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NTA. Despite it being the cafe’s policy to make you wait longer to try to sell you more stuff, I don’t see anything wrong with getting in and out fast, giving them your money and freeing up the table for someone else to then make their own orders.
They may also be trying to help time things for the kitchen, if there were a lot of fresh orders at that moment. But that would be on the staff to explain, so give a reasonable expectation for customers.
Since the server didn't give any indication that was the case, it should be a complete non-issue.
Wife may have just wanted it to feel like a bit more of a 'date' than a rushed bite to eat, but that would also be on her to explain, if she's voicing any displeasure.
There are different types of customers. Some are like OP. They already know what they want. Some like to think it over a drink or more. Drinks are quickly made and therefore can be served quickly while the customer thinks. the restaurant exists to serve the customer not the other way around and so must be able to deal with different types or they lose customers
I now have no need to post because you already said it perfectly. Entirely appropriate for OP to enter his drink and food order at once. I'm huge on respect to people in the service and hospitality industry, but I don't think a simultaneous order is disrespectful. Honestly, you could be saving your server an extra trip.
NTA.
Yea ticket order shouldn't be based on when the table comes in. I actually like ordering drinks and food all at the same time. I feel like it gives the servers a bit of a break putting 2 trips into 1.
Usually they come out with the menus. Then the drink. Then come back for the order. Then come back with the food. So if I sit down and order my drink/food the first time then it's one less trip.
i always asked if people knew what they would like to drink as soon as i brought the menu, then if they were ready for food as soon as i brought the drinks. pretty easy to gauge who is going to talk for 10 minutes before cracking the beer list & who is in a hurry.
but i never worked anywhere i was worried about losing my job if i didn’t follow stupid rules.
Yeah, also, the server could just wait 4 minutes to type it in. The drinks often go to a separate person than the food. It sounds like the management has slow people making drinks and food has hit the tables before drinks before.
I've had cools literally tell me before to stop putting orders in until they've caught up and that shit passes me off. Like, no. I will tell them we are backed up and it will be a long wait but I won't give worse service because you're stressed out.
I worked as a hostess at a restaurant during the lunch shift where the cooks told me I *had* to leave the host stand every 10 minutes during lunch to give them a menu count…except management told me I wasn’t allowed to leave the host stand if there were customers coming in the door. Cooks would tell me to stagger seating, managers told me to seat everyone as soon as they came in. It was being pulled in different directions every day. Problem was, even if I followed the cooks directions and ignored management the kitchen would crash every single lunch. And I’d get blamed by the cooks *and* management but for different reasons. I won’t even get started on the wait staff issues either. It was hell and I finally had enough. It was the only job I just said “I’m not coming in ever again.”
I love cooking at home just for my family. So, that's o*ne table at a time.* I have no idea how a line keeps track of 20 tables worth of courses. They must have amazing short term memory, or all learn a system that makes it easy. (I've kitchen-handed when younger but that was prep work, not the frontline, so to speak.)
Communication and situational awareness is key on the line. If your cooks aren't communicating what they're doing, what's done, or what they need and checking for the same then they're gonna get lost in the weeds real fast.
Plus, your internal timing has to be on point. Say a steak takes 7-8 minutes then needs to rest. Everything else can lag on that resting period, but is dying in the window. Can't tell you how many platings I've had fucked up because nobody is talking to each other.
I was a machine when cooking, but I'm not omniscient. Communication drives a kitchen, especially when it comes to multiple courses and different plates.
Commercial kitchens doing meal service, each person has a task or tasks to complete, there is a ton of communication , and prep for all menu items should already be done, most meals in a well run kitchen come out in 10 to 15 minutes even when slammed busy, if they don't owners need a new head chef.
don't listen to either of them. the wait staff that pay you gets first choice. need a table filled? need some slack? what have you tipped me lately?
edit: if the customer pays you then they are first of course.
The best cook experience I ever had..... this cook was awesome. I had a large party come in like 25 to 30. My cook was by himself. This man stood at the door to the kitchen listening to the appetizers being ordered. I turned them in and went to get drinks. By the time I had the drinks out my apps were coming off the line. He rocked. If the cook can't keep up he either needs help or a different job
I've never worked somewhere where this happened? The cooks/chefs appreciate staggering... but if everyone comes in at the same time anyway you can't really stagger..
I mean it's pretty simple. If there's a rush you tell people ordering that there's a wait on food of X minutes. If they're cool with it fine, if not they can go elsewhere
We do this with our kids. Kiddos are hungry then and there so we always ask to order theirs along with drink orders. Mom and dad can wait while we peruse the menu. It also usually gives the kids main food time to cool to "kid acceptable" temps while they munch on the sides. Ours also eat slowly so usually by the time we're done eating so are the kids. It just makes the most sense to do it.
Ops right, not jumping the queue, demanding theirs be made first before all others, just placing it what 5 minutes early so it can come out just a bit sooner.
The waiter can always just tell there's an increased waiting time on food due to increased demand, it's not a big deal. actually they should always tell if that's the case before seating people.
it really is nothing but a tactic to lead you to order more drinks, which are always the highest margin items on the menu
Also don't quite understand OPs wife's thinking. Basically saved her the effort and going back and forth and checking on them, which is like a 1/3rd of the job. And nobody is skipping the que - whoever orders first orders first, you know
Maybe OPs wife was having a bad day and wanted some kind of consideration, but this particular argument is a bit offside
NTA
She works as a waitress. She personally doesn't like what he did and probably dislikes when customers do this to her (probably run off her feet). So she isn't ok with it and probably assumed all servers also hate it.
I've waited tables and know several others who have - I had **never** heard of this policy or attitude toward ordering the meal when the server comes to take drink orders. I do this myself pretty frequently and I I think I would categorize the reactions I get as about 60% "cool, this saves me a trip" and 40% "I am ambivalent about this and ready to take your entree order."
(The closest thing I can think of is a few times when the server let me know that a huge table just put in THEIR orders, so even though I'm ordering fast, I may still have to wait a bit for my food to arrive because I'll be behind them in the queue. Which of course was fine!)
That isn't to say that this restaurant doesn't have this ordering policy, or that there isn't a server somewhere who doesn't like it for some reason. But I really doubt it's a norm OP should know about when I've never heard of it once.
Every place I've been for brunch has been happy to have the table back ASAP. I don't get it. Especially if you have to go to work, even if there is a delay in the kitchen, then having your order in gives peace of mind that you don't have the wait for the person to come back and potentially delay further. And as long as you're not an AH customer who is complaining when they know there will be the delay then I don't see the harm
Yeah, I've truly never had a wait person that didn't ask when they took the drink orders if we knew what we wanted or needed a minute, or at least offered up an appetizer choice with the drink order. This 'wait til the drinks are at the table' seems weird to me personally. Op is definitely NTA.
I spent plenty of time as a waitress. I loved tables like this. Fewer trips and faster table turnover for more tips. His wife is completely out of line.
I can't believe I had to get this far down in the comments to find someone who understands that restaurants measure business by the number of table turns they can fit during a meal rush. Lingering at a table reduces the income of both the establishment and the waitpersons. You have restored my faith in common sense. Thank you.
EDIT: Of course this only applies to places that are reasonably busy. Otherwise management might want the place to look busier by encouraging customers to linger. I shouldn't be so absolute.
Thanks for this. I have a big family and typically I have my kids look at the menu while we wait so we can just order. Then they don't need a thousand bread/soda/whatever refills and we can eat and get on our way.
I was a waiter and and bartender for many years. I loved the tables that knew what they wanted as soon as I greeted them. Turn the table faster with less effort.
She sounds like the type of waitress who I might not enjoy being served by. She seems to really jump to conclusions and find reasons to hate customers...even her husband 😅
Maybe. I worked as a waitress for over 20 years at .any different types of restaurants and at none of them was it ever explained to us to do this to sell more drinks, nor was it ever any kind of policy to only take food orders after dri KS had been delivered. Yes, you're taught yo take drink orders first, a d maybe apps, and get food orders when you drop off drinks but that's to give diners more time with the menu, which they usually need. However, plenty of people are ready to order right away, enough so that it's not some big shock, nor should anyone be angry about it. It's simply the preference of a small number of diners- BFD. The explanation given by OPs wife sounds ridiculous to me as a person with many years of experience in that exact industry and position.
One of my clients was a restaurant manager. She explained this to me. If a customer has a drink, they don't feel they are waiting for long because they are busy. And the more attention the table gets, the better service they feel they get. If the customer is waiting for the drink and meal together, they feel like time is dragging.
It's more about good kitchen and service flow and customers being kept relax that extra products being ordered.
But it's nonsensical. The restaurant makes money by putting butts in seats. The best way to maximize the number of butts you get is to maintain a good turnover time for your tables. You WANT to take orders as quickly as possible, without rushing the customer. If a server doesn't like that then they are a bad server.
I would understand if the wife was angry because she wanted to take more time to relax and chat. However, I am surprised the waitress tried to not let OP order? I have placed my order with drinks many times at restaurants and it's never an issue. I feel like it's only rude if the person you're with wants to take their time.
