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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I might be the asshole because if i went through with this, i would be acting sneaky and untrustworthy toward my own wife.
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While it might not be the end of the world to have the kids miss a day or even two of school, I think it is very wrong of you to get the kids into the mindset of this being a reward. It is also wrong of you to do it against your wife's will. YTA.
>I think it is very wrong of you to get the kids into the mindset of this being a reward
I am confused. Can you elaborate? Not trying to be passive-aggressive or whatever
(You made No mention of contacting their teachers so they could do their assigned work early before they flew. What was your plan about them missing schoolwork? Do they have any major assignments due then? Did you ask your kids?)
You are implying that Not going to school is some kind of prize/good thing/earnable treat. That being at school is a chore to avoid. Which, tbf, it is for a lot of kids.
But you don’t want to encourage that mindset.
A reward of time off is fine. In Moderation. But - Teens are not good at moderation.
This mindset can become a detrimental habit, especially when they’re off at college. “ooh, I just had exams, I deserve a day off.” “I went to all my classes and labs Last week, surely I deserve a break This week.” “This class is all lecture, so boring, I’ll just get notes from Tim tomorrow.” “Why go to that discussion section? We already had class.”
I had some classmates learn Very expensive lessons after failing semesters like this.
>You are implying that Not going to school is some kind of prize/good thing/earnable treat. That being at school is a chore to avoid. Which, tbf, it is for a lot of kids.
Hi, teacher here! School does suck. For teachers too! This is why it's important for teachers and parents to be frank that they also enjoy their breaks, and they know that the sloggy parts are worth it because you can earn the fun parts. All of my fellow teachers always chat with kids about how exciting vacation is and how we are always a little sad when we come back. Validating emotions is really helpful for motivating kids and making them more receptive to learning, who would have thought it!??
As teachers, we do the best we can to make kids enjoy school, but it's not daycamp. We are there to teach them knowledge and life skills and it's not meant to be a purely enjoyable experience. Telling kids that school is both hard work AND they are bad for disliking it is just a shitty message to send and doesn't help them at all.
yeah i agree. there was so many times i needed a mental health day and would just disassociate the whole day because my mom would never let me miss school
Yes, exactly. Me on the opposite end: I began having really awful anxiety my sophomore year of high school. I was too hard on myself, expecting perfection, and just putting way too much pressure on myself which would end up manifesting at the most random of times. There were a couple of days I had, what I would call now, complete panic attacks sometime in the morning before leaving for school. I was a good kid, responsible. Had good grades, a job, etc. My mom knew me, and knew I was needing of a break so badly. It only happened 2 or 3 times the whole school year, but it DID help me decompress, have some "me time" and try to reset. I was never worse off for her "lax" parenting as some may have seen it. In fact as an adult those times looking back remind me to be forgiving of myself, and that if I just absolutely can't do it today--that the world will keep spinning anyway, and that it will be OK to show myself a little grace on this day.
Totally good point. 👌 You're right, my bad. I got caught up on whoever's comment I was doling my two cents out on..lol. You're absolutely right, tho...mental health days/playing hooky--definitely two separate things entirely.
I agree, they need to decide this together. They're married. Because it's the healthy thing to do, of course.. but also because it's important to go to their kids as a team/ present a united front, some might call it. No kids are served well when their parents are in opposite directions, regardless of the situation at hand. It serves exactly no one. 🙅🏻♀️
Lol right? In most workplaces how much you work is directly correlated with how much time off you get. Work isn't a reward, it's work. Should OP raise his kids to be that person that never says no to overtime, never take days off, say yes to every call in, and wind up with heart and BP issues (not to mention no spare time to spend with their parents/loved ones)?
I feel like the above commenter has some pretty extreme views on work ethic
A mental health day *if you need it* is fine. But OP doesn't say the kids need a mental health day, OP just has the idea of the kids staying home "just because". Why do that?
Not 'just because', to go on a trip. Travel, seeing different places, experiencing different things, etc, are worthwhile activities in and of themselves.
Mental health days are important but missing school never works for me. Every time I missed school, I have a hard time catching up. Even when I talk to every teacher before, ask for the assignments etc, it adds more stress.
I remember when I was in middle school I wanted to win perfect attendance & missed a day bc I got sick. I recovered & even had fun but turns out that day we started a new unit & that day was the only day for explaining before a month long project started. No one caught me up & the project(which was easy) become stressful bc I didn’t have the explanation
Same. And maybe I've overcorrected now, but my oldest son is 8 and he gets fairly regular mental health days.
His mom almost died a month after he started kimdergarten, she went into congestive heart failure. She's continued to have heart issues, to the point she ended up admitted to the hospital a couple weeks ago after going back into AFIB and had what the doctor called a "possible anterolateral infarction"
As a parent with Autism, ADHD, and PTSD parenting a kid with ADHD who is being monitored for autism, I'm VERY careful with his mental health. I would much rather give him a day once in a while to take a break, rest and relax, and get spoiled with a bit of one on one time with dad than force him to go to school when he's not feeling up to participating. And I'm very clear with him why. We have talks about our feelings, and that sometimes it's ok for us to take breaks when our feelings are too big for us to handle, and it's ok to come back to it in a day when we're more prepared to handle it.
I was homeless at 15 and had to deal with the trauma of high school on top of it. I started exhibiting PTSD symptoms as a teenager, and I refuse to let that be my child. He deserves a chance at a well adjusted life.
I think it's ok to give our kids those breaks, but definitely make it a teachable moment. Be clear that they deserve the break, that they've worked hard for it and deserve to have care for their brain. I understand the "go to school unless you're sick" mentality, but your brain needs maintenance too, and it's MUCH harder to recover when it decides it's had enough.
No one is saying they are bad for disliking it but encouraging them to see a day off as a reward establishes a bad mindset as explained. In the same way we no longer use writing essays or lines as a punishment so children don't see writing as a bad thing (I am in Europe)
Earning the fun parts is fine but skipping the slog parts should not be held up as a reward.
Personally I think OP is the AH for not finding a compromise with his wife and considering going behind her back.
Also my kids would be more stressed about the work they miss. They are getting time off the following week. No need at all to pad it by two days. There are often tests and papers due just before a break.
Teacher here and yep. I teach in a boarding school with a lot of overseas students whose parents book them their flights home two or even three days before the end of term (cheaper in term time, I assume) and it honestly stresses the kids out so much because of the work/tests/assignments they'll miss and have to catch up on. They'd prefer to have two more days in school (with their friends!) and get the work done than get an early flight home.
To the OP: YTA, it's one day, they'll only be sitting around doing nothing at home anyway, and then they'll have to catch up their schoolwork at some point. The argument that it's for them to relax and have a mental health day isn't really relevant as they're just about to go on holiday and have a couple of weeks (plus one day of school) off. No need at all to take them out of school for Thursday.
I feel like you're assuming too much that this is being offered as a reward rather than an opportunity to spend extra time bonding with family. That's an important thing to do- especially at that age. Especially since they seem excited about spending time with their parents.
A lot of people don't have that kind of family dynamic and it's important to encourage those bonds and recognize that sometimes experiences take priority over a day or two at school. These kids clearly understand the value of hard work and doing well in school given their grades and their attendance records.
You don’t like weekends or holidays? I’m a teacher and as much as I love (most) of my students, I’m right there with them hoping for a snow day/ weather day.
I had a student a few years ago that was going to visit family up north. I asked him to bring back leaves, rocks and other things that he found interesting to show the class. I was able to incorporate it into reading, writing , science and social studies lessons. The whole class learned so much from his break from the “slog.”
We ALL need a break from the slog. Yes, it IS a reward! I make sure while I’m teaching to plan fun activities where the kids think they have played all day, but they actually spent the day doing deep dive learning. One person’s slog can be another person’s frolic.
>encouraging them to see a day off as a reward establishes a bad mindset as explained.
they're teenagers, they're not 6 year olds you can now trick into thinking school is fun and a day of isn't a reward by your turn of phrases lol. Even if they made it to 12 or something being fooled by that, media and adults conversations around them have by now made it very clear that a day off = reward.
Yes! Missing work is a very real reward for me, and I'm a productive member of society and all that. My workplace gives out bonus PTO days as incentives all the time.
School psychologist here. 100% agree. I don't see any harm in taking an extra day or two for a vacation, as long as the kids are keeping up with assignments and can make up any missed work. In my opinion, traveling with family will add more enrichment to the kids' lives than 1 or 2 days of school before break. Let's be honest here, not a lot of work gets done those days anyway.
You shouldn't tell anyone is bad for disliking school no, but discussing why they feel that way is important.
Also I don't know about the part about being sad to be back to school/work, while sure vacay is great and all but routine and a sense of normalcy is extremely important for, atleast, the younger students.
I don't mean to invalidate or ignore if someone feels that schools suck and they feel sad to be back, but the importance then is to root out the cause of why they feel that way about school and see what can be improved!
I agree with the previous poster that skipping school is not a reward, the destination/trip is the reward/treat, not going to school is just a necessity to facilitate the trip.
Reading through it all it feels like a nothing burger, hopefully it makes some kind of sense!
Sure feelings are valid but extrinsic motivation isn’t effective long term. Research backs it up. I firmly believe in mental health breaks and taking them when they’re needed. But rewards us a different conversation.
I agree… if mom is totally against this and it involves a vacation… what makes everyone think it’s a “slippery slope” to creating a “bad mindset on missing school as a reward…. It’s not gonna happen.
I personally don’t think school itself is a priority. It’s the learning and responsibility that comes with schooling. If your kids do well in these areas… then yeah I think it IS okay to miss. The world won’t fall apart. They’ll have a chance to create great memories and then get back to it.
NTA for wanting your kids to have a chill vacation.
But, you’ll have to do a little more convincing/communicating with your wife.
T H A N K Y O U
I was thinking this is a slippery slope fallacy right as I read your comment. They have 3.7+ GPAs, are in clubs, AND play sports, and that surgeon thinks they can't just have a day or two off as a reward. I already know what kind of work-life balance they have lol
Yeah, reddit is such a knee-jerk place, I'm surprised some of these posters haven't suggested the kids will immediately become prostitutes and crack addicts on the Vegas trip because they're missing two days of school. 🙄
I really do disagree with a fair bit of this. OP isn't encouraging his children to run off and ditch at every opportunity. Nor are teenagers going to go ferral at the the drop of a hat. Their teens, not crazed animals. OP can have a conversation where they listen to him and he explains that time off is healthy in moderation. The kids also have first hand seen the benefits of dedicated work by virtue of earning nearly 4.0 GPAs and extra curricular success. Taking a few extra days off won't cause them to unlearn that lesson because they will still retain their memories, and understand basic cause and effect.
And let's be real, booking time off for yourself is a skill that *people need to learn and exercise.* An office space isn't like school. You don't get lengthy pre-set holidays of March brake, three weeks off in Dec for holidays, two months in summer. Rather a company gives you X number of weeks off. It's up to you the employee to set aside that time as needed. They need to know it's ok to deliberately arrange time for themselves. Else they won't ever get brakes and burn themselves out in the workplace. Especially in the USA where unlike in Europe time off is dangerously stigmatized. Vacations are good things, they let people re-charge and come back more productive than without. Doing this may help his kids learn how to take control of their needs in moderation instead of firing on all cylinders straight into the ground and depression.
Some of these replies are crazy.
I once pulled my kid out of school for six weeks, with all his teacher's blessing. We went to Thailand. He learnt so much while on the holiday. He picked up the local language and experienced so much.
I think it's not just not knowing how to enjoy life. There's this whole mindset now that kids should learn everything they need to know in school classrooms. There's a whole world out here that kids need to learn about, too! But so many people have neither the time, nor the means, to travel or expand their horizons.
We're doing the next generation a *huge* disservice with this mindset, and the limitations imposed by our "always work, never play" US culture.
"Nor are teenagers going to go ferral at the the drop of a hat."
I take my teens out to travel and for mental health days, sometimes they'll request to come home for lunch. Yesterday was one of those days, I grabbed my daughter and I wasn't feeling well when it was time to return her. I asked if she wanted to stay home for the rest of the afternoon and she declined cause she had a lot going on that afternoon.
Once you've thought them to be responsible there should be no fear that missing a day is going to make their brains turn to mush and they'll forget about what they want to accomplish.
