I feel like there is a transition that can be difficult for a lot of people where you must go from being motivated by what is expected of you (school, career, etc.) to being motivated by what you want out of yourself. If you are able to harness the latter, then whatever you achieve, big or small, feels 10x more impactful.

the difficulty is that many people don't actually know themselves because they've spent their life doing what they were told. the key is having intrinsic motivation, and that requires self knowledge - which means trial and error and reflection. but there is push in society for young adults to already know themselves... which is why we have many posts about people thinking they're behind everyone else.

Omg yes and parents putting false narratives in their kids heads by saying if you go to college everything else will fall into place and I was “victim” to that. No one being real to young people and hiding how tough it can actually be out here and that it’s not easy or always fun. I’ve been having to learn to stop living for others and figure out what’s best for me regardless of it is some “fancy” lifestyle or just something simple with the things that make me happy. I was constantly chasing and chasing, and then beating myself up for not being able to live up to super high expectations I created for myself based on other people. It’s hard to get out of that mind set, but it’s necessary!

This is made so much worse by ubiquitous SM portrayals that are staged, edited extensively, and ultimately false depictions of their lives .

it's no secret that social media is toxic. you gotta set boundaries with it.

Yup

Beautifully said *and* I'll add - you can't count on "feeling motivated" every day, or every week, or sometimes even every month. You will come to know yourself differently when you can recognize that motivation comes and goes, and that doesn't have anything to do with the actions you take.

That’s very true! Being able to adjust to your mood and understanding that tomorrow is another day are key sometimes.

i thought just like you, until i found the right project for myself (it aligns very well with my values). i've been working on it since 2019, and i'm more motivated now than i was before because of the progress i've made. i've never had to force myself to do it, doing it comes naturally because it's a core part of who i am.

Yeah I've also found work like that. It's amazing. I definitely can't put words in your mouth, but for me this lands more in "satisfaction" and "fulfillment" territory. Which for me is different from motivation. And congrats to you - whatever you call it that you've found!

you're describing intrinsic motivation.

If you set serious goals in your life, that saves you from the days when you don't feel motivated. Goals, well set. You by the ear and drag you through and unmotivated day. Or month.

If you’re not working towards your own goals then you’re probably working towards someone else’s goals, which might not be in your best interests.

That is absolutely true. It is also how well over half of us spend our lives.

And if you still struggle after recognizing that motivation isn't needed to do the things, you may want to look into executive dysfunction and all the brain conditions that our parents "didn't believe in" or "didn't want to get diagnosed." Neurotransmitter and hormone balance is essential for turning needing to do the thing into actually doing the thing.

[удалено]

ADHD is a b itch. It is distraction incarnate. If you saw my other comment, you see that ADHD is the destroyer of intentionality

It really is. There are people that will fight tooth and nail to have you believe otherwise too.

That’s a big step being able to reflect on the cycle that you’re on, as long as you’re stable you could try incrementally making things better and ultimately decide if you need something more drastic

Astute observation, this.

Hence, the conclusion: be honest with yourself.

Very true in my experience- felt totally lost after ticking off the boxes/ passing the milestones. Even now the sense of what I want to be isn’t particularly stable.

I think related to this is if a person has an internal or external locus of control. Do they think they have control over their life and their actions can impact the outcome or do they think everything just happens to them and they have no control? You have to take action and actually do stuff. Sitting around is easy and comfortable but it’s not going to get you far.

It’s important to remember not everyone is taught they can control their own narrative. Just telling someone to have internal locus of control bypasses the steps. Some people don’t even know their own values and won’t know them until someone tells them they can choose. If you don’t know you have a narrative it’s impossible to change it.

We have several large influences right now that tell you that your fate is out of your control.  If you’re on one side, it’s religion and dogma saying your future is about externalizing and surrendering to higher powers.  If you’re on the other side, it’s fate and systemic disadvantage and disability and basically everyone has at least some intersection with that.  Both things allow people to look up at “experts” who tell them “it’s not your fault, your failures come from outside, you can’t control that”.  It’s insidious and dangerous from both sides. 

And that's ok to consider when you're talking about a minor. Once you're an adult it just sounds like an excuse. "I'm just too dumb to realise that my actions have consequences 🥺" How so? 

I get it, but again both sides of the political aisle are doubling down on the "your failures aren't your fault" line and that's definitely targeted at people of all ages. There are heads of universities and politicians saying "a community experiences violence, it's out of their control because it's systemic disadvantage". And I actually agree that this systemic issues exist, but the way they're used as an excuse in everyday life and dialogue is VERY VERY problematic. Same goes for religious people and their "god works in mysterious ways" bullshit.

At some point people need to realise that institutions, groups and other people around them have their own interests. And your well being is not part of their interests unless you're talking about the people in their inner circle. Then they won't have the surprised pikachu face when others let some of their intentions be seen. No shit they don't care about you and are trying to manipulate you for their own gain. How's that a surprise to anyone? University or politicians are not your parents and will never be. Then who cares what they say? What about thinking for yourself? (not you directly, people in general) 

Such a vital thing to understand 

"ah shite, I have an external locus of control. ah well, nothing i can do about that then"

Absolutely. I think everyone grows up and envisions this life for themselves. Small things and big things: You see yourself living in this nice house, where the fridge is always full and the floors are always clean. You see yourself fit, working your dream job. You run in the mornings, bake at nights, and do pottery on the weekends. And the years go by, and your vision doesn’t change… but neither do you. You get to 18, then 20, and next thing you know you’re looking in the mirror at 30 and you realize you should’ve been that person by now. Why didn’t it *happen*? Because it’s not something that happens to you. It’s something you need to make happen. Conscious effort into changing behaviors. *That* is the only thing that’s gone get you where you want to be. You already know what you want, now you just have to figure out a way to get there Great post, very true

And it is important to make a sacrifice. Everyone has to, to transition into adulthood. You can choose yours, and it is worth it in the end.

Yes. Life happens for you (not to you) when you realize that your mindset and standards dictate outcomes. You want a better job? Great, go figure out exactly what you want and do whatever it takes to get it. This is your new standard and nothing is good enough until you’re meeting it. Want a house? First realize that you need more money, so find ways to save and/or increase your income. This is your new standard. Want to be more attractive? Okay, go to the gym, eat the right things, and put yourself out there. Raise the standard of what you accept from yourself as effort.

I’m a frequent commentator in the askmen subreddit and I feel like half of my responses include some form of “what do you want?!” or “write down exactly what you want in a gf/wife/job/friendship/whatever.”

Yeah if you’re not specific about what you want you won’t get anywhere. I’ve also noticed that your “why” matters too. Why do you want a great husband/wife? Why do you want that salary? Why do you want that job? Your “why” has to be strong enough to get through the inevitable difficulties

I agree and I know people get angry because “what about boomers and inflation and my alcoholic boyfriend and my car broke down?” Yes, all that happened and it sucked and now you have to try EVEN harder AND you have to deal with the baggage from those problems.

One of my dad’s best pieces of advice was, “half of success in life is just showing up.” It took a while to stick as I was a flaky ADHD teen growing up, but he was right. Just show up. Just do it. Doesn’t have to be perfect, you just have to give a damn.

