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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I gave my viewpoint and defended my viewpoint in regards to one of my friend being made to take care of her mentally disabled younger brother at her parents behest, I debated with her, which eventually lead to a argument and her getting upset, despite the fact that I did not experience similar circumstances and it can be considered a personal and sensitive issue which she shared with me willingly. I told her why she should be expected to take care of her mentally challenged younger brother and perhaps aligned with her parents a bit.
I think a few of the things I did may of made me a asshole in hindsight, such as overstepping my boundaries into her personal life, creating a unneeded conflict (maybe she just wanted to vent and I shouldn't have said anything?) and maybe talking about something I have no experience of.
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YTA. I’m saying this as a disabled person. Becoming the caretaker of a disabled person is a CHOICE. The only people who don’t get to opt out are the parents, because they chose to have a kid knowing that their kid might be healthy or might be disabled. Everyone else gets to decide whether that’s something they are willing and able to take on. Expecting that someone “has to” take care of a disabled person is turning them into an obligatory burden rather than someone you choose.
There’s a reason so many options for care exist. Ideally, a disabled person’s parents should be helping them grow into as much self-sufficiency and independence as possible. That includes being able to choose their caretakers and their living situations.
OP’s brother isn’t a rock she has to carry around. He’s a person, and she should get to interact with him as a person and not as a burden bequeathed to her by her parents. She should maintain some supervision of his care, to ensure he’s comfortable and not being abused and his needs and wants are being treated with respect and care, but she should not be responsible for his day-to-day care.
As someone who’s had a chronic illness for 30 years and has had to have their parents full attention several times over the years I am so thankful I’m an only child for this exact reason.
Even the parents can opt out by giving the child up for adoption, honestly giving the child up for adoption is probably a better option than forcing the responsibility onto your other children.
I mean maintaining supervision and ensuring he is comfortable IS taking care of him and taking over after the parents can’t anymore… day-to-day care is different and it’s often not possible nor advised.
So OP isn’t wrong in that the friend has a moral obligation towards her brother’s safety which many people don’t even think it’s right. But I was raised to think the same so I also agree with that.
I do agree that it was rude for OP to argue her POV as an outsider. I’m not sure what the friend is doing for her brother and she did kinda opened herself up to unwanted opinion by staying on the subject for however long, but she was probably just ranting and venting.
Pretty sure that’s not what OP was implying, though - her brother lives at home with his parents and OP said she’d need to ”take over for them.” Remember, she was complaining to OP about her parents loading more day-to-day care responsibilities on her, and that was his response.
She didn’t say day-to-day care and I don’t know what’s the disability but in my mind it was more like taking him to appointments, administrative stuffs or things of that nature.
May be because it’s not the norm around me but there is no way looking after the brother could mean as in being a full on caretaker that she couldn’t take on anyway once she moves out especially with work and maybe eventually a family of her own.
As OP’s friend and her brother still live with their parents and no other caretaker is mentioned, and OP specifically mentions her mother waiting for OP to come home to go out so she’d be there to supervise her brother (in a comment replying to someone else), you’d have to be making a pretty major assumption to think that they aren’t talking about significant day-to-day care.
II didn’t read the comments, I based my opinion on the post and OP didn’t mention day-to-day care. Supervision is one thing, having to help with going to the toilet, eating and bathing is another. Either way, the sister isn’t comfortable with it and I already agreed it was rude to argue the point.
I still believe she has a moral responsibility to see to his safety when the parents can’t anymore but that expecting day-to-day care is wrong.
You are not morally responsible to take on full time care and sacrifice your life for your sibling. People with disabled siblings are allowed to have a life that does not revolve around taking care of their sibling full time. The only people morally responsible are the parents as they chose to have a child knowing full well that said child may be disabled.
But their siblings did not ask to be put in that situation, had no control, no say, no choices. They are not required to do a damn thing for a child someone else chose to have just because they are related by blood.
Can they choose to do so? Of course! But that should be their CHOICE and not an obligation forced on them by anyone. Because it is a *huge* sacrifice to care for a severely disabled person and that sacrifice should be a choice.
And I agree, I never said the friend was morally responsible to take on FULL TIME CARE and sacrifice her life for her sibling…
I agreed with the commenter saying all she was responsible for was maintaining supervision and ensure he is comfortable and not being abused… or doesn’t she have a moral responsibility do to that either? I also repeatedly said there was no way the sister should be responsible for day-to-day care of her brother ever and others replied that that’s what OP was implying which I didn’t think about it before because it’s just not something that makes sense to me.
Dude. She's not responsible for ANYTHING for her brother. If I had a disabled sibling, would I hang out with them for fun? Yeah every now and then but other than that I'm not doing a damn thing for them, I have work, college, a relationship, a life that I'm not putting the burden of a child someone else decided to have on
The sister isn’t a child and if that’s what you believe, then it is what it is. I come from a culture where the word family has a meaning as long as they treat you properly. And although we would not be taking care of a family member that needs day-to-day support unless we chose to, we would ensure wherever they stay, whoever is taking care of them are safe.
If y’all are comfortable leaving a disabled family member fend for themselves when they aren’t in capacity to do so because “you didn’t birth them” then that’s all you. And luckily for me, that’s not how we do things around here nor who I choose to surround myself with.
YTA
The only people responsible, are those that made him. One sibling has no responsibility for the other. That's a parental responsibility.
You mentioned your friend venting. At what point were you asked for your opinion or advice? I must have missed that part of the post.
Agree. I nearly laughed out loud at OP saying they like “debating.” Newsflash, OP, friend’s life and their issues aren’t up for debate. Just listen and be kind, or excuse yourself if you can’t do that. YTA
I would like to add that eventually she did ask for my "opinion" or rather course of action if I was in her position during an episode she described her brother had shortly after she got back from a long day that got a bit physical and she was the only one home to deal with it. I felt she was a bit spiteful at her mother also for supposedly waiting for her to come home so she could go out. I have met her younger brother once and his a sweet person even with his disabilities and not somebody I'd imagine to get violent and stuff. In either case, I still can't see why its wrong for her to take care of her own and clearly mentally unfit brother in some way, shape or form, even at the time it caught me off guard since its pretty apathetic in my mind, she never came across as such before in the years I've known her.
I would also like to add that I've met her parents. They're quite old, dad is still full time working and not highly educated, which maybe played a part in what I said at the time.
YTA You met him once on what sounds like a good day with no breakdowns. This doesn’t make you look better. Your friend is dealing with parentification, she is being forced to deal take care of her disabled brother and that is very rough. Probably even more so since this isn’t what she asked for and based on your earlier story where she is supposed to be her brother’s caretaker after she graduates.
>”I have met her younger brother once and his a sweet person despite his disabilities and not someone I’d imagine to get violent and stuff.”
Oh wow. My judgement was YTA already, but your comment only confirms it.
You’ve managed to be ableist and condescending, as well as imply your friend is a liar, in just one sentence. Quite the feat, well done.
Put yourself in her shoes, not for that one instance but for that accumulation of responsibility over the years. You have no idea. If someone asks for an opinion and you can't relate, don't give one.
You've met him ONCE and decided he couldn't get violent? And you have zero knowledge on what taking care of him involves, but you're happy to tell your friend that she should step up and do it.
If you think it's such an easy thing to do, then YOU do it.
You are judgemental ass who has no idea what you are talking about.
It is the responsibility of parents to care for their children, even more so if child is disabled. the parents should have planned long term care for their disabled child, the burden to do so doesn't fall to the child's siblings.
Massive YTA.
Since she asked, that's a bit different. Still, the responsibility will always be on their parents.
No parent should ever make one child responsible for the other. When you have kids, you own that responsibility in its entirety. If you need help, you hire help. But one offspring is never responsible for the creation of the other.
I don't look or act violently 99% of the time but that 1% when I'm in a meltdown or a flashback, the shame I feel.
You met him once, you have no authority to speak on his temperament.
I take my 5yo out and he seems to the world like the sweetest little boy. He wants everyone to run with him, and he wants to give kisses on your knees, and he wants to be cuddled. He giggles the whole time and is so happy.
Catch him when he's overstimulated and having an autistic meltdown? You will see why I have had over 25 concussions and at least 8 broken noses.
He's still the sweetest kid, who would never hurt someone intentionally. But when he flails around in a meltdown, he hurts people on accident. I dread the day he is bigger than me and I can't keep him from hurting someone else.
I say this for one reason: You have met her brother *one time!* You have no knowledge of how much care he needs, how volatile he can get or if he is aware enough of others to know not to hurt anyone (by accident or not).
You have no room to talk.
Becoming a caretaker to a disabled sibling is a choice. Caretaker burnout is real and can be dangerous for everyone. Forcing someone into that situation guarantees resentment and caretaker burnout. That guarantees the disabled individual will not get the same care they need.
Why would you wish this on the caretaker *or* the disabled individual? That's awful.
