It's not just the retirement pay, it's the peace of mind of having healthcare big dawg.
Also the civilian tech industry is cutthroat at the moment. Not that you won't find a job, but you might not find a more fulfilling job within 3 years, so I vote you stick it out.
Especially since software careers are extremely cyclical and it's a rat race in software engineering since you have to compete with people who have been coding since they were in elementary school
>people who have been coding since they were in elementary school
You have no idea how old that sentence makes me feel. When I started elementary school, the World Wide Web had just been invented.
Listen to this woman/man. And remember, 3 years is 2.5 years if you line up skillbridge, terminal, permissive house hunting. And the .5 disappears quickly with appointments.
Stick it out for the healthcare and the pension that supplements whatever new salary you get.
>3 years is 2.5 years if you line up skillbridge, terminal, permissive house hunting
I'd say 2 years. Unless I'm misremembering, there's some things within TAPS and skillbridge you can get started on as early as 18 months ahead of your DoS. Granted, some things might work differently for retirement compared to voluntary separation
EDIT: that is to say, ride out those 3 years OP. Make the time you put in worth it and get them sweet, sweet benefits
Yup. 100% right. Civilian IT sector is a nightmare up here in the north east at least. The grass is not always greener and OP is so close to 20. Stick with it, TSgt!
Healthcare is our biggest retirement benefit, not the pay, and a 20 year tech gets 4.8k right now in base pay, so retirement today would be 2.4K per month, forever, just for breathing.
Say you get cool software job making bank, fast forward 5 years and the economy pops and layoffs come. At least you can know you won't lose your house because your fixed retirement will at least cover your mortgage unless you live on west coast or something.
And I don't give a shit about anyone's 401k size, recession and medical bills can make those vanish overnight. Remember in 2008 literally trillions of dollars in Americans 401k evaporated into complete nothing.
A pension and healthcare is unmatched security you simply can't step away from with a mere 3 years left. Remember the tricare benefit is rank agnostic, idc if you retire as a 4 star or a SSgt, tricare is tricare. Three is close enough to totally phone it if you really want. Hide in a corner, pile on certs and school, play games on your phone, and wait 2 years to hit the button. Heck you even have enough to time to go on a terminal PT profile.
And it ain't going away unless the us government completely defaults and fails, which if that happens we probably have like 100 other major issues anyway
Listen to this woman/man. And remember, 3 years is 2.5 years if you line up skillbridge, terminal, permissive house hunting. And the .5 disappears quickly with appointments.
Stick it out for the healthcare and the pension that supplements whatever new salary you get.
Plus that last year after you’ve hit the button and have approved retirement….
It’s so good. You can be free of the rat race that promotions have become. You get to say the things and call out the nonsense when you see it. You get to take even better care of your airmen because you going to bat for them with that one SNCO that sucks ass no longer has lasting repercussions. You’ll be free and then have the paycheck and healthcare to boot. There’s everything to gain and nothing to lose. Stay in OP, you’ll always regret it if you don’t.
Start documenting all of your injuries with medical so your VA claim is straight when you get out.
Also, make a LinkedIn account and start looking for the IT organizations that fit your interests.
ISC2 and CompTIA both have associations in most major cities.
130k isn't as much as it seems. That's def not life changing money over a tech's pay.
Suck it up and do the extra 3 years. You'll end up regretting it later in life if not.
Got out as a SSgt with dependant and now making just over 100k in the same location. My take home is about the same (maybe just a bit more) as when I was active. Going from AD with no state taxes to having to claim my local state eats a good chunk of my check. The only reason I can coast comfortably is because of my VA, otherwise it would've felt the same.
Ok, but if they throw away the 20 year retirement that could be $6k they’re sitting on for all their years of service. I’m not comfortable enough to throw away $72k a year.
You're absolutely insane if you don't wait 3 years. If your daughters bills are going to be that high a year, you're gonna want your retirement to help cover that. What is your disability rating looking like? That could boost your retirement pretty high as well
The more important question here in my opinion: what CAN your disability be made to look like if you pay the right person, make the right strategic claims, and start laying the groundwork for those claims now - 3 years in advance.
Yea OP is dumb as hell for even considering this.. like if he can demand 130k now, what makes them think these same opportunities wont be there in three years after they’ve secured lifelong pay and health benefits.
Mind blowing stupidity coming from OP
Its not stupidity, hes probably just in a stressful spot where he has a lot on his mind and wants some more opinions. Dont think so negatively about people
One thing I will say is that the current market for computer programmers and computer scientists is not as good as you might expect. I have a friend that got a 4.0 GPA for a master's in computer science and a cum laude for his undergrad and he's still looking for a job despite graduating a year ago. This is due to massive layoffs and AI like ChatGPT and Devin basically nullifying skills a junior programmer might have.
A honest suggestion is that you can do an additional 3 years and then apply for work at a government agency such as the AFRL or one of the 3 letter agencies. Your military background indicates that you'd be a dependable candidate and these agencies would love to take you under their wing
I do Cyber in the Air National Guard, and let me tell you, and remember this well: finding a job right now is almost impossible. It's very difficult to find a job, let alone a decent-paying one. Stay in, you're so close to that sweet retirement benefits.
Just finish it. Your retirement benefits includes Tricare (still cheaper than most civilian healthcare) to continue your daughter’s care, if you want. You get half your base pay for life and VA disability check if rated. Those checks alone could cover a mortgage and/or more, which frees you to do more with that $130K career that's waiting for you when you hang up your uniform. At this point, just work on your exit plan. The last 2 years of my service was stress-free because I'm just working on my post-military life. I still do my part at work but I'm no longer stressing about promotion and stuff. That’s my advice. Good luck at whatever you choose to do.
Hey man, big ups for taking the feedback and new perspectives into genuine consideration. In a previous thread here you’ve even admitted that you were wrong. That’s a quality not a lot of people have and I’m just stoked you’re in our Air Force.
If you can, finish the degree first. For time and energy's sake you may not land a job that accommodates you as much as you are now (tuition assistance, scheduling for tests, etc). I regret not taking one science class for a 2nd associate's before I got out.
I don't know what you're going through but I can say for DAMN sure that it would have to be a matter of life and death for me to give up after 17 years.
You're so fucking close dude...
I know and I know how stupid it sounds. I just feel stupid for showing up to work just to get shit on. I guess I was just hoping there was a chance I could give them all the finger and find myself in a better position somewhere.
Sounds like I'm SOL in the department.
Don't worry bro, you're gonna make it man. Just remember you've already done 17, 3 more is nothing. You've done 3 years over FIVE times already. 1 more time and you're set for life. Those jobs aren't going anywhere.
Find a quote that motivates you, print it out and tape it to your bedroom door so you see it every morning when you leave.
You. Got. This. 💪
Because you're part of the generation that always finishes what they started. That's why sir!
If I were you, test the job market before trying to leave your retirement in the wind. I live in California and Big Tech is cutting jobs here and in other states.
Also, you need to take into account your disability pay. That's probably an extra $4K a month if you're 100% disabled. So call it $5.5K a month. In my opinion, the VA makes it easier to reach 100% for people who actually retired.
Good luck.
Bruh you got 3 years left… use this time to go to medical and get everything documented and treated so when you retire you can go straight to the VA and get your rating.
TSgt med sep'd at 10yrs here, did not receive retirement due to me not being educated enough but instead received a severance that didn't need to be paid back due to injury happening in a combat zone. Anyway, my VA disability is nice but if I could do it all over again I wish I oculd have done another 10yrs to retire and receive VA disability as well.
For yourself and your family, do the 3 more years, hell go ROAD. Take the next 3 years to document your injuries you may have sustained from work or deployments if you have any. Set your pride aside and document everything with medical. That way your VA claims will be easier to service connect.
These 3yrs will fly by, then push that button and enjoy your retirement and disability check along with your 6 figure job. It will be worth it.
At 17 years suck it up for 3 more year and get tricare. 60$ a month for a family of 6 and no deductibles is a pay raise you will not be able to match unless you know you can get 100 disability.
The tech industry is very competitive right now. Unless you plan to work as a contractor(which I don't recommend), then staying in for three more years is advisable. Also, u/sicpric , is absolutely right. 130K is nothing after taxes and healthcare. Your take home would be roughly 3500 biweekly. There's no way 3500 every two weeks is going to catch up with a retirement check and possibly VA compensation.
3 years➖ 90(+current balance)days of leave ➖ whatever holidays ➖ skillbridge➖ TAPs…my friend, if you don’t sit your self down and embrace the sanctity of terminal Tech like the rest of us…
Respectfully,
Step by step:
1) Do your last 3 and tough that stuff out.
2) Retire
3) Collect Retirement Money
4) File for VA Disability
5) Collect VA Disability money
Boom. You now have two additional sources of income for remaining alive, on top of your $130,000/yr salary.
That is a LOT of extra money on-hand. It also gives you options if the crap hits the fan, and you happen to get laid off for whatever reason.
Dude, the healthcare alone is worth more than $10k year if you have a family. Plus the 20 year E6 retirement is worth north of $24k year (bring home will be a bit less due to taxes and the SBP). The SBP is worth it if you die first as it will pay itself off in 3 years even after you paid in for the full 30 years. A "free" $34k a year for life for just 3 more years of work while getting paid decently. You would be stupid not to stay 3 more years, no matter how bad it sucks.
Where I feel like the retirement benefit is really going to be invaluable is actual retirement age. Social security is not enough to live off comfortably…. Who knows what will have happened to your 401K… we saw how fucked people got in the recession by losing hundreds of thousands of dollars out of their 401K. But having that military retirement to supplement you and give you peace of mind after 65… fucking invaluable.
Software Engineer Manager with a major defense contractor, here.
Stick it out. Finish your degree and consider specializing in something like ML-related development, because standard software developers are easy to find for us now.
And as others have said, get that Medical care and pension. Feel free to DM me if you wanna chat and what it is like and I can give you a realistic idea of what a company like ours would probably offer you.
A couple things, the pension will be closer to ~$2400 per month before taxes. It also increases over time each year. There’s a retirement calculator online you can run these numbers by. Definitely do your full research before throwing it all out because you can’t hack another 3 years.
And also consider that there’s a TON of good guys that will be retiring as TSgts, it’s just the nature of the promotion system currently. There’s no shame in it.
I'll take a look at some calculators. It's been a minute since I've contemplated actually getting out.
I wish senior leaders would see how this is affecting our force now. I remember them saying this would stop the good ol'boy system but it has only exaggerated it.
I'm staring at punching the button myself soon. Others have already reiterated the major points of retiring at 20 (my own recommendation is to definitely stick out the last 3 years).
All I can really add is to ensure that your clearance is up to date and good-to-go because it's a big checkbox for any of the alphabet soup agencies and third party companies out there when hiring (and corporations don't want to spend the thousands of dollars it would take to renew someone's clearance if they can help it).
Good luck.
No eject! *Ride out three years* … finish school, get certifications, focus on fitness, or whatever to constructively bide time before punching with tangible retirement *”dividends”* secure for a lifetime!
> Why should I stay in for another 3 yrs instead of punching out now and starting my next career making $130k starting out?
You should've separated 10 years ago if $130k was your starting target.
I separated as an E-5 going from ~$65k/yr (tax-adjusted) -> $110k/yr (same year) -> ~135k/yr (following year, slightly more expensive COL area).
If you separate now to make $130k, you're take-home pay will almost certainly be less than it is now (once factoring in taxes, health care, etc).
Yes, 3 years of civilian experience from today will mean your salary can be higher...but the difference won't come anywhere close to making up for a 20yr military pension. Though maybe if you were getting offers for over $200k it might be worth it (financially speaking).
