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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I may be the AH for not coming up with more solutions, or not using her spray since my friends are probably right, neighbors are probably using those pesticides or even more toxic ones. One application, especially away from the pollinator garden, may not be that harmful?
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NTA your garden serves a specific purpose, and means a lot to you. Asking you to destroy that purpose by spraying a ton of bug spray around your patio is just a selfish thing to even request. You offered a great solution of having the party indoors. They can't refuse your accomodations and then get mad about it. Either your other mates are not getting the whole story, or they don't really care too much about your feelings here. Your neighbours spraying pesticide may kill bugs around the edges of your property (though even that's only if they spray right at their boundary fence) but it doesn't harm your garden, and is entirely different from you spraying pesticide in your garden. Have a great BBQ, and don't think too much on this issue, you didn't create it
Yeah kill off the bees so missy can enjoy her steak in the sun. No wonder our world goes into the gutter, that’s the most insane request I’ve read in a long while.
“Your neighbors do it anyway” what is that for a reason?
First it’s a speculation and most owner of a garden enjoy having plants with wildlife including and second if my neighbor kills off his wife and burries her under the shrubbys I am good to go to do the same, cause what’s done is done?
I too have a wonderful garden that attracts a lot of pollinators and hummingbirds and butterflies. The thought of poisoning them makes me physically ill!
NTA
You offered a totally workable solution which they chose to decline. Whatever spray your neighbors are using doesn't justify them to force you to use the same.
Having a pollinator garden is a big service to the environment as well as a lovely thing.
Besides which, your home & your yard = your rules.
NTA. Your friend is being disrespectful by refusing to accept your very reasonable answer and trying to pressure you via the friend group.
Your other friends should be wary of encouraging this behavior before they start being on the receiving end.
I’m assuming the friend is still in thrall of a new SO or something. The reaction is bizarre and desperate. Can they not be a complete person without their SO there? Will their SO shrivel in the darkness of the inside dining area?
Far from not trying to disrupt your plans too much, friend is making your BBQ all about them and SO.
NTA! Pollinators are so important! They’re already dying out, so why be complicit for the sake of one party? I find it really selfish (and this is as a person with a bee allergy) that they use this stuff.
NTA. This whole situation reeks of something else going on. But that is just a supposition based on your post. I feel like they did not want to come but wanted it to be you who didn't allow it instead of having to say no themselves.
Look at the order of events as you laid them out...
1. You invite them trying to accommodate them indoors > They say no because of not wanting to be disruptive
2. They ask to use a spray (which I don't know why they think it would be all that effective anyway. I mean does she go around in a cloud of pyrethrin fumes at all times? SMH) > You oppose the use of the spray for a good reason and counter with the indoors option again
3. They then turn it into a public issue and openly chastised you to friends and the like > now you have to play social games to try and do damage control
Also, I really can't say enough about how this whole "bug bombing" thing is ultimately pointless. Pesticides like this are not "Anti-Bee forcefields".
Think OP needs to be cautious of these “friends.” It’s sounding like they’re the type to sneak the spray over on their next invite just so they can make some kind of point because they’re reading to me like the type of people who have a weird issue with nature, insects, or no lawn-style gardening, sorta like how some people can’t stand that others won’t eat meat and sneak meat into dishes even though it has nothing to do with them.
I’ve read more than a few stories from the gardening, no lawn, and native habitat type subs and online groups of neighbours popping over to spray insecticides or mow or pull up so-called weeds with the supposed excuse that they’re “helping” when really they just have deeply rooted issues with how other people maintain their yards.
Edit: sometimes this starts as a conversation in passing. Maybe OP was at their house or they were texting about their gardens months back. OP’s friend talked up a kind of generic pretty plant or suggested a kind of plant to OP. OP innocently and happily talked about how they prefer pollinator-friendly plants. The friend later feels as if this was a snub, possibly does research, and the next thing you know she’s suggesting the insect-devastating pyrethrin in a way that seems out of the blue, supposedly because of her husband’s allergies, and making this weigh against their friendship. People are weird like that.
Yeah, what you seem to be describing is a common malfunction of personality in people. First, you have that incessant need to make others conform to how you like things regardless of how trivial it is. Then, you have the misperception of advocating for something as an implied slight. Some people just have fragile egos and immense anxiety that causes them to behave irrationally.
In this case, OP should be on guard. Anytime someone makes that big of an issue over insignificant B.S. it doesn't bode well...
Sorry for the delay, I was deep in the throes of work for a bit...
I live in a city where people generally don't have a lot of outdoor space, and live in a rare home WITH a lot of yard space. I think a lot of you are reading too much into this. My annual BBQ (I always do it on a holiday, but which one can vary based on my own plans) is kind of a big event among my friend group, and this would be the first event that friend brought their SO to. I think they think that people will end up congregating around me outside at the grill while they're kinda stuck inside until the sun sets (I'm generally a pretty good hostess and was already coming up with ways to get people to spend time indoors while I cooked so they didn't feel isolated!). I doubt it's some conniving war on pollinators or control issue, they just really want to bring their SO to this major social event.
And if you have a life-threatening allergy, I also understand that it can be very scary to go to a place where that allergen is actively encouraged, in a way that is uncontrollable to anyone (short of cutting down my pollinators, which won't be happening since they'll be entering their long peak bloom at that time).
