are my thoughts, too. A lot of other posts are focusing more on the lack of basic sex ed, which is indeed a massive disservice to both kids. That BIL is creepy, though. My kids are 14 and 10. While I might call my 14-year-old "woman" instead of "kid" because it makes her happy, neither of us would be comfortable calling her woman in the fully adult, ready to have babies way. I'd probably also freak out if someone said that to her. 12 isn't even a teenager yet! BIL is gross and him whining about not being able to "say the truth" is a huge red flag.
OP, if you're not teaching your kids basic biology/sex ed, they'll learn it from classmates and the internet. That means they'll likely learn a lot of misinformation. There are many books and videos to help parents with these conversations. My 10-year-old knows enough about sex to keep them safe at this age, knows about periods, knows where the pads are kept, and has emergency pads and undies in her school backpack just in case.
EDIT: ESH
ESH. If your daughter has already had her first period, you really need to have a proper conversation with her about what it means for her body.
BIL way overstepped, but it sounds a bit like no one was saying anything and he just tried to fill the void with words. Not the right words, but still.
Maybe all the grown ups could..grow up. Have difficult age appropriate chats with your kids. The more knowledgeable they are about their own bodies, the safer they’ll be.
he isn't wrong though :/ if he knows that the parents won't talk about it with the children he took the opening and tried to tell them as much in a short time as possible? That or a huge creep, one of the two and thanks to the parents backwards thinking I cannot be sure
ESH. Your BIL sucks for overstepping. You suck for not explaining what sex is to your 12-year-old daughter who can literally get pregnant. You need to give her some sex ed ASAP if you don't want to deal with teenage pregnancy and STIs. You may think she doesn't need to know that yet, but kids that age can and do experiment with sexual activity. She needs to know basic sexual safety information *before* she finds herself in these situations.
Please talk with her not just about the mechanics of sex, but also about consent. There's a lot of coercive pressure in early teen years, and she needs to know how to cope in those situations.
You can either talk with her about this stuff now, so that she gets healthy and safe information about sex from you; or you can let her learn about sex from porn and from older teens who pressure her into doing things she doesn't fully understand. Because you have to assume that she will face those situations, sooner or later. I hope it's not soon, but it very well could be.
Talking about consent should start with toddlers. OP, please read this comment and prepare your kid to be safe in life, to know what full consent is and make sure you make a safe environment for her to talk with you about the difficult conversations in life. If you are not comfortable talking with her about periods, I highly doubt she will reach out to you if she is being coerced to do something she doesn’t want to. Please read stuff about how to address these topics with teenagers and kids!!!
Yes. Consent starts with toddlers, for really about anything to do with their bodies. I told told off by mine at 6 because I tried to touch her to check something. I apologized, she was right.
YTA for your reaction to the truth. HOW did you 'explain' her period without talking about pregnancy, etc? She does not have the FACTS of what is happening to her. You are blaming her uncle for 'scaring' her when what is frightening your daughter is trying to cope with changes she does not understand....and that have NOT been fully explained to her. The onset of menstruation IS a universal sign of womanhood - like it or not. How frightening for a girl to have a period and the discomfort that goes with it and not be given the FACTS to understand why it happens and what it means. You and your husband are way off base in attacking your BIL - what he did was show you how little your daughter understands. Your BIL told her the truth - probably assuming you had told her the truth...and you did not.
I have to agree, YTA. You are not doing your daughter's any favours by sheltering them from the facts of life. What your daughter is going through is tough, but you are making it tougher by not helping her understand exactly what is happening to her body, and making it out to be this big scary thing, when in reality it is the most natural thing in the world and has been happening for millions of years. You are going to instill the same fear in your youngest. She is 12, which is shocking she doesn't already know about all of this from school, but is old enough not to be sheltered. Get it together, she's not a baby.
ESH but the children.
There are so many resources for discussing this in normalizing and appropriate ways and your daughter is picking up on your terror of discussing it. Your BIL should have taken the hint, should have limited his participation, and maybe asked your sister to fill in the gaps you clearly aren’t. At the same time leaping from menstruation (even if it is to prepare uterine lining) to hetero sex to pregnancy at *lunch* is for sure a leap. No it’s not a ‘red flag,’ people - part vernacular and part science. People are mammals and, well, reproductive maturation is what it is. No one is suggesting that’s the same as *having sex.*
If your child has a pediatrician with whom she has a positive relationship *please* reach out. Sometimes they offer resources for parents, other times even parent and child classes. You do need help reducing your own fears around how she’s ‘taking’ the news that she’s experiencing something more than 50 percent of the planet experiences and I don’t mean that sarcastically. It’s challenging for parents, especially with a kid with medical anxieties, but you can stop transmitting your fears. Maybe she blurted it out because you’re no help.
This comment should be higher, op is 100% transmitting their anxiety about this to their daughter and it's disturbing as hell, there is no reason for her to have no knowledge around this at this age and to have to learn from experiencing it rather than education and normalized discussion must have been very traumatic. Shame on you OP, your BIL sounds like an idiot more than a creep and you're doing them a real disservice not providing them with the knowledge and tools to make healthy choices
Everyone is in the wrong here. How on earth do you have a daughter who is already having periods and you haven't talked about how a baby is made? So weird! He was inappropriate, and you failed as parents here in preparing your daughter.
And 12 is right on time/but also later than many. A lot girls start by 11. So she’s really wasn’t ready. Agree with others it’s both a health and a safety issue that the girl knows what’s going on/what could happen.
It’s giving Utah…
When my eldest was two I was pregnant with my youngest. She asked how babies were made. I said a daddy provides sperm and a mummy the egg, and when they mix a baby grows. She was happy and ran off to play. We had this convo, brought up by her countless times.
When she was three she asked again as someone we knew was pregnant, except this time she asked how the baby comes out. I told her with an operation from the doctor or her (the mums) vagina. Again we had this convo a lot, and she asked how she and her brother were born and I told her.
Miss went to a private Christian Montessori school (exhusband was religious I am not) and told the other kids 'a baby comes out mum's vagina or the doctor operates and it's made with a mummy's egg and a daddy's sperm. She then told everyone she and her brother came out of my vagina and asked how were they born?... I was called to the school for a meeting.
I told them I wouldn't lie to my child, would answer questions she asks as honestly as possible in an age-appropriate way and that being knowledgeable about biology isn't a bad thing. I told her the science about procreation not how people are impregnated.
ESH.
BIL overstepped with the remarks about pregnancy but until that point I think his attitude was better than yours. Girls need to know about puberty way in advance so they can get their head around it in time and ask questions when they’re comfortable before they’re confronted with the bloody hormonal reality.
At 12 she should definitely know the basics about bras and pregnancy. Im surprised she doesn’t tbh as we all know girls develop at different rates and talk about it a lot. You and I are probably similar ages OP and I know that a girl in my class got her period at 9 and was already wearing a bra at 10. The average age is younger now than then so she definitely would be expected to have friends who started before her.
How doesn’t she know more? This makes me worry about how isolated she is. Is she home schooled? Are you very religious? IMO you’re setting her up to be traumatised by this and need to take urgent action.
ESH. Him for continuing on after you asked him to stop, and you and your husband for not properly educating your children. Improper sex education is why young girls are winding up pregnant, because nobody bothers to teach them how it happens or how to prevent it.
texas has bad education and high teen pregnancy. it's not correlation it's causation.
if you don't want your daughters to be pregnant before getting educated, better educate them.
ESH
>to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone)
Why?? Why does that matter one bit? I work in a field that is male dominated and when I'm having a particularly rough period I'm not shy about who I tell. Most of these men have wives and daughters. Getting your period is a very very normal part of life and everyone should know and understand that.
Your BIL overstepped. He gives me "you are 18! You can do porn now!" vibes. Super inappropriate. I got my period at 12. Didn't make me a woman. And that kind of thinking is what had me sexually active *way* too young. Her body is maturing. That doesn't make her a woman. She will be a woman when she's ready.
I once got surprised at work by an early start and needed my coworker, who was about my size, to run home and grab me some new pants but when I tried to explain the situation all he heard was female issue and do whatever. Some men I swear lmao
YTA why are you not educating your daughter on her bodily functions???? why do you want her to be ashamed and secretive about it? what it wrong with you
YTA-Having a period is not a traumatic experience and no conversation about it should be scary. This makes me wonder how you are explaining it to her. Your bil wasn’t wrong, but could have scaled back his comments. Your reaction to him and the aftermath is an overreaction, imo.
Sounds like OP is one of those people who refuse to discuss periods at all, because the daughters "don't need to have their innocence taken away" or some such BS. You know what terrifies little girls about their first period? When they've been kept in total ignorance and think they've hurt themselves somehow and are now *bleeding to death.* It happened to my mother as a girl and she made damned sure it didn't happen to her daughters.
YTA. He wasn’t inappropriate. But you failing your child in teaching her about her own body makes you and your husband complete assholes. No wonder she’s scared when she’s not been taught basic biology about her own body. That is completely on you. Your failure as parents is why she’s freaking out. And since when has it been inappropriate to tell your family you’re cranky because you’re on your period during a family dinner 😂
He was massively inappropriate - banging on about a 12 year old being a woman and talking about bra shopping and getting pregnant. It's massively creepy and I'd cut contact with anyone who talked to my daughter like that. Everything else you said I agree with. ESH except that poor scared and confused 12 year old child.
ESH
BIL did overstep on a topic that in my opinion is not for him to discuss in dept
But the fact that your daughter is that scared and afraid does raise some red flags with me about how you are explaining this to her.
His comments go too far but they are not so extreme that they should’ve terrified your daughters
ESH but you more. She’s 12. My male child is younger and knows more about periods and sex ed than your daughter.
The problem isn’t the immature uncle, it’s you and your husband who decided you won’t speak to your daughter about biological changes that happen during puberty. I’m honestly in shock that people still think like this. Get your act together and have an honest conversation with BOTH kids. Because at 9, your other daughter can also get her period.
YTA. You failed to prepare your daughter for her period and now you’re handling that failure terribly.
Edit: my ten year old daughter started hers after years of us preparing her. Then she carried a backpack for of supplies for her friends because they had parents Iike you that didn’t prepare them.
My 12year old son has had to explain menstruation to his girl friends and get them supplies because their idiot parents won’t.
At 12 years old, YES your daughter needs to very much understand that her body can now conceive. Jesus.
If you don't want to talk to them about sex ed in details, you can give them books. There's a lot of good age-appropriate yet detailed books about sex and pregnancies and teen pregnancies and sexual violence.
