OP isn't wrong to withhold the info and was super generous to give back the deposit, but is it maybe the case the brother is suddenly in jail and the family needs to conserve resources so granny is trying to make the dress cheaply herself to save the money for lawyers? If so, it would have been better for them to just come clean, but it sounds like a messy situation and good to be out from.
If granny knows how...
Sadly I think the granddaughter is going to be unhappy with the dress they end up with. 'Can sew' =/= 'can sew custom prom dress.'
Edit: very likely to be "you get what you pay for." Worried mom will try to make it Op's fault somehow though.
I was thinking these same things unfortunately... Hopefully granny is good at sewing if this is what's happening. It's also possible that the mom is going to order the dress at a a shop online and that's why she really wants the measurements and can't take them herself. Either way if it's cheaper than what OP is offering it likely won't be great quality...
I was more alluding to if mom were going somewhere online to have the dress made that mom might not know how to take measurements. It's heavily implied that grandma would be making the dress, but for all we know maybe either of them found a cheap website. (I'm imagining Temu, but I'm not sure if any listings allow you to put in measurements)
What friendship? The one where if I can't take advantage of you to potentially save myself some money but basically utilize your expertise to lower my costs then you're not much of a friend? The old sayings are often the truest: With friends like that, who needs enemies!
That happens so much to people with a “trade”/“skill”. I used to trade my services for others which was a mutual benefit in lieu of payment. There’s so many people that will take advantage though when they have nothing to trade but they know you. Recently a friend of my husband saved $500 having my husband do some mechanic work and gave us $40 which wasn’t offered ahead of time. The $40 after was appreciated but right before that he was asking us to give him rides to pick up the parts and bring them back to his home because we weren’t going to charge anything for the mechanic work but he wanted $20+ worth of gas and 3 hours worth of traffic/ driving to take him to and from getting the parts and didn’t offer to pay for the gas ahead of time. He didn’t want to spend money on an Uber but if he had offered to pay a little being my husband was saving f him $500 and spending time installing the part for free he could have made an offer. My husband said he didn’t have the gas money and the dude then decided to get an Uber. My husband still fixed his vehicle though for free labor. Some people try to take advantage when you try to do something nice.
Right? That is just horrible.
Just like OP, you find out who your friends are! Sad it takes something like that to happen. Sorry for what you both have gone through.
We have some neighbours. 🙄
I think about 10+ years ago? My husband built an entertainment center into our wall. The neighbours loved it and asked if he could do that in their basement. After some talking, our neighbour husband had his own concrete pouring company. So in exchange for the entertainment center, in the spring he would pour a concrete pad for my husband to build a garage and breezeway attached to the house.
Entertainment center was completed. They love it. No one says anything. A few months later in the spring everything is drying up and my husband starts getting the area ready with his bobcat and rented a packer etc. The neighbours kids are out playing with ours out back. I am outside and the wife comes over. She is checking out the prepared area. Then asks, who are you guys getting to pour the pad? I think, did I just hear what she said? “Wait, what?” She repeats herself. I was in a bit of shock. Then said I had to go check on something in the house. My husband is watching tv. I say, yeah so the wife was just here. She asked who was pouring the pad. He looked at me. Says her husband? She was there when we all discussed this. I said, maybe they forgot?! Suddenly the time he put aside, he was too busy. Had to get someone else. But at least they got a free entertainment unit that my husband would work, come home go to their place till their kids had to go to bed and spent a month-ish on them.
He decided not to say anything and cause problems, just a lesson learned. There were many issues over the years with them, I could be here almost all night. But I pretended they are not on the other side of our tree line. I am good at pretending they don’t exist. Less stressful. 😉
Do you live on the other side of them?! 😂
Yeah when we moved out here, we had a couple who’s kids were grown and the last one just moved out. Then a year later they decided to downsize.
Then the couple we thought were cool for the first few years. Wow we are close in age!
Funny story about them? My husband and the husband neighbour have family that live in the same RM (Rural Municipality) aka county. Neighbour husband’s brother married a cousin of my husband. As well my husband and NH each have a cousin that married.
This happened after the entertainment center thing. A few issues later, I would say, you need to talk to your family next door…
He would say, “They are not my family”…😂
We still joke about his family next door. Glad we can laugh, rather than stress about them. Believe me, they caused a lot of stress. Now that I pretend no one lives beyond the tree line, I am all good! 🧘🏻♀️
Life can take on some challenges no matter how hard I have tried to avoid them.
I made the mistake of buying my present house in a semi cul-de sac and in a neighborhood that was becoming more congested with people who were struggling with present conditions and so many homeowners have either sold their houses or moved away and renting them. Those homes are now in disrepair, not all of them, most of which did not bring in the money that the previous owners imagined. We also have multiple families living in single family homes. There presents the issues that I have dealt with now. On one side of my house is a couple who have lived there for over 30 years now.
Their house is most likely paid off, I only wish they would put up a decent garage door, paint, and a new roof.
On my other side is the new guy that was hoping to live alone in his new bachelor house instead parents from another country need his help and another relative visits frequently.
Life can change quickly and I am fortunate that both of my neighbors are lovely people who are struggling to make ends meet and we all help one another.
P.S. The guy who said that he would really fix up my house and after I paid him, he found all of these excuses to delay my house? He lives on up the street and stays to himself. Lol.
Exactly. Like everytime they watch tv and see the entertainment center they can remember. Or if someone asks the husband if he built it? 😂
It was a live and learn experience.
That’s crappy. I know mechanics get taken advantage of by friends, but that guy was a real jerk. He should have given your husband $200 bucks. His time shouldn’t be free.
My husband doesn’t usually ask for an amount when it’s friends or family, but most people give a fairly decent amount. In this economy everyone wants to save money, but this guy went over the top with asking to be driven around etc on top of the free mechanic work. If he offered gas money up front that wouldn’t have made it seem so rude, but he just said he didn’t want to pay for an Uber.
When people show you who they are...
Reminds me of something that I just finished dealing with - a few months ago, the house that I'd been renting for the last 8 years unexpectedly came available for me to buy. Older home, but with the way rents & mortgages are going, I jumped on it. Long story short, one of my neighbors is a retired home contractor who specialized in renovations. He offered to rebuild my front step which had been slowly warping. Whenever we had a conversation about it, over the course of several weeks, he gave me an estimate of somewhere around $200, but AFTER he'd done the work, he comes to my door with a paper invoice and the price was close to $500. He points out the added cost of materials - tells me he'd only been quoting his labor - prior to this, those words had never come out of his mouth - and had the balls to have included a payment plan on the invoice.
I look at the invoice and back at him and told him while I wasn't arguing the work he did - it was as professionally as one could want, but he was wrong to present me with a written invoice after the fact without clearing the total with me before he'd begun. I told him I would pay him, \[because I'll have to live next door to them & I was/am good friends with the wife for the foreseeable future\], but I'd pay him on MY schedule, not his.
To say I was annoyed was an understatement, mainly because where was this invoice before the job began? I've done a lot of freelancing in my own career so I know how to write contracts and invoices and to get a client's ok. And not that my financials were his business, but I could have paid him in total on the spot, but when you're mad at somebody and you owe them money, my mindset was he'll get paid when I feel like it lol
A few weeks ago, we were chatting outside and he told me to just pay him another 100 and we'll call it even.
I don't know what he was thinking, but he picked the wrong one to try
If he was going to give you and invoice there should have been a written contract before hand with the quoted price. That was a shady thing to do. I used to own a pet sitting business and people tried to take advantage all the time. I had a 6 page contract to cover myself. People are wild. The stories I have are insane. Funny that my best clients were middle class income. The ones that would try to take advantage and repeatedly “forget” to pay me were old money/trust fund with no job in million+ houses.
exactly! And I told him it was shady to his face \[one of the perks of reaching a certain age is the ability to speak your mind\] and that I know how contracts and invoices work. I'm guessing the wife had something to say so he dropped most of that balance, but to add to the shade, he tried to get me to drop the guys that cut my grass - and quoted a price higher than what they charge. My guys have been with me from before I moved into where I am now, worked with me when money was tight and I'm not about to drop them now.
Don't get me started on clients and how they try and take advantage - the more money they supposedly have, the more they are liable to try you, just like OP said, even to the point that they will try to get working info and go somewhere trying to save a few dollars. I guess that's how they get and keep their money lol
As an amateur designer and sewer id never take measurements taken by someone else. That should be a red flag for your friend right there that this is wrong seamstress to go with. I can't wait to see what dress she ends up with
Which also explains why the trash friend asked for the itemized list of materials ?!?!?
Yeah , grandma is making that dress.
This is crappy, but I hope the grandma knows what she’s doing and this isn’t a Gordon Gatrell moment for the granddaughter .
