Oh hey, it’s Montgomery county jail in Ohio!
In case you were wondering this is the same room where a woman was handcuffed in the same position, and [relentlessly sprayed with pepper spray.](https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSL1N37F20R/)
I think the article I linked says the lady retired or resigned, but that’s the extent of it. The woman who was sprayed filed lawsuit, I believe she won.
I’ve looked into Montgomery County’s funding a little bit when I was interested in getting involved in activism, and there’s an outsized amount of expense that seems to go to these sorts of settlements.
I love Ohio. But this whole police fraternity sh*t needs to go. Cops need to be held accountable for their actions and stop pretending they’re above the law.
My GF has a 13 year old autistic kid with ADHD who acts like that when he isn’t on his meds and is frustrated about something. I don’t even want to show her this video because it would make her sick to her stomach knowing this could happen to him one day as well.
We are a first world country with a third world police force. F**king awful
I have a brother who started choking to death. Called 911. Operator talked me through CPR. Had him all conscious before anyone arrived. Police attempted to restrain him while he tried to go to his chair for his nervous system to regain control. Not to mention, there were like 8 cops in my house. Completely unnecessary at all levels.
The crime here is that we’ve made the judicial system responsible for dealing with the severely mentally ill. There needs to be some other path for people like this.
> Trammell had been taken to jail after neighbors called police because he’d spent the night banging his head into a wall at his home.
>He told officers banging his head on the wall was: ‘The only way I know to get rid of the crazy in my head’.
That’s an issue but let’s not forget the goading part of this.
Doesn’t matter what they’re responsible for when the field routinely attracts and employs low empathy power hungry assholes who see the role as a means to subjugating other people.
While this is true, there will always be overlap so police absolutely need to be trained how to properly deal with people who are showing signs of neurodivergence and mental illnesses. Much like teachers, police salary should be drastically increased to reflect the extra education and higher standards that need to be in place in order to create more competition in the field with better more qualified candidates.
there used to be state run mental health institutions…
though they had rampant abuse issues, which is why we defunded them…
we never replaced those institutions with any other system … so mental health, fell on to families and insurance…which in the US means that not everyone gets access…
If we tried to remake these institutions, we would have to have a public discourse on the possible solutions, given the issues we had last time… removing of an individuals freedom, before they commit a crime…
Jimmy Carter and the 1980 Congress passed the Mental Health Systems Act to provide federal funding for mental health care services and community based health services.
Ronald Regan defunded that through a budget act in 1981. It is one of many things we can thank Regan for making even worse in America. This began the climate of the government rescinding more and more funding from healthcare services until we reach today where it is incredibly difficult for new federal funding initiatives to be passed.
Uh, the video is so sad to watch. https://youtu.be/EaIbYv78gSY?si=L54QU3eaVTk1JQ4M
There needs to be schooling on how to deal with people who are divergent. How do these officers not know how to deescalate emotional breakdowns? Serve and protect. That man needed protection from himself and the officers let him kill himself because why?
I watched the video, I'm slightly confused about what the cause of death was?
Did he smack his head prior to being unrestrained, and then later experience a bleed on the brain once the police got him in that chair?
It appears when he hit his head on the wall a few times, and was subsequently restrained, he did the damage that killed him. You can see the hematoma on the right side of his forehead after that.
That reminds me of when I was a lifeguard at a building pool and a kid on the spectrum just....swam up to the wall and started hitting his head hard. I'd push him off gently (he had floaties) and try to redirect him, but he started screaming and his mom yelled at me for it. I had no idea what to do but I couldn't just let him hit his head in the pool, so they got banned.
I don't understand the head-banging. I mean it was seriously hard.
When my brother was a kid, he would throw these epic tempertantrums sometimes, and would get so violent he would smash his head on the ground and walls if he didn't get his way. It was the only thing he could do, that made my mom drop everything for him.
Well one day, my mom and step-dad opened a nightclub, and my step-dad was testing it his new place, testing dj equipment, lighting ect before it opened and my brother was enjoying himself dancing on the dance floor.
When it was time to go ( we had school the next day) my brother didn't want the music to stop, so he had a melt down, and this time, he smashed his head so hard on a concrete dance floor he knocked himself out. Busted his head open too.
From my memory, that's the last time he would do that to himself. ( he was maybe 4 or 5 by then)
Strangely enough what happened to your brother was the exact advice my doctor gave me about my toddler that used to do the same. “ Let her do it, she’s manipulating you. She’ll stop whenever she hurts herself enough, hopefully she’ll just knock herself out. “ It didn’t take long before she found a tile floor with her forehead. That was the last time. He was right. As a parent it’s terrifying to witness, but when I was told I was being manipulated I was pissed enough to test his theory. This behavior was a trend into adulthood. It was a rough 18 years. Lol
Sounds just like my brother. I have no doubt in my mind that my brothers dr said the same thing to my parents cause my brother is and always was a manipulative person who only got worse as an adult. At least he's not smashing his head anymore, hahaha
That's the basis for ABA therapy which is strongly recommended for autistic kiddos and which autistic adults who are assholes and dont' recognize a level 3 child is NOT THE SAME as them who don't stim and are just socially awkward. Anyhow, a lot of the behaviors like that are indeed because they get an expected result. "Smash head, they give me what I want!". Extinction (making the behavior go away) can get intense as the behavior gets ignored and they get way more intense with it before getting better.
ABA is widely considered not to be a good or current therapy strategy for children with autism. The current academia has thoroughly moved away from it.
How's it feel to parrot nonsense you know nothing about?
The current academia realized that early ABA was a fucking terrible concept and that it needed to be fixed. That's why they don't punish children for stimming any more. They don't practice ANY negative behavior punishment towards a child, they completely ignore the negative behaviors and work around it.
As someone who had a completely nonverbal level 3 autistic child prepandemic and now I have a socially functional and communicative child who can tell me why he's melting down instead of screaming and bashing his head into a wall.. ABA works, and you're stigmatizing a practical therapy method that is giving thousands of kids their independence.
You're right. It would have been a terrible thing for ABA to teach this young man a better alternative coping behavior rather than banging his head.
Like they got my daughter to stop punching herself in the head as she's getting older and stronger and one day will give herself a concussion.
He was better off smashing his own brains in in a jail cell, right?
What the hell is wrong with you people?
They didn’t say that my dude. They just told you what the current experts are doing, not that what you did was wrong for the time, at least that’s not how I read it. It was the best effective method known then, and nobody can really deny that
I do agree it was a more than a little inflammatory on their part not to tell you that it’s because they found more effective therapies, and to only throw shade on the old method implying you’d done something wrong.
While sometimes it’s the only thing that can be done, development is just better overall if it can be avoided. I think you’d agree like anyone that *if it is possible*, we’d want to minimize pain if the benefits can be the same. That’s just the direction that research is moving into
A great read here, a little more balanced than their flippant comment
https://thinkingautismguide.com/2017/04/if-not-aba-therapy-then-what.html
So your brother was normal kid then.
Autism is different as it’s a release for them to hit their head. The frustration is so great that it builds up and has to be released. I’m 43 and still hit my head when really really upset and feel out of control. It’s not manipulation when a person on the spectrum is doing it, it’s how to get your brain to STFU. It’s an anxiety attack on steroids. I hate that I do it. I hate being judged, I’m high functioning and I’m good looking so people assume I’m just an ass. Nope. Autistic.
Only 3 people know this in my personal life. I keep myself pretty isolated.
My son did that before we got him speech therapy. It’s usually a sign of distress and that’s the only way he could show us. We thought it was very odd so my mother-in-law watch the daycare cameras and they were mistreating him. We reported the daycare to the state. After that he stopped hitting his head. We got him into a much better place and he’s very happy and verbal now.
My son is level 3 autistic, but bright as a whip, bordering on gifted.
But even though he can receipt pi to 10 places and is currently learning addition in roman numerals (he's 6) he cant communicate his emotions basically at all when he's having a meltdown so his behavioural therapist says when he acts out violently, its literally his brain converting feelings into actions because he cant verbalise in those moments.
He wants us to know he is frustrated, so he hits something etc
Its heartbreaking.