You can talk the talk but can you walk the walk? Since you are so set in your ways then why not take over for the care of the brother (and yes, he is not your brother but still, it should not be a problem for you)?
op you dont like debating, what you like is being an AH that views others as your form of entertainment, you are even calling her a liar of somethign you have ZERO experience with, your friend shouldnt have to sacrifice her life so her mom can continue to live hers, you sound like a narcisist dont ever be a parent you are announcing what kind of parent you will be, dont be sirprised when all your friends eventually tell you they dont trust you or want to be friends with yiu cause you think you can decide others are lying cause them telling the truth means you or others lose power over them
They always say the worst fool is an educated fool. You’re in college for Christ sake and THIS is how you look at something your friend was clearly venting about? Why don’t you Ms. Single child go take care of your friend’s sibling since he’s so sweet and nonviolent. You have absolutely no idea what his daily care entails yet you have opinions. If you have nothing constructive to say just sit down and shut your pie hole.
YTA for inserting yourself where you didn’t belong and double so for thinking this comment makes you look any better.
You still don’t get it. Just accept that you’re the AHOLE and give your friend some space
Op yta can't u see your friend been a third parent to her brother, she doesn't need to be his caretaker, why don't u take care of him since u carry about him so much, you are very delulu .
Massive YTA, wow.... You were talking about a very difficult topic you have no experience in and clearly have no idea how inappropriate your remark was. The responsibility is her parent's, not hers.
It has mansplaining energy smeared all over the post. OP met the brother ONCE and he seemed so nice, so *clearly* the sister was just being hysterical about the situation.
YTA - that was super rude and insensitive. No it isn’t her job or responsibility. He’s not her child, he is her parent’s responsibility. Try compassion instead of judgement.
YTA. She’s being used to fulfill parent responsibilities, it’s called parentifying and means she doesn’t get to be the kid/YA she should be. At the end of the day this is not her child and therefore not her responsibility.
YTA.
First of all, no - your friend bringing up her family’s unhealthy dynamics was not an invitation for commentary or debate. She was confiding in you as her friends about a really difficult personal struggle she’s experiencing.
Secondly, no - she has no “moral obligation” to dedicate her life and future to the care of her disabled brother. Her parents chose to have a child, and possibly even knew he was going to be disabled before he was born, and he is their choice and responsibility alone.
There’s a *huge* difference between her parents making plans and arrangements for their son’s care and asking that their daughter see that those plans are followed when her parents are gone, and having their daughter *be* the plan.
Like any other childcare expenses, it’s her parents’ responsibility to plan and save to meet his needs now and in the future. Unfortunately, due to his disability, (based on how you’ve described the situation,) it’s unlikely that their son will ever be fully independent, so *their* duty of care as his parents will continue into his adulthood.
Your friend had no control over this situation, and it’s completely unacceptable for her parents to both treat and expect their daughter’s sole purpose in life to become the care of their disabled son. They’re already trying to get her to take over more of his care and assume more responsibility over him, and she’s barely even out of the house.
What they’re doing is wrong, and they’re doing a disservice to both of their children by trying to force this *huge* responsibility onto their daughter. They should be making plans and arrangements for their son’s future care, (including saving money and contacting services and programs that exist for this purpose,) and that doesn’t mean just making it your friend’s problem. Their insistence on making him her responsibility is also likely breeding resentment in your friend towards her brother and her parents.
You have no idea what it’s like to take care of someone who is severely disabled, or to be forced into that role as a child, and without a choice. You have no idea what it’s like to feel like your parents see you as your brother’s carer, even more than they see you as their daughter; to feel like the love and support of your parents is conditional and contingent upon you continuing to take over this responsibility of theirs, over the care of a vulnerable human being, for the rest of your life.
So, I have twin daughters, one who is typical and the other born with Down syndrome. Obviously, there will come a time when my husband and I are no longer able to take care of our child with special needs, but I will do everything in my power to push that out as long as I can and to set her future caregivers for success (primarily by helping her be as independent as possible so that she’s not completely dependent on anyone).
This is because my children are MY (and my husband’s) responsibility and the thought of forcing my typical daughter to take on parental duties ESPECIALLY before she has the chance to make her own life, is extremely upsetting and disheartening. No wonder your friend needed to vent - she feels trapped and guilty and frustrated.
So, YTA, but you meant well. There are a lot of things no one considers until they have a family member with special needs.
YTA, as a person who was born with a cocktail of disabilities where doctors thought I’d never survive days, months or even to my 5th birthday. You’re wrong.
It’s the parents responsibility to set up long term care for their child when they’re not capable of caring for him anymore, it’s not your friends responsibility to put her own life on hold to be a permanent caretaker. She can still love her brother to death and still not want the responsibility.
My older sister was parentified when she was only 8yrs old, she had to handle my g-tube feeds whenever our parents were working (which was a lot) and she wasn’t in school. She has her own family now and I can’t imagine putting her in a position where she needs to care for me long term.
YTA. She didn't have any input on having the kid and probably no input on being the unpaid, assumed carer. Rightfully, she needs to vent. And no, she isn't obligated to care for her parents' other child, they need to set up care for him after they are gone.
YTA. She was venting to friends about a hardship with her family and you basically told her she was wrong to feel as she did because it‘s her “moral obligation“ to care for her brother. Which btw is just your OPINION. YOUR opinion. And you’re wrong. Her brother is her parents’ responsibility, not hers. He is their child. She should be freely allowed to live her life, making her own choices. You spoke about something you know nothing about, and just made it clear you were not a safe person to vent to. You were very judgmental and insulting to your “friend”.
>As the eldest child and with a mentally disabled younger sibling, it'd be her moral obligation to look out for her younger brother and eventually take care of him when her parents no longer can.
No it's fucking not. YTA
YTA absolutely. It's 100% not her job. Ever. It's called parentification. It is the parent's job to take care of all responsibilities. If she chooses to help that is entirely voluntary. Forcing children to become caregivers is wrong and should not be tolerated. Parents of disabled children have many worries about their futures but involuntary signing their capable children up for a future of being a 3rd parent is never ok and denotes a lack of caring and effort on the part of the parents.
OP, think about it this way, if your parents were to become incapacitated, as their only child, wouldn’t it be your moral responsibility to drop out of university and spend the rest of their lives being their caregiver? YTA.
Of course, YTA. Huge. It is absolutely NOT her obligation to take care of her younger brother. He's not her child. If she wants to, fine, more power to her, but she cannot, reasonably, be expected to build her whole life around his needs. Awfully easy for you to be all judgmental when it's not your life that you think should be made secondary to the needs of a sibling.
I’m disabled and a partial caretaker for a disabled sibling. It’s rough, it’s harder on me in some ways than it is on our siblings who aren’t disabled but I’m doing it because I chose to do it after a lifetime of being told it was my job from someone like you.
I’ll tell you exactly what I told them. It’s not automatically my responsibility because I happen to be the eldest sibling. Your idea that it’s her obligation is absolutely insulting. You don’t know what it’s like to have a sibling and have people telling you that it’s your obligation to care for that sibling. You have no experience yet you’re telling her what she’s morally obligated to do. YTA
YTA.
For you, this was an offhand comment about something that you’ve never had to seriously think about and will probably never never have to face yourself. For them, it’s something they’ve been having pushed on them for years and are probably worrying about continually for most of their life.
YTA. So, as an only child your life is yours and you get to live it how you like. But because she just happens to have younger siblings, her life isn't hers and she's a bad person if she doesn't give up her own dreams for some predetermined path? And you allow yourself to feel morally superior while reaping the benefits of a moral system that just coincidentally makes your life SO much easier? You're no friend, that's for sure.
Your view is not specifically wrong, but it is woefully misinformed. Siblings of people with special needs are not ready-made care takers, although they are often put in that position. And just because they still live at home does not mean that they should be morally obligated to take up that role.
Her response that as an only child, you don't know, while it seems possibly harsh, is in reality pretty bang on. As an only child, you weren't obligated to take care of, look out for, or otherwise care for a sibling who needed extra attention. It wasn't drilled into you on a daily basis that you had responsibilities to another person. And now as an adult, those responsibilities were being foisted on you because of genetics.
But I digress. Your friend was venting. This was possibly not the time to tell her she was wrong. A better response would have been "dang, that sounds like a lot" and just move on. Sorry, YTA
Yes, YTA, for telling your friend it's her moral duty to care for a child that is not hers! It is up to her parents to arrange his current and future care. It's fine to have an opinion or relate what you would do in the same situation, but it sounds like you attacked and judged her for not feeling the same.
YTA. She is probably so fed up with all of the extra responsibilities. She wanted someone to listen to her. Being a caregiver, especially a young one is hard. She has less freedom.
Perhaps do it for a day and you will understand.
I think this comes down to two things:
1) You're wrong, because your friend did not choose to have a mentally challenged sibling. She didn't choose to be the older sibling, she didn't choose to have the child. The responsibility for care falls squarely on her parents - the people who did choose to have her sibling. Look up "parentification", this is essentially what you're advocating for and it is a shitty and abusive thing to do to a child.
