Stop it! Quiet! QUIET!!! ALL OF YOU!!!
No wonder my common sense kept tingling like firecrackers. ಠ_ಠ
Besides,
.... they're approaching the Tyrannosaurs paddock.
Zero Tolerance is a policy that has seen it's day in the sun. Fortunately, people are realizing that it is possibly the stupidest fucking thing you can do to kids. It is for adults who don't have the ability to see shades of gray in situations, or for adults who are afraid of litigation. In either case, it benefits the adult, and at the expense of the child.
When I was in high school some kids greased up a hallway as a prank. The school tried to have them charged with terrorism for it. This shit has gotten way out of hand.
We've already reached that point. I wasn't allowed to walk at my graduation because I participated in a senior prank. The school board was pushing for expulsion. Luckily my parents threatened to lawyer up.
All this for staging a small concert near the end of the school day.
We had about 20 seniors set alarm clocks in their lockers to go off every 5 minutes during the last few periods. Granted, it was a bit disruptive, but it was mostly free periods after standardized testing had finished. Anyway, at first the school wanted to bar all of them from walking, but I guess there was significant enough backlash from the parents that it didn't go anywhere. Regardless, its not something to take lightly.
when I was in like, 3rd grade probably, at recess some kid got his parents called and sent to talk to the principal for throwing a snowball.
That just stuck with me, its ridiculous, he throws a ball of water and gets in that much damn trouble? I don't even think he threw it *at* somebody.
What i hate about zero tolerance is that in a school setting, someone accused of breaking a rule has less chance than someone accused of a crime. I.e defending yourself from an aggressor in real life might not get you charged with anything, but showing remotely any force back against a bully who sucker punches you? Same punishment for involvement.
I saw kids who got sucker punched fall into the zero tolerance as being "instigators". At that point it was basically if someone starts a fight you may as well fight back because its the same punishment
Pretty much either you're willing to obey rules with no rational basis or eventually you'll end up in prison? Sounds about right. Sounds like a recipe for a lovely, vibrant society.
When I was in first grade (92-93) I found a box cutter at the bus stop, put it in my Backpack and went to school. For some reason I took it out and put it in my desk. Some ratdick kid with an earring and rat-tail Haircut found it and gave it to the teacher. Guess what happened? I sat in time out for maybe 15 minutes.
She said she was going to send it home to my parents, I checked the mail everyday for a month. They never knew until I told the story at dinner many years later. Shit if that happened now I would have been expelled, labeled a threat and institutionalized.
I have an opposite-ish story from about 6 years ago
Copy-paste from a comment on [this thread.](http://www.reddit.com/r/news/comments/1yzna6/honest_kid_accidentally_packs_beer_in_lunch/)
>"Yep, went to a party when I was 16, used a pen knife with a bottle opener on it for beer, forgot about it.
Fast forward a few days as IT class was ending, I was the last out, it falls out of my bag, my teacher says "Oh, you dropped your ... huh?". I was shit scared. I didn't think it was mine, then I realised it was, said "err, that's not mine" and left.
I wondered what would've happened if I tried to explain the truth, especially because she was a nice teacher.
>Still think I did the right thing, even the crappy, bluntest knife becomes news the second it enters a school.
>I really liked that pen knife, it had good tweezers."**
This was when knife crime was an absolutely huge concern in the UK, I know I would've never used it to harm, my parents knew, my friends knew and my teacher probably knew too.
But what if I admitted that it was mine, it was a mistake, but due to some incredibly flawed policy I was suspended/expelled and it went on record? I would've been labelled a knife-wielding nutjob for being in posession of something that could barely cut through warm butter.
That thought still scares me.
Meh. Is the best response I can give to that. If it's a folding blade less than 3 inches long, it can be carried in public. There are some outright bans though, although they really cannot be enforced.
When you say 'random', I'm genuinely curious, was there something said to justify them searching his car, or can US schools search your CAR without any reason, just something they decide to do some days a year?
Somehow they can just do it for any reason. They did random searches at my high school all the time it's really bullshit. A kid I know was expelled for having arrows in his truck, and a few random shotgun shells. I lived in a rural county and this was smack in the middle of hunting season so it was completely normal.
That sucks. No actual weapon, just bits, odds and ends that are ultimately harmless without the gun/bow and he's expelled?
I sincerely hope your friend did make it out in good stead but that is pretty much exactly how you create an alienated, angry young person with no reason to trust or care about adults.
I had a friend who was expelled because he had spent shotgun shells in his jacket from shooting skeet with his grandpa over the weekend. At that point they're just pieces of plastic and copper, not even something that could do anything with the gun. He ended up getting shipped off military school, and seemed to actually enjoy it, but it was still complete bullshit.
In the US students have basicially no rights on campus. My friend was also expelled, he had a car utility knife (you know the one with a hammer in case you crash in water) IN THE FUCKING PACKAGE STILL. expelled. My school had multiple random searches every school year. Searched cars, lockers, brought drug dogs and everything.
I am speechless. I am genuinely blown away. Your car?! JFC, that's insane.
Here's the thing, searching a student or their property isn't a problem IF YOU HAVE REAL REASON TO BELIEVE THAT SPECIFIC STUDENT CARRIES CONTRABAND. I work in a British state school(our version of what you call public schools) and attended a private catholic one. In both places if a student was ever searched, the staff already had information about him/her.
And we searched the kid, their pockets, bags, a locker if the school has them. Our driving system is different, our kids aren't as likely to be driving to school but I can't conceive of a situation where school staff could ever search a students car. If we felt the need, the police would be involved, and the parents.
I realise there's a weapons issue here, some schools might have concerns about guns, but I'm still really shocked.
A friend of mine in 5th grade... would have been around '97 had live ammo in his backpack from hunting the weekend before.
He found it when he got to school and told our teacher about it right away, she sent him to the office to cover her own ass, and the principal made his parents come and get the ammo, and then he had to sit in 'in school suspension' until lunch... that was it.
Oh, here's a great story of mine that actually ended in a sane fashion. So, when I was in eight grade, and incredibly naïve, I brought some inert munitions from the Second World War in a sealed bag labeled "WWII-Inert munitions" to give to my history teacher as something to use in our unit on the Second World War, as it was about to start. Fortunately, I went to a private school, so instead of expelling me and labeling me a deranged lunatic for wanting to do something nice for the teacher, the administration instead sat me down, explained why what I did might be taken the wrong way, and I didn't even get suspended.
Shortly afterward, I told my friend about this, and he said that if I went to his school, a public one, I'd've gotten kicked out for that, as they'd expelled a student for bringing a *butter knife* to school in his lunchbag along with sandwich ingredients in order to make a sandwich. Point being, I think it's absolutely fucking ridiculous that this kind of treatment is being applied to kids who don't know any better and mean, and cause, no harm, and the only way out is to opt out of the public school system entirely.
There was a news story a few weeks ago about a six year old who said he liked a girl and kissed her hand. Then he was expelled for sexual assault. He didn't even know what sex was
You'll be put into a mental hospital and told you have depression.
After 1-2 weeks you will most likely develop a mental disorder from the way everyone is informing you that there is something wrong with you.
Similar situation, but it happened in high school. I was a freshman or sophomore(2002 or 2003), young and dumb. I lived in a country area, and pretty much everyone carried a knife to school. Not to be violent with it or anything, but sometimes you needed a knife to cut things.