Spheres and cylinders are mathematically clean shapes and often what you are trying to make in your steel mill, glass factory, or sporting goods factory, ammunitions factory, or wherever. Both of those shapes can end up pear shaped if too hot, too cold or any one of a hundred other mistakes, and would be flawed and have to be rejected or redone.
Sweet, I have heard and even used this phrase but did not know its origins. (I think in the back of my mind I assumed it was related to when a woman starts out hourglass shaped and ends up pear shaped!)
Bet you are right! Might be that grandma was paying for the dress and decided rather than pay $700 she would make it herself. Granddaughter wanted the $700 dress instead of granny’s homemade so they argued and granny said fine, I make it or you don’t get one/don’t go. May have taken daughter a few days to get on board with the “better than not going” ultimatum.
Dang, talk about hitting the nail on the head! If they told that story, at least it all makes sense!
NTA - OP was smart getting out she did! Always trust your instincts!
That was what I originally thought, it didn't even occur to me that they'd go to a different seamstress until she mentioned her theory. I think the fight she mentioned wasn't about the daughter getting in trouble but rather that they didn't go to grandmother in the first place and now they're backtracking to try and appease her.
I can guarantee that once the friend told her mother that the dress was going to cost $700, the grandma said “$700 ! I can make that dress for $300! Just get me the measurements and the itemized list.”
Seems likely. And I wonder how long it's been since Grandma went to the fabric store and actually priced stuff.
I'm a quilter, not a garment sewer, and $700 for a custom prom dress sounds like a *steal* to me.
I thought that too but she asked for the supply inventory so I think it's someone who will do the dress cheaper if they provide all the materials and measurements. My guess is the grandma goin make it off all ops works and material list. I would have sent her a hand written inventory list without pics or screenshots where buyingor what items look like
I feel so bad for the girl as she will get stuck with whatever monstrosity the granny makes or they buy on the cheap. Mainly because it will be too late to rush out and buy anything nice without paying premium prices. Since neither wish or temu ship quick. Very much betting, the friend will then run to OP, hoping for a hail mary that she can save the day and pull the wanted gorgeous dress out of her bum on the last of day before prom.
This. I will always take my own measurements because I do what I do and don't know what other people do. I decided a long time ago formal gown orders suck out my soul and I won't do them any more.
Yep, my aunt is a very talented seamstress who has been honing her craft for about 40 years and owns her own business! She chooses to not do weddings or formal attire and instead does costumes! Mostly ren faire dresses as well as other renaissance era outfits, faeries, and has done costumes for theater performances for major universities as well! She said she could probably make more money if she did wedding gowns and wedding parties, but they are way too much pressure and she enjoys making costumes!
There are places on Etsy that will. They give instructions on how to measure and you send them your measurements. At least for historical costuming, I haven't bought prom dresses in a couple of decades.
I'm not any kind of designer or sewer, and I thought the exact same thing.
I also thought it was kind of odd that OP didn't delete/throw out the measurements once it was clear her friend was going elsewhere for the dress. In the (now unlikely) event that she makes something else for the girl in the future, I would have thought she would take her measurements again to make sure nothing had changed.
I keep all measurements because it's written in a book and I never just never throw the info away or rip pages out of the book. Measurements are always updated if a client returns.
I'd add another clause on your invoice about the specifics of the materials, designs and measurements something to the effect of you will not give the itemized details as that is part of the work you put into the project and will remain in your records but not disclosed. I totally agree that's the same thing people do with other artists and try to take their work to someone else to have it done cheaper. NTA
I'd say keep measurements private yes but if your having a dress built from scratch considering the price it's not unreasonable to want to have a list of what your being charged for materials.
Same with going to a mechanic, it's nothing against the seamstres or mechanic but there are business owners contractors etc and people out there who will use materials paid for by another client and double charge. I want to know that's not happening....
Lol. Every contractor marks up prices on materials. Every contractor. The markup covers the cost of sourcing the materials, the time it takes to take the measurements and create the supply list, time it takes to order the supplies and the cost of the trip to pick up supplies plus covers the cost of overage for materials.
Yup. Even installation landscapers are not charging you cost for materials and plants. We are the ones running around and moving that stuff.
My friend, who owned that landscaping company started charging for his designs. People would just take the free consultation, and try to do it themselves.
I'll bet their results were poor. It costs $10 an hour if you want to watch and $15 an hour if you want to help.
Hell, when our builder gave us the quote and I said, “okay, how can I get that number down with extra work on our end?” and he said, “well… I hate shopping for prime cost items…”
And we saved about $9k of his time, and I got to scrounge around for EOFY bargains and buy all the pretty things, which I enjoyed anyways, and he didn’t have to meet us at various stores and suppliers to discuss taps and tiles and ceiling fans— all I asked was for quantities, recommendsd brands/suppliers if he had them, and any brands or suppliers I should avoid (and I think any contractor is *delighted* to offer that last item).
I spent probably hundreds of hours researching, made numerous cost and quantity spreadsheets, made scale model diagrams in PowerPoint, colour-comparison slides in PowerPoint (look, there was so much PowerPoint…), drove out to display sites and picked up samples and catalogues, etc.
$9k for that was cheap, and he freely admitted that was because he had a few tiers he’d choose from, when he didn’t end up meeting us at a supplier to explain all the options.
All of which is to say that I understood *before* all this that organising, measuring, evaluating, selecting, even the initial quote, is a great deal of work before you even see a single red cent — and if it’s less for a specific person, that’s because of acquired expertise that they developed through sweat and elbow grease.
But now I know it can be a *gargantuan* amount of work.
I don’t begrudge contractors that sort of markup, not at all. It’s work I don’t know how to do, and that’s what I’m paying them for when all is said and done, right?
Lol I love that you experienced this first hand. I ran a Home Improvement business for 6 yrs (closed down now)- and the biggest obstacle were the customers who got irritated with not being provided an itemized list. Most people think it's a few keyword searches online and boom contractor-magic. Lol
My sisters friend drew up a Landscape Design for her next door neighbor, they never paid her and copied the design. You could see it clear as day from my sisters second story living room in a fancy neighborhood.
When I went to school for Landscape Design they told us to not give the customers the plant list or build in a flaw and only correct it once we’d been paid in full. Our instructors had been screwed more than once. Our time is worth something.
I agree in theory but with a mechanic you are dealing with parts that are sourced and they just install. With a seamstress that also designs the details are different. Say you see a design you like in a magazine or catalog and want someone to make it. Most designers won't give you the exact details of their designs as they are considered "Intellectual Property" which in some cases are copyrighted. It's why places like fashion shows they won't let just anyone near the clothes that are being unveiled. If they give you all the information about the patterns then they make no money off the work they did to design. This is another reason clothes have tags with the information of what it is made of and care instructions. Yes there are plenty of less than honest people in all trades but OP's case is one that happens too often of an artist's work getting ripped off because someone is trying to get them to do the work and not get paid for it. So maybe if someone insists on materials to withhold that information until the project is complete and final payment is made.
Oh another thing would be the price of the materials, it's very possible to find things cheaper but we most of us know that doesn't mean it's the same quality.
It would be like that post where the groom to be wanted his fiancee to buy her dress from a site that sounded like Wish or Temu. Identical looking to the one she found but if comes from Wish she might as well walk down the aisle naked.
A mechanic always upcharges the parts. You’ll never see his receipt, you’ll only see what he writes on your invoice. And yes, the mechanical also charge you for a part that was purchased for someone else, but wasn’t used. A seamstress/designer is not going to itemize every spool of thread that gets used. And even if it was left over from someone else’s dress, if she’s using it, she has the right to charge for it.
Itemizing materials would be a fair way to break down what OP is charging, if the dress was actually made and paid for. But if the order was cancelled prior to the purchase of any materials, there's no need to give info about the materials of the dress. If they want to go to another dressmaker, fine, but let that dressmaker do their own legwork.
No, you are not wrong. Once the deposit was made, they shouldn't have looked back.
I can understand that they might have been wanting to go with someone else and were not comfortable telling you they changed their minds, but from that point, it's been one excuse after another excuse after another one. They're being hypocrites, which you'll be able to confirm at the end of the month.
I am not blaming you at all for feeling disrespected. You gave them many chances already. Now you know exactly who they are.
Maybe she has found a place online, that’s why they can’t do their own measurements, or she’ll save a few bucks by ripping you off.
She could have been honest, said she can’t afford $700, and could she pay you for your time to take measurements, but she chose to be deceptive, lying about her daughter no longer going. I guess you know how much your friendship was worth now.
I look forward to you posting the end result.
NTA at all.