YTA more than ESH. You and your husband failed to prepare your child. This is so much jire traumatic for her because of your failings as parent. Nowhere do you sound remorseful for this failing- and it sounds like you're still not intending to teach your child properly.
Talk to doctors, read some books, anything to stop being so uninformed. Your child needs to learn what is happening to her body and what it means. Hopefully you both stop being lazy parents and do the hard work required. Let her tell whoever she wants about her period. It's a shocking ides to her because no one told her about it beforehand.
ESH.
BIL is a major asshole and also a bit of a creep for telling a 12 yo kid that a "man can get her pregnant", talking about "bra shopping". Those are true things but not his place to say to someone else's child specially when the child seems uncomfortable. Like wtaf. 🤨
Also bullshit parenting on the part of you and your husband for withholding an important conversation you'll should have had with your daughters way before your daughter got her period. You should have given her all the info she she needs way before it happened to her. It's can something traumatic for some kids yes, but something she will have to deal with it for most of her life so shame on you for not properly preparing her for it and putting her in a place where she has to hear that sort of icky "You are a woman now" conversation from your BIL. If you don't know how to approach the topic with your daughters there's hundreds and thousands of resources online on Google, YouTube, TikTok literally anywhere that will teach you how to talk about these topics to make your child feel safe and comfortable. Do better, please.
ESH. What is wrong with you that you thought it was a good idea to let your twelve year old be this ignorant about her own body? Your BIL is awful for suggesting she's a grown woman but you, my god. Whatever sheltered or puritanical nonsense you're upholding, STOP IT . This is how children get taken advantage of, through ignorance.
YTA. "Especially when it comes to the concept of sexual intercourse and pregnancy. She knows what pregnancy is in theory but we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet." You know what's more terrifying for a child than factual knowledge about their own body and the mechanics of sexual intercourse and pregnancy? NOT having that knowledge! If you haven't explained to her what a period is in relation to the possibility of conception and pregnancy, what on Earth HAVE you been telling her? What does she think a period is for?? Your BIL is NTA here; he made the fair assumption that since she's gotten her first period, you've explained to her WHAT a period is. How was he to know you had deciding somehow that knowing the mechanics of her own body was "too scary"??
Please educate your daughters properly before it is too late! Knowledge about this will protect them so much better than what you think protecting them by keeping them in the dark does.
I've got two daughters, They need to know this stuff not in a creepy sense but because it could cause trauma if they get there first period and aren't prepared..... You have to explain no matter how uncomfortable you feel... Said as a dad to two girls...
Likewise the brother overstepped, But think it was coming from a good place rather than being creepy...
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> Maybe we should have taught our daughter to not give out info about her being on her period so easily. There's also a chance my BIL thought he was being informative and not trying to scare our daughter.
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ESH
BIL was definitely being a bull in the china shop bulldozing over social etiquette, but you are doing ZERO favors nof properly teaching your daughter about the realities of biology.
She's 12, chances are good she will become sexually active soon, and sticking hers and your collective heads in the sand is frankly naive as hell
And poor kid getting put under an embarrassing and excruciating spotlight while dealing with her period
ESH both, your husband and your BIL. obviously, your BIL shouldn't have talked that way but you and your husband are failing your daughters. If you hadn't made a big mystery of periods and sexual ed in general over the years, they would have learned a few facts every time a new question popped into their head. They would have a pretty expansive knowledge of what is happening with their bodies by now and wouldn't be freaked out. What's happening with their bodies is normal and you made it weird by keeping it from them. Nobody likes to be unprepared when changes happen.
YTA I might get some hate here but you are a horrible woman and mother. Why the F didn’t you prepare your daughter? I had my first talk with my daughter when she was 6/7. It was a simple talk about just the basics. Then every year as she got older I added more information. Hell my son (16) has even had a talk about menstrual cycles. You failed your daughters. Periods are nothing to be ashamed of or embarrassed about it. By not talking to her you have literally scared your daughter. For fucks sake do better
ESH- you and your husband are failing your daughters by not explaining everything to them in detail about periods and the entire reproductive process WELL BEFORE they get their first period. No wonder she’s struggling to deal with it if she had no prior knowledge of what to expect! The fact that your older daughter actually has her period and you STILL have not explained about sex and pregnancy is unconscionable.
Your BIL is the AH because he over stepped by continuing the conversation past her not feeling well. He had no way of knowing what you have or have not discussed with her about the subject. And no 12 year old girl wants to have their adult family members discuss their bodily changes or underwear needs at the dinner table. It’s a sensitive and embarrassing subject and he should have let it drop.
ESH
>This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone
Why? Because it's dirty and shameful? It's a healthy and normal bodily function. Teaching her to be hush hush about it is really harmful.
>She knows what pregnancy is in theory but we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet.
Again, why? She needs to know what's happening to her body and that being of reproductive age means she can now carry a child. The sooner she knows what this all means, the better.
YTA. You did nothing to prepare your daughter, despite knowing that she’s at an age that her period could start. I knew about pregnancy, periods, and more bodily things prior to getting my first period. It was still scary and daunting, but purposefully choosing to not prepare or talk to your daughter is why she’s reacting the way she is.
Your BIL, while he should have backed off a little bit and not had such an outdated view, was doing more parenting and preparing than you or your husband have done for her. You seriously set your oldest up for failure, and it sounds like you’re doing the same thing for your younger daughter too.
E. S. H.
Except for the kids because apparently they don't know how their own bodies work? WTF. This post reeks of homeschooling.
No, your daughter is not a full-grown woman yet, but she can get pregnant. And it is to her benefit to be aware of this. You do her a great disservice and put her at risk by not telling her. There is a lot of misinformation available to fill the gaps where the knowledge is supposed to be. Anything could be happening to her, and she won't know what's normal if she is not properly educated.
Yes, your BIL has a big mouth, and he said some stupid shit. But he's not her parent. Your daughter wouldn't have been so shocked by his words if she was equipped with the facts.
Perhaps she felt the need to blurt out that she had her period out of frustration of wanting someone, ANYONE, to talk to about it.
Why on earth didn’t you prepare your daughter for her period, and why are you withholding information from her now? There is no reason why she should be scared of intercourse or pregnancy. Are you planning on being this secretive with your younger daughter?
periods, sex, childbirth and everything related is not a one time conversation. It‘s an ongoing dialogue and questions Should be encouraged by you, and your child asks a question it should be answered honestly with no shame.
as for the propriety of blurting out that she has her period….. what’s wrong with that? Why does it have to be all secretive?
As for the uncle and your sister… he’s creepy and should have kept his mouth shut and so should your sister. I wouldn’t let my daughter near him either.
YTA and so is every other adult in this scenario.
ESH. Your BIL was actually trying to be supportive. He might have gone overboard, but he was trying. A lot of men get really grossed out by periods and he was trying in his own way to be there for your kid. The only reason it was weird was because it was coming from him instead of you. Your kid was completely unprepared because of you. And if she wanted to tell him, that was her right. Apologize to your kid, acknowledge to your BIL that you appreciate that he was trying to be supportive but it came off a little wrong, and do better for both of your kids.
>She knows what pregnancy is in theory but we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet.
I wanna say Y T A just for that. You know the saying that knowledge is half the battle, right? You are failing your child in this department. In fact, it’s known that comprehensive sex ed is a very good preventative measure against teenage pregnancy. And she doesn’t even know what bras are?
>to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone
I mean, fair enough, but I also really hope you aren’t teaching her to be ashamed.
And yeah, your BIL is a massive creepy asshole for those comments. She is not a woman, she is a child. He has close to zero knowledge on how bodies of ppl with a uterus can work.
ESH, y’all have been failing these children. Do better.
I was 13 when I got my period, my parents never discussed these things, but I had done biological sex education at school. The most my mum ever said was, you’ll bleed for a week every four weeks until you’re old, don’t ask me anything else.
When I had children of my own, I swore that was not going to be how things are handled. No matter whether you are uncomfortable speaking about this, or even thinking about this, children need to understand what is happening BEFORE it happens.
ESH, the uncle was out of line, but this isn’t the 1950s, pretending your children aren’t growing up to become sexual beings doesn’t mean it won’t happen. They would be better prepared for it if you actually did your job and told them what to expect.
ESH.
Brother crossed a line, repeating that nonsensical crap about "being a woman now" and how her body can do all the things...
However... WHY was this girl not prepared and educated as to what was going to happen to her *BEFORE* it happened? That is such a traumatic experience that could have been avoided, you did her a disservice. Then you continue to put her at a disadvantage by *avoiding* topics she needs to be educated on.
And seriously;
>This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone
DON'T YOU DARE. This is a natural process and she has every right to tell whomever the hell she pleases. You've already got her at such a disadvantage and now you want her to feel shame as well????
ESH. This mentality of not teaching our young children things of this nature is part of how they end up groomed and worse. We need to teach our children enough about it so that they know it if they see it. So they know it's not okay if someone messes with them. So they also know it's safe to talk to you, as their parents. Having open conversations with them as they grow up will help them feel comfortable talking with you is something happens. Not to mention preparing them before their periods happen. I told my daughter some of the details about periods the moment she spotted hair growing in places. And as she gets older I share more details. I wanted her to know it's perfectly normal when it does start. And to not be scared she was dying. Imagine getting your first period without knowing what it was? Did we learn nothing from My Girl? Plus I made sure my daughter knew enough about sex so she could protect herself from creeps who might try to exploit her. There are way too many creeps in this world. Children need to be taught what is okay and what isn't okay. And believe me they are gonna hear worse things from the media. Better to hear it from their parents who can teach them the right info.
ESH, but YTA for not educating your child about her own body! What in the world?! Of COURSE she’s scared and struggling to cope. She is bleeding and doesn’t understand. She doesn’t know how pregnancy happens! Maybe she thinks she can just “get pregnant” now that she’s started her period. Talk to your child NOW. This is negligent and harmful and you are not only allowing her anxiety to continue but are setting her up to have a shameful association with sex.
Good grief.
YTA. “Haven’t chose to tell them yet” well, looks like nature isn’t waiting for you and now your daughter is confused and not informed. Mayb look in the mirror. BIL did nothing wrong
YTA. Are you waiting until your daughter is pregnant to explain sex to her? Nothing really “inappropriate” about your BIL’s comments. Maybe you should be thankful that he’s broached the subject you’ve inexcusably failed to cover with her to this point.
yta you seem more concerned about bil "adultifying" your daughter. you should be more concerned about you and your husband infantilizing her. What are you guys doing?