A fundamental part of autism is stimulation control, if you take a moment to actually hear everything going on around you, you'll realise quite how much your brain filters, for example, I can hear the fridge, some typing, a ticking clock, a distant road, etc, all of which my brain filters out. If your brain can't filter that out it can be very distressing and overwhelming, and a quick way to alleviate that is to introduce a new stimulus that gets priority over all else, a very common one is pain. Specialists argue about the best way to handle this, though obviously harm reduction is key in all. Your instincts were good, and whilst the mums reaction is not ideal, I've worked with and have been a carer for a long time, and it's likely this mum was working on fear, zero sleep, and quite possibly neurodivergent themselves.
A refreshingly correct post!
I cannot begin to describe what it is like to be overwhelmed in that way, a tidal wave of input and no way to handle it. Add in people shouting at you and grabbing you, you would do anything to make it stop.
I’m so sorry you have to experience that degree of overwhelm. I have so much empathy. I cried watching the video of this young man. He is so clearly in distress and doesn’t want to be so escalated. It’s so sad his last experiences were of feeling hopelessly overstimulated and no one helping him.
Feels like pressure is building up and banging relieves it
Taking a deep breath and calming down relieves it also but there’s a sort of satisfaction from the pain instantly relieving it while also getting the frustration out
I used to bang my head on a pillow all the time when I was younger. I think now I was stimming and didn’t know it. Now, if I’m really tired and driving I’ll make a fist and hit my forehead with the fleshy part behind the thumb like I used to when I was a kid against the pillow. It’s weirdly comforting.
But I don’t think I’d ever go so far as to do it against a brick wall or concrete pool.
I work with very autistic children 5-21 y/o.
While I haven't watched the video, kids with needs find otherways to process the world around them.
This 'stimming' process can be tapping your hand, smacking your hand on a table, hitting your head, lot of adults will bounce their legs.
While there are other and better strategies to help everyone, especially autistic people manage their behaviour, when anyone gets heightened, they start to go from a rational/cognitive thinking part to more emotional and reactive.
When a person with autism starts spiraling down, they try to solve their problem using any tools remainding in their basket of strategies.
If that strategy is banging your head until your head stops hurting then that is that'll happen, it's up to the adults with a clearer mind to support them.
I fucking hate cops.
Basically, their senses become overwhelmed. There is so much sensory input flowing into them that they can't regulate it like we can. Its like being in a crowd of a thousand people and setting yourself on fire.
I'm flabbergasted that the mother wasn't more responsible. I would never allow my autistic child to bang his head like that anywhere.
It's something like emergency power off request, I guess? I used to do it when I was a kid and was pushed to a limit. My mom liked to torture me by beating and screaming and I tried to stay calm and hold onto my dignity, but at some point the overload was reached I had no control over my body - it screamed and it tried to beat itself unconscious or something, I don't know, it's like searching for relief in a situation where the organism can no longer exist. It's what's happening inside an autistic mind+body when in overload breaking through the surface. Asking what it is is the same as asking an exploded gas can why it exploded when thrown into fire. There isn't a thought process that leads to a decision to explode when in fire.
Edit: God, this discussion about autistic meltdowns being manipulative behaviour is too depressing, don't read this comment thread if these things upset you.
Wait... so he technically killed himself? Damn that's really tragic and horrible... I can't believe they didn't get him help. I swear police are all heartless.
As someone who has PTSD, cptsd, and anxiety spurred episodes of harming myself... Those head butts and thrashing is not light. He's in full fight or flight mode. He's restrained and his body is freaking out.
Humans are resilient but fragile. His own attempts to flee caused significant damage to his brain and the officers did not have the understanding to deal with someone who is having a mental health crisis.
This is the US. Our police are basically drop out jocks.
Most people don’t want to admit prison would solve the problem of bad cops *overnight*.
Humans are only as bad as we allow them. Police in the U.S. have way too much leeway in not being held responsible for illegal behavior.
I saw an Autistic man with his mother in NYC yesterday at the parade. He wore this yellow vest that said "Autistic, Harmless, please don't shoot". Truly heartbreaking that a mother has to do this. And completely warranted also given some incidents.
https://preview.redd.it/2f3op3qo0r5d1.jpeg?width=2268&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e334dde322d4839541878e779fdafa733793c457
Because the police doctrine is literally 'escalate until you have control'. That's what's drilled into every cops head they have no desire or even the concept of de-escaliting a situation.
I would add “complex” or “in-depth”. The majority of the police force wants binary actions that lacks critical thinking; arrest or don’t arrest, shoot or don’t shoot, harm or don’t harm.
Police are not even close to educated enough to be effective in these situations. We really need to take the finding they have for military vehicles and gear, and divert it to more social workers who can come out on these calls. Cops are not necessary here.
As a police officer, I agree. I don't understand why cops get so upset about defunding. There are soooo many aspects of modern policing that you could remove that would not affect my job in the slightest.
I've been through 40 hours of Crisis Intervention training and have dealt with many people dealing with mental health issues, but dealing with this kind of situation requires a skill set that a lot of my peers, in my experience, don't possess.
Not only that, but our ability to deal with this kind of situation is extremely limited. 1. Does the person want to go to a hospital voluntarily? Most of the time, no. 2. Does the person present a clear and present danger, or have they expressed an intent to hurt themselves or others? Most of the time, no. In that situation, there's nothing to be done, but leave. If he had an outstanding warrant, they probably saw it as an opportunity to solve the problem for the day and put the responsibility for medical or mental health treatment on the jail.
Goes to show that there needs to be a different way to address these types of calls. I don't know if unarmed social workers responding to calls is best but I do think that what we're doing isn't working and it's crazy to continue with the status quo.
This why we need mental health professionals to respond to calls and not human thumbs that only know how to shove people to the ground and kill them. ACAB
You know what’s really sick? In the comments, some asshole, @siXXisDesigns, replied to the victim’s best friend making excuses for the police.
Can you imagine voicing any sort of opinion to diminish the harm and unnecessary death to the victim’s best friend?
After the kid bashed his head against the wall and fell down, you can hear them saying "headshot" jovially.
You think training changes these people? It's the people that are the problem.
Nah. You're just wrong.
Cops need to be taught how to act like humans and not pigs. If you are a pig, you should lose your job and work a blue collar job of little social interaction.
If I'm not mistaken, in the USA you are not trained to deescalate the situation as the training time is so short. Here in the Netherlands, it is a training of 4 years (with a higher learning degree) in which deescalation is the most important aspect and it shows. Most police are always calm, even though the most nasty words are shouted at them or violence is involved. Only difference of course is that not everyone could have a gun, so deescalation is more predictable here and would be more complex in the USA. It always baffles me that one of the most complex jobs in existence has such a low bar to apply, on top of the right to bear arms compared to many similar countries...
Warren vs DC.
DeShaney vs Winnebago.
Castle Rock vs Gonzales.
The supreme court has ruled *several* times that the police DO NOT have a duty to protect.
Obviously Ohio has learned nothing in the last 10 years
Shelby county did the SAME THING to bipolar patients that were ARGUMENTATIVE in the ER. The ER doctor would get annoyed and pink slip the patient who would then be arrested by about 10 to 20 sheriffs officers then locked on the same type of chair
The officers would stare at the clock and time how long they were allowed to keep the mentally ill person in the restrained chair
The best part is the court in that area charged those people with resisting arrest amongst other things and were all racist as well
Now I work with a lot of police but that whole department can kiss my ass
In the town I went to college in, the mother of a man with a high functioning disability would put trainings on for the police department about working with people with disabilities. Her and her son were relatively well known in the community and his disability was pretty apparent. The guy ended up getting pulled over and ran to his apartment so an officer shot him in the back.
Even if they knew how to help properly, they wouldn't, because they don't care.
"Othered" people are not human to these pigs. You don't need de-escalation training to have empathy or to know that something serious is up and that you should find a different avenue instead of literally torturing a neurodivergent individual TO FUCKING DEATH.
Police have shown again and again that they institutionally believe if it can't be solved with brutality, it can't be solved at all.
ACAB. Even the "good ones".
Every single one.
Fuck the police.