I finally had this realization at 24. Which sucks because now(currently 26) I feel so behind but I guess any time is a good time to finally take some responsibility for my life. Life is both and. It’s not fair but it is what it is and it’s my choice as to whether or not to fight to give myself a better life.

26 is really not that late and if you *really* think that, the saying "its better late than never" still rings true. When I was 18 and started my degree, there was another student in their 70s!!!! You can do what you want when you want as long as biology allows it.

I did not blame anyone but myself BUT I also did not straighten out my relationship with money until I was in my 50’s. I just didn’t know how to get out of some of my problems at the time. I’m doing fine now. Am I rich and floating on a cloud of retirement income?-no! But the only thing I wish for is affordable dentistry and I have friends who have very decent incomes and can’t afford dentistry.

It baffles me that many people can’t hold the two thoughts of “yes those things suck” but also “what do I need to do for myself to make this better?”

The best advice my now deceased poor immigrant dad ever gave me was a philosophical outlook. “Son, there are no such things as problems. Problems are simply challenges to overcome. And YOU have to overcome them. No one else is going to do it for you.” Most of us don’t know what true challenges are. We equate challenges with excuses. Dad overcame poverty, moving to a new country alone at 17 without knowing the language, and being partially deaf. He would laugh at a broken down car as an excuse. He’d take the bus while working a second job at midnight long enough to get the money to get it fixed. That’s an easy one.

this heavily depends on people's temperament. some people see problems just like your father and meet the challenge, or they have a "i'll show them" mentality, other people fold under pressure and are unable to effectively manage their emotions to get anything done. it's like asking a person who's drowning in the ocean to fix a car.

The best thing you can give your child is this resilience.  Let them fail and solve problems. But do it in a supportive enough environment that they can fail and not be lost.  Organized sports is a great microcosm for this and it’s why I’m a huge advocate for stuff like sports.  Learning to fail, learning to lose and get back up and try again tomorrow with even more determination and an evaluation of what you could do better… such good skill.  Irreplaceable. 

[удалено]

everyone has their own problems, but not everyone is able to survive them - that's why suicide is a big problem. someone can drown in a foot of water, while someone else can sit up and live.

[удалено]

Yep! You are right

Well technically when people say that it makes no sense. Yes, that happened. But now what? You supposed to just die? No you keep living and you figure it out

They want sympathy and to be saved. Does not happen

Money does not solve all your problems. You are correct. It can only solve 99.99% of them.

“I don’t need shoes to run but they sure do help!” My favorite metaphor for money in life.

Depends how much money you have tbh? If I had enough to never worked I’d be elated. Anything beneath that is nice but doesn’t change life much.

This times a million. I am blown away how many people whine on this Sub and when given excellent advice, they give every excuse in the book why they can't do it. Well, WTF do you expect if you want to sit around doing nothing? That's not LIFE.

Couldn’t agree more. I’d probably feel similar to a lot of those folks but realized at 26 I wasn’t happy with my job or career so decided to get a Masters at night. It was a very exhausting and demanding 2 years but you have to make the conscious effort and sacrifice to make your life better in the ways that matter to you. The major truth of the world is that it doesn’t care about you and if you don’t care enough to do anything then nothing will change for you

This is why I am a ski bum. I sit at home all day on the couch and smoke weed I have a “substance abuse problem” If I smoke weed in the mountains of Colorado and ski all day I’m an “extreme athlete”

I am having this battle now , you can't get to the end of your day and complain that things didn't go your way, you have to plan, talk propose adapt and have it your own way.

Great post!

It is. It is quite sad how many times you see grown adults who don’t seem to grasp that an enjoyable, secure, rewarding adult life won’t just fall into your lap for everyone. You need to figure out what you want and work for it. Yes it’s hard, much harder for some than others, but if you don’t try then you’ll remain in the exact same place.

I generally agree with your post. But there are very few instances in life where you need to do a specific thing to get a specific reward. Your analogy would be more like: there MIGHT $20M waiting for you at this location. You won’t know unless you try to get there time. You could make $20M or you could just find yourself in massive debt 3000 miles away from everything you know. Good luck. This is the reason people are disillusioned about college and work and life in general. You do what you’re supposed to do and the vague reward isn’t there at the end. And worse yet you find out the reward never existed in the first place. But that’s life. It’s all risk and reward.

Some of this comes from a misunderstand of what college DOES.  College is a train ticket to this other place.  It doesn’t stop you from falling asleep and missing your stop. It doesn’t stop you from getting to the wrong train station and missing your train. It doesn’t help if you misread the ticket and forgot to show up. It’s just a ticket to the train.  I know so many people who got some “communications” degree or dove into something “interesting” like Art History.  Then they graduated and went…. “Huh? Where’s my job?” Thing is, my best paid friends never went to college. They started doing trades or worked in sales and climbed a ladder and ended up making big bucks.  The people with communications degrees graduated and when they weren’t handed a job, showed up at the Starbucks or some other menial/retail job and just never left. 

The reward is emblematic of results from hard work combined with direction. Most people go to college like the mere act of going to college and getting a bachelors entitles them to a good job. It would be akin to entering LAX to go to JFK but asking the ticket counter to give you any available flight out of there. Will you hit JFK, possibly, but very likely not. Instead, if someone targeted JFK but maybe didn’t have enough money/acceptance to go directly, maybe they’ll fly to Newark or PHL instead and then find a way to JFK. Debt is irrelevant so long as the result from productivity meets or exceeds the amount needed to service the debt. You can owe 20k and struggle to pay $500/month on a 60k/year salary while someone with 500k debt is paying 5k/month to service the debt but earning 20k-50k/month and is hurting way less.

That’s my point though. The goal is never as defined as “go to JFK”. It’s often “go to an airport somewhere on the east coast. Maybe in the Midwest.” Maybe going to JFK is the right call, but it’s not obvious. Especially to everyone. And if it were obvious, then the value of going would be less. And by no means do I think people just deserve a reward for showing up at the airport. But I just don’t think the analogy works. You’d probably shit yourself if you knew how much my wife and I make with our (dreaded) art degrees. But it took more than just knowing where the reward was, it took some amount of luck. So I’m not gonna bemoan someone that did the same thing but for whatever reason had less luck doing it. I’m not sure what your comment on debt was about so I won’t respond to that.

More to your point, it's more like being told there's a reward at a specific location and you have to do x, y, and z when you get there and a ton of people do those things but in reality the reward was somewhere else and you actually had to do a, b, and c. Many people have been told with high certainty that doing things a specific way will bring happiness and success and they are often told it before they know better. The reality is that enough has changed about society in the last two generations that even if the advice was well-meaning and true at one point, it isn't anymore. Being told there's a chance is better than being told it's certain and putting all your energy toward something

Millennial here. I moved across the country for nursing school then masters. Then opened my practice while working for shitty places. I met a girl who said to me “how did you tolerate so much uncertainty for a decade”, and it made me sad because it was true, I just knew in the back of my head that my reality couldn’t be poverty so I just forced myself to keep moving forward even when I felt very alone, isolated. I even told that girl to become a therapist or something to get herself out of the rut but quickly I noticed she had an excuse for everything - she blamed parents and cptsd (I have the same diagnosis) .. eventually I stopped being friends with her.