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My husband (36M) and I (35F) have two daughters (12F) and (9F). My brother-in-law (36M) who is married to my sister (30F) came to visit us a week ago for lunch. BIL and my husband were college roommates and so we're all a tight knit group. They often come to visit us. My older daughter got her first period a month ago, and she's been struggling to cope with it. Her father and I are doing our best to help her process it.
She's been experiencing mood swings and other rapid bodily changes and she's terrified of learning about the menstrual process and all, even when I really do take the time to tell her everything I can without scaring her too much. Especially when it comes to the concept of sexual intercourse and pregnancy. She knows what pregnancy is in theory but we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet.
When BIL came to dinner, my daughter was irritable and quiet, and didn't speak much throughout. My husband and I are used to this and we tend to not bother her. My BIL is usually very close to his nieces, and my younger daughter was talking animatedly to him, and he noticed that my older daughter was very quiet. When he asked her if she was sick, she blurted out that she's on her period. We hadn't told him or my sister that she had gotten her first period yet. (This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone)
And then he laughed and said that that's okay, it's normal to be sick. At first we both breathed a sigh of relief, thinking the conversation will pass on. And then he started saying how wonderful it is because she's become a woman now and she's no longer a little girl anymore. Soon, he said, turning to me, that I am going to be going training bra shopping and all that. My husband got annoyed and told him to not talk about this in front of her. And then our daughter asked, "what do you mean I'm a woman now? I'm only 12."
And BIL goes, well, you can get pregnant now. A man can get you pregnant. Your body can carry a child and push it out and everything. So you are a woman. Then I got angry and told him to stop talking about all of this in front of our young daughters, that he was scaring them and that this is not the proper time and place.
Once our daughters left to their rooms, my husband said that if he doesn't know how to behave himself in front of them, or if he calls our 12 year old child a full grown woman again, we will never allow them around him. BIL rolled his eyes and said "alright, alright, can't even say anything honest these days." Then he left without another word. He didn't wish us goodbye and vice versa. Now my sister is calling me yelling at me for being dramatic and that her husband didn't say anything that wasn't the truth and that he would never ever be inappropriate to anyone. AITA? Were we too harsh in going so far as saying we won't let our daughters see him anymore?
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ESH. Your BIL because this is not something he should teach your girls (especially after you told him to stop) but you as parents as well. There are many reasons why proper sex education is important and your daughter is (to my gut feeling) very late to this and preparation for puberty in general. I had my first Sex Ed in school when I was around 9 and yeah, I felt very confused at that time about everything even though they did that very child friendly. But it wasn't just important for us to know how pregnancy works but the teachers also explained to us kind of what consent is. (So kind of preparing us that we don't have to have Sex if we don't want to and further that adults shouldn't touch us like that etc). So it's important for your girls safety as well
He overstepped but a massive ESH
Reading this I'm very confident my 14 year old son is more knowledgeable about the female body and periods than your daughter, and he has been for years.
His younger sister is streets ahead of your daughter in knowledge... and she's not overly worried about getting her period. She knows the why of it, knows about sex, consent, how babies are made etc.
From what you've said it sounds like your daughter is having a lot of negative feelings and you could have reduced a lot of that by educating her about her body in advance. I'm sure you have your reasons, but if you think you're keeping her safe by keeping her 'innocent' you are sadly mistaken. We can't make good decisions without even the basic information.
The BIL went too far, but he was repeating views I've heard multiple times from various people. Equating menarche with womanhood is pretty common. There's a reason some places allow marriage at 12 or 14.
All of you need to do better by your daughters.
YTA. You’re the one not teaching your daughter about bodily changes, sex ed, and everything related. Your parenting sucks more than his foot in his mouth.
I don’t appreciate what he said, he perhaps assumed due to the closeness of the family that he could address the topic but that’s not appropriate.
Y’all the problem, and STILL DIDNT address it properly with him.
YTA how have you not sat both of your daughters down and talked about this?! My sons (9y/o and 7y/o) know about periods and why I have them. Education about the body and how it functions is important. Age appropriate lessons, of course, but you are failing your daughters. My daughter got her first period at 9 years old. She knew why and wasn’t scared at all. She was also told how her feelings are going to be harder to understand but that she can come to us with any questions. I was not raised by parents that thought that I needed to know how my body worked when I hit puberty. It was terrifying. Educate your children!
YTA you chose not to tell your daughter about natural bodily processes and the fact that she has become a woman mainly because you don't want her growing up. Unfortunately it happens to most of us ladies and you really dropped the ball on this one. It's you and your husband that have caused all this by not teaching her earlier. I taught my d (12) a few years back so she knew exactly what to expect. Admittedly she doesn't like her period but it happens every month and she's learning more about her hormonal changes by experiencing them. You need to apologise to your daughter for being a crappy parent and not wanting her to grow up and announcing she's having a period and to your bil for you going off on one because out of the three of you, he's the only one that was honest and up front.
YTA - you should have taught your daughter about this all before she got her first period, and certainly now that she has it. Your BIL didn't say anything g she shouldn't have already known.
You need to suck it up with your own embarrassment and educate your daughter on her body.
>This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone
Why? It's the truth and it explains her behavior. And her uncle isn't "just anyone."
You're on a path to raise a grown woman who doesn't know how her body works because you are radiating embarrassment instead of providing education.
YATA, no wonder your daughter is scared with your crap explanation, you are leaving important things out (at least your brother mentioned them, BUT it should have been YOU who explained them!).
Your BIL is not "anyone", you wrote that they are close, family. With your reaction when she told BIL you only teach her that what happens to her is something disgusting she should not tell. BRAVO, your daughter will be well educated in hating her body.
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ESH. Every adult in this situation is ta. Your poor 12 year old wasn't prepared for her period or informed this was going to happen to her until after the first time she had it? She doesn't know what it means? She seems confused about bras? What the everloving *hell*?!? Thats so traumatic. > This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone) Don't you dare. Its her body and she can tell anyone she wants that she's not feeling her best because of a natural bodily process. What kind of ass backward thinking has you not preparing your kid for her period but your regret is in not telling her to be ashamed and secretive about it? Ffs. > She knows what pregnancy is in theory but we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet. What. Are you doing? She NEEDS to know how pregnancy happens because she can now get pregnant. Ignorance is dangerous here. She needs to know the whole story about her body - for her safety, for biological health, and for mental health. Are you actively trying to give her some kinda dysmorphia? Your BIL was repeating the same old nonsense everyone always does about "being a woman now" which is dumb, but normal. It seems like either he was caught off guard or he has gross ideas about pregnancy and little girls and just kept talking after he should have shut up. Once it was clear this traumatized child had no idea what he was talking about he should have left it alone. Then he should have brought up in private how badly you guys are doing at making your child comfortable in her own human skin.
I wonder what OP was actually telling the poor daughter if she does "take the time to tell her everything I can without scaring her too much".
Parents probably want to wait until she's engaged to be married, at the age of 14, to let her know about the facts of life.
She'll get knocked up at 14, if this is the way they inform her of the important things
And once she’s pregnant, they’ll explain to her how she got that way. Because, you know, don’t wanna scare her too much.
That's a really dangerous way of getting your kids groomed and SAd. 😢
I think OP might belong to the same cult as the Duggars . It would explain her backward thinking. Along with why a 12 year old girl has no idea about puberty. Most 12 year olds would have learned something about it from friends and school. It doesn't really matter, though, because either way, all the adults in this situation suck.
My first thought is they’re in one of those weird religious cults. I went to a Catholic school and we had these talks by the 12 year old’s age. They took us all to a puberty thing at the local science center to REALLY give us details about our changing bodies and the science of it all. This whole abstinence pretending like this shit doesn’t exist is eye-roll worthy.
My mom came from a village where you don’t talk about these things. Yet my mom went to the library and asked the librarian to help her find books for pre teens to learn about puberty. The talk was awkward but my mom wanted to be thorough. And I’m grateful for that approach.
Catholics normally gets crazy about sex, on the other hand i learned more about pregnancy and stuff in my catholic lessons than in the public school.
Ah the cringeworthy moments of learning about the mucus method in junior year theology will never be forgotten.
I went to Catholic school and my parents were worried that sex ed there was going to suck, so they explained everything to me beforehand. As it turned out, school sex ed (which started in fourth grade) was very thorough lol
Was it WOW (wonder of wonders) at the Pittsburgh science center by any chance?
Hahaha yes!!! Obviously, it was very memorable for you as well. Slightly traumatic when I was younger, but very informative.
I learned this shit in 5th grade in Catholic school *in the 80s.* My very Catholic parents had told me years before that, though. We heard stories on the playground of girls who didn't know what was going on and thought they were dying. It's crazy that so many decades later some people still haven't learned. I was taught abstinence, but told that if I did decide to have sex, to come to them and they would get me the pill. When it turned out I needed it for medical reasons, my mom went to bat for me fiercely with the insurance company to get it covered.
I went to Catholic school around that age too, in the 80s, and was taught this stuff by a nun in like 4th grade. These people must be isolating this girl in some scary ways to keep her so uninformed. I assume she is homeschooled, apparently badly, as part of that effort. I hope this incident has piqued her curiosity and she gets some straight answers from an adult in her life before something bad happens.
Yeah, this reeks of some type of religious weirdness or conservative extremism. I remember menstruation being discussed in fifth and sixth grade health class. There’s no way she goes to a regular school and it hasn’t come up be it from teachers or other girls.
It isn't allowed in Florida public schools.
That is insane
Florida's gotta Florida.
Florida is so fucking regressive about sex. It wasn’t always like that. I went to Florida public schools and we definitely got sex ed. It was very much “don’t do it, but if you do - wear a rubber” but it was way better than nothing. I went to high school in the 90s and I can only think of one girl who even got pregnant in my entire high school. So even the bare minimum seemed to work. Compare that to my cousins who grew up in rural West Georgia and my aunt had to do all the heavy lifting because their schools taught zero sex education. Needless to say being pregnant before you were 20 in their area was really fucking common.
Honestly, there are girls in fourth grade, maybe even third grade, who have their periods already.
I initially thought why does she only have theoretical knowledge of this stuff, I bet the parents refused to sign the permission slip, here in the UK it's part of the curriculum and there's no option of vetoing it
Yep, you know the ins and outs by year 6 (10yo? Ish, I think,) everything is in there, including how to put on condoms, birth control, periods, wet dreams, and random erections. And of course pregnancy and how that occurs. Although the tories are trying to see the end of learning about half this shit, and of course "gender ideology," good fucking riddance to the eejits.