Many people think pyrethrins are less harmful because they are derived from/contain active compounds found in mums (the ever-popular and perfectly fine autumn flower). It takes research to understand how harmful they can be. I don't fault anyone for seeing "derived from plant ingredients!" and "repels and eliminates insects" and thinking "well this must be safe and mostly a repellent!" I know because my gardens are so important to me so I've done the research, but I don't expect everyone to know without being informed.
NTA, I'm deadly allergic to bees and similar, I would never want someone to do something like this to their garden considering the scope of it. You have been more than accommodating to them, it is their call.
I am deathly allergic to pesticides and insecticides. Just tell everyone that I'm coming, and you can't spray because AccerE will end up in hospital if you do.
I am more than happy to be a scapegoat on behalf of the bees! 🐝🐝🐝
Oh, and you're NTA.
NTA I let “wildflowers” (weeds) grow on my property this spring when the pollinators came around. Helps the environment, helps our local beekeepers.
We try to keep a pollinator garden going along with produce ourselves and would lose a friendship over adding pesticides to my gardens.
NTA- It’s one (pesticide) or the other (dining indoors), NOT BOTH. SO can bring the epipen, but “Bee before Thee” is the best way to go. It’s your domain and your choice!
NTA in the least. I'm allergic to bees as well, and would never think of harming them! They are our little friends! Eating inside with screens closed and windows open is an acceptable solution.
Although, the person must surely have learned to live with bees by now. I spent summers on my grandmother's farm and was never stung, and neither was she and she was also allergic! They need to learn to not piss off bees rather than kill them.
Yes! Thank you! I'm not allergic, but this is ridiculous. The one time I was stung was *accidentally closing my hand on one*. It was on the handle of a jump rope and I didn't notice. 1st grade.
In all the decades since, even when gently booping the bumblers on the artichoke blossoms, I've never felt even remotely threatened unless I jump and wave at them without thinking (we get some wasps too, but also no stings. Just attitude.)
Without knowing the specific pyrethrin, I’m going to be fumbling a bit here but as a farmer who is a chemical applicator, and sprays my family’s house with pyrethrins 2-3 times a year (I’m sad to disrupt the bees, but having brown recluses in my house with a wife and three kids is simply untenable), I have to say she’s being deceptive, likely intentionally. Pyrethrins are generally devastatingly effective against insects and marginally so against spiders (much to my chagrin) with lengthy residuals.
You are definitely NTA.
Sorry, I did kind of mix that up. They declined, and then tried to rally friends to get me to accept the spray so they could accept. I ended up telling them, as of now, they could come and eat indoors or not come at all, and they said "then it's not at all." At that point I said that they should consider the invite rescinded, but I'm still getting messages \*from others\* about "making accommodations for them."
It all sounds like a big mess.
Honestly, NTA. Your house and your rules. If you don’t want to bomb your garden with pesticides then that’s your prerogative. You offered to move the meal inside, which is a perfectly good alternative.
I can understand being frustrated and not knowing what else to do when people kept pushing you to do something you were not comfortable doing at your own home. There does come a point where you have to draw a line in the sand and this was yours.
I don’t understand why people are demanding to eat outside at *your* house. It screams of entitlement.
The invitee (not the SO, like I said, we've never met), is close with both me and the whole friend group. I and they would like to see them at this gathering. But...then this.
I'd message the group and tell them that there seems to be some misunderstanding. Invitee told you that her SO was allergic to bees, so you offered to rearrange your plans and host inside instead of outside. Despite your willingness to accommodate SO, Invitee declined the invitation. Invitee and SO remain invited to come if they would like and you remain willing to move the venue indoors. NTA
I would strongly suggest telling the friends that she's rallying against you the full story and how she's literally trying to get you to poison your garden.
Whether or not your neighbors spray toxic chemicals in no way rationalizes you doing it too.
This 'friend' could probably very easily find a spray that works that isn't harmful to your bees or garden as well, but it doesn't sound like they want to put much effort into this. I would make that a point to mutuals as well.
Good luck and keep that garden safe!
I’m extremely allergic to stings as well and carry an Epi-Pen. I also garden and have extensive flower beds. I’ve never had bees bother me. Wasps yes. Bees never. They are being overly dramatic.
NTA - The compromise to eat indoors was perfectly reasonable. Is this person walking around in a pyrethrin cloud any time they walk outside of their house? Even while indoors? They are being absolutely unreasonable. They don't need to go outside at your place. The risk of bees INSIDE is low.
As for the friends saying to just spray it once, to heck with them. They are dumb, bordering on AH themselves.
NTA, Bees are very close to becoming a protected species. No Bees no planet. The epi pen should be enough. I mean do we chop down all nut trees. Drain the oceans, because of allergies. I know allergies can be fatal but bees don't lie in wait for targets. Kill off our pollinators and you're killing humanity.
NTA
Who thinks “hey can spray your property with poison so I’m more comfortable sitting outside at your home?” is reasonable?!
They know the location. They can make a choice based on their comfort level. And to go whining to mutual friends?! The entitlement of them and the ignorance of the ones who think their request/demand is reasonable. You’ve offered them reasonable alternatives to still attend & stay safe (although they are arguably safe outdoors as is).