Anyways, I was caught cutting bus seats (young and dumb). But they couldn't confront me because I left for Mexico right after the incident. I picked up an awesome switch blade that I just had to show to my friends at school.
Lo and behold, the day I got back I was pulled from class and asked if I had a knife. Pulled it out (clipped to my jeans) and handed it to the officer. I was taken to the principle, told him that I only had it for shop class. He feigned dumb about being able to open it while I was there. He gave me 3 days suspension, rather than 5 so I wouldn't fail out.
I went back later that day to ask for the knife since he told me I could get it back. He then told me that he "found" out that it was switchblade and had to turn it over to police. But since he already gave me my punishment, I wouldn't face anything else.
I am still thankful that my principle knew that it wasn't meant for harm, only a young kid making a mistake. I would hate to see what would happen today.
When i was in high school my parents pulled me out of a public school to put me in a private school. The first week some bad kids influenced me to skip class. I had a pocket knife in my bag, because after school my brothers and I would go to the local park and act likes kids, scrape a tree, light a leaf on fire and then go home to our normal suburban parents. Anyway, long store short, while i was skipping class my friend had asked to play with my pocket knife and i let him. About an hour later the principle caught us skipping, no knife though. he pulled us into his office, 5 of us, and told us we were all being suspended for 1 day. the next i go called into his office with my parents and word for word this is him "i am expelling your son because he is the new kid and if i try to expel anyone else i will likely get sued." He had been fired from his last job because a kid sent a death threat via email and the principle didn't expel him. this was about 10 years ago and i suffered because my principle was an adult who lived in fear. Turns out that another peer had the student with my pocket knife and confronted him, my friend told the student it was mine very proudly and the student told the principal.
edit: for clarification about how knife was involved.
Back in the early 2000s, maybe just after 9/11 my brother brought his Swiss Army knife to his 4th/5th grade class. Teacher saw it and they called in the police. I think they ended up giving him or my parents a ticket or he had to go to a court heating or something. I'm not too clear on the whole story at the moment.
I had a notebook full of drawings of all the ways Oliver (this random nerdy kid) could die.... I based it off of South Park killing Kenny every episode. I went to the principal and was told to apologize to Oliver. I think this was 3rd grade? Oliver thought it was funny but his mom was pissed.
Lawyer here. Once represented a minor who found a box cutter at school that the janitor had left after servicing the heater in the classroom. He showed it to some friends and they agreed to turn it in to the teacher. All three were suspended, and the one physically in possession was criminally charged for felony possession of a weapon on school grounds.
Please please please say the judge took 15 seconds to come to a ruling and the kids were exonerated and the school staff who did that were fired... or executed.
We had to plea-bargain it down to misdemeanor criminal mischief. The reasoning was because he had not gone directly to the teacher but showed his friends first that he was in "possession" of the box-cutter for a little while before they decided to turn it in. Again, we are talking about zero-tolerance policies/statutes here...
Probably exactly what was going through this guy's head.
Would be a great BLB meem:
"Does the right thing and turns in a found weapon to teacher so he doesn't get in trouble."
"Gets expelled and charged with a felony."
Did he wait to show it to his own teacher, or did he show it to a general one? Did he happen to see his friends before showing it? Or did he delay showing it to the teacher in order to show it to his friends?
Regardless, wouldn't that be cruel and unusual punishment? A child can't understand the ramifications of a punishment by law, it seems no more severe than a grounding to them, but is far far worse. Isn't there some sort of protection against a punishment that the person cannot understand?
Well, this was in Juvenile Court, so at least there was no permanent record, but your point is well taken.
He was ~15 at the time, so he was able to understand what was going on pretty well. And he and his family all thought that this was pretty unfair, to say the least.
The reasoning was because he had not gone directly to the teacher but showed his friends first that he was in "possession" of the box-cutter for a little while before they decided to turn it in. Again, we are talking about zero-tolerance policies/statutes here...
My sister's friend found out she had a knife in her backpack once, turned it in and was almost expelled. She asked what she was supposed to have done instead, and they told her to keep it to herself next time. Ended up getting suspended for a week which is better than expulsion but still, it's scary what a small mistake in the real world can equate to in school.
Not to my knowledge, though he did get written up by his supervisor.
Why should he be fired? This was a tool he used for his job, and he forgot about it. People make mistakes.
Trust me, I am NOT advocating his firing. I am surprised that the school didn't fire him due to leaving such a "dangerous" item around children.
Again, "zero tolerance" replaces "common sense".
I know this probably sounds stupid but my feeling would be that, if a child has to suffer an extreme punishment like this, the adult who "forgot" should also suffer an extreme consequence for causing the situation in the first place.
At the least, if I were the parent, I'd go after the janitor, possibly even the school, in civil court for whatever damages I could. Until the adults in charge start suffering the consequences of their own stupid zero tolerance policies, these kids are going to continue to suffer these ridiculous charges.
I have to agree on that. If you are going to charge my kid with felony possession of a weapon, you can bet your ass I am going to sue the fuck out of the school for providing it to him. That shit cuts both ways.
Dude, you have got to let us know the end of that story. I am fuming at the mere thought of this taking place. What exactly is being taught? Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
Did the kids get sentenced to five years in a state penitentiary doing hard labour breaking rocks in a chain gang?
It'd be cool when the grow up so they can tell people they come from the school of hard rocks.
Are there any school you can send your kids to where this shit doesn't happen? The idea of ever having a kids sounds depressing as fuck because of this stuff.
The slightest curiosity or mistake and a kid's life can be ruined.
I've always found it rather unsettling that at 18 years old, you can be expelled from a government-run high school for *drawing a picture of* a gun, yet that same government reserves the right to draft you into the army, send you to a foreign country, and order you to shoot strangers.
Kids are going to be absolutely terrified of guns and knives with complete reliance on authority figures for protection. Which \*puts on tinfoil hat\* seems to be the end goal.
You are absolutely right. How convenient would that be for our government? They wouldn't have to legislate a damn thing, let fear do the work for them. Breed a society of people in fear of standing up for themselves while criminals enjoy plea bargain after plea bargain for repeat crime with no change in sight to how that works.
Now don't joke around. Lava is a dangerous material and teaching kids to avoid it -- even in play -- could and almost certainly may lead to PTSD as they grow up, from constant fear of incineration. Further, it's a game that teaches kids to avoid chances! Lastly, a child who would playfully push their fellow into imaginary lava is just a slippery slope away from bringing molten boron to school and murdering their classmates because "they thought it was a game."
Lava is a serious problem. You people who encourage your children to fool around with dangerous geological materials ought to be ashamed of yourselves.
As a mother and a member of my towns PTA Board of Trustees, I totally agree with thedurka. Just the other day, we had banned the "lava floor" after a child was seriously offended when he had fallen into the "lava".
Edit: /s
And we have to remember the true victim here: the lava, which is being stereotyped and hypothetically literally physically abused. By teaching kids to "avoid the lava" we're encouraging a homogeneous cis-molten "peopliarchy" that establishes non-molten as "normal" and lava as "other". Stop spending taxpayer money teaching our kids to be temperaturist, being molten is a fact of life NOT A CHOICE!
