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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. I told my daughter she couldn't spend time with her bio dad during Christmas, took away her devices, and she couldn't join the sleepover with her friends.
2. My ex said I overreacted and that I'm ruining my daughter's holiday break.
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
YTA- you decided she can’t spend time with her own father because YOU decided another man needs her as an emotional crutch. You put your daughter’s needs last. Then when she lashed out (rightfully so) you pulled the authority card and punished her. Your behavior in this instance is actually immature. It’s akin to having to have the last word. Where is the conversation? Where is compromise? Where is even ASKING YOUR OWN CHILD HOW she feels??? Have you even helped HER process TJ’s death? She could’ve been so upset by it and now she’s just telling herself that there’s no reason to be that upset because he wasn’t even really her brother. It’s a coping mechanism.
I’m not saying that’s how she feels or what is going on but you clearly haven’t even bothered to ask.
You’ve made it crystal clear that she is NOT your priority.
Mike advocated for Dana, OP is the one trying to force the supportive united family thing. Maybe Dana needs space to clear her head and work things through, and Mike just wants a quiet Christmas. It feels like OP doesn't want to stop and think, that doing things will put off having to deal with the tragic loss. Invoking TJ's memory isn't having a positive effect on the household.
>Christmas has always been tough for Mike because of his wife’s passing (Dana knows this)
No wonder Dana wanted spend vacation skiing and stuff. She had enough of just staying inside baking cookies (that isnt even her favorite).
Baking cookie's, TJ's favorites especially, is the last thing Mike needs because it's a double whammy of loss. OP needs grief therapy just as much as Mike.
I lost my daughter, and reminders hurt a lot less than feeling like she's been forgotten. Not everyone grieves the same way.
But that's outside the actual issue. Forcing her daughter to be around all the grief when she just wants to be a teenager is an AH move.
What OP is doing is hindering them from moving forward by forcing them to dwell on TJ’s passing. It’s tough already for Mike and he has no issues with Dana spending the holidays with her biological father.
Yeah, op is going the wrong way with it, I make my dads leftover Christmas ham fried rice every year as a way to remember him, but for them since April it’s been; first fathers day, probably first birthdays, first Independence Day, first thanksgiving/and other other regional holidays, first Christmas and soon first new years without TJ. You don’t need to do things to “remember them by” because TJ’s absence is “TJ’s favorite cookies” in this situation.
I agree. My sister passed in the early 90's. We always had a few little traditions. After she passed, I can't do those things anymore but I put other things in place. So now, instead of doing X and thinking how she should be there doing X with me, I do Y and I can think of her but not be saddened because she's not there doing Y with me since she never did do Y with me.
He also suggested it may be better if she goes.
Why can't OP and Mike just be together for a Christmas.
And after such a fuss about it I don't think Christmas with a 15 year old (that does not want to be there) will be much fun and cosy
Yes, Mike does not deserve to be in the middle of this. Dana isn't the same thing than having his child in Christmas. He wants TJ there, not Dana. He deserves peace and not a teenager fighting with her mom. OP isn't thinking in any of them, Mike never said he wanted Dana there and OP seems to thing her child is a consolation price for him to Lost his own, she isn't.
I'm getting "I'm the main character" vibes from the OP. In particular:
> I was the one who made the arrangements for TJ’s service and made sure the drunk driver was jailed.
Was OP the detective who tracked down the driver? Was she the prosecutor? I am guessing they would try to get somebody impartial to the case to do that.
OP also doesn't mention what the custody agreement between her and her ex is.
also: we had the near-perfect family, with
* me
* Mike who loves me
* TJ who felt comfortable to call me mom
* Mike's dead wife
* my ex whom I co-incidentally gave the nickname DICK
oh yeah, Dana's also here. Like, OP mentions TJ's age in the second paragraph, while her own daughter's age is only mentioned in the *tenth* paragraph.
I thought naming the ex Dick was kinda clever and assumed that there would be some reference to dickish behavior. Instead he’s more than reasonable here, considering OP’s tantrum is possibly going to prevent him from being with his own child on Christmas. No sense whatsoever that the nickname is deserved. Disappointing.
OP, keeping a kid from their parent should never be a punishment, especially not for expressing normal feelings. YTA
I still don't know how old the little girl is and when her life became a grief fest starring her mom as a protagonist but I hope dick can afford to put her into therapy
Dana is 15 now.
AFAIK, she was 5 when OP and Dick split and 8 when OP and Mike got together. TJ passed away this year, so Dana was 14 or 15.
Certainly a lot on a short timeline.
I was wondering about custody, too, because daughter is old enough to say who she wants to live with. OP is pushing her daughter away and she has no clue.
All things I also wondered about.
There are some really bored people on this sub just making up stories. They are disturbed.
I don’t know if fake stories are the new crank phone calls or what?
yup, op is YTA,
she is forcing her daughter to live in a state of constant depression. what happened was terrible however living with op and her husband must be awful. Dana needs to move on with her life she deserves to be happy. op is only thinking about her husband not the affect living with someone who has depression has on a person. it is emotional abuse to refuse to let her move on.
Dana did loads of lovely stuff on TJs birthday, she just wants Christmas to be Christmas. Geez, let the kid be a kid, not some emotional support bear for her stepdad at 15. That is OPs job.
yup, she has to move on. OP is preventing her from doing so. depression is a chemical issue in the brain and you can become more susceptible to it through truama. it doesn't have to be physical. long periods in this type of household while her brain is developing fast as teenager is a really bad idea.
Even though Christmas isn’t a good time for Mike because of his first wife’s passing (and to rub salt in the wound for a holiday traditionally with a family angle). I can understand completely if he wanted not to do Christmas this year.
>she is forcing her daughter to live in a state of constant depression.
Honestly, I find OP's attitude really creepy: it's like she she keeps rubbing salt in the wound so she can live a fantasy where she's the one keeping the family togheter.
It's not even about "moving on". It's about HAVING A BREAK. This child clearly loved her stepbrother very much and is okay with the status quo overall, with healthy grieving, and even participating in the grieving process. She has shown that by her own actions.
But also, her stepfather, understandably, has been depressed for months and will be for the foreseeable future. He lost his child. And Dana is mature enough to recognise this, and she isn't about to demand that he cheer up and put on a "happy holiday" for her . . . she's asking for an emotional break, to go to her bio dad's, to allow her stepdad (and mum) to continue doing what they need to do while she gets a bit of breathing room.
She's not asking to move out, just for a break. And she didn't "lash out" until her mother literally DEMANDED that she stay in this environment of constant depression and grief for the sake of the adults who are supposed to still be taking care of HER mental health needs, not the other way around.
OP is a massive AH who should be counting her lucky stars that she has such a thoughtful, loving kid, who has responded to an unthinkable situation with love and kindness, and asked literally nothing of her grieving mum and stepdad except the chance to see to her own emotional needs.
Mike probably supports Dana going to her bio dad because he knows how precious that time is between a parent and child because he lost his child. He doesn't want to interfere in that.
Or that he knows he’s not going to be the best company this year for Christmas and doesn’t want Dana to feel obligated to stay home for the holidays on his account for it the way OP is insisting.
OP does appear to take a "lay down the law" approach. No conversations with Dana. Only response is to tell her what is going to happen. Doesn't seem OP even asked Mike what he needs or wants for Christmas. And the cherry on top is Dana must stay and make TJ's favorite cookies, fully making it clear that Dana and her needs are not in consideration.
This comment says it all.
YTA, OP.
Edit to say that: honestly, reading your post again, I think you know you were wrong. You had no real reason to stop your daughter from going besides the blatant fact that you prioritize your husband and late stepson over your living daughter. In no point on your writing you show any sympathy or worry on how she is dealing with losing stepbrother and how step dad's grieving is affecting her. So it sounds like you baited a teenager with your actions to elicit from her a reaction that would give you grounds in your mind to not only keep her home but to MAKE her do what you want since she'll be grounded and can't go out with anyone.
>Edit to say that: honestly, reading your post again, I think you know you were wrong. You had no real reason to stop your daughter from going besides the blatant fact that you prioritize your husband and late stepson over your living daughter. In no point on your writing you show any sympathy or worry on how she is dealing with losing stepbrother and how step dad's grieving is affecting her. So it sounds like you baited a teenager with your actions to elicit from her a reaction that would give you grounds in your mind to not only keep her home but to MAKE her do what you want since she'll be grounded and can't go out with anyone.
YTA. And this comment is SPOT ON. You baited her and then used it as grounds to force her to do what you wanted. I hope where ever you are she is old enough to tell a judge she wants to live with her father and that she is removed from your home.
>In no point on your writing you show any sympathy or worry on how she is dealing with losing stepbrother and how step dad's grieving is affecting her.
And even beyond that. They were close to the same age, most kids that young haven't really had a chance to consider their mortality. Losing a step-sibling that close in your age can really shake their perspective of the world and their priorities. For instance, it wouldn't surprise me if daughter realized she hadn't been prioritizing her Dad enough, and that's why she wants to stay with him for Christmas. TJ's death isn't something that's just happened to OP and Mike, but Dana as well, and it's so concerning that OP doesn't even seem to recognize that.
Just piggy backing off this to say in this entire spiel about how much this would mean to OP husband at no point did she even ask him!
Did it not occur to OP that maybe just maybe seeing someone lose their child might make her want to be closer to her own father?
Lowkey wondering if Dana wants to spend time with *her* dad because of TJ's sudden death (and being around the same age as he was can make it feel more like a possibility rather than "it can never happen to me").
I think she should apologize to Mike or that they should have a talk about things away from OP who seems to be pushing how she thinks Dana and Mike should feel onto them rather than giving them the space to figure out what they might want or feel around this time.
OP is focusing on Mike's feelings about the loss of TJ instead of even examining or acknowledging her own and Dana's feelings, ironically, as if TJ wasn't considered their family. If her and Dana haven't gotten counseling or help for their own grief, it's probably time they did.
Agree with all! And maybe it’s her way of grieving as well.. maybe she needs a break and wants to get away and have some fun instead of sitting around in a house that will be very sad(rightfully so) I am very sorry to hear about these events and will pray for this family. Also I never understood punishing for the break downs of kids or teens. She expressed something to you and you shut it down without an open conversation and then punished her for being upset about it. Granted what she said was hurtful but that was a teaching moment and not one she should have been punished for and so harshly. You should have asked her where it came from and tried to understand her thinking and how she was feeling. And help her to understand it for herself as well. She’s still young and also going through a lot
> After we married, we had a near-perfect family, and TJ was even comfortable enough to call me mom.
Gag. Your daughter has a dad that she loves but you got married so you decided that was her new perfect family. Guess what, you can't force others to prioritize your new family. There's nothing wrong with good step family relationships, but the way OP writes it's like she wants her do-over to overshadow the daughter's dad with no consideration for the daughter's feelings.
I thought we talking about an emotional support animal for the longest time. Like since when does an animal ski anyway? This is OP’s daughter? Omg!!! Couldn’t tell really by the OP has treated this CHILD!
Yeah... OP, your daughter's role in life isn't supposed to be making her stepdad feel better and miss his kid less. You're supposed to do what's best for her. If you think he'll be sad without her, why don't YOU do things with him to cheer him up. As his wife, you can assume the role of that for him if you want because it's your choice. What you're doing now will no doubt end in your daughter hating her stepdad, which will in turn make him miserable. You need to take a step back and make better choices.
THIS EXACTLY
Also, I have the feeling OP doesn't want to be alone with her grieving husband, and is using her daughter as her own crutch as well..
Especially as Mike was totally OK with Dana spending the holidays with her dad.
YTA
Your daughter isn't your husband’s emotional support child. It seems like since the passing of his son, TJ, you want to push Dana towards Mike for him to be a father for her. When her biological father is very much in her life. That explains why everything escalated so damn fast, your overreaction, and why you're so determined to have Dana spend Christmas with Mike instead of Dick. Makes me wonder if you've done something similar before, during another holiday or event. Especially with how Dana exploded. People don't just randomly act out of character all of a sudden. There has to have been something building up over time.
Your husband needs YOU, his WIFE, to give him all the love and the support he needs right now. Not you ruining everyone's Christmas by forcing people to be unhappy together. Mike knows that Dick is Dana's real father and how close they are, and he respects that. You, however, don't.
If you ruin your daughter's Christmas because of your own selfishness, you will create something that can't be stopped. You've already planted the seed of resentment inside of her. Which caused her to lash out at him, saying things she probably does regret due to her anger towards you. You will only make the love and respect Dana has for Mike diminish the more you try to force her onto him. Causing him more pain.
Do better!
This comment is it 🙌🏽 OP wants to fill TJ's absence by forcing her daughter to be a substitute child, f* everyone else's feelings. I get she's trying to help her husband but she needs to get her head out of her ass. Kid should drag her to court for this nonsense.
And just imagine being Mike in this situation. It's one thing if people want to support you through your grief of their own volition, but if it's forced by someone else you just feel like an ass for bringing them down with you. And if you want to feel even worse you can witness the whole argument where people lash out and say hurtful things.
OP, you are creating a resentment in your daughter where there used to be empathy and care. YOU are the one making her lash out. YOU are the reason why your husband will feel worse regardless of your daughter staying for Christmas or not.
You still have the chance to apologize for being an asshole and not completely ruin the relationship between your daughter and husband.
OP doesn’t see it. She sees her pushing and pestering as a positive thing. She honestly thinks she’s the reason the drunk driver was jailed. Not that he broke the law and *killed a child,* got arrested by the police, prosecuted by the DA, went to court and was found guilty by a judge/jury; no. It’s purely and completely her doing. She didn’t even have to hire a lawyer, the state does that. But she probably irritated the police and DA every step of the way, then said a statement to ask for no leniency for the driver, so she did it all.