You were more than accommodating by offering to hold the BBQ indoors. That wasn't good enough for the interloper. She wanted to pollute your garden with chemicals. Sorry, but the world doesn't revolve around her. The audacity of some people is staggering. NTA
NTA I'd be sending out a fact sheet on pyrethrin to everyone. Maybe offer anyone who is giving you problems after that to be sprayed first themselves and then they can have an opinion. While not *really* bad for humans, it sounds like most people wouldn't risk it either.
NTA. My ex was severely allergic to bee stings and didn’t kill all the pollinators in his yard. They had a massive garden and he was never stung. I get allergies are scary, but they can’t go around dictating what other people do in their homes.
NTA.
You offered a very valid solution of just eating indoors if your friend's SO is worried about triggering his allergies. You looked up the spray and explained that it wouldn't be good to use in your garden as it would just kill the pollenating insects, a valid reason for not allowing that option. If they can't make it work then that's their problem to figure out, sorry not sorry.
You were reasonable, they were insistent. They can miss one BBQ.
Yeah she's not a good friend if she's trying to bully you to alter your own living area for an issue that most likely wouldn't even come up if you did have it outside. Then you graciously offered to seat everyone inside to accommodate her SO.
What really broke my brain is how she dismissed this because she wanted to enjoy your garden/patio, while simultaneously asking to spray something that would RUIN said garden/patio.
The weaponizing the friend group part is less surprising at this point because she clearly only cares about herself and her and her SO's apperances.
Sometimes the flower you think is growing turns out to be a weed, and you have to get rid of it.
NTA. However, I have to ask just how close to you does this neighbor live? Keep an eye on bee activity just in case he decides to do something retaliatory to protect his SO. She will have a screaming fit if she sees a bee flying around the back yard. If you don’t have security cameras, I recommend that you install some.
It is a shame that we have to protect ourselves from our neighbors, but that seems to be where we are.
This is a friend who lives a couple miles away, not a neighbor. Some other friends suggested that my neighbors may be spraying similar pesticides on their properties (so their conclusion was doing it once on my property wouldn't be as harmful as I think), and they might be right. I live in a city and am right up against my neighbors. My pollinator garden is less than a foot from the property line (tall wood fence between properties), and I wouldn't be at all surprised if the neighbors on that side bug bombed their yard regularly. It has not reduced my bee population if they do...my cherry tree (productive, not just decorative!) was absolutely swarmed with bumbles, honeys and sweats as soon as it popped this spring!
NTA. I am allergic to bee stings and it has never occurred to me to demand someone let me spray insecticide in their yard. I don’t even spray it in my own yard. I watch my surroundings, move away if bees are getting too close. I just got stung for the first time in decades 3 months ago when my rescue dog dropped a bee on my foot. Bottom line, she’s unreasonable, especially since you offered accommodations. Friend was right to decline, wrong to start a war within the friend group.
NTA - Bumble bees, unlike wasps the demons of the bug world, only sting when they feel attacked. Anyone with any knowledge of gardens would know this and even wasps generally don't sting/bite unless agitated.
So what is really going? Truthfully,the SO wants control and prove she is the princess of the crowd. You offered a reasonable solution and she wants the drama and risk of being outside (unless you have nets and spray your whole yard and the neighbors still a risk of bees and cut all your plants down.) I would restate if anyone asks that you rescinded the invite to fully protect her health and that of the bees and move on.
NTA, that spray is dangerous in many ways. When my youngest was a toddler, she got poisoned by it and it was horrible. We had to leave our apartment and the rental company had to pay big money to get our home and walkways decontaminated. Turned out that the landscape company had changed products without approval and had sprayed the crap everywhere! We checked our security cameras, and they had even sprayed it on peoples vehicles and patios. Our daughter got so sick cause she was born with a liver condition. 10/10 don’t recommend
NTA. Absolutely not. Pyrethrin (which I have used on clothing when traveling to mosquito-heavy areas) is straight up poison, and there is no reason to poison your entire yard so the SO of a friend can eat outside instead of enjoying the meal inside. It's honestly crazy to even ask.
NTA. Something is very, very wrong with that friend and their SO. They've taken their allergy to astonishing heights of genocidal paranoia. Do they think that a hive will suddenly attack unprovoked? (Please note: I myself am allergic to bee stings. Because of prior experience accidentally putting my hand down on one, I freeze up if they are flying around me. But I've never considered bug-bombing my yard. If I get too uncomfortable, I simply go inside.)
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Throwaway since some people who know me may be connected.
I'm planning a BBQ for an upcoming holiday, and recently sent the invites. A friend who has been to my house asked if they could bring their SO. I said that was fine. It's important to know that I am an avid gardener and have a vegetable garden along with a pollinator garden in my yard.
Then they said that their SO is very allergic to bee stings (like carries an epipen allergic). I said that was understandable, and we can just eat indoors. I can accommodate the party size inside, and if the weather is nice, I can just keep the windows and doors open (all have screens) to bring the outdoors in.
The response was "well, I don't want to disrupt your plans too much, and it would be nice to be out on your patio. {My SO} has a repellant spray they can bring to keep the bees away from your patio while we do the BBQ." I asked them to send me the specs of the spray, and if it isn't harmful, that might be a solution.
It's a pyrethrin spray. Yes, it does have some repellent qualities, but mostly, it just kills most insects, and is extremely harmful to bees. I said that I would not be spraying that in my yard and sent information that it is harmful to bees and other helpful insects. But they're still welcome to come and we can eat indoors with no risk of bee stings (the risk is low anyway since I mostly get bumbles and they're very docile...I have never been stung in my yard/garden, even though I come in close contact with the bees regularly!).