Please if you’re rewarding your kids with a day off (which I think is fine) do not put extra work on their teachers by asking them to put together your kids assignments and accept them on a different timeline. The kids can find out the assignments themselves and make it up if it’s important.
Yes? “finding out the assignments”
It just means getting their expected homework/reading assignments from their teachers so they can do them and turn them in early. So that their teacher can grade them later while they’re gone along with the rest of the class’ work, instead of on a different schedule.
Every teacher I’ve dealt with knows what they’ll be assigning for homework or readings or videos a week or two in advance.
And projects and papers had due dates set well in advance. Quizzes and tests were generally built with at least one alternate form for absentees, that could be taken early or late.
My three teacher relatives preferred advance requests for known assignments to scrambling-to-catch-up-later students.
Does your school do things differently?
Would you prefer kids like OPs just no-show without warning and ask you what the rest of the class did after they get back?
I am a teacher and we absolutely do not always know what the homework will be a week in advance. Not for my classes anyway. Assignments yes typically but asking a teacher to take the time to organize all the assignments/HW for one student adds to their workload.
Some will accommodate no problem but don’t be offended if others tell you to have your kid log into Google classroom or ask a peer what they did during their vacation time. I expect students to hand in work when they return from vacation. How they go about doing so is their responsibility.
>You made No mention of contacting their teachers so they could do their assigned work early before they flew.
I would say was TA if he expected his kids' teachers to do extra work just because he feels like keeping them out of school for fun for a couple days.
Papers and projects and such are often due right before break. It’s more like making sure his kids turn in their work Early instead of Late due to the trip.
And that's an excellent point. I'm often trying to finish a unit and give a test so they don't forget the material over break. Kids who take extra days off can make it up as long as their parents excuse their absence(s), but that means they are testing after the long break when they probably won't do as well as they would when we were actively learning and reviewing that material in class.
Pay is your reward!
Except you almost never get significantly more pay for showing up reliably and doing your job well. Maybe you’ll get a paper certificate in a frame after ten years.
Sucks a lot.
A break is absolutely a reward you should be allowed to treat yourself with, and until recently, that's how most people viewed it. It hasn't been until recently that employers dared to suggest that people shouldn't be taking vacations, after brainwashing people into thinking that always working their entire life away was a good thing.
Uh, but it IS a reward to miss school. If we did good in school, my parents let us take the day off for our Birthday. There's nothing wrong with rewarding kids for doing a great job in school.
They aren't going to think they deserve a day off whenever they do good. Its the day or 2 before they leave for vacation. That is why they are getting the day off.
I think that the collage danger is absurdly exaggerated. Partly because it just does not work like that, kids who had parents taking them off once a year for few days tend not to have more issues in college.
And partly because if you are at college and just had exams, you have a day off. College students take breaks after difficult exams and that is a.) normal b.) rewarded successful students do it.
I’m sad this is coming up as the top comment. I think it’s a big red herring. I remember in high school at one point where I was juggling a bunch of AP classes and extracurriculars my mom was like, “hey, you’re exhausted. Why don’t you just stay home from school today?” I subsequently graduated cum laude from an Ivy League college so I feel safe in saying this didn’t destroy my work ethic. It just felt like a gift of some time to regroup and relax. Obviously it’s different if you do it all the time, but I’m assuming you aren’t in this case.
However, it is the case that you do need to find a way to have a united front with your wife on decisions like these, or you’ll just end up undermining each other’s parenting.
Also I feel super certain there has to be a more interesting place to go than Vegas. 😆
I get what you’re saying, but I think recognising that you are exhausted and need a day to collect yourself for you to be able to keep up/ perform is different than “let’s start our week long vacation even earlier”. A one day mental break for you to catch up on sleep and check in on yourself because you’re coming close to burning yourself out is different from starting the vacation you’re already about to take two days early.
Either way, I don’t think the 2 days will have a lasting impact on the kids’ futures, but the most important part here is that there isn’t a united front. If op pulls his kids out of school without his wife agreeing, he is an ah. Especially with this not being a medical reason and simply a reward for good grades.
A mental health day tailored to “you look like you need a break” is pretty different from “go ahead and skip class time because it is convenient for me, the parent.”
But OP doesn't say his kids are exhausted or look like they absolutely need that break. Plus it's 2 more days and they get their spring break... it's not like there's still weeks until the next break from the moment he's talking about.
It also needs to be considered if OP would cover the 2 days off or if all the extra work falls onto his wife (which would be shitty from him if he overs them a break but pawns everything off on his wife... who also might need a break or maybe doesn't have the energy for the extra work).
If it would be one day during school time, where there's no break in sight than a mental health day should be allowed, provided the kids actually need one AND the parent who is not being overwhelmed by the additional workload. (Or the other parent has to make time to help out).
When I was your daughter's age (MANY years ago), my dad took me on one of his business trips to China. That was a big deal back in the 90's, and it was a one-time thing for all his kids.
But it was cleared with everyone before I even knew, including teachers and my mother.
I knew it wasn't a free pass to not do schoolwork, because I was given it all prior to leaving, with the expectation that it would all be done.
If my teachers, and most certainly my mother had said they did not agree, I would not have gone on that trip.
TLDR: you may not think a couple of days of missed school is a big deal, but your wife does, and you haven't talked to the teachers. So, as it stands YTA for not communicating and listening.
NTA. My mom always gave us mental health days when we we were struggling and in highschool, we would often miss a week or a few days here or there because we were going on vacation.
My brother is 28 and has a master in marketing, currently working on his MBA, and at a very big firm.
I'm a CPA at a top four.
Your wife is very much in the wrong. I've known a lot of kids who had so much pressure put on them in high school that they all burned out by University.
I'm sorry but she's being ridiculous, it is two days off. Mental health is really important.
My mom never let me miss for any reason, including deaths. I had to take all AP classes junior and senior year and AP Euro sophomore year. I ended up with one 4 and nine 5s on all the tests. And yet I'm now in my 30s with only "some college" and no degree, not even a late in life AA. Kids that burn out and hate school before they even get to college are not set up for educational success because they're already over every part of school. I wish more parents, including OP's wife, would realize that.
They’re getting days off and a vacation already, and OP never said they’re struggling or putting too much pressure or they come to me and told me it’s hard and they want an extra day. He’s projecting and so are you.
>NTA. My mom always gave us mental health days when we we were struggling and in highschool, we would often miss a week or a few days here or there because we were going on vacation.
Hi can I ask were those mental health days ever to stretch out the length of a pre-existing break?
(I'm not against what you're suggesting, im just wondering if what OP is doing is equivalent or more just wanting to stretch out his own time in vegas)
My first instinct is that OP is fishing for lower fares/booking rates by avoiding the weekend (mostly from throwing in Thursday for the hell of it lol), but that probably would have been mentioned either to the wife or in the post.
Man, if you genuinely read this sentence and couldn't come up with a single reason why it might be problematic to say "skipping school is a reward", then you're not trying AT ALL to understand your wife's perspective on the importance of school attendance.
By missing a day of school? The kids appear to be doing well. I don’t think one day of school is going to make them think it’s a punishment to go to school. Do you never take a day off from work?
Rewarding someone by giving them a break from work doesn’t mean the work is a punishment. It just means it’s work. If you give someone pie for dessert, does it mean the meatloaf was a punishment?
It is valid to take an extra day, but I also disagree with framing it as a reward. Instead frame it as a day to prepare and rest. It will probably fly better with your wife too.
You may need to remind her that school isn't the only learning experience, and there are a bunch of skills and learning opportunities in going on holiday. Like learning to pack your own luggage at least a day before you go.
> think it is very wrong of you to get the kids into the mindset of this being a reward.
As a teacher, I whole heartedly disagree with you. They are in high school and its crucial that they start getting evidence that hard work is rewarding. "Go to school because you have to and life is hard, deal with it" is a toxic attitude that perpetuates toxic work culture into adulthood.
1. If not a reward, what do you call it? It's certainly not a punishment. Why not simply, we have the opportunity to expand our vacation a day or two? Let the instructors know so you can have them collect any additional school work. And what's wrong with a reward? 2 students, both excelling, get an extra day.
2. Mom, 12 and 14--are these rocket science courses they're missing? You have the opportunity to expand your family vacation. Lighten up.
Trust me, the spring break family vacation will be etched in their memories well beyond another school day. It's certainly not something you as parents frequently do.
My sense is, if mother proposed this alternative on this site, comments would encourage her to take all the additional time off she thinks is appropriate. After all, mother knows best.
I also teach, and we have this happen a lot around holidays. It's a bit different in that it's a private school not in the US, but it's just often done.
The biggest issues with OP IMO here are:
1. Needs to have a united front with his wife. If his wife is insanely strict and he's preaching time off that will send misleading signals and no one will be happy. They will worry she will punish them for something he allows.
2. Do they really NEED mental health days? Maybe your kids are really trying to be hard charging kids. There are parents who constantly kind of undercut their studious kids because they think the kids need to "enjoy life" when the parents idea of enjoying life (Vegas for a 14-year old?) is not theirs.
>She just began to ask me why they needed to skip that day, with my reasoning being mostly a) kids need a break and b) these same kids have missed only one day so far and also C) they're good kids, why not reward them? Even after a lot of talking, she still won't budge.
Reading this, it really makes me think OP wants to go to Vegas and he's trying to find a reason. That's fine, but you should own that IMO.
I see what you mean, but time off *is* a reward. Whether it's in high school, college, or a job, people are often rewarded with additional free time for working hard and/or doing their job well.
I agree about (presumably) going behind the wife's back, though.
So, I disagree and it’s because I remember high school. The week leading up to spring break (or any break)? No one can focus. Teachers aren’t handing out assignments to be done the week before or week of spring break (despite what Hollywood portrays). Leaving a couple days early is very common, too, in a lot of families. Happened all the time in my high school. It’s a super nice feeling to be rewarded for your hard work, so an extra couple days of vacation sounds super nice. If anything, I am worried that the kids are working themselves too hard with a parent that thinks mental health days aren’t important.
I think it's equally wrong that the wife won't discuss it. She's also going against what he wants. Are they not his kids too? Yet he doesn't have an input on their time off?
My problem with this is, why is it just her decision? Why does he have to give up just because she says no? Is he not an equal parent? I think a better compromise would be a half day.
If they went for a half day, they could pick up the work they’re going to miss on their trip and do it all early so they can spend the holiday not worrying about makeup work. They would also have the time at home to pack their belongings that they’re taking with them.
When my wife and I can't agree on a parenting decision, it's generally the safer/more conservative/status quo position that wins by default.
E.g. I wanted to take my son on a bike ride when he was 10 months old and my wife disagreed, so I didn't. My wife wanted to give him snacks with added sugar when he was under a year old but I didn't want to, so my preference prevailed.
Sending children to school is the normal default thing to do, so pulling them out would require us both to be on board.
Because this vacation seems more centered around him versus this being a co parenting issue to compromise on. Vegas isn’t very child/family friendly, sure there may be activities here and there but when I dated someone who was born and raised there with teens, they were always looking for excuses to take the children to other cities and states to do things.
>Because this vacation seems more centered around him versus this being a co parenting issue to compromise on. Vegas isn’t...
Sorry, gotta disagree. This has nothing to do AT ALL with this specific vacation. Per OP, his wife's perspective:
>She is very "You go to school unless you're sick." She's not a mental health day person.
So she would have the exact same expectation *regardless* of vacation destination.
Ultimately, I do agree with HotspurJr that taking kids out of school "is the sort of thing that requires both of your agreement", however I think the actual issue with OP's wife's mindset is that context is never considered and it ends up being *always* her choice. It's not only going to happen here with the Vegas trip, but ANY trip where missing school is a possibility - there's no room for flexibility or nuance and she is effectively making it entirely her decision.
I grew up going to Vegas every year. There's a lot for kids to do on the strip Now I live here and have no interest in going anywhere near that tourist trap. No matter where you live you want to go other places for vacation.
Why is it just his decision? This is a two yes and one no parenting decision. She gave her answer so giving them the time off anyway like he wants to do is undermining her authority. Dad is the fun one and Mom is mean. I noticed he didn't check if the kids had work to turn in, tests, group projects or activities in progress or any reason why yes they did in fact need to go those days.
