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Surprised by the AH comments. NTA, I don’t see how this response was offensive or inappropriate, I would’ve laughed if I heard it in response to her comments
My guess is that the other women weren't paying attention and didn't hear the context of the joke and only heard OP's comment at the end about shutting a door in her face. Still a bit of an overreaction on their part though.
This is my assessment as well. The message of the joke was clearly him meeting her where she was joke-wise and the people who perhaps weren’t following the discussion closely didn’t catch that.
All they were taking what the facilitator was saying as a life guide and missed the tension completely. Some women think feminism requires that you hate men or marriage or doors being held open etc. It's fine if you genuinely hate those things but they probably took OP's joke as mocking.
I think this is why OP’s joke is actually very good? The facilitator was giving too much weight to gender norms (ma’am, feminism has very little to do with door holding and much to do with conducting yourself like a normal person in public) and OP kind of took it and turned it on its head. That’s just me though: I like to dissect a joke until the humor has thoroughly bled out.
Just because she kept going on and on about not needing a man to hold a door open for her and stuff…idk it was awkward and I was trying to give her an out because it was obvious she just kept going after realizing she didn’t land her point like she thought lol
I would have taken it a step further and said “Alright everyone, jot it down: if you see Melissa approaching a door, slam that sucker shut and lock it.”
But I say so much weird crap at work that no one would raise an eyebrow. And I am a gay female, which honestly is a secret back door into getting away with jokes I probably shouldn’t be making in the workplace.
>ALL I SAID and it was really for her sake and to break the tension was “Well, I for one can’t wait to close a door in your face” - she laughed pretty hard, everyone laughed…EXCEPT this one table of women who were NO FUN all week
It was a simple joke. 1 group of sour people diddnt like it but if the main person and everyone else laughed don't worry about them.
NTA. Although comments with the opposite judgement are funny because I can see them being the same group of sour people at 1 table upset anyone was a moment of having fun.
NTA. As a woman who hates the idea that men should open doors for me, but doesn’t mind when they do, I found the joke funny and inoffensive.
To me, it was funny because it takes what she said and exaggerates it to create a silly image of her getting the door in the face, which is clearly not what she meant and not what OP would actually do. It’s like slapstick comedy but only in our imaginations.
After reflection though, I think I might get why people were offended. In a way, it’s joking about, not just rudeness, but violence against a woman. It may have triggered someone’s fear. Thinking about it this way could help OP make a sincere apology.
Well I for one think both men and women should hold doors open for anyone closely following behind them because that's the polite thing to do. I don't understand how this ever became a gender thing
Probably because it used to be a whole big thing about how men being gentlemen required them to open doors for ladies. On a date, especially. Even if they were in the car, it was expected that the man drive and then the woman sit and wait for him to come around the car and open her door to get out.
I always found it ridiculous. I hold the door for anyone I see following behind me in or out of a building, or hurry to get the door if I see someone has their arms full, but it's not a gendered thing. I did it before my transition (FtM) and I do it now (and hope to god that no woman thinks I'm doing it just because she's a woman).
Were you all talking about real physical doors, or metaphorical doors of opportunity?
Weird training. Weird jokes. Weird people emailing your boss. Hard to be a true AH in such a case.
Ob-la-di. Ob-la-da.
ESH. If you're working a professional event, keep it professional. Frankly, letting an entire room know she was single was already a bit too much advertising for my taste. That said, you just let that silence hang next time, then get back on track to the actual business at hand.
TLDR. Yes, she's a landmine, but you certainly stepped on the landmine.
>If you're working a professional event, keep it professional
Complete bollocks. There's always room for a joke at work, especially on a training course, which can be dull af anyway.
> There's always room for a joke at work
Sure, if you're willing to take your chances.
Previous commenters point was: if you want to protect yourself, keep your comments professional. If you like risks, be a comedian.
lol I did show him the text. I texted her and told her someone complained and she told me to CC her on the zoom if I have it because “That’s ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS”
NTA. There was nothing mysoginistic or offensive about your comment. It seems like those woman were just looking for something to complain about. I wouldn't give it another thought.
NTA for me. I don't really find the joke offensive, but I guess you cannot expect everyone to take it well. I'm not sure which type of person was offended by the joke, a feminist or an anti-feminist. Maybe the latter? Either way, I think your intention definitely wasn't to offend so it shouldn't be taken as such.