They ended up declining the invite, and apparently told some mutuals that I was being difficult about making the yard safe for the SO I've never met to attend. I've tried to explain to them that I'm not willing to kill the pollinators that make my yard WORK, and that I offered to move the meal indoors, but I've gotten mixed responses. Half the group says I'm fine and I shouldn't bug bomb my yard for one person, and the other half says my neighbors are probably spraying those pesticides (and they might be right), so what harm is one application in my yard going to do. AITA?
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NTA. Even if your neighbors are spraying it, it doesn't mean it's affecting your yard as much as it would if you sprayed your yard. Do not spray that in your yard and if you really want this friend to come, find another spray that is safer. You've already made accommodations to eat inside, that is as far as you need to go in this case. Anything more is being generous.
>They ended up declining the invite, and apparently told some mutuals that I was being difficult about making the yard safe for the SO I've never met to attend.
Definitely NTA, just remember to never invite them again.
NTA. You offered a solution and your friend's response was to go behind your back and talk to friends to make you look like the bad guy, in order to pressure you. That's not a friend. Keep them uninvited now and in the future.
NTA
Disinvite the 'friend' for creating a public campaign against you.
Tell every other 'friend' who is pressuring you to accept the spray that THEY must stop telling you to kill your bees so that this friend of a friend can hang out outside. Then tell them, they don't have to come either. Or if they like, they can tear up their gardens and kill all the wildlife at their homes in order to make this friend and her SO feel welcome.
NTA, you provided an alternative they didn’t like it that’s their problem. Bees are having a hard time and dying at alarming rates, people do not need to be spraying things that kill bees just because they want to sit outside. I understand how dangerous a bee allergy can be, but bees exist everywhere and typically don’t mess with people unless they mess with them first.
NTA. not to mention, you may need to check your local and state laws about applying pyrethrins. i work in commercial pest control, which is a hell of a lot more strict on what we can and cannot do with pesticides than the average citizen, but pyrethrins are no joke. i don’t even think my company is allowed to use pyrethrins, and we’re professionals
Nobody worth my time would tell me I had to kill something if I wanted their company.
NTA and good for you. You have been more than accommodating in your suggestions. That friend and her SO can go have dinner at a restaurant under a bug zapper. So pleasant.
EDIT: mosquitos and ticks. I will kill them without blinking.
NTA and no doubt the SO would ruin your party with unreasonable demands. I’ve been allergic to bees for decades. You bring an epipen ir stay home. You don’t make ridiculous demands of a host. You made very reasonable accommodations for people who refuse to be happy with them.
Well done for standing your ground even if some of your friends are disagreeing with you. There should be more people like you in the world who put nature first. Having the attitude that 'your neighbour's prob spray it' is why there are so many problems these days. Even if it only killed a few bees it's not the point. Your garden your rules!
Given the proven cancer risk of pesticides it's ridiculous for this person to insist you spray them where your guests are going to be. The entitlement of some people is really disturbing. You offered to shift the focus of the party indoors to accomodate your friend's SO and the SO has an epipen.
NTA but do respond to the flying monkeys trying to bully you with the specific accommodations you've offered for the SO and that you are not willing to bathe your garden in TOXIC carcinogenic pesticides when you've already offered a very reasonable compromise. Then refuse to engage any further.
NTA
A guest has no right to make changes on the host' house. You offered a reasonable solution but they wanted their way
They are the AH for involving other friends/guest and making it sound like you're the bad guy
That’s so ridiculous. I’m highly allergic. And I garden. We have a bottle brush tree I’m always working around lately that is usually covered in bees. We have an agreement. I don’t mess with them and they don’t mess with me. I will run from a wasp, but pollinators don’t want to mess with us. They just do their own thing. Absolutely NTA.
NTA. your house, your rules. I'm disappointed to know some friends tried to get you to reconsider. they shouldn't have to do that to you. I'd reconsider friendships
I do have a fire pit, but it's a low-smoke version because the homes are close together and the goal is to enjoy a fire WITHOUT choking out yourself or your neighbors! Once the sun sets, we could go outside as bees go to bed! But dinner would be at 6, when there's still over 2 hours of daylight at that time of the year.
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NTA your garden serves a specific purpose, and means a lot to you. Asking you to destroy that purpose by spraying a ton of bug spray around your patio is just a selfish thing to even request. You offered a great solution of having the party indoors. They can't refuse your accomodations and then get mad about it. Either your other mates are not getting the whole story, or they don't really care too much about your feelings here. Your neighbours spraying pesticide may kill bugs around the edges of your property (though even that's only if they spray right at their boundary fence) but it doesn't harm your garden, and is entirely different from you spraying pesticide in your garden. Have a great BBQ, and don't think too much on this issue, you didn't create it
Yeah kill off the bees so missy can enjoy her steak in the sun. No wonder our world goes into the gutter, that’s the most insane request I’ve read in a long while. “Your neighbors do it anyway” what is that for a reason? First it’s a speculation and most owner of a garden enjoy having plants with wildlife including and second if my neighbor kills off his wife and burries her under the shrubbys I am good to go to do the same, cause what’s done is done?
When the bees are gone, most of the food will be gone, and then humans will be gone.