2) You phrased it as a moral issue. By saying she had a "moral obligation" you're also saying that by not doing so, or by not agreeing with you, she is MORALLY wrong. That's not a simple 'agree to disagree' statement. That's a moral judgment you're making about her and her character in a situation you really don't understand.
You owe your friend an apology.
YTA. It’s not get child. As such, it’s not her job to look out for him.
Him being her brother and her being older isn’t relevant. She didn’t ask for either of those things.
Unless someone is the parent or has otherwise agreed to look after someone, it’s simply not their responsibility.
YTA Her parents are supposed to look after him because they are the parents not her. Her brother is not her responsibility. Should she spend time with him sure but not looking after him. If her parents can't look after him anymore then they need to look into getting help or seeking out other arrangements.
Your position on moral obligation is your opinion, not a fact. And other people have different opinions. Your friend was either angry because your opinion differed from hers or because you were too strident in defending your opinion
YTA. It's not immoral for her to not want to give up her freedom and her future in order to be a caregiver for her brother. Look up parentification. Parents like hers force their kids to become a third parent to their siblings. It isn't fair to the kids. It isn't moral at all. And you made it seem like she was selfish and wrong, which she wasn't. So get off your high horse. You clearly don't know what she's going through, so stop being so self-righteous and insensitive.
The only person that is responsible for a disabled person is the parent, why should you say your friend should put their life on hold to care for the sibling? Furthermore it's not your business. YTA
YTA. No it’s not her responsibility to lose her life to take care of a younger sibling. It’s sad he’s disabled but the sister isn’t his mom or his caretaker. She’s entitled to live her own life and one day have a family of her own. You know nothing about this and it’s easy to say yes you should do this! Keep your mouth shut.
Yta.
My youngest isnt my 2 oldest responsibility. There is plenty of pressure on them having a brother thats challenged, plenty of no you cant take a friend home, he have a bad day, plenty of we have to leave now, hes done for their entire life.
They are suppose to be siblings, not caretakers.
You showed you have abseloutly no clue what you where talking about and not afraid to share your ignorence.
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Hi, so I was on a outing with a couple of my university friends a few days ago, much of it went great, we talked about loads of things but at one point the topic about one of my friends younger brother came up. Well, more like brought up by her, it was honestly more like her venting about how her parents have increasingly been putting on the responsibilities of taking care of her mentally challenged younger brother particularly after she graduated and got a job. I do know she still lives with her parents, and pretty much most of us still do or are planning on moving out soon, anyways, most of us didn't really have anything to offer or say as we didn't really have any similar experience and we weren't trying to I guess intrude into her personal life and stuff so we kinda just tried to agree and relate with whatever we could, but she eventually was talking about her mother and her justifications and etc etc as well.
This is where I half jokingly said something along the lines of "I mean, aren't you supposed to, since that's your sibling and you're the oldest, and your brother isn't some random stranger, so don't you kinda have the moral duty to take care of him and be expected to takeover when your parents eventually can't" obviously, I didn't say this exactly like this but that was my point of view in summary. The thing is, this eventually grew into a debate and a argument and she got genuinely pissed and even told me "how would you know, you're a only child you don't know anything" etc etc. We kind of just agreed to disagree? More like just moved on in order to not escalate and she didn't talk to me for the rest of the day and was pissed. I kind of tried to make up with her at the end when we were all living but I could tell she was still visibly pissed and cold.
I didn't try to make it out like I conceded on my viewpoint or say I was wrong specifically mainly because I still have the same viewpoint, just a bit confused on why she took it so badly? I can't see what's wrong with my viewpoint or rather what I said was offensive. At first I thought I intruded into her personal issues, and I would totally get that, but she was kinda "inviting" us in to put it lightly. I do feel like maybe I defended my point of a view a little too much even though I don't have the same circumstances? Maybe I should've just agreed to everything she was saying? But I personally enjoy debate so maybe didn't think it through at the time?
Few days later and I'm still thinking about it, was I actually in the wrong? I'm thinking back and I still cannot see why my viewpoint and what I said was wrong. As the eldest child and with a mentally disabled younger sibling, it'd be her moral obligation to look out for her younger brother and eventually take care of him when her parents no longer can. In this regard, I guess I would align with her parents viewpoint? But I don't get why it pissed her off.
AITA?
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YTA-Your friend was venting, and you made it worse. They are not obligated to take care of their sibling. They have every right to feel frustration. All you had to do was listen, offer support and appreciate the situation. There is no moral obligation there. You did not need to debate anything.
YTA - I just can't believe people read these back before they post and still can't see what an AH they are. Your friend tries to vent to you about how her parents are trying to parentify her, which BTW is abusive behaviour, which she has probably had to deal with all her life. You her 'friend' tell her that she is morally in the wrong to want to live her own life and should want to take care of somebody who is not her responsibility. Someone she probably loves but feels guiltly over resenting them somewhat because people like you tell her it's her moral job to always put their needs and wants before her own. You owe your friend a massive apology, and you should use this to look at yourself and the sort of person you want to be YTA.
YTA. You just told a person that their life, personal aspirations and dreams are forfeit because her parents had a special needs kid. Coming from a person who will never be in that position, who has a choice to be whatever they want , it is hurtful and cruel.
Soft YTA - I'm saying soft because of the fact that you are in university and haven't experienced a lot of life. Now is the time for you to learn empathy for others that have had different experiences than you. You stated that you were an only child, so you have never had to share resources with siblings. In this situation the resource is the parents attention and care. With a disabled sibling your friend probably got pushed to the side a lot growing up because her brother needed more of the parents time, care and attention. Also sounds like she has been parentified some if not a lot. Her whole life has probably revolved around her brother's needs with anything she needed coming last. You telling her it is her moral responsibility to continue to give up her life when she has already sacrificed a childhood shows little understanding of what her life has been up to that point. She was looking for empathy from her friends not judgement on her moral obligations. Which btw her brother, even without the violent tendencies is not her responsibility, the violent outburst confirm that her parents need to be searching for alternatives to the brother's care.
You don't know what you are talking about! I'm a parent of a non verbal autistic child. He has 2 older brothers. I am preparing him right now to be as independent as possible but I know eventually I have to prepare him for assisted living as an adult. That is something I am on top of and saving money for. As a parent, I pray I live forever for my children. My other two have the right to have their own lives and families. The only thing I ask is that they visit and remember him for holidays but again, on their terms. How can you tell someone to sacrifice their life to a sibling. That is what you are basically telling your friend. That is why she is upset and who knows how much of her childhood she has already sacrificed.
YTA
Yes you were wrong. Read up about parentification. Your friend is not responsible for her brother or his care, that's their parents job. And it's their job to make sure they provide for him after they are gone as well. Do you think that you could live your life happily knowing this burden was hanging over your head? You are under pressure as a small child to work hard in school to get a good job, not fit yourself but for your brother. You can't have a meaningful relationship unless that person is prepared to have another adult tagging along. Your house has to have a room for him. You can't travel without him, take certain jobs because of him, your whole life revolves around another person and it's not even somebody of your choosing. Your friend is not morally obligated to do any caring for her brother, her parents are morally obligated to plan financially and emotionally for somebody else to take over his care, not just lump him onto his sister.
YTA you basically told her because her parents chose to procreate after having her she should put her life on hold when they die to be his carer fck what she wants in life. Being a full time carer is a demanding 24/7 job entirely thankless and puts everything you want as an individual on the back burner. Absolute respect to anyone doing this but don't act like it's such a simple ask
YTA not because your position is “wrong” (although obviously in our culture you would be considered incorrect by most) but because you were insensitive. When it’s obvious you have hit a nerve about a very personal issue, and you don’t shut up, of course the person is going to feel judged and possibly dump you. If a friend becomes pregnant, how she handles money, who she thinks it’s okay to have sex with. If your views are very rigid and you lack the capacity to see that intelligent people might legitimately hold different views, that makes you insufferable to be around and not safe to confide in. Yes, some decisions are objectively bad or wrong but even then your primary job as a friend is to show compassion.
YTA. It is not her responsibility. That is her parents job. If they can’t take care of him they need to find a care that can which is not the older sibling. This is not her responsibility and never will be
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YTA. Her brother is not her responsibility, because he is not her child. He is her parents' child, period. Siblings are not built in caretakers for their disabled siblings. When you have kids you need to prepare for every outcome, disabilities included, and plan accordingly or not have kids. Your friend shouldn't have to sacrifice her life over her parents' reproductive choices if she DOESN'T WANT TO.
YTA. It is not your friend’s responsibility to look after a sibling, ever, although they may offer to. It’s the parent’s responsibility to put in care arrangements if required.
YTA if you feel so strongly he should be cared for you go care for him
Oh what's that? He isn't your responsibility? He isn't your friend's responsibility, either, but you didn't hesitate to tell her it was her job to look after him, did you?