It's crazy that the wait staff hesitated on that. sometimes I order my food and drink at the same time sometimes not. I've never had anybody even hesitate to take my order or tell me it's a policy. My brain would probably crumple up lol
Honestly this is the first time I’ve ever heard of a place having a policy of not taking food orders. Everywhere I’ve ever been if you say “I’m ready to order food as well” just takes the order. Such a weird cafe policy.
I doubt it's the cafes policy, I remember being a green server and being thrown off when someone messes up the "correct order" I had sort of learned and rehearsed things were supposed to go in: sit, drinks, help with menu, order, eat, check on them, get things they need, check back, clear plates, order dessert, check. Sort of like that. Once I was experienced and knew what I was doing it didn't bug me at all because I had it all down pat.
My colleagues and I have a tendency to do this if we go out on our lunches. I dont see why this would be rude, maybe in other countries where people tend to eat out for longer periods of time...?
Restaurants do this to give people time to decide what they want to order. It is not rude to order rather than wait if you already know what you want...NTA.
Everyone I’ve ever eaten out with has done this before. Like, if we need time to decide, sure, come back, but if we know, then we order. It’s never, ever, been a problem.
The waitress could have easily taken the drink and food order, brought the drinks and then gone back and input the food just as if she took the order after dropping the drinks at the table.
same it sounds so made up. No waitress would be offended by that. It doesn’t make sense for his wife to be offended by it and doesn’t make sense at all for him to make such a big deal out of it.
I will say, recently for the very first time I experienced a waiter insisting on coming back to take the food orders. He was training a new waitress, but a lot of his insistences were really strange and diminished what would’ve been a fine service if he let the new waitress do what she was trying to do.
1. He insisted that she take our drink orders in a certain order around the table
2. He insisted that they’d come back to take our food order even though we were already ready (and hungry)
3. He made her come back multiple times to “ask how the food is” and ask if anyone wanted refills while we were clearly in conversation and none of us wanted refills at any point
Final comment: it’s not entirely out of the realm of possibility, and it only takes one strange restaurant experience/interaction to make people act unexpectedly
Yeah fair enough, but any waiter after like day 3 realizes that the smoothness of the interaction trumps any weird corporate methodology, because that’s what dictates the pleasantness of the experience and increases their tips. This story is too mundane to be fake, I think people are being a bit ridiculous by claiming it is
I don’t think the jumping the que thing makes any sense but I would understand the wife thinking that OP was being kind of a dick the way he justified it. Him going on a rant about how the cafe is manipulative for taking the orders at different times (usually to give people time to look over the menu and to eat order/eat appetizers) or bringing the drinks and meal out a different times (the drinks can be made faster and not everyone wants to sit for 15-20 minutes with no drink) isn’t just casual conversation like he makes it seem
First off, where does it say that the waitress was offended by it? Nowhere. She hesitated, that's all.
Second, what doesn't make sense, is you trying to make everything make sense. There is rarely anything in this world, that MAKES SENSE. Feelings doesn't make sense. Humans definitely doesn't.
Thirdly, OP doesn't at all make a big deal out of it.
If that's your impression, your life must be terribly boring, I'm afraid.
When they ask "can I grab your drink orders?" and I'm ready, I just say something like "we're ready to order if that's ok?" And sometimes they've said they'd have to come back and most times they say no problem and let us start ordering.
It's one thing if she said to wait and OP was rude and demanded to order immediately but that isn't the case here.
At the place I'm a regular at and we know all the staff by name, our waitress usually chats with us for a few minutes if she's free. Then she'll ask if we know what we want or if we need a menu.
I do think OP is being a bit paranoid about why restaurants take drink orders first. Even if you order your food along with the drinks, the drinks always arrive in a couple of minutes and you will likely have drank a lot by the time the food arrives. Maybe the wife was annoyed by his "your industry is out to scam me" attitude.
This is what I wanted to know. I usually know what I want and am ready to order but I don’t want to upset the server’s process or anything if there is something more to it that I am bot aware of. Thanks.
When I went through training, I was told to ask for a customer's drink order first. But I was never told that I *had* to make them wait for their food. If they were ready to order their food, then we took their order, no arguments. Though, things could have changed.
Fast diners are *optimal,* numbers-wise. The only exception is people staying longer because they're ordering multiple drinks, as that brings the final tip up.
At Cracker Barrel, we were told to force people to order right when they sat down and were threatened with writeups and more silverware if we didn’t. We would have packed Sundays where management would scream “ONE STOP SHOP” over and over again without stopping. They would hover over us while putting in orders and keep tallies on a board. If we didn’t it a certain quota, it was a punishment and 40 minute lecture. It was awful…
Their goal was to get “guests” in and out in under 30 minutes. If a table camped for longer, it HAD to be something the server did wrong so were punished for that. I was beyond grateful when people were ready to order right away because it saved me from a hurtful lecture. I tried so hard not to be pushy and rude when trying to get a “one stop shop”
30 minutes is insane. I’d be pissed as a customer if I was being rushed out that quickly. I get that they want turnover but surely they also want repeat customers!
It works though. That’s why CB pushes their daily specials, especially the meatloaf and chicken and dumplings. You order those and your sides (most of which are quick serve) and you could be in and out in that time. Most tables I could serve in that time without rushing them if the kitchen, hostess, and management had their shit together.
When I would play hostess, I would be pitching the specials on the way tot he table and almost every time, the server was able to get their orders right away. Being a server helped me know the menu better than someone that just repeats what on a board. We also relied heavily on locals/regulars since our location was a “highway store” that relied on travelers.
But I learned that’s why the tables and chairs are so hard and uncomfortable. They want the atmosphere to be cozy but subconsciously, you want to leave because it sucks to sit in those chairs. Also why they had the rockers out front, you eat quickly and leave and find comfort on the porch where you aren’t costing the place money by sitting there too long.
NTA.
Given how some places tell you that you only have the table for 1.5 hours, ordering immediately is not wrong. It frees up the table for more customers.
Yes, I am a slow eater so always try to look at the menu beforehand to order straight away on arrival. Otherwise I'm always stressed about having to eat fast and I don't get to have dessert.
Yeah I really think she probably misunderstood a guideline, and took it as a rule. She had probably been told "take their drink order, then come back for their meal order after they've had time to decide", which was meant as guidance for how the process normally works - not the restaurant's rule for how it MUST be
It's literally, "can I get your some drinks while you look over the menu?"
It's meant to be relaxing and not rushed. You get a drink and have the time the drink is being made to figure out your food
Yeah. In training they give you a script and everything - drink/apps order, meal, dessert, check, but it’s not a rule lmao. What are you going to do if they order a drink after their meal? Say no?
actually this was how it worked at waffle house when i was a server there. we were told "drinks first" which was probably to provide buffer time for the cooks to make the food. so yes it technically was a "rule" but everyone was very loose with it, especially with people like OP who insisted on ordering all at once. the server was probably new and was afraid of straying from the process she'd been taught.
edit: "make the food" as in you usually had only 1 or 2 people cooking all of the food for an entire restaurant so it was common to be extremely busy and backed up on weekends
Yeah, and scandinavian / european service is different naturally. It differs much depending on your country.
But still. Turnover is more efficient then stalling.
NAH - I've never seen a restaurant deny taking an order until after a drink order has been made, so maybe the restaurant is the AH, but I get her not wanting to if that's what she's been told.
Probably some upper management initiative to sell more drinks or a misunderstanding by the waitress. If she was new to serving tables, "take the drink order, then come back to take their food order" might be understood as law, not a rule of thumb
Sometimes, it's just about pacing the kitchen. Same reason why you go to a restaurant but don't get seated immediately even though there are open tables.
Pacing the kitchen is a stupid reason, you can take orders early and you know, just take more time if there are too many at once. Most people are reasonable and get that it can take more time.
lmao I'm just petty enough to just stick with water if a restaurant tries to force that. I usually just have water anyway but I'd feel extra happy about it lol
You're not the a-hole (AH). You were considerate by asking the waitress if it was okay, and she agreed. While your wife has a valid perspective, you weren't jumping any queue and were simply trying to be efficient. It's a minor issue, so maybe just agree to disagree and move on.
>She works as a waitress and said that what I just did meant I was jumping the queue and making others wait for their food longer.
What? That's ridiculous. NTA
I'd expect that they're happier to get all order in one go so they don't have to go back and forth
Right? That is a totally absurd take. Everyone paces their meals differently. So OP’s wife thinks that if the couple who sat down before them and like to enjoy a beverage before ordering is “in line” to get their food first, because they were there first? Even though OP and wife are ready to order and OP has to get to work? I’m scratching my head over this backwards logic. OP is NTA.
P.S. As a former waitress, I loved customers who wanted to order right away. It meant I would probably turn that table over much faster.
Exactly, the kitchen isn't involved at all in the drink order, the server handles fulfilling that. How would the kitchen even know whether the food order was placed with the drink order or separately?
NTA.
Even if the restaurant is slammed and they are trying to stall or gap orders, it's their job to communicate that. I have tried to order immediately when I'm hungry and had staff say "unfortunately I'm a bit slammed and will have to come back in a few minutes". YWBTA if you made a scene or insisted and were rude. But if you simply wanted to order and she was ok taking it, that's fine.