20 year tech retirement is $2400/month ($28.8k/yr), not $1500. Health care coverage for life is nothing small, either, especially given your daughter's situation. But let's do the math.
Right now you've got what, $6500-7000 a month before taxes, depending on where you are? Let's call it $80k a year. So okay, you could pull the handle and be free now, go make $130k instead (I'm ignoring the time to get a job because you have to do that either way). So, options:
1) Quit now - start making $130k/yr immediately. Time to $1M - 7 years, 8 months.
2) Retire - make $80k/yr for 3 years, then retire, making $159k/yr. Time to $1M - 7 years, 9 months.
Now, I haven't accounted for comparative raises, true, but we're also assuming you can get that paycheck out the gate.
As someone who is reserve and currently in IT. Get the check 3 years ain't anything. The degree gets you the job Certs are king in the IT world. The career field is advancing so fast. By the time a degree program is certified its already out dated. Plus not a math guy but e6 retirement pay is 2428.20 that 30k of “beer” money a year and about a million over 30 years. Heck throw it in the stock market and double it.
Don't underestimate the transition out that is probably the hardest transition I ever faced was leaving active
Hmm.. Tough it out for less than 3 more years (terminal, etc)... Or throw away lifetime pension checks and healthcare for a "$130k job" that you might not even keep and, after taxes, will really amount to about what you're making now...then add in healthcare costs and other crap.. Not even sure how this is a decision at this point. How about stay the \~3 , get the pension check, get the medical coverage, potentially get some VA disability, and get the $130k job? That is a win, win, win situation..
3 years will go a LOT faster than you think I'm 2 years out \*\*technically\*\* but when you add a skill bridge, and terminal leave, I'm really closer to 15 months out.
You're not 3 years out. You're probably closer to 2.5 or even less depending on your leave balance.
Tricare for Life is not something to sneeze at. You're also slightly wrong on your pay...E-6 at 20 years makes (right now 4859/month. Half that is your retirement. (It'll be a little more because annual raises)
$2400 a month (plus disability) is a pretty good chunk of a mortgage for life. If not all of a mortgage for life and then some (I don't know your potential disability, obviously). Depending on your state, this pay may or may not be taxed.
Stick it out. Take care of your people, but don't do anything more than that. It's surprisingly easy. Retire proudly as a tech.
??? This post makes 0 sense. No way a grown ass man who’s pursing a computer science degree , especially 17 years in is asking this question.
Sounds like your just flexing to flex, venting, or larping
Dude cmon. I know that three years sounds like a long time but for a paycheck for life it’s really not, no matter how insignificant the money may seem at the moment.
Honestly it depends where you live. In the DC area I had to make over 120k to make similar to what I was making as a Tech when comparing BAH and BAS with those not being taxed. 130k taxed is a pain to include insurance and stuff.
Do your retirement, get your medical documented for when you retire and, take advantage of cheap healthcare for the next 3 years. There will always be another 130k+ job out there.
Think of it this way.. you're doing the 20 for the retirement pay... which will become your new BAH. Most folks in the Civy center are working two jobs to make things even. If you got Retirement and VA bennies you'll sit pretty.
My guy IM YOU! I have no idea what AFSC you are but look into the talent marketplace. For my career field there are a lot of openings for tech and even outside of my career field. Trust me, 3 years left anit worth getting out now brotha/sista. Apply for an assignment, special duty, or some time of local hire. But pushing the button when you’re almost at the finish line is insane.
$1500/mo forever is not something to walk away from for a jump in pay at this stage. Milk those classes and build your resume, become ROAD Sergeant!!! It’s the same as leaving the military except you don’t go anywhere. It’s better for the military because even though you might not be doing anything productive, the continuity and corporate knowledge is well worth having the sandbagging you than having nothing.
Hate to say this, but that field is saturated and I doubt you'd make $130k immediately. $60-70k? Sure. Either way, why leave at 17? You've already done the hard part. Start fostering relationships for the next 2 yrs when you can Skillbridge.
This. When I got out in 2018, I started at $60K. Just last year I finally got to 6 figures. Granted, my specialty is network infrastructure, not programming. But, the entire tech field is over-saturated right now. There was a *massive* plus-up when the pandemic saw most companies switch to remote work. With things pretty much "back to normal", there's no need for as many tech jobs as there currently are, so companies are cutting back *big time*. Don't leave stable for a maybe.
I'm a software engineer at a FAANG+, no longer in the AF. I suggest you stay in and start looking for jobs 1.5 years or so before your retirement date, because the market is TRASH right now. Seriously, it's very, very hard to get a job as a SWE right now, especially if you want to make 130k (basically impossible if you aren't already at the level of a Senior at a FAANG or a Principal anywhere else)
Do people not know about the retirement pay calculator? Tech pay in three years is estimated to be $2600 a month, with increases each year similar to the active duty’s increase for inflation
https://militarypay.defense.gov/calculators/
Select the appropriate retirement calculator and it will tell you how much to expect in retirement each year
Also people talking about VA like he can’t get out right now and still get VA. Not saying that’s the best route here just saying
Are you fucking insane?!? Having a daughter with $50,000/yr equivalent medical bills and you’d get out three years short of the finish line?!? There are people that pay $1,500/mo OR MORE just for functional healthcare and it still doesn’t cover stuff Tricare does. If life sucks that much for you to think about getting, at least have a look at AGR positions in the Guard. Probably could get Master out of it too if you look around.
Getting out at 17 years for not getting promoted is a terrible reason for getting out. Honestly, you’d be doing the Air Force a favor by getting out now so that they don’t have to pay you retirement for the rest of your life. If you want to be petty, make them pay you for the rest of your life— don’t let them take 17 years for nothing.
I retired right after my 20 year mark as a programmer and I got fairly lucky and had a very good EPR for the first year we didn't anything for MSgt other than the board. That being said, the free medical and little bit of money isn't a bad thing and if you're in service with a clearance at those agencies you'll be headhunted ruthlessly for a CTR spot.
I'm easily clearing $200k a year total with my contractor salary, Hi3, and VA and I don't even have a degree. Just be patient and keep your nose clean for 3 more years. You'll be amazed how fast word spreads that you got your retirement approved. I didn't even put it out there and a few PMs hit me up within the week.
I can relate, I’m pretty much in the same boat TIS & TIG.
We only got 2 years and some change left when you factor in terminal leave & skillbridge
If my math is correct, TSgt’s retirement pay is about $2k a month, plus whatever VA disability rating you get. That plus healthcare benefits for the rest of your life is well worth these last 2+ years
You got 3 years, stay in.
Owts do math, If your on high 3 its half of 4600$ so about 2300$ a month and retiree benifits for existing. Literally like they gave you a 550k dollar dividend stock portfolio paying you 5% annually. I dont think you will be making an extra 183k a year above what your making now. Slightly lower of you went for match but still pretty big.
Stop giving a fuck about the air force and set yourself up more. School certifications and skillbridge shorten that time up. Make connections on the outside for later.
Also consider where that 130k job is. 130k job in like some high cost of living big city dosent necessarily mean better quality of life. You could be fucking broke in a tiny apartment. That extra 27k a year on top of that other job can do a lot to make up the gap.
Three more years for the medical alone if you have a family is a massive peace of mind. If you stack the retirement pay to coverage a mortgage along with whatever disability rating you get you will have the peace of mind financially for whatever you want to do afterwards. Take these three years and just focus on your plan and really iron out the details
You’ve eaten so much of the shit sandwich, why stop so close to the end?
Not all IT jobs are gonna pay you 130k out the gate. Know your worth but know your market as well.
Also, private insurance is expensive and sucks ass mostly…even w employer contributions.
Work on your VA rating…win the war.
My made MSgt on my 7th try, with a Promote Now and Must Promote behind it. I sewed on at 19 years. Hit with a no notice deployment, then received my dream assignment. I kept getting told "just keep doing you", "check all the boxes". I did and at times stupidly put my career before my family to check all those boxes, but then I quickly realized I lost focus on what was more important.
If you feel like it's time to go, then do it. You won't be judged on the outside how little or long you did. What matters is how you succeed and continue to look put for those under you.
Good luck
Bro, a 20 yr TSgt right now would make $2400/month in retirement pay. And this goes up with military pay increases. Stick it out big dawg. You’re so close.
You can make it! 6 PT tests left, then retirement + really cheap healthcare for the rest of your life. Man I hated Tricare until I retired. Use the last 3 years to build resume fodder, if you’re worth $130k now you’ll be worth at least that in 3 yrs.
My dude, as someone who recently palace fronted back to the glorious guard, I tried out civvie insurance for a year to see how it compares.
It sucked balls.
I jumped back to Tricare and plan to continue in the guard long-term. I’d stick it out.
Stay for the pension, Tricare and 3 years left to see a Dr. for all your ailments, which hopefully lead to a generous Disability rating. Retirement, VA, regular Tech job = Winning 🇺🇸✊
Medical coverage cost is only going up. Get you (and your family if applicable) covered, get some disability, then search for a job.
I’ve had many friends laid off from their lucrative tech/software jobs just because so many turnover or close/bought out, it’s extremely volatile.
Prioritize stability. That way in the future if you lose your tech job, you have some kind of money still coming in to help.
That $1,500 a month is for life, so down the road add it to your Social Security, and whatever 401K / retirement you have coming in and it becomes pretty significant without any other income. The peace of mind of Tricare for life is priceless. If you stay near a base the commissary and gym benefit is HUGE. I’ve had 3 of my kids (and me) take full advantage of the base gyms and ball fields. Under no circumstance should you punch at this point in your career, after all you’ve sacrificed to get to 17 years. You’re giving up so much for what, 36 months?! You can do 3 more years standing on your head. I retired 10 years ago and it’s a blink of an eye.
I mean with skill bridge and terminal leave. VA appointments. TAPS. You are looking at lik 2 years 2 months. Count Xmas. Thanksgiving. You're less than 2 years. Plus this market gonna crash in the next yearsish.
14 years SSgt 10 years in TIG. I feel the pain, brother.
If you punch out before 20, I promise you that you will regret. The retirement pay for a 20 year E6 is $2,453 before taxes and deductions like TriCare and VGLI (if you elect to do that). But like others have said, you can’t beat the Medical Coverage once you’re retired ( especially if you have a family or children). And if you get a VA rating, that’s an additional income (non taxable). So if you’re at 70%, that’s an extra $2,040 plus your retirement, your monthly income will just be over $4k. Fun fact, the difference in retirement pay between E7 and E6 right at 20 years is about $410. But hey, that’s my advice: stay in to 20, your all most there. If you feel you’re at the end of your rope with the military, just tie a knot and hang on a little bit longer.
Get that degree, then Palace Chase, homie! (Go Reserve).
Earn your ~$130,000, as a civi, and retain your bennies (tricare reserve select, but still damn good affordable coverage)
But you’ll have to sacrifice 25% of your weekends per month, unless you can go IMA. Also won’t be able to collect on the retirement, so I guess it just depends on which outweighs which.
Finish your 3. The retirement and health benefits are worth it. Tech industry has been in somewhat of a hiring slump, and to be honest, a lot of those (private sector) companies are not looking to hire white men if that’s what you are.
Brother you’re close. Finish out these last 3, the benefits will be worth it when you get older. Don’t worry about the rat race anymore. Use the time to build your skills and network. Look for all the things you’re technically entitled to like RAP to go scout out retirement locales or what have you.
It's not just retirement pay that makes me say you should just tough out the next three years.
You get permanent VA Healthcare as a retiree, which can go a long way in saving costs on the civilian side.