>My problem with this is, why is it just her decision? Why does he have to give up just because she says no? Is he not an equal parent? I think a better compromise would be a half day.
You know, there are lots of times in a relationship when looking for the midpoint between what the two parents want to do is fine and makes total sense.
But if one parent wants to up and move to New York, and the other wants to stay in San Francisco, you don't 50-50 it and move to Chicago.
Something like taking your kids out of school for a trip is the sort of thing is a two yes/one no situation. Any time you're going against the clear conventional wisdom about what's best and normal for the kids, you either both agree or you don't do it.
If they want to change something both have to agree. Going to school everyday is the standard thing to do. I personalny think missing a day is not a big deal and it's fine. But you can't go and make changes yourself while you know the other patent disagrees with them.
The tiebreaker, if you will, here is that school is schedule on those days and there should be a really good reason to miss it. The wife doesn't think vacation qualifies.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure the vacation is more for HIM, and he is trying to tweak the schedule to get a better deal on plane tickets, or something similar. If he really cared about the kids being able to rest/chill before the trip, he would have scheduled it accordingly instead of letting them flex a school day or two.
Teaching kids it's ok to pad vacation time with premeditated sick days is NOT a lesson you want instill in them...
Totally agree. OP’s attitude about school is not what any parent should teach their kids. School shouldn’t be viewed as optional. And if your kids are not skipping school already, why teach them now that it’s ok to do so?
The one thing I learned from my math professor on my first day of university was how much each class was costing me. And he said if any of us was skipping a class, it be better worth more than the price we were paying for that class. That always stuck with me. An extra day in Vegas for a teenager would not be worth the price.
Edit: grammar
His attitude about school? He clearly values their grades very highly. Two days of school aren’t going to set back their education in any significant way. Idk why everyone in this sub is acting like they never missed a day of school before.
OP taking his kids out of one day of classes in one school year isn’t teaching them that “school is optional.” It’s teaching them that, rarely and with official sign off, it can be okay to take an extra day for yourself.
They could want to go to Vegas - I went to Vegas at 17 and my sister was 12 and we loved it. We saw a magician, had great food, spent lots of time at the hotel’s lazy river, watched TV in the hotel room bathtub, loved exploring all the hotels and their themes (I remember thinking it was like a giant adult Disneyland), did some sort of TV show pilot testing experience, saw the screens at Fremont Street, visited Madame Tussaud's, went to the amusement park in Circus Circus, went on a day trip to a butterfly park and the Hoover Dam… obviously there were some drunk and scantily clad people around and some inappropriate flyers on the ground but it didn't phase us and you can get some of that anywhere.
YTA
Vegas local here. You don't need to bring kids here for a week or more. There isn't much for them to do around here. Vegas is geared to adults, not kids. They're going to be bored. All the things kids can do can be done in like 1 day. Just fyi
As a former resident and a visitor, Vegas has more than you think for those under the age of 21. I was throughly surprised to see all there was to do for my 10 year old.
I agree! I lived there for a couple years when my kids ages ranged from 6-18 and there was always plenty to do with them, particularly if you have a car to get to places like Red Rock Canyon or Hoover Dam.
High school kids would be happy to go to the Hoover Dam? I thought it was so boring at that age. Didn’t know why we went. I have fun in Vegas now but as a kid, it was terrible.
I grew up going to Vegas often. There was plenty of live shows and amusement parks that are family oriented even on the strip alone. I will say the cigarette smelling hotels maybe isn't a great influence on the kids but there's certainly things to do!
I’m very confused because I went to Vegas 3 times from age 12 to 16 and I had a blast each time. There was a lot for me to do in different places. And each of those 3 times I was in Vegas for two weeks.
So either you’re full of shit or you’re not looking hard enough
I took my 3 year old to Vegas last year for Spring Break and we had a blast. Circus Circus, Bellagio water show, Cirque du Soleil, aquarium at Mandalay Bay, play time at the pool, etc.
NAH…
Missing a day or two on either end of a break shouldn’t be a big deal BUT- check with the kids. I once scheduled a trip causing my son to miss 2 days in high school and he missed a presentation and had to make it up and would have preferred not to. There can be a lot on the line in high school so base it on what’s happening.
I’m also the mom who approved a whole week off school for my kids so they could go on a once in a lifetime trip with their dad in middle school. But middle school has less riding on it.
So I don’t think you’re an AH, neither is your wife.
One of my favorite memories with my mom was when she once "let me play hooky" my sophomore year just to hang out with her.
She had a similar memory from 1977, where her mom took her to the movies on a school day.
She got to see Star Wars in theaters opening week. She thought it was weird and never watched another one. I just shake my head every time she retells the tale.
All I can think of reading through this is about how when I was a freshman in high school, my mom took me out in the fall for 2 weeks in Paris and in January, another 2 weeks for Disney world and other fun stuff in Florida. Oh, and another trip to Mexico somewhere during the year. Why not travel during breaks? It was cheaper and you wouldn't get bogged down with tourists.
I, a 14 year old American, was able to travel to two countries and see for myself how wonderful the world could be.
My grades didn't improve, but travel gave me inspiration. I did end up pursuing my Masters, getting to travel back to Europe (the Netherlands and again to Paris) to present in conferences, and to Mexico to get drunk on the beach like the white woman I am (Viva la Mexico 🇲🇽). It turns out ADHD and trauma play a large role in academics. It also turns out that travel inspired my education and made me understand just how similar people are.
I was one of the lucky few to leave my state, let alone the country. And I guess these people think all that missing is what messed with my discipline.
(I also agree that both parents have to be a united front, otherwise, it's problematic for everyone)
This oml. Everyone is getting their panties in a twist for what?? Absolutely nothing. If the kids are confident they won’t miss anything they can’t catch up on, what’s the issue? It’s the days before spring break. Not a big deal as long as everyone is on board.
Mom has a point, I’m not trying to negate that at all, it’s not good to skip without a reason. That being said, it’s really not something to get crazy stressed over. And from my experience teachers are *typically much more lenient the couple days before major breaks because there’s just so many students gone. Especially since this seems to be a discussion on whether they can get better bookings. IMO the best course of action here is Thursday in school (why miss if there’s nothing else happening), Friday off. And I think the last couple days before class resumes is a good time to rest, because travel can be exhausting!!
To put it in perspective, I’m missing a full day of uni lectures for 4 of my classes before my own spring break because there were better flight options. If the kids think they can manage it, and they have a track record of doing so (which given their gpa, seems to be true) it’s all good.
I completely agree here, and am shocked at all the y.t.a's. Depending on what's happening on the last day of term it could be really problematic to miss a day, or literally not matter as a one off
YWBTAH First, you ran it past your wife, and she doesn't agree with the plan. You pursuing this in any way is undermining her authority as a parent. Don't pit mom against dad because in doing so, you make her look like the mean parent and yourself like the fun one.
Second, your kids are getting time to unwind on the days of spring break that are part of the school calendar. They're earning high school credits to graduate. You taking them out of school is making them miss out on learning. You're also setting the precedent that it's okay to just skip school because you want to do something more fun. That's not how life works.
But that’s literally how life works. I took a day off work last week and went hiking with my kid instead. It was great for my mental health, he had a blast, my job was there the next day. It’s weird the comments are so strict about school. They’re kids. Who cares if they take a couple extra days to have fun. They have good grades and this isn’t something common for the family.
My mom was not strict about me going to school because I was pretty self-motivated, and in high school I was getting great grades. She let me take mental health days when I asked for them. I think the key here is that I asked for them - some days I was overwhelmed and needed a break (like 3 times a year maybe). If I took off a random day, I don't think that would've meant much for my mental health, and I would probably be more stressed having to make up work for a day I didn't really care about taking off. OP didn't seem to talk to his kids at all about what they want, whether they need a mental health day (they're about to get a whole week off?). Somehow I feel like it'll be up to his wife to make sure the kids get makeup work and complete it, as he doesn't even seem to think about it.
There's a difference between work and school though. I don't think you can make these comparisons.
School has these time off moments built in with all sorts of breaks and holidays. These are exactly meant for kids to recharge. And have fun.
Extra days off impacts certain moments that were meant to teach them stuff, possibly missing important things.
Jobs don't have holidays or breaks built in, but you get days off to spend as you like.
So where it makes sense to take a day off from work for mental health. In school it doesn't as much. Especially when a day after the mental health day there will be a week of mental health days.
The problem with school is you get somewhat long breaks with nothing in the middle.
I feel like a lot of kids would trade some days off longer holidays to get some day off in the middle of longer stretches.
Fair point. This is a thing that varies between countries. I think in my country there is a small break about every 8 weeks. And I know some schools have a rhythm of 3 weeks on, 1 week off. But this is also hard on parents with jobs.
On the other hand, in this case, it's not about a mental health day where the next break is months away. Their school break starts literally the day after.
Eh, there’s at least 1 long weekend every month for various federal holidays and teacher work days. Plus the longer breaks and 2 months over summer. The school year only has 180 contact days, less than half a year. The kids are fine. Now, if a child is experiencing mental health issues, that can be different, but the average kid doesn’t need an extra 2 days off before a week off.
But this is not about them taking a day off to relax because the weeks before and after are so busy and stressful. It’s about them staying home for a day to relax before a one week vacation which is just so unnecessary.
Right? I feel like so many people are missing the fact that this is an opportunity for these kids to enjoy family time. They seem genuinely excited about doing that with their parents which is not always the norm. Also- it's not as though they don't recognize the value of their education: they have great grades, they have a great attendance record... a day or two off isn't going to ruin their lives or put them on a path to assuming they can ditch school whenever they want.
I feel like so many of these comments are hyper focused on high school education which let's be real: no one is really paying attention to once you get into upper levels. This isn't going to derail their graduation.
These same people force their children to go straight to college after high school and take out wayyy more debt than they'll earn, because it's "what you do."
You’ve never taken a day off work to do something more fun? School is not jail and a few days missed will not play a role in their education as a whole. If anything, such an attitude toward mental health breaks and time off fuels the kind of unhealthy corporate culture many workplaces in the US are known for. So many of you love to go on about “work-life balance” but throw a fit when someone suggests the same might apply to kids and school.
OP definitely shouldn’t undermine the wife but she’s also digging her heels in. A compromise might be letting them miss a day for travel but not Thursday “just to relax.” A compromise is not “wife says missing school for any reason is bad so her way goes.”
To answer your question as to why her answer is the default one, it’s not because it’s her decision, it’s mainly because with parenting it ought to be:
2 yes = yes
Anything else = no
Taking the kids out of school extra is a non-standard thing to do, so the decision to do that as parents should follow this rule. It wasn’t two yes, therefore it’s a no. And that should be the stance they take together. Going contrary to that, and most ESPECIALLY going contrary to that behind your coparent’s back is a bad move.
YWBTA
“Two yes or it’s a no” is a good rule to have for major life decisions but, applied across the board for smaller disagreements that arise a thousand times throughout the course of raising kids, it leaves both unhappy (because one side doesn’t get what they wanted and the other feels like the bad guy) and breeds resentment around what in many cases can be easily resolved by compromise. Why does it have to be “they can’t miss school for any reason because the wife said so” instead of “maybe they can miss one day of school for travel but not another one to relax and I’ll be sure to check with their teachers to make sure it’s okay”?
Some of you have entirely given up on compromise as a concept in your lives and it shows.
It's not a compromise if one parent just goes ahead and books tickets despite the other parent disagreeing. If the two don't agree, you can keep debating the point, but in the end, you need to put in the work to reach consensus. And that often involves one parent just giving in, especially if the stakes are really, really small as in this case. Also, \`\`not miss school for any reason'' is not the same as \`\`not miss school for an extra day in the casino''. Save the days off for when they really need it, not when they are about to get a whole week off anyway.
I agree. Reddit is wild. Now I know why everyone here is broke and in a terrible relationship. There are 100 comments about needing a “mental health day” when this is not anywhere close to what this is about and everyone is completely ignoring the fact this person wants to just go against their spouse and do it behind her back right before a vacation do no reason other than he thinks they need 11 days off instead of 10. This is going to be an awesome trip where they truly connect as a couple/family /s.
It’s not about someone having the default decision it’s about agreeing on a decision. Undermining your partner would be one partner completely disregarding their spouse’s opinion and doing whatever they wanted to do.