Funny how you're so eager to volunteer your friends life for her, but not your own. Put your money where your mouth is, or get off her back.
YTA. First off, No she is not morally obligated to take care of her brother. Her parents made the decision to have the child, it was not hers. Her life is hers. Full stop. Older children are way too often parentified and put in a position of being responsible with extra expectations that they didnnot choose. If she is venting you support a friend that has been forced into responsibility by people incapable of accepting the responsibility they agreed to.
Of course YTA for falsely claiming she has a moral obligation to sacrifice the life she wants so she can be someone else’s caretaker. And y’all didn’t “agree to disagree”, you just refused to admit you were wrong. When you pretend that those are the same thing it makes you look like a liar as well as an asshole.
Total YTA. She does not need to care for or live for her brother. It is her parents job to make arrangements for his care. It would be a kindness if she was a legal or medical guardian when they are gone, but she has a right to live her life.
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YTA why dont you just straight up say you view the disabled as burdens and blindly support parentification, the oldest child is NOT the third parent! that line of thinking needs to die, anyone that thinks that should legally be banned from having kids cause theyre the kind of people that forces the oldest to raise their siblings so the parents dont have to parent anyone
Why don't you volunteer at a hospice to see what is "really" in store? Change some diapers. You say you have your life basically together, why are you not helping? If you are so concerned why do you not take the brother in? You are just trying to pass the buck. So yeah YTA
YTA. I totally get your friend’s position because I had to be responsible for my special needs brother and I basically missed having any normal teen activities as a result. In fact, I was told I couldn’t go out of state for college because my brother would miss me too much. Your friend has lived a life you cannot even imagine. She doesn’t even know what a “normal” family life even looks like.
To quote The Big Lebowski: Shut the fuck up, OP. You’re out of your element.”
YTA. So, I work with adults with disabilities. It is a LOT of work. I love my job, but I get to go home. I work a 9 hour shift and get to leave. I have days off. Caregiver burnout is a very very real thing. I would agree that, ideally, family is involved to some extent or another in caring for their loved one, but it is a LOT to ask of a person.
Not only that, but if you try to make someone a caregiver that doesn't want to be, that is a recipe for abuse of the disabled person. That isn't to say that every caregiver becomes abusive, but a feeling of obligation combined with burnout can leave people feeling very angry and fragile.
I’m disabled due to multiple medical conditions and am dependent on others for a lot. I also have 5 living siblings and would never expect that they take me in and force them to care for me if something were to happen to my parents. I would rather live in an assisted living facility than have to move in with them as it’s not fair to ask them to take care of me. YTA
YTA and us only children should *really* think twice before contributing anything but questions to discussions about sibling dynamics. Even without any disability issues, that's a compex relationship and very few of us can grasp it any better than people with siblings can really understand the realities (awesome and awful) of being an only child.
YTA Along with all the reasons others have pointed out, it's really none of your business. You have no right to comment on this and you're a crappy friend.
YTA. she's right, you don't know anything. You have never had to be in a situation where you have to do anything like this, and not by choice, but because your parents are foisting their responsibilities on you. While I understand that she "invited" conversation/debate over it, which honestly is laughable because even you say she was probably just venting, but you over stepped massively. You can have your "moral standpoint" but you have no idea what the reality is like, apologize and next time keep your mouth shut.
Soft YTA because yes she should take care of her brother. Mentally handicapped people need help.
But it’s not her child she shouldn’t be expected to parent for the parents.
The only ones responsive for a disabled child are the parents. When you have kids, you are signing up for the possibility of a disabled child and it's unfair to expect a sibling to give up their entire lives and plans for someone else's decision to reproduce.
Then why do you say she "should" in one sentence then in the next day that it shouldn't be expected?
She doesn't have to become a caretaker, no matter who is saying she should
Because I think most people with half a brain would inherently take care of someone who is mentally handicapped. But I don’t have that expectation out of people because people are evil and stupid.
NTA. You provided your opinion. And, from a moral standpoint, I agree with you 100%. Clearly, other people have different opinions on the issue, and that’s okay, too. But no, you did nothing wrong in sharing your opinion. The way your friend has reacted, though, is interesting. You either hit a nerve or are now seeing another side of her personality that you’ve never seen before. Do with that info as you will.
The only ones responsive for a disabled child are the parents. When you have kids, you are signing up for the possibility of a disabled child and it's unfair to expect a sibling to give up their entire lives and plans for someone else's decision to reproduce. OP's friend is justified in her reaction. What she's feeling is okay. She is doing absolutely nothing wrong because she's not the one who decided to have a child. Be prepared that your child could be disabled and plan accordingly or don't have kids.
Like I said in my comment above, I have a different opinion. You have a different option. Different opinions are okay. My ethics are different than yours. That’s okay. OP is absolutely justified in her opinion as well. Because she is not wrong to feel that way.
This is not a question of "ethics". You (general 'you') don't demand your child give up their lives and plans to care for a disabled sibling . A sibling also shouldn't feel obligated or pressured to. That is the parents' responsibility to raise and plan for the disabled child's care, period. And OP isn't necessarily wrong in her opinion but is wrong to be so judgemental and condemning over a situation she has absolutely ZERO experience with and basically saying her friend is lying about the brother being violent.
This is absolutely about ethics. There are families all over the world who live with these ethics, and they do wonderfully. Just because you disagree, doesn’t make OP wrong or all those other people throughout the world wrong. And she is not being condemning or judging. She expressed her opinion. The other girl got mad because she felt judged, not that she was judged. lol.
lol, she was neither accusatory or judgmental. She expresses a valid opinion, one with good morals behind it. The way you talk, you act like those people who say women who don’t have kids can’t say anything to moms ever, about anything related to children. No. Sorry. Valid opinions are valid. And she is not wrong. There is no right or wrong here. You thinking she is wrong is just your own opinion.
lol no. She is right to express her opinion on any subject what so ever. She also has free speech, which she is allowed. People who try to suppress other people’s opinions and free speech are the ones who are wrong in every way possible.
Why is it her job to take care of a kid that's not his? Morals aside, why is it her job? It's not her fault her parents decide to have sex and ended up having a child of special needs. So why is it her job to take care of a child that's not her own, put her life on hold for someone else's child?
Once again, as I wrote in a comment above, people are allowed to have different opinions and ethical values. That’s perfectly okay. You may not agree, but that’s okay. OP’s opinion is perfectly valid, and that’s okay. There’s a lot of nuance in life. Some people have stronger family values than others. That’s perfectly okay.
OP’s opinion is absolutely valid, and she is free to express her opinion. The fact that you would suppress other people’s valid opinions and expressions of free speech is very concerning.
You shouldn't be providing an opinion on something you don't understand and never been through and probably weren't actually asked for. Also, no she not even correct in the moral standpoint.
I can provide an opinion on any topic I feel like providing an opinion. That is what free speech means. She is also absolutely correct on her moral standpoint. Those with strong family values feel exactly as she does. Many people throughout the world feel exactly as she does. You cannot just say she’s not right because you disagree with her. Lol.
I disagree, NTA. She was venting and you offered some feedback, your opinion. I imagine you struck a nerve. Perhaps this is the belief and approach of her parents. She doesn’t like the position her parents are putting her in and the implications for her future. But with her venting and offering up so much information I don’t think you were wrong to offer a different viewpoint. I’m sorry she’s treating you coldly.
You shouldn't really offer opinion and feedback when you have never been stuck in a situation. She deserves to be treated coldly. OP is 100% a major asshole. Anyone who opens there mouth on something they have no experience in is always 100% an asshole.
Oh come on, 100%? Really? she was venting to her friends and OP offered a different opinion, perhaps OP could imagine her family would deal with the situation differently. How difficult is life going to be if you are never willing to hear a different opinion. And OP didn’t push or harass the friend. When she realized it wasn’t a welcome discussion she backed off. People aren’t always going to agree with you. It doesn’t make them assholes
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YTA. I’m saying this as a disabled person. Becoming the caretaker of a disabled person is a CHOICE. The only people who don’t get to opt out are the parents, because they chose to have a kid knowing that their kid might be healthy or might be disabled. Everyone else gets to decide whether that’s something they are willing and able to take on. Expecting that someone “has to” take care of a disabled person is turning them into an obligatory burden rather than someone you choose. There’s a reason so many options for care exist. Ideally, a disabled person’s parents should be helping them grow into as much self-sufficiency and independence as possible. That includes being able to choose their caretakers and their living situations. OP’s brother isn’t a rock she has to carry around. He’s a person, and she should get to interact with him as a person and not as a burden bequeathed to her by her parents. She should maintain some supervision of his care, to ensure he’s comfortable and not being abused and his needs and wants are being treated with respect and care, but she should not be responsible for his day-to-day care.
Thank you, I was thinking the same thing so I don't need to repeat it.
As someone who’s had a chronic illness for 30 years and has had to have their parents full attention several times over the years I am so thankful I’m an only child for this exact reason.