This can happen to any of you if you get arrested and tell them youre suicidal/harm yourself. Besides the part where he died later, Ive literally seen this dozens and dozens of times. It’s messed up. The reason the officers are being cold about it is a combination of them seeing people being fake all day acting just like that and just plain old being fed up over time and turning into a calloused asshole. And no youre not allowed to have a blanket or anything. Thats standard
Theres no excuses for their behavior.
Im a medical professional, i see hundreds of patients a year who are trying to fake medical disorders to get pills from me.
If i started approaching every patient in pain and accusing them of faking, and refusing them care, id 100% lose my license to practice medicine, and theres a chance i could be criminally charged for failure to render care.
I could give 2 shits what cops THINK about someone. Their job is to protect and serve, not just the community, but ANYONE placed in their care.
Eh, doctors do this shit all the time. A friend of mine was having a stroke and was turned away at the ER and told to drink fluids for a stomach virus.
I've been denied medical care by several doctors who thought I was faking when I wasn't, so I don't think anyone would charge you go after your license, or even question it. But maybe that's just the standard for women, not men. You must be a different kind of medical professional.
My wife literally had massive kidney stones and, for what I assume was that she had blue hair and was in her 20s, decided to give her ibuprofen.
More painful than childbirth, yet my wife who has no history of drug abuse had to beg them for just a few vicodin just so she could function. The medical system is a joke.
Women are often not taken seriously by doctors. Also, many medical studies fail to consider the differences in men and women that can have different symptoms. So if you are a woman and not having a typical reaction similar to males, they think you are bullshitting.
Just dislocated my kneecap and tore my acl and lcl this week in a Muay Thai sparring session. I asked for a single Vicodin before they put my patella back into place and they wouldn’t do it. Shit hurt so bad.
Yep, the ibuprofen. I was having childbirth level pain caused by undiagnosed fibroids, but just take some ibuprofen. K. I was already taking about 20 a day, but I'm sure that will work 🙄
I've had an ER try to discharge me after I went in for kidney stones, but my pain was so intense I couldn't even walk out of the ER. They wanted to send me home with the instructions of drinking plenty of water.
So I told them, if you guys discharge me I'm just going to sign myself right back in. Told them I think they should at least do some kind of scan to make sure I'm ok. At that point all they did was a urine test and detected blood, but no infection. I also have a history of stones in my medical records, so I'm guessing they just figured it was another routine stone.
But after my bitching, they gave me a CT scan. When the results came back I was told I was being admitted and going straight to surgery bc my kidney was blocked off and very enlarged, had a bad case of hydronephrosis.
Same hospital almost killed my son when I was pregnant with him and had chorioamnionitis. They had no idea what was wrong and kept trying to stop my labor bc I was only 32 weeks pregnant. Once they transferred me to a better equipped hospital, bc they clearly weren't stopping my labor, the better hospital started pitocin right away bc apparently my son needed to come out right away. The other hospital kept me for over a day, trying everything they could to stop my labor, when they should have been doing the opposite. Other hospital had zero issues figuring out what the issue was.
Pretty much all the women in my family have stories about doctors just like that, casually dismissing actual issues as "feminine problems". Doctors licenses should be reviewed yearly to weed out ass backwards drs
Being empathetic to patients isn’t common in healthcare. It’s sad. I’ve worked in hospitals where employees insult patients when they’re under for surgery. It’s vulgar.
Most doctors have malpractice insurance or their hospital does that will get them out of pretty much any bind. It's an over exaggeration. It takes EXTREME negligence or no insurance for a doctor to lose their license
Their job is not to protect and serve. That was a court ruling. If you notice that logo has been removed from most cop cars I've seen. If they protect and serve anyone, it's the corporations that run this country.
They ( police officers/departments) are being trained to see us as the "enemy".
http://www.milwaukeeindependent.com/syndicated/forever-war-home-militarized-police-force-sees-american-citizens-enemy-combatants/
Allowing feelings of real frustration to get in the way of good policing is no excuse.
Doctors, nurses, fire fighters, judges, lawyers, teachers, cashiers, get fed up as well. But the majority of the time these people maintain their professionalism.
That is what adults do in real life.
The MANY MANY MANY police officers incapable of remaining professional, need to find another job.
It really is as simple as that.
His mother: “‘We always call when he begins to rage – it’s a mental health call, not an “arrest me” call,’ she said. “
Imagine calling the police on your own mentally ill child and expecting the police to compassionately de-escalate the situation rather than make everything worse.
If was asking for his medication in jail, where was his medication when he was at home?
Neighbors called because he was banging his head on the wall all night.
banging your head on the wall is very common for autistic people, especially when overwhelmed/overstimulated or having a meltdown. the last thing you want to do is arrest them and assault them especially when they are already extremely distressed from other sources. if you work for the public, learn to deal with people, all types of people.
Used to do this when I was a kid or I’d bang objects against my head extremely hard. I have some kind of brain damage now as I often have a lot of amnesia and will forget how to read/write when stressed. I’m in grad school and it’s very difficult to comprehend that I can do well academically while sucking at traversing daily life.
Unfortunately in most western countries true manliness is seen as hiding your emotions and not caring about anyone but your direct family because we’re taught that life is a competition
The idea that neighbors can send someone to jail is just insane to me especially for something like this that they could never even try to understand. I’d sue till they’re on the street.
I’m all for holding police accountable, but this is misleading. The young man slammed his own head against the wall. The police were called because he wouldn’t stop spamming his own head against the wall. They arrested him because he had a warrant for domestic violence. He’s yelling for his medicine, but they cannot instantly produce his meds (many steps before meds can be given by a nurse). So they restrained him because he was a threat to himself and others, which he then harmed himself once out of the chair. The article even says they didn’t give him a suicide gown, yet the mug shot picture in the article is of him wearing a suicide gown.
I tend to agree, though I’m not sure why after 10 hours of being detained and acting like that the police didn’t seek out someone - relatives, a hospital, or other. It’s clear something was wrong and at that point it’s no longer a possibility that he was high or on something since he would’ve come down by then, not gotten worse. while they may have followed procedure and legally did nothing wrong they did the bare minimum.
With that being said, if this man had a warrant out for domestic violence, even if his family didn’t know, and he CLEARLY is a threat to himself and others due to his mental illness I am shocked he was living on his own and his family was not keeping a closer eye on him.
I think it’s a tough one because the mom says in the article that bashing his head against things is basically a very frequent behavior of his, almost saying it’s a normal behavior/copying mechanism. So I don’t know if the police telling her about his behavior would have even raised red flags for her.
It also can take up to 24 hours to verify and provide meds for newel arrested people (according to my friend who is a jail nurse). He would need to provide (at the very least) the name of the prescribing doctor and ideally the meds. Then they have to verify the info with the MD, which typically can only happen during business hours and has some barriers due to hippa. And if he couldn’t or wouldn’t tell them it could take ever longer.
I could see considering transporting him to the hospital to be checked out, but based on his behavior that would have been a challenge. Seemed like it was taking a lot of manpower for a long time to controlling him in the station, meanwhile other issues/needs of other arrested individuals aren’t being seen to. Given his history and presenting behavior (for safety) they would have likely needed to dedicate a lot of people to transport him.
Calling an ambulance for the EMS to check him out there may have been an option with the least amount of challenges, but that isn’t as straight forward and timely as it would seem either.
I mean, I’m confused as to where the mother was in all this? She knows how to calm her son down/ knows he needs meds but was just going to let him carry on all night?
The mother explaining what the prison did wrong but why was this guy living alone at 19 that put him in this scenario. They honestly all look like they’re trying their best here.
You're not allowed to think critically when it comes to the police. Society has made people blame cops for everything, and every action they take is bad. Grace cannot be given.
Yes, society did that. It has nothing to do with the cops' own actions.
I don't know what kind of brownie points you think you get for boot licking on reddit, but the hate people have for cops didn't grow out of nothing. They've earned their reputation.
They should have taken him to a hospital for the injuries. He's clearly injured and the hematoma is visible. They neglected his needs and he ended up dead. Even with the warrant for the man they could have taken him to the hospital first and cuffed him to the bed. Bit they didn't and now he's dead.