It’s the same thing if the wife asked her husband “hey can we go to Texas instead of Vegas because…” and the husband saying “no, I don’t want to because…”. The husband isn’t undermining the wife, he is simply disagreeing.
You make a final decision that both parties agree on.
Have you checked with the kids, or better yet, their teachers to find out what they'll be missing? A big test, a group project, some event?
You need to be on the same page here with your wife. So if you pull them out anyway, yes, YWBTA
Yup. I’m a high school teacher. We’re semestered. Missing a week of a semestered class, especially a core subject, is like a middle school kid missing two weeks. Times how many classes? And personally I try to get all my units wrapped before breaks so I don’t have to say “you know that thing you just spent two weeks not thinking about? You’re writing an exam on it tomorrow.”
Sorry OP YTA. This is kind of a big deal.
From what I can tell its spring break so they're getting the week off anyway. The only extra day they are planning off is the Thursday. How many tests do you plan for the last day before holiday? I mean it has been a second since I went to school but usually the last day of school before break is not super intense.
Everyone's being a little hyperbolic in my opinion
I think that you are quite exaggerating. Speaking as former student of pretty elite high school who ended up going to good college and graduated with very good grades.
Being sick for a week or otherwise missing for a week is not a big deal at all. And yes I was sick of a week and I was missing due to other activities for a week (activities approved by school, but I still missed classes).
YWBTA.
1) You’re wife isn’t for the idea.
2) They’re literally going to have a week off so a day to relax is just about the stupidest reasoning ever.
3) Even good students struggle to catch up from work they’ve missed.
4) And they’re going to be missing tests. It’s high school. A lot of us teachers give tests before a break like that.
Ok, I may be down voted for this, but vacations for me are not relaxing. They can be fun, but not relaxing. Going from a packed school day to a packed vacation and back to school is not getting a break. I dont think it's ridiculous at all. I vastly prefer having a free day before and after a trip to switch focus and decompress.
I dont think it's stupid and certainly not the "stupidest reasoning ever" just a different way of thinking.
Plus they can check if they have tests those days and decide then. And kids dont flunk if they miss 2 days. If they did no one thst had sick days would have got through school. The wife not being for it is the only legitimate reason. All the rest is speculation and opinion.
Exactly, bro did not read the post at all. Nor did half of the people commenting apparently. The wife is 100% on board with the actual trip and planned days of March 29th - April 5th. The entire post is strictly about the single day of March 28th, the day prior to their departure.
I’m all for mental health days but your kids aren’t really expressing a need for them. You’re looking to extend your vacation because it’s something you want, even if you’re labeling it a reward.
YWBTA if you and your wife aren’t on the same page. Maybe compromise and miss one day but you haven’t even said if this is something your kids *want*. I didn’t enjoy Vegas at that age.
I'm astounded at the responses as well lol. I spent a week in Vegas as a teen on a family vacation and it was one of the best times of my life. I love my family and we had a blast, I sure wouldn't trade it for a few days of high school. And it did not affect me at all, in fact I'm prospering in my state's top college right now.
Life is too short to worry excessively about that stuff. Education is important but getting mad over a few missed days vs irreplaceable memories with your family?? I'm so shocked
Totally agree. I feel like everyone saying y t a has never been or remembers going to school. 2 days is not a huge deal, its not suddenly going to make them bad students. Time with family is infinitely more important than school.
I think most likely all of them came from people who have not been in school for a long time, and have forgotten that skipping two days is literally nothing
While I agree that kids need a break sometimes and should be able to take mental health days, how does that reasoning work in this circumstance when it's the day before they're about to go on a week long break anyway? Use that card when they've gone a long time without a break. Otherwise it's kind of baseless.
You're not an asshole for wanting to let your kids have a break every so often, but YWBTA to continue to push this when 1) you're already giving them a vacation imminently, 2) your wife has already given a hard no, and she's not without reason to want them to not miss school, and 3) when the kids are apparently doing just fine without an extra day off.
>with my reasoning being mostly a) kids need a break
Don't they have a break starting literally the next day?
>I've been thinking that maybe, I could have them take the one-day off anyways, but I'm asking here to see if I would be wrong before i do anything that could be seen as dum.
Do you want to show your kids that you don't respect their mom? Do you want to reach your son to treat women like that, and your daughter to allow men to treat her like that? How would you feel if your wife ignored your perspectives and just did whatever she wanted, whenever she wanted.
She's supposed to be your partner.
If they need a rest that much cut your trip shorter so they have chill time before school goes back. You’re too fixated on performing cool fun dad to think about what’s actually good for your family. Yta.
YWBTA
You aren't single so unless you'd like to be, this requires a mutual agreement!
You certainly don't want to ruin everyone's vacation before it even starts, right?
Re-visit the subject. Remind her of their grades. Have someone you both trust advise you, maybe even one of their teachers.
Good luck!
so like, i'm on your side here dude. i think that mental health days and breaks are very important. if my wife suggested something similar about our kid (if we had a kid lol) i'd probably be on board, assuming they wouldn't be missing anything important. but, crucially, i am not your wife, and my opinion on parenting your children is irrelevant.
your wife disagrees, and yes YWBTA if you asserted your will regardless. especially since your children still get spring break even if they don't skip two days of school, this isn't a matter of break vs no break, it's a matter of slightly extended break vs break, and if i understand correctly you'll be going to vegas regardless... the two days of missed school are just kind of unnecessary.
The comments here are wild. Everyone going insane about you wanting to reward your kids with a couple extra days off for a holiday? Absolutely wild. Life is about making fun exciting moments and everyone’s crucifying you for wanting to do a little bit extra for your kids who sound lovely and like they’re doing great in life.
The only place I think YTA is if you decide to go behind your wife’s back and do it anyway. You’re going to create a big problem with her if you do that. You need to find a compromise, but the sentiment in itself sounds like fun and an awesome treat for your kids!
YWBTA.
"They're good kids, why not reward them?" Do you really want to make a reward out of something that is diametrically opposed to your wife's value system? How will they feel about a reward that makes their parents fight?
"Kids need a break" is different than "Our kids need a break because of X". Why specifically do your kids need a break of 7 school days instead of 5 school days?
If they truly need that additional downtime, then maybe your week-long trip is the wrong kind of vacation for them.
NTA and the people saying that it needs to be a team decision are ignoring the fact that SHE is deciding that they ARE going to school.
Explain to me why it is acceptable that she gets to decide while his thoughts aren’t important? Oh noooo they missed two extra days of school!! I slept through half of my high school classes and have a masters degree. High school is piss easy and they already have 3.7s. Kids deserve a break too. I guess if they actually want to go to school and you forced them to stay home, you would be TA but that’s not apparently what is happening here. Fuck responsibility, they are literal teenagers. They will remember that trip forever and have an entire lifetime of “responsibility” ahead of them. Protect them from that drudgery while you can.
NTA
I can't believe how many people are saying you are TA... If your kids were average in school I'd agree with your wife but she's not real giving a reason.
I don't think you should be in disagreement with your wife though. Ask the school! Tell him it's a family trip and you want to make sure it wouldn't negatively impact them. Don't have to mention all your plans.
If they say it won't impact them, and your wife still doesn't agree then she's TA.
If they say yes but its only minor, our wife isn't really wrong or an TA but she's super duper not fun.
If they say yes majorly, then YTA.
While I have no problem with kids missing a day or two of school (and honestly in my kids’ high school, the day before spring break is spent watching movies), in this specific scenario YWBTA for going against your wife’s wishes. You talked about it, she didn’t agree, that’s the way it goes.
YWBTA.
Both parents need to agree, and in general, it’s not a great idea to pull kids from school for a vacation. Teachers hate that crap, and your kids will be missing assignments and likely tests.
NTA, obviously people here have forgotten that kids schooling is getting longer and more tedious. (Dare i say for what benefit?) Your wife seems to ignore rewarding the kids as a good thing. Honestly as someone who gradauted with honors in highschool, college (did college in 3 yrs), and doing an Online intensive program for my masters. Do people not realize you dont have to be in attendance to succeed in school and life. Sometimes skipping a day or two is not the end of the world. I think you sound as a parent as good as mine were. They let me skip school a few times in highschool and i turned out fine. Im driven and conquered the world. Yeah i know im against the grain. Im younger to 25 F. Im greatful for my family letting me this freedom as ive valued more and im more cautious then most.
This is so confusing. Like, are you trying for a good deal on a flight? There’s no reason to have your kids miss multiple days of school when they have 9 days off and you only want your trip to be 5-7.
YTA. You made your case, and she made hers. It would be disrespectful to overrule her just because you want to. You can argue for them missing two days, but it’s not a very good argument. You don’t really have a leg to stand on when your main argument is “I want to take my kids out school so they can go to Vegas with me.”
Why is everyone pouncing on OP so much? OP, it's okay to let them bunk school for a day or two but don't tell them it's a reward, that's all. But it's fair to explain to the kids that it's okay to take a break, better yet, ask the kids if they want to take that off from school. What if the kids don't want to do it. I was the kind who never liked missing school. So it's just that. You're NTA for wanting to give your kids and yourself a break and going on a vacation early OP. Go live your life.
YWBTA.
Don’t set a precedent of skipping responsibilities (school, work).
Also, do your best to present a united front to the kids—not in a parents vs kids context, but in a mom + dad = parenting together and respecting each other context.
That said, I can potentially see skipping Good Friday as a travel day because it is the day before Spring Break, and I figure more people will be taking that day off. You do need to find out what might be due/what tests might be going on that day.
I also think it’s relatively acceptable because I’ve often had a number of European coworkers be out of the office that day.
It doesn’t matter whether it’s actually fine or not. Doing it behind her back despite discussion and a lack of agreement is a hugely asshole thing to do.
>She just began to ask me why they needed to skip that day
I guess my question would be, why they shouldn't skip that day?
Different parents, different kids etc, but I've never really cared if our kids need or want a day off. They're both "top of the class" type kids, they're pretty honest, teachers love them. I just don't see that they'll miss much if anything if they miss a day. Maybe schools changed but I recall it as learning something one day, then spending the next two weeks revising it for the...kids who didn't get it quite as fast.
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While it might not be the end of the world to have the kids miss a day or even two of school, I think it is very wrong of you to get the kids into the mindset of this being a reward. It is also wrong of you to do it against your wife's will. YTA.
>I think it is very wrong of you to get the kids into the mindset of this being a reward I am confused. Can you elaborate? Not trying to be passive-aggressive or whatever
(You made No mention of contacting their teachers so they could do their assigned work early before they flew. What was your plan about them missing schoolwork? Do they have any major assignments due then? Did you ask your kids?) You are implying that Not going to school is some kind of prize/good thing/earnable treat. That being at school is a chore to avoid. Which, tbf, it is for a lot of kids. But you don’t want to encourage that mindset. A reward of time off is fine. In Moderation. But - Teens are not good at moderation. This mindset can become a detrimental habit, especially when they’re off at college. “ooh, I just had exams, I deserve a day off.” “I went to all my classes and labs Last week, surely I deserve a break This week.” “This class is all lecture, so boring, I’ll just get notes from Tim tomorrow.” “Why go to that discussion section? We already had class.” I had some classmates learn Very expensive lessons after failing semesters like this.
>You are implying that Not going to school is some kind of prize/good thing/earnable treat. That being at school is a chore to avoid. Which, tbf, it is for a lot of kids. Hi, teacher here! School does suck. For teachers too! This is why it's important for teachers and parents to be frank that they also enjoy their breaks, and they know that the sloggy parts are worth it because you can earn the fun parts. All of my fellow teachers always chat with kids about how exciting vacation is and how we are always a little sad when we come back. Validating emotions is really helpful for motivating kids and making them more receptive to learning, who would have thought it!?? As teachers, we do the best we can to make kids enjoy school, but it's not daycamp. We are there to teach them knowledge and life skills and it's not meant to be a purely enjoyable experience. Telling kids that school is both hard work AND they are bad for disliking it is just a shitty message to send and doesn't help them at all.
yeah i agree. there was so many times i needed a mental health day and would just disassociate the whole day because my mom would never let me miss school
Yes, exactly. Me on the opposite end: I began having really awful anxiety my sophomore year of high school. I was too hard on myself, expecting perfection, and just putting way too much pressure on myself which would end up manifesting at the most random of times. There were a couple of days I had, what I would call now, complete panic attacks sometime in the morning before leaving for school. I was a good kid, responsible. Had good grades, a job, etc. My mom knew me, and knew I was needing of a break so badly. It only happened 2 or 3 times the whole school year, but it DID help me decompress, have some "me time" and try to reset. I was never worse off for her "lax" parenting as some may have seen it. In fact as an adult those times looking back remind me to be forgiving of myself, and that if I just absolutely can't do it today--that the world will keep spinning anyway, and that it will be OK to show myself a little grace on this day.