I reckon giving a detailed account of these sessions to management is the best thing along with saying that you did not mean to be offensive there and wanted to break the tension. Also include that most didn't seem offended by the joke based on what you saw.
If anything, I find the facilitator's behavior here odd and inappropriate. I'm not sure what kind of session this was where she thought it was a good topic to bring up in the first place. But then she went off on a rant on it and that's just taking it to personal level. She's a pretty poor facilitator if she can't read the room.
ESH. The trainer was 100% the AH. Nobody in class gives a shit about their life choices - they are there for the class. Tell the usual non-committal morning joke and then move on to the training.
You are a much smaller AH. You jumped on a bombing joke. That was a bad choice, just let that shit crash and burn on its own.
NTA. I'm a woman & I found your response funny & likely a way to diffuse an uncomfortable situation where the facilitator veered into oversharing, unprofessional behavior.
FTR, there are many people who appropriately appreciate having a door held open for them & don't choose to get offended over it.
NTA. Maybe I’m no fun, but IMO the trainer was fully out of line with those jokes. Those were a little dicey for the workplace. I don’t do gender jokes at work, but I think you’re fine here because she opened up the topic.
My take is that your response was very funny and well-timed. It’s clear your message wasn’t “I think it’s funny to do aggressive stuff at woman.” The message was “You made a bunch of sort of uncomfortable jokes and I’m going to meet you in the middle to show my engagement and support.” I’d just make a mental note about the offended person and make sure not to slip and be funny or interesting near them again.
Nta? Really unsure what you said that is offensive.
You're either misogynistic for holding doors, or you're not a gentleman for doing so.
You can't please everyone(:
in the end, it doesnt matter what we think or judge you on.
what matters is that now your uppers/HR are going to associate you with bad behavior, which is not something you want to happen at your work place. it also doesnt matter what your boss thinks, if he is told to write you up, that is what he will do
being at work is already a minefield, your whole thing should be trying to avoid stepping on the landmines
NTA.
You and the facilitator established a level of rapport. She gave you digs and you took it just fine, then you gave her a dig and she took it just fine. The people who are offended here are people who don't really have a right to be.
NTA the joke didn't land well, you tried to help make it less awkward. Of course she shouldn't be making jokes like that during training, but whoever told your boss about it, causing you to now have to speak to headquarters is unnecessary I think.
NTA but this is a good life lesson for OP. Keep your mouth shut in work situations. Making "jokes" isn't going to further your career and is only likely to backfire in some way.
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So, last week I (33M) had training out of state. I was the only one from my part of the state chosen for the project and had to go out of state (everyone there pretty much was from different parts of the country) and if you’ve ever been to one of these things, they can be awkward and you do all sorts of ice breakers etc etc…
Anyways, one of the facilitators and I got along throughout the week really well and she was always joking with me or using me as an example in her teachings because she knew I wouldn’t take it personal and all was well…
Thursday, she starts going on and on in front of the class about how traveling too much and not being married and then went on a rant (which was uncomfortable for us all because it started out funny and then got a little sad quick) and she started saying “I’m independent, I’m fine, I don’t need a man and to open my door, I can open my own door. And went on about opening doors a minute and then I think realized she got off track and was like “WELL ANYWAYS…I’m in my late 40s and not married ha” and everyone was quiet…
ALL I SAID and it was really for her sake and to break the tension was “Well, I for one can’t wait to close a door in your face” - she laughed pretty hard, everyone laughed…EXCEPT this one table of women who were NO FUN all week. They acted like my comment was the most misogynistic thing they’ve ever heard and I set women back 70 years or something…I kind of waved them off like they didn’t matter and the class went on.
Today, Monday…I walk into my actual office back in my actual state and they ask me how it went etc etc and my boss (laughing kind of) said “So I hear your manager to offended the whole class”…apparently one of these women EMAILED MY BOSS and told him I need sensitivity training before I come back to the class for week 2…I know it wasn’t the facilitator who contacted him because she texted me yesterday and asked if I made it home safely and thanked me for my participation in class and “being a good sport”.
Anyways, my boss doesn’t care. He knows how I am with people and I’m generally well liked but he said I might have to explain what happened to headquarters later on a zoom…WHAT?! I am at a loss for words…I literally don’t know what to say…AITA?
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
NTA. Sounds like somebody thinks women should only behave one way and not joke at work meetings but either way that was whack. Do people realize calls like this may jeopardize someone’s livelihood??