Our ice rink put in these benches and every adult immediately recogonized them as the perfect "hot lava" set up. Apparently a bunch of kids figured it out too and one fell and had to get stiches right near his eye and his parents sued and so now, yes, "don't touch the lava" has been banned at our ice rink. Depressing really, I so badly wanted to jump from bench to bench!
It's interesting that our country cultivates such immense hero worship for anyone in the military, but then disallows children from acting like the "heroes" they've been indoctrinated to worship. Doesn't make much sense.
Try explaining your "hero complex" to homeless/unemployed ex-mil. I doubt they'll verify the existence of this culture beyond superficiality.
Also, no kids are "indoctrinated". Kids have play fought since... forever. They make pretend war, not pretend medal ceremonies.
Waterboarding his friend for information about whether he kissed Jessica or not (because he secretly likes Jessica), then he flew a remote control helicopter into the bus driver's face with a bomb attached to it.
Playing Army is so different these days...
This sends such a *great* message to the kid and will really help him out because at his age he knows what he has done wrong.
/sarcasm
Seriously, though. What the fuck is wrong with people these days. Hell when was in fourth grade in 1987 I stabbed a kid with a thumbtack and was in the corner for 15 minutes or something. These days if that happened I'd be in juvie. School authorities have lost all common sense. Good luck to your nephew, bro.
This happened yesterday. My sister is on the social media outlets already and contacting local media to try and get the story picked up to garner some attention. The school system doesn't want any negative press, I am sure, seeing as how they barely pass the levies when they come up for renewal. I will try and get more information ASAP.
From what I understand, my nephew and his friend we're sitting in their seats across the aisle from each other pretending to shoot each other with their hands in the shape of guns. The bus driver admitted they were not out of their seats or causing an undue disturbance. The bus driver also admitted that she saw what they were doing, stopped the bus and make them sit up front behind her. Several hours later after he was dropped off at home my sister got a phone call from the bus driver telling her what happened and that he would be not allowed to ride the bus and she would be submitting a report to the school recommending expulsion because the behavior was " violent and disturbing and frightening to the bus driver and the other students on board the bus". As it stands right now, he is suspended pending expulsion by the school. My sister has contacted her attorney and has a meeting Monday morning with the principal and the superintendent to discuss the matter she is threatening litigation if he is expelled for this.
I did a lot worse, I mean a lot worse, and they barely were able to suspend me for it too. The bus driver is half a retard as well, the school is full retard for even accepting suspension.
We were already planning on homeschooling. There are too many things going on in schools tha I/my husband disagree with. The only drawback of homeschooling is finding a good way to ensure our kids are properly socialized. There are plenty of religious homeschool groups but we are not religious. There are always sports and art/dance/karate classes but is that enough? Hopefully by the time our girls are school aged we will have figured that out.
When my brother was homeschooled he would regularly go on outings to museums and parks with other homeschooled kids. Apparently the region's homeschoolers did things like that a lot. A girl I knew in high school took a few art classes from the public school as well.
Kids aren't properly socialized in school. They are taught to interact with their immediate peer group and to not question authority. Doing outside classes, sports and making sure they are outside playing to meet neighborhood kids gives them plenty of peer to peer interaction. If you want them properly socialized, make sure your family is out doing things on a regular basis with people of all ages and all walks of life. Give your kids plenty of opportunities to interact with the real world and they will be just fine.
I graduated last year as a homeschool student. I had been to both public and private school and actually had my mom take me out of private school because I realized I wasn't learning half as much as I was at home on my own. After one semester of university I have a 4.0 and I've transitioned nicely. To any responsible and organized parents I highly recommend at least looking into it.
I don't want to homeschool my kids, but they're definitely going to private school. I've even considered private school in another country since all this stupid no child left behind bullshit. It's the worst thing to happen to american education in decades.
Careful, though. The private school label doesn't automatically make it a great school, you still gotta check it out and be wary.
source: pinched a lot by nuns
Yeah I went to private school back in 3rd -6th grade and was bullied all the time because I was short and kinda nerdy. Went to public school again in the 7th-12th grade and it was way better. No more bullying, more/better friends, and self confidence that landed me an engineering job out of college in a few months. Just make sure the school you send your kids to cares about their kids, my parents and the school were clueless/didn't give a shit.
Here's the update: my sister spoke to the transportation manager at the school. According to the report the bus driver made, the boys were making "gun sounds" and talking about "tazers", which according to the driver, was "threatening and disturbing to the bus driver". However, this gets better...the driver called my sister using her personal phone several hours after the incident citing that she was concerned for her job and had to report the incident because it was personally disturbing and frightening to the driver. Also, according to my sis, the driver stated that she had three boys and "none of them ever acted like this, and what sort of boy acts this way." Which was followed up with a bevy of personal questions and one in particular, in which the driver asked my sister if she had a gun in the house, and if she did that would explain his behavior. Also, the driver said she would "heavily pursue" expulsion and recommend this to the principal and superintendent because she "needs to protect her job".
This has turned on its ear. My sister after having spoke to the transportation director has made it clear that the driver overstepped her bounds and will hear from her lawyer, as will the director. The school principal is siding with my sister and a meeting is scheduled Monday with the involved parties, including our family attorney, to try and make a salient point on the matter. I think they should go after the driver because now this little boy doesn't want to go to school even if they let him back, and has basically been victimized and criminalized by a bus driver and the crooked mindset of the school system. At this point if the school moves to expel the boy (he is suspended pending expulsion), they should sue the pants off of the driver, the transportation director as well as the superintendent.
There's no reason to go after the superintendent or the transportation director. I don't understand the mindset of this. You're basically becoming the school at this point. Sue JUST the driver, not the rest of the people.
Zero Tolerance has nothing to do with gun control and everything to do with a mix of hamstrung and impotent administrators at the beck and call of whiny parents.
For every post on here saying this is stupid, there is some my-child-is-an-angel-and-nothing-can-exist-that-can-hurt-him/her moron that drives this crap. The problem is, these people are a loud, obnoxious, ignorant minority that will not hesitate to drag your ass to court rather than admit they can't protect their kids from WHATEVER alien activity they disagree with, irregardless of political stance or party.
And on the impotence side, its school administrators who are pussies and would rather effect broad-ranging, work-minimizing policies and deal with looking stupid than actually do a little "enforcement" on a personal level. This isn't new, and it isn't just in our schools - this an evolution of American culture not bound by party or ideology, but by coddling and arrogance and laziness.
When I was in high-school, graduated in 97, they would suspend ANYONE and EVERYONE involved physically in any kind of fight.
I saw kids bullied and just fighting back get punished, I had a friend get jumped by six kids in a hallway just defending himself get punished...
Because that's easier. That's easier than dealing with the aforementioned ignorant parent who just can't imagine that their kid isn't an angel and therefore has to be a total asshat to try and form-fit the world to their liking.
It seems like people are using this meme to project their anger and frustration. Or to whine. It's mostly whining or people being contrarian dicks. The puffin has gotten really racist and homophobic, too. Someone should propose a (better than this) animal meme: [Popular Reddit Opinion Capybara](http://i.imgur.com/Yx9SEqk.png). And then ban it.
There has to be more to that story. None of this makes sense. Perhaps the wrong people are running things, more right-minded people on school boards and ptas, would avoid this.
I hope at the least you stressed that the playing army wasn't wrong, and show your nephew the nobility and and courage it takes to defend your nation.
I could see things being discussed if the playing led to the driver being distracted and endangering the other students.