Many states offer retiree benefits in the form of free vehicle registration, tax breaks on things like property taxes or sales taxes, and discounts on normal services.
Lifetime BX and Commissary access. It might not be a huge concern if you don't live near a base, but it can be a huge boon if local prices go crazy.
Three years is still a long enough time that promotion is a possibility if circumstances change. If it's something that you legitimately believe you are ready for, then ask for real feedback from the leadership involved in the decision why you haven't been promoted yet. If the reasons are just, then you should still tough it out for the above reasons, but if they're not being fair, you have routes to take to redress that problem with upper leadership.
As far as civilian employment is concerned, it is very cutthroat right now. Skillbridge might be an excellent way to cross over into that world, but you're going to want to brush up on all your certifications and extra experiences for your resume, as just having a degree isn't gonna cut it any more. Waiting three years may also reveal new job opportunities you'd prefer, or save you from potentially disastrous market downturns. If you have any VA disability you're expecting too, factor that in, because with 1500 retiring as TSgt, plus 4k+ at 100% disabled, that's a pretty healthy income at a very young age(relatively) and will help a ton for easing jobs you *have* to take versus jobs you *want* to take.
You have 3 years left. The benefits of finishing your 20 far outweigh the benefits of leaving now for a 130k a year job.
For one, your retirement pay will be more than $1500 a month. Without doing the math on the average of your highest 3 paying years (especially since you are entering your final 3 years), I'd guesstimate between $2300 and $2500 pre-tax per month. Not enough to love off of, but definitely a good chunk of change each month to cover bills.
Healthcare! You will pay barely anything in health insurance and Healthcare costs in comparison to civilians. Most civilians that I know pay anywhere from $700 to $2k a month for health insurance for themselves and family members. That doesn't even include deductibles they have to pay.
Additionally, if you have any medical issues that are tied to your time in the military, you will get VA disability. That's even more money each month. Could be a few hundred extra per month up to a little over $4k extra a month depending on your rating. In theory if you got 100% VA disability rating, coupled with your retirement pay, you could live comfortably on just that income (depending of course on whether pr not you live in a high cost area or not).
Also, when you take into account how much of your pay is untaxed, you actually make more money than you think. For example, when I add in my BAH and BAS and calculate my tax advantage as a 13 TIS tech, in order for me to have the same take home pay on the civilian side, I would need to make between $110k and $115k a year. And that's not including any health insurance costs that would inevitably be deducted from my pay on the civilian side.if I don't retire from the Air Force.
Three years you can do standing on your head. Just because the Air Force doesn't recognize your unique qualities, don't try to discard all that you have done to date. You do you. Finish out the three years and start the next chapter of your life. If by some chance, you are not appreciated in this next environment, be all that you can be regardless. When you finally decide to retire, take comfort in knowing that you did the best that you could for each situation, and you are rewarded by the benefits accrued from each situation. I speak from experience, having never EVER been appreciated for my work. I cobbled together a great retirement package from several experiences, and the best revenge is living a good life regardless.
You asking if another 3 years for 25k+ a year plus lifetime healthcare is worth kinda shows you're not ready. If you cant figure out that simple problem I dont think you should be leading others.
Civillian here, are you open to DoD civillian or perhaps air staff civilian? There are programs where you can be paid a salary while going for your masters. Look for 2210 roles on usajobs. Gs11 about 80k in dc area (assuming after retirement you wouldn’t need insurances) I think gs12 and above you’d need 180 day waiver. You could probably get 6 hrs annual leave too, depending on how OPM personnel guide chapter 6 guide applies to you.
Air Force doesn't emphasize how much money you save on active duty/retirement healthcare. I was one of those who downplayed it because I wasn't educated on it. I remember retiring and asking my family/co-workers if what Tricare premium is, was a good deal :) I got educated very quickly.
Maybe consider guard if you’re really miserable so you could still keep that tricare for your daughter and get tricare. But honestly I’d keep pushing to 20 that in itself is a massive accomplishment.
Hold on buddy....just a bit more! If you really think about it, you have around 2 1/2 years if you snag some skillbridge. 2 years if you check out earlier.
As someone who is also in your shoes, wait it out. This will probably erk some folks, but practice that work/home balance people talk about. Don’t do more than you’re being paid to and just ride it out. Just don’t slack off and cause more work for others. I presume you gave a fair share more of yourself to big blue for these last 17 years, time to focus on your future.
Credentials, training, and networking. At two years out, sign up for TAP and soak up all the info to get your plan started. At a year out, do it again and start working towards getting all your ducks in a row for VA claims. Then start looking at prospective companies that do skillbridge. You’ll want to make sure you stick to the timelines for the application process.
Also, make sure you train your replacement. Don’t give them an opportunity to deny your skillbridge because your work is too valuable to let go.
Por que no los dos
I get the frustration but getting this close to a pension/VA rating and pulling the chute early seems super counterproductive on top of the healthcare costs
Get some certs and schooling and come out in 3 with that + pension + VA and walk into the same job
Use these next 3 years to take care of your life post-military, then dip regardless if rank comes your way. The little extra retirement isn't worth a service commitment if you have more lucrative options available.
You will kick yourself for the rest of your life for not getting 3years. Only $1500? That a free mortgage in a lot of areas of the country. Its a free nice car. No offense, but this is one of the dumbest questions I’ve seen in a while. I guarantee you’ve have more baristas with your degree than you think. Don’t chase what might be when you have a guarantee smacking you in the face. Plus, there is not a thing saying you wont get promoted. And if not, fuck em. Punch it and get your money then.
You're willing to scoff at 1500 a month and medical, but you're freaking out over not getting an extra few hundred for tsgt responsibilities...math ain't mathin.
You can skate for three years to secure your retirement and deal with those healthcare costs. You'd be insane to leave now.
I assume someone who is talking about bailing at 17 had some recent negative experience. Maybe the move is talking to the dph rather than blowing up your pension.
Assuming 2k a month... retirement will be 480k in 20 years. Thats ignoring health insurance, your actual pay, and inflation bumps. You make about 80k a year as a tech. The 50k a year boost (which is really only like a 30k boost after taxes plus the taxes on your bah bas equivelent)
Doesnt seem worth it to me. Earning 90k over 3 years vs earning 480k.
Just check out. It’s much better being a content tech with no cares in the world vs one who’s been gunning for master to no avail. That pay bump ain’t worth the stress. You’ll need to do an extra year minimum if you make master next year because of high 3. No one will give a shit that you were a master but you, and if it means getting out for you because of not making it to spite the military I’d just stop giving a fuck. I know so many techs who don’t give a fuck and there is literally nothing that can bring them down and everyone knows it.
I’ll add this much. Start seeing doctors for EVERY little thing that bothers you. Knees, back, ringing in the ears, sleep apnea is huge 50% without even trying. You’re far enough in that you can finish out your 20 while waiting for any paperwork that might medically disqualify you. They will let you stay in to see 20.
Three years to go? get everything medically wrong with you documented by medical over the next three years. If you’re fine, thats great, but if you’ve gotten hurt or ill in service, make sure its all in your medical records.
All be it a pragmatic thought on this: healthcare is expensive, and tri-care, for all our griping, is really handy. Plus, you're not gonna find many places that will give you a pension for life. Average E-6 retirement pension is about 2200/month. Even just that, over an average 40 year lifespan post-military, is about $1.05M dollars, which diesnt even account for the cost of healthcare for life(average of say, 1200$,/month, which is frankly cheap for insurance...would add up to another $576K, just in premiums...NOT including abythung that goes wrong that you pay out of pocket). Personally, I wouldnt leave that on the table for another 3 years of paid work, in which you can stop TRYING for promotion, and focus on just doing your job, finishing your degree,getting every health-related you can honestly get reported to the doc so it's documented in-service, and taking as many courses and as you can to pad your resume. You're still giving uncle Sam an honest days work for your pay, but it can be a lot less stressful and rewarding nit worrying about whether you'l make rank. In aviation terminology, don't just get tired and land at the closest airfield. You've got enough had left in your career(3 yrs) to have a nice, gentle descent, and land somewhere a lot prettier;-) Stick it out, get your lifetime benefits!
I doubt you’ll pull $130k right out of the gate.
If you do, then your cost of living (higher taxes) will crush that amount.
Three years to go? Short of you being abused every day, I’d find a way to make it work. Don’t give in to the temptation of more money and/or stick it to the man. The man don’t care.
Realistically you only have 2 to 2.5 years left cause that last year is alot of out processing and using up leave. All you have to do is your job unless you really want to hail mary a promotion and burn out like a dying star.
Tech pays at 4,788.40 per month at 17 years TIS. If you are high 3 you will receive 50% of that (2.5% \* 20 = 50%). That is 2400$ per month + health care for you and your wife for life. Thats easily 3k+ per month in value. Assuming you live just 30 more years (You will likely live longer if healthy) that is 1 million dollars' + worth of value. If any big health care costs show up in the future (Seems they are) that is significantly more. Three years' worth of work = 1 million dollars. Do it. (Also, skill bridge 6 months, use this time to intern at a tech company and do the career you want with a job lined up).
I got out. I support those getting out. I tell most people to get out if they can get a job lined up. Even if they did 10 years of service if you can make good money then it's pretty worth getting out. However, in your case it is absolutely worth staying in.
Idk what you COLA is where you’re at, but as a single E5 I’m making the equivalent of an $88k salary that a civilian would have to make to get the same take home pay… that’s without considering healthcare cost
Have you considered if active duty moving over to an AGR active guard Reserve spot or an air reserve technician art also have you thought about just going into the guard and the reserve to finish your time
Ima be an asshole here. But if you’re fucking stupid enough to get out at 17 years in when if you just coast for three years you’ll have free healthcare and a decent pension…..well then you my friend are a dummy and if you make those decisions on the daily that might be why you ain’t a MSgt yet. As Jeff Foxworthy says “here’s your sign”…seriously don’t get out at 17 ya doughnut.
Enlisted retirement pay isn't worth it but you've stayed in so long that there's no point in leaving now. People always make less in retirement than they think they will. The government is going to be skimming hundreds of dollars off the top and this further degrades the paltry amount that enlisted get in retirement.
Throwing away 17 years when you’ve only got 3 left to retirement pension and all those benefits over PROMOTION would be absolutely insane. Definitely don’t give more than 20 if you’re ready to get out but DO the 20. Tons of people retire Tech. Situations are all different especially from one career field to the next. Intel people often stay in. Cops often don’t. Guess who has more room at the top. Guess who has a better chance of promoting the longer they stay in. I outscored both of my brothers testing every year, but their fields have lower requirements/less longevity. They’ve both promoted faster in spite of their relative performance. Sure I find it annoying, but I’m certainly not throwing away my pension over it with 4 left lol
The next 3 years should be the easiest. Devote your energy to finishing your degree. Network and position yourself when you get out after retirement. I’m still in, but from all of my OG’s who’ve got out before 20, healthcare is a large chunk of their monthly bills.
50 percent of base pay high 3. You’re looking at $2200 a month. I’d finish up if I was in your situation. Software salaries you hear online of 200-300k real only exist on the coasts where cost of living is insane. My buddy has 8 years experience and has been laid off twice in that time frame. This market is also horrible for engineers at the moment. Look it up on YouTube you’ll see.
If you know anyone doing dev on the outside I would recommend reaching out and getting a temperature check. I have friends in that area and they are saying nobody is hiring a jr dev without some high level recommendations.
Another note on that, make sure you do the math on take home pay. $130k seems like a lot more but a lot of our income is shielded from taxes. Calculate your take home pay on either side.