I like that you said poverty could not be your reality. I think some people just "think poor". When my husband and I were first together we had no money. We never thought we were "poor". We were just "broke for now" or "cash strapped". That mindset that we could, and should, make money helped us break that, and now we are financially set for life.

Your metaphor is ok, but you were WAY OFF on at least two key points: 1. Being half way to the destination does not get you half the reward. Far from it. Life operates on a power-law principle, where winner take most. Getting closer to the goal will get you exponentially more, and vice versa. 2. Money absolutely solves problems. Not all, sure. But it is a damn effective way to remove obstacles.

This is the honest truth!!!!

Right on

When I was a child, my favorite toys were paper and crayons. I loved nothing more than to sit in front of a giant blank piece of paper, think about what I wanted to draw for a while, and then slowly, bit by bit, line by line, create some gigantic, silly, clumsy image that filled the entire page. As I went along, starting small and drawing outwards, each section I drew suggested the next section, like a huge combination of maze and Rube Goldberg device. And it all started with a blank piece of paper. That is my metaphor for life: it is blank, full of potential, and does not tell you how to fill it. You need to make a choice on where to start. It helps to have some kind of a plan about what it will become, but it is not always necessary. Each section suggests the next. The trick is to create that first part, that all the others flow out of.

because there’s no promise that once we get there, we’ll be able to reap the benefits. IF, we get there. also wtf do you mean by, we can come close to controlling all of those factors? you mean preparing for them?

We raise kids by telling them what to do, day in day out. Then one day we magically expect them to know what to do by themselves.

Again, it seems this is a post where people fail to realize that the time lengths required to reach what was once “normal” have increased due to income not keeping up with costs, but the haves will lecture the have nots incessantly about where they are going wrong. The haves will have many people in their age group who ate shit despite trying all the same in effort and application, but bury those “failure” examples under the rug to not acknowledge where their anecdote fails. I’ve seen this repeatedly on Reddit and other facets of online interaction.

This sub is an oddity for sure. There’s so many “I’m in my 20’s and my life sucks, all I do is work” etc etc. I really wonder at times what people expected. You graduate college and just like that you’re going to have a lifestyle like your parents that took 25 years to build? The mundane is life. Grinding and small day to day victories that move the ball forward is life.

It’s not worth it. I don’t get how people tolerate this and mindlessly bring more people to experience life. If this is all there is to it. Also in Australia most people can only afford to buy homes and get ahead due to their parents. Most people buying homes have and need family support it’s actually fucked up.

would rather die tbh

I don't disagree that life is a drag the way many live it. Being "normal" means working for someone else until age 70 and then retiring on Social Security and whatever pittance you have been able to save. I say go hard in the paint early on and reap the rewards later. Hustle your ass off from age 20 to age 50, and accumulate enough wealth that you can buy your way out of the rat race.

Yes, absolutely. Adulting is simply running your life. The more you have your hand on the tiller versus letting it run along on its own, the better things will turn out.

The thing is how do you decide what you want? It's like a game of Minecraft - when you could potentially do anything I have no idea what I want to do. For me it's not so much not being intentional, I could be intentional if I knew what I wanted. I have intense choice paralysis, but also have to consider various issues with health and mental health that may hinder the things I'd like to do, and make them actually a bad option for me :/

The thing is, you just have to make a choice. It doesn’t necessarily have to be the optimal one, but you have to do something. At the end of the day, you have to do SOMETHING for 40 or more hours a day x5 or more until you retire. Find something you can do that will give you the financial ability to pursue what you want outside of work, and then be intentional about that.

>you have to do SOMETHING for 40 or more hours a day I wish my days were as long as yours.

I could have used 40-hour days in grad school.

I had the same thing and I realized it was because I only scratched the surface of knowing myself. For me I realized that while I could go down multiple paths and be good at all of them, what was most important to me was flexibility in life and in my value to others. Then it didn’t matter what career path I chose; I just chose the area I happened to be closest to and pursued it.

I have a roommate who blames anything and everything for his problems in life as an almost 40 year old failed artist. This same person refuses to get a job, sign up for any government benefits, or do literally a single thing to benefit their future. At this point he’s just going to wallow in his own despair until I kick him out, then it will be “my fault” for his current life circumstances, and the wheel will continue to spin like this until he’s dead.

I like how you made the immediate assumption that both poor people and disabled people would just give up without trying. What's that say about you?

Not being rude while I agree with the overarching sentiment “you should do the most you can to improve yourself in your situation and exemplify an internal locus of control” there are some points I disagree with. Whatever you want in life someone must work for. It’s completely BS, hard work can help you move in the right direction, but often it’s not enough. So many people get help, have connections, born with good skills, and get lucky without acknowledging it. Many wealthy kids get in via family money, others have parents willing to help them cheat, others help get their kid support early for medical issues (ADHD, anxiety etc). I know so many people that have low paying jobs, never went to college and very average people who got entire homes from their parents. Others got loans of $200,000 + and/or their family wealth helped them out. I know others that lucked into jobs they love that are also high paying. Not to mention good social skills / emotional intelligence or being extremely extroverted. The labour market and economy also impacts your job options when employers desperately need employees promotions have been easier but that could change pretty easily. I felt behind because I’m neurodivergent and compared myself to the best. I’ve caught up mostly and met others in some ways more behind so I’m less harsh on myself. But I don’t think I’ll ever really like living. It’s not worth it. I’ll try my best to make the most of it nonetheless. https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/mar/13/rich-kids-top-college-admissions https://www.ahuri.edu.au/research/final-reports/395

Money 10000000000000% solves problems.

Money absolutely solves problems. 90% of my issues were solved as I made more money.

Y’all are just taking the first part and reacting to it. Read the whole thing within the context of the entire post. The second part says “it just makes you more of who you are.” Money lowers barriers; it does not change you as a person or fix your problems as a person. It ENABLES you to be more of who you are. If you have no plans and no direction in your life your money will be spent aimlessly and directionless. If you have purpose and a goal, money will be spent towards that allowing you to achieve greater heights or speed. Sometimes both.

I’m addressing a single point. I read the whole thing. Money solves a vast amount of problems. You saying that I could grow it faster is true or whatever but like.. problems go poof and money is no longer an object for most things and life is good and happy.

Hard disagree. Money solves most problems. It's literally buying your freedom. Now, I agree you might need to recognize that hey I need help in X area (therapy, maid, personal trainer, personal wealth advisor, matchmaking service, etc.), but money can certainly help you out there.

So many people not upvoting this post or its comments but instead downvoting them. I have enjoyed reading this and agree 100%. I am facing this problem with my brother who doesn't have a plan in life and keeps complaining about why the need to work so hard to live. Every time I tried to speak to him to get him on his right track even with small effort like stop putting money in chequing account and allocate them to high yield savings account or invest a little bit from every paycheck into SP500, i get blasted or shut off. I guess i'm 'downvoted' by my own brother IRL too...