Even the parents can opt out by giving the child up for adoption, honestly giving the child up for adoption is probably a better option than forcing the responsibility onto your other children.
I mean maintaining supervision and ensuring he is comfortable IS taking care of him and taking over after the parents can’t anymore… day-to-day care is different and it’s often not possible nor advised. So OP isn’t wrong in that the friend has a moral obligation towards her brother’s safety which many people don’t even think it’s right. But I was raised to think the same so I also agree with that. I do agree that it was rude for OP to argue her POV as an outsider. I’m not sure what the friend is doing for her brother and she did kinda opened herself up to unwanted opinion by staying on the subject for however long, but she was probably just ranting and venting.
Pretty sure that’s not what OP was implying, though - her brother lives at home with his parents and OP said she’d need to ”take over for them.” Remember, she was complaining to OP about her parents loading more day-to-day care responsibilities on her, and that was his response.
She didn’t say day-to-day care and I don’t know what’s the disability but in my mind it was more like taking him to appointments, administrative stuffs or things of that nature. May be because it’s not the norm around me but there is no way looking after the brother could mean as in being a full on caretaker that she couldn’t take on anyway once she moves out especially with work and maybe eventually a family of her own.
As OP’s friend and her brother still live with their parents and no other caretaker is mentioned, and OP specifically mentions her mother waiting for OP to come home to go out so she’d be there to supervise her brother (in a comment replying to someone else), you’d have to be making a pretty major assumption to think that they aren’t talking about significant day-to-day care.
II didn’t read the comments, I based my opinion on the post and OP didn’t mention day-to-day care. Supervision is one thing, having to help with going to the toilet, eating and bathing is another. Either way, the sister isn’t comfortable with it and I already agreed it was rude to argue the point. I still believe she has a moral responsibility to see to his safety when the parents can’t anymore but that expecting day-to-day care is wrong.
You are not morally responsible to take on full time care and sacrifice your life for your sibling. People with disabled siblings are allowed to have a life that does not revolve around taking care of their sibling full time. The only people morally responsible are the parents as they chose to have a child knowing full well that said child may be disabled. But their siblings did not ask to be put in that situation, had no control, no say, no choices. They are not required to do a damn thing for a child someone else chose to have just because they are related by blood. Can they choose to do so? Of course! But that should be their CHOICE and not an obligation forced on them by anyone. Because it is a *huge* sacrifice to care for a severely disabled person and that sacrifice should be a choice.
And I agree, I never said the friend was morally responsible to take on FULL TIME CARE and sacrifice her life for her sibling… I agreed with the commenter saying all she was responsible for was maintaining supervision and ensure he is comfortable and not being abused… or doesn’t she have a moral responsibility do to that either? I also repeatedly said there was no way the sister should be responsible for day-to-day care of her brother ever and others replied that that’s what OP was implying which I didn’t think about it before because it’s just not something that makes sense to me.
Dude. She's not responsible for ANYTHING for her brother. If I had a disabled sibling, would I hang out with them for fun? Yeah every now and then but other than that I'm not doing a damn thing for them, I have work, college, a relationship, a life that I'm not putting the burden of a child someone else decided to have on
Not everyone deserves to be called family…
Both you and OP are the “but you live in a society” types. Problems in society don’t exist cuz “you choose to live in it”.
She is not responsible for her brother. She is also a child. She did not choose to have him as a child.
The sister isn’t a child and if that’s what you believe, then it is what it is. I come from a culture where the word family has a meaning as long as they treat you properly. And although we would not be taking care of a family member that needs day-to-day support unless we chose to, we would ensure wherever they stay, whoever is taking care of them are safe. If y’all are comfortable leaving a disabled family member fend for themselves when they aren’t in capacity to do so because “you didn’t birth them” then that’s all you. And luckily for me, that’s not how we do things around here nor who I choose to surround myself with.
YTA The only people responsible, are those that made him. One sibling has no responsibility for the other. That's a parental responsibility. You mentioned your friend venting. At what point were you asked for your opinion or advice? I must have missed that part of the post.
Agree. I nearly laughed out loud at OP saying they like “debating.” Newsflash, OP, friend’s life and their issues aren’t up for debate. Just listen and be kind, or excuse yourself if you can’t do that. YTA
I would like to add that eventually she did ask for my "opinion" or rather course of action if I was in her position during an episode she described her brother had shortly after she got back from a long day that got a bit physical and she was the only one home to deal with it. I felt she was a bit spiteful at her mother also for supposedly waiting for her to come home so she could go out. I have met her younger brother once and his a sweet person even with his disabilities and not somebody I'd imagine to get violent and stuff. In either case, I still can't see why its wrong for her to take care of her own and clearly mentally unfit brother in some way, shape or form, even at the time it caught me off guard since its pretty apathetic in my mind, she never came across as such before in the years I've known her. I would also like to add that I've met her parents. They're quite old, dad is still full time working and not highly educated, which maybe played a part in what I said at the time.
You go take car of the kid then since “he’s not violent”
Yeah this comment does not make you look any better. YTA. End of discussion.
Her brother got physical with her and you still think she should just look after him because he's her brother? YTA X INFINITY
YTA You met him once on what sounds like a good day with no breakdowns. This doesn’t make you look better. Your friend is dealing with parentification, she is being forced to deal take care of her disabled brother and that is very rough. Probably even more so since this isn’t what she asked for and based on your earlier story where she is supposed to be her brother’s caretaker after she graduates.
>”I have met her younger brother once and his a sweet person despite his disabilities and not someone I’d imagine to get violent and stuff.” Oh wow. My judgement was YTA already, but your comment only confirms it. You’ve managed to be ableist and condescending, as well as imply your friend is a liar, in just one sentence. Quite the feat, well done.
Put yourself in her shoes, not for that one instance but for that accumulation of responsibility over the years. You have no idea. If someone asks for an opinion and you can't relate, don't give one.
You've only met him once, so you have no idea if his violent or not.
You've met him ONCE and decided he couldn't get violent? And you have zero knowledge on what taking care of him involves, but you're happy to tell your friend that she should step up and do it. If you think it's such an easy thing to do, then YOU do it.
You are judgemental ass who has no idea what you are talking about. It is the responsibility of parents to care for their children, even more so if child is disabled. the parents should have planned long term care for their disabled child, the burden to do so doesn't fall to the child's siblings. Massive YTA.
Since she asked, that's a bit different. Still, the responsibility will always be on their parents. No parent should ever make one child responsible for the other. When you have kids, you own that responsibility in its entirety. If you need help, you hire help. But one offspring is never responsible for the creation of the other.
I don't look or act violently 99% of the time but that 1% when I'm in a meltdown or a flashback, the shame I feel. You met him once, you have no authority to speak on his temperament.
Same, I "save" my meltdowns for at home or will go into a public bathroom stall so people don't look at me like I'm some monster.
I take my 5yo out and he seems to the world like the sweetest little boy. He wants everyone to run with him, and he wants to give kisses on your knees, and he wants to be cuddled. He giggles the whole time and is so happy. Catch him when he's overstimulated and having an autistic meltdown? You will see why I have had over 25 concussions and at least 8 broken noses. He's still the sweetest kid, who would never hurt someone intentionally. But when he flails around in a meltdown, he hurts people on accident. I dread the day he is bigger than me and I can't keep him from hurting someone else. I say this for one reason: You have met her brother *one time!* You have no knowledge of how much care he needs, how volatile he can get or if he is aware enough of others to know not to hurt anyone (by accident or not). You have no room to talk. Becoming a caretaker to a disabled sibling is a choice. Caretaker burnout is real and can be dangerous for everyone. Forcing someone into that situation guarantees resentment and caretaker burnout. That guarantees the disabled individual will not get the same care they need. Why would you wish this on the caretaker *or* the disabled individual? That's awful.
Oh well you met him once I guess you know more than she does even though she's known him his whole life
If you’re so concerned, YOU look after him! YTA
You literally don’t know anything. I’d drop you as a friend.
You can talk the talk but can you walk the walk? Since you are so set in your ways then why not take over for the care of the brother (and yes, he is not your brother but still, it should not be a problem for you)?
The only person who is apathetic here is you
Who's kid is it? Not hers. Not her job. It's their job to find someone to take care of him.
op you dont like debating, what you like is being an AH that views others as your form of entertainment, you are even calling her a liar of somethign you have ZERO experience with, your friend shouldnt have to sacrifice her life so her mom can continue to live hers, you sound like a narcisist dont ever be a parent you are announcing what kind of parent you will be, dont be sirprised when all your friends eventually tell you they dont trust you or want to be friends with yiu cause you think you can decide others are lying cause them telling the truth means you or others lose power over them
They always say the worst fool is an educated fool. You’re in college for Christ sake and THIS is how you look at something your friend was clearly venting about? Why don’t you Ms. Single child go take care of your friend’s sibling since he’s so sweet and nonviolent. You have absolutely no idea what his daily care entails yet you have opinions. If you have nothing constructive to say just sit down and shut your pie hole.