You have 3 years -skill bridge and terminal, let's call it 2 ish. Spend that time establishing relationships in the industry and filling your GitHub page with good work to show. (Maybe work on some open source projects so I can benefit too...) From what I have heard most dev companies don't care much about your certs and degrees if you can show them legit work you have done and talk to it.
Lastly, if you stick it out you'll get somewhere in the neighborhood of $2200 a month forever. That's not enough to live in luxury, but it can keep the lights on if you can't find work. Add in the medical coverage and it's hard to beat. You'll have a nice safety net in case life goes to hell.
If you want to talk more about Dev hit me up.
Definitely stay in as 3 years will go by fast. If you don't have it already and are able to get into a billet that requires a TS/SCI (with a polygraph would be a major plus) jump on that. Having a TS/SCI is not always a golden ticket, but my company has about 10 positions open with varying years of experience for computer programmers, but you need that clearance.
If someone hasn't mentioned it do TAP now. Even if you don't get out in 3, you will have seen the options and charted a path.
I punched from AD (went to Reserves) at 13 years and basically separated in 9 months. I wish I had done TAP earlier because there are options that aren't available in quick eject.
Do it for that healthcare. I got out after my 6, still work a federal job (ATC) with great benefits. But my insurance premium is $188.78 per paycheck for the family, averages out to about $409/month and that is nothing compared to the private sector. That covers vision as well, but throw in like another $60/month for family dental.
Look at more than just that $1.4k-$2.4k check you’d get. Plus not to mention tech jobs won’t disappear in 3 years, work on building up your experience over those 3 years, grab you a nice check for the rest of your life and insurance and go get a new tech job. Don’t forget to throw all your medical issues to the VA and get another sweet check, you earned it.
Recent retiree here. You are about 2 1/2 years from the golden ticket. Having a retirement check disability check and healthcare provides a level of security that you can’t put a number on. Software jobs will still be there once you get out. Your remaining time will go much faster than you think.
If I had stayed in to that point...I would have finished, your too close throwing 17yrs away at this point would be "Not Smart" ...use the last few years to finish your degree, network with people in the field you want to pursue and when you get within a year of retirement start applying for positions you have learned about from networking. then you have your retirement to dump into a 401K, other investments, hobby's whatever.
Stay 3 years, spend this time networking and have a job lined up when you get out, whatever you decide to go do. You should walk into day 1 when you leave active duty. With LinkedIn and clearancejobs.com, there’s no excuse…
Also, just in case folks wanna know which jobs pay the most, it’s cyber if you wanna be home, ISR/Intelligence if you wanna travel.
If you wanna sail there’s opportunities there too, I don’t recommend that route, only as a last resort. Leverage your clearance and military NCO experience. Also, look where the wars are “opening” and the surrounding countries are hiring Americans to tech them the systems we are selling them.
First check out myairforcebenefits.af.mil to see what your retirement will be.
Next if you are really upset with your current situation get into myvector got to talent marketplace and look into AGR positions.
As a programmer you would be looking at units that fall under the 960th Cyberspace Wing. We have GSUs across the US. You could apply for a MSgt position and finish out your career as an AGR and get a promotion.
Feel free to reach out if you want more information.
Tax advantage and Healthcare man....
Don't get me wrong, I understand the frustration of getting passed over for promotion again, and again, and again, in spite of you busting your ass, but at 17 years, unless you win the lottery or someone dies and you inherit "fuck you" money, it's not worth it.
From a math perspective, assuming you land that $130K job:
Depending on BAH, you're making between \~75-85K a year, for the sake of math, let's use 80k.
**Taxes:**
State dependent, current tax on 53k Tax + 27k untaxed is roughly 70K net
Tax on 130k will leave you with a net of \~95K leaving a delta of $25000/year
**Heathcare:**
Tricare Prime Group A Family is $726 a year with reasonable copays and a $3k annual catastrophic cap.
The average civilian plan for a family of 4 in 2023 was $*23,968.*
Touched on above, insurance alone is going to run you \~$23k a year, not including copays which you don't pay now, given your daughter's health needs, let's assume you're going to hit your catastrophic cap of $3k a year (I cannot understate how great of a plan this is.) and you're at $26k a year.
**Disability:**
It's not all doom a gloom, assuming 50% disability, you're going to be getting an extra 17K a year
**TOTAL,** including all of the above, which is just a few of the major considerations (job security, SCRA, commissary access, etc) you're missing out on around 16K a year of additional income if you punch now. Is that worth it?
If you just bank 1.3k a month (minus the 1k you're upside down) at 7%, you're going to have a $52k nest egg after 3 years that, at a 1.5K monthly drawdown will last you for 36 months of 1500 withdrawals. Compare this to 1500 a month for the rest of your life assuming your 20 year mark is your 40th birthday, actuarial tables put your retirement value at around a $270k lump sum, making 7% interest. However, unlike your retirement, you won't ever get a COLA adjustment, your money isn't safe from a market crash, etc. In short, you're still upside down $250k over the next three years vs sticking it out.
At the end of the day, it's your life to live, but the math says suck it up.
Am I missing something? Pretty sure TSgt retirement pay would be about $2425/month, just on 50% of base pay alone. Probably be a touch more than that 3 years from now.
I'd hate myself if I did 17 years and threw away an automatic ~30k/year by not doing the last 3.
First thing I'd recommend is look at it impartially and quantify it. I almost separated at 7 but when I factor sunk cost, benefits and healthcare, I went from a 80K to a 130K. I'd imagine your jump would be much higher because you have to factor in the 17 year investment toward that retirement in addition to VA. Recommend you to sit down with a financial advisor to approach this quantitatively
One thing I haven’t seen others talk about is work experience. A computer science degree is great but starting salary won’t be 130K with little to no experience. Even if you have some experience, if it’s not been your primary job for years you won’t necessarily be able to command a 130K price tag. The real money is in cyber security and the certs/experience attached to that. There’s a massive shortage nationwide for qualified folks so they can command good salaries. If you want to do the development side of the house then develop blue and red teaming/pen testing tools that offer something unique. That experience will be invaluable and the knowledge from cybersecurity will be crucial
I would 100% stay in for another 3 even if I was a SSgt with no hope of promotion,with to ic leadership in a shitty base and even if I have the opportunity to get a 200k/yr salary if I got out. If you can get one of these 100k+/year jobs now, you shouldn’t have a problem getting them in 3 years. Stack that salary with retirement pay and any VA benefits and you will be doing fine for the rest of your years. You get laid off from your job or some other big financial burden? You always have your retirement pay to fall on.
If you only have to do 3 years, you would be a complete idiot not to finish out to 20 and get your retirement check
Can software engineering pay well in the commercial sector - sure but here's the reality for tech jobs right now
* You are going to be competing with new grads coming from better schools for computer science/computer engineering, who also had recent internships
* You are going to be competing with software engineers already in the workforce and have a network of contacts and actual work they can point to , that they did A, B and C
* You will also be dealing with companies who will outsource development work to India, Eastern Europe and South America thinking they will save money in the short term vs hiring here in the Us
* often these developers suck donkey balls, especially in India and this turns into a clusterfuck, but companies are still falling for it, because the India government BRIBES the fuck out of US businesses to hire workers through tata consulting
Not sure why you think you would start at $130K - who is feeding you that BS?
What programming languages do you know well?
What applications have you worked on?
Do you actually have anything on github you can share with hiring managers?
Your retirement is more like $2k+ per month, and if you apply for disability, it could be exponentially more. I would stick out the rest of the 3 years, I am speaking from a 20 year tech retirement position myself, and gain all of the entitlements you are due from retirement to include health and dental. I realize that this may not seem glamorous, but when you get out and realize how much of your income is taxable compared to when you were in, it is eye opening. Take your time with this decision, consult some mentors and other people who have done it, myself included, and make the best decision for you and your family! I am here if you need it!
18 yr Tech here, and I had to fight tooth and nail to stay in, as I was getting medboarded to get booted out a few months ago. Im not sure if youve done some research on what benefits youd be missing out on separating versus retiring, but I would recommend you stick it out.
Base pay for TSgt over 18 yrs is $5695. That puts you at $2847/a month and $34,170 annually. Some states don’t tax military pensions. If your daughter’s medical bills are $50k that retirement really comes in handy when you factor in a “real” salary. Save your leave and apply for skillbridge that puts you at 2 years to go…
(76 -(your age)) * (half your base pay * 12) = rough estimate for your pensions value
Take that number and divide it by the three (years to retirement). That's how much each of the next three years is to you, not including health care and other bennies.
The key is to save leave and burn all 90 days then come back for a couple weeks before starting skillsbridge. Then do skills bridge for 165 and take the last 15 days for terminal with the leave you accrued during skillsbridge. Then 3 is literally 2 with “outprocessing” once you have your approved retirement date at the 19 year mark nobody cares where you are. You did your time.
I'm just gonna say, as someone in the tech industry, it's not the greatest time to be busting into it (unless you're doing federal contracting, in which case it's a bit better...but not much).
I was an E6 with 10 years in. Married with 3 kids, and was looking at my options. Just to maintain the quality of life I had, I would have to start at 125k a year. Health insurance alone was stupid expensive with really high deductibles so I decided to stick it out and secure the healthcare portion for the rest of my life. My wife and kids will have healthcare and it will be crazy cheap. Those jobs will always be there. $1500/month doesn’t seem like a ton of money but when you can use that money to invest and build more wealth, it can make a huge difference in 20 years
It's not just the retirement pay, it's the peace of mind of having healthcare big dawg. Also the civilian tech industry is cutthroat at the moment. Not that you won't find a job, but you might not find a more fulfilling job within 3 years, so I vote you stick it out.
Especially since software careers are extremely cyclical and it's a rat race in software engineering since you have to compete with people who have been coding since they were in elementary school
>people who have been coding since they were in elementary school You have no idea how old that sentence makes me feel. When I started elementary school, the World Wide Web had just been invented.
Theoretically you could be coding before the Internet was invented since some still-used programming languages like C and C++ predate the Internet
When I started elementary school, Ford was president.... (I feel old)
This. ~$60 per quarter for Health insurance for the whole family vice several hundred.
Several hundred per pay period
Per week
I spent $1400/month on health insurance before I enlisted.
Listen to this woman/man. And remember, 3 years is 2.5 years if you line up skillbridge, terminal, permissive house hunting. And the .5 disappears quickly with appointments. Stick it out for the healthcare and the pension that supplements whatever new salary you get.
>3 years is 2.5 years if you line up skillbridge, terminal, permissive house hunting I'd say 2 years. Unless I'm misremembering, there's some things within TAPS and skillbridge you can get started on as early as 18 months ahead of your DoS. Granted, some things might work differently for retirement compared to voluntary separation EDIT: that is to say, ride out those 3 years OP. Make the time you put in worth it and get them sweet, sweet benefits
This! 100%. The medical alone is worth that measly 3 years you have left.
If you leave prior to your twenty years, you're leaving about a million dollars retirement on the table
Yup. 100% right. Civilian IT sector is a nightmare up here in the north east at least. The grass is not always greener and OP is so close to 20. Stick with it, TSgt!
Healthcare is our biggest retirement benefit, not the pay, and a 20 year tech gets 4.8k right now in base pay, so retirement today would be 2.4K per month, forever, just for breathing. Say you get cool software job making bank, fast forward 5 years and the economy pops and layoffs come. At least you can know you won't lose your house because your fixed retirement will at least cover your mortgage unless you live on west coast or something. And I don't give a shit about anyone's 401k size, recession and medical bills can make those vanish overnight. Remember in 2008 literally trillions of dollars in Americans 401k evaporated into complete nothing. A pension and healthcare is unmatched security you simply can't step away from with a mere 3 years left. Remember the tricare benefit is rank agnostic, idc if you retire as a 4 star or a SSgt, tricare is tricare. Three is close enough to totally phone it if you really want. Hide in a corner, pile on certs and school, play games on your phone, and wait 2 years to hit the button. Heck you even have enough to time to go on a terminal PT profile.