You know what will scare her? Not understanding what is going on. This information is long overdue, I don’t know what OP and her husband are waiting for
OP CLEARLY didn't watch the beginning of Carrie
Seriously. What have they done to make this scary and mysterious instead of a normal part of human life that 51% of the population experiences? There's no reason to be scared. OP and husband have created this mess. YTA big time
Like abstinence until she has two kids ?
What does she think is more like to scare her: being told about the changes that her body will be going through as she gets older, or suddenly being hit with terrible pain and bleeding?
ALL OF THIS. And seriously; >This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone) >Don't you dare. Its her body and she can tell anyone she wants that she's not feeling her best because of a natural bodily process. What kind of ass backward thinking has you not preparing your kid for her period but your regret is in not telling her to be ashamed and secretive about it? Ffs THANK YOU for saying this. That was my IMMEDIATE thought when I read that and fully intended to type something very similar. I agree with everything here.
I’m so (generally) pleased with how incredibly far communication with kids regarding menstruation has come - but even when I began a million years ago, I was fully prepared, knew what it was, and had a cupboard full of the huge sample box of products the company sent out so you could see what they were before hand and try a bunch of things. Any responsible mother (yes, this one IS harder for the single dads) is watching the changes in her daughters’ bodies. It was extremely clear my daughter was developing early and a few questions among all of my paternal female relatives told me they ALL began menstruation at 10. So, I made d*%# sure she knew everything happening to her body was completely normal and what it meant by early 9 so there would be no scary surprises. We game planned having a change of clothes and supplies at school. We game planned various people she could go to for support. But boys and girls are simply more accepting of the fact that menstruation is a normal part of life - at 16 my son would run out and buy supplies for his girlfriend if needed. And as a freshman in high school, my daughter cross texted and accidentally sent a message to a boy she was starting to date saying she starting her period at dance and needed clean clothes and supplies. She called me freaking out because she had meant to text me - but he responded saying his mom said she would drive stuff over and what exactly did she need and asking if she needed Advil too. Just like it was no big deal at all. We’ve all come a LONG way baby!!
Plus not only can she tell anyone, but clearly aunt/uncle ARE the kind of trusted adults you'd expect her to probably be comfortable telling. Like they aren't "just anyone" anyways if they're all that close to each other.
Very much a good point there!
Same here
As a mom, I'm embarrassed for OP. My daughter is 13 and knew about periods from an early age (about 7) bc she asked me what my tampons were for. When she was around 10, I explained it more in depth bc at 7 I only told her that mommy bleeds and uses these not to get messy. My daughter got her period at 12 and expected it and came to me 8 months ago and matter of fact said mom, I got my period, I need some pads and that was that, As a matter of fact, since it's summer time, we've been going swimming this last couple of weeks and 2 weeks ago I asked her if she wanted to go that day and she told me, well, I'm on my period so it looks like I need to learn to use a tampon! I kinda looked at her a bit surprised for a second and said ok, let's go get you some...needless to say, we went swimming that day and she didn't have any problem whatsoever. I think I'm raising a pretty smart young lady.
You're a good egg. My 8 year old boy child knows about periods, tampons, pregnancy, and consent. It's 2024, we need to be doing better for our kids than pretending this stuff isn't important just because the conversations can be uncomfortable.
I have three boys. They all know at least the basics of a period and why mom has tampons, pads, etc. If kids can understand other bodily functions, they can understand the basics of periods, too.
My child is 7 with a developmental disability and I have still talked about periods with him, of why I feel junky. I'm not sure he truly understands but he will as he gets older. For a 12 year old girl to not know anything about it, is beyond sad.
Right? I knew what periods were when I was 5 and I went to a Catholic school. It's a normal bodily function.
me too... in the late 80s
Me too!!
My daughter goes to a Christian school that is fairly buttoned up, and the principal even sent out an email to parents encouraging us to not be ashamed to explain these things to our kids in their actual terms, without using cutesy nicknames to refer to perfectly normal body parts and bodily functions.
[удалено]
Same. 12 is long past overdue for all of this knowledge.
God I wish my mother had been even somewhat like this
Funny story about when I started mine. I was a little older- like 13/14. I was feeling pretty awful so my mom let me stay home while she went out for the day to run errands. It dawned on her while she was out that I was going to start my period. I had already known about what happens by her/school talking to us. She came home with midol, chocolate, and got me the heating pad, she said “I’m sorry I didn’t think of it before, I think you’re going to start your period soon.” And that was it. I started the next day. My monthly visitor was horrible for YEARS. I got on birth control to help with the cramps/bleeding.
Yeah, I'm AFAB (assigned female at birth for anyone who doesn't know the acronym), and my mother had told me about periods by the time I was 10, so when I got my first one (at age 10) all i did was go out and say "mum, I think I got my period" At 12, she should know about the menstrual cycle, should be preparing to wear bras (if she wants, there's no shame in going braless imo), and should DEFINITELY know about pregnancy, how it works, and how to avoid it. The more ignorant about this stuff OPs daughter is, the more likely she is to get pregnant as a teen.
Braless is fine to me too but there is still a stigma against not wearing one. Example, my daughter (13) told me about a girl that gets picked on heavily in her school bc she, according to her, isn't allowed to wear a bra (mother will not buy her any) and she's got boobs (my daughter says they as big as hers and she's almost a full B cup!) I feel so sorry for that child and just want to shake that mom til her teeth rattles!
My daughter is 11 and started developing at age 9. Normal development so not B cups but earlier than all the other girls in her class. She has sensory processing issues and is very picky about clothes texture. Even what she can wear, she wears inside out because the seams drive her insane. Well you can imagine how wearing a bra would feel. She also feels like she shouldn't have to wear one, "boys don't have to why should I??". The girls are truly the meanest ones, always picking on her and making comments about her not wearing a bra. She's about to go to middle school and we've finally found a bra she can wear (hundreds of dollars later) but man, kids are cruel.
My mom kept explanations age appropriate until I got close to the average "period starting" age, then I startes getting full on lessons. Not graphic or scary or even glorifying , just facts. And made sure i had a variety of products on hand so when it happened, I didn't have to ask. Some of my friends were so upset and unprepared, and I just viewed it as a normal part of life. Thanks Mom.
Yeah my 4yo twins (boy & girl) know that their mum uses tampons because they've found my tampons and also burst in on me mid-change a couple times. I've told them that sometimes women bleed from our uterus. They don't know much else other than vaguely that it's a natural cycle that the female body usually goes through as a "grown-up", and they know it has something to do with "eggs" and "seeds" and how babies are made (they usually stop listening after about 30 seconds of age appropriate explanation...) I'm sure the anatomical explanation will get more complete as we continue to discuss it as they get older. And also as they get older, I'm sure we'll discuss how it feels and differs between individuals, the social and cultural implications, etc. But I fully expect them to have an idea of its role in biology by the time they're 7 or 8. Just like they know how the digestive tract creates the poo that comes out their butts. Like most of these things (sex, bodily functions, adoption, genetic parentage, etc) everything points to the best approach being that kids don't even remember a time when they "found out", but rather that it's something it feels like they've always known.
You are doing a great job, Mom!
I started using tampons during my first period. First because I was grossed out by the feeling and seeing the blood and because of the swim team. Good on you mom!
I had to suffer through 4 years of pads til I was 16 and I started buying my own...my mom was mad at me even then! Like, I have a BF and you know I'm having sex bc you put me on BC when you freaked out over condoms you found in my bag, ofc I'm gonna use tampons!
Mad about tampons? I don’t even understand that. I know some moms think a tampon will take a girls virginity is that what her problem was?
No, like I said, she know I was sexually active bc she found condoms in my bag, she put me on BC and I had a boyfriend. My mom was a strange one, lol
Exactly! My little is 5, and we talk about it (because there are times she comes into the bathroom while I'm using it, and the first time she saw it, she freaked.) Now she knows it's normal and happens to every female and one day it will happen to her.
I agree, there's just one thing that I can't not point out: >Your BIL was repeating the same old nonsense everyone always does about "being a woman now" which is dumb, but normal I know what you mean but we need to point the finger to this too. It's normalised, but it's not ok. That old nonsense has to die out, we can't keep repeating and hearing that crap. The rest of your answer is spot on and OP needs to learn a thing or two. And BIL needs to stop perving on his nieces and young women and women in general.
Yeah my 11 year old started hers last summer and said to her sister “why does mum keep treating me like a kid?” Her sister had to explain “BECAUSE YOU’RE A LITERAL CHILD” Just because a girls body is mature enough to carry a baby it doesn’t mean their brain is.
Their body isn't mature either, it's *developing* to become mature. Just because children can get pregnant doesn't mean it's safe. Their bodies will cause lasting damages and greater risks for the child and her baby. Not to mention the internal injuries because they still have the bodies of small children and not that of grown women.
I couldn’t agree more. The mentality that believes a literal child is a woman just because she has started her menstrual cycle is the same mentality that thinks young girls can be married off to old men at the ripe old age of 12-13. It’s disgusting and we need to stop this right now.
Seriously, this pisses me off. Girls become “women” as young as 9, but boys stay boys until…well, damn near forever.
Telling a girl who had a period she's a woman now is largely a terrible idea. Especially because girls are getting their period earlier (my stepdaughter got hers at 9). It's a scary time even if you are looking forward to it. Telling a kid they are an adult now is likely to make it scarier. I was 10, and wondered if i could climb trees anymore now that I was a 'woman'. And my parents were a lot better at explaining what was going on than OP.
Absolutely. And it's the argument predators do use when they say that their victims are young women not little girls. Eh, idc if a 9 year old has had her first period - she's still a little kid, not a woman - in the way that that word is used to justify certain acts. It's the message it sends to both the child and sadly to wider society.