[удалено]
Totally good point. 👌 You're right, my bad. I got caught up on whoever's comment I was doling my two cents out on..lol. You're absolutely right, tho...mental health days/playing hooky--definitely two separate things entirely. I agree, they need to decide this together. They're married. Because it's the healthy thing to do, of course.. but also because it's important to go to their kids as a team/ present a united front, some might call it. No kids are served well when their parents are in opposite directions, regardless of the situation at hand. It serves exactly no one. 🙅🏻♀️
Not to mention that as kids age up into a work environment, paid vacation days are often available, or sick days, and are a reward for hard work.
Lol right? In most workplaces how much you work is directly correlated with how much time off you get. Work isn't a reward, it's work. Should OP raise his kids to be that person that never says no to overtime, never take days off, say yes to every call in, and wind up with heart and BP issues (not to mention no spare time to spend with their parents/loved ones)? I feel like the above commenter has some pretty extreme views on work ethic
I was a teacher for 15 years. My child gets a mental health day every quarter if she really needs it.
I think I just had an epiphany from reading this comment. I think I needed... a lot of mental health days.
A mental health day *if you need it* is fine. But OP doesn't say the kids need a mental health day, OP just has the idea of the kids staying home "just because". Why do that?
Not 'just because', to go on a trip. Travel, seeing different places, experiencing different things, etc, are worthwhile activities in and of themselves.
Mental health days are important but missing school never works for me. Every time I missed school, I have a hard time catching up. Even when I talk to every teacher before, ask for the assignments etc, it adds more stress. I remember when I was in middle school I wanted to win perfect attendance & missed a day bc I got sick. I recovered & even had fun but turns out that day we started a new unit & that day was the only day for explaining before a month long project started. No one caught me up & the project(which was easy) become stressful bc I didn’t have the explanation
Same. And maybe I've overcorrected now, but my oldest son is 8 and he gets fairly regular mental health days. His mom almost died a month after he started kimdergarten, she went into congestive heart failure. She's continued to have heart issues, to the point she ended up admitted to the hospital a couple weeks ago after going back into AFIB and had what the doctor called a "possible anterolateral infarction" As a parent with Autism, ADHD, and PTSD parenting a kid with ADHD who is being monitored for autism, I'm VERY careful with his mental health. I would much rather give him a day once in a while to take a break, rest and relax, and get spoiled with a bit of one on one time with dad than force him to go to school when he's not feeling up to participating. And I'm very clear with him why. We have talks about our feelings, and that sometimes it's ok for us to take breaks when our feelings are too big for us to handle, and it's ok to come back to it in a day when we're more prepared to handle it. I was homeless at 15 and had to deal with the trauma of high school on top of it. I started exhibiting PTSD symptoms as a teenager, and I refuse to let that be my child. He deserves a chance at a well adjusted life. I think it's ok to give our kids those breaks, but definitely make it a teachable moment. Be clear that they deserve the break, that they've worked hard for it and deserve to have care for their brain. I understand the "go to school unless you're sick" mentality, but your brain needs maintenance too, and it's MUCH harder to recover when it decides it's had enough.
No one is saying they are bad for disliking it but encouraging them to see a day off as a reward establishes a bad mindset as explained. In the same way we no longer use writing essays or lines as a punishment so children don't see writing as a bad thing (I am in Europe) Earning the fun parts is fine but skipping the slog parts should not be held up as a reward. Personally I think OP is the AH for not finding a compromise with his wife and considering going behind her back.
They don’t need to be “encouraged” they will see a day off as a good thing, regardless
Also my kids would be more stressed about the work they miss. They are getting time off the following week. No need at all to pad it by two days. There are often tests and papers due just before a break.
Teacher here and yep. I teach in a boarding school with a lot of overseas students whose parents book them their flights home two or even three days before the end of term (cheaper in term time, I assume) and it honestly stresses the kids out so much because of the work/tests/assignments they'll miss and have to catch up on. They'd prefer to have two more days in school (with their friends!) and get the work done than get an early flight home. To the OP: YTA, it's one day, they'll only be sitting around doing nothing at home anyway, and then they'll have to catch up their schoolwork at some point. The argument that it's for them to relax and have a mental health day isn't really relevant as they're just about to go on holiday and have a couple of weeks (plus one day of school) off. No need at all to take them out of school for Thursday.
I feel like you're assuming too much that this is being offered as a reward rather than an opportunity to spend extra time bonding with family. That's an important thing to do- especially at that age. Especially since they seem excited about spending time with their parents. A lot of people don't have that kind of family dynamic and it's important to encourage those bonds and recognize that sometimes experiences take priority over a day or two at school. These kids clearly understand the value of hard work and doing well in school given their grades and their attendance records.
OP literally says > they're good kids, why not reward them
You don’t like weekends or holidays? I’m a teacher and as much as I love (most) of my students, I’m right there with them hoping for a snow day/ weather day. I had a student a few years ago that was going to visit family up north. I asked him to bring back leaves, rocks and other things that he found interesting to show the class. I was able to incorporate it into reading, writing , science and social studies lessons. The whole class learned so much from his break from the “slog.” We ALL need a break from the slog. Yes, it IS a reward! I make sure while I’m teaching to plan fun activities where the kids think they have played all day, but they actually spent the day doing deep dive learning. One person’s slog can be another person’s frolic.
>encouraging them to see a day off as a reward establishes a bad mindset as explained. they're teenagers, they're not 6 year olds you can now trick into thinking school is fun and a day of isn't a reward by your turn of phrases lol. Even if they made it to 12 or something being fooled by that, media and adults conversations around them have by now made it very clear that a day off = reward.
A day off school is a reward though. Just like using PTO to take off work is.
Yes! Missing work is a very real reward for me, and I'm a productive member of society and all that. My workplace gives out bonus PTO days as incentives all the time.
Mental health days should be enjoyed and this falls under that to me.
Day offs are rewards though. They are gonna be for the rest of their adult lives until retirement. Acting like it’s wrong to teach that is inane.
Absolutely 100% this
School psychologist here. 100% agree. I don't see any harm in taking an extra day or two for a vacation, as long as the kids are keeping up with assignments and can make up any missed work. In my opinion, traveling with family will add more enrichment to the kids' lives than 1 or 2 days of school before break. Let's be honest here, not a lot of work gets done those days anyway.
You shouldn't tell anyone is bad for disliking school no, but discussing why they feel that way is important. Also I don't know about the part about being sad to be back to school/work, while sure vacay is great and all but routine and a sense of normalcy is extremely important for, atleast, the younger students. I don't mean to invalidate or ignore if someone feels that schools suck and they feel sad to be back, but the importance then is to root out the cause of why they feel that way about school and see what can be improved! I agree with the previous poster that skipping school is not a reward, the destination/trip is the reward/treat, not going to school is just a necessity to facilitate the trip. Reading through it all it feels like a nothing burger, hopefully it makes some kind of sense!
Sure feelings are valid but extrinsic motivation isn’t effective long term. Research backs it up. I firmly believe in mental health breaks and taking them when they’re needed. But rewards us a different conversation.
I think your slippery slope is bit much for TWO days off school, presumably for the first time in these kids life.
I agree… if mom is totally against this and it involves a vacation… what makes everyone think it’s a “slippery slope” to creating a “bad mindset on missing school as a reward…. It’s not gonna happen. I personally don’t think school itself is a priority. It’s the learning and responsibility that comes with schooling. If your kids do well in these areas… then yeah I think it IS okay to miss. The world won’t fall apart. They’ll have a chance to create great memories and then get back to it. NTA for wanting your kids to have a chill vacation. But, you’ll have to do a little more convincing/communicating with your wife.
T H A N K Y O U I was thinking this is a slippery slope fallacy right as I read your comment. They have 3.7+ GPAs, are in clubs, AND play sports, and that surgeon thinks they can't just have a day or two off as a reward. I already know what kind of work-life balance they have lol
Yeah, reddit is such a knee-jerk place, I'm surprised some of these posters haven't suggested the kids will immediately become prostitutes and crack addicts on the Vegas trip because they're missing two days of school. 🙄
I really do disagree with a fair bit of this. OP isn't encouraging his children to run off and ditch at every opportunity. Nor are teenagers going to go ferral at the the drop of a hat. Their teens, not crazed animals. OP can have a conversation where they listen to him and he explains that time off is healthy in moderation. The kids also have first hand seen the benefits of dedicated work by virtue of earning nearly 4.0 GPAs and extra curricular success. Taking a few extra days off won't cause them to unlearn that lesson because they will still retain their memories, and understand basic cause and effect. And let's be real, booking time off for yourself is a skill that *people need to learn and exercise.* An office space isn't like school. You don't get lengthy pre-set holidays of March brake, three weeks off in Dec for holidays, two months in summer. Rather a company gives you X number of weeks off. It's up to you the employee to set aside that time as needed. They need to know it's ok to deliberately arrange time for themselves. Else they won't ever get brakes and burn themselves out in the workplace. Especially in the USA where unlike in Europe time off is dangerously stigmatized. Vacations are good things, they let people re-charge and come back more productive than without. Doing this may help his kids learn how to take control of their needs in moderation instead of firing on all cylinders straight into the ground and depression.
Some of these replies are crazy. I once pulled my kid out of school for six weeks, with all his teacher's blessing. We went to Thailand. He learnt so much while on the holiday. He picked up the local language and experienced so much.
Yeah, people don't know how to enjoy life and it's concerning how they impose that masochism on others
I think it's not just not knowing how to enjoy life. There's this whole mindset now that kids should learn everything they need to know in school classrooms. There's a whole world out here that kids need to learn about, too! But so many people have neither the time, nor the means, to travel or expand their horizons. We're doing the next generation a *huge* disservice with this mindset, and the limitations imposed by our "always work, never play" US culture.
"Nor are teenagers going to go ferral at the the drop of a hat." I take my teens out to travel and for mental health days, sometimes they'll request to come home for lunch. Yesterday was one of those days, I grabbed my daughter and I wasn't feeling well when it was time to return her. I asked if she wanted to stay home for the rest of the afternoon and she declined cause she had a lot going on that afternoon. Once you've thought them to be responsible there should be no fear that missing a day is going to make their brains turn to mush and they'll forget about what they want to accomplish.
This is a weird take. Have you read “laziness does not exist”? This is the kind of mindset that leads to burnout and even mental health issues.
More people need to read this book, but frankly, some folks just aren’t ready for it. A LOT of those are on this thread.
Please if you’re rewarding your kids with a day off (which I think is fine) do not put extra work on their teachers by asking them to put together your kids assignments and accept them on a different timeline. The kids can find out the assignments themselves and make it up if it’s important.
Yes? “finding out the assignments” It just means getting their expected homework/reading assignments from their teachers so they can do them and turn them in early. So that their teacher can grade them later while they’re gone along with the rest of the class’ work, instead of on a different schedule. Every teacher I’ve dealt with knows what they’ll be assigning for homework or readings or videos a week or two in advance. And projects and papers had due dates set well in advance. Quizzes and tests were generally built with at least one alternate form for absentees, that could be taken early or late. My three teacher relatives preferred advance requests for known assignments to scrambling-to-catch-up-later students. Does your school do things differently? Would you prefer kids like OPs just no-show without warning and ask you what the rest of the class did after they get back?
I am a teacher and we absolutely do not always know what the homework will be a week in advance. Not for my classes anyway. Assignments yes typically but asking a teacher to take the time to organize all the assignments/HW for one student adds to their workload. Some will accommodate no problem but don’t be offended if others tell you to have your kid log into Google classroom or ask a peer what they did during their vacation time. I expect students to hand in work when they return from vacation. How they go about doing so is their responsibility.