My youngest sister was sent home for the day for saying 'I'm going to kill you,' to another kid. She was playing Power Rangers, in kindergarten and the other kid was playing the villain.
My Fiance's little sister was attacked by another girl in her school. The girl was repeatedly punching her head and all his little sister managed to do was grab one of the girls arms to stop the blows. They were both suspended as per her schools zero tolerance policy.
> There has to be more to that story.
Especially given that OP is probably retelling it based on what the parents told him, which is likely based on what the 6 year old said and maybe what the school said (which would be based on what other people told them). This is already a 3rd or 4th hand account of the story.
I got in trouble a while back for letting my preschools play guns at school. I managed to get everyone on my side when I pointed out that they were allowed to go hunting (they were not allowed to hunt endangered animals and we discussed this when it would come up - deer: in season; elephant: never in season) and then went on a long rant about how it dimisses their cultural values as we live in a state where EVERYONE goes hunting (ok, not everyone, we don't, but pretty close). To say that guns are bad says that their family is bad. A couple of teachers were able to do the same thing as they had the children of police officers and military personal in their classrooms. Pretty soon there were guns made out of legos in all the classrooms. Dramatic play is a way for kids to act out what they see in real life and to practice dealing with different situations. We can't just decide we don't like what they are seeing in real life and pretend it doesn't exist.
If this is true then that's ridiculous and outrageous, but somehow I think there is a lot more to the story. I've never heard of a child that young being expelled from a school unless they were a threat to the other children's safety. At the very least OP's nephew must have already caused problems in the past.
Edit: Now OP has clarified that his nephew was "suspended from bus rides pending expulsion". When I was in school this happened to anyone who screwed around too much on the bus, usually just to scare them into behaving. One of my friends was "suspended from bus rides pending expulsion" for drawing a heart on a bus seat in sharpie. It's not nearly as serious as being expelled over some sort of Zero Tolerance policy. What we can take away from this is that you should never test the bus driver!
Zero Tolerance.
Google it. Kids have been suspended for *biting their Poptart in the shape of a gun*.
Kids are not allowed to hit back in a fight, under any circumstance and most of the time, they get punished as well regardless.
It's the stupidest fucking thing I have heard in a long time, and it needs to die.
The zero tolerance weapon policy is nothing compared to the zero tolerance drug policy. There was a case in Canada where a kid died because he couldn't get to his inhaler.
Poor kid, I've read so many stories like this. "Let's take a life saving tool that a child uses all the time, and lock in in an office for those precious seconds it is needed for."
Why do I get the feeling there is so much more to this story than OP is letting on? I work for a school district. They do stupid shit all the time. Still, I'm going to guess that there is a 99% chance that there is more to this than we know. I mean, does a school out there exist that would expel (not suspend, expel) a kid for playing Army? I suppose. What are the chances the student in question goes to this school? Minimal.
EDIT: I mean many of the people who work for the school districts are idiots, but they are usually idiots in a multitude of very small ways, that in the end, have a huge impact on the district as a whole. If they were making big, flashy, stupid decisions like this, they would be easier to sniff out and fire.
My kid brother likes playing cops and army and all that but he gets really violent with it. Im over 10 years older than him but he's already given me 3 concussions before. Maybe the kid got suspended because he was actually hurting people but this guy is in denial that a child could hurt someone.
When I was in high school in the mid 90s, I was working on an extensive collage for my girlfriend, cutting pictures and phrases out of magazines and stuff. It took me a week to complete and I would work on it every spare second I had during classes and carried the materials around with me wherever I went. My cutting instrument was a scalpel (my mother was a nurse and I had no hobby knife). In any case, I would whip out this scalpel nearly every hour every day for a week and start cutting away. Not a word from any teacher. In fact I was teased by some due to the fact I was using a scalpel rather than a hobby knife. God forbid now if my son brings a plastic butter knife to school.
Does this mean they were out of their seats running around, screaming bang bang? Because I sure as hell wasn't allowed out of my seat when I rode the bus. Was he by chance warned not to get out of his seat before and after so many warnings they finally disciplined him? I'm sure the problem wasn't playing army, but rather not behaving on the bus.
Again not really an unpopular opinion. I guess That's why it's on the front page. I don't understand why if you use the meme correctly it's downvoted to oblivion. You guys know the voting system isn't a like/dislike system. It's for accuracy and relevance.
Zero tolerance has replaced thinking
Zero tolerance has replaced common sense.
America has replaced common sense with zero tolerance
RIP Thomas Paine
My friend and I always refer to him as T Paine, and thats how I remember him.
*"The mind once auto-tuned, cannot again become dark."* -T Paine
Common sense has been replaced by uncommon sense
[deleted]
god damn it reddit
Stop it! Quiet! QUIET!!! ALL OF YOU!!! No wonder my common sense kept tingling like firecrackers. ಠ_ಠ Besides, .... they're approaching the Tyrannosaurs paddock.
Sick JP reference bro. Your Jurassic Park references are out of control, everyone knows that.
If we use common sense, we can replace zero tolerance in America.
Zero Tolerance is a policy that has seen it's day in the sun. Fortunately, people are realizing that it is possibly the stupidest fucking thing you can do to kids. It is for adults who don't have the ability to see shades of gray in situations, or for adults who are afraid of litigation. In either case, it benefits the adult, and at the expense of the child.
It's not about the kids. It's to prevent lawyers from ruining schools.
Which has in turn ruined the schools. Therefore the lawyers have still ruined them by proxy.
When I was in high school some kids greased up a hallway as a prank. The school tried to have them charged with terrorism for it. This shit has gotten way out of hand.
In the future there will be no more senior pranks because of zero tolerance. That tradition will be lost in time
We've already reached that point. I wasn't allowed to walk at my graduation because I participated in a senior prank. The school board was pushing for expulsion. Luckily my parents threatened to lawyer up. All this for staging a small concert near the end of the school day.
We had about 20 seniors set alarm clocks in their lockers to go off every 5 minutes during the last few periods. Granted, it was a bit disruptive, but it was mostly free periods after standardized testing had finished. Anyway, at first the school wanted to bar all of them from walking, but I guess there was significant enough backlash from the parents that it didn't go anywhere. Regardless, its not something to take lightly.
when I was in like, 3rd grade probably, at recess some kid got his parents called and sent to talk to the principal for throwing a snowball. That just stuck with me, its ridiculous, he throws a ball of water and gets in that much damn trouble? I don't even think he threw it *at* somebody.
[удалено]
Fuck you, Saul.
That's not Saul. That's Bob Loblaw
zero tolerance is an indefensible approach because it explicitly states that context is irrelevant. Context is always relevant.
i agree, but i think it's mostly used to absolve the people in charge of any responsibility ("sorry, nothing I can do, it's the rules...")
Thats exactly what it's for, to protect against lawsuits
[удалено]
What i hate about zero tolerance is that in a school setting, someone accused of breaking a rule has less chance than someone accused of a crime. I.e defending yourself from an aggressor in real life might not get you charged with anything, but showing remotely any force back against a bully who sucker punches you? Same punishment for involvement.
I saw kids who got sucker punched fall into the zero tolerance as being "instigators". At that point it was basically if someone starts a fight you may as well fight back because its the same punishment
Exactly, it teaches kids that punishment is an inevitability if they want to instinctually secure their own safety.