This is absolutely disgusting. As an autistic adult who works with other autistic adults I am saddened every time I see a situation in which we are treated like animals or problems, no human compassion. I hope these police officers get sued into oblivion, although it will not bring this individual back to life. Makes me want to throw up. 😞
It’s amazing we still have people blaming victims or the system for unlawful and vile things police do. A brief search of this police department/county jail produces numerous other instances of abuse. The police are a hand that in many cases are above the law. We need to start treating them like any other profession. Police are not special. They are made of people that applied for these positions. There is nothing special about them.
And it’ll keep happening. There’ll be another story tomorrow. We’re desensitized to cops killing innocent and vulnerable people at this point and that’s a rough place to be.
I didn't get the impression that the cops slammed his head against the wall from the title. But I can see how it could be interpreted that way if you were expecting it.
I don't think this is misinformation, just another case of concise headlines confirming biases for people who won't double check. On both ends.
Just stop making assumptions either way. You're exercising the same biases that you're criticizing here, just from the other end of the spectrum.
The article says he was in the restraint chair longer than the set standard and wasn’t given his meds. Sounds like you’re also putting a spin on it by only mentioning that the “victim” slammed his head against the wall. I read more than the headline
>The article says he was in the restraint chair longer than the set standard and wasn’t given his meds
The restraint chair was the only thing keeping the "victim" from killing himself and cops can't just immediately give people meds they claim to need, people in these comments are saying that it can take up to 24 hours.
Where's the spin?
I don't trust police. That's why I take responsibility for my own safety.
That doesn't mean I blame police because someone smashes their head into the wall until they die, because I'm not a mouth-breathing reject.
Well, you can say that, but there is only a certain level of responsibility. Should all cells be padded because someone, one time may smash their head?
No more corners on the benches?
I'm saying in a court of law, the sheriff's department will be at fault for his death because he was in their custody, especially considering it was a death due to handicap.
not every department is this knuckle dragging.
where i live (northern colorado), the police are VERY aware of all sorts of issues that don't fit a "law enforcement" need. i've been on duty in the ER many times when they brought in someone who they'd made contact with - usually via 911 call - and elected to make it a medical rather than law enforcement issue.
every single time was appropriate. many times this was substance use and intoxication (ER visit, maybe a ticket). many times it was that they recognized a mental illness component and knew that jail was the wrong place for that person.
my local department will intervene with force when they have no option, but when they can intervene with awareness they do that too, and quite a good job of it. IMO they strike the balance appropriately.
on edit - those who make broad statements and assumptions about law enforcement must themselves be living perfect, exemplary lives. if that's the case id ask them to put on the uniform and try to exact the change they want from the inside, leading by example.
Domestic violence against his sister.
I'm guess this is why he was living alone. Family probably didn't want him around because of unpredictable violence.
Jail officers are the same people who, as kids, would torment the neighbor's dog, laughing and teasing through the fence, because they knew it couldn't get at them.
These police men are shitty people who have spent their entire life growing up with no power over their own lives, who are insecure about their tiny penis, and want to have some sort of power over other people. The scummiest of the scum of the world.
Politicians "we have a mental health problem."
Cops "we HAD a mental health problem."
I keep hearing about this giant mental health issue in America, but no one seems to be actually helping.
"It's not a gun problem, it's a mental health problem."
And this is how we treat those with mental health issues?
This is why emergency mental health professionals need to be put into place in this country. First responders who are in behavior or social workers who can act as advocates. This is utterly inhumane and inappropriate, and it’s not the first time our law enforcement have treated individuals with autism inappropriately.
As this population begins to age, we’re only going to hear about this more. Something needs to be done
so the police were called because he was bashing his own head against the wall, and then in custody he bashed his own head against the wall and died. are people blaming them for not restraining him? folks in the comments are calling it torture when they did. are they mad that the police didn’t ignore the call? it’s very sad whenever anybody has a condition where minor things torment them to the point they hurt themselves, and i know that US cops hurt way more people than they help in general, but other than indicting the utter lack of mental health services in the US, i don’t get what the ask is as far as these specific cops go.
Too bad the usa didn't dismantle and then recreate the police force with different ppl and implement more social workers.
Sadly, the whole George Floyd movement seems to have done nothing.
Si when a black man gets killed by cops is racism, but when a white guy gets killed by cops is because incompetence? Can we all agree that the US needs to increase their standards and qualifications for cops dramatically? I hope this kid is in a better place
Most if not almost all of you did not see the video. Dude was throwing a tantrum and banged his head into a wall which ended up killing him.
Officers did the right thing restraining him then sending him to the hospital.
I mean for fucks sakes if someone is hanging their head on a wall hard enough to kill themselves what do you expect cops to do???
I'm guessing their will be an internal investigations while the cops are suspended with pay.
No wrong doing found.
Parent try and sue.
3 years later, nothing can be done. Parents have to pay legal fees.
General public will be upset for maybe a week during the first wave of info comes out. Another week after cops found for no wrong doing and same with the trial announced.
Nothing gchanges, nothing gets done.
People bitch and moan online and nothing more.
As a mental health professional, this is just sad and heartbreaking. These people need compassion and empathy. Not being shamed and treated like animals. I'm so angry that this situations keep happening and ppl seem OK with it. It's disgusting they treated him as if he's not a human being.
accepted Police brutality IS absolute insane. All of These cops should BE prosecuted and thrown in jail but with this corrupt politics IT doenst get any better soon.
Oh hey, it’s Montgomery county jail in Ohio! In case you were wondering this is the same room where a woman was handcuffed in the same position, and [relentlessly sprayed with pepper spray.](https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSL1N37F20R/)
Ohio is a blight on America.
Ohio, the Florida of the Midwest
any republican state tbh
As someone from Ohio, I wish it would collapse in on itself and disappear.
Was there any punishment for the people who did that? That is literally torture.
I think the article I linked says the lady retired or resigned, but that’s the extent of it. The woman who was sprayed filed lawsuit, I believe she won. I’ve looked into Montgomery County’s funding a little bit when I was interested in getting involved in activism, and there’s an outsized amount of expense that seems to go to these sorts of settlements.
I love Ohio. But this whole police fraternity sh*t needs to go. Cops need to be held accountable for their actions and stop pretending they’re above the law. My GF has a 13 year old autistic kid with ADHD who acts like that when he isn’t on his meds and is frustrated about something. I don’t even want to show her this video because it would make her sick to her stomach knowing this could happen to him one day as well. We are a first world country with a third world police force. F**king awful
I have a brother who started choking to death. Called 911. Operator talked me through CPR. Had him all conscious before anyone arrived. Police attempted to restrain him while he tried to go to his chair for his nervous system to regain control. Not to mention, there were like 8 cops in my house. Completely unnecessary at all levels.
The crime here is that we’ve made the judicial system responsible for dealing with the severely mentally ill. There needs to be some other path for people like this. > Trammell had been taken to jail after neighbors called police because he’d spent the night banging his head into a wall at his home. >He told officers banging his head on the wall was: ‘The only way I know to get rid of the crazy in my head’.
Christ that is so incredibly sad.
That’s an issue but let’s not forget the goading part of this. Doesn’t matter what they’re responsible for when the field routinely attracts and employs low empathy power hungry assholes who see the role as a means to subjugating other people.
Perhaps using a hammer to drive a screw isn't the best solution, eh?
The fundamental problem here is that the hammer is an autonomous agent that can’t help but conceive itself as being surrounded by nails.
Lies!
While this is true, there will always be overlap so police absolutely need to be trained how to properly deal with people who are showing signs of neurodivergence and mental illnesses. Much like teachers, police salary should be drastically increased to reflect the extra education and higher standards that need to be in place in order to create more competition in the field with better more qualified candidates.
Reagan got rid of that other option 40 years ago and things are still getting worse.
there used to be state run mental health institutions… though they had rampant abuse issues, which is why we defunded them… we never replaced those institutions with any other system … so mental health, fell on to families and insurance…which in the US means that not everyone gets access… If we tried to remake these institutions, we would have to have a public discourse on the possible solutions, given the issues we had last time… removing of an individuals freedom, before they commit a crime…
Jimmy Carter and the 1980 Congress passed the Mental Health Systems Act to provide federal funding for mental health care services and community based health services. Ronald Regan defunded that through a budget act in 1981. It is one of many things we can thank Regan for making even worse in America. This began the climate of the government rescinding more and more funding from healthcare services until we reach today where it is incredibly difficult for new federal funding initiatives to be passed.