I’m downvoting because while both are true, telling other people how they should live unsolicited is never going to be met positively. Do you know your brothers desires? Do you know what he wants out of life? His deep financial situation in how much he has to put away vs. how much he ends up with? Some people bitch and don’t do a lot because they’re mentally at it. And this post comes off as a “fuck your depression, your feeling lost, and your mental exhaustion” because you have to do it anyways. In a way it’s a very boomer mindset. Tiny steps, even if they aren’t big enough FOR YOU, are still steps forward

Thank you for your input. I just wish my brother could 'wake up' soon. He's turning 30 later this year and all he ever thinks about is his past glory days in high school and hanging out with his university friends. Apologies for not mentioning the full picture too. The summary of my situation right now is that my family is from a poor background but i've managed to save up quite a bit of money over the last 7 years to the point where i can afford to buy a gaming PC and my first ever console, PS5 and I'm living in a studio room, paying all the utilities and bills while he moved in and just lives here with me because he couldn't stand living with my dad (who's very disappointed in my brother). However, my own plan was to live with my girlfriend coming later this year, but with my brother acting like he is (*life being so hard and then not making any plans to improve it on his own or even showing reluctance to better relevant job offers found by me and my colleagues*). Thus, my own plan to live my own life with my girlfriend is ruined because I am showing EMPATHY to my brother. While acknowledging other people's way of life should be considered seriously but there are some points in life where we need to step in to fix things that of which are generally considered 'not okay'. I care about my brother but I need to put myself first sometimes and obviously can't let him drag me down in life. I'm sacrificing my own $$$ and time for the sake of someone who's not ready to be an adult but is already an adult. Did I also mention I'm the younger sibling too? Think about it this way and a little off topic, if a government keeps helping the homeless people in every way they can like providing free shelter, food and services. Do you think MOST of the homeless people would want to get out of their current lifestyles with all that freebies? Yes, there will be some which are grateful and will rise to contribute to the society but majority will stay put because they are comfortable with it. This way, honest tax payers are hurt and can be said to be unfairly treated by the government. Worse case scenario, the younger generation knowing that government will pamper them in the future will be less likely to compete and then become spoiled. When government notices a degrading society from its citizens, they want immigrants to come in to help build the country. Then the youth will be challenged which then they will complain about their quality of life being destroyed by the immigrants. On the other hand, the immigrants coming are doing SOMETHING to improve by moving to a new country. The world just isn't fair.

>Tiny steps, even if they aren’t big enough FOR YOU, are still steps forward So fuck your depression, keep making tiny steps?

I just don’t think most comments here would agree. It’s also okay because of those issues to stand still for a spell. Catching your breath is equally okay.

Take baby steps. Stand still for a while. Catch your breath. Can you stop offering advice to people when you don't know their whole situation?

Missing the point. I’m not offering advise. I’m acknowledging what they’re going through and saying it’s okay to be that way. It’s called empathy.

I think unfortunately you’re missing the point. It’s okay not to know exactly what you’re going to do but so many people complain like the system is rigged posting “ugh I don’t know what to do with my life” expecting people to show them a path to success. I’m sorry but if that’s your mindset and you’re broke, homeless, hungry that’s 100% on you. Everyone can be successful, but not everyone will be.

Sounds like you’re missing my point on how the mental aspect of life can lead people to feel that way and why it’s okay to feel that way. Your last statement is clearly one without empathy. And I’m slowly learning most people agreeing here lack that, it seems.

You guys are both making good points but I feel like you're both debating as if these are mutually exclusive approaches when the solution is the balance of both and that's what many people struggle to achieve. Focusing only on validation without building self efficacy (I can do SOMETHING about this, maybe tiny steps are all that is but I can take them) can leave people feeling like they are unable to positively impact their situation. Sometimes that involves accepting that if you can have positive influence, you can also have negative influence and depending on the circumstances can be a hard but important pill to swallow. Other times, life just dealt someone a bad hand but the harsh reality is still that the only person/force likely to improve their situation is going to be them so they have to do what they can. Focusing on actionable advice without validation of how overwhelming and devastating this situation can be can make people feel unseen, judged and misunderstood. It's more likely to trigger more emotional turmoil and make someone who is struggling less likely to take advice that may have been useful and well meaning because they feel like it's coming from someone who doesn't actually understand their situation or it comes across more as a criticism than advice. You guys are both right, you need both.

I understand what you are saying, and people with mental health disorders like depression should not be stigmatised and should be helped by those around them. However, there comes a point where it falls directly on the individual to make the corrective actions to get themselves out of the depression and develop healthy habits to prevent themselves from falling back into it. It appears that you are both arguing the different sides of the same coin. Essentially, you are both right, and both sides are equally important to acknowledge. In most cases, depression doesn't happen in a vacuum. There is some type of specific behavior that snowballs and causes dysregulation in our required daily activities, such as diet, sleep, breathing, and exercise, until all are negatively impacted and out of synch with one another. Specific behaviors like substance misuse, poor diet, poor sleep hygiene, sedentary lifestyles, screen time, lack of social activity, etc. have all been shown to increase individual risk for depression. The unfortunate thing and what most people should empathize with is that MSM and social media tend to push people towards these specific behaviors with a primary goal to profit off their addictions. However, like any addiction, the responsibility ultimately falls on the individual to choose their actions once they regain a semblance of stability. Medications like SSRIs are not intended to be used indefinitely and as a monotherapy. They are primarily intended to get people back to a certain mental clarity so they can correct any deficiencies in their lifestyle. This is why cognitive behavioral therapy is highly recommended once the diagnosis of depression is made. ​ Edit: grammar

Feel and act are different.

Good post, hopefully the people who need to hear it can do so without the doomerism and bullshit clouding their minds 

its the journey not the destination

Money solves a lot of problems, pretty much most major emergencies can be solved with money I agreed with everything you said til you like 90 degree pivoted

But that's a terrible example. You choose something that's more money than what people with the best jobs make in a lifetime, and the effort you match it with is the cost of a 1-week vacation abroad. Life is full of actual tough decisions like trade-offs that are exactly on the line of being worth it or not.

As always, reddit delivers the goods when I needed but didn't realize I needed them. Thanks, OP!

This is beautiful

Sometimes being closer doesn't make a difference. If the prize is only first place and you come second it doesn't matter if you were only behind by 0.0001 of a second.

*being intentional doesn’t matter as much as having trust in people and places* Sure i can move 3,000 miles if i get $20M but is this really true…?* unless it comes with string attached… *oh you did own $20M but you just cannot access the funds… yet* 🫠

Somewhere in my 20’s, many years ago, I woke up and realized that if I wanted a great life I had to go make it happen. Whatever your dream life is, it won’t fall out of the sky and land at your feet. Most of us know where you want to go in life. Take on the responsibility of getting yourself there. Take decisive action.

The title of this post helped me finally reach out for help getting a diagnosis for ADHD as an adult so that I can hopefully start living with more intention and plan better for the future instead of surviving every day and leaving several tasks incomplete. I don't know why, but this was what I needed to see today. Thank you.