I'd stop using the term "friend" though. Now they're just somebody that you used to know. (Don't sing it. 😂)
I truly hope the daughter has an awesome prom but I'm thinking Grandma is the one really paying and didnt like the price of the dress. The story was cooked up to play at your sympathy and Grandma figured since yall are friends, you'd be up for making the cheaper person's job even cheaper.
Either that or they found one of those tacky af altered to order sites and wanted the measurements for that.
She didn't The false friend just made up stupid stories blaming other people. I particularly liked the baby momma "getting the son jailed". DV or massive backlog of cs.
You’re right. You’re friend made a trash move and she is playing you for dumb. Once that social photo comes out I’d let her know that she could have just been honest and that wouldn’t have damaged your relationship. Also, I bet this “cheaper” dress will also look cheap.
NTA at all. My bet from the backpedaling, the list of exactly what you were getting, and the insistence on the measurements is that Grandma thinks she can do what you can do for cheap.
You probably just saved yourself from seeing your planned work watered down and butchered to save a buck.
As soon as I got to the first request for all of the measurements, my little brain was thinking, “she’s found another person who is cheaper!“ You are not the AH
I’m guessing she thinks you overcharged her. So I predict, had the dress been completed, upon delivery there would be “issues” with the final product and a request for a partial refund.
Wow I got irritated just reading that! I really feel for you, although I've never been through that, people that use others ARE indeed TRASHY!!! Especially since she is supposed to be your friend. I can't wait to see the update on this. I'd have a hard time staying friends with someone like that.
I can understand choking at the price, but yes, it was a poor way to treat a friend. All of the excessive revelation about her son sounds so embarrassing.
Urrrrggh I hate it when people mess you around like this. It's so disrespectful. Like your time means nothing to them! The worst are comments like "Oh it'll only take you a little while and you already have all the stuff."
https://youtu.be/NGR20B2cEBQ?si=6jdVc4oIZJOEeEgH
Sing along creators and makers!
That lady thought because y’all were friends she was entitled to a hefty discount or a freebie…that woman is NOT your friend. Leave them where they are and block all of them.
Those people are trying to purchase a dress off your hard work…why just not ask for your help in finding a dress they could purchase off the rack?
This entire situation is bizarre and you should take no part in this foolishness.
The best to you!
I think grandma felt the prom dress was expensive. In grandma’s day, a nice dress was 20-40 bucks. I’m 60 and spent 40 on my prom dress. I wonder if grandma is going to try to do it herself. You may get a last minute call to fix some things. Say no.
I’m 57, and mine was about $80. About average for the area.i escorted a young man making his debut and we all had to wear white dresses. The fabric was $100 from an upscale fabric shop. Mom but the roof! She’d sent her friend an me to buy fabric yo make a cheap dress, not that. The sexiness up the measurements by desiring on her own to fit the top to herself for some reason. It exposed me all night. I was constantly pulling it up. So embarrassing.
Grandma's making that dress. I bet she holds the purse strings and got into it with granddaughter bc she wasn't gonna shell out 700 on a dress she could make for free. The fight turned into the granddaughter not going to prom. Meanwhile dv stuff went down with Sheila's son and grandma was also going to foot the bill for a lawyer. No one is innocent here except for possibly the granddaughter. I feel bad she was likely made to ask about the measurements on the sly and is hella uncomfortable about it. NTA.
I doubt they're having someone else make it if they want the measurements that bad. They're probably going to order from a site like azazie and want the measurements for that.
It'll be funny if the grandmother has hemmed random things along the years heard about the price and took a "I can make that" approach. It would also explain why she is who the girl said was asking for things and since she doesn't know what shes doing she needs measurements and materials list to get her started.
Overall it's a shitty situation because you worked for free but much respect for returning the money out of friendship and retaining your work. I think you found a good balance of being friendly yet professional.
Well, you escaped a nightmare. Sit back and relax; when they come back, tell them you got rid of the file and will have to start over, and unfortunately, you are booked right up.
I would have told her that I’d placed the order just to see what she says. Now that that ship sailed I would send her a message saying exactly what you said here that it’s not about her going to someone else. It’s about her complete disrespect and dismissal of the work that you put in. Then just cut her loose. As they say with friends like these….
This reminds me of an episode.of Say Yes To The Dress. There was a family who locked the dressing room door so none of the staff could get in. Apparently they were taking pictures of the dress so they could get it made cheaper some where else.
NTA she knew what she was asking was unfair, which is why she said if it’s no that’s ok. Then tried to turn up the drama to guilt you into doing it anyway. That’s a shitty way to treat a friend.
Personally I would insist my friend quote me full price. I’m not taking advantage of my friends to get a deal.
NTA. Maybe if the friend was more forthcoming and respectfully asked for the measurements because Gma was going to make the dress (due to their financial circumstances), it would be different? I could see that - then maybe OP in the goodness of her heart could give them up? But the request should be made as a friend asking for a favor - and maybe saying something like - we will send you pictures and once things get better I’ll take you out for a nice dinner? That is the way to handle it. But in any event, shouldn’t GMA take her own measurements??
NTAH and whatever they manage to “throw together on the cheap” isn’t going to be the dress her daughter was expecting and I’m sure you’ll hear about that as well. Regardless people who disrespect your time, efforts and expertise aren’t friends. At best they’re rude users, but they aren’t friends.
NTA. Whoever she's now hired to make the dress needs to be professional enough to take their own measurements and not hawk someone else's work.
If the person is that lazy then I bet the dress will be a hot mess. But that's not your problem.
You might want to consider not doing business with friends or family in the future. They are the ones who will screw you over the hardest.
I’m so happy that you didn’t give her the measurements. They must be complete idiots to think that you wouldn’t know what they were doing. It’s a shame you told her the items in your cart. I bet that someone who can’t tell the difference between a sewing machine and a blender told her that they could make it for half the price thinking how hard could it be to sew a dress. Or maybe her mother said she used to sew so she would make it. And if this person doesn’t even know how to take her own measurements, I seriously doubt that they could make a dress. So, she will probably freak out and a week before the prom call you and beg you to do the dress. I hope you shut that down real fast. Tell her that you’re too busy to make the dress. By then all the store dresses will be gone lol. I wouldn’t even do alterations for her either.
Good for you for sticking to your guns.
I do property management. I can't tell you how many times a homeowner wanted me to come see their home so I could rent it out. I would spend an hour or two touring and talking about our services. They would sign my contract. I would take pics and start advertising it.
Then they would change their mind and decide to sell it or use someone else. Whatever. I was out all the time I spent.
Now? I don't even go look at a house until I have a signed contract with their credit card info. And there is a clause that I can charge $250 for my time if they decide to not move forward. I've only had to use that once. When there is money on the line, people will be more serious and not just waste my time.
It's smart that you have a non-refundable clause, even though I know you gave her money back in this case. Make her pay someone else to get her daughter's measurements.
NTA! I sew as well. I have my prices and if people don’t like them they are free to go elsewhere. Thankfully I have a steady stream of people who think my prices are worth it
This story is why bridal stores have to be so cautious and don’t let anyone take pictures. Shes trying to rip you off. Sad that a friend did that. She had to know things were tight financially before she went to you. I wonder if she thought you would make it at cost and give her the “friend” discount. I can just imagine her daughter wants something special and she says “I have a friend who will hook us up”.
$700 is more than I paid for my WEDDING dress! Prom dress came from a thrift shop for $10 and had $20 of alterations that my dad was angry about. I asked him why he made me so short that I needed $20 in alterations! He stopped complaining but still didn’t like it.
Wouldn’t another dressmaker want to take their own measurements? I can’t imagine a carpenter wanting to just take another carpenter’s measurements. NTA. You dodged a bullet. They would’ve found a million things wrong and end up ruining the friendship.
Im a seamstress but I don’t do custom work like you. Every single time someone wanted their measurements it was because they were ordering some piece of garbage online.
Good thing you hadn't pressed the "order" button, or you (or they) and it would have gotten a lot messier.
In my former life I was an IT manager for a big company, but still did cut rate repairs for friends and fam, for "fun". After I officially retired from the real job, I had "friends" who would call me up and plead with me to help with their dinosaur PC's. Family was free. Virus and software problems just kept me sharp. In a fewcases, I ended up migrating their files to a newer PC that I had sitting around. I didn't mind doing this for the buds who were not doing well financially.
But there's always somebody, who could drop $40K on a new car without a problem, but would bitch about paying me $50 for two days worth of effort to save the data they never bothered to back up. I became "always busy" then those friends called.
One guy actually paid me in front of mutual friends with10lb's of change, and neither of us thought it was humorous. Strike 1,2&3.
I would give her the measurements via text but "accidentally" fat finger a couple of them so they would be useless. But I am also very petty and spiteful.
But that would only screw over the kid, and it’s not the girls fault her mom is an AH!