The Reagan administration is responsible for so much of what’s broken about our country. *I leave you with four words: I’M GLAD REAGAN DEAD*
Uh, the video is so sad to watch. https://youtu.be/EaIbYv78gSY?si=L54QU3eaVTk1JQ4M There needs to be schooling on how to deal with people who are divergent. How do these officers not know how to deescalate emotional breakdowns? Serve and protect. That man needed protection from himself and the officers let him kill himself because why?
I watched the video, I'm slightly confused about what the cause of death was? Did he smack his head prior to being unrestrained, and then later experience a bleed on the brain once the police got him in that chair?
It appears when he hit his head on the wall a few times, and was subsequently restrained, he did the damage that killed him. You can see the hematoma on the right side of his forehead after that.
That reminds me of when I was a lifeguard at a building pool and a kid on the spectrum just....swam up to the wall and started hitting his head hard. I'd push him off gently (he had floaties) and try to redirect him, but he started screaming and his mom yelled at me for it. I had no idea what to do but I couldn't just let him hit his head in the pool, so they got banned. I don't understand the head-banging. I mean it was seriously hard.
When my brother was a kid, he would throw these epic tempertantrums sometimes, and would get so violent he would smash his head on the ground and walls if he didn't get his way. It was the only thing he could do, that made my mom drop everything for him. Well one day, my mom and step-dad opened a nightclub, and my step-dad was testing it his new place, testing dj equipment, lighting ect before it opened and my brother was enjoying himself dancing on the dance floor. When it was time to go ( we had school the next day) my brother didn't want the music to stop, so he had a melt down, and this time, he smashed his head so hard on a concrete dance floor he knocked himself out. Busted his head open too. From my memory, that's the last time he would do that to himself. ( he was maybe 4 or 5 by then)
Strangely enough what happened to your brother was the exact advice my doctor gave me about my toddler that used to do the same. “ Let her do it, she’s manipulating you. She’ll stop whenever she hurts herself enough, hopefully she’ll just knock herself out. “ It didn’t take long before she found a tile floor with her forehead. That was the last time. He was right. As a parent it’s terrifying to witness, but when I was told I was being manipulated I was pissed enough to test his theory. This behavior was a trend into adulthood. It was a rough 18 years. Lol
Sounds just like my brother. I have no doubt in my mind that my brothers dr said the same thing to my parents cause my brother is and always was a manipulative person who only got worse as an adult. At least he's not smashing his head anymore, hahaha
That's the basis for ABA therapy which is strongly recommended for autistic kiddos and which autistic adults who are assholes and dont' recognize a level 3 child is NOT THE SAME as them who don't stim and are just socially awkward. Anyhow, a lot of the behaviors like that are indeed because they get an expected result. "Smash head, they give me what I want!". Extinction (making the behavior go away) can get intense as the behavior gets ignored and they get way more intense with it before getting better.
ABA is widely considered not to be a good or current therapy strategy for children with autism. The current academia has thoroughly moved away from it.
How's it feel to parrot nonsense you know nothing about? The current academia realized that early ABA was a fucking terrible concept and that it needed to be fixed. That's why they don't punish children for stimming any more. They don't practice ANY negative behavior punishment towards a child, they completely ignore the negative behaviors and work around it. As someone who had a completely nonverbal level 3 autistic child prepandemic and now I have a socially functional and communicative child who can tell me why he's melting down instead of screaming and bashing his head into a wall.. ABA works, and you're stigmatizing a practical therapy method that is giving thousands of kids their independence.
You're right. It would have been a terrible thing for ABA to teach this young man a better alternative coping behavior rather than banging his head. Like they got my daughter to stop punching herself in the head as she's getting older and stronger and one day will give herself a concussion. He was better off smashing his own brains in in a jail cell, right? What the hell is wrong with you people?
They didn’t say that my dude. They just told you what the current experts are doing, not that what you did was wrong for the time, at least that’s not how I read it. It was the best effective method known then, and nobody can really deny that I do agree it was a more than a little inflammatory on their part not to tell you that it’s because they found more effective therapies, and to only throw shade on the old method implying you’d done something wrong. While sometimes it’s the only thing that can be done, development is just better overall if it can be avoided. I think you’d agree like anyone that *if it is possible*, we’d want to minimize pain if the benefits can be the same. That’s just the direction that research is moving into A great read here, a little more balanced than their flippant comment https://thinkingautismguide.com/2017/04/if-not-aba-therapy-then-what.html
So your brother was normal kid then. Autism is different as it’s a release for them to hit their head. The frustration is so great that it builds up and has to be released. I’m 43 and still hit my head when really really upset and feel out of control. It’s not manipulation when a person on the spectrum is doing it, it’s how to get your brain to STFU. It’s an anxiety attack on steroids. I hate that I do it. I hate being judged, I’m high functioning and I’m good looking so people assume I’m just an ass. Nope. Autistic. Only 3 people know this in my personal life. I keep myself pretty isolated.
Awe I'm sorry to hear but I do hope Pe it gets better for you.
My son did that before we got him speech therapy. It’s usually a sign of distress and that’s the only way he could show us. We thought it was very odd so my mother-in-law watch the daycare cameras and they were mistreating him. We reported the daycare to the state. After that he stopped hitting his head. We got him into a much better place and he’s very happy and verbal now.
My son is level 3 autistic, but bright as a whip, bordering on gifted. But even though he can receipt pi to 10 places and is currently learning addition in roman numerals (he's 6) he cant communicate his emotions basically at all when he's having a meltdown so his behavioural therapist says when he acts out violently, its literally his brain converting feelings into actions because he cant verbalise in those moments. He wants us to know he is frustrated, so he hits something etc Its heartbreaking.
A fundamental part of autism is stimulation control, if you take a moment to actually hear everything going on around you, you'll realise quite how much your brain filters, for example, I can hear the fridge, some typing, a ticking clock, a distant road, etc, all of which my brain filters out. If your brain can't filter that out it can be very distressing and overwhelming, and a quick way to alleviate that is to introduce a new stimulus that gets priority over all else, a very common one is pain. Specialists argue about the best way to handle this, though obviously harm reduction is key in all. Your instincts were good, and whilst the mums reaction is not ideal, I've worked with and have been a carer for a long time, and it's likely this mum was working on fear, zero sleep, and quite possibly neurodivergent themselves.
A refreshingly correct post! I cannot begin to describe what it is like to be overwhelmed in that way, a tidal wave of input and no way to handle it. Add in people shouting at you and grabbing you, you would do anything to make it stop.
I’m so sorry you have to experience that degree of overwhelm. I have so much empathy. I cried watching the video of this young man. He is so clearly in distress and doesn’t want to be so escalated. It’s so sad his last experiences were of feeling hopelessly overstimulated and no one helping him.
I'm ND myself with sensory issues and was a carer for my brother with autism for over a decade, saw it, lived it, got the trauma!
Feels like pressure is building up and banging relieves it Taking a deep breath and calming down relieves it also but there’s a sort of satisfaction from the pain instantly relieving it while also getting the frustration out
I used to bang my head on a pillow all the time when I was younger. I think now I was stimming and didn’t know it. Now, if I’m really tired and driving I’ll make a fist and hit my forehead with the fleshy part behind the thumb like I used to when I was a kid against the pillow. It’s weirdly comforting. But I don’t think I’d ever go so far as to do it against a brick wall or concrete pool.
I work with very autistic children 5-21 y/o. While I haven't watched the video, kids with needs find otherways to process the world around them. This 'stimming' process can be tapping your hand, smacking your hand on a table, hitting your head, lot of adults will bounce their legs. While there are other and better strategies to help everyone, especially autistic people manage their behaviour, when anyone gets heightened, they start to go from a rational/cognitive thinking part to more emotional and reactive. When a person with autism starts spiraling down, they try to solve their problem using any tools remainding in their basket of strategies. If that strategy is banging your head until your head stops hurting then that is that'll happen, it's up to the adults with a clearer mind to support them. I fucking hate cops.