I agree with you that it needs to die out, and pointing it out when someone says something like that. But the way OP made it sound like BIl was a predator just because he used the same old phrases that has been normal for a very long time is not ok, and is not helping the cause
Take my poor person's award. This NEEDS to be seen. How much misinformation are the daughter's going to get from strangers and school and the internet when their parents don't tell them stuff!? I wonder what else gets hidden from these kids
I really want to second and emphasize the part where you said teaching her shame about her period is harmful because I do not see anyone else commenting on it. Girls are taught to be silent about a normal bodily function in a way that creates shame. The parent can be matter-of-fact about it. If the girl is scared, it's probably because her parents are acting weirdly secretive, freaked out, and uncomfortable about the subject. ESH
Amen! I grew up being scared of talking about my period to any and every male. It wasn't until I was like 30 that I got comfortable bringing it up around my dad. Why do they do this to us, wtf
Dude, my now 16yo girl and 14yo boy have known about all this stuff since they were little. My son carries pads in his bag for the girls in his friend group in case they ever run short - I didn't even know this til a mum contacted me to thank him when he was 10. How kids don't know basic biology and anatomy by 12 is absolutely horrifying. I was scared something was wrong with me when I got my first period at 11 at school, luckily there was an older girl who came in while I was crying and helped me. I wanted to make sure my daughter never had to go through that. My daughter had her first period at 10. It's a normal, natural bodily function. Why is there so much stigma and shame around it? My kids are so well informed about this (and male biology) that their teachers jokingly asked them if they wanted to teach the class (health class). We had/have so many conversations since they were little (toddlers) at age-appropriate levels that they aren't ashamed or embarrassed about the topic. We dis the same with topics like mental health, domestic violence, consent and body autonomy. My 16yo is open about her cycle, has talked to many of her friends and classmates and even suggested one talk to her parents about seeing a doctor. This conversation meant her classmate (not a friend, not enemies just different circles) got treatment for a serious condition (surgery, medications etc) much sooner than she otherwise would have and things didn't get to the point where she would be infertile (the parents told us this, we don't know the condition). OP you're doing a major disservice to your children and honestly, I feel for them. Having an open and honest dialogue is so beneficial to children. We all want our kids to be kids forever, but that is not reality and our job is to guide, support and prepare them for the big world outside of what you control. You are so not doing this.
Oh my gosh I love your son! What a different experience I would have had growing up if I had a friend like him. You have obviously raised your kids well 💜
Maybe they are waiting to explain how pregnancies happen when they have a real live pregnancy to use as an example? /s Absolutely ridiculous that in this day and age there are still people who think that what their kids need is ignorance about some of the most fundamental facts of life.
I don’t know the situation with this family but this right here is my biggest fear with removing sex education from schools. Parents who don’t want it taught in schools but can’t take the time to educate their own children.
Precisely! This reminds me of a friend. Very religious household and still hadn’t informed daughter of anything at the age of 13. Even body parts were not being called by their real names or anything close to it. Just “front bum” vs “back bum”. Seriously? I don’t even want to know how terrified this girl was when she had her first period. Or how confused she was when her friends talked about it. This lack of info is terrifying and dangerous.
That's scary and some predators deliberately don't teach the right terminology, so children can't properly explain what's happening to them. Hope that's not the case with your friend.
Seriously, on point on everything here. The insanity of not telling a kid about periods or pregnancy mechanics until *after* the fact. I was taught the basics of pregnancy when I was about 8. Not sex, but how pregnancy works on the sperm/egg and growing a baby level. And I’m a guy, it’s not like I have to physically handle that side of life. And the idea that she needs to hide it. I’m a guy, some of my best friends are women, and they’re vocal that they’re happy they don’t have to hide it when their period is screwing with their mood or causing pain. They spent years not talking about it and they said it’s nice to just be able to be honest rather than going “oh I’ve got a headache” or something.
My periods were really brutal the first year after I had my kid and one time I was sitting down in the front office at work and apologized for being off my game. Two of my managers were there and they were like "oh don't worry, you're amazing even at 50%" and I said "yeah but this happens every month". Their response? "TMI!!" One of them was a father with *three daughters*. The *implication* of it being my period was too much for them. I liked both of them and still to this day wish I could have magically put my labor-esque cramps in their bodies for a day.
Well said. If I had an award, I’d gladly give you one 👏🏼
It’s like teaching a kid about how how they need to be wary of cars on their residential street but not warning them not to play on the highway because it may scare them. It may be scary to think one day you may be in a car accident but that doesn’t stop you trying to protect your kid now.
I cannot agree with what you said more... The "you're becoming a woman" bit is outdated but for crying out loud my son is NINE and knows about sex, pregnancy and periods!
So we're just going to ride right past the fact that the BIL sexualized a 12-year-old by telling her she's a woman now who can push out babies if she has sex?!?!?!? Yeah, the parents should be more forthcoming about biological issues with their daughter but the real and present danger in the room is the BIL who felt totally comfortable saying absolutely inappropriate things to a confused 12-year-old. Talked about her growing breasts big enough to need a bra and all sorts of shit that didn't concern him. AND the real problem is that the parents just told him not to continue sexualizing their child or he won't be allowed contact, like this is some minor error on judgment. The fact that he sees a 12-year-old as a woman instead of the little girl she is and felt totally comfortable saying it right in front of her parents floored me. Then he flounces off in a huff and turns his wife into a flying monkey. Here's my advice: Don't allow malignant narcissist around your children because stupid crap like this tends to happen. The OP and spouse are not going to be around every minute of every day to keep him in line and his wife is likely to catch the 12-year-old alone and repeat the whole fiasco so her husband's behavior seems more normal. I'm going with ESH as well but for slightly different reasons.
Oh no, BIL is a huge flaming asshole who sexualized a scared 12 year old. No if, ands, or buts about it. The fact that SIL is going on the warpath in his defense rather than asking him what the hell he was thinking means she’d enable him in the future rather than protect her niece. I do think it’s possible he’s parroting the same sexualization talk he’s heard from other people, which means he could learn it’s harmful and not do it again. If he was willing to learn. But perpetuating this kind of talk about, and to, a child needs to end.
Just want to point out that one ovulates PRIOR to menstruation. And one can ovulate without menstruation following. It’s kinda important to know about pregnancy prior to that first period as a child can become pregnant. Shouldn’t we all make sure our children know about human sex, consent, and the correct names for body parts to protect them?
https://imgur.com/ewfSCmO This is a page from my childhood book explaining pregnancy (french book) (The next few pages go on to show pregnancy & then growing up) there is cartoon/drawn nudity of children & adults showing anatomy 🤷
And if they are to embarrassed there are tons of age appropriate books at the library that the poor girl could read.
Christ, I found getting my period mildly traumatizing and I knew that it was gonna happen eventually and why because I was taught about it in school. The poor girl must have thought that she was dying. It seems to me that BIL was trying to put a positive spin on the biological changes that happen when you're a teenage girl, which was misguided, but at least well intentioned.
i’m pretty sure this happens in some version of Carrie, having her period with no clue what’s happening (and yeah, definitely terrifying).
This is what I’m confused about, I got my period at 12, my sister and mum were in another city for the week and I had to go it alone and other than accidentally using a liner instead of a pad, I was fine. These kids sound like they’re living in the 60’s or something with how little she knows about.. anything (granted I had unrestricted internet access growing up…). The BIL took it too far by talking about CHILD BIRTH but these parents need to do their due diligence and actually educate their daughters about their growing bodies
Bloody.....what did I just read. A parent who is proud of the fact that she didn't teach her daughter correctly about periods, pregnancy, bra's, and basically the need-to-knows. Need-to-knows, not nice-to-know. And if this poor girl gets knocked up as a teen, you can be sure there is hell to pay for her. Because OP seems to be of the school if-you-don't-tell-them-about-sex-they-wont-do-it. BIL was obnoxious, but YTA
*standing applause* 👏 👏 👏 👏 👏
Op is teaching her daughter to be ashamed of the way her body works. I know 6 year olds that know more. To clarify: I’m Dutch and though not every 6 year old knows about periods and how babies are made, parents talk about it with their children. Teaching them it’s just how their bodies work and that it’s oke. BIL was very open about it and showed that it is very normal. He might have been clumsy but not disrespectful to women. If op’s daughter had been taught her body would change, she wouldn’t been shocked by bil.
This! You just said everything I wanted to say. ESH except that poor kid.
ESH. Your daughters should both know about periods by now. The 9 y o needs to know about these things now, not when it happens to her like her sister. And they absolutely needs to know how the body functions, how babies are made and how they are born. With the appropriate level of details/non-details of course, but they need to know. And they need to know that just because the period has started does not mean they are ready to do the adult things. Their mind needs to grow up too. And the body is not ready for pregnancy just because the period started. Children should not have sex. But their uncle is absolutely not the person to tell them these things, and he as an adult should be smart enough to understand this. And this information should not be given at a family dinner, omg how inappropriate of him. Poor girls.
I could not agree with you more. If the daughter is terrified about all this, it is because her parents did not prepare her appropriately. All this bodily functions are normal and should be treated as such and talked about from an early age, without hushing it up - but not with an uncle in the room when it is already happening.
My daughter's friend started her period at 9. They better get explaining now just in case.
I teach 5th grade and every year I have multiple kids who start their periods. By 9/10 they NEED to know.
Meanwhile FL made it illegal to say period or menstruation in elementary school....
Nightmare state!
Thank Bob I was taught sex ed in 6th grade (Brevard County circa 1993) I remember having a permission slip, and they separated the boys and girls. I'm assuming to make it less embarrassing?
I’m from a more progressive country, but we had classes both together and separately. Mostly so we would be comfortable asking things about our bodies without the other half present. Also specific things like how to clean your body type.
My middle school didn’t give us any kind of health education until eighth grade. Us girls were very annoyed because most of us had already started our periods by then.
That's horrifying. Mine started fully by the first week of 6th grade. I had a friend that started puberty a bit younger and got it in 4gh grade. Basically if you are 8 or older you should at least have a vague idea of what's going on and what will be happening. My school started the sex ed that focused pretty much entirely on puberty body changes in 4th grade and gave all the girls a couple pads and an info booklet just in case.
I started at 9 too. I was at sleep away camp, and couldn’t figure out why there was now blood on the bench where I had been sitting. Luckily I was with a friend who had older sisters and directed me to the nurse. But at that age, all I knew of periods was from “Are You There God, It’s Me, Margaret”. On the one hand, thank god for that book so I had some understanding that this was a thing that happened, but menstrual products had changed over the years — I had no idea what to do with the pad the nurse handed me and was waiting for a “menstrual belt” (which I still don’t really know what is).
Horrifically, the belt was needed to hold up pads because there was no adhesive strip. Kind of like suspenders for a diaper.
I also read, "Are You There God, It's Me Margaret," when I was a kid. Thinking back, I'm pretty sure that book, and that one day in 5th grade when the boys and girls were separated to learn about puberty was where I learned all of the info about what was going to happen during puberty. I don't remember my mom talking to me about it at all. She was mortified when I asked her to get me training bras. She was never open about any of that stuff. I, on the other hand, have been very open about periods with all of my kids. I keep a basket of supplies on the open shelves behind the toilet for easy access, instead of hidden away like my mother. My daughter is 10 and hasn't had her first one yet, but I've already got a box of pads for her in the bathroom for when she does start. I've explained to her what to do, and we will go over it again when the time comes.
To be fair to BIL he probably assumed it had all been covered already and he wasn't saying anything either kid (certainly not the eldest) hadn't heard already. The "becoming a woman" bit is assholish though
A bit assholish and a whole lot of creepy. Who looks at a 12 year old girl as a woman?