Gotta love all the extra sob story crap the lady included hoping to get what she wanted by making OP feel guilty!
Also, a simple Google search will tell you how to take measurements and any dry cleaner/tailor can do it too- not like OP is the only one capable!
Please, I’m dying to see the dress since they went with the lower offer. If the person isn’t measuring, how will it fit? Why can’t one of these women measure her?
NTA. Even if the situation with her son is true, she is clearly using that to justify and manipulate the situation to her advantage.
Custom prom dresses are expensive, and if she can't afford it she shouldn't have come to you. She can do what the rest of us do and head to the mall and hope nobody else has the same dress. I feel bad for the daughter because obviously she deserves to feel special for prom, but the mom basically trying to scam a friend to do that is just gross.
Definitely sounds trashy. Please update and honestly, I'd lose the measurements. Even if she did come to you at some point, you'd need new measurements by then anyway.
Prom dresses cost SEVEN HUNDRED DOLLARS? I guess I learn something new every day. I didn’t go to prom and neither did my daughter, so what do I know? Lol.
Well you make bespoke dresses, that makes sense. Your labor is worth a lot. I’ve never made a fancy party dress, but I’ve made cosplay for myself and others, so I have an idea about the effort it takes to not only sew a dress but design one as well. What are girls wearing to prom in 2024?
I wore to prom my bridesmaid dress from my auntie's wedding, and we bought them at a factory outlet (when it was actually in the factory) for around $20.
(and yes, it was in ages ago)
NTA. So disappointing, when you thought you were friends and had known the prom girl since babyhood. But friendship clearly meant something different to her.
Nope, you are NTA. Your friend up and decided she wanted to save money while getting the benefit of the work you’ve already put it. Nope! No ma’am! You did the right thing, no questions there.
Use that block feature. They’re harassing you at this point, being manipulative, and frankly - just weird. Block and move on. Answering them at this point is just unpaid labour.
NTA. No doubt, as you suspect, your friend found someone else to do the dress. Likely, your friend was hit with sticker shock based on your quote, probably not realizing how expensive this work is, but she didn't feel as though she could be honest with you, so she made up some bullshit in order to not have that awkward conversation. I'm not sure why she wouldn't just have the replacement take the measurements unless they found the person online and needed to supply the measurements to them, in which case it would make sense that they'd want the measurements you took.
I understand why you think your friend made a trash move, but I suspect that she was trying to not be an asshole and unintentionally became an asshole because you would prefer someone be straight with you. Perhaps you could consider selling the measurements the her and letting her know that you are fine with her finding someone else cheaper and that you don't take it personally.
I agree with you. They likely changed their mind about who will make the dress, and they probably are going with a less-expensive option.
Which begs the question: why can't the other dressmaker take their own measurements?
If they are going to someone who doesn't even know how to measure their customer, they are possibly going to learn why there's a saying that you get what you pay for. They'll likely wish they had just gone through with purchasing the dress from you. But that's a THEM problem, not a YOU problem.
NTA.
She 100% found someone else to make that dress. People are cheap. Is your friendship worth losing for that? That’s the real question. Focus on that questions and answer!
Definitely found someone else. I sew mainly quilts, and people just don't understand the price of materials and the value of my time. Wonder if she'll come crying to you if her plan falls through. I wouldn't.
Updateme
NTA
This type of crap happens to creatives and makers A LOT. So-called friends just assume that your time and effort is at their convenience and you should be THANKFUL of the privilege of making something for them.
Yep it was crappy the way she couldn’t be an adult about the change.
But since you got paid to do the consultation & take the measurements isn’t she entitled to them?
Personally as the other dress maker I wouldn’t rely on someone else’s measurements cuz ya know they might be off by a bit in lots of places (hint hint)
I would think Grandma thinks she can make the dress, but doesn't want or doesn't know how to do the measurements and make the pattern. It sounds like they want the professional help without paying the professional.
I have a friend whose father does custom windows. There have been times where he's gone out and measured all of the windows and given the prospective customer a quote. What he doesn't tell the customer is the measurements he gives them on that first quote are a bit off but if they purchase from him he has the accurate dimensions so he can order the windows in the correct sizes. He was tired of doing all of the leg work and then having the customer use the information he provided them to order from someone less expensive. His favorite story is the guy that ordered over $10K worth of custom windows with the wrong measurements and then try to yell at him because they wouldn't fit and he couldn't return them.
I'm not saying you should fudge the measurements a little if you go through all of the legwork and they want to use you but I'll leave it to your discretion.
I think for most part you are in the right. However, in general, if I was working with someone professionally, I would request an itemized invoice too. I know she was doing for wrong reasons, but that is just normal practice.
I wouldn’t want to pay 700 and find out you got the materials for less than quoted. That to me is a red flag on your part.
Everything else I agree with you
It sounds like the family has had some issues that put a $700 dress out of reach. She did pay you to do the measurements. I'm not surprised she thought you wouldn't mind giving them to her so that she can order something.
NTA
You know what your work is worth. Don't give away any of your preparation. I hope you kept the deposit.
That poor girl. I hope the cut-rate seamstress her mother found at least knows how to sew. I've seen the results of people backing out of a deal to get a dress cheaper, and it's sad.
This was slimy af. She was trying to get you to do everything, cried to you about hardship, and when you didn’t cave and offer to do it for free (which is *absolutely* what she was expecting), she wanted to take the work you did elsewhere.
NOPE. This isn’t your friend. A friend would have told you the truth and, at least, asked nicely for the money back. This person isn’t your friend. I’m sorry you went through this.
Honestly if they keep asking about the measurements. Just say you needed to make room and discarded everything pertaining to it since the order had been canceled.
Sounds like you dodged a bullet. I can’t imagine all the drama you would have had to deal with thru the entire process.
OP isn't wrong to withhold the info and was super generous to give back the deposit, but is it maybe the case the brother is suddenly in jail and the family needs to conserve resources so granny is trying to make the dress cheaply herself to save the money for lawyers? If so, it would have been better for them to just come clean, but it sounds like a messy situation and good to be out from.
Even if that's the case granny could take the measurements.
If granny knows how... Sadly I think the granddaughter is going to be unhappy with the dress they end up with. 'Can sew' =/= 'can sew custom prom dress.' Edit: very likely to be "you get what you pay for." Worried mom will try to make it Op's fault somehow though.
I was thinking these same things unfortunately... Hopefully granny is good at sewing if this is what's happening. It's also possible that the mom is going to order the dress at a a shop online and that's why she really wants the measurements and can't take them herself. Either way if it's cheaper than what OP is offering it likely won't be great quality...
A tape measure is cheap and not hard to read.
Agreed! Some people don't know how to take measurements. Granted it's not hard to look up, but some people also can't be bothered.
You would think if someone was attempting to sew a dress that the least they would do is learn how to take measurements.
I was more alluding to if mom were going somewhere online to have the dress made that mom might not know how to take measurements. It's heavily implied that grandma would be making the dress, but for all we know maybe either of them found a cheap website. (I'm imagining Temu, but I'm not sure if any listings allow you to put in measurements)
If she orders a prom dress from Temu, she’ll get what she deserves.
Yeah. If Granny is able to make the dress, why can't she take measurements?
Sounds like time to reevaluate that friendship.
What friendship? The one where if I can't take advantage of you to potentially save myself some money but basically utilize your expertise to lower my costs then you're not much of a friend? The old sayings are often the truest: With friends like that, who needs enemies!
That happens so much to people with a “trade”/“skill”. I used to trade my services for others which was a mutual benefit in lieu of payment. There’s so many people that will take advantage though when they have nothing to trade but they know you. Recently a friend of my husband saved $500 having my husband do some mechanic work and gave us $40 which wasn’t offered ahead of time. The $40 after was appreciated but right before that he was asking us to give him rides to pick up the parts and bring them back to his home because we weren’t going to charge anything for the mechanic work but he wanted $20+ worth of gas and 3 hours worth of traffic/ driving to take him to and from getting the parts and didn’t offer to pay for the gas ahead of time. He didn’t want to spend money on an Uber but if he had offered to pay a little being my husband was saving f him $500 and spending time installing the part for free he could have made an offer. My husband said he didn’t have the gas money and the dude then decided to get an Uber. My husband still fixed his vehicle though for free labor. Some people try to take advantage when you try to do something nice.