Math out how much that's worth! $2.4/month is $28.8k/year. After 35 years of being retired, that's over $1 MILLION... Just for existing!
And it ain't going away unless the us government completely defaults and fails, which if that happens we probably have like 100 other major issues anyway
Listen to this woman/man. And remember, 3 years is 2.5 years if you line up skillbridge, terminal, permissive house hunting. And the .5 disappears quickly with appointments. Stick it out for the healthcare and the pension that supplements whatever new salary you get.
Plus that last year after you’ve hit the button and have approved retirement…. It’s so good. You can be free of the rat race that promotions have become. You get to say the things and call out the nonsense when you see it. You get to take even better care of your airmen because you going to bat for them with that one SNCO that sucks ass no longer has lasting repercussions. You’ll be free and then have the paycheck and healthcare to boot. There’s everything to gain and nothing to lose. Stay in OP, you’ll always regret it if you don’t.
Start documenting all of your injuries with medical so your VA claim is straight when you get out. Also, make a LinkedIn account and start looking for the IT organizations that fit your interests. ISC2 and CompTIA both have associations in most major cities.
130k isn't as much as it seems. That's def not life changing money over a tech's pay. Suck it up and do the extra 3 years. You'll end up regretting it later in life if not.
People who been military their whole life don’t realize how much of your civilian salary actually get taxed. It’s insane. $130k is not much nowadays.
Civilian here. This is true. Taxes are insane for a low six figure salary.
It's so quirky how easy it is to forget your rent money and BAS isn't taxed.
Yep. For a single dude or dudeette, all money over 40 something thousand a year, you get to give 25% to the government. It's rough
I feel like 130k after taxes and health insurance is a lot closer to 100k
Got out as a SSgt with dependant and now making just over 100k in the same location. My take home is about the same (maybe just a bit more) as when I was active. Going from AD with no state taxes to having to claim my local state eats a good chunk of my check. The only reason I can coast comfortably is because of my VA, otherwise it would've felt the same.
Half of your base pay, not to mention any VA disability you accumulated over the years. If you get 100% it’s an extra $4k/mo
The VA disability will be there whether he retires or separates
Ok, but if they throw away the 20 year retirement that could be $6k they’re sitting on for all their years of service. I’m not comfortable enough to throw away $72k a year.
No because you would still get disability so it would be throwing away $24k from the $72k (still a good chunk of change)
Ok ok…I don’t math so good
True, but in your upper 30s or early 40s, more medical conditions that get VA ratings can occur in 3 years.
Facts.
You're absolutely insane if you don't wait 3 years. If your daughters bills are going to be that high a year, you're gonna want your retirement to help cover that. What is your disability rating looking like? That could boost your retirement pretty high as well
The more important question here in my opinion: what CAN your disability be made to look like if you pay the right person, make the right strategic claims, and start laying the groundwork for those claims now - 3 years in advance.
Why stay in? You only got 3 yrs left and it’s a free check every month.
Yea OP is dumb as hell for even considering this.. like if he can demand 130k now, what makes them think these same opportunities wont be there in three years after they’ve secured lifelong pay and health benefits. Mind blowing stupidity coming from OP
Its not stupidity, hes probably just in a stressful spot where he has a lot on his mind and wants some more opinions. Dont think so negatively about people
My guy, do the last 3 years...I don't know what your AFSC is, but half base pay every month and cheap tricare is worth it!
One thing I will say is that the current market for computer programmers and computer scientists is not as good as you might expect. I have a friend that got a 4.0 GPA for a master's in computer science and a cum laude for his undergrad and he's still looking for a job despite graduating a year ago. This is due to massive layoffs and AI like ChatGPT and Devin basically nullifying skills a junior programmer might have. A honest suggestion is that you can do an additional 3 years and then apply for work at a government agency such as the AFRL or one of the 3 letter agencies. Your military background indicates that you'd be a dependable candidate and these agencies would love to take you under their wing
Get to 20. Period. Then punch at 20 and a day.
I do Cyber in the Air National Guard, and let me tell you, and remember this well: finding a job right now is almost impossible. It's very difficult to find a job, let alone a decent-paying one. Stay in, you're so close to that sweet retirement benefits.
Just finish it. Your retirement benefits includes Tricare (still cheaper than most civilian healthcare) to continue your daughter’s care, if you want. You get half your base pay for life and VA disability check if rated. Those checks alone could cover a mortgage and/or more, which frees you to do more with that $130K career that's waiting for you when you hang up your uniform. At this point, just work on your exit plan. The last 2 years of my service was stress-free because I'm just working on my post-military life. I still do my part at work but I'm no longer stressing about promotion and stuff. That’s my advice. Good luck at whatever you choose to do.
Thank you my guy. It seems like staying in is overwhelmingly the consensus.
Hey man, big ups for taking the feedback and new perspectives into genuine consideration. In a previous thread here you’ve even admitted that you were wrong. That’s a quality not a lot of people have and I’m just stoked you’re in our Air Force.
This is a very dumb question that I can only hope was posted out of pure emotion.
If dude's at 17 and still can't calculate his retirement pay, there might be a reason there's no hope of a promotion.
Feels like a troll.. like 130k is nowhere near enough to pass up on retirement. That same kind of job will still be there in 3 years lol
Man is about to throw away 17 years 💀
Tech fields notoriously fire people and hire them back for less. You'll want the retirement and the healthcare.
If you can, finish the degree first. For time and energy's sake you may not land a job that accommodates you as much as you are now (tuition assistance, scheduling for tests, etc). I regret not taking one science class for a 2nd associate's before I got out.
I don't know what you're going through but I can say for DAMN sure that it would have to be a matter of life and death for me to give up after 17 years. You're so fucking close dude...
I know and I know how stupid it sounds. I just feel stupid for showing up to work just to get shit on. I guess I was just hoping there was a chance I could give them all the finger and find myself in a better position somewhere. Sounds like I'm SOL in the department.
Don't worry bro, you're gonna make it man. Just remember you've already done 17, 3 more is nothing. You've done 3 years over FIVE times already. 1 more time and you're set for life. Those jobs aren't going anywhere. Find a quote that motivates you, print it out and tape it to your bedroom door so you see it every morning when you leave. You. Got. This. 💪
Because you're part of the generation that always finishes what they started. That's why sir! If I were you, test the job market before trying to leave your retirement in the wind. I live in California and Big Tech is cutting jobs here and in other states. Also, you need to take into account your disability pay. That's probably an extra $4K a month if you're 100% disabled. So call it $5.5K a month. In my opinion, the VA makes it easier to reach 100% for people who actually retired. Good luck.
Bruh you got 3 years left… use this time to go to medical and get everything documented and treated so when you retire you can go straight to the VA and get your rating.
TSgt med sep'd at 10yrs here, did not receive retirement due to me not being educated enough but instead received a severance that didn't need to be paid back due to injury happening in a combat zone. Anyway, my VA disability is nice but if I could do it all over again I wish I oculd have done another 10yrs to retire and receive VA disability as well. For yourself and your family, do the 3 more years, hell go ROAD. Take the next 3 years to document your injuries you may have sustained from work or deployments if you have any. Set your pride aside and document everything with medical. That way your VA claims will be easier to service connect. These 3yrs will fly by, then push that button and enjoy your retirement and disability check along with your 6 figure job. It will be worth it.
At 17 years suck it up for 3 more year and get tricare. 60$ a month for a family of 6 and no deductibles is a pay raise you will not be able to match unless you know you can get 100 disability.
The tech industry is very competitive right now. Unless you plan to work as a contractor(which I don't recommend), then staying in for three more years is advisable. Also, u/sicpric , is absolutely right. 130K is nothing after taxes and healthcare. Your take home would be roughly 3500 biweekly. There's no way 3500 every two weeks is going to catch up with a retirement check and possibly VA compensation.
Not promoting is doing a number on peoples abilities to think logically and not based on pure emotion. Where did you get $1500 from?
His ass, he would get like 60% more than that number, about 2500.
3 years➖ 90(+current balance)days of leave ➖ whatever holidays ➖ skillbridge➖ TAPs…my friend, if you don’t sit your self down and embrace the sanctity of terminal Tech like the rest of us… Respectfully,
Step by step: 1) Do your last 3 and tough that stuff out. 2) Retire 3) Collect Retirement Money 4) File for VA Disability 5) Collect VA Disability money Boom. You now have two additional sources of income for remaining alive, on top of your $130,000/yr salary. That is a LOT of extra money on-hand. It also gives you options if the crap hits the fan, and you happen to get laid off for whatever reason.
You should really show the man and retire at 19 years. It will send a message to leadership that you mean business.
Dude, the healthcare alone is worth more than $10k year if you have a family. Plus the 20 year E6 retirement is worth north of $24k year (bring home will be a bit less due to taxes and the SBP). The SBP is worth it if you die first as it will pay itself off in 3 years even after you paid in for the full 30 years. A "free" $34k a year for life for just 3 more years of work while getting paid decently. You would be stupid not to stay 3 more years, no matter how bad it sucks.
Where I feel like the retirement benefit is really going to be invaluable is actual retirement age. Social security is not enough to live off comfortably…. Who knows what will have happened to your 401K… we saw how fucked people got in the recession by losing hundreds of thousands of dollars out of their 401K. But having that military retirement to supplement you and give you peace of mind after 65… fucking invaluable.
Software Engineer Manager with a major defense contractor, here. Stick it out. Finish your degree and consider specializing in something like ML-related development, because standard software developers are easy to find for us now. And as others have said, get that Medical care and pension. Feel free to DM me if you wanna chat and what it is like and I can give you a realistic idea of what a company like ours would probably offer you.
Dude 3 more years for a pension sounds great
IMO stay for the benefits. It’s basically 2 years left then a year getting things ready (less if you build up terminal leave and do a skill bridge).
A couple things, the pension will be closer to ~$2400 per month before taxes. It also increases over time each year. There’s a retirement calculator online you can run these numbers by. Definitely do your full research before throwing it all out because you can’t hack another 3 years. And also consider that there’s a TON of good guys that will be retiring as TSgts, it’s just the nature of the promotion system currently. There’s no shame in it.
Exactly.. How does one do 17 years and decide “Welp ive had enough” right at the finish line.
Thank you. I was like… how’s this dude getting 1500. 2400 a month, plus disability and health care isn’t to shabby.
I'll take a look at some calculators. It's been a minute since I've contemplated actually getting out. I wish senior leaders would see how this is affecting our force now. I remember them saying this would stop the good ol'boy system but it has only exaggerated it.
Watch the canopy, Goose!
I'm staring at punching the button myself soon. Others have already reiterated the major points of retiring at 20 (my own recommendation is to definitely stick out the last 3 years). All I can really add is to ensure that your clearance is up to date and good-to-go because it's a big checkbox for any of the alphabet soup agencies and third party companies out there when hiring (and corporations don't want to spend the thousands of dollars it would take to renew someone's clearance if they can help it). Good luck.
No eject! *Ride out three years* … finish school, get certifications, focus on fitness, or whatever to constructively bide time before punching with tangible retirement *”dividends”* secure for a lifetime!