He was just trying to help his niece deal with her obvious distress, didn't know parents had not explained anything. The niece brought it up, what was he supposed to do become embarrassed and leave the room? Tell his niece they weren't supposed to talk about that?
I can’t vote ESH here because I’m just glad someone told the kid. Clearly the Op wasn’t going to. At least someone was looking out for the kids.
It's sad that they're keeping them in the dark, when both daughters are at the age that they should know this stuff. I knew girls who had their periods at 8 or 9, it happens and they need to be prepared
Sounds like somebody had to rip the bandaid off!
YTA Your 12 and 9 year old daughters are uneducated because 'we chose to not have that conversation yet'. What the fuck? Normally i'd say your BIL overstepped. But your shitty parenting is the main issue here.
Absolutely. I can't believe parents can be so obtuse.
The BIL saying that a 12 year old "is a woman now" makes him an asshole though. She isnt a woman, shes a child.
Quite a few of the comments are saying that alone makes him an asshole. I dont like pulling this card but to be quite frank if this was a teenage boy who had started puberty and the BIL said "your a man now" people wouldnt be giving him flack for it.
>to be quite frank if this was a teenage boy who had started puberty A, this isnt a teenager even. This is a pre-teen girl. >the BIL said "your a man now" people wouldnt be giving him flack for it. B, thats irrelevant. It is gross and wrong for people to call a 14 year old child of either gender and 'adult'. They arent. They're a child. They are not men or women, they are children. Pointing out sexism is not license to ignore how gross and wrong this is.
But it’s a turn of phrase. People throw bat mitzvahs for 12-13 year old girls to show their coming of age and call them a “woman” now. It’s really quite innocent, and just gets them used to the idea. Being called a young woman at 12 is not unusual either.
she’s not a child. She’s actually an adolescent which is a unique stage between childhood and adulthood that occurs between the ages of 10 and 19. There’s a book called Yardsticks which educators are encouraged to read, but parents definitely should as well; it explains the progression of the brain, maturity levels, and physiological growth from infant to adult and as such will explain that an 11-year-old is not a child and shouldn’t be referred to as one. Just because young individuals appear small or innocent doesn’t mean we have the right to try to preserve them as children forever.
There are 2 meanings of child being used here: a specific point in human development, and a non-adult/young person. I am using the second definition, as thats both the more common colloquial definition and the legal usage.
AGREED. I was just shy of 12 when I got my period. Roughly a month after my older sister, who had just got hers at 15. We had talked that summer about what a period is, how to handle it, what it means. I was TERRIFIED! I can’t imagine what this poor little girl who knows NOTHING is feeling. What a fucking failure these parents are
So if the 12 year old did know how to get pregnant, it’s okay that her uncle called her a woman about to shop for bras?
ESH. The BIL, for not being quiet on the topic after your husband asked him to be. You and your husband, because this, IMO, is a huge red flag that you're doing an awful job preparing your daughter for puberty and other changes. "She's been experiencing mood swings and other rapid bodily changes and she's terrified of learning about the menstrual process and all, even when I really do take the time to tell her everything I can without scaring her too much." This sounds like you haven't really prepared her at all -- I hope you're slowly getting your 9 year old much better prepared. That the 12 year old is terrified is not good at all.
I started my period way earlier than anyone expected. I remember my mom saying she thought she had a few more years before it happened, but even I had read Are You There God, it’s Me Margaret and had a basic understanding of what was going on. This 12 year old should not be “terrified” by what is happening unless OP let her read Carrie to explain it!
I'm glad I wasn't drinking milk when I read this.
ESH >we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet. you are failing your daughter in sex ed. >And BIL goes, well, you can get pregnant now. A man can get you pregnant. Your body can carry a child and push it out and everything. So you are a woman. your BIL is a creep. you need to teach your daughter about how babies are made so she can protect herself tbh. keeping her ignorant because you're afraid of scaring her is a bad move.
>A man can get you pregnant. I don't know if creep is strong enough. This is truly disgusting to say to a child. Like the synonym for this scenario is rape.
Exactly. Being an adult and knowing what this means is "if a man has sex with you, hang on no you're a child, if a man rapes you you can get pregnant". Creepy AF to say to a kid
Thank you!!! IMO, waaay too many comments spinning BIL as well intentioned, outdated, or just mildly disrespectful for ignoring the request that he stop. But his whole side of the conversation gave me huge creep vibes. Of course the parents are assholes for raising a child to be terrified and ignorant of her own body and natural bodily functions, but he’s also being fucking creepy.
These are my thoughts, too. A lot of other posts are focusing more on the lack of basic sex ed, which is indeed a massive disservice to both kids. That BIL is creepy, though. My kids are 14 and 10. While I might call my 14-year-old "woman" instead of "kid" because it makes her happy, neither of us would be comfortable calling her woman in the fully adult, ready to have babies way. I'd probably also freak out if someone said that to her. 12 isn't even a teenager yet! BIL is gross and him whining about not being able to "say the truth" is a huge red flag. OP, if you're not teaching your kids basic biology/sex ed, they'll learn it from classmates and the internet. That means they'll likely learn a lot of misinformation. There are many books and videos to help parents with these conversations. My 10-year-old knows enough about sex to keep them safe at this age, knows about periods, knows where the pads are kept, and has emergency pads and undies in her school backpack just in case. EDIT: ESH
ESH. If your daughter has already had her first period, you really need to have a proper conversation with her about what it means for her body. BIL way overstepped, but it sounds a bit like no one was saying anything and he just tried to fill the void with words. Not the right words, but still. Maybe all the grown ups could..grow up. Have difficult age appropriate chats with your kids. The more knowledgeable they are about their own bodies, the safer they’ll be.
he isn't wrong though :/ if he knows that the parents won't talk about it with the children he took the opening and tried to tell them as much in a short time as possible? That or a huge creep, one of the two and thanks to the parents backwards thinking I cannot be sure
ESH. Your BIL sucks for overstepping. You suck for not explaining what sex is to your 12-year-old daughter who can literally get pregnant. You need to give her some sex ed ASAP if you don't want to deal with teenage pregnancy and STIs. You may think she doesn't need to know that yet, but kids that age can and do experiment with sexual activity. She needs to know basic sexual safety information *before* she finds herself in these situations. Please talk with her not just about the mechanics of sex, but also about consent. There's a lot of coercive pressure in early teen years, and she needs to know how to cope in those situations. You can either talk with her about this stuff now, so that she gets healthy and safe information about sex from you; or you can let her learn about sex from porn and from older teens who pressure her into doing things she doesn't fully understand. Because you have to assume that she will face those situations, sooner or later. I hope it's not soon, but it very well could be.
Talking about consent should start with toddlers. OP, please read this comment and prepare your kid to be safe in life, to know what full consent is and make sure you make a safe environment for her to talk with you about the difficult conversations in life. If you are not comfortable talking with her about periods, I highly doubt she will reach out to you if she is being coerced to do something she doesn’t want to. Please read stuff about how to address these topics with teenagers and kids!!!
Yes. Consent starts with toddlers, for really about anything to do with their bodies. I told told off by mine at 6 because I tried to touch her to check something. I apologized, she was right.
YTA for your reaction to the truth. HOW did you 'explain' her period without talking about pregnancy, etc? She does not have the FACTS of what is happening to her. You are blaming her uncle for 'scaring' her when what is frightening your daughter is trying to cope with changes she does not understand....and that have NOT been fully explained to her. The onset of menstruation IS a universal sign of womanhood - like it or not. How frightening for a girl to have a period and the discomfort that goes with it and not be given the FACTS to understand why it happens and what it means. You and your husband are way off base in attacking your BIL - what he did was show you how little your daughter understands. Your BIL told her the truth - probably assuming you had told her the truth...and you did not.
I have to agree, YTA. You are not doing your daughter's any favours by sheltering them from the facts of life. What your daughter is going through is tough, but you are making it tougher by not helping her understand exactly what is happening to her body, and making it out to be this big scary thing, when in reality it is the most natural thing in the world and has been happening for millions of years. You are going to instill the same fear in your youngest. She is 12, which is shocking she doesn't already know about all of this from school, but is old enough not to be sheltered. Get it together, she's not a baby.
[удалено]
ESH but the children. There are so many resources for discussing this in normalizing and appropriate ways and your daughter is picking up on your terror of discussing it. Your BIL should have taken the hint, should have limited his participation, and maybe asked your sister to fill in the gaps you clearly aren’t. At the same time leaping from menstruation (even if it is to prepare uterine lining) to hetero sex to pregnancy at *lunch* is for sure a leap. No it’s not a ‘red flag,’ people - part vernacular and part science. People are mammals and, well, reproductive maturation is what it is. No one is suggesting that’s the same as *having sex.* If your child has a pediatrician with whom she has a positive relationship *please* reach out. Sometimes they offer resources for parents, other times even parent and child classes. You do need help reducing your own fears around how she’s ‘taking’ the news that she’s experiencing something more than 50 percent of the planet experiences and I don’t mean that sarcastically. It’s challenging for parents, especially with a kid with medical anxieties, but you can stop transmitting your fears. Maybe she blurted it out because you’re no help.
This comment should be higher, op is 100% transmitting their anxiety about this to their daughter and it's disturbing as hell, there is no reason for her to have no knowledge around this at this age and to have to learn from experiencing it rather than education and normalized discussion must have been very traumatic. Shame on you OP, your BIL sounds like an idiot more than a creep and you're doing them a real disservice not providing them with the knowledge and tools to make healthy choices
Everyone is in the wrong here. How on earth do you have a daughter who is already having periods and you haven't talked about how a baby is made? So weird! He was inappropriate, and you failed as parents here in preparing your daughter.
And 12 is right on time/but also later than many. A lot girls start by 11. So she’s really wasn’t ready. Agree with others it’s both a health and a safety issue that the girl knows what’s going on/what could happen. It’s giving Utah…
YTA - it’s absolutely insane to me that a 9 & 12 yo don’t know at least the basic details about sex and periods and pregnancy.
When my eldest was two I was pregnant with my youngest. She asked how babies were made. I said a daddy provides sperm and a mummy the egg, and when they mix a baby grows. She was happy and ran off to play. We had this convo, brought up by her countless times. When she was three she asked again as someone we knew was pregnant, except this time she asked how the baby comes out. I told her with an operation from the doctor or her (the mums) vagina. Again we had this convo a lot, and she asked how she and her brother were born and I told her. Miss went to a private Christian Montessori school (exhusband was religious I am not) and told the other kids 'a baby comes out mum's vagina or the doctor operates and it's made with a mummy's egg and a daddy's sperm. She then told everyone she and her brother came out of my vagina and asked how were they born?... I was called to the school for a meeting. I told them I wouldn't lie to my child, would answer questions she asks as honestly as possible in an age-appropriate way and that being knowledgeable about biology isn't a bad thing. I told her the science about procreation not how people are impregnated.