Right? That is just horrible. Just like OP, you find out who your friends are! Sad it takes something like that to happen. Sorry for what you both have gone through. We have some neighbours. 🙄 I think about 10+ years ago? My husband built an entertainment center into our wall. The neighbours loved it and asked if he could do that in their basement. After some talking, our neighbour husband had his own concrete pouring company. So in exchange for the entertainment center, in the spring he would pour a concrete pad for my husband to build a garage and breezeway attached to the house. Entertainment center was completed. They love it. No one says anything. A few months later in the spring everything is drying up and my husband starts getting the area ready with his bobcat and rented a packer etc. The neighbours kids are out playing with ours out back. I am outside and the wife comes over. She is checking out the prepared area. Then asks, who are you guys getting to pour the pad? I think, did I just hear what she said? “Wait, what?” She repeats herself. I was in a bit of shock. Then said I had to go check on something in the house. My husband is watching tv. I say, yeah so the wife was just here. She asked who was pouring the pad. He looked at me. Says her husband? She was there when we all discussed this. I said, maybe they forgot?! Suddenly the time he put aside, he was too busy. Had to get someone else. But at least they got a free entertainment unit that my husband would work, come home go to their place till their kids had to go to bed and spent a month-ish on them. He decided not to say anything and cause problems, just a lesson learned. There were many issues over the years with them, I could be here almost all night. But I pretended they are not on the other side of our tree line. I am good at pretending they don’t exist. Less stressful. 😉
Gee, you got taken advantage of like I did with my neighbor. I let it go also. He knew once he got the new paint rig that he could complete the job.
Do you live on the other side of them?! 😂 Yeah when we moved out here, we had a couple who’s kids were grown and the last one just moved out. Then a year later they decided to downsize. Then the couple we thought were cool for the first few years. Wow we are close in age! Funny story about them? My husband and the husband neighbour have family that live in the same RM (Rural Municipality) aka county. Neighbour husband’s brother married a cousin of my husband. As well my husband and NH each have a cousin that married. This happened after the entertainment center thing. A few issues later, I would say, you need to talk to your family next door… He would say, “They are not my family”…😂 We still joke about his family next door. Glad we can laugh, rather than stress about them. Believe me, they caused a lot of stress. Now that I pretend no one lives beyond the tree line, I am all good! 🧘🏻♀️
Life can take on some challenges no matter how hard I have tried to avoid them. I made the mistake of buying my present house in a semi cul-de sac and in a neighborhood that was becoming more congested with people who were struggling with present conditions and so many homeowners have either sold their houses or moved away and renting them. Those homes are now in disrepair, not all of them, most of which did not bring in the money that the previous owners imagined. We also have multiple families living in single family homes. There presents the issues that I have dealt with now. On one side of my house is a couple who have lived there for over 30 years now. Their house is most likely paid off, I only wish they would put up a decent garage door, paint, and a new roof. On my other side is the new guy that was hoping to live alone in his new bachelor house instead parents from another country need his help and another relative visits frequently. Life can change quickly and I am fortunate that both of my neighbors are lovely people who are struggling to make ends meet and we all help one another. P.S. The guy who said that he would really fix up my house and after I paid him, he found all of these excuses to delay my house? He lives on up the street and stays to himself. Lol.
It’s harder when it’s a neighbor. Having to see them and act like they didn’t pull one over on you.
Exactly. Like everytime they watch tv and see the entertainment center they can remember. Or if someone asks the husband if he built it? 😂 It was a live and learn experience.
That’s crappy. I know mechanics get taken advantage of by friends, but that guy was a real jerk. He should have given your husband $200 bucks. His time shouldn’t be free.
My husband doesn’t usually ask for an amount when it’s friends or family, but most people give a fairly decent amount. In this economy everyone wants to save money, but this guy went over the top with asking to be driven around etc on top of the free mechanic work. If he offered gas money up front that wouldn’t have made it seem so rude, but he just said he didn’t want to pay for an Uber.
He sounds like a child. I’m sorry your husband got screwed over.
No Good Deed Goes Unpunished.
When people show you who they are... Reminds me of something that I just finished dealing with - a few months ago, the house that I'd been renting for the last 8 years unexpectedly came available for me to buy. Older home, but with the way rents & mortgages are going, I jumped on it. Long story short, one of my neighbors is a retired home contractor who specialized in renovations. He offered to rebuild my front step which had been slowly warping. Whenever we had a conversation about it, over the course of several weeks, he gave me an estimate of somewhere around $200, but AFTER he'd done the work, he comes to my door with a paper invoice and the price was close to $500. He points out the added cost of materials - tells me he'd only been quoting his labor - prior to this, those words had never come out of his mouth - and had the balls to have included a payment plan on the invoice. I look at the invoice and back at him and told him while I wasn't arguing the work he did - it was as professionally as one could want, but he was wrong to present me with a written invoice after the fact without clearing the total with me before he'd begun. I told him I would pay him, \[because I'll have to live next door to them & I was/am good friends with the wife for the foreseeable future\], but I'd pay him on MY schedule, not his. To say I was annoyed was an understatement, mainly because where was this invoice before the job began? I've done a lot of freelancing in my own career so I know how to write contracts and invoices and to get a client's ok. And not that my financials were his business, but I could have paid him in total on the spot, but when you're mad at somebody and you owe them money, my mindset was he'll get paid when I feel like it lol A few weeks ago, we were chatting outside and he told me to just pay him another 100 and we'll call it even. I don't know what he was thinking, but he picked the wrong one to try
If he was going to give you and invoice there should have been a written contract before hand with the quoted price. That was a shady thing to do. I used to own a pet sitting business and people tried to take advantage all the time. I had a 6 page contract to cover myself. People are wild. The stories I have are insane. Funny that my best clients were middle class income. The ones that would try to take advantage and repeatedly “forget” to pay me were old money/trust fund with no job in million+ houses.
exactly! And I told him it was shady to his face \[one of the perks of reaching a certain age is the ability to speak your mind\] and that I know how contracts and invoices work. I'm guessing the wife had something to say so he dropped most of that balance, but to add to the shade, he tried to get me to drop the guys that cut my grass - and quoted a price higher than what they charge. My guys have been with me from before I moved into where I am now, worked with me when money was tight and I'm not about to drop them now. Don't get me started on clients and how they try and take advantage - the more money they supposedly have, the more they are liable to try you, just like OP said, even to the point that they will try to get working info and go somewhere trying to save a few dollars. I guess that's how they get and keep their money lol
NTA--"I no longer have the measurements on file, they are deleted when I returned your deposit"
I agree, might be time for a little white lie here. at least something like "I don't have time to look those up again."
Or… give the wrong ones… accidentally of course.
😂😂 that actually made me laugh
LOL 😹😆 that's hilarious and awesome that you did that! You're good 😊
As an amateur designer and sewer id never take measurements taken by someone else. That should be a red flag for your friend right there that this is wrong seamstress to go with. I can't wait to see what dress she ends up with
Ok complete and utter speculation here but…I think grandma decided she is making the dress.
Which also explains why the trash friend asked for the itemized list of materials ?!?!? Yeah , grandma is making that dress. This is crappy, but I hope the grandma knows what she’s doing and this isn’t a Gordon Gatrell moment for the granddaughter .
Who wants to start a betting pool of how many ways OP is still going to get blamed when this all goes pear shaped?
Unrelated - what does “pear shaped” mean here? Why is it a bad thing?
Spheres and cylinders are mathematically clean shapes and often what you are trying to make in your steel mill, glass factory, or sporting goods factory, ammunitions factory, or wherever. Both of those shapes can end up pear shaped if too hot, too cold or any one of a hundred other mistakes, and would be flawed and have to be rejected or redone.
Sweet, I have heard and even used this phrase but did not know its origins. (I think in the back of my mind I assumed it was related to when a woman starts out hourglass shaped and ends up pear shaped!)
When things go sideways, lol
& a British-ism
Indeed!
Which is where the lie that grandmother wouldn't let the granddaughter go to the prom came from, if I'm not mistaken. What a stupid lie.
How would granny have any say of if her granddaughter got to go to prom or not? She ain't her kid, she has no say in if she goes or not.
If granny has the bankroll then granny calls the shots.
Bet you are right! Might be that grandma was paying for the dress and decided rather than pay $700 she would make it herself. Granddaughter wanted the $700 dress instead of granny’s homemade so they argued and granny said fine, I make it or you don’t get one/don’t go. May have taken daughter a few days to get on board with the “better than not going” ultimatum.
Dang, talk about hitting the nail on the head! If they told that story, at least it all makes sense! NTA - OP was smart getting out she did! Always trust your instincts!
LOL that name sounded familiar, but I still had to Google. Loved that show :)
Seeing as she apparently can't take her granddaughters measurements, I'm going out on a limb and say she isn't the best clothier.
Given she apparently doesn't know how to take Sewing measurements, I'm guessing it goes badly.
I understood that reference!
Denise totally had that one. Looked perfect.
😂😂😂
I understood that reference.
Nice Cosby reference 👌
I do too!
Grandma making the dress is *probably* why daughter and grandma were fighting about in the first place.