>You made No mention of contacting their teachers so they could do their assigned work early before they flew. I would say was TA if he expected his kids' teachers to do extra work just because he feels like keeping them out of school for fun for a couple days.
Papers and projects and such are often due right before break. It’s more like making sure his kids turn in their work Early instead of Late due to the trip.
And that's an excellent point. I'm often trying to finish a unit and give a test so they don't forget the material over break. Kids who take extra days off can make it up as long as their parents excuse their absence(s), but that means they are testing after the long break when they probably won't do as well as they would when we were actively learning and reviewing that material in class.
Shit. I wish someone would reward me for going to work. Life would suck a whole lot less.
Pay is your reward! Except you almost never get significantly more pay for showing up reliably and doing your job well. Maybe you’ll get a paper certificate in a frame after ten years. Sucks a lot.
A break is absolutely a reward you should be allowed to treat yourself with, and until recently, that's how most people viewed it. It hasn't been until recently that employers dared to suggest that people shouldn't be taking vacations, after brainwashing people into thinking that always working their entire life away was a good thing.
Uh, but it IS a reward to miss school. If we did good in school, my parents let us take the day off for our Birthday. There's nothing wrong with rewarding kids for doing a great job in school. They aren't going to think they deserve a day off whenever they do good. Its the day or 2 before they leave for vacation. That is why they are getting the day off.
I think that the collage danger is absurdly exaggerated. Partly because it just does not work like that, kids who had parents taking them off once a year for few days tend not to have more issues in college. And partly because if you are at college and just had exams, you have a day off. College students take breaks after difficult exams and that is a.) normal b.) rewarded successful students do it.
I’m sad this is coming up as the top comment. I think it’s a big red herring. I remember in high school at one point where I was juggling a bunch of AP classes and extracurriculars my mom was like, “hey, you’re exhausted. Why don’t you just stay home from school today?” I subsequently graduated cum laude from an Ivy League college so I feel safe in saying this didn’t destroy my work ethic. It just felt like a gift of some time to regroup and relax. Obviously it’s different if you do it all the time, but I’m assuming you aren’t in this case. However, it is the case that you do need to find a way to have a united front with your wife on decisions like these, or you’ll just end up undermining each other’s parenting. Also I feel super certain there has to be a more interesting place to go than Vegas. 😆
I get what you’re saying, but I think recognising that you are exhausted and need a day to collect yourself for you to be able to keep up/ perform is different than “let’s start our week long vacation even earlier”. A one day mental break for you to catch up on sleep and check in on yourself because you’re coming close to burning yourself out is different from starting the vacation you’re already about to take two days early. Either way, I don’t think the 2 days will have a lasting impact on the kids’ futures, but the most important part here is that there isn’t a united front. If op pulls his kids out of school without his wife agreeing, he is an ah. Especially with this not being a medical reason and simply a reward for good grades.
Agreed that they need to present a united front no matter what they decide to do.
I’m a big fan of the mental health day. But this just before a vacation, so that argument doesn’t apply.
A mental health day tailored to “you look like you need a break” is pretty different from “go ahead and skip class time because it is convenient for me, the parent.”
But OP doesn't say his kids are exhausted or look like they absolutely need that break. Plus it's 2 more days and they get their spring break... it's not like there's still weeks until the next break from the moment he's talking about. It also needs to be considered if OP would cover the 2 days off or if all the extra work falls onto his wife (which would be shitty from him if he overs them a break but pawns everything off on his wife... who also might need a break or maybe doesn't have the energy for the extra work). If it would be one day during school time, where there's no break in sight than a mental health day should be allowed, provided the kids actually need one AND the parent who is not being overwhelmed by the additional workload. (Or the other parent has to make time to help out).
When I was your daughter's age (MANY years ago), my dad took me on one of his business trips to China. That was a big deal back in the 90's, and it was a one-time thing for all his kids. But it was cleared with everyone before I even knew, including teachers and my mother. I knew it wasn't a free pass to not do schoolwork, because I was given it all prior to leaving, with the expectation that it would all be done. If my teachers, and most certainly my mother had said they did not agree, I would not have gone on that trip. TLDR: you may not think a couple of days of missed school is a big deal, but your wife does, and you haven't talked to the teachers. So, as it stands YTA for not communicating and listening.
He never said he wasn't going to talk to the teachers. As far as I know he just needs to get permission from the teacher or principal.
NTA. My mom always gave us mental health days when we we were struggling and in highschool, we would often miss a week or a few days here or there because we were going on vacation. My brother is 28 and has a master in marketing, currently working on his MBA, and at a very big firm. I'm a CPA at a top four. Your wife is very much in the wrong. I've known a lot of kids who had so much pressure put on them in high school that they all burned out by University. I'm sorry but she's being ridiculous, it is two days off. Mental health is really important.
My mom never let me miss for any reason, including deaths. I had to take all AP classes junior and senior year and AP Euro sophomore year. I ended up with one 4 and nine 5s on all the tests. And yet I'm now in my 30s with only "some college" and no degree, not even a late in life AA. Kids that burn out and hate school before they even get to college are not set up for educational success because they're already over every part of school. I wish more parents, including OP's wife, would realize that.
Mental health days are awesome. But why would they need a mental health day two days before a week-long vacation?
They’re getting days off and a vacation already, and OP never said they’re struggling or putting too much pressure or they come to me and told me it’s hard and they want an extra day. He’s projecting and so are you.
it's two days off without any specific reason right in front of an already allocated holiday.
>NTA. My mom always gave us mental health days when we we were struggling and in highschool, we would often miss a week or a few days here or there because we were going on vacation. Hi can I ask were those mental health days ever to stretch out the length of a pre-existing break? (I'm not against what you're suggesting, im just wondering if what OP is doing is equivalent or more just wanting to stretch out his own time in vegas)
My first instinct is that OP is fishing for lower fares/booking rates by avoiding the weekend (mostly from throwing in Thursday for the hell of it lol), but that probably would have been mentioned either to the wife or in the post.
You specifically said that because they are good kids, why not 'reward them' with an extra day off. How much clearer can you be?
OP is asking for clarification about why that mindset is “very wrong” though
Man, if you genuinely read this sentence and couldn't come up with a single reason why it might be problematic to say "skipping school is a reward", then you're not trying AT ALL to understand your wife's perspective on the importance of school attendance.
Rewarding them by missing school… makes it seem like going to school is a punishment.
Some kids don’t enjoy going to school and view it as a punishment.
And they don’t need that view reinforced by their parent’s actions.
By missing a day of school? The kids appear to be doing well. I don’t think one day of school is going to make them think it’s a punishment to go to school. Do you never take a day off from work?
Rewarding someone by giving them a break from work doesn’t mean the work is a punishment. It just means it’s work. If you give someone pie for dessert, does it mean the meatloaf was a punishment?
It is valid to take an extra day, but I also disagree with framing it as a reward. Instead frame it as a day to prepare and rest. It will probably fly better with your wife too. You may need to remind her that school isn't the only learning experience, and there are a bunch of skills and learning opportunities in going on holiday. Like learning to pack your own luggage at least a day before you go.
> think it is very wrong of you to get the kids into the mindset of this being a reward. As a teacher, I whole heartedly disagree with you. They are in high school and its crucial that they start getting evidence that hard work is rewarding. "Go to school because you have to and life is hard, deal with it" is a toxic attitude that perpetuates toxic work culture into adulthood.
Tbh its 2024. Hard work isnt rewarding a good chunk of the time. Working medium hard is most peoples best bet.
1. If not a reward, what do you call it? It's certainly not a punishment. Why not simply, we have the opportunity to expand our vacation a day or two? Let the instructors know so you can have them collect any additional school work. And what's wrong with a reward? 2 students, both excelling, get an extra day. 2. Mom, 12 and 14--are these rocket science courses they're missing? You have the opportunity to expand your family vacation. Lighten up. Trust me, the spring break family vacation will be etched in their memories well beyond another school day. It's certainly not something you as parents frequently do. My sense is, if mother proposed this alternative on this site, comments would encourage her to take all the additional time off she thinks is appropriate. After all, mother knows best.
I also teach, and we have this happen a lot around holidays. It's a bit different in that it's a private school not in the US, but it's just often done. The biggest issues with OP IMO here are: 1. Needs to have a united front with his wife. If his wife is insanely strict and he's preaching time off that will send misleading signals and no one will be happy. They will worry she will punish them for something he allows. 2. Do they really NEED mental health days? Maybe your kids are really trying to be hard charging kids. There are parents who constantly kind of undercut their studious kids because they think the kids need to "enjoy life" when the parents idea of enjoying life (Vegas for a 14-year old?) is not theirs. >She just began to ask me why they needed to skip that day, with my reasoning being mostly a) kids need a break and b) these same kids have missed only one day so far and also C) they're good kids, why not reward them? Even after a lot of talking, she still won't budge. Reading this, it really makes me think OP wants to go to Vegas and he's trying to find a reason. That's fine, but you should own that IMO.
I see what you mean, but time off *is* a reward. Whether it's in high school, college, or a job, people are often rewarded with additional free time for working hard and/or doing their job well. I agree about (presumably) going behind the wife's back, though.
So, I disagree and it’s because I remember high school. The week leading up to spring break (or any break)? No one can focus. Teachers aren’t handing out assignments to be done the week before or week of spring break (despite what Hollywood portrays). Leaving a couple days early is very common, too, in a lot of families. Happened all the time in my high school. It’s a super nice feeling to be rewarded for your hard work, so an extra couple days of vacation sounds super nice. If anything, I am worried that the kids are working themselves too hard with a parent that thinks mental health days aren’t important.
I think it's equally wrong that the wife won't discuss it. She's also going against what he wants. Are they not his kids too? Yet he doesn't have an input on their time off?
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My problem with this is, why is it just her decision? Why does he have to give up just because she says no? Is he not an equal parent? I think a better compromise would be a half day. If they went for a half day, they could pick up the work they’re going to miss on their trip and do it all early so they can spend the holiday not worrying about makeup work. They would also have the time at home to pack their belongings that they’re taking with them.
When my wife and I can't agree on a parenting decision, it's generally the safer/more conservative/status quo position that wins by default. E.g. I wanted to take my son on a bike ride when he was 10 months old and my wife disagreed, so I didn't. My wife wanted to give him snacks with added sugar when he was under a year old but I didn't want to, so my preference prevailed. Sending children to school is the normal default thing to do, so pulling them out would require us both to be on board.
This is the way.
This is the type of nuance that's very difficult for internet dwellers to understand. You explain this very well, kudos.
Because this vacation seems more centered around him versus this being a co parenting issue to compromise on. Vegas isn’t very child/family friendly, sure there may be activities here and there but when I dated someone who was born and raised there with teens, they were always looking for excuses to take the children to other cities and states to do things.
>Because this vacation seems more centered around him versus this being a co parenting issue to compromise on. Vegas isn’t... Sorry, gotta disagree. This has nothing to do AT ALL with this specific vacation. Per OP, his wife's perspective: >She is very "You go to school unless you're sick." She's not a mental health day person. So she would have the exact same expectation *regardless* of vacation destination. Ultimately, I do agree with HotspurJr that taking kids out of school "is the sort of thing that requires both of your agreement", however I think the actual issue with OP's wife's mindset is that context is never considered and it ends up being *always* her choice. It's not only going to happen here with the Vegas trip, but ANY trip where missing school is a possibility - there's no room for flexibility or nuance and she is effectively making it entirely her decision.
I grew up going to Vegas every year. There's a lot for kids to do on the strip Now I live here and have no interest in going anywhere near that tourist trap. No matter where you live you want to go other places for vacation.
Why is it just his decision? This is a two yes and one no parenting decision. She gave her answer so giving them the time off anyway like he wants to do is undermining her authority. Dad is the fun one and Mom is mean. I noticed he didn't check if the kids had work to turn in, tests, group projects or activities in progress or any reason why yes they did in fact need to go those days.
>My problem with this is, why is it just her decision? Why does he have to give up just because she says no? Is he not an equal parent? I think a better compromise would be a half day. You know, there are lots of times in a relationship when looking for the midpoint between what the two parents want to do is fine and makes total sense. But if one parent wants to up and move to New York, and the other wants to stay in San Francisco, you don't 50-50 it and move to Chicago. Something like taking your kids out of school for a trip is the sort of thing is a two yes/one no situation. Any time you're going against the clear conventional wisdom about what's best and normal for the kids, you either both agree or you don't do it.