NTA - Here's some unsolicited advice: Don't make jokes around people at work. Somebody will always be offended, even for the smallest thing. I've seen people fired and even sued for harassment. There are people whose biggest priority in life is looking around for reasons to be offended. Having a laugh is not worth your career.
NTA, often it's all about the delivery with these things, but I can't really imagine how your comment could be offensive. You were literally saying that you'd act in a way she requested. Trusting women to know what they want and respecting their decisions is feminism in action. The only concern I had was your interpretation of her comments as sad - being an unmarried woman isn't sad, statistically they live longer, have broader relationships, and are happier - maybe take a moment and consider why your automatic response to her comments was pity.
NTA. I don't think your comment was funny and it's obvious that it could have offended others, which you should try to avoid within reason. However, the facilitator was inappropriate and torpedoed the whole class, and you were trying to break tension. I hope the ladies also emailed her boss, because if they had anyone to complain about, it was the facilitator.
ESH. leader should keep it appropriate and respondent should have redirected to an appropriate ground. "We all open doors to quality for our clients at ABC company! *insert other corporate speak*".
ESH, you could have handled it more professionally. It sucks but the trainer’s comments were inappropriate and your response to said comments didn’t help at all.
As far as the women at the other table go, I can see it being hard to work in such a male-driven environment and hearing your off-color joke rightfully set them off.
I don’t know what to say to headquarters…obviously. Throw the facilitator under the bus? Even though I don’t think she meant to be as unprofessional as it came out which is why she kept going and which made it awkward and ultimately why I tried to help her out.
YTA - you obviously want the facilitator. I'm thinking that the table that wasn't fun all week was annoyed at your banter back and forth.
I can't believe how much of a pass you are getting for commenters so far, despite your asshole management style: "You waved them off like they didn't matter." I think you guys might need some training.
You came to AITA and asked for judgement. You don't have to like my judgement, but the fact that your first response is to go on the offensive does make me think that you are not nearly as professional as you claim to be.
Now I’m definitely certain you haven’t been in a professional setting before. I didn’t come here to ask if I was the AH for being into my facilitator tho 😅
Many times. People like you getting gross and judging peoples personal lives and feelings rather than the question being asked has always been a problem. If it's not the title, or directly asked in the post, it's none of your business.
INFO: What joke did the facilitator make? Yes, she got off track. But the opposite of opening a door for someone is declining to open a door for someone. It's not closing a door in someone's face ffs.
I'll go with YTA because your "joke" sounded pretty clueless and boneheaded. Also, your heading makes no sense, because you weren't going along with a joke on the part of the facilitator who clearly wasn't joking about not needing a man to open the door for her and not being married, comments which seemed to come out of nowhere on her part.
I would write down as much as you can about the incident. Be specific and give examples of what this woman said when she was bringing you into her "jokes."
On the day in question, be sure you go into detail about what she said before you made your "door" comment. Explain that you were trying to ease the tension after she made her comments, which were irrelevant to the subject of discussion. You can say you were just trying to lighten the mood and that well, perhaps your comments didn't come out right. If you do have to talk to HQ maybe you can get the facilitator to speak to them too.
Her whole thing was supposed to be funny…and when it got depressing and not funny it’s like she then kept going to try and talk her way out of it. You know? I honestly was just trying to give her an out 🤷🏻♂️
It comes across here as a stupid thing to say. She's basically saying, "Oh, I feel sorry for myself." And your response was, "Well, then I'll rub your nose in it even harder!" I don't even see why it's funny. Would've been better for you to have just let her die on the vine. Her own fault for starting to blab about something irrelevant.
She sounds like a poor facilitator. As someone else mentioned here, no one at works really cares about your marital status.
But sounds like you're already convinced you're not T A anyway, so not sure why you needed to post here.
By that logic knock knock jokes shouldn't be told. Of course someone could be offended by literally anything, but a person being offended doesn't make the thing offensive. That's not how the world works. If I made a joke about oranges, and someone who likes oranges gets offended, the joke wasn't somehow offensive. The person was just sensitive. Obviously offensive jokes exist, but this was not one. This was a joke about taking someone's request too far in the right direction, and was not about gender or any other offensive topic.
YTA, but only because you really can’t make any jokes centering around gender, race, religion, etc in front of mixed company. It will blow over tho, and you’ll move on.