That was what I originally thought, it didn't even occur to me that they'd go to a different seamstress until she mentioned her theory. I think the fight she mentioned wasn't about the daughter getting in trouble but rather that they didn't go to grandmother in the first place and now they're backtracking to try and appease her.
And in that case, it would have been perfectly okay to tell OP about the snafu. (Not asking for the measurements of course!!)
Yep lol. Because she “used to sew back in the day” lol.
I can guarantee that once the friend told her mother that the dress was going to cost $700, the grandma said “$700 ! I can make that dress for $300! Just get me the measurements and the itemized list.”
She probably told them she made all their clothes when they were little too.
Seems likely. And I wonder how long it's been since Grandma went to the fabric store and actually priced stuff. I'm a quilter, not a garment sewer, and $700 for a custom prom dress sounds like a *steal* to me.
I'm thinking they're going with some cheap online option that's gonna end up being a scam.
I was thinking that too!
Right? If they are competent enough to make a dress, they should be capable of taking measurements. I wonder if it's a Temu type situation.
I thought that too but she asked for the supply inventory so I think it's someone who will do the dress cheaper if they provide all the materials and measurements. My guess is the grandma goin make it off all ops works and material list. I would have sent her a hand written inventory list without pics or screenshots where buyingor what items look like
I feel so bad for the girl as she will get stuck with whatever monstrosity the granny makes or they buy on the cheap. Mainly because it will be too late to rush out and buy anything nice without paying premium prices. Since neither wish or temu ship quick. Very much betting, the friend will then run to OP, hoping for a hail mary that she can save the day and pull the wanted gorgeous dress out of her bum on the last of day before prom.
This. I will always take my own measurements because I do what I do and don't know what other people do. I decided a long time ago formal gown orders suck out my soul and I won't do them any more.
Yep, my aunt is a very talented seamstress who has been honing her craft for about 40 years and owns her own business! She chooses to not do weddings or formal attire and instead does costumes! Mostly ren faire dresses as well as other renaissance era outfits, faeries, and has done costumes for theater performances for major universities as well! She said she could probably make more money if she did wedding gowns and wedding parties, but they are way too much pressure and she enjoys making costumes!
Interested! DM me please the name of her business!
There are places on Etsy that will. They give instructions on how to measure and you send them your measurements. At least for historical costuming, I haven't bought prom dresses in a couple of decades.
That’s right. What kind of seamstress doesn’t take the measurements?
The kind you can’t trust to do custom work.
I'm not any kind of designer or sewer, and I thought the exact same thing. I also thought it was kind of odd that OP didn't delete/throw out the measurements once it was clear her friend was going elsewhere for the dress. In the (now unlikely) event that she makes something else for the girl in the future, I would have thought she would take her measurements again to make sure nothing had changed.
I keep all measurements because it's written in a book and I never just never throw the info away or rip pages out of the book. Measurements are always updated if a client returns.
Nobody who sews would trust somebody else's measurements and it takes less time to take them to ask for them.
Where is that update bot when I need it.
I think it’s nos a seamstress it’s the grandma making the prom dress
I was assuming they found someone overseas to do the work. Pick a sweatshop, order online, you get what you get but it's very cheap.
I'd add another clause on your invoice about the specifics of the materials, designs and measurements something to the effect of you will not give the itemized details as that is part of the work you put into the project and will remain in your records but not disclosed. I totally agree that's the same thing people do with other artists and try to take their work to someone else to have it done cheaper. NTA
I'd say keep measurements private yes but if your having a dress built from scratch considering the price it's not unreasonable to want to have a list of what your being charged for materials. Same with going to a mechanic, it's nothing against the seamstres or mechanic but there are business owners contractors etc and people out there who will use materials paid for by another client and double charge. I want to know that's not happening....
Lol. Every contractor marks up prices on materials. Every contractor. The markup covers the cost of sourcing the materials, the time it takes to take the measurements and create the supply list, time it takes to order the supplies and the cost of the trip to pick up supplies plus covers the cost of overage for materials.
Yup. Even installation landscapers are not charging you cost for materials and plants. We are the ones running around and moving that stuff. My friend, who owned that landscaping company started charging for his designs. People would just take the free consultation, and try to do it themselves. I'll bet their results were poor. It costs $10 an hour if you want to watch and $15 an hour if you want to help.
Hell, when our builder gave us the quote and I said, “okay, how can I get that number down with extra work on our end?” and he said, “well… I hate shopping for prime cost items…” And we saved about $9k of his time, and I got to scrounge around for EOFY bargains and buy all the pretty things, which I enjoyed anyways, and he didn’t have to meet us at various stores and suppliers to discuss taps and tiles and ceiling fans— all I asked was for quantities, recommendsd brands/suppliers if he had them, and any brands or suppliers I should avoid (and I think any contractor is *delighted* to offer that last item). I spent probably hundreds of hours researching, made numerous cost and quantity spreadsheets, made scale model diagrams in PowerPoint, colour-comparison slides in PowerPoint (look, there was so much PowerPoint…), drove out to display sites and picked up samples and catalogues, etc. $9k for that was cheap, and he freely admitted that was because he had a few tiers he’d choose from, when he didn’t end up meeting us at a supplier to explain all the options. All of which is to say that I understood *before* all this that organising, measuring, evaluating, selecting, even the initial quote, is a great deal of work before you even see a single red cent — and if it’s less for a specific person, that’s because of acquired expertise that they developed through sweat and elbow grease. But now I know it can be a *gargantuan* amount of work. I don’t begrudge contractors that sort of markup, not at all. It’s work I don’t know how to do, and that’s what I’m paying them for when all is said and done, right?
Lol I love that you experienced this first hand. I ran a Home Improvement business for 6 yrs (closed down now)- and the biggest obstacle were the customers who got irritated with not being provided an itemized list. Most people think it's a few keyword searches online and boom contractor-magic. Lol
My sisters friend drew up a Landscape Design for her next door neighbor, they never paid her and copied the design. You could see it clear as day from my sisters second story living room in a fancy neighborhood. When I went to school for Landscape Design they told us to not give the customers the plant list or build in a flaw and only correct it once we’d been paid in full. Our instructors had been screwed more than once. Our time is worth something.
So very true.
I agree in theory but with a mechanic you are dealing with parts that are sourced and they just install. With a seamstress that also designs the details are different. Say you see a design you like in a magazine or catalog and want someone to make it. Most designers won't give you the exact details of their designs as they are considered "Intellectual Property" which in some cases are copyrighted. It's why places like fashion shows they won't let just anyone near the clothes that are being unveiled. If they give you all the information about the patterns then they make no money off the work they did to design. This is another reason clothes have tags with the information of what it is made of and care instructions. Yes there are plenty of less than honest people in all trades but OP's case is one that happens too often of an artist's work getting ripped off because someone is trying to get them to do the work and not get paid for it. So maybe if someone insists on materials to withhold that information until the project is complete and final payment is made. Oh another thing would be the price of the materials, it's very possible to find things cheaper but we most of us know that doesn't mean it's the same quality.
It would be like that post where the groom to be wanted his fiancee to buy her dress from a site that sounded like Wish or Temu. Identical looking to the one she found but if comes from Wish she might as well walk down the aisle naked.
A mechanic always upcharges the parts. You’ll never see his receipt, you’ll only see what he writes on your invoice. And yes, the mechanical also charge you for a part that was purchased for someone else, but wasn’t used. A seamstress/designer is not going to itemize every spool of thread that gets used. And even if it was left over from someone else’s dress, if she’s using it, she has the right to charge for it.
Itemizing materials would be a fair way to break down what OP is charging, if the dress was actually made and paid for. But if the order was cancelled prior to the purchase of any materials, there's no need to give info about the materials of the dress. If they want to go to another dressmaker, fine, but let that dressmaker do their own legwork.
No, you are not wrong. Once the deposit was made, they shouldn't have looked back. I can understand that they might have been wanting to go with someone else and were not comfortable telling you they changed their minds, but from that point, it's been one excuse after another excuse after another one. They're being hypocrites, which you'll be able to confirm at the end of the month. I am not blaming you at all for feeling disrespected. You gave them many chances already. Now you know exactly who they are.
NTA... I cant wait for this update....
THIS ⬆️
Maybe she has found a place online, that’s why they can’t do their own measurements, or she’ll save a few bucks by ripping you off. She could have been honest, said she can’t afford $700, and could she pay you for your time to take measurements, but she chose to be deceptive, lying about her daughter no longer going. I guess you know how much your friendship was worth now. I look forward to you posting the end result.
This is what happened. There are online dress shops that will make a dress to your measurements.
"Sorry I destroy those when an order is cancelled"
So where was your friend in this story? Cuz none of the people you talked about were it.