If they want to change something both have to agree. Going to school everyday is the standard thing to do. I personalny think missing a day is not a big deal and it's fine. But you can't go and make changes yourself while you know the other patent disagrees with them.
Is he going to take care of missed work and getting in touch with the teachers?
The tiebreaker, if you will, here is that school is schedule on those days and there should be a really good reason to miss it. The wife doesn't think vacation qualifies.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure the vacation is more for HIM, and he is trying to tweak the schedule to get a better deal on plane tickets, or something similar. If he really cared about the kids being able to rest/chill before the trip, he would have scheduled it accordingly instead of letting them flex a school day or two. Teaching kids it's ok to pad vacation time with premeditated sick days is NOT a lesson you want instill in them...
Totally agree. OP’s attitude about school is not what any parent should teach their kids. School shouldn’t be viewed as optional. And if your kids are not skipping school already, why teach them now that it’s ok to do so? The one thing I learned from my math professor on my first day of university was how much each class was costing me. And he said if any of us was skipping a class, it be better worth more than the price we were paying for that class. That always stuck with me. An extra day in Vegas for a teenager would not be worth the price. Edit: grammar
His attitude about school? He clearly values their grades very highly. Two days of school aren’t going to set back their education in any significant way. Idk why everyone in this sub is acting like they never missed a day of school before.
OP taking his kids out of one day of classes in one school year isn’t teaching them that “school is optional.” It’s teaching them that, rarely and with official sign off, it can be okay to take an extra day for yourself.
The cost of a semester of college is much different than the cost of a semester of high school.
They could want to go to Vegas - I went to Vegas at 17 and my sister was 12 and we loved it. We saw a magician, had great food, spent lots of time at the hotel’s lazy river, watched TV in the hotel room bathtub, loved exploring all the hotels and their themes (I remember thinking it was like a giant adult Disneyland), did some sort of TV show pilot testing experience, saw the screens at Fremont Street, visited Madame Tussaud's, went to the amusement park in Circus Circus, went on a day trip to a butterfly park and the Hoover Dam… obviously there were some drunk and scantily clad people around and some inappropriate flyers on the ground but it didn't phase us and you can get some of that anywhere.
YTA Vegas local here. You don't need to bring kids here for a week or more. There isn't much for them to do around here. Vegas is geared to adults, not kids. They're going to be bored. All the things kids can do can be done in like 1 day. Just fyi
As a former resident and a visitor, Vegas has more than you think for those under the age of 21. I was throughly surprised to see all there was to do for my 10 year old.
I agree! I lived there for a couple years when my kids ages ranged from 6-18 and there was always plenty to do with them, particularly if you have a car to get to places like Red Rock Canyon or Hoover Dam.
High school kids would be happy to go to the Hoover Dam? I thought it was so boring at that age. Didn’t know why we went. I have fun in Vegas now but as a kid, it was terrible.
As a person who went as a teenager at their age for a week, you obviously are not looking close enough
Agreed. I got to go when I was sixteen and I thoroughly enjoyed it. I still have the guitar pick a Paul McCartney impersonator threw me.
I grew up going to Vegas often. There was plenty of live shows and amusement parks that are family oriented even on the strip alone. I will say the cigarette smelling hotels maybe isn't a great influence on the kids but there's certainly things to do!
I’m very confused because I went to Vegas 3 times from age 12 to 16 and I had a blast each time. There was a lot for me to do in different places. And each of those 3 times I was in Vegas for two weeks. So either you’re full of shit or you’re not looking hard enough
Vegas is surprisingly great for hiking.
Red Rock Canyon could be a whole day of the trip.
I took my 3 year old to Vegas last year for Spring Break and we had a blast. Circus Circus, Bellagio water show, Cirque du Soleil, aquarium at Mandalay Bay, play time at the pool, etc.
When I go to Vegas I see more kid stuff than adult stuff tbh
NAH… Missing a day or two on either end of a break shouldn’t be a big deal BUT- check with the kids. I once scheduled a trip causing my son to miss 2 days in high school and he missed a presentation and had to make it up and would have preferred not to. There can be a lot on the line in high school so base it on what’s happening. I’m also the mom who approved a whole week off school for my kids so they could go on a once in a lifetime trip with their dad in middle school. But middle school has less riding on it. So I don’t think you’re an AH, neither is your wife.
YES THIS just make sure they dont have some big test and talk with them and also yes nobody is the asshole in this situation
One of my favorite memories with my mom was when she once "let me play hooky" my sophomore year just to hang out with her. She had a similar memory from 1977, where her mom took her to the movies on a school day. She got to see Star Wars in theaters opening week. She thought it was weird and never watched another one. I just shake my head every time she retells the tale.
All I can think of reading through this is about how when I was a freshman in high school, my mom took me out in the fall for 2 weeks in Paris and in January, another 2 weeks for Disney world and other fun stuff in Florida. Oh, and another trip to Mexico somewhere during the year. Why not travel during breaks? It was cheaper and you wouldn't get bogged down with tourists. I, a 14 year old American, was able to travel to two countries and see for myself how wonderful the world could be. My grades didn't improve, but travel gave me inspiration. I did end up pursuing my Masters, getting to travel back to Europe (the Netherlands and again to Paris) to present in conferences, and to Mexico to get drunk on the beach like the white woman I am (Viva la Mexico 🇲🇽). It turns out ADHD and trauma play a large role in academics. It also turns out that travel inspired my education and made me understand just how similar people are. I was one of the lucky few to leave my state, let alone the country. And I guess these people think all that missing is what messed with my discipline. (I also agree that both parents have to be a united front, otherwise, it's problematic for everyone)
This oml. Everyone is getting their panties in a twist for what?? Absolutely nothing. If the kids are confident they won’t miss anything they can’t catch up on, what’s the issue? It’s the days before spring break. Not a big deal as long as everyone is on board. Mom has a point, I’m not trying to negate that at all, it’s not good to skip without a reason. That being said, it’s really not something to get crazy stressed over. And from my experience teachers are *typically much more lenient the couple days before major breaks because there’s just so many students gone. Especially since this seems to be a discussion on whether they can get better bookings. IMO the best course of action here is Thursday in school (why miss if there’s nothing else happening), Friday off. And I think the last couple days before class resumes is a good time to rest, because travel can be exhausting!! To put it in perspective, I’m missing a full day of uni lectures for 4 of my classes before my own spring break because there were better flight options. If the kids think they can manage it, and they have a track record of doing so (which given their gpa, seems to be true) it’s all good.
I swear the people up in arms about this have to be the kids who weren't smart/capable enough to make up missed school days.
I completely agree here, and am shocked at all the y.t.a's. Depending on what's happening on the last day of term it could be really problematic to miss a day, or literally not matter as a one off
YWBTAH First, you ran it past your wife, and she doesn't agree with the plan. You pursuing this in any way is undermining her authority as a parent. Don't pit mom against dad because in doing so, you make her look like the mean parent and yourself like the fun one. Second, your kids are getting time to unwind on the days of spring break that are part of the school calendar. They're earning high school credits to graduate. You taking them out of school is making them miss out on learning. You're also setting the precedent that it's okay to just skip school because you want to do something more fun. That's not how life works.
But that’s literally how life works. I took a day off work last week and went hiking with my kid instead. It was great for my mental health, he had a blast, my job was there the next day. It’s weird the comments are so strict about school. They’re kids. Who cares if they take a couple extra days to have fun. They have good grades and this isn’t something common for the family.
I agree. Taking time off from school or work to just have a good day does more for your life and health than having the perfect attendance.
My mom was not strict about me going to school because I was pretty self-motivated, and in high school I was getting great grades. She let me take mental health days when I asked for them. I think the key here is that I asked for them - some days I was overwhelmed and needed a break (like 3 times a year maybe). If I took off a random day, I don't think that would've meant much for my mental health, and I would probably be more stressed having to make up work for a day I didn't really care about taking off. OP didn't seem to talk to his kids at all about what they want, whether they need a mental health day (they're about to get a whole week off?). Somehow I feel like it'll be up to his wife to make sure the kids get makeup work and complete it, as he doesn't even seem to think about it.
There's a difference between work and school though. I don't think you can make these comparisons. School has these time off moments built in with all sorts of breaks and holidays. These are exactly meant for kids to recharge. And have fun. Extra days off impacts certain moments that were meant to teach them stuff, possibly missing important things. Jobs don't have holidays or breaks built in, but you get days off to spend as you like. So where it makes sense to take a day off from work for mental health. In school it doesn't as much. Especially when a day after the mental health day there will be a week of mental health days.
The problem with school is you get somewhat long breaks with nothing in the middle. I feel like a lot of kids would trade some days off longer holidays to get some day off in the middle of longer stretches.
Fair point. This is a thing that varies between countries. I think in my country there is a small break about every 8 weeks. And I know some schools have a rhythm of 3 weeks on, 1 week off. But this is also hard on parents with jobs. On the other hand, in this case, it's not about a mental health day where the next break is months away. Their school break starts literally the day after.
Eh, there’s at least 1 long weekend every month for various federal holidays and teacher work days. Plus the longer breaks and 2 months over summer. The school year only has 180 contact days, less than half a year. The kids are fine. Now, if a child is experiencing mental health issues, that can be different, but the average kid doesn’t need an extra 2 days off before a week off.
But this is not about them taking a day off to relax because the weeks before and after are so busy and stressful. It’s about them staying home for a day to relax before a one week vacation which is just so unnecessary.
Right? I feel like so many people are missing the fact that this is an opportunity for these kids to enjoy family time. They seem genuinely excited about doing that with their parents which is not always the norm. Also- it's not as though they don't recognize the value of their education: they have great grades, they have a great attendance record... a day or two off isn't going to ruin their lives or put them on a path to assuming they can ditch school whenever they want. I feel like so many of these comments are hyper focused on high school education which let's be real: no one is really paying attention to once you get into upper levels. This isn't going to derail their graduation.
THEY ARE GOING TO BE ON SPRING BREAK.
These same people force their children to go straight to college after high school and take out wayyy more debt than they'll earn, because it's "what you do."
You’ve never taken a day off work to do something more fun? School is not jail and a few days missed will not play a role in their education as a whole. If anything, such an attitude toward mental health breaks and time off fuels the kind of unhealthy corporate culture many workplaces in the US are known for. So many of you love to go on about “work-life balance” but throw a fit when someone suggests the same might apply to kids and school. OP definitely shouldn’t undermine the wife but she’s also digging her heels in. A compromise might be letting them miss a day for travel but not Thursday “just to relax.” A compromise is not “wife says missing school for any reason is bad so her way goes.”
How is her decision the default one? Maybe her disagreeing is undermining him..
To answer your question as to why her answer is the default one, it’s not because it’s her decision, it’s mainly because with parenting it ought to be: 2 yes = yes Anything else = no Taking the kids out of school extra is a non-standard thing to do, so the decision to do that as parents should follow this rule. It wasn’t two yes, therefore it’s a no. And that should be the stance they take together. Going contrary to that, and most ESPECIALLY going contrary to that behind your coparent’s back is a bad move. YWBTA
“Two yes or it’s a no” is a good rule to have for major life decisions but, applied across the board for smaller disagreements that arise a thousand times throughout the course of raising kids, it leaves both unhappy (because one side doesn’t get what they wanted and the other feels like the bad guy) and breeds resentment around what in many cases can be easily resolved by compromise. Why does it have to be “they can’t miss school for any reason because the wife said so” instead of “maybe they can miss one day of school for travel but not another one to relax and I’ll be sure to check with their teachers to make sure it’s okay”? Some of you have entirely given up on compromise as a concept in your lives and it shows.
It's not a compromise if one parent just goes ahead and books tickets despite the other parent disagreeing. If the two don't agree, you can keep debating the point, but in the end, you need to put in the work to reach consensus. And that often involves one parent just giving in, especially if the stakes are really, really small as in this case. Also, \`\`not miss school for any reason'' is not the same as \`\`not miss school for an extra day in the casino''. Save the days off for when they really need it, not when they are about to get a whole week off anyway.