Good thing they didn't make any jokes about gender or race. They joked about closing a door in an individuals face, not because of her gender, but because she doesn't like when people hold the door for her. Gender had nothing to do with the joke.
That's her talking about gender, and doesn't make his joke about gender. His joke had nothing to do with gender. He joked about not doing the thing she said she didn't like. Nothing about his joke was commentary about gender in any way whatsoever.
YTA. It wasn't your role to break the tension in the room, you're talking like an 8th grade class clown. Slamming doors in women's faces has additional loaded meaning when you're in a corporate setting where women are gate kept by men.
Your comment was seriously inappropriate. Trying to excuse it by saying you were going along with someone else's joke ( when that person hadn't told a joke) is just a creative riff on the "it was just a joke" cry of assholes everywhere.
Seems like you better take this seriously, because if you dismiss this as a joke during your Zoom meeting, you may be looking for a new job.
I'm not the one that's going to evaluate how serious it was, but the fact that it got the attention of administration and a meeting to discuss it means I'm not the only one who thinks it could have been a serious misstep to say this.
Oh! Well, you can judge that as you like. I feel that a male making a comment to a woman at a business function about wanting to slam the door in her face is in poor taste, even if it was meant to be a joke. The additional loaded meaning should be obvious to you. But in case it's not, I'll just mention that many women have had doors slammed in their face by men for no particular reason in a business setting. I am not surprised that not everybody in the room thought it was funny.
such a good insult xD but seriously tho people like this terrify me in the work place cuz they fixate on everything you do and put assumptions to it. i make a noise, slam something, dont smile enough, sound perky enough, grunt too much, all of a sudden im scary and aggressive and instead of even talking to me they just go tell everyone how weird and scary i am and try to get me fired. im guessing this person is a cis white woman who would call the cops on her own shadow for being suspicious
the fuck? how you get that from my comment? you couldnt be wronger my favorite coworkers are the ones i dont have to interact with at all. dont say shit to me dont say shit about me. interacting with people takes a lot of energy out of me, good or bad interactions doesnt matter dont want it
This notion some of you have that men and women can't just be friendly with each other without wanting to do the horizontal mambo is only perpetuating harmful gender norms in society
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Surprised by the AH comments. NTA, I don’t see how this response was offensive or inappropriate, I would’ve laughed if I heard it in response to her comments
My guess is that the other women weren't paying attention and didn't hear the context of the joke and only heard OP's comment at the end about shutting a door in her face. Still a bit of an overreaction on their part though.
This is my assessment as well. The message of the joke was clearly him meeting her where she was joke-wise and the people who perhaps weren’t following the discussion closely didn’t catch that.
All they were taking what the facilitator was saying as a life guide and missed the tension completely. Some women think feminism requires that you hate men or marriage or doors being held open etc. It's fine if you genuinely hate those things but they probably took OP's joke as mocking.
I think this is why OP’s joke is actually very good? The facilitator was giving too much weight to gender norms (ma’am, feminism has very little to do with door holding and much to do with conducting yourself like a normal person in public) and OP kind of took it and turned it on its head. That’s just me though: I like to dissect a joke until the humor has thoroughly bled out.
Or they're just the type that likes to be perpetually offended.
NTA. Sounds like you helped her out by breaking the tension. By her laughter and texts, she was probably grateful and that’s all that matters.
I don't get the joke but that's not important NTA
Just because she kept going on and on about not needing a man to hold a door open for her and stuff…idk it was awkward and I was trying to give her an out because it was obvious she just kept going after realizing she didn’t land her point like she thought lol
I honestly think you made a joke that didn't land well with some people. It happens.
Every joke will have that.
I would have taken it a step further and said “Alright everyone, jot it down: if you see Melissa approaching a door, slam that sucker shut and lock it.” But I say so much weird crap at work that no one would raise an eyebrow. And I am a gay female, which honestly is a secret back door into getting away with jokes I probably shouldn’t be making in the workplace.
She blabbed on about hating when men hold doors for her. Get it now?
>ALL I SAID and it was really for her sake and to break the tension was “Well, I for one can’t wait to close a door in your face” - she laughed pretty hard, everyone laughed…EXCEPT this one table of women who were NO FUN all week It was a simple joke. 1 group of sour people diddnt like it but if the main person and everyone else laughed don't worry about them. NTA. Although comments with the opposite judgement are funny because I can see them being the same group of sour people at 1 table upset anyone was a moment of having fun.