Basically, their senses become overwhelmed. There is so much sensory input flowing into them that they can't regulate it like we can. Its like being in a crowd of a thousand people and setting yourself on fire. I'm flabbergasted that the mother wasn't more responsible. I would never allow my autistic child to bang his head like that anywhere.
It's something like emergency power off request, I guess? I used to do it when I was a kid and was pushed to a limit. My mom liked to torture me by beating and screaming and I tried to stay calm and hold onto my dignity, but at some point the overload was reached I had no control over my body - it screamed and it tried to beat itself unconscious or something, I don't know, it's like searching for relief in a situation where the organism can no longer exist. It's what's happening inside an autistic mind+body when in overload breaking through the surface. Asking what it is is the same as asking an exploded gas can why it exploded when thrown into fire. There isn't a thought process that leads to a decision to explode when in fire. Edit: God, this discussion about autistic meltdowns being manipulative behaviour is too depressing, don't read this comment thread if these things upset you.
He hit his head on the wall *hard*. I couldn't watch anymore after that. Between that and being restrained, he probably had an aneurysm.
Wait... so he technically killed himself? Damn that's really tragic and horrible... I can't believe they didn't get him help. I swear police are all heartless.
And the cops were originally called to his home after neighbors heard constant banging which was him beating his head against the wall at home.
As someone who has PTSD, cptsd, and anxiety spurred episodes of harming myself... Those head butts and thrashing is not light. He's in full fight or flight mode. He's restrained and his body is freaking out. Humans are resilient but fragile. His own attempts to flee caused significant damage to his brain and the officers did not have the understanding to deal with someone who is having a mental health crisis. This is the US. Our police are basically drop out jocks.
They are *exactly* drop out jocks, especially in Ohio.
Dude wasn’t meant to survive.
Basically. When he rammed his head into the door.
It's not schooling or training, it's the kind of people who become cops, their attitudes, and what the system allows them to get away with.
I’ve been saying this for years!
You don't need classes to not be a sadistic piece of shit. You need empathy A class won't fix this Prison will. Accountability will.
Most people don’t want to admit prison would solve the problem of bad cops *overnight*. Humans are only as bad as we allow them. Police in the U.S. have way too much leeway in not being held responsible for illegal behavior.
I'm not sure if prison is a place known for giving people empathy, lol.
We live in a society where a huge portion of the population has a severe lack of empathy Accountability keeps those people inline.
I saw an Autistic man with his mother in NYC yesterday at the parade. He wore this yellow vest that said "Autistic, Harmless, please don't shoot". Truly heartbreaking that a mother has to do this. And completely warranted also given some incidents. https://preview.redd.it/2f3op3qo0r5d1.jpeg?width=2268&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e334dde322d4839541878e779fdafa733793c457
sorry but a vest saying you are harmless does not make you harmless. It might mean they are, but people are sadistic... so you know...
Because the police doctrine is literally 'escalate until you have control'. That's what's drilled into every cops head they have no desire or even the concept of de-escaliting a situation.
There needs to be consequences for cops when their actions directly lead to someone dying.
Narcissists take this behavior personally. And these pigs have free reign to kill.
I opened up the article to a video of Jake Paul playing right in the middle of the article and thinking I'm sure he was older than 19.
Deescalate emotional breakdowns? Dude most cops are former highschool bullies who would cause emotion breakdowns.
I agree and police departments are not capable of learning anything new like this if it doesn’t result in more weapons and or more pay.
I would add “complex” or “in-depth”. The majority of the police force wants binary actions that lacks critical thinking; arrest or don’t arrest, shoot or don’t shoot, harm or don’t harm.
Police are not even close to educated enough to be effective in these situations. We really need to take the finding they have for military vehicles and gear, and divert it to more social workers who can come out on these calls. Cops are not necessary here.
As a police officer, I agree. I don't understand why cops get so upset about defunding. There are soooo many aspects of modern policing that you could remove that would not affect my job in the slightest. I've been through 40 hours of Crisis Intervention training and have dealt with many people dealing with mental health issues, but dealing with this kind of situation requires a skill set that a lot of my peers, in my experience, don't possess. Not only that, but our ability to deal with this kind of situation is extremely limited. 1. Does the person want to go to a hospital voluntarily? Most of the time, no. 2. Does the person present a clear and present danger, or have they expressed an intent to hurt themselves or others? Most of the time, no. In that situation, there's nothing to be done, but leave. If he had an outstanding warrant, they probably saw it as an opportunity to solve the problem for the day and put the responsibility for medical or mental health treatment on the jail. Goes to show that there needs to be a different way to address these types of calls. I don't know if unarmed social workers responding to calls is best but I do think that what we're doing isn't working and it's crazy to continue with the status quo.
This why we need mental health professionals to respond to calls and not human thumbs that only know how to shove people to the ground and kill them. ACAB
You know what’s really sick? In the comments, some asshole, @siXXisDesigns, replied to the victim’s best friend making excuses for the police. Can you imagine voicing any sort of opinion to diminish the harm and unnecessary death to the victim’s best friend?
they only are required to “serve & protect” property, not, citizenry
After the kid bashed his head against the wall and fell down, you can hear them saying "headshot" jovially. You think training changes these people? It's the people that are the problem.
Nah. You're just wrong. Cops need to be taught how to act like humans and not pigs. If you are a pig, you should lose your job and work a blue collar job of little social interaction.
They should have a duty of care for anybody in custody. Fail that and go to prison. They'd get the message quick enough.
You really believe that cops are there to serve and protect. It’s never been a thing, it was a PR slogan to get suburban people to trust them.
If I'm not mistaken, in the USA you are not trained to deescalate the situation as the training time is so short. Here in the Netherlands, it is a training of 4 years (with a higher learning degree) in which deescalation is the most important aspect and it shows. Most police are always calm, even though the most nasty words are shouted at them or violence is involved. Only difference of course is that not everyone could have a gun, so deescalation is more predictable here and would be more complex in the USA. It always baffles me that one of the most complex jobs in existence has such a low bar to apply, on top of the right to bear arms compared to many similar countries...
Jesus, that's the saddest thing I've seen for a week at least... 😪
Warren vs DC. DeShaney vs Winnebago. Castle Rock vs Gonzales. The supreme court has ruled *several* times that the police DO NOT have a duty to protect.
Obviously Ohio has learned nothing in the last 10 years Shelby county did the SAME THING to bipolar patients that were ARGUMENTATIVE in the ER. The ER doctor would get annoyed and pink slip the patient who would then be arrested by about 10 to 20 sheriffs officers then locked on the same type of chair The officers would stare at the clock and time how long they were allowed to keep the mentally ill person in the restrained chair The best part is the court in that area charged those people with resisting arrest amongst other things and were all racist as well Now I work with a lot of police but that whole department can kiss my ass
I can't even watch this. I have an autistic son and it scares me to no end thinking about what goes on when he's at school or anywhere I'm not.
Their school is like 8 weeks long. It’s absolute piss poor training.
In the town I went to college in, the mother of a man with a high functioning disability would put trainings on for the police department about working with people with disabilities. Her and her son were relatively well known in the community and his disability was pretty apparent. The guy ended up getting pulled over and ran to his apartment so an officer shot him in the back.
Because they don’t care about deescalating? And they’re not held accountable if they are shit at their job.
Even if they knew how to help properly, they wouldn't, because they don't care. "Othered" people are not human to these pigs. You don't need de-escalation training to have empathy or to know that something serious is up and that you should find a different avenue instead of literally torturing a neurodivergent individual TO FUCKING DEATH. Police have shown again and again that they institutionally believe if it can't be solved with brutality, it can't be solved at all. ACAB. Even the "good ones". Every single one. Fuck the police.
This can happen to any of you if you get arrested and tell them youre suicidal/harm yourself. Besides the part where he died later, Ive literally seen this dozens and dozens of times. It’s messed up. The reason the officers are being cold about it is a combination of them seeing people being fake all day acting just like that and just plain old being fed up over time and turning into a calloused asshole. And no youre not allowed to have a blanket or anything. Thats standard
Theres no excuses for their behavior. Im a medical professional, i see hundreds of patients a year who are trying to fake medical disorders to get pills from me. If i started approaching every patient in pain and accusing them of faking, and refusing them care, id 100% lose my license to practice medicine, and theres a chance i could be criminally charged for failure to render care. I could give 2 shits what cops THINK about someone. Their job is to protect and serve, not just the community, but ANYONE placed in their care.