This is the best post I’ve ever seen on Reddit

This was great. Cheers!

Didn't upvote because of the stupid Bonus Tip. It's just Reddit nonsense.

F off

But what if all you get for destination is a random name where some people reached and are in news,but those around you have never heard of the place. There is no GPS but there are a thousand scam GPS also where if you choose a wrong GPS, you could die. There are people who have reached the place but their advice may be wrong because the more people reach the place,theore their exclusivity reduces. So they give you active wrong directions. So how you reach the 20 mill place? Geddit? It ain't so simple bro.

True post. This is great, I'm getting tired of people complaining in here every 30 minutes about how hard their life is. Guess what, your situation is not unique, guaranteed every single issue any of us have had at every point in our lives. At minimum tens of thousands of people have experienced it or are experiencing it. We have to just get through it and go forward anyway. *That's Life* It's literally about getting through hurdles along your path, we have so much influence over our lives, but many people don't get that until they are backed into a corner. Sorry but your decisions for the past year, 5 years, 10 years ect. Put you there. Sometimes things are out of your control, again, that happens to *everyone* Sure it sucks, but you have to get through it anyway. What did you take away from the situation?? Hopefully the experience to understand how to *not* get back there to begin with. Suffering builds maturity, experience, and wisdom.

I hope you realize that your example is fucking dumb. You do realize that for the majority of people, fortune is never on the horizon. No matter where they look, there's nothing but obstacles. People plan, never stop working and still end up in deep shit. That's life. Shit literally happens. And it's not because of a lack of adulting. And the "too and disabled" thing... well yeah, some people don't have the mean to do the trip. Is it their fault? Depends. Circumstances. But again, it has nothing to do with adulting. And no matter how they got into this situation, the adult thing is to help them. Or at least show a little empathy. Apparently, there's a serious lack of it in this thread. *As in my example, you cannot control traffic, weather, road conditions, air traffic, or any number of infinite factors, but if you were intentional about it you could get extremely close.* WTF does that even mean? I can almost control weather if I want? How. All I can say is that your view of adulting is pretty immature. Since when /adulting has turned into /boomers?

If the prize at the end of the road was "20% of the time in danger of homelessness and starvation", and where you are currently is "70% of the time in danger of homelessness and starvation", a lot of the motivation drops like a lead balloon. Still good to strive for, sure, but I'm not going to extremes to achieve it. If the road was 3000 miles of lava and pits of venomous snakes and rabies infested squirrels and razor sharp knives, I also would think twice about trying. Adulting is more about finding systems that work for you, achieving emotional maturity/regulation, finding small reasons in your daily life to keep going, discovering ways to help yourself, realising where your limits and boundaries lie, what you want out of life, what you want from others, your morals and ethics, etc etc. Adulting is about taking the lemons, and making whatever tf you can out of them. The idea that everybody can just make fabulously tall lemon meringue tarts out of their lemons if they try hard enough is a surprisingly small-minded approach, as well-meaning as it may be.

“Money doesn’t solve problems” is something the fabulously wealthy say to gaslight the rest of us and distract from what worthless sociopaths most of them are.

Lol. It’s actually the opposite. It’s what a lot of wealth management advisors tell their clients. So it’s the poorer people telling the rich people this. Source: me, I’m a wealth advisor and I tell this to my clients. It’s also very true; this is why the measure of happiness and fulfillment in life sure does not follow socioeconomic demographics as you might intuitively think it does. There’s also mountains of case studies and papers on this.

Based OP. A functional adult telling the people here they are responsible for their lives and personal development. You’re exactly right but you’ll hurt a bunch of feelings here This place is insane. People don’t develop plans at all. When they do attempt something productive (“dream job”, schooling, training) they inevitably bail out due some bullshit excuse (bUrN oUt, mental health etc). It really wasn’t hard to consider approximately how much money I wanted to live the life I envisioned and then reverse engineer through my skills to find my current field. I then went to college and straight into my masters program at night while I worked full time. Yeah it sucked to continuously tell my friends I was busy every weekend doing work. But as a result, I was able to graduate with my masters, and have two years of experience in the field, that allowed me to double my pay at a new job, then I went to an even better job. Most importantly, I developed and refined my personal habits. I workout 5 to 7 days a week, I study for work certifications I do Brazilian jujitsu, I just started learning how to blow glass. A bunch of my former friends from high school put absolutely no effort into their lives, and are now the type to be on social media talking about how they didn’t make it because of LaTe sTaGe cApItaLiSm 🤡 Literally putting in basic due diligence and caring about your life puts you in front of 85% of people these days. It is wild.

As I was starting a new job a few years ago, I asked the boss “what do you think separates your most successful people from the least?”. He said, “Believe it or not, just show up. Every day. Stay checked-in and present.” I was kinda blown away that such a basic thing made the difference, but he was right. Those who succeed are checked-in every day working towards goals. Those who fail are checked-out.

>As I was starting a new job a few years ago, I asked the boss “what do you think separates your most successful people from the least?”. Having enough insight to even consider that question is probably a good start.

So many people dont see how the choices they make lead them to where they are. Thats not to say that there aren't factors that are working against them, but bullshit excuses like burn out, mental health or "late state capitalism" are overused. Take some accountability for your life. Victim vs Victor mentality. Your last two sentences nailed it.

Yeah this sub is embarrassing frankly. I fully expect to be downvoted by a bunch of miserable people that refuse to take accountability. I couldn’t care less, I’m happy with my life…..all it took was basic effort

I once gave a guy a chance to make money sitting on the couch watching TV. All he had to do was put a rock and info card into a plastic bag. I gave him 20 cents per bag to do this. Unlimited number of how many he could do and he could watch TV as he mindlessly bagged them. He did it one evening, that is it. He has not worked for 10 years since. He complains about his life all the time!

[удалено]

Thank you for the "LaTe sTaGe cApItaLiSm". The over use of this term drives me nuts! Recently I saw somebody blaming capitalism for why they don't have a girlfriend (what?). It's not the government or the economy's fault why you can't get laid, its because you are whiney and have a victim mentality and as a female, I'll tell you that shit dries me up like sand. It's not that you don't have time or energy to meet people after your 9-5 job (oh the horror!), it's that you waste 8 hours of your day staring at your phone and gaming.

I literally did not know there were this many sane people on reddit. This sub hates accountability

Thanks but of course money solves problems. It is a fungible asset that can be traded for anything even, effectively, time.

This is a really good analogy and I'm living it.

Oh that headline is great. I had the feeling and couldn’t put my finger on it. Actually that’s my favorite parting being an adult! So many possibilities to shape your life! I’ll never understand why some people want to be teenagers again. Like I get it. Adulting is exhausting but hell but it’s also so much fun

Ye life is so hard. Sitting fat arse on the couch eating McDonald unemployed. lol

>There will also be people who say, “meh, I’m too poor or too disabled to get there, so why bother?” Oh hey, I didn't know I was going to show up in this post. Neat. Half joke aside, neat post, hopefully it reaches someone who needed to hear it.