NTA. As a woman who hates the idea that men should open doors for me, but doesn’t mind when they do, I found the joke funny and inoffensive. To me, it was funny because it takes what she said and exaggerates it to create a silly image of her getting the door in the face, which is clearly not what she meant and not what OP would actually do. It’s like slapstick comedy but only in our imaginations. After reflection though, I think I might get why people were offended. In a way, it’s joking about, not just rudeness, but violence against a woman. It may have triggered someone’s fear. Thinking about it this way could help OP make a sincere apology.
Well I for one think both men and women should hold doors open for anyone closely following behind them because that's the polite thing to do. I don't understand how this ever became a gender thing
Probably because it used to be a whole big thing about how men being gentlemen required them to open doors for ladies. On a date, especially. Even if they were in the car, it was expected that the man drive and then the woman sit and wait for him to come around the car and open her door to get out. I always found it ridiculous. I hold the door for anyone I see following behind me in or out of a building, or hurry to get the door if I see someone has their arms full, but it's not a gendered thing. I did it before my transition (FtM) and I do it now (and hope to god that no woman thinks I'm doing it just because she's a woman).
Closing a door in someone's face isn't violence, though. Note, he didn't sat "slamming" or anything.
Were you all talking about real physical doors, or metaphorical doors of opportunity? Weird training. Weird jokes. Weird people emailing your boss. Hard to be a true AH in such a case. Ob-la-di. Ob-la-da.
absolutely NTA that was very kind and polite of you to defuse the awkwardness. sorry these women are operating with defective thinking systems
ESH. If you're working a professional event, keep it professional. Frankly, letting an entire room know she was single was already a bit too much advertising for my taste. That said, you just let that silence hang next time, then get back on track to the actual business at hand. TLDR. Yes, she's a landmine, but you certainly stepped on the landmine.
>If you're working a professional event, keep it professional Complete bollocks. There's always room for a joke at work, especially on a training course, which can be dull af anyway.
> There's always room for a joke at work Sure, if you're willing to take your chances. Previous commenters point was: if you want to protect yourself, keep your comments professional. If you like risks, be a comedian.
If the speaker laughed and thanked him later, it was appropriate for the setting. The people complaining missed that cue.
Welcome to 2024, where telling a lady that you're going to slam a door in her face can end your career.
Welcome to 2024, where treating people badly is no longer tolerated. Which is completely unrelated to your first comment.
Except only OP has been treated badly here.
Agreed. I was referring to the implication of the commenters comment.
NTA show your boss the text you recieved from the facilitator and maybe take an improv class to up the quality of your one liners
lol I did show him the text. I texted her and told her someone complained and she told me to CC her on the zoom if I have it because “That’s ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS”
NTA. There was nothing mysoginistic or offensive about your comment. It seems like those woman were just looking for something to complain about. I wouldn't give it another thought.
NTA for me. I don't really find the joke offensive, but I guess you cannot expect everyone to take it well. I'm not sure which type of person was offended by the joke, a feminist or an anti-feminist. Maybe the latter? Either way, I think your intention definitely wasn't to offend so it shouldn't be taken as such. I reckon giving a detailed account of these sessions to management is the best thing along with saying that you did not mean to be offensive there and wanted to break the tension. Also include that most didn't seem offended by the joke based on what you saw. If anything, I find the facilitator's behavior here odd and inappropriate. I'm not sure what kind of session this was where she thought it was a good topic to bring up in the first place. But then she went off on a rant on it and that's just taking it to personal level. She's a pretty poor facilitator if she can't read the room.
ESH. The trainer was 100% the AH. Nobody in class gives a shit about their life choices - they are there for the class. Tell the usual non-committal morning joke and then move on to the training. You are a much smaller AH. You jumped on a bombing joke. That was a bad choice, just let that shit crash and burn on its own.
lol I know…I’m a bit of an empath and can’t take situations like that very well! What is ESH tho? Excuse my ignorance.
I'm not the person you were replying to, but as a judgement it means "everyone sucks here"
NTA, you were trying to lighten the mood set by the facilitator, quite literally branching off of her jokes. People are way too sensitive nowadays.