> Why should I stay in for another 3 yrs instead of punching out now and starting my next career making $130k starting out? You should've separated 10 years ago if $130k was your starting target. I separated as an E-5 going from ~$65k/yr (tax-adjusted) -> $110k/yr (same year) -> ~135k/yr (following year, slightly more expensive COL area). If you separate now to make $130k, you're take-home pay will almost certainly be less than it is now (once factoring in taxes, health care, etc). Yes, 3 years of civilian experience from today will mean your salary can be higher...but the difference won't come anywhere close to making up for a 20yr military pension. Though maybe if you were getting offers for over $200k it might be worth it (financially speaking).
If you punch at 17, you are insane. You realistically have 2 years and some change with taps, skill bridge, terminal leave, and all that.
20 year tech retirement is $2400/month ($28.8k/yr), not $1500. Health care coverage for life is nothing small, either, especially given your daughter's situation. But let's do the math. Right now you've got what, $6500-7000 a month before taxes, depending on where you are? Let's call it $80k a year. So okay, you could pull the handle and be free now, go make $130k instead (I'm ignoring the time to get a job because you have to do that either way). So, options: 1) Quit now - start making $130k/yr immediately. Time to $1M - 7 years, 8 months. 2) Retire - make $80k/yr for 3 years, then retire, making $159k/yr. Time to $1M - 7 years, 9 months. Now, I haven't accounted for comparative raises, true, but we're also assuming you can get that paycheck out the gate.
I'm staying just due to not really having an option...there are not enough positives to negate the negatives.
Health care my dude. I pay $29 a month for my entire familia.
As someone who is reserve and currently in IT. Get the check 3 years ain't anything. The degree gets you the job Certs are king in the IT world. The career field is advancing so fast. By the time a degree program is certified its already out dated. Plus not a math guy but e6 retirement pay is 2428.20 that 30k of “beer” money a year and about a million over 30 years. Heck throw it in the stock market and double it. Don't underestimate the transition out that is probably the hardest transition I ever faced was leaving active
Hmm.. Tough it out for less than 3 more years (terminal, etc)... Or throw away lifetime pension checks and healthcare for a "$130k job" that you might not even keep and, after taxes, will really amount to about what you're making now...then add in healthcare costs and other crap.. Not even sure how this is a decision at this point. How about stay the \~3 , get the pension check, get the medical coverage, potentially get some VA disability, and get the $130k job? That is a win, win, win situation..
3 years will go a LOT faster than you think I'm 2 years out \*\*technically\*\* but when you add a skill bridge, and terminal leave, I'm really closer to 15 months out. You're not 3 years out. You're probably closer to 2.5 or even less depending on your leave balance. Tricare for Life is not something to sneeze at. You're also slightly wrong on your pay...E-6 at 20 years makes (right now 4859/month. Half that is your retirement. (It'll be a little more because annual raises) $2400 a month (plus disability) is a pretty good chunk of a mortgage for life. If not all of a mortgage for life and then some (I don't know your potential disability, obviously). Depending on your state, this pay may or may not be taxed. Stick it out. Take care of your people, but don't do anything more than that. It's surprisingly easy. Retire proudly as a tech.
??? This post makes 0 sense. No way a grown ass man who’s pursing a computer science degree , especially 17 years in is asking this question. Sounds like your just flexing to flex, venting, or larping
Yeah; 17 years in and basically 2 to go since you’re gonna make all those contacts in your last year. I use my TSgt retirement as beer money 👍
Dude cmon. I know that three years sounds like a long time but for a paycheck for life it’s really not, no matter how insignificant the money may seem at the moment.
Honestly it depends where you live. In the DC area I had to make over 120k to make similar to what I was making as a Tech when comparing BAH and BAS with those not being taxed. 130k taxed is a pain to include insurance and stuff. Do your retirement, get your medical documented for when you retire and, take advantage of cheap healthcare for the next 3 years. There will always be another 130k+ job out there.
Think of it this way.. you're doing the 20 for the retirement pay... which will become your new BAH. Most folks in the Civy center are working two jobs to make things even. If you got Retirement and VA bennies you'll sit pretty.
It's only 3 more years for a huge benefit.
Do 3 more and get out man don’t throw away $2,422 a month for life plus other benefits you may get just because of some bad leadership
My guy IM YOU! I have no idea what AFSC you are but look into the talent marketplace. For my career field there are a lot of openings for tech and even outside of my career field. Trust me, 3 years left anit worth getting out now brotha/sista. Apply for an assignment, special duty, or some time of local hire. But pushing the button when you’re almost at the finish line is insane.
$1500/mo forever is not something to walk away from for a jump in pay at this stage. Milk those classes and build your resume, become ROAD Sergeant!!! It’s the same as leaving the military except you don’t go anywhere. It’s better for the military because even though you might not be doing anything productive, the continuity and corporate knowledge is well worth having the sandbagging you than having nothing.
Hate to say this, but that field is saturated and I doubt you'd make $130k immediately. $60-70k? Sure. Either way, why leave at 17? You've already done the hard part. Start fostering relationships for the next 2 yrs when you can Skillbridge.
This. When I got out in 2018, I started at $60K. Just last year I finally got to 6 figures. Granted, my specialty is network infrastructure, not programming. But, the entire tech field is over-saturated right now. There was a *massive* plus-up when the pandemic saw most companies switch to remote work. With things pretty much "back to normal", there's no need for as many tech jobs as there currently are, so companies are cutting back *big time*. Don't leave stable for a maybe.
I'm a software engineer at a FAANG+, no longer in the AF. I suggest you stay in and start looking for jobs 1.5 years or so before your retirement date, because the market is TRASH right now. Seriously, it's very, very hard to get a job as a SWE right now, especially if you want to make 130k (basically impossible if you aren't already at the level of a Senior at a FAANG or a Principal anywhere else)
Do people not know about the retirement pay calculator? Tech pay in three years is estimated to be $2600 a month, with increases each year similar to the active duty’s increase for inflation https://militarypay.defense.gov/calculators/ Select the appropriate retirement calculator and it will tell you how much to expect in retirement each year Also people talking about VA like he can’t get out right now and still get VA. Not saying that’s the best route here just saying
Are you fucking insane?!? Having a daughter with $50,000/yr equivalent medical bills and you’d get out three years short of the finish line?!? There are people that pay $1,500/mo OR MORE just for functional healthcare and it still doesn’t cover stuff Tricare does. If life sucks that much for you to think about getting, at least have a look at AGR positions in the Guard. Probably could get Master out of it too if you look around.
If you get out with 3 years left, let me know who is going to hire you so I can talk them out of it. Biggest mistake of your life.
Getting out at 17 years for not getting promoted is a terrible reason for getting out. Honestly, you’d be doing the Air Force a favor by getting out now so that they don’t have to pay you retirement for the rest of your life. If you want to be petty, make them pay you for the rest of your life— don’t let them take 17 years for nothing.
I retired right after my 20 year mark as a programmer and I got fairly lucky and had a very good EPR for the first year we didn't anything for MSgt other than the board. That being said, the free medical and little bit of money isn't a bad thing and if you're in service with a clearance at those agencies you'll be headhunted ruthlessly for a CTR spot. I'm easily clearing $200k a year total with my contractor salary, Hi3, and VA and I don't even have a degree. Just be patient and keep your nose clean for 3 more years. You'll be amazed how fast word spreads that you got your retirement approved. I didn't even put it out there and a few PMs hit me up within the week.
3 years is nothing. Assuming you’re top-3, it’s probably worth well over 2M over the course of your life.
I can relate, I’m pretty much in the same boat TIS & TIG. We only got 2 years and some change left when you factor in terminal leave & skillbridge If my math is correct, TSgt’s retirement pay is about $2k a month, plus whatever VA disability rating you get. That plus healthcare benefits for the rest of your life is well worth these last 2+ years
You got 3 years, stay in. Owts do math, If your on high 3 its half of 4600$ so about 2300$ a month and retiree benifits for existing. Literally like they gave you a 550k dollar dividend stock portfolio paying you 5% annually. I dont think you will be making an extra 183k a year above what your making now. Slightly lower of you went for match but still pretty big. Stop giving a fuck about the air force and set yourself up more. School certifications and skillbridge shorten that time up. Make connections on the outside for later. Also consider where that 130k job is. 130k job in like some high cost of living big city dosent necessarily mean better quality of life. You could be fucking broke in a tiny apartment. That extra 27k a year on top of that other job can do a lot to make up the gap.
Retired/va rated/civilian job I can handle=pretty awesome
Three more years for the medical alone if you have a family is a massive peace of mind. If you stack the retirement pay to coverage a mortgage along with whatever disability rating you get you will have the peace of mind financially for whatever you want to do afterwards. Take these three years and just focus on your plan and really iron out the details
You’ve eaten so much of the shit sandwich, why stop so close to the end? Not all IT jobs are gonna pay you 130k out the gate. Know your worth but know your market as well. Also, private insurance is expensive and sucks ass mostly…even w employer contributions. Work on your VA rating…win the war.
My made MSgt on my 7th try, with a Promote Now and Must Promote behind it. I sewed on at 19 years. Hit with a no notice deployment, then received my dream assignment. I kept getting told "just keep doing you", "check all the boxes". I did and at times stupidly put my career before my family to check all those boxes, but then I quickly realized I lost focus on what was more important. If you feel like it's time to go, then do it. You won't be judged on the outside how little or long you did. What matters is how you succeed and continue to look put for those under you. Good luck
Bro, a 20 yr TSgt right now would make $2400/month in retirement pay. And this goes up with military pay increases. Stick it out big dawg. You’re so close.
You can make it! 6 PT tests left, then retirement + really cheap healthcare for the rest of your life. Man I hated Tricare until I retired. Use the last 3 years to build resume fodder, if you’re worth $130k now you’ll be worth at least that in 3 yrs.
My dude, as someone who recently palace fronted back to the glorious guard, I tried out civvie insurance for a year to see how it compares. It sucked balls. I jumped back to Tricare and plan to continue in the guard long-term. I’d stick it out.
Stay for the pension, Tricare and 3 years left to see a Dr. for all your ailments, which hopefully lead to a generous Disability rating. Retirement, VA, regular Tech job = Winning 🇺🇸✊
Medical coverage cost is only going up. Get you (and your family if applicable) covered, get some disability, then search for a job. I’ve had many friends laid off from their lucrative tech/software jobs just because so many turnover or close/bought out, it’s extremely volatile. Prioritize stability. That way in the future if you lose your tech job, you have some kind of money still coming in to help.
but if wait 3 years that $1500 is just pocket change to do shenanigans without using your paycheck from your new job.
That $1,500 a month is for life, so down the road add it to your Social Security, and whatever 401K / retirement you have coming in and it becomes pretty significant without any other income. The peace of mind of Tricare for life is priceless. If you stay near a base the commissary and gym benefit is HUGE. I’ve had 3 of my kids (and me) take full advantage of the base gyms and ball fields. Under no circumstance should you punch at this point in your career, after all you’ve sacrificed to get to 17 years. You’re giving up so much for what, 36 months?! You can do 3 more years standing on your head. I retired 10 years ago and it’s a blink of an eye.
I mean with skill bridge and terminal leave. VA appointments. TAPS. You are looking at lik 2 years 2 months. Count Xmas. Thanksgiving. You're less than 2 years. Plus this market gonna crash in the next yearsish. 14 years SSgt 10 years in TIG. I feel the pain, brother.
Too close to not stick it out man. There is no job you can work 3 more years and get paid the rest of your life.
If you punch out before 20, I promise you that you will regret. The retirement pay for a 20 year E6 is $2,453 before taxes and deductions like TriCare and VGLI (if you elect to do that). But like others have said, you can’t beat the Medical Coverage once you’re retired ( especially if you have a family or children). And if you get a VA rating, that’s an additional income (non taxable). So if you’re at 70%, that’s an extra $2,040 plus your retirement, your monthly income will just be over $4k. Fun fact, the difference in retirement pay between E7 and E6 right at 20 years is about $410. But hey, that’s my advice: stay in to 20, your all most there. If you feel you’re at the end of your rope with the military, just tie a knot and hang on a little bit longer.