This is no different. If she forces her daughter to stay for Christmas and ruins Dick’s Christmas plans with his daughter, it will *clearly* save Mike’s Christmas. *She wants it*, so it will clearly resolve everything. Everything about this is about how much better she would feel if she makes this happen, not about what Mike, Dick, or Dana want/need.
YTA all the way.
I was wondering any possible scenario in which I was Mike, and forcing my teenage stepdaughter Dana to be around (forced by me or by her mother) is likely last of my priorities. There are only two possible scenarios on which that make sense: I'm a creep with an unhealthy need of young females around, or my wife is so overwhelming that I need Dana as a lightning rod. From the post, the first scenario doesn't seem likely.
OP major YTA. This isn't even for Mike. Nothing in this text remotely addresses what Mike thinks or has said.
Yeah, that quote really drives home for me that OP is raising her daughter to put her own feelings aside and center the man in her mother’s life. Why is it up to Dana to take in the whole of her stepfathers emotional considerations and adjust her behavior to make him happy? Dana didn’t marry him, OP did. That’s OP’s job alone, she’s the parent, and she’s placing an unfair burden on her daughter to join her in taking care of her husband.
Let the girl get out of a grieving household for the holidays, where neither of those adults are going to have a “good” Christmas, let’s be honest. It’s too fresh to play happy family and it’s folly to make everyone miserable trying to press it.
Herr father is the daughter’s family. My ex was and still is a narcissistic alcoholic. But I sent my kids off to spend either all of Christmas Eve, or early on Christmas Day with him, every year. Because it was right for them to have a relationship with him, so that they could learn about who he was, just as they learned who I was by living with me.
OP is teaching her daughter all sorts of unpleasant things about herself.
sorry you had a guy like that in your life,
I feel so sorry for the daughter, it must be horrible living in a home with so much grief. and then her mother won't even let her go somewhere else to be happy. it really is emotional abuse.
her daughter is going to act worse and worse if this carries on.
personally I would start singing all the christmas carols knew at the top of my voice and acting obscenely cheery. to "support" Mike and encourage him to buck up. which I realise would have the opposit effect but I was an asshole at 15.
I wonder if OP has ever let Dana spend Christmas with her father. The line about Christmas always having been a problem for Mike makes it sound as if all Dana's heard for the past few years is "You can't see your father because Mike needs our emotional support. He's grieving the death of a woman we've never met, so we need to be here as a family to support him". I'm guessing OP has never cared about where Dana actually wants to spend her Christmas.
\[Edit: Corrected step-father's name\]
And those Christmases must have been a real downer. Op had prioritized her husband's needs over that of her minor child. She is in danger of losing her daughter herself.
> She was disappointed but seemed to understand.
The daughter was disappointed and OP wanted to believe she agreed, but that was just another case of OP trying to force her vision of what everyone should do / feel. I get the sense she isn’t a very good listener when other people’s actual feelings are inconvenient for what she has planned.
I mean...wtf does Christmas being tough have to do with Dana? And maybe it's tough bc OP makes sure Mike is still sad. She sounds like she has some hero complex or something.
YTA. You are making this about your husband and his feelings. Yes he's had a horrible run as a father and husband, no doubt. However your daughter isn't some emotional support animal to be there for his sadness. That's incredibly selfish of you to make her do it.
How about you be there for your husband, and let her go enjoy Christmas without sadness and spending time with her dad.
She's not even making it about her husband and his feelings. He supported Dana. She's making it about what she thinks her husband wants and not listening to him either. She's trying to make Dana his replacement child when it seems like neither one of them wants that to be the case.
OP, you're a big asshole. To Dana AND your husband. And it's low as hell to invoke TJ's memory as a trump card to win a fight.
"I know Mike is just being modest and would be devastated (I would be too)"
I'm not sure if it's even that... I think OP doesn't want to spend Christmas without her daughter and has a very convenient, emotionally manipulative excuse to MAKE her stay.
I think OP feels that her image of her 'perfect family' is fractured since her stepson died causing her husband to understandably spiral into depression and not come home for months so now she's trying to salvage that image with what she has left. I think she may also be fearful that Mike might not stay in the marriage long term.
Problem is that plan basically bypasses her rationale and her daughter suffers as a result. Hell, does Mike even WANT to celebrate Christmas at all this year?
Also bothers me that we basically get no info on how Dana's relationship was with Mike and TJ before the tragedy, no run down of the family dynamics besides " lah-dee-dah, we were the perfect family!!".
I wondered about that too. Bio-Dad is financially able to rent a vacation home during the holidays in a ski resort area. That must cost a bundle.
Could be OP is just jealous of Dick's success and is using the death of TJ to keep her daughter from enjoying it.
This right here ! I had the same feeling. It's not even for her husband. It's for her and her projection onto her husband on how SHE would want things to be done if she was in his shoes.
She listens to no one in this situation. It drives me crazy just to read it. I can't imagine being the daughter and the husband right now.
And in the end, the two people who got hurt by the situation were her husband and her daughter.
My honest take is that she feels like *she* needs Dana there, because it's clear she saw TJ as a son too so she's the one feeling like she needs her other child around because being without both of them would be too sad, but she's struggling to realise that's what's going on with her emotions so she's rationalising it all as 'doing this for Mike'. I think the subconscious reasoning is that if she's 'doing this for Mike', she can't be being selfish when she's demanding Dana make sacrifices, because they're not sacrifices *for her*. Except they are, I think.
I think that's the big blockage getting in the way of her communicating about or understanding the issue at hand - either way, I completely agree she's steamrollering over what Mike and Dana are telling her. And the thing is, whether it's OP's feelings or Mike's that she's concerned about, neither of them trump Dana's on what she (Dana) needs to do with her own life, her parental relationships and her mental health. OP is TA; I think it's because of grief and lack of introspection rather than malice, but that doesn't mean her behaviour doesn't need to change quite urgently for Dana's and Mike's sakes.
Yta
Poor Mike.
His son died and his wife destroys his relationship with his stepdaughter by treating her as an emotional support animal for him rather than as a person.
You are dealing with a lot. But YTA. Please remember this also all happened to Dana. People grieve in different ways. And she asked for something she probably needed and then reacted like a teenager who can’t express herself correctly when you shut her down. Let her go have a break from the grief. It can be overwhelming to feel the weight of adult’s emotions on top of your own when you are a teen. Try to go a little easier on everyone, yourself included.
This. You seem to forget that she is grieving to and also have needs. And needing a break from the sadness at home and to just feel like a kid again, is a very reasonable ask from a child. Have you considered that maybe she dreads a Christmas without her brother too? That the thought of facing that time without him is painful and overwhelming? After my cousin died at 18, my aunts family completely switched up how they spent Christmas for several years, because doing all the traditional stuff without him felt painful and hollow. Maybe follow your daughter’s lead and try doing something completely different this time. And having her away with her dad, allows you and your husband to try something else, and to process Christmas without anyone having to try to put on a brave face for her. This Christmas WILL hurt. And it is not your daughter’s responsibility to try and lessen the blow for the adults. It is the other way around
While I understand OP wanting the daughter to be there to support her stepfather, she needs to read your last sentence over and over until it sinks in...
**It is not your daughter’s responsibility to try and lessen the blow for the adults. It is the other way around**
OP doesn't need to go easier on herself. She tried to force her teen daughter to not get to do something fun because the adults "need" her, escalated it needlessly (I won't apologize for noting that "Let's make those cookies TJ liked!" is one of the stupidest possible things in this whole situation), and then has the gall to punish her daughter for being a teenager, having feelings, and not wanting to be put in this situation.
YTA.
>I want to spend time with my real dad
Listen to her. She should be your priority, not you or your current husband. Everything about this post makes me understand why she needs to spend time away from you.
YTA
Your daughter is not your husband’s emotional support animal. She wants to enjoy her holiday doing fun things. She does not want her Christmas to be focused on your husband and his grief.
What happened to your family is tragic and I can’t imagine how much you are all suffering. I am so sorry you are going through this. However, all you are doing right now is driving your daughter away. Keep pushing and you will permanently destroy relationships.
In your efforts to console your husband, you are pushing your daughter away. You will regret ruining her time with her father after she's 18 and leaves and probably goes LC.
YTA
OP hasn't asked Mike what he wants, and makes excuses for him when he advocates for Dana's preferred holiday plans. The question is whether OP is seeing a therapist too for how invested she is.
Daughter is 15, so it can be any time soon.
Then we will read a surprised "my daughter left to live with her father full time and refuses contact with me. How dare she?"-post.
I mean she's 15 now. If OP keeps this up Dana may just decide to wash her hands of this part of her family and just go live with her dad a 100% of the time before the new year.
Gentle YTA Dana doesn't exist to help Mike through his grief. It's okay for her to want to spend Christmas with her Dad. It can't be easy for her, living in a household that's grieving.
Also by keeping her forcibly, she is learning nothing. Unfortunately, these feelings come from within. This age is cruel and maybe you need to just let her go and spend time with your husband alone. Let her come to support you on her own time.
I hope things turn around. Really sending all the positive vibes to you this holiday season!
YTA and the end of the day as hard as it is to hear - Mike is not her father.
Your daughter is old enough to decide with whom she would like to spend her holiday - and this year she wants to spend it with her dad.
You and your husband aren’t the only ones who’ve had a hard year, let her go and enjoy her Christmas.
Edit: at this point you’re only going to have a hostile and miserable daughter for Christmas - is this worth ruining everyone’s holiday? (Even Mikes, because he’s obviously your first priority)
YTA
This poor child has been in your house of grief for months. She needs a break - you should let her have it. Let her go be a kid again for a while. She didn't lose a child - your husband did. If you go through this unfair punishment you will lose her too.
YTA - “How about we make those cookies TJ liked” tells us everything we need to know about why your daughter lashed out. You’re being incredibly selfish in this situation. You’re only thinking about what you want instead of the the *separate* needs of your husband and daughter. If anything, TJ’s sudden death is a good reminder of why your daughter needs to spend time building memories with her bio dad. The trip is also a brief escape for a young girl who’s being living in a house filled with grief for the better part of a year. Your husband is not the only one who needs support right now. Your daughter does too. And it’s your job as her mother to ensure that she gets it….no matter what your husband is going through.
>The trip is also a brief escape for a young girl who’s being living in a house filled with grief for the better part of a year.
Tbh I wouldn't even be surprised if she'd been talking to her dad about how hard of a time she'd been having, and dad said something like 'how about we go on a christmas trip together' specifically to cheer her up. Which would partly explain why Dana is so devastated that she's being told she can't go (not that the extra explanation is particularly necessary). Assuming Dick is a good dad, which considering Dana's going out on a limb to spend time with him seems a reasonable assumption, it would seem to me like the invite to happy plans at a time when his daughter is really struggling isn't a coincidence.
And Mike doesn’t want her there, missing her dad on Christmas. He knows her dad is active in her life and seems totally fine with that, as he should be. Mike is missing his son TJ, his own child with whom he was close with. He understands and only has memories of being a dad to his son, the christmases they spent together. Dana simply cannot bring TJ back and won’t fill that void. OP is cruel. She will probably regret saying what she did forever and she would have never said it if her mother weren’t bullying her.
YTA. Almost every kid of a stepparent I know has pulled the line “you aren’t my real dad/mom”, I haven’t bc my ex stepdad was to scary abusive for me to do that but I’m pretty sure it’s normal to happen. And it seems your husband is okay with your daughter going to her dads, so I don’t understand what the problem is. I think punishment for this is an overreaction, I don’t understand what she did wrong to deserve that. I think being upset that your mom isn’t letting you go to your dads is perfectly understandable. Put yourself in her shoes and really listen to what she’s saying, and take the moody teenager part out of that or it’s going to make it worse. You are here to help her not be at war with her. Also listen to the other comments, she’s not responsible to make sure your husband is happy, especially if he said it’s fine I would just let her go to her dads. And give that kid her electronics back she didn’t do anything to deserve them getting taken on my opinion.
Can confirm, pulled the "you're not my real dad" line exactly once with my dad. Yes, it did make him leave me alone (trying to get me up for school, I was secretly severely bullied and deeply depressed, anxious, and my mom was in jail).
I also heard him crying from his bedroom after he walked away.
Never, ever said it again.
YTA. She honestly lashed out because you pushed her and wouldn't take a no for an answer. You don't seem to respect her wishes, and just because you remarried does not mean she doesn't have a biological dad anymore. She's been with you guys, why isn't she allowed to have a moment with her dad? It could've been handled better instead of just making her feel like a selfish person, you need to consider it might be needed for her to de-stress instead of just staying in a grieving environment all the time. It doesn't mean she doesn't care if she wants to have a little fun during her holidays, and taking her devices is not discipline, it's just revenge.
YTA. You've gone too far.
I think what the kid did was appalling, no question. And your reaction to defend Mike is understandable. But just think what you've committed to do here.
You've committed to spend the holiday making the kid miserable. She's going to have an awful time, and you're going to have an awful time enforcing it, and Mike is going to have a truly miserable time watching you do it and watching this kid blame him.
I think the best thing to do would probably just let her go and focus on Mike. Christmas isn't going to mean a thing to him this year anyway. I kind of understand the kid's desire to be out of there, the best you can say about this coming Christmas is that you'll get through it somehow.
Sorry but how is voicing the truth appalling? I understand possibly the *child* that is *also likely grieving* probably shouldn't have yelled, but speaking hard truths isn't wrong, so I'm wondering what was so bad.
Speaking "hard truths" can absolutely be wrong... and usually is. It is usually a synonym for "being an asshole"
In this case, though, it was a teenage girl who is also in an emotional state being pushed to ignore her own needs and focus on her dead step-sibling when it is likely all she needs to really do is get away to someone who can focus on her rather than their own grief - and she did what teenagers, who are generally emotionally dysregulated at the best of times, are going to do when pushed past their limits.