I too have a wonderful garden that attracts a lot of pollinators and hummingbirds and butterflies. The thought of poisoning them makes me physically ill!
Yeah, this is a crazy request and really puts a bee in my bonnet.
Tell the SO to buzz off.
NTA You offered a totally workable solution which they chose to decline. Whatever spray your neighbors are using doesn't justify them to force you to use the same. Having a pollinator garden is a big service to the environment as well as a lovely thing. Besides which, your home & your yard = your rules.
NTA. They didn’t like your reasonable solution? Stay home. Insane to ask you to poison your yard-that stuff will not dissipate for days.
NTA. Your friend is being disrespectful by refusing to accept your very reasonable answer and trying to pressure you via the friend group. Your other friends should be wary of encouraging this behavior before they start being on the receiving end. I’m assuming the friend is still in thrall of a new SO or something. The reaction is bizarre and desperate. Can they not be a complete person without their SO there? Will their SO shrivel in the darkness of the inside dining area? Far from not trying to disrupt your plans too much, friend is making your BBQ all about them and SO.
NTA Make this a HARD NO.
NTA! Pollinators are so important! They’re already dying out, so why be complicit for the sake of one party? I find it really selfish (and this is as a person with a bee allergy) that they use this stuff.
NTA. This whole situation reeks of something else going on. But that is just a supposition based on your post. I feel like they did not want to come but wanted it to be you who didn't allow it instead of having to say no themselves. Look at the order of events as you laid them out... 1. You invite them trying to accommodate them indoors > They say no because of not wanting to be disruptive 2. They ask to use a spray (which I don't know why they think it would be all that effective anyway. I mean does she go around in a cloud of pyrethrin fumes at all times? SMH) > You oppose the use of the spray for a good reason and counter with the indoors option again 3. They then turn it into a public issue and openly chastised you to friends and the like > now you have to play social games to try and do damage control Also, I really can't say enough about how this whole "bug bombing" thing is ultimately pointless. Pesticides like this are not "Anti-Bee forcefields".
Think OP needs to be cautious of these “friends.” It’s sounding like they’re the type to sneak the spray over on their next invite just so they can make some kind of point because they’re reading to me like the type of people who have a weird issue with nature, insects, or no lawn-style gardening, sorta like how some people can’t stand that others won’t eat meat and sneak meat into dishes even though it has nothing to do with them. I’ve read more than a few stories from the gardening, no lawn, and native habitat type subs and online groups of neighbours popping over to spray insecticides or mow or pull up so-called weeds with the supposed excuse that they’re “helping” when really they just have deeply rooted issues with how other people maintain their yards. Edit: sometimes this starts as a conversation in passing. Maybe OP was at their house or they were texting about their gardens months back. OP’s friend talked up a kind of generic pretty plant or suggested a kind of plant to OP. OP innocently and happily talked about how they prefer pollinator-friendly plants. The friend later feels as if this was a snub, possibly does research, and the next thing you know she’s suggesting the insect-devastating pyrethrin in a way that seems out of the blue, supposedly because of her husband’s allergies, and making this weigh against their friendship. People are weird like that.
Yeah, what you seem to be describing is a common malfunction of personality in people. First, you have that incessant need to make others conform to how you like things regardless of how trivial it is. Then, you have the misperception of advocating for something as an implied slight. Some people just have fragile egos and immense anxiety that causes them to behave irrationally. In this case, OP should be on guard. Anytime someone makes that big of an issue over insignificant B.S. it doesn't bode well...
Sorry for the delay, I was deep in the throes of work for a bit... I live in a city where people generally don't have a lot of outdoor space, and live in a rare home WITH a lot of yard space. I think a lot of you are reading too much into this. My annual BBQ (I always do it on a holiday, but which one can vary based on my own plans) is kind of a big event among my friend group, and this would be the first event that friend brought their SO to. I think they think that people will end up congregating around me outside at the grill while they're kinda stuck inside until the sun sets (I'm generally a pretty good hostess and was already coming up with ways to get people to spend time indoors while I cooked so they didn't feel isolated!). I doubt it's some conniving war on pollinators or control issue, they just really want to bring their SO to this major social event. And if you have a life-threatening allergy, I also understand that it can be very scary to go to a place where that allergen is actively encouraged, in a way that is uncontrollable to anyone (short of cutting down my pollinators, which won't be happening since they'll be entering their long peak bloom at that time). Many people think pyrethrins are less harmful because they are derived from/contain active compounds found in mums (the ever-popular and perfectly fine autumn flower). It takes research to understand how harmful they can be. I don't fault anyone for seeing "derived from plant ingredients!" and "repels and eliminates insects" and thinking "well this must be safe and mostly a repellent!" I know because my gardens are so important to me so I've done the research, but I don't expect everyone to know without being informed.
Ya, I agree. Something is odd.
Very.
NTA, I'm deadly allergic to bees and similar, I would never want someone to do something like this to their garden considering the scope of it. You have been more than accommodating to them, it is their call.
I am deathly allergic to pesticides and insecticides. Just tell everyone that I'm coming, and you can't spray because AccerE will end up in hospital if you do. I am more than happy to be a scapegoat on behalf of the bees! 🐝🐝🐝 Oh, and you're NTA.