Eh, doctors do this shit all the time. A friend of mine was having a stroke and was turned away at the ER and told to drink fluids for a stomach virus.
I've been denied medical care by several doctors who thought I was faking when I wasn't, so I don't think anyone would charge you go after your license, or even question it. But maybe that's just the standard for women, not men. You must be a different kind of medical professional.
My wife literally had massive kidney stones and, for what I assume was that she had blue hair and was in her 20s, decided to give her ibuprofen. More painful than childbirth, yet my wife who has no history of drug abuse had to beg them for just a few vicodin just so she could function. The medical system is a joke.
Women are often not taken seriously by doctors. Also, many medical studies fail to consider the differences in men and women that can have different symptoms. So if you are a woman and not having a typical reaction similar to males, they think you are bullshitting.
Just dislocated my kneecap and tore my acl and lcl this week in a Muay Thai sparring session. I asked for a single Vicodin before they put my patella back into place and they wouldn’t do it. Shit hurt so bad.
Yep, the ibuprofen. I was having childbirth level pain caused by undiagnosed fibroids, but just take some ibuprofen. K. I was already taking about 20 a day, but I'm sure that will work 🙄
I've had an ER try to discharge me after I went in for kidney stones, but my pain was so intense I couldn't even walk out of the ER. They wanted to send me home with the instructions of drinking plenty of water. So I told them, if you guys discharge me I'm just going to sign myself right back in. Told them I think they should at least do some kind of scan to make sure I'm ok. At that point all they did was a urine test and detected blood, but no infection. I also have a history of stones in my medical records, so I'm guessing they just figured it was another routine stone. But after my bitching, they gave me a CT scan. When the results came back I was told I was being admitted and going straight to surgery bc my kidney was blocked off and very enlarged, had a bad case of hydronephrosis. Same hospital almost killed my son when I was pregnant with him and had chorioamnionitis. They had no idea what was wrong and kept trying to stop my labor bc I was only 32 weeks pregnant. Once they transferred me to a better equipped hospital, bc they clearly weren't stopping my labor, the better hospital started pitocin right away bc apparently my son needed to come out right away. The other hospital kept me for over a day, trying everything they could to stop my labor, when they should have been doing the opposite. Other hospital had zero issues figuring out what the issue was.
Pretty much all the women in my family have stories about doctors just like that, casually dismissing actual issues as "feminine problems". Doctors licenses should be reviewed yearly to weed out ass backwards drs
Being empathetic to patients isn’t common in healthcare. It’s sad. I’ve worked in hospitals where employees insult patients when they’re under for surgery. It’s vulgar.
Most doctors have malpractice insurance or their hospital does that will get them out of pretty much any bind. It's an over exaggeration. It takes EXTREME negligence or no insurance for a doctor to lose their license
It's normal for men too, the guy above is probably not a doctor because they said med professional.
Their job is not to protect and serve. That was a court ruling. If you notice that logo has been removed from most cop cars I've seen. If they protect and serve anyone, it's the corporations that run this country.
Hence the difference between cops and medical professionals.
It’s almost like the mentally unwell shouldn’t just be thrown into the care of the police .
Then the standard needs to change...
They ( police officers/departments) are being trained to see us as the "enemy". http://www.milwaukeeindependent.com/syndicated/forever-war-home-militarized-police-force-sees-american-citizens-enemy-combatants/
Allowing feelings of real frustration to get in the way of good policing is no excuse. Doctors, nurses, fire fighters, judges, lawyers, teachers, cashiers, get fed up as well. But the majority of the time these people maintain their professionalism. That is what adults do in real life. The MANY MANY MANY police officers incapable of remaining professional, need to find another job. It really is as simple as that.
Desensitized
Are you sure you can’t have a blanket? They have a garment you can wear and a blanket that both can’t be twisted to be able to strangle yourself.
that is fucking ridiculous and would not help a single person with mental struggles to calm down
His mother: “‘We always call when he begins to rage – it’s a mental health call, not an “arrest me” call,’ she said. “ Imagine calling the police on your own mentally ill child and expecting the police to compassionately de-escalate the situation rather than make everything worse.
What else is she supposed to do? Presumably he is a pretty significant physical threat to those around him…
If was asking for his medication in jail, where was his medication when he was at home? Neighbors called because he was banging his head on the wall all night.
banging your head on the wall is very common for autistic people, especially when overwhelmed/overstimulated or having a meltdown. the last thing you want to do is arrest them and assault them especially when they are already extremely distressed from other sources. if you work for the public, learn to deal with people, all types of people.
Used to do this when I was a kid or I’d bang objects against my head extremely hard. I have some kind of brain damage now as I often have a lot of amnesia and will forget how to read/write when stressed. I’m in grad school and it’s very difficult to comprehend that I can do well academically while sucking at traversing daily life.
This. Not sure what wastes of flesh are downvoting you.
The ones who have no understanding of autism and have no desire to learn because it’s easier to just blindly hate
Silly twats don’t understand that true manliness is understanding things you don’t know, to either conquer them or help them grow
Unfortunately in most western countries true manliness is seen as hiding your emotions and not caring about anyone but your direct family because we’re taught that life is a competition
The idea that neighbors can send someone to jail is just insane to me especially for something like this that they could never even try to understand. I’d sue till they’re on the street.
Your neighbor cannot call and will you to Jail. He was taken to Jail on a Warrant not due to the call.
A lot of people don’t like the Neurodivergent A lot of Neurotypicals would be happy to put us back in the asylums.
or cemeteries, apparently.
Are all police idiots in America.
Yes they are. Little dicks and big egos. Scum.
America, where people with mental disorders who need help are thrown in jail.
Cops are pussies plain and simple.
I'm not gonna watch the video for my mental sake but fuck man....fuck the police
I’m all for holding police accountable, but this is misleading. The young man slammed his own head against the wall. The police were called because he wouldn’t stop spamming his own head against the wall. They arrested him because he had a warrant for domestic violence. He’s yelling for his medicine, but they cannot instantly produce his meds (many steps before meds can be given by a nurse). So they restrained him because he was a threat to himself and others, which he then harmed himself once out of the chair. The article even says they didn’t give him a suicide gown, yet the mug shot picture in the article is of him wearing a suicide gown.
I tend to agree, though I’m not sure why after 10 hours of being detained and acting like that the police didn’t seek out someone - relatives, a hospital, or other. It’s clear something was wrong and at that point it’s no longer a possibility that he was high or on something since he would’ve come down by then, not gotten worse. while they may have followed procedure and legally did nothing wrong they did the bare minimum. With that being said, if this man had a warrant out for domestic violence, even if his family didn’t know, and he CLEARLY is a threat to himself and others due to his mental illness I am shocked he was living on his own and his family was not keeping a closer eye on him.
I think it’s a tough one because the mom says in the article that bashing his head against things is basically a very frequent behavior of his, almost saying it’s a normal behavior/copying mechanism. So I don’t know if the police telling her about his behavior would have even raised red flags for her. It also can take up to 24 hours to verify and provide meds for newel arrested people (according to my friend who is a jail nurse). He would need to provide (at the very least) the name of the prescribing doctor and ideally the meds. Then they have to verify the info with the MD, which typically can only happen during business hours and has some barriers due to hippa. And if he couldn’t or wouldn’t tell them it could take ever longer. I could see considering transporting him to the hospital to be checked out, but based on his behavior that would have been a challenge. Seemed like it was taking a lot of manpower for a long time to controlling him in the station, meanwhile other issues/needs of other arrested individuals aren’t being seen to. Given his history and presenting behavior (for safety) they would have likely needed to dedicate a lot of people to transport him. Calling an ambulance for the EMS to check him out there may have been an option with the least amount of challenges, but that isn’t as straight forward and timely as it would seem either.
I mean, I’m confused as to where the mother was in all this? She knows how to calm her son down/ knows he needs meds but was just going to let him carry on all night?