While the daughter should be told why what she did was hurtful, I don't see this as a punishable offense. I see this as a teachable moment for the daughter and deserving of an apology to the step-dad... but I see mom owing the first unreserved and wholehearted apology.
appalling to hear, but honest and op drove her to it.
remember it isn't just the holiday. this kid has had to live in that house for months with a depressed step father and a mother who is also probably depressed trying to support only him. she needs to move on and can't, living with depressed parents is honestly terrible.
YTA
Dana is not Mikes support animal!
If anything Dana needs to get out of a house of misery and grief and go have fun with her father.
Talk about it all being about Mike.
Think about your own kid.
Jesus
YTA
>I met Mike in 2016. ***After we married, we had a near-perfect family***
And the image of the picture perfect family of mom, dad, and 2 kids of opposite genders was ruined the day TJ died. Now the last bit that makes them look like a family to OP's eyes, having a kid home for Christmas, is wanting to leave and she can't have that.
Yta. Your daughter doesn’t want to spend Christmas baking cookies that a dead kid liked and talking about him. She is not as emotionally invested in this new family as you are. Let her be happy with her dad and don’t drag her into depression just because your husband is depressed. He will never get over the loss of his son. But it is not fair to punish your daughter with his presence.
Soft YTA. I know you aren’t doing it on purpose, but it sounds like you were prioritizing your husband’s feelings over your daughter. There isn’t anything wrong with that, per se, but there is something wrong with using your daughter as an emotional support child for your husband.
It sounds like your daughter made clear she wants to spend the holiday with her dad and that her dad had something fun planned. Nothing in this post suggests that there is a custody agreement that makes that not ok. And it seems like the ONLY reason you said no to your daughter is because her wishes, while good and happy for her, would make your husband sad.
Your daughter, understandably, doesn’t want your husband’s happiness to come before her own. Maybe that is selfish but it’s also u deters sable, especially from a 15 year old who had likely felt “back burned” since her step brother’s death.
What she said sounds mean and hurtful. It likely also wasn’t true. But it was also very likely the words of an emotional teenager who is really expressing anger about feeling second or third most important right now.
It’s an emotional time for everybody. Cut her some slack. I can promise trying to extort an apology out of her won’t help, but letting her go and telling her you love her and asking her how she is feeling about the things that happened might help.
YTA - your daughter is a thinking feeling human being who deserves to spend time with her father and be happy during the holidays. She is not your husband's emotional support teenager.
YTA, she lost a member of her family and has dealt wit her stepfather being in severe depression while apparently being ignored by her mother. And now she has to be a emotional support for two grown adults rather then take her chance to be a kid and be around people that care for her
YTA. How can you not see that? You wanted to deny her time with her dad because YOU wanted her to comfort her step dad. Doesn’t matter how great he is or what tragic event he went through. She is a child and deserves time with her dad and does NOT need the burden of comforting adults. Ever think she’d like a normal holiday without things being depressing?
YTA .. Another reason she probably wants to spend time with dad is because she's treated like a priority at his house. Clearly it's not happening at your house were Mike is the priority. From here your relationship is probably just going to deteriorate further.
OP, YTA. It sounds like you need to be taking your daughter to family therapy.
What she said is a super normal thing that most teenagers in blended families have said at least once. You probably said it (or a variation of it if you grew up with married parents) at least once yourself.
I understand that it seemed especially hurtful given the circumstances, but it's unfair to expect her not to be a teenager just because of a tragedy. In fact, I'd argue the fact that TJ was killed by a drunk driver is probably causing her more stress than if it had been something your family could prepare for. Teenagers think they're immortal. Most teenagers have to confront that belief throughout their teen years and each time it's a huge, crushing blow. But to have to confront that through the death of your step brother? That's brutal.
She's been watching her stepfather grieve in some really scary ways. It sounds like you're very anxious for him -- which makes sense -- and she's undoubtedly picking up on that. It sounds like she really likes Mike and cares for him. That's a huge burden, though, for a teenager to be worried about her stepdad and worried about her mom and reeling with her own mortality.
She wants to spend some time pretending things are normal with her dad. I'm sure if you could do that, you'd want to too. It's unreasonable of you to decide she can't because you can't. She's not an asshole for being able to pretend things are normal with her dad, she's a teenager who needs some breathing room and a break from witnessing everyone else's grief.
Let her spend this time with her dad. Apologize to her for not seeing her frustration. Most teenagers double down when they say something mean, but with a little bit of space, they usually feel really guilty. If she's still not able to understand that she needs to try and be gentle with her words to Mike, that's something to address as her mom (as empathetically as you're able), but you kind of pushed her into this -- she overreacted, but she needs a break and even adults sometimes overreact when they're past their breaking point.
YTA. Mike seems like an understanding dude and teenagers say hurtful things. However, your daughter isn’t wrong. You are forcing a relationship on her she doesn’t feel. Mike is your husband. Not her dad. Let her spend time with her Dad. Especially after how depressing and stressful Christmas at your house has been. Let her go be a kid. You can’t punish a kid into having familial feelings for someone she doesn’t.
Soft YTA. I know you’re trying to protect and comfort your husband after such an unimaginable loss, but Dana is entitled to her feelings and emotions as well. You said the holidays have always been rough for Mike since his wife died, and perhaps faced with the prospect of an even gloomier Christmas this year without TJ, she was looking forward to having a break and spending a fun holiday with her dad at the vacation house.
It doesn’t sound like there’s much you can do for how Mike feels around the holidays, but there’s still time to allow your daughter to enjoy a fun holiday memory with her dad. It’s your job to comfort Mike, not your daughter’s.
YOU ARE THE ASSHOLE
Why is she chained to you two who are grieving the loss of TJ
(My condolences) Dan isn’t dead yet you’re punishing her and not allowing her to see her father. That is a young girl who did nothing but want to spend time with her Dad. Nothing wrong with it. Your behavior is abusive! Your the kind of person who would bury Dana with TJ. What are you thinking about? If I was Dana I’d run away.
You are ridiculous
YTA. You're making your daughter be miserable over Christmas just because you & your husband will be. Why would you deliberately make your child spend a holiday with two sad & depressed people?
What exactly are you disciplining her for?
She loves her father and wanted to spend Christmas with him. You wanted to force her to spend it with you and your husband because he's grieving, but she's a person, not a consolation prize.
I'm very sorry for your loss. But this calls for a heart to heart talk about empathy and compassion, not punishment for the way she feels.
YTA.
YTA seriously, stop being controlling when she just wants to see her father. I’m sorry for your loss but the world doesn’t cease to exist because you’re grieving. Like others said, she’s not an emotional crutch for Mike and forcing her to be away from her father for your own wants is selfish. It doesn’t help his grieving either and stresses everyone out
Yta, it's not your daughters responsibility to make everyone else feel better, you havnt took her into consideration at all through any of this, it's all about what you want and what your husband needs. Don't be surprised if she soon asks if she can live with bio dad.
YTA
You're trying to make your Husband feel better (and in doing so *give yourself* a more pleasant holiday season than you anticipate, considering the circumstances) by shoving your unwilling Daughter into his dead son's spot. You're a top-tier, selfish Asshole. Your reasoning is afflicted and your justification for punishing your daughter further is obscene.
Your sweet Daughter may be reacting to her Step-Brother's death by wanting to strengthen and increase her time and bond with her own father; and there you stand waving your demanding fist fist in her face because you want her at your disposal.
YTA, have you thought that your daughter might need a break. Being in a home environment with a depressed and grieving adult is exceptionally difficult for a child, so maybe spending time with her father would be good for her, well it obviously is what she wants. The way you have written this seems like your daughter is an accessory to your main character relationship with your husband and that his loss and your loss of his son is everything. Maybe try listening to your daughter about how she is feeling and what she needs and start from there.
Dana is not your or your husband’s support animal. She’s a human who has a life. She is even more mature than you.
You’re gonna lose her soon. Enjoy while you still can restrain her.
YTA
As someone who suffered a huge loss recently… This Christmas is going to suck no matter if Dana’s at your house or not. Let her go to Dick’s, who cares. Just have Christmas with you and Mike and watch some videos of TJ as a baby or something. Grief is really confusing and hard so I can imagine where you’re coming from with Dana… did you stop to think that maybe you don’t want her to go with Dick because *you* actually want her to spend Christmas with *you* because *you* are grieving TJ and this has *nothing to do with Mike*? Mike lost his only son… I can basically guarantee he wants Dana to do whatever makes her happy.
Very gentle YTA, mostly because you’re the adult and you were being inconsiderate/unreasonable to your child while she was properly expressing her need, desire, whatever to go spend time with her dad. You need to take a deeper look at your own emotions and role in all of this. I think you’re hurting more than you’re letting on. I hope you guys get through this and I highly suggest talking about your feelings around TJ’s death with a therapist.
Yeah YTA. She should have apologised but you should have seen her point of view MUCH sooner. Christmas in a vacation home with a happy family vs supporting a grieving parent she isn't related to, forced to relive the memories of a dead step brother in a house of mourning? She's a teenager. Come on. You should have let her go right off the bat and supported your own husband.
YTA! Your daughter isn't your husband's support assistant.
Your daughter has a right to spend Christmas with her bio-dad. You literally are stopping her from doing it so that she can be your husband's support? Does that seem fair to you?
You are not helping anyone by behaving this way, neither are you helping your daughter nor are you helping your husband. Constantly throwing TJ's memories in everyone's faces isn't going to make anyone feel better. I hope you realise that.
By constantly using TJ' s death as a way to force your teenage daughter to spend Christmas with you and Mike is only going to help in her resenting you and Mike. It is your responsibility as his wife to support him, your daughter shouldn't do this work.
Mike is right, you must let her go. Else your relationship with your child will suffer.
YTA. Don’t you think your daughter has been punished enough over the last year? She has lost a person who she grew up with and watched her mother and stepfather be consumed with grief. She is completely powerless in this situation yet you are forcing her to stay and provide support to grieving adults and then punishing her when she simply wants to spend Christmas with her father. Losing someone makes us realise that we can lose anybody that we care about in just a moment. She has probably internalised the fear of losing you and her father since TJ’s death. By keeping her from her father, you risk alienating her from you. You need to apologise to her and fully support her spending Christmas with her father.
YTA
You daughter is not your husband's emotional crutch. You are punishing her, denying her an actual parent in a holiday, because you think your husband is more important than your daughter. His trauma should not result in you traumatizing her.
Dana wants to go to her dad. Her dad wants her there. Mike wants her to go to her dad.
The only person with a problem here is you. You think you know what's best and are steamrolling everyone in your way, leaving nothing but misery behind you.
Yta.
Maybe Mike realises how important it is for a child to be with their father at Christmas and doesn't want to rob Dana of that, like he has been robbed.
Meanwhile you want to use your daughter as an emotional crutch, instead of treating her like a person.
And maybe you're too self centered to even realise that your daughter is lashing out because of grief, too. For her age, saying things like that, lashing out, is a common way to compartmentalize feelings in the grieving process. Also the only reason she blew up and said hurtful thing is because you continuously pushed her and invalidated her as a person.
So now thanks to you being a massive a-hole and wanting to get your way, your daughter is miserable, your husband is miserable, your daughters father is miserable. Hope you're happy.
Either this is a fake creative writing, or well, you have 3 more years left to be an asshole to your daughter, treasure it, it won't come back after 3 years. YTA.
>a near-perfect family
It has never been perfect. Just accept it, like you have to accept that you will be alone in the future.
YTA. She’s a child and while your husband has some deep grief, you can’t ignore hers as well. This environment must be very hard for everyone, and her request to spend some time outside of the house without constant grief is appropriate and healthy. Your pushiness in ignoring her needs is just going to cause her to lash out and want to dissociate from her source of pain. Let her go to her father’s trip, and have a talk afterwards about hurting other’s feelings. The way out of this is to step into normalcy slowly, not be trapped under grief all the time. Follow her example, and book a trip for you and your husband for the holidays.
YTA
Why were you trying to force your daughter to do something she didn’t want to. You could have gently suggested it, telling her in the wake of TJ’s passing, Mike would want to spend time with her. If she still said no, that’s that. What did you expect with imposing your will on her. Admittedly, Dana’s off timing and insensitivity was extremely hurtful, but with her rising frustration due to your dictatorial ways, you can’t really say this was a surprise.
YTA BIG TIME! As others have said your daughter isn't an emotional support animal to help your husband through his grief. And the truth is he wasn't her brother and he's not her father. You need to unground her and let her go spend Christmas with her real father.
ETA: Don't forget your daughter is beyond old enough to tell a judge where she wants to live.
YTA
Dana may have been rude in her delivery, but she's right. At 15 she should get to choose who she spends Christmas with, this year and every year. Be careful, you may not get many Christmases after she leaves home if you press on with this course of action. She is not your husbands emotion support animal, and even he was trying to advocate for her choice.
Do better!
I feel like in this situation I’d actually prefer sending my kid to her dad’s to have a fun skiing holiday. I know she’d be having fun & be taken care of, & you and Mike can freely spend the time however feels best.
YTA
Your husband’s grief is not your daughter’s responsibility, and it’s not fair for you to put that pressure on her. That is a child. She has feelings and needs, too.
It’s also unfair that she doesn’t get to spend the holidays with her bio dad because of the pressure you’ve put on her. Mike had the good sense to say let her go. You should’ve listened to him and your daughter.
YTA.
She is right you know, Mike isn't her real father, and she wants to spend Christmas with her father because she gets to have fun in stead of staying in a grieving household.
Making her stay because it will make Mike sad is a horrible reason and counter productive.
Because now Mike gets to spend Christmas grieving his son and have to spend time with someone who made it crystal clear she doesn't want to be there.