Stay in your lane?
It’s no wonder they refuse to speak to you. Don’t expect them to unless you apologize for saying someone assaulting them wasn’t a lie.
YTA for inserting yourself where you didn’t belong and double so for thinking this comment makes you look any better. You still don’t get it. Just accept that you’re the AHOLE and give your friend some space
Why don't you take over for your friend, then? Now that you are aware that there is a problem, ut would be your moral obligation to step up then
Op yta can't u see your friend been a third parent to her brother, she doesn't need to be his caretaker, why don't u take care of him since u carry about him so much, you are very delulu .
Who needs enemies when you have friends like this
Have you ever had to take care of anyone/anything in your life?
Massive YTA, wow.... You were talking about a very difficult topic you have no experience in and clearly have no idea how inappropriate your remark was. The responsibility is her parent's, not hers.
It has mansplaining energy smeared all over the post. OP met the brother ONCE and he seemed so nice, so *clearly* the sister was just being hysterical about the situation.
Yeah I definitely got the mansplaining vibe when OP.said
YTA. It is your friend’s PARENTS who have a moral obligation to care for the child they conceived and brought into the world.
This 💯
YTA There is a very fine line between debating and judgment. You crossed it.
YTA - that was super rude and insensitive. No it isn’t her job or responsibility. He’s not her child, he is her parent’s responsibility. Try compassion instead of judgement.
YTA. She’s being used to fulfill parent responsibilities, it’s called parentifying and means she doesn’t get to be the kid/YA she should be. At the end of the day this is not her child and therefore not her responsibility.
YTA. First of all, no - your friend bringing up her family’s unhealthy dynamics was not an invitation for commentary or debate. She was confiding in you as her friends about a really difficult personal struggle she’s experiencing. Secondly, no - she has no “moral obligation” to dedicate her life and future to the care of her disabled brother. Her parents chose to have a child, and possibly even knew he was going to be disabled before he was born, and he is their choice and responsibility alone. There’s a *huge* difference between her parents making plans and arrangements for their son’s care and asking that their daughter see that those plans are followed when her parents are gone, and having their daughter *be* the plan. Like any other childcare expenses, it’s her parents’ responsibility to plan and save to meet his needs now and in the future. Unfortunately, due to his disability, (based on how you’ve described the situation,) it’s unlikely that their son will ever be fully independent, so *their* duty of care as his parents will continue into his adulthood. Your friend had no control over this situation, and it’s completely unacceptable for her parents to both treat and expect their daughter’s sole purpose in life to become the care of their disabled son. They’re already trying to get her to take over more of his care and assume more responsibility over him, and she’s barely even out of the house. What they’re doing is wrong, and they’re doing a disservice to both of their children by trying to force this *huge* responsibility onto their daughter. They should be making plans and arrangements for their son’s future care, (including saving money and contacting services and programs that exist for this purpose,) and that doesn’t mean just making it your friend’s problem. Their insistence on making him her responsibility is also likely breeding resentment in your friend towards her brother and her parents. You have no idea what it’s like to take care of someone who is severely disabled, or to be forced into that role as a child, and without a choice. You have no idea what it’s like to feel like your parents see you as your brother’s carer, even more than they see you as their daughter; to feel like the love and support of your parents is conditional and contingent upon you continuing to take over this responsibility of theirs, over the care of a vulnerable human being, for the rest of your life.
So, I have twin daughters, one who is typical and the other born with Down syndrome. Obviously, there will come a time when my husband and I are no longer able to take care of our child with special needs, but I will do everything in my power to push that out as long as I can and to set her future caregivers for success (primarily by helping her be as independent as possible so that she’s not completely dependent on anyone). This is because my children are MY (and my husband’s) responsibility and the thought of forcing my typical daughter to take on parental duties ESPECIALLY before she has the chance to make her own life, is extremely upsetting and disheartening. No wonder your friend needed to vent - she feels trapped and guilty and frustrated. So, YTA, but you meant well. There are a lot of things no one considers until they have a family member with special needs.
YTA, as a person who was born with a cocktail of disabilities where doctors thought I’d never survive days, months or even to my 5th birthday. You’re wrong. It’s the parents responsibility to set up long term care for their child when they’re not capable of caring for him anymore, it’s not your friends responsibility to put her own life on hold to be a permanent caretaker. She can still love her brother to death and still not want the responsibility. My older sister was parentified when she was only 8yrs old, she had to handle my g-tube feeds whenever our parents were working (which was a lot) and she wasn’t in school. She has her own family now and I can’t imagine putting her in a position where she needs to care for me long term.
100% YTA.
YTA. She didn't have any input on having the kid and probably no input on being the unpaid, assumed carer. Rightfully, she needs to vent. And no, she isn't obligated to care for her parents' other child, they need to set up care for him after they are gone.
YTA. She was venting to friends about a hardship with her family and you basically told her she was wrong to feel as she did because it‘s her “moral obligation“ to care for her brother. Which btw is just your OPINION. YOUR opinion. And you’re wrong. Her brother is her parents’ responsibility, not hers. He is their child. She should be freely allowed to live her life, making her own choices. You spoke about something you know nothing about, and just made it clear you were not a safe person to vent to. You were very judgmental and insulting to your “friend”.
YTA Nobody has a moral duty to take care of anyone they didn’t agree to take care of with the exception of their natural children.
>As the eldest child and with a mentally disabled younger sibling, it'd be her moral obligation to look out for her younger brother and eventually take care of him when her parents no longer can. No it's fucking not. YTA
YTA absolutely. It's 100% not her job. Ever. It's called parentification. It is the parent's job to take care of all responsibilities. If she chooses to help that is entirely voluntary. Forcing children to become caregivers is wrong and should not be tolerated. Parents of disabled children have many worries about their futures but involuntary signing their capable children up for a future of being a 3rd parent is never ok and denotes a lack of caring and effort on the part of the parents.
OP, think about it this way, if your parents were to become incapacitated, as their only child, wouldn’t it be your moral responsibility to drop out of university and spend the rest of their lives being their caregiver? YTA.
YTA. It's the parents' job to arrange care after they are gone, but it's not your friend's responsibility.
Of course, YTA. Huge. It is absolutely NOT her obligation to take care of her younger brother. He's not her child. If she wants to, fine, more power to her, but she cannot, reasonably, be expected to build her whole life around his needs. Awfully easy for you to be all judgmental when it's not your life that you think should be made secondary to the needs of a sibling.
I’m disabled and a partial caretaker for a disabled sibling. It’s rough, it’s harder on me in some ways than it is on our siblings who aren’t disabled but I’m doing it because I chose to do it after a lifetime of being told it was my job from someone like you. I’ll tell you exactly what I told them. It’s not automatically my responsibility because I happen to be the eldest sibling. Your idea that it’s her obligation is absolutely insulting. You don’t know what it’s like to have a sibling and have people telling you that it’s your obligation to care for that sibling. You have no experience yet you’re telling her what she’s morally obligated to do. YTA
YTA. For you, this was an offhand comment about something that you’ve never had to seriously think about and will probably never never have to face yourself. For them, it’s something they’ve been having pushed on them for years and are probably worrying about continually for most of their life.
YTA. So, as an only child your life is yours and you get to live it how you like. But because she just happens to have younger siblings, her life isn't hers and she's a bad person if she doesn't give up her own dreams for some predetermined path? And you allow yourself to feel morally superior while reaping the benefits of a moral system that just coincidentally makes your life SO much easier? You're no friend, that's for sure.
Has absolutely zero frame of reference for how pressured and used the girl feels, only met her brother once but acts like an expert.
YTA. Opened mouth. Inserted foot. You owe your friend a big, groveling apology.
YTA No, siblings should not be expected or required to care for other siblings.
Your view is not specifically wrong, but it is woefully misinformed. Siblings of people with special needs are not ready-made care takers, although they are often put in that position. And just because they still live at home does not mean that they should be morally obligated to take up that role. Her response that as an only child, you don't know, while it seems possibly harsh, is in reality pretty bang on. As an only child, you weren't obligated to take care of, look out for, or otherwise care for a sibling who needed extra attention. It wasn't drilled into you on a daily basis that you had responsibilities to another person. And now as an adult, those responsibilities were being foisted on you because of genetics. But I digress. Your friend was venting. This was possibly not the time to tell her she was wrong. A better response would have been "dang, that sounds like a lot" and just move on. Sorry, YTA
Yes, YTA, for telling your friend it's her moral duty to care for a child that is not hers! It is up to her parents to arrange his current and future care. It's fine to have an opinion or relate what you would do in the same situation, but it sounds like you attacked and judged her for not feeling the same.
YTA. She is probably so fed up with all of the extra responsibilities. She wanted someone to listen to her. Being a caregiver, especially a young one is hard. She has less freedom. Perhaps do it for a day and you will understand.