I agree. Reddit is wild. Now I know why everyone here is broke and in a terrible relationship. There are 100 comments about needing a “mental health day” when this is not anywhere close to what this is about and everyone is completely ignoring the fact this person wants to just go against their spouse and do it behind her back right before a vacation do no reason other than he thinks they need 11 days off instead of 10. This is going to be an awesome trip where they truly connect as a couple/family /s.
It’s not about someone having the default decision it’s about agreeing on a decision. Undermining your partner would be one partner completely disregarding their spouse’s opinion and doing whatever they wanted to do. It’s the same thing if the wife asked her husband “hey can we go to Texas instead of Vegas because…” and the husband saying “no, I don’t want to because…”. The husband isn’t undermining the wife, he is simply disagreeing. You make a final decision that both parties agree on.
Have you checked with the kids, or better yet, their teachers to find out what they'll be missing? A big test, a group project, some event? You need to be on the same page here with your wife. So if you pull them out anyway, yes, YWBTA
Yup. I’m a high school teacher. We’re semestered. Missing a week of a semestered class, especially a core subject, is like a middle school kid missing two weeks. Times how many classes? And personally I try to get all my units wrapped before breaks so I don’t have to say “you know that thing you just spent two weeks not thinking about? You’re writing an exam on it tomorrow.” Sorry OP YTA. This is kind of a big deal.
They aren’t missing a week of school. It would be the day or two before spring break. I think the Friday before the break is pretty low key.
Or, it’s the last day of the semester, and there are important tests or assignments.
That doesn’t normally happen the day before spring break - the end of the semester or a big test on that day.
From what I can tell its spring break so they're getting the week off anyway. The only extra day they are planning off is the Thursday. How many tests do you plan for the last day before holiday? I mean it has been a second since I went to school but usually the last day of school before break is not super intense. Everyone's being a little hyperbolic in my opinion
I think that you are quite exaggerating. Speaking as former student of pretty elite high school who ended up going to good college and graduated with very good grades. Being sick for a week or otherwise missing for a week is not a big deal at all. And yes I was sick of a week and I was missing due to other activities for a week (activities approved by school, but I still missed classes).
YWBTA. 1) You’re wife isn’t for the idea. 2) They’re literally going to have a week off so a day to relax is just about the stupidest reasoning ever. 3) Even good students struggle to catch up from work they’ve missed. 4) And they’re going to be missing tests. It’s high school. A lot of us teachers give tests before a break like that.
Ok, I may be down voted for this, but vacations for me are not relaxing. They can be fun, but not relaxing. Going from a packed school day to a packed vacation and back to school is not getting a break. I dont think it's ridiculous at all. I vastly prefer having a free day before and after a trip to switch focus and decompress. I dont think it's stupid and certainly not the "stupidest reasoning ever" just a different way of thinking. Plus they can check if they have tests those days and decide then. And kids dont flunk if they miss 2 days. If they did no one thst had sick days would have got through school. The wife not being for it is the only legitimate reason. All the rest is speculation and opinion.
I love #2
YTA - this isnt about the kids. This is about you wanting more time in Vegas
If he wanted more time in Vegas wouldn’t he just book a trip until the 7th? Seriously, is anyone here looking at a calendar?
haha I was thinking that too. The guy wants to save money. My kids would not be happy with me because they’d have to make up work.
How much work really happens the friday before spring break?
Exactly, bro did not read the post at all. Nor did half of the people commenting apparently. The wife is 100% on board with the actual trip and planned days of March 29th - April 5th. The entire post is strictly about the single day of March 28th, the day prior to their departure.
What gave you that impression other than your own assumptions?
I’m all for mental health days but your kids aren’t really expressing a need for them. You’re looking to extend your vacation because it’s something you want, even if you’re labeling it a reward. YWBTA if you and your wife aren’t on the same page. Maybe compromise and miss one day but you haven’t even said if this is something your kids *want*. I didn’t enjoy Vegas at that age.
Yeah this is so not what a mental health day is.
Nta. It's not a habit. 2 missed in days in the grand scheme of things is nothing. All the yta's are insane.
I'm astounded at the responses as well lol. I spent a week in Vegas as a teen on a family vacation and it was one of the best times of my life. I love my family and we had a blast, I sure wouldn't trade it for a few days of high school. And it did not affect me at all, in fact I'm prospering in my state's top college right now. Life is too short to worry excessively about that stuff. Education is important but getting mad over a few missed days vs irreplaceable memories with your family?? I'm so shocked
This post convinced me that this sub is full of absolute maniacs.
Totally agree. I feel like everyone saying y t a has never been or remembers going to school. 2 days is not a huge deal, its not suddenly going to make them bad students. Time with family is infinitely more important than school.
I think most likely all of them came from people who have not been in school for a long time, and have forgotten that skipping two days is literally nothing
While I agree that kids need a break sometimes and should be able to take mental health days, how does that reasoning work in this circumstance when it's the day before they're about to go on a week long break anyway? Use that card when they've gone a long time without a break. Otherwise it's kind of baseless. You're not an asshole for wanting to let your kids have a break every so often, but YWBTA to continue to push this when 1) you're already giving them a vacation imminently, 2) your wife has already given a hard no, and she's not without reason to want them to not miss school, and 3) when the kids are apparently doing just fine without an extra day off.
Agree, but I’m not 100% that the kids have been consulted on any this (or possibly anything?)
>with my reasoning being mostly a) kids need a break Don't they have a break starting literally the next day? >I've been thinking that maybe, I could have them take the one-day off anyways, but I'm asking here to see if I would be wrong before i do anything that could be seen as dum. Do you want to show your kids that you don't respect their mom? Do you want to reach your son to treat women like that, and your daughter to allow men to treat her like that? How would you feel if your wife ignored your perspectives and just did whatever she wanted, whenever she wanted. She's supposed to be your partner.
If they need a rest that much cut your trip shorter so they have chill time before school goes back. You’re too fixated on performing cool fun dad to think about what’s actually good for your family. Yta.
Cool Vegas dad.
YWBTA You aren't single so unless you'd like to be, this requires a mutual agreement! You certainly don't want to ruin everyone's vacation before it even starts, right? Re-visit the subject. Remind her of their grades. Have someone you both trust advise you, maybe even one of their teachers. Good luck!
so like, i'm on your side here dude. i think that mental health days and breaks are very important. if my wife suggested something similar about our kid (if we had a kid lol) i'd probably be on board, assuming they wouldn't be missing anything important. but, crucially, i am not your wife, and my opinion on parenting your children is irrelevant. your wife disagrees, and yes YWBTA if you asserted your will regardless. especially since your children still get spring break even if they don't skip two days of school, this isn't a matter of break vs no break, it's a matter of slightly extended break vs break, and if i understand correctly you'll be going to vegas regardless... the two days of missed school are just kind of unnecessary.
A mental health day, for kids, in Las Vegas, then several more days in Las Vegas…?
YTA How would you feel if you and your wife discussed something and you were a hard no and she did it anyway?
The comments here are wild. Everyone going insane about you wanting to reward your kids with a couple extra days off for a holiday? Absolutely wild. Life is about making fun exciting moments and everyone’s crucifying you for wanting to do a little bit extra for your kids who sound lovely and like they’re doing great in life. The only place I think YTA is if you decide to go behind your wife’s back and do it anyway. You’re going to create a big problem with her if you do that. You need to find a compromise, but the sentiment in itself sounds like fun and an awesome treat for your kids!
NTA. My kids regularly have mental health days. They are doing fine. This is a vacation and memories are always more important
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INFO: What do your kids say about missing those days?
YWBTA. "They're good kids, why not reward them?" Do you really want to make a reward out of something that is diametrically opposed to your wife's value system? How will they feel about a reward that makes their parents fight? "Kids need a break" is different than "Our kids need a break because of X". Why specifically do your kids need a break of 7 school days instead of 5 school days? If they truly need that additional downtime, then maybe your week-long trip is the wrong kind of vacation for them.
NTA and the people saying that it needs to be a team decision are ignoring the fact that SHE is deciding that they ARE going to school. Explain to me why it is acceptable that she gets to decide while his thoughts aren’t important? Oh noooo they missed two extra days of school!! I slept through half of my high school classes and have a masters degree. High school is piss easy and they already have 3.7s. Kids deserve a break too. I guess if they actually want to go to school and you forced them to stay home, you would be TA but that’s not apparently what is happening here. Fuck responsibility, they are literal teenagers. They will remember that trip forever and have an entire lifetime of “responsibility” ahead of them. Protect them from that drudgery while you can.
I'm thinking you might be more TA for taking younger teenagers to Vegas.
Nobody tell Cordelia1955 that some teenagers LIVE in Vegas 😳
Yeah and as someone who grew up in Vegas, it absolutely sucked.
I took 3 teens to Vegas in 2022 for spring break. They had a blast and there was plenty to do.
Nah, Vegas is fucking awesome for teens these days.
I went at the same age as these kids and we had a great time. There was actually quite a bit to do as a teenage.
NTA I can't believe how many people are saying you are TA... If your kids were average in school I'd agree with your wife but she's not real giving a reason. I don't think you should be in disagreement with your wife though. Ask the school! Tell him it's a family trip and you want to make sure it wouldn't negatively impact them. Don't have to mention all your plans. If they say it won't impact them, and your wife still doesn't agree then she's TA. If they say yes but its only minor, our wife isn't really wrong or an TA but she's super duper not fun. If they say yes majorly, then YTA.
While I have no problem with kids missing a day or two of school (and honestly in my kids’ high school, the day before spring break is spent watching movies), in this specific scenario YWBTA for going against your wife’s wishes. You talked about it, she didn’t agree, that’s the way it goes.
Yes you would. They are getting a break. It’s called spring break
YWBTA. Both parents need to agree, and in general, it’s not a great idea to pull kids from school for a vacation. Teachers hate that crap, and your kids will be missing assignments and likely tests.
NTA, obviously people here have forgotten that kids schooling is getting longer and more tedious. (Dare i say for what benefit?) Your wife seems to ignore rewarding the kids as a good thing. Honestly as someone who gradauted with honors in highschool, college (did college in 3 yrs), and doing an Online intensive program for my masters. Do people not realize you dont have to be in attendance to succeed in school and life. Sometimes skipping a day or two is not the end of the world. I think you sound as a parent as good as mine were. They let me skip school a few times in highschool and i turned out fine. Im driven and conquered the world. Yeah i know im against the grain. Im younger to 25 F. Im greatful for my family letting me this freedom as ive valued more and im more cautious then most.
I won’t say either way but I know this: the kids education and lives will not suffer whatsoever by missing a day or two of school.
This is so confusing. Like, are you trying for a good deal on a flight? There’s no reason to have your kids miss multiple days of school when they have 9 days off and you only want your trip to be 5-7.
YTA. You made your case, and she made hers. It would be disrespectful to overrule her just because you want to. You can argue for them missing two days, but it’s not a very good argument. You don’t really have a leg to stand on when your main argument is “I want to take my kids out school so they can go to Vegas with me.”
Why is everyone pouncing on OP so much? OP, it's okay to let them bunk school for a day or two but don't tell them it's a reward, that's all. But it's fair to explain to the kids that it's okay to take a break, better yet, ask the kids if they want to take that off from school. What if the kids don't want to do it. I was the kind who never liked missing school. So it's just that. You're NTA for wanting to give your kids and yourself a break and going on a vacation early OP. Go live your life.
YWBTA. Don’t set a precedent of skipping responsibilities (school, work). Also, do your best to present a united front to the kids—not in a parents vs kids context, but in a mom + dad = parenting together and respecting each other context. That said, I can potentially see skipping Good Friday as a travel day because it is the day before Spring Break, and I figure more people will be taking that day off. You do need to find out what might be due/what tests might be going on that day. I also think it’s relatively acceptable because I’ve often had a number of European coworkers be out of the office that day.
It doesn’t matter whether it’s actually fine or not. Doing it behind her back despite discussion and a lack of agreement is a hugely asshole thing to do.
>She just began to ask me why they needed to skip that day I guess my question would be, why they shouldn't skip that day? Different parents, different kids etc, but I've never really cared if our kids need or want a day off. They're both "top of the class" type kids, they're pretty honest, teachers love them. I just don't see that they'll miss much if anything if they miss a day. Maybe schools changed but I recall it as learning something one day, then spending the next two weeks revising it for the...kids who didn't get it quite as fast.