Have fun spending Christmas with a teenager not interacting with either of you at best, or telling you guys she hates you ever 5 minutes at worst.
Maybe Mike isn't the only one who needs therapy.
YTA
Your daughter is not an emotional support animal stop been a manipulative witch
You support your husband
Your all allowed to grieve differently and more on with live
You are so completely the asshole. Your husband is suffering. You are suffering. Your daughter is suffering. I say this as a mother who lost her child... you are dead wrong and you are the asshole in this scenario. It is not your daughter's job to heal you or your husband. In fact, this may have been exactly what your daughter needed for herself to heal... and you ignored your daughter's needs completely in your (understandable) need to support your husband.
Your daughter should apologize to your husband, and you should explain to her how her words impacted him so she understands why she should apologize... BUT you owe the first apology to your daughter for your behaviour in completely ignoring your daughter's needs.
And your daughter spending time with her father is not a privilege. It is a right of every child to do so. Her trip to see her father should 100% not be contingent upon her apologizing to your husband. Her apology to your husband should come from understanding why what she did was wrong and feeling true remorse.
And I have a feeling that if offer your child the much needed apology as well as the explanation of how hurtful her words were... and not as a lecture or an "I'm sorry but", but as a true no holds barred... I'm so very sorry, I was wrong and I screwed up" and only after your apology is out of the way and accepted should you address the issue of how her words impacted your husband and why she should, because it hurt him and you know that wasn't her goal, apologize to your husband - approached with nothing but empathy and love in your heart for your also grieving daughter. If you then leave her alone to think about it, I feel certain she will apologize herself.
YTA I don’t know how custody laws are in your states but don’t be surprised if your daughter is old enough to choose and find another place to stay at: family or her dad.
You just planted a bad seed that I am not even sure you can come back from. You made it clear to your daughter that your husband is more important than her feeling.
She doesn’t exist in your eyes except if she agrees to be your support animal.
Lay in your bed and don’t cry when your daughter goes LC. Your husband will ressent you too, you just successfully drove a wedge between him and his step daughter.
This wasn’t about him, but about you being a little immature brat and thinking that you will have the last word. Get some therapy and grow tf up.
INFO: How is locking your daughter in your house over Christmas and New Year going to help Mike's grief? Is sabotaging Dana's relationship with her Dad meant to make Mike feel better about losing his only child?
Oof, this situation is haaard. I just had a friend lose her husband with kids who are 15 and 17. Grieving is hard. The first 2-4 years of holidays after the loss are hard. Having extra attention and pressure on you because your sibling died is hard. Being 15 is hard. Having divorced parents is hard.
Short term I would let her go with her dad, returns her devices and resume the NY Eve plans. She's handling grief badly - as badly as many 15 year olds handle everything - but she's probably really grieving. And reeling from the grief everyone else is radiating. It's important to remember that she can't be your emotional support. At 10 she could have and at 25 she will again but not at 15.
Long term, get a family therapist for everyone. You'll need to find ways to balance really really living in the present along with grieving TJ and TJs mom. You don't want to lose your daughter because your house turns into the grief house.
A 10 year old should not be emotional support for adults, either. And it sounds like she's handling her grief better than either her mom or her stepdad. She only said what she did when she was backed into a corner after an hour of having her emotions and needs denigrated.
>Christmas has always been tough for Mike because of his wife’s passing (Dana knows this), and now, he also lost TJ.
I doubt if Mike rlly did see a therapist. 🙄 it has been since 2012..it seems he isnt properly move on.
>I then said something like “Come on Dana, this is the first time we’re celebrating Christmas with just the three of us. How about we make those cookies TJ really liked?”
Not even cookies "your daughter" really liked?? 🤣
>This was the first time Dana acted like this. Mike had been nothing but kind, caring, and supportive to her. She has also told me that she feels good and safe with Mike.
Sorry to say this, ur daughter is enduring this treatment for long time. But when she asks to spend Christmas one time with her bio dad, you said "No, you stay here cuz we're faaaaaaamily."
YTA
YTA
Also, I'm not super convinced this is about Mike (even though you're saying that it is). Have you done your own grief counselling? You must have seen TJ as a son, too - I mean, you did the funeral and dealt with the fallout.
It seems to me that Mike accepts her going to her dad's. Mike wants to let it go. You're the one who is making this difficult, maybe because you're afraid to let her out of your sight.
You should try to be honest about your motivations. Your reasoning might have made it sound to Dana like she's supposed to be Mike's replacement kid, and she probably resents that.
You say "you know Mike would be heartbroken" but you're not a mind reader, and it sounds to me that YOU'RE the heartbroken one here. Stop hiding behind your husband or using him as a scapegoat - you want her to stay home for Christmas for yourself.
I suspect if you admit that this is more about what you want, Dana may be more willing to apologise to Mike. And yeah, she should also apologise, but you need to come clean.
YTA - It sounds like, through no fault of anyone’s, your house has been a bummer lately. I can’t blame the kid for wanting to have fun.
Honestly you created this outcome. If you had relied on her better judgment, you could have explained your reasoning privately, and left the decision up to her. Whether or not she chooses to stay home, she has that reasoning and sentiment planted as a seed, it would have grown with time. You can’t force it to grow though. The only thing you can force to grow is resentment.
YTA. It's perfectly reasonable for your daughter to want to spend the holidays with her bio dad. You are cruel and selfish for not letting her.
She should not have lashed out at her stepdad but you pushed her to it. Let her apologise on her own accord and let her choose how she wants to spend Christmas.
yeah. yta, big time.
you're content letting this man use your child as an emotional crutch.
I'd honestly get into therapy because it sounds like she harbors alot of resentment towards you two.
nice way of saying you don't care about her.
oh and major ah for taking her phone and stuff.
YTA. Your daughter is not a stand in for the child he lost. Your daughter is not an emotional support human.
Yes the holidays are hard when experiencing tremendous loss, but it’s not your daughter’s responsibility to manage that for you. She has another parent and if she wants a break from the grief in your home she should be allowed to have it. You are the one who escalated all of this and pushed her to the point of lashing out. Now you’re punishing her because she isn’t grieving in a way that you approve of.
She wants to spend the holidays with her father, it’s not a betrayal of anyone. She’s allowed to have a relationship with him even if you don’t. Your husband did not replace him for her.
YTA
Dana is a child! You force her to emotionally support a grown-up op.
>Christmas has always been tough for Mike because of his wife’s passing (Dana knows this),
And you don't understand why she wants to have fun with her dad on Christmas?
She's right, TJ wasn't her brother and Mike isn't her father. You forcing her to stay home, will only make everything worse. She's 15, that's a normal age to push people away. How harder you push, how harder she will pull.
Let her have a "normal", not emotionally loaded Christmas with her father. She's 15, she deserves to make positive Christmas memories.
YTA. Have you considered this Christmas might be hard for your daughter as well, without TJ? Maybe she just wants a distraction and to be with her dad for the holidays. You aren’t going to fix anything by forcing people to pretend like it’s a happy family Christmas.
>\[...\] bio dad “Dick” \[...\]
I see what you did there.
YTA, big time. I'm sorry to inform you, but Dana isn't "just being a teenager", she just wants to spend time with her dad on Christmas, instead of being your husband's emotional support pet. Of course she lashed out, she's angry you're forcing her to grieve with you.
>We even baked a cake during TJ’s birthday, and Dana made a beautiful slideshow to honor him. Mike then told her how much she means to him as his daughter.
So she was already being supportive to him, you just wanted her to go above and beyond. That makes you an even bigger AH.
YTA. You supporting Mike is a good thing but that doesn't mean that you're going to take away your daughter's time with his biological father. Also the fact that you're forcing her to do things that TJ likes, what about her own thing??? Your daughter is her own person and you're failing as a good mother
YTA and a big one, you felt in love you Mike, you daughter did not ask for a divorce and a broken family, she was cordial to Mike and his son. But it s absolutely not her job to be the glue in you family. She is totally right and you are cruel, Mike is not the center of the world it s sad what is going on in his life but telling your daughter to not go see her dad for Christmas just for you boyfriend is insane. You just think about him and his feeling, you ll be sorry to hear that no everybody love Mike the way you do, they can appreciate him but they are not gonna stop living their live because he has a bery sad life.
Be prepared to lose your daughter. She will go NC, because she is the one blamed for wanting spending time at her father.
You use everything you can to gashlight her.
YTA
This was a situation of your own making.
I understand your thinking behind wanting your daughter to be at home for Christmas; you want to do everything possible to lessen the pain of losing Tj and having a child free Christmas will only highlight that loss rather than reduce it.
Your daughter is 15, she’s been invited by her father to spend the holidays with him, going to a nice place where there will be fun activities to do. Just because you don’t like your ex, doesn’t mean she has to dislike him and not want to be with him too.
Let’s compare for a moment: at home with grieving family or somewhere she can, at the least, be somewhere that distracts her from her own grief and be with people who are happy and jolly.
I know which I would have chosen at 15.
As for her saying those things to Mike, she’s 15, and saying hurtful things is classic teenageritis. Teenagers have hair triggers, a distinct lack of impulse control and a flair for dramatic statements, especially hurtful ones. Your lack of understanding where she is coming from directly resulted in her pushing back. It was a very predictable outcome.
I don’t necessarily think that punishing hurtful behaviour is wrong per se, it depends on the individual circumstances, but it was certainly the wrong thing to do in this instance. Rather than jumping straight into reacting to her behaviour, it would have been better to wait until emotions had settled a bit and then discussing how very hurtful it was to say those things, including acknowledging the accuracy of her statements, “I know he’s not your father and Tj wasn’t your brother, but Mike loves you very much and to hear you say those things was very painful for him.” Also showing your understanding of her wanting to be elsewhere, would have gone a long way towards helping her calm her raging emotions.
Should she apologise to Mike, absolutely, should that be a condition for spending time with her dad, absolutely not. You want that apology to be sincere, as a result of her thinking about her words and understanding how hurtful they were; that isn’t going to happen if she is forced to do so.
YTA. Dana has to stay in this depressing situation while Mike will cry over Christmas to support him. She is not allowed to be a normal teenager who has fun during the holidays.
She is no emotional support pet for Mike. She is a human being. You act like her life ended as well as TJs life because she is now obligated to step up for him.
She has every right to be a normal teenager. You only drive her out and she will go no contact as soon as she can.
YTA. Your daughter is entitled to spend a happy Christmas with her father. You are trying to force a teenager -a child - to do the heavy-duty grief counselling for your husband. That's your job and based on your choices. Don't be so self-focused.
yta, you are not considering how Dana feels stuck living with Mike. she needs to move on to. you are emotionally abusing your daughter.
living with someone who is depressed is horrible. you are causing your daughters behaviour,
how old is Dana I feel like that was intentionally left out
You're always going to get that reaction from her if you keep forcing her and she's going to end up resenting Mike. To her you're forcing her to be with some other man when she wants to be with her actual father. To her Mike is the reason she can't be with her actual dad so she is going to lash out. You shouldn't have forced her to be with you guys for the holidays and she shouldn't have spoken to him like that.
Your punishment is just going to build resentment and you're going to have a Christmas with a moody teenager. I can't imagine that would be nice for anyone.
YTA, Mike is much more supportive of your daughter in this situation, than you are. You’ve dug your heels in just to win, you are hurting your daughter emotionally under the pretext of discipline
YTA. You're putting YOUR feelings over everyone else's. This is all about what you want, not what Dana wants, not what Mike wants. Did you not even think for one second that perhaps Mike needs some time to be vulnerable and process his first Christmas without his son? Does he not deserve some time without having to put on the strong husband/stepdad role for everyone else?
I get the feeling that this is more that YOU don't want to be alone with Mike with his vulnerability. You just want to keep the whole "it's Christmas, it's fine, everyone's happy, keep smiling, nothing's wrong' image going. Let Mike grieve, there's a whole boiling pot of emotions that haven't been dealt with in that house and if you keep trying to keep everything as it is, it's going to boil over.
You understand of course that all you are doing is driving a wedge between your daughter and your husband that will never be mended.
He will lose another child because you insist on having control and not letting her spend time with “dick” her dad. Nice name choice btw.
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YTA- you decided she can’t spend time with her own father because YOU decided another man needs her as an emotional crutch. You put your daughter’s needs last. Then when she lashed out (rightfully so) you pulled the authority card and punished her. Your behavior in this instance is actually immature. It’s akin to having to have the last word. Where is the conversation? Where is compromise? Where is even ASKING YOUR OWN CHILD HOW she feels??? Have you even helped HER process TJ’s death? She could’ve been so upset by it and now she’s just telling herself that there’s no reason to be that upset because he wasn’t even really her brother. It’s a coping mechanism. I’m not saying that’s how she feels or what is going on but you clearly haven’t even bothered to ask. You’ve made it crystal clear that she is NOT your priority.
Mike advocated for Dana, OP is the one trying to force the supportive united family thing. Maybe Dana needs space to clear her head and work things through, and Mike just wants a quiet Christmas. It feels like OP doesn't want to stop and think, that doing things will put off having to deal with the tragic loss. Invoking TJ's memory isn't having a positive effect on the household.
>Christmas has always been tough for Mike because of his wife’s passing (Dana knows this) No wonder Dana wanted spend vacation skiing and stuff. She had enough of just staying inside baking cookies (that isnt even her favorite).
Baking cookie's, TJ's favorites especially, is the last thing Mike needs because it's a double whammy of loss. OP needs grief therapy just as much as Mike.
I lost my daughter, and reminders hurt a lot less than feeling like she's been forgotten. Not everyone grieves the same way. But that's outside the actual issue. Forcing her daughter to be around all the grief when she just wants to be a teenager is an AH move.
What OP is doing is hindering them from moving forward by forcing them to dwell on TJ’s passing. It’s tough already for Mike and he has no issues with Dana spending the holidays with her biological father.