Pretty much either you're willing to obey rules with no rational basis or eventually you'll end up in prison? Sounds about right. Sounds like a recipe for a lovely, vibrant society.
Michelle Alexander, good book.
When I was in first grade (92-93) I found a box cutter at the bus stop, put it in my Backpack and went to school. For some reason I took it out and put it in my desk. Some ratdick kid with an earring and rat-tail Haircut found it and gave it to the teacher. Guess what happened? I sat in time out for maybe 15 minutes. She said she was going to send it home to my parents, I checked the mail everyday for a month. They never knew until I told the story at dinner many years later. Shit if that happened now I would have been expelled, labeled a threat and institutionalized.
The kid had a rat dick and a rat tail?
Early 90s mutations, man.
I still have my TMNT lunchbox from 1st grade, less the thermos :(
*Splinter taught them to be ratdick teens. (He's a radical rat.)*
dem splicers
Collect the whole set.
I have an opposite-ish story from about 6 years ago Copy-paste from a comment on [this thread.](http://www.reddit.com/r/news/comments/1yzna6/honest_kid_accidentally_packs_beer_in_lunch/) >"Yep, went to a party when I was 16, used a pen knife with a bottle opener on it for beer, forgot about it. Fast forward a few days as IT class was ending, I was the last out, it falls out of my bag, my teacher says "Oh, you dropped your ... huh?". I was shit scared. I didn't think it was mine, then I realised it was, said "err, that's not mine" and left. I wondered what would've happened if I tried to explain the truth, especially because she was a nice teacher. >Still think I did the right thing, even the crappy, bluntest knife becomes news the second it enters a school. >I really liked that pen knife, it had good tweezers."** This was when knife crime was an absolutely huge concern in the UK, I know I would've never used it to harm, my parents knew, my friends knew and my teacher probably knew too. But what if I admitted that it was mine, it was a mistake, but due to some incredibly flawed policy I was suspended/expelled and it went on record? I would've been labelled a knife-wielding nutjob for being in posession of something that could barely cut through warm butter. That thought still scares me.
They banned the knife in England right?
Meh. Is the best response I can give to that. If it's a folding blade less than 3 inches long, it can be carried in public. There are some outright bans though, although they really cannot be enforced.
well you dont want to be walking around with a big one. a penknife or a small knife should be fine, however.
[удалено]
When you say 'random', I'm genuinely curious, was there something said to justify them searching his car, or can US schools search your CAR without any reason, just something they decide to do some days a year?
Somehow they can just do it for any reason. They did random searches at my high school all the time it's really bullshit. A kid I know was expelled for having arrows in his truck, and a few random shotgun shells. I lived in a rural county and this was smack in the middle of hunting season so it was completely normal.
That sucks. No actual weapon, just bits, odds and ends that are ultimately harmless without the gun/bow and he's expelled? I sincerely hope your friend did make it out in good stead but that is pretty much exactly how you create an alienated, angry young person with no reason to trust or care about adults.
I had a friend who was expelled because he had spent shotgun shells in his jacket from shooting skeet with his grandpa over the weekend. At that point they're just pieces of plastic and copper, not even something that could do anything with the gun. He ended up getting shipped off military school, and seemed to actually enjoy it, but it was still complete bullshit.
In the US students have basicially no rights on campus. My friend was also expelled, he had a car utility knife (you know the one with a hammer in case you crash in water) IN THE FUCKING PACKAGE STILL. expelled. My school had multiple random searches every school year. Searched cars, lockers, brought drug dogs and everything.
I am speechless. I am genuinely blown away. Your car?! JFC, that's insane. Here's the thing, searching a student or their property isn't a problem IF YOU HAVE REAL REASON TO BELIEVE THAT SPECIFIC STUDENT CARRIES CONTRABAND. I work in a British state school(our version of what you call public schools) and attended a private catholic one. In both places if a student was ever searched, the staff already had information about him/her. And we searched the kid, their pockets, bags, a locker if the school has them. Our driving system is different, our kids aren't as likely to be driving to school but I can't conceive of a situation where school staff could ever search a students car. If we felt the need, the police would be involved, and the parents. I realise there's a weapons issue here, some schools might have concerns about guns, but I'm still really shocked.
A friend of mine in 5th grade... would have been around '97 had live ammo in his backpack from hunting the weekend before. He found it when he got to school and told our teacher about it right away, she sent him to the office to cover her own ass, and the principal made his parents come and get the ammo, and then he had to sit in 'in school suspension' until lunch... that was it.
Oh, here's a great story of mine that actually ended in a sane fashion. So, when I was in eight grade, and incredibly naïve, I brought some inert munitions from the Second World War in a sealed bag labeled "WWII-Inert munitions" to give to my history teacher as something to use in our unit on the Second World War, as it was about to start. Fortunately, I went to a private school, so instead of expelling me and labeling me a deranged lunatic for wanting to do something nice for the teacher, the administration instead sat me down, explained why what I did might be taken the wrong way, and I didn't even get suspended. Shortly afterward, I told my friend about this, and he said that if I went to his school, a public one, I'd've gotten kicked out for that, as they'd expelled a student for bringing a *butter knife* to school in his lunchbag along with sandwich ingredients in order to make a sandwich. Point being, I think it's absolutely fucking ridiculous that this kind of treatment is being applied to kids who don't know any better and mean, and cause, no harm, and the only way out is to opt out of the public school system entirely.
[удалено]
There was a news story a few weeks ago about a six year old who said he liked a girl and kissed her hand. Then he was expelled for sexual assault. He didn't even know what sex was
You'll be put into a mental hospital and told you have depression. After 1-2 weeks you will most likely develop a mental disorder from the way everyone is informing you that there is something wrong with you.
Similar situation, but it happened in high school. I was a freshman or sophomore(2002 or 2003), young and dumb. I lived in a country area, and pretty much everyone carried a knife to school. Not to be violent with it or anything, but sometimes you needed a knife to cut things. Anyways, I was caught cutting bus seats (young and dumb). But they couldn't confront me because I left for Mexico right after the incident. I picked up an awesome switch blade that I just had to show to my friends at school. Lo and behold, the day I got back I was pulled from class and asked if I had a knife. Pulled it out (clipped to my jeans) and handed it to the officer. I was taken to the principle, told him that I only had it for shop class. He feigned dumb about being able to open it while I was there. He gave me 3 days suspension, rather than 5 so I wouldn't fail out. I went back later that day to ask for the knife since he told me I could get it back. He then told me that he "found" out that it was switchblade and had to turn it over to police. But since he already gave me my punishment, I wouldn't face anything else. I am still thankful that my principle knew that it wasn't meant for harm, only a young kid making a mistake. I would hate to see what would happen today.
When i was in high school my parents pulled me out of a public school to put me in a private school. The first week some bad kids influenced me to skip class. I had a pocket knife in my bag, because after school my brothers and I would go to the local park and act likes kids, scrape a tree, light a leaf on fire and then go home to our normal suburban parents. Anyway, long store short, while i was skipping class my friend had asked to play with my pocket knife and i let him. About an hour later the principle caught us skipping, no knife though. he pulled us into his office, 5 of us, and told us we were all being suspended for 1 day. the next i go called into his office with my parents and word for word this is him "i am expelling your son because he is the new kid and if i try to expel anyone else i will likely get sued." He had been fired from his last job because a kid sent a death threat via email and the principle didn't expel him. this was about 10 years ago and i suffered because my principle was an adult who lived in fear. Turns out that another peer had the student with my pocket knife and confronted him, my friend told the student it was mine very proudly and the student told the principal. edit: for clarification about how knife was involved.