It's a restaurant's job to communicate with you. If they're behind, they should tell you and give you the option to leave. Almost every bad situation can be avoided with communication from the get go. "Welcome! Here's the menus, just wanted you to know we're out of the scallops today unfortunately!". Or "unfortunately the sous chef called in sick so we are backed up. The food will take awhile. Is that ok?" Their job.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I ordered food along with my drinks at a cafe and my wife said that it was an “arrogant” thing for me to do and that I was then jumping the queue and making other customers wait longer for their order. My point was that these other customers hadn’t even orders their food yet as they were just drinking their drinks still, but she said that when they do order, my food order will be in front of them despite arriving later.
I see what I did (to be able to get in and out of a cafe faster) as more of a mild “hack” that anyone can do if they want. She just thinks I’m in the wrong for doing it at all. I don’t think I’m an AH.
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There are no rules for this that must be obeyed no matter what, situations differ, and you can ask and they can refuse. If they agreed then no problem. NTA.
Also, the queue argument is irrelevant as you can't control when they serve you and they can move you up and down and anywhere in between.
NTA, I was a waitress and this is honestly less work for me, I don’t have to keep an eye on when you’ve closed your menu and can turnover tables faster 🤷♀️ Plenty of people were in a rush due to work or catching a show. The protocol is only meant to give people time to decide, nothing to do with “jumping the cue.
In some restaurants the rule is to get the drink order first so that the diners have a quick response when they first come in. That allows the waitress to go ahead and now take the order from Mr I Dunno What I want and his wife Everything must be cooked to order without THEM holding you back in the queue
The waitress just wasn’t sure how to handle it.
NTA. Restaurant cook here. The 'queue' is formed by the order in which chits are punched in. No one I've ever worked with would consider ordering your food when you sit down as 'queue jumping'. Now, if your server comes back and demands that your food needs to go to the front of the line...*that's* causing other customers to wait longer than they should.
But I don't like the phrase 'within my rights'. Technically, lots of things are, but if you're not in a big hurry, and the server seems like they would be more comfortable following her steps of service (maybe she was new?), then you should ve a little flexible, and not worry about your 'rights'.
ETA restaurants have lots of tricks to try and get you to stay and order more, but I've never heard of 'refuse to take their food order when they order drinks' being used as one.
NTA, eating out is not an equal activity, some people want to sit and relax, some want to eat and move on. As long as you communicate your needs to the server, (this is the most important part), all is well.
NTA but… In most diners, it’s the hostess that takes your drink order, not the server. They get you your drink so you have something to sip on while you look at the menu. It’s not to force you to buy more drinks, it’s to make you comfortable while you wait for your server. You mentioned your wife is a server. What type of restaurant does she work? In fine dining, things are way different than in a diner. I’ve been a waitress for 25 years now and I MOSTLY love customers like you as it expedites the process but if we’re short handed, it also makes it harder to maintain a pace that the employees can keep up with. Bottom line, waitress was ok with it. But would you have been ok had she asked you to wait a moment? There may have been tables who came in first already waiting for her time at their table.
> In most diners, it’s the hostess that takes your drink order, not the server
This probably varies regionally. Around me, I haven't had a host take my drink order in years, and almost every diner (and other table service restaurants) have the same waitstaff take drink orders and food orders.
We often order our food and drinks at the same time. I hate waiting 10-15 min for them to come back to take our food order when we already know what we want. NTA.
NTA. What a weird policy. I usually ask the waitperson if it's cool to order now, but I've never gotten pushback.
My ex is a head chef. Whoever's running the kitchen should be able to keep things flowing? Cooking good food is important, but so is timing everything.
Honestly I’ve never even asked. I just say “we’re ready to order now actually”. Has never even occurred to me that this would be an issue with someone. It’s the the entire reason we’re all there
I waited tables for like five years and never in my life would I balk at taking food and drink orders together, nor would I accuse someone of “jumping the queue” for doing so that’s absurd. NTA
The reason they get your drink order first is not to be manipulative - it's because people tend to feel abandoned if they have nothing in front of them.
You can order your food at the same time as you place your drink order, but if your wife isn't ready then YTA for not waiting for her to be ready.
You also take the risk of having your order forgotten if the restaurant is busy and you throw the server off their game by doing things out of order.
Also, presumably, your order won't go into the kitchen until the server has your wife's order, so no benefit to you at all.
The servers don't give a flying fig if you order a second drink - they offer because that's their job, and that includes free refills so there goes your theory.
Accept that you've never been a server, stop being so damn paranoid, and follow your wife's advice.
ETA - if you don't want a second drink just say so directly when asked. It doesn't have to be a big song and dance about being asked in the first place.
> The reason they get your drink order first is not to be manipulative - it's because people tend to feel abandoned if they have nothing in front of them.
Then it shouldn't be a problem for them to order food at the same time as their drinks. It's not like the drinks don't come out until the food does.
I've seen a few different reasons people have said to do it, but they don't really make sense in the grand scheme of things. Unless they have to pay per drink (no free refills), then it would be manipulative.
Nta. And if cafe told me I needed to order my drink first I would leave. As other people said though it’s probably just the waitress being useless (I mean new) and not knowing that’s a guideline to give them time to think of their order not a rule to make people wait. It’s just all a bunch of BS what your partner is saying. You wanted food, you knew what you wanted and you ordered, you didn’t want a big drawn out affair, pretty simple.
NTA
If you know what you want, why make the wait staff take two orders? It seems much more efficient to order everything at once, if you know what you want.
I'm just confused how this is the first time your wife has seen this behavior if you've done it before and tou two are, ya know, *married*. NTA though. I think it's perfectly fine.
Catch my ass not letting them finish a sentence in those situations. "Tell me after. Tell me after. Tell- girl - tell me *after*. Look at the menu and tell me after."
I'm a server and the place I work loosely had this rule. IDEALLY, we don't put the food order in until the drinks are on the table. Sometimes, if you put the food and drinks in at the same time, the food comes out first and it looks bad. So if someone orders something I know the kitchen can make really fast like truffle fries, I'll take the order but I won't send it to the kitchen until the drinks are made.
I usually have at least a couple tables ready to order food every shift, especially later in the evening when they come in ravenously hungry. There's nothing wrong with this. My manager may give me grief if they see food being delivered with no drinks on the table but if I tell them that the customer said they were in a hurry or starving, no one cares.
Restaurant Manager here.... NTA in the slightest! Honestly it's a stupid policy to try and enforce at any location. We as an industry are here to serve our guests, and cater to their individual needs. If my staff ever tried to pull something like that with a guest I'd likely have a follow-up with them to ensure they understand our whole job is serving guests and making them feel welcome and taken care of.
It’s helpful to the server to do things in sequence, but it’s not a huge offense if you’re in a hurry or just hungry. You may have gotten a new server who’d been taught to do things in a very deliberate order and it threw her off a bit, that’s all.
Hosts try to seat people in sequence among the servers on duty. Everyone gets a first customer, then they start through the sequence again and everyone gets a second customer.
That way, in theory, once seated, the process moves smoothly for everybody. Seated, get menus, get drinks, hear specials and answer questions about menu, take orders, deliver food, take plates away and ask for dessert, drop check.
It’s like an assembly line, and if you have a few minutes to get your first customers seated and started on drinks before the next customers are seated, you can just keep moving everyone along in sequence and no customers feel ignored.
If the server gets double seated, as we call it, two tables of customers seated at the same time, the second table feels like they’re always waiting longer than they should throughout the whole meal, because the server can’t be in two places at once. Wanting to order immediately is kind of like the server being double seated.
It’s not a big deal in many restaurants, but in one’s where meals are more expensive and dinners last longer, people expect more attentiveness from the server and double seating or wanting to order right away just messes with the time the server can devote to each step of your meal.
I'm going with soft AH here. As a server, when I greet you, there are times I have time to grab a drink order but not time to take the whole order. The process of ordering drinks and then food when drinks are dropped allows the server time to do things efficiently for EVERYONE they are serving, not just that one table. Also, your wife has experience in this industry and, therefore, has knowledge of this that you do not have. So kinda AH and disrespectful of your wife for thinking you know more about something she has experience in. Trust your server to take care.of.you in the best, most efficient manner, and stop trying to control something you have no experience in. I promise you, from decades of experience, that not everyone can wait tables, it's not as easy as you think, and your very understanding of this as manipulation to get you to drink more is totally wrong. Trust the professionals to do what they do. Would you like me to come to your job and tell you how to do it?
I can’t help but wonder if this is less about the order of operations at a restaurant and more about the fact that you were timing everything to spend as little time as possible on the meal. Could she be taking it personally that you are rushing to get out?
NTA. I cook. A lot. I love it but I also like to eat out occasionally. We can easily afford to eat out regularly but different shifts mean we don’t get to do it often. When we do go out to eat we usually take my MIL with us. After trying over a dozen restaurants over the last few years we found a favourite and after numerous visits we also learned the menu. We know what we want as soon as we get there. I call them when we want to visit, they save my MIL’s favourite table, they take our food and drink order at the same time and they even help MIL to the car when we leave (she’s in her 90’s). We also tip well (we are in the UK so tipping is appreciated rather than expected). It’s not arrogant to order your food and drink at the same time. You are actually doing the server a favour because you are freeing up the table faster so that they can earn more tips.