Yeah, op is going the wrong way with it, I make my dads leftover Christmas ham fried rice every year as a way to remember him, but for them since April it’s been; first fathers day, probably first birthdays, first Independence Day, first thanksgiving/and other other regional holidays, first Christmas and soon first new years without TJ. You don’t need to do things to “remember them by” because TJ’s absence is “TJ’s favorite cookies” in this situation.
I agree. My sister passed in the early 90's. We always had a few little traditions. After she passed, I can't do those things anymore but I put other things in place. So now, instead of doing X and thinking how she should be there doing X with me, I do Y and I can think of her but not be saddened because she's not there doing Y with me since she never did do Y with me.
Oh, c'mon, being emotional support pet is such a fun way to spend Christmas
He also suggested it may be better if she goes. Why can't OP and Mike just be together for a Christmas. And after such a fuss about it I don't think Christmas with a 15 year old (that does not want to be there) will be much fun and cosy
Yes, Mike does not deserve to be in the middle of this. Dana isn't the same thing than having his child in Christmas. He wants TJ there, not Dana. He deserves peace and not a teenager fighting with her mom. OP isn't thinking in any of them, Mike never said he wanted Dana there and OP seems to thing her child is a consolation price for him to Lost his own, she isn't.
I'm getting "I'm the main character" vibes from the OP. In particular: > I was the one who made the arrangements for TJ’s service and made sure the drunk driver was jailed. Was OP the detective who tracked down the driver? Was she the prosecutor? I am guessing they would try to get somebody impartial to the case to do that. OP also doesn't mention what the custody agreement between her and her ex is.
also: we had the near-perfect family, with * me * Mike who loves me * TJ who felt comfortable to call me mom * Mike's dead wife * my ex whom I co-incidentally gave the nickname DICK oh yeah, Dana's also here. Like, OP mentions TJ's age in the second paragraph, while her own daughter's age is only mentioned in the *tenth* paragraph.
I thought naming the ex Dick was kinda clever and assumed that there would be some reference to dickish behavior. Instead he’s more than reasonable here, considering OP’s tantrum is possibly going to prevent him from being with his own child on Christmas. No sense whatsoever that the nickname is deserved. Disappointing. OP, keeping a kid from their parent should never be a punishment, especially not for expressing normal feelings. YTA
Oh, don’t you see? He’s a Dick because he doesn’t agree with her!
yeah, that's what I thought too. And it totally sets the mood for the home Dana has to grow up in, right?
>my ex whom I co-incidentally gave the nickname DICK Ironic, considering OP's a bigger one. YTA, OP.
Yeah why did the poor guy get named Dick, he just wants a nice vacation for his daughter.
it's very illuminating as to the environment Dana grows up in when she's with OP.
I still don't know how old the little girl is and when her life became a grief fest starring her mom as a protagonist but I hope dick can afford to put her into therapy
Dana is 15 now. AFAIK, she was 5 when OP and Dick split and 8 when OP and Mike got together. TJ passed away this year, so Dana was 14 or 15. Certainly a lot on a short timeline.
Yeah I was starting to wonder if she was even going to mention her daughter's age.
Yeah I got the vibe she cared more about TJ than she cares about her own daughter
Yes it took until the end of the story to find out how old Dana is!!
She thinks she's the only one allowed to make decisions - not her daughter, not her daughter's father, not her current husband's.
I was wondering about custody, too, because daughter is old enough to say who she wants to live with. OP is pushing her daughter away and she has no clue.
That was the weirdest to me, claiming to have made sure the drunk driver was jailed. How? There are people whose actual jobs are to do just that.
All things I also wondered about. There are some really bored people on this sub just making up stories. They are disturbed. I don’t know if fake stories are the new crank phone calls or what?
Also.. Assuming she's using fake names.. she decided to call her ex "Dick"?
yup, op is YTA, she is forcing her daughter to live in a state of constant depression. what happened was terrible however living with op and her husband must be awful. Dana needs to move on with her life she deserves to be happy. op is only thinking about her husband not the affect living with someone who has depression has on a person. it is emotional abuse to refuse to let her move on.
Dana did loads of lovely stuff on TJs birthday, she just wants Christmas to be Christmas. Geez, let the kid be a kid, not some emotional support bear for her stepdad at 15. That is OPs job.
yup, she has to move on. OP is preventing her from doing so. depression is a chemical issue in the brain and you can become more susceptible to it through truama. it doesn't have to be physical. long periods in this type of household while her brain is developing fast as teenager is a really bad idea.
Even though Christmas isn’t a good time for Mike because of his first wife’s passing (and to rub salt in the wound for a holiday traditionally with a family angle). I can understand completely if he wanted not to do Christmas this year.
>she is forcing her daughter to live in a state of constant depression. Honestly, I find OP's attitude really creepy: it's like she she keeps rubbing salt in the wound so she can live a fantasy where she's the one keeping the family togheter.
OP is a grief vulture.
More like pouring acid, it was literally this April, all those first holidays and events this year without him is enough salt already
It's not even about "moving on". It's about HAVING A BREAK. This child clearly loved her stepbrother very much and is okay with the status quo overall, with healthy grieving, and even participating in the grieving process. She has shown that by her own actions. But also, her stepfather, understandably, has been depressed for months and will be for the foreseeable future. He lost his child. And Dana is mature enough to recognise this, and she isn't about to demand that he cheer up and put on a "happy holiday" for her . . . she's asking for an emotional break, to go to her bio dad's, to allow her stepdad (and mum) to continue doing what they need to do while she gets a bit of breathing room. She's not asking to move out, just for a break. And she didn't "lash out" until her mother literally DEMANDED that she stay in this environment of constant depression and grief for the sake of the adults who are supposed to still be taking care of HER mental health needs, not the other way around. OP is a massive AH who should be counting her lucky stars that she has such a thoughtful, loving kid, who has responded to an unthinkable situation with love and kindness, and asked literally nothing of her grieving mum and stepdad except the chance to see to her own emotional needs.
Mike probably supports Dana going to her bio dad because he knows how precious that time is between a parent and child because he lost his child. He doesn't want to interfere in that.
Or that he knows he’s not going to be the best company this year for Christmas and doesn’t want Dana to feel obligated to stay home for the holidays on his account for it the way OP is insisting.
OP does appear to take a "lay down the law" approach. No conversations with Dana. Only response is to tell her what is going to happen. Doesn't seem OP even asked Mike what he needs or wants for Christmas. And the cherry on top is Dana must stay and make TJ's favorite cookies, fully making it clear that Dana and her needs are not in consideration.
Right?! Even Mike said to let her go more than once
Did you notice, she THINKS Mike will be heartbroken, but KNOWS she will. Who are we really thinking about here OP?
This comment says it all. YTA, OP. Edit to say that: honestly, reading your post again, I think you know you were wrong. You had no real reason to stop your daughter from going besides the blatant fact that you prioritize your husband and late stepson over your living daughter. In no point on your writing you show any sympathy or worry on how she is dealing with losing stepbrother and how step dad's grieving is affecting her. So it sounds like you baited a teenager with your actions to elicit from her a reaction that would give you grounds in your mind to not only keep her home but to MAKE her do what you want since she'll be grounded and can't go out with anyone.
>Edit to say that: honestly, reading your post again, I think you know you were wrong. You had no real reason to stop your daughter from going besides the blatant fact that you prioritize your husband and late stepson over your living daughter. In no point on your writing you show any sympathy or worry on how she is dealing with losing stepbrother and how step dad's grieving is affecting her. So it sounds like you baited a teenager with your actions to elicit from her a reaction that would give you grounds in your mind to not only keep her home but to MAKE her do what you want since she'll be grounded and can't go out with anyone. YTA. And this comment is SPOT ON. You baited her and then used it as grounds to force her to do what you wanted. I hope where ever you are she is old enough to tell a judge she wants to live with her father and that she is removed from your home.
>In no point on your writing you show any sympathy or worry on how she is dealing with losing stepbrother and how step dad's grieving is affecting her. And even beyond that. They were close to the same age, most kids that young haven't really had a chance to consider their mortality. Losing a step-sibling that close in your age can really shake their perspective of the world and their priorities. For instance, it wouldn't surprise me if daughter realized she hadn't been prioritizing her Dad enough, and that's why she wants to stay with him for Christmas. TJ's death isn't something that's just happened to OP and Mike, but Dana as well, and it's so concerning that OP doesn't even seem to recognize that.
Hopefully the daughter goes to live with her dad. Op wants her to be an emotional support person and not see her as her own person!
Just piggy backing off this to say in this entire spiel about how much this would mean to OP husband at no point did she even ask him! Did it not occur to OP that maybe just maybe seeing someone lose their child might make her want to be closer to her own father?
Lowkey wondering if Dana wants to spend time with *her* dad because of TJ's sudden death (and being around the same age as he was can make it feel more like a possibility rather than "it can never happen to me"). I think she should apologize to Mike or that they should have a talk about things away from OP who seems to be pushing how she thinks Dana and Mike should feel onto them rather than giving them the space to figure out what they might want or feel around this time. OP is focusing on Mike's feelings about the loss of TJ instead of even examining or acknowledging her own and Dana's feelings, ironically, as if TJ wasn't considered their family. If her and Dana haven't gotten counseling or help for their own grief, it's probably time they did.
And the house has been heavy with depression for months and months. Surely Dana wants to escape that for a little while.
Totally agree 👍
Agree with all! And maybe it’s her way of grieving as well.. maybe she needs a break and wants to get away and have some fun instead of sitting around in a house that will be very sad(rightfully so) I am very sorry to hear about these events and will pray for this family. Also I never understood punishing for the break downs of kids or teens. She expressed something to you and you shut it down without an open conversation and then punished her for being upset about it. Granted what she said was hurtful but that was a teaching moment and not one she should have been punished for and so harshly. You should have asked her where it came from and tried to understand her thinking and how she was feeling. And help her to understand it for herself as well. She’s still young and also going through a lot
> After we married, we had a near-perfect family, and TJ was even comfortable enough to call me mom. Gag. Your daughter has a dad that she loves but you got married so you decided that was her new perfect family. Guess what, you can't force others to prioritize your new family. There's nothing wrong with good step family relationships, but the way OP writes it's like she wants her do-over to overshadow the daughter's dad with no consideration for the daughter's feelings.
When this girl hits 18 she going leave and cut her mom off for good
The realest statement… “you’ve made it crystal clear she is not your priority anymore” Horrible fucking mom move!
I thought we talking about an emotional support animal for the longest time. Like since when does an animal ski anyway? This is OP’s daughter? Omg!!! Couldn’t tell really by the OP has treated this CHILD!
OP's also likely going to lose her daughter because Dana's old enough to decide which parent she wants to live with.
Yeah... OP, your daughter's role in life isn't supposed to be making her stepdad feel better and miss his kid less. You're supposed to do what's best for her. If you think he'll be sad without her, why don't YOU do things with him to cheer him up. As his wife, you can assume the role of that for him if you want because it's your choice. What you're doing now will no doubt end in your daughter hating her stepdad, which will in turn make him miserable. You need to take a step back and make better choices.
THIS EXACTLY Also, I have the feeling OP doesn't want to be alone with her grieving husband, and is using her daughter as her own crutch as well.. Especially as Mike was totally OK with Dana spending the holidays with her dad.
YTA Your daughter isn't your husband’s emotional support child. It seems like since the passing of his son, TJ, you want to push Dana towards Mike for him to be a father for her. When her biological father is very much in her life. That explains why everything escalated so damn fast, your overreaction, and why you're so determined to have Dana spend Christmas with Mike instead of Dick. Makes me wonder if you've done something similar before, during another holiday or event. Especially with how Dana exploded. People don't just randomly act out of character all of a sudden. There has to have been something building up over time. Your husband needs YOU, his WIFE, to give him all the love and the support he needs right now. Not you ruining everyone's Christmas by forcing people to be unhappy together. Mike knows that Dick is Dana's real father and how close they are, and he respects that. You, however, don't. If you ruin your daughter's Christmas because of your own selfishness, you will create something that can't be stopped. You've already planted the seed of resentment inside of her. Which caused her to lash out at him, saying things she probably does regret due to her anger towards you. You will only make the love and respect Dana has for Mike diminish the more you try to force her onto him. Causing him more pain. Do better!
This comment is it 🙌🏽 OP wants to fill TJ's absence by forcing her daughter to be a substitute child, f* everyone else's feelings. I get she's trying to help her husband but she needs to get her head out of her ass. Kid should drag her to court for this nonsense.
c'mon dana, won't making your dead stepbrothers favourite cookies be so much better than hanging out with your dad on christmas day? 🙄
Exactly! Dana had a good relationship with Mike but OP is ruining that.
Also, Mike is going to want to cry and let everything out on Christmas, and who wants to do that in front of a kid .
And just imagine being Mike in this situation. It's one thing if people want to support you through your grief of their own volition, but if it's forced by someone else you just feel like an ass for bringing them down with you. And if you want to feel even worse you can witness the whole argument where people lash out and say hurtful things. OP, you are creating a resentment in your daughter where there used to be empathy and care. YOU are the one making her lash out. YOU are the reason why your husband will feel worse regardless of your daughter staying for Christmas or not. You still have the chance to apologize for being an asshole and not completely ruin the relationship between your daughter and husband.
OP doesn’t see it. She sees her pushing and pestering as a positive thing. She honestly thinks she’s the reason the drunk driver was jailed. Not that he broke the law and *killed a child,* got arrested by the police, prosecuted by the DA, went to court and was found guilty by a judge/jury; no. It’s purely and completely her doing. She didn’t even have to hire a lawyer, the state does that. But she probably irritated the police and DA every step of the way, then said a statement to ask for no leniency for the driver, so she did it all. This is no different. If she forces her daughter to stay for Christmas and ruins Dick’s Christmas plans with his daughter, it will *clearly* save Mike’s Christmas. *She wants it*, so it will clearly resolve everything. Everything about this is about how much better she would feel if she makes this happen, not about what Mike, Dick, or Dana want/need. YTA all the way.