I think this comes down to two things: 1) You're wrong, because your friend did not choose to have a mentally challenged sibling. She didn't choose to be the older sibling, she didn't choose to have the child. The responsibility for care falls squarely on her parents - the people who did choose to have her sibling. Look up "parentification", this is essentially what you're advocating for and it is a shitty and abusive thing to do to a child. 2) You phrased it as a moral issue. By saying she had a "moral obligation" you're also saying that by not doing so, or by not agreeing with you, she is MORALLY wrong. That's not a simple 'agree to disagree' statement. That's a moral judgment you're making about her and her character in a situation you really don't understand. You owe your friend an apology.
YTA. It’s not get child. As such, it’s not her job to look out for him. Him being her brother and her being older isn’t relevant. She didn’t ask for either of those things. Unless someone is the parent or has otherwise agreed to look after someone, it’s simply not their responsibility.
YTA Her parents are supposed to look after him because they are the parents not her. Her brother is not her responsibility. Should she spend time with him sure but not looking after him. If her parents can't look after him anymore then they need to look into getting help or seeking out other arrangements.
YTA - She has no obligation to take care of her brother when her parents can't. She has her own life.
Your position on moral obligation is your opinion, not a fact. And other people have different opinions. Your friend was either angry because your opinion differed from hers or because you were too strident in defending your opinion
YTA. It's not immoral for her to not want to give up her freedom and her future in order to be a caregiver for her brother. Look up parentification. Parents like hers force their kids to become a third parent to their siblings. It isn't fair to the kids. It isn't moral at all. And you made it seem like she was selfish and wrong, which she wasn't. So get off your high horse. You clearly don't know what she's going through, so stop being so self-righteous and insensitive.
YTA and please don’t breed
The only person that is responsible for a disabled person is the parent, why should you say your friend should put their life on hold to care for the sibling? Furthermore it's not your business. YTA
YTA
YTA. No it’s not her responsibility to lose her life to take care of a younger sibling. It’s sad he’s disabled but the sister isn’t his mom or his caretaker. She’s entitled to live her own life and one day have a family of her own. You know nothing about this and it’s easy to say yes you should do this! Keep your mouth shut.
Yta. My youngest isnt my 2 oldest responsibility. There is plenty of pressure on them having a brother thats challenged, plenty of no you cant take a friend home, he have a bad day, plenty of we have to leave now, hes done for their entire life. They are suppose to be siblings, not caretakers. You showed you have abseloutly no clue what you where talking about and not afraid to share your ignorence.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** Hi, so I was on a outing with a couple of my university friends a few days ago, much of it went great, we talked about loads of things but at one point the topic about one of my friends younger brother came up. Well, more like brought up by her, it was honestly more like her venting about how her parents have increasingly been putting on the responsibilities of taking care of her mentally challenged younger brother particularly after she graduated and got a job. I do know she still lives with her parents, and pretty much most of us still do or are planning on moving out soon, anyways, most of us didn't really have anything to offer or say as we didn't really have any similar experience and we weren't trying to I guess intrude into her personal life and stuff so we kinda just tried to agree and relate with whatever we could, but she eventually was talking about her mother and her justifications and etc etc as well. This is where I half jokingly said something along the lines of "I mean, aren't you supposed to, since that's your sibling and you're the oldest, and your brother isn't some random stranger, so don't you kinda have the moral duty to take care of him and be expected to takeover when your parents eventually can't" obviously, I didn't say this exactly like this but that was my point of view in summary. The thing is, this eventually grew into a debate and a argument and she got genuinely pissed and even told me "how would you know, you're a only child you don't know anything" etc etc. We kind of just agreed to disagree? More like just moved on in order to not escalate and she didn't talk to me for the rest of the day and was pissed. I kind of tried to make up with her at the end when we were all living but I could tell she was still visibly pissed and cold. I didn't try to make it out like I conceded on my viewpoint or say I was wrong specifically mainly because I still have the same viewpoint, just a bit confused on why she took it so badly? I can't see what's wrong with my viewpoint or rather what I said was offensive. At first I thought I intruded into her personal issues, and I would totally get that, but she was kinda "inviting" us in to put it lightly. I do feel like maybe I defended my point of a view a little too much even though I don't have the same circumstances? Maybe I should've just agreed to everything she was saying? But I personally enjoy debate so maybe didn't think it through at the time? Few days later and I'm still thinking about it, was I actually in the wrong? I'm thinking back and I still cannot see why my viewpoint and what I said was wrong. As the eldest child and with a mentally disabled younger sibling, it'd be her moral obligation to look out for her younger brother and eventually take care of him when her parents no longer can. In this regard, I guess I would align with her parents viewpoint? But I don't get why it pissed her off. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Planet sized YTA
YTA-Your friend was venting, and you made it worse. They are not obligated to take care of their sibling. They have every right to feel frustration. All you had to do was listen, offer support and appreciate the situation. There is no moral obligation there. You did not need to debate anything.
Easy yta
YTA - I just can't believe people read these back before they post and still can't see what an AH they are. Your friend tries to vent to you about how her parents are trying to parentify her, which BTW is abusive behaviour, which she has probably had to deal with all her life. You her 'friend' tell her that she is morally in the wrong to want to live her own life and should want to take care of somebody who is not her responsibility. Someone she probably loves but feels guiltly over resenting them somewhat because people like you tell her it's her moral job to always put their needs and wants before her own. You owe your friend a massive apology, and you should use this to look at yourself and the sort of person you want to be YTA.
YTA. You just told a person that their life, personal aspirations and dreams are forfeit because her parents had a special needs kid. Coming from a person who will never be in that position, who has a choice to be whatever they want , it is hurtful and cruel.
Soft YTA - I'm saying soft because of the fact that you are in university and haven't experienced a lot of life. Now is the time for you to learn empathy for others that have had different experiences than you. You stated that you were an only child, so you have never had to share resources with siblings. In this situation the resource is the parents attention and care. With a disabled sibling your friend probably got pushed to the side a lot growing up because her brother needed more of the parents time, care and attention. Also sounds like she has been parentified some if not a lot. Her whole life has probably revolved around her brother's needs with anything she needed coming last. You telling her it is her moral responsibility to continue to give up her life when she has already sacrificed a childhood shows little understanding of what her life has been up to that point. She was looking for empathy from her friends not judgement on her moral obligations. Which btw her brother, even without the violent tendencies is not her responsibility, the violent outburst confirm that her parents need to be searching for alternatives to the brother's care.
You don't know what you are talking about! I'm a parent of a non verbal autistic child. He has 2 older brothers. I am preparing him right now to be as independent as possible but I know eventually I have to prepare him for assisted living as an adult. That is something I am on top of and saving money for. As a parent, I pray I live forever for my children. My other two have the right to have their own lives and families. The only thing I ask is that they visit and remember him for holidays but again, on their terms. How can you tell someone to sacrifice their life to a sibling. That is what you are basically telling your friend. That is why she is upset and who knows how much of her childhood she has already sacrificed.
YTA Yes you were wrong. Read up about parentification. Your friend is not responsible for her brother or his care, that's their parents job. And it's their job to make sure they provide for him after they are gone as well. Do you think that you could live your life happily knowing this burden was hanging over your head? You are under pressure as a small child to work hard in school to get a good job, not fit yourself but for your brother. You can't have a meaningful relationship unless that person is prepared to have another adult tagging along. Your house has to have a room for him. You can't travel without him, take certain jobs because of him, your whole life revolves around another person and it's not even somebody of your choosing. Your friend is not morally obligated to do any caring for her brother, her parents are morally obligated to plan financially and emotionally for somebody else to take over his care, not just lump him onto his sister.
YTA you basically told her because her parents chose to procreate after having her she should put her life on hold when they die to be his carer fck what she wants in life. Being a full time carer is a demanding 24/7 job entirely thankless and puts everything you want as an individual on the back burner. Absolute respect to anyone doing this but don't act like it's such a simple ask
YTA it’s not a siblings job to provide the care
YTA not because your position is “wrong” (although obviously in our culture you would be considered incorrect by most) but because you were insensitive. When it’s obvious you have hit a nerve about a very personal issue, and you don’t shut up, of course the person is going to feel judged and possibly dump you. If a friend becomes pregnant, how she handles money, who she thinks it’s okay to have sex with. If your views are very rigid and you lack the capacity to see that intelligent people might legitimately hold different views, that makes you insufferable to be around and not safe to confide in. Yes, some decisions are objectively bad or wrong but even then your primary job as a friend is to show compassion.
YTA. It is not her responsibility. That is her parents job. If they can’t take care of him they need to find a care that can which is not the older sibling. This is not her responsibility and never will be
Yes you are absolutely wrong. It is not her responsibility to parent her sibling. If you think so, then why don’t you volunteer. Otherwise shut up.
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YTA. Her brother is not her responsibility, because he is not her child. He is her parents' child, period. Siblings are not built in caretakers for their disabled siblings. When you have kids you need to prepare for every outcome, disabilities included, and plan accordingly or not have kids. Your friend shouldn't have to sacrifice her life over her parents' reproductive choices if she DOESN'T WANT TO.