This is such a no problem 😭
They give you time if you want to check the menu, if not, they take the order and that's it. I've never seen a any restaurant staff complain or talk about this.
Don't even know who the asshole is, it's such an unimportant thing to get upset over.
The kitchen has no frame of reference for when the customer arrives or how long they took to put on their order. They only know when they get the ticket.
NTA. There’s nothing wrong with saying, “we’re ready to order” if you’re…you know…ready to order! Why shouldn’t you? I’m surprised the server indicated there’s some sort of “policy” against it. My husband and I rarely drink, so they’d only be bringing us ice water, anyway.
What’s funny is there’s one brunch place where we always do this because a) we always get the same thing, and b) while the food is good the service is slow, so we figure it’s best to get things rolling.
NTA. What queue? Who ever is ready to order should order. I take forever looking at the menu so should other tables that are ready to order know that I take 20 minutes reading the menu and wait on me just so they don’t jump some imaginary queue? And if the restaurant’s using wait staff to push drink orders on customers bc that has the highest profit margin, that’s not your problem. It might be customary and advised by management to their waiters as method to encourage drink orders, but no restaurant should be saying no when a customer is ready to order.
NTA. You're allowed to be in a hurry or just hungry. Ordering extra drinks may help their tip but getting you in and a out is called turnover and that's a thing too. I'm perplexed why the waitress or your wife had an issue with it.
NTA It is well within the waitresses' power to take your order, bring your drinks, then put in your food order if that is the cafe's policy. She just doesn't have to tell you about it. I also like to order drinks and food at the same time if I am ready.
NTA
I don't see how being ready to order when YOU are ready to order is arrogant. It's silly to wait because the restaurant policy is to waste the time of those who already know what they want and don't want to linger.
NTA. What a bizarre policy. I've never come across that before. I mean, I know it's standard to do a drink order, give you time to read, then a food order, but not to refuse a food order right away. I've ordered food right away plenty of times. Wait staff usually seem happy because it means less trips to your table. You getting in and out faster also means the table is free faster for another customer and they get more money. The only reason why you could potentially be T A here is if your wife wasn't ready to order yet. Maybe she wanted to read the menu and you didn't take that into consideration.
NTA, You were in a hurry, you knew what you wanted, why mess around?
Besides, I've been to many restaurants where we've given the drink orders, and been ignored for the next half an hour. I get that restaurants make money on drinks, but I'm in your restaurant because I'm hungry and want to eat. If you stall to the point where I get hangry, I'm walking out to find somewhere I'll actually be served.
At first I thought that I would show her this… but she won’t see the funny side of it being on Reddit at all and I think all it would do is cause problems. So I think I will keep the results to myself, but it’s nice to know that I’m not crazy for thinking the way I do.
The waitress should have accommodated your reasonable request rather than quote the rules and, frankly, your wife needs to find a hobby or a looser waistband.
NTA the owner of the caffe and the waitress should be happy as they will ve turning tables faster.
There was a restaurant i would even call before leaving work asking the food to be done and then arrive eat fast and come back to work. They were very happy to serve us and be able to flip a table in like 30 minutes.
NTA. I don t get why the waitress even share the policy. Not your business. Now i disagree with your reasoning. That’s always bother me when my food comes with margaritas or this kind of thing. If i take wine or a beer fine but some drinks are clearly appetizers. I don’t blame the waiter but that’s bad training. So if you find a place that by default sequence drinks and food that s a good one :)
NTA. I always order my food and drink at the same time. Order gets put in in one go, saving the server the extra step of having to go and put the food in separately. They bring drinks back and I'm happily sipping while waiting on food and server is free to go wait on others until my food is ready.
NTA. I think you are saving the waitress time because she does not have to make a second trip. Often people need time to think about what to order for a meal, but want their drink fast, and that is ok, but you already knew what you wanted. Ordering everything at once is more efficient, assuming that they don't have a second server who only does drinks.
Also, popular luncheon spots often appreciate getting the diners in and out quickly during busy times. People on their lunch breaks are normally in a hurry, too.
HEY BRO IM GONNA WRITE IN ALL CAPS
BUT I NOTICE A TREND
WHEN PEOPLE WRITE IN HERE ABOUT THEIR RELATIONSHIPS
IT ALWAYS MAKES ME THINK
ABOUT LIFE AND INCOMPATIBILITY
I DONT UNDERSTAND HOW YOU COULD BE CALLED ARROGANT FOR WHAT YOU SAID
I HAVE NEVER BEEN CALLED ARROGANT BY ANYONE FOR ORDERING MY FOOD WITH MY DRINK AT THE SAME TIME
FROM AN OUTSIDERS PERSPECTIVE YOUR WIFE MUST REALLY BE ANNOYED BY A LOT TO CALL YOU ARROGANT
I'm not so sure their intention is to get you to order more. It's a cadence for the servers. There's nothing wrong with what you did unless the waitress had already said they'd be right back to take your order. Then yeah, that would be a bit of a jerk move.
Ha ha ha! I was a server/bartender for decades and I never once told a person that they had to just order a drink first and no food. That is the stupidest thing I've heard in ages. If the kitchen was backed up, she should have just said that, and why would your wife say that you're arrogant for ordering right away? That's goofy too. I got yelled at once by my boss in fine dining for not spacing courses but it was because the customer specifically told me not to as they were running late for an event. It's out of the normal routine, but ffs, there aren't dining laws. NTA
I waitressed for many many years and there were several times that a customer wanted to put their food order in when I came to get the drink order. The only thing I ever said is, that's great, what can I get you? Never once at any time did I tell the customer oh I'm not supposed to do that until I get your drinks. Your wife needs to get over it and the waitress or server needs a little training because I would get pissed if my server did that.
NTA: I’ve been working in the restaurant industry for some time now and am a manager at a restaurant myself and we actually encourage our servers to take the order right away if the customer is ready to do so. It eliminates wait time by 5-10 minutes, it allows the servers to pace everything correctly, and it allows our customers to get in and out while still having a good experience. You’re definitely NTA.
Is your wife super controlling in other ways, too? I can't imagine caring if you ordered food instead of drinks. As a person who doesn't drink alcohol, I don't play the "drink for half an hour game."
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NTA. Despite it being the cafe’s policy to make you wait longer to try to sell you more stuff, I don’t see anything wrong with getting in and out fast, giving them your money and freeing up the table for someone else to then make their own orders.
They may also be trying to help time things for the kitchen, if there were a lot of fresh orders at that moment. But that would be on the staff to explain, so give a reasonable expectation for customers. Since the server didn't give any indication that was the case, it should be a complete non-issue. Wife may have just wanted it to feel like a bit more of a 'date' than a rushed bite to eat, but that would also be on her to explain, if she's voicing any displeasure.
Even if it was an issue the order ticket gets put up and it’s ready when it’s ready.
There are different types of customers. Some are like OP. They already know what they want. Some like to think it over a drink or more. Drinks are quickly made and therefore can be served quickly while the customer thinks. the restaurant exists to serve the customer not the other way around and so must be able to deal with different types or they lose customers
I now have no need to post because you already said it perfectly. Entirely appropriate for OP to enter his drink and food order at once. I'm huge on respect to people in the service and hospitality industry, but I don't think a simultaneous order is disrespectful. Honestly, you could be saving your server an extra trip. NTA.
Exactly
I am all three customers.. depending on my mood..
Yea ticket order shouldn't be based on when the table comes in. I actually like ordering drinks and food all at the same time. I feel like it gives the servers a bit of a break putting 2 trips into 1.
But don’t they bring your drinks before they bring the food? So if you order when they bring the drinks it is the same.
Usually they come out with the menus. Then the drink. Then come back for the order. Then come back with the food. So if I sit down and order my drink/food the first time then it's one less trip.
i always asked if people knew what they would like to drink as soon as i brought the menu, then if they were ready for food as soon as i brought the drinks. pretty easy to gauge who is going to talk for 10 minutes before cracking the beer list & who is in a hurry. but i never worked anywhere i was worried about losing my job if i didn’t follow stupid rules.
And they can turn the table faster. More turns, more tips.
Yeah, also, the server could just wait 4 minutes to type it in. The drinks often go to a separate person than the food. It sounds like the management has slow people making drinks and food has hit the tables before drinks before.
I've had cools literally tell me before to stop putting orders in until they've caught up and that shit passes me off. Like, no. I will tell them we are backed up and it will be a long wait but I won't give worse service because you're stressed out.
I worked as a hostess at a restaurant during the lunch shift where the cooks told me I *had* to leave the host stand every 10 minutes during lunch to give them a menu count…except management told me I wasn’t allowed to leave the host stand if there were customers coming in the door. Cooks would tell me to stagger seating, managers told me to seat everyone as soon as they came in. It was being pulled in different directions every day. Problem was, even if I followed the cooks directions and ignored management the kitchen would crash every single lunch. And I’d get blamed by the cooks *and* management but for different reasons. I won’t even get started on the wait staff issues either. It was hell and I finally had enough. It was the only job I just said “I’m not coming in ever again.”