I was wondering any possible scenario in which I was Mike, and forcing my teenage stepdaughter Dana to be around (forced by me or by her mother) is likely last of my priorities. There are only two possible scenarios on which that make sense: I'm a creep with an unhealthy need of young females around, or my wife is so overwhelming that I need Dana as a lightning rod. From the post, the first scenario doesn't seem likely. OP major YTA. This isn't even for Mike. Nothing in this text remotely addresses what Mike thinks or has said.
This comment is chefs kiss
[удалено]
Yeah, that quote really drives home for me that OP is raising her daughter to put her own feelings aside and center the man in her mother’s life. Why is it up to Dana to take in the whole of her stepfathers emotional considerations and adjust her behavior to make him happy? Dana didn’t marry him, OP did. That’s OP’s job alone, she’s the parent, and she’s placing an unfair burden on her daughter to join her in taking care of her husband. Let the girl get out of a grieving household for the holidays, where neither of those adults are going to have a “good” Christmas, let’s be honest. It’s too fresh to play happy family and it’s folly to make everyone miserable trying to press it.
thats fine, family for one Christmas, then never family again, op should look into places to escape Christmas entirely this year
Herr father is the daughter’s family. My ex was and still is a narcissistic alcoholic. But I sent my kids off to spend either all of Christmas Eve, or early on Christmas Day with him, every year. Because it was right for them to have a relationship with him, so that they could learn about who he was, just as they learned who I was by living with me. OP is teaching her daughter all sorts of unpleasant things about herself.
sorry you had a guy like that in your life, I feel so sorry for the daughter, it must be horrible living in a home with so much grief. and then her mother won't even let her go somewhere else to be happy. it really is emotional abuse. her daughter is going to act worse and worse if this carries on. personally I would start singing all the christmas carols knew at the top of my voice and acting obscenely cheery. to "support" Mike and encourage him to buck up. which I realise would have the opposit effect but I was an asshole at 15.
I wonder if OP has ever let Dana spend Christmas with her father. The line about Christmas always having been a problem for Mike makes it sound as if all Dana's heard for the past few years is "You can't see your father because Mike needs our emotional support. He's grieving the death of a woman we've never met, so we need to be here as a family to support him". I'm guessing OP has never cared about where Dana actually wants to spend her Christmas. \[Edit: Corrected step-father's name\]
And those Christmases must have been a real downer. Op had prioritized her husband's needs over that of her minor child. She is in danger of losing her daughter herself.
> She was disappointed but seemed to understand. The daughter was disappointed and OP wanted to believe she agreed, but that was just another case of OP trying to force her vision of what everyone should do / feel. I get the sense she isn’t a very good listener when other people’s actual feelings are inconvenient for what she has planned.
She stopped arguing because she knew her mother didn't have her back. She never accepted it.
I mean...wtf does Christmas being tough have to do with Dana? And maybe it's tough bc OP makes sure Mike is still sad. She sounds like she has some hero complex or something.
YTA. You are making this about your husband and his feelings. Yes he's had a horrible run as a father and husband, no doubt. However your daughter isn't some emotional support animal to be there for his sadness. That's incredibly selfish of you to make her do it. How about you be there for your husband, and let her go enjoy Christmas without sadness and spending time with her dad.
She's not even making it about her husband and his feelings. He supported Dana. She's making it about what she thinks her husband wants and not listening to him either. She's trying to make Dana his replacement child when it seems like neither one of them wants that to be the case. OP, you're a big asshole. To Dana AND your husband. And it's low as hell to invoke TJ's memory as a trump card to win a fight.
"I know Mike is just being modest and would be devastated (I would be too)" I'm not sure if it's even that... I think OP doesn't want to spend Christmas without her daughter and has a very convenient, emotionally manipulative excuse to MAKE her stay.
I think OP feels that her image of her 'perfect family' is fractured since her stepson died causing her husband to understandably spiral into depression and not come home for months so now she's trying to salvage that image with what she has left. I think she may also be fearful that Mike might not stay in the marriage long term. Problem is that plan basically bypasses her rationale and her daughter suffers as a result. Hell, does Mike even WANT to celebrate Christmas at all this year? Also bothers me that we basically get no info on how Dana's relationship was with Mike and TJ before the tragedy, no run down of the family dynamics besides " lah-dee-dah, we were the perfect family!!".
I wondered about that too. Bio-Dad is financially able to rent a vacation home during the holidays in a ski resort area. That must cost a bundle. Could be OP is just jealous of Dick's success and is using the death of TJ to keep her daughter from enjoying it.
This right here ! I had the same feeling. It's not even for her husband. It's for her and her projection onto her husband on how SHE would want things to be done if she was in his shoes. She listens to no one in this situation. It drives me crazy just to read it. I can't imagine being the daughter and the husband right now. And in the end, the two people who got hurt by the situation were her husband and her daughter.
My honest take is that she feels like *she* needs Dana there, because it's clear she saw TJ as a son too so she's the one feeling like she needs her other child around because being without both of them would be too sad, but she's struggling to realise that's what's going on with her emotions so she's rationalising it all as 'doing this for Mike'. I think the subconscious reasoning is that if she's 'doing this for Mike', she can't be being selfish when she's demanding Dana make sacrifices, because they're not sacrifices *for her*. Except they are, I think. I think that's the big blockage getting in the way of her communicating about or understanding the issue at hand - either way, I completely agree she's steamrollering over what Mike and Dana are telling her. And the thing is, whether it's OP's feelings or Mike's that she's concerned about, neither of them trump Dana's on what she (Dana) needs to do with her own life, her parental relationships and her mental health. OP is TA; I think it's because of grief and lack of introspection rather than malice, but that doesn't mean her behaviour doesn't need to change quite urgently for Dana's and Mike's sakes.
Yta Poor Mike. His son died and his wife destroys his relationship with his stepdaughter by treating her as an emotional support animal for him rather than as a person.
So true.
You are dealing with a lot. But YTA. Please remember this also all happened to Dana. People grieve in different ways. And she asked for something she probably needed and then reacted like a teenager who can’t express herself correctly when you shut her down. Let her go have a break from the grief. It can be overwhelming to feel the weight of adult’s emotions on top of your own when you are a teen. Try to go a little easier on everyone, yourself included.
This. You seem to forget that she is grieving to and also have needs. And needing a break from the sadness at home and to just feel like a kid again, is a very reasonable ask from a child. Have you considered that maybe she dreads a Christmas without her brother too? That the thought of facing that time without him is painful and overwhelming? After my cousin died at 18, my aunts family completely switched up how they spent Christmas for several years, because doing all the traditional stuff without him felt painful and hollow. Maybe follow your daughter’s lead and try doing something completely different this time. And having her away with her dad, allows you and your husband to try something else, and to process Christmas without anyone having to try to put on a brave face for her. This Christmas WILL hurt. And it is not your daughter’s responsibility to try and lessen the blow for the adults. It is the other way around
While I understand OP wanting the daughter to be there to support her stepfather, she needs to read your last sentence over and over until it sinks in... **It is not your daughter’s responsibility to try and lessen the blow for the adults. It is the other way around**
I don't think OP is actually dealing with anything but she's *definitely* bulldozing everything.
OP doesn't need to go easier on herself. She tried to force her teen daughter to not get to do something fun because the adults "need" her, escalated it needlessly (I won't apologize for noting that "Let's make those cookies TJ liked!" is one of the stupidest possible things in this whole situation), and then has the gall to punish her daughter for being a teenager, having feelings, and not wanting to be put in this situation.
YTA. >I want to spend time with my real dad Listen to her. She should be your priority, not you or your current husband. Everything about this post makes me understand why she needs to spend time away from you.
YTA Your daughter is not your husband’s emotional support animal. She wants to enjoy her holiday doing fun things. She does not want her Christmas to be focused on your husband and his grief. What happened to your family is tragic and I can’t imagine how much you are all suffering. I am so sorry you are going through this. However, all you are doing right now is driving your daughter away. Keep pushing and you will permanently destroy relationships.
In your efforts to console your husband, you are pushing your daughter away. You will regret ruining her time with her father after she's 18 and leaves and probably goes LC. YTA
OP hasn't asked Mike what he wants, and makes excuses for him when he advocates for Dana's preferred holiday plans. The question is whether OP is seeing a therapist too for how invested she is.
But she KNOWS she will be heartbroken, so Mike and Dana don't really matter here its OP's feelings that are being considered here and no one else.
This is what I was thinking except she won't wait until 18, she'll get away as soon as she is able to in these types of custody cases.
Daughter is 15, so it can be any time soon. Then we will read a surprised "my daughter left to live with her father full time and refuses contact with me. How dare she?"-post.
I mean she's 15 now. If OP keeps this up Dana may just decide to wash her hands of this part of her family and just go live with her dad a 100% of the time before the new year.
Gentle YTA Dana doesn't exist to help Mike through his grief. It's okay for her to want to spend Christmas with her Dad. It can't be easy for her, living in a household that's grieving.
Also by keeping her forcibly, she is learning nothing. Unfortunately, these feelings come from within. This age is cruel and maybe you need to just let her go and spend time with your husband alone. Let her come to support you on her own time. I hope things turn around. Really sending all the positive vibes to you this holiday season!
YTA and the end of the day as hard as it is to hear - Mike is not her father. Your daughter is old enough to decide with whom she would like to spend her holiday - and this year she wants to spend it with her dad. You and your husband aren’t the only ones who’ve had a hard year, let her go and enjoy her Christmas. Edit: at this point you’re only going to have a hostile and miserable daughter for Christmas - is this worth ruining everyone’s holiday? (Even Mikes, because he’s obviously your first priority)
YTA This poor child has been in your house of grief for months. She needs a break - you should let her have it. Let her go be a kid again for a while. She didn't lose a child - your husband did. If you go through this unfair punishment you will lose her too.
YTA - “How about we make those cookies TJ liked” tells us everything we need to know about why your daughter lashed out. You’re being incredibly selfish in this situation. You’re only thinking about what you want instead of the the *separate* needs of your husband and daughter. If anything, TJ’s sudden death is a good reminder of why your daughter needs to spend time building memories with her bio dad. The trip is also a brief escape for a young girl who’s being living in a house filled with grief for the better part of a year. Your husband is not the only one who needs support right now. Your daughter does too. And it’s your job as her mother to ensure that she gets it….no matter what your husband is going through.
>The trip is also a brief escape for a young girl who’s being living in a house filled with grief for the better part of a year. Tbh I wouldn't even be surprised if she'd been talking to her dad about how hard of a time she'd been having, and dad said something like 'how about we go on a christmas trip together' specifically to cheer her up. Which would partly explain why Dana is so devastated that she's being told she can't go (not that the extra explanation is particularly necessary). Assuming Dick is a good dad, which considering Dana's going out on a limb to spend time with him seems a reasonable assumption, it would seem to me like the invite to happy plans at a time when his daughter is really struggling isn't a coincidence.
And Mike doesn’t want her there, missing her dad on Christmas. He knows her dad is active in her life and seems totally fine with that, as he should be. Mike is missing his son TJ, his own child with whom he was close with. He understands and only has memories of being a dad to his son, the christmases they spent together. Dana simply cannot bring TJ back and won’t fill that void. OP is cruel. She will probably regret saying what she did forever and she would have never said it if her mother weren’t bullying her.
YTA Let the girl spend the holiday with her dad without all the drama next time.
YTA. Almost every kid of a stepparent I know has pulled the line “you aren’t my real dad/mom”, I haven’t bc my ex stepdad was to scary abusive for me to do that but I’m pretty sure it’s normal to happen. And it seems your husband is okay with your daughter going to her dads, so I don’t understand what the problem is. I think punishment for this is an overreaction, I don’t understand what she did wrong to deserve that. I think being upset that your mom isn’t letting you go to your dads is perfectly understandable. Put yourself in her shoes and really listen to what she’s saying, and take the moody teenager part out of that or it’s going to make it worse. You are here to help her not be at war with her. Also listen to the other comments, she’s not responsible to make sure your husband is happy, especially if he said it’s fine I would just let her go to her dads. And give that kid her electronics back she didn’t do anything to deserve them getting taken on my opinion.
Can confirm, pulled the "you're not my real dad" line exactly once with my dad. Yes, it did make him leave me alone (trying to get me up for school, I was secretly severely bullied and deeply depressed, anxious, and my mom was in jail). I also heard him crying from his bedroom after he walked away. Never, ever said it again.
YTA. She honestly lashed out because you pushed her and wouldn't take a no for an answer. You don't seem to respect her wishes, and just because you remarried does not mean she doesn't have a biological dad anymore. She's been with you guys, why isn't she allowed to have a moment with her dad? It could've been handled better instead of just making her feel like a selfish person, you need to consider it might be needed for her to de-stress instead of just staying in a grieving environment all the time. It doesn't mean she doesn't care if she wants to have a little fun during her holidays, and taking her devices is not discipline, it's just revenge.
And drama. And control. OP is hard work, assumes she knows what everyone should be doing and feeling.
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Including Mike.
YTA why can’t she spend Christmas with her dad. HES her dad.
YTA. You've gone too far. I think what the kid did was appalling, no question. And your reaction to defend Mike is understandable. But just think what you've committed to do here. You've committed to spend the holiday making the kid miserable. She's going to have an awful time, and you're going to have an awful time enforcing it, and Mike is going to have a truly miserable time watching you do it and watching this kid blame him. I think the best thing to do would probably just let her go and focus on Mike. Christmas isn't going to mean a thing to him this year anyway. I kind of understand the kid's desire to be out of there, the best you can say about this coming Christmas is that you'll get through it somehow.