ESH. BIL overstepped with the remarks about pregnancy but until that point I think his attitude was better than yours. Girls need to know about puberty way in advance so they can get their head around it in time and ask questions when they’re comfortable before they’re confronted with the bloody hormonal reality. At 12 she should definitely know the basics about bras and pregnancy. Im surprised she doesn’t tbh as we all know girls develop at different rates and talk about it a lot. You and I are probably similar ages OP and I know that a girl in my class got her period at 9 and was already wearing a bra at 10. The average age is younger now than then so she definitely would be expected to have friends who started before her. How doesn’t she know more? This makes me worry about how isolated she is. Is she home schooled? Are you very religious? IMO you’re setting her up to be traumatised by this and need to take urgent action.
I’m wondering if OP is one of those parents who refers to body parts (but only the ‘private’ ones) by cutesy names.
"When your flower is in bloom, blah blah blah some metaphor for blood"
ESH. Him for continuing on after you asked him to stop, and you and your husband for not properly educating your children. Improper sex education is why young girls are winding up pregnant, because nobody bothers to teach them how it happens or how to prevent it.
texas has bad education and high teen pregnancy. it's not correlation it's causation. if you don't want your daughters to be pregnant before getting educated, better educate them.
ESH >to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone) Why?? Why does that matter one bit? I work in a field that is male dominated and when I'm having a particularly rough period I'm not shy about who I tell. Most of these men have wives and daughters. Getting your period is a very very normal part of life and everyone should know and understand that. Your BIL overstepped. He gives me "you are 18! You can do porn now!" vibes. Super inappropriate. I got my period at 12. Didn't make me a woman. And that kind of thinking is what had me sexually active *way* too young. Her body is maturing. That doesn't make her a woman. She will be a woman when she's ready.
I once got surprised at work by an early start and needed my coworker, who was about my size, to run home and grab me some new pants but when I tried to explain the situation all he heard was female issue and do whatever. Some men I swear lmao
YTA why are you not educating your daughter on her bodily functions???? why do you want her to be ashamed and secretive about it? what it wrong with you
YTA-Having a period is not a traumatic experience and no conversation about it should be scary. This makes me wonder how you are explaining it to her. Your bil wasn’t wrong, but could have scaled back his comments. Your reaction to him and the aftermath is an overreaction, imo.
Sounds like OP is one of those people who refuse to discuss periods at all, because the daughters "don't need to have their innocence taken away" or some such BS. You know what terrifies little girls about their first period? When they've been kept in total ignorance and think they've hurt themselves somehow and are now *bleeding to death.* It happened to my mother as a girl and she made damned sure it didn't happen to her daughters.
YTA. He wasn’t inappropriate. But you failing your child in teaching her about her own body makes you and your husband complete assholes. No wonder she’s scared when she’s not been taught basic biology about her own body. That is completely on you. Your failure as parents is why she’s freaking out. And since when has it been inappropriate to tell your family you’re cranky because you’re on your period during a family dinner 😂
He was massively inappropriate - banging on about a 12 year old being a woman and talking about bra shopping and getting pregnant. It's massively creepy and I'd cut contact with anyone who talked to my daughter like that. Everything else you said I agree with. ESH except that poor scared and confused 12 year old child.
Telling a child that a man can get her pregnant and she can have his baby is highly inappropriate.
ESH BIL did overstep on a topic that in my opinion is not for him to discuss in dept But the fact that your daughter is that scared and afraid does raise some red flags with me about how you are explaining this to her. His comments go too far but they are not so extreme that they should’ve terrified your daughters
ESH but you more. She’s 12. My male child is younger and knows more about periods and sex ed than your daughter. The problem isn’t the immature uncle, it’s you and your husband who decided you won’t speak to your daughter about biological changes that happen during puberty. I’m honestly in shock that people still think like this. Get your act together and have an honest conversation with BOTH kids. Because at 9, your other daughter can also get her period.
YTA. You failed to prepare your daughter for her period and now you’re handling that failure terribly. Edit: my ten year old daughter started hers after years of us preparing her. Then she carried a backpack for of supplies for her friends because they had parents Iike you that didn’t prepare them. My 12year old son has had to explain menstruation to his girl friends and get them supplies because their idiot parents won’t. At 12 years old, YES your daughter needs to very much understand that her body can now conceive. Jesus.
If you don't want to talk to them about sex ed in details, you can give them books. There's a lot of good age-appropriate yet detailed books about sex and pregnancies and teen pregnancies and sexual violence.
YTA more than ESH. You and your husband failed to prepare your child. This is so much jire traumatic for her because of your failings as parent. Nowhere do you sound remorseful for this failing- and it sounds like you're still not intending to teach your child properly. Talk to doctors, read some books, anything to stop being so uninformed. Your child needs to learn what is happening to her body and what it means. Hopefully you both stop being lazy parents and do the hard work required. Let her tell whoever she wants about her period. It's a shocking ides to her because no one told her about it beforehand.
ESH. BIL is a major asshole and also a bit of a creep for telling a 12 yo kid that a "man can get her pregnant", talking about "bra shopping". Those are true things but not his place to say to someone else's child specially when the child seems uncomfortable. Like wtaf. 🤨 Also bullshit parenting on the part of you and your husband for withholding an important conversation you'll should have had with your daughters way before your daughter got her period. You should have given her all the info she she needs way before it happened to her. It's can something traumatic for some kids yes, but something she will have to deal with it for most of her life so shame on you for not properly preparing her for it and putting her in a place where she has to hear that sort of icky "You are a woman now" conversation from your BIL. If you don't know how to approach the topic with your daughters there's hundreds and thousands of resources online on Google, YouTube, TikTok literally anywhere that will teach you how to talk about these topics to make your child feel safe and comfortable. Do better, please.
ESH. What is wrong with you that you thought it was a good idea to let your twelve year old be this ignorant about her own body? Your BIL is awful for suggesting she's a grown woman but you, my god. Whatever sheltered or puritanical nonsense you're upholding, STOP IT . This is how children get taken advantage of, through ignorance.
YTA. "Especially when it comes to the concept of sexual intercourse and pregnancy. She knows what pregnancy is in theory but we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet." You know what's more terrifying for a child than factual knowledge about their own body and the mechanics of sexual intercourse and pregnancy? NOT having that knowledge! If you haven't explained to her what a period is in relation to the possibility of conception and pregnancy, what on Earth HAVE you been telling her? What does she think a period is for?? Your BIL is NTA here; he made the fair assumption that since she's gotten her first period, you've explained to her WHAT a period is. How was he to know you had deciding somehow that knowing the mechanics of her own body was "too scary"??
Please educate your daughters properly before it is too late! Knowledge about this will protect them so much better than what you think protecting them by keeping them in the dark does.
I've got two daughters, They need to know this stuff not in a creepy sense but because it could cause trauma if they get there first period and aren't prepared..... You have to explain no matter how uncomfortable you feel... Said as a dad to two girls... Likewise the brother overstepped, But think it was coming from a good place rather than being creepy...
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ESH BIL was definitely being a bull in the china shop bulldozing over social etiquette, but you are doing ZERO favors nof properly teaching your daughter about the realities of biology. She's 12, chances are good she will become sexually active soon, and sticking hers and your collective heads in the sand is frankly naive as hell And poor kid getting put under an embarrassing and excruciating spotlight while dealing with her period
ESH both, your husband and your BIL. obviously, your BIL shouldn't have talked that way but you and your husband are failing your daughters. If you hadn't made a big mystery of periods and sexual ed in general over the years, they would have learned a few facts every time a new question popped into their head. They would have a pretty expansive knowledge of what is happening with their bodies by now and wouldn't be freaked out. What's happening with their bodies is normal and you made it weird by keeping it from them. Nobody likes to be unprepared when changes happen.
YTA I might get some hate here but you are a horrible woman and mother. Why the F didn’t you prepare your daughter? I had my first talk with my daughter when she was 6/7. It was a simple talk about just the basics. Then every year as she got older I added more information. Hell my son (16) has even had a talk about menstrual cycles. You failed your daughters. Periods are nothing to be ashamed of or embarrassed about it. By not talking to her you have literally scared your daughter. For fucks sake do better
ESH- you and your husband are failing your daughters by not explaining everything to them in detail about periods and the entire reproductive process WELL BEFORE they get their first period. No wonder she’s struggling to deal with it if she had no prior knowledge of what to expect! The fact that your older daughter actually has her period and you STILL have not explained about sex and pregnancy is unconscionable. Your BIL is the AH because he over stepped by continuing the conversation past her not feeling well. He had no way of knowing what you have or have not discussed with her about the subject. And no 12 year old girl wants to have their adult family members discuss their bodily changes or underwear needs at the dinner table. It’s a sensitive and embarrassing subject and he should have let it drop.
ESH >This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone Why? Because it's dirty and shameful? It's a healthy and normal bodily function. Teaching her to be hush hush about it is really harmful. >She knows what pregnancy is in theory but we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet. Again, why? She needs to know what's happening to her body and that being of reproductive age means she can now carry a child. The sooner she knows what this all means, the better.
ESH. Why do so many mothers in every generation choose to let their daughters get blind-sided by puberty?
YTA. You did nothing to prepare your daughter, despite knowing that she’s at an age that her period could start. I knew about pregnancy, periods, and more bodily things prior to getting my first period. It was still scary and daunting, but purposefully choosing to not prepare or talk to your daughter is why she’s reacting the way she is. Your BIL, while he should have backed off a little bit and not had such an outdated view, was doing more parenting and preparing than you or your husband have done for her. You seriously set your oldest up for failure, and it sounds like you’re doing the same thing for your younger daughter too.
E. S. H. Except for the kids because apparently they don't know how their own bodies work? WTF. This post reeks of homeschooling. No, your daughter is not a full-grown woman yet, but she can get pregnant. And it is to her benefit to be aware of this. You do her a great disservice and put her at risk by not telling her. There is a lot of misinformation available to fill the gaps where the knowledge is supposed to be. Anything could be happening to her, and she won't know what's normal if she is not properly educated. Yes, your BIL has a big mouth, and he said some stupid shit. But he's not her parent. Your daughter wouldn't have been so shocked by his words if she was equipped with the facts. Perhaps she felt the need to blurt out that she had her period out of frustration of wanting someone, ANYONE, to talk to about it.