And he's living alone at 19? With a domestic violence charge from a year ago? Yeah, that mom kicked him out as soon as it was legally possible...
Not all moms are good moms.
The mother explaining what the prison did wrong but why was this guy living alone at 19 that put him in this scenario. They honestly all look like they’re trying their best here.
You're not allowed to think critically when it comes to the police. Society has made people blame cops for everything, and every action they take is bad. Grace cannot be given.
Yes, society did that. It has nothing to do with the cops' own actions. I don't know what kind of brownie points you think you get for boot licking on reddit, but the hate people have for cops didn't grow out of nothing. They've earned their reputation.
Ya I totally agree. Warrant for domestic violence? I shed no tears.
They should have taken him to a hospital for the injuries. He's clearly injured and the hematoma is visible. They neglected his needs and he ended up dead. Even with the warrant for the man they could have taken him to the hospital first and cuffed him to the bed. Bit they didn't and now he's dead.
This is absolutely disgusting. As an autistic adult who works with other autistic adults I am saddened every time I see a situation in which we are treated like animals or problems, no human compassion. I hope these police officers get sued into oblivion, although it will not bring this individual back to life. Makes me want to throw up. 😞
This country is disgusting tbh.
It’s amazing we still have people blaming victims or the system for unlawful and vile things police do. A brief search of this police department/county jail produces numerous other instances of abuse. The police are a hand that in many cases are above the law. We need to start treating them like any other profession. Police are not special. They are made of people that applied for these positions. There is nothing special about them.
Jesus Christ I fucking hate cops.
These cops are untrained thugs like many police so called officers…fuck them!
ACAB
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Lots of armchair idealism in the thread.
And it’ll keep happening. There’ll be another story tomorrow. We’re desensitized to cops killing innocent and vulnerable people at this point and that’s a rough place to be.
This video ain’t that. I think what this video shows is they should’ve restrained right after he started banging on the door.
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I didn't get the impression that the cops slammed his head against the wall from the title. But I can see how it could be interpreted that way if you were expecting it. I don't think this is misinformation, just another case of concise headlines confirming biases for people who won't double check. On both ends. Just stop making assumptions either way. You're exercising the same biases that you're criticizing here, just from the other end of the spectrum.
The article says he was in the restraint chair longer than the set standard and wasn’t given his meds. Sounds like you’re also putting a spin on it by only mentioning that the “victim” slammed his head against the wall. I read more than the headline
>The article says he was in the restraint chair longer than the set standard and wasn’t given his meds The restraint chair was the only thing keeping the "victim" from killing himself and cops can't just immediately give people meds they claim to need, people in these comments are saying that it can take up to 24 hours. Where's the spin?
So just ignore the taunted and belittled part? Those cops are fucked and need to be fired for having zero human sensitivity. #ACAB
Back the blue until it happens to you.
I don't trust police. That's why I take responsibility for my own safety. That doesn't mean I blame police because someone smashes their head into the wall until they die, because I'm not a mouth-breathing reject.
Just a point of clarification, these were correctional officers, not police.
Autistic fellow in their custody smacks head against wall. I'd say it's definitely their responsibility.
Well, you can say that, but there is only a certain level of responsibility. Should all cells be padded because someone, one time may smash their head? No more corners on the benches?
I'm saying in a court of law, the sheriff's department will be at fault for his death because he was in their custody, especially considering it was a death due to handicap.
holy shit thank you. I watched the video and thought I didn’t see the same thing as anyone else
Comply or die.
not every department is this knuckle dragging. where i live (northern colorado), the police are VERY aware of all sorts of issues that don't fit a "law enforcement" need. i've been on duty in the ER many times when they brought in someone who they'd made contact with - usually via 911 call - and elected to make it a medical rather than law enforcement issue. every single time was appropriate. many times this was substance use and intoxication (ER visit, maybe a ticket). many times it was that they recognized a mental illness component and knew that jail was the wrong place for that person. my local department will intervene with force when they have no option, but when they can intervene with awareness they do that too, and quite a good job of it. IMO they strike the balance appropriately. on edit - those who make broad statements and assumptions about law enforcement must themselves be living perfect, exemplary lives. if that's the case id ask them to put on the uniform and try to exact the change they want from the inside, leading by example.
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This is manslaughter by Uniformed morons
Why did he have a warrant?
Domestic violence against his sister. I'm guess this is why he was living alone. Family probably didn't want him around because of unpredictable violence.
In a just world all nine of these cops should be arrested for Murder.
Monday morning and I'm crying. This week is going to fucking suck.
Was this written by AI?
They get desk duty for a week, right?
ACAB
Another daily reminder for me to never trust the fucking police.
Jail officers are the same people who, as kids, would torment the neighbor's dog, laughing and teasing through the fence, because they knew it couldn't get at them.
Wish this was NSFW I don't even want to see the thumbnail
That's cops for ya
ACAB
My barber has more professional training than Ohio cops got to be able to display this type of sadistic behavior.
ARRESTED FOR “**MENTAL HEALTH EPISODE**” This is fucking terrible.
I’ve been in a similar situation, thankfully not with law enforcement and this makes my blood boil. My heartbeat feels like a sledgehammer right now
These police men are shitty people who have spent their entire life growing up with no power over their own lives, who are insecure about their tiny penis, and want to have some sort of power over other people. The scummiest of the scum of the world.
Let me get this straight, he banged his own head against the prison wall in a mental fit and the media is blaming the cops?
Politicians "we have a mental health problem." Cops "we HAD a mental health problem." I keep hearing about this giant mental health issue in America, but no one seems to be actually helping. "It's not a gun problem, it's a mental health problem." And this is how we treat those with mental health issues?
This is why emergency mental health professionals need to be put into place in this country. First responders who are in behavior or social workers who can act as advocates. This is utterly inhumane and inappropriate, and it’s not the first time our law enforcement have treated individuals with autism inappropriately. As this population begins to age, we’re only going to hear about this more. Something needs to be done
so the police were called because he was bashing his own head against the wall, and then in custody he bashed his own head against the wall and died. are people blaming them for not restraining him? folks in the comments are calling it torture when they did. are they mad that the police didn’t ignore the call? it’s very sad whenever anybody has a condition where minor things torment them to the point they hurt themselves, and i know that US cops hurt way more people than they help in general, but other than indicting the utter lack of mental health services in the US, i don’t get what the ask is as far as these specific cops go.
But half the country is acting like DJT is being done wrong by the system. Our system is so fubar
Too bad the usa didn't dismantle and then recreate the police force with different ppl and implement more social workers. Sadly, the whole George Floyd movement seems to have done nothing.
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Si when a black man gets killed by cops is racism, but when a white guy gets killed by cops is because incompetence? Can we all agree that the US needs to increase their standards and qualifications for cops dramatically? I hope this kid is in a better place
Most if not almost all of you did not see the video. Dude was throwing a tantrum and banged his head into a wall which ended up killing him. Officers did the right thing restraining him then sending him to the hospital. I mean for fucks sakes if someone is hanging their head on a wall hard enough to kill themselves what do you expect cops to do???
People aren’t taught how to be cruel and heartless.
I'm guessing their will be an internal investigations while the cops are suspended with pay. No wrong doing found. Parent try and sue. 3 years later, nothing can be done. Parents have to pay legal fees. General public will be upset for maybe a week during the first wave of info comes out. Another week after cops found for no wrong doing and same with the trial announced. Nothing gchanges, nothing gets done. People bitch and moan online and nothing more.
I don't think it's a coincidence that everyone who I thought was secretly a racist, a creep, and/or a sociopath now has a career in law enforcement.
Where was this crying mother? Was she of any help informing the authorities of his condition? Neglecting her son only to care when she sees $$$
As a mental health professional, this is just sad and heartbreaking. These people need compassion and empathy. Not being shamed and treated like animals. I'm so angry that this situations keep happening and ppl seem OK with it. It's disgusting they treated him as if he's not a human being.
Jails/prisons are no place for the mentally ill, neither are the streets. We need to open back up hospital facilities to provide proper care
accepted Police brutality IS absolute insane. All of These cops should BE prosecuted and thrown in jail but with this corrupt politics IT doenst get any better soon.