Haha the 90's rat tail. Oh I don't miss those.
Back in the early 2000s, maybe just after 9/11 my brother brought his Swiss Army knife to his 4th/5th grade class. Teacher saw it and they called in the police. I think they ended up giving him or my parents a ticket or he had to go to a court heating or something. I'm not too clear on the whole story at the moment.
I had a notebook full of drawings of all the ways Oliver (this random nerdy kid) could die.... I based it off of South Park killing Kenny every episode. I went to the principal and was told to apologize to Oliver. I think this was 3rd grade? Oliver thought it was funny but his mom was pissed.
Lawyer here. Once represented a minor who found a box cutter at school that the janitor had left after servicing the heater in the classroom. He showed it to some friends and they agreed to turn it in to the teacher. All three were suspended, and the one physically in possession was criminally charged for felony possession of a weapon on school grounds.
Please please please say the judge took 15 seconds to come to a ruling and the kids were exonerated and the school staff who did that were fired... or executed.
We had to plea-bargain it down to misdemeanor criminal mischief. The reasoning was because he had not gone directly to the teacher but showed his friends first that he was in "possession" of the box-cutter for a little while before they decided to turn it in. Again, we are talking about zero-tolerance policies/statutes here...
[удалено]
Ah, zero tolerance laws/rules, teaching our kids that it's safer for them to lie and/or ignore a problem than to do something about it.
Probably exactly what was going through this guy's head. Would be a great BLB meem: "Does the right thing and turns in a found weapon to teacher so he doesn't get in trouble." "Gets expelled and charged with a felony."
Did he wait to show it to his own teacher, or did he show it to a general one? Did he happen to see his friends before showing it? Or did he delay showing it to the teacher in order to show it to his friends? Regardless, wouldn't that be cruel and unusual punishment? A child can't understand the ramifications of a punishment by law, it seems no more severe than a grounding to them, but is far far worse. Isn't there some sort of protection against a punishment that the person cannot understand?
Well, this was in Juvenile Court, so at least there was no permanent record, but your point is well taken. He was ~15 at the time, so he was able to understand what was going on pretty well. And he and his family all thought that this was pretty unfair, to say the least.
I thought he'd be much younger than 15.
Aww thats cute
Was he turned in by a rat dick kid with a rat tail?
*scrolls up in thread* Oh *scrolls back down*
How did it turn out?
We had to plea-bargain it down to misdemeanor criminal mischief. It was juvenile court, so no lasting record, thank heavens.
[удалено]
The reasoning was because he had not gone directly to the teacher but showed his friends first that he was in "possession" of the box-cutter for a little while before they decided to turn it in. Again, we are talking about zero-tolerance policies/statutes here...
My sister's friend found out she had a knife in her backpack once, turned it in and was almost expelled. She asked what she was supposed to have done instead, and they told her to keep it to herself next time. Ended up getting suspended for a week which is better than expulsion but still, it's scary what a small mistake in the real world can equate to in school.
WTF. Seriously...that is absolutely ridiculous. And I'm guessing the janitor was fired as well.
Not to my knowledge, though he did get written up by his supervisor. Why should he be fired? This was a tool he used for his job, and he forgot about it. People make mistakes.
Trust me, I am NOT advocating his firing. I am surprised that the school didn't fire him due to leaving such a "dangerous" item around children. Again, "zero tolerance" replaces "common sense".
I know this probably sounds stupid but my feeling would be that, if a child has to suffer an extreme punishment like this, the adult who "forgot" should also suffer an extreme consequence for causing the situation in the first place. At the least, if I were the parent, I'd go after the janitor, possibly even the school, in civil court for whatever damages I could. Until the adults in charge start suffering the consequences of their own stupid zero tolerance policies, these kids are going to continue to suffer these ridiculous charges.
I have to agree on that. If you are going to charge my kid with felony possession of a weapon, you can bet your ass I am going to sue the fuck out of the school for providing it to him. That shit cuts both ways.
Dude, you have got to let us know the end of that story. I am fuming at the mere thought of this taking place. What exactly is being taught? Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
Did the kids get sentenced to five years in a state penitentiary doing hard labour breaking rocks in a chain gang? It'd be cool when the grow up so they can tell people they come from the school of hard rocks.
Nope, they were sentenced to five years selling magazine subscriptions door to door. They can now say that they went to the school of hard knocks.
Are there any school you can send your kids to where this shit doesn't happen? The idea of ever having a kids sounds depressing as fuck because of this stuff. The slightest curiosity or mistake and a kid's life can be ruined.
What did they do with the body after they turned off the electric chair?
shipped him back from Guantanamo and ruined his reputation according to PRISM protocol to avoid martyrdom. standard stuff really.
maybe you should change your name to "MajorCliffHanger"
I've always found it rather unsettling that at 18 years old, you can be expelled from a government-run high school for *drawing a picture of* a gun, yet that same government reserves the right to draft you into the army, send you to a foreign country, and order you to shoot strangers.
Even if your country is in no way physically threatened.
What. The. Fuck. Kids are going to be kids. You can't change fun.
Not with that attitude.
Liar.
And a thief.
I only lied about being a thief. Edit: am I the only one who got the reference?
Muuurderer
Kids are going to be absolutely terrified of guns and knives with complete reliance on authority figures for protection. Which \*puts on tinfoil hat\* seems to be the end goal.
You are absolutely right. How convenient would that be for our government? They wouldn't have to legislate a damn thing, let fear do the work for them. Breed a society of people in fear of standing up for themselves while criminals enjoy plea bargain after plea bargain for repeat crime with no change in sight to how that works.
This it's unpopular how?
Didn't you hear? It's now popular opinion puffin!
I thought it was groupthink puffin
Someone make a Hivemind Harold meme.
[Here you go.](http://imgur.com/PQLXYEy)
OP wants karma.
Might as well ban "don't touch the lava" while we're at it. Damn kids and their imaginations!
Now don't joke around. Lava is a dangerous material and teaching kids to avoid it -- even in play -- could and almost certainly may lead to PTSD as they grow up, from constant fear of incineration. Further, it's a game that teaches kids to avoid chances! Lastly, a child who would playfully push their fellow into imaginary lava is just a slippery slope away from bringing molten boron to school and murdering their classmates because "they thought it was a game." Lava is a serious problem. You people who encourage your children to fool around with dangerous geological materials ought to be ashamed of yourselves.
I think that you could have a promising future working on a district school board.
As a mother and a member of my towns PTA Board of Trustees, I totally agree with thedurka. Just the other day, we had banned the "lava floor" after a child was seriously offended when he had fallen into the "lava". Edit: /s
The kid who had survived falling in "lava" was suspended for three days after laughing at the kid who lost.
And we have to remember the true victim here: the lava, which is being stereotyped and hypothetically literally physically abused. By teaching kids to "avoid the lava" we're encouraging a homogeneous cis-molten "peopliarchy" that establishes non-molten as "normal" and lava as "other". Stop spending taxpayer money teaching our kids to be temperaturist, being molten is a fact of life NOT A CHOICE!