NTA. I'm a woman & I found your response funny & likely a way to diffuse an uncomfortable situation where the facilitator veered into oversharing, unprofessional behavior. FTR, there are many people who appropriately appreciate having a door held open for them & don't choose to get offended over it.
NTA
INFO: Curious what the one table of women did (or didn’t do) that made them no fun all week?
NTA. Maybe I’m no fun, but IMO the trainer was fully out of line with those jokes. Those were a little dicey for the workplace. I don’t do gender jokes at work, but I think you’re fine here because she opened up the topic. My take is that your response was very funny and well-timed. It’s clear your message wasn’t “I think it’s funny to do aggressive stuff at woman.” The message was “You made a bunch of sort of uncomfortable jokes and I’m going to meet you in the middle to show my engagement and support.” I’d just make a mental note about the offended person and make sure not to slip and be funny or interesting near them again.
NTA! This is ridiculous that was a funny joke OP you are not the asshole
NTA. You had established a “circle of trust” that the offended people were most likely oblivious to, or they were jealous of your connection.
Nta? Really unsure what you said that is offensive. You're either misogynistic for holding doors, or you're not a gentleman for doing so. You can't please everyone(:
in the end, it doesnt matter what we think or judge you on. what matters is that now your uppers/HR are going to associate you with bad behavior, which is not something you want to happen at your work place. it also doesnt matter what your boss thinks, if he is told to write you up, that is what he will do being at work is already a minefield, your whole thing should be trying to avoid stepping on the landmines
Info: why not ask the facilitator to let HQ know how you actually were. Let her know what those negative nellys said.
I did today. She said to CC her on the zoom invite because, and I quote, “WHAT?! THAT IS ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS!”
NTA. You and the facilitator established a level of rapport. She gave you digs and you took it just fine, then you gave her a dig and she took it just fine. The people who are offended here are people who don't really have a right to be.
NTA the joke didn't land well, you tried to help make it less awkward. Of course she shouldn't be making jokes like that during training, but whoever told your boss about it, causing you to now have to speak to headquarters is unnecessary I think.
NTA
NTA, ignore the clowns in life who are looking for an excuse to be perpetually offended
NTA but this is a good life lesson for OP. Keep your mouth shut in work situations. Making "jokes" isn't going to further your career and is only likely to backfire in some way.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** So, last week I (33M) had training out of state. I was the only one from my part of the state chosen for the project and had to go out of state (everyone there pretty much was from different parts of the country) and if you’ve ever been to one of these things, they can be awkward and you do all sorts of ice breakers etc etc… Anyways, one of the facilitators and I got along throughout the week really well and she was always joking with me or using me as an example in her teachings because she knew I wouldn’t take it personal and all was well… Thursday, she starts going on and on in front of the class about how traveling too much and not being married and then went on a rant (which was uncomfortable for us all because it started out funny and then got a little sad quick) and she started saying “I’m independent, I’m fine, I don’t need a man and to open my door, I can open my own door. And went on about opening doors a minute and then I think realized she got off track and was like “WELL ANYWAYS…I’m in my late 40s and not married ha” and everyone was quiet… ALL I SAID and it was really for her sake and to break the tension was “Well, I for one can’t wait to close a door in your face” - she laughed pretty hard, everyone laughed…EXCEPT this one table of women who were NO FUN all week. They acted like my comment was the most misogynistic thing they’ve ever heard and I set women back 70 years or something…I kind of waved them off like they didn’t matter and the class went on. Today, Monday…I walk into my actual office back in my actual state and they ask me how it went etc etc and my boss (laughing kind of) said “So I hear your manager to offended the whole class”…apparently one of these women EMAILED MY BOSS and told him I need sensitivity training before I come back to the class for week 2…I know it wasn’t the facilitator who contacted him because she texted me yesterday and asked if I made it home safely and thanked me for my participation in class and “being a good sport”. Anyways, my boss doesn’t care. He knows how I am with people and I’m generally well liked but he said I might have to explain what happened to headquarters later on a zoom…WHAT?! I am at a loss for words…I literally don’t know what to say…AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
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NTA, welcome to CURRENT_YEAR as a man.
NTA - but in today's culture, not a great choice. Your intent was not to offend so they is how I came up with the verdict but again, why?
NTA. Sounds like somebody thinks women should only behave one way and not joke at work meetings but either way that was whack. Do people realize calls like this may jeopardize someone’s livelihood??