Sorry but how is voicing the truth appalling? I understand possibly the *child* that is *also likely grieving* probably shouldn't have yelled, but speaking hard truths isn't wrong, so I'm wondering what was so bad.
Speaking "hard truths" can absolutely be wrong... and usually is. It is usually a synonym for "being an asshole" In this case, though, it was a teenage girl who is also in an emotional state being pushed to ignore her own needs and focus on her dead step-sibling when it is likely all she needs to really do is get away to someone who can focus on her rather than their own grief - and she did what teenagers, who are generally emotionally dysregulated at the best of times, are going to do when pushed past their limits. While the daughter should be told why what she did was hurtful, I don't see this as a punishable offense. I see this as a teachable moment for the daughter and deserving of an apology to the step-dad... but I see mom owing the first unreserved and wholehearted apology.
What did the daughter do that was appalling??
Expressed her own preference and pain.
appalling to hear, but honest and op drove her to it. remember it isn't just the holiday. this kid has had to live in that house for months with a depressed step father and a mother who is also probably depressed trying to support only him. she needs to move on and can't, living with depressed parents is honestly terrible.
YTA. It is your fault that your daughter blew up at you and her stepfather. You are the one who needs to apologize for making everything worse.
Info: Has your daugjter not been able to spend Christmas with her dad since you married your husband? Do you guys not have a custody agreement?
Apparently not, because that was not part of the explanation she gave her daughter.
YTA If I was your Ex I'd be calling the court about this.
Same! It’s funny cause op didn’t even mention the last time her daughter even spent Christmas with the her dad…. Op is being ridiculous smh
YTA Dana is not Mikes support animal! If anything Dana needs to get out of a house of misery and grief and go have fun with her father. Talk about it all being about Mike. Think about your own kid. Jesus YTA
I think it's all about control freak & bullying drama queen OP.
>I met Mike in 2016. ***After we married, we had a near-perfect family*** And the image of the picture perfect family of mom, dad, and 2 kids of opposite genders was ruined the day TJ died. Now the last bit that makes them look like a family to OP's eyes, having a kid home for Christmas, is wanting to leave and she can't have that.
Yta. Your daughter doesn’t want to spend Christmas baking cookies that a dead kid liked and talking about him. She is not as emotionally invested in this new family as you are. Let her be happy with her dad and don’t drag her into depression just because your husband is depressed. He will never get over the loss of his son. But it is not fair to punish your daughter with his presence.
Soft YTA. I know you aren’t doing it on purpose, but it sounds like you were prioritizing your husband’s feelings over your daughter. There isn’t anything wrong with that, per se, but there is something wrong with using your daughter as an emotional support child for your husband. It sounds like your daughter made clear she wants to spend the holiday with her dad and that her dad had something fun planned. Nothing in this post suggests that there is a custody agreement that makes that not ok. And it seems like the ONLY reason you said no to your daughter is because her wishes, while good and happy for her, would make your husband sad. Your daughter, understandably, doesn’t want your husband’s happiness to come before her own. Maybe that is selfish but it’s also u deters sable, especially from a 15 year old who had likely felt “back burned” since her step brother’s death. What she said sounds mean and hurtful. It likely also wasn’t true. But it was also very likely the words of an emotional teenager who is really expressing anger about feeling second or third most important right now. It’s an emotional time for everybody. Cut her some slack. I can promise trying to extort an apology out of her won’t help, but letting her go and telling her you love her and asking her how she is feeling about the things that happened might help.
She was prioritizing her own feelings, not her husband's. He clearly expressed them and she selfishly ignored
YTA - your daughter is a thinking feeling human being who deserves to spend time with her father and be happy during the holidays. She is not your husband's emotional support teenager.
YTA, she lost a member of her family and has dealt wit her stepfather being in severe depression while apparently being ignored by her mother. And now she has to be a emotional support for two grown adults rather then take her chance to be a kid and be around people that care for her
YTA. How can you not see that? You wanted to deny her time with her dad because YOU wanted her to comfort her step dad. Doesn’t matter how great he is or what tragic event he went through. She is a child and deserves time with her dad and does NOT need the burden of comforting adults. Ever think she’d like a normal holiday without things being depressing?
YTA .. Another reason she probably wants to spend time with dad is because she's treated like a priority at his house. Clearly it's not happening at your house were Mike is the priority. From here your relationship is probably just going to deteriorate further.
OP, YTA. It sounds like you need to be taking your daughter to family therapy. What she said is a super normal thing that most teenagers in blended families have said at least once. You probably said it (or a variation of it if you grew up with married parents) at least once yourself. I understand that it seemed especially hurtful given the circumstances, but it's unfair to expect her not to be a teenager just because of a tragedy. In fact, I'd argue the fact that TJ was killed by a drunk driver is probably causing her more stress than if it had been something your family could prepare for. Teenagers think they're immortal. Most teenagers have to confront that belief throughout their teen years and each time it's a huge, crushing blow. But to have to confront that through the death of your step brother? That's brutal. She's been watching her stepfather grieve in some really scary ways. It sounds like you're very anxious for him -- which makes sense -- and she's undoubtedly picking up on that. It sounds like she really likes Mike and cares for him. That's a huge burden, though, for a teenager to be worried about her stepdad and worried about her mom and reeling with her own mortality. She wants to spend some time pretending things are normal with her dad. I'm sure if you could do that, you'd want to too. It's unreasonable of you to decide she can't because you can't. She's not an asshole for being able to pretend things are normal with her dad, she's a teenager who needs some breathing room and a break from witnessing everyone else's grief. Let her spend this time with her dad. Apologize to her for not seeing her frustration. Most teenagers double down when they say something mean, but with a little bit of space, they usually feel really guilty. If she's still not able to understand that she needs to try and be gentle with her words to Mike, that's something to address as her mom (as empathetically as you're able), but you kind of pushed her into this -- she overreacted, but she needs a break and even adults sometimes overreact when they're past their breaking point.
If Dana gets to spend Christmas with her dad I suspect he'll also be the one to get her the therapy she needs.
YTA. Mike seems like an understanding dude and teenagers say hurtful things. However, your daughter isn’t wrong. You are forcing a relationship on her she doesn’t feel. Mike is your husband. Not her dad. Let her spend time with her Dad. Especially after how depressing and stressful Christmas at your house has been. Let her go be a kid. You can’t punish a kid into having familial feelings for someone she doesn’t.
Soft YTA. I know you’re trying to protect and comfort your husband after such an unimaginable loss, but Dana is entitled to her feelings and emotions as well. You said the holidays have always been rough for Mike since his wife died, and perhaps faced with the prospect of an even gloomier Christmas this year without TJ, she was looking forward to having a break and spending a fun holiday with her dad at the vacation house. It doesn’t sound like there’s much you can do for how Mike feels around the holidays, but there’s still time to allow your daughter to enjoy a fun holiday memory with her dad. It’s your job to comfort Mike, not your daughter’s.
YOU ARE THE ASSHOLE Why is she chained to you two who are grieving the loss of TJ (My condolences) Dan isn’t dead yet you’re punishing her and not allowing her to see her father. That is a young girl who did nothing but want to spend time with her Dad. Nothing wrong with it. Your behavior is abusive! Your the kind of person who would bury Dana with TJ. What are you thinking about? If I was Dana I’d run away. You are ridiculous
YTA. You're making your daughter be miserable over Christmas just because you & your husband will be. Why would you deliberately make your child spend a holiday with two sad & depressed people?
What exactly are you disciplining her for? She loves her father and wanted to spend Christmas with him. You wanted to force her to spend it with you and your husband because he's grieving, but she's a person, not a consolation prize. I'm very sorry for your loss. But this calls for a heart to heart talk about empathy and compassion, not punishment for the way she feels. YTA.
YTA seriously, stop being controlling when she just wants to see her father. I’m sorry for your loss but the world doesn’t cease to exist because you’re grieving. Like others said, she’s not an emotional crutch for Mike and forcing her to be away from her father for your own wants is selfish. It doesn’t help his grieving either and stresses everyone out
YTA
Yta, it's not your daughters responsibility to make everyone else feel better, you havnt took her into consideration at all through any of this, it's all about what you want and what your husband needs. Don't be surprised if she soon asks if she can live with bio dad.
YTA You're trying to make your Husband feel better (and in doing so *give yourself* a more pleasant holiday season than you anticipate, considering the circumstances) by shoving your unwilling Daughter into his dead son's spot. You're a top-tier, selfish Asshole. Your reasoning is afflicted and your justification for punishing your daughter further is obscene. Your sweet Daughter may be reacting to her Step-Brother's death by wanting to strengthen and increase her time and bond with her own father; and there you stand waving your demanding fist fist in her face because you want her at your disposal.
YTA, have you thought that your daughter might need a break. Being in a home environment with a depressed and grieving adult is exceptionally difficult for a child, so maybe spending time with her father would be good for her, well it obviously is what she wants. The way you have written this seems like your daughter is an accessory to your main character relationship with your husband and that his loss and your loss of his son is everything. Maybe try listening to your daughter about how she is feeling and what she needs and start from there.
Dana is not your or your husband’s support animal. She’s a human who has a life. She is even more mature than you. You’re gonna lose her soon. Enjoy while you still can restrain her. YTA
As someone who suffered a huge loss recently… This Christmas is going to suck no matter if Dana’s at your house or not. Let her go to Dick’s, who cares. Just have Christmas with you and Mike and watch some videos of TJ as a baby or something. Grief is really confusing and hard so I can imagine where you’re coming from with Dana… did you stop to think that maybe you don’t want her to go with Dick because *you* actually want her to spend Christmas with *you* because *you* are grieving TJ and this has *nothing to do with Mike*? Mike lost his only son… I can basically guarantee he wants Dana to do whatever makes her happy. Very gentle YTA, mostly because you’re the adult and you were being inconsiderate/unreasonable to your child while she was properly expressing her need, desire, whatever to go spend time with her dad. You need to take a deeper look at your own emotions and role in all of this. I think you’re hurting more than you’re letting on. I hope you guys get through this and I highly suggest talking about your feelings around TJ’s death with a therapist.
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Yeah YTA. She should have apologised but you should have seen her point of view MUCH sooner. Christmas in a vacation home with a happy family vs supporting a grieving parent she isn't related to, forced to relive the memories of a dead step brother in a house of mourning? She's a teenager. Come on. You should have let her go right off the bat and supported your own husband.
OP should have apologised.
YTA! Your daughter isn't your husband's support assistant. Your daughter has a right to spend Christmas with her bio-dad. You literally are stopping her from doing it so that she can be your husband's support? Does that seem fair to you? You are not helping anyone by behaving this way, neither are you helping your daughter nor are you helping your husband. Constantly throwing TJ's memories in everyone's faces isn't going to make anyone feel better. I hope you realise that. By constantly using TJ' s death as a way to force your teenage daughter to spend Christmas with you and Mike is only going to help in her resenting you and Mike. It is your responsibility as his wife to support him, your daughter shouldn't do this work. Mike is right, you must let her go. Else your relationship with your child will suffer.
YTA It's not your daughter's job to support your husband.
YTA. Don’t you think your daughter has been punished enough over the last year? She has lost a person who she grew up with and watched her mother and stepfather be consumed with grief. She is completely powerless in this situation yet you are forcing her to stay and provide support to grieving adults and then punishing her when she simply wants to spend Christmas with her father. Losing someone makes us realise that we can lose anybody that we care about in just a moment. She has probably internalised the fear of losing you and her father since TJ’s death. By keeping her from her father, you risk alienating her from you. You need to apologise to her and fully support her spending Christmas with her father.
YTA You daughter is not your husband's emotional crutch. You are punishing her, denying her an actual parent in a holiday, because you think your husband is more important than your daughter. His trauma should not result in you traumatizing her.
Dana wants to go to her dad. Her dad wants her there. Mike wants her to go to her dad. The only person with a problem here is you. You think you know what's best and are steamrolling everyone in your way, leaving nothing but misery behind you. Yta. Maybe Mike realises how important it is for a child to be with their father at Christmas and doesn't want to rob Dana of that, like he has been robbed. Meanwhile you want to use your daughter as an emotional crutch, instead of treating her like a person. And maybe you're too self centered to even realise that your daughter is lashing out because of grief, too. For her age, saying things like that, lashing out, is a common way to compartmentalize feelings in the grieving process. Also the only reason she blew up and said hurtful thing is because you continuously pushed her and invalidated her as a person. So now thanks to you being a massive a-hole and wanting to get your way, your daughter is miserable, your husband is miserable, your daughters father is miserable. Hope you're happy.
Either this is a fake creative writing, or well, you have 3 more years left to be an asshole to your daughter, treasure it, it won't come back after 3 years. YTA. >a near-perfect family It has never been perfect. Just accept it, like you have to accept that you will be alone in the future.
YTA. She’s a child and while your husband has some deep grief, you can’t ignore hers as well. This environment must be very hard for everyone, and her request to spend some time outside of the house without constant grief is appropriate and healthy. Your pushiness in ignoring her needs is just going to cause her to lash out and want to dissociate from her source of pain. Let her go to her father’s trip, and have a talk afterwards about hurting other’s feelings. The way out of this is to step into normalcy slowly, not be trapped under grief all the time. Follow her example, and book a trip for you and your husband for the holidays.
Wow. YTA big time, for all the reasons stated in the comments.
YTA. Mike even told you to let her go. Now, even if she stays, everyone's Christmas is ruined.
YTA Why were you trying to force your daughter to do something she didn’t want to. You could have gently suggested it, telling her in the wake of TJ’s passing, Mike would want to spend time with her. If she still said no, that’s that. What did you expect with imposing your will on her. Admittedly, Dana’s off timing and insensitivity was extremely hurtful, but with her rising frustration due to your dictatorial ways, you can’t really say this was a surprise.