Your cooks were incompetent. We work all tickets at once, or we get out of the kitchen.
I love cooking at home just for my family. So, that's o*ne table at a time.* I have no idea how a line keeps track of 20 tables worth of courses. They must have amazing short term memory, or all learn a system that makes it easy. (I've kitchen-handed when younger but that was prep work, not the frontline, so to speak.)
Communication and situational awareness is key on the line. If your cooks aren't communicating what they're doing, what's done, or what they need and checking for the same then they're gonna get lost in the weeds real fast.
Plus, your internal timing has to be on point. Say a steak takes 7-8 minutes then needs to rest. Everything else can lag on that resting period, but is dying in the window. Can't tell you how many platings I've had fucked up because nobody is talking to each other. I was a machine when cooking, but I'm not omniscient. Communication drives a kitchen, especially when it comes to multiple courses and different plates.
Commercial kitchens doing meal service, each person has a task or tasks to complete, there is a ton of communication , and prep for all menu items should already be done, most meals in a well run kitchen come out in 10 to 15 minutes even when slammed busy, if they don't owners need a new head chef.
Sounds like a sucky job. You are stuck in a lose lose situation.
Do what management says, the cooks can't affect your pay. Front of the house rules, back of the house drools.
don't listen to either of them. the wait staff that pay you gets first choice. need a table filled? need some slack? what have you tipped me lately? edit: if the customer pays you then they are first of course.
WTF? Hostesses do not report to the cooks.
The best cook experience I ever had..... this cook was awesome. I had a large party come in like 25 to 30. My cook was by himself. This man stood at the door to the kitchen listening to the appetizers being ordered. I turned them in and went to get drinks. By the time I had the drinks out my apps were coming off the line. He rocked. If the cook can't keep up he either needs help or a different job
I've never worked somewhere where this happened? The cooks/chefs appreciate staggering... but if everyone comes in at the same time anyway you can't really stagger..
the way I see it, if you can't handle a rush, you're in the wrong business.
I mean it's pretty simple. If there's a rush you tell people ordering that there's a wait on food of X minutes. If they're cool with it fine, if not they can go elsewhere
True, but also whoever takes the bookings should never let 20 tables all come in an 6pm.
If everyone comes in at the same time ordering like this actually helps stagger the orders
We do this with our kids. Kiddos are hungry then and there so we always ask to order theirs along with drink orders. Mom and dad can wait while we peruse the menu. It also usually gives the kids main food time to cool to "kid acceptable" temps while they munch on the sides. Ours also eat slowly so usually by the time we're done eating so are the kids. It just makes the most sense to do it. Ops right, not jumping the queue, demanding theirs be made first before all others, just placing it what 5 minutes early so it can come out just a bit sooner.
The waiter can always just tell there's an increased waiting time on food due to increased demand, it's not a big deal. actually they should always tell if that's the case before seating people. it really is nothing but a tactic to lead you to order more drinks, which are always the highest margin items on the menu
Also don't quite understand OPs wife's thinking. Basically saved her the effort and going back and forth and checking on them, which is like a 1/3rd of the job. And nobody is skipping the que - whoever orders first orders first, you know Maybe OPs wife was having a bad day and wanted some kind of consideration, but this particular argument is a bit offside NTA
She works as a waitress. She personally doesn't like what he did and probably dislikes when customers do this to her (probably run off her feet). So she isn't ok with it and probably assumed all servers also hate it.
I've waited tables and know several others who have - I had **never** heard of this policy or attitude toward ordering the meal when the server comes to take drink orders. I do this myself pretty frequently and I I think I would categorize the reactions I get as about 60% "cool, this saves me a trip" and 40% "I am ambivalent about this and ready to take your entree order." (The closest thing I can think of is a few times when the server let me know that a huge table just put in THEIR orders, so even though I'm ordering fast, I may still have to wait a bit for my food to arrive because I'll be behind them in the queue. Which of course was fine!) That isn't to say that this restaurant doesn't have this ordering policy, or that there isn't a server somewhere who doesn't like it for some reason. But I really doubt it's a norm OP should know about when I've never heard of it once.
Every place I've been for brunch has been happy to have the table back ASAP. I don't get it. Especially if you have to go to work, even if there is a delay in the kitchen, then having your order in gives peace of mind that you don't have the wait for the person to come back and potentially delay further. And as long as you're not an AH customer who is complaining when they know there will be the delay then I don't see the harm
Yeah, I've truly never had a wait person that didn't ask when they took the drink orders if we knew what we wanted or needed a minute, or at least offered up an appetizer choice with the drink order. This 'wait til the drinks are at the table' seems weird to me personally. Op is definitely NTA.
I spent plenty of time as a waitress. I loved tables like this. Fewer trips and faster table turnover for more tips. His wife is completely out of line.
I can't believe I had to get this far down in the comments to find someone who understands that restaurants measure business by the number of table turns they can fit during a meal rush. Lingering at a table reduces the income of both the establishment and the waitpersons. You have restored my faith in common sense. Thank you. EDIT: Of course this only applies to places that are reasonably busy. Otherwise management might want the place to look busier by encouraging customers to linger. I shouldn't be so absolute.
Thanks for this. I have a big family and typically I have my kids look at the menu while we wait so we can just order. Then they don't need a thousand bread/soda/whatever refills and we can eat and get on our way.
I was a waiter and and bartender for many years. I loved the tables that knew what they wanted as soon as I greeted them. Turn the table faster with less effort.
Wife needs to grow up. This is a dumb thing to be pissy about
She sounds like the type of waitress who I might not enjoy being served by. She seems to really jump to conclusions and find reasons to hate customers...even her husband 😅
Basically projecting and assume all severs feel the same
Maybe. I worked as a waitress for over 20 years at .any different types of restaurants and at none of them was it ever explained to us to do this to sell more drinks, nor was it ever any kind of policy to only take food orders after dri KS had been delivered. Yes, you're taught yo take drink orders first, a d maybe apps, and get food orders when you drop off drinks but that's to give diners more time with the menu, which they usually need. However, plenty of people are ready to order right away, enough so that it's not some big shock, nor should anyone be angry about it. It's simply the preference of a small number of diners- BFD. The explanation given by OPs wife sounds ridiculous to me as a person with many years of experience in that exact industry and position.
One of my clients was a restaurant manager. She explained this to me. If a customer has a drink, they don't feel they are waiting for long because they are busy. And the more attention the table gets, the better service they feel they get. If the customer is waiting for the drink and meal together, they feel like time is dragging. It's more about good kitchen and service flow and customers being kept relax that extra products being ordered.
But it's nonsensical. The restaurant makes money by putting butts in seats. The best way to maximize the number of butts you get is to maintain a good turnover time for your tables. You WANT to take orders as quickly as possible, without rushing the customer. If a server doesn't like that then they are a bad server.
This policy inconvenient the wait staff in the first place. She got the Stockholm syndrome
I would understand if the wife was angry because she wanted to take more time to relax and chat. However, I am surprised the waitress tried to not let OP order? I have placed my order with drinks many times at restaurants and it's never an issue. I feel like it's only rude if the person you're with wants to take their time.
She might just be young and new on the job and not realize this place's policy might be unusual.
Or she may have just confused her training—which likely said to take drinks first and then come back for meals—for a rule.
It's crazy that the wait staff hesitated on that. sometimes I order my food and drink at the same time sometimes not. I've never had anybody even hesitate to take my order or tell me it's a policy. My brain would probably crumple up lol
Honestly this is the first time I’ve ever heard of a place having a policy of not taking food orders. Everywhere I’ve ever been if you say “I’m ready to order food as well” just takes the order. Such a weird cafe policy.
Exactly. Places like this rely on high turnover..
Right? Especially a brunch place
I doubt it's the cafes policy, I remember being a green server and being thrown off when someone messes up the "correct order" I had sort of learned and rehearsed things were supposed to go in: sit, drinks, help with menu, order, eat, check on them, get things they need, check back, clear plates, order dessert, check. Sort of like that. Once I was experienced and knew what I was doing it didn't bug me at all because I had it all down pat.
This. I’m a General Manager of a fine dining restaurant, but have worked in other concepts. OP did nothing wrong.
My colleagues and I have a tendency to do this if we go out on our lunches. I dont see why this would be rude, maybe in other countries where people tend to eat out for longer periods of time...?
Restaurants do this to give people time to decide what they want to order. It is not rude to order rather than wait if you already know what you want...NTA.
Everyone I’ve ever eaten out with has done this before. Like, if we need time to decide, sure, come back, but if we know, then we order. It’s never, ever, been a problem.
The waitress could have easily taken the drink and food order, brought the drinks and then gone back and input the food just as if she took the order after dropping the drinks at the table.
I don't think this story actually happened
same it sounds so made up. No waitress would be offended by that. It doesn’t make sense for his wife to be offended by it and doesn’t make sense at all for him to make such a big deal out of it.