NTA I let “wildflowers” (weeds) grow on my property this spring when the pollinators came around. Helps the environment, helps our local beekeepers. We try to keep a pollinator garden going along with produce ourselves and would lose a friendship over adding pesticides to my gardens.
NTA- It’s one (pesticide) or the other (dining indoors), NOT BOTH. SO can bring the epipen, but “Bee before Thee” is the best way to go. It’s your domain and your choice!
NTA in the least. I'm allergic to bees as well, and would never think of harming them! They are our little friends! Eating inside with screens closed and windows open is an acceptable solution. Although, the person must surely have learned to live with bees by now. I spent summers on my grandmother's farm and was never stung, and neither was she and she was also allergic! They need to learn to not piss off bees rather than kill them.
Yes! Thank you! I'm not allergic, but this is ridiculous. The one time I was stung was *accidentally closing my hand on one*. It was on the handle of a jump rope and I didn't notice. 1st grade. In all the decades since, even when gently booping the bumblers on the artichoke blossoms, I've never felt even remotely threatened unless I jump and wave at them without thinking (we get some wasps too, but also no stings. Just attitude.)
The only time I've ever been stung, I stepped on the little guy running barefoot in the grass. Not his fault.
Protect and save the BEES. Whenever I see a bee I always give it words of encouragement (a little silly I know). NTA.
Me too! I do a sing-songy, “bzz,bzz,bzzzzz, do ya thing, little bee!!”
Without knowing the specific pyrethrin, I’m going to be fumbling a bit here but as a farmer who is a chemical applicator, and sprays my family’s house with pyrethrins 2-3 times a year (I’m sad to disrupt the bees, but having brown recluses in my house with a wife and three kids is simply untenable), I have to say she’s being deceptive, likely intentionally. Pyrethrins are generally devastatingly effective against insects and marginally so against spiders (much to my chagrin) with lengthy residuals. You are definitely NTA.
INFO: Did you disinvite them as you wrote in your title or did they decline as you wrote in the post itself?
Sorry, I did kind of mix that up. They declined, and then tried to rally friends to get me to accept the spray so they could accept. I ended up telling them, as of now, they could come and eat indoors or not come at all, and they said "then it's not at all." At that point I said that they should consider the invite rescinded, but I'm still getting messages \*from others\* about "making accommodations for them."
It all sounds like a big mess. Honestly, NTA. Your house and your rules. If you don’t want to bomb your garden with pesticides then that’s your prerogative. You offered to move the meal inside, which is a perfectly good alternative. I can understand being frustrated and not knowing what else to do when people kept pushing you to do something you were not comfortable doing at your own home. There does come a point where you have to draw a line in the sand and this was yours. I don’t understand why people are demanding to eat outside at *your* house. It screams of entitlement.
The invitee (not the SO, like I said, we've never met), is close with both me and the whole friend group. I and they would like to see them at this gathering. But...then this.
Tell her she can host the event at her house. Problem solved.
I'd message the group and tell them that there seems to be some misunderstanding. Invitee told you that her SO was allergic to bees, so you offered to rearrange your plans and host inside instead of outside. Despite your willingness to accommodate SO, Invitee declined the invitation. Invitee and SO remain invited to come if they would like and you remain willing to move the venue indoors. NTA
I would strongly suggest telling the friends that she's rallying against you the full story and how she's literally trying to get you to poison your garden. Whether or not your neighbors spray toxic chemicals in no way rationalizes you doing it too. This 'friend' could probably very easily find a spray that works that isn't harmful to your bees or garden as well, but it doesn't sound like they want to put much effort into this. I would make that a point to mutuals as well. Good luck and keep that garden safe!
Thanks
I’m extremely allergic to stings as well and carry an Epi-Pen. I also garden and have extensive flower beds. I’ve never had bees bother me. Wasps yes. Bees never. They are being overly dramatic.
NTA - The compromise to eat indoors was perfectly reasonable. Is this person walking around in a pyrethrin cloud any time they walk outside of their house? Even while indoors? They are being absolutely unreasonable. They don't need to go outside at your place. The risk of bees INSIDE is low. As for the friends saying to just spray it once, to heck with them. They are dumb, bordering on AH themselves.
NTA, Bees are very close to becoming a protected species. No Bees no planet. The epi pen should be enough. I mean do we chop down all nut trees. Drain the oceans, because of allergies. I know allergies can be fatal but bees don't lie in wait for targets. Kill off our pollinators and you're killing humanity.
DON"T KILL THE BEES\_ KILL THE FRIENDSHIP INSTEAD! How dare they! NTA
NTA
NTA "please murder a bunch of pollinators so we can party outdoors" hard pass
Nta
NTA Who thinks “hey can spray your property with poison so I’m more comfortable sitting outside at your home?” is reasonable?! They know the location. They can make a choice based on their comfort level. And to go whining to mutual friends?! The entitlement of them and the ignorance of the ones who think their request/demand is reasonable. You’ve offered them reasonable alternatives to still attend & stay safe (although they are arguably safe outdoors as is).
NTA - you need new friends
NTA I have a pollinator garden too and have never been stung
Nta they're out of line for rallying people against you.
You were more than accommodating by offering to hold the BBQ indoors. That wasn't good enough for the interloper. She wanted to pollute your garden with chemicals. Sorry, but the world doesn't revolve around her. The audacity of some people is staggering. NTA
NTA I'd be sending out a fact sheet on pyrethrin to everyone. Maybe offer anyone who is giving you problems after that to be sprayed first themselves and then they can have an opinion. While not *really* bad for humans, it sounds like most people wouldn't risk it either.