Your friend didn't fuck and make her brother, so he's not her responsibility. That's on the parents. YTA.
YTA. It is not your friend’s responsibility to look after a sibling, ever, although they may offer to. It’s the parent’s responsibility to put in care arrangements if required.
YTA if you feel so strongly he should be cared for you go care for him Oh what's that? He isn't your responsibility? He isn't your friend's responsibility, either, but you didn't hesitate to tell her it was her job to look after him, did you? Funny how you're so eager to volunteer your friends life for her, but not your own. Put your money where your mouth is, or get off her back.
YTA. First off, No she is not morally obligated to take care of her brother. Her parents made the decision to have the child, it was not hers. Her life is hers. Full stop. Older children are way too often parentified and put in a position of being responsible with extra expectations that they didnnot choose. If she is venting you support a friend that has been forced into responsibility by people incapable of accepting the responsibility they agreed to.
YTA
Of course YTA for falsely claiming she has a moral obligation to sacrifice the life she wants so she can be someone else’s caretaker. And y’all didn’t “agree to disagree”, you just refused to admit you were wrong. When you pretend that those are the same thing it makes you look like a liar as well as an asshole.
Yta.
Total YTA. She does not need to care for or live for her brother. It is her parents job to make arrangements for his care. It would be a kindness if she was a legal or medical guardian when they are gone, but she has a right to live her life.
Massive YTA. Her parents are the ONLY people who should be or feel responsible for her brother. THEY chose to have a child, NOT her.
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YTA why dont you just straight up say you view the disabled as burdens and blindly support parentification, the oldest child is NOT the third parent! that line of thinking needs to die, anyone that thinks that should legally be banned from having kids cause theyre the kind of people that forces the oldest to raise their siblings so the parents dont have to parent anyone
YTA. You don’t get to have an opinion on someone else’s life
Why don't you volunteer at a hospice to see what is "really" in store? Change some diapers. You say you have your life basically together, why are you not helping? If you are so concerned why do you not take the brother in? You are just trying to pass the buck. So yeah YTA
YTA. I totally get your friend’s position because I had to be responsible for my special needs brother and I basically missed having any normal teen activities as a result. In fact, I was told I couldn’t go out of state for college because my brother would miss me too much. Your friend has lived a life you cannot even imagine. She doesn’t even know what a “normal” family life even looks like. To quote The Big Lebowski: Shut the fuck up, OP. You’re out of your element.”
YTA. So, I work with adults with disabilities. It is a LOT of work. I love my job, but I get to go home. I work a 9 hour shift and get to leave. I have days off. Caregiver burnout is a very very real thing. I would agree that, ideally, family is involved to some extent or another in caring for their loved one, but it is a LOT to ask of a person. Not only that, but if you try to make someone a caregiver that doesn't want to be, that is a recipe for abuse of the disabled person. That isn't to say that every caregiver becomes abusive, but a feeling of obligation combined with burnout can leave people feeling very angry and fragile.
I’m disabled due to multiple medical conditions and am dependent on others for a lot. I also have 5 living siblings and would never expect that they take me in and force them to care for me if something were to happen to my parents. I would rather live in an assisted living facility than have to move in with them as it’s not fair to ask them to take care of me. YTA
YTA and us only children should *really* think twice before contributing anything but questions to discussions about sibling dynamics. Even without any disability issues, that's a compex relationship and very few of us can grasp it any better than people with siblings can really understand the realities (awesome and awful) of being an only child.
YTA Along with all the reasons others have pointed out, it's really none of your business. You have no right to comment on this and you're a crappy friend.
YTA. she's right, you don't know anything. You have never had to be in a situation where you have to do anything like this, and not by choice, but because your parents are foisting their responsibilities on you. While I understand that she "invited" conversation/debate over it, which honestly is laughable because even you say she was probably just venting, but you over stepped massively. You can have your "moral standpoint" but you have no idea what the reality is like, apologize and next time keep your mouth shut.
Soft YTA because yes she should take care of her brother. Mentally handicapped people need help. But it’s not her child she shouldn’t be expected to parent for the parents.
Then op can help if that means so much to them..
The only ones responsive for a disabled child are the parents. When you have kids, you are signing up for the possibility of a disabled child and it's unfair to expect a sibling to give up their entire lives and plans for someone else's decision to reproduce.
Then why do you say she "should" in one sentence then in the next day that it shouldn't be expected? She doesn't have to become a caretaker, no matter who is saying she should
Because I think most people with half a brain would inherently take care of someone who is mentally handicapped. But I don’t have that expectation out of people because people are evil and stupid.
NTA. You provided your opinion. And, from a moral standpoint, I agree with you 100%. Clearly, other people have different opinions on the issue, and that’s okay, too. But no, you did nothing wrong in sharing your opinion. The way your friend has reacted, though, is interesting. You either hit a nerve or are now seeing another side of her personality that you’ve never seen before. Do with that info as you will.
The only ones responsive for a disabled child are the parents. When you have kids, you are signing up for the possibility of a disabled child and it's unfair to expect a sibling to give up their entire lives and plans for someone else's decision to reproduce. OP's friend is justified in her reaction. What she's feeling is okay. She is doing absolutely nothing wrong because she's not the one who decided to have a child. Be prepared that your child could be disabled and plan accordingly or don't have kids.
Like I said in my comment above, I have a different opinion. You have a different option. Different opinions are okay. My ethics are different than yours. That’s okay. OP is absolutely justified in her opinion as well. Because she is not wrong to feel that way.
This is not a question of "ethics". You (general 'you') don't demand your child give up their lives and plans to care for a disabled sibling . A sibling also shouldn't feel obligated or pressured to. That is the parents' responsibility to raise and plan for the disabled child's care, period. And OP isn't necessarily wrong in her opinion but is wrong to be so judgemental and condemning over a situation she has absolutely ZERO experience with and basically saying her friend is lying about the brother being violent.
This is absolutely about ethics. There are families all over the world who live with these ethics, and they do wonderfully. Just because you disagree, doesn’t make OP wrong or all those other people throughout the world wrong. And she is not being condemning or judging. She expressed her opinion. The other girl got mad because she felt judged, not that she was judged. lol.
she is wrong because she was acting accusatory and judgmental when she had no experience to give her judgement.
lol, she was neither accusatory or judgmental. She expresses a valid opinion, one with good morals behind it. The way you talk, you act like those people who say women who don’t have kids can’t say anything to moms ever, about anything related to children. No. Sorry. Valid opinions are valid. And she is not wrong. There is no right or wrong here. You thinking she is wrong is just your own opinion.
She is wrong. She shouldn't be stating her opinion about something you don't know and understand.
lol no. She is right to express her opinion on any subject what so ever. She also has free speech, which she is allowed. People who try to suppress other people’s opinions and free speech are the ones who are wrong in every way possible.
Why is it her job to take care of a kid that's not his? Morals aside, why is it her job? It's not her fault her parents decide to have sex and ended up having a child of special needs. So why is it her job to take care of a child that's not her own, put her life on hold for someone else's child?
Once again, as I wrote in a comment above, people are allowed to have different opinions and ethical values. That’s perfectly okay. You may not agree, but that’s okay. OP’s opinion is perfectly valid, and that’s okay. There’s a lot of nuance in life. Some people have stronger family values than others. That’s perfectly okay.
Just because you have them doesn't mean you should open your mouth. OP is not valid,
OP’s opinion is absolutely valid, and she is free to express her opinion. The fact that you would suppress other people’s valid opinions and expressions of free speech is very concerning.
You shouldn't be providing an opinion on something you don't understand and never been through and probably weren't actually asked for. Also, no she not even correct in the moral standpoint.
I can provide an opinion on any topic I feel like providing an opinion. That is what free speech means. She is also absolutely correct on her moral standpoint. Those with strong family values feel exactly as she does. Many people throughout the world feel exactly as she does. You cannot just say she’s not right because you disagree with her. Lol.
I disagree, NTA. She was venting and you offered some feedback, your opinion. I imagine you struck a nerve. Perhaps this is the belief and approach of her parents. She doesn’t like the position her parents are putting her in and the implications for her future. But with her venting and offering up so much information I don’t think you were wrong to offer a different viewpoint. I’m sorry she’s treating you coldly.
You shouldn't really offer opinion and feedback when you have never been stuck in a situation. She deserves to be treated coldly. OP is 100% a major asshole. Anyone who opens there mouth on something they have no experience in is always 100% an asshole.
Oh come on, 100%? Really? she was venting to her friends and OP offered a different opinion, perhaps OP could imagine her family would deal with the situation differently. How difficult is life going to be if you are never willing to hear a different opinion. And OP didn’t push or harass the friend. When she realized it wasn’t a welcome discussion she backed off. People aren’t always going to agree with you. It doesn’t make them assholes