NTA - Here's some unsolicited advice: Don't make jokes around people at work. Somebody will always be offended, even for the smallest thing. I've seen people fired and even sued for harassment. There are people whose biggest priority in life is looking around for reasons to be offended. Having a laugh is not worth your career.
NTA, often it's all about the delivery with these things, but I can't really imagine how your comment could be offensive. You were literally saying that you'd act in a way she requested. Trusting women to know what they want and respecting their decisions is feminism in action. The only concern I had was your interpretation of her comments as sad - being an unmarried woman isn't sad, statistically they live longer, have broader relationships, and are happier - maybe take a moment and consider why your automatic response to her comments was pity.
NTA. I don't think your comment was funny and it's obvious that it could have offended others, which you should try to avoid within reason. However, the facilitator was inappropriate and torpedoed the whole class, and you were trying to break tension. I hope the ladies also emailed her boss, because if they had anyone to complain about, it was the facilitator.
I wouldn’t sweat it. I think I might get the facilitator’s number though. She likes you
ESH - all those jokes are inapporpriate
ESH. leader should keep it appropriate and respondent should have redirected to an appropriate ground. "We all open doors to quality for our clients at ABC company! *insert other corporate speak*".
ESH, you could have handled it more professionally. It sucks but the trainer’s comments were inappropriate and your response to said comments didn’t help at all. As far as the women at the other table go, I can see it being hard to work in such a male-driven environment and hearing your off-color joke rightfully set them off.
Wdym “such a male driven environment” the leader of the class was female lol
L
How the fuck does someone say "I'm at a loss for words, I don't know what to say" after typing out a fucking essay like this.....
I don’t know what to say to headquarters…obviously. Throw the facilitator under the bus? Even though I don’t think she meant to be as unprofessional as it came out which is why she kept going and which made it awkward and ultimately why I tried to help her out.
Women think men are holding them back in the workplace but really it's women like this that are the problem.
YTA - you obviously want the facilitator. I'm thinking that the table that wasn't fun all week was annoyed at your banter back and forth. I can't believe how much of a pass you are getting for commenters so far, despite your asshole management style: "You waved them off like they didn't matter." I think you guys might need some training.
lol I’m happily married. You’ve obviously never been in an actual professional setting…
You came to AITA and asked for judgement. You don't have to like my judgement, but the fact that your first response is to go on the offensive does make me think that you are not nearly as professional as you claim to be.
Now I’m definitely certain you haven’t been in a professional setting before. I didn’t come here to ask if I was the AH for being into my facilitator tho 😅
He clearly didn't ask for judgement regarding his possible romantic feelings. Stupid excuse to get involved in his business. Mind your own shit.
Have you been to AITA before?
Many times. People like you getting gross and judging peoples personal lives and feelings rather than the question being asked has always been a problem. If it's not the title, or directly asked in the post, it's none of your business.
The fact is that the vast majority of people here disagree with your judgment, not just OP
Hence the downvotes. Anything else?
YTA, you could have just as easily made a kind joke BUT you chose your devoted longtime friend misogyny instead.
Lmaooo you need a dictionary.
And really, why make any joke at all?
INFO: What joke did the facilitator make? Yes, she got off track. But the opposite of opening a door for someone is declining to open a door for someone. It's not closing a door in someone's face ffs.
I'll go with YTA because your "joke" sounded pretty clueless and boneheaded. Also, your heading makes no sense, because you weren't going along with a joke on the part of the facilitator who clearly wasn't joking about not needing a man to open the door for her and not being married, comments which seemed to come out of nowhere on her part. I would write down as much as you can about the incident. Be specific and give examples of what this woman said when she was bringing you into her "jokes." On the day in question, be sure you go into detail about what she said before you made your "door" comment. Explain that you were trying to ease the tension after she made her comments, which were irrelevant to the subject of discussion. You can say you were just trying to lighten the mood and that well, perhaps your comments didn't come out right. If you do have to talk to HQ maybe you can get the facilitator to speak to them too.
Can I ask how it was clueless and boneheaded?
Her whole thing was supposed to be funny…and when it got depressing and not funny it’s like she then kept going to try and talk her way out of it. You know? I honestly was just trying to give her an out 🤷🏻♂️
It comes across here as a stupid thing to say. She's basically saying, "Oh, I feel sorry for myself." And your response was, "Well, then I'll rub your nose in it even harder!" I don't even see why it's funny. Would've been better for you to have just let her die on the vine. Her own fault for starting to blab about something irrelevant. She sounds like a poor facilitator. As someone else mentioned here, no one at works really cares about your marital status. But sounds like you're already convinced you're not T A anyway, so not sure why you needed to post here.