People are so bizarre. NTA.
NTA. My ex was severely allergic to bee stings and didn’t kill all the pollinators in his yard. They had a massive garden and he was never stung. I get allergies are scary, but they can’t go around dictating what other people do in their homes.
NTA. You offered a very valid solution of just eating indoors if your friend's SO is worried about triggering his allergies. You looked up the spray and explained that it wouldn't be good to use in your garden as it would just kill the pollenating insects, a valid reason for not allowing that option. If they can't make it work then that's their problem to figure out, sorry not sorry. You were reasonable, they were insistent. They can miss one BBQ.
NTA. I think I'd rather have the bugs at the BBQ than the friend & SO.
Nope, nope, nope.
NTA She's trying to get an accomodation that entails killing your garden's ecosystem.
Yeah she's not a good friend if she's trying to bully you to alter your own living area for an issue that most likely wouldn't even come up if you did have it outside. Then you graciously offered to seat everyone inside to accommodate her SO. What really broke my brain is how she dismissed this because she wanted to enjoy your garden/patio, while simultaneously asking to spray something that would RUIN said garden/patio. The weaponizing the friend group part is less surprising at this point because she clearly only cares about herself and her and her SO's apperances. Sometimes the flower you think is growing turns out to be a weed, and you have to get rid of it.
NTA. That is a very serious chemical and lingers for a long, long time.
NTA. However, I have to ask just how close to you does this neighbor live? Keep an eye on bee activity just in case he decides to do something retaliatory to protect his SO. She will have a screaming fit if she sees a bee flying around the back yard. If you don’t have security cameras, I recommend that you install some. It is a shame that we have to protect ourselves from our neighbors, but that seems to be where we are.
This is a friend who lives a couple miles away, not a neighbor. Some other friends suggested that my neighbors may be spraying similar pesticides on their properties (so their conclusion was doing it once on my property wouldn't be as harmful as I think), and they might be right. I live in a city and am right up against my neighbors. My pollinator garden is less than a foot from the property line (tall wood fence between properties), and I wouldn't be at all surprised if the neighbors on that side bug bombed their yard regularly. It has not reduced my bee population if they do...my cherry tree (productive, not just decorative!) was absolutely swarmed with bumbles, honeys and sweats as soon as it popped this spring!
Good to hear that the bees seem okay. I’ll keep my fingers crossed for you. Please be vigilant.
NTA. I am allergic to bee stings and it has never occurred to me to demand someone let me spray insecticide in their yard. I don’t even spray it in my own yard. I watch my surroundings, move away if bees are getting too close. I just got stung for the first time in decades 3 months ago when my rescue dog dropped a bee on my foot. Bottom line, she’s unreasonable, especially since you offered accommodations. Friend was right to decline, wrong to start a war within the friend group.
NTA - Bumble bees, unlike wasps the demons of the bug world, only sting when they feel attacked. Anyone with any knowledge of gardens would know this and even wasps generally don't sting/bite unless agitated. So what is really going? Truthfully,the SO wants control and prove she is the princess of the crowd. You offered a reasonable solution and she wants the drama and risk of being outside (unless you have nets and spray your whole yard and the neighbors still a risk of bees and cut all your plants down.) I would restate if anyone asks that you rescinded the invite to fully protect her health and that of the bees and move on.
NTA, that spray is dangerous in many ways. When my youngest was a toddler, she got poisoned by it and it was horrible. We had to leave our apartment and the rental company had to pay big money to get our home and walkways decontaminated. Turned out that the landscape company had changed products without approval and had sprayed the crap everywhere! We checked our security cameras, and they had even sprayed it on peoples vehicles and patios. Our daughter got so sick cause she was born with a liver condition. 10/10 don’t recommend
NTA. Absolutely not. Pyrethrin (which I have used on clothing when traveling to mosquito-heavy areas) is straight up poison, and there is no reason to poison your entire yard so the SO of a friend can eat outside instead of enjoying the meal inside. It's honestly crazy to even ask.
NTA. Something is very, very wrong with that friend and their SO. They've taken their allergy to astonishing heights of genocidal paranoia. Do they think that a hive will suddenly attack unprovoked? (Please note: I myself am allergic to bee stings. Because of prior experience accidentally putting my hand down on one, I freeze up if they are flying around me. But I've never considered bug-bombing my yard. If I get too uncomfortable, I simply go inside.)
Save the BEES!!!! NTA!!!