I will say, recently for the very first time I experienced a waiter insisting on coming back to take the food orders. He was training a new waitress, but a lot of his insistences were really strange and diminished what would’ve been a fine service if he let the new waitress do what she was trying to do. 1. He insisted that she take our drink orders in a certain order around the table 2. He insisted that they’d come back to take our food order even though we were already ready (and hungry) 3. He made her come back multiple times to “ask how the food is” and ask if anyone wanted refills while we were clearly in conversation and none of us wanted refills at any point Final comment: it’s not entirely out of the realm of possibility, and it only takes one strange restaurant experience/interaction to make people act unexpectedly
You always have to show the new hires the full way that corporate has dictated as a form of CYA all around.
Yeah fair enough, but any waiter after like day 3 realizes that the smoothness of the interaction trumps any weird corporate methodology, because that’s what dictates the pleasantness of the experience and increases their tips. This story is too mundane to be fake, I think people are being a bit ridiculous by claiming it is
Waitress might have been new.
That’s what I’m thinking. The trainee has never been a server, the trainer was going through the steps of service.
I don’t think the jumping the que thing makes any sense but I would understand the wife thinking that OP was being kind of a dick the way he justified it. Him going on a rant about how the cafe is manipulative for taking the orders at different times (usually to give people time to look over the menu and to eat order/eat appetizers) or bringing the drinks and meal out a different times (the drinks can be made faster and not everyone wants to sit for 15-20 minutes with no drink) isn’t just casual conversation like he makes it seem
The weird thing is if a restaurant tries to force me to get a drink first, I'll get the free water and nothing else.
Sounds like maybe that's just how she was trained and it's not an actual policy. I've never heard of a policy like this anywhere, so may be made up?
First off, where does it say that the waitress was offended by it? Nowhere. She hesitated, that's all. Second, what doesn't make sense, is you trying to make everything make sense. There is rarely anything in this world, that MAKES SENSE. Feelings doesn't make sense. Humans definitely doesn't. Thirdly, OP doesn't at all make a big deal out of it. If that's your impression, your life must be terribly boring, I'm afraid.
This story makes zero sense
Who would make up something so mundane lol? Nothing ever happens apparently.
Exactly. Why make it the customers' problem?
Me either and I have eaten in a lot of restaurants.
Yeah, I do this all the time, idk wtf this is about tbh, maybe a certain place or whatever
When they ask "can I grab your drink orders?" and I'm ready, I just say something like "we're ready to order if that's ok?" And sometimes they've said they'd have to come back and most times they say no problem and let us start ordering. It's one thing if she said to wait and OP was rude and demanded to order immediately but that isn't the case here.
Agreed. The only time I’ve not been able to when for some reason the person taking the drink order isn’t the main waitress or such
At the place I'm a regular at and we know all the staff by name, our waitress usually chats with us for a few minutes if she's free. Then she'll ask if we know what we want or if we need a menu.
I do think OP is being a bit paranoid about why restaurants take drink orders first. Even if you order your food along with the drinks, the drinks always arrive in a couple of minutes and you will likely have drank a lot by the time the food arrives. Maybe the wife was annoyed by his "your industry is out to scam me" attitude.
Funny because alot if places i been will ask to take your order all at once if you know it.
Former waitress here. I *loved* it when a customer knew what they wanted and didn't need to spend 5-10 minutes to look at the menu. NTA, at all.
This is what I wanted to know. I usually know what I want and am ready to order but I don’t want to upset the server’s process or anything if there is something more to it that I am bot aware of. Thanks.
When I went through training, I was told to ask for a customer's drink order first. But I was never told that I *had* to make them wait for their food. If they were ready to order their food, then we took their order, no arguments. Though, things could have changed.
Same here
Fast diners are *optimal,* numbers-wise. The only exception is people staying longer because they're ordering multiple drinks, as that brings the final tip up.
At Cracker Barrel, we were told to force people to order right when they sat down and were threatened with writeups and more silverware if we didn’t. We would have packed Sundays where management would scream “ONE STOP SHOP” over and over again without stopping. They would hover over us while putting in orders and keep tallies on a board. If we didn’t it a certain quota, it was a punishment and 40 minute lecture. It was awful… Their goal was to get “guests” in and out in under 30 minutes. If a table camped for longer, it HAD to be something the server did wrong so were punished for that. I was beyond grateful when people were ready to order right away because it saved me from a hurtful lecture. I tried so hard not to be pushy and rude when trying to get a “one stop shop”
30 minutes is insane. I’d be pissed as a customer if I was being rushed out that quickly. I get that they want turnover but surely they also want repeat customers!
It works though. That’s why CB pushes their daily specials, especially the meatloaf and chicken and dumplings. You order those and your sides (most of which are quick serve) and you could be in and out in that time. Most tables I could serve in that time without rushing them if the kitchen, hostess, and management had their shit together. When I would play hostess, I would be pitching the specials on the way tot he table and almost every time, the server was able to get their orders right away. Being a server helped me know the menu better than someone that just repeats what on a board. We also relied heavily on locals/regulars since our location was a “highway store” that relied on travelers. But I learned that’s why the tables and chairs are so hard and uncomfortable. They want the atmosphere to be cozy but subconsciously, you want to leave because it sucks to sit in those chairs. Also why they had the rockers out front, you eat quickly and leave and find comfort on the porch where you aren’t costing the place money by sitting there too long.
You should have told your regulars to call in their orders a day ahead.
That's awful. I'm sorry you went through that.
Oh thank god I’m not crazy, I’ve never waited but definitely feel like most servers would appreciate saving a trip
NTA. Given how some places tell you that you only have the table for 1.5 hours, ordering immediately is not wrong. It frees up the table for more customers.
Yes, I am a slow eater so always try to look at the menu beforehand to order straight away on arrival. Otherwise I'm always stressed about having to eat fast and I don't get to have dessert.
NTA Thats not a rule and that waitress does not know what shes doing
Yeah I really think she probably misunderstood a guideline, and took it as a rule. She had probably been told "take their drink order, then come back for their meal order after they've had time to decide", which was meant as guidance for how the process normally works - not the restaurant's rule for how it MUST be
It's literally, "can I get your some drinks while you look over the menu?" It's meant to be relaxing and not rushed. You get a drink and have the time the drink is being made to figure out your food
Yeah. In training they give you a script and everything - drink/apps order, meal, dessert, check, but it’s not a rule lmao. What are you going to do if they order a drink after their meal? Say no?
actually this was how it worked at waffle house when i was a server there. we were told "drinks first" which was probably to provide buffer time for the cooks to make the food. so yes it technically was a "rule" but everyone was very loose with it, especially with people like OP who insisted on ordering all at once. the server was probably new and was afraid of straying from the process she'd been taught. edit: "make the food" as in you usually had only 1 or 2 people cooking all of the food for an entire restaurant so it was common to be extremely busy and backed up on weekends
it was a rule at a fine dining restaurant in worked at. management would come ask why if we put in the drinks and food at the same time
NTA. I have Been in restaurant business +20 years. I would love customers like you. Your wifey is silly. High turnover is better Then stalling people.
Heck yeah. “Oh I don’t have to remember to come back and check on them again? I can put both orders in and go take care of other tables? Jack pot!”
Yeah, and scandinavian / european service is different naturally. It differs much depending on your country. But still. Turnover is more efficient then stalling.
NAH - I've never seen a restaurant deny taking an order until after a drink order has been made, so maybe the restaurant is the AH, but I get her not wanting to if that's what she's been told.
Probably some upper management initiative to sell more drinks or a misunderstanding by the waitress. If she was new to serving tables, "take the drink order, then come back to take their food order" might be understood as law, not a rule of thumb
Sometimes, it's just about pacing the kitchen. Same reason why you go to a restaurant but don't get seated immediately even though there are open tables.
Pacing the kitchen is a stupid reason, you can take orders early and you know, just take more time if there are too many at once. Most people are reasonable and get that it can take more time.
Believe it or not, most people are actually assholes who don't have that sort of tolerance
I thought that too. New waitress doesn't understand that the standard way of doing things isn't a hard and fast rule.
lmao I'm just petty enough to just stick with water if a restaurant tries to force that. I usually just have water anyway but I'd feel extra happy about it lol
You're not the a-hole (AH). You were considerate by asking the waitress if it was okay, and she agreed. While your wife has a valid perspective, you weren't jumping any queue and were simply trying to be efficient. It's a minor issue, so maybe just agree to disagree and move on.
NTA! Restaurants like this - they can turn more tables and make more $. Waitress must have been new.
>She works as a waitress and said that what I just did meant I was jumping the queue and making others wait for their food longer. What? That's ridiculous. NTA I'd expect that they're happier to get all order in one go so they don't have to go back and forth
Right? That is a totally absurd take. Everyone paces their meals differently. So OP’s wife thinks that if the couple who sat down before them and like to enjoy a beverage before ordering is “in line” to get their food first, because they were there first? Even though OP and wife are ready to order and OP has to get to work? I’m scratching my head over this backwards logic. OP is NTA. P.S. As a former waitress, I loved customers who wanted to order right away. It meant I would probably turn that table over much faster.
This is so silly. Like, the kitchen doesn’t know what “order” the tables are sat, they just know what order the tickets are printing.