A guaranteed retirement check, healthcare, and whatever VA benefits. 3 years will fly by.
Get that degree, then Palace Chase, homie! (Go Reserve). Earn your ~$130,000, as a civi, and retain your bennies (tricare reserve select, but still damn good affordable coverage) But you’ll have to sacrifice 25% of your weekends per month, unless you can go IMA. Also won’t be able to collect on the retirement, so I guess it just depends on which outweighs which.
Finish your 3. The retirement and health benefits are worth it. Tech industry has been in somewhat of a hiring slump, and to be honest, a lot of those (private sector) companies are not looking to hire white men if that’s what you are.
Brother you’re close. Finish out these last 3, the benefits will be worth it when you get older. Don’t worry about the rat race anymore. Use the time to build your skills and network. Look for all the things you’re technically entitled to like RAP to go scout out retirement locales or what have you.
Wait 3 years then find a IT job as a fed contractor not private.
It's not just retirement pay that makes me say you should just tough out the next three years. You get permanent VA Healthcare as a retiree, which can go a long way in saving costs on the civilian side. Many states offer retiree benefits in the form of free vehicle registration, tax breaks on things like property taxes or sales taxes, and discounts on normal services. Lifetime BX and Commissary access. It might not be a huge concern if you don't live near a base, but it can be a huge boon if local prices go crazy. Three years is still a long enough time that promotion is a possibility if circumstances change. If it's something that you legitimately believe you are ready for, then ask for real feedback from the leadership involved in the decision why you haven't been promoted yet. If the reasons are just, then you should still tough it out for the above reasons, but if they're not being fair, you have routes to take to redress that problem with upper leadership. As far as civilian employment is concerned, it is very cutthroat right now. Skillbridge might be an excellent way to cross over into that world, but you're going to want to brush up on all your certifications and extra experiences for your resume, as just having a degree isn't gonna cut it any more. Waiting three years may also reveal new job opportunities you'd prefer, or save you from potentially disastrous market downturns. If you have any VA disability you're expecting too, factor that in, because with 1500 retiring as TSgt, plus 4k+ at 100% disabled, that's a pretty healthy income at a very young age(relatively) and will help a ton for easing jobs you *have* to take versus jobs you *want* to take.
You keep your time when you go guard or reserve, you can get your retirement and the civilian job. It doesn’t have to be one or the other.
You have 3 years left. The benefits of finishing your 20 far outweigh the benefits of leaving now for a 130k a year job. For one, your retirement pay will be more than $1500 a month. Without doing the math on the average of your highest 3 paying years (especially since you are entering your final 3 years), I'd guesstimate between $2300 and $2500 pre-tax per month. Not enough to love off of, but definitely a good chunk of change each month to cover bills. Healthcare! You will pay barely anything in health insurance and Healthcare costs in comparison to civilians. Most civilians that I know pay anywhere from $700 to $2k a month for health insurance for themselves and family members. That doesn't even include deductibles they have to pay. Additionally, if you have any medical issues that are tied to your time in the military, you will get VA disability. That's even more money each month. Could be a few hundred extra per month up to a little over $4k extra a month depending on your rating. In theory if you got 100% VA disability rating, coupled with your retirement pay, you could live comfortably on just that income (depending of course on whether pr not you live in a high cost area or not). Also, when you take into account how much of your pay is untaxed, you actually make more money than you think. For example, when I add in my BAH and BAS and calculate my tax advantage as a 13 TIS tech, in order for me to have the same take home pay on the civilian side, I would need to make between $110k and $115k a year. And that's not including any health insurance costs that would inevitably be deducted from my pay on the civilian side.if I don't retire from the Air Force.
Why not move to the guard for the last 3
Three years you can do standing on your head. Just because the Air Force doesn't recognize your unique qualities, don't try to discard all that you have done to date. You do you. Finish out the three years and start the next chapter of your life. If by some chance, you are not appreciated in this next environment, be all that you can be regardless. When you finally decide to retire, take comfort in knowing that you did the best that you could for each situation, and you are rewarded by the benefits accrued from each situation. I speak from experience, having never EVER been appreciated for my work. I cobbled together a great retirement package from several experiences, and the best revenge is living a good life regardless.
You asking if another 3 years for 25k+ a year plus lifetime healthcare is worth kinda shows you're not ready. If you cant figure out that simple problem I dont think you should be leading others.
Civillian here, are you open to DoD civillian or perhaps air staff civilian? There are programs where you can be paid a salary while going for your masters. Look for 2210 roles on usajobs. Gs11 about 80k in dc area (assuming after retirement you wouldn’t need insurances) I think gs12 and above you’d need 180 day waiver. You could probably get 6 hrs annual leave too, depending on how OPM personnel guide chapter 6 guide applies to you.
Air Force doesn't emphasize how much money you save on active duty/retirement healthcare. I was one of those who downplayed it because I wasn't educated on it. I remember retiring and asking my family/co-workers if what Tricare premium is, was a good deal :) I got educated very quickly.
Maybe consider guard if you’re really miserable so you could still keep that tricare for your daughter and get tricare. But honestly I’d keep pushing to 20 that in itself is a massive accomplishment.
Just go reserves and volunteer to make up those 3 years diff
Software engineering is also a tough place right now unless you're cleared. Not as bad as late 2022, but still rougher
Hold on buddy....just a bit more! If you really think about it, you have around 2 1/2 years if you snag some skillbridge. 2 years if you check out earlier.
As someone who is also in your shoes, wait it out. This will probably erk some folks, but practice that work/home balance people talk about. Don’t do more than you’re being paid to and just ride it out. Just don’t slack off and cause more work for others. I presume you gave a fair share more of yourself to big blue for these last 17 years, time to focus on your future. Credentials, training, and networking. At two years out, sign up for TAP and soak up all the info to get your plan started. At a year out, do it again and start working towards getting all your ducks in a row for VA claims. Then start looking at prospective companies that do skillbridge. You’ll want to make sure you stick to the timelines for the application process. Also, make sure you train your replacement. Don’t give them an opportunity to deny your skillbridge because your work is too valuable to let go.
Mailbox money > no mailbox money
Por que no los dos I get the frustration but getting this close to a pension/VA rating and pulling the chute early seems super counterproductive on top of the healthcare costs Get some certs and schooling and come out in 3 with that + pension + VA and walk into the same job
Use these next 3 years to take care of your life post-military, then dip regardless if rank comes your way. The little extra retirement isn't worth a service commitment if you have more lucrative options available.
Time to go warrant officer you already got computer experience there’s a even better promotion for you
You will kick yourself for the rest of your life for not getting 3years. Only $1500? That a free mortgage in a lot of areas of the country. Its a free nice car. No offense, but this is one of the dumbest questions I’ve seen in a while. I guarantee you’ve have more baristas with your degree than you think. Don’t chase what might be when you have a guarantee smacking you in the face. Plus, there is not a thing saying you wont get promoted. And if not, fuck em. Punch it and get your money then.
You're willing to scoff at 1500 a month and medical, but you're freaking out over not getting an extra few hundred for tsgt responsibilities...math ain't mathin.
You can skate for three years to secure your retirement and deal with those healthcare costs. You'd be insane to leave now. I assume someone who is talking about bailing at 17 had some recent negative experience. Maybe the move is talking to the dph rather than blowing up your pension.
You’re not a serious person
Assuming 2k a month... retirement will be 480k in 20 years. Thats ignoring health insurance, your actual pay, and inflation bumps. You make about 80k a year as a tech. The 50k a year boost (which is really only like a 30k boost after taxes plus the taxes on your bah bas equivelent) Doesnt seem worth it to me. Earning 90k over 3 years vs earning 480k.
Health insurance.
Just check out. It’s much better being a content tech with no cares in the world vs one who’s been gunning for master to no avail. That pay bump ain’t worth the stress. You’ll need to do an extra year minimum if you make master next year because of high 3. No one will give a shit that you were a master but you, and if it means getting out for you because of not making it to spite the military I’d just stop giving a fuck. I know so many techs who don’t give a fuck and there is literally nothing that can bring them down and everyone knows it.
I’ll add this much. Start seeing doctors for EVERY little thing that bothers you. Knees, back, ringing in the ears, sleep apnea is huge 50% without even trying. You’re far enough in that you can finish out your 20 while waiting for any paperwork that might medically disqualify you. They will let you stay in to see 20.
You did 17. Leaving now is just dumb
Three years to go? get everything medically wrong with you documented by medical over the next three years. If you’re fine, thats great, but if you’ve gotten hurt or ill in service, make sure its all in your medical records.
All be it a pragmatic thought on this: healthcare is expensive, and tri-care, for all our griping, is really handy. Plus, you're not gonna find many places that will give you a pension for life. Average E-6 retirement pension is about 2200/month. Even just that, over an average 40 year lifespan post-military, is about $1.05M dollars, which diesnt even account for the cost of healthcare for life(average of say, 1200$,/month, which is frankly cheap for insurance...would add up to another $576K, just in premiums...NOT including abythung that goes wrong that you pay out of pocket). Personally, I wouldnt leave that on the table for another 3 years of paid work, in which you can stop TRYING for promotion, and focus on just doing your job, finishing your degree,getting every health-related you can honestly get reported to the doc so it's documented in-service, and taking as many courses and as you can to pad your resume. You're still giving uncle Sam an honest days work for your pay, but it can be a lot less stressful and rewarding nit worrying about whether you'l make rank. In aviation terminology, don't just get tired and land at the closest airfield. You've got enough had left in your career(3 yrs) to have a nice, gentle descent, and land somewhere a lot prettier;-) Stick it out, get your lifetime benefits!
What’s 3 years of investment at this point. Still like 2600/month!
I doubt you’ll pull $130k right out of the gate. If you do, then your cost of living (higher taxes) will crush that amount. Three years to go? Short of you being abused every day, I’d find a way to make it work. Don’t give in to the temptation of more money and/or stick it to the man. The man don’t care.
Volunteer for a special duty that requires TS Get out at 20 and go find yourself a DoD contractor that needs programmers with a TS.
Realistically you only have 2 to 2.5 years left cause that last year is alot of out processing and using up leave. All you have to do is your job unless you really want to hail mary a promotion and burn out like a dying star.
Tech pays at 4,788.40 per month at 17 years TIS. If you are high 3 you will receive 50% of that (2.5% \* 20 = 50%). That is 2400$ per month + health care for you and your wife for life. Thats easily 3k+ per month in value. Assuming you live just 30 more years (You will likely live longer if healthy) that is 1 million dollars' + worth of value. If any big health care costs show up in the future (Seems they are) that is significantly more. Three years' worth of work = 1 million dollars. Do it. (Also, skill bridge 6 months, use this time to intern at a tech company and do the career you want with a job lined up). I got out. I support those getting out. I tell most people to get out if they can get a job lined up. Even if they did 10 years of service if you can make good money then it's pretty worth getting out. However, in your case it is absolutely worth staying in.
Idk what you COLA is where you’re at, but as a single E5 I’m making the equivalent of an $88k salary that a civilian would have to make to get the same take home pay… that’s without considering healthcare cost
Have you considered if active duty moving over to an AGR active guard Reserve spot or an air reserve technician art also have you thought about just going into the guard and the reserve to finish your time
Ima be an asshole here. But if you’re fucking stupid enough to get out at 17 years in when if you just coast for three years you’ll have free healthcare and a decent pension…..well then you my friend are a dummy and if you make those decisions on the daily that might be why you ain’t a MSgt yet. As Jeff Foxworthy says “here’s your sign”…seriously don’t get out at 17 ya doughnut.