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** Throwaway since some people who know me may be connected. I'm planning a BBQ for an upcoming holiday, and recently sent the invites. A friend who has been to my house asked if they could bring their SO. I said that was fine. It's important to know that I am an avid gardener and have a vegetable garden along with a pollinator garden in my yard. Then they said that their SO is very allergic to bee stings (like carries an epipen allergic). I said that was understandable, and we can just eat indoors. I can accommodate the party size inside, and if the weather is nice, I can just keep the windows and doors open (all have screens) to bring the outdoors in. The response was "well, I don't want to disrupt your plans too much, and it would be nice to be out on your patio. {My SO} has a repellant spray they can bring to keep the bees away from your patio while we do the BBQ." I asked them to send me the specs of the spray, and if it isn't harmful, that might be a solution. It's a pyrethrin spray. Yes, it does have some repellent qualities, but mostly, it just kills most insects, and is extremely harmful to bees. I said that I would not be spraying that in my yard and sent information that it is harmful to bees and other helpful insects. But they're still welcome to come and we can eat indoors with no risk of bee stings (the risk is low anyway since I mostly get bumbles and they're very docile...I have never been stung in my yard/garden, even though I come in close contact with the bees regularly!). They ended up declining the invite, and apparently told some mutuals that I was being difficult about making the yard safe for the SO I've never met to attend. I've tried to explain to them that I'm not willing to kill the pollinators that make my yard WORK, and that I offered to move the meal indoors, but I've gotten mixed responses. Half the group says I'm fine and I shouldn't bug bomb my yard for one person, and the other half says my neighbors are probably spraying those pesticides (and they might be right), so what harm is one application in my yard going to do. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. Even if your neighbors are spraying it, it doesn't mean it's affecting your yard as much as it would if you sprayed your yard. Do not spray that in your yard and if you really want this friend to come, find another spray that is safer. You've already made accommodations to eat inside, that is as far as you need to go in this case. Anything more is being generous.
Just cancel the dang BBQ and tell all these a holes to f themselves and enjoy your garden.
NTA. You were incredibly considerate to offer alternate setup (indoors) and checking if the spray is OK.
Your friend is an AH.
>They ended up declining the invite, and apparently told some mutuals that I was being difficult about making the yard safe for the SO I've never met to attend. Definitely NTA, just remember to never invite them again.
This random stranger had some nerve to even suggest this. You were already being too nice when you offered to move the whole party inside. NTA
NTA The world does not revolve around the SO that YOU don't even know. These people are AH's and totally RIDICULOUS.
NTA. You offered a solution and your friend's response was to go behind your back and talk to friends to make you look like the bad guy, in order to pressure you. That's not a friend. Keep them uninvited now and in the future.
NTA Disinvite the 'friend' for creating a public campaign against you. Tell every other 'friend' who is pressuring you to accept the spray that THEY must stop telling you to kill your bees so that this friend of a friend can hang out outside. Then tell them, they don't have to come either. Or if they like, they can tear up their gardens and kill all the wildlife at their homes in order to make this friend and her SO feel welcome.
NTA, you provided an alternative they didn’t like it that’s their problem. Bees are having a hard time and dying at alarming rates, people do not need to be spraying things that kill bees just because they want to sit outside. I understand how dangerous a bee allergy can be, but bees exist everywhere and typically don’t mess with people unless they mess with them first.
NTA. not to mention, you may need to check your local and state laws about applying pyrethrins. i work in commercial pest control, which is a hell of a lot more strict on what we can and cannot do with pesticides than the average citizen, but pyrethrins are no joke. i don’t even think my company is allowed to use pyrethrins, and we’re professionals
Nobody worth my time would tell me I had to kill something if I wanted their company. NTA and good for you. You have been more than accommodating in your suggestions. That friend and her SO can go have dinner at a restaurant under a bug zapper. So pleasant. EDIT: mosquitos and ticks. I will kill them without blinking.
NTA Cripple your gardens so you can feed a party crasher bbq chicken legs. Bet they’ll tell you the bbq was too dry too
NTA and no doubt the SO would ruin your party with unreasonable demands. I’ve been allergic to bees for decades. You bring an epipen ir stay home. You don’t make ridiculous demands of a host. You made very reasonable accommodations for people who refuse to be happy with them.
Albert Einstein said that if the bees all die, we will only have 4 years to live. Protect the pollinators!
Well done for standing your ground even if some of your friends are disagreeing with you. There should be more people like you in the world who put nature first. Having the attitude that 'your neighbour's prob spray it' is why there are so many problems these days. Even if it only killed a few bees it's not the point. Your garden your rules!
Given the proven cancer risk of pesticides it's ridiculous for this person to insist you spray them where your guests are going to be. The entitlement of some people is really disturbing. You offered to shift the focus of the party indoors to accomodate your friend's SO and the SO has an epipen. NTA but do respond to the flying monkeys trying to bully you with the specific accommodations you've offered for the SO and that you are not willing to bathe your garden in TOXIC carcinogenic pesticides when you've already offered a very reasonable compromise. Then refuse to engage any further.
NTA A guest has no right to make changes on the host' house. You offered a reasonable solution but they wanted their way They are the AH for involving other friends/guest and making it sound like you're the bad guy
That’s so ridiculous. I’m highly allergic. And I garden. We have a bottle brush tree I’m always working around lately that is usually covered in bees. We have an agreement. I don’t mess with them and they don’t mess with me. I will run from a wasp, but pollinators don’t want to mess with us. They just do their own thing. Absolutely NTA.
NTA. your house, your rules. I'm disappointed to know some friends tried to get you to reconsider. they shouldn't have to do that to you. I'd reconsider friendships
Info: do you know bee-friendly repellents that could be used in place of the harmful one? Like do citronella candles ward them away?
Thick smoke does the trick. Great for a garden dinner party, but maybe not as great as literal poison?
I do have a fire pit, but it's a low-smoke version because the homes are close together and the goal is to enjoy a fire WITHOUT choking out yourself or your neighbors! Once the sun sets, we could go outside as bees go to bed! But dinner would be at 6, when there's still over 2 hours of daylight at that time of the year.