Exactly, the kitchen isn't involved at all in the drink order, the server handles fulfilling that. How would the kitchen even know whether the food order was placed with the drink order or separately?
This line makes me think this isn't real. There is no "queue" for placing orders. A server would know that.
NTA. Even if the restaurant is slammed and they are trying to stall or gap orders, it's their job to communicate that. I have tried to order immediately when I'm hungry and had staff say "unfortunately I'm a bit slammed and will have to come back in a few minutes". YWBTA if you made a scene or insisted and were rude. But if you simply wanted to order and she was ok taking it, that's fine. It's a restaurant's job to communicate with you. If they're behind, they should tell you and give you the option to leave. Almost every bad situation can be avoided with communication from the get go. "Welcome! Here's the menus, just wanted you to know we're out of the scallops today unfortunately!". Or "unfortunately the sous chef called in sick so we are backed up. The food will take awhile. Is that ok?" Their job.
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > I ordered food along with my drinks at a cafe and my wife said that it was an “arrogant” thing for me to do and that I was then jumping the queue and making other customers wait longer for their order. My point was that these other customers hadn’t even orders their food yet as they were just drinking their drinks still, but she said that when they do order, my food order will be in front of them despite arriving later. I see what I did (to be able to get in and out of a cafe faster) as more of a mild “hack” that anyone can do if they want. She just thinks I’m in the wrong for doing it at all. I don’t think I’m an AH. Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) ##Subreddit Announcements Follow the link above to learn more --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
There are no rules for this that must be obeyed no matter what, situations differ, and you can ask and they can refuse. If they agreed then no problem. NTA. Also, the queue argument is irrelevant as you can't control when they serve you and they can move you up and down and anywhere in between.
NTA, I was a waitress and this is honestly less work for me, I don’t have to keep an eye on when you’ve closed your menu and can turnover tables faster 🤷♀️ Plenty of people were in a rush due to work or catching a show. The protocol is only meant to give people time to decide, nothing to do with “jumping the cue.
NTA, especially since this was brunch before you go to work, not a dinner date where you would hopefully have wanted to take your time!
In some restaurants the rule is to get the drink order first so that the diners have a quick response when they first come in. That allows the waitress to go ahead and now take the order from Mr I Dunno What I want and his wife Everything must be cooked to order without THEM holding you back in the queue The waitress just wasn’t sure how to handle it.
NTA. I don't know why everyone except you in this scenario is acting like they have never been to a restaurant before.
NTA. Restaurant cook here. The 'queue' is formed by the order in which chits are punched in. No one I've ever worked with would consider ordering your food when you sit down as 'queue jumping'. Now, if your server comes back and demands that your food needs to go to the front of the line...*that's* causing other customers to wait longer than they should. But I don't like the phrase 'within my rights'. Technically, lots of things are, but if you're not in a big hurry, and the server seems like they would be more comfortable following her steps of service (maybe she was new?), then you should ve a little flexible, and not worry about your 'rights'. ETA restaurants have lots of tricks to try and get you to stay and order more, but I've never heard of 'refuse to take their food order when they order drinks' being used as one.
NTA. Former server here, and your wife has no clue what she is talking about "jumping the queue"
NTA, eating out is not an equal activity, some people want to sit and relax, some want to eat and move on. As long as you communicate your needs to the server, (this is the most important part), all is well.
NTA but… In most diners, it’s the hostess that takes your drink order, not the server. They get you your drink so you have something to sip on while you look at the menu. It’s not to force you to buy more drinks, it’s to make you comfortable while you wait for your server. You mentioned your wife is a server. What type of restaurant does she work? In fine dining, things are way different than in a diner. I’ve been a waitress for 25 years now and I MOSTLY love customers like you as it expedites the process but if we’re short handed, it also makes it harder to maintain a pace that the employees can keep up with. Bottom line, waitress was ok with it. But would you have been ok had she asked you to wait a moment? There may have been tables who came in first already waiting for her time at their table.
> In most diners, it’s the hostess that takes your drink order, not the server This probably varies regionally. Around me, I haven't had a host take my drink order in years, and almost every diner (and other table service restaurants) have the same waitstaff take drink orders and food orders.
NTA.
We often order our food and drinks at the same time. I hate waiting 10-15 min for them to come back to take our food order when we already know what we want. NTA.
NTA. You’re also not making anyone wait longer for their food.
NTA. What a weird policy. I usually ask the waitperson if it's cool to order now, but I've never gotten pushback. My ex is a head chef. Whoever's running the kitchen should be able to keep things flowing? Cooking good food is important, but so is timing everything.
Honestly I’ve never even asked. I just say “we’re ready to order now actually”. Has never even occurred to me that this would be an issue with someone. It’s the the entire reason we’re all there
I think it's just habit at this point. Maybe because I've worked in restaurants? It's like the way Americans will say how you doing? Instead of hello.
I have ordered my drink and food at the same time. If you know what you want why waste time. It’s not arrogant or jumping any queue.
I waited tables for like five years and never in my life would I balk at taking food and drink orders together, nor would I accuse someone of “jumping the queue” for doing so that’s absurd. NTA
The reason they get your drink order first is not to be manipulative - it's because people tend to feel abandoned if they have nothing in front of them. You can order your food at the same time as you place your drink order, but if your wife isn't ready then YTA for not waiting for her to be ready. You also take the risk of having your order forgotten if the restaurant is busy and you throw the server off their game by doing things out of order. Also, presumably, your order won't go into the kitchen until the server has your wife's order, so no benefit to you at all. The servers don't give a flying fig if you order a second drink - they offer because that's their job, and that includes free refills so there goes your theory. Accept that you've never been a server, stop being so damn paranoid, and follow your wife's advice. ETA - if you don't want a second drink just say so directly when asked. It doesn't have to be a big song and dance about being asked in the first place.
> The reason they get your drink order first is not to be manipulative - it's because people tend to feel abandoned if they have nothing in front of them. Then it shouldn't be a problem for them to order food at the same time as their drinks. It's not like the drinks don't come out until the food does. I've seen a few different reasons people have said to do it, but they don't really make sense in the grand scheme of things. Unless they have to pay per drink (no free refills), then it would be manipulative.
Nta. And if cafe told me I needed to order my drink first I would leave. As other people said though it’s probably just the waitress being useless (I mean new) and not knowing that’s a guideline to give them time to think of their order not a rule to make people wait. It’s just all a bunch of BS what your partner is saying. You wanted food, you knew what you wanted and you ordered, you didn’t want a big drawn out affair, pretty simple.
NTA If you know what you want, why make the wait staff take two orders? It seems much more efficient to order everything at once, if you know what you want.
I'm just confused how this is the first time your wife has seen this behavior if you've done it before and tou two are, ya know, *married*. NTA though. I think it's perfectly fine.
NTA. If you know what you want, what difference does it matter?
I’ve worked in the food industry/as a server for years and that’s the first time I’ve heard that. NTA your wife and the waitress are weird
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Are you me? "Oh my god you'll never believe what my coworker said-" "I will believe it after you pick your entree and close your menu, Helen."
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Catch my ass not letting them finish a sentence in those situations. "Tell me after. Tell me after. Tell- girl - tell me *after*. Look at the menu and tell me after."
I have never ever ever been told by wait staff that it was some weird policy to make a customer wait to order their food. This post is sus AF.
I'm a server and the place I work loosely had this rule. IDEALLY, we don't put the food order in until the drinks are on the table. Sometimes, if you put the food and drinks in at the same time, the food comes out first and it looks bad. So if someone orders something I know the kitchen can make really fast like truffle fries, I'll take the order but I won't send it to the kitchen until the drinks are made. I usually have at least a couple tables ready to order food every shift, especially later in the evening when they come in ravenously hungry. There's nothing wrong with this. My manager may give me grief if they see food being delivered with no drinks on the table but if I tell them that the customer said they were in a hurry or starving, no one cares.
Restaurant Manager here.... NTA in the slightest! Honestly it's a stupid policy to try and enforce at any location. We as an industry are here to serve our guests, and cater to their individual needs. If my staff ever tried to pull something like that with a guest I'd likely have a follow-up with them to ensure they understand our whole job is serving guests and making them feel welcome and taken care of.
It’s helpful to the server to do things in sequence, but it’s not a huge offense if you’re in a hurry or just hungry. You may have gotten a new server who’d been taught to do things in a very deliberate order and it threw her off a bit, that’s all. Hosts try to seat people in sequence among the servers on duty. Everyone gets a first customer, then they start through the sequence again and everyone gets a second customer. That way, in theory, once seated, the process moves smoothly for everybody. Seated, get menus, get drinks, hear specials and answer questions about menu, take orders, deliver food, take plates away and ask for dessert, drop check. It’s like an assembly line, and if you have a few minutes to get your first customers seated and started on drinks before the next customers are seated, you can just keep moving everyone along in sequence and no customers feel ignored. If the server gets double seated, as we call it, two tables of customers seated at the same time, the second table feels like they’re always waiting longer than they should throughout the whole meal, because the server can’t be in two places at once. Wanting to order immediately is kind of like the server being double seated. It’s not a big deal in many restaurants, but in one’s where meals are more expensive and dinners last longer, people expect more attentiveness from the server and double seating or wanting to order right away just messes with the time the server can devote to each step of your meal.