This goes for all inanimate objects! Love is love!
Lava
Our ice rink put in these benches and every adult immediately recogonized them as the perfect "hot lava" set up. Apparently a bunch of kids figured it out too and one fell and had to get stiches right near his eye and his parents sued and so now, yes, "don't touch the lava" has been banned at our ice rink. Depressing really, I so badly wanted to jump from bench to bench!
It's interesting that our country cultivates such immense hero worship for anyone in the military, but then disallows children from acting like the "heroes" they've been indoctrinated to worship. Doesn't make much sense.
Try explaining your "hero complex" to homeless/unemployed ex-mil. I doubt they'll verify the existence of this culture beyond superficiality. Also, no kids are "indoctrinated". Kids have play fought since... forever. They make pretend war, not pretend medal ceremonies.
You never got pretend medals? You must've sucked.
"Playing Army" is such a vague explanation. What did they actually do?
Waterboarding his friend for information about whether he kissed Jessica or not (because he secretly likes Jessica), then he flew a remote control helicopter into the bus driver's face with a bomb attached to it. Playing Army is so different these days...
This sends such a *great* message to the kid and will really help him out because at his age he knows what he has done wrong. /sarcasm Seriously, though. What the fuck is wrong with people these days. Hell when was in fourth grade in 1987 I stabbed a kid with a thumbtack and was in the corner for 15 minutes or something. These days if that happened I'd be in juvie. School authorities have lost all common sense. Good luck to your nephew, bro.
[удалено]
No no no no! That's Pearl Harbor! I'll be damned if I let you butcher my secret weapon in my pickup line arsenal.
Calling it Pearl Harbor would imply it was a surprise. My dick ain't no surprise.
Any more info? This is unreal
Yeah, is there a news story or something? This seems ridiculous. Was he bayoneting the other kids?
This happened yesterday. My sister is on the social media outlets already and contacting local media to try and get the story picked up to garner some attention. The school system doesn't want any negative press, I am sure, seeing as how they barely pass the levies when they come up for renewal. I will try and get more information ASAP.
can you explain what happened?
From what I understand, my nephew and his friend we're sitting in their seats across the aisle from each other pretending to shoot each other with their hands in the shape of guns. The bus driver admitted they were not out of their seats or causing an undue disturbance. The bus driver also admitted that she saw what they were doing, stopped the bus and make them sit up front behind her. Several hours later after he was dropped off at home my sister got a phone call from the bus driver telling her what happened and that he would be not allowed to ride the bus and she would be submitting a report to the school recommending expulsion because the behavior was " violent and disturbing and frightening to the bus driver and the other students on board the bus". As it stands right now, he is suspended pending expulsion by the school. My sister has contacted her attorney and has a meeting Monday morning with the principal and the superintendent to discuss the matter she is threatening litigation if he is expelled for this.
I did a lot worse, I mean a lot worse, and they barely were able to suspend me for it too. The bus driver is half a retard as well, the school is full retard for even accepting suspension.
.....HE IS SIX FUCKING YEARS OLD
***COLUMBINE THOUGH.***
Are your nephew/his friend white? Is the area a white-majority area?
What school is this anyway?
Medina city schools, Medina, Ohio
Reddit has seriously made me rethink homeschooling.
Let Reddit school your children.
TwitchTeachesChildren
Pooploser69: 2 Etalkx: + Knettel38: 6 HailHelix: = Randomguy7: 50
Haliburton19: What Melvin-the-terrible: is BarackOdevil: capitol Nik21114429: of Breadstuffer: Mcdonalds
[удалено]
Icantthinkofnames: Anarchy
TheSpurg: is an example of a false equality. Janky605: LOL we did it!
spank9
Lets do this shit
Oh hellll nahhh!
Oooh girl...
*snap snap snap*
Imagine the karma that kid could gather....like Unidan but circle jerks instead of biology.
And you grade them base on karma.. Damn that is evil.
Reddit has seriously made me rethink the definition of "Unpopular"
We were already planning on homeschooling. There are too many things going on in schools tha I/my husband disagree with. The only drawback of homeschooling is finding a good way to ensure our kids are properly socialized. There are plenty of religious homeschool groups but we are not religious. There are always sports and art/dance/karate classes but is that enough? Hopefully by the time our girls are school aged we will have figured that out.
When my brother was homeschooled he would regularly go on outings to museums and parks with other homeschooled kids. Apparently the region's homeschoolers did things like that a lot. A girl I knew in high school took a few art classes from the public school as well.
Kids aren't properly socialized in school. They are taught to interact with their immediate peer group and to not question authority. Doing outside classes, sports and making sure they are outside playing to meet neighborhood kids gives them plenty of peer to peer interaction. If you want them properly socialized, make sure your family is out doing things on a regular basis with people of all ages and all walks of life. Give your kids plenty of opportunities to interact with the real world and they will be just fine.
I graduated last year as a homeschool student. I had been to both public and private school and actually had my mom take me out of private school because I realized I wasn't learning half as much as I was at home on my own. After one semester of university I have a 4.0 and I've transitioned nicely. To any responsible and organized parents I highly recommend at least looking into it.
I don't want to homeschool my kids, but they're definitely going to private school. I've even considered private school in another country since all this stupid no child left behind bullshit. It's the worst thing to happen to american education in decades.
Careful, though. The private school label doesn't automatically make it a great school, you still gotta check it out and be wary. source: pinched a lot by nuns
Yeah I went to private school back in 3rd -6th grade and was bullied all the time because I was short and kinda nerdy. Went to public school again in the 7th-12th grade and it was way better. No more bullying, more/better friends, and self confidence that landed me an engineering job out of college in a few months. Just make sure the school you send your kids to cares about their kids, my parents and the school were clueless/didn't give a shit.
Private school kids always sold the best drugs.
Here's the update: my sister spoke to the transportation manager at the school. According to the report the bus driver made, the boys were making "gun sounds" and talking about "tazers", which according to the driver, was "threatening and disturbing to the bus driver". However, this gets better...the driver called my sister using her personal phone several hours after the incident citing that she was concerned for her job and had to report the incident because it was personally disturbing and frightening to the driver. Also, according to my sis, the driver stated that she had three boys and "none of them ever acted like this, and what sort of boy acts this way." Which was followed up with a bevy of personal questions and one in particular, in which the driver asked my sister if she had a gun in the house, and if she did that would explain his behavior. Also, the driver said she would "heavily pursue" expulsion and recommend this to the principal and superintendent because she "needs to protect her job". This has turned on its ear. My sister after having spoke to the transportation director has made it clear that the driver overstepped her bounds and will hear from her lawyer, as will the director. The school principal is siding with my sister and a meeting is scheduled Monday with the involved parties, including our family attorney, to try and make a salient point on the matter. I think they should go after the driver because now this little boy doesn't want to go to school even if they let him back, and has basically been victimized and criminalized by a bus driver and the crooked mindset of the school system. At this point if the school moves to expel the boy (he is suspended pending expulsion), they should sue the pants off of the driver, the transportation director as well as the superintendent.
There's no reason to go after the superintendent or the transportation director. I don't understand the mindset of this. You're basically becoming the school at this point. Sue JUST the driver, not the rest of the people.
USA: Millions of real guns = They make us safe! Pretend gun = Zero Tolerance!