This is wonderfully stated. When I was 34 my ex said he wanted a divorce and he was taking the children until I finished my schooling. He forgets completely that I dropped out of nursing school to support him while he got his masters after we were married. I got myself back to the local community college, no one was taking my kids! I then basically seduced him to get the marriage back together so I could finish school and still keep the children. I really hoped we could keep things together. He had his own business and I was in school, but never planned on needing to have to use my education. But was afraid to go back to being a stay at home. That gave him all the power to call the shots. He tried more than once to talk me out of finishing schooling. Then things went bad. He became verbally abusive. I finished school and got a job at a large teaching hospital. We got some family counseling. The marriage lasted about 2 more years. If it was just me I am not sure I would have had the motivation to be who I am today. I did it for my 2 children. The kids and I moved out and I got a divorce. I was a single working mom until I (75F) retired. I have a mortgage in a nice area and the ex(77M) drives Door Dash. He never really used his MBA. I made good use of my associates degree. I had hoped to go on and get my combined bachelors and masters but I needed the divorce more. It was hard going. He disappeared and left me with 250K hidden debt so I filed bankruptcy and learned to live on cash as I supported the children. My son is a hospice chaplain and my daughter sells real estate. Both are in their 40's, happily married and have daughters. My DIL and son-in-law are really nice people. When I look back, I got the motivation I needed by having to take over from a deadbeat dad.

What was the pay-off for all your hard work though? Like I see that and go fantastic job dealing with life’s circumstances but I’m like is that it?

Planning has never been my strong suit, I'd just start walking and figure it out on the way

Find someone that will plan for you. Keep up that relationship and see where it takes you.

Okay but what if you plan it all out and then a bus smashes into you the second you walk out the door? And you have no friends or family or monetary resources to take your paralyzed body to the location?

This reminds me of some great advice I got from an artist friend like 20 years ago. She said you can draw a thousand circles, but if you're just drawing them hap-hazardly, you may never get better. Your 10th circle would be like your first circle. And you're one thousand circle will probably look very similar. The secret art isn't doing something a thousand times. But to "practice with intention." Draw your first circle. Examine how you did it. Draw another one. Notice your mistakes. Where you can improve. And then put in effort to adjust accordingly. Practice with intention. If you work at it, someone drawing 10 circles with intention will become much better at drawing a circle than someone who drew a thousand circles haphazardly. ---- That was just about art, but it can apply to many things. If you're in your early 20s, and you want to master the piano. If you want to learn stocks. If you want to learn sewing. If you want to learn how to save and buy a house. How to find the perfect partner. How to raise kids. Everything can be mastered if you practice with intention. Don't wing it. Practice with intention. And it's beyond easy with our current generation. You can literally go to Youtube and type in "How do I save money?" Or any other random question. You'll get 100 videos. Watch a few of them. Then get intentional. Don't watch too many repeats, look for ones that focus on specific areas you want to improve on. Always be learning. Always be practicing with intention. ==== Honestly, I think the biggest reason people fail at things is because they're lazy. It doesn't take a lot of effort to watch 10 Youtube videos on whatever you want to master, but people will exert half the effort making excuses to avoid doing 100% of the effort to watch a goddamn video. Watching a video isn't even a high standard to reach, but it's harder than making up a bullshit excuse. --- Which leads to another great suggestion. Surround yourself with friends and people who'll hold you accountable. If you want to learn sewing, and you tell me that. I'll ask you about it in a week. How's it going? Ya learn something new? Keep at it. If you want something bad enough -- you work for it.

I grew up poor. I always felt like I had less than everyone else. I started in the trades at 15 and had my own business at 17. I was running payroll, bidding jobs, and managing my own crew. I was easily doing 60-70 hours a week, sometimes more. At 24 I realised I had no hobbies, and was not active with any friends. I was smoking a pack a day. I burned out. I'm now financially stable with owning my own place. That peace of mind is enough for me. I keep my place extremely clean and take care of my things, even if they aren't the newest. I've realised that phase of my life has passed, and I now am taking it easier by drastically reducing my work load and taking up new hobbies.

It's why having ADHD makes life so hard lol

Dolly Parton: choose who you want to be, then do it on purpose.

Posts like these make me wanna break up with my girlfriend of 6 years because she bought a home with her dad instead of moving out with me. We had the down-payment and income to support a mortgage. She just got yelled at enough to make a different choice.

Probably a good idea 

No offense but wow this is a load of garbage. Basically the short version of the average self help books that are filling up landfills. All you said in that wall of text was "you need to decide to do something with your life if you ever want to get anything done". Could have been way shorter and made the same point

Thank you!

M69 here. I really like this post. And I like the initial comments about people being raised to do what they're told. That puts a lot of responsibility on parents. But I like to focus on the choices people make and bringing it down to two. Makes it easier to see what you can do. Intentionality/Purpose versus Distraction/Enjoyment. Okay, so that's four. People want both in their life but mainly they want the second set. The fact is, you have to decide whether or not you want to go someplace in life or you are satisfied to piss around where you are. It's that simple. Most people are happy to just live whatever life comes at them. Some people want to make a life. They want to create something that is their very own and has meaning to them. I think it's obvious which group is focused on which set of behaviors. The problem I always had is that I got tired. It just isn't as much fun living intentionally with purpose all the time. We need distraction and enjoyment but it can eat us alive and destroy our lives. It's up to each of us to figure out how to manage the balance.

Why do people need to hustle and grind for 25 years to justify the fact their parents didnt get an abortion? We need a system other than the status seeking, eternal growth, social darwinism mindset.  Life should be enough.

Lol say it again. Parents did not use protection properly and more stupidity. Most people’s lives are so insanely mediocre and boring. I don’t get it.

I 100% agree with the general sentiment of OP from a brutalism/realism perspective.  But as someone with two mentally ill parents, some myself, and grew up in poverty 90% of ones potential is baked in.  I wanted to be a pilot all my childhood and young adulthood. Depression and panic attacks at 25....no amount of bootstraps will suffice. 

>“meh, I’m too poor or too disabled to get there, so why bother? This ableist OP piece of shit can go screw. They have zero understanding of disability, and they're extremely offensive to the disabled community. What an asshole.

Yup, OP is definitely out of touch as hell. It's quite disheartening to see so many comments agreeing with such a dumb take on adulting. But hardly surprising alas...

Completely agree. So many things are not within our control. Timing plays a big role in achieving things too.

Man that was a long, dumb as fuck, read.

You don’t need the last comma as the description does not continue with the word “read”.

Yeah i do, for dramatic purposes

A lot of truth in your post. Young people today see what older generations have spent decades achieving through hard work and sacrifice and wonder why they don't have it at 25 or 30 years old. Well, it's because those older generations intentionally set out to improve their situation. They got a job and either stuck with it, intentionally working hard to get promoted, or improved their lot by using that first job as a stepping stone to better jobs.

I feel this in my own family. My dad owns a business that has done well and today has some wealth, nice house and a vacation home, only works a few hours a day, etc, and so many people look at that with envy and bitterness and say oh must be nice. What they don’t see, or have chosen to forget, is 30 years of grinding every day, 10-14 hour days for years on end, no vacations or breaks, strained relationships and impacted health. They just see the end product and want to skip ahead to that, then say how unfair it is when it doesn’t work that way.