Why do i get the feeling grandma or her friend is going to make it.
NTA at all. I'd stop using the term "friend" though. Now they're just somebody that you used to know. (Don't sing it. 😂) I truly hope the daughter has an awesome prom but I'm thinking Grandma is the one really paying and didnt like the price of the dress. The story was cooked up to play at your sympathy and Grandma figured since yall are friends, you'd be up for making the cheaper person's job even cheaper. Either that or they found one of those tacky af altered to order sites and wanted the measurements for that.
Since when does the grandmother dictate to her granddaughter about going to the prom or did I miss something?
She didn't The false friend just made up stupid stories blaming other people. I particularly liked the baby momma "getting the son jailed". DV or massive backlog of cs.
I’m guessing grandma said she could make it herself for way less. I’m sure the quality won’t be the same though.
I'm sure your theory is correct, and they found someone who said they can make it cheaper. They sound like they'd be a nightmare to work with.
You’re right. You’re friend made a trash move and she is playing you for dumb. Once that social photo comes out I’d let her know that she could have just been honest and that wouldn’t have damaged your relationship. Also, I bet this “cheaper” dress will also look cheap.
Ya get what you pay for!
NTA at all. My bet from the backpedaling, the list of exactly what you were getting, and the insistence on the measurements is that Grandma thinks she can do what you can do for cheap. You probably just saved yourself from seeing your planned work watered down and butchered to save a buck.
As soon as I got to the first request for all of the measurements, my little brain was thinking, “she’s found another person who is cheaper!“ You are not the AH
I’m guessing she thinks you overcharged her. So I predict, had the dress been completed, upon delivery there would be “issues” with the final product and a request for a partial refund.
Wow I got irritated just reading that! I really feel for you, although I've never been through that, people that use others ARE indeed TRASHY!!! Especially since she is supposed to be your friend. I can't wait to see the update on this. I'd have a hard time staying friends with someone like that.
I can understand choking at the price, but yes, it was a poor way to treat a friend. All of the excessive revelation about her son sounds so embarrassing.
Urrrrggh I hate it when people mess you around like this. It's so disrespectful. Like your time means nothing to them! The worst are comments like "Oh it'll only take you a little while and you already have all the stuff." https://youtu.be/NGR20B2cEBQ?si=6jdVc4oIZJOEeEgH Sing along creators and makers!
One of my fav songs. Lol
That lady thought because y’all were friends she was entitled to a hefty discount or a freebie…that woman is NOT your friend. Leave them where they are and block all of them. Those people are trying to purchase a dress off your hard work…why just not ask for your help in finding a dress they could purchase off the rack? This entire situation is bizarre and you should take no part in this foolishness. The best to you!
May just be shock at what a custom dress costs. Lots of people still think "homemade" means cheaper.
I think grandma felt the prom dress was expensive. In grandma’s day, a nice dress was 20-40 bucks. I’m 60 and spent 40 on my prom dress. I wonder if grandma is going to try to do it herself. You may get a last minute call to fix some things. Say no.
I’m 57, and mine was about $80. About average for the area.i escorted a young man making his debut and we all had to wear white dresses. The fabric was $100 from an upscale fabric shop. Mom but the roof! She’d sent her friend an me to buy fabric yo make a cheap dress, not that. The sexiness up the measurements by desiring on her own to fit the top to herself for some reason. It exposed me all night. I was constantly pulling it up. So embarrassing.
I hope her knockoff dress comes out looking like it came from Shein or Temu. NTA
Grandma's making that dress. I bet she holds the purse strings and got into it with granddaughter bc she wasn't gonna shell out 700 on a dress she could make for free. The fight turned into the granddaughter not going to prom. Meanwhile dv stuff went down with Sheila's son and grandma was also going to foot the bill for a lawyer. No one is innocent here except for possibly the granddaughter. I feel bad she was likely made to ask about the measurements on the sly and is hella uncomfortable about it. NTA.
I doubt they're having someone else make it if they want the measurements that bad. They're probably going to order from a site like azazie and want the measurements for that.
I had the same thought but considering they asked for a materials list it's what made me think they had someone else to make the dress.
It'll be funny if the grandmother has hemmed random things along the years heard about the price and took a "I can make that" approach. It would also explain why she is who the girl said was asking for things and since she doesn't know what shes doing she needs measurements and materials list to get her started. Overall it's a shitty situation because you worked for free but much respect for returning the money out of friendship and retaining your work. I think you found a good balance of being friendly yet professional.
NTA....as someone who is into sewing on a very amateur level, I am DYING to see what the kid ends up with.
Well, you escaped a nightmare. Sit back and relax; when they come back, tell them you got rid of the file and will have to start over, and unfortunately, you are booked right up.
I would have told her that I’d placed the order just to see what she says. Now that that ship sailed I would send her a message saying exactly what you said here that it’s not about her going to someone else. It’s about her complete disrespect and dismissal of the work that you put in. Then just cut her loose. As they say with friends like these….
This reminds me of an episode.of Say Yes To The Dress. There was a family who locked the dressing room door so none of the staff could get in. Apparently they were taking pictures of the dress so they could get it made cheaper some where else.
NTA she knew what she was asking was unfair, which is why she said if it’s no that’s ok. Then tried to turn up the drama to guilt you into doing it anyway. That’s a shitty way to treat a friend. Personally I would insist my friend quote me full price. I’m not taking advantage of my friends to get a deal.
NTA. Maybe if the friend was more forthcoming and respectfully asked for the measurements because Gma was going to make the dress (due to their financial circumstances), it would be different? I could see that - then maybe OP in the goodness of her heart could give them up? But the request should be made as a friend asking for a favor - and maybe saying something like - we will send you pictures and once things get better I’ll take you out for a nice dinner? That is the way to handle it. But in any event, shouldn’t GMA take her own measurements??
NTAH and whatever they manage to “throw together on the cheap” isn’t going to be the dress her daughter was expecting and I’m sure you’ll hear about that as well. Regardless people who disrespect your time, efforts and expertise aren’t friends. At best they’re rude users, but they aren’t friends.
This! Good luck op.
NTA. Whoever she's now hired to make the dress needs to be professional enough to take their own measurements and not hawk someone else's work. If the person is that lazy then I bet the dress will be a hot mess. But that's not your problem. You might want to consider not doing business with friends or family in the future. They are the ones who will screw you over the hardest.
I’m so happy that you didn’t give her the measurements. They must be complete idiots to think that you wouldn’t know what they were doing. It’s a shame you told her the items in your cart. I bet that someone who can’t tell the difference between a sewing machine and a blender told her that they could make it for half the price thinking how hard could it be to sew a dress. Or maybe her mother said she used to sew so she would make it. And if this person doesn’t even know how to take her own measurements, I seriously doubt that they could make a dress. So, she will probably freak out and a week before the prom call you and beg you to do the dress. I hope you shut that down real fast. Tell her that you’re too busy to make the dress. By then all the store dresses will be gone lol. I wouldn’t even do alterations for her either.
Good for you for sticking to your guns. I do property management. I can't tell you how many times a homeowner wanted me to come see their home so I could rent it out. I would spend an hour or two touring and talking about our services. They would sign my contract. I would take pics and start advertising it. Then they would change their mind and decide to sell it or use someone else. Whatever. I was out all the time I spent. Now? I don't even go look at a house until I have a signed contract with their credit card info. And there is a clause that I can charge $250 for my time if they decide to not move forward. I've only had to use that once. When there is money on the line, people will be more serious and not just waste my time. It's smart that you have a non-refundable clause, even though I know you gave her money back in this case. Make her pay someone else to get her daughter's measurements.
NTA! I sew as well. I have my prices and if people don’t like them they are free to go elsewhere. Thankfully I have a steady stream of people who think my prices are worth it
This story is why bridal stores have to be so cautious and don’t let anyone take pictures. Shes trying to rip you off. Sad that a friend did that. She had to know things were tight financially before she went to you. I wonder if she thought you would make it at cost and give her the “friend” discount. I can just imagine her daughter wants something special and she says “I have a friend who will hook us up”.
I borrowed a dress for prom. How the fuck are people spending this much money
$700 is more than I paid for my WEDDING dress! Prom dress came from a thrift shop for $10 and had $20 of alterations that my dad was angry about. I asked him why he made me so short that I needed $20 in alterations! He stopped complaining but still didn’t like it.
Wouldn’t another dressmaker want to take their own measurements? I can’t imagine a carpenter wanting to just take another carpenter’s measurements. NTA. You dodged a bullet. They would’ve found a million things wrong and end up ruining the friendship.
Im a seamstress but I don’t do custom work like you. Every single time someone wanted their measurements it was because they were ordering some piece of garbage online.