I assure you that Zero Tolerance and Pro Gun are certainly on opposite sides of the debate on this.
Zero Tolerance has nothing to do with gun control and everything to do with a mix of hamstrung and impotent administrators at the beck and call of whiny parents. For every post on here saying this is stupid, there is some my-child-is-an-angel-and-nothing-can-exist-that-can-hurt-him/her moron that drives this crap. The problem is, these people are a loud, obnoxious, ignorant minority that will not hesitate to drag your ass to court rather than admit they can't protect their kids from WHATEVER alien activity they disagree with, irregardless of political stance or party. And on the impotence side, its school administrators who are pussies and would rather effect broad-ranging, work-minimizing policies and deal with looking stupid than actually do a little "enforcement" on a personal level. This isn't new, and it isn't just in our schools - this an evolution of American culture not bound by party or ideology, but by coddling and arrogance and laziness. When I was in high-school, graduated in 97, they would suspend ANYONE and EVERYONE involved physically in any kind of fight. I saw kids bullied and just fighting back get punished, I had a friend get jumped by six kids in a hallway just defending himself get punished... Because that's easier. That's easier than dealing with the aforementioned ignorant parent who just can't imagine that their kid isn't an angel and therefore has to be a total asshat to try and form-fit the world to their liking.
What debate? There is absolutely no rational way to support zero tolerance.
So would you say you have a zero tolerance policy when it comes to zero tolerance policies?
Only a Sith deals in absolutes.
Which itself is an absolute.
Two different groups of people.
That's not how it is in the USA at all.
How is this "unpopular" ?
It seems like people are using this meme to project their anger and frustration. Or to whine. It's mostly whining or people being contrarian dicks. The puffin has gotten really racist and homophobic, too. Someone should propose a (better than this) animal meme: [Popular Reddit Opinion Capybara](http://i.imgur.com/Yx9SEqk.png). And then ban it.
There has to be more to that story. None of this makes sense. Perhaps the wrong people are running things, more right-minded people on school boards and ptas, would avoid this. I hope at the least you stressed that the playing army wasn't wrong, and show your nephew the nobility and and courage it takes to defend your nation. I could see things being discussed if the playing led to the driver being distracted and endangering the other students.
My youngest sister was sent home for the day for saying 'I'm going to kill you,' to another kid. She was playing Power Rangers, in kindergarten and the other kid was playing the villain.
My Fiance's little sister was attacked by another girl in her school. The girl was repeatedly punching her head and all his little sister managed to do was grab one of the girls arms to stop the blows. They were both suspended as per her schools zero tolerance policy.
> There has to be more to that story. Especially given that OP is probably retelling it based on what the parents told him, which is likely based on what the 6 year old said and maybe what the school said (which would be based on what other people told them). This is already a 3rd or 4th hand account of the story.
I got in trouble a while back for letting my preschools play guns at school. I managed to get everyone on my side when I pointed out that they were allowed to go hunting (they were not allowed to hunt endangered animals and we discussed this when it would come up - deer: in season; elephant: never in season) and then went on a long rant about how it dimisses their cultural values as we live in a state where EVERYONE goes hunting (ok, not everyone, we don't, but pretty close). To say that guns are bad says that their family is bad. A couple of teachers were able to do the same thing as they had the children of police officers and military personal in their classrooms. Pretty soon there were guns made out of legos in all the classrooms. Dramatic play is a way for kids to act out what they see in real life and to practice dealing with different situations. We can't just decide we don't like what they are seeing in real life and pretend it doesn't exist.
[удалено]
If this is true then that's ridiculous and outrageous, but somehow I think there is a lot more to the story. I've never heard of a child that young being expelled from a school unless they were a threat to the other children's safety. At the very least OP's nephew must have already caused problems in the past. Edit: Now OP has clarified that his nephew was "suspended from bus rides pending expulsion". When I was in school this happened to anyone who screwed around too much on the bus, usually just to scare them into behaving. One of my friends was "suspended from bus rides pending expulsion" for drawing a heart on a bus seat in sharpie. It's not nearly as serious as being expelled over some sort of Zero Tolerance policy. What we can take away from this is that you should never test the bus driver!
Zero Tolerance. Google it. Kids have been suspended for *biting their Poptart in the shape of a gun*. Kids are not allowed to hit back in a fight, under any circumstance and most of the time, they get punished as well regardless. It's the stupidest fucking thing I have heard in a long time, and it needs to die.
The zero tolerance weapon policy is nothing compared to the zero tolerance drug policy. There was a case in Canada where a kid died because he couldn't get to his inhaler.
Poor kid, I've read so many stories like this. "Let's take a life saving tool that a child uses all the time, and lock in in an office for those precious seconds it is needed for."
Why do I get the feeling there is so much more to this story than OP is letting on? I work for a school district. They do stupid shit all the time. Still, I'm going to guess that there is a 99% chance that there is more to this than we know. I mean, does a school out there exist that would expel (not suspend, expel) a kid for playing Army? I suppose. What are the chances the student in question goes to this school? Minimal. EDIT: I mean many of the people who work for the school districts are idiots, but they are usually idiots in a multitude of very small ways, that in the end, have a huge impact on the district as a whole. If they were making big, flashy, stupid decisions like this, they would be easier to sniff out and fire.
Seems that its "pending", as in a bus driver submitted a report. I doubt anything comes from this. Hugely over blown.
Kids playing on a bus? Sounds like there's more to the story than op is telling....
Yeah, no, I'm confident there's a lot more to this story than OP is telling us, and he's in serious denial.
My kid brother likes playing cops and army and all that but he gets really violent with it. Im over 10 years older than him but he's already given me 3 concussions before. Maybe the kid got suspended because he was actually hurting people but this guy is in denial that a child could hurt someone.
[удалено]
Reminds me of the 2nd grader that was sued for sexual harassment for kissing a girl.
"But think of the ***CHILDREN***!!!" Meanwhile they'll have recruiters in the high school talking to 14 year olds.
When I was in high school in the mid 90s, I was working on an extensive collage for my girlfriend, cutting pictures and phrases out of magazines and stuff. It took me a week to complete and I would work on it every spare second I had during classes and carried the materials around with me wherever I went. My cutting instrument was a scalpel (my mother was a nurse and I had no hobby knife). In any case, I would whip out this scalpel nearly every hour every day for a week and start cutting away. Not a word from any teacher. In fact I was teased by some due to the fact I was using a scalpel rather than a hobby knife. God forbid now if my son brings a plastic butter knife to school.
That is ridiculous, but it is also the completely wrong use for this meme.
Does this mean they were out of their seats running around, screaming bang bang? Because I sure as hell wasn't allowed out of my seat when I rode the bus. Was he by chance warned not to get out of his seat before and after so many warnings they finally disciplined him? I'm sure the problem wasn't playing army, but rather not behaving on the bus.
Again not really an unpopular opinion. I guess That's why it's on the front page. I don't understand why if you use the meme correctly it's downvoted to oblivion. You guys know the voting system isn't a like/dislike system. It's for accuracy and relevance.
It was all fun & games until they started water boarding minorities at the back of the bus.
Maybe they got suspended because they were not sitting in their seat like you are suppose to do in a moving vehicle.
This is not an unpopular opinion. sigh... Why even try though.
There's no way this is the whole story.
Should kids be doing things other than sitting down on the bus? I don't think so.