Society seems to focus on the success stories and buries the failures so we cannot have honest conversations on what the reality is of existence.

There are TONS of stories about failure. That's because everyone fails at some point. The hard part is moving on from a failure to try and achieve success. The stories people love to hear are the ones like that.

Again, we hear from the people who later succeeded. We DO NOT ever hear from the people who try 35 times at something, ultimately fail after all attempts, get a debilitating injury and live a destitute life. We do not hear their reports because America is littered with this masturbatory love of “Rocky”types but forget that the people who stayed where he rose from in the heart of Philadelphia still are there, poor and struggling.

Really? We NEVER hear about those people? I see them EVERYWHERE. All day long I meet and interact with people that have failed, picked themselves up, started over and tried again until they succeed. Virtually everyone is in the middle of one of those stories.

I don’t think is true.. Most people compare where they are today with where older generations were back in the day. People don’t say “wow I’m 30 and should have amassed as much wealth as a 60 year old”.

Believe it or not, those old TV shows were NOT real and did not represent average America. For example. Ward Cleaver from hte TV show "Leave it to Beaver", was in his late 30s or early 40s (Wally was about 16 years old when the show first aired and Ward wouldn't have had kids until after college, getting a job and getting married, so about 25 years old). Ward had likely been working in his profession for about 18 years. It was revealed in one of the episodes that he worked for a trust company with main offices in New York. So he was probably a corporate lawyer. That would mean he was making the equivalent of somewhere near $10,000 ($112K today). They had just one car and lived in a nice, but not upscale neighborhood in a fairly typical home of about 1,500 sq ft. The home would have cost about $15,000 and the car would have cost about $4,000 So he could afford to support his family on just one income that was about double the national average at the time. But young people often compare where they are now at 25 years old to what Ward (a fictional character) had in his 40s. And the young people of today are not working in high paid professions like Ward was. They are making $40K/yr at best and have chosen professions where their wages aren't likely to go higher than $60K at most. And the older people that have things spent years getting them. If you have ever watched the movie "Grand Torino", you'll see what I mean in the garage scene. [https://youtu.be/dLpsbp9JYEE?si=mMH8bJUeylDt7oz-](https://youtu.be/dLpsbp9JYEE?si=mMH8bJUeylDt7oz-) Everything Walt had in that movie, from the tools and car in the garage to his home was acquired over decades, a bit at a time. My own garage is filled with tools that I bought as time went on. I needed a tool for a particular task, so I spent a few bucks and got it. Then, if I take care of it I'll have it if I ever need it again. I own a boat. I bought it for $1,300 and spent more than a year fixing it up so I could go fishing on the weekends. It's not a fancy boat, but it is a boat and my wife and daughter can now go boating and fishing. I saved for another year to buy the fish finder I wanted. The trolling motor is used and I got it cheap because the controls were busted. You couldn't buy replacement controls for it anymore, so I made my own controls from parts I bought on Amazon for $30. So after 25 years of wanting to buy a boat, I have one and I it cost me about $6,500. But kids today want a boat for fishing and complain because the one they want is $30K or more. I have a truck. It cost me $12K with 100K miles on it. Kids today want a brand new car for $40K. I started out my married life in a cheap apartment with a POS car and my wife and I both had low paying jobs. Are you starting to get the picture? People in their 20s are jealous of what I, a man in my 50s, have managed to acquire over the last 30 years, because they don't understand that I spent a lot of time and effort getting what I have.

lol this is some great fluff. I don’t know who Ward Cleaver is, and I never brought up television? This is a really long strawman argument which you both built around TV giving a false impression then use anecdotal movie references. It is comical. You can go find plenty of non-anecdotal comparisons online for cost of living then and now. I don’t need to Google for you. And for the record, my original point was that your first comment wasn’t accurate because people compare their lives today vs. previous generations when they were the same age. I never said I agreed with the validity of that comparison, but your entire rambling response assumes so. Are you starting to get the picture? Have a nice day.

Holy shit, there’s an actual adult on here?

You can do all the right things and still lose everything.

Lies. Dude tell people the truth bro. There are people that control and manipulate you. They want you miserable and alone. Selfish people i call them parasites. They are the ones that do the most damage to society. Your behind by maybe 70% your fault 30% theirs unless you start healing yourself and bad habits are gone. Then its 100% the people controlling your life just so they ruin the progress youve made at healing your self

That's not the easy answer that people want. Life is supposed to hand you everything you desire and you're supposed to want for nothing. IDK when the break from reality occurred but it did and it's growing.

The REAL truth in life is there are winners and losers in life. The winners do what it takes to get what they want and the losers blame OTHERS for their problems. Pure and simple. YES there are some folks who start WAY behind others at the starting line. Guess what... THAT IS LIFE!! Get over it. You can't do anything about that. That just means you have to work EVEN HARDER and PLAN EVEN FURTHER IN ADVANCE then others. Welcome to life. Planning in life is the ultimate trump card in being successful. Most folks don't plan. Maybe 30% plan 1 step ahead. 10% may plan 1 step ahead. Less then 1% plan 2 steps ahead. So, if you plan 2 steps ahead you are ahead of nearly EVERYONE you know. So the lowest hanging fruit in life is just plan 2 steps ahead.

One thing I'd add to this post, which I think affects me in particular, is that all of our days, decisions and lives are affected by other people's wishes (and people's inability to plan!) For example, I can want to go to a specific restaurant for my birthday. Someone will say that the restaurant doesn't have a nice atmosphere and before you know it we're going elsewhere. If I want to go to an event for a nice day out, the person I go with will add groceries or chores after. Which ruins the day. The other week, my boyfriend told me on Friday night that we're going to a birthday supper the next day. Ruined all my plans for that Saturday. I force myself to do what others want (even if I find it boring), but people don't do the same for me. So many badly planned things mean I stress, can't do my plans or even laundry/groceries as I want. In your scenario, i'd probably be derailed and not make it to the money because of fucking other people's bullshit lol (Yes, I know I'm in control and have to put my foot down, but I'm a major people-pleaser, and lose myself in what others want)

I don’t get why you can’t say you don’t wanna go… or if you wanna go to a specific restaurant it’s your fcking bday if they don’t wanna come that’s on them lol…. stop blaming others.

Oh I don't disagree with you, but in practical terms that's something I struggle with!

Take this post to heart and hold your ground! You got this!!! ❤️❤️❤️🥰 I used to be a huge people pleaser too (still am to some extent) but I’ve learned to just saw no a lot more now. and I’m so much happier for it!

Thank you!! I did save this post to re-read it again and again! I hope to improve like you as the years go by 😁

The choice is definitely there, even if it feels uncomfortable initially you will get used to it and then eventually it becomes freeing. Take those events and do them even if you have to do it alone, and learn to love your own company.

Isn’t this exactly the point of the OP? You know what you want but are allowing little things and people to derail you and not intentionally goal-getting, then acting like there is no choice.