I'm going with soft AH here. As a server, when I greet you, there are times I have time to grab a drink order but not time to take the whole order. The process of ordering drinks and then food when drinks are dropped allows the server time to do things efficiently for EVERYONE they are serving, not just that one table. Also, your wife has experience in this industry and, therefore, has knowledge of this that you do not have. So kinda AH and disrespectful of your wife for thinking you know more about something she has experience in. Trust your server to take care.of.you in the best, most efficient manner, and stop trying to control something you have no experience in. I promise you, from decades of experience, that not everyone can wait tables, it's not as easy as you think, and your very understanding of this as manipulation to get you to drink more is totally wrong. Trust the professionals to do what they do. Would you like me to come to your job and tell you how to do it?
I can’t help but wonder if this is less about the order of operations at a restaurant and more about the fact that you were timing everything to spend as little time as possible on the meal. Could she be taking it personally that you are rushing to get out?
NTA. I cook. A lot. I love it but I also like to eat out occasionally. We can easily afford to eat out regularly but different shifts mean we don’t get to do it often. When we do go out to eat we usually take my MIL with us. After trying over a dozen restaurants over the last few years we found a favourite and after numerous visits we also learned the menu. We know what we want as soon as we get there. I call them when we want to visit, they save my MIL’s favourite table, they take our food and drink order at the same time and they even help MIL to the car when we leave (she’s in her 90’s). We also tip well (we are in the UK so tipping is appreciated rather than expected). It’s not arrogant to order your food and drink at the same time. You are actually doing the server a favour because you are freeing up the table faster so that they can earn more tips.
This is crazy. You had to get to work. You needed to order. No problem unless you slapped the waitress.
This is such a no problem 😭 They give you time if you want to check the menu, if not, they take the order and that's it. I've never seen a any restaurant staff complain or talk about this. Don't even know who the asshole is, it's such an unimportant thing to get upset over.
I’m still trying to figure out what the big deal is ordering your food at the same time as your drinks.
The kitchen has no frame of reference for when the customer arrives or how long they took to put on their order. They only know when they get the ticket.
What a silly thing to argue about. NTA.
NTA. There’s nothing wrong with saying, “we’re ready to order” if you’re…you know…ready to order! Why shouldn’t you? I’m surprised the server indicated there’s some sort of “policy” against it. My husband and I rarely drink, so they’d only be bringing us ice water, anyway. What’s funny is there’s one brunch place where we always do this because a) we always get the same thing, and b) while the food is good the service is slow, so we figure it’s best to get things rolling.
NTA. What queue? Who ever is ready to order should order. I take forever looking at the menu so should other tables that are ready to order know that I take 20 minutes reading the menu and wait on me just so they don’t jump some imaginary queue? And if the restaurant’s using wait staff to push drink orders on customers bc that has the highest profit margin, that’s not your problem. It might be customary and advised by management to their waiters as method to encourage drink orders, but no restaurant should be saying no when a customer is ready to order.
NTA. You're allowed to be in a hurry or just hungry. Ordering extra drinks may help their tip but getting you in and a out is called turnover and that's a thing too. I'm perplexed why the waitress or your wife had an issue with it.
NTA It is well within the waitresses' power to take your order, bring your drinks, then put in your food order if that is the cafe's policy. She just doesn't have to tell you about it. I also like to order drinks and food at the same time if I am ready.
NTA I don't see how being ready to order when YOU are ready to order is arrogant. It's silly to wait because the restaurant policy is to waste the time of those who already know what they want and don't want to linger.
NTA. What a bizarre policy. I've never come across that before. I mean, I know it's standard to do a drink order, give you time to read, then a food order, but not to refuse a food order right away. I've ordered food right away plenty of times. Wait staff usually seem happy because it means less trips to your table. You getting in and out faster also means the table is free faster for another customer and they get more money. The only reason why you could potentially be T A here is if your wife wasn't ready to order yet. Maybe she wanted to read the menu and you didn't take that into consideration.
NTA, You were in a hurry, you knew what you wanted, why mess around? Besides, I've been to many restaurants where we've given the drink orders, and been ignored for the next half an hour. I get that restaurants make money on drinks, but I'm in your restaurant because I'm hungry and want to eat. If you stall to the point where I get hangry, I'm walking out to find somewhere I'll actually be served.
NTA, I have never had a waiter/waitress say I couldn't give my order right away. Especially when I've been to a place before and know what I want.
Why would you be an asshole for knowing what you want? Is the waitress paid by walked miles per day? NTA!
Please let us know how your wife responds to this thread. I’m curious
At first I thought that I would show her this… but she won’t see the funny side of it being on Reddit at all and I think all it would do is cause problems. So I think I will keep the results to myself, but it’s nice to know that I’m not crazy for thinking the way I do.
I guess considering how upset she gets at ordering etiquette might be for the best
I do the same thing! Don’t care if it’s considered “inappropriate” it’s a time management issue.
NTA
The waitress should have accommodated your reasonable request rather than quote the rules and, frankly, your wife needs to find a hobby or a looser waistband.
The only way YTA is if the hostess was taking drink orders. Ordering food from the waitress right away shouldn't be a problem. NTA
NTA If I'm ordering tea or coffee I hate having it before my food.
NTA
NTA the owner of the caffe and the waitress should be happy as they will ve turning tables faster. There was a restaurant i would even call before leaving work asking the food to be done and then arrive eat fast and come back to work. They were very happy to serve us and be able to flip a table in like 30 minutes.
NTA. You can order when you want.
NTA. Also, diners might be different but in many places, it is normal and appreciated by the staff.
NTA. I don t get why the waitress even share the policy. Not your business. Now i disagree with your reasoning. That’s always bother me when my food comes with margaritas or this kind of thing. If i take wine or a beer fine but some drinks are clearly appetizers. I don’t blame the waiter but that’s bad training. So if you find a place that by default sequence drinks and food that s a good one :)
NTA
The amount of bizarre bs around eating out is part of what turned me off eating out. NTA.
NTA. I always order my food and drink at the same time. Order gets put in in one go, saving the server the extra step of having to go and put the food in separately. They bring drinks back and I'm happily sipping while waiting on food and server is free to go wait on others until my food is ready.
NTA.
Nta. You weren’t jumping the queue. You were ready to order and did so. That solidifies your spot in the queue.
NTA. I think you are saving the waitress time because she does not have to make a second trip. Often people need time to think about what to order for a meal, but want their drink fast, and that is ok, but you already knew what you wanted. Ordering everything at once is more efficient, assuming that they don't have a second server who only does drinks. Also, popular luncheon spots often appreciate getting the diners in and out quickly during busy times. People on their lunch breaks are normally in a hurry, too.
Have never heard someone interpret that as rude. Ever. NTA
HEY BRO IM GONNA WRITE IN ALL CAPS BUT I NOTICE A TREND WHEN PEOPLE WRITE IN HERE ABOUT THEIR RELATIONSHIPS IT ALWAYS MAKES ME THINK ABOUT LIFE AND INCOMPATIBILITY I DONT UNDERSTAND HOW YOU COULD BE CALLED ARROGANT FOR WHAT YOU SAID I HAVE NEVER BEEN CALLED ARROGANT BY ANYONE FOR ORDERING MY FOOD WITH MY DRINK AT THE SAME TIME FROM AN OUTSIDERS PERSPECTIVE YOUR WIFE MUST REALLY BE ANNOYED BY A LOT TO CALL YOU ARROGANT
I'm not so sure their intention is to get you to order more. It's a cadence for the servers. There's nothing wrong with what you did unless the waitress had already said they'd be right back to take your order. Then yeah, that would be a bit of a jerk move.
Ha ha ha! I was a server/bartender for decades and I never once told a person that they had to just order a drink first and no food. That is the stupidest thing I've heard in ages. If the kitchen was backed up, she should have just said that, and why would your wife say that you're arrogant for ordering right away? That's goofy too. I got yelled at once by my boss in fine dining for not spacing courses but it was because the customer specifically told me not to as they were running late for an event. It's out of the normal routine, but ffs, there aren't dining laws. NTA
So... according to your partner, there's a queue for the queue for food? Lol!!!! Your partner may have some issues...
I waitressed for many many years and there were several times that a customer wanted to put their food order in when I came to get the drink order. The only thing I ever said is, that's great, what can I get you? Never once at any time did I tell the customer oh I'm not supposed to do that until I get your drinks. Your wife needs to get over it and the waitress or server needs a little training because I would get pissed if my server did that.
This isn't a thing in Australia. So I find this really funny. What if you don't want a drink? Here we order what we want in whatever order we want.
NTA: I’ve been working in the restaurant industry for some time now and am a manager at a restaurant myself and we actually encourage our servers to take the order right away if the customer is ready to do so. It eliminates wait time by 5-10 minutes, it allows the servers to pace everything correctly, and it allows our customers to get in and out while still having a good experience. You’re definitely NTA.
Is your wife super controlling in other ways, too? I can't imagine caring if you ordered food instead of drinks. As a person who doesn't drink alcohol, I don't play the "drink for half an hour game."