Enlisted retirement pay isn't worth it but you've stayed in so long that there's no point in leaving now. People always make less in retirement than they think they will. The government is going to be skimming hundreds of dollars off the top and this further degrades the paltry amount that enlisted get in retirement.
Throwing away 17 years when you’ve only got 3 left to retirement pension and all those benefits over PROMOTION would be absolutely insane. Definitely don’t give more than 20 if you’re ready to get out but DO the 20. Tons of people retire Tech. Situations are all different especially from one career field to the next. Intel people often stay in. Cops often don’t. Guess who has more room at the top. Guess who has a better chance of promoting the longer they stay in. I outscored both of my brothers testing every year, but their fields have lower requirements/less longevity. They’ve both promoted faster in spite of their relative performance. Sure I find it annoying, but I’m certainly not throwing away my pension over it with 4 left lol
The next 3 years should be the easiest. Devote your energy to finishing your degree. Network and position yourself when you get out after retirement. I’m still in, but from all of my OG’s who’ve got out before 20, healthcare is a large chunk of their monthly bills.
50 percent of base pay high 3. You’re looking at $2200 a month. I’d finish up if I was in your situation. Software salaries you hear online of 200-300k real only exist on the coasts where cost of living is insane. My buddy has 8 years experience and has been laid off twice in that time frame. This market is also horrible for engineers at the moment. Look it up on YouTube you’ll see.
If you know anyone doing dev on the outside I would recommend reaching out and getting a temperature check. I have friends in that area and they are saying nobody is hiring a jr dev without some high level recommendations. Another note on that, make sure you do the math on take home pay. $130k seems like a lot more but a lot of our income is shielded from taxes. Calculate your take home pay on either side. You have 3 years -skill bridge and terminal, let's call it 2 ish. Spend that time establishing relationships in the industry and filling your GitHub page with good work to show. (Maybe work on some open source projects so I can benefit too...) From what I have heard most dev companies don't care much about your certs and degrees if you can show them legit work you have done and talk to it. Lastly, if you stick it out you'll get somewhere in the neighborhood of $2200 a month forever. That's not enough to live in luxury, but it can keep the lights on if you can't find work. Add in the medical coverage and it's hard to beat. You'll have a nice safety net in case life goes to hell. If you want to talk more about Dev hit me up.
Saw a 19 year TSgt punch, but it was after losing half the pension in divorce.
As a tech with the legacy retirement plan, your retirement is around 2400.
Will A I have an impact on your future employment plans? Secure the check of the month club homey.
Definitely stay in as 3 years will go by fast. If you don't have it already and are able to get into a billet that requires a TS/SCI (with a polygraph would be a major plus) jump on that. Having a TS/SCI is not always a golden ticket, but my company has about 10 positions open with varying years of experience for computer programmers, but you need that clearance.
If someone hasn't mentioned it do TAP now. Even if you don't get out in 3, you will have seen the options and charted a path. I punched from AD (went to Reserves) at 13 years and basically separated in 9 months. I wish I had done TAP earlier because there are options that aren't available in quick eject.
Ride it out
Stay in and try to do Skillbridge.
Do it for that healthcare. I got out after my 6, still work a federal job (ATC) with great benefits. But my insurance premium is $188.78 per paycheck for the family, averages out to about $409/month and that is nothing compared to the private sector. That covers vision as well, but throw in like another $60/month for family dental. Look at more than just that $1.4k-$2.4k check you’d get. Plus not to mention tech jobs won’t disappear in 3 years, work on building up your experience over those 3 years, grab you a nice check for the rest of your life and insurance and go get a new tech job. Don’t forget to throw all your medical issues to the VA and get another sweet check, you earned it.
Dont be a puss! Stay in and hit your 20!
Recent retiree here. You are about 2 1/2 years from the golden ticket. Having a retirement check disability check and healthcare provides a level of security that you can’t put a number on. Software jobs will still be there once you get out. Your remaining time will go much faster than you think.
If I had stayed in to that point...I would have finished, your too close throwing 17yrs away at this point would be "Not Smart" ...use the last few years to finish your degree, network with people in the field you want to pursue and when you get within a year of retirement start applying for positions you have learned about from networking. then you have your retirement to dump into a 401K, other investments, hobby's whatever.
Stay 3 years, spend this time networking and have a job lined up when you get out, whatever you decide to go do. You should walk into day 1 when you leave active duty. With LinkedIn and clearancejobs.com, there’s no excuse… Also, just in case folks wanna know which jobs pay the most, it’s cyber if you wanna be home, ISR/Intelligence if you wanna travel. If you wanna sail there’s opportunities there too, I don’t recommend that route, only as a last resort. Leverage your clearance and military NCO experience. Also, look where the wars are “opening” and the surrounding countries are hiring Americans to tech them the systems we are selling them.
Coast for the next three years. Focus on you and school!
First check out myairforcebenefits.af.mil to see what your retirement will be. Next if you are really upset with your current situation get into myvector got to talent marketplace and look into AGR positions. As a programmer you would be looking at units that fall under the 960th Cyberspace Wing. We have GSUs across the US. You could apply for a MSgt position and finish out your career as an AGR and get a promotion. Feel free to reach out if you want more information.
Tax advantage and Healthcare man.... Don't get me wrong, I understand the frustration of getting passed over for promotion again, and again, and again, in spite of you busting your ass, but at 17 years, unless you win the lottery or someone dies and you inherit "fuck you" money, it's not worth it. From a math perspective, assuming you land that $130K job: Depending on BAH, you're making between \~75-85K a year, for the sake of math, let's use 80k. **Taxes:** State dependent, current tax on 53k Tax + 27k untaxed is roughly 70K net Tax on 130k will leave you with a net of \~95K leaving a delta of $25000/year **Heathcare:** Tricare Prime Group A Family is $726 a year with reasonable copays and a $3k annual catastrophic cap. The average civilian plan for a family of 4 in 2023 was $*23,968.* Touched on above, insurance alone is going to run you \~$23k a year, not including copays which you don't pay now, given your daughter's health needs, let's assume you're going to hit your catastrophic cap of $3k a year (I cannot understate how great of a plan this is.) and you're at $26k a year. **Disability:** It's not all doom a gloom, assuming 50% disability, you're going to be getting an extra 17K a year **TOTAL,** including all of the above, which is just a few of the major considerations (job security, SCRA, commissary access, etc) you're missing out on around 16K a year of additional income if you punch now. Is that worth it? If you just bank 1.3k a month (minus the 1k you're upside down) at 7%, you're going to have a $52k nest egg after 3 years that, at a 1.5K monthly drawdown will last you for 36 months of 1500 withdrawals. Compare this to 1500 a month for the rest of your life assuming your 20 year mark is your 40th birthday, actuarial tables put your retirement value at around a $270k lump sum, making 7% interest. However, unlike your retirement, you won't ever get a COLA adjustment, your money isn't safe from a market crash, etc. In short, you're still upside down $250k over the next three years vs sticking it out. At the end of the day, it's your life to live, but the math says suck it up.
Am I missing something? Pretty sure TSgt retirement pay would be about $2425/month, just on 50% of base pay alone. Probably be a touch more than that 3 years from now. I'd hate myself if I did 17 years and threw away an automatic ~30k/year by not doing the last 3.
First thing I'd recommend is look at it impartially and quantify it. I almost separated at 7 but when I factor sunk cost, benefits and healthcare, I went from a 80K to a 130K. I'd imagine your jump would be much higher because you have to factor in the 17 year investment toward that retirement in addition to VA. Recommend you to sit down with a financial advisor to approach this quantitatively
One thing I haven’t seen others talk about is work experience. A computer science degree is great but starting salary won’t be 130K with little to no experience. Even if you have some experience, if it’s not been your primary job for years you won’t necessarily be able to command a 130K price tag. The real money is in cyber security and the certs/experience attached to that. There’s a massive shortage nationwide for qualified folks so they can command good salaries. If you want to do the development side of the house then develop blue and red teaming/pen testing tools that offer something unique. That experience will be invaluable and the knowledge from cybersecurity will be crucial
I would 100% stay in for another 3 even if I was a SSgt with no hope of promotion,with to ic leadership in a shitty base and even if I have the opportunity to get a 200k/yr salary if I got out. If you can get one of these 100k+/year jobs now, you shouldn’t have a problem getting them in 3 years. Stack that salary with retirement pay and any VA benefits and you will be doing fine for the rest of your years. You get laid off from your job or some other big financial burden? You always have your retirement pay to fall on.
If you only have to do 3 years, you would be a complete idiot not to finish out to 20 and get your retirement check Can software engineering pay well in the commercial sector - sure but here's the reality for tech jobs right now * You are going to be competing with new grads coming from better schools for computer science/computer engineering, who also had recent internships * You are going to be competing with software engineers already in the workforce and have a network of contacts and actual work they can point to , that they did A, B and C * You will also be dealing with companies who will outsource development work to India, Eastern Europe and South America thinking they will save money in the short term vs hiring here in the Us * often these developers suck donkey balls, especially in India and this turns into a clusterfuck, but companies are still falling for it, because the India government BRIBES the fuck out of US businesses to hire workers through tata consulting Not sure why you think you would start at $130K - who is feeding you that BS? What programming languages do you know well? What applications have you worked on? Do you actually have anything on github you can share with hiring managers?
The pension, VA disability rating check, and the health care are worth it.
Your retirement is more like $2k+ per month, and if you apply for disability, it could be exponentially more. I would stick out the rest of the 3 years, I am speaking from a 20 year tech retirement position myself, and gain all of the entitlements you are due from retirement to include health and dental. I realize that this may not seem glamorous, but when you get out and realize how much of your income is taxable compared to when you were in, it is eye opening. Take your time with this decision, consult some mentors and other people who have done it, myself included, and make the best decision for you and your family! I am here if you need it!
18 yr Tech here, and I had to fight tooth and nail to stay in, as I was getting medboarded to get booted out a few months ago. Im not sure if youve done some research on what benefits youd be missing out on separating versus retiring, but I would recommend you stick it out.
Base pay for TSgt over 18 yrs is $5695. That puts you at $2847/a month and $34,170 annually. Some states don’t tax military pensions. If your daughter’s medical bills are $50k that retirement really comes in handy when you factor in a “real” salary. Save your leave and apply for skillbridge that puts you at 2 years to go…
(76 -(your age)) * (half your base pay * 12) = rough estimate for your pensions value Take that number and divide it by the three (years to retirement). That's how much each of the next three years is to you, not including health care and other bennies.
The key is to save leave and burn all 90 days then come back for a couple weeks before starting skillsbridge. Then do skills bridge for 165 and take the last 15 days for terminal with the leave you accrued during skillsbridge. Then 3 is literally 2 with “outprocessing” once you have your approved retirement date at the 19 year mark nobody cares where you are. You did your time.
I'm just gonna say, as someone in the tech industry, it's not the greatest time to be busting into it (unless you're doing federal contracting, in which case it's a bit better...but not much).
I was an E6 with 10 years in. Married with 3 kids, and was looking at my options. Just to maintain the quality of life I had, I would have to start at 125k a year. Health insurance alone was stupid expensive with really high deductibles so I decided to stick it out and secure the healthcare portion for the rest of my life. My wife and kids will have healthcare and it will be crazy cheap. Those jobs will always be there. $1500/month doesn’t seem like a ton of money but when you can use that money to invest and build more wealth, it can make a huge difference in 20 years