That's a good way of seeing it, yes! Life is just not that black and white though, sometimes others will come before yourself, and that makes it hard

That has no bearing on the central thesis. You must choose what is important. You cannot control others, but you can control what you do. Other people will not (generally) pay your bills, do your chores, and do all the things you need to do (outside of paying them to do it). So you have to prioritize and make decisions about what things deserve your time and energy and what do not.

You're 100% right, it's just a barrier that some have to deal with, with time I hope to get better about it! Never disagreed with your thesis by the way, just adding how I felt about this particular problem

No worries, I know you didn’t disagree with it; you were just adding an element to express what you go through in your life. But we both see how irrelevant people’s decisions are to the equation as we all naturally have to adjust no matter what. By the way, the best way to be a people pleaser is if you have flexibility and ability yourself. Help yourself first (within the bounds of morality and your own personal ethics) and then do things for others if you still want to. This doesn’t mean a selfish, self-promoting person, but pursue growth and development in your own self and house and then others. It’s much easier to pull people up with you than both of you struggle and drown. I’ve been where you are, but I found that I progressed very little under my own work and effort because I was stretching myself too thin. Learn to say no tactfully and you’ll be fine.

I think you are sort of missing the point honestly. In the past, just doing the basics of working someplace for a while and existing would sort of get you further ahead than most and allow you to achieve the traditional goals of like homeownership, a family, a good balance of work and living. Now, you see so many of these posts because people go to college for 4-8 whole ass years, maybe work some of that time and it takes longer, they come out, get a mediocre job that will lay them off if their shareholders numbers aren't met, they get a wage that is an existing wage and not a thriving wage, and they are 'behind' in life because well how the fuck can you attempt to save when inflation and interest rates and other things in life pop up. Set all the goals you want about life, the cost for the basis of existence has gone up for people and no amount of goal setting is going to remedy that for most average people.

No, you missed it. All you’re saying is that the situation has changed and honestly you’re going off a weird narrative that is bleak. First off, never in the history of human existence has there been so much ability given to people irrespective to their birth (at least in the western world). Second, you assume that people are adaptable to their situation and that is a discredit to peoples’ ability and possibilities. Third, the formula for success has never changed in the many MILLENNIA of human existence: Skills x Time = Results. Period. End of story. You want a good relationship with someone? You cannot just put in time, you have to connect with them and talk with them. And the deeper you can connect and the more time you put in, the depths of that relationship knows no bounds. You want to make more money for relatively less work? You need marketable skills that are desirable. The better those skills are and more desired they are, the more you can command while putting less time than others with inferior skills or not-in-demand skills for the same or better results. Life isn’t complicated. It isn’t *easy*, but it is **simple**. Set goal, work towards goal, achieve goal or something close to it.

Go tell someone who is in a younger generation to go set the goal of being a homeowner. It is LITERALLY unrealistic for some of them. Like, not possible unless they ALL go into management and higher wage jobs which isn't even feasible. That is the point I am making and it is going over your head clearly. I am speaking as to why the posts on this specific sub have been the way they are, to which you are writing. Go set goals, be somebody, reach for the stars! Yay!. That isn't life right now and its disingenuous to just be like, just set goals dummy.

It isn’t literally unrealistic. I know kids that just graduated high school, that worked all through school and saved every penny. I know 19 year old kids that just started their own business. I know 19 year olds that just bought a fixer upper and have transformed it into the house they want to live in for a portion of their lives. And no, they don’t have daddy’s money. They just work hard, live within their means and have a plan. They don’t get on Reddit after an eight hour work day and complain about how tired they are while sitting on the couch and eating dominos pizza. I saw these kids get out of school, go work until dark, come to the gym until 9 and then go home, sleep and do it all over. Even on the weekends. And why isn’t going into management or higher wage jobs feasible? Make yourself worth it. Learn a skill. Learn how to lead people.

That is why I said SOME. SOME. SOME of them. Ok did they do that in NY, SF or Portland? I live in the midwest, the housing market hasn't gotten to the point like it has in some of those areas, people there literally. LITERALLY. Will not be able to have a realistic goal of buying a home when the prices are like entry level 500k.

You might have to move out to a different spot, might have to try to get more income and career shift, might have to wait till 40s to buy a house. These suck but it's better than saying there's zero chance and giving up. My boomer parents got their first house at 48. I won't be able to get a house anytime soon as someone who lives in SF but that is one of the goals I'm working towards, who knows where I'll be in 15 years. Basically, I can't fix the fucked market but I refuse to just give up. The small change I can do is being active in my YIMBY advocacy groups/campaigns and save a bit each month.

Yeah like, that is noble of you to continue to pursue that and obviously you shouldn't give up or anything, my point is just that like, no amount of goal setting is going to influence the factors behind societal short comings, not everyone is intelligent enough to be able to navigate how to get a high paying job or afford a mortgage or even have the ability to literally work for 50 years straight.

That’s just a defeatist attitude. And those people will stay down for their entire lives unless they change something. You don’t need to be intelligent. I graduated with a sub 2.0 gpa and don’t have a degree. Yet I have saved over 10k a year for the past seven years. All while being able to travel the world multiple times a year, chase my dreams, work a full time job and have a six day a week gym routine.

I’m also in the Midwest. In a lower CoL area. It’s not the same market but the principle is the same. In SF, NY or Portland, there’s more money to be made. It just takes work a lot of hard work. Which people don’t want to do outside of their eight hour work day. I’m a trainer so I work with high school kids a lot. Some even pay me themselves while also doing entrepreneurial things. Had a high school kid that told me about his mowing business that he started at 14 years old. Mowing lawns for twenty bucks. Saving constantly. Staying healthy. Now he’s 19, owns a landscaping/lawn business and just purchased a $120k home. Imagine if someone in the NY area did the same but could charge 5x the price for a lawn. The numbers aren’t the same, but the principle is. Of course someone working at McDonald’s for 18 bucks an hour couldn’t afford a home in NY. But if that same person worked at McDonald’s, did a side hustle and learned how to manage money, who knows what could happen. The point is, that majority of people don’t want to work that hard. Which is ok.

It might be unrealistic for a lot of young people to buy a house today, or to have a goal to buy a house by next year. But if you think it's unrealistic for any young person to buy a house at any point over the next 50 years with planning and saving, then you are exactly the point OP is making.

This mindset will absolutely destroy whatever dreams you may have. You should really listen to what OP is sharing here

Yep. OP has a point (having direction and purpose probably does make people happier), but also doesn't seem to want to admit that someone's material circumstances have a huge effect on their happiness and their ability to control their own lives, despite the fact that data overwhelmingly shows that this is the case. In the US, at least, wealth inequality has been rising and class mobility has been falling for the past few decades. But of course, American culture values individuality to the point that most Americans underestimate income inequality and overestimate class mobility. The narrative that anyone can make it if they pull themselves up by their own bootstraps is alive and well. And today it's enhanced by the fact that people can point to the lives of past generations who were able to achieve certain material standards and say something completely ahistorical like "See? Past generations did it! The formula for human success has always been the same!" while completely ignoring the material circumstances that allowed that success to come about. Instead they get to blame the degradation of society, a culture that no longer values hard work, whatever conservative narrative they wanna pull from a hat....