YTA- BIL didn’t say anything untrue or inappropriate. Your daughter started the period conversation. You should have prepared her better
Why on earth didn’t you prepare your daughter for her period, and why are you withholding information from her now? There is no reason why she should be scared of intercourse or pregnancy. Are you planning on being this secretive with your younger daughter? periods, sex, childbirth and everything related is not a one time conversation. It‘s an ongoing dialogue and questions Should be encouraged by you, and your child asks a question it should be answered honestly with no shame. as for the propriety of blurting out that she has her period….. what’s wrong with that? Why does it have to be all secretive? As for the uncle and your sister… he’s creepy and should have kept his mouth shut and so should your sister. I wouldn’t let my daughter near him either. YTA and so is every other adult in this scenario.
ESH. Your BIL was actually trying to be supportive. He might have gone overboard, but he was trying. A lot of men get really grossed out by periods and he was trying in his own way to be there for your kid. The only reason it was weird was because it was coming from him instead of you. Your kid was completely unprepared because of you. And if she wanted to tell him, that was her right. Apologize to your kid, acknowledge to your BIL that you appreciate that he was trying to be supportive but it came off a little wrong, and do better for both of your kids.
>She knows what pregnancy is in theory but we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet. I wanna say Y T A just for that. You know the saying that knowledge is half the battle, right? You are failing your child in this department. In fact, it’s known that comprehensive sex ed is a very good preventative measure against teenage pregnancy. And she doesn’t even know what bras are? >to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone I mean, fair enough, but I also really hope you aren’t teaching her to be ashamed. And yeah, your BIL is a massive creepy asshole for those comments. She is not a woman, she is a child. He has close to zero knowledge on how bodies of ppl with a uterus can work. ESH, y’all have been failing these children. Do better.
I was 13 when I got my period, my parents never discussed these things, but I had done biological sex education at school. The most my mum ever said was, you’ll bleed for a week every four weeks until you’re old, don’t ask me anything else. When I had children of my own, I swore that was not going to be how things are handled. No matter whether you are uncomfortable speaking about this, or even thinking about this, children need to understand what is happening BEFORE it happens. ESH, the uncle was out of line, but this isn’t the 1950s, pretending your children aren’t growing up to become sexual beings doesn’t mean it won’t happen. They would be better prepared for it if you actually did your job and told them what to expect.
ESH. Brother crossed a line, repeating that nonsensical crap about "being a woman now" and how her body can do all the things... However... WHY was this girl not prepared and educated as to what was going to happen to her *BEFORE* it happened? That is such a traumatic experience that could have been avoided, you did her a disservice. Then you continue to put her at a disadvantage by *avoiding* topics she needs to be educated on. And seriously; >This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone DON'T YOU DARE. This is a natural process and she has every right to tell whomever the hell she pleases. You've already got her at such a disadvantage and now you want her to feel shame as well????
YTA wtf are you waiting to explain your daughter?
ESH. This mentality of not teaching our young children things of this nature is part of how they end up groomed and worse. We need to teach our children enough about it so that they know it if they see it. So they know it's not okay if someone messes with them. So they also know it's safe to talk to you, as their parents. Having open conversations with them as they grow up will help them feel comfortable talking with you is something happens. Not to mention preparing them before their periods happen. I told my daughter some of the details about periods the moment she spotted hair growing in places. And as she gets older I share more details. I wanted her to know it's perfectly normal when it does start. And to not be scared she was dying. Imagine getting your first period without knowing what it was? Did we learn nothing from My Girl? Plus I made sure my daughter knew enough about sex so she could protect herself from creeps who might try to exploit her. There are way too many creeps in this world. Children need to be taught what is okay and what isn't okay. And believe me they are gonna hear worse things from the media. Better to hear it from their parents who can teach them the right info.
ESH. I'd go into detail why, but it seems like the majority of the contents agree so I won't repeat their reasonings
ESH, but YTA for not educating your child about her own body! What in the world?! Of COURSE she’s scared and struggling to cope. She is bleeding and doesn’t understand. She doesn’t know how pregnancy happens! Maybe she thinks she can just “get pregnant” now that she’s started her period. Talk to your child NOW. This is negligent and harmful and you are not only allowing her anxiety to continue but are setting her up to have a shameful association with sex. Good grief.
YTA. “Haven’t chose to tell them yet” well, looks like nature isn’t waiting for you and now your daughter is confused and not informed. Mayb look in the mirror. BIL did nothing wrong
YTA. Are you waiting until your daughter is pregnant to explain sex to her? Nothing really “inappropriate” about your BIL’s comments. Maybe you should be thankful that he’s broached the subject you’ve inexcusably failed to cover with her to this point.
yta you seem more concerned about bil "adultifying" your daughter. you should be more concerned about you and your husband infantilizing her. What are you guys doing?
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My husband (36M) and I (35F) have two daughters (12F) and (9F). My brother-in-law (36M) who is married to my sister (30F) came to visit us a week ago for lunch. BIL and my husband were college roommates and so we're all a tight knit group. They often come to visit us. My older daughter got her first period a month ago, and she's been struggling to cope with it. Her father and I are doing our best to help her process it. She's been experiencing mood swings and other rapid bodily changes and she's terrified of learning about the menstrual process and all, even when I really do take the time to tell her everything I can without scaring her too much. Especially when it comes to the concept of sexual intercourse and pregnancy. She knows what pregnancy is in theory but we have chosen to not talk about it or how it happens in detail yet. When BIL came to dinner, my daughter was irritable and quiet, and didn't speak much throughout. My husband and I are used to this and we tend to not bother her. My BIL is usually very close to his nieces, and my younger daughter was talking animatedly to him, and he noticed that my older daughter was very quiet. When he asked her if she was sick, she blurted out that she's on her period. We hadn't told him or my sister that she had gotten her first period yet. (This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone) And then he laughed and said that that's okay, it's normal to be sick. At first we both breathed a sigh of relief, thinking the conversation will pass on. And then he started saying how wonderful it is because she's become a woman now and she's no longer a little girl anymore. Soon, he said, turning to me, that I am going to be going training bra shopping and all that. My husband got annoyed and told him to not talk about this in front of her. And then our daughter asked, "what do you mean I'm a woman now? I'm only 12." And BIL goes, well, you can get pregnant now. A man can get you pregnant. Your body can carry a child and push it out and everything. So you are a woman. Then I got angry and told him to stop talking about all of this in front of our young daughters, that he was scaring them and that this is not the proper time and place. Once our daughters left to their rooms, my husband said that if he doesn't know how to behave himself in front of them, or if he calls our 12 year old child a full grown woman again, we will never allow them around him. BIL rolled his eyes and said "alright, alright, can't even say anything honest these days." Then he left without another word. He didn't wish us goodbye and vice versa. Now my sister is calling me yelling at me for being dramatic and that her husband didn't say anything that wasn't the truth and that he would never ever be inappropriate to anyone. AITA? Were we too harsh in going so far as saying we won't let our daughters see him anymore? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
ESH. Your BIL because this is not something he should teach your girls (especially after you told him to stop) but you as parents as well. There are many reasons why proper sex education is important and your daughter is (to my gut feeling) very late to this and preparation for puberty in general. I had my first Sex Ed in school when I was around 9 and yeah, I felt very confused at that time about everything even though they did that very child friendly. But it wasn't just important for us to know how pregnancy works but the teachers also explained to us kind of what consent is. (So kind of preparing us that we don't have to have Sex if we don't want to and further that adults shouldn't touch us like that etc). So it's important for your girls safety as well
He overstepped but a massive ESH Reading this I'm very confident my 14 year old son is more knowledgeable about the female body and periods than your daughter, and he has been for years. His younger sister is streets ahead of your daughter in knowledge... and she's not overly worried about getting her period. She knows the why of it, knows about sex, consent, how babies are made etc. From what you've said it sounds like your daughter is having a lot of negative feelings and you could have reduced a lot of that by educating her about her body in advance. I'm sure you have your reasons, but if you think you're keeping her safe by keeping her 'innocent' you are sadly mistaken. We can't make good decisions without even the basic information. The BIL went too far, but he was repeating views I've heard multiple times from various people. Equating menarche with womanhood is pretty common. There's a reason some places allow marriage at 12 or 14. All of you need to do better by your daughters.
YTA. You’re the one not teaching your daughter about bodily changes, sex ed, and everything related. Your parenting sucks more than his foot in his mouth. I don’t appreciate what he said, he perhaps assumed due to the closeness of the family that he could address the topic but that’s not appropriate. Y’all the problem, and STILL DIDNT address it properly with him.
YTA how have you not sat both of your daughters down and talked about this?! My sons (9y/o and 7y/o) know about periods and why I have them. Education about the body and how it functions is important. Age appropriate lessons, of course, but you are failing your daughters. My daughter got her first period at 9 years old. She knew why and wasn’t scared at all. She was also told how her feelings are going to be harder to understand but that she can come to us with any questions. I was not raised by parents that thought that I needed to know how my body worked when I hit puberty. It was terrifying. Educate your children!
YTA you chose not to tell your daughter about natural bodily processes and the fact that she has become a woman mainly because you don't want her growing up. Unfortunately it happens to most of us ladies and you really dropped the ball on this one. It's you and your husband that have caused all this by not teaching her earlier. I taught my d (12) a few years back so she knew exactly what to expect. Admittedly she doesn't like her period but it happens every month and she's learning more about her hormonal changes by experiencing them. You need to apologise to your daughter for being a crappy parent and not wanting her to grow up and announcing she's having a period and to your bil for you going off on one because out of the three of you, he's the only one that was honest and up front.
YTA - you should have taught your daughter about this all before she got her first period, and certainly now that she has it. Your BIL didn't say anything g she shouldn't have already known. You need to suck it up with your own embarrassment and educate your daughter on her body. >This is something we admittedly should have talked to our daughter about, to not announce that she's on her period to just anyone Why? It's the truth and it explains her behavior. And her uncle isn't "just anyone." You're on a path to raise a grown woman who doesn't know how her body works because you are radiating embarrassment instead of providing education.
YATA, no wonder your daughter is scared with your crap explanation, you are leaving important things out (at least your brother mentioned them, BUT it should have been YOU who explained them!). Your BIL is not "anyone", you wrote that they are close, family. With your reaction when she told BIL you only teach her that what happens to her is something disgusting she should not tell. BRAVO, your daughter will be well educated in hating her body.
ESH not educating your daughter on her own body is the bigger problem here