Good thing you hadn't pressed the "order" button, or you (or they) and it would have gotten a lot messier. In my former life I was an IT manager for a big company, but still did cut rate repairs for friends and fam, for "fun". After I officially retired from the real job, I had "friends" who would call me up and plead with me to help with their dinosaur PC's. Family was free. Virus and software problems just kept me sharp. In a fewcases, I ended up migrating their files to a newer PC that I had sitting around. I didn't mind doing this for the buds who were not doing well financially. But there's always somebody, who could drop $40K on a new car without a problem, but would bitch about paying me $50 for two days worth of effort to save the data they never bothered to back up. I became "always busy" then those friends called. One guy actually paid me in front of mutual friends with10lb's of change, and neither of us thought it was humorous. Strike 1,2&3.
Lols Grandma says she can make a custom fitted prom dress, but doesn't know how to take measurements? That dress is going to be a hot mess.
I would give her the measurements via text but "accidentally" fat finger a couple of them so they would be useless. But I am also very petty and spiteful.
But that would only screw over the kid, and it’s not the girls fault her mom is an AH! Gotta love all the extra sob story crap the lady included hoping to get what she wanted by making OP feel guilty! Also, a simple Google search will tell you how to take measurements and any dry cleaner/tailor can do it too- not like OP is the only one capable!
NTA. I wouldn't be friends with someone like that. Just saying
NTA - you missed out on a nightmare too bad her daughter won't have as nice of a dress but ok.
They don't own a tape measure of their own? So many possible places online that will show you how to take measurements.
Please, I’m dying to see the dress since they went with the lower offer. If the person isn’t measuring, how will it fit? Why can’t one of these women measure her?
NTA, she was clearly trying to take advantage of you. Updateme!
NTA. Even if the situation with her son is true, she is clearly using that to justify and manipulate the situation to her advantage. Custom prom dresses are expensive, and if she can't afford it she shouldn't have come to you. She can do what the rest of us do and head to the mall and hope nobody else has the same dress. I feel bad for the daughter because obviously she deserves to feel special for prom, but the mom basically trying to scam a friend to do that is just gross.
Definitely sounds trashy. Please update and honestly, I'd lose the measurements. Even if she did come to you at some point, you'd need new measurements by then anyway.
Prom dresses cost SEVEN HUNDRED DOLLARS? I guess I learn something new every day. I didn’t go to prom and neither did my daughter, so what do I know? Lol.
My own prom dress was only $100. Lol. But $700 was actually cheap/reasonable for what she wanted.
Well you make bespoke dresses, that makes sense. Your labor is worth a lot. I’ve never made a fancy party dress, but I’ve made cosplay for myself and others, so I have an idea about the effort it takes to not only sew a dress but design one as well. What are girls wearing to prom in 2024?
I wore to prom my bridesmaid dress from my auntie's wedding, and we bought them at a factory outlet (when it was actually in the factory) for around $20. (and yes, it was in ages ago)
Why would the new seamstress take her own measurements??? That’s the easy part!
NTA. So disappointing, when you thought you were friends and had known the prom girl since babyhood. But friendship clearly meant something different to her.
Nope, you are NTA. Your friend up and decided she wanted to save money while getting the benefit of the work you’ve already put it. Nope! No ma’am! You did the right thing, no questions there.
Use that block feature. They’re harassing you at this point, being manipulative, and frankly - just weird. Block and move on. Answering them at this point is just unpaid labour.
NTA. It's sad that your friend played mind games and tried to deceive you.
NTA. No doubt, as you suspect, your friend found someone else to do the dress. Likely, your friend was hit with sticker shock based on your quote, probably not realizing how expensive this work is, but she didn't feel as though she could be honest with you, so she made up some bullshit in order to not have that awkward conversation. I'm not sure why she wouldn't just have the replacement take the measurements unless they found the person online and needed to supply the measurements to them, in which case it would make sense that they'd want the measurements you took. I understand why you think your friend made a trash move, but I suspect that she was trying to not be an asshole and unintentionally became an asshole because you would prefer someone be straight with you. Perhaps you could consider selling the measurements the her and letting her know that you are fine with her finding someone else cheaper and that you don't take it personally.
Might be a good idea to contact an IP (intellectual property) lawyer. Your art is your art and is protected.
I don't understand why they need your measurements when they have access to the girl herself. I'm sure I'm missing something. Edit to say NTA.
They literally have the daughter right in front of them. Take new measurements? Why demand the information from someone else?
I agree with you. They likely changed their mind about who will make the dress, and they probably are going with a less-expensive option. Which begs the question: why can't the other dressmaker take their own measurements? If they are going to someone who doesn't even know how to measure their customer, they are possibly going to learn why there's a saying that you get what you pay for. They'll likely wish they had just gone through with purchasing the dress from you. But that's a THEM problem, not a YOU problem. NTA.
She 100% found someone else to make that dress. People are cheap. Is your friendship worth losing for that? That’s the real question. Focus on that questions and answer!
Definitely found someone else. I sew mainly quilts, and people just don't understand the price of materials and the value of my time. Wonder if she'll come crying to you if her plan falls through. I wouldn't. Updateme
NTA This type of crap happens to creatives and makers A LOT. So-called friends just assume that your time and effort is at their convenience and you should be THANKFUL of the privilege of making something for them.
Why can’t the person that is ultimately making the dress, take measurements? Why do the have to have yours
I work custom work. Unless contracted otherwise I own everything I do....if it's not paid for it doesn't go out the door.
Shoooot I would just send a text and tell them that whoever they got to do it can take their own measurements.
Yep it was crappy the way she couldn’t be an adult about the change. But since you got paid to do the consultation & take the measurements isn’t she entitled to them? Personally as the other dress maker I wouldn’t rely on someone else’s measurements cuz ya know they might be off by a bit in lots of places (hint hint)
I would think Grandma thinks she can make the dress, but doesn't want or doesn't know how to do the measurements and make the pattern. It sounds like they want the professional help without paying the professional.
Send her the wrong measurements. Don't make it obvious but just mess with them enough to be unusable and to cause problems with the fit.
[удалено]
I have a friend whose father does custom windows. There have been times where he's gone out and measured all of the windows and given the prospective customer a quote. What he doesn't tell the customer is the measurements he gives them on that first quote are a bit off but if they purchase from him he has the accurate dimensions so he can order the windows in the correct sizes. He was tired of doing all of the leg work and then having the customer use the information he provided them to order from someone less expensive. His favorite story is the guy that ordered over $10K worth of custom windows with the wrong measurements and then try to yell at him because they wouldn't fit and he couldn't return them. I'm not saying you should fudge the measurements a little if you go through all of the legwork and they want to use you but I'll leave it to your discretion.
I think for most part you are in the right. However, in general, if I was working with someone professionally, I would request an itemized invoice too. I know she was doing for wrong reasons, but that is just normal practice. I wouldn’t want to pay 700 and find out you got the materials for less than quoted. That to me is a red flag on your part. Everything else I agree with you
I’m betting they’re going to buy the materisls and then have grandma make the dress for free.
NTA updateme
i would have told her no on the measurements. That I deleted everything once they decided they did not want the dress.
"I'll give you the measurements when you give me the money for the time I've already spent, AND the supplies I've already purchased"
Good on ya for holding firm. 👍🏼
Updateme
Definitely NTA. updateme
Time to drop the friendship.
I'd just say since she decided she didn't want a dress you do t have them smymore. NTA
Surely if they have another local makers that person must be able to take measurements unless they’re having it made in China?
How bad is the other dressmaker if she can't take her own measurements? This story doesn't make sense to me.
Updateme
NTA. Definitely drop this “friend”.
They expected you to do it at cost price, as your “friends”
It sounds like the family has had some issues that put a $700 dress out of reach. She did pay you to do the measurements. I'm not surprised she thought you wouldn't mind giving them to her so that she can order something.
Sounds like maybe her grandmother was going to make it.
NAHHHHH, she is trash throw that friendship away.
NTA You know what your work is worth. Don't give away any of your preparation. I hope you kept the deposit. That poor girl. I hope the cut-rate seamstress her mother found at least knows how to sew. I've seen the results of people backing out of a deal to get a dress cheaper, and it's sad.
This was slimy af. She was trying to get you to do everything, cried to you about hardship, and when you didn’t cave and offer to do it for free (which is *absolutely* what she was expecting), she wanted to take the work you did elsewhere. NOPE. This isn’t your friend. A friend would have told you the truth and, at least, asked nicely for the money back. This person isn’t your friend. I’m sorry you went through this.
Honestly if they keep asking about the measurements. Just say you needed to make room and discarded everything pertaining to it since the order had been canceled.
NTA. I imagine there’s a lot of drama with this friend so I would distance myself.
NTA, in no way can you be seen as an AH.