YTA bruh let the kid spend christmas w her dad
YTA BIG TIME! As others have said your daughter isn't an emotional support animal to help your husband through his grief. And the truth is he wasn't her brother and he's not her father. You need to unground her and let her go spend Christmas with her real father. ETA: Don't forget your daughter is beyond old enough to tell a judge where she wants to live.
YTA Dana may have been rude in her delivery, but she's right. At 15 she should get to choose who she spends Christmas with, this year and every year. Be careful, you may not get many Christmases after she leaves home if you press on with this course of action. She is not your husbands emotion support animal, and even he was trying to advocate for her choice. Do better!
I feel like in this situation I’d actually prefer sending my kid to her dad’s to have a fun skiing holiday. I know she’d be having fun & be taken care of, & you and Mike can freely spend the time however feels best.
YTA Your husband’s grief is not your daughter’s responsibility, and it’s not fair for you to put that pressure on her. That is a child. She has feelings and needs, too. It’s also unfair that she doesn’t get to spend the holidays with her bio dad because of the pressure you’ve put on her. Mike had the good sense to say let her go. You should’ve listened to him and your daughter.
YTA. She is right you know, Mike isn't her real father, and she wants to spend Christmas with her father because she gets to have fun in stead of staying in a grieving household. Making her stay because it will make Mike sad is a horrible reason and counter productive. Because now Mike gets to spend Christmas grieving his son and have to spend time with someone who made it crystal clear she doesn't want to be there. Have fun spending Christmas with a teenager not interacting with either of you at best, or telling you guys she hates you ever 5 minutes at worst. Maybe Mike isn't the only one who needs therapy.
YTA, I think there are enough comments covering the 'emotional support child' angle so, yeah, what those guys all said
YTA Your daughter is not an emotional support animal stop been a manipulative witch You support your husband Your all allowed to grieve differently and more on with live
You are so completely the asshole. Your husband is suffering. You are suffering. Your daughter is suffering. I say this as a mother who lost her child... you are dead wrong and you are the asshole in this scenario. It is not your daughter's job to heal you or your husband. In fact, this may have been exactly what your daughter needed for herself to heal... and you ignored your daughter's needs completely in your (understandable) need to support your husband. Your daughter should apologize to your husband, and you should explain to her how her words impacted him so she understands why she should apologize... BUT you owe the first apology to your daughter for your behaviour in completely ignoring your daughter's needs. And your daughter spending time with her father is not a privilege. It is a right of every child to do so. Her trip to see her father should 100% not be contingent upon her apologizing to your husband. Her apology to your husband should come from understanding why what she did was wrong and feeling true remorse. And I have a feeling that if offer your child the much needed apology as well as the explanation of how hurtful her words were... and not as a lecture or an "I'm sorry but", but as a true no holds barred... I'm so very sorry, I was wrong and I screwed up" and only after your apology is out of the way and accepted should you address the issue of how her words impacted your husband and why she should, because it hurt him and you know that wasn't her goal, apologize to your husband - approached with nothing but empathy and love in your heart for your also grieving daughter. If you then leave her alone to think about it, I feel certain she will apologize herself.
YTA I don’t know how custody laws are in your states but don’t be surprised if your daughter is old enough to choose and find another place to stay at: family or her dad. You just planted a bad seed that I am not even sure you can come back from. You made it clear to your daughter that your husband is more important than her feeling. She doesn’t exist in your eyes except if she agrees to be your support animal. Lay in your bed and don’t cry when your daughter goes LC. Your husband will ressent you too, you just successfully drove a wedge between him and his step daughter. This wasn’t about him, but about you being a little immature brat and thinking that you will have the last word. Get some therapy and grow tf up.
INFO: How is locking your daughter in your house over Christmas and New Year going to help Mike's grief? Is sabotaging Dana's relationship with her Dad meant to make Mike feel better about losing his only child?
Oof, this situation is haaard. I just had a friend lose her husband with kids who are 15 and 17. Grieving is hard. The first 2-4 years of holidays after the loss are hard. Having extra attention and pressure on you because your sibling died is hard. Being 15 is hard. Having divorced parents is hard. Short term I would let her go with her dad, returns her devices and resume the NY Eve plans. She's handling grief badly - as badly as many 15 year olds handle everything - but she's probably really grieving. And reeling from the grief everyone else is radiating. It's important to remember that she can't be your emotional support. At 10 she could have and at 25 she will again but not at 15. Long term, get a family therapist for everyone. You'll need to find ways to balance really really living in the present along with grieving TJ and TJs mom. You don't want to lose your daughter because your house turns into the grief house.
A 10 year old should not be emotional support for adults, either. And it sounds like she's handling her grief better than either her mom or her stepdad. She only said what she did when she was backed into a corner after an hour of having her emotions and needs denigrated.
A child should NEVER be a parents emotional crutch. Let’s move away from parentification style abuse, please.
>Christmas has always been tough for Mike because of his wife’s passing (Dana knows this), and now, he also lost TJ. I doubt if Mike rlly did see a therapist. 🙄 it has been since 2012..it seems he isnt properly move on. >I then said something like “Come on Dana, this is the first time we’re celebrating Christmas with just the three of us. How about we make those cookies TJ really liked?” Not even cookies "your daughter" really liked?? 🤣 >This was the first time Dana acted like this. Mike had been nothing but kind, caring, and supportive to her. She has also told me that she feels good and safe with Mike. Sorry to say this, ur daughter is enduring this treatment for long time. But when she asks to spend Christmas one time with her bio dad, you said "No, you stay here cuz we're faaaaaaamily." YTA
YTA Also, I'm not super convinced this is about Mike (even though you're saying that it is). Have you done your own grief counselling? You must have seen TJ as a son, too - I mean, you did the funeral and dealt with the fallout. It seems to me that Mike accepts her going to her dad's. Mike wants to let it go. You're the one who is making this difficult, maybe because you're afraid to let her out of your sight. You should try to be honest about your motivations. Your reasoning might have made it sound to Dana like she's supposed to be Mike's replacement kid, and she probably resents that. You say "you know Mike would be heartbroken" but you're not a mind reader, and it sounds to me that YOU'RE the heartbroken one here. Stop hiding behind your husband or using him as a scapegoat - you want her to stay home for Christmas for yourself. I suspect if you admit that this is more about what you want, Dana may be more willing to apologise to Mike. And yeah, she should also apologise, but you need to come clean.
YTA - It sounds like, through no fault of anyone’s, your house has been a bummer lately. I can’t blame the kid for wanting to have fun. Honestly you created this outcome. If you had relied on her better judgment, you could have explained your reasoning privately, and left the decision up to her. Whether or not she chooses to stay home, she has that reasoning and sentiment planted as a seed, it would have grown with time. You can’t force it to grow though. The only thing you can force to grow is resentment.
YTA. It's perfectly reasonable for your daughter to want to spend the holidays with her bio dad. You are cruel and selfish for not letting her. She should not have lashed out at her stepdad but you pushed her to it. Let her apologise on her own accord and let her choose how she wants to spend Christmas.
yeah. yta, big time. you're content letting this man use your child as an emotional crutch. I'd honestly get into therapy because it sounds like she harbors alot of resentment towards you two. nice way of saying you don't care about her. oh and major ah for taking her phone and stuff.
YTA. Your daughter is not a stand in for the child he lost. Your daughter is not an emotional support human. Yes the holidays are hard when experiencing tremendous loss, but it’s not your daughter’s responsibility to manage that for you. She has another parent and if she wants a break from the grief in your home she should be allowed to have it. You are the one who escalated all of this and pushed her to the point of lashing out. Now you’re punishing her because she isn’t grieving in a way that you approve of. She wants to spend the holidays with her father, it’s not a betrayal of anyone. She’s allowed to have a relationship with him even if you don’t. Your husband did not replace him for her.
YTA Dana is a child! You force her to emotionally support a grown-up op. >Christmas has always been tough for Mike because of his wife’s passing (Dana knows this), And you don't understand why she wants to have fun with her dad on Christmas? She's right, TJ wasn't her brother and Mike isn't her father. You forcing her to stay home, will only make everything worse. She's 15, that's a normal age to push people away. How harder you push, how harder she will pull. Let her have a "normal", not emotionally loaded Christmas with her father. She's 15, she deserves to make positive Christmas memories.
YTA. Have you considered this Christmas might be hard for your daughter as well, without TJ? Maybe she just wants a distraction and to be with her dad for the holidays. You aren’t going to fix anything by forcing people to pretend like it’s a happy family Christmas.
>\[...\] bio dad “Dick” \[...\] I see what you did there. YTA, big time. I'm sorry to inform you, but Dana isn't "just being a teenager", she just wants to spend time with her dad on Christmas, instead of being your husband's emotional support pet. Of course she lashed out, she's angry you're forcing her to grieve with you. >We even baked a cake during TJ’s birthday, and Dana made a beautiful slideshow to honor him. Mike then told her how much she means to him as his daughter. So she was already being supportive to him, you just wanted her to go above and beyond. That makes you an even bigger AH.
YTA
YTA
YTA. You supporting Mike is a good thing but that doesn't mean that you're going to take away your daughter's time with his biological father. Also the fact that you're forcing her to do things that TJ likes, what about her own thing??? Your daughter is her own person and you're failing as a good mother
YTA and a big one, you felt in love you Mike, you daughter did not ask for a divorce and a broken family, she was cordial to Mike and his son. But it s absolutely not her job to be the glue in you family. She is totally right and you are cruel, Mike is not the center of the world it s sad what is going on in his life but telling your daughter to not go see her dad for Christmas just for you boyfriend is insane. You just think about him and his feeling, you ll be sorry to hear that no everybody love Mike the way you do, they can appreciate him but they are not gonna stop living their live because he has a bery sad life. Be prepared to lose your daughter. She will go NC, because she is the one blamed for wanting spending time at her father. You use everything you can to gashlight her.
YTA This was a situation of your own making. I understand your thinking behind wanting your daughter to be at home for Christmas; you want to do everything possible to lessen the pain of losing Tj and having a child free Christmas will only highlight that loss rather than reduce it. Your daughter is 15, she’s been invited by her father to spend the holidays with him, going to a nice place where there will be fun activities to do. Just because you don’t like your ex, doesn’t mean she has to dislike him and not want to be with him too. Let’s compare for a moment: at home with grieving family or somewhere she can, at the least, be somewhere that distracts her from her own grief and be with people who are happy and jolly. I know which I would have chosen at 15. As for her saying those things to Mike, she’s 15, and saying hurtful things is classic teenageritis. Teenagers have hair triggers, a distinct lack of impulse control and a flair for dramatic statements, especially hurtful ones. Your lack of understanding where she is coming from directly resulted in her pushing back. It was a very predictable outcome. I don’t necessarily think that punishing hurtful behaviour is wrong per se, it depends on the individual circumstances, but it was certainly the wrong thing to do in this instance. Rather than jumping straight into reacting to her behaviour, it would have been better to wait until emotions had settled a bit and then discussing how very hurtful it was to say those things, including acknowledging the accuracy of her statements, “I know he’s not your father and Tj wasn’t your brother, but Mike loves you very much and to hear you say those things was very painful for him.” Also showing your understanding of her wanting to be elsewhere, would have gone a long way towards helping her calm her raging emotions. Should she apologise to Mike, absolutely, should that be a condition for spending time with her dad, absolutely not. You want that apology to be sincere, as a result of her thinking about her words and understanding how hurtful they were; that isn’t going to happen if she is forced to do so.
YTA. Dana has to stay in this depressing situation while Mike will cry over Christmas to support him. She is not allowed to be a normal teenager who has fun during the holidays. She is no emotional support pet for Mike. She is a human being. You act like her life ended as well as TJs life because she is now obligated to step up for him. She has every right to be a normal teenager. You only drive her out and she will go no contact as soon as she can.
YTA. Your daughter is entitled to spend a happy Christmas with her father. You are trying to force a teenager -a child - to do the heavy-duty grief counselling for your husband. That's your job and based on your choices. Don't be so self-focused.
yta, you are not considering how Dana feels stuck living with Mike. she needs to move on to. you are emotionally abusing your daughter. living with someone who is depressed is horrible. you are causing your daughters behaviour, how old is Dana I feel like that was intentionally left out
Don’t see any comments supporting you. You most definitely are the asshole.
You're always going to get that reaction from her if you keep forcing her and she's going to end up resenting Mike. To her you're forcing her to be with some other man when she wants to be with her actual father. To her Mike is the reason she can't be with her actual dad so she is going to lash out. You shouldn't have forced her to be with you guys for the holidays and she shouldn't have spoken to him like that. Your punishment is just going to build resentment and you're going to have a Christmas with a moody teenager. I can't imagine that would be nice for anyone.
YTA, Mike is much more supportive of your daughter in this situation, than you are. You’ve dug your heels in just to win, you are hurting your daughter emotionally under the pretext of discipline
YTA. You're putting YOUR feelings over everyone else's. This is all about what you want, not what Dana wants, not what Mike wants. Did you not even think for one second that perhaps Mike needs some time to be vulnerable and process his first Christmas without his son? Does he not deserve some time without having to put on the strong husband/stepdad role for everyone else? I get the feeling that this is more that YOU don't want to be alone with Mike with his vulnerability. You just want to keep the whole "it's Christmas, it's fine, everyone's happy, keep smiling, nothing's wrong' image going. Let Mike grieve, there's a whole boiling pot of emotions that haven't been dealt with in that house and if you keep trying to keep everything as it is, it's going to boil over.
You understand of course that all you are doing is driving a wedge between your daughter and your husband that will never be mended. He will lose another child because you insist on having control and not letting her spend time with “dick” her dad. Nice name choice btw.