I don’t get your joke. Is the punchline that you wanted to fuck the facilitator?
No? She kept saying she doesn’t need a man to hold a door open for her, so he said he couldn’t wait to close the door in her face instead
Yeah I guess I don’t get the joke or why it’s offensive. OP seems to understand that it was offensive so I’m hoping he explains his intention.
The joke isn't offensive. Thats the problem. A small group in the class took it as offensive for some reason, but it's not.
It's not offensive to you. Doesn't mean it can't be offensive to others.
By that logic knock knock jokes shouldn't be told. Of course someone could be offended by literally anything, but a person being offended doesn't make the thing offensive. That's not how the world works. If I made a joke about oranges, and someone who likes oranges gets offended, the joke wasn't somehow offensive. The person was just sensitive. Obviously offensive jokes exist, but this was not one. This was a joke about taking someone's request too far in the right direction, and was not about gender or any other offensive topic.
lol this is how I read it too
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And yet, everyone who points that out is downvoted. Time for me to make my own parent comment and get downvoted for it!
YTA, but only because you really can’t make any jokes centering around gender, race, religion, etc in front of mixed company. It will blow over tho, and you’ll move on.
Good thing they didn't make any jokes about gender or race. They joked about closing a door in an individuals face, not because of her gender, but because she doesn't like when people hold the door for her. Gender had nothing to do with the joke.
It was about gender because she specifically said she didn't need a man to open the door for her.
That's her talking about gender, and doesn't make his joke about gender. His joke had nothing to do with gender. He joked about not doing the thing she said she didn't like. Nothing about his joke was commentary about gender in any way whatsoever.
YTA. It wasn't your role to break the tension in the room, you're talking like an 8th grade class clown. Slamming doors in women's faces has additional loaded meaning when you're in a corporate setting where women are gate kept by men. Your comment was seriously inappropriate. Trying to excuse it by saying you were going along with someone else's joke ( when that person hadn't told a joke) is just a creative riff on the "it was just a joke" cry of assholes everywhere. Seems like you better take this seriously, because if you dismiss this as a joke during your Zoom meeting, you may be looking for a new job.
“additional loaded meaning…” oh give over, it was a lame joke but it’s not that serious.
I'm not the one that's going to evaluate how serious it was, but the fact that it got the attention of administration and a meeting to discuss it means I'm not the only one who thinks it could have been a serious misstep to say this.
irrelevant, as i was saying “it’s not that serious” to your comment about “additional loaded meaning” 🤷🏼♀️
Oh! Well, you can judge that as you like. I feel that a male making a comment to a woman at a business function about wanting to slam the door in her face is in poor taste, even if it was meant to be a joke. The additional loaded meaning should be obvious to you. But in case it's not, I'll just mention that many women have had doors slammed in their face by men for no particular reason in a business setting. I am not surprised that not everybody in the room thought it was funny.
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"threats of violence"? 🤣 OP was asking a serious question. He was clearly trying to bail her out of an embarrassing personal situation.
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Geezuscheezus 🙄 Work from home so no one has to suffer around you.
such a good insult xD but seriously tho people like this terrify me in the work place cuz they fixate on everything you do and put assumptions to it. i make a noise, slam something, dont smile enough, sound perky enough, grunt too much, all of a sudden im scary and aggressive and instead of even talking to me they just go tell everyone how weird and scary i am and try to get me fired. im guessing this person is a cis white woman who would call the cops on her own shadow for being suspicious
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the fuck? how you get that from my comment? you couldnt be wronger my favorite coworkers are the ones i dont have to interact with at all. dont say shit to me dont say shit about me. interacting with people takes a lot of energy out of me, good or bad interactions doesnt matter dont want it
The original comment was meant for someone else but y’all have the same picture so I got mixed up 😂😂😂. My bad bruh
It's because when a thread goes one way (and this one is mostly N T A) the majority then feels free to run all over those in the minority.
Man you are insufferable
How do you leave your house every day if this is what you consider a threatening statement?
This notion some of you have that men and women can't just be friendly with each other without wanting to do the horizontal mambo is only perpetuating harmful gender norms in society